PhD A: It 's not very significant .Professor B: Uh , channel one . Yes .Grad D: Channel three .Professor B: OK .PhD F: Mm - hmm .Grad D: Channel three .PhD A: TaGrad D: Channel three . Alright .Professor B: OK , didyou solve speech recognition last week ?Grad E: Almost .Professor B: Alright ! Let 's do image processing .PhD C: Yes , again .PhD A: Great .PhD C: We did it again , Morgan .Professor B: Alright !Grad E: Doo - doop ,doo - doo .PhD A: What 's wrong with {disfmarker} ?Professor B: OK . It 's April fifth . Actually , Hynek should be getting back in town shortly if he isn't already .PhD C: Is he gonna come here ?Professor B: Uh . Well ,we 'll drag him here . I know where he is .PhD C: So when you said " in town " , you mean {pause} Oregon .Professor B: U u u u uh , I meant , you know , this end of the world , yeah , {vocalsound} is really what Imeant ,PhD C: Oh .Grad E: Doo , doo - doo .Professor B: uh , cuz he 's been in Europe .Grad E: Doo - doo .Professor B: So .PhD C: I have something just fairly brief to report on .Professor B: Mmm .PhD C: Um , I didsome {pause} experim uh , uh , just a few more experiments before I had to , {vocalsound} uh , go away for the w well , that week .Professor B: Great !PhD C: Was it last week or whenever ? Um , so what I wasstarted playing with was the {disfmarker} th again , this is the HTK back - end . And , um , I was curious because the way that they train up the models , {vocalsound} they go through about four sort of rounds of{disfmarker} of training . And in the first round they do {disfmarker} uh , I think it 's three iterations , and for the last three rounds e e they do seven iterations of re - estimation in each of those three . And so , youknow , that 's part of what takes so long to train the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the back - end for this .Professor B: I 'm sorry , I didn't quite get that . There 's {disfmarker} there 's four and there 's seven and{disfmarker} I {disfmarker} I 'm sorry .PhD C: Yeah . Uh , maybe I should write it on the board . So , {vocalsound} there 's four rounds of training . Um , I g I g I guess you could say iterations . The first one is three ,then seven , seven , and seven . And what these numbers refer to is the number of times that the , uh , HMM re - estimation is run . It 's this program called H EProfessor B: But in HTK , what 's the difference between ,uh , a {disfmarker} an inner loop and an outer loop in these iterations ?PhD C: OK . So what happens is , um , at each one of these points , you increase the number of Gaussians in the model .Professor B: Yeah . Oh ,right ! This was the mix up stuff .PhD C: Yeah . The mix up .Professor B: That 's right .PhD C: Right .Professor B: I remember now .PhD C: And so , in the final one here , you end up with , uh {disfmarker} for all of the{disfmarker} the digit words , you end up with , uh , three {pause} mixtures per state ,Professor B: Yeah .PhD C: eh , in the final {pause} thing . So I had done some experiments where I was {disfmarker} I{disfmarker} I want to play with the number of mixtures .Professor B: Mm - hmm .PhD C: But , um , uh , I wanted to first test to see if we actually need to do {pause} this many iterations early on .Grad E: Uh , one ,two ,Professor B: Mm - hmm .PhD C: And so , um , I {disfmarker} I ran a couple of experiments where I {vocalsound} reduced that to l to be three , two , two , {vocalsound} uh , five , I think , and I got almost theexact same results .Professor B: Mm - hmm .PhD C: And {disfmarker} but it runs much much faster . So , um , I {disfmarker} I think m {pause} it only took something like , uh , three or four hours to do the fulltraining ,Professor B: As opposed to {disfmarker} ?PhD F: Good .PhD C: as opposed to wh what , sixteen hours or something like that ? I mean , it takes {disfmarker} you have to do an overnight basically , the way itis set up now .PhD F: Yeah . It depends .PhD A: Mm - hmm .Professor B: Mm - hmm .PhD C: So , uh , even we don't do anything else , doing something like this could allow us to turn experiments around a lot faster.Professor B: And then when you have your final thing , do a full one , so it 's {disfmarker}PhD C: And when you have your final thing , we go back to this .PhD F: Yeah .PhD C: So , um , and it 's a real simple change tomake . I mean , it 's like one little text file you edit and change those numbers , and you don't do anything else .PhD F: Oh , this is a {disfmarker}PhD A: Mm - hmm .PhD C: And then you just run .PhD F: OK .PhD C: Soit 's a very simple change to make and it doesn't seem to hurt all that much .PhD A: So you {disfmarker} you run with three , two , two , five ? That 's aPhD C: So I {disfmarker} Uh , I {disfmarker} I have to look tosee what the exact numbers were .PhD A: Yeah .PhD C: I {disfmarker} I thought was , like , three , two , two , five ,PhD A: Mm - hmm .PhD C: but I I 'll {disfmarker} I 'll double check . It was {vocalsound} over aweek ago that I did it ,PhD A: OK . Mm - hmm .PhD C: so I can't remember exactly .Grad E: Oh .PhD C: But , uh {disfmarker}Professor B: Mm - hmm .PhD C: um , but it 's so much faster . I it makes a big difference.Grad E: Hmm .PhD C: So we could do a lot more experiments and throw a lot more stuff in there .PhD F: Yeah .Professor B: That 's great .PhD C: Um . Oh , the other thing that I did was , um , {vocalsound} I compiled{pause} the HTK stuff for the Linux boxes . So we have this big thing that we got from IBM , which is a five - processor machine . Really fast , but it 's running Linux . So , you can now run your experiments on thatmachine and you can run five at a time and it runs , {vocalsound} uh , as fast as , you know , uh , five different machines .PhD A: Mm - hmm .PhD F: Mm - hmm .PhD C: So , um , I 've forgotten now what the name ofthat machine is but I can {disfmarker} I can send email around about it .PhD A: Yeah .PhD C: And so we 've got it {disfmarker} now HTK 's compiled for both the Linux and for , um , the Sparcs . Um , you have tomake {disfmarker} you have to make sure that in your dot CSHRC , {vocalsound} um , it detects whether you 're running on the Linux or a {disfmarker} a Sparc and points to the right executables . Uh , and you maynot have had that in your dot CSHRC before , if you were always just running the Sparc . So , um ,PhD A: Mm - hmm .PhD C: uh , I can {disfmarker} I can tell you exactly what you need to do to get all of that to work .But it 'll {disfmarker} it really increases what we can run on .Grad E: Hmm . Cool .PhD C: So , {vocalsound} together with the fact that we 've got these {pause} faster Linux boxes and that it takes less time to do{pause} these , um , we should be able to crank through a lot more experiments .PhD A: Mm - hmm .PhD C: So .Grad E: Hmm .PhD C: So after I did that , then what I wanted to do {comment} was try {pause}increasing the number of mixtures , just to see , um {disfmarker} see how {disfmarker} how that affects performance .PhD A: Yeah .PhD C: So .Professor B: Yeah . In fact , you could do something like {pause} keepexactly the same procedure and then add a fifth thing onto itPhD C: Mm - hmm .Professor B: that had more .PhD C: Exactly .Professor B: Yeah .PhD C: Right . Right .Grad E: So at {disfmarker} at the middle o wherethe arrows are showing , that 's {disfmarker} you 're adding one more mixture per state ,PhD C: Uh - huh . Uh ,Grad E: or {disfmarker} ?PhD C: let 's see , uh . It goes from this {disfmarker} uh , try to go it backwards{disfmarker} this {disfmarker} at this point it 's two mixtures {pause} per state . So this just adds one . Except that , uh , actually for the silence model , it 's six mixtures per state .Professor B: Mm - hmm .PhD C: Uh, so it goes to two .Grad E: OK .PhD C: Um . And I think what happens here is {disfmarker}Professor B: Might be between , uh , shared , uh {disfmarker} shared variances or something ,PhD C: Yeah . I think that 'swhat it is .Professor B: or {disfmarker}PhD C: Uh , yeah . It 's , uh {disfmarker} Shoot . I {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} I can't remember now what happens at that first one . Uh , I have to look it up and see .Grad E:Oh , OK .PhD C: Um , there {disfmarker} because they start off with , uh , an initial model which is just this global model , and then they split it to the individuals . And so , {vocalsound} it may be that that 's what 'shappening here . I {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} {vocalsound} I have to look it up and see . I {disfmarker} I don't exactly remember .Grad E: OK .Professor B: OK .PhD C: So . That 's it .Professor B: Alright . So whatelse ?PhD A: Um . Yeah . There was a conference call this Tuesday . Um . I don't know yet the {disfmarker} {vocalsound} what happened {vocalsound} Tuesday , but {vocalsound} the points that they were supposedto discuss is still , {vocalsound} uh , things like {vocalsound} the weights , uh {disfmarker}Professor B: Oh , this is a conference call for , uh , uh , Aurora participant sort of thing .Grad E: For {disfmarker}PhD A: Yeah. Yeah .Professor B: I see .PhD A: Mmm .Professor B: Do you know who was {disfmarker} who was {disfmarker} since we weren't in on it , uh , do you know who was in from OGI ? Was {disfmarker} {vocalsound} was{disfmarker} was Hynek involved or was it SunilPhD A: I have no idea .Professor B: or {disfmarker} ?PhD A: Mmm , I just {disfmarker}Professor B: Oh , you don't know . OK .PhD A: Yeah .Professor B: Alright .PhD A:Um , yeah . So the points were the {disfmarker} the weights {disfmarker} how to weight the different error rates {vocalsound} that are obtained from different language and {disfmarker} and conditions . Um , it 's notclear that they will keep the same kind of weighting . Right now it 's a weighting on {disfmarker} on improvement .Professor B: Mm - hmm .PhD A: Some people are arguing that it would be better to have weights onuh {disfmarker} well , to {disfmarker} to combine error rates {pause} before computing improvement . Uh , and the fact is that for {disfmarker} right now for {pause} the English , they have weights {disfmarker}they {disfmarker} they combine error rates , but for the other languages they combine improvement . So it 's not very consistent . Um {disfmarker}Professor B: Mm - hmm .PhD A: Yeah . The , um {disfmarker} Yeah .And so {disfmarker} Well , {vocalsound} this is a point . And right now actually there is a thing also , {vocalsound} uh , that happens with the current weight is that a very non - significant improvement {pause} on thewell - matched case result in {pause} huge differences in {disfmarker} {vocalsound} in the final number .Professor B: Mm - hmm .PhD A: And so , perhaps they will change the weights to {disfmarker}PhD C: Hmm.PhD A: Yeah .PhD C: How should that be done ? I mean , it {disfmarker} it seems like there 's a simple way {disfmarker}PhD A: Mm - hmm .PhD C: Uh , this seems like an obvious mistake or something .Professor B:Well , I mean , the fact that it 's inconsistent is an obvious mistake .PhD C: Th - they 're {disfmarker}Professor B: But the {disfmarker} but , um , the other thing {disfmarker}PhD A: InProfessor B: I don't know Ihaven't thought it through , but one {disfmarker} one would think that {vocalsound} each {disfmarker} It {disfmarker} it 's like if you say what 's the {disfmarker} what 's the best way to do an average , an arithmeticaverage or a geometric average ?PhD C: Mm - hmm .Professor B: It depends what you wanna show .PhD A: Mm - hmm .Professor B: Each {disfmarker} each one is gonna have a different characteristic .PhD A: Yeah.Professor B: So {disfmarker}PhD C: Well , it seems like they should do , like , the percentage improvement or something , rather than the {pause} absolute improvement .PhD A: Tha - that 's what they do .ProfessorB: Well , they are doing that .PhD A: Yeah .Professor B: No , that is relative . But the question is , do you average the relative improvements {pause} or do you average the error rates and take the relativeimprovement maybe of that ?PhD A: Yeah . Yeah .Professor B: And the thing is it 's not just a pure average because there are these weightings .PhD C: Oh .Professor B: It 's a weighted average . Um .PhD A: Yeah . Andso when you average the {disfmarker} the relative improvement it tends to {disfmarker} {vocalsound} to give a lot of {disfmarker} of , um , {vocalsound} importance to the well - matched case because {pause} thebaseline is already very good and , um , i it 's {disfmarker}PhD C: Why don't they not look at improvements but just look at your av your scores ? You know , figure out how to combine the scoresPhD A: Mm - hmm.PhD C: with a weight or whatever , and then give you a score {disfmarker} here 's your score . And then they can do the same thing for the baseline system {disfmarker} and here 's its score . And then you can lookat {disfmarker}PhD A: Mm - hmm .Professor B: Well , that 's what he 's seeing as one of the things they could do .PhD A: Yeah .Professor B: It 's just when you {disfmarker} when you get all done , I think that theypro I m I {disfmarker} I wasn't there but I think they started off this process with the notion that {vocalsound} you should be {pause} significantly better than the previous standard .PhD C: Mm - hmm .Professor B:And , um , so they said " how much is significantly better ? what do you {disfmarker} ? " And {disfmarker} and so they said " well , {vocalsound} you know , you should have half the errors , " or something , " that youhad before " .PhD A: Mm - hmm . Hmm .PhD C: Mm - hmm .PhD A: Yeah .Professor B: So it 's , uh , But it does seem likePhD C: Hmm .Professor B: i i it does seem like it 's more logical to combine them first and thendo the {disfmarker}PhD A: Combine error rates and then {disfmarker}Professor B: Yeah .PhD A: Yeah . Well {disfmarker}Professor B: Yeah .PhD A: But there is this {disfmarker} this {disfmarker} is this still thisproblem of weights . When {disfmarker} when you combine error rate it tends to {pause} give more importance to the difficult cases , and some people think that {disfmarker}Professor B: Oh , yeah ?PhD A: well , theyhave different , {vocalsound} um , opinions about this . Some people think that {vocalsound} it 's more important to look at {disfmarker} {vocalsound} to have ten percent imp relative improvement on {pause} well -matched case than to have fifty percent on the m mismatched , and other people think that it 's more important to improve a lot on the mismatch and {disfmarker} So , buPhD C: It sounds like they don't really have agood idea about what the final application is gonna be .PhD A: l de fff ! Mmm .Professor B: Well , you know , the {disfmarker} the thing is {vocalsound} that if you look at the numbers on the {disfmarker} on the moredifficult cases , {vocalsound} um , if you really believe that was gonna be the predominant use , {vocalsound} none of this would be good enough .PhD A: Yeah . Mmm . Yeah .Professor B: Nothing anybody 's{disfmarker}PhD C: Mm - hmm .Professor B: whereas {vocalsound} you sort of with some reasonable error recovery could imagine in the better cases that these {disfmarker} these systems working . So , um , I thinkthe hope would be that it would {disfmarker} {vocalsound} uh , it would work well {pause} for the good cases and , uh , it would have reasonable {disfmarker} reas {vocalsound} soft degradation as you got to worseand worse conditions . Um .PhD C: Yeah . I {disfmarker} I guess what I 'm {disfmarker} I mean , I {disfmarker} I was thinking about it in terms of , if I were building the final product and I was gonna test to see whichfront - end I 'd {disfmarker} {vocalsound} I wanted to use , I would {vocalsound} try to {pause} weight things depending on the exact environment that I was gonna be using the system in .Professor B: But{disfmarker} but {disfmarker} No .PhD C: If I {disfmarker}Professor B: Well , no {disfmarker} well , no . I mean , {vocalsound} it isn't the operating theater . I mean , they don they {disfmarker} they don't{disfmarker} they don't really {pause} know , I think .PhD C: Yeah .Professor B: I mean , I thPhD C: So if {disfmarker} if they don't know , doesn't that suggest the way for them to go ? Uh , you assume everything 'sequal . I mean , y y I mean , you {disfmarker}Professor B: Well , I mean , I {disfmarker} I think one thing to do is to just not rely on a single number {disfmarker} to maybe have two or three numbers ,PhD C: Yeah.Professor B: you know ,PhD C: Right .Professor B: and {disfmarker} and {disfmarker} and say {vocalsound} here 's how much you , uh {disfmarker} you improve {vocalsound} the , uh {disfmarker} the {disfmarker}the relatively clean case and here 's {disfmarker} or {disfmarker} or well - matched case , and here 's how {disfmarker} here 's how much you ,PhD C: Mm - hmm .Professor B: uh {disfmarker}PhD C: So not{disfmarker}Professor B: So .PhD C: So not try to combine them .Professor B: Yeah . Uh , actually it 's true .PhD C: Yeah .Professor B: Uh , I had forgotten this , uh , but , uh , well - matched is not actually clean . Whatit is is just that , u uh , the training and testing are similar .PhD C: The training and testing .PhD A: Mmm .Professor B: So , I guess what you would do in practice is you 'd try to get as many , {vocalsound} uh ,examples of similar sort of stuff as you could , and then ,PhD C: Yeah .Professor B: uh {disfmarker} So the argument for that being the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the more important thing , {vocalsound} is thatyou 're gonna try and do that , {vocalsound} but you wanna see how badly it deviates from that when {disfmarker} when {disfmarker} when the , uh {disfmarker} it 's a little different .PhD C: So{disfmarker}Professor B: Um ,PhD C: so you should weight those other conditions v very {disfmarker} you know , really small .Professor B: But {disfmarker} No . That 's a {disfmarker} that 's a {disfmarker} that 's anargPhD C: I mean , that 's more of an information kind of thing .Professor B: that 's an ar Well , that 's an argument for it , but let me give you the opposite argument . The opposite argument is you 're never reallygonna have a good sample of all these different things .PhD C: Uh - huh .Professor B: I mean , are you gonna have w uh , uh , examples with the windows open , half open , full open ? Going seventy , sixty , fifty , fortymiles an hour ? On what kind of roads ?PhD C: Mm - hmm .Professor B: With what passing you ? With {disfmarker} uh , I mean ,PhD C: Mm - hmm .Professor B: I {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} I think that you couldmake the opposite argument that the well - matched case is a fantasy .PhD C: Mm - hmm .Professor B: You know , so ,Grad E: Uh - huh .Professor B: I think the thing is is that if you look at the well - matched caseversus the po you know , the {disfmarker} the medium and the {disfmarker} and the fo and then the mismatched case , {vocalsound} um , we 're seeing really , really big differences in performance . Right ? And{disfmarker} and y you wouldn't like that to be the case . You wouldn't like that as soon as you step outside {disfmarker} You know , a lot of the {disfmarker} the cases it 's {disfmarker} is {disfmarker}PhD C: Well ,that 'll teach them to roll their window up .Professor B: I mean , in these cases , if you go from the {disfmarker} the , uh {disfmarker} I mean , I don't remember the numbers right off , but if you {disfmarker} if you gofrom the well - matched case to the medium , {vocalsound} it 's not an enormous difference in the {disfmarker} in the {disfmarker} the training - testing situation , and {disfmarker} and {disfmarker} and it 's a reallybig {vocalsound} performance drop .PhD C: Mm - hmm .Professor B: You know , so , um {disfmarker} Yeah , I mean the reference one , for instance {disfmarker} this is back old on , uh {disfmarker} on Italian{disfmarker} uh , was like {pause} six percent error for the well - matched and eighteen for the medium - matched and sixty for the {disfmarker} {vocalsound} for highly - mismatched . Uh , and , you know , withthese other systems we {disfmarker} we {vocalsound} helped it out quite a bit , but still there 's {disfmarker} there 's something like a factor of two or something between well - matched and medium - matched . And{vocalsound} so I think that {vocalsound} if what you 're {disfmarker} {vocalsound} if the goal of this is to come up with robust features , it does mean {disfmarker} So you could argue , in fact , that the well -matched is something you shouldn't be looking at at all , that {disfmarker} that the goal is to come up with features {vocalsound} that will still give you reasonable performance , you know , with again gentle degregradegradation , um , even though the {disfmarker} the testing condition is not the same as the training .PhD C: Hmm .Professor B: So , you know , I {disfmarker} I could argue strongly that something like the mediummismatch , which is you know not compl pathological but {disfmarker} I mean , what was the {disfmarker} the medium - mismatch condition again ?PhD A: Um , {vocalsound} it 's {disfmarker} Yeah . Medium


Lynne Neagle AM: Good afternoon. Can I welcome Members to the virtual meeting of the Children, Young People and Education Committee this afternoon? In accordance with Standing Order 34.19, I've determined thatthe public are excluded from the committee's meeting, in order to protect public health. In accordance with Standing Order 34.21, notice of this decision was included in the agenda for this meeting, which was publishedlast Thursday. This meeting is, however, being broadcast live on Senedd.tv, with all participants joining via video-conference. A record of proceedings will be published as usual. Aside from the procedural adaptationrelated to conducting proceedings remotely, all other Standing Order requirements for committees remain in place. The meeting is bilingual, and simultaneous translation from Welsh to English is available. Can I remindeveryone that the microphones will be controlled centrally, so there's no need to turn them on and off individually? We've received apologies for absence from Hefin David AM, and there is no substitution. Can I askMembers if there are any declarations of interest, please? No. Okay, thank you. Can I just note for the record that if for any reason I drop out of the meeting, the committee has agreed that Dawn Bowden AM willtemporarily chair while I try to rejoin? Moving on, then, to item 2 this afternoon, which is an evidence session with the Welsh Government in relation to the impact of the coronavirus pandemic on health and socialservices as they relate to children and young people in Wales. I'm very pleased to welcome Vaughan Gething AM, the Minister for Health and Social Services; Julie Morgan AM, Deputy Minister for Health and SocialServices; Albert Heaney, deputy director general of the health and social services group; Nicola Edwards, deputy director, childcare, play and early years; Jean White, chief nursing officer; and Tracey Breheny, who isdeputy director of mental health, substance misuse and vulnerable groups. Thank you all very much for your attendance today—we appreciate your time. We've got lots of questions that we'd like to cover, which we'llgo straight into, with questions from Siân Gwenllian.Sian Gwenllian AM: Good afternoon. How much do we understand about how this virus impacts children and young people, and their role in transmitting the virus?And how important is it that this is considered in the Welsh Government's exit strategy, especially in the context of reopening schools?Vaughan Gething AM: Okay. I think it's fair to say that our understanding isdeveloping across all age ranges about the virus and its impact. It's still the case that children and young people are less likely to be affected significantly by COVID-19 than people with a range of healthcare conditions,and in particular the age grade that we've seen, and that's underpinned the advice we've given to the whole population about self-isolation by people in age categories, as well as the extremely vulnerable group weadvise to shield. We still don't understand everything about the role that children have to play in the transmitting of the virus, and this is one of the difficulties we face. Because in cold and flu, children transmit the virusand they're also susceptible, in particular to the flu, as well; that's why we have a childhood immunisation programme for the flu as well. We do know that there's some developing evidence about what's called aKawasaki-like syndrome, but that's affecting very small numbers of children. We have one possible case in Wales—a child who's in critical care—but that isn't confirmed. That's still a developing knowledge base. So, therest of the world is still trying to understand that too. But the generals still apply—that children are less likely to be affected than older people, but can nevertheless still become unwell, and that's, if you like, one of thefew positives in this condition. But as I say, we're still learning, so I won't try and present a fully accurate or finalised picture of knowledge in this area.Sian Gwenllian AM: And in terms—[Inaudible.]Vaughan GethingAM: Chair. Sorry. Excuse me, Chair. Sorry—with apologies to the Member, my translation stopped after a while, so I heard the first part translated, and then it just fell off. I'm really sorry, but I didn't want to try toanswer a different question to the one that may be being asked, and don't think that's fair to the Member or other members of the committee.Lynne Neagle AM: Can we check that translation is back on, please, andmaybe Siân could repeat her question?Vaughan Gething AM: I can hear it, yes.Lynne Neagle AM: Okay, Siân, would you mind repeating that, please?Sian Gwenllian AM: Not at all. I was discussing NHS services,including critical care services, and I was asking whether there is sufficient capacity in place to manage any increase. We, of course, hope that there won't be any increase, but should there be an increase, particularly inpaediatric cases of coronavirus—let's say such a thing were to happen and this rare syndrome that you mentioned did emerge here in Wales—do we have the capacity in place to deal with these, and with the impact ofcoronavirus more generally on children?Vaughan Gething AM: At this point in time, the answer is 'yes', and there is always a significant caveat, though, and the 'but' that comes in there is that despite the fact thatwe've got a plan for surge capacity in paediatric care—. So, when we increased critical care right across the national health service, we of course looked at paediatric care as part of that as well. So, we can flex up ourcapacity. But the challenge in all of that this is—it's part of my caution and the Government's caution about moves out of lockdown. So, it's much easier to go into lockdown than to come out of it, and I know you heardevidence from the Minister for Education last week about the approach that she wants to take and the principles behind doing that. So, actually, we'll need to think carefully about if we are reopening schools, even on alimited basis, what that then does to the circulation of coronavirus within that group of children as well as within the wider community, and then to try to understand whether the current capacity we have planned for insurge capacity is still going to be enough, because, actually, one of the real success stories of the first stage of the fight with coronavirus is that we haven't had our critical care capacity filled up. It's been extended, andthe extension has meant that we haven't been overtopped. If we hadn't done that, we definitely would have been. And we'll need to carry on testing ourselves and seeing what's happening and looking at the evidenceand making sure that the plan we already have got that we published for paediatric critical care is still fit for purpose, and again to reconsider if we need to do things differently. But that's part of the difficulty of being aMinister at the moment—you don't know everything that's coming, and on this disease in particular, we do know that we're still learning with each passing day.Lynne Neagle AM: [Inaudible.]—Siân?Sian Gwenllian AM:Hello. Yes, those are the questions I had on that section.Lynne Neagle AM: Okay. Lovely. Thank you very much. Right, we'll move on now then to some question on access to health services from Dawn Bowden.DawnBowden AM: Thank you, Chair. Minister, just some concern that you will have heard about in terms of parents and carers maybe not taking their children into the healthcare system for other conditions while thecoronavirus pandemic is with us. How are you monitoring that situation at the moment and have you had to look at your own commutation strategy in relation to that?Vaughan Gething AM: We've had to look at somespecifics around communication, so challenges about not just different languages, but about how we get messages to people in a very different environment, and it's really challenging. So, for example, our health visitorservice has absolutely not stopped. We've had to think about the way it works, and I had this conversation earlier this week with the chief nurse. But the bigger challenge are parents refusing to engage with the service.I understand people's fear and anxiety, but that then means that their family, and in particular their child, isn't getting the sort of proactive care that we would want them to have. So, there's a real concern both at theprofessional leadership end and for the chief nurse and for Ministers as well about how we can get through. That's actually about rebuilding people's confidence in the service, and that isn't straightforward becausethere's a broader concern about coronavirus still circulating. But I think for us it's really important to reiterate that we have thought again about how to provide the service. We've thought about how to protect staff andfamilies and the very clear message to parents is to please make sure that when health and care professionals are calling to help and support your family, please discuss your concerns with them. We're doing even moreremotely, via telephone and online as well. There are times you need to be physically in the same place, for example on routine vaccinations, because we certainly haven't stopped that programme either, and I reallywouldn't want to see that one of the unintended consequences of what we've done is that if parents don't engage with that service, we could potentially see a rise in other diseases. We're all, I think—not just you inyour constituency, but others who are on this call and others as well—seeing an occasional reappearance of measles, and that's because people didn't engage with the vaccination programme. I don't want, either myselfor a different health Minister in the future, to be sat here talking about how in years to come the failure to engage in a vaccination programme has led to clearly avoidable but significant harm to children and youngpeople and the communities they live in.Lynne Neagle AM: Thank you. Jean, you wanted to come in.Vaughan Gething AM: You need to unmute yourself. Oh, no—Professor Jean White: Thank you. I just want to add towhat the Minister said. So, I approached the immunisation lead in Public Health Wales to see exactly what has been happening recently and they said at the very beginning of the outbreak parents were very reluctantabout coming forward for their routine immunisations, but recently, through lots of energy from the immunisation clinics and the leads within it reaching out to families, that trend seems to have turned and there's nowa much better attendance. One of the most important things we can do to protect our children is to make sure they have their vaccinations. So, yes, there was a bit of a downturn, but it does seem to be improving atthe moment. Thank you.Dawn Bowden AM: Okay, thank you. And that answered my second question, Chair, so I'm happy to leave it there. Thank you.Lynne Neagle AM: Okay, thank you very much. We're going to goon now to some questions about mental health from Siân Gwenllian. Siân.Sian Gwenllian AM: It's a cause of great concern to us all, of course, in terms of the impact of this crisis on mental health and well-being amongour children and young people. So, what assessment has the Government undertaken of the impact on these aspects in young people and what work is being done to understand the impact of the pandemic? Whatlonger term measures will be put in place and what support services will be put in place?Vaughan Gething AM: Again, I think it's helpful that you've already heard from the education Minister last week, because I thinkthe first of her key principles for returning to school is the impact on the emotional health and well-being of children. So, children's mental health was a central concern and remains so for both myself and the educationMinister. Part of the honest challenge, again, is that we don't fully understand the impact on the mental health and well-being of children but we do expect there will have been an impact. So, we're working togetherwith both health boards and our own knowledge and analytical services across the Government to both try to further understand what that is and the difference. Until we have more contact with families, we may notfully understand that, and that's a real point of concern for me. In all of the unknowns within this, the impact on mental health and well-being is absolutely one of them, because we're looking at how we then developnot just a recovery plan for the economy but a recovery plan around mental health, how we support people, and that will have to be informed by the understanding of what's happening when we get more engagementwith families about the level of need, and then how we need to think about that. Obviously, it's a key factor for their return to school, but, actually, for the life children and young people lead outside the schoolenvironment, and that will be difficult because we're going to phase out of lockdown—it's not going to be a one-hit measure. That absolutely isn't going to happen. We're going to be looking at, at each point, whatdifference has been made, what more we can do. And, again, there are the efforts we're making to make sure that our online support services and our telephone support services—that we keep on reminding people thatthey're there and are available, and we want people to make use of them, because I know, as this committee said, we'd much rather be able to support people and intervene earlier rather than wait until there's a muchbigger problem in a period of months in the future.Sian Gwenllian AM: So, in reality, there's been no assessment undertaken because it's difficult to do that. So, the full picture in terms of the outcomes of the crisis—youdon't know what they are at the moment as things stand.Vaughan Gething AM: We can't know, because we don't have that level of contact. There is a development—. I wouldn't say that no work's being done, but Icouldn't tell you honestly that that work is finalised and we have a definitive understanding of the picture. If I tried to say that, then I'm sure you'd ask me, 'How on earth can you say that? If you're not having regularcontact with people, you can't possibly understand the picture.' And it's much better to say, 'We don't understand the full picture. We know there'll have been an impact. We're working alongside health boards andothers, but we'll know more as we carry on having more contact with families.' I'll look at a variety of different areas, again, both to reform the recovery plan, but also then to understand what we need to do at variouspoints in the future, and the picture that we're seeing isn't straightforward and we need to make sure that we don't try to pretend to ourselves or to the public that there is a one-off measure that will allow us to besuccessful in all the areas that we'd want to be.Sian Gwenllian AM: But can you give the committee an assurance today that this area of mental health and well-being is going to be a priority for you as healthMinister?Vaughan Gething AM: Of course. Not just on the work we've done in the past; not just because it's one of the key principles for the education Minister about the reopening of schools, but it is a real worry list forme about how we understand the impact on the mental health and well-being of children and young people, and to move forwards, that we don't end up with an entire generation of children and young people who growup with a range of damage because we haven't thought about what that will look like. So, the mental health recovery plan will of course be of very real importance to me. In amongst all the other priorities I have, I'mcertainly not going to allow the mental health and well-being of children and young people to be forgotten.Sian Gwenllian AM: And how does the current capacity in terms of child and adolescent mental health servicescompare to service capacity prior to the coronavirus outbreak in Wales? Have you had to shift some resources over from CAMHS, for example, in order to deal with more general aspects of coronavirus?Vaughan GethingAM: No, we've actually got—. Maybe perhaps it might be helpful, Chair, if Tracey Breheny could say something about the way that we're monitoring the impact we have, in terms of we've got a reporting tool, but alsoweekly contact with leads in CAMHS services.Lynne Neagle AM: Tracey.Tracey Breheny: Of course. Thanks, Minister. Yes, on that question, we moved pretty quickly at the beginning of the pandemic phase to put inplace, as the Minister said, a weekly monitoring tool of all local health boards, so through that tool, we look at that every week in terms of collecting information. Whilst national reporting's been stood down, we arepicking up assurance through that tool on things like staff sickness in CAMHS services, referral numbers and so on, so we do have that tool in place, and at the moment, that's telling us that the system can meet thecapacity; has the capacity to meet need.Sian Gwenllian AM: Have CAMHS staff been shifted over to do other work during this virus outbreak?Tracey Breheny: There has been some movement, as I'm saying, aroundhealth boards, particularly where in the first phase of the epidemic the concentration was on in-patient provision, providing critical care, but my understanding is from the latest tool that we looked at last week, thosestaff are gradually not just returning to work from self-isolation or whatever, or from different parts of the system.Sian Gwenllian AM: And then, what about the capacity for CAMHS primary mental health services? Hasthere been a reduction in that capacity since the beginning of the pandemic in terms of in-patients? Because that's what I'm hearing, that there has been such a reduction, but how are those patients then treated andserved?Tracey Breheny: In terms of in-patient capacity, that is in the system in both the north Wales and in the south Wales unit at the moment. There were some discharges of young people, but we've had theassurance that that was only undertaken where it was clinically safe to do so and where the community support was in place.Sian Gwenllian AM: And finally in this section from me, given that schools are of courseclosed and that schools are so very important in terms of signposting young people towards services, how can young people access appropriate services—online services, for example? How are they signposted towardsthose services at the moment?Vaughan Gething AM: Well, we've not closed off general practice and, as you know, we've expanded the ability for people to access services in an online manner. We've expanded a rangeof telephone advice services, so the telephone advice service we already provide, we've made sure that's maintained, and both myself and the deputy Minister have referred to that on a number of occasions. I think thereal struggle and the real difficulty is actually how you punch through different messages when the broader news agenda is so overwhelmingly focused on headline messages in other areas. That is, again, a worry forme, but the communications we have within the health and care system, people should know where to refer people to and how to provide access to both telephone and online support that continues to be available, andactually, as I say, we've expanded that right across our healthcare system. That's what I’m keen to see continue into the future. Whatever the post-COVID-19 world is, I don't want to miss out on the progress we havemade in the online provision of services. Of course, most children and young people expect to be able to access services in an online manner already.Sian Gwenllian AM: But, of course, there will be some who aremissed; they may fall between two stools because they won’t know where to turn.Vaughan Gething AM: Yes, and that, again, comes back to our challenge of how we help children and young people in their context, withtheir families, to know where support and advice and guidance is. Many people are defaulting to their general practitioner if they can't find advice somewhere else, so that's why there's the information we're providingthrough general practice to signpost people, so those pathways haven’t been closed off. It's about making sure that people have alternative means that they’re prepared to use at this point in time. If we go back towhere we started this evidence session, we were talking about the difficulty of families who don't want to engage in a traditional person-to-person contact or being in the same room as someone else or allowing peopleinto their home. So, there's a real challenge about how we make the service available, but then encourage people to take it up, so that we don’t see much greater harm that we have to try and resolve at a laterpoint.Lynne Neagle AM: Okay, thank you. I've got a supplementary from Suzy Davies, and can I remind Ministers about concise answers, please? Suzy.Suzy Davies AM: Yes, thank you. Just as we're speaking aboutchildren and young people's mental health, I wonder if you can confirm whether you've seen the United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child's reports about what they call the grave physical and psychological


Project Manager: So {disfmarker} Hello . {vocalsound}Marketing: Good afternoon . Sorry I'm a little late .Project Manager: No problem .Marketing: Got stuck in the traffic .Project Manager: Okay . {vocalsound}UserInterface: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: That's possible on uh this time of day . Starts at three o'clock . Uh {disfmarker} {vocalsound}Marketing: Yeah .Project Manager: Uh , let mesee . Our fourth and last meeting . There he is . Yes . Okay this our last meeting . In this meeting we will discuss our final design . And we will do some evaluation about the , not only the product , but also the project .And then we're going to close the project today as well . So after this you will be uh free to go and uh spend all your money . {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing:{vocalsound} {vocalsound}Project Manager: And this uh design , detailed design meeting uh we will discuss uh the look-and-feel of the design , the usability interface design , and we will do the product evaluation . Um, in order to do that we have this agenda . We'll have the prototype presentation first . Then we will set up some evaluation cri um criteria . {vocalsound} Then we will look at the finance . Uh we will have to see ifeverything we wanna do is also possible within our budget . Because everything costs money , and the more functions you wanna have the more money it will cost . So we have to see if it fits within the twelve and ahalf Euro per remote . But we will see that later . Then we will do the project uh evaluation , and the closing after that .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: We've got forty minutes . So we will be finishedat half past three . But first um we will do the {disfmarker} this is prototype presentation . So , if some yeah if somebody wants step forward .Industrial Designer: Okay . Well this is what me and Richard came up with .The default spot for the on-off button . The mute button just below that . Then there's the volume and channel selectors . Simple plus-minus button . Uh we thought of a help button . If you hold it and you press anotherbutton , uh the help goes to the L_C_D_ screen . Then there's the zero to {disfmarker} one to zero buttons . A button for teletext . A button for the subtitles . And the company logo . So it's rather simple prototype .And uh we'll have to see from testing uh how the users take it .Project Manager: Okay .Marketing: Um , {vocalsound} is this the moment where we ask or can ask questions about the functionality ?User Interface: So{disfmarker} Yeah . Yeah .Industrial Designer: Sure uh just pop in at any time .Marketing: Um , when you're in teletext there usually are buttons where you just you just press it and you g go to the next teletext page.User Interface: Uh , that's just uh the normal uh as th as the normal uh remote controls uh {disfmarker} So um {disfmarker} You put it uh {disfmarker} you um came in uh page uh one hundred . Now you can use thenormal uh one to zero buttons .Marketing: Mm-hmm .User Interface: And you {disfmarker} But you can also uh use the um button th for uh changing the the channel . S so uh the shifting uh button . Uh for uh yeahshif shifting up in uh on t on t uh teletext , and shifting uh down . So {disfmarker}Marketing: Okay . Okay . Um {disfmarker} Yeah .Project Manager: Okay . Uh but um I thought in a few meetings earlier we uh uh triedto keep it uh simple . Uh just a few buttons and large buttons .User Interface: Oh yeah ?Project Manager: But uh I think these are altogether quite a quite a few buttons . So I'm wondering if we if we neely {disfmarker}really need all of those buttons .User Interface: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: I think if you look at most controls , they've got more buttons than this .Project Manager: That's right .User Interface:Yeah .Industrial Designer: And well the on-off button , it's it's a necessity .Project Manager: Yeah .User Interface: Yeah .Industrial Designer: You can't drop that one . The volume and channel buttons , you need youobviously need those those .Project Manager: Yeah .Industrial Designer: The mute button could be replaced uh by pressing the volume-down button twice . So we could cancel that one . I think the help button really isnecessaryUser Interface: Yeah yeah .Industrial Designer: because there's no other way to know when someone wants to know what a button does .Project Manager: Mm .User Interface: Uh , or you can build in uh whenyou press uh one button uh uh {disfmarker}Project Manager: Long time . Yeah .User Interface: Yeah .Project Manager: If you put {disfmarker}User Interface: But m Yeah . We disc discuss that already . But uh wethink uh old people uh don't know that uh option . So uh they just put in uh put {vocalsound} press uh the button and uh {disfmarker}Project Manager: Yeah . Okay .Industrial Designer: Well , {vocalsound} you can'tleave out the number buttons I guess .Project Manager: Yeah .User Interface: And uh {disfmarker}Project Manager: Uh teletext and subtitles are yeah necessary .Industrial Designer: And {disfmarker}{vocalsound}User Interface: Oh .Industrial Designer: Yeah .Marketing: Yeah .Project Manager: Okay .Industrial Designer: So it's rather basic already .Marketing: Yeah . Think so . That's what I pointed out earlier . Ifyou just make a control for just the T_V_ there's just not much to gain here .Project Manager: Yep .User Interface: Yeah .Project Manager: Okay . So we had somebody about th interfa Something about the design ofthe buttons there ?Industrial Designer: Yeah , they're {disfmarker}Project Manager: Just n normal plain buttons .User Interface: Yeah . Yeah ,Industrial Designer: It's rather hard to draw on the white-board .UserInterface: it {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: But they're supposed to be equal sized , round , with a with a little logo on it for the for the volume , the the triangle and stuff .Project Manager: Yeah . 'Kay .UserInterface: Yeah yeah . Just to recognise it , so uh {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Just for recognition .User Interface: Uh yeah and now we don't need uh LEDs or um {disfmarker} Y uhProject Manager: No .UserInterface: s some uh remote controls uh do it also ,Project Manager: No .User Interface: but um uh because we use the little display we don't uh have to use it . Uh so {disfmarker}Project Manager: Yeah . Okay.Industrial Designer: So and for the materials we've just chosen for rubber buttons . With a a different colour than the case .User Interface: Nay .Project Manager: Yep .Industrial Designer: So they jump out .ProjectManager: Okay .Industrial Designer: And uh that's about it .Project Manager: That's nice . Then because we only have thirty minutes left , I will move on to the finance part , which is pretty exciting , to see if it's allpossible what we wanna do . And I can tell you that we're going to have a pretty hard time producing this for twelve and a half Euros .Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: Mm .Project Manager: If we see{disfmarker} I don't know if I've filled in correctly , so just correct me if you see uh something wrong . I counted two batteries . But maybe we can also use one . I don't know if it's possible .Marketing: Since itrechargeable .Project Manager: It's rechargeable . That's right .User Interface: Yeah we can u just uh {gap} {disfmarker}Project Manager: Okay . That's two Euros off . {vocalsound}User Interface: 'Kay .{vocalsound}Project Manager: We need the advanced chip . So there's not much to uh {vocalsound} to save there .Industrial Designer: Yep .Project Manager: {vocalsound} Here we have the single curves . Uh we cansee that the difference between uncurved and the single curved is one Euro . Um ,User Interface: Mm .Project Manager: I don't know , but I think the single curved is good for design , and also for the display to have aprominent place on the remote control .User Interface: Yeah .Project Manager: I think we have to keep that .Industrial Designer: Yes .User Interface: Yeah .Project Manager: Then we have the case materialsupplements . It's plastic . It's the cheapest one we need . So that's uh not much to save either . But then the biggest costs are the buttons . So maybe we really should try to discard some buttons to uh keep our costslow .User Interface: Okay .Project Manager: Because you have to {disfmarker} we will have to get the twelve and a half Euros at the end . Um ,User Interface: Yeah .Project Manager: so if we {disfmarker} Let's fir firstcount the buttons we have now .User Interface: Uh {disfmarker} Sixteen , I believe so .Project Manager: Because I {disfmarker} {vocalsound} Sixteen . Nah , that will be even more then . Eighteen Euros . So ,UserInterface: Uh seventeen . Uh with the help button .Project Manager: seventeen .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: Um {disfmarker}Project Manager: Okay , including the help ?Industrial Designer: Yep.Marketing: Damn .Project Manager: Yeah . Uh seventeen .User Interface: Yeah .Project Manager: I think we can uh discard the help and the mute button uh by pressing down volume long , or pressing down a anumber long .Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: {gap} .Industrial Designer: Yep .Project Manager: That saves us uh one Euro already . 'Cause then we have got fifteen I think ?Industrial Designer: Yeah.Marketing: Wouldn't {disfmarker}Project Manager: Fifteen buttons .Marketing: Yeah . No . That wouldn't be an option .Project Manager: And this is {disfmarker}Marketing: Uh , d I assume you'd count the volume andchannel thingies for two buttons each , right ?Project Manager: No those are one , I think .User Interface: Yeah . Where did uh {disfmarker} {vocalsound}Marketing: Well , think actually there're two buttons ,UserInterface: Uh , it's just one button .Marketing: aren't they ?User Interface: But , um {disfmarker} Yeah . There were uh two uh for one big button . But they are uh more expensive than the small ones . Uh , yeah . So{disfmarker}Project Manager: Yeah but th it's not stated in this files .User Interface: It's just a {gap} .Project Manager: So maybe we can we can even make one button with the volume and the channel in one , bypressingMarketing: Well I was thinking , maybe you could just integrate three of those numbers to one button .Project Manager: That's possibility as well .Marketing: That would cut the cost .Project Manager: So{disfmarker} And it's good for the design as well . So you can make {disfmarker} Uh let's see . If you make this {disfmarker} {vocalsound} Looks a bit like uh a cross . {vocalsound} Plus . Min .User Interface: But Idon't don't know if if it's cheaper .Project Manager: Uh s yeah channel .User Interface: So uh ,Project Manager: Yeah wUser Interface: we've still got four buttons , but just um {disfmarker} So {disfmarker}ProjectManager: Yeah th I think they count uh the materials .User Interface: You got uh not not a butt button itself , but uh on the um {disfmarker}Project Manager: Yeah on the chip there . Yeah .User Interface: Yeah . Onthe chip you've got still uh four uh four buttons .Industrial Designer: Yeah .Marketing: Mm-hmm .Project Manager: That's right . That's right .User Interface: So {disfmarker}Project Manager: But I think because wehave the advanced chipMarketing: Yeah .Project Manager: {vocalsound} we can just count this as one button .User Interface: Yeah , but {disfmarker}Marketing: {vocalsound} But , I think this really is four buttonsanyhow .Project Manager: But {disfmarker} No but I think {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Yes .Project Manager: {vocalsound} Yeah . Maybe it is , but then it seems to me that it's impossible to get the twelve and ahalf Euros . Also the L_C_ display , I think it's , I think it's too expensive for the display we use .Marketing: Yes .Industrial Designer: Uh that's that's a big cost .Project Manager: I think they uh try tIndustrial Designer:If we leave out the display we can also save money on the chip .Project Manager: That's right , but what's the big advantage of our remote then ? {vocalsound}Marketing: Only the docking station , I guess .ProjectManager: Yeah .Industrial Designer: Which isn't the {disfmarker} the docking station isn't even in this c s schematic .Project Manager: No .Industrial Designer: So it's not even taken into the price .Project Manager:That's extra . {vocalsound} That's extra . That's right .Marketing: Maybe we should to a different supplier .Project Manager: {vocalsound} That's an option .Marketing: {vocalsound} {vocalsound} Yeah .ProjectManager: Poland . Something . {vocalsound} Polish supplier . Don't you think we can , if we can count this as v as one button , and integrate th uh these buttons in three , then we save a lot of money as well .IndustrialDesigner: {vocalsound} We we could save money on it . But would it make the remote more usable for elderly people ?User Interface: {gap} .Marketing: Yeah , that's what I'm wondering . {vocalsound}IndustrialDesigner: My mother can't even send send an S_M_S_ message .Project Manager: Yeah . That's a point .Industrial Designer: So {disfmarker}User Interface: {vocalsound} Are we gonna buy a um a remote control uhwhen you can uh use it ?Marketing: Um {disfmarker}User Interface: So um {disfmarker} Yeah . We m uh we must um stay below the um below um twelve uh fifty or {disfmarker} Can't uh go um {disfmarker}ProjectManager: Yep .Industrial Designer: Yeah .Project Manager: No .Marketing: Well , since the market research indicated that older people spend their money easier , more easy , maybe it's feasible to just put the price ofthe remote up a little . Especially since we have those nice features .User Interface: Nay .Project Manager: Yeah but uh we have to stick to the twelve and a half Euros . We don't have any more budget to develop it.User Interface: Is it impossible to {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: The margin will get too small . Yeah .Project Manager: Yeah . So {disfmarker}User Interface: But it is possible to make one uh for uh twelve fifty.Project Manager: It is . If you leave out the L_C_ display . And if you use less buttons . Say {disfmarker} Or you can take the single chip .User Interface: I don't think so .Marketing: It would be a be a pretty rigid one.User Interface: S Yeah . {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: But , you can't use uh {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Ten .Project Manager: There it is . {vocalsound}User Interface: Yeah .IndustrialDesigner: {vocalsound}Project Manager: But then w Good looking .User Interface: Uh , wi with n Oh , with uh attractive uh o options .Project Manager: Yeah .User Interface: So uh , you can stay uh below uh twelvefifty . So {disfmarker}Project Manager: I think it's uh difficult as well ,Marketing: Or bProject Manager: but {disfmarker}Marketing: Basically becoming a choice between like either a good remote and a higherproduction cost , or just any other remote control .Industrial Designer: No remote . {vocalsound}Project Manager: Or we can leave out the ten buttons and take one scroll wheel for the programme numbers . ThenwUser Interface: Scroll-wheel's one .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} That's {disfmarker}Project Manager: Because then we save ten buttons .User Interface: No , it {disfmarker}Project Manager: Then we have fiveand one .User Interface: Yeah .Project Manager: And and see . If we have this one and we've got the advanced {disfmarker} W uh , we're getting close . {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: We're getting closer .UserInterface: Yeah . {vocalsound}Marketing: But how does scroll-wheel work here ?Project Manager: Then you will {disfmarker} Or maybe you can um scroll . If you scroll you will see the numbers on the L_C_D_ display .Until you've got the right number , then you push it .Industrial Designer: Yeah .Marketing: That would bring up the price of the scroll-wheel also . Integrated scroll-wheel push-button .Project Manager: Alright . It'sgotta scroll and push .User Interface: Mm .Project Manager: Okay but then you you can push uh some other button as well .Marketing: But {disfmarker} Yeah .Industrial Designer: You could just not scroll for a half asecond .Project Manager: Yeah . That's right . So if you scroll to a number and then you wait a half second , then it g turns to that channel .Industrial Designer: So you won't need a button .Marketing: I think that wouldbe like the end of our usability .Project Manager: {vocalsound} But it would definitely crop cost , a lot .User Interface: D yeah . {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound} Yeah , but{disfmarker} {vocalsound}Project Manager: And we need the battery . {vocalsound} And the regular chip is not possible ? It has to be advanced ?Industrial Designer: If you want to use an L_C_D_ screen you you needan advanced chip , yes .Project Manager: It has to be advanced . Yeah . Okay .User Interface: Hmm .Project Manager: And we can save a Euro by a flat design . That's an option we can {disfmarker}User Interface: Jaja .Industrial Designer: Yep .Project Manager: Then we're almost there .Industrial Designer: Yeah if you v could just leave out one more button .Project Manager: Yeah . So if we {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah , orwe have to uh skip the subtitle uh button .Industrial Designer: Yeah .Project Manager: Yeah but I think that's {disfmarker} That is a big advantage ,User Interface: So {disfmarker} Yeah {disfmarker}Project Manager:if we're {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah it's a big advantage .Project Manager: But {disfmarker}User Interface: But um , it's {disfmarker}Project Manager: Can we use {disfmarker} can't we integrate the teletext andthe subtitles in one button ?User Interface: Uh , yeah .Industrial Designer: I think so . Yeah .Project Manager: If you push it three times ?Marketing: Well , think it's pretty much the teletext subtitles areUser Interface:Yeah .Marketing: right now you just push the teletext button , go to page eight eight eight ,Project Manager: Yeah .User Interface: Yeah .Marketing: and teletext disappears . But the subtitles stay there .User Interface:{gap} {disfmarker} But if you push the teletext button twice {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} What if you have to scroll to page eighty eight ? Eight hundred eighty eight . {vocalsound}Marketing: I thinkthat's the case on most {disfmarker}User Interface: It's uh {disfmarker} One m uh one b uh , a few buttons .Project Manager: Ah that's not really that {disfmarker}Marketing: Well , that could be just uh like the scrollto eight , click , scroll to eight , click , scroll to eight , click .Industrial Designer: Yeah . Okay .Marketing: But then again that would be d j just pretty much not an option for older people ,Industrial Designer: No.Marketing: who don't even know what a scroll-wheel is .User Interface: Yeah .Project Manager: No .Marketing: Holding a remote with {vocalsound} which they expect to have like ten buttons for the numbers one tozero .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: With only five buttons on it . And a scroll-wheel .Project Manager: I think if you make a good advertisement uh on television and in the in the guide , you can explainto the people how to use the scroll wheel . If you just make it real simple . Because it saves it saves a lot of money . And we can keep our L_C_D_ screen , which can provide extra information . How to use the scrollwheel . How to use the other bu buttons as subtitles .Marketing: True . True .User Interface: Hmm .Project Manager: And it's good for the innovative design as well . If you would erase these . Mm eraser ? And we putuh {disfmarker} Looks a bit odd maybe . {vocalsound}Marketing: That's a pretty big scroll wheel .Project Manager: That is {disfmarker} {vocalsound} Something like that .Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager:Then , yeah . We've got the scroll-wheel . One , two , three , four , five buttons , if we erase this one . And these are two buttons then .Industrial Designer: We could make two buttons out of that . And just um{disfmarker} If you press the volume button you can control the volume with the scroll-wheel .Project Manager: Yeah .Industrial Designer: So that would save two buttons . If you do the same for the channel .ProjectManager: Yeah . That's really a good good idea , I think . And it will make the use of the scroll wheel uh more obvious indeed .Industrial Designer: More obvious .Project Manager: So we make one for the volume , onefor the channel . Plus scroll . That's right .Industrial Designer: So if we {disfmarker}Project Manager: So we've got one , two , three . Yeah , we can leave the teletext in if we want . That's m that's better .UserInterface: Yeah .Industrial Designer: Yeah . So {disfmarker}Marketing: So this is five buttons .Industrial Designer: If we leave out all those buttons , perhaps you can go with the flat flat case . And make it smalleroverall .Project Manager: Y yeah .Industrial Designer: So if you put the the volume and channel buttons on the same height as the on-off button , the screen right behi under that , than the scroll buttonProject Manager:


Grad A: OK , we 're on .Professor B: Yeah .Grad A: So , I think this is gonna be a pretty short meeting because I have four agenda items , three of them were requested by Jane who is not gonna be at the meetingtoday .  So . {vocalsound} The uh first was transcription status . Does anyone besides Jane know what the transcription status is ?PhD F: Um , sort of , I do , peripherally .PhD C: Is that English ?PhD F: Um{disfmarker} Well first of all with IBM I got a note from Brian yesterday saying that they finally made the tape for the thing that we sent them a {pause} week or week and a half agoPhD D: That 's our system .Grad A:Ugh !PhD F: and that it 's gone out to the transcribers and hopefully next week we 'll have the transcription back from that .Grad A: C can I have a pen ?PhD F: Um {disfmarker} Jane seems to be um moving right alongon the transcriptions from the ICSI side . She 's assigned , I think probably five or six m more meetings .PhD C: Yeah , I think we 're up to MR thirteen or something .PhD D: Mmm .PhD F: Yeah , so um , I guess she 'shired some new transcribersPhD D: Speaking {disfmarker}Grad E: Which meetings is she transcribing ?PhD F: and {disfmarker} Um well we 've {disfmarker} we 've run out of E D Us because a certain number of themare um , sort of awaiting to go to IBM .Grad E: OK .PhD C: For IBM , yeah .PhD D: Hmm .Grad E: OK .PhD F: and the rest are in process being transcribed uh here .PhD D: So does she have transcribers right now whoare basically sitting idle because there 's no data back from IBMGrad E: So we 're doing some in parallel .Grad A: Yep .PhD F: No .Grad A: No , no .PhD F: Oh no no .Grad A: We haven't done that process .PhD D: no?PhD F: No . We 're not waiting on them .Grad A: So . They ' r they 're doing the full transcription process .PhD D: Oh . Oh , OK .Grad E: So they 're just doing their own thing until {disfmarker}PhD F: Yeah .PhD D:Because I {disfmarker} I need to ask Jane whether it 's {disfmarker} it would be OK for her {disfmarker} um , s some of her people to transcribe uh some of the initial data we got from the SmartKom data collection ,which is these short like five or seven minute sessions .PhD F: We 're doing it in parallel , yeah .Grad E: OK .PhD C: Yep .PhD D: Um and we want it {disfmarker} You know , we need {disfmarker} The {disfmarker}Again , we {disfmarker} we have a similar uh logistic set - up where we are supposed to send the data to MunichGrad A: Right .PhD D: and get it transcribed and get it back . But to get going we would like some of thedata transcribed right away so we can get started .Grad A: Yep , sounds familiar .PhD D: And so um I wanted to ask Jane if {disfmarker} if uh , you know , maybe one of their transcribers could {disfmarker} could do{disfmarker} I mean since these are very short , that should really be uh ,Professor B: Mm - hmm .PhD D: um {disfmarker} It 's {disfmarker}PhD C: There 's only two channels . So it 's only {disfmarker} Yeah .PhD D:Yeah .PhD C: As the synthesis doesn't have to be transcribed I think .PhD D: It 's only two {disfmarker} Right , sPhD C: So .PhD D: Yeah . So {disfmarker} So it 's basically one channel to transcribe . And it 's{disfmarker} One session is only uh like seven {disfmarker}Professor B: So that should have ma many fewer {disfmarker} And it 's also not uh a bunch of interruptions with people and all that ,PhD D: Right . And someof it is read speech , so we could give them the {disfmarker} the thing that they 're readingProfessor B: right ? So . Yeah .PhD D: and they just may {disfmarker}Grad A: Make sure it 's right .PhD C: Yep .PhD D: Andso um , um , I guess since she 's {disfmarker} I was gonna ask her but since she 's not around I {disfmarker} maybe I 'll {disfmarker}Professor B: Yeah , well it certainly seems {disfmarker}PhD D: Uh if {disfmarker}if that 's OK with you to {disfmarker} to , you know , get that stuff uh {disfmarker} to ask her for that , then I 'll do that .Professor B: Yeah . Yeah , if we 're held up on this other stuff a little bit in order to encompassthat , that 's OK because I I um , I mean I still have high hopes that the that the IBM pipeline 'll work out for us , so it 's {disfmarker}PhD D: Yeah . OK , yeah .Professor B: Yeah .PhD D: Alrighty .PhD F: Oh , yeah , andalso related to the transcription stuff , so I 've been trying to keep a web page uh up to date f showing what the current status is of the trans of all the things we 've collected and what stage each meeting is in , in termsof whether it 's {disfmarker}Grad A: Can you mail that out to the list ?PhD F: Mm - hmm , yeah I will . I {disfmarker} That 's the thing that I sent out just to foo people saying can you update these pagesGrad A: Oh ,OK , OK .PhD F: and so that 's where I 'm putting it but I 'll {disfmarker} I 'll send it out to the list telling people to look at it .Grad A: Yeah , I haven't done that . So . I have lots of stuff to add that 's just in my owndirectory .PhD F: Yeah .Grad A: I 'll try to get to that . OK . So Jane also wanted to talk about participant approval , but I don't really think there 's much to talk about . I 'm just gonna do it . And uh , if anyone objectstoo much then they can do it instead .Professor B: You are going to {disfmarker}Grad A: I 'm gonna send out to the participants , uh , with links to web pages which contain the transcripts and allow them to {pause}suggest edits . And then bleep them out .Professor B: OK .Grad A: For the ones that we have . Um {disfmarker}PhD C: So but it 's just transcripts , not the {disfmarker} not the audio ?Grad A: Nope , they 'll haveaccess to the audio also .PhD C: OK , yeah , yep . Ah .Grad A: I mean that 's my intention . Because the transcripts might not be right .PhD C: Yeah .PhD F: So {disfmarker}Grad A: So you want people to be able tolisten to them .PhD C: Yeah .PhD F: So , um the audio that they 're gonna have access to , will that be the uncompressed version ? Or will you have scripts that like uncompress the various pieces and {disfmarker}GradA: Oh , that 's a good point . That 's a good point . Yeah , it 's {disfmarker} it 's probably going to have to be the uncompressed versions because , uh , uh , it takes too long to do random access decompression .PhD F:Hmm . Yeah , I was just wondering because we 're uh running out of the un - backed - up disk space onGrad A: Well , that was the other point .PhD F: Oh , was that another one ?Grad A: Yep , that 's another agendaitem .PhD F: OK . I 'll wait .Grad A: So , uh {disfmarker} But that is a good point so we 'll get to that , too . Um , DARPA demo status , not much to say . The back - end stuff is working out fine . It 's more or less readyto go . I 've added some stuff that uh indes indexes by the meeting type MR , EDU , et cetera and also by the user ID . So that the front - end can then do filtering based on that as well . Uh {disfmarker} The back - endis uh , going more slowly as I s I think I said before just cuz I 'm not much of a Tcl - TK programmer . And uh Dave Gelbart says he 's a little too busy . So I think Don and I are gonna work on that and {disfmarker} andyou and I can just talk about it off - line more .Grad E: Right .Grad A: But uh {pause} the back - end was pretty smooth .Professor B: OhGrad A: So I think , we 'll have something . It may not be as {disfmarker} Aspretty as we might like , but we 'll have something .Professor B: I wondered whe when we would reach Dave 's saturation point . He 's sort of been {disfmarker} been volunteering for everythingGrad A: Yeah .ProfessorB: and {pause} and uh {disfmarker}PhD D: Mm - hmm .Professor B: O K . Finally said he was too busy . I guess we reached it .Grad A: Yeah , he {disfmarker} he actually {disfmarker} he volunteered but then he sthen he retracted it . So . Oh well . Um {disfmarker}Grad E: And , also um , I was just showing Andreas , I got um an X Waves kind of display , and I don't know how much more we can do with it {disfmarker} with likethe prosodic stuff where we have like stylized pitches and signals and the transcripts on the bottomGrad A: Oh , cool .Grad E: so , right now it 's just an X Waves and then you have three windows but I don't know , itlooked pretty nice and I 'm sure it {disfmarker} think it has potential for a little something ,Grad A: For a demo ?Grad E: yeah , for a demo .Grad A: Yeah , sounds good .Grad E: So {disfmarker}Professor B: OK , soagain , the issue is {disfmarker} For July , the issue 's gonna be what can we fit into a Windows machine , uh , and so on , but {disfmarker}Grad E: Oh . OK .Grad A: So it might just be slides .Grad E: Yeah , OK .PhD C:Well {disfmarker} {pause} Yeah .Grad E: Well , we 'll see , um {disfmarker}PhD C: I 've been putting together uh Transcriber things for Windows so i And I installed it on Dave Gelbart 's PC and it worked just fine . Sohopefully that will work .PhD D: Really ? So is that {disfmarker} Because there 's some people um {disfmarker} It would be cool if we could uh get that to work uh at {disfmarker} at SRIPhD C: Yeah . Yep .PhD D:because the um {disfmarker}Grad A: Well Transcriber is Tcl - TK , very generic with Snack ,PhD D: we have m m We have more Windows machines to run the {disfmarker}PhD C: Yeah .Grad A: so basically anythingyou can get Snack to run on , it will work .PhD D: Right .PhD C: Yeah . Yeah but {disfmarker} But the problem is the version Transcriber works with , the Snack version , is one point six whatever and that 's notanymore supported . It 's not on {disfmarker} on the web page anymore . But I just wrote an email to {disfmarker} to the author of {disfmarker} to the Snack author and he sent me to one point six whateverlibraryGrad A: Well I thought it was packaged with Transcriber ?PhD C: and so it works . Yeah , but then you can't add our patches and then the {disfmarker} the new version is {disfmarker} is totally differentGrad A:Oh .PhD C: a and in {disfmarker} yeah , in terms of {disfmarker} of the source code .Grad A: Ah .PhD C: You {disfmarker} you can't find the Tcl files anymore . It 's some whatever wrapped thingPhD D: Mmm .PhD C:and you can't {disfmarker} you can't access that so you have to install {disfmarker} First install Tcl then install Snack and then install the Transcriber thing and then do the patches .Grad A: Patch . Ugh !PhD D: I{disfmarker} I wonder if {disfmarker} if we should contribute our changes back to the authors so that they maintain those changes along {disfmarker}PhD C: Yeah . Yeah .Grad A: We have {disfmarker} Yeah b it 'sjust hasn't made it into the release yet .PhD D: We have ? Oh . Oh , OK .PhD F: So did you um put the uh {disfmarker} {vocalsound} the NT version out on the uh Meeting Recorder page ? Or {disfmarker}PhD C: No , Ihaven't done that yet . I 'm {disfmarker} oh Nope . But I definitely will do that .Professor B: So , can some of the stuff that Don 's talking about somehow fit into this Uh , mean you just have a set of numbers that areassociated with the {disfmarker}Grad E: Yeah .PhD C: So {disfmarker}Grad E: Yeah , it 's basically ASCII files or binary files , whatever representation . Just three different {disfmarker} It 's a waveform and just astylized pitch vector basically so it 's {disfmarker}PhD D: So {disfmarker} So {disfmarker} Well {disfmarker}Grad E: I mean we could do it in Matl - {comment} I mean you could do it in a number of different places I'm sure .PhD D: But {disfmarker} But it would be cool if the Transcriber interface had like another window for the {disfmarker} you know , maybe above the waveform where it would show some arbitrary valuedfunction that is {disfmarker} that is you know time synchron ti ti time synchronous with the wavform .PhD C: Yep .Grad E: Yeah .Professor B: Yes .Grad E: Yeah , that 'd be very cool .Grad A: It 'd be easy enough toadd that . Again it 's {disfmarker} it 's {pause} It 's more Tcl - TGrad E: Yeah .Grad A: So someone who 's familiar with Tcl - TK has to do it ,PhD D: Right .Grad A: but uh , it wouldn't be hard to do .PhD D: Right . Butit would almost be like having another waveform displayed .Grad A: Yep .PhD C: Yep .PhD D: SGrad E: Mm - hmm .PhD D: Right .PhD C: Yeah . Yeah , maybe we could l look into that .Grad E: Yeah .Grad A: But it{disfmarker} it seems to me that I cPhD C: And {disfmarker}Grad A: It doesn't seem like having that real time is that necessary . So yo It seems to me you could do images .Grad E: Um {pause} What do you mean byreal time ? Do you mean like {disfmarker}PhD F: Like being able to scroll through it and stuff for the demo .Grad E: OK .Grad A: Yeah , jus Yeah .PhD F: Is that what you mean ?Grad A: It just seems to me jusGrad E:It would be cool to see it {disfmarker}PhD F: Yeah .Grad E: It would be cool like to see {disfmarker} to hear it and see it ,PhD C: And to hear it . Yeah . Yeah .Grad E: and see the pitch contours also .Grad A: Sure , butI don't think {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} You can do all that just statically inPhD C: Yeah .Grad E: I think it would lose {disfmarker} Yeah , I mean yGrad A: Just record the audio clip and show an image and I think that's {disfmarker}Grad E: Right , right . I just thought if you meant slides I thought you meant like just {pause} like {pause} um view graphs or something .Professor B: You know , wh Yeah . So . Uh , no , we 're talkingabout on the computer and {disfmarker} and um , I think when we were talking about this before we had littl this little demo meeting ,Grad E: Right .Professor B: we sort of set up a range of different degrees ofliveness that you could have and , {vocalsound} the more live , the better , but uh , given the crunch of time , we may have to retreat from it to some extent . So I think {disfmarker} {pause} For a lot of reasons , Ithink it would be very nice to have this Transcriber interface be able to show some other interesting signal along with itPhD D: Mm - hmm .Professor B: so it 'd be a good thing to get in there . But , um {disfmarker}Anyway , jus just looking for ways that we could actually show what you 're doing , uh , in {disfmarker} {pause} to people .Grad E: Mm - hmm .Professor B: Cuz a lot of this stuff , particularly for Communicator , uhcertainly a significant chunk of the things that we waved our arms about th originally had t had to do with prosodics It 'd be nice to show that we can actually get them and see them .PhD D: Mmm .Grad E: Mm - hmm.Grad A: And the last i item on the agenda is disk issues yet again . So , we 're doing OK on backed up . We 're {disfmarker} We 're only about thirty percent on the second disk . So , uh , we have a little bit of timebefore that becomes critical , but we are like ninety five percent , ninety eight percent on the scratch disks for the expanded meetings .PhD C: Yeah .Grad A: And , my original intention was like we would just deletethem as we needed more space , but unfortunately we 're in the position where we have to deal with all the meeting data {pause} all at once , in a lot of different ways .PhD C: Yeah .PhD F: Oh there 's a lot oftranscribers , too .Grad A: Yeah , there 're a lot of transcribers ,PhD C: Yeah .Grad A: so all of those need to be expanded , and then people are doing chunking and I want to do uh , uh , uh , the permission forms ,PhDF: Mm - hmm .PhD C: AnPhD F: Right .Grad A: so I want those to be live , so there 's a lot of data that has to be around . Um {disfmarker} And Jane was gonna talk to , uh , Dave Johnson about it . One of the things Iwas thinking is we {disfmarker} we just got these hundred {disfmarker} alright , excuse me {disfmarker} ten , uh SPARC - Blade SUN - Blades .Professor B: Did they come in ?PhD F: SUN - Blades .PhD D: Yeah .PhDF: Yeah . They came in the other day .Grad A: They came in but they 're not set up yet .Professor B: Oh .Grad A: And so it seems to me we could hang scratch disk on those {pause} because they 'll be in the machineroom , they 'll be on the fast connection to the rest of the machines . And if we just need un - backed - up space , we could just hang disks off them .PhD F: Well , is there {disfmarker} Why not just hang them off ofAbbott , is there a {disfmarker}Grad A: Because there 's no more room in the disk racks on Abbott .Professor B: Yeah .PhD F: Ah .Professor B: Weren't we gonna get {disfmarker}PhD F: Ah , I see .Professor B: Well ,maybe it should get another rack .PhD D: But you still need to store the disks somehow .Grad A: Well , but the SUN - Blades have spare drive bays .PhD D: So {disfmarker}Grad A: Just put them in .PhD F: You can puttwo {disfmarker}PhD D: Oh you mean you put them inside the pizza boxes for the {disfmarker}Grad A: Sure .PhD C: Internal . Yeah .Grad A: Yeah . Cuz the SUN {disfmarker} uh , these SUN - Blades take commodityhard drives .PhD D: Oh .Grad A: So you can just go out and buy a PC hard drive and stick it in .PhD D: Mmm .Professor B: But if Abbott is going to be our disk server it {disfmarker} it {disfmarker} file server{comment} it seems like we would want to get it , uh , a second disk rack or something .PhD D: Plus we 're talking about buying a second dis uh , file server .Grad A: Well , I mean there are lots of long term solutions .What I 'm looking for is where do we s expand the next meeting ?PhD C: Yep .PhD D: I see {vocalsound} {pause} Oh , I see .Professor B: Well , for the next meeting you might be out of luck with those ten , mightn'tyou ? Uh , you know Dave Johnson is gone for , like , ten days ,Grad A: Oh , I didn't know he had left already .Professor B: Uh , well , tonight .Grad A: Oh , oh well .PhD D: You mean he won't set up the {disfmarker}mmm .Professor B: I don't know .Grad E: How much space do you need for these ?Professor B: I don't know what his schedule is .Grad A: You {disfmarker} we need about a gig per meeting .Professor B: I 'm justsaying he 's gone .PhD C: Yep .PhD F: I {disfmarker} I thiGrad E: I have um {disfmarker} I have an eighteen gig drive hanging off of my computer .Grad A: Alright ! What 's your computer 's name ?Grad E: So{disfmarker} Uh , Samosa .Professor B: You had an eighteen gigabyte drive .Grad E: Yeah , I had . Well it 's about {disfmarker} I think there 's about twelve gig left .Grad A: So it {disfmarker} And you have an Xdrives installed ? OK .Grad E: Yeah . So , I didn't realize it was so critical .Grad A: And you 're o you 're offering ?Grad E: I mean I 'm not doing anything on it right now until I get new meetings to transcri or that are{disfmarker} new transcriptions coming in I really can't do anything .Grad A: OK .Grad E: Um not that I can't do anything , I jusPhD F: I {disfmarker} I jus I just gave Thilo some {disfmarker} about ten gigs , the lastten gigs of space that there was on {disfmarker} on uh Abbott . Uh {disfmarker} And uh {disfmarker} So but that {disfmarker} But {disfmarker}Grad A: Which one was that , X {pause} G ? X {pause} G ?PhD C: XG.PhD F: XG .Grad A: OK .PhD D: XG ?PhD F: Yeah .PhD D: That 's also where we store the {disfmarker} The uh Hub - five training set waveforms ,PhD C: Oops .Grad A: But that won't be getting any bigger ,PhD D:right ?PhD F: No .Grad A: will it ?PhD F: I don't think that 's on XG .PhD D: Right .PhD F: On XG is only Carmen and Du - and Stephane 's disk .PhD C: It 's {disfmarker} Yeah .PhD D: But I 've also been storing{disfmarker} I 've been storing the feature files there and I guess I can s start deleting some because we now know what the best features areGrad E: Well {disfmarker}PhD D: and we won't be using the old onesanymore .Grad E: I have a lot of space , though .PhD F: Yeah , I do I don't think it was on XG .PhD D: Uh {disfmarker} Oh thats XA {disfmarker} Oh that 's X {disfmarker}PhD C: Isn't that XH ?PhD F: I thGrad A: Not{disfmarker} not for long .Grad E: I have a lot of space and it 's not {disfmarker} it 's n There 's very little uh {disfmarker} Yeah not for long .PhD D: Maybe I 'm confuGrad E: But I mean it 's not going fPhD D: Oh no I'm sorry .Grad E: It 's not being used often at all .PhD C: But I 'm using XH {disfmarker} H , too .Grad A: Yeah , it 's probably {disfmarker} Probably only about four gig is on X {disfmarker} on your X drive ,PhD C: So.PhD D: Oh OK .Grad A: but we 'll definitely take it up if you {disfmarker}Grad E: I thPhD D: I think you 're right . It 's XH and D {disfmarker}Grad E: I think it 's about four or five gig cuz I have four meetings on there,PhD D: The b I 'm also using DG I got that confused .Grad E: three or four meetings .PhD D: OK .Grad A: Great .Grad E: So .Grad A: OK , so that will get us through the next couple days .Professor B: We need{disfmarker} We need another gigaquad .Grad A: Yep . At least .Professor B: There should {disfmarker} I d There should just be a b I should have a button .Grad A: The " more disk space " button ?Professor B: Justpress {disfmarker} Press each meeting saying " we need more disk space " {vocalsound} " this week " .Grad A: Yep .Professor B: Skip the rest of the conversation .PhD F: Well we 've collected so far something like uhsixty - five meetings .Professor B: And {disfmarker} And how much does each meeting take ?PhD F: And it 's about a gig uncompressed .PhD C: It 's {disfmarker} It 's a little bit more as I usually don't {disfmarker} do