Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Okay , welcome to the second meeting of this uh design group . Um {vocalsound} I'll briefly go through the uh notes of the of the last meeting uh just done in in noteform and I haven't attributed anything to individuals , because we're working strictly as a team here and uh n nobody's working equally ,User Interface: Sorry .Project Manager: so uh . Um we we s we saw that the theproblems with existing remote controls were the uh b a boring shape and boring colour . Um and and we s we saw that the um what we needed to do was to to make sure the device um controls several items , thatswitching was easy , that you shouldn't need to point the thing at uh anything in particular , um that it need to be contoured to make it interesting , that the keys might be concave , simply because that hasn't beendone before that we know of . Um should have interchangeable fascias so people can personalise it , um illuminated so that people can see it in dark rooms . Um and that people might want it as as {disfmarker} inaddition to their existing remote controls . Um {vocalsound} and that it sh it should just always work , whenever you uh um mm uh use it . And that it shouldn't be too small , mm that it it gets lost . Um . {gap} Now uhuh I'll shortly ask for for three three presentations . Uh before I do that , however , I will go through some new project requirements that um {disfmarker} the the management have placed on us and uh will bechallenging in terms of what we discussed at the first meeting . Um the uh the ma the management has had it's own thoughts on this and uh the they don't necessarily agree with with what we uh we thought . Um andand then we'll {disfmarker} as a result of that we will then talk through the the functions that we see the the device um actually b carrying out , and we have uh forty minutes to do this in and I uh {disfmarker} Anyway. Okay . Now , the n the new requirements are um the the management team see that um teletext is no longer of any importance given the uh the rise of the internet . Um and and they want it only to cover televisions .Um now , what is not q quite clear from their directive is whether they mean th they don't want it to cover teletext or whether they don't want it to cover , you know , videos , D_V_D_s , um satellite boxes , which uh{disfmarker} I mean we saw as being fundamental to the uh to the exercise . The um the actual wording of the directive is that it should cover television only . Um and on that basis um I I think we we need to bear thatin mind , um but possibly uh keep at the backs of our minds that the reality that people even when they uh no longer {disfmarker} they don't look at teletext anymore , they certainly do look at other things . Um{vocalsound} the device has to incorporate the company logo and colours . Um the the logo uh being at b the bottom of the screen there , the the the two R_s in grey against uh a yellow background . Um now thisdoesn't {vocalsound} necessarily mean that we have to give up some of our ideas about making it attractive to the t to the market . But uh do do introduce some some constraints as to how we might do that . Um italso has to be simple , which to some extent goes along w with the first one , and that {disfmarker} we've already said that it must be simple 'cause that's what people want anyway . Um but they also want it to besimple to get it to the market quickly , which um mm {vocalsound} uh is is is their choice , but uh um we we need to talk that through . Um okay , so uh after the meeting it'll be summarised and uhIndustrial Designer:{vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: um notes sent out and uh etcetera . Okay , so {vocalsound} we'll first of all mm have individual reports from everybody . Um again I {vocalsound}{disfmarker} there is no order of precedence here um so I I I'll leave it up to you to {disfmarker} who who who thinks they would like to go go first ?Marketing: Uh I don't mind . {gap}Project Manager: P fine.Marketing: Uh can I steal the cable ?Project Manager: Oh sorry , you can indeed .Marketing: Cheers .Project Manager: {vocalsound} {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound} I got a {disfmarker} how do Istart there ?Project Manager: Oh , if you click on the um uh the one that that looks like a projection screen , no the one to the right of that . That one .Marketing: That one . Cool . Well these are functionalityrequirements from the {disfmarker} our our guys down in the the research lab . Took hundred people and covered all the aspects of what um is needed by people and what they want to see . Um {vocalsound}everything kinda from functionality and how individual functions are {disfmarker} how mu how how often they're used and how much their necessary and stuff . And general opinions about current current remotes .See that , as we kinda noticed , seventy five percent of people find their remote controls ugly . So some kind of a new style should be incorporated that's less ugly {vocalsound} . Uh along with um looking less ugly , if itlooks better , eighty percent of people said they'd spend more money on it . Which is a a plus for us , if we can make it look better , it'd be uh more cost effective and we can put the price up . Current remote controlsdo not match the operating behaviour of the user . I can empl I kinda take that to mean as um {vocalsound} they they don't uh {disfmarker} they , yeah , they only use {disfmarker} they only work for the television oryeah like as in in my flat I've got six remote controls for a stereo system , a digital box , a D_V_D_ player , a video player and T_V_ . If it was uh {disfmarker} I mean th my behaviour is to use multiple things at thesame time and multiple remotes aren't really matched well to my behaviour . {vocalsound} Uh again , seventy five percent is {disfmarker} seventy five percent of users say they zap a lot . I took to mean that they just{disfmarker} they use it a lot , they use it regularly rather than standing up and manually change channels or volume {gap} . {vocalsound} And uh yeah , uh I think the big issue is fifty percent users only use tenpercent of the buttons , 'cause uh wh if we got a remote that like {disfmarker} well we'll have some buttons taken off by the lack of teletext , but uh oh and we're going to see uh on the {disfmarker} uh that some ofthe functions like audio settings aren't h hardly ever used and used very {disfmarker} aren't considered relevant by the user . So I think maybe fewer buttons , which also make the design look sleeker , I dunno . Uh umyeah and uh frustrations of like people losing remote control .Project Manager: Mm .Marketing: I dunno maybe some kind of system of you press a button on the T_V_ or maybe that's b it would have to incorporate{gap} , but like some kind of system where you can f use something else to find the remote control . Maybe like it'll beep or something . And um , yep , the uh time taken to learn new remote controls is {disfmarker}Uh don't want to make it too complicated , easy to use for uh new {disfmarker} like first time users and stuff . And uh repetitive strain injury , I suppose we should make it more comfortable and make ma possibly evenuse {disfmarker} have to make it , yeah , fewer buttons , like I was saying about the whole mice {disfmarker} the mouse idea of it feels more comfortable .Project Manager: Mm .Marketing: Maybe don't even have tohold it as such .Project Manager: Gosh , must be some telly addicts out there if they get R_S_I_ from their television remote , is all I can say .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface:{vocalsound}Marketing: But uh yeah . It also asked um if we would {disfmarker} if people would pay more for speech recognitionProject Manager: {vocalsound} {gap}Marketing: and younger people say they would .And uh there was another section on our {disfmarker} on the report for uh L_C_D_ displays , but the data wasn't there , so . I don't actually know what the results for that were ,Project Manager: Mm . Right . Mm.Marketing: so . {vocalsound} May be incrementally emitting , but yeah .Project Manager: Yeah , I must say that um the uh {disfmarker} I c can't remember what {vocalsound} um f you know phone service I wasusing the other day , but that had sorta speech recognition which worked uh remarkably well , so that is indeed a uh um a thoughtMarketing: And uh {vocalsound} it would cut out the R_S_I_ as well if you{disfmarker} {vocalsound}Project Manager: and it it cuts out uh {disfmarker} I was was gonna say , you can't get a lot of R_S_I_ ,Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: j just get jaw ache . Okay , sorry .{vocalsound}Marketing: Yeah , um {disfmarker} oh yeah , so possibly the speech recognition is possibly something could add into the design . Oh , I've got some other things I couldn't fit onto this presentation . Um .You see this okay ? Almost {disfmarker} no ? It's {disfmarker} sorry it's a bit {gap} . I'll read out to you . Uh functionality , uh like people's opinions on functionality , the relevance to the remote and how often they'reused . So um like the power . Using the using the d swi the power switch to switch on T_V_ is a high relevance of nine , but it's not frequently used . You see what I mean ?Project Manager: Yeah .{vocalsound}Marketing: Whereas channel selection , which is very high relevanceProject Manager: Mm-hmm .Marketing: is used the most . So m we can maybe even start to cut down on {disfmarker} or I was possiblyeven thinking of a design that maybe some of the buttons are hidden from everyday use . Maybe like uh a folding ledge or something . So that we can maybe go into the channel settings and the audio settings,Industrial Designer: Mm .Marketing: which are low relevanceProject Manager: {vocalsound} Mm-hmm . I mean {disfmarker}Marketing: and rarely used . And keep the v volume selection and channel selection veryeasily {disfmarker}User Interface: It could be {disfmarker} oh uh I was just gonna say uh maybe like the flip phones that they use ?Industrial Designer: Mm .User Interface: Have you seen the new mo mobilephonesProject Manager: {vocalsound} Yeah .User Interface: that flip out and they have the like texting , and then the numbers on one side ,Marketing: Oh yeah .User Interface: soProject Manager: Mm .User Interface:you could have the most {vocalsound} used buttons on top and flip it out or something .Project Manager: Hmm , hmm .Industrial Designer: Mm .Marketing: Yeah , like the one that like slides backProject Manager: Uh .Should we actually bite the bullet here ?Marketing: and the buttons are concealed underneath .User Interface: Yeah .Industrial Designer: Mm .Project Manager: If people really don't use those buttons to any extent atall um {vocalsound} remove them altogether .Marketing: Just remove them completely ?Project Manager: We we could actually have we could actually have a remote control with um {disfmarker}User Interface: Thatmight be the {disfmarker}Project Manager: I wonder whether we could get the remote control with no buttons at all if we went for voice recognition , given that um the {disfmarker} {vocalsound} Um now the the agestructure we were looking at {disfmarker} um I mean w we had usage by age structure , what we didn't have was what proportion of people using remotes were in those particular age groups . Now do we knowwhether they {disfmarker}Marketing: Uh yeah .Project Manager: Forty {disfmarker} no sorry {disfmarker} for forty five to fifty five age group , uh to put myself right in the middle of it , um u use remote controls to agreat extent .Marketing: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Yes we {disfmarker}Marketing: Um no this is for {disfmarker} pay more for speech recognition .Project Manager: That would've speech recogn right . So , we're looking at {disfmarker} um well again , we don't know the relative proportion {disfmarker} the relative numbers in the age groups .Marketing: Yeah , that's true .Project Manager: Ifwe wanted something different , truly different , then the buttonless remote control w would be it .Industrial Designer: P Well the only problem I can think of with that is if you've got a lot of people that don't wanna bebothered learning how to use new rem remote controls . If you just kind of take away everything that they're used to knowing , that's gonna be quite a change .Project Manager: But if you just lift it up and say , channelone or B_B_C_ {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: It might {disfmarker}Marketing: Or even {disfmarker} I mean you could even just have it left on .User Interface: Maybe iMarketing: You could just put it down once ontop your T_V_ and never have to {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah , have a big kind of like the satellite box or the cable boxProject Manager: {vocalsound}User Interface: and have it just go on the T_V_ and then itdoesn't matter where in the room you are ,Industrial Designer: Mm .User Interface: you won't lose it .Marketing: Yeah .Project Manager: It c well it {disfmarker} I can I can see technical problems with that in terms ofthe , you know , the sound from the television ,Industrial Designer: Mm .User Interface: No .Project Manager: because if somebody actually on the television says uh uh , you know , I_T_V_ and you're watching B_B_C_then then it might um change itself ,Marketing: {vocalsound} B_B_C_ one . {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Yeah . {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound} Oh . {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Yeah .Marketing:{vocalsound}Project Manager: so it probably needs to be um {disfmarker} possibly actually need a button on itUser Interface: Yeah , that's true .Project Manager: just to activate it .Marketing: Oh yeah .ProjectManager: Or or something just to identify that you've lifted it up and it's use . And and then just say , oh I don't know , a thought and and then {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah .Project Manager: uh I mean that thatwould certainly be uh truly different . {vocalsound} Um 'cause uh you know audio settings , nought point eight percent . I mean if they weren't there , {vocalsound} would people miss them ?Marketing: Mm-mm.Industrial Designer: But look at the importance of them . The volume settings .Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: Relevance of two out of ten ,Project Manager: Vol volume ,Marketing: yeah .IndustrialDesigner: Yeah .Project Manager: yes umIndustrial Designer: They're not used oftenProject Manager: th {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: but they are quite important when they're used .Project Manager: w we needto s identify things that {vocalsound} people actually needIndustrial Designer: Yeah .Project Manager: and and it's a function of frequency and relevance . And um I would say ignoring ig ignoring power for the moment, um the channel and volumeIndustrial Designer: Mm .Project Manager: and th w w given given that we've been told to ignore teletext . Uh channel and volume are the only ones thatMarketing: Yeah .Project Manager:{vocalsound} uh would appear to be essential .Marketing: Stand out .Project Manager: Um . So {disfmarker} if we can design something that that looks interesting , know , or looks different , um incorporates the thelogo and and the colours and um we can still have our interchangeable fascias even if it's {gap} the yellow and grey , um and uh I dunno , buttons or or buttons as an option .Marketing: Uh I just had a thought actually, sorry to interrupt .Project Manager: Do , please .Marketing: Uh you were saying about um it could {disfmarker} technical problems of like uh someone on the television saying a channel number and it changed{disfmarker}Project Manager: Mm-hmm .Marketing: we could maybe have like an activation word .Project Manager: You cer certainly could .Marketing: 'Cause I've seen I've seen this used on computers before , whereyou just {disfmarker} you address the remote ,Project Manager: {vocalsound} Depe uh i depends whether um {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Mm .Marketing: you address the computer , and then give it a command.Project Manager: if we want to make this so simple that anybody can walk into the room and lift it up and sayMarketing: Oh I see . Oh yeah , I see .Project Manager: B_B_C_ one . Um okay , I mean you could print{disfmarker} actually print it on the uhMarketing: {vocalsound} Mm-hmm , yeah .Project Manager: device itself . Um .Marketing: I mean I'm just thinking of the point of view of peop you could still like lose this remote.Project Manager: S th this I th {vocalsound} that's always gonna be a problem I think .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: Mm .Project Manager: Um and I I I s so I suppose one um {disfmarker} could makeit so desirable that if people lose it they immediately go out and buy another one .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Anyway , sorry , carry on . Doyou want to just carry on with {disfmarker}Marketing: Oh noProject Manager: or {disfmarker}Marketing: I I interrupted you ,Project Manager: no no , no uh b I was in the middle of in the middle of your report there .{vocalsound}Marketing: sorry {vocalsound} . Oh okay . Um well , I was just kinda wrapping up there . Yeah ,Project Manager: Mm okay . {vocalsound}Marketing: I was thinking um , yeah , maybe such things arerelevant . We could make things much more f I think the the eighty percent of people would spend more on uh a remote uh that looks better , combined with uh decrease the {disfmarker} or take out the limited functiofunctions that we don't really use much . {gap} alright take out teletext , but as for channel settings and stuff it might it might um turn people somewhe peop some people that want the whole functionality away . But ,since {disfmarker} if we're marketing a more kind of fashionable approach then it'd {disfmarker} it would be fashion and fashion over practicality .Project Manager: Mm-hmm . S s we could {disfmarker} we could makeit dual function {gap} voice recognition and {gap} still have buttons on it umMarketing: {vocalsound} Oh , we could , yeah . We c yeah ,Project Manager: 'cause we're {disfmarker}Marketing: we could even have it aslike a {disfmarker} yeah the buttons control this and the voice functions control the f things that you would do all the time , so .Project Manager: {vocalsound} Certainly could . Yeah , yeah .Industrial Designer: Mm.Marketing: So uh yeah , if we could uh {disfmarker} power on and channel selection and and volume selection , wouldn't have to really {disfmarker}Project Manager: {gap} The {disfmarker} I mean the the advantageof doing away the buttons altogether is it makes the thing cheaper .Marketing: Yeah and probably it would look better as well .Project Manager: No , it cou certainly opens up the possibility for making it uh , you know ,visually very distinctive .Marketing: Yeah . yeah .Project Manager: Um 'cause you know , it does not have to be a oblong box .Industrial Designer: Mm .Marketing: Lined with numbered buttons and {disfmarker}ProjectManager: Mm , yeah . Okay , who {disfmarker} sorry , have you have you finished there Andy ?Marketing: Uh yeah , yeah , that's everything .Project Manager: Yep , yep . Um {vocalsound} given that we've alreadyhad a extensive discussion uh {disfmarker} {vocalsound} .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: Okay well , I can do mine .Industrial Designer: Hmm.Marketing: Do you want the cable ?User Interface: Yeah , let's see if I can make this work . Um .Industrial Designer: Oh , you have to hit like function and F_ something .User Interface: Oh .Marketing: F_ eight.Industrial Designer: F_ eight .User Interface: Is it doing {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Dunno .Marketing: Uh , give it about twenty seconds , or so .User Interface: Okay .Project Manager: Ah , therewe go . {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Oh yeah , it's going .User Interface: Oh okay . {vocalsound} Okay , so this is just about the technical functions .Project Manager: Alright .User Interface: So the method , Ilooked online for examples of other similar products and then just kind of was trying to brainstorm some possible design ideas and um identify what the necessary things are , what people are {disfmarker} what youreally wanna have a remote control do . Um and then there are two different kinds that I found . There's a user centred one and an engineering centred one which I will have pictures of and then we kinda have to decidewhich one this should be .Project Manager: Mm-hmm .User Interface: {vocalsound} So these are the two different ones . This one um {disfmarker} this is the user centred , it has uh quite a few mm uh um fewerbuttonsMarketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: and then this is the engineering centred , which has a lot more buttons ,Project Manager: Mm-hmm .User Interface: and probably this is one that people complain about ,


Grad G: headphones that aren't so uncomfortable .PhD B: I think {disfmarker} Well , this should be off the record ,Professor D: Hmm .PhD B: but I think {disfmarker}Professor D: Uh , OK .Professor A: We 're notrecording yet , are we ?Grad G: Well , I don't think {disfmarker}PhD F: No , uh , that {disfmarker} that wasn't recorded .Grad G: No . Um , I don't think they 're designed to be over your ears .PhD B: Yeah , I know . Itjust {disfmarker} it really hurts . It gives you a headache , like if you {disfmarker} On your temple {disfmarker}PhD F: Temple squeezers .PhD B: Yeah .Grad G: Yep .PhD B: Yeah .Professor D: Mm - hmm .Grad G: ButI definitely {pause} haven't figured it out .Professor A: Um , Meeting Recorder meeting .PhD F: I guess I have to d stop doing this sigh of contentment , you know , after sipping cappuccino or something .PhD B: Yeah ,with the {disfmarker} We kno I know .Grad G: " Sip , sigh . "PhD B: We know exactly how much you have left in your cup .PhD F: I was just noticing a big sProfessor D: So are we recording now ? Is this{disfmarker}PhD E: Yeah .Professor D: Oh ! We 're {disfmarker} we 're {disfmarker} we 're live . OK .PhD E: Yeah .Professor D: So , uh , {vocalsound} what were we gonna talk about again ? So we said {disfmarker}we said data collection , which we 're doing .PhD B: Were we gonna do digits ?Professor A: OK . Do we do th do you go around the room {pause} and do names or anything ?Grad G: I think that {disfmarker}PhD E: It 'sa good idea .Grad G: u usually we 've done that and also we 've s done digits as well , but I forgot to print any out . So . Besides with this big a group ,PhD B: You can write them on the board , if you want .Professor D:No . I it 'd be even better with this big {disfmarker}Grad G: it would take too much time .PhD E: Which way is {disfmarker}Grad G: Yeah , but it takes too much time .PhD E: Mari ?Postdoc H: What{disfmarker}Professor A: What ?Professor D: It 's not that long .PhD E: Y I think your {disfmarker} your {disfmarker} your thing {nonvocalsound} may be pointing in a funny direction . Sort of it 's {disfmarker} ithelps if it points sort of upwards .Professor A: Whoops .PhD E: Sort of it {disfmarker} you know .Professor A: Would it {disfmarker} mPhD E: Yeah .Professor D: w uPhD E: So that thing {disfmarker} the little{disfmarker} th that part should be pointing upwards .Professor A: So {disfmarker} Oh , this thing .PhD E: That 's it . Yeah .Professor A: Yeah .Postdoc H: Otherwise you just get a heartbeats .Professor A: It 's kind of{disfmarker}Professor D: Oh , yeah , the element , yeah , n should be as close to you {disfmarker} your mouth as possible .Professor A: Yeah . OK .PhD E: That 's good . That kind of thing is good .Postdoc H: It 's a{disfmarker}Professor A: This w Alright .PhD E: Yeah .Professor A: How 's that working ?Professor D: Yeah .PhD E: Oh , yeah . It 's a {disfmarker} It 's working .Professor A: OK .Professor D: Alright . So what we had{pause} was that we were gonna talk about data collection , and , um , uh , you {disfmarker} you put up there data format ,Professor A: Um .Professor D: and other tasks during data collection ,Professor A: So , Ithink the goal {disfmarker} the goal was what can we do {disfmarker} how can you do the data collection differently to get {disfmarker}Professor D: and {disfmarker}Professor A: what can you add to it to get , um ,some information that would be helpful for the user - interface design ? Like {disfmarker}Grad G: Uh , especially for querying .Professor A: Especially for querying . So , getting people to do queries afterwards , gettingpeople to do summaries afterwards . Um .Postdoc H: Well , one thing that came up in the morning {disfmarker} in the morning was the , um , i uh , if he {disfmarker} I , um {disfmarker} if he has {disfmarker} s I{disfmarker} I don't remember , Mister Lan - Doctor Landry ?Grad G: Landay . James .Postdoc H: La - Landay ? So he has , um , these , uh , um , tsk {comment} note - taking things ,Professor A: Mm - hmm .PostdocH: then that would sort of be a summary which you wouldn't have to solicit . y if {disfmarker} if we were able to {disfmarker} to do that .Professor A: Well , if {disfmarker} if you actually take notes as a summary asopposed to n take notes in the sense of taking advantage of the time - stamps . So action item or uh , reminder to send this to so - and - so , blah - blah - blah .Postdoc H: Mm - hmm .Professor A: So that wouldn't be asummary . That would just be {disfmarker} that would b relate to the query side .Grad G: But if we had the CrossPads , we could ask people , you know , if {disfmarker} if something comes up {vocalsound} write itdown and mark it {vocalsound} {pause} somehow ,Postdoc H: Mm - hmm .PhD E: Right . I mean , we {disfmarker} because you 'd have several people with these pads , you could collect different things .Grad G: youknow .Professor A: Right .PhD E: I mean , cuz I tend to take notes which are summaries . And so , you know {disfmarker}PhD F: I mean , the down - side to that is that he sort of indicated that the , uh , quality of{vocalsound} the handwriting recognition was quite poor .Professor A: Well {disfmarker}Grad G: But that 's alright . I don't think there 'd be so many that you couldn't have someone clean it upProfessor A: So{disfmarker}Grad G: pretty easily .Professor A: Yeah . We also could come up with some code for things that people want to do so that {disfmarker} for frequent things .PhD F: Yeah .Professor A: And the other things ,people can write whatever they want . I mean , it 's to some extent , uh , for his benefit . So , if that {disfmarker} you know , if {disfmarker} if we just keep it simple then maybe it 's still useful .PhD F: Right .Grad G:Yeah .Professor D: I just realized we skipped the part that we were saying we were gonna do at the front where we each said who we were .Postdoc H: The roll call .Professor A: Right . I thought you did that on purpose.Professor D: Roll call .Professor A: But anyway , shall we do the roll call ?Professor D: No , not a No , I just {disfmarker} My mind went elsewhere . So , uh , yeah , I 'm Morgan , and where am I ? I 'm on channel three.Grad G: And I 'm Adam Janin on channel A .Postdoc H: I 'm Jane Edwards , I think on channel B .PhD E: I 'm Dan Ellis .PhD F: Eric on channel nine .PhD B: Liz , on channel one .Professor A: Mari on channel zero.Professor C: Katrin on channel two .Postdoc H: Should we have used pseudo - names ? Should we do it a second time with pseudo No . {vocalsound} No .Professor D: I 'm Rocky Raccoon {vocalsound} on channel{disfmarker}PhD E: Let me , uh , turn that off .Grad G: And , uh , do you want to do the P D As and the {pause} P ZPhD E: Oh . PZM nearest , nearest , next nearest . Next one .Postdoc H: Next nearest .PhD E:Furthest .Grad G: Far .PhD E: PDM - right , PZA - right {disfmarker} PDA - right , PDA - left .Postdoc H: OK .PhD E: Thanks .Grad G: Yeah , and eventually once this room gets a little more organized , the Jimlets{comment} will be mounted under the table , and these guys will be permanently mounted somehow . You know , probably with double - sided tape , but {disfmarker} So . You {disfmarker} So we won't have to gothrough that .Professor A: Hmm .Postdoc H: I have a question on protocol in these meetings , which is when you say " Jimlet " and the person listening won't know what that is , sh shou How {disfmarker} how do weget {disfmarker} Is that important information ? You know , the Jimlet {disfmarker} I mean , the box that contains the {disfmarker}Professor D: Well , I mean , suppose we broaden out and go to a range of meetingsbesides just these internal ones . There 's gonna be lots of things that any group of people who know each other have in column {disfmarker} common {comment} that we will not know .Professor A: Right .Postdoc H:Mm - hmm .Professor A: Right .Postdoc H: OK .Professor A: So the there will be jargon that we he There 'll be transcription errors .Postdoc H: Good .Professor D: Yeah .Postdoc H: OK .Professor D: I mean , we{disfmarker} we were originally gonna do this with VLSI design , and {disfmarker} and {disfmarker} and the reason we didn't go straight to that was because immediately ninety percent of what we heard would be{vocalsound} jargon to {disfmarker} to us . So .Grad G: Well , that was just one of the reasons . But , yeah , definitely .Professor D: Yeah .Postdoc H: OK . Good .Professor D: That {disfmarker} that 's right . Therewere others of course . Yeah .Postdoc H: OK , so we were on the data collection {pause} {comment} and the summary issue .Professor D: Right . We can go back .Professor A: So , uh , u u So , actually there 's kind ofthree issues . There 's the CrossPad issue . Should we do it and , if so , what 'll we have them do ? Um , do we have s people write summaries ? Everybody or one person ? And then , do we ask people for how theywould query things ? Is that {disfmarker}PhD F: There 's {disfmarker} there 're sub - problems in that , in that where {disfmarker} or when do you actually ask them about that ?Professor A: Right .PhD F: I mean ,that was {disfmarker} One thing I was thinking about was is that Dan said earlier that , you know , maybe two weeks later , which is when you would want to query these things , you might ask them then .Professor A:Right .PhD F: But there 's a problem with that in that if {pause} you 're not {disfmarker} If you don't have an interactive system , it 's gonna be hard to go beyond sort of the first level of question .Professor A: Right.PhD F: Right . And furth id explore the data further .Professor A: Right .PhD F: So .Professor D: There 's {disfmarker} there 's another problemGrad G: And {disfmarker}Professor D: which is , um , we certainly dowant to branch out beyond , uh , uh , recording meetings about Meeting Recorder . And , uh , once we get out beyond our little group , the people 's motivation factor , uh , reduces enormously . And if we start givingthem a bunch of other things to do , how {disfmarker} you know , we {disfmarker} we did n you know another meeting here for another group and {disfmarker} and , uh , they were fine with it . But if we 'd said , " OK, now all eight of you have to {disfmarker} {vocalsound} have to come up with , uh , the summar "Grad G: Well , I asked them to and none of them did .Professor D: t See ? There we go .Grad G: So , I {disfmarker} Iasked them to send me ideas for queries after the meetingPostdoc H: Mm - hmm .Professor A: They {disfmarker}Grad G: and no one ever did .PhD E: Mm - hmm .Grad G: I didn't follow up either .Professor A: Yeah.Grad G: So I didn't track them down and say " please do th do it now " . But , uh , no one spontaneously provided anything .Professor D: I I 'm worried that if you did {disfmarker} even if you did push them into it , it{disfmarker} it {disfmarker} it might be semi - random ,Professor A: Right .Professor D: uh , as opposed to what you 'd really want to know if you were gonna use this thing .PhD E: Right .Professor A: OK .Grad G: Ijust don't know how else to generate the queries other than getting an expert to actually listen to the meeting and say " that 's important , that might be a query " .Postdoc H: Tsk . Well , there is this other thing whichy which you were alluding to earlier , which is , um , there are certain key words like , you know , " action item " and things like that , which could be used in , uh , t to some degree finding the structure .Professor A:Yeah .PhD E: Although {disfmarker}Professor A: WPostdoc H: And {disfmarker} and I also , um , was thinking , with reference to the n uh , note - taking , the advantage there is that you get structure without theperson having to do something artificial later . And the fir third thing I wanted to say is the summaries afterwards , um , I think they should be recorded instead of written because I think that , um , it would take solong for people to write that I think you wouldn't get as good a summary .Professor A: How about this idea ? That normally at most meetings somebody is delegated to be a note - taker .Postdoc H: Yeah , good . Goodpoint .Professor A: And {disfmarker} So why don't we just use the notes that somebody takes ?Postdoc H: Yeah .Grad G: I mean , that gives you a summary but it doesn't really {disfmarker} How do you generatequeries from that ?PhD E: Well . But , I mean , maybe a summary is one of the things we 'd want from the output of the system .Postdoc H: Yeah .Professor A: Right .PhD E: Right ? I mean , they 're something . It 's a{disfmarker} a kind of output you 'd like .PhD B: Actually {disfmarker} And so {disfmarker}Grad G: Uh , James and I were talking about this during one of the breaks . And the problem with that is , I 'm definitelygoing to do something with information retrieval even if it 's sort of not full full - bore what I 'm gonna do for my thesis .Professor A: Right .Grad G: I 'm gonna do something . I 'm not gonna do anything withsummarization . And so if someone wants to do that , that 's fine , but it 's not gonna be me .Professor D: Well , I think that we {disfmarker} I mean , the {disfmarker} the f the core thing is that you know once we getsome of these issues nailed down , we need to do a bunch of recordingsProfessor A: Well {disfmarker}Professor D: and send them off to IBM and get a bunch of transcriptions even if they 're slightly flawedGrad G: Yep.Professor D: or need some other {disfmarker} And then we 'll have some data there .Professor A: Yeah .Professor D: And then , i i we can start l looking and thinking , what do we want to know about these things and{disfmarker} at the very least .PhD E: Mm - hmm .Professor A: Yeah {disfmarker}PhD B: I actually want to say something about the note pad . So , if you could sense just when people are writing , and you tell themnot to doodle , or try not to {pause} be using that for other purposes , {comment} and each person has a note pad . They just get it when they come in the room . Then you c you can just have a fff {comment} plot ofwh you know , who 's writing when .Professor D: Hmm .PhD B: That 's all you {disfmarker}PhD E: Activity . Yeah .PhD B: And , you can also have notes of the meeting . But I bet that 's {disfmarker} that will allow youto go into the {disfmarker} sort of the hot places where people are writing things down .Professor D: Mm - hmm .Grad G: Oh , I see .PhD B: I mean , you can tell when you 're in a meeting when everybody stops towrite something down that something was just said .Professor A: Mm - hmm .PhD B: It may not be kept in the later summary , but at that point in time is was something that was important .Postdoc H: Mm - hmm .PhDB: And that wouldn't take any extra {disfmarker}Postdoc H: That 's a nice idea .Professor A: Mm - hmm .PhD B: Or someone could just pu you could just put your hand on the padProfessor D: It {disfmarker}ProfessorC: Mm - hmm .PhD B: and go like that if you want to . It 's {disfmarker}Professor D: That 's a good idea but that doesn't {disfmarker} Maybe I 'm missing something , but that doesn't get to the question of how wecome up with queries , right ?Professor A: Well , what it does {disfmarker}PhD B: Well , then you can go to the points where the {disfmarker} you could actually go to those points in time and find out what they weretalking about . And you rProfessor A: Well , what it does is provide a different {disfmarker}Professor D: Yeah .PhD B: And {disfmarker}Grad G: Uh , yProfessor A: I {disfmarker} I think it 's an interesting thing . I don'tthink it gets at the {disfmarker} the queries per - se , but it does give us an information fusion sort of thing that , you know , you wanna i say " what were the hot - points of the meeting ? "PhD B: Yeah .Professor D:That {disfmarker} that 's what I mean , is that I think it gets at something interesting but if we were asking the question , which I thought we were , of {disfmarker} of {disfmarker} of , um , " how do we figure outwhat 's the nature of the queries that people are gonna want to ask of such a system ? " , knowing what 's important doesn't tell you what people are going to be asking .PhD B: But I bet it 's a good {pause} superset ofit .Professor D: Does it ?Professor A: Well , yeah .PhD E: Well , see , there are thProfessor A: I think you could say they 're gonna ask about , uh , when {disfmarker} uh , when did so - and - so s talk about blah . Andat least that gives you the word {pause} that they might run a query on .PhD B: At least you can find the locations where there are maybe keywordsProfessor D: Maybe .Grad G: I mean , i this would tell you what thehit is ,PhD B: and {disfmarker}Grad G: not what the query is .Professor A: Right .PhD B: Right , right .Grad G: What {disfmarker}Professor A: It 'll tell you the hit but not the query .PhD B: But I think {disfmarker} Ithink thinking about queries is a little bit dangerous right now .Grad G: And so you could {disfmarker} you can generate a query from the hits ,Professor A: Right .Grad G: but {disfmarker}PhD B: We don't even knowwhat {disfmarker} I mean , if you want to find out what any user will use , that might be true for one domain and one user ,Professor D: Mm - hmm .PhD B: but I mean a different domain and a different user{disfmarker}Postdoc H: Mm - hmm .Professor D: Yeah , but we 're just looking for a place to start with thatPhD B: Um .Professor D: because , you know , th what {disfmarker} what {disfmarker} what James is gonnabe doing is looking at the user - interface and he 's looking at the query in {disfmarker} in {disfmarker} i We {disfmarker} we have five hours of pilot data of the other stuff but we have zero hours of {disfmarker} of{disfmarker} of queries . So he 's just sort of going " where {disfmarker} where do I {disfmarker} where do I start ? "Professor A: w Well , th you could do {disfmarker} I think the summaries actually may help get usthere ,Professor D: OK .Professor A: for a couple reasons . One , if you have a summary {disfmarker} if you have a bunch of summaries , you can do a word frequency count and see what words come up in differenttypes of meetings .Professor D: Mm - hmm .Professor A: So " action item " is gonna come up whether it 's a VLSI meeting , or speech meeting , or whatever . So words that come up in different types of meetings maybe something that you would want to query about .Grad G: Mm - hmm .Professor A: Um , the second thing you could possibly do with it is just run a little pilot experiment with somebody saying " here 's a summary of ameeting , what questions might you want to ask about it to go back ? "Grad G: Yeah , I think that 's difficult because then they 're not gonna ask the questions that are in the summary .Professor A: Well{disfmarker}Grad G: But , I think it would give {disfmarker}Professor A: That 's one possi one possible scenario , though , is you have the summary ,Grad G: Mm - hmm .Professor A: and you want to ask questions toget more detail .Grad G: th Yeah , I think it has to be a participant . Well , it doesn't have to be . OK . So that {disfmarker} that is another use of Meeting Recorder that we haven't really talked about , which is forsomeone else , as opposed to as a {pause} remembrance agent , which is what had been my primary thought in the information retrieval part of it would be . But , uh , I guess if you had a meeting participant , theycould use the summary to refresh themselves about the meeting and then make up queries . But it 's not {disfmarker}Professor D: Mm - hmm .Grad G: I don't know how to do it if {disfmarker} until you have a system.PhD B: The summary is actually gonna drive the queries then .Professor A: Mmm .PhD E: Yeah .PhD B: I mean , your research is going to be very circular .Professor A: Yeah .Grad G: Yeah , that {disfmarker} that 'swhat I was saying .PhD E: But th there is this , um {disfmarker} {vocalsound} {vocalsound} {vocalsound} There is this class of queries , which are the things that you didn't realize were important at the time but somein retrospect you think " oh , hang on , didn't we talk about that ? " And it 's something that didn't appear in the summary but you {disfmarker}Professor A: Mm - hmm .PhD E: And that 's kind of what this kind of , uh ,complete data capture is kind of nicest for .Professor A: Right . Right .PhD B: Right .PhD E: Cuz it 's the things that you wouldn't have bothered to make an effort to record but they get recorded . So , I mean{disfmarker} And th there 's no way of generating those , u u until we just {disfmarker} until they actually occur .PhD B: But you could always post - hoc label them .PhD E: You know , it 's like {disfmarker} Right ,right . Exactly .PhD B: Yeah . Yeah .PhD E: But I mean , it 's difficult to sort of say " and if I was gonna ask four questions about this , what would they be ? " Those aren't the kind of things that come up .Grad G: But atleast it would get us started .PhD E: Oh , yeah . Yeah , sure .Postdoc H: I also think that w if {disfmarker} if you can use the summaries as an indication of the important points of the {disfmarker} of the meeting , then


Grad G: Time .Grad C: Thanks .Grad G: Are you Fey ?Undergrad D: I am Fey , yeah .Grad G: Oh .Grad B: What day is today ?Undergrad D: Hi .Grad G: Hi . I think we 've met before , like , I remember talking to youabout Aspect or something like that at some point or other .Undergrad D: A couple times yeah .Grad F: It 's the uh twenty {disfmarker} nineteenth .Grad B: Nineteenth ?Undergrad D: That 's right , yeah .Grad G: So.Undergrad D: And you were my GSI briefly , until I dropped the class .Grad F: Grad B: Right , right .Grad G: Oh that 's right .Undergrad D: But .Grad G: Well .Grad C: OK , wh whGrad G: No offense .Grad C: Yeah.Grad G: Like .Grad C: OK . Some in some introductions are in order .Grad G: Oh , OK sorry .Grad C: OK .Grad G: Getting ahead of myself .Grad C: So . Um . For those who don't know {disfmarker} Everyone knows me, this is great . Um , apart from that , sort of the old gang , Johno and Bhaskara have been with us from {disfmarker} from day oneGrad G: Yay !Grad E: Hi .Grad C: and um they 're engaged in {disfmarker} in variousactivities , some of which you will hear about today . Ami is um our counselor and spiritual guidance and um also interested in problems concerning reference of the more complex type ,PhD A: Well .Grad E: Oh wow.Grad C: and um he sits in as a interested participant and helper . Is that a good characterization ?PhD A: u That 's pretty good , I think .Grad C: I don't know .PhD A: Yeah . Thanks .Grad C: OK . Keith is not technicallyone of us yet ,Grad E: Not yet .Grad C: ha - ha . but um it 's too late for him now .Grad G: " One of us . "Grad C: So .Grad E: Yeah right . I 've got the headset on after all .Grad C: Um . Officially I guess he will bejoining us in the summer .Grad E: yes .Grad C: And um hopefully it is by {disfmarker} by means of Keith that we will be able to get a b a better formal and a better semantic um idea of what a construction is and umhow we can make it work for us . Additionally his interest um surpasses um English because it also entails German , an extra capability of speaking and writing and understanding and reading that language . And um , isthere anyone who doesn't know Nancy ? Do you {disfmarker} do you know Nancy ?Grad G: Me ?Grad E: I know Nancy .Grad G: Mm - hmm .Grad B: I made that joke already , Nancy , sadly .Grad C: OK .Grad G: What?Grad B: The " I don't know myself " joke .Grad G: You did ? When ?Grad B: Uh before you came in .Grad G: Oh .Grad E: Man !Grad G: About me or you ?Grad B: About me .Grad G: OK . {vocalsound} OK .PhD A: Youcould do it about you .Grad B: Yeah .Grad G: Well I didn't know . I didn't mean to be humor copying , but OK , sorry . Yes , I know myself . It 's OK .Grad C: OK .Grad G: It 's a {disfmarker}Grad C: And um Fey is withus as of six days ago officially ?Undergrad D: Officially ,Grad C: Officially ,Undergrad D: yeah .Grad C: but in reality already um much much longer and um um next to some {disfmarker} some more or less bureaucraticuh stuff with the {disfmarker} the data collection she 's also the wizard in the data collection Um ,Grad G: Of Oz .Undergrad D: It 's very exciting .Grad C: we 're sticking with the term " wizard " ,Undergrad D: Yes.Grad C: OK .Undergrad D: Yes .Grad C: and umGrad G: Not witch - like .Grad B: Wizardette .Grad E: Wizard .Grad F: Wizardess .Grad C: Sorceress , I think .Grad G: OK .Undergrad D: Wizard .Grad C: wizard uh by bypopular voteGrad G: OK .Grad C: umGrad G: Didn't take a vote ? OK .Grad C: OK , um , why don't we get started on that subject anyways . Um , so we 're about to collect data and um the uh s the following things havehappened since we last met . When will we three meet again ? And umGrad G: More than three of us .Grad C: what happened is that um , " A " , {comment} there was some confusion between you and Jerry with the{disfmarker} that leading to your talking to Catherine Snow , and he was uh he {disfmarker} he agreed completely that some something confusing happened . Um his idea was to get sort of the l the lists of mayors ofthe department , the students . It {disfmarker} it 's exactly how you interpreted it , sort of sGrad E: The list of majors in the department ?Undergrad D: M m Majors ?Grad C: Ma - majors , majors .Undergrad D: Majors?Grad C: " Mayors " .Undergrad D: OK , mayor {disfmarker}Grad C: Majors .Undergrad D: Something I don't know about theseGrad G: The department has many mayors .Grad C: Majors and um just sending the{disfmarker} the little write - up that we did on to those email listsUndergrad D: OK . OK . Yeah , yeah , yeah . But {disfmarker} Yeah .Grad C: uh {disfmarker}Undergrad D: So it was really Carol Snow who wasconfused , not me and not Jerry .Grad C: Yep , yep , yep . OK . So . So , that is uh {disfmarker}Undergrad D: That 's good . So I should still do that .Grad C: Yep .Undergrad D: OK .Grad C: And {disfmarker}UndergradD: And using the thing that you wrote up .Grad C: Yep .Undergrad D: OK .Grad C: Wonderful . And um we have a little description of asking peop subjects to contact Fey for you know recruiting them for our thing andum there was some confusion as to the consent form , which is basically that {disfmarker} that what what you just signedGrad G: Right .Grad C: and since we have one already um {disfmarker}Grad G: Did Jerry talk toyou about maybe using our class ? the students in the undergrad class that he 's teaching ?Grad C: Um well he said um we {disfmarker} definitely " yes " ,Grad G: eGrad C: however there is always more people in a{disfmarker} in a facul uh in a department than are just taking his class or anybody else 's class at the momentGrad G: Yeah .Grad C: and one should sort of reach out and try and get them all .Grad G: OK , but th Iguess it 's that um people in his class cover a different set so {disfmarker} than the c is the CogSci department that you were talking about ?Undergrad D: I guess . SeeGrad G: uh reaching out to ?Undergrad D: that 'swhat I suggested to him , that people like {disfmarker} like Jerry and George and et cetera just {disfmarker}Grad G: Cuz we have you know people from other areasGrad C: Yeah .Grad G: advertise in their classes aswell .Undergrad D: Yeah or even I could {disfmarker} you know I could do the actual {disfmarker}Grad C: Mm - hmm .Grad G: Cuz I mean I {disfmarker} I know how to contact our students ,Undergrad D: That 'sgenerally the way it 's done .Grad G: so if there 's something that you 're sending out you can also s um send me a copy ,Grad C: Yeah .Grad G: me or Bhaskara could {disfmarker} either of us could post it to uh is it{disfmarker}Undergrad D: A mailing list .Grad G: if it 's a general solicitation that you know is just contact you then we can totally pro post it to the news groupGrad C: Mm - hmm . Yeah .Undergrad D: Yeah .Grad G:so .Grad C: Do it . Yeah .Undergrad D: That 's {disfmarker}Grad G: OK , so you 'll send it or something so .Grad C: As a matter of fact , if you {disfmarker}Undergrad D: I can send it .Grad C: if {disfmarker}UndergradD: I 'll send it ,Grad G: You can send it to me .Grad C: Now , iUndergrad D: yeah .Grad G: OK . Don't worry , we {disfmarker} this doesn't concern you anymore , Robert .Grad C: How {disfmarker} however I suggestthat if you {disfmarker} if you look at your email carefully you may think {disfmarker} you may find that you already have it .Grad G: It 's fine . Oops . Already ? Really ?Grad C: Maybe .Undergrad D: ProbabGrad G:Oops .Grad C: OK . W we 'll see .Grad G: I don't remember getting anything .Grad C: Anyhow , um the uh Yeah , not only Also we will talk about Linguistics and of course Computer Science .Grad G: Mm - hmm .Grad C:Um and then , secondly , we had , you may remember , um the problem with the re - phrasing , that subject always re - phrase sort of the task that uh we gave them ,Grad B: Right .Grad C: and so we had a meetingon Friday talking about how to avoid that , and it proved finally fruitful in the sense that we came up with a new scenario for how to get the {disfmarker} the subject m to really have intentions and sort of to act uponthose , and um there the idea is now that next actually we {disfmarker} we need to hire one more person to actually do that job because it {disfmarker} it 's getting more complicated . So if you know anyone interestedin {disfmarker} in what i 'm about to describe , tell that person to {disfmarker} to write a mail to me or Jerry soon , fast . Um {vocalsound} the idea now is to sort of come up with a high level of sort of abstract tasks "go shopping " um " take in uh a batch of art " um " visit {disfmarker} do some sightseeing " blah - blah - blah - blah - blah , sort of analogous to what Fey has started in {disfmarker} in {disfmarker} in compiling{disfmarker} compiling here and already {disfmarker} she has already gone to the trouble of {disfmarker} of anchoring it with specific um o {comment} um entities and real world places you will find in Heidelberg .And um . So out of these f s these high level categories the subject can pick a couple , such as if {disfmarker} if there is a cop uh a category in emptying your roll of film , the person can then decide " OK , I wanna dothat at this place " , sort of make up their own itinerary a and {disfmarker} and tasks and the person is not allowed to take sort of this h high level category list with them , but uh the person is able to take notes on amap that we will give him and the map will be a tourist 's sort of schematic representation with {disfmarker} with symbols for the objects . And so , the person can maybe make a mental note that " ah yeah I wanted togo shopping here " and " I wanted to maybe take a picture of that " and " maybe um eat here " and then goes in and solves the task with the system , IE {comment} Fey , and um and we 're gonna try out that{disfmarker} Any questions ?Grad G: so um y you 'll have those say somewhere what their intention was {disfmarker} so you still have the {disfmarker} the nice thing about having data where you know what theactual intention was ?Grad C: Mm - hmm . Yeah .Grad G: But they will um {disfmarker} There 's nothing that says you know " these are the things you want to do " so they 'll say " well these are the things I want to do" and {disfmarker} Right , so they 'll have a little bit more natural interaction ?Grad C: Hopefully .Grad G: OK . Mm - hmm .Grad F: So they 'll be given this map , which means that they won't have to like ask thesystem for in for like high level information about where things are ?Grad C: Yeah it 's a schematic tourist map . So it 'll be uh i it 'll still require the {disfmarker} that information and AnGrad G: It w it doesn't have likestreets on it that would allow them to figure out their way {disfmarker}Grad C: N not {disfmarker} not {disfmarker} not really the street network . Nuh .Grad G: OK .Grad E: So you 're just saying like what part oftown the things are in or whatever ?Grad C: Yeah a and um the map is more a means for them to have the buildings and their names and maybe some ma ma major streets and their namesGrad G: Mm - hmm .Grad C:and we want to maybe ask them , if you have {disfmarker} get it sort of isolated street the {disfmarker} the , whatever , " River Street " , and they know that {disfmarker} they have decided that , yes , that 's wherethey want to do this kind of action um that they have it with them and they can actually read them or sort of have the label for the object because it 's too hard to memorize all these st strange German names . Andthen we 're going to have another {disfmarker} we 're gonna have w another trial run IE the first with that new setup tomorrow at two and we have a real interesting subject which is Ron Kay for who {disfmarker}those who know him , he 's the founder of ICI . So he 'll {disfmarker} he 's around seven seventy years old , or something .Grad G: I didn't know he was the founder . That 's {disfmarker} OK .Grad C: And he alsoapproached me and he offered to help {vocalsound} um our project and he was more thinking about some high level thinking tasks and {vocalsound} I said " sure we need help you can come in as a subject " and hesaid " OK " . So that 's what 's gonna happen , tomorrow , data .Grad G: Using this new {disfmarker} new um plan ,Grad C: New {disfmarker} new set up .Grad G: OK .Grad C: Yeah . Which I 'll hopefully sort of scrapetogether t But , thanks to Fey , we already have sort of a nice blueprint and I can work with that . Questions ? Comments on that ? If not , we can move on . No ? No more questions ?Grad E: I 'm not sure I totallyunderstand thisGrad G: So what 's the s this is what you made , Fey ?Grad C: Hmm ?Grad E: but {disfmarker} I 'm not sure I totally understand everything that 's being talked aboutGrad G: Like so {disfmarker} So it's just based on like the materials you had about Heidelberg .Grad C: Um are you familiar with {disfmarker} with the {disfmarker} with the very rough setup of the data ?Grad E: but I {disfmarker} I imagine I 'll c justcatch on .Undergrad D: Based on the web site , yeah , at the {disfmarker}Grad G: Oh OK there 's a web siteGrad C: experiment ?Undergrad D: Right .Grad G: and then you could like um figure out what thecateUndergrad D: It 's a tourist information web site ,Grad E: Uh , this is where they 're supposed to {disfmarker}Undergrad D: so .Grad G: OK .Grad C: Talk to a machine and it breaks down and then the human comeson .Grad G: OK .Grad E: Yeah . Yeah .Grad C: The question is just sort of how do we get the tasks in their head that they have an intention of doing something and have a need to ask the system for something withoutgiving them sort of a clear wording or phrasing of the task .Grad E: OK . OK . OK .Grad C: Because what will happen then is that people repeat {disfmarker} repeat , {comment} or as much as they can , of thatphrasing .Grad E: OK .Grad G: Hmm . Um , are you worried about being able to identify {disfmarker}Grad E: OK .Grad G: Um . The {disfmarker} The goals that we 've d you guys have been talking about are this{disfmarker} these you know identifying which of three modes um their question uh concerns .Grad C: Mm - hmm .Grad G: So it 's like the Enter versus View {disfmarker}Grad C: Yeah , we {disfmarker} we{disfmarker} we will sort of get a protocol of the prior interaction ,Grad G: Uh - huh .Grad C: right ? That 's where the instructor , the person we are going to hire , um and the subjects sit down together with these highlevel thingsGrad G: Uh - huh . Mm - hmm .Grad C: and so th the q first question for the subject is , " so these are things , you know , we thought a tourist can do . Is there anything that interests you ? "Grad G: Mm -hmm .Grad C: And the person can say " yeah , sure sh this is something I would do . I would go shopping " . Yeah ? and then we can sort of {disfmarker} this s instructor can say " well , uh then you {disfmarker} youmay want to find out how to get over hereGrad G: Mm - hmm .Grad C: because this is where the shopping district is " .Grad G: So the interaction beforehand will give them hints about how specific or how whateverthough the kinds of questions that are going to ask during the actual session ?Grad C: No . Just sort of {disfmarker} OK , what {disfmarker} what {disfmarker} what would you like to buy and then um OK there youwanna buy a whatever cuckoos clocksGrad G: Yeah .Grad C: OK and the there is a store there .Grad E: Mm - hmm .Grad C: So the task then for that person is t finding out how to get there , right ?Grad G: Mm - hmm.Grad C: That 's sort of what 's left .Grad G: Mm - hmm .Grad C: And we know that the intention is to enter because we know that the person wants to buy a cuckoos clock .Grad G: OK , that 's what I mean so like thosetasks are all gonna be um unambiguous about which of the three modes .Grad C: Hopefully .Grad G: Right . OK . So .PhD A: Well , so the idea is to try to get the actual phrasing that they might use and try to interfereas little as possible with their choice of words .Grad C: Hopefully .Grad G: t {vocalsound} {vocalsound} {vocalsound} {vocalsound} {vocalsound} {vocalsound} {vocalsound} {vocalsound} {vocalsound} {vocalsound}{vocalsound} {vocalsound} That they 'll be here ?Grad C: Yes . In a sense that 's exactly the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the idea ,PhD A: uh uhGrad C: which is never possible in a {disfmarker} in a s in a labsituation ,PhD A: Well , u u the one experiment th that {disfmarker} that {disfmarker} that I 've read somewhere , it was {disfmarker} they u used pictures .Grad C: nuh ?PhD A: So to {disfmarker} to uh actually umuh specify the {disfmarker} the tasks .Grad C: Yep .Grad E: Mm - hmm .PhD A: Uh , but you know i iGrad C: Yeah . We had exactly that on our list of possible way things so we {disfmarker} uh I even made a sort of asilly thing how that could work , how you control you are here you {disfmarker} you want to know how to get someplace , and this is the place and it 's a museum and you want to do some and {disfmarker} and{disfmarker} and there 's a person looking at pictures . So , you know , this is exactly getting someplace with the intention of entering and looking at pictures .PhD A: Right .Grad C: However , not only was{disfmarker} the common census were {disfmarker} among all participants of Friday 's meeting was it 's gonna be very laborious to {disfmarker} to make these drawings for each different things ,PhD A: Right .Grad C:all the different actions , if at all possible , and also people will get caught up in the pictures . So all of a sudden we 'll get descriptions of pictures in there .PhD A: Right .Grad C: And people talking about pictures andpictorial representationsGrad E: Hmm .Grad C: and {disfmarker} umPhD A: Right .Grad C: I would s I would still be willing to try it .PhD A: I mean , I I 'm {disfmarker} I 'm not saying it 's necessary but {disfmarker}but uh i uh uh i {vocalsound} you might be able to combine you know text uh and {disfmarker} and some sort of picture and also uh I think it {disfmarker} it will be a good idea to show them the text and kind of chewthe task and then take the test away {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the text awayGrad C: Mm - hmm . Yeah .PhD A: so that they are not uh guided by {disfmarker}by by what you wrote ,Grad C: We will {disfmarker}PhD A: but can come up with their {disfmarker} with their own {disfmarker}Grad C: Yeah , they will have no more linguistic matter in front of them when they enterthis room .PhD A: Right .Grad C: OK . Then I suggest we move on to the {disfmarker} to we have um uh the EDU Project , let me make one more general remark , has sort of two {disfmarker} two side uh um actions ,its um action items that we 're do dealing with , one is modifying the SmartKom parser and the other one is modifying the SmartKom natural language generation module . And um this is not too complicated but I 'mjust mentioning it {disfmarker} put it in the framework because this is something we will talk about now . Um , I have some news from the generation , do you have news from the parser ?Grad F: Um , not{disfmarker}Grad C: By that look I {disfmarker}Grad F: Yes , uh , I would really p It would be better if I talked about it on Friday .Grad C: OK .Grad F: If that 's OK .Grad C: Yeah , wonderful . Um , did you run intoproblems or did you run into not h having time ?Grad F: Yeah . But not {disfmarker} not any time part .Grad C: OK , so that 's good . That 's better than running into problems .Grad F: OK .Grad C: And um I{disfmarker} I do have some good news for the natural language generation however . And the good news is I guess it 's done . Uh , meaning that Tilman Becker , who does the German one , actually took out sometime and already did it in English for us . And so the version he 's sending us is already producing the English that 's needed to get by in version one point one .Grad F: So I take it that was similar to the {disfmarker}what {disfmarker} what we did for the parsing ?Grad C: Yeah . I {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} it {disfmarker} even though the generator is a little bit more complex and it would have been , not changing one hundredwords but maybe four hundred words ,Grad F: OK .Grad C: but it would have beenGrad F: OK .Grad C: but this {disfmarker} this is I guess good news , and the uh {disfmarker} the time and especially Bhaskara and uh{disfmarker} and um {disfmarker} Oh do I have it here ? No . The time is now pretty much fixed . It 's the last week of April until the fourth of May so it 's twenty - sixth through fourth . That they 'll be here . So it 's{disfmarker} it 's extremely important that the two of you are also present in this town during that time .Grad B: Wait , what {disfmarker} what are the days ? April twenty - sixth to the {disfmarker} May fourth ?GradC: Yeah , something like that .Grad B: I 'll probably be here .Grad C: It 's {disfmarker}Grad F: Yeah .Grad E: You will be here .Grad C: There is a d Isn't finals coming up then pretty much after that ?Grad F: Finals was


Project Manager: Good .Industrial Designer: Beep . {vocalsound} {vocalsound} Oh .Project Manager: So well uhUser Interface: What ?Project Manager: welcome everyone .User Interface: Yeah .Project Manager: Umas you may have noticed I uhUser Interface: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: created separate folders because it was uh tending to get a little busy in our uh shared project documentsuh folder .User Interface: Yeah .Project Manager: I don't know if everybody uh put their own uh documents in the right folder , which is for now the detailed design meeting .Marketing: That's new one ?Project Manager:Yeah .User Interface: We didn't make any uh {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Uh , we should save that one . {vocalsound}User Interface: Oh in {disfmarker}Project Manager: Then I'll move this one .User Interface:Didn't we just do that ?Industrial Designer: Yeah , save in the folder . Save as project .User Interface: Oh .Project Manager: Oh no , this is just one big document , so you can leave that wherever it is .IndustrialDesigner: Oh , okay .Project Manager: {vocalsound} And we have a evaluation left here .User Interface: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Hmm hmm .Project Manager: Okay .Industrial Designer: Agenda .ProjectManager: Well not main documents this time . Oh uh yes .User Interface: Hmm ?Project Manager: I have it open myself I guess . Um well the detailed design meeting {disfmarker} Huh ? We're finally gettingsomewhere hopefully .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Um what are we going to do ? I've opened it already . Um I'm still going to take some minutes , and if I'm right ,you two are going to give a prototype presentation ?Industrial Designer: Oh , sorry .Marketing: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {gap}Project Manager: Aren't you ?User Interface: We could . {vocalsound}ProjectManager: Yes , you are .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Project Manager: And uh m did you do something with evaluation criteria ?Marketing: Yep . Yep .Project Manager: Good . And we have a correctagenda . And uh then we have to look at something which is less nice , the finance uh aspect , whether we can afford what we have designed ,User Interface: Oops . {vocalsound}Project Manager: and if we can we canuh commence the final part which is the production or project evaluation , how did we work together and what are the results , and how happy are we with those . Okay , well finance uh will be later . Now I'd like to givethe word to you two .User Interface: Yeah .Industrial Designer: Okay .User Interface: {vocalsound} Well uhIndustrial Designer: Get up stand up . {gap} just {disfmarker}User Interface: we made a prototype.Industrial Designer: 'Kay .User Interface: We first start with the overall uh {disfmarker} This is about the total remote control .Industrial Designer: View .User Interface: We made it green .Industrial Designer: Justexample colour ,User Interface: Yeah .Industrial Designer: so uh there's one of the colours we would like to uh see in our prototype .User Interface: It's a fresh colour . And uh the screen light blue . Oh uh this the scrollbutton and the microphone on the on the sides here under . And the R_ and R_ logo , it just says R_ and R_ now , but uh {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Okay ?User Interface: Any questions so far ?{vocalsound}Marketing: Big microphone .Industrial Designer: {gap} yeah ,User Interface: Yeah .Industrial Designer: just uh just an idea about how to m th that could also be possible .Marketing: Oh okay . That's theplace where it's going to be , not the size . {gap}User Interface: Yeah .Industrial Designer: Uh well , it's an idea in a {disfmarker} so .User Interface: Oh y you {disfmarker} perhaps you should make it a bit big , sopeople know it's there and uh {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Do not forget it .User Interface: Uh {disfmarker}Marketing: Mm-hmm .Industrial Designer: To function it it doesn't really have to be sm uh big of course.User Interface: Hmm .Marketing: Yeah , okay . Of course .Industrial Designer: The microphone could be just a minor uh hole uh on the left uh button .Marketing: Mm . Mm , th yeah .Industrial Designer: OkayumMarketing: Small .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} we also made some uh ideas about how uh the options menu would work . Uh using the scroll button on sides uh y uh I uh um {gap} {disfmarker}User Interface:You push the scroll buttonIndustrial Designer: Yeah , you push the scroll buttonUser Interface: and it's claps out if there's a {disfmarker} {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: and a drop down menu or a pull out menucomes out and uh you get uh you get the options uh becoming available . For example uh T_V_ settings , uh remote settings , et cetera .User Interface: Remote settings , et cetera . Yeah .Industrial Designer: So uh youcan scroll down too with the scroll uh button , uh as you can see {disfmarker} oh , it's here , just push it in , uh the menu comes out like this and uh i it all becomes visible . Um {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah . Andyou could also touch it so that it comes out ,Industrial Designer: Yeah , that's cUser Interface: and and use the the the scroll thing as a {disfmarker} with your fingers .Industrial Designer: Yeah . Indeed .User Interface:Yes .Industrial Designer: Okay , um it's also uh nice to see that um we made a small uh menu , uh the options menu uh becoming available when pressing the uh scroll uh button , and the opportunity to use the teletext, whi which is used uh {disfmarker} which should still be used and we think that it's uh very handy to put it uh not uh under the options menu , but in uh {disfmarker} Yes . In an apart uh {disfmarker}User Interface:Yeah .Project Manager: So a separate button for for text ,Industrial Designer: In a separate button , yeah . {vocalsound}User Interface: Yeah .Project Manager: okay .User Interface: Perhaps we should use the teletextsign in p yeah .Industrial Designer: A sign , yeah , just like {disfmarker} Okay , indeed .User Interface: Yeah .Industrial Designer: Okay ,User Interface: Forgot . {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: we can uh modify thatlater . Okay . Would you like to make any comments about next uh {disfmarker}User Interface: Uh well , this is the total interface uh that f of the L_C_D_ screen . Uh the numbers , which is pretty straight forward . Weput ano an an extra button in . We can erase it , but {disfmarker} It's the button where you can switch channels . {gap} just when you are one and you go to two , you can {disfmarker} or if you go to five , you can goback to one with that button . Yeah , that one , yeah .Industrial Designer: Previous page , yeah , indeed .User Interface: It has a name . And uh uh we put that in ,Industrial Designer: Oh my God .User Interface: Ithought it would be handy there . Uh this the one number or two numbers button . Below that , the page and the sound . And uh in the middle the the mute . Uh battery indicator . {vocalsound}Industrial Designer:{vocalsound} {vocalsound} {vocalsound} It's quite large .User Interface: It's {vocalsound} it's a bit big .Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound} And this is the uh the on off uh knop , the stand by uhknop . Or at least it should look like it . And the options uh of teletext .Industrial Designer: Okay . You can see very clearly now that the uh teletext and options menu isn't uh taking uh much uh {disfmarker} uh it'staking much part of the screen , so it's very uh {disfmarker} when you uh {vocalsound} when you use it , doesn't uh become irritating to see .User Interface: Huh .Industrial Designer: 'Cause if you put it on the top youalways get see the the options menu . 'Cause people regularly uh read from left top to right down ,Project Manager: Mm-hmm .Industrial Designer: so {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah . Well this about it , I think.Industrial Designer: Okay . Huh .User Interface: Yeah .Project Manager: Thank you . Looks good .User Interface: I will put it back on the {disfmarker} {vocalsound} on the nice green .Industrial Designer:{vocalsound}Project Manager: And I just missed when I was typing {disfmarker} The R_R_ stands for ?Industrial Designer: {gap}User Interface: That's the logo of the {disfmarker}Project Manager: Logo , okay .{vocalsound}User Interface: Yeah . It's th th right now it's only R_ R_ , but uh {disfmarker} {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Okay well {disfmarker} {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Full screen.Project Manager: I would have recognised it if it were the right colours of course . {vocalsound}Marketing: Shit .User Interface: Yeah . {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Alright . {vocalsound}User Interface: Sorry .{vocalsound}Marketing: 'Kay . {gap}Project Manager: Okay , the evaluation criteria ,User Interface: Oh full screen , yeah {vocalsound} {gap} .Industrial Designer: Huh .Project Manager: huh ?Marketing: Evaluation .'Kay , my task was this time to put up a questionnaire by which we can evaluate the design of the remote control by the questions we {gap} {disfmarker} requirements from the {disfmarker} of the users . My name ,my job , okay .Industrial Designer: My name , my job . {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound}Marketing: The methods . Questionnaire with seven point scale from one to seven , from true to false ,User Interface:Right .Marketing: like question , is remote big enough , we can say it's true or it's false by steps . One means absolutely not true , seven {gap} {disfmarker} means true .User Interface: Yeah .Marketing: The threeimportant things of refa {vocalsound} {gap} are uh from th of this year is {disfmarker} are ,Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Sorry ,User Interface: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: you used thePowerPoint {gap} {disfmarker}Marketing: is the remote control fancy enough ,User Interface: Yeah .Marketing: is it in innovative enough , and is it easy enough to use . And then evaluation itself . Uh .User Interface:{vocalsound}Industrial Designer: What ? {vocalsound}Marketing: So .Industrial Designer: Bling .Marketing: Okay .User Interface: Yeah .Marketing: First question . Is the design fancy enough ?User Interface: Well{disfmarker}Marketing: Project Manager , what do you think ?Project Manager: Well it's {disfmarker} looks fancy , especially with the green colour . And the the curves which we decided ,User Interface: {vocalsound}Yeah .Marketing: But does it {disfmarker}Project Manager: huh ?Marketing: Yeah .Project Manager: Only what happened to the single curve we spoke about last meeting ?User Interface: It uh {disfmarker} oh it's inthe background . Oh .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Now uh the single curved idea was uh {disfmarker} Yeah , okay , you ge um {disfmarker}User Interface: Y you should make uh a sideways uh view .IndustrialDesigner: Yeah . The sideways view , uh that that that maUser Interface: It will be , I guess . Oh , we can {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Ho not that pen . {vocalsound} Not that pen . {vocalsound} {vocalsound}{vocalsound}User Interface: OhMarketing: {vocalsound} {gap} {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound} WellUser Interface: g {vocalsound} I would {vocalsound} {disfmarker} smart board .Project Manager: itmight work one time , huh . {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Suppose so .User Interface: {vocalsound} Uh can I draw here or uh {disfmarker}Marketing: Think .User Interface: Ooh .Industrial Designer:Ah . Oh my God ,Marketing: Yeah , yeah , you can .User Interface: So it would be uh something like this from the side , but with a bit of uh curve here ,Industrial Designer: it works .User Interface: right ?IndustrialDesigner: Yeah , that's the single curve indeed .User Interface: Yeah . So if you v flip it like this .Project Manager: Okay .Industrial Designer: Yep .User Interface: Here's {gap} yeah .Industrial Designer: That's not very{disfmarker} i it's also uh very handy if you make a side curve way to make the the remote control very thin at the bottom uh at a bottom at a bottom . Uh make it uh rather thick on the top , because uh on the top ithas uh the screen , which takes uh in some uh space , and the batteries can be located over there ,User Interface: Yeah . So you just make the back of this part a bit bigger ,Industrial Designer: so uh {disfmarker}UserInterface: so that it lays a bit oIndustrial Designer: Yeah .Marketing: Isn't going to be a little bit heavy at the top ?Industrial Designer: {gap}User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah , that's a bit of problem maybe.Marketing: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: No .Marketing: With two batteries , the whole print plate and t and top , and if you're holding it quite a lot I think {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah . I think yeah , thebattery should be in here , because it's just nothing ,Industrial Designer: Yeah .User Interface: so if you could {disfmarker}Marketing: Yeah .Industrial Designer: Okay , indeed . Yeah .User Interface: Yeah .ProjectManager: Okay , but we have to rate uh these things now ?User Interface: 'Cause otherwise I think iMarketing: Yeah , we have to rate .Project Manager: Okay .Marketing: Is it fancy enough ? True is one , false is seven. So fancy enough means , does it comes to the younger people and the elder people .User Interface: I think it does .Industrial Designer: I think so .User Interface: I if you don't make it green , then the elder peoplewon't won't like it .Industrial Designer: It's pretty fancy .Marketing: I think {disfmarker} {vocalsound} Yeah , I have to agree , all the colour colours don don doesn't matter that m that much now ,User Interface: Yeah.Industrial Designer: {gap} you get thProject Manager: Mm-hmm .Marketing: it's only design .User Interface: I think it does .Project Manager: Yeah .Marketing: And the design .Project Manager: Well I think uhespecially because of the microphone and the L_C_D_ screen also .Industrial Designer: Yeah .User Interface: Yeah . I don't know whether older people will use it , but {disfmarker}Project Manager: Very new thing .Well {disfmarker} Fancy {gap} the old people will .Marketing: So {disfmarker}User Interface: I would make it a two or something .Industrial Designer: {gap}Marketing: A two ?User Interface: Yeah .IndustrialDesigner: {gap} It's true , it's a one . {vocalsound} Very fancy .User Interface: Huh ? Alright , it's a one . {vocalsound} Oh it's a one . {vocalsound}Project Manager: No , it's a two . {vocalsound} Little bit strange wehave to judge that ourselves , huh ?User Interface: Yeah .Marketing: Yeah , I n used {disfmarker} I wouldn I should use that one , but it doesn't {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: But it's aone uh {disfmarker} Maybe uh {disfmarker}Marketing: Okay , no it's two ? True is a one .User Interface: Yeah .Marketing: Very true , is it very true or isn't that true ?Project Manager: Well I'd say two on a scale{disfmarker}User Interface: Well they think it's very true , but uh {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: It's very true , because we designed it to be very fancy ,Marketing: Yeah , I think two .User Interface: {vocalsound}Yeah ,Industrial Designer: so {disfmarker}User Interface: but {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: It's very fancy , I think .User Interface: We should perhaps {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Have you ever seen aremote control like this ?Project Manager: No , okay well , that's true . {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: No , okay ,User Interface: That not .Industrial Designer: so so it's fancy .Marketing: That's fancy enough .UserInterface: Yeah .Project Manager: Okay , one two .Marketing: Then ?Project Manager: That doesn't matter that much , so make it a one . {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Yeah .{vocalsound}Marketing: Okay . Let's give it a two . Is it innovative ?User Interface: I think it is ,Marketing: Enough .Project Manager: YeahUser Interface: because it has an L_C_D_ screen , a mi microphone .ProjectManager: mIndustrial Designer: And uh uh the scroll is rubber ,User Interface: It's from rubber .Marketing: We have for the search function .User Interface: Yeah . {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: so s Eno enough to{gap} I think .Marketing: The scroller a bit {disfmarker} I think it's it's a one yeah .User Interface: {vocalsound} It's a one I think .Industrial Designer: {gap}Marketing: True . Also huh uh-huh {disfmarker} thebuttons , are they easy to find ? That was a big requirement of the old people .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: Yeah , because they're right on your screen . So you can use the b the the arrows .They're right on your screen ,Industrial Designer: Huh .User Interface: so I don't know where you'd search .Industrial Designer: With the ones {gap}Marketing: Are all the buttons easy to find ? Not only this buttons ,all the buttons .User Interface: Yeah .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: Well , I think they are . The options are it {disfmarker} uh little bit harder ,Industrial Designer: Yeah .User Interface: but if youtouch the options then it's uh {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Take a harder look , yeah , sure .Marketing: I think th it'sIndustrial Designer: It's easier than the regular uh remote control .Marketing: easy tProjectManager: Yeah , and you use these buttons the most ,Marketing: Yeah , I think this is easy now . I think th I think the options buttons are not the the easiest way to toProject Manager: huh ? So {disfmarker}IndustrialDesigner: Yeah .User Interface: No they're not , but they're they're they are easy to find .Marketing: to handle . True .Industrial Designer: Yeah , they are a lot easier to find than uh th than on the regular remotecontrolsMarketing: I would rate it a {disfmarker}User Interface: Oh .Industrial Designer: where you have to uh find out what {disfmarker} which sign or icon means on uh every button .Marketing: Yeah , okay , that'strue , that's true .User Interface: Yeah .Project Manager: SoIndustrial Designer: So you have t you have to use the the the manual to understand most {disfmarker}Project Manager: which {disfmarker}Marketing: Butthat's that's vantage of L_C_D_ screen , you can have text .Project Manager: So which number are we going to fill in ?Industrial Designer: Yeah .User Interface: I would say yeah .Industrial Designer: I think it's uh it's atwo , at least .User Interface: Yeah . Yeah ,Project Manager: A two , yeah ?User Interface: you can make it a two .Project Manager: Two , three and {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: It's not perfect , but{disfmarker}Marketing: Yeah .Project Manager: what do you think ?Marketing: {vocalsound} I think it's a three .Industrial Designer: A three ?Project Manager: Okay , so we have two , two , three .Industrial Designer:And why is that ?Marketing: I personally think , because I d I don't think i maybe it's easy to use , it has to be easy to find right away . I I think if you have the button at the right , I don't think you can find the optionbutton that easy .User Interface: Yeah , but you don't have t have to use the button on the right . You can touch it .Marketing: You can touch it .User Interface: Yeah . You you can touch options .Industrial Designer: Itsaid bo both the options .Marketing: Yeah , okay , but you have y then you have here s written option on here , the teletext button ,User Interface: Yeah .Marketing: right ?Industrial Designer: Yeah .Marketing: Okay ,then okay , good . Then I think also two , yeah .User Interface: You can touch optionsProject Manager: A two , okay ,User Interface: and it's comes out .Project Manager: because we have to {disfmarker}IndustrialDesigner: A two , a two .Marketing: Yep .User Interface: {vocalsound} The uh the um {disfmarker} Below .Project Manager: It's the box below it ,Industrial Designer: Uh the next question the next question .ProjectManager: huh ?Industrial Designer: Oh my God .Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Project Manager: Otherwise we have two results in one question .User Interface: {vocalsound} It'sdifferent .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Okay , next question .Marketing: It's easy to use , as well for younger as elderl elderly people .User Interface: For young people I think it's easy to use.Project Manager: {gap}Marketing: Young means sixteen to forty years .Industrial Designer: Yeah , I was {disfmarker} uh {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah .Marketing: And elderly from forty eight to their death.Industrial Designer: Yeah .User Interface: I think it's {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: I think it's the most useful uh remote control ever to be manufactured . {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound} In the entiremankind .Project Manager: Okay , you're very enthusiastic about your own design ,Marketing: Also if you're sixty years old {disfmarker}Project Manager: huh ?Industrial Designer: Yeah , but because it has the regularuh controls , li uh as you can see in the screen now , and uh you don't have all the other options uh always uh on your screen .User Interface: Yeah .Industrial Designer: So it's t I think it's really easy to use . You want