Project Manager: Okay , all set ? Welcome to the conceptual design meeting .User Interface: Uh , okay.Industrial Designer: Yes .Project Manager: The agenda . The opening . I'll again be the secretary andmake minutes , take minutes , uh and it will be three presentations , just like the last meeting . So um ,{vocalsound} who wants to start off ? Technical uh designer again ?User Interface: {vocalsound} Again.Project Manager: Okay .User Interface: Hmm .Project Manager: Uh , yeah . Uh , before we begin it , Iwant to say I've I've put the minutes of the uh second meeting in the shared folder , but they're still notuh quite okay . It uh it uh still some technical difficulties so the the first part of the minutes are very hardto read , because there are two documents that uh were layered over each other .User Interface:Mm-hmm .Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: So {disfmarker}Marketing: Okay .Project Manager:But uh , from now on I won't use my pen anymore , so will be p just {vocalsound} ordinary keyboard.User Interface: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface:Uh , may be better , yeah .Marketing: Keyboard work . Yeah .Project Manager: I think it {gap} will will bemore uh easy for you to read the minutes .User Interface: Yeah .Marketing: Alright .Industrial Designer:Okay , when we talk about uh components design , um it's really about the material and the{disfmarker} and uh uh really the stuff we build uh the remote controls of . Um , a remote control consistof uh components and the components of a remote control consist of uh properties and material . Wehave to choose th uh these uh wisely and it could affect uh uh a kind of grow of {disfmarker} in uh inbuying uh the remote controls . Um , the components of a remote control are of course uh the case . Uhthe properties of the case , um it has to be solid uh in hard material like uh hard plastic uh with softrubber for uh falling and and uh uh {disfmarker} yeah , it feels uh good in your hand .Marketing:{vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Mm the buttons has to be uh solid too , and the material is soft rubber .Uh I've got a uh email from the possibilities of Real Reaction . Um uh they're telling me that um when webuild uh a remote control of um of plastic or rubber , the uh buttons have to be uh rubber too . Mm{disfmarker} It's okay . Yeah . I when we use a rubbled {disfmarker} a doubled curved case , we mustuse a rubber push-buttons to {disfmarker} uh the the rubber double-curved case is a is a t uhthree-dimensional uh curve in the in the design , which is uh necessary when we want to be trendy . Uh{disfmarker} UmUser Interface: Oh .Industrial Designer: the energy source , uh I've got a lot ofpossibilities for that too . Um , uh the basic battery , which I thi prefer because of its uh its non uhnon-depending of of of uh um {disfmarker} Uh here you have to have a hand uh {disfmarker} yeah ,kinetic uh energy . Also in uh this one , like in the watches , but a remote control can lie on a table for aday , and then you push uh a button and {disfmarker} so you don't have to uh walk with it all the all thetime . Mm , solar cells are also uh a bit weird for uh remote controls .Marketing: {vocalsound}{vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Um uh also the casematerial , uh I think that plastic is the is the best with rubber , because uh wood or titanium would alsobe a bit weird .User Interface: Oh titanium is probably trendy , I think . {gap} .Marketing: That's true , Iguess . Yeah .User Interface: Well , maybe a little bit expensive .Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface:I don't know .Industrial Designer: Uh , they don't tell anything about the cost of uh titanium .Marketing:Huh .Industrial Designer: Um the chip {disfmarker} uh the chip set uh and the board is uh all off theshelf . Also , the speaker in the remote control , when we want to retrieve it . Um , the base station isalso off the shelf , all the materials and the components are uh just available in uh in our uh factory . Mm, I've told about uh the three first points . Mm , the simple electronical chip uh is is available uh with theLED transmitter uh transmitter . Uh , it's all uh off the shelf and even the speaker and the wirelessretriever are all uh available in our company . Um , another possibility . I uh yeah , I looked up on was uhthe L_C_D_ displays . Could be uh something special to our uh remote control , and it's possible , but itonly cost a bit more , but maybe it can be uh within the limits of twenty five Euros .Project Manager:Twelve and a half . Actually {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Ah yeah .Marketing: Yeah .User Interface:Yeah , production cost .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} I th I got an email with uh some examples andit {disfmarker} these were were the most trendiest one .User Interface: {vocalsound}Industrial


Project Manager: {vocalsound} Wouldn't wanna be Project Manager . {vocalsound} Uh , what we goingto do .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Um , once again I'muh gonna take minutes . So , um no presentation for me . Uh , first we have a prototype presentation byG_ and G_ .User Interface: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager:{vocalsound} Afterwards some uhUser Interface: Yo .Marketing: J_ and J_ . {vocalsound}ProjectManager: eval eval evaluIndustrial Designer: Evaluation .Project Manager: evaluationUser Interface:Evaluation criteria .Marketing: Evaluation .Project Manager: s {vocalsound} sorry .Industrial Designer:{vocalsound}Project Manager: Uh evaluation crit criteria . Uh , in combination with the finance I um{vocalsound} uh I received uh a an uh an Excel uh fileUser Interface: {vocalsound}Marketing: Hmm.Project Manager: which we have to fill in later on . Um , you see . Uh , and then we must see uh if we uhstay under the twelve and a half Euro .Marketing: Hmm . Interesting . Ah , okay .Project Manager: So ,that's uh that's a bigUser Interface: {vocalsound} Oops .Marketing: {vocalsound} Cool .{vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm . That's gonna be t problem .Project Manager: l so let's uhwait it uh umMarketing: {vocalsound} {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Project Manager: we have we havemust {disfmarker} uh ,User Interface: Some creative uh {disfmarker}Project Manager: we must have uhsome time for that uh because it will be uh {disfmarker} yeah , quite a lot of mathematics .UserInterface: Oh . Yeah .Project Manager: And after that , uh uh an evaluation of uh the process how we uhhow we have done it here with the SMARTboard , with the with our laptops , with the {disfmarker} all uhall this . And uh afterwards , uh we closing . Once again , forty minutes , so uh let's start .User Interface:Ok okay .Project Manager: I would g give the word to um G_ and G_ for the prototype presentation .UserInterface: Shall I give a short introduction and then uh {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Yeah , well sure.Marketing: J_ and J_ .Project Manager: J_ and J_ .User Interface: Okay . {vocalsound} J_ and J_ , okay.Marketing: Jane and Jane .Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: 'Kay guys , take it away .UserInterface: Take it away .Industrial Designer: Hi .Project Manager: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Marketing:{vocalsound}User Interface: Um , this was our first concept . We decided to use a single touch-screen .So , we've worked out this concepts , how to how to hold it , where to put the buttons and and stuff . Andum , well , we began with uh with a form of shape , that is uh is easy to hold w in one hand , left or righthanded .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: So , we made i it a little bit less thick and uh ithas some ar artistic meaning . No ? This uh isn't nothing . {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}ProjectManager: {vocalsound}User Interface: Idea maybe uh is better .Project Manager: {vocalsound}UserInterface: Um well , during the meeting I showed you the concept of uh placing the buttons on top ,usable with your thumb , and uh the menu structure , uh if necessary , with your other hand , so it's justgonna hold it easily .Project Manager: {vocalsound}User Interface: And it has to be acce accessible withyour uh other hand too , of course .Project Manager: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}User Interface: So webegan uh working out a concept .Industrial Designer: Yeah , uh well , and as you saw , we would justhave the basic remote with the panel L_C_D_ uh screen . Well , these would be the main buttons , h youcould uh change them later on in your own profile if you want to . But , well it's standard they will bedelivered with this kind of uh set-up . We have the {gap} more advanced menu uh setting right here .We have the sub-menus and stu stuff . We made a top {disfmarker} oh , or a front view . Just so like youwanna uh back view . As you can see , this uh {disfmarker} there , there are uh two uh weird bumps in it.Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} This is for uhthe added uh effect of uh well uh y youth and dynamic . And uh this is for the artistic effect .ProjectManager: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Well , what we figured is uh we'll show you a picture {gap}later on {gap} you have more b a better idea after that . But , idea is for to stay in balance with thesetwo uh {disfmarker} with these two .Marketing: Hmm .Industrial Designer: And so when you put it onthe table , it will just {gap} lay down . It won't {vocalsound} uh roll around or stuff . But it will lie morein your hand like an old telephone maybe , or like these old uh phones .Project Manager: Mm .IndustrialDesigner: Y you you may get the idea . So thi this is about uh how we figured it should be . The s panel


Lynne Neagle AM: Good morning, everyone, and welcome to the Children, Young People and Educationcommittee this morning. We've received apologies for absence from Siân Gwenllian and there is nosubstitute this morning. Can I ask if Members have got any declarations of interest they'd like to make,please? No? Okay. Thank you. Item 2 this morning, then, is a further session on our follow-up on our'Mind over matter' report. I'm very pleased to welcome Carol Shillabeer, who is chief executive of PowysTeaching Health Board, and who manages the Together for Children and Young People programme.Thank you very much for attending, and thank you for the written update that you provided in advance tothe committee. We've got a lot of ground that we want to cover this morning, so if it's okay we'll gostraight into questions. If I can just start and ask you if you're satisfied with the progress that's beenmade since the programme was established in 2015.Carol Shillabeer: Thank you very much for thatquestion, Chair. I've got to say 'yes', in many regards. So, the key focus of the programme in the earlystages was about improving access to specialist child and adolescent mental health services. Wedeveloped the windscreen model—or we lifted the windscreen model. Other models that are very similarhave been talked about as well, and our big focus was on ensuring that we could make immediateprogress around access to specialist CAMHS. It's some years ago now since this committee did theoriginal report, and obviously Healthcare Inspectorate Wales and the Wales Audit Office had done reportsin the past, and I think there was a need for a programme that could focus on action. You'll see in thewritten update that we covered quite a large number of areas, and so therefore had to make aprioritisation. The prioritisation was at the specialist CAMHS end. We have provided the committee with ared, amber or green rating of where we feel that we were, and that was just before submission of theevidence. Overall I would say we have made progress. I recognise you recognise that in your 'Mind overmatter' report, and that is pleasing. What I would say, though, is that there's a still a lot to be done.Certainly over the last nine months or so, we've seen a real momentum around the whole-schoolapproach work, which we're not actually leading now as a programme, although we facilitated theworkshop held in September. But that's got a real momentum, and the absolute priority now is the earlyhelp and enhanced support part of the work moving forward, and I'm sure we will come on to that inmore detail. But we know there is more community workforce in specialist CAMHS, we know we're seeingchildren in a shorter time frame, and we know we're accepting more referrals, so our indicators are tellingus we are making progress.Lynne Neagle AM: Thank you. And you referred to the work on thewhole-school approach, which is very welcome, and I recognise that the programme has been involved indriving that as well. But I'm sure you'll also recognise the emphasis that the committee has placed on thisbeing a whole-system approach to children and young people's mental health, and we feel very stronglythat if any of the areas get out of balance, then it will jeopardise the progress in other parts of theprogramme. Are there any particular areas where you feel you haven't made enough progress that you'dlike to draw the committee's attention to?Carol Shillabeer: This is maybe about what the programme'sdone, but really around the broader sense as well. I'm going to be very straight and say we should havemade more progress on psychological therapies. I'm disappointed that we haven't. I'm assured thatwe've got capacity in place now and the drive in place to get the Matrics Cymru framework developed forchildren and young people. I've had discussions with the national psychological therapies committee, whohave owned this, and we're working together more on this area. That's not to say for one minute thathealth boards and local areas haven't been working on psychological therapy service provision andchanging the models, but that is an area we should have made, I think, earlier progress on. There's beena general reflection from myself and the Together for Children and Young People programme board overthe phase of the programme. I think we started very strongly; I think we probably had a bit of a lull inthe middle, if I'm truthful about that—we had a change of personnel, and we really gathered amomentum over the last year or 18 months, and that has helped to push us from a focus on specialistCAMHS into that whole-school approach. But, if I could just agree with your comments about the wholesystem, it has to be the whole system and that's why the real focus now on early help and enhanced


Project Manager: Okay Right {vocalsound} Um well this is the kick-off meeting for our our project . Um{vocalsound} and um this is just what we're gonna be doing over the next twenty five minutes . Um sofirst of all , just to kind of make sure that we all know each other ,Marketing: Mm-hmm .Project Manager:I'm Laura and I'm the project manager . {vocalsound} Do you want to introduce yourself again?Marketing: Great .Industrial Designer: Hi , I'm David and I'm supposed to be an industrial designer.Project Manager: Okay .Marketing: And I'm Andrew and I'm uh our marketingUser Interface: Um I'mCraig and I'm User Interface .Marketing: expert .Project Manager: Great . Okay . {vocalsound} Um sowe're designing a new remote control and um {disfmarker} Oh I have to record who's here actually . Sothat's David , Andrew and Craig , isn't it ? And you all arrived on time . Um yeah so des uh {vocalsound}design a new remote control . Um , as you can see it's supposed to be original , trendy and user friendly .Um so that's kind of our our brief , as it were . Um and so there are three different stages to the design .Um I'm not really sure what what you guys have already received um in your emails . What did you get?Industrial Designer: Um , I just got the project announcement about what the project is {vocalsound}.Project Manager: Mm-hmm .Industrial Designer: Designing a remote control .Marketing: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: That's about it , didn't get anything else .Marketing: Mm-hmm . Yeah , that's that'sit .Project Manager: Is that what everybody got ?Industrial Designer: Did you get the same thing ?UserInterface: Yeah .Project Manager: Okay .Marketing: Yeah .Project Manager: Um . So we're gonna havelike individual work and then a meeting about it . And repeat that process three times . Um and at thispoint we get try out the whiteboard over there . Um . {vocalsound} So uh you get to draw your favouriteanimal and sum up your favourite characteristics of it . So who would like to go first ?Marketing: I will go. That's fine .Project Manager: Very good . {vocalsound}Marketing: Alright . So {disfmarker}{vocalsound} {vocalsound} This one here , right ?Project Manager: Mm-hmm .Marketing: Okay . Verynice . Alright . My favourite animal is like {disfmarker} {vocalsound} {vocalsound} A beagle .ProjectManager: {vocalsound}Marketing: Um charac favourite characteristics of it ? Is that right ?ProjectManager: Yeah . Yeah .Marketing: Uh , right , well basically um high priority for any animal for me is thatthey be willing to take a lot of physical affection from their family . And , yeah that they have lots ofpersonality and uh be fit and in robust good health .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: So thisis blue . Blue beagle . My family's beagle .Project Manager: Right .Marketing: {vocalsound}ProjectManager: Lovely . {vocalsound}User Interface: {gap} Well , my favourite animal would be a monkey.Project Manager: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound} Thenthey're small cute and furry , and uh when planet of the apes becomes real , {vocalsound} I'm gonna beup there with them .Marketing: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Cool .Project Manager: Right .UserInterface: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: There's too much gear . {vocalsound}ProjectManager: You can take as long over this as you like , because we haven't got an awful lot to discuss.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Ok oh we do we doUser Interface:{vocalsound}Project Manager: Don't feel like you're in a rush , anyway .Industrial Designer: Okay.Marketing: I coulda told you a whole lot more about beagles .Project Manager: Ach {gap} why not{disfmarker}Marketing: Boy , let me tell you . {vocalsound}Project Manager: We might have to get youup again then .User Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: I don't know what mine is . I'm gonna haveto think on the spot now .Marketing: Impressionist .Project Manager: {vocalsound}User Interface:{vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Can't draw . {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound}IndustrialDesigner: Um .Project Manager: Is that a whale ? {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Yeah . Um , wellanyway , I don't know , it's just the first animal I can think off the top of my head . Um . Yes . Big reasonis 'cause I'm allergic to most animals . Allergic to animal fur ,Project Manager: Ah .Industrial Designer: soum fish was a natural choice . Um , yeah , and I kind of like whales . They come in and go {vocalsound}eat everything in sight . {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}IndustrialDesigner: And they're quite harmless and mild and interesting .Marketing: {vocalsound} Alright . Mm.Project Manager: Okay . God , I still don't know what I'm gonna write about . Um .Marketing: Superb


Lynne Neagle AM: Good morning, everyone. Welcome to the Children, Young People and EducationCommittee this morning. I've received no apologies for absence. Can I ask Members if there are anydeclarations of interest, please? No. Okay, thank you. Item 2 this morning is our scrutiny session onEstyn's annual report 2018-19. I'm very pleased to welcome Meilyr Rowlands, Her Majesty's ChiefInspector, Estyn; Jassa Scott, strategic director at Estyn; and Claire Morgan, strategic director at Estyn.Thank you all for attending. We're looking forward to hearing what you've got to say. We'll go straightinto questions from Suzy Davies.Suzy Davies AM: Bore da. Good morning, everybody. Thank you for thepapers upfront, in which you say that the most striking feature of the education system, looking forward,of course is the curriculum and the change that that's bringing. How can we be sure that, during thisperiod of change, standards don't slip? And also, from the point of view of scrutiny, will we be back in asituation where we're being told, 'You can't compare one set of results against the previous year's results,because of the nature of the change'?Meilyr Rowlands: Bore da, bawb. Thank you for the invitation tocome here. I think that's a good question. I think any kind of major educational reform has got risksattached to it, particularly if those changes were made too quickly. I think this process of reform hasbeen going on in the background for a few years now, so I think there is a track record of standards andprovision not slipping. We've seen small incremental improvements. So, overall, I think we can be fairlyconfident that standards won't slip during this period of preparation.Suzy Davies AM: Can I just ask: isthat based on your evidence around primary schools, where the sort of ethos that we've seen in thecurriculum has been already articulated through the foundation phase?Meilyr Rowlands: The track recordI'm talking about is across the board, so it's very difficult to think of anything that's actually got worseover the last three or four years, so it's difficult to say that standards of provision is slipping. It might notbe improving as quickly as we would like, but the purpose of major curriculum and, more generally,educational reform is to make sure that we do get a more substantial sort of improvement. I think weshould congratulate the profession for the work they've been doing. A large number of schools andteachers and leaders have been part of preparing the new curriculum and all the associated work, as wellas doing the day job. I think their commitment and their engagement with curriculum reform, andengagement with wider education reform, is to be congratulated. So, I think going forward, we mustmake sure that that is continued; that this process that's called co-construction—engaging with theprofession, making sure that they're behind all the changes—continues. I think that's what's going tomake sure that we don't see any slippage.Suzy Davies AM: Okay, and on that point of comparing year onyear, we will be able to make those comparisons legitimately then?Meilyr Rowlands: Yes, certainly, interms of our inspection outcomes and our inspection work, yes.Suzy Davies AM: Okay. That's great,thank you. Can I just ask you then about the difference in preparedness between primary and secondaryschools, which I've just mentioned previously, and also what your views are on the impact of funding forschools on that as well? Because we're in a situation where a number of primary schools have got surplusfunds, sometimes that's because of end of year additional funds just being magicked up, but there is aserious worry that so many secondary schools are in deficit and that, overall, secondary schools are indeficit. Is there a correlation between those two positions, that secondary schools may be less ready forthis than primary schools?Meilyr Rowlands: I think it's probably true to say that secondary schools have agreater challenge than primary schools generally in terms of preparedness for the new curriculum. I thinkthat's why we welcomed the phasing in of the new curriculum. With any sort of education reform, you'vegot that danger of people wanting to see change as soon as possible on the one hand, and on the otherhand you need time to pilot things, to make sure that people have the right professional learning andmake sure that there's opportunity for evaluation and thinking and so forth. So, we've got to get thatbalance right.Suzy Davies AM: Sorry, that could be difficult to do if a school doesn't have money to createthat space, couldn't it?Meilyr Rowlands: Yes. You raised two issues, I think. One, about the differencebetween primary and secondary: I think what I'm saying there is I think the fact that the new curriculumis going to be brought in for all the years in primary, but it's going to be phased in year by year for


Professor B: Is it starting now ?PhD E: Yep .Professor B: So what {disfmarker} what {disfmarker} from{disfmarker} what {disfmarker}Grad A: Hello ?Professor B: Whatever we say from now on , it can beheld against us , right ?PhD E: That 's right .Professor B: and uhGrad A: It 's your right to remain silent.Professor B: Yeah . So I {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the problem is that I actuallydon't know how th these held meetings are held , if they are very informal and sort of just people are saywhat 's going onPhD E: Yeah .Professor B: andPhD E: Yeah , that 's usually what we do .Professor B: OK.PhD E: We just sorta go around and people say what 's going on , what 's the latest uh{disfmarker}Professor B: Yeah . OK . So I guess that what may be a {disfmarker} reasonable is if I uhfirst make a report on what 's happening in Aurora in general , at least what from my perspective .PhD E:Yeah . That would be great .Professor B: And {disfmarker} and uh so , I {disfmarker} I think thatCarmen and Stephane reported on uh Amsterdam meeting ,PhD D: Uh oProfessor B: which was kind ofinteresting because it was for the first time we realized we are not friends really , but we are competitors. Cuz until then it was sort of like everything was like wonderful and {disfmarker}PhD E: Yeah . Itseemed like there were still some issues ,Professor B: Yeah .PhD E: right ? that they were trying todecide ?Professor B: There is a plenty of {disfmarker} there 're plenty of issues .PhD E: Like the voiceactivity detector ,Professor B: Well and what happened was that they realized that if two leadingproposals , which was French Telecom Alcatel , and us both had uh voice activity detector . And I said "well big surprise , I mean we could have told you that {pause} n n n four months ago , except we didn'tbecause nobody else was bringing it up " .PhD E: Right .Professor B: Obviously French Telecom didn'tvolunteer this information either , cuz we were working on {disfmarker} mainly on voice activity detectorfor past uh several monthsPhD E: Right .Professor B: because that 's buying us the most uh thing . Andeverybody said " Well but this is not fair . We didn't know that . " And of course uh the {disfmarker} it 'snot working on features really . And be I agreed .PhD E: Right .Professor B: I said " well yeah , you areabsolutely right , I mean if I wish that you provided better end point at speech because uh {disfmarker}or at least that if we could modify the recognizer , uh to account for these long silences , becauseotherwise uh that {disfmarker} that {disfmarker} th that wasn't a correct thing . " And so then ev eveverybody else says " well we should {disfmarker} we need to do a new eval evaluation without voiceactivity detector , or we have to do something about it " .PhD E: Right .Professor B: And in principle I{disfmarker} uh I {disfmarker} we agreed .PhD E: Mm - hmm .Professor B: We said uh " yeah " .Because uh {disfmarker} but in that case , uh we would like to change the uh {disfmarker} the algorithmbecause uh if we are working on different data , we probably will use a different set of tricks .PhD E:Right .Professor B: But unfortunately nobody ever officially can somehow acknowledge that this can bedone , because French Telecom was saying " no , no , no , now everybody has access to our code , soeverybody is going to copy what we did . " Yeah well our argument was everybody ha has access to ourcode , and everybody always had access to our code . We never uh {disfmarker} uh denied that . Wethought that people are honest , that if you copy something and if it is protected {disfmarker} protectedby patent then you negotiate , or something ,PhD E: Yeah . Right .Professor B: right ? I mean , if you findour technique useful , we are very happy .PhD E: Right .Professor B: But {disfmarker} And FrenchTelecom was saying " no , no , no ,PhD E: Mm - hmm .Professor B: there is a lot of little tricks which uhsort of uh cannot be protected and you guys will take them , " which probably is also true . I mean , youknow , it might be that people will take uh uh th the algorithms apart and use the blocks from that . But Isomehow think that it wouldn't be so bad , as long as people are happy abou uh uh uh honest about it.PhD E: Yeah .Professor B: And I think they have to be honest in the long run , because winning proposalagain {disfmarker} uh what will be available th is {disfmarker} will be a code . So the uh {disfmarker}the people can go to code and say " well listen this is what you stole from me "PhD E: Mm - hmm.Professor B: you know ?PhD E: Right .Professor B: " so let 's deal with that " .PhD E: Right .Professor B:So I don't see the problem . The biggest problem of course is that f that Alcatel French Telecom cl claims" well we fulfilled the conditions . We are the best . Uh . We are the standard . " And e and other people


Grad F: OK .PhD C: Adam , what is the mike that , uh , Jeremy 's wearing ? Grad F: It 's the ear - plugmike .Postdoc A: Ear - plug .PhD E: That 's good .PhD C: Is that a wireless , or {disfmarker} ? Oh .GradF: No .Grad G: It 's wired .Professor B: Oh !Postdoc A: Is that {disfmarker} Does that mean you can'thear anything during the meeting ?Grad D: It 's old - school .Grad F: Huh ? What ? Huh ?Professor B:Should we , uh , close the door , maybe ?Grad F: It {disfmarker} it 's a fairly good mike , actually.Professor B: So it 's {disfmarker} Yeah . Huh .Grad F: Well , I shouldn't say it 's a good mike . All I reallyknow is that the signal level is OK . I don't know if it 's a {disfmarker} the quality .Professor B: Well , that's aGrad F: Ugh ! So I didn't send out agenda items because until five minutes ago we only had oneagenda item and now we have two . So . {vocalsound} And , uh .Professor B: OK . So , just to repeat thething bef that we said last week , it was there 's this suggestion of alternating weeks on {vocalsound}more , uh , automatic speech recognition related or not ? Was that sort of {pause} the division ?Grad F:Right .Professor B: So which week are we in ?Grad F: Well {disfmarker} We haven't really started , but Ithought we more {disfmarker} we more or less did Meeting Recorder stuff last week , so I thought wecould do , uh {disfmarker}Professor B: I thought we had a thing about speech recognition last week too.PhD C: Yeah .Grad F: But I figure also if they 're short agenda items , we could also do a little bit of each.Professor B: Yeah .Grad F: So . I seem to be having difficulty getting this adjusted . Here we go.Professor B: OK .Grad F: So , uh , as most of you should know , I did send out the consent form thingiesand , uh , so far no one has made any {disfmarker} Ach ! {comment} {comment} any comments onthem . So , no on no one has bleeped out anything .Professor B: Um . Yeah .Grad F: So . I don't expectanyone to . But .Professor B: Um . {vocalsound} So , w what follows ? At some point y you go aroundand get people to sign something ?Grad F: No . We had spoken w about this beforeProfessor B: Yeah ,but I 've forgotten .Grad F: and we had decided that they have {disfmarker} they only needed to signonce . And the agreement that they already signed simply said that we would give them an opportunity .So as long as we do that , we 're covered .Professor B: And how long of an opportunity did you tell them?Grad F: Uh , July fifteenth .Professor B: July fifteenth . Oh , so they have a plenty of time , and yGrad F:Yep .Professor B: Given that it 's that long , um , um {disfmarker} Why was that date chosen ? You justfelt you wanted to {disfmarker} ?Grad F: Jane told me July fifteenth . So , that 's what I set it .Postdoc A:Oh . I just meant that that was {pause} the release date that you had on the {pause} data .Professor B:Oh , OK .Grad F: Oh . I {disfmarker} I didn't understand that there was something specific .Postdoc A: I ,uh {disfmarker} I thought {disfmarker}Grad F: You {disfmarker} y you had {disfmarker}Professor B: Idon't {disfmarker}Grad F: I had heard July fifteenth , so that 's what I put .Postdoc A: Mm - hmm.Professor B: No , the only {disfmarker} th the only {pause} mention I recall about that was just thatJuly fifteenth or so is when {vocalsound} this meeting starts .Grad F: So .Postdoc A: That 's right . That's why .Professor B: Oh , I see .Postdoc A: You said you wanted it to be available then .Professor B: OK.Postdoc A: I didn't mean it to be the hard deadline .Professor B: Right .Postdoc A: It 's fine with me if itis , or we cou But I thought it might be good to remind people two weeks prior to thatProfessor B:wPostdoc A: in case , uh {disfmarker} you know , " by the way {pause} this is your last {disfmarker}"Professor B: Right .Postdoc A: Uh . Yeah .Professor B: We probably should have talked about it , cuz ibecause if we wanna be able to give it to people July fifteenth , if somebody 's gonna come back and say" OK , I don't want this and this and this used " , uh , clearly we need some time to respond to that .Right ?Grad F: Yeah . As I said , we {disfmarker} I just got one dateProfessor B: Yeah .PhD H: Damn!Grad F: and that 's the one I used .Professor B: Yeah .Grad F: So . But I can send a follow - up . I mean ,it 's almost all us . I mean the people who are in the meeti this meeting was , uh , these {disfmarker} themeetings that {disfmarker} in {disfmarker} are in set one .PhD C: Was my {disfmarker} was myresponse OK ?Postdoc A: That 's right .PhD C: I just wrote you {disfmarker} replied to the email sayingthey 're all fine .Grad F: Right . I mean , that 's fine .PhD C: OK , good .Grad F: I {disfmarker} we don't{disfmarker} My understanding of what we {pause} had agreed upon when we had spoken about thismonths ago was that , uh , we don't actually need a reply .PhD C: That makes it easy .Grad F: We just


Project Manager: Hello again .User Interface: Hello .Industrial Designer: Hi . {vocalsound}Marketing:Hey , Project Manager .Project Manager: {vocalsound}User Interface: Um , Project Manager , I havesomething to tell you .Project Manager: Mm yeah .User Interface: I have a little problems with my laptop.Project Manager: Okay .User Interface: And uh s s s so I had a little less time to complete .ProjectManager: Okay .User Interface: No , a little problem , uh {vocalsound} big problem . I just thought{disfmarker}Marketing: What was it , problem ?User Interface: Um , it didn't work anymore .{vocalsound}Marketing: The laptop ?User Interface: The entire Windows uh {disfmarker}Marketing: Ithang {disfmarker} hung .User Interface: It it hung . {vocalsound}Project Manager:{vocalsound}Marketing: Ha-ha . Oh . Project Manager .Project Manager: {vocalsound} Yes .{vocalsound} Yes .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: You're our Project Manager .ProjectManager: {vocalsound} Your project manager . {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}UserInterface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Welcome to the conceptual design meetingIndustrial Designer:{vocalsound} {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: for Real Reaction .Marketing:{vocalsound}Project Manager: Uh , hello again . Uh it's uh the same as the last time . Uh uh , also thistime there will be uh three presentations .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: And we ummust uh reach a decision on uh the remote control concepts . Um uh , and at the end , uh I uh , when Ifinish it off I have some uh input from uh a master class I uh {vocalsound} visited . {vocalsound} {gap}information . {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface:During lunch , yeah .Marketing: Master .User Interface: He's the master , yeah . {vocalsound}{vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: The thethe the the concepts on uh {disfmarker} we uh {disfmarker} where we uh must reach a decision on . Umuh , our {disfmarker} from uh are of two sorts .Marketing: Master of {disfmarker}Project Manager:Components concepts and user interface concepts . Uh , the first one is uh really about the the the thethe total package uh with uh {disfmarker} Well , we have decided to do a {disfmarker} do the uh{disfmarker} with a touch-screen that must be a case around it so uh it won't be uh uh as breakable . Uhhow how about the energy ? Can you uh can you reload it or uh just have batteries which you mustexchange ? Uh , the user interface concept . Uh , with the type and uh the the supplements . So uh whereto put what button . {vocalsound} And uh uh I would say uh {disfmarker} Jans , can you begin?Industrial Designer: Yeah , sure .Project Manager: Okay .Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Atthe end , uh {disfmarker} I will take notes uh and at the end of the minutes uh will uh be at the sharedfolder .Industrial Designer: Okay . Uh , let me see . I think it's this one . Ha .User Interface: Wow.Industrial Designer: Right . Uh , well , I'll be talking about the components .Marketing:{vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Uh , what I did was I reviewed previously used items uh by uh two twouh different uh age groups .Project Manager: Mm-hmm .Industrial Designer: Uh below forty five andabove . And uh I just uh watch what the differences are and I checked uh , well , what what d do we want, and {gap} how can we uh d aim a at uh the target group . Well uh what I found was that a senior um{disfmarker}Project Manager: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} senior citizens uh{disfmarker} {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound} I'm sorry . {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Ye Ah ,it's {vocalsound} it's okay .Marketing: Okay . Go on . {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Uh {disfmarker}{vocalsound} They , well , they like more the {disfmarker} they like the traditional materials , like woodand and such more .Marketing: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Wood and chrome .Project Manager:{vocalsound}Industrial Designer: And uh uh they like uh straightforward shapes . Um , uh they they theythey like luxurious uh styles , where whereas the young and dynamic , they like a more uh soft materials. Think of the Teletubbies , for instance .Project Manager: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Uh uh , softand fluffy and colourful and {disfmarker}Marketing: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Well uh , shapesare curved and round .Marketing: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Y y you get {vocalsound} the picture. And uh they like sports and gaming , and that gives them uh the vitality . Uh , so w well uh , firsProjectManager: One one little question .Industrial Designer: Yes .Project Manager: Um about the the material


Project Manager: Okay we all all set ? Right . Well this is the uh final detailed design meeting . Um we'regonna discuss the look and feel design , the user interface design , and we're gonna evaluate the product. And the end result of this meeting has to be a decision on the details of this remote control , likeabsolute final decision , um and then I'm gonna have to specify the final design in the final report . So umjust from from last time to recap , we said we were gonna have a snowman shaped remote control withno L_C_D_ display , no need for talk-back , it was hopefully gonna be kinetic power and battery uh withrubber buttons , maybe backlighting the buttons with some internal L_E_D_s to shine through the casing, um hopefully a jog-dial , and incorporating the slogan somewhere as well . Anything I've missed?Industrial Designer: No .Project Manager: Okay um so uh if you want to present your prototype goahead .User Interface: Uh-oh . This is it ? {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Ninja Homer , made in Japan. {vocalsound}User Interface: Um , there are a few changes we've made .Project Manager: Okay .UserInterface: Um , well look at the expense sheet , and uh it turned to be quite a lot expensive to have openup and have lots of buttons and stuff inside ,Project Manager: Mm . Mm-hmm .User Interface: so insteadwe've um {disfmarker} this is gonna be an L_C_D_ screen , um just a a very very basic one , very smallum with access to the menu through the the scroll wheel and uh confirm um button .Marketing: Mm 'kay.User Interface: Uh , apart from that , it's just pretty much the same as we discussed last time .IndustrialDesigner: And there isn't uh d it doesn't open up to the advanced functions ? the advanced functions arestill hidden from you , but they're hidden in the sense that um they're not in use .Marketing: Where arethey ?Industrial Designer: Um they're in the L_C_D_ panel and the jog-dial ?Marketing: Ah , right.Industrial Designer: Okay 'cause {disfmarker}Project Manager: So w what kind of thing uh is gonna be{disfmarker}Marketing: Great .User Interface: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: The L_C_D_ panel justdisplays um functionally what you're doing . If you're using an advanced function right , like um cbrightness , contrast , whatever , it will just say {disfmarker}Marketing: Right . Okay .IndustrialDesigner: You know it's like it only has four columns , it's a very simple L_C_D_ like , whereas many{disfmarker} the minimum amount we need that the user will automatically know like this is brightnessor this is contrast .Marketing: Right .Project Manager: Mm-hmm . Okay cool .Marketing: Right , 'kay.Industrial Designer: It might even be one , a bit more complex L_C_D_ panel with pictures like maybethe sun or the , you know , the the symbols of the various functions .Marketing: OkayProject Manager:Oh right okay .Marketing: Mm-hmm , and what is this here ?Project Manager: Cool .Industrial Designer:That's a number pad .Marketing: Okay so the number pad is {disfmarker} 'Kay , great .Project Manager:Where are we gonna have the slogan ?Industrial Designer: Um they're al along this {disfmarker}UserInterface: You know , just like right inside there .Industrial Designer: Yeah .Project Manager: Okay cool.Industrial Designer: You have this space here , and then you have this thing on the side as well , or atthe bottom .Project Manager: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: 'Cause slogans are usually quite small ,right ,Project Manager: Okay .Industrial Designer: they're not like hugeMarketing: Mm .IndustrialDesigner: so they're sMarketing: Yep .Industrial Designer: Say a button's aboutProject Manager: Okay.Marketing: Looks good .Industrial Designer: say a button's about this size , right , so you would stillhave plenty of space for a slogan , say even for that .Marketing: Yep . {vocalsound} Mm-hmm .ProjectManager: So if this isn't to scale , what kind of dimensions are you thinking about here ?User Interface:{vocalsound} Well {vocalsound} we want the other buttons to be big enough to push easily with afingerProject Manager: Mm-hmm .User Interface: so we reckon maybe that'll be about the same size asthe palm of your hand . {gap}Marketing: Okay .Industrial Designer: Yep so that would be about acentimetre for a button , so one two three four centimetres . Plus maybe half o fiveMarketing: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: six seven eight ,Marketing: About nine in total .Project Manager: Six , seven , eight, nine , ten .Industrial Designer: about yeah nine total .Project Manager: So we're talking about tencentimetres .Marketing: That sounds good . Yeah .Project Manager: That would be good . So tencentimetres in height .Marketing: Yep .Industrial Designer: Nine , ten . Yep .Project Manager: Okay um{vocalsound} .Marketing: That'd be good , in fact a pen is about ten centimetres usually , so that would


Professor D: OK . So , uh You can fill those out , uh {pause} after , actually , so So , I got , uh {pause}these results from , uh , Stephane . Also , um , I think that , uh {pause} um {pause} we might hear latertoday , about other results . I think s that , uh , there were some other very good results that we 'regonna wanna compare to . But , {vocalsound} r our results from other {disfmarker} other places , yeah.PhD A: I I 'm sorry ? I didn'tProfessor D: Um , I got this from youPhD A: Yeah .Professor D: and then Isent a note to Sunil about the {disfmarker} cuz he has been running some other systemsPhD A: Mm -hmm .Professor D: other than the {disfmarker} the ICSI OGI one .PhD A: Oh yeah .Professor D: So{pause} um , I wan wanna {disfmarker} wanna see what that is . But , uh , you know , so we 'll see whatit is comparatively later . But {pause} it looks like , umPhD A: M yeah .Professor D: You know most ofthe time , even {disfmarker} I mean even though it 's true that the overall number for Danish{disfmarker} we didn't improve it If you look at it individually , what it really says is that there 's , um ,uh Looks like out of the six cases , between the different kinds of , uh , matching conditions {pause} outof the six cases , there 's basically , um , a couple where it stays about the same , uh , three where itgets better , and one where it gets worse .PhD A: Yeah .Professor D: Uh , go ahead .PhD A: Y Actually ,uh , um , for the Danish , there 's still some kind of mystery because , um , um , when we use thestraight features , we are not able to get these nice number with the ICSI OGI one , I mean . We don'thave this ninety - three seventy - eight , we have eightPhD E: Eighty - nine forty - four .PhD A: yeah . Uh, so , uh , that 's probably something wrong with the features that we get from OGI . Uh , and Sunil isworking on {disfmarker} on trying to {disfmarker} to check everything .Professor D: Oh , and{disfmarker} and we have a little time on that {disfmarker} and {disfmarker} actually soPhD A: Hmm?Professor D: We have a little bit of time on that , actually .PhD A: Yeah .Professor D: We have a day orso , so When {disfmarker} when {disfmarker} when do you folks leave ?PhD A: Uh , Sunday .ProfessorD: Sunday ? So So , uh Yeah , until Saturday midnight , or something , we have W we {disfmarker} wehave time , yeah . Well , that would be good . That 'd be good .PhD A: Yeah .Professor D: Yeah . Uh , and, you know , i u when whenever anybody figures it out they should also , for sure , email Hynek becauseHynek will be over there {vocalsound} telling people {vocalsound} what we did , so he should know .PhDA: Mmm . Yeah .Professor D: Good , OK . So , um So , we 'll {disfmarker} we 'll hold off on that a little bit. I mean , even with these results as they are , it 's {disfmarker} it 's {disfmarker} it 's really not thatbad . But {disfmarker} but , uh , um And it looks like the overall result as they are now , even without ,you know , any {disfmarker} any bugs being fixed is that , uh , on the {disfmarker} the other tasks , wehad this average of , uh , forty uh {disfmarker} nine percent , or so , improvement . And here we havesomewhat better than that than the Danish , and somewhat worse than that on the German , but I mean, it sounds like , uh , one way or another , the methods that we 're doing can reduce the error rate from{disfmarker} from mel ceptrum {pause} down by , you know {pause} a fourth of them to , uh , a half ofthem . Somewhere in there , depending on the {pause} exact case . So So that 's good . I mean , I thinkthat , uh , one of the things that Hynek was talking about was understanding what was in the other reallygood proposals and {disfmarker} and trying to see if what should ultimately be proposed is some , uh ,combination of things . Um , if , uh {disfmarker} Cuz there 's things that they are doing {pause} therethat we certainly are not doing . And there 's things that we 're doing that {pause} they 're not doing .And {disfmarker} and they all seem like good things .PhD A: Yeah .Professor D: SoPhD E: Mmm , yeah.PhD C: How much {disfmarker} how much better was the best system than ours ?Professor D: So Well ,we don't know yet .PhD C: Mmm .Professor D: Uh , I mean , first place , there 's still this thing to{disfmarker} to work out , and second place {disfmarker} second thing is that the only results that wehave so far from before were really development set results .PhD C: Oh , OK .Professor D: So , I think inthis community that 's of interest . It 's not like everything is being pinned on the evaluation set . But ,um , for the development set , our best result was a little bit short of fifty percent . And the best result ofany system was about fifty - four , where these numbers are the , uh , relative , uh , reduction in , uh ,word error rate .PhD C: Oh , OK .Professor D: And , um , the other systems were , uh , somewhat lower


User Interface: Okay .Project Manager: So I see all everybody's here , 'kay .Marketing: Mm-hmm.Industrial Designer: Yep .Project Manager: And we can start meeting .User Interface: Okay{vocalsound} .Marketing: What's the agenda for this meeting ?Project Manager: The {disfmarker} I willuh present here agenda with with with with slides to you .Marketing: Okay .Project Manager: Um as youcan see here .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Perfect.Project Manager: So first uh just to mention I will take notes uh of this meetingMarketing: Mm-hmm.Project Manager: and uh I will try to work them out and give them to you . I've also made notes of theprevious meeting and um I was about to send them you but {vocalsound} then uh I had to go to this uhmeeting so you will get them too uhMarketing: Mm-hmm .User Interface: Next .Project Manager: Um.Industrial Designer: So y you are the secretary also .Project Manager: Yes . Indeed .Industrial Designer:Right ? Okay .Project Manager: Then I hope you all have uh worked out {vocalsound} some some uh{vocalsound} some some presentations about uh about well you the the task given to you in the previousmeeting .Industrial Designer: Perfectly yeah yeah of course uh-huh .User Interface: {gap}ProjectManager: Um . W We will uh in a minute we will uh {vocalsound} start with them . Um , we will see inwhich order we will handle them of . Um then I will uh bring in some some some new requirements I I gotuh from the uh account manager , I try to work them out , they were quite abstract , and we can havemaybe have com some discussion about it . Uh Um about the functionsMarketing: Mm-hmm .ProjectManager: and {disfmarker} Well in this meeting we should really {vocalsound} try to reach a decisionabout the target group and the functionality of the {disfmarker}Marketing: Mm .Industrial Designer: Youmean the social target group who we wants to target ?Project Manager: Yes I mean well yes w who arewe going to uh to well to sell this ,Marketing: Mm .User Interface: {gap}Industrial Designer: Oh thecustomers , okay .Marketing: Yeah .Project Manager: the customers , indeed yes . Think that's that'simportant matter .Marketing: That's the big question yeah .Project Manager: Uh . {vocalsound} So{vocalsound} And then uh we will close this meeting uhUser Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager:and after this meeting we'll uh we'll have a lunch . Good . Um . Maybe um why uh Anna can you c do youhave a presentations ?Marketing: No , I don't .Project Manager: You don't have presentation ?Marketing:I wasn't . No .Project Manager: Uh you want a table to to uhMarketing: I c I can talk about it but I haveno slides or anything .Project Manager: Yes yes maybe maybe you can uh can just talk about it or maybeyou can use the whiteboard if necessary um .Marketing: Mm-hmm . Well I've just been um presentedwith some research we've done in a small focus group so , a hundred people , just asked them abouttheir remote control usage habits and what they want in a remote control . Um . It's {disfmarker}probably can't email this to you , I've just got a web page with some data on it . Um basically it's sayingthat users generally dislike the look and feel of their remote controls . Um seventy five u seventy fivepercent of users find most remote controls ugly . Um .Project Manager: Mm-hmm .Marketing: Eightypercent of users would spend more money when a remote control would look fancy . Um . Current remotecontrols do not match well the operating behaviour of the user . Uh seventy five percent of users saidthey zap a lot , so they use their remote control quite frequently while they're watching television . Uh .Fifty percent of users say that they only use ten percent of the buttons , so they've got a remote controlwith a lot of functionality but really most of the time they only use a small part of that .Project Manager:Mm .Marketing: Um .Project Manager: Do you Do you have this uh information on the web page you said?Marketing: I have an a web page yes .Project Manager: Yes , mayb maybe you can can send an email tome later uh . Uh about this .Marketing: Yep . Yep , sure . Mm-hmm . So basically um there's a breakdownof how much they use the different functions on a rem remote control . Um , power and volume selectionare only used a few times within this uh per hour . Um , channel selection is used a hundred and sixtyeight times um {vocalsound} and then there's things like channel settings , audio settings , which areonly used very infrequently .Project Manager: Mm .Marketing: Um . Teletext is used um fourteen times inthe hour , so it is used but not nearly as much as the channel selection is used . Um .Project Manager:Mm .Marketing: An interesting thing that this report has brought up is that um fifty fifty percent of users


Project Manager: Yep . Soon as I get this . Okay . This is our last meeting . Um I'll go ahead and gothrough the minutes from the previous meeting . Uh and then we'll have a , the prototype presentation .{vocalsound} Um then we will um do an evaluation . Uh or we'll see what , what we need to have underthe criteria for the evaluation . Then we'll go through the finance and see if we fall within the budget . Umthen we'll do the evaluation , and then we can finish up after that with um any changes that we'll need tomake , or hopefully everything will fall right in line . Um let's see , minutes from the last meeting . Um welooked at uh the the trends . We had uh the fashion trends that people want a fancy look-and-feel . Itwas twice as important as anything else . Um they liked fruit and vegetables in the new styles . Um and aspongy feel . So we were talking about trying to incorporate those into our prototype . Um they wantedlimited buttons and simplicity . Um then we looked at the uh the method for coming up with our ownremote . Um looking at other other devices . Um the iPod , we really liked the look of that . Um we alsohad uh the kid's remote for a simple idea . Um a two part remote , which was what were were originallylooking at . Uh and then um there was talk of spee uh speech recognition um becoming more uhpredominant and easier to use . But I think we've still decided not to go with that . {vocalsound} Then welooked at the components um the materials for the case , the different energy sources , the differenttypes of chips , um and made a decision on what we were going to use to make our remote . Um andbasically how , what were making for the prototype . So I'm going to leave it at that and let you guystake over .User Interface: The prototype discussion .Project Manager: The prototype yeah . Do you needa {disfmarker} this ?User Interface: No . {vocalsound}Project Manager: Okay .Industrial Designer:{vocalsound} Can try to plug that in thereUser Interface: There is our remo {gap} the banana.Marketing: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: but {disfmarker}User Interface: Um {vocalsound} yeahbasically we we st went with the colour yellow . Um working on the principle of a fruit which wasmentioned , it's basically designed around a banana .Project Manager: {vocalsound}User Interface: Umbut it would be held in such a fashion ,Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: where it is , obviously itwouldn't be that floppy 'cause this would be hard plastic . These would be like the rubber , the rubbergrips . So that's so that would hopefully help with grip , or like the ergonomics of it . Um but all thecontrolling would be done with this scroll wheel . You have to use your imagination a little bit . And thishere represents the screen , where you , where you'd go through .Project Manager: Very nice .UserInterface: And the the simplest functions would be um almost identical to an iPod , where that one waych through channels , that way th other way through channels . Volume up and down . And then toaccess the more complicated functions you'd you sorta go , you press that and go through the menus .It's that that simple . That just represents the infrared uh beam . That's a simple on and off switch . Um Idon't know , we could use the voice . T that blue bits should be yellow , that that'd be where the batterieswould be I suppose . And um {vocalsound} that's about it . It's as simple as you , we could make it really.Industrial Designer: Right .User Interface: Is there anything you want to add ?Industrial Designer:That's what we have there . That's plastic . Plastic covered with rubber . We might uh add some moreunderneath here . Maybe give it , give it a form . I mean you're supposed to hold it like that , but um justif you grab it , take it from somewhere ,User Interface: Yeah .Project Manager: Mm-hmm .IndustrialDesigner: so {disfmarker} yeah ,User Interface: Doesn't make much make much difference .IndustrialDesigner: you have some rub yeah .User Interface: You could work left-handed or right-handed Isuppose .Industrial Designer: Exactly , {gap} use both . Might as well think about {disfmarker}UserInterface: T the actual thing might be smaller .Industrial Designer: Th think about the button as well .Like either put either one {gap} one on either side orUser Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah .ProjectManager: What but what's that button ?Industrial Designer: not do it at all . It's a quick on-off button.User Interface: Just the on and off .Project Manager: Uh , 'kay .Industrial Designer: That's umMarketing:{vocalsound}Industrial Designer: yeah I think it's pretty important . So you don't have to fiddle with that.Project Manager: 'Kay .Industrial Designer: Right ? Um that's not um {disfmarker}Project Manager:{vocalsound}Industrial Designer: I'd say a bit smaller would probably be nice . You wanna play with that


Project Manager: Mm-hmm ? Okay . Ooh .User Interface: {gap}Industrial Designer: So we're 'kay ? Onthe {gap} or {disfmarker} No . I dunno where to put it 'cause the {disfmarker} Okay . Could you s takeit off ? {gap} .Marketing: Is that alright ? {vocalsound} {gap} or {disfmarker} Okay .IndustrialDesigner: Okay .Marketing: Keeps coming off . 'S fiddly .Project Manager: Hmm . {gap}Marketing:{vocalsound} Right .Project Manager: How do we sta wa how do we start ? Does anybody know?Marketing: Oh , another one .Project Manager: So that's this {disfmarker}Industrial Designer:{vocalsound}Project Manager: Oh okay , right .Industrial Designer: Are we free to take notes uh{disfmarker} Okay .Project Manager: Uh {vocalsound} {gap} . {vocalsound} {gap} . Hmm . Okay , justhang on a second everybody . I haven't actually looked at this yet .Marketing: {vocalsound} Ah .ProjectManager: {gap} um {disfmarker}Marketing: Very nice .Project Manager: I haven't looked at it , but let'sjust start it off and we'll see what happens . If you're all ready .User Interface: Yeah .Project Manager: So{gap} is the agenda ? Opening , acquaintance , tool training and project plan , discussion and thenclosing . Project aim is a new remote control . It's original , uh trendy and it's user-friendly .Marketing:'Kay .Project Manager: Project method , functional design , individual work , another meeting ,conceptual design , individual work , and a meeting of details design , individual work and a meeting .Tool training . Try out the whiteboard , every participant should draw their favourite animal and sum uptheir favourite characteristics of that animal .Marketing: Okay .Project Manager: Um . Uh Miss IndustrialDesigner , would you like to go first ?Industrial Designer: Okay . So are we supposed to bring the littlethings for the {disfmarker}Project Manager: Yeah , why don't you just c , I think just clip on{disfmarker} clipMarketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {disfmarker} do you have a belt ?IndustrialDesigner: Mm .Marketing: Clip {gap} .Project Manager: Or put 'em in your pocket , yeah .IndustrialDesigner: Yeah . {vocalsound} {gap} okay . So my favourite animal {disfmarker}Project Manager: Yeah, what's your favourite animal ?Industrial Designer: 'Kay um {disfmarker}Marketing: Ah .ProjectManager: Is it rude ?Marketing: It's an elephant . {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound}ProjectManager: That's a very good elephant .User Interface: The back end of an elephant .Marketing: Oh mygosh , I'm never gonna be able to draw that well . {vocalsound}Project Manager: 'Kay , and you want towrite up on there , it says you've gotta sum up your f f your favourite characteristics of that animal.Industrial Designer: Um {vocalsound} okay , it's big , it's got a great memory .Marketing: Does it ? Oh.Industrial Designer: Supposed to have a great memory , we say an elephant never forgets .ProjectManager: Mm .Marketing: Mm .Industrial Designer: And uh dunno know why but {vocalsound} looks likenice to me .Project Manager: Okay . Wonderful , well done .Industrial Designer: Nice animal .ProjectManager: Do you want to use the wipe {disfmarker} the m the wiper and wipe it off ?Industrial Designer:Okay .Project Manager: And Mister aesthetics designer do you wanna go next ?User Interface:{vocalsound} Aesthetic yep , sure .Marketing: I have no idea what my favourite animal is .UserInterface: 'Kay , my favourite animal ,Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: uh let's see .Marketing:Oh .User Interface: Dunno if any of you have seen Napoleon Dynamite before .Marketing: It's{disfmarker}User Interface: It's a liger {vocalsound} ,Project Manager: No .Marketing: A what ?UserInterface: a combination of a lion and tiger {vocalsound} .Marketing: Alright .Project Manager:{vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: Have you not seen Napoleon Dynamite?Marketing: How {gap} .Project Manager: No .Industrial Designer: No .User Interface: Oh it's a hilariousmovie .Marketing: No .User Interface: You have to see it . And and it's best characteristic is it's prettymuch the awesomest animal . But you have to see the movie to fully appreciate it . {vocalsound}ProjectManager: Okay , well done .Marketing: Great . Me ?Project Manager: Yeah . Miss mar Miss Marketing?Marketing: Okay . Not quite sure how this is gonna work .User Interface: There {gap} go .Marketing:{vocalsound} Cool . {vocalsound} Uh {vocalsound} well I'll try my best {vocalsound} to draw . Can Ijust draw the face ?Project Manager: Um yeah , I think you can just draw the face , but then you'll haveto describe in writing how the rest of it looks . {vocalsound}Marketing: Ooh . It's a cat .Project Manager:That's a very pr pretty cat .Marketing: {vocalsound} Which also has what ? A big fat body and big


Marketing: I wanna find our if our remote works .Project Manager: Me too . {vocalsound}Marketing: Oh .{vocalsound}Project Manager: Okay . Um here's the agenda for our last meeting .Marketing: Whoohoo.Project Manager: Um after the opening we're going to have a prototype presentation , then we're goingto discuss the evaluation criteria and the financing of our remote . Then we're going to evaluate theproduct and I think the whole production process , and then we're gonna close it up , and we have fortyminutes , so let's get started . Oh , no , let's have the prototype presentation .Industrial Designer: Mm'kay ,User Interface: {gap}Industrial Designer: you ready ?User Interface: Um sure . You or me?Industrial Designer: Y you read that stuff , since you wrote it .User Interface: Okay . Well , since ourmaterials aren't exactly what we were going for , I'm just gonna translate what this all means for you.Industrial Designer: I'll be the Vanna .User Interface: {vocalsound} The base is gonna be gunmetal gray, which is what we had decided , and it's gonna be plastic . Um then there's the latex cover , which iswhat you see as red . Um because it can be replaceable , we just kinda went with the colour .ProjectManager: Right .User Interface: Um and then the buttons are actually kind of poking through rather thanon top . Um and the buttons will be a l much lighter blue , almost see-through .Project Manager: Hmm.User Interface: It's just sort of a very pale blue and a light-up yellow .Marketing: That's nice .ProjectManager: Yeah .User Interface: The whole thing lights up if you press any button , rather than it{disfmarker} just that one button will light up .Marketing: Good .User Interface: Um and then at thebottom we have our logo . Um bright yellow sort of design with the R_R_ {vocalsound} which will actuallylook like our logo .Project Manager: {vocalsound} Great .User Interface: And then on the side you havethe buttons . {vocalsound} They're one button , but they kind of push up and down .Project Manager:Okay .User Interface: I don't think they're scrolling .Industrial Designer: No . They're just buttons .UserInterface: {vocalsound} Right , yeah . And then {disfmarker} yeah , the buttons .Industrial Designer: Onoff switch will be here and as you've noticed on our prototype um they've ended up with a curvature kindof , by concave sort of thing , except for , you know , {gap} can't see underneath .Marketing: Yeah.Industrial Designer: So I'm hoping that when we get to production we can actually make them like that ,because they're very nice to stock {gap} you know , stick your finger in . Um the two squared buttonsare are two probably least used , menu , mute ,User Interface: Thumb-shaped .Marketing: Yeah.Industrial Designer: and then these are the numbers , so our channel and our volume will be on eitherside .User Interface: Yeah . And then the last thing is just that it'll be black labelling on top , just whichwe didn't do . {vocalsound}Project Manager: Okay . And did you determine um the curvature of thebottom part of it for the hand , is it gonna be a single or a double ?User Interface: {vocalsound}IndustrialDesigner: I'd say a single .Project Manager: Single . Single sounds good ,User Interface: Single .ProjectManager: 'cause it's not big enough to really constitute a double .Marketing: Yeah .Industrial Designer:Yeah , it's only actually the size of my hand .User Interface: Right .Project Manager: Great . Great . Ithink you did an awesome job .Marketing: Yeah , I think it's a beautiful {disfmarker}Project Manager: Itis beautiful , and it's everything that we discussed .User Interface: {vocalsound}Marketing: Yeah . Goodjob , you guys .Project Manager: Good job .Industrial Designer: Whoohoo .User Interface: Oh thank you .{vocalsound}Marketing: Those are really good .Project Manager: Alright {vocalsound}IndustrialDesigner: {gap}Project Manager: what's next in our agenda ? Um we're gonna discuss the evaluationcriteria , and that's with Courtney .Marketing: Okay , it's a PowerPoint presentation . I don't really knowexactly what we should uh talk about . It's under evaluation .Project Manager: Right .Marketing: Alright .Um so these are the criteria we're gonna ask , is it easy to use , is it fashionable uh {disfmarker} yeah , Iguess we should write these down so we can reference them .Project Manager: Mm .User Interface: Feelgood meaning what ?Marketing: Like does it feel good , like {disfmarker}User Interface: Physically,Project Manager: Right .User Interface: okay .Marketing: yeah , physically .User Interface: {gap}ProjectManager: Sqi {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound} {vocalsound} That's just for current trend .ProjectManager: Right .User Interface: {vocalsound}Marketing: It doesn't really count , you guys .IndustrialDesigner: Yeah , it was a little difficult to incorporate the cover with the cherry fruit on it .User Interface:


Professor E: Let 's see . Test ? Test ? Yeah . OK .Grad A: Hello ?PhD B: Channel one .Grad A: Hello ?PhDC: Test .Professor E: I was saying Hynek 'll be here next week , uh , Wednesday through Friday{disfmarker} uh , through Saturday , and , um , I won't be here Thursday and Friday . But my suggestionis that , uh , at least for this meeting , people should go ahead , uh , cuz Hynek will be here , and , youknow , we don't have any Czech accent yet , uh , {vocalsound} as far as I know , so {disfmarker} Therewe go .PhD F: OK .Professor E: Um . So other than reading digits , what 's our agenda ?PhD F: I don'treally have , uh , anything new . Been working on {pause} Meeting Recorder stuff . So .Professor E: OK .Um . Do you think that would be the case for next week also ? Or is {disfmarker} is , uh {disfmarker} ?What 's your projection on {disfmarker} ?PhD F: Um .Professor E: Cuz the one thing {disfmarker} theone thing that seems to me we really should try , if you hadn't tried it before , because it hadn't occurredto me {disfmarker} it was sort of an obvious thing {disfmarker} is , um , adjusting the , uh , sca thescaling and , uh , insertion penalty sorta stuff .PhD F: I did play with that , actually , a little bit . Um .What happens is , uh , {vocalsound} when you get to the noisy stuff , you start getting lots of insertions.Professor E: Right .PhD F: And , um , so I 've tried playing around a little bit with , um , the insertionpenalties and things like that .Professor E: Yeah .PhD F: Um . I mean , it {disfmarker} it didn't make awhole lot of difference . Like for the well - matched case , it seemed like it was pretty good . Um .{vocalsound} I could do more playing with that , though . And , uh {disfmarker}Professor E: But youwere looking at mel cepstrum .PhD F: and see . Yes .Professor E: Right .PhD F: Oh , you 're talking aboutfor th {vocalsound} for our features .Professor E: Right . So , I mean , i it it 's not the direction that youwere working with that we were saying what 's the {disfmarker} uh , what 's the best you can do with{disfmarker} with mel cepstrum . But , they raised a very valid point ,PhD F: Mmm .Professor E: which ,I guess {disfmarker} So , to first order {disfmarker} I mean , you have other things you were gonna do ,but to first order , I would say that the conclusion is that if you , um , do , uh , some monkeying aroundwith , uh , the exact HTK training and @ @ {comment} with , uh , you know , how many states and soforth , that it {disfmarker} it doesn't particularly improve the performance . In other words , that eventhough it sounds pretty dumb , just applying the same number of states to everything , more or less , nomatter what language , isn't so bad . Right ? And I guess you hadn't gotten to all the experiments youwanted to do with number of Gaussians ,PhD F: Right .Professor E: but , um , let 's just {disfmarker} Ifwe had to {disfmarker} if we had to draw a conclusion on the information we have so far , we 'd saysomething like that . Right ?PhD F: Mm - hmm .Professor E: Uh , so the next question to ask , which is Ithink the one that {disfmarker} that {disfmarker} that Andreas was dre addressing himself to in thelunch meeting , is , um , we 're not supposed to adjust the back - end , but anybody using the systemwould .PhD F: Yeah .Professor E: So , if you were just adjusting the back - end , how much better wouldyou do , uh , in noise ? Uh , because the language scaling and insertion penalties and so forth areprobably set to be about right for mel cepstrum .PhD F: Mm - hmm .Professor E: But , um , they 'reprobably not at all set right for these things , particularly these things that look over , uh , larger timewindows , in one way or another with {disfmarker} with LDA and KLT and neural nets and {vocalsound}all these things . In the fa past we 've always found that we had to increase the insertion penalty to{disfmarker} to correspond to such things . So , I think that 's , uh , @ @ {comment} that 's kind of afirst - order thing that {disfmarker} that we should try .PhD F: So for th so the experiment is to , um ,run our front - end like normal , with the default , uh , insertion penalties and so forth , and then tweakthat a little bit and see how much of a difference it makesProfessor E: So by " our front - end " I meantake , you know , the Aurora - two s take some version that Stephane has that is , you know , our currentbest version of something .PhD F: if we were {disfmarker} Mm - hmm .Professor E: Um . I mean , y don'twanna do this over a hundred different things that they 've tried but , you know , for some version thatyou say is a good one . You know ? Um . How {disfmarker} how much , uh , does it improve if youactually adjust that ?PhD F: OK .Professor E: But it is interesting . You say you {disfmarker} you have forthe noisy {disfmarker} How about for the {disfmarker} for the mismatched or {disfmarker} or


Project Manager: So we come again for the the second meeting .User Interface: Mm-hmm .ProjectManager: Uh for the aim of this meeting now is to to make presentation about uh the work for each one.User Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: And {gap} take the the decision about the the design andthe functionality of the the remote control .User Interface: Okay . {vocalsound}Project Manager: And wehave {disfmarker} think I got a new project requirement .Industrial Designer: Okay .Project Manager: SoI think uh teletext becomes outdated . So the popularity of the {disfmarker} since the popularity of theinternet ,Industrial Designer: Okay .Project Manager: and I think we don't need lighting adaptive , so theremote control should be only used for the the television . And of course we should have our image {gap}in the in the design . So , let's start with the the industrial designer .User Interface: {vocalsound}ProjectManager: {gap} .User Interface: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Yeah , alright .Project Manager: Or yyou can use the whiteboard if you want .Industrial Designer: So uh {disfmarker} Well I have aPowerPoint pr presentation stored in my in my personal folderProject Manager: Here .Industrial Designer:so I I I think you can reach it from here .Marketing: Just go to explorer .Project Manager: Oh okay.Marketing: Or open . Participant two .Industrial Designer: Participant two .Project Manager: This one.Industrial Designer: Yeah .Marketing: Open uh .Industrial Designer: Uh open . {vocalsound}ProjectManager: Do you want to open {disfmarker}User Interface: Because it's open you mean .{vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Right , so um I will talkabout the the w working design and {disfmarker}User Interface: {vocalsound} F_ five .Marketing: Slideshow , view slide show , {gap} .Project Manager: Ah .Industrial Designer: And um well I I will present mymy first idea on how to build the {disfmarker} our new remote control for television .User Interface:{vocalsound}Industrial Designer: So uh can you go one page down , please . So I think the first things todo is to define the hardware components neededs to achieve uh what we want to do .User Interface:{vocalsound}Industrial Designer: So uh mm I'm thin uh {vocalsound} I think uh I I'll do a survey aboutwhat is uh what is available on the market and what what is the the cheapest possible {vocalsound}things we hav we can use . Then uh I will try with the technical team to to build a prototype and to see uhwith uh h how this little box {vocalsound} would uh look look like .User Interface: {vocalsound}IndustrialDesigner: And how an and we can uh start troubleshooting first uh com communication problems orthings like that .User Interface: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: And when we are ready with this firstprototype I I think we can add some software functionalities on a programmable chip like browsing bycontent or um things like that . Okay so can you go down uh {disfmarker} So , wha what I think{vocalsound} for now {vocalsound} is {vocalsound} we don't want to have a remote control w which iswiredUser Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: so uh I think we uwe can use a battery for the {gap} . Then two programmable chips for both software functionalities andcommunication . And the communication with the T_V_ set is uh made through uh infraredcommunication So uh this is the {vocalsound} the schema of the {vocalsound} o of the future uh remotecontrolsUser Interface: Did you draw it ? {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager:{vocalsound} Wow . {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: so uh you can you can see the components , uhbattery and uh the two chips goes to the infrared uh connection to the T_V_ set .User Interface: This{gap} .Project Manager: This {disfmarker}User Interface: What is the other chip for ? The one on top.Industrial Designer: The one on top is for the um {disfmarker} well the functionali thefunctionalitiesUser Interface: {vocalsound}Marketing: One is a communication .Industrial Designer: andthe the th red um {disfmarker} sorry the green one is is to {disfmarker} well , putting things together ,um f transform the data into uh qu into the format to to {gap} uh to communicate with the T_V_ set.User Interface: For men . To the {disfmarker} in {disfmarker} {vocalsound} Okay .Industrial Designer:And , that's it . I think we should use a F_P_G_A_ for {vocalsound} for the functionalities which is easy toto tUser Interface: Mm . What is F_P_G_A_ ?Industrial Designer: It's field programmable uh somethingarray .Marketing: {vocalsound} Gateway arrays .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Yeah .Marketing: It'sa field programmable gateway arrays .User Interface: So why's it {disfmarker} how is it different from


Project Manager: Is everyone ready to start ?Industrial Designer: Yeah . {vocalsound}User Interface:Yeah .Marketing: {vocalsound} Yes .Project Manager: Okay . Great . Well , welcome to the third meetingof conceptual design . I'll just get the PowerPoint presentation up and running . Okay . Um , on theagenda for this , um , for this particular meeting , we'll have your three presentations on what you'vedone since our last meeting , after we came up with um some general ideas of our design . And , um ,then we have to make some key decisions on , on our remote control concept , and how we're gonnamake it , what uh materials we're gonna use , and that sort of thing .Industrial Designer:{vocalsound}Project Manager: The meeting will be forty minutes long .Industrial Designer: Okay .ProjectManager: And um we will once again have Poppy as our first presenter .Industrial Designer:{vocalsound} Okay .Project Manager: Alright , and I will switch up PowerPoint .Industrial Designer:Thank you .Project Manager: Okay .Industrial Designer: Should be just loading . {vocalsound} Okay . Oh, although I can't see it on my screen . That says go here . Okay . I've been doing some research into thedifferent components that we could use , um what's available to us f to actually make the remote control. Um , first of all we have to look at how the remote control is actually made , and what is it happensinside the casing , which is more your field . Um , thes main internal feature is a circuit board , whichcontains all the elec electronics and also the contacts with the power source .Marketing:{vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Which is not necessarily a battery , as we're about to see . Um , thereare several components of , um , the circuit board that we need to consider , where we'll be getting themfrom , what they'll be made of . Um , including the integrated circuit , which is also known as the chip .Which is where all the main information is uh contained . Um , diodes , transistors , resonators , resistors, and capacit capacitors all need to be considered as well . Um , and all their positioning in the circuit.Project Manager: Um {disfmarker} Are they all included , like mandatorily , or r are these differentoptions ?Industrial Designer: Uh , these , they're all different options , they're all separate , apart fromthe chip , which we will probable decide whether we buy a simple , a regular , advanced .ProjectManager: Yeah .Industrial Designer: We can go into that later . Um , all the other things are individualcomponents that we'd have to get in separately , and work out the most , like , effective um circuit ,including all the wires and everything like that . And the L_E_D_ of course , that's a light emitting diode .So , we could , so we've got flex flexibility with colours and things , with that as well .Project Manager:Mm .Industrial Designer: Okay , there are lots of different possibilities for the energy source . We coulduse a basic battery , but that brings with it , like they need to be recharged and the bulk , the size of it aswell . And they're not so great to dispose of , environmentally . {vocalsound} There's a hand-powereddynamo which is a sort of thing that was used for torches fifty years ago . A bit out of date . Kineticenergy is something that's been recently developed .Project Manager: Um {disfmarker} What is ahand-powered dynamo ?Industrial Designer: Um , where you manually charge up the power .ProjectManager: Just every , every once in a while ?Industrial Designer: Like you wind up something .ProjectManager: Just every once in a while or constantly ?Industrial Designer: Sorry ? Yeah . Every once in awhile I thinkProject Manager: Alright . It'd be kind of strange to always be cranking it I think .IndustrialDesigner: . But it's {disfmarker} Yeah . It would be like going a step back in time .User Interface:{vocalsound} Yeah .Industrial Designer: I don't think it would really be with kind of cutting edgetechnology .Project Manager: No . {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Whereaskinetic energy is a new idea that's being used by some watches and other devices , where you just shakethe device and it gives it power . I mean , the kinetic energy is transformed into power to make thecircuit work . Um , or there's solar power , which we've been considering inside a building , which iswhere it's gonna be used , might not be quite so useful .Project Manager: Right .Industrial Designer: But, good to look into , renewable energy , always the way . Um , lots of considerations for the case , likewhat sort of shape it would be , curved or flat . That's got a lot to do with the ergonomics . Like how it'scomfortable and s sits in the hand . We don't want something that's huge and you can't pick up . Or toosmall . Or too slidy . I know I've had a remote control before which you couldn't tell which was the front


Project Manager: Uh it fell off . One , two , three , four , yeah , we're ready . Okay . Welcome to thissecond meeting . Um it's now quarter after twelve and we're given forty minutes um for this meeting .This is a meeting on functional design . Um and I wanna welcome you all and thank you all for doingsome research in between . Um I did {disfmarker} took the minutes from the first meeting and I'll showthem to you in a moment . Um I know each of you have a presentation and um in thinking about the fortyminutes , I thought it would take only like three minutes for the previous minutes , um each of youhaving about seven minutes or maybe a little more , maybe a little less for your pre presentations and alittle discussion , because there's {disfmarker} I happen to have been told there were some new projectrequirements and we have to make some uh decision on what functions it will have . Okay ? Is this apeverybody agree with this ?Industrial Designer: Oops .User Interface: Yes .Marketing: Yes .ProjectManager: Okay . Um and after the meeting there'll be things to be done and as you can see it says weget to get lunch , um and then some more individual work and then putting minutes away and individualactions . {vocalsound} Um but uh now for the minutes of the first meeting . And go to that one . Um asyou can see it was this earlier today . Um Kate , Steph , Sarah and myself in our four capacities werepresent . I opened the meeting , the product was developed uh and reviewed , and we talked about thefinancial end of it . Um and it had some implications , um the four million sales target and new ideas ofnot too many buttons , bright colours and some of the influence of the Japanese . And we closed early soyou could then proceed with your research and getting your reports together for tod this meeting{vocalsound} Anybody have any questions on those minutes ? Are they complete , did they discusseverything that we covered last time ? 'Kay .Industrial Designer: Uh I think so ,Project Manager: Did Imiss something ?Industrial Designer: we we we talked about the the individual roles that we each had aswell .Marketing: Mm-hmm .Project Manager: Yeah . I'm afraid I incorporated {vocalsound} that when Isaid who was present , but {disfmarker} yes , we did ,Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Okay .ProjectManager: and we did a little bit of uh team building of uh of making the pictures ,Marketing:{vocalsound} Okay , I accept the minutes .Project Manager: but I didn't think those were appropriate tothe minutes necessarily . So um as a group I think we've {disfmarker} are {disfmarker} they'reaccepting the minutes . And uh {disfmarker} okay .Marketing: Is that what we're supposed to say?Project Manager: Yeah .User Interface: Yeah , I do .Project Manager: Good . Um , then we'll move to thethree presentations . Okay ?Marketing: Okay .Project Manager: Okay . Mm we need to move this . Whowants to go f first ? {vocalsound} That's as far as it goes .User Interface: Uh not really meant to touchthose microphones . Oh it doesn't have any on , does it ? That's fine .Marketing: Excellent , thank you.Industrial Designer: Oy , big loop under the table .Project Manager: She said we didn't need to screw itin .Marketing: Okay . Okay , that looks good .Project Manager: It's doing its thing . There we are.Marketing: Alright . Thank you very much . Um . One of the the biggest issues I found about um fromlast meeting was the fact that we need to sell four million of these um remote controls and I think thatthis is an opportunity to really take Real Reaction in the direction of of similar {disfmarker} of handheldtools that have been used and are used by many of us and to kind of bring the remote control into the sisame realm as an accessible um useful electronic device , as opposed to something that is lost in thecouch and what have you . So um my main goal here is to re-envision the remote control in in thiscontext and to think about menu functionality and current technology and the fact that it could beinteractive with other tools . Um some of the research uh in the market has shown that people really arenot happy with remote controls as they are now , and um that means we do need to make somedecisions about what what keys or or buttons on the on the remote control to perhaps keep and and whatones to discard . And if we devote some energy into this , I think the um recent productions of RealReaction , the I go everywhere power and the high definition D_V_D_ players {disfmarker} although itmakes immediate sense to {vocalsound} have our remote control interact with these , I think we can alsouse this as a platform to make it interact with other tools . And um in fact I think the high definitionD_V_D_ players and all of this will come along in the uh {disfmarker} will only benefit from the positive


Postdoc B: Alright .Professor C: So , uh {disfmarker}Grad F: Um , so I wanted to discuss digits briefly ,but that won't take too long .Professor C: Oh good . Right . OK , agenda items , Uh , we have digits ,What else we got ?PhD A: New version of the presegmentation .Professor C: New version ofpresegmentation .Postdoc B: Um , do we wanna say something about the , an update of the , uh ,transcript ?PhD G: Yeah , why don't you summarize the {disfmarker}Professor C: Update on transcripts.PhD G: And I guess that includes some {disfmarker} the filtering for the , the ASI refs , too .Postdoc B:Mmm .Professor C: Filtering for what ?PhD G: For the references that we need to go from the{disfmarker} the {pause} fancy transcripts to the sort of {nonvocalsound} brain - dead .Postdoc B: It 'll{disfmarker} it 'll be {disfmarker} basically it 'll be a re - cap of a meeting that we had jointly thismorning .Professor C: Uh - huh .PhD G: With Don , as well .Postdoc B: Mm - hmm .Professor C: Got it .Anything else more pressing than those things ? So {disfmarker} So , why don't we just do those . Yousaid yours was brief , so {disfmarker}Grad F: OK . OK well , the , w uh as you can see from the numberson the digits we 're almost done . The digits goes up to {pause} about four thousand . Um , and so , uh ,we probably will be done with the TI - digits in , um , another couple weeks . um , depending on howmany we read each time . So there were a bunch that we skipped . You know , someone fills out the formand then they 're not at the meeting and so it 's blank . Um , but those are almost all filled in as well .And so , once we 're {disfmarker} it 's done it would be very nice to train up a recognizer and actuallystart working with this data .PhD D: So we 'll have a corpus that 's the size of TI - digits ?Grad F: And so{disfmarker} One particular test set of TI - digits .PhD D: Test set , OK .Grad F: So , I {disfmarker} Iextracted , Ther - there was a file sitting around which people have used here as a test set . It had beenrandomized and so onPhD D: Grad F: and that 's just what I used to generate the order . of theseparticular ones .PhD D: Oh ! Great . Great .Professor C: So , I 'm impressed by what we could do , Is takethe standard training set for TI - digits , train up with whatever , you know , great features we think wehave , uh for instance , and then test on uh this test set .Grad F: Um {disfmarker}Professor C: Andpresumably uh it should do reasonably well on that , and then , presumably , we should go to the distantmike , and it should do poorly .PhD D: Yeah .Professor C: And then we should get really smart over thenext year or two , and it {disfmarker} that should get better .Grad F: Right . And inc increase it by one ortwo percent , yeah .Professor C: Yeah , {vocalsound} Yeah .Grad F: Um , but , in order to do that weneed to extract out the actual digits .Professor C: Right .Grad F: Um , so that {disfmarker} the reason it's not just a transcript is that there 're false starts , and misreads , and miscues and things like that . Andso I have a set of scripts and X Waves where you just select the portion , hit R , um , it tells you what thenext one should be , and you just look for that . You know , so it {disfmarker} it 'll put on the screen , "The next set is six nine , nine two two " . And you find that , and , hit the key and it records it in a file in aparticular format .Professor C: So is this {disfmarker}Grad F: And so the {disfmarker} the question is ,should we have the transcribers do that or should we just do it ? Well , some of us . I 've been do I 'vedone , eight meetings , something like that , just by hand . Just myself , rather . So it will not take long .Um {disfmarker}Professor C: Uh , what {disfmarker} what do you think ?Postdoc B: My feeling is that wediscussed this right before coffee and I think it 's a {disfmarker} it 's a fine idea partly because , um , it 'snot un unrelated to their present skill set , but it will add , for them , an extra dimension , it might be aninteresting break for them . And also it is contributing to the , uh , c composition of the transcript cuz wecan incorporate those numbers directly and it 'll be a more complete transcript . So I 'm {disfmarker} Ithink it 's fine , that part .Grad F: There is {disfmarker} there is {disfmarker}Professor C: So you think it's fine to have the transcribers do it ?Postdoc B: Mm - hmm .Professor C: Yeah , OK .Grad F: There 's oneother small bit , which is just entering the information which at s which is at the top of this form , ontothe computer , to go along with the {disfmarker} where the digits are recorded automatically .PhD D:Good .Professor C: Yeah .Grad F: And so it 's just , you know , typing in name , times {disfmarker} time ,date , and so on . Um , which again either they can do , but it is , you know , firing up an editor , or ,again , I can do . Or someone else can do .Postdoc B: And , that , you know , I 'm not , that {disfmarker}


Grad D: And we already got the crash out of the way . It did crash , so I feel much better , earlier.Professor F:  Yeah .Postdoc E: Interesting . Hmm .Professor F: Will you get the door , and {disfmarker}? Grad D: OK , so um .Professor F: OK . You collected an agenda , huh ?Grad D: I did collect an agenda .So I 'm gonna go first . Mwa - ha - ha ! It shouldn't take too long .Postdoc E: Yeah .Grad D: Um , so we're pretty much out of digits . We 've gone once through the set . Um , so the only thing I have todoProfessor F: No there 's only ten .Grad D: Yeah , that 's right . so I {disfmarker} I just have to gothrough themProfessor F: Well , OK .Grad D: and uh pick out the ones that have problems , and eithercorrect them or have them re - read . So we probably have like four or five more forms to be read , to beonce through the set . I 've also extracted out about an hour 's worth . We have about two hours worth . Iextracted out about an hour 's worth which are the f digits with {disfmarker} for which whose speakerhave speaker forms , have filled out speaker forms . Not everyone 's filled out a speaker form . So Iextracted one for speakers who have speaker forms and for meetings in which the " key " file and thetranscript files are parsable . Some of the early key files , it looks like , were done by hand , and so they're not automatically parsable and I have to go back and fix those . So what that means is we have aboutan hour of transcribed digits that we can play with . Um , Liz {disfmarker}Professor F: So you think two{disfmarker} you think two hours is the {disfmarker} is the total that we have ?Grad D: Yep , yeah.Professor F: And you think we th uh , I {disfmarker} I didn't quite catch all these different things thatare not quite right , but you think we 'll be able to retrieve the other hour , reasonably ?Grad D: Yes ,absolutely .Professor F: OK .Grad D: So it 's just a question of a little hand - editing of some files andthen waiting for more people to turn in their speaker forms . I have this web - based speaker form , and Isent mail to everyone who hadn't filled out a speaker form , and they 're slowly s trickling in .Professor F:So the relevance of the speaker form here , sGrad D: It 's for labeling the extracted audio files .ProfessorF: Oh , OK .Grad D: By speaker ID and microphone type .Professor F: Wasn't like whether they weregiving us permission to use their digits or something .Grad D: No , I spoke with Jane about that and wesort of decided that it 's probably not an issue that {disfmarker} We edit out any of the errors anyway .Right ? So the there are no errors in the digits ,Professor F: Yeah .Grad D: you 'll always read the stringcorrectly . So I can't imagine why anyone would care . So the other topic with digits is uh , Liz would liketo elicit different prosodics , and so we tried last week with them written out in English . And it just didn'twork at all because no one grouped them together . So it just sounded like many many more linesinstead of anything else . So in conversations with Liz and uh Jane we decided that if you wrote them outas numbers instead of words it would elicit more phone number , social security number - like readings .The problem with that is it becomes numbers instead of digits . When I look at this , that first line is "sixty one , sixty two , eighteen , eighty six , ten . " Um , and so the question is does anyone care ? Um , I've already spoken with Liz and she feels that , correct me if I 'm wrong , that for her , connectednumbers is fine ,Postdoc E: Mm - hmm .Grad D: as opposed to connected digits . Um , I think two hoursis probably fine for a test set , but it may be a little short if we actually wanna do training and adaptationand all that other stuff .Professor F: Yeah Um , do um you want different prosodics , so if you always hadthe same groupings you wouldn't like that ? Is that correct ?PhD G: Well , we actually figured out a wayto {disfmarker}Grad D: Yeah , the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker}PhD G: the {disfmarker} the groupingsare randomly generated .Professor F: No but , I was asking if that was something you really cared aboutbecause if it wasn't , it seems to me if you made it really specifically telephone groupings that maybepeople wouldn't , uh , go and do numbers so much . You know if it if it 's {disfmarker}PhD A: Uh{disfmarker}PhD G: I think they may still do it , um ,Professor F: Maybe some , but I probably not somuch .PhD B: What about putting a hyphen between the numbers in the group ?PhD G: And{disfmarker}Professor F: Right ? So if you {disfmarker} if {disfmarker} if you have uhGrad D: Six dashone , you mean ?Professor F: if you go six six six uh dash uh two nine three one .PhD G: I {disfmarker}well OK {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} it might help , I would like to g get away from having only onespecific grouping .Professor F: That 's what I was asking , yeah .PhD G: Um , so if that 's your question