Grad A: OK , we 're recording .Professor F: We can say the word " zero " all we want ,PhD G: I 'm doing someProfessor F: but just {disfmarker}PhD G: squarebrackets , coffee sipping , square brackets .PhD B: That 's not allowed , I think .Postdoc C: Cur - curly brackets .Grad E: Is that voiced or unvoiced ?Grad A: Curlybrackets .PhD B: Curly brackets .Professor F: Curly brackets .Grad A: Right .PhD B: Oops .Professor F: Well , correction for transcribers .PhD G: Mmm !{comment} {vocalsound} Gar - darn !Professor F: Yeah .Postdoc C: Channel two .Grad A: Do we use square brackets for anything ?Postdoc C: Yeah . Uh{disfmarker}Grad E: These poor transcribers .Professor F: uPostdoc C: Not ri not right now . I mean {disfmarker} No .PhD D: There 's gonna be some zeros fromthis morning 's meeting because I noticed thatProfessor F: uPhD D: Barry , I think maybe you turned your mike off before the digits were {disfmarker} Oh , wasit during digits ? Oh , so it doesn't matter .Professor F: Yeah .Grad A: It 's still not a good idea .PhD B: So it 's not {disfmarker} it 's not that bad if it 's at the end, but it 's {disfmarker} in the beginning , it 's {pause} bad .PhD D: Yeah . Yeah .Grad A: Yeah , you wanna {disfmarker} you wanna keep them on so you get{pause} good noise {disfmarker} noise floors , through the whole meeting .Postdoc C: That 's interesting . Hmm .Professor F: Uh , I probably just should haveleft it on . Yeah I did have to run , but {disfmarker}Grad E: Is there any way to change that in the software ?Grad A: Change what in the software ?Grad E:Where like you just don't {disfmarker} like if you {disfmarker} if it starts catching zeros , like in the driver or something {disfmarker} in the card , or somewherein the hardware {disfmarker} Where if you start seeing zeros on w across one channel , you just add some {vocalsound} random , @ @ {comment} noise floor{disfmarker} like a small noise floor .Grad A: I mean certainly we could do that , but I don't think that 's a good idea . We can do that in post - processing if{disfmarker} if the application needs it .Grad E: Yeah .PhD B: Manual post - processing .Professor F: Well , I {disfmarker} u I actually don't know what thedefault {comment} is anymore as to how we 're using the {disfmarker} the front - end stuff but {disfmarker} for {disfmarker} for {disfmarker} when we use theICSI front - end ,Grad A: As an argument .Professor F: but um , there is an {disfmarker} there is an o an option in {disfmarker} in RASTA , which , um ,{vocalsound} in when I first put it in , uh , back in the days when I actually wrote things , uh , {vocalsound} I {pause} did actually put in a random bit or so thatwas in it ,Grad E: OK .Professor F: but {vocalsound} then I realized that putting in a random bit was equivalent to adding uh {disfmarker} adding flat spectrum,Grad E: Right .Professor F: and it was a lot faster to just add a constant to the {disfmarker} {vocalsound} to the spectrum . So then I just started doingthatGrad E: Mmm . OK .Professor F: instead of calling " rand " {comment} or something ,Grad E: Right .Professor F: so . So it d it does that . Gee ! Here we allare !Grad A: Uh , so the only agenda items were Jane {disfmarker} was Jane wanted to talk about some of the IBM transcription process .Professor F: There 's anagenda ?Grad A: I sort of {vocalsound} condensed the three things you said into that . And then just {disfmarker} I only have like , this afternoon and maybetomorrow morning to get anything done before I go to Japan for ten days . So if there 's anything that n absolutely , desperately needs to be done , you should letme know now .Professor F: Uh , and you just sent off a Eurospeech paper , so .PhD G: Right . I hope they accept it .Professor F: Right .PhD G: I mean , I{disfmarker} both actu as {disfmarker} as a submission and {disfmarker} {vocalsound} you know , as a paper . Um {disfmarker} but {disfmarker}Grad A: Wellyeah , you sent it in {pause} late .Professor F: Yeah , I guess you {disfmarker} first you have to do the first one ,Grad A: Yeah .Professor F: and then{disfmarker} Yeah .PhD G: We actually exceeded the delayed deadline by o another day , so .PhD B: Oops .Professor F: Oh they {disfmarker} they had someextension that they announced or something ?PhD G: Well yeah . Liz had sent them a note saying " could we please {pause} have another " {comment} {pause}I don't know , " three days " or something , and they said yes .PhD D: And then she said " Did I say three ?Grad A: Oh ,PhD D: I meant four . "Grad A: that wasthe other thing uh ,PhD G: But uGrad A: uh , Dave Gelbart sent me email , I think he sent it to you too , {comment} that um , there 's a special topic , section insi in Eurospeech on new , corp corpors corpora . And it 's not due until like May fifteenth .Professor F: Oh this isn't the Aurora one ?Grad A: No .Professor F: It 'sanother one ?Grad A: It 's a different one .PhD B: No it 's {disfmarker} Yeah . Yeah .Grad E: Huh !Grad A: And uh ,Professor F: Oh !PhD B: I got this mail from{disfmarker}Grad A: I s forwarded it to Jane as I thought being the most relevant person . Um {disfmarker} So , I thought it was highly relevant{disfmarker}Postdoc C: Yeah I 'm {disfmarker}Professor F: That 's {disfmarker}Grad A: have you {disfmarker} did you look at the URL ?Postdoc C: Yeah . Ithink so too . Um , I haven't gotten over to there yet ,Grad A: Mm - hmm .Postdoc C: but what {disfmarker} our discussion yesterday , I really {disfmarker} I{disfmarker} I wanna submit one .PhD B: Was this {pause} SmartKom message ? I think {pause} Christoph Draxler sent this ,Postdoc C: Yeah . And , youoffered to {disfmarker} to join me , if you want me to .Grad A: I 'll help ,PhD B: yeah .Grad A: but obviously I can't , really do , most of it ,Postdoc C: Yeah . Yeah, that 's right .PhD G: I think several people {disfmarker} sent this ,Grad A: so .PhD B: Yeah .Postdoc C: Uh - huh .PhD G: yeah .Grad A: But any {disfmarker}any help you need I can certainly provide .Professor F: Well ,PhD G: Yeah .Professor F: that 's {disfmarker} that 's a great idea .PhD G: Well {disfmarker} there{disfmarker} there were some interesting results in this paper , though . For instance that Morgan {disfmarker} uh , accounted for fifty - six percent of theRobustness meetings in terms of number of words .Grad A: Wow .Postdoc C: In {disfmarker} in terms of what ? In termPhD G: Number of words .Postdoc C: One? Wow ! OK .Grad A: That 's just cuz he talks really fast .Postdoc C: Do you mean ,Professor F: n No .Grad A: I knowPhD B: Oh . Short words .Postdoc C: because{disfmarker} is it partly , eh , c correctly identified words ? Or is it {disfmarker} or just overall volume ?PhD G: No . Well , according to the transcripts .Grad A:But re well regardless . I think it 's {disfmarker} he 's {disfmarker} he 's in all of them ,Postdoc C: Oh . OK .Professor F: Yeah .PhD G: I mean , we didn't mentionMorgan by nameGrad A: and he talks a lot .PhD G: we just {disfmarker}Grad A: One participant .Professor F: Well {disfmarker} we have now , but{disfmarker}PhD G: We {disfmarker} we {disfmarker} we {disfmarker} something about {disfmarker}Grad A: Did you identify him as a senior {pause} member?PhD G: No , we as identify him as the person dominating the conversation .Professor F: Well .Grad A: Yeah .Postdoc C: OK .Professor F: I mean I get these AARPthings , but I 'm not se really senior yet , but {disfmarker}PhD G: RightProfessor F: Um ,PhD G: Hmm .Professor F: but uh , other than that delightful result ,what was the rest of the paper about ?PhD G: Um , well it was about {disfmarker} it had three sectionsProfessor F: You sent it to me but I haven't seen it yet.PhD G: uh {disfmarker} three kinds of uh results , if you will . Uh , the one was that the {disfmarker} just the {disfmarker} the amount of overlapGrad A: Thegood , the bad , and the ugly .PhD G: um , s in terms of {disfmarker} in terms of number of words and also we computed something called a " spurt " , which isessentially a stretch of speech with uh , no pauses exceeding five hundred milliseconds . Um , and we computed how many overlapped i uh spurts there were andhow many overlapped words there were . {vocalsound} Um , for four different {pause} corpora , the Meeting Recorder meetings , the Robustness meetingsSwitchboard and CallHome , and , found {disfmarker} and sort of compared the numbers . Um , and found that the , uh , you know , as you might expect theMeeting Recorder {pause} meetings had the most overlap uh , but next were Switchboard and CallHome , which both had roughly the same , almost identical infact , and the Robustness meetings were {disfmarker} had the least , so {disfmarker} One sort of unexpected result there is that uh two - party telephoneconversations have {vocalsound} about the same amount of overlap ,Grad A: I 'm surprised .PhD G: sort of in gen you know {disfmarker} order of magnitude -wise as , uh {disfmarker} as face - to - face meetings with multiple {disfmarker}Grad A: I have {disfmarker} I had better start changing all my slides !PhD G:Yeah . Also , I {disfmarker} in the Levinson , the pragmatics book , {comment} in you know , uh , textbook , {vocalsound} there 's {disfmarker} I found thisgreat quote where he says {vocalsound} you know {disfmarker} you know , how people {disfmarker} it talks about how uh {disfmarker} how {disfmarker} howpeople are so good at turn taking ,Postdoc C: Mm - hmm . Yeah . Yeah .PhD G: and {vocalsound} so {disfmarker} they 're so good that {vocalsound} generally ,u the overlapped speech does not {disfmarker} is less than five percent .Postdoc C: Oh , that 's interesting . Yeah .PhD G: So , this is way more than five percent.Grad E: Did he mean face {disfmarker} like face - to - face ? Or {disfmarker} ?PhD G: Well , in real conversations ,Grad E: Hmm .PhD G: everydayconversations .Postdoc C: Mm - hmm .PhD G: It 's s what these conversation analysts have been studying for years and years there .Postdoc C: Mm - hmm .PhDB: But {disfmarker}Postdoc C: Well , of course , no , it doesn't necessarily go against what he said , cuz he said " generally speaking " . In order to {disfmarker}to go against that kind of a claim you 'd have to big canvassing .Grad A: Hmm .PhD B: And in fPhD G: Well , he {disfmarker} he made a claim {disfmarker}GradA: Well {disfmarker}PhD G: Well {disfmarker}Grad A: PhD B: But {disfmarker}Professor F: Yeah , we {disfmarker} we have pretty limited sample here .PhD B:Five percent of time or five percent of what ?Grad A: Yeah , I was gonna ask that too .Postdoc C: Yeah .PhD B: Yeah .Postdoc C: Exactly .PhD G: Well it 's time.PhD B: Yeah , so {disfmarker}Postdoc C: It 's {disfmarker} i it 's not against his conclusion ,PhD G: So {disfmarker} {vocalsound} but still {disfmarker} but still{disfmarker} uPostdoc C: it just says that it 's a bi bell curve , and that , {vocalsound} you have something that has a nice range , in your sampling .PhD G: Yeah. So there are slight {disfmarker} There are differences in how you measure it , but still it 's {disfmarker} {vocalsound} You know , the difference between um{disfmarker} between that number and what we have in meetings , which is more like , {vocalsound} you know , close to {disfmarker} in meetings like these ,uh {disfmarker} you know , close to twenty percent .Postdoc C: Mm - hmm . Mm - hmm .Professor F: But what was it like , say , in the Robustness meeting , for


The Acting Chair (Mr. Bruce Stanton (Simcoe North, CPC)): Honourable members, I call this meeting to order. Welcome to the 15thmeeting of the House ofCommons Special Committee on the COVID-19 Pandemic. This will be a hybrid meeting. Members will be participating via video conference or in person.  I willremind you that in order to avoid issues with sound, members participating in person should not also be connecting by video conference. In order to ensure thatthose joining the meeting via video conference can be seen and heard by those in the chamber, two screens have been set up here on either side of the Speaker'schair, and members in the chamber can listen to the floor audio or to interpretation using the earpieces on their desks. Before speaking, please wait until Irecognize you by name and please direct your remarks through the chair. For those joining by video conference, I'd like to remind you to leave your microphoneson mute when you are not speaking. Also, please note that if you want to speak in English, you need to be on the English channel for interpretation, and if youwant to speak French, you should do so on the French channel. Should you wish to alternate between the two languages, please change to the channel for thelanguage that you happen to be using at the time. Should members participating by video conference need to request the floor outside their designated speakingtimes, they should activate their mic and state that they have a point of order. Those in the Chamber can rise in the usual way. Please note that today'sproceedings will be televised in the same way as a typical sitting of the House. We will now proceed to ministerial announcements. I invite the Right Hon. PrimeMinister to take the floor.Right Hon. Justin Trudeau (Papineau, Lib.): Thank you, Mr.Chair. I rise today to address what so many people of colour live with everyday. Over the past few days, we've seen horrific reports of police violence against black men and women south of the border, but these are not isolated incidentsor elsewhere problems. Prejudice, discrimination and violence are a lived reality for far too many people. They are a result of systems that far too often condone,normalize, perpetrate and perpetuate inequality and injustice against people of colour. As a country, we are not concerned bystanders simply watching what ishappening next door. We are part of it. The calls for justice, for equality and for peace are found echoed in our communities, because anti-black racism ishappening here, everywhere in Canada, every single day. This is something that our own staff, cabinet ministers and colleagues face even in these halls. Over thepast few days, I've heard many of these personal stories directly from them. I'm not just talking about acts of violence. I'm also talking about microaggressions,which many of us may not even see. That is the daily reality of far too many racialized Canadians, and it needs to stop. When it comes to being an ally, I havemade serious mistakes in the past, mistakes that I deeply regret and continue to learn from. I want to thank my colleagues, community leaders and fellowCanadians for opening my eyes to what is really going on in our communities and for helping me better understand both privilege and power. I'm not perfect, butnot being perfect is not a free pass to not do the right thing. It's not an excuse to not step up, stand up for each other, be an ally. I know that for so many peoplelistening right now, the last thing you want to hear is another speech on racism from a white politician. I'm not here today to describe a reality I do not know or tospeak to a pain I have not felt. I'm here because I want you to know that our government is listening. We hear your calls for justice, equality and accountability.We acknowledge your frustration, your anger, your heartbreak. We see you.  Since coming to office, our government has taken many concrete steps to fightanti-black racism, systemic discrimination and injustice across the country. We are working directly with the communities and their leaders to close the gaps thatpersist in Canada. For example, we have provided $9million to support programs for black Canadian youth. We have made significant investments to enable thePublic Health Agency of Canada to provide more mental health services to people who have experienced racism or intergenerational trauma. We are helpingcommunity organizations to obtain funding to purchase equipment or lease space. We have also created the anti-racism secretariat, which has an envelope of$4.6million, to address systemic barriers, such as employment, justice and social participation, that perpetuate injustice. We have made progress, but we knowthe work is far from being done.  Over the past five years, our government has worked with communities to recognize and address injustices. We've taken actionto support community organizations, invest in better data and fight racism. While we've made some progress, there is still so much more to do, because here arethe facts in Canada: Anti-black racism is real. Unconscious bias is real. Systemic discrimination is real. For millions of Canadians, it is their daily, lived reality. Thepain and damage it causes are real too. Mr. Chair, every Canadian who has felt the weight of oppression, every student who has the courage to demand a betterfuture, every person who marches and posts and reads and fights, from Vancouver to Montreal to Halifax, expects more than the status quo. They expect moreand deserve better.  The Government of Canada has a lot of work to do, but we're ready. We're ready to work with our opposition colleagues, community leadersand Canadians to make our country a more just and fair place. Racism never has a place in this country, and we will do everything we can to eradicate it fromcoast to coast to coast. Thank you, Mr.Chair.The Acting Chair (Mr. Bruce Stanton): The honourable Leader of the Opposition.Hon. Andrew Scheer (Leader of theOpposition): Thank you very much, Mr. Chair. Over the past week, we have all been affected by the heartbreaking killing of George Floyd in the United States.The video is painful to watch. No one should ever have to plead for help while a crime is being committed, ignored by other members of law enforcement. Thetragedy triggered marches, occupations, protests and, unfortunately, riots. However, I hope it has mostly sparked conversations. Racism is real, painful andunacceptable.  No one should ever feel unsafe because of the colour of their skin, especially around police officers who have a duty and a responsibility to upholdthe law for all. Here in Canada, we are fortunate to live in a country that is welcoming, tolerant and inclusive. Canada was a beacon of freedom to so manyescaping slavery during the U.S. Civil War. Our nation has benefited immensely from great Canadians who overcame prejudices and discrimination to serve theircommunities and make Canada a better country: Lincoln Alexander, elected as a Conservative in 1968, was the first black member of Parliament and went on tobecome the first black cabinet minister; John Ware was born into slavery in South Carolina but, following the American Civil War, was a leading figure in bringingthe first cattle to Alberta and spearheading the ranching industry that would become the backbone of the province; Josiah Henson escaped slavery to become athriving businessman in Ontario; and of course, Viola Desmond challenged segregation in Nova Scotia. Black Canadians throughout history have not just built thisnation with their contributions; they have also represented Canada with excellence and pride on the world stage, like Harry Jerome, who represented Canada inthree Olympic Games and won a bronze medal in 1964. He would go on to become a teacher in British Columbia, once again serving with excellence to try tomake a better world for the next generation. Throughout our history, black Canadians have put their lives on the line for their fellow Canadians, bravely servingaround the world in our armed forces. While there are many things we can point to in our history with pride, that is not to say that we have a perfect record, northat we are immune to the threat of racism or that anti-black racism is just an American problem. Canada has had its own dark episodes of racism that cannot beignoredsadly, not just in our past. Every day, there are people who experience discrimination or racism in some form. Throughout this pandemic, we have seen atroubling spike in anti-Asian racism. No one should be attacked in their community or targeted on the bus because of the colour of their skin. Nor should places ofworship be broken into and desecrated, like the synagogue in Montreal. The Conservatives condemn all acts of anti-semitism, racism and discrimination. In apeaceful and free country like Canada, there is absolutely no room for intolerance, racism or extremism of any kind.  But the violence and destruction we haveseen in response are not the answer. Millions of people are protesting peacefully across the United States and in Canada, and we must always protect the rights ofpeople who are protesting peacefully and within the law for a just cause and separate them from those who exploit tragedies to commit acts of violence. Mr.Floyd's brother, Terrence, said that violence will not bring his brother back. Instead, he has called for peace and justice and urged the crowds to educatethemselves and to vote. Out of such tragedy, Mr. Chair, that is a powerful message about how each one of us can use our democratic rights to effect change. In apeaceful and free country like Canada, there is absolutely no room for intolerance, racism and extremism of any kind. We are not born believing we are betterthan one another. We are all created in the image and likeness of God, and because of that, we are all equal. An infinite value exists in each one of us.  Canada isan incredibly diverse country. Canada is a nation of immigrants that stands on the traditional territories of first nations, Inuit and Mtis people. Waves ofnewcomers have come to Canada for a better life because our country is built on a rock-solid foundation of enduring values, democratic institutions, the rule oflaw and fundamental and universal human rights. Everyone comes here because Canada is built on solid values, democratic institutions, and respect for the ruleof law, as well as for fundamental, universal human rights. We must absolutely protect these values, because they are what sets us apart. They allow Canada tooffer what so many other countries simply cannot. There are those who say that diversity is our strength, and that is true, but it doesn't quite capture the fullpicture. Diversity is the result of our strength, and our strength is and always has been our freedom. It is the freedom for people to preserve and pass on theircultural traditions and the opportunity to live in peace with those around them; the freedom to live your life with equality under the law, regardless of your race orethnic background; and the economic freedom that so many governments around the world deny their people. It is that economic freedom that ensures that hardwork pays off. It gives people the ability to work towards their dreams and choose their own path in life. Together, generations of Canadians who trace their rootsback to countries around the world have built Canada to truly the greatest country on earth, the true north strong and free. To ensure that our people remain


Project Manager: So we come to the third meetings . I have {gap} good .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Um so in the last meeting we havediscussed the functional design and now we will talk about the conceptual design . So we will talk about some specific details .Industrial Designer: Okay so I thinkI will do my presentation on the components concept so can you please uh open uh {disfmarker} I'm participant two .Project Manager: This{disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Components design .Project Manager: {gap}Industrial Designer: Okay so uh the first thing uh I have done is to to made areview together with the uh manufactural uh department and have which components was uh available to build a remote control . So for energy sources we havewe have to choose between the solar energy , hand dynamo and uh kinetic um well uh kinetic uh technique {vocalsound} to to store the energy .User Interface:{vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: We also um {vocalsound} we also can put a regular battery in the in the remote control . Now{disfmarker}Project Manager: Uh this is what we have decided in the last meeting . But if we use battery {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Yeah b uh f well uh Imeant uh by by battery I meant uh I will not have a uh a wire between the remote control and the energy source but uh I didn't fou we didn't decide yet whichkind of battery we will put inside the the remote . So uh it's a point to discuss . Then uh the case material we have uh uh also several choices , like wood , rubber, titanium or latex . {vocalsound} But uh well it's not a a re uh well a real issue for the {vocalsound} {disfmarker} from the technical uh point of view .Concerning the interface uh we can we can put mm just simple buttons or scrolls or buttons uh much more complicated , but it also requires that the chip toprocess the button is more complicated so .User Interface: Mm .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} And uh this is the last point , the choice of chips . So what Ihave f found is that I think basic battery or kinetic uh energy uh collection is the is the better way to provide energy because I think solar energy wi won't work{vocalsound} in a cluttered uh {vocalsound} uh environment .User Interface: Mm .Industrial Designer: So um so I think we can start with these two main things. For the case uh well uh I think that uh titanium is um is a good choice because it's trendy and it's uh it's uh well it's modern and uh user are are are{disfmarker} mm will be uh very happy to have a {vocalsound} a a nice remote . For the interface uh I think that we can ach achieve uh all the desiredfunctionalities by s just uh using uh rubber buttons , simple buttons and th thus this allow to use a regular chip {vocalsound} that are uh well cheaper .{vocalsound}User Interface: Mm .Industrial Designer: And s so uh we can move to the next slide .User Interface: Sorry .Industrial Designer: Yeah .UserInterface: What is this single curved {disfmarker} what does it mean ?Industrial Designer: Well uh uh i i it's uh it's the the shape of the um of the remote .UserInterface: So it's it's not {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: You you will have the {disfmarker} well um the the curve will fit into your hand when you grab the{disfmarker}User Interface: Yo l yeah . When you hold on it , it is comfortable to hold .Industrial Designer: Yeah . It's more confog f comfortable that if these uhit's completely flat .User Interface: Okay . Yeah . And the battery , is it kind of a rechargeable or it doesn't matter ?Industrial Designer: Yeah the um that's thepoint . The kinetic one is uh y you can recharge uh by the um {disfmarker}User Interface: That that's what it means by kinetic .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Yeah and by {disfmarker} well by just by moving the ar uh your arm the mm well the remote will uh accumulate energy .User Interface: Okay . Mm-hmm . Okay.Industrial Designer: But I d I don't know it's {disfmarker} if it is feasible because I don't know if yet if if the user will move enough to provide the remote um allthe necessary energy .User Interface: Mm . {vocalsound} Mm . Okay . Yeah . Yeah . We we might check with our R_ and D_ department to see if they have thisproduct {vocalsound} ready for market . {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Yeah . {vocalsound} And {disfmarker} yeah and so can you go to the next slideplease . So and uh that's uh that summarize well what I have said .User Interface: Mm mm . {vocalsound} {vocalsound} WhaIndustrial Designer: So uh you'reright we can uh see in our uh R_ and D_ uh {vocalsound} if the kinetic metal is sufficient to provide enough energy .User Interface: Ah the department . Mm.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} That's it .User Interface: Uh {disfmarker} So I um keep in touch with the R_ and D_ department .Industrial Designer: OhyeahUser Interface: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: I take care , it's all right .User Interface: {vocalsound} So the titanium case is the normal case that{disfmarker} I'll show you some pictures that I have and you tell me whether they are titanium case or not .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} All right . Yeah.User Interface: 'Cause I am not very sure , plastic , titanium or whatever . There's another point I want to make , is that the uh {disfmarker} well you've seenthem I le na my presentation that um I point out some {disfmarker} why buttons are not the mm not the only ways you can {vocalsound} use {disfmarker} Yeah. Yeah , maybe nIndustrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: We will , okay .User Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Three .User Interface: Yeah .{vocalsound} So the user interface is uh i it uses the aspect uh of a computer system , a programme which can be seen or heard or otherwise perceived by thehuman userProject Manager: {gap}User Interface: and the commands and mechanism the user uses to control its operation and input data . So you s this givesyou the ways to input data and we have uh {disfmarker} we are more {disfmarker} we emphasise more on the graphical user interface here . The idea is torepresent buttons as figures , diagrams , symbols and on so you you can easily when you look at the symbols you understand what it is doing .Project Manager:What's the function of this button .User Interface: Yeah . Yeah . So .Project Manager: I think it makes the the interface really {disfmarker}User Interface: Ea easyto use . So next one .Project Manager: Graphical user interface {gap} .User Interface: {gap} function five . So I can use the button , the mouse maybe .ProjectManager: A graphical user interface emphasise the use of pictures .User Interface: Yeah . So next line . So the {disfmarker} here are some examples . So theycluster the buttons together . They group them into col they colour them and uh they have different forms as well . Mm but this interface are kind of confusing .Uh basically there are too many buttons . Right . Next one .Industrial Designer: Yeah .User Interface: So some people are propose voice recognition and so{disfmarker} ah by the way I receive an email from the from one our departments saying that the voice recognition has been used in the coffee machine{vocalsound} for this by a companyIndustrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: when you tell the {disfmarker} you say good morning coffee machine andthe machine are reply to you . So I just got an email saying that .Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm mm mm .User Interface: And it seems like this voice recognitiontechnology is ready to be used so we might consider that , supposedly .Industrial Designer: Yeah fine .User Interface: {vocalsound} The next one . Mm sosomebody {disfmarker} some people use uh some people use a spinning wheel th with the L_C_ display so instead of using the mm buttons you have a L_C_D_screen and then there you can u you can use that as buttons , you can use that as real {disfmarker} so so that could be an option as well . Touch screen , I mean.Project Manager: Yeah .User Interface: Next one . And some people propose a scroll button . Integrated with push buttons or you may have scroll button insteadof p just the push button . Like the one we have here . Uh , next one . So mmProject Manager: Mm-hmm .User Interface: so there are a few aspects that Icollected here . So s basically this deals with special users , children , handicapped people , old people , and uh mm and prog basically they are programmable ,specially for children . And uh mm {disfmarker} yeah yeah . And then they also secure uh covers , to protect uh secure and hidden programming and batterycovers that will protect your settings . So {disfmarker} But we don't have to integrate all these complicated features . I'm just saying that the {disfmarker}currently in the market there are there are control there are remote controllers f {gap} customisable for different people . Yeah , so that's the point . The nextone . And uh you see this is the one where you have the protection cover . Mm maybe useful for children , they migh you you they only see the buttons outside .And for adults wh where you have more control you can see the one inside . So the adults might wanna have a key to lock that to pr so children will not touch thebutton inside .Industrial Designer: Yeah .User Interface: Yeah .Industrial Designer: S a good idea .User Interface: The next one .Industrial Designer:{vocalsound}User Interface: So this guy {disfmarker} this is another company that provides big buttons . At {disfmarker} I see that that is useful for old peopleand then you don't get it lost . But for our product we don't need a big one because you have voice recognition e eventually with use .Industrial Designer: Yeah.User Interface: And you can call your remote controller if you don't know where it is .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound} T_V_remote controller where are you ?Project Manager: {vocalsound}User Interface: And then , he will beeps and to say that I am here , {vocalsound} for example.Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {gap} We should include speech synthesis in this case , no ?User Interface: Is it possible ?IndustrialDesigner: Yeah .Marketing: Yeah .User Interface: Uh ? {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Yeah but uh as Norman say if uh there is uh already a commercialproduct available who t who do this we we can check uh to integrate it i into our uh new remote control .Marketing: Yeah .User Interface: Yeah . Yeah . Yeah .Yeah . And uh , this is another one where you can uh {disfmarker} the the the part that's a V_ standing for the volume . So there's a up arrow and a down arrow. But you the see that in the V_ , the V_ appears to be the down arrow on the top {disfmarker} on the top up arrow {disfmarker} {vocalsound} if you{disfmarker}Project Manager: Mm-hmm .User Interface: up arrow there's a V_ like as as if it's turning down so it's confusing interface , so I wanna avoid thiskind of thing in the design .Industrial Designer: Yeah yeah .User Interface: And here are {disfmarker} is uh here is a s short summary that I summary that Icompiled after the findings I found . Big buttons are convenient , voice recognition helps , push buttons , scroll buttons , spinning wheels can be used asnavigation tools . And uh user customisable is important and finally simplicity simplicity is the key . Yeah . So {vocalsound} we have many concepts


Project Manager: Okay , welcome to the detailed design meeting . Again , I'm gonna take minutes . Oh , we're gonna have a prototype presentation first .UserInterface: {gap}Project Manager: Uh , who's gonna give the prototype presentation ? You two guys ? Okay . Go ahead .Industrial Designer: Yes . {vocalsound}{gap}User Interface: {gap} .Marketing: {vocalsound} {vocalsound} {gap} . {vocalsound}User Interface: {gap} coffee .Marketing: {vocalsound}IndustrialDesigner: 'Kay , we've made a prototype . Um , we've got uh {vocalsound} uh our aspects from the last meeting . Uh , especially we looked at the form , materialand the colour . Um , we've uh drawn here the p prototype . The logo is uh is uh {vocalsound} is pretty uh {vocalsound} obvious to see on the on the remotecontrol ,User Interface: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: but it is necessary when you want to build your uh company f to a level higher . Um ,{vocalsound} our interface elements , there are shown in the in the drawing . Maybe you can uh point them uh {disfmarker} The functions .User Interface: Uh ,well the uh {disfmarker} all the functions are discussed uh {disfmarker} I think the most of the functions are uh uh obvious . Uh , it's a little bit . Uh , powerbutton . Uh then the the the nine uh channels .Project Manager: {vocalsound}User Interface: Uh the volume uh uh at the side , and the other side is theprogrammes . And then we had uh just uh two buttons , we place them in the middle , uh the menu , and for the teletextProject Manager: Oh no , the the themute button misses now .User Interface: {vocalsound} {disfmarker} I thought that was thMarketing: Alright , I {disfmarker}Project Manager: Do y do you{disfmarker}User Interface: Oh , the mute button .Project Manager: did we want to have a m mute button ?Industrial Designer: But uh that{disfmarker}Marketing: Yeah .Industrial Designer: It's uh here then , in the middle .User Interface: Yeah .Project Manager: Huh .Marketing: Alright , and uh yougotta point out which is the volume um uh button and which is the programme button .Industrial Designer: Yes , umUser Interface: {vocalsound} Well , yeah mouh moIndustrial Designer: we've discUser Interface: Yeah , well most of them are right-handed .Industrial Designer: Most of the usersMarketing: Yeah , but youyou gotta make it clear on the {disfmarker} on {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah well , I don't have time in uh anymore on the {disfmarker}Industrial Designer:Yes , y there there will be a p a little a little P_ on that and a little uh {disfmarker} yeah .Marketing: Yeah , and a and a triangle on that .User Interface: Oh yeah ,just progr programme above , I think .Marketing: Yes . Next to that I kinda miss a zero actually .User Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound}Wait , there's {disfmarker} was one thing I wanted to ask .Marketing: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound}Marketing:{vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Uh , there are different ways for remote controls to uh {vocalsound} do uh likeMarketing:{vocalsound}Project Manager: uh d I call it teens and twenties . Uh , y th th th the two numbers .Industrial Designer: Yes .Marketing: All n no , that's um{vocalsound} kinda dependent on the television .User Interface: Yeah , true , yeah .Industrial Designer: It's a television . Yes .Project Manager: Yeah , but do wehave {disfmarker} do we need extra buttons ,User Interface: Uh {disfmarker}Project Manager: {vocalsound} for example some uh some have to{disfmarker}User Interface: Uh I think so .Marketing: I think {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Yes , yes , you have you have a lot of standard buttons that has tobe uh on it , uh th with the one and a double uh uh {disfmarker}Marketing: Yeah , I think you should add {disfmarker} {vocalsound}User Interface: Zero?Marketing: A cross , or whatever . Yeah , line .Project Manager: Yeah , but you don't you don't actually need them ,User Interface: May maybe here ?IndustrialDesigner: yes .Project Manager: becau b l a lot of remote controls work that y when y that you when you fir you push the one first , then you have a couple ofseconds {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah . And then a second .Marketing: No , that's dependent on the television .Project Manager: No , I don't think so.Industrial Designer: Yes , you have televisions , then you have to , you know , you have to uh press {disfmarker}Marketing: I do know so .User Interface: Is itdepending on television ?Project Manager: Nah , I don't think so really ,Marketing: Yeah .Project Manager: because you have a {disfmarker} I know some remotecontrols that don't have these buttons , but you still can , know , obviously you can still select the twenty {disfmarker} uh a number in the twenty or in the ten.Industrial Designer: Yes , but but a lot {disfmarker} uh {disfmarker}Marketing: Yes , but uh uh no uh remote control nowadays are um {disfmarker}{vocalsound} they come with the television . Or actually , the other way around .Project Manager: No , I think {disfmarker} uh I really think it's nMarketing: But{disfmarker} {vocalsound}Project Manager: because you can {disfmarker} when when you put a button on it with like one and uh then a dash , it's the samething as when you just push the one ,Marketing: Yeah .Project Manager: because it i it first gives you the functionality of that that uh separate button you alsohad to uh apply .Industrial Designer: Yes , butMarketing: Yeah , well {disfmarker} but su {vocalsound} If {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: some televisionsdon't accept uh that that {disfmarker}Project Manager: Yeah , because that's i it's for television . It's exact the same thing .Industrial Designer: No , no , butsMarketing: No no no . So some television respond differently . Look , if uh i iProject Manager: No , listen listen . When you push the button , the remote controlgives a signal . I in th in the first place it gives a signal which it would also send when you put a separate button on it .Marketing: Yes . Yes , that's true .ProjectManager: The one with dash , that signal gi and when y whe when you don't push another button on the remote control within five seconds , then the remotecontrol gives a signal for channel one .User Interface: Yeah . True .Marketing: No {disfmarker}Project Manager: I think it works that way , really .Marketing: No ,it it it works uh if you haven't got uh a special button for it , uh if you push a one , then on your television there will appear a one and a a line , which is an emptyspace .Project Manager: {vocalsound} Yeah , but it's exact the same {gap} that w would appear when you put a separate button {disfmarker} push a separatebutton .Industrial Designer: Yes , but some some old televisions uh you have to uh click on uh a special button , uh then you go to a a next level , you can pushtwo buttons .Project Manager: Yeah , but you don't underst uh you don't understand my point .Marketing: Yep . {vocalsound} True .Project Manager: I think it'sexact the same thing when yIndustrial Designer: You want {disfmarker} Yes , but some television don't support it .Project Manager: No , but then they would awould also support that button , because it's the same thing .User Interface: But the exProject Manager: Listen , with {disfmarker} that that's that special butbutton {gap} you're talking about , eh ? That's just a signal to recei ju they send a t signal to the v tv T_V_ that they have to put a one in {disfmarker} on yourscreen and a dash , which you can pu so you can uh still put another number on it . When you don't have that separate button , and you push y one , it's exactlythe same thing . Do y you {disfmarker} the remote control gives that same signal as it would give when you only had {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: No,Marketing: No , s some some televisions need the input first uh and and you cIndustrial Designer: a remote can {disfmarker}Project Manager: Yeah .IndustrialDesigner: Yes ,Project Manager: But you give the input .Industrial Designer: so they need {disfmarker} no , they need {disfmarker}Project Manager: You pushthe one . That's the same thing as the button with the one and it {disfmarker}Marketing: No , that's not true .Project Manager: yes it it is .Marketing: It's simplynot true . It's simply not true .Project Manager: Think about it .User Interface: Yeah .Industrial Designer: No ,User Interface: You uh you can wai when you pushthe one you can show on the telly a one and just a dash , and then wait uh two uh seconds or something {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: but uh{disfmarker}Marketing: Uh {disfmarker}Project Manager: And it's the same thing what happens and a g remote control gives another signal after five secondsthat is just one .Marketing: No , remote control doesn't give signal after five seconds . Remote control is a stupid thing . If you push a button , it sends itimmediately to to the television .Project Manager: Yeah , that's true . Yeah , but I m uh but it's {disfmarker} I I know for sure that some televisions that w th ththe remote control supplied , only ha has the c these buttons with a one and a dash and a two and a dash , but when you use a bu a n remote control that doesn'tsport these buttons , it still works .Industrial Designer: Yeah , it {disfmarker}Project Manager: But okay , we we'll implMarketing: No , definitely not . Definitelynot .User Interface: We'll discuss them in the usability lab .Project Manager: No , we'll apply them then for now .User Interface: Uh eva evaluation .Marketing:{vocalsound}User Interface: I don't know uh I don't know if if it's it's necessary .Project Manager: Yeah , app just apply them next to the zero , the one and thetwo .User Interface: Yeah ?Project Manager: Yeah , I think so . Yeah , for now , if we don't know for sure whether {disfmarker} {vocalsound}User Interface:{vocalsound} Okay .Industrial Designer: And the button for the SCART uh audio video uh external input .Marketing: Yes .User Interface: Ach .Project Manager:Yeah but {disfmarker}Marketing: Uh , you can access that uh via zero , and then minus , I guess .Project Manager: okay . {vocalsound} What I said about uh theremote control sending another signal , that that might not be true ,Marketing: Yeah .User Interface: Yeah .Project Manager: but I still think i it it {disfmarker} allT_V_s in some ways support it , I don't know . I think it's more c is m maybe we don't {disfmarker} uh we both don't really understand how it i how it reallyworks ,Industrial Designer: No , no .Project Manager: but I think there's more to in than wha than what you just said .Industrial Designer: Uh , remote controlsends one signal at one button uh press .Project Manager: I do think that uh m T_V_s support mur multiple kind of remote controls . MIndustrial Designer: Uh ,some {disfmarker} N some televisions when when you want to go further than uh ten {disfmarker}Project Manager: Th won't work wi with uh{disfmarker}Industrial Designer: No , you have to you have to uh give the television uh two or more signals .Project Manager: to have that special button.Industrial Designer: When you uh press one button , you give one signal . And the older televisions need more signals to go a level higher . But{disfmarker}Project Manager: Okay , well we'll see .Marketing: Yep .Industrial Designer: When you make the technology that that it will uh give more signals , it


Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: So in last meeting we have discussed the conceptual design and we asked you to prepare a prototype for thefor the remote control .User Interface: {vocalsound} Okay .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound} So {gap} .{vocalsound} So let's see the {disfmarker} what did you prepare .User Interface: Yeah , so can you go out to the shared folder ? Mm the shared folder .ProjectManager: Sh share folder for th your presentation ?User Interface: Yes . We have a presentation .Project Manager: Because I have here {disfmarker}IndustrialDesigner: {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound} Uh {disfmarker} {gap} So I got the participant uh three . W uh {vocalsound} . Three . It's the final design ,yeah .Project Manager: Okay just one {gap} .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound} S so so I discussed with Guillaume .IndustrialDesigner: Mm . {vocalsound} Yeah .User Interface: Right . {vocalsound} And uh {vocalsound} so we have {vocalsound} {disfmarker} and we we are bothagreed on some two versions of the prototypes , because we were no not decided whether we wanted to have an L_C_D_ or not because it's too expensive . Sowe come up with two versions . One with and one without L_C_D_s . Um but both comes with a charger and then detachable and uh or {gap} control module .And detachable big buttons for all people um . So {vocalsound} .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} S okay so I'll show you the the two prototypes {vocalsound} .Here we have the first one with the beautiful uh L_C_D_ um display . You you can s here . And you can uh just um browse into the the navigation menu by uhjoystick joystick-like uh button .User Interface: Mm .Industrial Designer: You can uh choose the direction and if you just push on it it's considered like a enterfunction .User Interface: Mm . Mm-hmm .Industrial Designer: You have on the mm on the side here the microphone for the {vocalsound} for the speechrecognition system here .User Interface: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: And here the the switch that control if you want {disfmarker}Project Manager: Whyyou why you you put it in the the side ?Industrial Designer: Well I I I think uh it's the {disfmarker}Project Manager: It's not a good place maybe {gap} .IndustrialDesigner: Yeah but {disfmarker}User Interface: No i i it's the all around camer uh microphone isn't it . The the microphone picks up the speeches from anywhere.Industrial Designer: Yeah .Marketing: Is it an only a single mic or a microphone array ?Industrial Designer: Well so it's a microphone array .User Interface:{vocalsound}Project Manager: Oh it's very costly , microphone array {vocalsound} .Marketing: Mm-hmm .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} NoUser Interface:Yeah {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: it's just a single microphone , and you {disfmarker} I I think uh we we put it here because I think when you when you arebrowsing your L_C_D_ you will be close to {disfmarker}User Interface: Mm .Marketing: Yeah .Industrial Designer: well it's better to to to place it here th thanhere , for instance .User Interface: Yeah {vocalsound} yeah .Marketing: Okay .Industrial Designer: And here is a little switch that control if you want the thespeaker uh recognition system to um to be on or off . And uh so this remote control comes up with its charger .Project Manager: How much does it cost this one?Industrial Designer: Well this this prototype is um made for about uh well fi fi fifteen fifteen dollarsUser Interface: For the {disfmarker}Project Manager: Fifteendollars ?User Interface: Yeah .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} fifteen dollars ,Project Manager: Ah it's above it's above the budget .Industrial Designer: but uhwell it's not it's not uh {disfmarker} yeah , but uh it's just a prototype and if we uh if we optimises the um the uh {disfmarker} voila .Marketing: The cost wouldbe le reduced .Industrial Designer: Yeah the {gap} and the the production costs we we can achieve uh about ten dollars . {gap}User Interface: Mm . Hmm.Project Manager: How many b battery is there ?Industrial Designer: How many , excuse me ?Project Manager: Battery .Industrial Designer: Well uh f battery ,we use uh about uh {disfmarker}User Interface: Is it n the two A_A_s batteries in it .Industrial Designer: Yeah .User Interface: A_A_ rechargeable batteries.Industrial Designer: Rechargeable of course ,User Interface: Yeah rechargeable batteries .Industrial Designer: because we have the charger .User Interface: Wehave the charger so it's no problem .Industrial Designer: Yeah and you just {disfmarker}Project Manager: So one one battery ?Industrial Designer: On uh yeahone battery .Marketing: Is that two or one ?User Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: It's kinetic reserve .User Interface: {vocalsound} Actually uh it's aflexible thing .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: You just n uh {disfmarker}Marketing: Now what is the whole day ratingfor that ?Industrial Designer: The {disfmarker} excuse me ?Marketing: Whole day's rating .User Interface: {vocalsound}Marketing: What type of battery?Industrial Designer: Oh yeah it's just a r uh simple battery a rechargeable uh {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah yeah .Industrial Designer: if you uh like it's exist.Marketing: Something like a two A_ , A_ three size batteries ?Industrial Designer: Yeah .User Interface: Yeah {vocalsound} .Marketing: Mm-hmm .IndustrialDesigner: So and if you want to charge the battery you just put the remote control like that to plug in the the chargerUser Interface: Yeah . Yeah .IndustrialDesigner: and uh leave it uh alone , it's alright .User Interface: Mm . {vocalsound} At uh {vocalsound} yeah .Industrial Designer: Then the next time you pick it ,ohProject Manager: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: it works {vocalsound} .User Interface: I forgot to tell you there is only a single button there , b this button{disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Yeah just explain the button uh Norman .User Interface: yeah alright . This button is like the mouse {disfmarker} is like ajoystick ,Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: you can move in three hundred and sixty degrees of direction so you can make a turn and it{disfmarker} the additi functions associated to all the actions you ma you have a click you have a double click all in a single button {vocalsound} .ProjectManager: Mm .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: You can move up , down , left , right , or you can do a swing . So a swing to the left , a swing tothe right defines other functions . So even though it's a single button , but it is pretty s flexible because of the three hundred and sixty degree movement{vocalsound} .Marketing: And the L_C_D_ is this one , on the remote ?User Interface: Yeah . This is the version y that comes with L_C_D_ .Industrial Designer:Yep .Marketing: Yeah .User Interface: Here I present another version without the L_C_D_ .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: I think it's not agood idea because after maybe one or two months of function is {gap} getting destroyed .User Interface: Mm .Project Manager: If youUser Interface: Uh okaythis is new prototype uh {vocalsound} .Project Manager: {gap} {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Yeah it's {disfmarker}Project Manager: {vocalsound}IndustrialDesigner: So we have the the second version also with the different uh button configuration . The second version is also simpler , we d uh we had just uh I haveto put the microphone also {vocalsound} .User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah yeah .Marketing: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: So basically th it's the same uh{disfmarker}Marketing: Uh-huh and also the switch .Project Manager: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: yeah {vocalsound} .Marketing: {vocalsound} Okay.Industrial Designer: Basically it's the same uh things uh uh as uh I presented before . But here we have uh we have uh four buttons for navigation . Press onebutton uh acting as a a enter button .User Interface: Mm . {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: So um yeah according to what you said it's more robust to the user.Project Manager: Mm-hmm .User Interface: {vocalsound}Marketing: Mm-hmm .Industrial Designer: And uh it's also cheaper to produce . We can produce uhsuch remote control for about uh four dollars . {vocalsound}Project Manager: No four dollars , it's {vocalsound} {gap} good . {gap}User Interface:{vocalsound}Marketing: And I think you forgot a point here to have an button to find the charger ,User Interface: Oh noMarketing: because that's a major that'sa {disfmarker}User Interface: th actually th we'll come to that point in our {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Yeah it's it's it's embed in the uh speech recognitionsystem .User Interface: Yeah .Marketing: OkayIndustrial Designer: So {disfmarker}Marketing: and if you disable speech recognition system then ?User Interface:W w I'll I'll come to that point later on .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} so Norman will explain to you {vocalsound} .Marketing: Mm hmm hmm hmm hmmhmm .Project Manager: And we will we will serve the charger with this ?User Interface: Yeah .Marketing: Okay .Industrial Designer: Yeah yeah of course mm{gap} .User Interface: Th they {vocalsound} either these with the {disfmarker} uh the the charger anyProject Manager: With the remote control .User Interface:in either versions you they they ha they use the same charger yeah .Project Manager: Okay so the price of the charger included in the {disfmarker}UserInterface: Uh it's a standard module so you should get it for a cheap price uh {vocalsound} .Project Manager: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}{vocalsound} Thank thank you {vocalsound} .Project Manager: Mm-hmm . {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: And so mm-hmm .User Interface: It's that samecharger that you can use for the hand-phone but uh again depends on the types . I think we have to investigate more on that , but {vocalsound}{disfmarker}Project Manager: The price should be below twelve and a half Euro .User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah . YeahProject Manager: Well that's{disfmarker} so {disfmarker}User Interface: but as the Marketing Manager says , people is willing to {disfmarker} people are willing to pay more for good design.Project Manager: We have we have just {vocalsound} {disfmarker}Marketing: Yeah people are willing to pay more ,User Interface: {vocalsound}IndustrialDesigner: {vocalsound}Marketing: but the company is not willing to invest more at the moment .Project Manager: The price of selling is twenty five Euros .UserInterface: Yeah . Yeah . Mm-hmm .Project Manager: And the price of production {disfmarker}User Interface: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Alright please uhgo on Norman with the special features {vocalsound} .Marketing: Or uh {disfmarker}User Interface: Yeah we'll we'll come up to that , the the the thing thatmakes this the controller cheap is that it is modular so you want more function you pay more . If you want less function i i if you want a reasonable price you payfor the functions that you add on to the system ,Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: so is uh modular .Project Manager: That's for this basis function and ifyou want more you pay more .User Interface: Yeah yeah ,Project Manager: {gap}User Interface: for example the L_C_D_ , you can take it you can put it


Project Manager: So welcome . The first kick-off meeting . What shall we do ? First the opening , then the rest . What are we going to do . We m have to make anew remote control .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: It has to be original , trendy and user-friendly . So we will get back th on that . First wehave to make a functional design . After that we have to make a conceptual design , and then after that a detailed design . So we'll discuss that later . First wehave a look at {gap} . So first to {disfmarker} we have to make a small painting . What have {disfmarker} do we have to do . First you can save the documents .We have to do that every time we make something . You can print it . No . And we have to use {vocalsound} the pen and the eraser . So {disfmarker} Now . Weall have to use this one .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: You have to make your own favourite animal .Marketing: {vocalsound}ProjectManager: So I'll make an example .Marketing: Yep .Project Manager: First don't touch that things .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager:{vocalsound} You can use the pen . And then you can make {vocalsound} um something .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Nice .Marketing: {vocalsound}{vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound} Um you can change some things .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Um format , line , and changeit . {gap} {disfmarker} {vocalsound} {vocalsound} And you can change the colour .User Interface: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer:An elephant . {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound} So that's it . {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: So{disfmarker} So and after it you have to save it .Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Now we can make a new one .Marketing: Okay .Project Manager: Youhave to paint now . {vocalsound} So you're next .Marketing: Oh . {vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: 'Kay .Marketing: Well we will try. Where it going ?Industrial Designer: {gap} .User Interface: Hmm . That's uh strange . {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {gap} .Project Manager: What is goingon ?Industrial Designer: {gap} pop-ups .Project Manager: What are you {disfmarker} What ?Marketing: Hmm .Project Manager: {vocalsound}IndustrialDesigner: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {gap} .Marketing: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: What is this , Pictionary .Marketing:{vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: Uh {disfmarker}Project Manager: Um {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Uh a bird .Project Manager: Isa {disfmarker} It is a {disfmarker} It is a {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Bird .Project Manager: A duck .Marketing: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer:{vocalsound}Marketing: Mm .Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: So {disfmarker} Now save ?Project Manager: Yes .Industrial Designer: Yeah .ProjectManager: Hmm .Marketing: Now uh blank ?Project Manager: Blank , yes .User Interface: Yeah .Marketing: Yeah .Project Manager: Okay next one .{vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface: Okay . Let's try this . Uh {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Whoo .Marketing: Yeah , yeah.User Interface: {vocalsound} Um . Mm-hmm . Mm .Project Manager: {vocalsound} Oh . {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Oh not . Oh . {vocalsound}UserInterface: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Okay . Okay . Yeah . No problem .Marketing: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Shithappens . {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound} {vocalsound} I'm not getting anything uh on my screen now . Okay .Industrial Designer: A parrot . Ish.Marketing: Wow . Oh .Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: He did it before .Marketing: {vocalsound}User Interface:{vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound}User Interface: Uh{disfmarker}Project Manager: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: No , no . Yeah . Okay .Marketing: {vocalsound} Nice.Project Manager: Very good .Industrial Designer: Oh .User Interface: Uh blank .Industrial Designer: Thank you .Project Manager: {vocalsound}{vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Okay . Very good . So um you can always go back . {gap} So{disfmarker}Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: {vocalsound} That's it . So that was two . Now next . The budget . The b Uh we will sell the t at twentyfive Euros . And we have only twenty of twelve and a half Euro to make it . So {vocalsound} now we have to think about what we will make . First I wanna hearfrom you . Uh what are your experiences with remote controls . So {disfmarker}Industrial Designer: Uh I will start .Project Manager: F first {gap} .IndustrialDesigner: Uh {disfmarker} {gap}Marketing: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer: Big one , they are uh not easy to use . Um I have one set and uh a remote control, when I dropped it , uh it broke . So that won't be uh our goal , I think .User Interface: No .Industrial Designer: And uh g big buttons , {vocalsound} m uh that'seasier to use than uh {disfmarker} I think . Not all the small buttons , you don't know {disfmarker}Project Manager: Is this positive or negative , that uh bigbuttons ?Industrial Designer: Big buttons , positive .Project Manager: Positive .Industrial Designer: All all small buttons like when you have uh like a hundredbuttons on your remote control , you won't know what they're working for .Project Manager: Okay . What are your experiences ?User Interface: Uh well I thinkthe the the goal of a remote control is that it's it it has an influence on the T_V_ set .Project Manager: Mm .User Interface: And that it controls the channels andthe the volume . And uh I I I think it's positive if there's a a LED uh uh a LED on the corner of the of the remote . So that you know it s it still has batteries on it{disfmarker} in it . And that if you push the button the LED uh gives a light , and uh and you see that it's working . And uh yeah . Uh {disfmarker}ProjectManager: So and do they always have that ?User Interface: Yeah , but {disfmarker} No no no . But I {disfmarker} my my experience is that it it it's convenientto have that .Project Manager: It's easy to you .User Interface: Yeah . Yeah .Project Manager: Okay . 'Kay .Marketing: Uh at home we have a T_V_ , a video uhrecorder , a D_V_D_ player , and a satellite receiver . We have uh four distinctive remote controls for that .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Thank you.Marketing: That's not really ea easy .Industrial Designer: Help also . {vocalsound} Thank you .Marketing: So it would be nice if we have one for all . And we alsohad a remote control for our radio set . But um i it it had a lot of buttons on it , and you didn't know which one was what . And it was uh uh v {vocalsound} noteasy to use . So we n barely used it .Project Manager: Okay so they have too much . So next .User Interface: Hmm .Project Manager: For our own remote controlwe have to think how do we make it . So what ideas do you have for it , for the new remote control ? What what does it have to have ? {vocalsound}IndustrialDesigner: The weight . Not not too heavy .Project Manager: Not too heavy . Yes .Industrial Designer: Not much buttons .Project Manager: Yeah .IndustrialDesigner: Bust-free . That when you drop it , it won't break . Like uh some kind of rubber on it . Or hard uh hard plastic . Uh buttons not too small . Uh somethinglike when you uh lose your uh remote control , sometimes it happen . Uh it between the couch and you can't find it .Project Manager: Yes .Industrial Designer:When you push a but a button on the T_V_ , then you hear some {gap} {disfmarker} uh some sort of bleep .User Interface: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Likea phone .Industrial Designer: And then you uh , hey there there's remote control .Project Manager: Okay .Marketing: Yeah .Industrial Designer:{vocalsound}User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager: So ,Industrial Designer: Next .Project Manager: that's{gap} .User Interface: Yeah well that's {disfmarker} that are good ideas . Uh {disfmarker} Yeah well the LED on the corner , that that indicates that it's working. If you push a button . Um {disfmarker} Yeah . And looking on the budget , not too expensive uh material . So probably plastic or something . Uh{disfmarker}Project Manager: Okay .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: Yeah I think it uh {disfmarker} from a marketing point of view , it also has tolook nice . Or you won't sell it .Project Manager: Yes .Marketing: And um yeah uh on our website we can see what products we already have . And it should workwith as many uh as possible of them .Project Manager: Okay . This is {disfmarker} It has to be compatible with other things .Marketing: Yes .Project Manager:Okay .Industrial Designer: I have one more idea . Just popped up .Project Manager: Yes ?Industrial Designer: Uh it it won't take a lot of batteries . So you don't{disfmarker} won't have to change the batteries uh once a week or uh once every two weeks .Project Manager: No battery use . So more ideas ?User Interface:Mm no .Project Manager: No okay . It's only the first ideas . So {vocalsound} uh what are we going to do now is {disfmarker} Next meeting is in half an h hour .Uh {disfmarker} {vocalsound} Okay . Next meeting , half an hour . Um , what you have to do . Well look on your {gap} . And {disfmarker} Next instructionsyou'll get in your email . So {disfmarker} This is the first meeting . See you later in half an hour .User Interface: Yes .Industrial Designer: Okay . Thank you.Marketing: Okay .


Lynne Neagle AM: Good morning, everyone. Welcome to the Children, Young People and Education Committee. We've received apologies for absence from SuzyDavies, and I'm very pleased to welcome Angela Burns, who is substituting for Suzy this morning. We've also received apologies from Dawn Bowden. Can I alsowelcome Siân Gwenllian to the meeting? Siân is joining us from her constituency office via video-conference. Can I ask Members if they've got any declarations ofinterest, please? Hefin.Hefin David AM: Apologies. I'm currently registered as an associate lecturer at Cardiff Metropolitan University, although I haven't done anywork for them for some time.Lynne Neagle AM: Okay. Thank you very much. We'll move on, then, to item 2 this morning, which is our evidence session on thehigher education new academic year allocations. I'm very pleased to welcome David Blaney, who is chief executive of the Higher Education Funding Council forWales, and Bethan Owen, who is deputy chief executive of HEFCW. Thank you, both, for attending this morning. We're looking forward to hearing what you've gotto say. If you're happy, we'll go straight into questions from Members, and the first questions are from Angela Burns.Angela Burns AM: Good morning. Thank youvery much, indeed. I just wanted to talk about, really, the financial sustainability of the higher education sector because, as we know, there's been all sorts ofthings going on in the press. So, can I just start with, actually, quite a technical question and ask you what the financial indicators look like for the universitieshere in Wales, and are there particular indicators that are really flashing warning signals to you?Dr David Blaney: Well, shall I just start with a couple ofcontextualising comments and Bethan can come in then with some detail? It's undeniably the case there are financial challenges facing our universities. Theyresult from three main causes: one is the impact of the demographic dip of 18-year-olds, which is deeper and longer in Wales than it is elsewhere in the UK.There are increased pension costs and, actually, increased costs generally. And, of course, we also have current uncertainty as a result of the Augar review inEngland, and whether that might play into Wales, and also Brexit. These challenges are not unique to Wales; the majority of the UK universities are actuallytaking out cost one way or another. So, this is not a Welsh issue. Before the Diamond review of fees and funding in Wales, there was a pre-existing funding gap inresource between England and Wales, and even now, that's still the case. So, Welsh higher education institutions are approximately £40 million worse off thanthey would be in the English system. That's a challenge, and that is a result from a political decision to invest in students, and that's fine. The money's gone intothe system but it hasn't gone into universities, necessarily. So, these are serious challenges for institutions to manage, but I think it is a managed situation. We'renot seeing a crisis; we are seeing some real challenges, and there is a distinction, I think, between—. We have to understand, though, that taking out cost tobalance the books has a detrimental effect on the capacity. Obviously it impacts on the people who lose their jobs immediately, but there's a medium to longerterm impact on the capacity of the system to deliver for Wales. They are taking out capacity; they're not cutting at fat now, they're cutting out core capacity. Andso, the range of the curriculum, the range of research and innovation, the range of the contribution that universities can make will be diminished by that. Andagainst that backdrop, the introduction of the Diamond reforms is hugely important—delivery of that is going to be really important—and we are really pleased tosee the Minister able to meet her commitments in respect of that. The Diamond money is coming in. This forthcoming year will be the first year we see anincrease in the resource, through us, to higher education. And the projections in future years are better still, and that will be extremely important. Theperformance of the sector is very good; we had the national student survey results out yesterday. Wales is still the best in the UK, which is excellent. We have thebest impact from research in Wales across the UK. So, all of that is very positive, but that is also being done at some cost. There are some very tired staff inuniversities, and we've seen some stuff in the press recently about some of the impact of stress there as well.Angela Burns AM: Can I bring you back to thefinancial element of that? Can I just ask a question: what are the university reserves looking like at present?Dr David Blaney: Here, I refer to my learnedfriend.Bethan Owen: The reserves are a measure. There's a difference between the distributable reserves—I don't have those numbers before me, but looking atreserves, what is more important are those reserves that are available as cash or liquid cash. So, universities have reserves, but a large amount of that is tied upin their estates, so they're not immediately realisable. So, one of the key measures that we're looking at, which is even more important than surpluses anddeficit, is the operating cash that our universities are generating at the moment. When we look at operating cash in 2017-18, they were generating, as apercentage of income, about 7.6 per cent, which contrasts with nearly 10 per cent for the same year for English institutions. And that represents their capacity togenerate surplus cash to meet their costs, which now, increasingly, include the costs of servicing their borrowings. So, again, because capital funding has notbeen as available to universities as it was, they've invested in their estates and that's largely been funded by borrowings. The costs of those borrowings have tobe met on an annual basis, so that's becoming an increasing proportion of the operating cash that universities have.Angela Burns AM: I just asked that questionbecause I know that about four years ago, the universities were sitting on substantial reserves and were less than keen to deploy them back into actually usingthem for the students—it was more about building up the war chest, if you like, of the universities. And I just really wanted to have an understanding of how thatpicture might have changed over the last four years and are they actually skinnier cats now, rather than before.Bethan Owen: We can get you that analysis, buteven four years ago, I think the definition of exactly what's meant by reserves, it's really important to look at what are distributable reserves as opposed to theassets that universities have.Angela Burns AM: Yes, I do understand the difference.Bethan Owen: And, there are also differences in the way that universities havesecured funding for investing in their estates. So, for example, Cardiff University have had a bond rather than borrowing, which you draw down as you'respending. So, in the short term, the reserves of Cardiff will appear as though they have significant cash balances, but all of those are restricted for investment inthe estate and, over the next two or three years, will be utilised for that.Angela Burns AM: So, overall, you're painting a picture of a sector that's under asignificant degree of financial stress, and this is obviously using your key financial indicators. Do you monitor each and every university, or do you wait for themto come back and tell you what their situation is?Bethan Owen: We monitor, we receive forecasts, five-year forecasts, and we meet frequently with all ouruniversities now. It varies, depending on the risks of the universities, as to how frequently we meet, but we're actually meeting with every university becauseeven the forecast that we received last July, the changes, even in the 12-month period, are significant enough for us to need a better understanding of what thelatest position is. The forecasts, if I just run through—. We had a sector that, in 2017-18, had a deficit. Although it had a turnover and income of £1.5 billion,which had increased, nonetheless it had a small deficit of 0.4 per cent of income in 2017-18, which was an improvement on the deficit the year before of 1.7 percent, but notably, again, the sector in England were looking at surpluses of 3 per cent to 4 per cent in the same period. The forecasts that we had this time lastyear were indicating that, for 2018-19, we should have a sector that's roughly in a break-even position, but that has to be caveated with waiting for new forecastsin July, where there will have to be a reflection of the pension costs, and there have been significant changes in pension costs, both for the teachers' pensionscheme and the universities' superannuation scheme as well, and those will be significant costs that universities have to build into their forecasts at a time whentheir income, certainly their fee income, is not increasing, and that is the challenge.Angela Burns AM: Are we going to lose any universities in the next couple ofyears?Dr David Blaney: I don't think so. As I said earlier on, we're not seeing a crisis, we're seeing really challenging circumstances for institutions to manage. Atthe moment, our sense is they are managing them, so one of the things we try to do is to make sure that, insofar as we can see it, we are making sure that theinstitutions are alert to the challenges they're facing, and are actually engaging those challenges properly, and we are seeing that at the moment. So I think whatwe will see if the pressure continues unabated is more costs being taken out, so more jobs being lost, more capacity being lost, but that's not the same as fallingover. I don't see people falling over. There is always the possibility of structural change within the sector, and that might be one of the solutions that institutionsthink about, but it's not a policy position, and it's not always a good short-term response to crisis anyway, actually. But I think, as I say, we're in a managedsituation, but the challenges are quite acute. But I don't see an institution falling over in the foreseeable future.Angela Burns AM: When you talk about structuralchange, are you referring to the fact that certain offshoots or divisions might close? I bring this up because I'm the Assembly Member for Carmarthen West andSouth Pembrokeshire, and I have had multiple representations from students, and their parents, who are about to go to Lampeter and who've been told thatcourses are being restructured, there's a massive staff loss, and they have concerns about whether the three-year commitment they're about to make to a courseis going to be able to be sustained. So I am trying to drill down a little bit, because I think it's only fair for the students to know what they're up against, and alsoit's a bit like in the great depression—you can start a run on something, can't you? Because if enough people believe it, then suddenly enough people will stopgoing to what is an excellent little university, really top-quality in medieval literature, in archaeology. And I'm just talking about one, but I know there areproblems in other universities around Wales, so I just wondered if you could comment on that and also what processes you as HEFCW might have in place toprotect any student who does find themselves in a situation where their course appears to be disappearing before their eyes.Dr David Blaney: So, there's quite alot in that question, actually. Let me try not to forget any of the elements. First of all, your comment about causing a run is a serious consideration. So, if we look


Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: Okay .Marketing: {gap} .Project Manager: Right . Okay . Alright . Is everyone here ? {vocalsound}Marketing:{vocalsound} Yep . {vocalsound}User Interface: Yep .Project Manager: Okay . This is our conceptual design meeting . And {disfmarker} {vocalsound} I'll justtake a few minutes and uh go through the previous minutes . Um then each of you will have your presentation , um and then we will need to make a decision onthe concept for the remote control . And then we'll have uh forty minutes for finishing up . Um {disfmarker} {vocalsound} I'll go through the mee through theminutes first . Um , we just refreshed our our uh goal of making the finest remote control available .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager:{vocalsound} Um we decided that , or we know that we need to use company colours , company logo . Um {vocalsound} and our Marketing Expert uh gave ussome i uh information from interviews with a hundred different remote users . Um with some statistics that backed basically what we were thinking before .People thought their remotes were ugly , um um that remotes zap a lot . Um they only use uh a finite amount of buttons .Industrial Designer:{vocalsound}Project Manager: Um and that they often lose the {disfmarker} it's easy to lose a remote . Um which were all things we were thinking we would{disfmarker} wanna make it simple . Um {disfmarker} {vocalsound} And uh some sort of locator . Either a button or tracking device . Um {disfmarker} And thatit should look different than what's out there . Um {disfmarker} Kind of mixed mixed response on the speech recognition . The younger people said they wanted it, older people did not . Um uh I think we decided that um the expense was not necessarily worth it , and that it was probably a gimmick , that um wouldincreasingly wear on the consumers' nerves . Um {vocalsound} {disfmarker} Then the User Interface Designer um explored some of the technical functions ofthe remote . Um the simple versus the um the complex . The simple one being better for a user , the complex better for an engineer . Um {disfmarker} Um andsome personal preferences that were found in that would be that it should be a user-oriented remote , something simple . Um and that we didn't wanna go with auniversal remote , because uh increasing cost and increasing complexity . Um we would just have a T_V_ remote . Um and that we should also focus on theappearance of the remote . Have it s be something that looks different . And finally our um Industrial Designer uh gave us a rundown of how the remote will work. Um from energy source , um uh what we would use . Batteries because we don't wanna have a a cable . Um {disfmarker} {vocalsound} How that would powerthe remote and the lamp . If we were to to have one . Uh um the user interface then would connect to a chip , {vocalsound} which would work with the infraredcontrols uh to send the signal to the T_V_ . Um {disfmarker} I believe then we came up with a couple of ideas for what we think the design of the remote will be .Um {disfmarker} {vocalsound} Um something that will fit into uh easily into someone's hand . {vocalsound} And with a , just a few buttons . Just the basics .And with a scrolling um function also . Okay and I will leave that , leave it at that . So {disfmarker} Marketing ?Marketing: Okay .Project Manager: We'rewatching trends .Marketing: Yep . Can I have your cable please ?Project Manager: I suppose that you can have this .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing:Thanks . Okay so I was looking at trend-watching . Um unfortunately I wasn't given too much information . I was given a brief executive summary , and then anupdate on some recent fashion trends that we might like to look at . And then I'll just tell you some personal preferences that I got from that . Um okay the mostimportant finding was that the fancy look-and-feel seems to be twice as important to the users as the current functional look-and-feel design , which I think we'vekind of already discussed before . Um the second most important finding was that the remote should be technologically innovative . And again these are all thingswe've kind of already come up with on our own , but this just backs it up . And thirdly the remote would be easy to use . As far as fashion update , we've learnedthat fruits and vegetables will be the most important theme for cloths , shoes and furniture .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: So that might be a bitof a challenge to incorporate this into our remote , but we can try . Um and also , as opposed to last year , this year the material is expected to be spongy in feel .{vocalsound} Okay so from that um , as we've already said , we need to focus on a fancy look-and-feel . Um I think we've already discovered that it's kind ofhard to go away from the traditional rectangular design . But I think that , even if it's very subtle , we need to kind of trick our consumers , so they at least getthe idea that they're getting something that's new and modern and sleek and {disfmarker} Whether it's through the shape or the colours or all of that . Um fortechnologically innovative , we've talked about the tracking device . We brought up the idea of having two pieces , which we could discuss further . And Manuelhad suggested um the energy source and the user interface , discussing some of those , um that we could change a little bit . We need to keep it simple , havelimited buttons , which I think the two piece idea might be really beneficial for . {vocalsound} Um {vocalsound} we need to incorporate this fashion trend of fruitsand vegetables . I don't know , I mean I guess the two options are if we had our remote in the shape of a fruit or vegetable .Project Manager: {vocalsound} Abanana shape ?User Interface: Oh it was sort of banana shaped . {gap}Marketing: {vocalsound} Yeah . Yeah . Right . Or with exterior designs . But my questionis , I mean the stereotypically speaking , you kind of picture males with their remote controls , and I'm not sure how they'd feel about having fruity logos on theoutside .Project Manager: {vocalsound}Marketing: So maybe we could have something that's somewhat removable , or I don't know , different options for female, male target groups . And then the spongy feel . I guess we could look at mobile phones and other technology that's out there . C and look at different types ofmaterial that {vocalsound} might please our users who want spongy-feeling remote controls . So that's that .Project Manager: So possibly like a uh ,IndustrialDesigner: Alright .Marketing: {vocalsound}Project Manager: sorry , just to butt in for a second . Possibly uh like a cover like they have for mobile phones?Marketing: That's what I was thinking yeah .User Interface: Those like , yeah , sort of spongy ones .Project Manager: You have one with a flag , and one with abanana and one that's a spongyUser Interface: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound} {vocalsound} Yeah . So when you buy your remote you can buyProjectManager: feel to it . {vocalsound} You can {disfmarker}Marketing: various coverings .Project Manager: Mm various covers .User Interface: What's it called ? Custyou {disfmarker} {vocalsound} personalised , yeah .Marketing: Personalise your remote . {vocalsound}Project Manager: We could leave that to the coverdepartment . {vocalsound}User Interface: Yeah . {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound} Mm-hmm .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Project Manager:{vocalsound} {vocalsound} We all know they've got nothing to do all day .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}Marketing: {vocalsound}Industrial Designer:{vocalsound}User Interface: Okay . Why can't I see the {disfmarker} crazy . Um yeah I {disfmarker} talking about the interface concept and how the customerrelates to , will use the , consumer will use the actual device . Um so I've looked at some of the stuff I was sent , um , try and get some inspiration . But keep inmind that our own ideas that we had . Um I was sent some information from the company saying that they , the technology department have devised a newspeech recognition technology , where you can program questions into such devices . They gave an example of a coffee machine where you program a question ,you program the answer , and the machine responds accordingly . Um okay . There's different ways of a user can use products l like a remote . Um there's agraphical use , where you you look at pictures and well on a screen . A command line where you obviously type things in , and you get a response . Um and thenit ju that's just to point out the sort of inconsistent u sort of use of interface in remotes . You can't really see that picture well , but there's various differentremotes , once again with lots of different buttons on , making it more complicated .Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}User Interface: So , then I had a look atnew products that are on the market . Not necessarily remote controls but ones that you'll recognise . Um this is the voice , there is a voice recognition remotecontrol , which can control mus multiple devices . I have a {disfmarker} there is a picture {gap} . You surf your favourite channels uh with your voice . Store upto eighty speech samples , controls four devices , T_V_ , cable , satellite , V_C_R_ , D_V_D_ and audio . And you can record your own v verbal labels , that areconnected to remote control functions . So the technology is there . Um the one on the left is very similar to what we drew up on the board in the previousmeeting , where there {disfmarker} has scroll down functions on the side . You can sort of just make those out . And then on the right is obviously an iPod ,which is you know possibly one of the simplest things to use out there , and really is , and all that is is just a a nice big scroll menu that y you sort of go through .That is a {vocalsound} possibility . And nothing's simpler really . Um then there's things like this , which is a a a kid's remote , where the the parents have thefacility to control and program what children can watch before . So the remote control it o only allows them to access the channels that their parents want themto watch . And um it means that th children have a novelty of having their own remote control . So I don't know {gap} if there's a possibility of having oneremote contr you know like we just had two components , maybe it can have more components you know , different remotes . Um the point made at the endthere here is that you have to be sort of be {disfmarker} need to be clear on your um devices , as to what , you know , things you use . Sometimes an arrowpointing down , which may suggest volume down , could become confused just as a V_ for volume . Just little things like that , which would need to be made clearin the design . Um I think , d carrying on from what I've already said , a user friendly remote with minimum buttons . Maybe we've so suggested this two-partthing , where if it was to have a speech recognition thing , you could maybe control that on the {disfmarker} do it {disfmarker} or program all that on the controlbit . And then just have the simple sort of hand-held thing that we sort of devised earlier , as the actual remote . Um I don't {disfmarker} it could be a graphicaldisplay , the actual remote contr the actual control port maybe could have like an iPod where you just sort of control through the menus . Stuff like {gap} gets