Input: I'd like to bring this meeting to order today. We have a very full agenda. And so we are going to be, as the meeting today is a special meeting to deal with appointing some or interviewing for the appointment of judicial candidates for the district court. And they're all in the front row and they're all upright and looking good. So that's a good thing. So we'd like to start the meeting and then the clerk, would you please call the role? Thank you, Madam Chair. Councilmember Bell, Dutchie, Councilmember DEMBOSKY, Councilmember Dunn, Councilmember Gossett here. Councilmember Cole Wells. Councilmember McDermott. Councilmember up the Grove Councilmember. Line right here. Madam Chair. Here. Thank you. Thank you, Madam Chair. I mean, thank you. We have a personal privilege. But, Mr. Bond, right now, I would like to. First of all, I want my. First privilege. Madam Chair is thanking you for rearranging the process. I think you listen to the members who want to make sure we have an opportunity not only to follow standard questions, but might have individual questions for individual members. And I want to thank you for making that adjustment. You're most welcome. And you see these 19 pages of instructions. That's what the department gave me. So thank you. So and apparently another another piece of paper is coming down from more instructions. In addition, Madam Chair. Yes. Sir. I, for one, will probably not vote for an. Individual. Today, but hold my vote until Monday's meeting, because I want to digest what we have presented to us today and have a chance to do some questions with people who are on the referral list for some of the some of the candidates. So I, for one, will probably not vote for an individual today, but we'll hold off until Monday. Okay. And I think that will be a discussion during the executive session to see if people want to send all three motions out with out recommendations, which is legally available as an option, or if there's one or two that they would like to put the names in. And that will be the decision during the executive session. But thank you for letting us know your comments on that. Councilmember Gossett Thank you very much. Panel Chair I'm Pete. First comments about having a lot of flexibility to ask nonstandard questions. I say that we have about 7 to 9 minutes for that purpose, but I thought it was only supposed to be used for follow up questions. Can we be a little more flexible than follow up? Well, that's the legal thing coming downstairs. So basically, they would like you to follow the instructions on the email that came out three times and make sure by the email. Document, like the one from Jim. Now, this one, the one that came for me. Yeah, that one should be very aware of the bottoms, the do's and don'ts, and to try to make it as close to follow up questions as possible so that there's continuity, that all the all of the questions are fairly similar through the interview process. But of course, as means the questions already asked are based on things they've already said. Yes, that is correct. As long as they don't violate any of the do nots. And the bottom line is it. All right. Thank you. And there's 19 pages of instructions right here. So I don't think I've ever been so scripted for anything before. Maybe my wedding day. So I had no idea. So you brought lots of exciting in my life in the last four days. Okay, so before we start, since we don't have anybody here, I would like to take a moment of personal privilege also to talk to you about local government. I was at the local government meeting this morning and in Snoqualmie and I announced the land purchase that was announced yesterday. And the reaction was, why do you want to own more land? You already own over 60%. You know, take care of the noxious weeds. Our parks are closed. Takes us off the tax rolls. So I just wanted you to know that that meeting was also exciting this morning. All right. With that, we will begin our approval. Just a moment, please. Approval of the minutes we have the minutes of the March 30th, April 6th and April 25th that are before us. Who would like to make the motion on those. Thank you very much. The minutes are before us. All those in favor of the minutes as written. Please say I, I, those opposed. Nay, the minutes are approved as written. All right. Now we get to go into the process. Council members, before you you have a a sheet that may help you to keep track of all the different people that are going to be before us today. And across the top are some suggestions from the Bar Association of characteristics that make a good judge. So if you wanted to use those or any of that out to help you remember at the end, we hope that is helpful to you. All right. So I want to make sure I have those documents you just spoke about. Okay. Is that one of your. If that's the one. Yes. All right. So everybody so I'm going to start reading at our special meeting on April 25th, the committee selected seven final candidates to fill the vacancy in the Southwest Division and five for the two vacancies in the West Division. We are going to be interviewing those candidates this morning after the interviews. I expect the committee will go into executive session to discuss the candidates qualifications. After the executive session, we will come back into open session to decide what we want to do, whether we make some motions today or whether we wait till Monday. That will depend on what is discussed in the executive session. Each of the seven final candidates have been rated exceptionally well qualified by at least one the local bar associations that has a program for evaluating judicial candidates. Congratulations and all the hoops you guys have gone through to get here. It is amazing. I think that I thank the candidates for participating in the review process. This is how we are going to proceed with the interviews. We will interview one candidate at a time and like federal things going on to avoid giving the remaining candidates the unfair advantage of listening to the previous questions and answers, I will ask them to wait in the nearby room until their turn to be interviewed. And you will be with my staff member right there. He will make sure that you get to the right place at the right time, that is Ross. Well, all the candidates are still here. I want to describe the interview process. Each candidate will be given an opportunity to make an opening statement of up to 2 minutes. While the content of the opening statement is left up to your discretion. Then you will be asked a series of three standard questions. You'll have 3 minutes to answer each question. In the interest of fairness, the questions will be the same for all candidates during this election. Then, after that, council members will have time to ask follow up questions based on the answers provided by the candidates. After a candidate has answered the last question, the candidate will be allowed 2 minutes to make a closing statement to help the candidates keep within the time limits. There's a set of warning lights in front of me on the dais right here. The countdown timer will show the time remaining when 30 seconds are left, yellow light will go on. When time is up, the red light will go on. If you are in the middle of a word, you do not need to stop. Candidates should not feel obligated to use the full time that is allowed. So if you feel like you've made your point, you don't need to take all the time. When a candidate interviews over the candidate is welcome to remain in the council chamber. But you should also feel free to go and to return to your work. Attend to other business. Are there any. Questions from the candidates. Okay. We're going to interview the Southwest Division candidates first in alphabetical order by last name, which means we will start with Laura Gibson. So, Laura, if you'll just come on up here, our staff will now escort the other six candidates into the Blue Room. And he's going to be over in our executive session interview. These are open by law. These have to be open. The only thing that is closed is our discussion in executive session. Okay. When is it. Going to stop? I do not understand. Where do I think. We're going to go. Then? Now, when you tell on this stand up. Enough, as usual, as usual. She's not her. She's a lot of people who have admittedly been here more than 850 times. I'm asking you to leave the chambers now when I have ask you to leave the chambers. We are now going into recess again. Why don't. We'll come back to you after. Does he still want to be a judge? Okay. Do you want a little did. That scare you? That's okay. No. That was used to. That was going to be my question. Yeah, I. I deal with that on a regular basis. So you've heard nothing before? Oh, yeah. All right. For the listening audience, we have a group of three that comes, one of which has been here 850 times. By his own admission, I'm sure for me it feels like 850,000. But 800 times. 50 times who screams and yells, which is their constitutional right. However, we have important things to do today, and so I'm so thankful that was our scene to see how you handle stress. And you know, you did it very well. She was cool. She was very cool. So thank you. I'm hoping that won't be repeated during your testimony. Anyway, thank you for being with us today. And we'd like to give you one minute and I'm sorry, 2 minutes to do the opening introduction of telling us a little bit about yourself. Okay. Well, I hadn't prepared anything about myself in general, but I want to first thank you all for allowing me to be here. And your brain and my clothes. Sure. Is that. Is that better? Much better. Thank you. So you all know my name and you have my materials in front of you. I don't really want to necessarily reiterate that. But, you know, we're here today to decide who sits on the bench in our district court. And our district courts are, in my mind, very important to our communities. They are the courts that belong to the community and a judge that sits on the bench. The district court really needs to understand what the makeup is of his or her community, what their needs are met, their limitations are. So I've spent half my career as a public defender working with the indigent persons of King County. The other half of my career are spent determining benefits and matching people up with benefits for their disabilities and also to overcome poverty. I know my community very well. I've lived in South King County my whole life for the last 12 years. I've been actively involved in the public school system there. And I think that that familiarity and that knowledge of the demographics of my community would be very beneficial for someone sitting on the bench. I think it's a matter of knowing what are their obstacles as well as what are their needs. Thank you very much. And we asked them how you deal with stress. So our first question today will be asked by a council member. Sorry about duty. Thank you, Madam Chair. Good morning and welcome. Thank you for applying for this position. And the first question is, what is your vision for the future of our judicial system? What changes would you advocate for and why and will have to be? I think our judicial system and I'm going to focus this on the district courts, because it's it's different than superior court. The district courts, you know, are fully entrenched in their communities and they're designed to be very accessible. Attorney We don't necessarily have full accessibility, largely because of the demographic changes in our region. So King County in particular has had a huge influx of minority population. We now are taking on the largest population and poverty. Our court system hasn't really adjusted as well as it should. We don't have enough forms in different languages. We don't have that out in the community where people can access it. So as an administrative law judge, I go around to the different community support offices where I hold hearings and I'm familiar with the information that's on the walls. There's nothing about the courts, and the courts offer a lot of services to people. That's the place where they can establish rules between feuding parties. It's a place where they can go to address their concerns that perhaps they were financially exploited. It's a place where they can go for protection orders against an abusive spouse or other other person. And I think that many of our non-English speaker community members aren't aware that that services offered. So I would like to see more information put into the community in languages that are relevant to those particular language speaking areas so individuals can access it better. I'd like to see better automation in the sense that if we could get in to an electrical and electronic filing system and do so where there might be a hyperlink, so that when you're accessing the information that you need, you can actually click on something and it will pull up the information that you want. And the reason I like that is not because it necessarily helps the consumers, but it helps the judge to efficiently get information which allows him or her to spend more time personally with the consumers and with the persons that utilize that the courts. Thank you very much. Our second question will be asked by Councilmember Dombroski. Thank you, Madam Chair. I have the second prearranged question, and that is how does and should how does and should the District Court have an impact on racial disproportionality in the justice system? Racial disproportionality is a very difficult topic and in my mind I've not been able to resolve where the issue is, is is are we over legislating conduct? Are we making conduct criminal? It shouldn't be. Are we over enforcing our laws? Is the judicial branch failing to look at cases from a constitutional? I. I. When we met last, I had discussed my concern about the Ferguson, Missouri instance and in in that I find a good model of observation and that in that instance, the judge actually allowed close to 75% of the population to have warrants for their arrest . There's something wrong there. And I believe from the judicial perspective, the judge was somewhat complicit us in in the error. Whether or not it's exclusively a judicial problem, I don't think it is exclusively a judicial problem. I think it's a it's a larger problem. So what what role does the judicial branch play? Ultimately, judges are there to enforce the Constitution. That is the first source of law. And I think there are times when judges get bogged down with local influences. And in Ferguson, it was it was the need for money, quite frankly. They were using it as a revenue generating function. I think we need to remind ourselves as judges that we have individuals have civil rights. So it's not just the right of the community to be protected and safe, but it's also the rights of the individual to have their civil liberties acknowledged. So there there should be some form of a balance. I don't have the answer to how to eradicate disproportionality. I have a lot of questions and I'm very aware of it. Well, let me follow up then. What steps have you taken in the course of your professional career to learn more about this issue or to tackle it in your own professional way? One of the a couple of the cases that I cited as as cases that were significant to me involved just that issue. As a public defender, I would sometimes see different branches of the government that would seem seem to pull in members of our minority communities more often than are non minority members. And this includes the non-English speakers in particular. I saw it a lot with our Fish and Wildlife where, you know the rules and the regulations were only promulgated in English. And I don't know if any of you have ever looked at those Fish and Wildlife Manual have extremely difficult to understand. So they use a lot of geographic components, latitudes, longitudes and if you're not a native to this area, it's extremely difficult to understand that. So then to pile on a criminal penalty for that, what I was seeing is many, many non-English speakers that didn't intend to violate the law, never had a foul intent at all. We're now faced with charges of criminal law violations, and the efforts I took was to educate my bench. Thank you very. Much. Having read those, you're right. Even in English, they're tough to understand. Third question, council member, does it please? Thank you, Madam Chair. How long have you been doing interim presiding judge work? I've been a pro tem in District Court for just about two years. Two years? Okay. So I think this is a very relevant question for you. Our district court processes about 250,000 matters per year here in King County, and judges consistently manage very high volume our calendars. So the question is, how would you approach a calendar when you have the resolve at least to stay up with the amount of court cases assigned to you? You know, I am no more or less 50 cases oftentimes in 2 hours, while making sure that the people involved feel that justice is accruing to them. Can you do it? Have you done it? Is it realistic? And are you committed to being able to handle that? I answer yes to all of those. Yes, I am committed to it. And I think one of my advantages is having a very intimate knowledge of other benefits available. So I know what services are offered through the state government, through the federal government, state government in particular. I even know the eligibility. So when persons appear in front of me and they have particular needs, I can often advise them where they may go to address those particular needs. That is a quick thought process for me and I can go through it rather quickly. I don't believe that you sacrifice individual attention for purposes of expediency. Sometimes matters take a long time and sometimes people need to be heard. You know, when when you look at the law, oftentimes your analysis under the law is driven by the facts that are presented to you. If you don't fully hear the facts, your analysis is going to go awry. So I never believe in shortcutting the process, but I do believe in making sure that people are fully heard. And sometimes people know they're heard. When you give them a suggestion for how they can improve their situation, that is outside of the court arena. And you could handle that 50 cases in a couple hours. Maybe. Maybe not. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you very much. That completes our standard questions. And so now we have a few minutes for anybody that would like to ask a follow up question that came to their minds. That's a member. Yes, go ahead. I'm sure. Given your deep involvement with education, are you concerned about education, particularly K-12, in South King County? What do you think are some of the major problems that need to be addressed in our public school system today, as particularly as it relates to preparing young people for society? Because, again, I've often taken the position as a member of the Boys and Girls Club of South King County, that the investment we make at that level is a lot less than the investment we made later in the criminal justice system. I absolutely agree with that. I think that the the point in time that is most effective to resolve not only future racial tension is with our children to get them, you know, more engaged, more understanding, teach them tolerance, teach them some discipline. I know that our education system, at least in my school district, there has been an effort to hold kids accountable for their behavior. Also to not hand out trophies when trophies aren't, aren't, aren't worthy. So the expectations when they become adults are extremely high. And I think we do a disservice to our children when we don't prepare them for that. You don't go from being developed mentally prepared, because you turn from 17 to 18 in a day. That is a process that takes time. And I would like to see more encouragement of working directly with the kids to learn the discipline, not necessarily the academics, but the discipline of managing their time and putting forth a proper effort. I think that will teach them the reward of overcoming their obstacles. Thank you very much. Councilmember Balaji. Thank you. Reading your materials, you write about serving as a pro tem judge for going on almost about two years now. Can you just describe a little bit of how when you do that, how you run your courtroom, what's your process? How does that look from from the bench for you? Well, from my perspective, it's largely driven by the calendar, who is there? So ultimately you come in and you count out who is there, what matters are ready, and you identify the parties that can be heard to get your calendar moving right away. So you get it started. I spent a lot of time preparing my calendars, so I spend maybe two or. 3 hours. I just did a review calendar on Friday. I spent two and a half hours prepping that calendar because it was large. Review matters are very important to me. Review matters are the way that you impose consistency on people that otherwise lack an ability to be consistent. So I prepare the calendar that way. I know which ones need time, which ones don't need time, which can be resolved quickly and which can't. And I think that that's extremely necessary in the high, high volume court. And when Mr. Gosset asks, Can I handle 50 matters in two hour time period? That's how I would be able to handle 50 matters in a two hour time period. Thank you. Any other follow up questions? Councilmember Coble. Thank you, Madam Chair. Laurel is having been an administrative lead church and so understanding mainly with Department of Social Services. And is it correct that most of the litigants, too, are not represented? That's correct. So and how what's your view on that? And how have you been able to handle that, to make sure that there's adequate adequate due process? Well, it's interesting. The administrative law judges are under Article three of our Constitution. Article four is our judicial branch. So we are a part of the executive branch of government. Our guiding principles for due process come from the Administrative Procedures Act. And one of the caveats is that the administrative law judge assists in developing the record, meaning that I play an active role and ask a lot of questions. That's very different than my role when I sit on the bench where other parties present it, and I have to make my decision based on what is presented as an administrative law judge. I actively go out and ask questions of the appellant, and most of these individuals are there because they need services. Some of them are there because there's accusations of abuse or neglect. But a large majority of them need help. They need food assistance. They need cash, they need housing. And they many of them have organic limitations to their thought process. So it's difficult for them to know how to prioritize information. So I actually spend a great deal of time asking them the questions to get the information that I need to determine the right way to resolve the matter. Thank you for the time where you get to make a closing statement. I think your questions have been great. I the only closing I would say is, you know, I think I have a broad base of experience, but most importantly, I feel that I am engaged with my community and I value my community. I'm very proud of South King County. You know, in spite of all the obstacles, we have a really high homeownership rate. And so even though there's a lot of minority involvement, a lot of immigrants, and we have a lot of the poor population, we have this base, the stable base of persons that own homes are invested in their community. And that gives me faith and hope that we can help the others come along and maybe raise their standard of living, maybe fully integrate and in a in a better way. I hope that you find those qualities suitable for the bench. Thank you very much. It's been a pleasure meeting you and I look forward to seeing you again. And thank you for your willingness to serve as a district court judge. Thank you. Thank you. With that, we will call for a second person, and our second person will be Mr. Brian Todd. Welcome. Thank you for being with us today. When you do get seated, keep the microphone as close as possible. Thank you. So that way we can hear you. Thank you. It is disarming how close you have to have it. So and so when you're ready. If you'd like to make your opening statement. I would. Thank you, Councilmember Lambert. Our district courts are truly the people's courts. These are the smaller courts that deal with the issues, cases and constituents that have disputes that truly need to be understood by someone from those communities. And they need to be understood by someone that has served many of those communities before. This committee and this council have the unique opportunity to increase the diversity on the King County District Court bench by appointing a person to the open position in the Southwest District Court who has or who is a member of a minority community , who is active in serving minority communities from volunteering at El Centro de la Raza by providing legal consultations to clients in Spanish, volunteering for the Center for Multicultural Health, working with Deaf communities and working with many other minority and diverse communities in King County. And I am that person. I am a part of the gay community, and I am proud to have with me today my partner of six years, Ray Harris, along with my mother, who has been a support and has instilled the values and virtues that I have today have had in my legal profession and will carry through with me to the bench to respect all people, regardless of who they are, where they came from, or what they have been through. I have always and I will always continue to seek to give each and every person that I come in contact with, regardless of race, ethnicity, social status, gender or handicap. Full access to the courts. My commitment to the diverse communities in King County is demonstrated by the ratings that I received by three of the minority bar associations here in the county. The Latino Bar Association, CU Law and the Joint Asian Bar have rated me as qualified, well-qualified and exceptionally well qualified respectively to be appointed to this position in the King County District Court. This commitment and the ability to connect with the diverse constituents and litigants who come before the King County District Court are what makes me the ideal candidate to be appointed to this position. And with that, I look forward to your questions and the brief discussion that we may get to have this morning. Thank you. First question will be asked by a Councilmember McDermott and the second question by a council member. Cole Wells Thank you very much, Madam Chair. Mr.. Todd, we're really happy to have you with us this morning. What is your vision for the future of our judicial system and what changes would you advocate and why? Sure. We are at a critical point in the in our judicial system today, particularly in the King County District Court. One of the really important considerations to look at with the district court is that we want to open up the courts and allow everybody to have access to the courts. And we want them to be able to come in to the courts and continue to work with those. I say that the King County District Court is at a critical point right now because, for example, one of the ways that the district court is increasing the access to people and to clients that are coming before the court is the mediation program that is run in conjunction with the King County Dispute Resolution Center. The King County District Court has set up a pretrial hearing process where litigants can come in who have their small claims and they are able to able to mediate those claims. They're able to have that conversation, listen to each other, learn from each other, and perhaps link what they have and their concerns to come to a good resolution. So that's a very important point in working with our courts and changing our courts. One other court or even on a larger level, for example, we can look at the King County Superior Court understood that I am seeking the position of Southwest District Court Judge, but when you look at the ways that you can change the courts in the way that you can change the structure in the courts, you can look at, for example, what Judge Mack is doing on the Superior Court, where she is actually looking to engage in a process that allows for juvenile offenders to be committed to mental treatment as opposed to doing incarceration. Again, it's being able to serve those constituents, being able to understand where they come from and being able to work through what they need to do. So all of those things, the communities that I've worked with, the gay community, the minority communities, the deaf community, the Hispanic or Latino communities, all of them have different needs and different concerns. And I have worked with them and I would be able to give them the access to the justice in the King County District Court, and I would continue that process to open that access. I would be the ideal candidate to continue with the mediation program that's working in the King County. To be district court to allow the people to come in, mediate their disputes and have a different way to be able to deal with the problems and concerns that they are facing. And I would seek to do that. Thank you very much. Councilmember Coles. Thank you, Madam Chair. And Mr. Todd to you. How does and should the District Court have an impact on racial disproportionality in the justice system? Sure. Racial disproportionality in the justice system is a problem that we have seen and we continue to see through all of the processes that we have. It happens in the work that I do in Superior Court, working with felonies. Many of the clients that I serve, I serve through as a public a contract, public defender. And so I've seen the steps that many people take from the juvenile system to the adult system, and that that disproportionality then becomes even greater. One of the greatest ways that you can work to address the disproportionality in the criminal justice system, even in district court and in superior court, is by working through the restorative justice. I am trained through the federal public defender in defense victim outreach, which of course is based in restorative justice principles where you can still be bought and the responsibility and those clients that come before you and they're able to see that the impact, the choices that they make have impacts. The other thing that's really important when you look at the disproportionality in race or in in our criminal justice system, is you also have to go back and realize that there are needs and there are concerns being on the district court judge. As I said, the district court is the People's Court. It is a smaller court. You have the opportunity to listen to the litigants that come before you. When you listen to them, you can learn about them. You can learn about what brings them here and what they need to do to move forward. And then you can link those needs and those concerns with the services that, for example, as a judge, you can certainly make recommendations to the probation department to address some of the concerns, whether they are mental health concerns that need to be addressed, whether they are drug addiction, concerns that need to be addressed or whatever it is. Being in the unique position of being in the district court, the smaller court, you have the greater impact to be able to do that. Having worked with all of those communities and I've gone to the homes of my clients, I've talked to their families. I listened to some of the concerns that they have, some of the issues that they have dealt with from the time that they have been raised. And it's linking those. It's listening to those. It's learning from them and then linking the services that you're able to provide as a district court judge and make strong recommendations to be able to follow through with that and to be able to ensure that they are able to succeed. Because really that's the goal in the end is for success and reducing the number of the disproportionality the minority population. Thank you very much. And the last question of this round will be by council member Yvonne. Right about it. Thank you, Madam Chair. District court processes around 250,000 cases per year and judges consistently manage high volume calendars. How would you approach a calendar when you have to resolve 50 cases in 2 hours by making sure that the people involved feel that justice has been done? Certainly. And to answer the councilmembers question, the large volume of calendars is one thing that is very unique to the King County District Court. When we look at that, as the council member mentioned, that the district courts do process a large number of cases that are going through there. And so when you consider the way to process cases, there would actually be a breakdown, I think, between the difference between civil cases that would be between before the King County District Court and the criminal cases that are before the King County District Court. One way that you can encourage the processing of the large number of civil cases is by encouraging the parties to mediate and continuing that partnership with the King County Dispute Resolution Center. I am a trained mediator. I'm a professional mediator that has been trained and has gone through the practicum of the King County Dispute Resolution Center. And I've mediated cases in the King County District Court. I've mediated cases where in Judge Christie's court judge, it's court judge, step instance court, as well as many of the other judges in Seattle and Issaquah, Auburn and Shoreline. And by encouraging the parties to do mediation in a civil context, that's the best way to to work through that that system. The. Is that where they're able to resolve their own disputes? It's better for everybody involved. They can come to that win win situation by listening to concerns, coming up with the issues that need to be done and finding out and finding the best way to resolve those issues. Now, Councilmember, on the other side, the criminal side. Certainly there are other considerations that have to be remembered when you're dealing with criminal clients. The first thing is, is that criminal clients have specific constitutional rights that have to be upheld. You can't cut corners in a criminal context. You certainly can't and would not cut corners in a civil context. And I'm not saying that either in a criminal context, the the defendants that are before the court have those constitutional rights that as a judge, you have the obligation to uphold and make sure that those are followed through with. Certainly, they have counsel and it would be up to counsel to ensure that they follow through with those rights. The other thing you have to remember with a criminal case is that you have two sides, the state as well as the defense. You need to make sure and ensure that each side has the right to a fair trial, has a fair trial, and again, does have that access to the justice. So being able to work through that number of cases, you would certainly have to be efficient. You would have to make sure that all the parties that come before you are ready to go, that they've talked with counsel and they know what they're going to do with their hearing that day. But at the same time, Councilmember, if the time needs to be taken, certainly in the district court would be the place to take that, because that is the People's Court to take the time to be able to make those connections with people and work through those case loads. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you very much. That is the end of the three set questions. So now open it up for council members to ask the pertinent questions to your qualifications. Councilmember Garcia Thank you and thank you, Madam Chair. I would like to ask a follow up question related to our question about racial disproportionality to. Mr. Todd. Mr.. TODD There's a professor at the University of Washington named Dr. Katherine Beckett who did a study on the out of with the Seattle police. 1999 to 2004, where she found that 68% of all the people then went to state prison for drug possession and distribution. At the felony level from Seattle were African-Americans during that whole five year period. And she further found through national, state and other independent study that estimated the population of illicit drug users, NCR were about 74% white . The Socialist Alliance and the Socialist Workers Party would say that that problem exists because of capitalism and racism. You agree or disagree? Why? Sure. The clients that I worked with through my work as both a private criminal defense attorney as well as through a public defender, has shown exactly what Councilmember Gossett has indicated that so many of the clients that come through the system are the minority and therefore they're the ones that end up in the prison population. And I would agree with that. Even The Huffington Post back in 2011 did an article which indicates that the reason why so many black people are in prison go well beyond profiling. So they identified not only the issue of profiling as one of the reasons that we end up with so many minority clients, but also just the institutional racism that is there. I would agree with that. The one way that I think that has been really good in King County in being able to deal with some of that at least, is the alternatives that we give to have drug treatment. Like I indicated in my comments earlier, so many of the problems that we run into are dealing with drug use. But as a councilmember points out, the largest percentage of illicit drug users are white. And it's not the minorities that are the largest percentage, but they are certainly the ones that become contacted and they are the ones that become the clients or those of us who do criminal defense. And then many times they end up in prison. The best way to address that or not? Excuse me? Not the best way. One of the ways to address that is through the alternatives. We have a great drug court here in King County. That is one of the things that certainly at this point we know. Judge Carey, is there a drug court judge here in Seattle? Judge Casey is the drug court judge down in Kent. They've done a fantastic job in being able to address some of those concerns and being able to address some of the addiction issues to try to decrease the number of minority populations that end up incarcerated or end up in prison and is continuing to listen to those clients, is continuing to learn from them. And when you listen to them, you learn from them. Then you can link up the services that might need to be done. Councilmember. Unfortunately, some of those situations are maybe somewhat outside of the control of a district court judge. You know, they were certainly institutional problems that, you know, we have seen run through. Unfortunately, here in King County and particularly in the city of Seattle, the racial profiling and the abuse of force that the Seattle Police Department uses. And some of those may be out of the purview of the district court. But certainly as a district court judge, you know, we have the ability and we have the you know, we have the ability to say something. You know, we have the ability to address that at the lower level, at the district court level, to try to ensure that there is a decrease in the number of minority populations in prison. Thank you. Perfect timing. Our last follow up question will be from Councilmember Bell. Thank you. Thank you very much for coming in. I appreciate hearing about your experience with clients and the public and different community groups. I noticed in your materials, though, that you haven't served as a pro tem judge before. So maybe could you talk a little bit about how what would be your process for running a calendar or learning to run a calendar? I mean, how would you what would be the nuts and bolts of how you would go about doing the job if selected? Certainly. And and I understand, you know, that there is a concern about not having pro talent in the past. But the one thing that I can say is we all come to this point on seeking a bench by coming through different paths. Those of us that have gone to law school, we take different paths. We have different majors to go to law school. Those of us that are here seeking to be appointed by this committee and this council to judge arrive at different paths. Some people choose to pro tem and do that, but what I've chosen to do is I've chosen to continue to practice to make those connections with all of the populations that I've been working with. And so, Councilmember, the question in particular was how to get through the nuts and bolts of running a calendar. I've appeared before the King County District Court on criminal cases. I've seen the way that they run the calendar with criminal cases I have appeared in and I have worked with Judge Christi, Judge Heidi, Judge Steffensen in the Southwest District, as well as many of our other district court judges on the small claims calendar. And so knowing how they run those calendars. I've spoken with court staff in how to get those calendars in and get them up and going. Certainly I've worked in the anti-harassment area at the King County District Court to deal with the traffic infractions that the King County District Courts deal with as many as well as many of the other areas. I'm a quick learner. I always have been, and I am confident that when I were to go in there, I would have no problems stepping. Right. And and being able to do that. We rely a lot of times on our staff. I know this committee in this council may rely on their staff for help at times, and that's certainly something that a new judge would do. And that's certainly something that somebody that has programed and worked as a judge for a long time does is they rely on their staff. They rely on the people to be able to do that. I'm confident that, given my experiences in King County District Court, both mediating through King County District Court, as well as appearing in King County District Court, conducting trials before Judge Williams down at the King County District Court, that I would be able to step into that role . And I would hope that this committee and this council would feel confident that I would be able to do that and make that transition seamlessly. Certainly. So, thank you. And that has come to the time for you to do your follow up and your closing statement. All right. Thank you. Thank you, Councilmember, and thank you to the committee as well as to the council for the opportunity today. I'm extraordinarily humbled today to be here before this committee as a finalist for the position of judge in the Southwest District Court. And I brought with Bright to you today over six years of experience in criminal, family, civil and mediation experience as well as experience practicing in King County District Court as a leader, litigator and as a mediator, ready to step into the position with the commitment that this committee and this council demands of all of their appointees. I've been humbled throughout this process with the support that I've received from members of the Superior Court bench, court staff members, and a member of the Washington Supreme Court, along with my mediation colleagues, fellow attorneys and Mayor Jim Farrell of Federal Way. My recent practice, my recent practice in many of the areas of district courts gives me the confidence to be able to step into and immediately fill the position on the Southwest District Court bench and serve all of the constituents of the Southwest District, as well as certainly all the constituents of King County as well. If this committee and this council were to appoint me, I would be the new voice on the court that would create and increase the diversity on the King County Court bench. I'm a member of the minority community and I am actively serving and volunteering with minority communities and King County and will continue to do so to ensure that they can have that access to justice. The King County District Court is truly the People's Court and it should look like our community. I recently mediated the small claims calendars which as Christy, Judge Eddy, just Steffensen and having cooperated with them in those courts, I'm sure that they would welcome me to their court in the Southwest District. Now is an important and exciting time in the change of progress for King County District Court. It is a leader in many of the areas involving public safety, access to justice, and I am the one candidate that can continue that commitment to diversity, access to justice, and bring an understanding to the connect with those communities in King County. Excellent. Thank you so much. It's a pleasure to see you again. Yes, thank you as well. So, as I mentioned earlier, you're welcome to stay or you can feel free to leave and relax. Thank you. Thank you. Now turn to the. That was the final candidate for the South Division. So now we're going to turn to the candidates for the West division. And again, we're going to have those in alphabetical order by last name. So our first candidate is Greg here, Koa. And welcome, Greg. It's good to have you here. And please go ahead with your opening statement. Good morning, Madam Chair. Good morning, members of the Council. It certainly is an honor and a privilege to be here before you this morning. I know you do want to ask questions. I'll just make a brief statement to open. You have all my material before you. I'm sure you have everybody's binder there. I would just like to highlight a couple of things. I would like to think that the material shows somebody who is competent, able to do this job. I'm very proud of my judicial evaluations. Those, as you know, are reviews based on interviews with my peers, with judges that I've appeared before, with people I've practice with and practiced against. And so I was very pleased to see how my colleagues and fellow lawyers and judicial officers view me. And I also want to point out that I do serve currently regularly for the King County Court, District Court Judge Pro Tempore. I enjoy that. And I like to think that if it could not be their job, they wouldn't keep asking me back. And so I'm very pleased to provide service to King County in that respect. I believe that my material also shows somebody who's collegial, somebody who can get along with a lot of people, with opposing counsel, with people that I've worked with in the legal and non-legal settings, people in the public as I worked on many public commissions , taking testimony from of citizens of King County, commenting on on issues. And I think my material shows that I am somebody who can respect other views and other opinions. And lastly, I like to think my material shows a commitment to King County. I've served on numerous commissions looking at very complex matters for the governance of King County, as well as for the city of Seattle, and have done so for many years. And so with that, I'd be happy to take your questions. Excellent. Thank you very much. Your first question today will come from Councilmember Balducci. Thank you. And thank you for being here with us today. Really appreciate your interest in this position. The first question is, what is your vision for the future of our judicial system? What changes would you advocate and why? I would like to see a judicial system that works to really address the issues that are before the people in the most efficient way. Possible. I think we have some challenges with regards to its operations. There's a lot of overlap and redundancy and I think that some of that's good. But I also think that it's possible to streamline or at least consolidate the some of the jurisdictional issues from a strategic standpoint. I also would like to see a system that really takes into account objective evidence or objective material when making decisions with regards to, for example, certain criminal matters. We hear a lot of opinions with regard to sentencing, with regards to pretrial conditions of release. And they're really opinions from from people who work in the system, law enforcement officers, probation officers and so forth. And they're valuable, certainly. But, you know, whether they have any, you know, scientific basis for that, I'm not so certain. And as a judge, I as a judge pro tempore, when I look at these things, I try to look at the objective evidence before me, the past record, past history, the dockets and those types of things. And so we're really looking at, you know, what risk are we taking when we make these decisions? And I would like to see something that has a more objective scientific basis for, you know, risk assessment basis for it. And I think that's important not just for the purposes of sentencing or pretrial conditions of release, but for the people of King County. You know, they need to know that there is the appropriate sentence or restrictions on somebody based on at least some objective science and some objective evidence and not just gut feeling. Thank you. Thank you, Councilmember. Thank you, Madam Chair. Dombroski the other councilmember with vowels. Yes. Greg, great to see you. Thanks for being here. I have the second canned question, if you will, and that is this. It's not and not to diminish it. It's a very important question that all members are interested in hearing. How does and should how does and should the district court have an impact on racial disproportionality in the justice system? That issue is is probably is an answer that's probably longer than 3 minutes. But I'll try. And there is no doubt about that. I'll do my best. And I do have quite a bit of experience in this based on not just as a pro tem judge, but also as a defense lawyer and as a prosecutor and quite frankly, as as a civil practitioner who handles a lot of cases involving the vulnerable population. By the time somebody gets to us in the court system, a number of decisions have already been made. Now we have no control over why is a person stopped? Is that based on a standard contact with the police officer or is there an emphasis in a particular area? What is the basis for that emphasis of patrol? What is the basis for the stop? What is the basis for the arrest? Why were they arrested as opposed to released? And if they are booked, why weren't they administratively released as opposed to coming before the judge on a bail hearing? That's only then do we get an opportunity to look at at the person in the in the criminal justice system. I think one thing that to get to get to your answer, one thing that is consistent with the nonwhite population, we said I've seen it tends to also run consistent with economic data in King County. There's no question that the census data shows that African-Americans make about 40, 45% of what a white King County's residents are making, Latino and Hispanics, about 60 to 65%. And I raised that because one of the biggest issues with regard to who is in our criminal justice system is based a lot upon economics, whether somebody is going to be able to make bail, whether somebody is going to be able to be released pretrial. And I think that makes a difference because of if somebody is out or somebody is able to work with their defense lawyer, they have a better chance of getting to a pretrial diversion program or not getting part in getting involved in the system. Because once you're in the system, you're in the system for at least two years following conviction. And so one of the things that I think the court can look at is the criteria for imposing bail or bond. And one of those is where you, you know, is that person likely to appear in court again. Well, so many people, white, nonwhite, with low incomes, have unstable housing, which means that's not likely to show up in court. They may be they may have mental health issues. They may come from a dysfunctional family. And so there's a housing situation. It's unstable. They may not get summons and notices, and so they don't show up. And so now that becomes a basis for incarceration or at least a bail hearing. Every judge is different. But I think I think that's something that the court can look at and probably should look at a little differently with regards to how that person is treated pretrial. And I think that will make a big difference in what happens in the rest of the case. Thank you. Our next question will come from Councilmember McDermott. Thank you, Madam Chair. Thank you for joining us today. District court processes around 250,000 cases per year and judges consistently manage high volume calendars. How do you approach a calendar where you have to resolve 50 cases in 2 hours? Well, making sure that the people involved feel the justice has been done. Fortunately, that's something that I have a lot of experience in. I do serve on the court. I say regularly. I was there yesterday on a pretrial calendar. I'll be there again on Friday. The biggest thing that I do is look ahead and try to read the pleadings and read the dockets ahead of time or read the calendars ahead of time. Make certain that I'm up to speed on a lot of the issues that are before the court at that time. One of the things that I think is important, though, is to make certain that there is a record of decisions or rulings that are made. And I if anything, I always try to make that record to make certain that a defendant before me knows the reason for my decision. I think there's some some letters in the material that indicate people who have been before me, who are observing me on the bench knows that that's what I do. I try to show the facts that I find significant and apply those facts to the law at that time. I think the biggest thing that people have to understand about district court is the volume, but also that I think people have to know that they have a have a good experience in the court system because we don't have any legitimacy if we if a person doesn't believe that we actually listened to their case. And so I want to make certain and I do make certain I think that somebody understands that decisions that I make and the basis for the. But to to to to manage the case. It's being prepared. It just means getting there. Early review, reviewing the calendar, reviewing the motions, reading everything. And that's worked fairly successfully so far. I don't think I've had to continue many matters and it's resolved the calendars before I could say again, well, you know, one of the things that we have to do is move the calendar for that very reason you've expressed. And if we don't do that, if we as judge programs don't do that, we're not going to be asked back. And that's as simple as that. Thank you. That is the staged questions. So now you're into the follow up questions on topics. So Councilmember Caldwell's and followed by Councilmember Garcia. Thank you, Madam Chair, and thank you for being with us today. I'm asking a question related to your experience as an administrative law judge in which I understand that the appellants who have come before you are under or unrepresented in most cases. So how do you handle that to ensure that there's an outcome that would be positive, but that would not provide the opportunity for people to have representation? Are you referring to at the administrative level or in district court? And I said, in your experience and as an administrative law. Judge at the minute, as dealing with administrative matters or civil matters, and so no one gets there's no right to counsel. But these are generally complex in the case of, for example, civil service rules. These are extremely complex issues with a lot of procedural timing issues. And so oftentimes employees would come aggrieved, employees would come on appeal. Before me and my colleagues. The thing that we always want to make certain and I directed the executive director of the of the Civil Service Commission at that time, and I'm sure they still do. This is to make certain that they understand the procedural rules ahead of time. So when they come before us to understand the timing, the deadlines, the the things that they can present or should be able to present, and what the commission would be interested in hearing, in knowing that they can present anything they want. But this is generally the things that we want to look at, whether they're declarations or witnesses or, you know, timesheets and those types of things. And we go on employment matters once they once they have that done at the administrative level when they're before us. The first thing that if I was presenting and making sure that are comfortable, making sure that they understand the proceedings, what's going to happen that day and if there are any questions and there's no prejudice to any other party that if they had to if they wanted to take a short break or a short continuance and the other party didn't object because now they're in court for the first time. Now, the record, this panel, for the first time in like district court administrative proceedings may be the person's only experience before a panel or tribunal. And so it is it's naturally uncomfortable for them. And they're in a world that they've never been in before. And I understand I understand that. And so there's no prejudice still in the party, and they need more time to prepare than we would. And I would at least and, you know, ask my colleagues to grant them a short continuing to break. I mean, most attorneys would do that when they come to court anyway if they need time to prepare. And so I don't see why they shouldn't afford somebody who's pro se the same reason. Once we get that, though, I try to have to have as much latitude as I can to allow them to argue their case, to present their facts. They may not, you know, I may not rule in their favor, but I want to make sure that they understand that they're going to have their day in court and are allowed to present the evidence that they think they want to present. And, you know, we'll see, you know, how it goes from there. But the thing that I want to make sure is that they have the opportunity to be in court, to argue their case as they see fit, often knowing that there is another party, that that person's due process rights have to be respected as well. But if they can work it out together and, you know, agree on what facts we're going to hear, then that's even better. But that my approach to administrative clearance. Thank you very much. Councilmember Gossett. Thank you, Madam Chair. I'd like to delve, Greg a little deeper into the issue of racial disproportionality in our criminal justice system, if I may, and I want to join my colleagues. Thank you for being willing to apply to work. And I do so in our court system at the district court level. It is the hypothetical. I read an article about 2000. Five where this gala, this last politician went to speak in England. Three or 400 are criminal justice officials in England. And he told them that there are more African-American men in prison in the U.S. for one crime than there are people for every crime imaginable in the entire EU, Europe, European Union. He told them that and he told them that. And in 2005, there was an estimated 323,000 people in all the jails of the members of the European Union, collectively for every crime imaginable. But in the U.S. there 360, 65,000 black men in jail for possessing drugs or selling drugs. And in the United States and that the E.U. population was 440 million, and then the black population in the U.S. was 40 million. On and on. So the both the Socialist Alliance and the Socialist Workers Party said it's against the absolute root cause of that problem is capitalism and institutional racism. Do you agree with those two organizations? Disagree? Well, I. I would disagree with that assertion, but I do understand the concern. I think there is. And there can be implicit bias in the system. Are you talking about just the court system or the entire criminal character, part of the entire criminal justice system? I believe there is racism within it. I don't I don't doubt that. I've been stuck on Queen in while carrying a basketball, but for no other reason than somebody looked like me that they were looking for. So I do believe that happens within the court system. I think we do have an obligation to consider those issues, I think. But I'm also cognizant there's another side once they get to the court system. There's a there's a prosecutor there. And the state has rights, just like the defense counsel has. And I like to think that the court can try and balance those issues and those rights. But the one thing that I'm I'm very aware of, and I think everybody in the council are the the the bench is aware of is implicit bias within the system. And I think one of those issues are housing issues, income issues. And that disproportionately does affect people of color. I'm 100% agree with you on that. You know, whether it's based on capitalism or other types of thing, I'm not I probably I, I don't think so. But I do believe that there is implicit bias based on income. And income disproportionately affects people of color. How to address it. I think we have to be smarter about looking at how we apply the rules and our standards. And I will say this I practice in other jurisdictions, other counties and other municipalities. I think King County does a pretty good job of King County as a whole. There's a pretty good job of looking at some of these issues much better than other counties, which I've been before. There are a lot of people, a lot of times when I've represented individuals, first time offenders, first time offenders from a minority population who don't get released for a nonviolent offense, they have to make bail 5000 kilometers. Wrap this up because you're going to go over time. I'm sorry. So thank you very much. We now have time for you to do your closing statement. Well, I will. You know, I think my materials before me, I really don't want to spend too much time belaboring. I do want to answer Councilmember Gazette's questions. I'll use my balance of time for that. I think that when we look at these issues, we do have to take a look at the whole person and not just the charge, not just the crime, and not just the court rules that we're administering because we have really things that we're bound by as on the bench. But we can we can look at social situations and use that as a barometer in addition to our our basic court rules. Because I think that's important when we address this issue of implicit bias, particularly with regard to income distribution and income disparities. That's that is you know, I think one of the single biggest reasons when we look at people being incarcerated is that because they can't afford a lawyer and they'll just plead to get out. That's it. So all they do is they that they can't make bail. They plead to get out. Now they have a criminal record. Don't they have a strike against them? And there's been no rehabilitation, no training, no education. They're just out because they pleaded to get out because they couldn't make bail, because they had unstable housing, because they had no income. I mean, that is rampant in the district court system. And I would like to think that we can fix that a little bit as a court. But a lot of these other issues are, quite frankly, on your side of the dais education, training, rehabilitation, that's expensive. That costs money. I recognize that, and I'm willing to work with you on that. I've always been willing to work with people on that, but I think that's the best way I can answer your question. It's an incredibly complex question, and it's my answer, and I'll use my balance of time for that. With that, I have 19 seconds or 15 seconds left. I want to say it's been a pleasure and honor to be here. I'm proud of the material that's before you. I'm proud of the people, the support, the people that are supporting me and look forward to your decision. Thank you very much. And thank you for both interviews. We appreciate it. Thank you. So you can either choose to state or you can go home and relax, whichever you prefer. Thank you. Our next candidate for the West Division is Mary Lynch. Welcome, Mary. Well, you get seated in that one right there and be aware that the microphone needs to be really close to your mouth. Uncomfortably close to your mouth. Actually, yeah, like that. Most people don't realize that to be that close. So as soon as you're ready, please go ahead and give us your opening statement. All right. Well, thank you. Good morning again, everybody. My name is Mary Lynch. And as you know, I'm here seeking appointment to the West Division of King County District Court. I'd like to just take this opportunity to tell you a little bit about myself. You have my materials, so I'm sure that you're fairly well versed in my professional experience. But I was a prosecutor for 20 years in the Seattle City Attorney's Office, and in that capacity I did actually all kinds of criminal cases. My specialties were domestic violence, DUI law. I spent five years in the appellate division, and I also served in the specialty courts of Seattle Municipal Court. In in being in these therapeutic and restorative courts, I was able to address the specific issues that really brought people to court in Seattle. I'm sure you all know that those issues are basically homelessness, drug and alcohol addiction and mental illness. This has served me well after I left the city attorney's office because having worked in these specialty courts, I had served a niche and I was able to also work in Superior Court as a judge on the involuntary treatment calendar . For the last six years, really mostly for the last four and a half years, I've served full time as a pro tem judge in Superior Court, District Court and also most of the municipal courts in King County. My experience as a prosecutor made the transition very easy, and in the second half of my legal career, I found something that I really loved doing. The criminal justice system is moving towards a specialty court model. Having served in these types of courts as both a prosecutor and a judge, I know that they can be implemented in district court to a greater extent than they already are. And I also know that they work. Given my work in these courts, in addition to my vast experience as a prosecutor and a pro tem judge, I believe that I am uniquely qualified for this appointment. So thank you. Thank you very much. Our first question will be asked you from Councilmember Garcia, followed by Councilmember Wells. Good morning and thank you, Madam Chair, and thank you for being willing to be a candidate for these very, very important positions to our government. And this is also my second opportunity to interview you. So I'm grateful for having this chance. But the first question we'd like to ask you is about your outlook. So what is your vision for the future of our judicial system and what changes? If you had the magic wand, would you advocate for and why? Well, I think, as I indicated in my opening statement, I think the specialty court system is the way the criminal justice system is going, because the criminal justice system and prisons and jails are overcrowded. And we simply cannot lock up people continuously when we can address the issues that are bringing them to court in the first place . I think as we discussed a couple of weeks ago when we met the King County Jail is the largest mental hospital in the state. Yes. And mentally ill people, especially people who are low risk of being threats to public safety, should not be locked up in jail, where they're not getting the addressing the needs that are bringing them to court. A lot of times they are not getting their medications in jail. They're dealing there are vulnerable people. The mentally ill can be very vulnerable and prisons and the jails are not the places to house them. If it were up to me, I would have another holding facility for people who have the mentally ill mental illnesses and not put them in jails. We used to have a facility, the North Rehab Center up in North Seattle, where you would put people who would be incarcerated due to the it's mostly DUI people. You wouldn't put them in the jail because they were not really risk to public safety except when they were obviously under the. Influence of alcohol. Then you wouldn't want them. In a car. But I do believe that the restorative courts, mental health court, veterans court, community court, which I worked in, in the Seattle City Attorney's Office, is really exceptional because it's not necessarily limited to people who are mentally ill. It addresses the social issues that bring them to courts, their drug addictions, their alcohol addictions, their homelessness, which we all know is a huge problem in Seattle. It gets them puts them into. Contact with services for them. They do things such as they are taken to the library and they're given tours of the libraries so they understand the resources that the public library can give them in finding jobs. They are expected to do community service, so they're giving back to the community from which they took. And that's a very successful court. It's the one court that I've been in when we have a graduation and one woman told me I had her graduation. She had never succeeded in anything in her life. That was the first time she had succeeded at anything. And everybody who goes through that court, even if they don't succeed, they always think the court for the opportunities for the people who are in the program who are not necessarily successful, they see the benefit to people and it works. It's district court doesn't currently have anything like that, and that is something that I would like to bring to District Court. One of the things that would be my goal as a judge is to get the mentally ill people out of the King County Jail. Thank you. You're welcome. Thank you very much. So question number two, Councilmember Caldwell's. Thank you, Madam Chair, and thank you for being here. Thank you for having me. My question is to you, how does and should the district court have an impact on racial disproportionality in the justice system? Well, that's an interesting question, because as a judge, you can't just say, well, I'm not going to put you in jail because you're a person of color and it's unfair to you. That has to be done more at the street level. But as a district court judge, you can educate people to the issues of racial disparity in the court, in the court system and in the jails and prisons. I think it's a tragedy that there is that racial disparity. I think that there I think it was exacerbated actually by something that occurred that was supposed to have good intentions. And that was the 1994 crime bill where they added police officers and everybody thought, that's great public safety. They increased the prison budgets and everybody thought great public safety. But one of the things that they took away was the ability of somebody who was incarcerated to get an education. And when you have literally a captive audience in prison, why would you want to take the one thing away from them that would be a benefit once they're out of prison? And so to a as in the district courts, you can address the issue of racial disparity only to a certain extent because you're not out on the streets arresting people, but you can identify offenders who are not a risk to public safety. And as I said before, community courts, the specialty courts. I would like to see a mentoring the court because people you don't stop having mentors when you turn 18 and the juvenile justice system, they do have programs that provide mentors to the kids who are in that program. But when they go to adult court, a lot of times people are just lost. They're not necessarily bad people. They're in court for a variety of reasons because maybe they have an alcohol or drug issue. But a lot of times people are just sort of irresponsible. They've never had anybody that they can really look up to. And one of the things as a judge that I hear a lot and I know we discussed this before, was when I'm sentencing somebody and I see the guy in front of me, is there anything that you'd like to say? And he tells me, and one of the things that I hear over and over and over is I just want to be a good dad. I really want to be a good dad. And I tell them, Well, the best way you can be a good dad is by being a good dad. But sometimes you have to learn how to do that and they don't have that. And if we had sort of a court that could be set up to provide people with the opportunity to find somebody. I've told people before, you might have had a fourth grade teacher that you really enjoyed. They really, you know, struck you find that person and ask how to be like them. Thank you. Council member Well, did you? Question number three. Very good. Thank you very much for being here and for your interest in serving. Thank you. The question is, district court processes around 250,000 cases per year and judges consistently manage high volume calendars. How would you approach a calendar when you have to resolve 50 cases in 2 hours while making sure that the people involved feel that justice has been done? Well, I was lucky enough to spend my career in Seattle Municipal Court, which is the busiest court in the state. And as the prosecutor, you're kind of in charge of moving the cases through. I've also worked as a judge in Seattle Municipal Court, which is the busiest court in the state. I worked as a judge in a city a federal way, which is a very busy court. And I worked in King County District Court. So clearly I have a lot of experience moving things along. And I'm I'm pretty efficient on the bench. I don't if people are repeating things over and over, I told them I don't need to hear it again, so just move on. You have to allocate time properly. You can't just let people do whatever they want. You have to continuously move the lawyers along because sometimes they're out inside the courtroom talking to their clients and their cases need to be done. I tell people early in the calendar that we're not going to go past noon because it's not fair to the clerks, the court staff to do that because then they lose out on their lunch hour. And I think that there's ways that concurrently are established that actually make the court pretty efficient. The electronic court records, which most courts in King County now are using, they it makes things go faster. We have online forms now so the attorneys can come to court with the forms of plea form or whatever kind of form filled out before they come into court. I know that used to really slow things down because they come into court and they're looking for the forms, you know, the day when they're supposed to be prepared before they come to court. I would like to see a system where you could apply for a public defender online rather than come to court. And then the court says, well, you have to screen for a public defender, so we're going to continue the case and come back. That cuts down on continuances. But I think that there's a lot of different ways you can manage the calendar, and those are just some of them. It's there. There's a lot of inefficiency in the courts right now. Just a quick follow up. Certainly the second part of that really was how do you how do you do that? You know, the sort of efficiency part while still making people feel that they've been heard and that justice has been done, even if they only had 2 minutes for their case? Well, I think people most people who come into the court understand when they walk in the door, when they see 40 other people sitting in court, that you're not going to be there for an hour listening to their case, their defense. Defense attorneys are really good at telling people upfront what's going to happen when they come into court. But clearly, if there's some element of misunderstanding, when you hear their cases, you do take more time to do it. But you just have to be efficient. You have to be able to make a decision. And I've I've been I was a prosecutor for 20 years, and I was before a lot of judges who couldn't make a decision to save their life. And that took a lot of time. I'm very good at making decisions sometimes. Oh, I guess I'm no go ahead in your sentence. And sometimes you have to shoot from the hip. But if you know the law, which I do. Having spent so much time as a prosecutor and five years in the appellate unit, I'm pretty comfortable that I can get my point across in a short period of time. Thank you, Councilmember. And as a follow up question, it has been a. Very. Yeah, it's free flowing now, so you have some free flowing questions. And so a councilmember at the gravel asked the first people on question. Good morning. Thanks for being here. Well, thank you for having me. I had a question. Is more about getting to know you as a person a little bit. And I'm wondering if you could share an experience, an event, a relationship in your life that was formative in shaping your values and in particular. Has helped you understand and appreciate people who have different upbringings than your own. Okay. Well, I think my relationship with my parents clearly was the most formative relationship that a person could have. My parents and I grew up fairly middle class, but we had eight kids in our family, so we didn't have really a lot. My parents never said, We're going to buy you a car when you turn 16. So I drove around in my mom's station wagon, which wasn't very cool actually when I knew nature, but my parents made a promise to all of their children, and that was that they would give them an education and that was very important to me having that. They also were strong. And basically giving being people of faith was very important. I'm I'm very, very happy with my faith. It gives me guidance that grounds me. And I forget what the second part of your question was. I was so focused on my love for my parents and I could think. God and family are a good place to start. Yeah, I am. In helping you. Develop an appreciation for folks who are. At a different life experience. Right? Well, that's an interesting question, because one of my brothers is developmentally disabled and my father actually died pretty young. And my mom had I was one of the older kids. I was 22 when he died. But my mom had five children under the age of 19 when my dad died. And one of them was my brother who was developmentally disabled. And that really opened my eyes to the fact that not everybody is born with you know, it's not a level playing ground for everybody. He was a special needs kid who got bullied a lot in school. He still lives around here. And he requires attention because as vulnerable adults, people take advantage of him. And it's very sad to see. And I think that gave me an appreciation for the issues relating to the mentally ill, the disabled people, homelessness, because it really was very close to me in my family. Thank you very much. We are now at the place. Are there any other follow up questions? Councilmember Gossett We had a quick okay. Yeah, I like the other now a little bit more. So the racial. Personality question and 2009, the city of Seattle said that 44% of all the folks that gave driving while licenses and tickets to NCR were African-American, but only 7.8% of all the citizens were. And last Friday, the King County Jail in a county that's 6% black, 6.7% black. Now, 40% of all the adults are African-American and 56% of area youth. And there is a black America. My friends and Associates, Alliance and Associates Workers Party said it's clear it's because of capitalism and racism. Do you agree or disagree why? Well, I think we actually discussed this when we met a couple of weeks ago, that there is African-Americans have been historically treated fairly poorly by the criminal justice system. And I don't think today people intend to be racist. I think that there is some institutional racism that goes on. I don't think people realize I don't think most police officers are out to get African-Americans. But whether or not it happens, it happens because while they might have good intentions, they are focusing on that community, which I think is very tragic because there are issues in every community. There's a lot of white collar crime that is pretty much overlooked. All right. I don't know how to solve that problem. As a judge, you can only deal with what you have before you as a community leader. However, you can educate people to the issue. I think Seattle is actually really good at doing that because especially since the Department of Justice investigation of the Seattle Police up on Seattle Police Department has gone on, it's really opened the eyes to more citizens that there is a problem in the city that needs to be dealt with and hopefully you have to look at long term how it's going to pan out. And we're very new into it. It's only the I forget exactly what it's called, but it's only been in effect for a little bit over a year. So we'll see maybe ten years down the road if it's had the desired effect. I hope it does. Thank you. You're welcome. There comes a time, the time now where you get to give your closing comments. Okay. Thank you. Well, again, thank you so much for having me here today. It's really an honor to appear before the King County Council. As I indicated earlier, I do believe that I'm the most uniquely qualified candidate for this position. In order to be a good judge, you have to have the requisite experience, which I have after having prosecuted somewhere between two and 300 jury trials, as well as my experience in the therapeutic and restorative courts. As both a prosecutor and a judge, I'm confident that my experience will make me an excellent District Court judge. One thing that I have learned along the way is that you can be a great litigator, either a prosecutor, defense attorney, or a civil attorney. But that doesn't necessarily guarantee that you will be a good judge. I have over 6000 hours sitting on the bench. Most of that's been in the last four years. It takes time on the bench. For that determination to be made of whether or not you're going to be a good judge. And given that I've had the 6000 hours, I believe that I've actually proven myself. You don't get called back to pro tem if you're not a good judge. If I am appointed to this position, I will not disappoint you. Thank you. Thank you very much. And according to your resume, you are quite the cook. So I know. I'm really excited to hear that. I am not. I'm great at a peanut butter chicken sandwich. That's a cookbook. Absolutely. So what I'd like to tell you is that we are very appreciative of your willingness to serve on the district court. And you can either stay or you can go home and relax, whichever is is just for you. Only the latter. Okay. That sounds like a good plan. So thank you very much. And our next candidate will be Lisa Pegg of City. And as we're waiting for Lisa to get set, we have an Amber Alert that has just gone out. So anybody listening to this should be looking for a license plate, A as an apple, you as an unicorn. Why is in yellow 0186. It's a Washington license plate with a 26 black Chrysler 300 series. So the Amber Alert is now out with an Amber Alert from the other day. And did we found the young girl? So we have a new Amber Alert. We welcome the microphone only to be closer to your mouth almost cause that that is perfect. All right. So welcome. And Lisa, viewers will begin giving us an introduction about yourself. I will. Good morning, council members. I'd like to first start out by thanking you all for considering me for an appointment. My name is Lisa Paglia. Sorry, I have worked and committed myself to working in the justice system in this community for over 30 years. My experience extends beyond the courtroom. For the past 22 plus years, I've been a public defender in King County, where I've served this county's indigent population. Prior to that, I served the youth of this community as both a juvenile corrections officer and a juvenile probation counselor, primarily primarily in the screening unit. I have come face to face on a daily basis for the last 30 plus years within access to justice, which is why I believe my qualifications are unique given my broad spectrum of experience, to open the doors, to access to justice for all members of our community. I have a passion for people. I have a passion for justice. And I have the years of experience and commitment. And I'm still very excited every day when I go to work. The people I work with energized me. I believe the skills I've gained over the years will help me to be the best judge that this community deserves. Thank you. Thank you very much. Our first question is going to come from council member up the Grove. Good morning. Good morning. What is your. Vision for the future of our judicial system? And what changes would you advocate and why? I'm speaking directly to district court. The changes I foresee that I'm very excited about working towards are the development of a community court, the continuation of development of therapeutic courts within this county. I'm a very strong believer that we can be financially wise and reduce social costs by concurrently holding people accountable for their actions while at the same time rehabilitating people. I think the mistake that our justice system has made over the last three decades that I've been involved in prior to that time is we keep trying the same thing. We have public health issues such as mental health issues, substance abuse issues, which I very strongly believe are public health issues that have been diverted to the criminal justice system. That's been a long process. It's going to be a long process to unwind that. But while those issues are still entangled in the criminal justice system, what we as judges, community members can do is work with therapeutic courts to try to divert those issues away. And there are alternative programs, one of those programs that's been very successful, and I can tell all of you that my clients are very excited about it. Is the CAP Enhanced Program, which I think provides a link that has been missing from our system, a link in transition. The CAP enhanced program is not a long term treatment program, but it does provide information to people, opens the doors to this is how you get hooked up with mental health services. This is a little bit of moral recognition therapy. This is how you get an evaluation. Those type of programs, we can monitor individuals to ensure community safety, but at the same time help them access services. And that's what the community courts will do as well. I think it's very important that the community get involved and people can be remanded to their community. A judge does not stand alone. This counsel does not stand alone. A prosecutor and a defense attorney don't stand alone. We're all part of a team. I've worked in almost every position in some form or another in the justice system. So I understand every team members role, and I'm excited to be potential. Part of the judicial team. Thank you very much. Councilmember DEMBOSKY will be asking question number two, followed by Councilmember McDermott, the question three. Thank you, Madam Chair, and good morning. Good morning and thank you for being here. I have the second standard question, and it's an important one, and that is this. How do you I'm sorry, how does and should the district court have an impact on racial disproportionality in the justice system? How does and should the district court have an impact on racial disproportionality in the justice system? Every member of the justice system, starting from the citizen who calls the police to begin with. From police contact to prosecutorial discretion has a role in recognition of explicit and implicit biases which are in our system. As a judge, I am very aware of explicit biases. I think a good judge needs to have the courage to learn and to recognize and to call out implicit biases and to be aware of those implicit biases. I think the as I spoke before over the last three decades, our community, frankly, the entire nation here, which began with the war on drugs and has continued. We are in a situation now where entire communities have been devastated by socioeconomic issues and cultural issues, and there is a disproportionate number of people of color in prisons and in jails. What we need to do is be aware of that. We need to look at programs to get people out of jail, because what we forget is when an individual goes to jail, that not only affects that individual, it affects the family. It affects the children. It affects their ability to get a job. Which is why one of the reasons we're in the situation that we're in right now. So a judge needs to have the courage to make decisions, to call out implicit biases and to recognize them. Thank you. Thank you very much. Next question. And can I add one thing to that? We often hear that justice should be blind. Justice should not be blind unless and until we have addressed the disproportionality that exists in our system. We need to recognize that. Thank you, Councilmember and a German. Thank you very much and welcome. This court process is about 250,000 cases per year and judges consistently manage high volume case calendars. How would you approach a calendar where you have to resolve 50 cases in 2 hours by making sure that the people involved feel that justice has been done? Thank you, Councilmember. It's very important to me that every individual, number one, be treated with dignity and respect. It's important to me and has been important to me as a lawyer. And I have worked every calendar that King County has. In fact, I've made changes to some of those calendars. It's important to me that that individual before me, just as the individual standing next to me, understands why they're there. I worked high volume calendars as an intake screener. I've dealt with sometimes up to 30 kids being booked into detention in one evening, and I'm the one making that decision. I'm very good at multitasking. I can read a docket, I can understand a dock that I can explain. I explain to my clients why they're there in a very short period of time. So I have full confidence that I will be able to do that. And it and I've slowed calendars down, I should note, because I am aware, as some of my colleagues have pointed out, who are not lawyers, that judges and lawyers speak a different language, said nobody understands what y'all are talking about. So I I'm very conscious of making sure that that person next to me now as a lawyer understands why they're there for that two minute calendar. Thank you very much. You have completed the three standard questions. And so now we will open it up to follow up questions on the answers. Councilmember Balducci, it means by way of follow up to the last question, if you don't mind. So looking at your materials and as a former jail person, very thrilled with your experience. But I noticed that you have not served as a judge pro tem as yet. So can you just speak a little bit more about how you would make that transition to running a calendar? What would be your process for getting through that high volume calendar that you just described? And I have actually served as a pro tem, but only on one occasion, and that's due to my high volume caseload. And my clients come first right now. So I haven't had the opportunity, but I know those calendars. I read dockets and oftentimes judges have indicated to me, I'll hire you if I had my own court because I know the docket better than the judge does. So I'm very good at navigating through schemas and discus and judges and quickly reading a docket, getting to the issue. That day that I did pro tem out in Burian, I had a docket of 110 people. I read every one of those dockets ahead of time. I knew what the issues were. I was prepared to listen to both sides, which I did, and make a decision based on the presentation before me, as well as my knowledge of the issues that you had to deal with. Discus injuries as all the judges. Bless you. Okay. So anybody else have a follow up question, counsel? A member, Ambassador. Thank you very much, Madam Chair. Mine is the fallout crisis. Two, three in the fallout that you just had. And it's the hypothetic. Let's say that you were appointed, not elected to be a new municipal court judge. And Ferguson, Missouri, about a week after the Justice Department rulings and findings came out. And you already know that over the last ten years, the amount of money raised in Ferguson from simply imposing certain tickets, given African-Americans tickets in that town, had a five fold increase in the amount of money that was entering the pool of money in their municipal coffers. And you went into court that next day, and it was 39 African-Americans and two Indians and two whites. Business as usual. What how would you deal with it? And over half of that were in there for basic tickets, driving on a like suspended speeding. So financial issues. Yeah. First of all, I think as I've touched on before, I am aware of not only explicit bias and I would consider that explicit bias recognition of that disproportionality right there, but also implicit biases as to, well, here's what the population is, here's what's just happened in the community. And what I'm seeing in front of me is why were all these individuals stopped. That are all people of color? I would be aware of that. As a judge. I need to remain neutral and take into consideration all of what I've just mentioned, but treat every case individually. I am a firm believer that our court system should not be funded on the backs of poor people. And I've as I've already addressed, sometimes some communities have disproportionately disparately been developed due to a lot of biased issues. So I believe that socioeconomic barriers is a is a huge barrier to access to justice. It's a very complicated issue. And how we got to where we are is decades. So I would be very aware and would have the courage, I think, as a judicial officer, to call out biases. And if I had the authority to waive those fines. Thank you. Thank you. Any other follow up questions? Okay. With that, we've come to the time of your closing statement. Thank you. I again, I want to thank all of you. I want to tell you what's most important to me. And I've tried to live it every day of my career, as well as walking down the street. I was raised to believe and I do believe every individual should be treated with dignity and respect. The judges that I would like to emulate are those judges who do treat every individual before them with dignity and respect. But more importantly, a good judge should be able to distinguish and separate the individual from that individual's behavior. I believe that a judge, when disciplining, when sanctioning, if it gets to that point, should address the behavior but separate that behavior from the individual. I believe that every individual has the ability to do better. I've seen it in my work on a day to day basis. I've seen in access to justice issues. But I also want to say that I have seen people pick themselves up, face struggles and end up very successful. I want to be the type of judge that continues to treat everyone with dignity and respect, that continues to have hope in people that is able to hold people that are able to hold people accountable. And I believe I will be the type of judge that all members of this community deserve. Thank you for your time. Thank you. And thank you for your willingness to go through the process and to serve our people in such a great way. So thank you. So you're free to stay or you can go home and actually relax, whichever you prefer. Thank you so much. Okay. So our next candidate will be Andrew Simon, and so I will be bringing Andrew in. Andrew, just one thing to tell you that when you sit down, the microphone needs to be so close to your mouth you think you're almost eating it. So be prepared for that. Thank you. And as soon as you're ready, just go ahead and get your introductory statement. Whenever you're ready. Thank you. Good morning. Thank you for the honor of including me in this group of well-qualified candidates for District Court Judge in the West Division. There are three things that I could talk about this morning. Why choose me? What your expectations might be and what my what I hope to bring to the bench myself? So why choose me? I bring in expertize in both criminal and civil law to the bench, as well as exposure to the various circumstances facing Washington residents as a public defender. I fought for the indigent accused for ten years as an assistant attorney general. I have advocated for abuse, neglect of children, vulnerable adults and injured workers. And I've also worked to help Washington's work to keep Washington's workplaces safe. For me, continuing to serve the public interest as a judge would be an opportunity to apply the wisdom I've gained during the last 25 years of practice to an even wider spectrum of needs and people. And what might your expectations be at this point? Well, I don't know all of them. I know that I will promise to bring you a fundamental commitment to the rule of law, to the bench. And all the skills I've developed as a pro tem judge in my career, excellent listening skills, even temperament, openness to reasonable arguments and decisiveness. I would also bring to the bench as a public sector attorney, I've thrived in the midst of budget cuts and limited resources, as well as heavy caseload. And it would be exciting for me to participate in the technological changes that King County is pioneering. Finally, what I hope to bring to the bench, as I mentioned in my opening. My experience in both criminal and civil law. Uniquely qualifies me to be an effective judge in the district court. I will continue to work very hard to be fair and impartial and understand the individual circumstances of people who come before me. And I'll continue to advocate for improved access to justice, particularly for King County's low income populations. Thank you. Excellent. We're going to ask you a series of three questions and then some open ended follow up questions. So the first question will be from Gina Cornwell's file by phone right there. Question number two. Thank you, Madam Chair, and thank you very much for being with us today. My question is, what is your vision for the future of our judicial system and what changes would you advocate for and why? I think the judicial system in Washington is by and large, working is working well. I think the the perennial concern that Justice Madsen has brought out the last few years in the state, the judiciary has been funding issues. And, of course, that's sort of the elephant in the room that there just needs to be more more money, particularly from the state, to improve both the numbers of judges that we have at all levels, the availability of legal aid to civil civil people with civil problems, low income civil problems in the state. There are million low income residents in Washington that simply don't have access to justice because of basic fundamental funding issues. So I think those are going to be major challenges. My vision would be that there would also be enough judges at all levels for for people to have ready access to the courts or for prompt justice, for speedy justice. Those are the sort of issues that, you know, certainly we all aspire to for that. And I think that's something that would be achievable. But I think that it does need some some work at the state level on funding issues as well. And then I think also in terms of, you know, issues close to my heart are simply having better funding for for civil legal aid, because that seems to be in the areas of family problems, employment, housing. I mean, those are where people really are falling through the cracks in Washington's legal world. Thank you. Okay. Question number two, council member Mary Barra. Thank you, Madam Chair. Thank you again for being here today. Hello. Thank you. How does the and should the district court have an impact on racial disproportionality in our justice system? How would you see the district court impacting racial disproportionality in our justice system? And by racial disproportionality in terms of number like disproportionate arrest and incarceration rates, that sort of thing? That's a really good question. And I think it's you know, as a district court judge, there's limited things that that a judge sitting as a judge can do. But there's also unique things that district court judges can do. I think the limitations are that you have to try the cases that are brought to you. The prosecutor's office and our law enforcement agencies have a lot more to do with who was arrested, who was prosecuted. And once someone's in the courtroom, then they need to deal with the case. That's before you. But I think being predictable, treating people who are particularly in custody of not be able to bond out with equal justice to those who. Been able to bond out. I think the structure of bail and bond is is is exorbitant for many defendants in King County. And many people simply can't get out of jail. And that affects a lot of what sort of outcomes they have in district and superior court as well. The I think that outside the courtroom, there's judges have a a peculiar, not peculiar, but a particular sort of influence that other people don't have. I think that people will listen to what judges have to say. So in terms of writing OP, Ed's the justice in the classroom programs the different judges have participated in, and I would very much like to participate in that. The, you know, speaking at conferences, supporting things like the limited, the loyalty programs can also help help with racial disparities of other low income issues that come up. So I think there's limited things, but I think there's also unique things that district court judges can bring to that question. Thank you very much for your comment. Again, thank you for your willingness to serve. Oh, thank you. Thank you. Councilmember about district question number three. Welcome and thanks. I had my thanks for your willingness to do this. Good to see you again. You're welcome. Thank you. So the third question is district court processes around 250,000 cases per year and judges consistently manage high volume calendars. How would you approach a calendar when you have to resolve 50 cases in 2 hours while making sure that the people involved feel that justice has been done? That's a really good question, and I've actually done that. So I know I know I can do it. It's the very first time I pro tem. There was probably at least 50 cases on the calendar. I think there are two big things. One is listening carefully to people and also, you know, the the role of prosecutors and defense attorneys is is critical in district court in terms of them getting their cases together, getting cases ready. I think being able to prioritize cases, not being afraid necessarily to continue them if necessary, although like I said, I've rarely had to continue well, I've never had to continue cases because of a docket running out of time. You know, I find that people if people feel like they're being listened to and that you are you're being empathic with them and that you understand with the issues before them that that actually makes things move along more quickly as well. I've been working in, you know, as a public defender and assistant attorney general. My stock and trade has been high volume, high intensity practices for 25 years. So stepping into heavy dockets was not something that was a a shock. It was just a it was a different sort of high volume, high intensity world for me to follow. Okay, great. So that completes the standard questions. And so now we be able to go on to the follow up questions on these. And the first will be council member at the Grove. Thank you, Madam Chair, and thanks for being here. Very welcome. I just wanted to get a little bit more of. A sense about you as a person and wondering if you could share either an. Event. An experience or a relationship in your life that was formative in shaping your values and in. Particular has helped you understand folks who are different than you. Yeah. I think a couple of different people come to mind. You know, certainly my wife, she we've been married for 11 years now and her she comes from a Polish background. Her parents were, you know, off the boat. And and so having an entire, you know, ethnic heritage of a universe I'd never experienced before has been obviously very influential. I think also when I was in the public defender's office, I, I had a number of clients where in the process of working with them and defending their cases, I would go out to their homes and meet their families, be in their living rooms, watch their kids, you know, cook things and play. And I think there was, you know, just being introduced to an entirely different universe of of a life that I had not experienced growing up. I think those were also very, very important. Okay. Councilmember and Tim wrote about the. Other councilmember was. Bass. Yeah, I just spoke to them because they're like. Three and a half year anniversary here on the. Trail. Lambert calling you ride the train, call me four months now. I'm Amber Rudd. Well, thank you very much for being here and for your willingness to serve. And we actually mean that because it's a big undertaking. I'm wondering, Andrew, in your 25 years of practicing law in a number of roles as a defender. And on the prosecutor state side and also as a judge. Is there has there been a case or a client where in hindsight you feel like I got something wrong on that, or I made an error and kind of judgment or tactical decision making or in deciding and how have you squared that? That's a good question and a really hard question as well. Two things kind of mind. One is they tend to put more of my energy into the cases that I've got and that we're worrying about what's happening in those moments. You know, but having said that, there are a couple of cases where as a public defender, I made I had defenses. You know, the old adage, you don't want to write to horses as a defense, you want to have one defense and run with it. That public defending criminal defense is not like a law school exam question where you lay out all the possible defenses you have, you actually need to pick one and run with it. And there have certainly been a couple of cases where I had two viable defenses available and it wasn't really practical to try to run both. And so I chose one and one case in particular. I chose an alibi defense as opposed to other sorts of defenses. The ultimate, ultimate outcome was okay, but it was it was one of those things where, you know, if I could have gone back and retried it with a different defense, knowing what I knew and knowing what the what the jury's initial verdict was, then I think that that would have been a change. I think also I probably would have taken more risks in things, in aspects of jury selection with some of the bigger cases. I've had a you know, you get, you know, like the first murder case, you're probably a little more nervous than a second murder case. And there are things I think I would have done in in voir dire that might have brought up some of the issues better, perhaps. But no, I really feel like I have given my that I really gave my all and gave my best to that work and certainly in the AG's office as well, where we have to retrials, you know, the stakes are monetary and there's a civil and civil universe. No one's going to jail at the end of the day, hopefully. But there's, you know, there's there's that sense that you really want to advocate for your client and do a good job for your client. Thank you. Thank you, Councilmember Gossett. Thank you. I'm out of time. I'd like to join my colleagues in thanking you for participating in this process. I'd like to delve deeper into the issue of racial disproportionality in our entire criminal justice system. In the year 2007, Michelle Alexander, a black lawyer, wrote a book that became immediately a bestseller but extremely controversial. Matter of fact, all the judges in our King County Courthouse have now read it. For the most part, it's called the New Jim Crow, where she made the case that our judicial systems are quick tracked and incarcerate and create an almost slave like system for black males in this country and her. But Cornell West, who is considered also a very controversial black intellectual but also very popular, said until we get to the root cause of this horrific racial, there's a portion out there. What he said is capitalism and racism. We cannot change it. Do you agree or disagree with him? Why? Well, I I would fundamentally I think he's got the fundamentals correct. I think that there is I think ever since President Clinton, the the drug and drug laws passed back in during the Clinton 84, 94, that the prison population just jumped at that point. And you can see it. You can see in the graphs, you could see in the incarceration rates. And they were largely linked to making crack cocaine drug offenses more serious than powder cocaine drug offenses. And certainly as a public defender, I saw I saw those sorts of disparities as well. You know, I think that that is a those are I think those analyzes are correct. I've read reviews of Ms.. Alexander's book. I've not read the book myself at this point, but I've certainly it's on ice. It's certainly on the list. And I think that she from what I've read of that, I think I would agree with much of the analysis as well. You know, it's a it's it's a. Judge Justice Madsen has referred to some of these problems as being intractable, not in the sense of being unsolvable. Not unsolvable. Well, that was the word she chose, not unsolvable, but persistent and stubborn. And that they've been persistent, stubborn problems for, you know, in our country for 150 years. And certainly Clinton, President Clinton, there were some exacerbations and some of the crime laws were passed. So I think those laws those laws need to be changed. I think there is there's certainly a need to for education at law enforcement and prosecution levels. You know, once again, it's frustrating, as I'm sure you you see as well, that judges are stuck with the cases that come before them. So there's a certain amount of that in court. You want to be fair and you want to be just. But I think there's also a need to recognize that to be advocating for changes in laws that will they will begin to chip away at that disproportionality, because it really it is it is real. It's a real problem. And there's to to try to argue or believe that it's not a real problem, I think just exacerbates that problem. Thank you. Welcome to you. I'm actually going to ask a follow up question. Caseloads are down right now. And so tell me why you think we should have more judges if the caseload is down? Well, I may be at this particular particular moment in history that they may be down. But I. I know that district courts handle 90% of the caseload in Washington state. And the and the population is increasing. King County is certainly population. King County is increasing as well. In any given day when I pro-tem, there's been at least 50 or 60 cases on the docket. So I'd be curious as to what what the actual numbers are over what period of time. But even so, I think the the amount of caseloads that the district courts have become accustomed to doing are probably more high perhaps than would be good. I think lower caseload in general spread over more judges would be a good public policy avenue to pursue as well. The fact that, in other words, the fact they've gone down may be a good thing and perhaps keeping them down is also a good thing from public policy as well as access to justice. Great. Well, we've come to the end of the free flowing questions. It's now time to give your closing statement. Thank you. Thank you all for taking up time this morning. I appreciate the questions and I appreciate the time to be able to present this morning. As I mentioned at the beginning, I bring experience and expertize to the bench in both criminal and civil law. I've also protested in King County District Court as well as Seattle Municipal Court, and gaining invaluable practical experience as a result as a district court judge. I would continue to advocate for improved access to justice, particularly for King County's various minorities and low income populations. The issue of of of making courts more accessible to more people, particularly low income people, is is close to my heart. And I know it's close to the King County Council's heart. And I would work very hard to continue to make those efforts improve and increase in King County. So thank you for your consideration. Thank you so much. And we really appreciate your willingness to serve. And you are free now to either join us or even go home and relax. All right. Thank you. Sir. Thank you very much. With that, we will be bringing on our final candidate. Our candidate's name is Samir Singular, and so he will be next. And this will be our last one. Following that, we will have an executive session. Right. Right here. Right here. Okay. And I made it disappear. Welcome, Mr. Single. The microphone needs to be almost dangerously close to your mouth, so be aware of that. Okay. Thank you. And when you are ready, give your opening statement. Good morning, Council Member Lambert and members of the committee. My name is Samir Singla and I am seeking a position for King County District Court. I want to thank you for considering me as a finalist for this position. I'm truly humbled and honored. I also want to thank your committee staff and your individual staff for shepherding us through this process. They've been extremely patient with us. I have worked very hard to prepare myself for this position. I have been a pro tem judge for over half a decade. I've served over 200 days as a pro tem judge with thousands of hours. I've covered almost every single calendar imaginable in King County District Court. I have served as a prosecutor, as a policy director, as a trial instructor, and currently I'm in private practice as a civil rights litigator. I want the district I want to be on the district court because I want to effect a positive change in my community. I believe that a judge should be accessible, should be able to be make a connection with the people that appear in front of them. We should make sure that people are participants in the process not being processed through the judicial system. I believe I bring a unique perspective and fresh energy to this position. As some of you may know. I'm an immigrant. My family moved here from India when I was 12 years old. My father, who was a judge in India, had a great career, but he found himself in a position in Punjab during the 1980s. There was a lot of violent activity and he had to try cases of accused terrorist. They tried to bribe him and that didn't work. So they ended up threatening his life and then his family's life. So he chose to retire after 20 years of service and moved to a small town in Othello. Washington, Othello. Washington. And that experience that experience, what it taught me was the value of hard work, persistence and perseverance. And it impacted me so much that it set me on a path to be on the judiciary. And that's what brings me here to you today. Excellent. Thank you so much. Your first question today will be asked by a council member at the Grove. We have three prepared questions. And the first is. What is your vision for the future of our judicial system. And what changes would you advocate and why? I think we have a lot of different challenges in the King County district court system, and one of the challenges that we have is providing adequate access to justice. Let me just give you an idea. Serving as a pro tem judge, I have to handle about 30 to 35 cases in an hour and a half. And these cases are with defendants who are facing some of the same challenges that you're facing, challenges of addiction, challenges of homelessness, challenges of safety. And these are the same challenges that you're struggling with now. I have as much time to address those cases as I have to answer this question. So think about that for a second. Our public defenders and prosecutors work really, really hard, but at some point we have to figure out how do we make people who appear in front of us actually participants in the process? And that is something that we're going to continue to challenge, continue to deal with and about the budget as a barrier to that challenge. So what we can do is look to expand on the programs that have been working. Some of the great successes that we've had in District Court is with therapeutic programs, with with mental health courts and with veterans courts. And we can expand those programs to include some of the issues that we're dealing with here today. Successes have been made in other other jurisdictions with community courts and with restorative justice programs where they're applicable. Well, we have to learn to do is we have to learn to do more with less. And what I mean by that is use what's been working and use technology that's been working and use it more effectively. Some of the things that we can do, and I call this really low hanging fruit, is being able to text message or email reminders to the participants who are going to be in front of us. What we see a lot of the time is people don't show up to court and there is a warrant that's issued for them and they're subsequently arrested on that warrant. That requires now three different agencies that you have to manage the budget for being involved. You have the King County Sheriff's Office, you have the jail and you have the court system. And when we invariably see them again, ask them, why didn't they didn't show up to court. They said, either I forgot or I lost the piece of paper that was handed to me telling me what my next court date was. And we can use the system and it has worked in other jurisdictions to be able to text message or email them so they're reminded because that is where the next generation is going. The other thing that we can do is make the court more accessible. I'm here. We're being livestreamed on King County Network. My mother and father are watching me. We can do the same thing with our court system. It's an open court system. One of the other things that I hear all the time is that people don't know what the process is going to be and they're always afraid of going to court because it's a mystery to them. Live streaming the court system again makes it more accessible so you can actually figure out what a traffic ticket hearing is going to look like or an arraignment is going to look like before you show up. Thank you very much. If you're in the middle of a sentence, don't worry about going over. Yeah, we're just giving guidelines there. Okay. Question number two, Councilmember Dombrowski. Thank you, Madam Chair. And good morning, Samir. Thanks for being here and thank you for your willingness to serve. This is the second base question that we've got, and that is how does and should how does and should the district court have an impact on racial disproportionality in our justice system? Well, Councilmember Dombrowski, this is a question that that's very personal to me. And I do believe that we can take a look back at this point over 200 years and see that there is a racial disproportionality in the criminal justice system. And it's borne itself out at this point through a number of means, through studies. And quite frankly, had I interacted differently with police officers when I was pulled over for wearing a hoodie and driving a nice car, I might be part of that statistic. But I was a lawyer and I knew how to interact and I knew how to handle myself. So what do we do that we recognize as racial disproportionality? Last month, the Department of Justice came out with a letter addressed to all district and municipal courts nationwide, encouraging them to take a look at the system of legal financial obligations and the burden that places on them creating essentially debtors prison. People are being imprisoned because they can't pay their fines. That, again, leads to racial disproportionality. What we can do is that the recognize that the issue is real, that exist. And what I mean by disproportionality and discrimination, it goes beyond just that issue. We we have issues of gender. We have racial issues of sexual orientation. We have issues of race, we have issues of poverty. And those are all amalgamation of what what the real issue that we're dealing with here today is. My goal is to make each individual that comes in front of me an important part of the process. My goal and I do this every time when I am a pro-tem judge is to let people know that the reason that they're in front of me does not need to define who they are moving forward. We work together to make sure that they recognize that this is a circumstance that they've found themselves in. It's not a definition of who they are. What we can do is we can find alternatives to incarceration. We can find whether work crew or a community service works better to improve that system. We can address these issues before people even enter the system. We can, as judges, go out into the community and serve as role models. I think it's important for the for the types of issues that we're dealing with is to have judges go and share their own stories, share their own stories of what's happened to them, their own stories of their upbringing, to serve as a role model, to show that there is somebody that looks like them, that understands what they've been through, that lives in their community, that can then help them get through the process. What I have done, and I've spent a lot of time in my work and that's why it's personal to me in addressing these issues. I've served as a board member on Washington Appleseed, where we've written reports about the effects of suspension and exclusion in two schools, which has led to reforms in that system. And what we found when we did our study is that it did disproportionately affect students of color, and it did create a pipeline to the prisons. Okay. Did you finish my question? Okay. All right. And so then the last question of the canned stage questions will be Councilmember McDermott. Question number three. Thank you, Madam Chair. Though I find it hard to categorize as a can do question district court process around district court processes, around 250,000 cases a year, and judges manage a high volume calendar regularly. How would you approach a calendar when you have to resolve 50 cases in 2 hours while making sure that the people involved feel that justice has been done? You know, I'm glad that you asked that question and we've been talking about that. I think I gave the example of just as long as it takes me to answer this question is what we're talking about in the process, what the most important part is to make sure that the individual rights are protected and that they're being served. What I have learned through this process is trying to understand the triggers of what's happening. What I can tell you is asking questions, and I'll give you an example. I was I was serving in Esquire District Court on Monday, and there was a young man, 20 years old, African-American, who was being who was under review and was going to be sanctioned for discharging a firearm under age. Here's a 20 year old young man. The recommendation in front of me was for him to serve ten days in jail. And I'm looking at him. And the simple question I asked is, what's going on? How are you doing? Explain to me why we're here today. It's simply that question. What I saw this young man would do was slump his shoulders down and get a relief, as in somebody was actually going to listen to what they had to say. Now, you asked me the question was, how do we do that with the 50 cases you're facing? Using those triggers, understanding what's going on, understanding why they find themselves in this position, whether it's dealing with issues for driving while license suspended, issues of poverty or issues of addiction, and doing doing what we need to do in in the district courts, which is a rehabilitative it's a court of rehabilitation, as our our goal is to make sure that we set them on a path for success, that we don't find them in this position again. So really working with them to get down to the to the heart of the issue and it's those triggers of how are you doing today? Every time I've asked a asked a person who's in front of me, how are you doing today? Good morning. And they get a smile on their face because all of a sudden it's not lawyers and judges talking to each other. It's a judge who's talking the person that we're actually want to effect. The other thing that I always say is I want to set you up for success. If there's somebody that's going to count on you to succeed, you can count on that person to be me. I've had the great opportunity to serve in in district court for a while now, so I have to have the opportunity to see the same individuals appear in front of me over time. For me to remember who they are. I remember you from last week or last month. And remember we talked about how you were doing. You don't you promised me that you would come back with your treatment form. And I see that here. We're just missing one more part. What are we going to do to work on that? That takes a lot of work and a lot of preparation from a judge beforehand to recall that case. But once you do that, you develop that connection. And that connection is what lasts for such a long time with the defendant. I've had defendants come to me and say, I know, Judge, you told me and you promised. I promised you I was going to do this and I'm going to hold you to and I say, I'm going to hold you to it and I'm counting on you. Thank you. That is completion of our three basic questions. And now we're going to the follow up questions. The first final question will be Councilmember von Rainbow by Councilmember Gossett. Thank you, Madam Chair. No. I did not have a chance to meet with all the candidates, but I did have an opportunity to meet with you 1 to 1. And I appreciate that opportunity. Particularly because I think we have a very clear understanding. Of your professional resume by reading the paper. But when I met with you, what impressed me most was your personal resume and the conversation we had about the person who has had such an impact on your personal life, your father. And I know that we have all before us a written paper. But I like. To take advantage of the fact that your father's watching us. And I remember our private conversation. But I think it's worthy. Because this is a public. Medium to understand that behind the robe. Behind the decision is a person. What are some of the lessons that you learned from your father that you share with me the other day in our office? And I'd like to share that right now. Go ahead. Don't cry. So. Yeah, I plead with you. Hear me cry? My father is watching and he and I had a conversation about this last night as well. You know, the very first memory that I have of my father is him, me asking him why he worked as hard as he did as long as he did, and him coming back and reading his briefs, his handwritten briefs. And I was five years old in India at this time and telling me why this was important and the type of work he was doing and and me watching him go through the process of transitioning his entire life, a life of promise and prestige to come here to this country where we started with nothing. We started with no money, no skills on how to run a farm in a small town with very little opportunity. And what I can definitely tell you is that my father never gave up on us, and he instilled us in the value of hard work, the value of education, the value of always looking forward. And we, we, my, my, my, my brother and sister and I look back now that we've grown up and we have our own kids to where we were when we were growing up. He never made me feel like I didn't have anything where I know. And this is something that I can share with people that appear in front of me where I know for a fact a $200 traffic ticket caused havoc in our lives of $50. I recall conversing with my sister about this. A $50 graduation gown for my sister was a big deal. We had to figure out how we were going to pay for that. But if you talk to my father, he would never let me see it. And I can't tell you I can't. All I can say is if I could ask for a dial a friend, there's no better person than my father. And I got to call him Dad every day. Thank you, Madam Chair. I wanted to get that on the record. I know we have all this paperwork in front of us, but for some reason I have a mutual friend and I had an opportunity to get to know him. Through his. Mutual friend. And the story of his. Father is something that his friends are also private as well. Thank you. Thank you very much, Councilmember. This is next. Thank you very much, Madam Chair. I appreciate it. I, too, like the opportunity to meet Samir in my office and he set up the appointment. And all I need to say. I concur with me about the way that you came across as a positive person, profoundly impacted by your family and your circumstances, particularly over there and below where you faced a lot of racism and overcame all that. My quick question has to do with getting a deeper understanding on your perspective on disproportionality. Cornel West, the famous Harvard and Princeton prof. Former professor, has been consistently talking about the impact of the Clinton 1994 crime legislation that extended the building of jails, hired 100,000 police, and began to reinforce and significantly expand the use of mandatory sentencing and what impact it had on our society and on racial disproportionality, particularly as it impacts blacks. But in a recent speech I saw him make, he said, There's no way we can get to these problems unless we're able to make significant, radical change. And the capital is a racist system under which we live. I just wanted to know if you agree or disagree with how and why, just getting your perspective as a potential judge. I, I had a chance to to catch some of those comments from Dr. West at one point. I do agree I do agree with the basis of the Clinton administration's focus on the war on drugs and also on on the sentencing guidelines at the federal level. That did create a and I think the Department of Justice has also recognized that and is trying to trying to at least focus on those mandatory sentencing guidelines that do create a level of disproportionality. To answer directly your question, I do believe that courts of limited jurisdiction are in a lot of ways on the front line of how we go about addressing this issue. And the reason I say that, Councilmember, is that the types of issues and the types of crimes that we deal with and this is not not only extensive crimes, but it also extends to civil matters as well. We get to see firsthand how an individual is impacted by these types of crimes and what circumstance brings them in front of us. We have been we as as a district court have been working on one of these issues is driving while license suspended in the third degree. We've had diversion programs and relicensing programs we've amended. There has been a statute amendment which I was a part of, to reconfigure how we actually suspend someone's license so that they're not they're not suspended for a particular poverty based infraction, but they're suspended for a safety based infraction, for example. So if you your license will now be suspended. If you don't pay your insurance ticket, your license won't be suspended if you don't pay your registration, because those are the issues where people can't afford to pay pay those tickets. But that's that's just only one of the issues and looking at a broader and global perspective. We have to we have to take into consideration the circumstance that that brings an individual in front of us and what is the motivator and the driving factor of why we see them today, why we see them here today. With that being said, the discretion that a district court judge has to be actually involved in changing some of those behaviors is great. We have a broad discretion. We're not limited by is sentencing guidelines were limited by discretion of having a carrot and stick. The carrot coming obviously first really getting involved and working with individuals to ensure that they're going to reach the level of success and up here in front of us. Thank you very much. Thank you, Madam Chair. Thank you. And I guess I'm going to ask the last follow up question. We actually have a couple of extra minutes. The follow up question is this If you were presiding and the judge next door came by and for some reason didn't like something that you said or the way you did it and came to you and said, I, I have an idea for you, blah, blah, blah, blah, how would you deal with that? Oh, well, I can tell you is I am I have learned from the role models that I've had and I'm not lucky and I'm fortunate to have some great role models who are Supreme Court justices and superior court justice judges. And some of them I've been period in front of, and they have held me to a very high standard. And I've had to live up to that standard at times when I didn't think that I either wanted to or was able to, but they forced me to it. And this is what it taught me, is that I need to be humble, I need to be fair, I need to be just and I need to be civil. And those are the lessons that I take with me as a judge to the bench every time I'm a pro tem. And those are the lessons that I practice as a lawyer. So if a judge came to me and said, I didn't like the way that you did something and here's I would how I'd want you to do it. I will always welcome those comments because, quite frankly, it's it's an art form being. Being a judicial magistrate is an art form. It's not as it's not simple. We're making life changing decisions. And I am always able to learn. I'm a lifelong learner. That's what I know how. That's the only thing that I know how to do. I can't imagine myself being stuck in a certain position because again, somebody may have an idea on how to connect with a participant in this process that I didn't think of or that I wasn't privy to. And it's those things that I need to know to improve myself. I would welcome anyone to come to me and tell me how I can improve my practice. That's something that I cherish and actually look forward to. Excellent. You know, I'll come to the time when you get to give your closing comments. Okay. Says these were the only two periods that you could actually prepare. So. So I want to thank you, first of all, for giving me the opportunity to be here. Like I said before, I'm truly humbled and honored. And I believe that I have a broad base of experience that would make me a good King County District Court judge, and I hope you appoint me. Some of you may be wondering about the disparity in some of the ratings that I and some of our other colleagues have received. I'm honored to have been qualified by some agencies and especially honored to have been qualified exceptionally well qualified by other agencies. I can't tell you the reason for the disparity in the process. I wasn't privy to those conversations. What I can tell you is that they all had the same materials that you have in front of you in my application. They had all the same references. What they didn't have and that I'm proud to present to you are the letters of support that I received from Supreme Court judges and judges from Superior Court judges, from municipal court judges, from court administrators, and also from King County court clerks. I do respect that process. I can tell you that as well. Some of the qualifications that do separate me from my other colleagues, I believe, as I have actually served as an interim presiding judge in Des Moines Municipal Court, where I've had an opportunity to administer an entire court system, handle our budget and manage the court administrations . And that's an invaluable experience I have. I believe that my commitment to community service is great. I have served as an advisory board member for the Boards Children's Clinic. I'm a board member for building changes where a goal is to reduce or eliminate homelessness for families. I have also spoken about the perspective that I have and I do believe that I bring a unique perspective. There's two things that I tell my two young daughters that my father has taught me. They know that single girls never quit, and they always get up when they're knocked down. Those are the same lessons that I bring to the defendants that appear in front of me. If I'm appointed, I can promise me. Promise you you will get the best from me every day, because that is what I've grown up doing and that is the only thing that I know how to do. Thank you very much. Thank you. It's good to see you again. It's here. Thank you. So you have the option of sitting or you don't? Actually, you have no option. You have to go. Thank you very much. Okay. With that, we will go into executive session and we will be able to discuss the candidates qualifications. When we come out of executive session, we will entertain motions to take action on our three agenda items, which are the three appointments. The grounds we would be going into executive session are to evaluate the qualifications of candidates for appointments elective office as provided for in RTW 42.30 .110 Subsection H. The committee will now be in executive session for about 15 minutes. We need to go longer. We will and that will take us just shy of noon. And I'm going to ask the clerk to post the doors to that effect. And I must now ask the members in the public who are and county employees were not directly necessary for this discussion to please leave the council chambers. Thank you very much. As you know, we can keep the microphones on so we can hear each other. So I guess we'll go back into executive session for. You know, when we're out, we're out. Okay, great. So we're now at an executive session. And before we talk about anything else, I just want to say thank you to everybody. This has been a very busy process. It's been very thorough. We've learned a lot about the process itself, about the underlying law. And I know that it took me over 12 hours of just reading the packets, so I know that took you a long time also. So thank you for taking the time to do all that. And I especially like to thank three people who came and participated in the earlier process where we got it down from 15 to 7. And so I'd like to thank Councilmember Gossett for his work on that committee. Member Beth Balducci and Council member Tim Belsky for all your work and pointing out that all of you spent a lot of nights and time outside of this process, in the interview process. So thank you very much. So with that, we are going to move the first motion. The first motion is the one for Southwest Division, and that is proposed motion 2016 0218. And because it's Southwest, we are going to have a Southwest Councilmember Council member at the Grove. Thank you, Madam Chair. I move the proposed motion 2016 0218 be adopted. Thank you. Would you like to make a motion of filling in a name? Yes. Thank you, Madam Chair. I would move that the name of Laurel Gibson be inserted on line 18. Thank you very much. All those in favor of the. So I speak to it. Yes, please speak to it first. Yes. Thank you. Thank you. Madam Chair, this is really an honor for me. To be able to nominate Laurel Gibson to the Southwest Division District. Court. She got her undergraduate degree from University. Of Washington and her. Law degree from Seattle University. She's been practicing criminal law for 12 years. And but most. Importantly and what stands out in my mind is she brings four years. Experience both as an administrative. Law judge, but as a pro tem in this court on the Friday calendars. And the folks she worked with, the current bench and the staff have nothing but praise for the work she's been doing in the district court right now. I want to also mention how much I enjoyed listening to the remarks this morning of Brian Todd. He brings a tremendous life experience and commitment to people who are disadvantaged, and I hope he stays engaged and we get to see his name again in the future. And so we were blessed to have many excellent candidates, but I think we will be very well served in Southwest Division Court with what I hope to be a Judge Laura Gibson, and committed to you. For your support. Thank you very much. Any other comments? Can I please ask our clerk? Yeah. Okay. So the name being built into I treat that as an amendment and we vote on that as an amendment or since it was already a blank, do I just go forward and do it as just so I think we'll treat that as an amended motion? Okay. That's what I that's where we will report it. Okay. That's what I was going to do. But I want to make sure. Okay, good. So, Councilmember Domestic. Thank you, Madam Chair, of be very brief. I wanted to echo Councilmember up the Grove's comments in support of Ms.. Gibson as the appointed judge for the Southwest District. Really excellent job in the interview is a great background, great recommendations. But I also wanted to recognize Mr. Todd. I thought he did very well and made a very compelling case, really appreciate his service to the community at El Centro de la Raza and in the community legal clinics. And I want to note that the most compelling recommendations for me were for Mr. Todd from court staff bailiffs who sometimes don't up bailiffs wrote in in his materials. And to me that was very telling about Mr. Todd as an individual, as a person, as a human being, how he treats the court staff. And it wasn't just one, but there were multiple letters from court staff. And I think that we'll see. Mr.. Todd again. Thank you. And that also tells our bailiffs we care about them. So thank you for pointing that out. Anybody else? All right. So before us right now is the amendment, oral amendment, to put the name of Laura Gibson in to this motion. All those in favor of the amendment, please say those opposed. Nay amendment is on. And so now before us we have the underlying legislation 2016 0218 Any questions or comments? The clerk please call. Did we push? Do okay. Call for the roll. Okay. Please call the off. Thank you, Madam Chair. You didn't I remember Dumbo Knight Councilmember Dunn Knight. Councilmember Gossett. Councilmember Toll. Well, I've. Been a councilmember. Experiment, all right. Which remember. The girl? Navajo Code Council councilmember of the girl, I think. Councilmember. Brown right there. Madam Chair, I don't know who is Ada. Mike Bowers Excellent. So that one will proceed to Monday. And we want that on the consent calendar to want to talk about it. We want to talk about it or not. Do you want to consent for us to say a few words? Okay. So it'll be expedited, but not no consent. Okay. So the next two motions that are before us to 2016, oh two and nine and oh to 20, we're going to move those together. So would you please move both of those at the same time? Thank you, Madam Chair. And I'm pleased to move adoption of 2016 219 and 2 to 0 to the full council unexpired basis Monday. And we've had a good discussion. We've had good interviews. I think members still want to have time to consider these qualified candidates and continue to check background and and resources and recommendations. And so at this time, I wouldn't expect to offer any motions to amend these two motions, but we've moved them with that recommendation today. And that would be fine. Any questions or comments? All right. With that clerk, would you please call for the vote? Thank you. Madam Chair comes from our beloved council member. By. Councilmember. Don. Gossett. Councilor Coles councilor in the. McDermott. House. Member of the Grove. Councilor I'm right there. I know. Chair The seminar is no nos in council members. On my cards. Excellent. With that, we have completed our work for today. County is very fortunate to have so many qualified individuals who are willing to serve their communities as a district court judge. And we are 4 minutes beyond the time that I thought it would take us and just we had to take a recess for our recess, friends. We were right on track. So with that, the meeting is adjourned. Thank you all.

Output: A MOTION making an appointment to fill a judicial vacancy in the west division of King County district court.