[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, I mean the greeting abacaba habibi, how are you? There's a, there's a whole range of phrases, essentially, short phrases that one uses on the street or in the bazaar. [speaks Malay] That was one. Where is the post office? I remember trying that out the first day I got to Kuala Lumpur on one of the local policemen that were standing there. The fellow just sort of looked at me and said, well, I'll tell you, Joe.

[Assistant] In English?

[User] In English, yes.

[Assistant] Okay, so then flew to, from, directly from Hawaii to Kuala Lumpur? Or you went back home for a bit?

[User] Well, we didn't go back home. We had three days in Hawaii. They flew us from, uh, Hilo to Honolulu. Put us up at a hotel for two nights so that in fact we could enjoy Waikiki Beach and make phone calls. And then we flew directly from there to Bangkok, because the chartered plane also had a group that was going to Thailand and after Bangkok we flew down to Kuala Lumpur. Greeted by the Peace Corps staff. We were Malaysia IX, ninth group.

[Assistant] Do you remember your reaction when you opened the door and there you were in Kuala Lumpur? In particular, was it what you expected, not expected?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] In English, yes.

[Assistant] Okay, so then flew to, from, directly from Hawaii to Kuala Lumpur? Or you went back home for a bit?

[User] Well, we didn't go back home. We had three days in Hawaii. They flew us from, uh, Hilo to Honolulu. Put us up at a hotel for two nights so that in fact we could enjoy Waikiki Beach and make phone calls. And then we flew directly from there to Bangkok, because the chartered plane also had a group that was going to Thailand and after Bangkok we flew down to Kuala Lumpur. Greeted by the Peace Corps staff. We were Malaysia IX, ninth group.

[Assistant] Do you remember your reaction when you opened the door and there you were in Kuala Lumpur? In particular, was it what you expected, not expected?

[User] Well, I'm not sure how much I expected. When they opened the door, the Peace Corps staff was there. The director, his wife, I think a couple of his children, other members, local members of the staff. And they put leis around our necks. And I remember that as being nice. Uh. We were thrilled to be finally in Malaysia, in Kuala Lumpur. I remember that the tropics, of course, you opened that door of the airplane that had been air conditioned to get that nice, warm, humid, uh, waves and, you know, fragrant that, that I think you all experienced.

[Assistant] How did you train in Kuala Lumpur then for a little bit or?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, we didn't go back home. We had three days in Hawaii. They flew us from, uh, Hilo to Honolulu. Put us up at a hotel for two nights so that in fact we could enjoy Waikiki Beach and make phone calls. And then we flew directly from there to Bangkok, because the chartered plane also had a group that was going to Thailand and after Bangkok we flew down to Kuala Lumpur. Greeted by the Peace Corps staff. We were Malaysia IX, ninth group.

[Assistant] Do you remember your reaction when you opened the door and there you were in Kuala Lumpur? In particular, was it what you expected, not expected?

[User] Well, I'm not sure how much I expected. When they opened the door, the Peace Corps staff was there. The director, his wife, I think a couple of his children, other members, local members of the staff. And they put leis around our necks. And I remember that as being nice. Uh. We were thrilled to be finally in Malaysia, in Kuala Lumpur. I remember that the tropics, of course, you opened that door of the airplane that had been air conditioned to get that nice, warm, humid, uh, waves and, you know, fragrant that, that I think you all experienced.

[Assistant] How did you train in Kuala Lumpur then for a little bit or?

[User] Not really. We were, uh, we were put up for different parts of the time until we were ready to go off to our different assignments. I mentioned that there were 66 of us that made it through the, uh, the training. Only 17 of us actually stayed in Malaya. The rest of the group set off to Sabah and Sarawak. And so I think after 1 or 2 days, that group left for Sabah and Sarawak and the 17 of us would gradually go off to our assignments.

[Assistant] So you may have stayed in a hotel or something in Kuala Lumpur until you found your assignment?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, I'm not sure how much I expected. When they opened the door, the Peace Corps staff was there. The director, his wife, I think a couple of his children, other members, local members of the staff. And they put leis around our necks. And I remember that as being nice. Uh. We were thrilled to be finally in Malaysia, in Kuala Lumpur. I remember that the tropics, of course, you opened that door of the airplane that had been air conditioned to get that nice, warm, humid, uh, waves and, you know, fragrant that, that I think you all experienced.

[Assistant] How did you train in Kuala Lumpur then for a little bit or?

[User] Not really. We were, uh, we were put up for different parts of the time until we were ready to go off to our different assignments. I mentioned that there were 66 of us that made it through the, uh, the training. Only 17 of us actually stayed in Malaya. The rest of the group set off to Sabah and Sarawak. And so I think after 1 or 2 days, that group left for Sabah and Sarawak and the 17 of us would gradually go off to our assignments.

[Assistant] So you may have stayed in a hotel or something in Kuala Lumpur until you found your assignment?

[User] I think it was a hotel, although there was a Peace Corps hostel there too. The Peace Corps hostel had bunk beds for volunteers when they came into Kuala Lumpur. It was a place they could, they could stay.

[Assistant] Now, did you have any voice in your assignment about either of who you might be teamed with, or where you would go or it was all assigned?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Not really. We were, uh, we were put up for different parts of the time until we were ready to go off to our different assignments. I mentioned that there were 66 of us that made it through the, uh, the training. Only 17 of us actually stayed in Malaya. The rest of the group set off to Sabah and Sarawak. And so I think after 1 or 2 days, that group left for Sabah and Sarawak and the 17 of us would gradually go off to our assignments.

[Assistant] So you may have stayed in a hotel or something in Kuala Lumpur until you found your assignment?

[User] I think it was a hotel, although there was a Peace Corps hostel there too. The Peace Corps hostel had bunk beds for volunteers when they came into Kuala Lumpur. It was a place they could, they could stay.

[Assistant] Now, did you have any voice in your assignment about either of who you might be teamed with, or where you would go or it was all assigned?

[User]
No, I had no, uh, involvement in the assignment, the, partly because I had had some training in soil science when I was at the university. They decided that I would be seconded to the Department of Agriculture and work on soil surveying. I would become a soil surveyor. There were two Peace Corps soil surveyors that were there ahead of me, and they were both completing their assignments and leaving. And so both had very positive experiences. And partly because of this previous training in soil science, although I knew nothing about tropical soils, I was assigned to the Soil Survey Division of the Department of Agriculture, which, as I mentioned, was very different than from what I had been trained in. [tape break]

My assignment, and the short answer was no. I had no role in choosing the assignment. On the other hand, the assignment was not specifically what I had been trained for because it involved assignment to a rural town where I would be one of two people that were involved in conducting and mapping agricultural soils in the center part of the country.

[Assistant] The question, you said you were the third, two preceded you with soils?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I think it was a hotel, although there was a Peace Corps hostel there too. The Peace Corps hostel had bunk beds for volunteers when they came into Kuala Lumpur. It was a place they could, they could stay.

[Assistant] Now, did you have any voice in your assignment about either of who you might be teamed with, or where you would go or it was all assigned?

[User]
No, I had no, uh, involvement in the assignment, the, partly because I had had some training in soil science when I was at the university. They decided that I would be seconded to the Department of Agriculture and work on soil surveying. I would become a soil surveyor. There were two Peace Corps soil surveyors that were there ahead of me, and they were both completing their assignments and leaving. And so both had very positive experiences. And partly because of this previous training in soil science, although I knew nothing about tropical soils, I was assigned to the Soil Survey Division of the Department of Agriculture, which, as I mentioned, was very different than from what I had been trained in. [tape break]

My assignment, and the short answer was no. I had no role in choosing the assignment. On the other hand, the assignment was not specifically what I had been trained for because it involved assignment to a rural town where I would be one of two people that were involved in conducting and mapping agricultural soils in the center part of the country.

[Assistant] The question, you said you were the third, two preceded you with soils?

[User] Correct.

[Assistant] Were they still there when you arrived?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User]
No, I had no, uh, involvement in the assignment, the, partly because I had had some training in soil science when I was at the university. They decided that I would be seconded to the Department of Agriculture and work on soil surveying. I would become a soil surveyor. There were two Peace Corps soil surveyors that were there ahead of me, and they were both completing their assignments and leaving. And so both had very positive experiences. And partly because of this previous training in soil science, although I knew nothing about tropical soils, I was assigned to the Soil Survey Division of the Department of Agriculture, which, as I mentioned, was very different than from what I had been trained in. [tape break]

My assignment, and the short answer was no. I had no role in choosing the assignment. On the other hand, the assignment was not specifically what I had been trained for because it involved assignment to a rural town where I would be one of two people that were involved in conducting and mapping agricultural soils in the center part of the country.

[Assistant] The question, you said you were the third, two preceded you with soils?

[User] Correct.

[Assistant] Were they still there when you arrived?

[User] One was there, just leaving. The other had just left.

[Assistant] Did you have a chance to talk to this person or not really?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Correct.

[Assistant] Were they still there when you arrived?

[User] One was there, just leaving. The other had just left.

[Assistant] Did you have a chance to talk to this person or not really?

[User] Uh, I talked to him on the phone. He was stationed in a different city, Kuantan, over on the east coast.

[Assistant] So is that helpful at all or not that you remember?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] One was there, just leaving. The other had just left.

[Assistant] Did you have a chance to talk to this person or not really?

[User] Uh, I talked to him on the phone. He was stationed in a different city, Kuantan, over on the east coast.

[Assistant] So is that helpful at all or not that you remember?

[User] Not really. In part because it really, the phone call really just had to do with arranging for the transfer of some equipment and things of that sort. I was assigned to a counterpart, uh, Malaysian, who eventually then went on to become the soil correlator for the entire peninsula of Malaya. But he and I then shared an office and basically taught me what I needed to know about carrying out a soil survey.

[Assistant] Now you said there were two of you that did soil survey, is that correct?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Uh, I talked to him on the phone. He was stationed in a different city, Kuantan, over on the east coast.

[Assistant] So is that helpful at all or not that you remember?

[User] Not really. In part because it really, the phone call really just had to do with arranging for the transfer of some equipment and things of that sort. I was assigned to a counterpart, uh, Malaysian, who eventually then went on to become the soil correlator for the entire peninsula of Malaya. But he and I then shared an office and basically taught me what I needed to know about carrying out a soil survey.

[Assistant] Now you said there were two of you that did soil survey, is that correct?

[User] In this one office.

[Assistant] Were there not two volunteers, or wasn't there another volunteer you said that was assigned to a similar assignment to you or not?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Not really. In part because it really, the phone call really just had to do with arranging for the transfer of some equipment and things of that sort. I was assigned to a counterpart, uh, Malaysian, who eventually then went on to become the soil correlator for the entire peninsula of Malaya. But he and I then shared an office and basically taught me what I needed to know about carrying out a soil survey.

[Assistant] Now you said there were two of you that did soil survey, is that correct?

[User] In this one office.

[Assistant] Were there not two volunteers, or wasn't there another volunteer you said that was assigned to a similar assignment to you or not?

[User] Not at the time that I was there. I was the only one. There had been two previous to my arrival that had carried on soil survey work.

[Assistant] Okay. So then how far away was this village from Kuala Lumpur to where you had to go? Or how many hours?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] In this one office.

[Assistant] Were there not two volunteers, or wasn't there another volunteer you said that was assigned to a similar assignment to you or not?

[User] Not at the time that I was there. I was the only one. There had been two previous to my arrival that had carried on soil survey work.

[Assistant] Okay. So then how far away was this village from Kuala Lumpur to where you had to go? Or how many hours?

[User] The town was called Raub. It was in the central highlands and it was about 90 miles away, or four hours by bus.

[Assistant] Would you spell that for us?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Not at the time that I was there. I was the only one. There had been two previous to my arrival that had carried on soil survey work.

[Assistant] Okay. So then how far away was this village from Kuala Lumpur to where you had to go? Or how many hours?

[User] The town was called Raub. It was in the central highlands and it was about 90 miles away, or four hours by bus.

[Assistant] Would you spell that for us?

[User] R-A-U-B.

[Assistant] And did you go by bus then, four hours?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] The town was called Raub. It was in the central highlands and it was about 90 miles away, or four hours by bus.

[Assistant] Would you spell that for us?

[User] R-A-U-B.

[Assistant] And did you go by bus then, four hours?

[User] I did.

[Assistant] Do you have any anecdotes about that bus trip? Was that your first?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] R-A-U-B.

[Assistant] And did you go by bus then, four hours?

[User] I did.

[Assistant] Do you have any anecdotes about that bus trip? Was that your first?

[User] Well, it was my first bus trip in, yes, in Malaysia, and because it was in the mountains, there were a lot of switchbacks and in terms of getting there. Once I got to Malaysia or I got to Raub and got to the soil survey office that had been set up, uh, there was a Land Rover and there were, uh, the railroad would go close by route and I was given a set of tickets where I could write myself tickets to take myself and my crew up to where I needed to get off to do soil search. So transportation actually wasn't a problem. Although I do recall that four hour bus ride.

[Assistant] Tell us a little bit about that.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I did.

[Assistant] Do you have any anecdotes about that bus trip? Was that your first?

[User] Well, it was my first bus trip in, yes, in Malaysia, and because it was in the mountains, there were a lot of switchbacks and in terms of getting there. Once I got to Malaysia or I got to Raub and got to the soil survey office that had been set up, uh, there was a Land Rover and there were, uh, the railroad would go close by route and I was given a set of tickets where I could write myself tickets to take myself and my crew up to where I needed to get off to do soil search. So transportation actually wasn't a problem. Although I do recall that four hour bus ride.

[Assistant] Tell us a little bit about that.

[User] Well, the, uh, there are a lot of switchbacks. Actually, quickly what I learned was that in Malaysia, uh, you don't really need to take the bus on these long trips because they have taxis where you can go to the taxi station in Kuala Lumpur, and you can buy a seat in one of these old Mercedes, uh, diesel taxis. You may have to sit there for an hour or two until they filled up the taxi. But then that taxi would take people to your city or cities nearby, and they could do that four hour trip in about 2.5 hours. Uh, again, it's advisable to have a little Dramamine and do that because they're driving pretty fast. And so the curves are pretty exciting.

[Assistant] So was it a fairly exciting bus trip that you had, the four hour one with the switchbacks?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, it was my first bus trip in, yes, in Malaysia, and because it was in the mountains, there were a lot of switchbacks and in terms of getting there. Once I got to Malaysia or I got to Raub and got to the soil survey office that had been set up, uh, there was a Land Rover and there were, uh, the railroad would go close by route and I was given a set of tickets where I could write myself tickets to take myself and my crew up to where I needed to get off to do soil search. So transportation actually wasn't a problem. Although I do recall that four hour bus ride.

[Assistant] Tell us a little bit about that.

[User] Well, the, uh, there are a lot of switchbacks. Actually, quickly what I learned was that in Malaysia, uh, you don't really need to take the bus on these long trips because they have taxis where you can go to the taxi station in Kuala Lumpur, and you can buy a seat in one of these old Mercedes, uh, diesel taxis. You may have to sit there for an hour or two until they filled up the taxi. But then that taxi would take people to your city or cities nearby, and they could do that four hour trip in about 2.5 hours. Uh, again, it's advisable to have a little Dramamine and do that because they're driving pretty fast. And so the curves are pretty exciting.

[Assistant] So was it a fairly exciting bus trip that you had, the four hour one with the switchbacks?

[User] That was a little bit slower. I mean, the bus was crowded. It was hot. Uh, but when you're in a country for the first time, it's all new and very exciting. And so, uh, I don't recall that I particularly regretted the trip or thought it was uncomfortable.

[Assistant] So it's fairly mountainous then in the switchbacks of that?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, the, uh, there are a lot of switchbacks. Actually, quickly what I learned was that in Malaysia, uh, you don't really need to take the bus on these long trips because they have taxis where you can go to the taxi station in Kuala Lumpur, and you can buy a seat in one of these old Mercedes, uh, diesel taxis. You may have to sit there for an hour or two until they filled up the taxi. But then that taxi would take people to your city or cities nearby, and they could do that four hour trip in about 2.5 hours. Uh, again, it's advisable to have a little Dramamine and do that because they're driving pretty fast. And so the curves are pretty exciting.

[Assistant] So was it a fairly exciting bus trip that you had, the four hour one with the switchbacks?

[User] That was a little bit slower. I mean, the bus was crowded. It was hot. Uh, but when you're in a country for the first time, it's all new and very exciting. And so, uh, I don't recall that I particularly regretted the trip or thought it was uncomfortable.

[Assistant] So it's fairly mountainous then in the switchbacks of that?

[User] Oh yes. The main range of, uh, that goes down basically the spine of the Malay Peninsula, that's, it's about the same size and shape as Florida, except there's this mountain range towards the middle, uh, that goes up to about 70,000 feet. And so the town that I was assigned to, Raub, was in the foothills of the range, at about 500 ft. And that turned out to be an advantage, because it's actually a little bit cooler than all of the coastal towns.

[Assistant] About how big of a town was it roughly, would you say?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] That was a little bit slower. I mean, the bus was crowded. It was hot. Uh, but when you're in a country for the first time, it's all new and very exciting. And so, uh, I don't recall that I particularly regretted the trip or thought it was uncomfortable.

[Assistant] So it's fairly mountainous then in the switchbacks of that?

[User] Oh yes. The main range of, uh, that goes down basically the spine of the Malay Peninsula, that's, it's about the same size and shape as Florida, except there's this mountain range towards the middle, uh, that goes up to about 70,000 feet. And so the town that I was assigned to, Raub, was in the foothills of the range, at about 500 ft. And that turned out to be an advantage, because it's actually a little bit cooler than all of the coastal towns.

[Assistant] About how big of a town was it roughly, would you say?

[User] I would say it was probably about 10,000 people.

[Assistant] So a decent sized town.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh yes. The main range of, uh, that goes down basically the spine of the Malay Peninsula, that's, it's about the same size and shape as Florida, except there's this mountain range towards the middle, uh, that goes up to about 70,000 feet. And so the town that I was assigned to, Raub, was in the foothills of the range, at about 500 ft. And that turned out to be an advantage, because it's actually a little bit cooler than all of the coastal towns.

[Assistant] About how big of a town was it roughly, would you say?

[User] I would say it was probably about 10,000 people.

[Assistant] So a decent sized town.

[User] It was, yes. It had two and a half main streets. It had three cinemas, had a roundabout, had a government guest house. And working for the Malaysian Department of Agriculture, I was treated as a division one government officer. So I was entitled to government quarters and to the perks, essentially, that government officers get.

[Assistant] So what were your quarters like?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I would say it was probably about 10,000 people.

[Assistant] So a decent sized town.

[User] It was, yes. It had two and a half main streets. It had three cinemas, had a roundabout, had a government guest house. And working for the Malaysian Department of Agriculture, I was treated as a division one government officer. So I was entitled to government quarters and to the perks, essentially, that government officers get.

[Assistant] So what were your quarters like?

[User] I was given a, an apartment in an old, uh, apartment building, essentially, that the government had foreclosed on. It had six rooms, of which I only needed one, and at later time several people came, Malaysians came to work at the soil survey office where I was assigned, and I would let them stay in the other rooms. I stayed in one that was sort of out back and kind of faced a vacant lot where timber was dried. And it was a public lot with people coming and going at all hours of the night. So it was interesting to look out my balcony and see the back alley of Raub and all of the activities that occur in the middle of the night.

[Assistant] What kind of activities would be?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I was given a, an apartment in an old, uh, apartment building, essentially, that the government had foreclosed on. It had six rooms, of which I only needed one, and at later time several people came, Malaysians came to work at the soil survey office where I was assigned, and I would let them stay in the other rooms. I stayed in one that was sort of out back and kind of faced a vacant lot where timber was dried. And it was a public lot with people coming and going at all hours of the night. So it was interesting to look out my balcony and see the back alley of Raub and all of the activities that occur in the middle of the night.

[Assistant] What kind of activities would be?

[User]
Oh, all kinds of things. Uh, very often, uh, the shopkeepers who would have the, uh, living quarters on the second floor of their shops on Main Street would come to the back of their house, and they had been out drinking all night, and at 2:00 in the morning, they'd be banging on the door for their wives to let them in.

Uh, there was a, there was a mad lady that lived in this kind of, uh, vacant lot. Uh, she was an old Chinese lady, uh, mad as a hatter. People would feed her. She would sort of sleep in, uh, under the boards and that were being dried, uh. And she would come over and look up at me on the balcony when I would have to go to the, there was a bathroom that basically right next to my bedroom. But I would have to go along this balcony and she would look at me, and I don't know what she was saying, but she would scold me and she would yell and scream and point at me, and everybody ignored her. As I say, they, uh, in the mornings they would, she would go along Main Street and people would give her food.

[Assistant] Now, were you there the whole two years in this?

[User] I was there the whole two years.

[Assistant] Was she there the whole two years?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User]
Oh, all kinds of things. Uh, very often, uh, the shopkeepers who would have the, uh, living quarters on the second floor of their shops on Main Street would come to the back of their house, and they had been out drinking all night, and at 2:00 in the morning, they'd be banging on the door for their wives to let them in.

Uh, there was a, there was a mad lady that lived in this kind of, uh, vacant lot. Uh, she was an old Chinese lady, uh, mad as a hatter. People would feed her. She would sort of sleep in, uh, under the boards and that were being dried, uh. And she would come over and look up at me on the balcony when I would have to go to the, there was a bathroom that basically right next to my bedroom. But I would have to go along this balcony and she would look at me, and I don't know what she was saying, but she would scold me and she would yell and scream and point at me, and everybody ignored her. As I say, they, uh, in the mornings they would, she would go along Main Street and people would give her food.

[Assistant] Now, were you there the whole two years in this?

[User] I was there the whole two years.

[Assistant] Was she there the whole two years?

[User] I think so, yes, I think so. Uh, I had been, hadn't been told that there had been a Peace Corps volunteer that had been assigned to Raub prior to my being there. But he had tried to open some, I think he was a teacher, a youth club of some sort, and it hadn't gone very well. And so he actually had to leave early. So.

[Assistant] Remember the story of that? What happened?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I was there the whole two years.

[Assistant] Was she there the whole two years?

[User] I think so, yes, I think so. Uh, I had been, hadn't been told that there had been a Peace Corps volunteer that had been assigned to Raub prior to my being there. But he had tried to open some, I think he was a teacher, a youth club of some sort, and it hadn't gone very well. And so he actually had to leave early. So.

[Assistant] Remember the story of that? What happened?

[User] I had no, that was, that is about as much as I ever knew, what I was told by local people. Oh, uh, you know, they, they had had a Peace Corps volunteer there, and it hadn't worked out.

[Assistant] Now, this, were there any other Peace Corps volunteers nearby you at all?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I think so, yes, I think so. Uh, I had been, hadn't been told that there had been a Peace Corps volunteer that had been assigned to Raub prior to my being there. But he had tried to open some, I think he was a teacher, a youth club of some sort, and it hadn't gone very well. And so he actually had to leave early. So.

[Assistant] Remember the story of that? What happened?

[User] I had no, that was, that is about as much as I ever knew, what I was told by local people. Oh, uh, you know, they, they had had a Peace Corps volunteer there, and it hadn't worked out.

[Assistant] Now, this, were there any other Peace Corps volunteers nearby you at all?

[User] Later on, after one year, there was one young man who was sent to teach industrial arts in the local school. And then about six months before I left, there were, there was a Peace Corps couple that came to teach also in the local school. And then finally, uh, a month before I left, there was a fellow who came to work on TB. So when I first arrived, there were no Peace Corps volunteers. And then when I left, there were four.

[Assistant] Now, were there other Europeans in the area or?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I had no, that was, that is about as much as I ever knew, what I was told by local people. Oh, uh, you know, they, they had had a Peace Corps volunteer there, and it hadn't worked out.

[Assistant] Now, this, were there any other Peace Corps volunteers nearby you at all?

[User] Later on, after one year, there was one young man who was sent to teach industrial arts in the local school. And then about six months before I left, there were, there was a Peace Corps couple that came to teach also in the local school. And then finally, uh, a month before I left, there was a fellow who came to work on TB. So when I first arrived, there were no Peace Corps volunteers. And then when I left, there were four.

[Assistant] Now, were there other Europeans in the area or?

[User] Yes. Uh, there was an American missionary couple, uh, that was looking after a church in town. There were, uh, there was the British, uh, bank manager of the local bank there. I think that's pretty much it.

[Assistant] Now, did that color people's perception of you, do you think, this previous volunteer that had to leave or?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Later on, after one year, there was one young man who was sent to teach industrial arts in the local school. And then about six months before I left, there were, there was a Peace Corps couple that came to teach also in the local school. And then finally, uh, a month before I left, there was a fellow who came to work on TB. So when I first arrived, there were no Peace Corps volunteers. And then when I left, there were four.

[Assistant] Now, were there other Europeans in the area or?

[User] Yes. Uh, there was an American missionary couple, uh, that was looking after a church in town. There were, uh, there was the British, uh, bank manager of the local bank there. I think that's pretty much it.

[Assistant] Now, did that color people's perception of you, do you think, this previous volunteer that had to leave or?

[User] I don't think so. My job was to work with basically this federal, uh, soil survey project. It didn't involve me interacting, uh, professionally with the townspeople. I ate, uh, in the local shops, uh, when I was not out in the jungle, but I had no interaction that formed any sort of reaction on the people.

[Assistant] Now, many volunteers report having a cook or somebody do laundry. Did you have anything like that in your situation?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes. Uh, there was an American missionary couple, uh, that was looking after a church in town. There were, uh, there was the British, uh, bank manager of the local bank there. I think that's pretty much it.

[Assistant] Now, did that color people's perception of you, do you think, this previous volunteer that had to leave or?

[User] I don't think so. My job was to work with basically this federal, uh, soil survey project. It didn't involve me interacting, uh, professionally with the townspeople. I ate, uh, in the local shops, uh, when I was not out in the jungle, but I had no interaction that formed any sort of reaction on the people.

[Assistant] Now, many volunteers report having a cook or somebody do laundry. Did you have anything like that in your situation?

[User] I had a young girl that would come and collect my laundry, and I, of course, would pay her and she would bring it back all nicely cleaned and pressed. She didn't know what she was getting into when we made the initial agreement, in part because when we worked in the jungle and you live in the same clothes for five or 6 or 8 days at a time, they come back pretty dirty. And so when she, after a couple of times, she insisted on renegotiating her agreement.

[Assistant] So tell us a little bit about, uh, working in the jungle or and combined with your office work. So there was some office work and some jungle or maybe?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I don't think so. My job was to work with basically this federal, uh, soil survey project. It didn't involve me interacting, uh, professionally with the townspeople. I ate, uh, in the local shops, uh, when I was not out in the jungle, but I had no interaction that formed any sort of reaction on the people.

[Assistant] Now, many volunteers report having a cook or somebody do laundry. Did you have anything like that in your situation?

[User] I had a young girl that would come and collect my laundry, and I, of course, would pay her and she would bring it back all nicely cleaned and pressed. She didn't know what she was getting into when we made the initial agreement, in part because when we worked in the jungle and you live in the same clothes for five or 6 or 8 days at a time, they come back pretty dirty. And so when she, after a couple of times, she insisted on renegotiating her agreement.

[Assistant] So tell us a little bit about, uh, working in the jungle or and combined with your office work. So there was some office work and some jungle or maybe?

[User] We had a soil survey office where, uh, for the first year, I had this counterpart, uh, Malaysian, who had been trained in soil survey and was quite experienced. At the end of that first year, he returned to Kuala Lumpur to take up this role of coordinator for all soil survey offices around the country. So I was in charge of this office, which included a Malay assistant, a Chinese assistant, an office boy.

[Assistant] Now, in charge, was the second year or this was the first year?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I had a young girl that would come and collect my laundry, and I, of course, would pay her and she would bring it back all nicely cleaned and pressed. She didn't know what she was getting into when we made the initial agreement, in part because when we worked in the jungle and you live in the same clothes for five or 6 or 8 days at a time, they come back pretty dirty. And so when she, after a couple of times, she insisted on renegotiating her agreement.

[Assistant] So tell us a little bit about, uh, working in the jungle or and combined with your office work. So there was some office work and some jungle or maybe?

[User] We had a soil survey office where, uh, for the first year, I had this counterpart, uh, Malaysian, who had been trained in soil survey and was quite experienced. At the end of that first year, he returned to Kuala Lumpur to take up this role of coordinator for all soil survey offices around the country. So I was in charge of this office, which included a Malay assistant, a Chinese assistant, an office boy.

[Assistant] Now, in charge, was the second year or this was the first year?

[User] Second year.

[Assistant] Okay. Let's say the first year right now. Did your counterpart speak English?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] We had a soil survey office where, uh, for the first year, I had this counterpart, uh, Malaysian, who had been trained in soil survey and was quite experienced. At the end of that first year, he returned to Kuala Lumpur to take up this role of coordinator for all soil survey offices around the country. So I was in charge of this office, which included a Malay assistant, a Chinese assistant, an office boy.

[Assistant] Now, in charge, was the second year or this was the first year?

[User] Second year.

[Assistant] Okay. Let's say the first year right now. Did your counterpart speak English?

[User] Oh, yes. Yes, he was Chinese, and English was, uh, the language basically of anyone at that level of government service.

[Assistant] So did you need your Malaysian language much or?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Second year.

[Assistant] Okay. Let's say the first year right now. Did your counterpart speak English?

[User] Oh, yes. Yes, he was Chinese, and English was, uh, the language basically of anyone at that level of government service.

[Assistant] So did you need your Malaysian language much or?

[User] I did, because when I would go into the jungle, it would be for a week or two weeks at a time. And the only people that would be with me were Malay speaking laborers.

[Assistant] How about your coworker? Would he be with you, your partner?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh, yes. Yes, he was Chinese, and English was, uh, the language basically of anyone at that level of government service.

[Assistant] So did you need your Malaysian language much or?

[User] I did, because when I would go into the jungle, it would be for a week or two weeks at a time. And the only people that would be with me were Malay speaking laborers.

[Assistant] How about your coworker? Would he be with you, your partner?

[User] Not after the first time. We went in together the first time, uh, so that he, in fact, showed me what the procedure was, how we would sample the soil, and how we would use that information, especially to make a map. But after that one time, I was on my own.

[Assistant] And how did that go, say, especially early on?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I did, because when I would go into the jungle, it would be for a week or two weeks at a time. And the only people that would be with me were Malay speaking laborers.

[Assistant] How about your coworker? Would he be with you, your partner?

[User] Not after the first time. We went in together the first time, uh, so that he, in fact, showed me what the procedure was, how we would sample the soil, and how we would use that information, especially to make a map. But after that one time, I was on my own.

[Assistant] And how did that go, say, especially early on?

[User]
It went all right. Uh, there's a good reason that, in fact, people aren't flocking to map soils in the Malaysian jungle. And that is this, it's sticky, boring work. Uh, it's, you are literally drenched with sweat from morning to night. You're soaked from stepping into streams at the bottoms of hills. And, uh, it's, uh, it's, uh, it's actually not a very pleasant experience. It's, it's sort of boring.

Uh, the evenings are interesting because the jungle, although it's still warm, it becomes more animated at night. Most of the animals in tropical jungles are nocturnal. Uh, the elephants, the wildlife, move around at night. During the day, the only thing that's moving around are the leeches who are after you as you stand there trying to make notes. You can see them, they're like little inchworms heading towards you.

[Assistant] Are they attracted to the heat or?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Not after the first time. We went in together the first time, uh, so that he, in fact, showed me what the procedure was, how we would sample the soil, and how we would use that information, especially to make a map. But after that one time, I was on my own.

[Assistant] And how did that go, say, especially early on?

[User]
It went all right. Uh, there's a good reason that, in fact, people aren't flocking to map soils in the Malaysian jungle. And that is this, it's sticky, boring work. Uh, it's, you are literally drenched with sweat from morning to night. You're soaked from stepping into streams at the bottoms of hills. And, uh, it's, uh, it's, uh, it's actually not a very pleasant experience. It's, it's sort of boring.

Uh, the evenings are interesting because the jungle, although it's still warm, it becomes more animated at night. Most of the animals in tropical jungles are nocturnal. Uh, the elephants, the wildlife, move around at night. During the day, the only thing that's moving around are the leeches who are after you as you stand there trying to make notes. You can see them, they're like little inchworms heading towards you.

[Assistant] Are they attracted to the heat or?

[User] They are, I think they're attracted to the heat, yes. And although they were not large leeches, they are not buffalo leeches like you get in the paddies, they, uh, they get into your boot, canvas boots were what we wore in the jungle, and they gorge themselves. And very often you didn't know that you had a leech until the side of your boot started sort of turning red because they inject an anticoagulant. And even though they drop off, the little hole that they bore in you still continues to bleed a bit.

[Assistant] Now, how would you get them off if you wanted them off before they dropped you off? Did you have to use salt or something?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] They are, I think they're attracted to the heat, yes. And although they were not large leeches, they are not buffalo leeches like you get in the paddies, they, uh, they get into your boot, canvas boots were what we wore in the jungle, and they gorge themselves. And very often you didn't know that you had a leech until the side of your boot started sort of turning red because they inject an anticoagulant. And even though they drop off, the little hole that they bore in you still continues to bleed a bit.

[Assistant] Now, how would you get them off if you wanted them off before they dropped you off? Did you have to use salt or something?

[User] Salt is, uh, was commonly used. Uh, tobacco was commonly used. Uh, my experience was I always had a little hunting knife and I could just kind of scrape them off, and they would irritate me enough that I would take the trouble to cut them in half, which just made two of them, but rather messy. I tried using a match, for example, too but that, that was really just true colors.

[Assistant] You don't have to worry about them leaving any mouthparts in you or anything like that, like with a tick?

[User] Well, you do have to worry about that. You don't, uh. You know, you have to be a little bit careful in terms of. Actually, as I recall, I used to carry a little bottle of iodine and a drop of iodine.

[Assistant] So describe a little bit about the work. You would just go to a spot, get some soil, and go, uh, 100 yards away or?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I didn't have a transit. Uh, I had a compass. And what we would do is prior to actually going out and recording soil samples at eight, one eighth of a mile intervals, we would have the laborers chain off the distances. They would take a surveyor's chain, and they would put a stick at a certain intervals along what was called the rentis, which is, uh, which is the survey line. And then they would come out and then, uh, my colleague and I then would go in on that same track. They have to make measurements, but we would always know where we were because the track was done previous to the survey.

[Assistant] And were you living in a tent or how did you live when you're out in the jungle?

[User] Well, a tent would be too hot at night. They had what were called camp stretchers, which basically is just a rectangular piece of canvas. And the laborers would cut sticks that would create a little sort of sloping roof that would go over then, uh, a canvas thing you will use for your, uh, your bed. That would be also with sticks put up, uh, a little bit above ground level. You don't really want to be on the ground with all the critters in the jungle.

[Assistant] Any critter stories?

[User] Nothing of any great note. Uh, we would keep, I would usually, uh, have 3 or 4 laborers that were also staying in the camp, and so any large animal that would come along would see that indeed there were more people there than that the animal want to tackle. We had, we did wake up and see tiger tracks around the camp where the tiger, you know, sort of surveyed things and decided that's not what he wanted to.

[Assistant] Was that fairly dangerous? I think you might need somebody with a, with a gun handy or not?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] This fine, fine mist. And of course, I had this canvas over the top of my little cot.

[Assistant] You know, I picture biting ants and all sorts of rainforest things, like scorpions.

[User] I took, uh, a mosquito net in the first few times. [cat meows] I should strangle my cat. [laughs] Um, but I found that working in the primary jungle, particularly working in an area that's not close to human habitation, mosquitoes are not a problem. Mosquitoes go after warm blooded animals, and the tropical jungle is actually a pretty sterile place. There aren't a lot of big, warm blooded animals in high densities. Only when you get to places where there are villages where people go along paths, then you get a lot of mosquitos. And with the leeches too, for that matter.

[Assistant] What about poisonous snakes, like that?

[User]
There was. [phone rings] Okay. [tape break]

Uh, no problem with poisonous snakes. Poisonous snakes are normally water snakes. I was working in kind of highland areas. You might see, I did see a python, which is a very beautiful snake. And the skin is worth a lot of money. The laborers were delighted. The snake was all sort of coiled up by the side of the path. And at first I thought it was dead, because one of the laborers kicked the snake and it didn't move. Later took out his parang, his machete, and cut one of the coils that was a kind on top of the pile of the snake, and essentially about that much, about a foot of his tail was sliced off. And the rest of the snake kind of gave a lurch and kind of moseyed off into the, into the jungle without the benefit of his tail.

[Assistant] So now you were up a little bit in the highlands. Right now we're at sea level, so it wasn't as humid as it could have been?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] That's correct. It was, it was plenty humid in the jungle. Uh, yeah. We were going up and down hill all the time, and so we were warm, but the temperatures were a little bit milder than what you'd get at sea level.

[Assistant] Okay. I also, you know, you hear stories about the Amazon with various biting insects and all that particularly. Run into that in the rainforest?

[User] No, not a, not a problem. Again, the objective is to go into the jungle just as soon as the traverse line has been cut and chained off. The laborers would cut their way through the jungle. What you find is if you wait too long, then all the animals in the jungle use that trail as well. And if they use that trail, the tigers, the barking deer, other mammals, uh, will attract then mosquitoes and will attract leeches. But if you get in right away, essentially before the animals are using that trailways.

[Assistant] What would you eat while you're off on what safari? Ten, ten days or so you'd say you were off?

[User] Well, anywhere from four to, I think the longest was probably about ten days. Uh. And I would what the laborers ate. I would bring along, well, I'd bring along some tins and cans of, uh, beef stew. They would cook rice. They would also cook little fried fish. They would fry up some fish, put the spices in. And I found I could live on that quite well.

[Assistant] And were the fish from the jungle or are they brought from?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, not a, not a problem. Again, the objective is to go into the jungle just as soon as the traverse line has been cut and chained off. The laborers would cut their way through the jungle. What you find is if you wait too long, then all the animals in the jungle use that trail as well. And if they use that trail, the tigers, the barking deer, other mammals, uh, will attract then mosquitoes and will attract leeches. But if you get in right away, essentially before the animals are using that trailways.

[Assistant] What would you eat while you're off on what safari? Ten, ten days or so you'd say you were off?

[User] Well, anywhere from four to, I think the longest was probably about ten days. Uh. And I would what the laborers ate. I would bring along, well, I'd bring along some tins and cans of, uh, beef stew. They would cook rice. They would also cook little fried fish. They would fry up some fish, put the spices in. And I found I could live on that quite well.

[Assistant] And were the fish from the jungle or are they brought from?

[User] No, no, they were dried fish that they brought from the market in town. And they would, of course, bring rice. And so they would have a little bit of rice left over from the night before for breakfast. We would stop once for lunch, but basically it was just a cup of tea with lots of condensed milk in it. And then have a reasonable size dinner.

[Assistant] Now in the areas you worked in the jungle, were there people there already living or is it not?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, anywhere from four to, I think the longest was probably about ten days. Uh. And I would what the laborers ate. I would bring along, well, I'd bring along some tins and cans of, uh, beef stew. They would cook rice. They would also cook little fried fish. They would fry up some fish, put the spices in. And I found I could live on that quite well.

[Assistant] And were the fish from the jungle or are they brought from?

[User] No, no, they were dried fish that they brought from the market in town. And they would, of course, bring rice. And so they would have a little bit of rice left over from the night before for breakfast. We would stop once for lunch, but basically it was just a cup of tea with lots of condensed milk in it. And then have a reasonable size dinner.

[Assistant] Now in the areas you worked in the jungle, were there people there already living or is it not?

[User] There were relatively few people. This was an area that had been occupied by terrorists during the Malaysian emergency after World War II. Communists attacked the British in Malaysia and that emergency was declared over in 1955, but there were still remnants that were reported to be in the jungle. And so, for example, I was told I shouldn't wear jungle green outfit. I should report to a police station when I go into the jungle and then go out again. So they know that I'm working in the jungle. But the short answer was they were [inaudible].

[Assistant]
Did you ever run into any of these individuals in the jungle, as far as you know? [tape break]

Okay. Now, would you run into these Aboriginal groups or tell me a little bit about these Aboriginals?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, no, they were dried fish that they brought from the market in town. And they would, of course, bring rice. And so they would have a little bit of rice left over from the night before for breakfast. We would stop once for lunch, but basically it was just a cup of tea with lots of condensed milk in it. And then have a reasonable size dinner.

[Assistant] Now in the areas you worked in the jungle, were there people there already living or is it not?

[User] There were relatively few people. This was an area that had been occupied by terrorists during the Malaysian emergency after World War II. Communists attacked the British in Malaysia and that emergency was declared over in 1955, but there were still remnants that were reported to be in the jungle. And so, for example, I was told I shouldn't wear jungle green outfit. I should report to a police station when I go into the jungle and then go out again. So they know that I'm working in the jungle. But the short answer was they were [inaudible].

[Assistant]
Did you ever run into any of these individuals in the jungle, as far as you know? [tape break]

Okay. Now, would you run into these Aboriginal groups or tell me a little bit about these Aboriginals?

[User] Okay. Uh, in Malaya there are proto-Malay groups, groups that are, uh, fairly primitive, live in remote areas of the jungle that have their own villages. There are different groups of them. Some are still hunters and gatherers. Others have, uh, villages where they will raise crops for a while, and then the soil gets exhausted and they'll move to other areas of the jungle. So from time to time we would run into these groups of, uh. They were shorter in stature than the Malays and always very friendly and always very interested in what we were doing. I can remember going camping near one of their villages and being invited into their longhouse, where they'd dance and sing and put on quite a show.

[Assistant] Somebody that I talked to in Malaya talked about longhouses. Is this is the area where the long houses were, where you were?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] There were relatively few people. This was an area that had been occupied by terrorists during the Malaysian emergency after World War II. Communists attacked the British in Malaysia and that emergency was declared over in 1955, but there were still remnants that were reported to be in the jungle. And so, for example, I was told I shouldn't wear jungle green outfit. I should report to a police station when I go into the jungle and then go out again. So they know that I'm working in the jungle. But the short answer was they were [inaudible].

[Assistant]
Did you ever run into any of these individuals in the jungle, as far as you know? [tape break]

Okay. Now, would you run into these Aboriginal groups or tell me a little bit about these Aboriginals?

[User] Okay. Uh, in Malaya there are proto-Malay groups, groups that are, uh, fairly primitive, live in remote areas of the jungle that have their own villages. There are different groups of them. Some are still hunters and gatherers. Others have, uh, villages where they will raise crops for a while, and then the soil gets exhausted and they'll move to other areas of the jungle. So from time to time we would run into these groups of, uh. They were shorter in stature than the Malays and always very friendly and always very interested in what we were doing. I can remember going camping near one of their villages and being invited into their longhouse, where they'd dance and sing and put on quite a show.

[Assistant] Somebody that I talked to in Malaya talked about longhouses. Is this is the area where the long houses were, where you were?

[User] Well, there's longhouses, uh, among the, um, among these proto-Malay groups. But the long houses are more characteristic really of [inaudible]. Different groups than others.

[Assistant] Now, describe this longhouse, whether this is about.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Okay. Uh, in Malaya there are proto-Malay groups, groups that are, uh, fairly primitive, live in remote areas of the jungle that have their own villages. There are different groups of them. Some are still hunters and gatherers. Others have, uh, villages where they will raise crops for a while, and then the soil gets exhausted and they'll move to other areas of the jungle. So from time to time we would run into these groups of, uh. They were shorter in stature than the Malays and always very friendly and always very interested in what we were doing. I can remember going camping near one of their villages and being invited into their longhouse, where they'd dance and sing and put on quite a show.

[Assistant] Somebody that I talked to in Malaya talked about longhouses. Is this is the area where the long houses were, where you were?

[User] Well, there's longhouses, uh, among the, um, among these proto-Malay groups. But the long houses are more characteristic really of [inaudible]. Different groups than others.

[Assistant] Now, describe this longhouse, whether this is about.

[User] Well, it's, uh, bamboo, uh, up on stilts. Uh, uh, bamboo floor. Bamboo sides. Kind of thatch roof. And, uh, it's, it's, uh, probably 25, 30 feet long and maybe about, uh, seven feet wide, something like that. And you would have a number of these longhouses that make up the village. The young men would live in one. Different extended families lived in one.

[Assistant] Now, could you communicate with them? Do they speak the language you were taught?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, there's longhouses, uh, among the, um, among these proto-Malay groups. But the long houses are more characteristic really of [inaudible]. Different groups than others.

[Assistant] Now, describe this longhouse, whether this is about.

[User] Well, it's, uh, bamboo, uh, up on stilts. Uh, uh, bamboo floor. Bamboo sides. Kind of thatch roof. And, uh, it's, it's, uh, probably 25, 30 feet long and maybe about, uh, seven feet wide, something like that. And you would have a number of these longhouses that make up the village. The young men would live in one. Different extended families lived in one.

[Assistant] Now, could you communicate with them? Do they speak the language you were taught?

[User] Well, I was, uh, I had my Malay laborers with me and they could speak, uh, Malay very well, which the Aboriginal groups also understood.

[Assistant] And what kind of, you said they'd invite you for a meal? What kind of meal would you have?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, it's, uh, bamboo, uh, up on stilts. Uh, uh, bamboo floor. Bamboo sides. Kind of thatch roof. And, uh, it's, it's, uh, probably 25, 30 feet long and maybe about, uh, seven feet wide, something like that. And you would have a number of these longhouses that make up the village. The young men would live in one. Different extended families lived in one.

[Assistant] Now, could you communicate with them? Do they speak the language you were taught?

[User] Well, I was, uh, I had my Malay laborers with me and they could speak, uh, Malay very well, which the Aboriginal groups also understood.

[Assistant] And what kind of, you said they'd invite you for a meal? What kind of meal would you have?

[User] Well, we, we would have tea. We would always start off with tea. That's, you know, whenever you're invited into a home, the first question is, a cup of tea?

[Assistant] So hunter gatherers, they had tea.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, I was, uh, I had my Malay laborers with me and they could speak, uh, Malay very well, which the Aboriginal groups also understood.

[Assistant] And what kind of, you said they'd invite you for a meal? What kind of meal would you have?

[User] Well, we, we would have tea. We would always start off with tea. That's, you know, whenever you're invited into a home, the first question is, a cup of tea?

[Assistant] So hunter gatherers, they had tea.

[User] Yeah, they would have tea. And I would take along, although I didn't smoke. Well, actually, that's not entirely true. I would, uh, I did have these little short cigars if mosquitoes ever got to be a problem. A lot of cigar would keep the mosquitoes away. Would also knock me out for the night. But I would also take along some packs of cigarettes and pass them around to the Aborigines, and they were, they were just absolutely thrilled to have store bought cigarettes. They would roll their own tobacco cigarettes. So that was a form of making myself compatible with this, with these groups.

[Assistant] You say they roll their own. Was there tobacco in the jungle?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, we, we would have tea. We would always start off with tea. That's, you know, whenever you're invited into a home, the first question is, a cup of tea?

[Assistant] So hunter gatherers, they had tea.

[User] Yeah, they would have tea. And I would take along, although I didn't smoke. Well, actually, that's not entirely true. I would, uh, I did have these little short cigars if mosquitoes ever got to be a problem. A lot of cigar would keep the mosquitoes away. Would also knock me out for the night. But I would also take along some packs of cigarettes and pass them around to the Aborigines, and they were, they were just absolutely thrilled to have store bought cigarettes. They would roll their own tobacco cigarettes. So that was a form of making myself compatible with this, with these groups.

[Assistant] You say they roll their own. Was there tobacco in the jungle?

[User] Well, they would buy tobacco and then they would create cigarettes. But they were not, they were not Islamic. The Malays were Islamic. And so there were prohibitions against smoking for Muslims, the Malays. I remember asking one Aborigine if he was ever going to become a Malay. And he said, can't eat dog, can't eat guinea dog, can't eat pig. How can, man? In other words, he wasn't going to give up his diet that was forbidden.

[Assistant] Well, speaking of that, when you were with the Aboriginals, did you ever have dog as far as you know?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, they would have tea. And I would take along, although I didn't smoke. Well, actually, that's not entirely true. I would, uh, I did have these little short cigars if mosquitoes ever got to be a problem. A lot of cigar would keep the mosquitoes away. Would also knock me out for the night. But I would also take along some packs of cigarettes and pass them around to the Aborigines, and they were, they were just absolutely thrilled to have store bought cigarettes. They would roll their own tobacco cigarettes. So that was a form of making myself compatible with this, with these groups.

[Assistant] You say they roll their own. Was there tobacco in the jungle?

[User] Well, they would buy tobacco and then they would create cigarettes. But they were not, they were not Islamic. The Malays were Islamic. And so there were prohibitions against smoking for Muslims, the Malays. I remember asking one Aborigine if he was ever going to become a Malay. And he said, can't eat dog, can't eat guinea dog, can't eat pig. How can, man? In other words, he wasn't going to give up his diet that was forbidden.

[Assistant] Well, speaking of that, when you were with the Aboriginals, did you ever have dog as far as you know?

[User] Not so far as I know. We didn't have, as I say, we didn't have big meals with camp and go in and meet the headman and be introduced to his family. When you're in the jungle, there's not much to do. So both for Aborigine and for itinerant soil surveyors, it wasn't a terrible way to spend a couple of hours.

[Assistant] Now, how often might this happen that you'd do that?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, they would buy tobacco and then they would create cigarettes. But they were not, they were not Islamic. The Malays were Islamic. And so there were prohibitions against smoking for Muslims, the Malays. I remember asking one Aborigine if he was ever going to become a Malay. And he said, can't eat dog, can't eat guinea dog, can't eat pig. How can, man? In other words, he wasn't going to give up his diet that was forbidden.

[Assistant] Well, speaking of that, when you were with the Aboriginals, did you ever have dog as far as you know?

[User] Not so far as I know. We didn't have, as I say, we didn't have big meals with camp and go in and meet the headman and be introduced to his family. When you're in the jungle, there's not much to do. So both for Aborigine and for itinerant soil surveyors, it wasn't a terrible way to spend a couple of hours.

[Assistant] Now, how often might this happen that you'd do that?

[User] Oh, it only happened, uh, 2 or 3 times during the whole two years I was there.

[Assistant] Now, you were basically with your survey crew or soils crew.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Not so far as I know. We didn't have, as I say, we didn't have big meals with camp and go in and meet the headman and be introduced to his family. When you're in the jungle, there's not much to do. So both for Aborigine and for itinerant soil surveyors, it wasn't a terrible way to spend a couple of hours.

[Assistant] Now, how often might this happen that you'd do that?

[User] Oh, it only happened, uh, 2 or 3 times during the whole two years I was there.

[Assistant] Now, you were basically with your survey crew or soils crew.

[User] I was with my Malay laborers, who I would pick up from the local Malay villages for particular expeditions to go.

[Assistant] So they weren't government workers, so to speak.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh, it only happened, uh, 2 or 3 times during the whole two years I was there.

[Assistant] Now, you were basically with your survey crew or soils crew.

[User] I was with my Malay laborers, who I would pick up from the local Malay villages for particular expeditions to go.

[Assistant] So they weren't government workers, so to speak.

[User] They weren't government, no. They were, they were casual laborers that when we're planning. But they were from the same village and so got to know a number of these laborers that would carry equipment, they would carry camping gear, they would carry expedition.

[Assistant] Would they lay down these lines too for you then?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I was with my Malay laborers, who I would pick up from the local Malay villages for particular expeditions to go.

[Assistant] So they weren't government workers, so to speak.

[User] They weren't government, no. They were, they were casual laborers that when we're planning. But they were from the same village and so got to know a number of these laborers that would carry equipment, they would carry camping gear, they would carry expedition.

[Assistant] Would they lay down these lines too for you then?

[User] Yes, they would do that.

[Assistant] Was there much difficulty in training them to do this particular task?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] They weren't government, no. They were, they were casual laborers that when we're planning. But they were from the same village and so got to know a number of these laborers that would carry equipment, they would carry camping gear, they would carry expedition.

[Assistant] Would they lay down these lines too for you then?

[User] Yes, they would do that.

[Assistant] Was there much difficulty in training them to do this particular task?

[User] By the time I got there, they were all trained to do that. And then there was the, what, the old man who was basically in charge of all the laborers. One for 5 or 6. [inaudible] Six people. He arranged it. He would also arrange for the cutting of, traverse of, prior to.

[Assistant] Now, you mentioned the rains. Did they come almost daily or was there a monsoon season?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, they would do that.

[Assistant] Was there much difficulty in training them to do this particular task?

[User] By the time I got there, they were all trained to do that. And then there was the, what, the old man who was basically in charge of all the laborers. One for 5 or 6. [inaudible] Six people. He arranged it. He would also arrange for the cutting of, traverse of, prior to.

[Assistant] Now, you mentioned the rains. Did they come almost daily or was there a monsoon season?

[User] Yes, there were monsoon seasons. There was a, I think a southeast monsoon and a northwest monsoon. And so Malaysia actually had twoc, or Malaya had two rainy periods, one in, a small one in November. And then a more major one in late May, early June.

[Assistant] Would that affect your work at all?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] By the time I got there, they were all trained to do that. And then there was the, what, the old man who was basically in charge of all the laborers. One for 5 or 6. [inaudible] Six people. He arranged it. He would also arrange for the cutting of, traverse of, prior to.

[Assistant] Now, you mentioned the rains. Did they come almost daily or was there a monsoon season?

[User] Yes, there were monsoon seasons. There was a, I think a southeast monsoon and a northwest monsoon. And so Malaysia actually had twoc, or Malaya had two rainy periods, one in, a small one in November. And then a more major one in late May, early June.

[Assistant] Would that affect your work at all?

[User] We usually arrange so that we didn't go during that time. Just because it was not pleasant to be rained on while you were trying to make notes on quality and so forth.

[Assistant] So what would you typically do then during the monsoon times, go on vacation or?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, there were monsoon seasons. There was a, I think a southeast monsoon and a northwest monsoon. And so Malaysia actually had twoc, or Malaya had two rainy periods, one in, a small one in November. And then a more major one in late May, early June.

[Assistant] Would that affect your work at all?

[User] We usually arrange so that we didn't go during that time. Just because it was not pleasant to be rained on while you were trying to make notes on quality and so forth.

[Assistant] So what would you typically do then during the monsoon times, go on vacation or?

[User] Well, there was always plenty of work to do in the office after you collected this information. Our job was to create a soil survey, which included a map and report on the kinds of soils that we encountered. Part of our job then was to relate what we were seeing to what other soil surveyors were seeing in other parts of Malaya. So the soil correlator would get two or 3 or 4 of us from different parts of the country together, and we would compare notes. We would look at the same soil profile and talk about whether it's similar or dissimilar from things that these other soil surveyors are seeing happening.

[Assistant] So would you actually physically get together with these others?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] We usually arrange so that we didn't go during that time. Just because it was not pleasant to be rained on while you were trying to make notes on quality and so forth.

[Assistant] So what would you typically do then during the monsoon times, go on vacation or?

[User] Well, there was always plenty of work to do in the office after you collected this information. Our job was to create a soil survey, which included a map and report on the kinds of soils that we encountered. Part of our job then was to relate what we were seeing to what other soil surveyors were seeing in other parts of Malaya. So the soil correlator would get two or 3 or 4 of us from different parts of the country together, and we would compare notes. We would look at the same soil profile and talk about whether it's similar or dissimilar from things that these other soil surveyors are seeing happening.

[Assistant] So would you actually physically get together with these others?

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] In Kuala Lumpur then, would you all meet up?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, there was always plenty of work to do in the office after you collected this information. Our job was to create a soil survey, which included a map and report on the kinds of soils that we encountered. Part of our job then was to relate what we were seeing to what other soil surveyors were seeing in other parts of Malaya. So the soil correlator would get two or 3 or 4 of us from different parts of the country together, and we would compare notes. We would look at the same soil profile and talk about whether it's similar or dissimilar from things that these other soil surveyors are seeing happening.

[Assistant] So would you actually physically get together with these others?

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] In Kuala Lumpur then, would you all meet up?

[User] In Kuala Lumpur, but sometimes in the districts that other soil surveyors were doing, Kuantan on the east coast, and then taking a trip down there. And we would actually then go out into the rural area around that town and look at the soils that that person was doing. We went down to Johor, 2 or 3 of us, and looked at the soils that were being. The idea, of course, was to come up with a uniform categorization of the different soils.

[Assistant] Now these other soils people, were any other of them Peace Corps, or were you the only Peace Corps?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] In Kuala Lumpur then, would you all meet up?

[User] In Kuala Lumpur, but sometimes in the districts that other soil surveyors were doing, Kuantan on the east coast, and then taking a trip down there. And we would actually then go out into the rural area around that town and look at the soils that that person was doing. We went down to Johor, 2 or 3 of us, and looked at the soils that were being. The idea, of course, was to come up with a uniform categorization of the different soils.

[Assistant] Now these other soils people, were any other of them Peace Corps, or were you the only Peace Corps?

[User] I was the only Peace Corps volunteer. There were half a dozen, uh, Malaysian trained soil surveyors, and there were two Colombo Plan sort of surveyors. Colombo Plan being the British, well, actually the British, the British Commonwealth, uh, aid workers. So there were two people from New Zealand. I think there was one from Australia. That's all I can remember.

[Assistant] Now when you were out in the jungle, other than out there doing your work, would there be any leisure time? What would you do with any leisure time you had out there, or was there really wasn't any?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] In Kuala Lumpur, but sometimes in the districts that other soil surveyors were doing, Kuantan on the east coast, and then taking a trip down there. And we would actually then go out into the rural area around that town and look at the soils that that person was doing. We went down to Johor, 2 or 3 of us, and looked at the soils that were being. The idea, of course, was to come up with a uniform categorization of the different soils.

[Assistant] Now these other soils people, were any other of them Peace Corps, or were you the only Peace Corps?

[User] I was the only Peace Corps volunteer. There were half a dozen, uh, Malaysian trained soil surveyors, and there were two Colombo Plan sort of surveyors. Colombo Plan being the British, well, actually the British, the British Commonwealth, uh, aid workers. So there were two people from New Zealand. I think there was one from Australia. That's all I can remember.

[Assistant] Now when you were out in the jungle, other than out there doing your work, would there be any leisure time? What would you do with any leisure time you had out there, or was there really wasn't any?

[User] There was no leisure time when you were in the jungle. I mean, either you were mapping soils or you were resting at night. And so you would, uh, the first thing in the morning is that you put on your wet socks and wet boots and continue to, to map until middle or late afternoon and stop.

[Assistant] So things just wouldn't dry there for you in the jungles?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I was the only Peace Corps volunteer. There were half a dozen, uh, Malaysian trained soil surveyors, and there were two Colombo Plan sort of surveyors. Colombo Plan being the British, well, actually the British, the British Commonwealth, uh, aid workers. So there were two people from New Zealand. I think there was one from Australia. That's all I can remember.

[Assistant] Now when you were out in the jungle, other than out there doing your work, would there be any leisure time? What would you do with any leisure time you had out there, or was there really wasn't any?

[User] There was no leisure time when you were in the jungle. I mean, either you were mapping soils or you were resting at night. And so you would, uh, the first thing in the morning is that you put on your wet socks and wet boots and continue to, to map until middle or late afternoon and stop.

[Assistant] So things just wouldn't dry there for you in the jungles?

[User] There's no way that things would dry. There was plenty of water though. The nice thing was that there were streams. And so after a hot day of going through the jungle, you could cool off by sitting, usually you'd do this for a very big stream, so sit down and throw water over your head. No, they were nice and cool.

[Assistant] I could picture health problems, rashes, whatever from all that. Did you want to say anything about that?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] There was no leisure time when you were in the jungle. I mean, either you were mapping soils or you were resting at night. And so you would, uh, the first thing in the morning is that you put on your wet socks and wet boots and continue to, to map until middle or late afternoon and stop.

[Assistant] So things just wouldn't dry there for you in the jungles?

[User] There's no way that things would dry. There was plenty of water though. The nice thing was that there were streams. And so after a hot day of going through the jungle, you could cool off by sitting, usually you'd do this for a very big stream, so sit down and throw water over your head. No, they were nice and cool.

[Assistant] I could picture health problems, rashes, whatever from all that. Did you want to say anything about that?

[User] I didn't have a problem with that. I was, I think, uh, as healthy if not healthier during the two years that I was in the Peace Corps at any time in my life. Of course we received, uh, gamma globulin injections. We had anti-malarials that we took. We had penicillin or something. If ever it felt like we were getting some intestinal problems, we had pills that we could take and I never had a problem.

[Assistant] Did you very religiously boil your water?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] There's no way that things would dry. There was plenty of water though. The nice thing was that there were streams. And so after a hot day of going through the jungle, you could cool off by sitting, usually you'd do this for a very big stream, so sit down and throw water over your head. No, they were nice and cool.

[Assistant] I could picture health problems, rashes, whatever from all that. Did you want to say anything about that?

[User] I didn't have a problem with that. I was, I think, uh, as healthy if not healthier during the two years that I was in the Peace Corps at any time in my life. Of course we received, uh, gamma globulin injections. We had anti-malarials that we took. We had penicillin or something. If ever it felt like we were getting some intestinal problems, we had pills that we could take and I never had a problem.

[Assistant] Did you very religiously boil your water?

[User] Well, water would. Well, I would take tea. Everybody drank tea. And of course, with tea, even though the water was probably full of critters, by the time it was boiled it was certainly safe to drink. Uh, and then when we were in town, there was soda pop. There was Cokes, and there was even beer. [tape break]

[Assistant] Well, now it was Muslim, but they had beer there also?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I didn't have a problem with that. I was, I think, uh, as healthy if not healthier during the two years that I was in the Peace Corps at any time in my life. Of course we received, uh, gamma globulin injections. We had anti-malarials that we took. We had penicillin or something. If ever it felt like we were getting some intestinal problems, we had pills that we could take and I never had a problem.

[Assistant] Did you very religiously boil your water?

[User] Well, water would. Well, I would take tea. Everybody drank tea. And of course, with tea, even though the water was probably full of critters, by the time it was boiled it was certainly safe to drink. Uh, and then when we were in town, there was soda pop. There was Cokes, and there was even beer. [tape break]

[Assistant] Well, now it was Muslim, but they had beer there also?

[User] Oh, yes. The center parts of the towns were always Chinese. The Malays kind of lived in compounds and villages around the edges of the town, but alcohol was available. Hard liquor. I'd get, I'd get Budweiser beer in the local grocery store, which was, which was fine.

[Assistant] Did they have their own home brew too that they made out there?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, water would. Well, I would take tea. Everybody drank tea. And of course, with tea, even though the water was probably full of critters, by the time it was boiled it was certainly safe to drink. Uh, and then when we were in town, there was soda pop. There was Cokes, and there was even beer. [tape break]

[Assistant] Well, now it was Muslim, but they had beer there also?

[User] Oh, yes. The center parts of the towns were always Chinese. The Malays kind of lived in compounds and villages around the edges of the town, but alcohol was available. Hard liquor. I'd get, I'd get Budweiser beer in the local grocery store, which was, which was fine.

[Assistant] Did they have their own home brew too that they made out there?

[User] There, uh, yeah, there were rice wines. There were, uh, there were local liquors that would be created that very often the truck drivers would drink, and it was not infrequent to read the morning newspaper about trucks running off the road, particularly in this area.

[Assistant] Did you ever try any of that?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh, yes. The center parts of the towns were always Chinese. The Malays kind of lived in compounds and villages around the edges of the town, but alcohol was available. Hard liquor. I'd get, I'd get Budweiser beer in the local grocery store, which was, which was fine.

[Assistant] Did they have their own home brew too that they made out there?

[User] There, uh, yeah, there were rice wines. There were, uh, there were local liquors that would be created that very often the truck drivers would drink, and it was not infrequent to read the morning newspaper about trucks running off the road, particularly in this area.

[Assistant] Did you ever try any of that?

[User] I think I probably did. I guess I would have to say that it left no impression on me.

[Assistant] Now when you're out in the jungle, then you wouldn't particularly run to town. Maybe these Aboriginal groups, that'd be about it. I assume that there are. You mentioned earlier about taking the train. You would take the train to your site sometime?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] There, uh, yeah, there were rice wines. There were, uh, there were local liquors that would be created that very often the truck drivers would drink, and it was not infrequent to read the morning newspaper about trucks running off the road, particularly in this area.

[Assistant] Did you ever try any of that?

[User] I think I probably did. I guess I would have to say that it left no impression on me.

[Assistant] Now when you're out in the jungle, then you wouldn't particularly run to town. Maybe these Aboriginal groups, that'd be about it. I assume that there are. You mentioned earlier about taking the train. You would take the train to your site sometime?

[User] Yes. There is a train line. The main line in Malaysia goes right through the center of the peninsula. And although the train didn't go through, uh, the town that I was in, uh, about, uh, ten, 15 miles away, there was a town that had a train station. And when we would lay out the survey lines that we were using, they would go east and west. The train would go north and south, so we would get off the train at, and I was, I was entitled actually to pull the cord to stop the train. The train would stop and then we would pick up our traverse line, which would usually then take us to a river five or 6 or 10 miles away. And then our boatman, I also had a boat and a boatman, 45 horsepower outboard motor. He would meet us and take us back to the town where he kept the boat.

[Assistant] Interesting. So you would take the train to a designated spot and know roughly where the river was in conjunction to us. The boatmen would be there, and you could take the train to another spot later on, and the boatmen would meet you up there. You always go back by boat to the town?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I think I probably did. I guess I would have to say that it left no impression on me.

[Assistant] Now when you're out in the jungle, then you wouldn't particularly run to town. Maybe these Aboriginal groups, that'd be about it. I assume that there are. You mentioned earlier about taking the train. You would take the train to your site sometime?

[User] Yes. There is a train line. The main line in Malaysia goes right through the center of the peninsula. And although the train didn't go through, uh, the town that I was in, uh, about, uh, ten, 15 miles away, there was a town that had a train station. And when we would lay out the survey lines that we were using, they would go east and west. The train would go north and south, so we would get off the train at, and I was, I was entitled actually to pull the cord to stop the train. The train would stop and then we would pick up our traverse line, which would usually then take us to a river five or 6 or 10 miles away. And then our boatman, I also had a boat and a boatman, 45 horsepower outboard motor. He would meet us and take us back to the town where he kept the boat.

[Assistant] Interesting. So you would take the train to a designated spot and know roughly where the river was in conjunction to us. The boatmen would be there, and you could take the train to another spot later on, and the boatmen would meet you up there. You always go back by boat to the town?

[User] Yeah, we would usually do 1 or 2 lines at a time. And if there's a long line, we would just get off the train and then go for 7 or 8 miles. Have the boatman pick us up and then we would go back to Raub until the next, next time.

[Assistant] So then you saved a lot of your office work for the monsoon season?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, we would usually do 1 or 2 lines at a time. And if there's a long line, we would just get off the train and then go for 7 or 8 miles. Have the boatman pick us up and then we would go back to Raub until the next, next time.

[Assistant] So then you saved a lot of your office work for the monsoon season?

[User] Yes. There was a lot of, always a lot of this soil correlation work, writing up notes and actually doing the mapping after you identified the different soils at particular spots. And look at the map and decide the extent of the good soil. What's the extent of the bad soil? And then provide that map to Kuala Lumpur. And that was seen as necessary because the Department of Agriculture could not get loans for moving these people into the interior of the country unless they had a soil map to prove that the soils could support agriculture. Where it happens, people do it.

[Assistant] I'm curious. My memory is that the soils really in a, in a rain forest can't really support. Perhaps but that's not true. There are some that could support a number of crops or?

[User] Tree crops are supported by tropical soils. There are some that are richer than others, depending on the underlying parent material, the kinds of rocks they came from. But generally it's true that if you simply plant an annual crop, including rice or cotton, the soil would be quickly depleted. But you can plant trees that take, uh, like a rubber tree might take 6 or 7 years before it grows tall enough to be tapped, but it both holds the soil in place and then gradually takes the nutrients, the leaf from the trees. Fertility and soil. In Malaysia, as other places, government programs that fertilizer and those kinds of tree crops. Oil palm is another.

[Assistant] Now, when you were in town, uh, again, besides work, was there anything to do with your leisure time? Like you mentioned something about a movie show in town or something like that?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes. There was a lot of, always a lot of this soil correlation work, writing up notes and actually doing the mapping after you identified the different soils at particular spots. And look at the map and decide the extent of the good soil. What's the extent of the bad soil? And then provide that map to Kuala Lumpur. And that was seen as necessary because the Department of Agriculture could not get loans for moving these people into the interior of the country unless they had a soil map to prove that the soils could support agriculture. Where it happens, people do it.

[Assistant] I'm curious. My memory is that the soils really in a, in a rain forest can't really support. Perhaps but that's not true. There are some that could support a number of crops or?

[User] Tree crops are supported by tropical soils. There are some that are richer than others, depending on the underlying parent material, the kinds of rocks they came from. But generally it's true that if you simply plant an annual crop, including rice or cotton, the soil would be quickly depleted. But you can plant trees that take, uh, like a rubber tree might take 6 or 7 years before it grows tall enough to be tapped, but it both holds the soil in place and then gradually takes the nutrients, the leaf from the trees. Fertility and soil. In Malaysia, as other places, government programs that fertilizer and those kinds of tree crops. Oil palm is another.

[Assistant] Now, when you were in town, uh, again, besides work, was there anything to do with your leisure time? Like you mentioned something about a movie show in town or something like that?

[User] There were three movie theaters in town. Occasionally they would have an English picture. There was a lot of, there were a lot of Indian Hindi pictures, a lot of Chinese pictures.

[Assistant] So how might you spend some of your leisure time in town?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Tree crops are supported by tropical soils. There are some that are richer than others, depending on the underlying parent material, the kinds of rocks they came from. But generally it's true that if you simply plant an annual crop, including rice or cotton, the soil would be quickly depleted. But you can plant trees that take, uh, like a rubber tree might take 6 or 7 years before it grows tall enough to be tapped, but it both holds the soil in place and then gradually takes the nutrients, the leaf from the trees. Fertility and soil. In Malaysia, as other places, government programs that fertilizer and those kinds of tree crops. Oil palm is another.

[Assistant] Now, when you were in town, uh, again, besides work, was there anything to do with your leisure time? Like you mentioned something about a movie show in town or something like that?

[User] There were three movie theaters in town. Occasionally they would have an English picture. There was a lot of, there were a lot of Indian Hindi pictures, a lot of Chinese pictures.

[Assistant] So how might you spend some of your leisure time in town?

[User] Well, I, uh, I read a lot.

[Assistant] Peace Corps locker type?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] There were three movie theaters in town. Occasionally they would have an English picture. There was a lot of, there were a lot of Indian Hindi pictures, a lot of Chinese pictures.

[Assistant] So how might you spend some of your leisure time in town?

[User] Well, I, uh, I read a lot.

[Assistant] Peace Corps locker type?

[User] Yeah, we had a book locker, and, uh. Socialized. I would get together every evening when I was in town with half a dozen other junior government officers. We would arrange then as a group to take our meals at one of the local restaurants. It was sort of a set meal kind of arrangement. We didn't know ahead of time what it consisted of, but it would always have plenty of rice, soup. We would have some sort of meat and some sort of vegetable. So we would get together and like clockwork, the local people used to say. Then walk, then up and back the two blocks of the main street of town afterwards, after we had our meals, then head off.

[Assistant] Now would they speak English or Malay?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, I, uh, I read a lot.

[Assistant] Peace Corps locker type?

[User] Yeah, we had a book locker, and, uh. Socialized. I would get together every evening when I was in town with half a dozen other junior government officers. We would arrange then as a group to take our meals at one of the local restaurants. It was sort of a set meal kind of arrangement. We didn't know ahead of time what it consisted of, but it would always have plenty of rice, soup. We would have some sort of meat and some sort of vegetable. So we would get together and like clockwork, the local people used to say. Then walk, then up and back the two blocks of the main street of town afterwards, after we had our meals, then head off.

[Assistant] Now would they speak English or Malay?

[User] They all spoke English.

[Assistant] Any particular strong friendships that arose for you out of that group?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, we had a book locker, and, uh. Socialized. I would get together every evening when I was in town with half a dozen other junior government officers. We would arrange then as a group to take our meals at one of the local restaurants. It was sort of a set meal kind of arrangement. We didn't know ahead of time what it consisted of, but it would always have plenty of rice, soup. We would have some sort of meat and some sort of vegetable. So we would get together and like clockwork, the local people used to say. Then walk, then up and back the two blocks of the main street of town afterwards, after we had our meals, then head off.

[Assistant] Now would they speak English or Malay?

[User] They all spoke English.

[Assistant] Any particular strong friendships that arose for you out of that group?

[User] I had a Chinese assistant who was very good, very ambitious, young fellow. After the completion of our survey, I recommended him for a Fulbright scholarship, which he got. He went to the University of Hawaii, eventually got a PhD. Then he went back and headed up an agriculture college.

[Assistant] Have you had any contact with him since then?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] They all spoke English.

[Assistant] Any particular strong friendships that arose for you out of that group?

[User] I had a Chinese assistant who was very good, very ambitious, young fellow. After the completion of our survey, I recommended him for a Fulbright scholarship, which he got. He went to the University of Hawaii, eventually got a PhD. Then he went back and headed up an agriculture college.

[Assistant] Have you had any contact with him since then?

[User] Not directly. I'm aware of what work that he has been doing in Malaysia. He's aware of some of the subsequent work that I have done. But we haven't gotten down, sat together and compared notes on previous years.

[Assistant] Are there any other events from the first year that come to mind?