[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] It did not continue. It would, I think it would have been really cool if we could have found a way like to keep that going. But as far as I know, I don't think that they have.

[Assistant] Any other summary statements you'd like to make?

[User] I'm actually now that I'm moving back down to the D.R. in like a month or so for a job for a year. I've been talking with like the Friends of the D.R. about helping them do some work. That's like supporting the Brigada Verde programs that are still being run as kind of like a secondary option for volunteers to do if they want. So I'm really excited. I mean, I'm not sure exactly what I'm going to be doing yet or like what might work or not, but I'm really excited about that, to kind of come back to be able to still help support that work in some way. So, yeah, like looking towards the future, that's something I'm really excited about that's connected to Peace Corps.

[Assistant] I think we pretty much covered the framework that we're trying to elicit from you. So unless you have any other things, we've talked about other things that you've already noted here, so I think we've covered what you particularly wanted to bring up.

[User] Cool. I'm definitely glad I did it. Hopefully, Peace Corps continues for a while to come.

[Assistant] Well, thank you for your time.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, enough to send an airplane down there or a helicopter. I think at first it was a rescue plane, and then a helicopter got down there.

[Assistant] Yes, from everything I've heard, he just floated around, waiting. [Laughter] He knew he was fine and eventually he'd be found. And he likes the ocean anyway. He's gone into the nautical and the diving stuff.

[User] Yes. One thing to say about Scott Carpenter, one of the first times I had gone down to Cape Canaveral [Florida], which was a chore, because in those days the government was not too wild about you flying on commercial, so we had a NASA airplane we flew from Langley to Cape Canaveral, and it took forever. It was an old, dilapidated, two-engine prop-driven—I think it was a Martin 404 or something, made barely 200 miles an hour.\n\n Actually, I got down to the Cape and went into a meeting where we were briefing the mission team, and I met Scott there for the first time. What impressed me about Scott was he remembered my name after the meeting. So he was very gracious. I did not give a briefing, but I had something to contribute to the meeting, and after the meeting was over, he called me by name and asked me to explain something to him. So I was pretty impressed that he—

[Assistant] That's good.

[User] But in my association at NACA on the airplane end, I had several friends and associates who were test pilots, and they always very much impressed me in terms of their grasp. I think just about all of them were full engineers, and they were flight test engineers, and they knew as much about aerodynamics and stability and control that I did. They probably knew a lot more than I did.

[Assistant] I'm sure it's important to know some of those details when you are up there flying a test aircraft, and if something starts to go wrong, having that background would give you some knowledge to be able to decide what to do next. Definitely a unique group of people. You mentioned Scott Carpenter. Did you work at all with any of the other astronauts?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, a trip to the beach. She probably got saltwater in it or something. [Laughter]

[Assistant] Oh, how funny. Well, it was a new program at the time, and there were several points where, I've read in a couple of books, you needed a part and you ran down to the hardware store. It was such a small group and they were trying to get things done in such a short time, that you did what you had to.

[User] Oh, yes. Exactly. The Space Task Group was just a few hundred people. I remember if you needed to take a trip anywhere, in my middle desk drawer I had a book of government travel vouchers, and all I did was just rip one of these—it looked like an IBM punch card, kind of a stiff cardboard thing, pull it off. Go down to the airport, they would fill it out, and I would sign it, and they would give me an airplane ticket in return.

[Assistant] Wow. That's great.

[User] And then when I'd get back, I would take my receipt of that and whatever else—travel was much more simple. We didn't have all these travel offices and many levels of signature and everything. It was just like that was my job and—

[Assistant] You needed to do it, and they trusted you to do it.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, actually, it wasn't. In fact, I'm surprised that nobody got wise to this, but in those days you could never afford to go on a trip, even to Los Angeles. We used to go to Boston a lot on the Apollo Program and stay in a room where it wouldn't cost a lot more than sixteen dollars a day. So the trick was to take a buddy with you, and you would share a room. So you'd split the cost of a room, and then you could—

[Assistant] You could eat. [Laughter]

[User] You could eat. Yes. Otherwise, you were having to subsidize the government on the room and board kind of participation.

[Assistant] Things are a little different.

[User] Exactly. In fact, I remember on a couple of occasions—we had, I remember, a trip to Boston, which was extremely expensive, where we had three guys staying in a room, and we had a roll-in cot, and we split the room three ways.

[Assistant] Wow. Well, it worked out, I guess.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] You could eat. Yes. Otherwise, you were having to subsidize the government on the room and board kind of participation.

[Assistant] Things are a little different.

[User] Exactly. In fact, I remember on a couple of occasions—we had, I remember, a trip to Boston, which was extremely expensive, where we had three guys staying in a room, and we had a roll-in cot, and we split the room three ways.

[Assistant] Wow. Well, it worked out, I guess.

[User] It was not a lot of fun.

[Assistant] I'm sure if somebody snored pretty loudly, too, that might be— [Laughter]


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Exactly. In fact, I remember on a couple of occasions—we had, I remember, a trip to Boston, which was extremely expensive, where we had three guys staying in a room, and we had a roll-in cot, and we split the room three ways.

[Assistant] Wow. Well, it worked out, I guess.

[User] It was not a lot of fun.

[Assistant] I'm sure if somebody snored pretty loudly, too, that might be— [Laughter]

[User] Yes, that was always a problem. [Laughter]

[Assistant] Well, from the Mercury Program, you then moved into Gemini.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] It was not a lot of fun.

[Assistant] I'm sure if somebody snored pretty loudly, too, that might be— [Laughter]

[User] Yes, that was always a problem. [Laughter]

[Assistant] Well, from the Mercury Program, you then moved into Gemini.

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] Based on all these missions and the various things you were learning along the way, what sorts of lessons were you able to transfer into the Gemini Program?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, that was always a problem. [Laughter]

[Assistant] Well, from the Mercury Program, you then moved into Gemini.

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] Based on all these missions and the various things you were learning along the way, what sorts of lessons were you able to transfer into the Gemini Program?

[User] A lot of what we did on Gemini was basically a takeoff of what we were doing on Mercury. So there was not a lot of—I won't say there was a lot of innovation, or not a lot of innovation, but it was really just sort of a transfer of what seemed to work, what seemed to do right. And for me it was an easy transition, because I was working on, really, almost a liaison function with the Air Force on the Atlas Program and then doing the liaison with the Titan II on the Gemini Program. So a lot of the same people I worked with in Los Angeles.\n\n Some of the contractors were different, of course. I was working with General Dynamics out of San Diego [California] on the Atlas and then started working with the Martin Company out of—actually, it was out of Baltimore [Maryland] at the start, because they were transitioning to their Denver [Colorado] operations at the time. But a lot of the Titans were built in Baltimore at the time.

[Assistant] You mentioned that you were liaison with the Titan. Was this basically a continuation of your same responsibilities, or did those change?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] A long move. Then, as I understand it, Lyndon Johnson was the chairman of the Space and Science Committee, and he had final veto. And, of course, Berkeley, California, was not in Texas, so it lost out. So then we find out that, hey, we're moving to Houston, Texas, now, or outside Houston, Texas.\n\n Then shortly after they made that announcement, there was a weather phenomena called a hurricane, and Hurricane Carla hit that area. So here we had hurricane-tracking maps on our walls. Of course, we had all these trajectory maps and everything, so we were plotting that thing as we got reports on the hurricane moving in there.\n\n It was interesting, a lot of people were not that wild about moving to Houston. I didn't have a problem with it. I thought wherever the space center would be, that's where I would move to. But there were people there that had some attachment to Virginia or that area, or the East Coast. There weren't a lot of my colleagues who had families and were raised on the East Coast and they were not moving halfway across the country to Texas or to California. So we lost quite a few people when we moved, and I was surprised how many did not join us. There were a number of people that did. I think the majority did move [with] the Space Task Group, but there was quite a few that did not move. A number of the people I worked with did not move.

[Assistant] It's a tough decision.

[User] It was a tough decision. It really was.

[Assistant] When you did move down to Houston, do you remember—of course, when the [Manned] Space[craft] Center first moved down, offices were scattered all over town.

[User] Yes, they were.

[Assistant] Do you remember where you primarily worked out of?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] I guess one good thing about all the travel time is that at least Houston doesn't have weather like today. [Laughter]

[User] Well, I'll tell you, there have been some gully-washers there that I remember driving to get to the Computer Center, and the water was gushing out of manhole covers with such force they were lifting the iron manhole covers off.

[Assistant] Wow. Okay, they have their different brand of weather.

[User] That's true. The weather was a little more cooperative.

[Assistant] How long did you stay in that situation, do you recall?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, I'll tell you, there have been some gully-washers there that I remember driving to get to the Computer Center, and the water was gushing out of manhole covers with such force they were lifting the iron manhole covers off.

[Assistant] Wow. Okay, they have their different brand of weather.

[User] That's true. The weather was a little more cooperative.

[Assistant] How long did you stay in that situation, do you recall?

[User] In the temporary buildings? I think we moved there in early '62, and I forgot when our building was ready at the Space Center. I believe it was not till '64 or '65 that we moved. We were one of the last groups to move down there, and I don't know why. It was around that time frame that they moved us from there to the new Space Center, the Manned Spacecraft Center, the MSC.

[Assistant] And the new Space Center came up to speed, really, early in the Gemini Program, or at least got the Mission Control Center up to speed.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes. I think during those times, probably I became much more of a negotiator than I had been in the past. [Laughter]

[Assistant] Developed your diplomatic skills.

[User] Yes. I probably could have gone into the diplomatic corps following that.

[Assistant] In the Gemini Program, several of the missions, while successful to a certain extent, they experienced various problems, be it with how do you work in space, how do you keep yourself in place to work, and then some problems even with the Agena on one not having separated—

[User] Yes, the masking tape on the shroud. Yes.

[Assistant] After each mission, as these problems would arise, how would you look at these? How would you evaluate for the future missions?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, not at all. I don't think anybody does, really, unless—like I said, I was perfectly happy testing airplanes in wind tunnels. I'm glad I decided to go into a different direction, a different way, but I think the career I had at NASA was certainly very fulfilling. I had great assignments on the Skylab Program. I had the opportunity to appear on the NBC Today show, interviewed right after the first launch and the Skylab series, and interviewed on that show. I got many fan letters from that later. Surprising.

[Assistant] Oh, that's great.

[User] School kids, a few, yes, and adults.\n\n The Skylab Program was a real challenge, and, again, we had great teams of people and got involved in the early days of the Shuttle Program and the design of the Shuttle and worked on some of the early concepts on the Shuttle Program that's been really quite a successful program.\n\n The last assignment I had with NASA, JSC [Johnson Space Center] was trying to get the Air Force to have their own Shuttle Operations and Planning Complex, which was going to be located right outside of Colorado Springs. That, unfortunately, fell through for a number of reasons, but mainly because of the Challenger, that the Air Force decided not to pursue that. But that was a challenging assignment in itself.\n\n But, no, I would have never predicted. Although when I was in eighth grade—I went to grade school at the time when you went to eighth grade then you went to high school, so you graduated from eighth grade, you graduated from grammar school, and in my class prophecy, my prophecy was I would be sending rockets to the moon.

[Assistant] Wow!

[User] So, talk about predictions, grade-school predictions that were right. That was in 1949.

[Assistant] That's great. What sparked your interest back then in—


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] School kids, a few, yes, and adults.\n\n The Skylab Program was a real challenge, and, again, we had great teams of people and got involved in the early days of the Shuttle Program and the design of the Shuttle and worked on some of the early concepts on the Shuttle Program that's been really quite a successful program.\n\n The last assignment I had with NASA, JSC [Johnson Space Center] was trying to get the Air Force to have their own Shuttle Operations and Planning Complex, which was going to be located right outside of Colorado Springs. That, unfortunately, fell through for a number of reasons, but mainly because of the Challenger, that the Air Force decided not to pursue that. But that was a challenging assignment in itself.\n\n But, no, I would have never predicted. Although when I was in eighth grade—I went to grade school at the time when you went to eighth grade then you went to high school, so you graduated from eighth grade, you graduated from grammar school, and in my class prophecy, my prophecy was I would be sending rockets to the moon.

[Assistant] Wow!

[User] So, talk about predictions, grade-school predictions that were right. That was in 1949.

[Assistant] That's great. What sparked your interest back then in—

[User] Well, I don't know who wrote the prediction, but I was very much just taken up by airplanes, not rockets necessarily, because there weren't really, other than the German V-1 rockets, there weren't really many rockets. But rockets had my interest, and I did a lot of reading on that. I was very active in model airplane building and flying and competing, and I was very engrossed in that. I read a lot of science fiction and so forth, so I can see where probably someone would have predicted that for me.

[Assistant] That's pretty neat.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes. And now he's an engineer, a chip designer for Intel Corporation, doing very well.

[Assistant] Wonderful.

[User] I'm hoping a lot of that was an inspiration to him.

[Assistant] It sounds like it was. It sounds like it was.

[User] It was, yes.

[Assistant] Looking back again over your whole career, even the areas we haven't talked of, what do you think was both your most challenging time and maybe your most significant contribution?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, I think in those days, Peace Corps was fairly well known, talked about, the volunteer service aspect, and it sounded like something that would be real interesting to be a part of. Nobody really talked to me about it specifically. I researched it on my own and found out a lot of interesting facts that made me more intrigued.

[Assistant] What were you doing before that? Were you a student or had you been working for a while or what?

[User] I had just graduated, finished a mathematics degree, and it was always my intention to take two years, coincidentally, between undergraduate and graduate school. I had vague ideas about graduate school, and what I did know for sure is I didn't want to go straight through school, straight into a working type environment. I wanted to see the world. And really the competition for Peace Corps was being a yachty. That's a term popular in those days. I don't even know if they still use it. But you crewed on people's boats and traveled around the world. And started thinking about that and the lack of structure it offered and then thought about a Peace Corps and there was a real job there to do and it eventually won out.

[Assistant] So where did you go to school, here in California or?

[User] My undergraduate was at the University of the Pacific. It's located in Stockton, California, in the Big Valley, if you remember that story.

[Assistant] Yeah. So you're from this area, then?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I had just graduated, finished a mathematics degree, and it was always my intention to take two years, coincidentally, between undergraduate and graduate school. I had vague ideas about graduate school, and what I did know for sure is I didn't want to go straight through school, straight into a working type environment. I wanted to see the world. And really the competition for Peace Corps was being a yachty. That's a term popular in those days. I don't even know if they still use it. But you crewed on people's boats and traveled around the world. And started thinking about that and the lack of structure it offered and then thought about a Peace Corps and there was a real job there to do and it eventually won out.

[Assistant] So where did you go to school, here in California or?

[User] My undergraduate was at the University of the Pacific. It's located in Stockton, California, in the Big Valley, if you remember that story.

[Assistant] Yeah. So you're from this area, then?

[User] I was born and raised in San Francisco. My family's all from San Francisco pretty much.

[Assistant] So now when you told your family and friends that you were going to join the Peace Corps, what did they think about it?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] My undergraduate was at the University of the Pacific. It's located in Stockton, California, in the Big Valley, if you remember that story.

[Assistant] Yeah. So you're from this area, then?

[User] I was born and raised in San Francisco. My family's all from San Francisco pretty much.

[Assistant] So now when you told your family and friends that you were going to join the Peace Corps, what did they think about it?

[User] Well, they were very encouraging, I would say, generally. My parents were pretty much encouraging in general. As you will remember, this was quite a tumultuous time. The war in Vietnam had ended. And there was a lot of changes in society going on. And so there was a great sense of exploration in general. So my parents were not ones to restrict that. They wanted me to try new things. Seeing the world certainly was not something they were against in any way. Friends thought it was, I guess, cool. Or maybe they said groovy in those days.

[Assistant] Yeah. So you didn't get any kind of negative pushback from anybody?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I was born and raised in San Francisco. My family's all from San Francisco pretty much.

[Assistant] So now when you told your family and friends that you were going to join the Peace Corps, what did they think about it?

[User] Well, they were very encouraging, I would say, generally. My parents were pretty much encouraging in general. As you will remember, this was quite a tumultuous time. The war in Vietnam had ended. And there was a lot of changes in society going on. And so there was a great sense of exploration in general. So my parents were not ones to restrict that. They wanted me to try new things. Seeing the world certainly was not something they were against in any way. Friends thought it was, I guess, cool. Or maybe they said groovy in those days.

[Assistant] Yeah. So you didn't get any kind of negative pushback from anybody?

[User] None at all. None at all. In fact, my, well, I did have a girlfriend at the time that wasn't so thrilled about my heading away. That was my only negative feedback.

[Assistant] Understandably. And did you choose to go to Fiji or did you have, were you open to going anywhere? Or what was your first choice?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, they were very encouraging, I would say, generally. My parents were pretty much encouraging in general. As you will remember, this was quite a tumultuous time. The war in Vietnam had ended. And there was a lot of changes in society going on. And so there was a great sense of exploration in general. So my parents were not ones to restrict that. They wanted me to try new things. Seeing the world certainly was not something they were against in any way. Friends thought it was, I guess, cool. Or maybe they said groovy in those days.

[Assistant] Yeah. So you didn't get any kind of negative pushback from anybody?

[User] None at all. None at all. In fact, my, well, I did have a girlfriend at the time that wasn't so thrilled about my heading away. That was my only negative feedback.

[Assistant] Understandably. And did you choose to go to Fiji or did you have, were you open to going anywhere? Or what was your first choice?

[User] At the time I was given, it might have been similar for you. There was three lines on the form and the first line, for pretty much no reason, I put Malta. And I realized that to be more specific, you had less chance of getting that. The second choice was Micronesia, because I thought, well, being in an American trust area, maybe I'd want to stay there. Maybe there'd be opportunities for Americans there. And then the third was just, gee, any South Pacific. And they came back, through great fortune and no real deserving of my own, with this offer of Fiji. And I really didn't debate on it long at all. I thought it sounded better than my choices.

[Assistant] So you did have a predetermination to kind of go to the South Pacific. That was something you thought about.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] None at all. None at all. In fact, my, well, I did have a girlfriend at the time that wasn't so thrilled about my heading away. That was my only negative feedback.

[Assistant] Understandably. And did you choose to go to Fiji or did you have, were you open to going anywhere? Or what was your first choice?

[User] At the time I was given, it might have been similar for you. There was three lines on the form and the first line, for pretty much no reason, I put Malta. And I realized that to be more specific, you had less chance of getting that. The second choice was Micronesia, because I thought, well, being in an American trust area, maybe I'd want to stay there. Maybe there'd be opportunities for Americans there. And then the third was just, gee, any South Pacific. And they came back, through great fortune and no real deserving of my own, with this offer of Fiji. And I really didn't debate on it long at all. I thought it sounded better than my choices.

[Assistant] So you did have a predetermination to kind of go to the South Pacific. That was something you thought about.

[User] I've always been, well, again, imagine the yachty thing. You know, I grew up in a fishing family and being out on the ocean has always been very, very desirable. So, you know, being yachty or being in the Peace Corps, you're next to the water. I'm still very much that way, oriented towards the ocean, water, fishing, and that type of lifestyle.

[Assistant] Yeah. Yeah. So after applying, then you got this invitation to go to Fiji. And did you know much about Fiji before that?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] At the time I was given, it might have been similar for you. There was three lines on the form and the first line, for pretty much no reason, I put Malta. And I realized that to be more specific, you had less chance of getting that. The second choice was Micronesia, because I thought, well, being in an American trust area, maybe I'd want to stay there. Maybe there'd be opportunities for Americans there. And then the third was just, gee, any South Pacific. And they came back, through great fortune and no real deserving of my own, with this offer of Fiji. And I really didn't debate on it long at all. I thought it sounded better than my choices.

[Assistant] So you did have a predetermination to kind of go to the South Pacific. That was something you thought about.

[User] I've always been, well, again, imagine the yachty thing. You know, I grew up in a fishing family and being out on the ocean has always been very, very desirable. So, you know, being yachty or being in the Peace Corps, you're next to the water. I'm still very much that way, oriented towards the ocean, water, fishing, and that type of lifestyle.

[Assistant] Yeah. Yeah. So after applying, then you got this invitation to go to Fiji. And did you know much about Fiji before that?

[User] You know, they had things like the Encyclopedia Britannica in those days. You didn't just pull up your iPhone and Google, tell me all about Fiji. So the information was fairly hard to come by. So really when I first set foot on Fiji, it was all new and all learning from the beginning, you know, vague concepts, and of course Peace Corps gave you some information about the country and which shots to get. I remember, what did we have, what they call WHO cards that had your vaccinations on there. And those were the types of things that they talked about.

[Assistant] Did they have any kind of orientation before you left the States, to kind of brief you about the country or?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I've always been, well, again, imagine the yachty thing. You know, I grew up in a fishing family and being out on the ocean has always been very, very desirable. So, you know, being yachty or being in the Peace Corps, you're next to the water. I'm still very much that way, oriented towards the ocean, water, fishing, and that type of lifestyle.

[Assistant] Yeah. Yeah. So after applying, then you got this invitation to go to Fiji. And did you know much about Fiji before that?

[User] You know, they had things like the Encyclopedia Britannica in those days. You didn't just pull up your iPhone and Google, tell me all about Fiji. So the information was fairly hard to come by. So really when I first set foot on Fiji, it was all new and all learning from the beginning, you know, vague concepts, and of course Peace Corps gave you some information about the country and which shots to get. I remember, what did we have, what they call WHO cards that had your vaccinations on there. And those were the types of things that they talked about.

[Assistant] Did they have any kind of orientation before you left the States, to kind of brief you about the country or?

[User] We did have a few days in San Francisco. So we did, for me no travel. I was already here. But the rest of the volunteers from my group, Fiji 24, came from across the country. And we spent several days in San Francisco in some hotel learning about what the job might entail and how really it wasn't a generalist. You know, they referred to the previous Peace Corps groups as more generalist kind of things. And they said, really the goal of your group is to replace mid-level skills and supplement the need for hiring of those skills for the government that we were serving.

[Assistant] Was the whole group education, all teachers?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] You know, they had things like the Encyclopedia Britannica in those days. You didn't just pull up your iPhone and Google, tell me all about Fiji. So the information was fairly hard to come by. So really when I first set foot on Fiji, it was all new and all learning from the beginning, you know, vague concepts, and of course Peace Corps gave you some information about the country and which shots to get. I remember, what did we have, what they call WHO cards that had your vaccinations on there. And those were the types of things that they talked about.

[Assistant] Did they have any kind of orientation before you left the States, to kind of brief you about the country or?

[User] We did have a few days in San Francisco. So we did, for me no travel. I was already here. But the rest of the volunteers from my group, Fiji 24, came from across the country. And we spent several days in San Francisco in some hotel learning about what the job might entail and how really it wasn't a generalist. You know, they referred to the previous Peace Corps groups as more generalist kind of things. And they said, really the goal of your group is to replace mid-level skills and supplement the need for hiring of those skills for the government that we were serving.

[Assistant] Was the whole group education, all teachers?

[User] Every one of my group was education.

[Assistant] Education. Hmm. So then you have this orientation and you get on the plane and take off to this new place. Do you remember your initial reaction when you landed in Fiji? How you felt about it?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] We did have a few days in San Francisco. So we did, for me no travel. I was already here. But the rest of the volunteers from my group, Fiji 24, came from across the country. And we spent several days in San Francisco in some hotel learning about what the job might entail and how really it wasn't a generalist. You know, they referred to the previous Peace Corps groups as more generalist kind of things. And they said, really the goal of your group is to replace mid-level skills and supplement the need for hiring of those skills for the government that we were serving.

[Assistant] Was the whole group education, all teachers?

[User] Every one of my group was education.

[Assistant] Education. Hmm. So then you have this orientation and you get on the plane and take off to this new place. Do you remember your initial reaction when you landed in Fiji? How you felt about it?

[User] Yeah, it was just.

[Assistant] Did anything impress you in particular?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Every one of my group was education.

[Assistant] Education. Hmm. So then you have this orientation and you get on the plane and take off to this new place. Do you remember your initial reaction when you landed in Fiji? How you felt about it?

[User] Yeah, it was just.

[Assistant] Did anything impress you in particular?

[User] Well, what I remember most is that I was feeling great, because a lot of the folks stayed up all night on the airplane, and I slept all the flight and woke up feeling really refreshed and seeing this beautiful kind of environment. It was just really nothing but positive from the beginning there where it was. And, you know, it's just part of my nature is to be a traveler anyway. I mean, my career later in life was doing international business and I went to an international business school. So I already had an orientation towards being multicultural. And that was just, oh great, here's the next chapter. And that was more of the way I was thinking of it.

[Assistant] Yeah. So it must have been pretty exciting for you when you landed there.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, it was just.

[Assistant] Did anything impress you in particular?

[User] Well, what I remember most is that I was feeling great, because a lot of the folks stayed up all night on the airplane, and I slept all the flight and woke up feeling really refreshed and seeing this beautiful kind of environment. It was just really nothing but positive from the beginning there where it was. And, you know, it's just part of my nature is to be a traveler anyway. I mean, my career later in life was doing international business and I went to an international business school. So I already had an orientation towards being multicultural. And that was just, oh great, here's the next chapter. And that was more of the way I was thinking of it.

[Assistant] Yeah. So it must have been pretty exciting for you when you landed there.

[User] Yeah, it really was. Because the intake, if you will, they, uh. I may be leaving out some parts, but basically they whisked us as fast as you could whisk something in Fiji off to the inside of Viti Levu and we went to the welcoming ceremony. So next thing I know, I'm sitting inside of a bure and the whole group is there.

[Assistant] In a Fijian village? You went straight to a village?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] In the interior.

[Assistant] Wow.

[User] So this isn't, you know, just a village. This is a full-on in the interior type of village.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] And that was quite remarkable. Nothing had ever been. And then something you probably experienced, they say, oh, you're going to be the chief. And I go, what the heck is that? They said, it'll mean you'll have the first imbelo. And I didn't know what an imbelo was. And next thing I knew, there was this milky substance sitting out in front of me and everyone staring rather intently at me. And thankfully the Fijian gentleman who was part of the Peace Corps, who was sitting next to me, leaned over and quietly said, drink it.

[Assistant] So they didn't tell you anything about that in orientation?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] So this isn't, you know, just a village. This is a full-on in the interior type of village.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] And that was quite remarkable. Nothing had ever been. And then something you probably experienced, they say, oh, you're going to be the chief. And I go, what the heck is that? They said, it'll mean you'll have the first imbelo. And I didn't know what an imbelo was. And next thing I knew, there was this milky substance sitting out in front of me and everyone staring rather intently at me. And thankfully the Fijian gentleman who was part of the Peace Corps, who was sitting next to me, leaned over and quietly said, drink it.

[Assistant] So they didn't tell you anything about that in orientation?

[User] It was all real time learning.

[Assistant] Wow. Yeah. So how long a drive outside of Nadi was it, do you remember, from the airport to that village? You said it was right in the interior.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And that was quite remarkable. Nothing had ever been. And then something you probably experienced, they say, oh, you're going to be the chief. And I go, what the heck is that? They said, it'll mean you'll have the first imbelo. And I didn't know what an imbelo was. And next thing I knew, there was this milky substance sitting out in front of me and everyone staring rather intently at me. And thankfully the Fijian gentleman who was part of the Peace Corps, who was sitting next to me, leaned over and quietly said, drink it.

[Assistant] So they didn't tell you anything about that in orientation?

[User] It was all real time learning.

[Assistant] Wow. Yeah. So how long a drive outside of Nadi was it, do you remember, from the airport to that village? You said it was right in the interior.

[User] Yeah. I certainly couldn't remember what road we took. I know that the roads were dirt. There was no such thing as a paved road. So when I say whisked us, it was compared to walking.

[Assistant] Was it a couple of hours?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] It was all real time learning.

[Assistant] Wow. Yeah. So how long a drive outside of Nadi was it, do you remember, from the airport to that village? You said it was right in the interior.

[User] Yeah. I certainly couldn't remember what road we took. I know that the roads were dirt. There was no such thing as a paved road. So when I say whisked us, it was compared to walking.

[Assistant] Was it a couple of hours?

[User] It was fast. It had to be, I would guess 3 or 4 hours.

[Assistant] Right. Yeah. And then after that, how long did you spend in training, do you remember, before you started on your job?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah. I certainly couldn't remember what road we took. I know that the roads were dirt. There was no such thing as a paved road. So when I say whisked us, it was compared to walking.

[Assistant] Was it a couple of hours?

[User] It was fast. It had to be, I would guess 3 or 4 hours.

[Assistant] Right. Yeah. And then after that, how long did you spend in training, do you remember, before you started on your job?

[User] Well, there were several weeks where we were in Labasa area. We were at a school and the school was in a break period. And there were students that were brought in, as I call it, the equivalent of summer school. And we were their teachers, so we were basically getting training on the job. So the training really consisted of some cultural education, some practice teaching, and then language training. In my case, Hindi language training.

[Assistant] Because they expected you to teach at a Hindi school or a school that served mostly Indians?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] It was fast. It had to be, I would guess 3 or 4 hours.

[Assistant] Right. Yeah. And then after that, how long did you spend in training, do you remember, before you started on your job?

[User] Well, there were several weeks where we were in Labasa area. We were at a school and the school was in a break period. And there were students that were brought in, as I call it, the equivalent of summer school. And we were their teachers, so we were basically getting training on the job. So the training really consisted of some cultural education, some practice teaching, and then language training. In my case, Hindi language training.

[Assistant] Because they expected you to teach at a Hindi school or a school that served mostly Indians?

[User] I suppose that was. I suppose that was the case. Right. Right. I ended up teaching at schools where, you know, English was the primary language. So bad for me for not learning really either Hindi well or Fijian, since it really was never required for my job, other than it would have been nice to have because you open up culture with language.

[Assistant] Right. And so what else was memorable about your training? I know you did a home stay with a family.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, there were several weeks where we were in Labasa area. We were at a school and the school was in a break period. And there were students that were brought in, as I call it, the equivalent of summer school. And we were their teachers, so we were basically getting training on the job. So the training really consisted of some cultural education, some practice teaching, and then language training. In my case, Hindi language training.

[Assistant] Because they expected you to teach at a Hindi school or a school that served mostly Indians?

[User] I suppose that was. I suppose that was the case. Right. Right. I ended up teaching at schools where, you know, English was the primary language. So bad for me for not learning really either Hindi well or Fijian, since it really was never required for my job, other than it would have been nice to have because you open up culture with language.

[Assistant] Right. And so what else was memorable about your training? I know you did a home stay with a family.

[User] I did, yeah. Lovely family. And they had quite a few kids. And at the time, you know, I was dabbling with the idea of being a vegetarian and of course, an Indian family. The majority were vegetarian. So I was excited about that. And what I do specifically remember was that I told the lady of the house that I'd quite happily be a vegetarian for them. And she said, oh no, you're going to eat bones. And apparently what they wanted was for me to demonstrate that you could actually eat lamb and chicken and survive the experience in front of their children. I think they thought their children would be better off to have meat in their diet.

[Assistant] Oh, so they didn't eat meat, but they wanted you to eat meat as an example?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I did, yeah. Lovely family. And they had quite a few kids. And at the time, you know, I was dabbling with the idea of being a vegetarian and of course, an Indian family. The majority were vegetarian. So I was excited about that. And what I do specifically remember was that I told the lady of the house that I'd quite happily be a vegetarian for them. And she said, oh no, you're going to eat bones. And apparently what they wanted was for me to demonstrate that you could actually eat lamb and chicken and survive the experience in front of their children. I think they thought their children would be better off to have meat in their diet.

[Assistant] Oh, so they didn't eat meat, but they wanted you to eat meat as an example?

[User] Demonstrate it for their children. Exactly. Exactly.

[Assistant] That's interesting.

[User] I really didn't want to, because, as I said at the time, I was thinking about becoming a vegetarian and the vegetable dishes were just outstanding. I mean, they, you know, cook eight, ten, 12 dishes every meal. So it wasn't just you got vegetables and rice and that was your meal. There would be this great table setting at every meal, even including breakfast. There was quite a few things to choose from.

[Assistant] Wow. And did you stay there by yourself or were there other volunteers staying with the same family?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Demonstrate it for their children. Exactly. Exactly.

[Assistant] That's interesting.

[User] I really didn't want to, because, as I said at the time, I was thinking about becoming a vegetarian and the vegetable dishes were just outstanding. I mean, they, you know, cook eight, ten, 12 dishes every meal. So it wasn't just you got vegetables and rice and that was your meal. There would be this great table setting at every meal, even including breakfast. There was quite a few things to choose from.

[Assistant] Wow. And did you stay there by yourself or were there other volunteers staying with the same family?

[User] Yeah, that was just me at that house.

[Assistant] And so each volunteer was farmed out to a different family.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, that was just me at that house.

[Assistant] And so each volunteer was farmed out to a different family.

[User] Correct. In our case, that was true. Yeah. It was a very interesting area in Labasa.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] I could certainly tell you about the story of three sisters and the mosquito net. The mosquito net was very quick. I remember it as I had literally layers of mosquito bites. I had probably, if I were to venture a guess, 200 on each ankle. And I didn't know how to deal with that at all. It was pretty disturbing. And then they came and said, oh, there's a mosquito net and this will help you. So sure enough, first night I got my trusty mosquito net out feeling protected. And they didn't tell me or nor was I smart enough to think of that you had to tuck it in. So I woke up to a den of mosquitoes that I had trapped.

[Assistant] Inside the net.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Correct. In our case, that was true. Yeah. It was a very interesting area in Labasa.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] I could certainly tell you about the story of three sisters and the mosquito net. The mosquito net was very quick. I remember it as I had literally layers of mosquito bites. I had probably, if I were to venture a guess, 200 on each ankle. And I didn't know how to deal with that at all. It was pretty disturbing. And then they came and said, oh, there's a mosquito net and this will help you. So sure enough, first night I got my trusty mosquito net out feeling protected. And they didn't tell me or nor was I smart enough to think of that you had to tuck it in. So I woke up to a den of mosquitoes that I had trapped.

[Assistant] Inside the net.

[User] Who were inside, right. So night number two, I was good. I learned the trick of the mosquito net. Tuck it in. And that was a lifesaver for me. You know, like a lot of volunteers, I was a little ill for maybe a week and a half or so. I think that was probably the lower end. We had one guy, Ralph Sukurski. I recall he got down from 160 to 98 pounds and they were just about to ship him to Hawaii.

[Assistant] Wow, sounds serious.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Who were inside, right. So night number two, I was good. I learned the trick of the mosquito net. Tuck it in. And that was a lifesaver for me. You know, like a lot of volunteers, I was a little ill for maybe a week and a half or so. I think that was probably the lower end. We had one guy, Ralph Sukurski. I recall he got down from 160 to 98 pounds and they were just about to ship him to Hawaii.

[Assistant] Wow, sounds serious.

[User] That was, he was on his way out and he just, his health kicked in. But that was several, several months. So, you know, you have to adapt to all the bacterias and have to adapt to this very different kind of environment chemically than your body is used to. But yeah, I always have to tell the big adventure, which was Three Sisters Mountain, because there is a mountain in the Labasa area called Three Sisters. It's rather famous because it's supposedly haunted. And the family said to me, yeah, you don't want to go there. And that really didn't deter me. So my friend and I decided to take a hike up there, and we encountered a junction between one mountain and the next to the Three Sisters Mountain. And, well, the short version is he was quite able to cross. I was not. I got stung by bees once. I moved hundreds of yards down the hill, got stung again. He passed through twice without ever seeing or being harassed.

[Assistant] And this is because of some superstition about the mountain?

[User] Well, I'm giving you the facts of what happened to me. Whether or not the superstition led the bees to me or not? You know, I really can't answer that. It literally changed my perception of the spirit world from one of.

[Assistant] Well, what was it that you did that he didn't, to make the bees come after you?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] That was, he was on his way out and he just, his health kicked in. But that was several, several months. So, you know, you have to adapt to all the bacterias and have to adapt to this very different kind of environment chemically than your body is used to. But yeah, I always have to tell the big adventure, which was Three Sisters Mountain, because there is a mountain in the Labasa area called Three Sisters. It's rather famous because it's supposedly haunted. And the family said to me, yeah, you don't want to go there. And that really didn't deter me. So my friend and I decided to take a hike up there, and we encountered a junction between one mountain and the next to the Three Sisters Mountain. And, well, the short version is he was quite able to cross. I was not. I got stung by bees once. I moved hundreds of yards down the hill, got stung again. He passed through twice without ever seeing or being harassed.

[Assistant] And this is because of some superstition about the mountain?

[User] Well, I'm giving you the facts of what happened to me. Whether or not the superstition led the bees to me or not? You know, I really can't answer that. It literally changed my perception of the spirit world from one of.

[Assistant] Well, what was it that you did that he didn't, to make the bees come after you?

[User] Well, you know, on the way up the mountain, you know, there are rumors that there are bones from the cannibal days there way up the mountain. I said, Glen, are you planning to touch the bones? And he said, no. And I was thinking to myself, I didn't really verbalize it, I was thinking to myself, well, I probably would. And that's the only difference that I'm aware of between us.

[Assistant] You didn't actually find any bones or touching them?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I never got that close. There was no problem. But the aftermath of the whole thing, which was even more freaky, was after all those bee stings, the next day when I woke up there was, across from my chest to my leg, swelling. And you want to guess how many of them were swollen? Three.

[Assistant] Three.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] Wow.

[User] And yeah, there's lots of, I mean, you can Google the legend behind the Three Sisters Mountain and, you know, you'll see that I'm not making this all up. And there are stories of people who touch the bones or take the bones, and they, women grow beards. And people have had to repatriate the bones because their lives were ruined afterwards. That type of lore.

[Assistant] That's a lucky thing you didn't find any then.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] Wow.

[User] And yeah, there's lots of, I mean, you can Google the legend behind the Three Sisters Mountain and, you know, you'll see that I'm not making this all up. And there are stories of people who touch the bones or take the bones, and they, women grow beards. And people have had to repatriate the bones because their lives were ruined afterwards. That type of lore.

[Assistant] That's a lucky thing you didn't find any then.

[User] Absolutely. Yeah, I really did change my attitude, though, because now spiritually I don't doubt things at the same. You know, I always say there's a lot going on in the spiritual world. I call it a mystery. It actually connects directly to my current Episcopalian faith. Episcopalians love to say things are a mystery.

[Assistant] All right. So after training, you made it through successfully. Did you guys lose anybody in training? Did you have anybody go home or couldn't cut it or?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And yeah, there's lots of, I mean, you can Google the legend behind the Three Sisters Mountain and, you know, you'll see that I'm not making this all up. And there are stories of people who touch the bones or take the bones, and they, women grow beards. And people have had to repatriate the bones because their lives were ruined afterwards. That type of lore.

[Assistant] That's a lucky thing you didn't find any then.

[User] Absolutely. Yeah, I really did change my attitude, though, because now spiritually I don't doubt things at the same. You know, I always say there's a lot going on in the spiritual world. I call it a mystery. It actually connects directly to my current Episcopalian faith. Episcopalians love to say things are a mystery.

[Assistant] All right. So after training, you made it through successfully. Did you guys lose anybody in training? Did you have anybody go home or couldn't cut it or?

[User] Yeah, none that I recall. I might be forgetting that aspect of it, but there wasn't, it wasn't a big washout. We did through the entire period lose some folks. But I don't recall anybody washing out actually during the training period.

[Assistant] Well, that's good. Then you guys went off and started your jobs. Where were you assigned to teach initially?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Absolutely. Yeah, I really did change my attitude, though, because now spiritually I don't doubt things at the same. You know, I always say there's a lot going on in the spiritual world. I call it a mystery. It actually connects directly to my current Episcopalian faith. Episcopalians love to say things are a mystery.

[Assistant] All right. So after training, you made it through successfully. Did you guys lose anybody in training? Did you have anybody go home or couldn't cut it or?

[User] Yeah, none that I recall. I might be forgetting that aspect of it, but there wasn't, it wasn't a big washout. We did through the entire period lose some folks. But I don't recall anybody washing out actually during the training period.

[Assistant] Well, that's good. Then you guys went off and started your jobs. Where were you assigned to teach initially?

[User] Yeah, we all interviewed with the Ministry of Education and they told me that I would be going to Suva Grammar School, which is one of the three main government schools, Suva Grammar School. As well as for boys, that was Queen Victoria School and RKS. And then the girls school where I eventually taught at Adi Cakobau School. But I spent a semester at Suva Grammar School.

[Assistant] So and Suva's the capital city.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, none that I recall. I might be forgetting that aspect of it, but there wasn't, it wasn't a big washout. We did through the entire period lose some folks. But I don't recall anybody washing out actually during the training period.

[Assistant] Well, that's good. Then you guys went off and started your jobs. Where were you assigned to teach initially?

[User] Yeah, we all interviewed with the Ministry of Education and they told me that I would be going to Suva Grammar School, which is one of the three main government schools, Suva Grammar School. As well as for boys, that was Queen Victoria School and RKS. And then the girls school where I eventually taught at Adi Cakobau School. But I spent a semester at Suva Grammar School.

[Assistant] So and Suva's the capital city.

[User] Suva is the capital city and it's right in the area they call the Domain. In fact, our school and our housing was right across the street from the prime minister residence.

[Assistant] So that was pretty upscale compared to most volunteers probably.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Suva is the capital city and it's right in the area they call the Domain. In fact, our school and our housing was right across the street from the prime minister residence.

[Assistant] So that was pretty upscale compared to most volunteers probably.

[User] This was not an imbore.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] Yeah, I was actually embarrassed by the whole thing. I was thinking I was going away for this helping others type experience and, you know, seeing this housing and how nice everything was, I was feeling a little guilty about that. Which, you know, didn't last long because I was after one semester out in the bush.

[Assistant] Sure. Why did you get transferred?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] This was not an imbore.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] Yeah, I was actually embarrassed by the whole thing. I was thinking I was going away for this helping others type experience and, you know, seeing this housing and how nice everything was, I was feeling a little guilty about that. Which, you know, didn't last long because I was after one semester out in the bush.

[Assistant] Sure. Why did you get transferred?

[User] Well, the Ministry of Education.

[Assistant] Was that a choice?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, I was actually embarrassed by the whole thing. I was thinking I was going away for this helping others type experience and, you know, seeing this housing and how nice everything was, I was feeling a little guilty about that. Which, you know, didn't last long because I was after one semester out in the bush.

[Assistant] Sure. Why did you get transferred?

[User] Well, the Ministry of Education.

[Assistant] Was that a choice?

[User] No, it was a, well, yes, it was a choice. The Ministry of Education called me in and said, we have this immediate vacancy. There's no mathematics teacher at this all girls school out in the Sawani area. And would I help out? I'm a volunteer to begin with, right? And the first thing that crossed my mind is absolutely, yeah, I would do that.

[Assistant] So when you were back in Suva, how did you like living in the big city there?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, the Ministry of Education.

[Assistant] Was that a choice?

[User] No, it was a, well, yes, it was a choice. The Ministry of Education called me in and said, we have this immediate vacancy. There's no mathematics teacher at this all girls school out in the Sawani area. And would I help out? I'm a volunteer to begin with, right? And the first thing that crossed my mind is absolutely, yeah, I would do that.

[Assistant] So when you were back in Suva, how did you like living in the big city there?

[User] You know, coming from San Francisco, it really didn't seem like a big city to me. It seemed like an island that had, you know, the odd bit of building on it. But for the feeling of it at all was not at all like what I considered a big city.

[Assistant] Was it what you expected when you signed up for the Peace Corps?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, it was a, well, yes, it was a choice. The Ministry of Education called me in and said, we have this immediate vacancy. There's no mathematics teacher at this all girls school out in the Sawani area. And would I help out? I'm a volunteer to begin with, right? And the first thing that crossed my mind is absolutely, yeah, I would do that.

[Assistant] So when you were back in Suva, how did you like living in the big city there?

[User] You know, coming from San Francisco, it really didn't seem like a big city to me. It seemed like an island that had, you know, the odd bit of building on it. But for the feeling of it at all was not at all like what I considered a big city.

[Assistant] Was it what you expected when you signed up for the Peace Corps?

[User] I don't know what I expected, not really. I was looking for really an adventure of learning and cultural exploration and giving back to some degree. I would say the giving back part got stronger as I was actually there. May have been more self interest in the beginning, but when you start seeing the effect you have on folks' lives and particularly your students' lives. And you realize, well, you know, if they pass six form math, which is not that common in Fiji, pretty much get a job at a bank or some relatively good job by local standards. So you were offering something that really did matter in their lives. That's what convinces you to believe in the vision, if you will, and embrace it. At least that was, in my case, the facts.

[Assistant] So then you went from living in Suva to Adi Cakobau school, which you said was out in the bush.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] You know, coming from San Francisco, it really didn't seem like a big city to me. It seemed like an island that had, you know, the odd bit of building on it. But for the feeling of it at all was not at all like what I considered a big city.

[Assistant] Was it what you expected when you signed up for the Peace Corps?

[User] I don't know what I expected, not really. I was looking for really an adventure of learning and cultural exploration and giving back to some degree. I would say the giving back part got stronger as I was actually there. May have been more self interest in the beginning, but when you start seeing the effect you have on folks' lives and particularly your students' lives. And you realize, well, you know, if they pass six form math, which is not that common in Fiji, pretty much get a job at a bank or some relatively good job by local standards. So you were offering something that really did matter in their lives. That's what convinces you to believe in the vision, if you will, and embrace it. At least that was, in my case, the facts.

[Assistant] So then you went from living in Suva to Adi Cakobau school, which you said was out in the bush.

[User] Sawani. Yeah, it was about 12 miles.

[Assistant] Was there a village nearby where you stayed or what was your living situation like out there?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I don't know what I expected, not really. I was looking for really an adventure of learning and cultural exploration and giving back to some degree. I would say the giving back part got stronger as I was actually there. May have been more self interest in the beginning, but when you start seeing the effect you have on folks' lives and particularly your students' lives. And you realize, well, you know, if they pass six form math, which is not that common in Fiji, pretty much get a job at a bank or some relatively good job by local standards. So you were offering something that really did matter in their lives. That's what convinces you to believe in the vision, if you will, and embrace it. At least that was, in my case, the facts.

[Assistant] So then you went from living in Suva to Adi Cakobau school, which you said was out in the bush.

[User] Sawani. Yeah, it was about 12 miles.

[Assistant] Was there a village nearby where you stayed or what was your living situation like out there?

[User] They were quarters. They were nothing near as nice as the teachers’ quarters at Suva Grammar School. But there were teacher's quarters we had, I believe there were three in one building. And then you had a shared kitchen, living room, cooking area, that type of thing. None of us actually cooked.

[Assistant] Was it all Peace Corps volunteers staying in the quarters?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Sawani. Yeah, it was about 12 miles.

[Assistant] Was there a village nearby where you stayed or what was your living situation like out there?

[User] They were quarters. They were nothing near as nice as the teachers’ quarters at Suva Grammar School. But there were teacher's quarters we had, I believe there were three in one building. And then you had a shared kitchen, living room, cooking area, that type of thing. None of us actually cooked.

[Assistant] Was it all Peace Corps volunteers staying in the quarters?

[User] No.

[Assistant] Or were there local teachers?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] They were quarters. They were nothing near as nice as the teachers’ quarters at Suva Grammar School. But there were teacher's quarters we had, I believe there were three in one building. And then you had a shared kitchen, living room, cooking area, that type of thing. None of us actually cooked.

[Assistant] Was it all Peace Corps volunteers staying in the quarters?

[User] No.

[Assistant] Or were there local teachers?

[User] I was at an all girls school. I was the only man at the school. I was the only male teacher at the school at the time. And everybody else was a Fijian teacher.

[Assistant] And you shared the quarters with these Fijian, other Fijian teachers?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No.

[Assistant] Or were there local teachers?

[User] I was at an all girls school. I was the only man at the school. I was the only male teacher at the school at the time. And everybody else was a Fijian teacher.

[Assistant] And you shared the quarters with these Fijian, other Fijian teachers?

[User] Correct. Yeah. And they also had other arrangements. I don't remember anybody cooking. I ate pretty much every night at the dining hall with girls. So I would sit at the matron's table. The girls have a matron that's in charge of running the kitchen area and many of the activities for the girls. And so I used to call her my wife and I'd sit there and have dinner with my wife.

[Assistant] How'd that go over? Probably a big joke around the school.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I was at an all girls school. I was the only man at the school. I was the only male teacher at the school at the time. And everybody else was a Fijian teacher.

[Assistant] And you shared the quarters with these Fijian, other Fijian teachers?

[User] Correct. Yeah. And they also had other arrangements. I don't remember anybody cooking. I ate pretty much every night at the dining hall with girls. So I would sit at the matron's table. The girls have a matron that's in charge of running the kitchen area and many of the activities for the girls. And so I used to call her my wife and I'd sit there and have dinner with my wife.

[Assistant] How'd that go over? Probably a big joke around the school.

[User] Well, she was about, I was in my twenties and she was in her sixties, so yeah, we were quite the pair. But she had, as many folks there do, a wonderful laugh and it was just plain fun to be with all the time.

[Assistant] So then your whole life pretty much revolved around the school since you weren't in a village with the local community.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Correct. Yeah. And they also had other arrangements. I don't remember anybody cooking. I ate pretty much every night at the dining hall with girls. So I would sit at the matron's table. The girls have a matron that's in charge of running the kitchen area and many of the activities for the girls. And so I used to call her my wife and I'd sit there and have dinner with my wife.

[Assistant] How'd that go over? Probably a big joke around the school.

[User] Well, she was about, I was in my twenties and she was in her sixties, so yeah, we were quite the pair. But she had, as many folks there do, a wonderful laugh and it was just plain fun to be with all the time.

[Assistant] So then your whole life pretty much revolved around the school since you weren't in a village with the local community.

[User] Yes. So you'd watch the Adi Cakobau School sports activities. I've got pictures of the girls sitting on the sides of the building and watching field hockey. Adi Cakobau School is pretty much an undefeated champion of field hockey. And you watch the girls sports. We would also do some activities together like math club and those type of activities, some academic. And if you had time off, you know, you went into town. That was certainly an option for the weekends.

[Assistant] What was it, a couple of hours into town from there?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, she was about, I was in my twenties and she was in her sixties, so yeah, we were quite the pair. But she had, as many folks there do, a wonderful laugh and it was just plain fun to be with all the time.

[Assistant] So then your whole life pretty much revolved around the school since you weren't in a village with the local community.

[User] Yes. So you'd watch the Adi Cakobau School sports activities. I've got pictures of the girls sitting on the sides of the building and watching field hockey. Adi Cakobau School is pretty much an undefeated champion of field hockey. And you watch the girls sports. We would also do some activities together like math club and those type of activities, some academic. And if you had time off, you know, you went into town. That was certainly an option for the weekends.

[Assistant] What was it, a couple of hours into town from there?

[User] Yeah, it's 12 miles so. As you know, the speed of the busses in those days, so it could be a couple of hours.

[Assistant] Yeah, probably more like an hour. So just tell me what a typical day might be like there at the school.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes. So you'd watch the Adi Cakobau School sports activities. I've got pictures of the girls sitting on the sides of the building and watching field hockey. Adi Cakobau School is pretty much an undefeated champion of field hockey. And you watch the girls sports. We would also do some activities together like math club and those type of activities, some academic. And if you had time off, you know, you went into town. That was certainly an option for the weekends.

[Assistant] What was it, a couple of hours into town from there?

[User] Yeah, it's 12 miles so. As you know, the speed of the busses in those days, so it could be a couple of hours.

[Assistant] Yeah, probably more like an hour. So just tell me what a typical day might be like there at the school.

[User]
Yeah. I think like most teachers you head off to your class. I had pretty much the same. I taught forms four, five, and six, which is equivalent in the U.S. to grades 10, 11 and 12. So most of my sixth form class was in the same building. So I would head off to that building and I'd prepared the lesson and, you know, would start the conversation with the girls and live a teacher's life. It's actually pretty programed because they have breaks. I found out what a biscuit is in a nice way. You know, they had asked me if I wanted a biscuit and didn't realize it was a homemade, delicious cookie that I was going to get with this wonderful tea.

So after the bit of teaching, you'd get your first break and you'd sit and talk to other teachers, and then there'd be a break for lunch and then into the afternoon. I suppose you finished roughly the same time as U.S. schedules, you know, early afternoon, 3:00 or 4:00. And then you're back to your quarters to do paper grading and preparing for the next day lessons.

[Assistant] Yeah, so teachers had a lot of work to do outside of school, just as they do here with grading papers and.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, it's 12 miles so. As you know, the speed of the busses in those days, so it could be a couple of hours.

[Assistant] Yeah, probably more like an hour. So just tell me what a typical day might be like there at the school.

[User]
Yeah. I think like most teachers you head off to your class. I had pretty much the same. I taught forms four, five, and six, which is equivalent in the U.S. to grades 10, 11 and 12. So most of my sixth form class was in the same building. So I would head off to that building and I'd prepared the lesson and, you know, would start the conversation with the girls and live a teacher's life. It's actually pretty programed because they have breaks. I found out what a biscuit is in a nice way. You know, they had asked me if I wanted a biscuit and didn't realize it was a homemade, delicious cookie that I was going to get with this wonderful tea.

So after the bit of teaching, you'd get your first break and you'd sit and talk to other teachers, and then there'd be a break for lunch and then into the afternoon. I suppose you finished roughly the same time as U.S. schedules, you know, early afternoon, 3:00 or 4:00. And then you're back to your quarters to do paper grading and preparing for the next day lessons.

[Assistant] Yeah, so teachers had a lot of work to do outside of school, just as they do here with grading papers and.

[User] Sure.

[Assistant] That would probably eat up your evening.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Sure.

[Assistant] That would probably eat up your evening.

[User]
Yeah. Yeah. And then, as I say, I did start a math club at one time that. You know, you look back at these things and say, boy, I would do so much more if I was there now, and I would do things more intensely and better. But you know, at the time, they'd never heard of a math club, so it was a good project to also be involved with. And, you know, there are a lot of school functions as well on days they would put on mecces and various events, welcome people from the outside who are visiting, have assemblies. Typical things you'd have at a boarding school. You know, the majority of all the students at Adi Cakobau School were boarders and, you know, you're talking about several hundred girls that are living there from all over Fiji really.

As you probably know, Adi Cakobau School is the pride of Fijian womanhood. And brilliant women are there, most notably my former boss, who later became the Deputy Prime Minister, Miss Vakatale. So, you know, she is, uh, and also the vice principal, Ethalini. Thankfully I was able to connect with them. I've talked with them through the years as well. In fact, I was intending to see both of them at the recent 50th anniversary.

[Assistant] Did you meet up with them?

[User] Well, unfortunately, there was a reguregu for Ethalini and her family, a funeral. And Miss Vakatale is in her eighties, and so she has her good days and bad days. And frankly, I was pleased at this particular event. The 50th celebration was very loud and noisy. And I really don't think she would have been comfortable had she met up there. She confirmed to go, but then sent her regrets that she wasn't feeling up to it. And it was a pretty noisy event.

[Assistant] So what did you do in your leisure time out there while you're out at the school?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, unfortunately, there was a reguregu for Ethalini and her family, a funeral. And Miss Vakatale is in her eighties, and so she has her good days and bad days. And frankly, I was pleased at this particular event. The 50th celebration was very loud and noisy. And I really don't think she would have been comfortable had she met up there. She confirmed to go, but then sent her regrets that she wasn't feeling up to it. And it was a pretty noisy event.

[Assistant] So what did you do in your leisure time out there while you're out at the school?

[User] Well, one of my favorite activities was scuba diving. You know, when I went there, I was a licensed scuba diver with NAUI. And then I joined the local dive organization there, the British Sub-Aqua Club, and I was an assistant instructor. So I got to do quite a bit of diving, went to places like the Astrolabe Reef that's typically rated in the top five by U.S. divers. So all throughout the time, particularly when I was in Suva area, I did a lot of scuba diving. So other favorite activities were meeting up with friends and going hiking, exploring around, going to places like Levuka. We'd take trips on, I think they call them copra boats.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] I think there's one, I recall the name Ace Akula, that was able to be a transport boat. So exploring was probably the thing I would talk about next. And then I spent quite a bit of time socializing with other Fijians and just going to their houses, cooking chicken curry.

[Assistant] You mean around the school?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, one of my favorite activities was scuba diving. You know, when I went there, I was a licensed scuba diver with NAUI. And then I joined the local dive organization there, the British Sub-Aqua Club, and I was an assistant instructor. So I got to do quite a bit of diving, went to places like the Astrolabe Reef that's typically rated in the top five by U.S. divers. So all throughout the time, particularly when I was in Suva area, I did a lot of scuba diving. So other favorite activities were meeting up with friends and going hiking, exploring around, going to places like Levuka. We'd take trips on, I think they call them copra boats.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] I think there's one, I recall the name Ace Akula, that was able to be a transport boat. So exploring was probably the thing I would talk about next. And then I spent quite a bit of time socializing with other Fijians and just going to their houses, cooking chicken curry.

[Assistant] You mean around the school?

[User] Other teachers, other friends around the school. Pretty much every night.

[Assistant] Because the other teachers would have had their families out there, the married ones anyway, they would have been there with their families. So you did have some good community there, huh?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I think there's one, I recall the name Ace Akula, that was able to be a transport boat. So exploring was probably the thing I would talk about next. And then I spent quite a bit of time socializing with other Fijians and just going to their houses, cooking chicken curry.

[Assistant] You mean around the school?

[User] Other teachers, other friends around the school. Pretty much every night.

[Assistant] Because the other teachers would have had their families out there, the married ones anyway, they would have been there with their families. So you did have some good community there, huh?

[User] Yeah. Pretty much. Well, when I was in Suva, pretty much every night we would be in the circle with somebody having a guitar and a tanoah and we would sit there singing songs, talking about the day, and going over problem areas that we had with students, discussing that type of thing. And of course drinking grog.

[Assistant] Any memorable experiences or episodes while you were at, during your teaching time out there in the school?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah. Pretty much. Well, when I was in Suva, pretty much every night we would be in the circle with somebody having a guitar and a tanoah and we would sit there singing songs, talking about the day, and going over problem areas that we had with students, discussing that type of thing. And of course drinking grog.

[Assistant] Any memorable experiences or episodes while you were at, during your teaching time out there in the school?

[User]
Well, yeah. I mean there's, gosh, lots of things happened. Memorable. It was one thing in particular that I enjoyed. There was a bit of a battle. There's a position similar to valedictorian at schools in Fiji they call dux, D-U-X, and that particular role is a high honor. And we had quite a debate over who would actually get that particular role. The student I wanted was Telaite Biu, and she was one of my top math students. So I and the other teachers all debated and Telaite was in fact selected. And I was so pleased.

When I went back to Fiji a few years ago, I put on a little party and invited people and she showed up. She's now a doctor, Telaite Biu, and she became an eye surgeon and runs the Pacific, she's now the director of the Pacific Eye Institute, so in a very prestigious role.

[Assistant] Wow.

[User] And so that was, you know, quite memorable to me that I promoted this person and to see their life where it went and how super successful that she became.

[Assistant] Right. Right. It's rewarding to see somebody that you taught become such a success, huh?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User]
Well, yeah. I mean there's, gosh, lots of things happened. Memorable. It was one thing in particular that I enjoyed. There was a bit of a battle. There's a position similar to valedictorian at schools in Fiji they call dux, D-U-X, and that particular role is a high honor. And we had quite a debate over who would actually get that particular role. The student I wanted was Telaite Biu, and she was one of my top math students. So I and the other teachers all debated and Telaite was in fact selected. And I was so pleased.

When I went back to Fiji a few years ago, I put on a little party and invited people and she showed up. She's now a doctor, Telaite Biu, and she became an eye surgeon and runs the Pacific, she's now the director of the Pacific Eye Institute, so in a very prestigious role.

[Assistant] Wow.

[User] And so that was, you know, quite memorable to me that I promoted this person and to see their life where it went and how super successful that she became.

[Assistant] Right. Right. It's rewarding to see somebody that you taught become such a success, huh?

[User] Absolutely. Yes.

[Assistant] All right. So looking back at your service, what do you think were your main accomplishments?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Absolutely. Yes.

[Assistant] All right. So looking back at your service, what do you think were your main accomplishments?

[User] You know, as a teacher in Fiji, getting folks to pass exams is very important. In fact, it's critical. They take different examinations to move to the next level. So me being a math teacher, I would say that answer's pretty simple. Getting the maximum number of people to pass. I was a completely untrained teacher and at the end of the year, the boss, Miss Vakatale, told me that my pass rate was higher than the previous year, when they had a trained teacher from, I believe it was Australia or New Zealand, that they would have had to pay a lot more money than the $0 they paid me.

[Assistant] That's impressive.

[User] That was our benchmark, is how many of your students pass the exams?

[Assistant] Any regrets about your service there or anything that happened?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] You know, as a teacher in Fiji, getting folks to pass exams is very important. In fact, it's critical. They take different examinations to move to the next level. So me being a math teacher, I would say that answer's pretty simple. Getting the maximum number of people to pass. I was a completely untrained teacher and at the end of the year, the boss, Miss Vakatale, told me that my pass rate was higher than the previous year, when they had a trained teacher from, I believe it was Australia or New Zealand, that they would have had to pay a lot more money than the $0 they paid me.

[Assistant] That's impressive.

[User] That was our benchmark, is how many of your students pass the exams?

[Assistant] Any regrets about your service there or anything that happened?

[User] You know, I can't remember anything at all other than what I talked about earlier that, you know, when you get older and hopefully wiser, you think, oh, I would have worked harder from the get-go. I would have been more serious about certain aspects of the job, more dedicated to accomplishing more. So if there were any regrets, it would have just been to do more and more seriously what that job was. But, you know, you're in your twenties. You're there for an experience for yourself. And it really doesn't evolve completely until you've actually felt the results of your work. And that's when really service, I think, begins. And its contribution begins, when you see some results of your work.

[Assistant] So you completed the initial first year tour and decided not to extend it. Did you have an opportunity to extend if you had, if you'd wanted to?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] You know, I can't remember anything at all other than what I talked about earlier that, you know, when you get older and hopefully wiser, you think, oh, I would have worked harder from the get-go. I would have been more serious about certain aspects of the job, more dedicated to accomplishing more. So if there were any regrets, it would have just been to do more and more seriously what that job was. But, you know, you're in your twenties. You're there for an experience for yourself. And it really doesn't evolve completely until you've actually felt the results of your work. And that's when really service, I think, begins. And its contribution begins, when you see some results of your work.

[Assistant] So you completed the initial first year tour and decided not to extend it. Did you have an opportunity to extend if you had, if you'd wanted to?

[User] Yeah. At one point, I guess coming from a business background for my dad, I went to the Ministry of Education and I asked them for a raise and their answer was, sure, we have no problem to give you a raise. We'll offer you a job here and you can quit the Peace Corps and work for us.

[Assistant] Yeah?

[User] So that was always in the cards.

[Assistant] But you decided not to do that?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I did, yeah. My family was transferred to Canada. I spent three years in Canada, but I managed many organizations globally, set up joint ventures in China. I opened subsidiary offices in Mexico and Hong Kong. All over most parts of the world. And, yeah, we could have moved again. My wife is a little partial to this area, though, so that wasn't such an easy thing to do. She was okay with Canada, but you know, she wanted to really ensure that if we were to move somewhere, you know, it was going to be better for all the family. And I couldn't argue with that.

[Assistant] So you think the Peace Corps service had something to do with pushing you into that international?

[User] No doubt. No doubt. It convinced me that I liked other cultures. I could say I was equally if not more comfortable with other cultures and certainly with what I experienced in Fiji, to make me want to spend time away from my own country. That I saw many, many things about Fijians that I felt were quite superior to what I perceived of my own fellow Americans. And their loving warmth was. Certainly one of my most memorable experiences was a very simple thing of getting on a bus. And there were some ladies in the back of the bus and then the bus would stop and another lady would get on. And they literally would run across the bus, hug each other, this great warm feeling, like a long-lost friend they hadn't seen. And they did that every day.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] Every single day. And I'd never really seen anybody embracing, loving, warm like that pretty much in my entire growth. And, you know, I came from a loving family, relatively speaking, a super happy family, but we didn't do anything like that.

[Assistant] And you've been back to Fiji a time or two since then?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No doubt. No doubt. It convinced me that I liked other cultures. I could say I was equally if not more comfortable with other cultures and certainly with what I experienced in Fiji, to make me want to spend time away from my own country. That I saw many, many things about Fijians that I felt were quite superior to what I perceived of my own fellow Americans. And their loving warmth was. Certainly one of my most memorable experiences was a very simple thing of getting on a bus. And there were some ladies in the back of the bus and then the bus would stop and another lady would get on. And they literally would run across the bus, hug each other, this great warm feeling, like a long-lost friend they hadn't seen. And they did that every day.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] Every single day. And I'd never really seen anybody embracing, loving, warm like that pretty much in my entire growth. And, you know, I came from a loving family, relatively speaking, a super happy family, but we didn't do anything like that.

[Assistant] And you've been back to Fiji a time or two since then?

[User] Yes. Yeah. Well, there was the Habitat for Humanity trip. Went back in conjunction with that trip, did some work, some projects and visited the people who I had worked with previously. And then of course the 50th anniversary. So I've been back twice.

[Assistant] The Habitat trip was 2011. So was that the first time since 1977 that you had been back?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Every single day. And I'd never really seen anybody embracing, loving, warm like that pretty much in my entire growth. And, you know, I came from a loving family, relatively speaking, a super happy family, but we didn't do anything like that.

[Assistant] And you've been back to Fiji a time or two since then?

[User] Yes. Yeah. Well, there was the Habitat for Humanity trip. Went back in conjunction with that trip, did some work, some projects and visited the people who I had worked with previously. And then of course the 50th anniversary. So I've been back twice.

[Assistant] The Habitat trip was 2011. So was that the first time since 1977 that you had been back?

[User] It was.

[Assistant] OK. And did you notice a lot of changes in that time?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes. Yeah. Well, there was the Habitat for Humanity trip. Went back in conjunction with that trip, did some work, some projects and visited the people who I had worked with previously. And then of course the 50th anniversary. So I've been back twice.

[Assistant] The Habitat trip was 2011. So was that the first time since 1977 that you had been back?

[User] It was.

[Assistant] OK. And did you notice a lot of changes in that time?

[User] You know, I would say I noticed more similarities than the changes, really. I mean, sure, Suva was different and people had grown up. But the warmth, the friendliness, the cultural aspects that I described earlier were pretty much identical. I didn't notice any change in that whatsoever. They didn't suddenly become less warm, less loving, and less friendly.

[Assistant] And you're still, now you're involved with Friends of Fiji. So you're still giving back to, uh, to the country in some way.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] It was.

[Assistant] OK. And did you notice a lot of changes in that time?

[User] You know, I would say I noticed more similarities than the changes, really. I mean, sure, Suva was different and people had grown up. But the warmth, the friendliness, the cultural aspects that I described earlier were pretty much identical. I didn't notice any change in that whatsoever. They didn't suddenly become less warm, less loving, and less friendly.

[Assistant] And you're still, now you're involved with Friends of Fiji. So you're still giving back to, uh, to the country in some way.

[User] Yeah, it's really part of something that I like doing, especially now that I'm, I guess I could call it semi-retired, that it's one of the projects of interest to me. Because you just don't have that good of an experience and sort of a special relationship with the country and then turn down an opportunity to continue to be engaged. And of course, I was really pleased that many of us from Friends of Fiji were able to travel there. I liked that we all just, just like before. You know, I hung out with some Peace Corps people in the beginning. And then once I was integrated into the culture, most all of my friends were Fijians. I still had a few Peace Corps friends, you know, and that's what I noticed, that everybody has their own affinity group we all go back to. We all meet up with the locals who we were associated with, which I think is great.

[Assistant] Yeah. So it must have been good to see some of those people after so many years.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] You know, I would say I noticed more similarities than the changes, really. I mean, sure, Suva was different and people had grown up. But the warmth, the friendliness, the cultural aspects that I described earlier were pretty much identical. I didn't notice any change in that whatsoever. They didn't suddenly become less warm, less loving, and less friendly.

[Assistant] And you're still, now you're involved with Friends of Fiji. So you're still giving back to, uh, to the country in some way.

[User] Yeah, it's really part of something that I like doing, especially now that I'm, I guess I could call it semi-retired, that it's one of the projects of interest to me. Because you just don't have that good of an experience and sort of a special relationship with the country and then turn down an opportunity to continue to be engaged. And of course, I was really pleased that many of us from Friends of Fiji were able to travel there. I liked that we all just, just like before. You know, I hung out with some Peace Corps people in the beginning. And then once I was integrated into the culture, most all of my friends were Fijians. I still had a few Peace Corps friends, you know, and that's what I noticed, that everybody has their own affinity group we all go back to. We all meet up with the locals who we were associated with, which I think is great.

[Assistant] Yeah. So it must have been good to see some of those people after so many years.

[User] It's tremendously undescribably rewarding. I don't even think I could tell people how cool that is.

[Assistant] Yeah. So would you say that maybe the best part of the whole Peace Corps experience is those relationships, those connections that you make with the local people that last so long?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, it's really part of something that I like doing, especially now that I'm, I guess I could call it semi-retired, that it's one of the projects of interest to me. Because you just don't have that good of an experience and sort of a special relationship with the country and then turn down an opportunity to continue to be engaged. And of course, I was really pleased that many of us from Friends of Fiji were able to travel there. I liked that we all just, just like before. You know, I hung out with some Peace Corps people in the beginning. And then once I was integrated into the culture, most all of my friends were Fijians. I still had a few Peace Corps friends, you know, and that's what I noticed, that everybody has their own affinity group we all go back to. We all meet up with the locals who we were associated with, which I think is great.

[Assistant] Yeah. So it must have been good to see some of those people after so many years.

[User] It's tremendously undescribably rewarding. I don't even think I could tell people how cool that is.

[Assistant] Yeah. So would you say that maybe the best part of the whole Peace Corps experience is those relationships, those connections that you make with the local people that last so long?

[User] It's absolutely, absolutely that, and feeling that, you know, within this complicated world made some kind of a positive impact and that they recognize that you did make some kind of a positive impact. And, you know, because a lot of times you'd go to a place and really try to do your best, but it might not be what they really appreciated. But, you know, they let you know that they did appreciate what you did.

[Assistant] Yeah. Any plans to go back in the future?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] It's tremendously undescribably rewarding. I don't even think I could tell people how cool that is.

[Assistant] Yeah. So would you say that maybe the best part of the whole Peace Corps experience is those relationships, those connections that you make with the local people that last so long?

[User] It's absolutely, absolutely that, and feeling that, you know, within this complicated world made some kind of a positive impact and that they recognize that you did make some kind of a positive impact. And, you know, because a lot of times you'd go to a place and really try to do your best, but it might not be what they really appreciated. But, you know, they let you know that they did appreciate what you did.

[Assistant] Yeah. Any plans to go back in the future?

[User] I'd like to go back as often as possible. You know, I live here in the Bay Area. All my family's here in the Bay Area. So it's not a simple task for me to go. I've got to convince others that it's in their interests as well. So, yeah, that's if I have a bit of an issue there, it's that this is my project. It's not something that we all in the family do together. So that means I have limited amount of time I can spend with it because it's individual to me. I was the only one who was a Peace Corps volunteer in Fiji.

[Assistant] Yeah. So is there anything else you want to share? I think we're kind of wrapping up the questions here. Bu any last thoughts or things that you might have remembered while we've been talking that you want to get in here?