[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And so, you know, that was the right decision. She had to convince me, though, that the whole training staff had talked about it, that the ag people and she had talked about it.

[Assistant] Was Dave in the same group?

[User] Yes. Yeah. So he and I were in the same training as far as that part of it.

[Assistant] Right. Now, well, let's talk about the ag training. What was involved, I mean, what were they preparing you for?

[User] Um, basically it was, um, you know, it was very different agriculture than most of us had been around. In the highlands of Ecuador, of course, they grew some wheat and grains and so on. There was that aspect of it. But the emphasis was on the kinds of things that we would not have been exposed to. You know, bananas, cacao, coffee, you know, tropical things. Some of which, you know, were grown in a lot of plantations, but there were some small producers.

[Assistant] But Bozeman is not a tropical environment.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes. Yeah. So he and I were in the same training as far as that part of it.

[Assistant] Right. Now, well, let's talk about the ag training. What was involved, I mean, what were they preparing you for?

[User] Um, basically it was, um, you know, it was very different agriculture than most of us had been around. In the highlands of Ecuador, of course, they grew some wheat and grains and so on. There was that aspect of it. But the emphasis was on the kinds of things that we would not have been exposed to. You know, bananas, cacao, coffee, you know, tropical things. Some of which, you know, were grown in a lot of plantations, but there were some small producers.

[Assistant] But Bozeman is not a tropical environment.

[User] No, it isn't. I guess the highlands, you know, they had staff on the training staff from Ecuador.

[Assistant] Who were Ecuadorian?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Um, basically it was, um, you know, it was very different agriculture than most of us had been around. In the highlands of Ecuador, of course, they grew some wheat and grains and so on. There was that aspect of it. But the emphasis was on the kinds of things that we would not have been exposed to. You know, bananas, cacao, coffee, you know, tropical things. Some of which, you know, were grown in a lot of plantations, but there were some small producers.

[Assistant] But Bozeman is not a tropical environment.

[User] No, it isn't. I guess the highlands, you know, they had staff on the training staff from Ecuador.

[Assistant] Who were Ecuadorian?

[User] Who were Ecuadorians, someone from the Ecuadorian extension service who was not that, which was not that old at the time. Um, the director of Heifer Project in Ecuador. Our group, by the way, was contracted to Heifer Project in Ecuador to manage the agriculture part of it, and they had either started or been very involved with the Ecuadorian extension service for quite a number of years.

[Assistant] Can you give me a brief description of what the Heifer Project was?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, it isn't. I guess the highlands, you know, they had staff on the training staff from Ecuador.

[Assistant] Who were Ecuadorian?

[User] Who were Ecuadorians, someone from the Ecuadorian extension service who was not that, which was not that old at the time. Um, the director of Heifer Project in Ecuador. Our group, by the way, was contracted to Heifer Project in Ecuador to manage the agriculture part of it, and they had either started or been very involved with the Ecuadorian extension service for quite a number of years.

[Assistant] Can you give me a brief description of what the Heifer Project was?

[User] OK. Heifer Project is based in Little Rock, Arkansas, and it was actually started after World War II by a person who had the vision of sending livestock from here to Europe to replenish the livestock, particularly dairy heifers, originally. That's the name Heifer. And so they would send bred heifers to Europe and then the person, the recipient, would then be responsible for returning the first female offspring so that this was like a calf chain, you know, to multiply the livestock in the country. It later became incorporated, you know, they have a huge research operation now down near Little Rock. And Heifer Project had been doing agricultural development work, particularly in the livestock arena, in various countries of the world. And I believe the Peace Corps contract with Heifer to run that was the first contract with Heifer in the world, the one in Ecuador.

[Assistant] Now did they get money from AID also?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Who were Ecuadorians, someone from the Ecuadorian extension service who was not that, which was not that old at the time. Um, the director of Heifer Project in Ecuador. Our group, by the way, was contracted to Heifer Project in Ecuador to manage the agriculture part of it, and they had either started or been very involved with the Ecuadorian extension service for quite a number of years.

[Assistant] Can you give me a brief description of what the Heifer Project was?

[User] OK. Heifer Project is based in Little Rock, Arkansas, and it was actually started after World War II by a person who had the vision of sending livestock from here to Europe to replenish the livestock, particularly dairy heifers, originally. That's the name Heifer. And so they would send bred heifers to Europe and then the person, the recipient, would then be responsible for returning the first female offspring so that this was like a calf chain, you know, to multiply the livestock in the country. It later became incorporated, you know, they have a huge research operation now down near Little Rock. And Heifer Project had been doing agricultural development work, particularly in the livestock arena, in various countries of the world. And I believe the Peace Corps contract with Heifer to run that was the first contract with Heifer in the world, the one in Ecuador.

[Assistant] Now did they get money from AID also?

[User] I don't know what their funding was. We didn't know that much about the funding, but the advantage was that we were working with Peace Corps, but we were working directly with Heifer and we were assigned to the Ecuadorian extension service. So there were people at our training site who had been involved in extension in Ecuador, like the assistant director was there throughout, and then the director of Heifer for Ecuador was there throughout.

[Assistant] And they were all Ecuadorians?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] OK. Heifer Project is based in Little Rock, Arkansas, and it was actually started after World War II by a person who had the vision of sending livestock from here to Europe to replenish the livestock, particularly dairy heifers, originally. That's the name Heifer. And so they would send bred heifers to Europe and then the person, the recipient, would then be responsible for returning the first female offspring so that this was like a calf chain, you know, to multiply the livestock in the country. It later became incorporated, you know, they have a huge research operation now down near Little Rock. And Heifer Project had been doing agricultural development work, particularly in the livestock arena, in various countries of the world. And I believe the Peace Corps contract with Heifer to run that was the first contract with Heifer in the world, the one in Ecuador.

[Assistant] Now did they get money from AID also?

[User] I don't know what their funding was. We didn't know that much about the funding, but the advantage was that we were working with Peace Corps, but we were working directly with Heifer and we were assigned to the Ecuadorian extension service. So there were people at our training site who had been involved in extension in Ecuador, like the assistant director was there throughout, and then the director of Heifer for Ecuador was there throughout.

[Assistant] And they were all Ecuadorians?

[User] The director of Heifer Project was not. He was from the States.

[Assistant] How about language training?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I don't know what their funding was. We didn't know that much about the funding, but the advantage was that we were working with Peace Corps, but we were working directly with Heifer and we were assigned to the Ecuadorian extension service. So there were people at our training site who had been involved in extension in Ecuador, like the assistant director was there throughout, and then the director of Heifer for Ecuador was there throughout.

[Assistant] And they were all Ecuadorians?

[User] The director of Heifer Project was not. He was from the States.

[Assistant] How about language training?

[User] Oh, language training was very intense because I started out with zero. And we had five hours of language a day.

[Assistant] What was the approach, do you recall?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] The director of Heifer Project was not. He was from the States.

[Assistant] How about language training?

[User] Oh, language training was very intense because I started out with zero. And we had five hours of language a day.

[Assistant] What was the approach, do you recall?

[User] Primarily conversational. We had a book or two, a couple of books, but it was primarily conversational.

[Assistant] Did you get tapes and listen?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh, language training was very intense because I started out with zero. And we had five hours of language a day.

[Assistant] What was the approach, do you recall?

[User] Primarily conversational. We had a book or two, a couple of books, but it was primarily conversational.

[Assistant] Did you get tapes and listen?

[User] Oh no, they didn't have tape players and all that in our training at that point. No, it was just strictly small group with a native speaking instructor.

[Assistant] So they had Ecuadorians.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Primarily conversational. We had a book or two, a couple of books, but it was primarily conversational.

[Assistant] Did you get tapes and listen?

[User] Oh no, they didn't have tape players and all that in our training at that point. No, it was just strictly small group with a native speaking instructor.

[Assistant] So they had Ecuadorians.

[User] Well, not necessarily Ecuadorians. Our instructor was from Mexico. And there were like 12 people. They broke us down, the approximately 77 of us, into groups of about 12 or so. And for a lot of things, you functioned in this group of 12, in language you stayed with this group of 12. And for your weekend camp out and hike ins in the mountains, you functioned with this group of 12 plus the staff who went along. And then for your area studies, you know, we had big things with all of us. And then the agriculture training included those who were in the agriculture training. And the home economics training included those who were in the home economics training.

[Assistant] With the language training, were you told that you had to get up to a certain level in order to be selected?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh no, they didn't have tape players and all that in our training at that point. No, it was just strictly small group with a native speaking instructor.

[Assistant] So they had Ecuadorians.

[User] Well, not necessarily Ecuadorians. Our instructor was from Mexico. And there were like 12 people. They broke us down, the approximately 77 of us, into groups of about 12 or so. And for a lot of things, you functioned in this group of 12, in language you stayed with this group of 12. And for your weekend camp out and hike ins in the mountains, you functioned with this group of 12 plus the staff who went along. And then for your area studies, you know, we had big things with all of us. And then the agriculture training included those who were in the agriculture training. And the home economics training included those who were in the home economics training.

[Assistant] With the language training, were you told that you had to get up to a certain level in order to be selected?

[User] Mm hmm. Yes.

[Assistant] Which must have been a source of a certain amount of tension.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, not necessarily Ecuadorians. Our instructor was from Mexico. And there were like 12 people. They broke us down, the approximately 77 of us, into groups of about 12 or so. And for a lot of things, you functioned in this group of 12, in language you stayed with this group of 12. And for your weekend camp out and hike ins in the mountains, you functioned with this group of 12 plus the staff who went along. And then for your area studies, you know, we had big things with all of us. And then the agriculture training included those who were in the agriculture training. And the home economics training included those who were in the home economics training.

[Assistant] With the language training, were you told that you had to get up to a certain level in order to be selected?

[User] Mm hmm. Yes.

[Assistant] Which must have been a source of a certain amount of tension.

[User] Oh, it was a lot of anxiety for everyone. That and then the other anxiety was the all the psychological tests that they gave you when you. And as I'm recalling part of that was when you first arrived, they gave you a lot of psychological tests.

[Assistant] Paper and pencil?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Mm hmm. Yes.

[Assistant] Which must have been a source of a certain amount of tension.

[User] Oh, it was a lot of anxiety for everyone. That and then the other anxiety was the all the psychological tests that they gave you when you. And as I'm recalling part of that was when you first arrived, they gave you a lot of psychological tests.

[Assistant] Paper and pencil?

[User] Paper and pencil tests. And um, and then based on I'm not sure what all criteria. I know that the psychological portion and the tests were part of it, the observation of the psychiatrists and psychologists who were with your group because each of these groups of 12 had a psychiatrist, a psychologist, assigned to be with them.

[Assistant] Did you get, were you interviewed separately by a psychologist or psychiatrist?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh, it was a lot of anxiety for everyone. That and then the other anxiety was the all the psychological tests that they gave you when you. And as I'm recalling part of that was when you first arrived, they gave you a lot of psychological tests.

[Assistant] Paper and pencil?

[User] Paper and pencil tests. And um, and then based on I'm not sure what all criteria. I know that the psychological portion and the tests were part of it, the observation of the psychiatrists and psychologists who were with your group because each of these groups of 12 had a psychiatrist, a psychologist, assigned to be with them.

[Assistant] Did you get, were you interviewed separately by a psychologist or psychiatrist?

[User] Yes. Uh huh.

[Assistant] What was that like? Because I assume you had not had much contact with either.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes. Uh huh.

[Assistant] What was that like? Because I assume you had not had much contact with either.

[User] No, I had never had any contact with either. Actually, I was probably so naive. I was probably pretty relaxed about it. But they ask you, I really don't remember what they ask and so on but.

[Assistant] Go ahead.

[User] Yeah, I just can't. You know, part of it was follow up to some of the pencil paper questionnaire, I believe. I really don't remember a whole lot about that, though.

[Assistant] Were you and Dave interviewed together at any point?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, I had never had any contact with either. Actually, I was probably so naive. I was probably pretty relaxed about it. But they ask you, I really don't remember what they ask and so on but.

[Assistant] Go ahead.

[User] Yeah, I just can't. You know, part of it was follow up to some of the pencil paper questionnaire, I believe. I really don't remember a whole lot about that, though.

[Assistant] Were you and Dave interviewed together at any point?

[User] No, separately.

[Assistant] And do you recall being questioned about how do you think, you're newly married, how will it go?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, I just can't. You know, part of it was follow up to some of the pencil paper questionnaire, I believe. I really don't remember a whole lot about that, though.

[Assistant] Were you and Dave interviewed together at any point?

[User] No, separately.

[Assistant] And do you recall being questioned about how do you think, you're newly married, how will it go?

[User] Yes, definitely on things like that. Yes, there were things along that line and, um, you know, maybe some questioning of me about, you know, his motivations and probably him about mine. I can't recall exactly about that, it's been a long time ago,

[Assistant] But did you and Dave talk about?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, definitely on things like that. Yes, there were things along that line and, um, you know, maybe some questioning of me about, you know, his motivations and probably him about mine. I can't recall exactly about that, it's been a long time ago,

[Assistant] But did you and Dave talk about?

[User] Well, they didn't really give you that much time. Our day started at 5:30 in the morning with physical training. And we had to run. Well, actually, you could walk over, but you had to be over at the football field at a certain time for physical training. And so, you know, you usually be running late and you'd go over there and you do your exercises and then you'd run and then you'd run all the way back to the dorm. I tried to get back first or second because so I was in a hurry because the water would run out in the showers and everyone was coming in at the same time and the water in Montana was cold even in June and July.

[Assistant] That's great.

[User] And so, then we'd go to breakfast and yeah, we did talk about it. But you know, I just don't remember that. That's been a long time ago. But, you know, the days were pretty busy. You didn't have a lot of time for that kind of talking. You were, you know, pretty busy and tired most of the time. Then you'd go through, you'd go to breakfast and then you'd go to your first language class. And then you'd have, as I'm recalling, either area studies, which would be about the history and culture. We studied a lot on the history, the customs, the culture, you know, of Ecuador. Um, you know, then I can't remember exactly the language class schedule. I remember there was one early in the morning, and it totaled about five hours a day altogether.

[Assistant] Do you remember if in the dining hall, they tried to set up speak Spanish only at meals kind of thing?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, they didn't really give you that much time. Our day started at 5:30 in the morning with physical training. And we had to run. Well, actually, you could walk over, but you had to be over at the football field at a certain time for physical training. And so, you know, you usually be running late and you'd go over there and you do your exercises and then you'd run and then you'd run all the way back to the dorm. I tried to get back first or second because so I was in a hurry because the water would run out in the showers and everyone was coming in at the same time and the water in Montana was cold even in June and July.

[Assistant] That's great.

[User] And so, then we'd go to breakfast and yeah, we did talk about it. But you know, I just don't remember that. That's been a long time ago. But, you know, the days were pretty busy. You didn't have a lot of time for that kind of talking. You were, you know, pretty busy and tired most of the time. Then you'd go through, you'd go to breakfast and then you'd go to your first language class. And then you'd have, as I'm recalling, either area studies, which would be about the history and culture. We studied a lot on the history, the customs, the culture, you know, of Ecuador. Um, you know, then I can't remember exactly the language class schedule. I remember there was one early in the morning, and it totaled about five hours a day altogether.

[Assistant] Do you remember if in the dining hall, they tried to set up speak Spanish only at meals kind of thing?

[User] No, I don't think so. I think that the language instructors did join us at the tables as we got more into the training and then we would talk with the instructor in Spanish. But I think in the beginning, no, they did not. We just went through the cafeteria, the university cafeteria, along with all the students, and selected from the line.

[Assistant] And do you remember if there was a component of American studies and world communism?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And so, then we'd go to breakfast and yeah, we did talk about it. But you know, I just don't remember that. That's been a long time ago. But, you know, the days were pretty busy. You didn't have a lot of time for that kind of talking. You were, you know, pretty busy and tired most of the time. Then you'd go through, you'd go to breakfast and then you'd go to your first language class. And then you'd have, as I'm recalling, either area studies, which would be about the history and culture. We studied a lot on the history, the customs, the culture, you know, of Ecuador. Um, you know, then I can't remember exactly the language class schedule. I remember there was one early in the morning, and it totaled about five hours a day altogether.

[Assistant] Do you remember if in the dining hall, they tried to set up speak Spanish only at meals kind of thing?

[User] No, I don't think so. I think that the language instructors did join us at the tables as we got more into the training and then we would talk with the instructor in Spanish. But I think in the beginning, no, they did not. We just went through the cafeteria, the university cafeteria, along with all the students, and selected from the line.

[Assistant] And do you remember if there was a component of American studies and world communism?

[User] Oh yes, I think there was some. Yeah, I think there was American studies too. I'd forgotten that aspect of it.

[Assistant] And any discussion of world communism as well?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, I don't think so. I think that the language instructors did join us at the tables as we got more into the training and then we would talk with the instructor in Spanish. But I think in the beginning, no, they did not. We just went through the cafeteria, the university cafeteria, along with all the students, and selected from the line.

[Assistant] And do you remember if there was a component of American studies and world communism?

[User] Oh yes, I think there was some. Yeah, I think there was American studies too. I'd forgotten that aspect of it.

[Assistant] And any discussion of world communism as well?

[User] I believe so. That part I don't remember really as clearly as, um, as the Ecuadorian area studies, probably because that was totally new to me.

[Assistant] Well, yeah, I mean, in practical, you're about to go to Ecuador


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh yes, I think there was some. Yeah, I think there was American studies too. I'd forgotten that aspect of it.

[Assistant] And any discussion of world communism as well?

[User] I believe so. That part I don't remember really as clearly as, um, as the Ecuadorian area studies, probably because that was totally new to me.

[Assistant] Well, yeah, I mean, in practical, you're about to go to Ecuador

[User] Focused on it. But yes, there was a history professor from the university on our training staff. This many years later, my guess is that that was probably his role to coordinate that part of it. And the reason I remember him so clearly because he was in our camp out group.

[Assistant] Oh, OK. Tell me about the camp outs.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I believe so. That part I don't remember really as clearly as, um, as the Ecuadorian area studies, probably because that was totally new to me.

[Assistant] Well, yeah, I mean, in practical, you're about to go to Ecuador

[User] Focused on it. But yes, there was a history professor from the university on our training staff. This many years later, my guess is that that was probably his role to coordinate that part of it. And the reason I remember him so clearly because he was in our camp out group.

[Assistant] Oh, OK. Tell me about the camp outs.

[User] Oh, the camp outs. Well, we had.

[Assistant] Was it every weekend?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Focused on it. But yes, there was a history professor from the university on our training staff. This many years later, my guess is that that was probably his role to coordinate that part of it. And the reason I remember him so clearly because he was in our camp out group.

[Assistant] Oh, OK. Tell me about the camp outs.

[User] Oh, the camp outs. Well, we had.

[Assistant] Was it every weekend?

[User]
Every weekend. We had training all week, Monday through Friday, and then Saturday morning. And then Saturday, as soon as training was over, maybe lunch, they'd load us into the back of trucks along with our World War II surplus or Korean War surplus issued sleeping bags and haul us out somewhere to the foothills of the mountains, usually each group totally separately. Sometimes they would combine maybe two, but usually each group separately. And our psychologist went along and an outdoor person expert went along, on the area, you know, on that area where we were going. Or two of them usually because our outdoor experts, one of them was the history professor and then the other one was this woman who really was an outdoorsman, a rancher and so on in area.

And we would hike in with our food on our back and it wasn't freeze dried like today. I remember the time that I had the five pound can of tuna put in the back of my backpack. It was along with all the other things that you had back then. You know, you tried to keep it to a minimum, but anyway, you'd hike in and you'd make camp and you'd make fire and you'd cook your supper. And, you know, usually we'd sing around the campfire and things.

[Assistant] And how did the staff explain the purpose of it?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh, the camp outs. Well, we had.

[Assistant] Was it every weekend?

[User]
Every weekend. We had training all week, Monday through Friday, and then Saturday morning. And then Saturday, as soon as training was over, maybe lunch, they'd load us into the back of trucks along with our World War II surplus or Korean War surplus issued sleeping bags and haul us out somewhere to the foothills of the mountains, usually each group totally separately. Sometimes they would combine maybe two, but usually each group separately. And our psychologist went along and an outdoor person expert went along, on the area, you know, on that area where we were going. Or two of them usually because our outdoor experts, one of them was the history professor and then the other one was this woman who really was an outdoorsman, a rancher and so on in area.

And we would hike in with our food on our back and it wasn't freeze dried like today. I remember the time that I had the five pound can of tuna put in the back of my backpack. It was along with all the other things that you had back then. You know, you tried to keep it to a minimum, but anyway, you'd hike in and you'd make camp and you'd make fire and you'd cook your supper. And, you know, usually we'd sing around the campfire and things.

[Assistant] And how did the staff explain the purpose of it?

[User] Well, they sort of explained it that we didn't know where we were going in Ecuador. And you know, some of us might have to, you know, do a lot of hiking and walking in and it was a mountainous country. As I'm recalling, that was more or less the explanation.

[Assistant] But you didn't believe it.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User]
Every weekend. We had training all week, Monday through Friday, and then Saturday morning. And then Saturday, as soon as training was over, maybe lunch, they'd load us into the back of trucks along with our World War II surplus or Korean War surplus issued sleeping bags and haul us out somewhere to the foothills of the mountains, usually each group totally separately. Sometimes they would combine maybe two, but usually each group separately. And our psychologist went along and an outdoor person expert went along, on the area, you know, on that area where we were going. Or two of them usually because our outdoor experts, one of them was the history professor and then the other one was this woman who really was an outdoorsman, a rancher and so on in area.

And we would hike in with our food on our back and it wasn't freeze dried like today. I remember the time that I had the five pound can of tuna put in the back of my backpack. It was along with all the other things that you had back then. You know, you tried to keep it to a minimum, but anyway, you'd hike in and you'd make camp and you'd make fire and you'd cook your supper. And, you know, usually we'd sing around the campfire and things.

[Assistant] And how did the staff explain the purpose of it?

[User] Well, they sort of explained it that we didn't know where we were going in Ecuador. And you know, some of us might have to, you know, do a lot of hiking and walking in and it was a mountainous country. As I'm recalling, that was more or less the explanation.

[Assistant] But you didn't believe it.

[User] Well, actually, I sort of did, except I ended up in the coast, and so. I ended up in the desert on the coast.

[Assistant] But the whole time you were out on these weekends, did you have a sense you were being watched?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, actually, I sort of did, except I ended up in the coast, and so. I ended up in the desert on the coast.

[Assistant] But the whole time you were out on these weekends, did you have a sense you were being watched?

[User] Oh yeah. Everyone, everyone had a sense that they were being watched and all the time because this psychiatrist, psychologist, was there all the time. His name was Dr. Geenwa, ours was. And starting about two weeks into our training, on a certain day of the week when you came back from your morning physical training before you went to breakfast, there would be pink slips in the mailboxes and so everyone would run to their mailboxes to see if they'd gotten a pink slip that week. And that was a deselection slip.

[Assistant] Huh.

[User] And actually, we started out with about 77. I think 47 or 49 of us went to Ecuador.

[Assistant] Oh my god.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, of course, in a couple, if one's deselected, the other is.

[Assistant] Well, yeah.

[User] And so he may have had some concern about my Spanish because my Spanish wasn't quite as good as his. But, you know, he never verbalized it.

[Assistant] Oh, OK.

[User] But I think we were both concerned about deselection. Everyone was. Everyone was, you know, really, you know, really uptight. And, you know, there may have been more competition in this group than what I have seen and heard about from recent RPCVs. You know, because of this thing that was set up on the deselection process.

[Assistant] And this went on pretty much in the same pattern for eight weeks?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And so he may have had some concern about my Spanish because my Spanish wasn't quite as good as his. But, you know, he never verbalized it.

[Assistant] Oh, OK.

[User] But I think we were both concerned about deselection. Everyone was. Everyone was, you know, really, you know, really uptight. And, you know, there may have been more competition in this group than what I have seen and heard about from recent RPCVs. You know, because of this thing that was set up on the deselection process.

[Assistant] And this went on pretty much in the same pattern for eight weeks?

[User] Yeah, eight weeks.

[Assistant] And you were tested midpoint and at the end in language?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] But I think we were both concerned about deselection. Everyone was. Everyone was, you know, really, you know, really uptight. And, you know, there may have been more competition in this group than what I have seen and heard about from recent RPCVs. You know, because of this thing that was set up on the deselection process.

[Assistant] And this went on pretty much in the same pattern for eight weeks?

[User] Yeah, eight weeks.

[Assistant] And you were tested midpoint and at the end in language?

[User] Right.

[Assistant] What about your technical skills, that was? There was no test.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, eight weeks.

[Assistant] And you were tested midpoint and at the end in language?

[User] Right.

[Assistant] What about your technical skills, that was? There was no test.

[User] I don't think there were any tests in the technical skills. No. It was more of an, as I look back on it, I would call it more of an awareness. Yeah, I did learn some things because, you know, about how bananas are propagated and so on. That I still remember and a few things.

[Assistant] At any point in the training, was there any kind of specificity about the job you were going to be doing when you got to Ecuador?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Right.

[Assistant] What about your technical skills, that was? There was no test.

[User] I don't think there were any tests in the technical skills. No. It was more of an, as I look back on it, I would call it more of an awareness. Yeah, I did learn some things because, you know, about how bananas are propagated and so on. That I still remember and a few things.

[Assistant] At any point in the training, was there any kind of specificity about the job you were going to be doing when you got to Ecuador?

[User] At one point, we did get to indicate what part of the country we might like to go to. You know, coast or Andes, and that may, they may have at that point then focused a little bit more. I don't really remember totally. But I do remember there was discussion. We had an opportunity to indicate whether we were more interested in the coast or the Andes.

[Assistant] Of course, you weren't asked about who you wanted to be assigned with because the assumption was it would be you and Dave.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] At one point, we did get to indicate what part of the country we might like to go to. You know, coast or Andes, and that may, they may have at that point then focused a little bit more. I don't really remember totally. But I do remember there was discussion. We had an opportunity to indicate whether we were more interested in the coast or the Andes.

[Assistant] Of course, you weren't asked about who you wanted to be assigned with because the assumption was it would be you and Dave.

[User] Right. And I don't know that they asked the others who they wanted to be assigned with. They did assign. They did not assign single women to an area unless they assigned a male Peace Corps volunteer there.

[Assistant] Oh, OK.

[User] I guess because of the culture and the time and so on, they felt that the females needed to be have someone to quote, look after them.

[Assistant] Right. Right. So how did how was final selection? By then everybody who was going to be deselected had been or was there the last couple of days when you didn't know if it was going to happen or not?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I guess because of the culture and the time and so on, they felt that the females needed to be have someone to quote, look after them.

[Assistant] Right. Right. So how did how was final selection? By then everybody who was going to be deselected had been or was there the last couple of days when you didn't know if it was going to happen or not?

[User] And, you know, I've forgotten that. I'm really not sure.

[Assistant] OK, OK.

[User] So I don't remember if it went up, the final deselection was right at the end or if it had been a week or so earlier.

[Assistant] Do you know what your final score was on language?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And, you know, I've forgotten that. I'm really not sure.

[Assistant] OK, OK.

[User] So I don't remember if it went up, the final deselection was right at the end or if it had been a week or so earlier.

[Assistant] Do you know what your final score was on language?

[User] No, I don't remember. I don't know that we were told that.

[Assistant] All right. But you and Dave were selected.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] So I don't remember if it went up, the final deselection was right at the end or if it had been a week or so earlier.

[Assistant] Do you know what your final score was on language?

[User] No, I don't remember. I don't know that we were told that.

[Assistant] All right. But you and Dave were selected.

[User] Yeah, we were selected.

[Assistant] Along with 40 some other people.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, I don't remember. I don't know that we were told that.

[Assistant] All right. But you and Dave were selected.

[User] Yeah, we were selected.

[Assistant] Along with 40 some other people.

[User] Along with 40 some other people.

[Assistant] And at that point, what happened?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, we were selected.

[Assistant] Along with 40 some other people.

[User] Along with 40 some other people.

[Assistant] And at that point, what happened?

[User] Well, then we were given a plane ticket to fly home and pack. We were told, you know, what kinds of things to pack. And back then you got a foot locker to ship, as well as your 66 pounds or whatever you could take on an international flight. And so we went home and, you know, packed up our stuff.

[Assistant] Did you fly back?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Along with 40 some other people.

[Assistant] And at that point, what happened?

[User] Well, then we were given a plane ticket to fly home and pack. We were told, you know, what kinds of things to pack. And back then you got a foot locker to ship, as well as your 66 pounds or whatever you could take on an international flight. And so we went home and, you know, packed up our stuff.

[Assistant] Did you fly back?

[User] Yes, we did fly back. We flew back.

[Assistant] And that was your first flight.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, then we were given a plane ticket to fly home and pack. We were told, you know, what kinds of things to pack. And back then you got a foot locker to ship, as well as your 66 pounds or whatever you could take on an international flight. And so we went home and, you know, packed up our stuff.

[Assistant] Did you fly back?

[User] Yes, we did fly back. We flew back.

[Assistant] And that was your first flight.

[User] That was my first flight. Yes. That was my first flight. Flew back, packed up the things, and then flew to New York City and convened as a group in New York City.

[Assistant] OK, let's get there in a minute. But when you're doing training, had you been calling your family or writing them or?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, we did fly back. We flew back.

[Assistant] And that was your first flight.

[User] That was my first flight. Yes. That was my first flight. Flew back, packed up the things, and then flew to New York City and convened as a group in New York City.

[Assistant] OK, let's get there in a minute. But when you're doing training, had you been calling your family or writing them or?

[User] Well, I'd been, we'd been writing.

[Assistant] Were you hearing from them?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] That was my first flight. Yes. That was my first flight. Flew back, packed up the things, and then flew to New York City and convened as a group in New York City.

[Assistant] OK, let's get there in a minute. But when you're doing training, had you been calling your family or writing them or?

[User] Well, I'd been, we'd been writing.

[Assistant] Were you hearing from them?

[User] Um, I was hearing from not my parents, but from other family members. I was hearing from my grandmother, my grandmothers. I think both of my grandmothers. My aunts.

[Assistant] And what were they saying?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, I'd been, we'd been writing.

[Assistant] Were you hearing from them?

[User] Um, I was hearing from not my parents, but from other family members. I was hearing from my grandmother, my grandmothers. I think both of my grandmothers. My aunts.

[Assistant] And what were they saying?

[User] Oh, they were just, you know, writing family stuff mostly.

[Assistant] Nobody was saying, you know, are you going to give this up?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Um, I was hearing from not my parents, but from other family members. I was hearing from my grandmother, my grandmothers. I think both of my grandmothers. My aunts.

[Assistant] And what were they saying?

[User] Oh, they were just, you know, writing family stuff mostly.

[Assistant] Nobody was saying, you know, are you going to give this up?

[User] No.

[Assistant] OK. What happened to all the wedding presents?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh, they were just, you know, writing family stuff mostly.

[Assistant] Nobody was saying, you know, are you going to give this up?

[User] No.

[Assistant] OK. What happened to all the wedding presents?

[User] Well, you know, it was a very small wedding, so they were just sort of stored. They were just stored.

[Assistant] Just a side kind of question. How long were you back home in between? Two days, three days?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No.

[Assistant] OK. What happened to all the wedding presents?

[User] Well, you know, it was a very small wedding, so they were just sort of stored. They were just stored.

[Assistant] Just a side kind of question. How long were you back home in between? Two days, three days?

[User] It was at least a week, I can't remember, because I did see some family.

[Assistant] Did you and Dave split and he went to his family and you went to yours?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, you know, it was a very small wedding, so they were just sort of stored. They were just stored.

[Assistant] Just a side kind of question. How long were you back home in between? Two days, three days?

[User] It was at least a week, I can't remember, because I did see some family.

[Assistant] Did you and Dave split and he went to his family and you went to yours?

[User] I was just down at my family's for a day and mostly was at his family's and actually then with some of my other relatives. My parents didn't go to see me off at the plane.

[Assistant] Did you have any second thoughts at that point, you know? That maybe it's pretty far I'm going and?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I was just down at my family's for a day and mostly was at his family's and actually then with some of my other relatives. My parents didn't go to see me off at the plane.

[Assistant] Did you have any second thoughts at that point, you know? That maybe it's pretty far I'm going and?

[User] No. But as far as the phone calls, you know, that was not that unusual because you have to remember that my parents didn't have a telephone. His parents did. But you know, people didn't make long distance calls like that back then. You know, it's different than now with cell phones and.

[Assistant] Email even.

[User] Right. No, I don't, no. We really didn't have any second thoughts. I don't think either one of us did. You know, we were excited about it. We were pumped up. We were ready to go. And you know, the only, you know, sad thing was when we went to the airport in Peoria, Illinois, you know, to fly out. My dad's parents were there. My grandmother in a wheelchair. She had several strokes and, um, my dad's youngest sister and her husband and her children. And Dave's parents were there. And, you know, but my parents were not there.

[Assistant] And was it disapproval?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No. But as far as the phone calls, you know, that was not that unusual because you have to remember that my parents didn't have a telephone. His parents did. But you know, people didn't make long distance calls like that back then. You know, it's different than now with cell phones and.

[Assistant] Email even.

[User] Right. No, I don't, no. We really didn't have any second thoughts. I don't think either one of us did. You know, we were excited about it. We were pumped up. We were ready to go. And you know, the only, you know, sad thing was when we went to the airport in Peoria, Illinois, you know, to fly out. My dad's parents were there. My grandmother in a wheelchair. She had several strokes and, um, my dad's youngest sister and her husband and her children. And Dave's parents were there. And, you know, but my parents were not there.

[Assistant] And was it disapproval?

[User] Oh yes. Oh yes. And, you know, it was going to Ecuador, getting married so young, marrying him at that point in time, you know, just the whole.

[Assistant] Just too much.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Right. No, I don't, no. We really didn't have any second thoughts. I don't think either one of us did. You know, we were excited about it. We were pumped up. We were ready to go. And you know, the only, you know, sad thing was when we went to the airport in Peoria, Illinois, you know, to fly out. My dad's parents were there. My grandmother in a wheelchair. She had several strokes and, um, my dad's youngest sister and her husband and her children. And Dave's parents were there. And, you know, but my parents were not there.

[Assistant] And was it disapproval?

[User] Oh yes. Oh yes. And, you know, it was going to Ecuador, getting married so young, marrying him at that point in time, you know, just the whole.

[Assistant] Just too much.

[User] Just all of it combined. Yeah.

[Assistant] So continue with the great adventure. You flew for the second time in your life.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh yes. Oh yes. And, you know, it was going to Ecuador, getting married so young, marrying him at that point in time, you know, just the whole.

[Assistant] Just too much.

[User] Just all of it combined. Yeah.

[Assistant] So continue with the great adventure. You flew for the second time in your life.

[User] Right.

[Assistant] And ended up in New York City.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Just all of it combined. Yeah.

[Assistant] So continue with the great adventure. You flew for the second time in your life.

[User] Right.

[Assistant] And ended up in New York City.

[User] Ended up in New York City.

[Assistant] Where you had not been before.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Right.

[Assistant] And ended up in New York City.

[User] Ended up in New York City.

[Assistant] Where you had not been before.

[User] Where I'd not been before. And actually, we went in, as a lot of people did, a day or two early to see some of New York. We walked because everyone was on a tight budget and didn't have, you know, extra money. You know, we weren't, you know, I didn't have support from my family on this venture. So, you know, I was on my own totally. We walked from Central Park to the harbor to see the Statue of Liberty at a distance. It's a long way.

[Assistant] Oh yes. Oh yes.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Ended up in New York City.

[Assistant] Where you had not been before.

[User] Where I'd not been before. And actually, we went in, as a lot of people did, a day or two early to see some of New York. We walked because everyone was on a tight budget and didn't have, you know, extra money. You know, we weren't, you know, I didn't have support from my family on this venture. So, you know, I was on my own totally. We walked from Central Park to the harbor to see the Statue of Liberty at a distance. It's a long way.

[Assistant] Oh yes. Oh yes.

[User] Uh huh. And then, you know, on the way down and back actually zigzagged a little bit seeing some other sights, you know, just generally took advantage of that day or whatever it was.

[Assistant] You remember what you stayed?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Where I'd not been before. And actually, we went in, as a lot of people did, a day or two early to see some of New York. We walked because everyone was on a tight budget and didn't have, you know, extra money. You know, we weren't, you know, I didn't have support from my family on this venture. So, you know, I was on my own totally. We walked from Central Park to the harbor to see the Statue of Liberty at a distance. It's a long way.

[Assistant] Oh yes. Oh yes.

[User] Uh huh. And then, you know, on the way down and back actually zigzagged a little bit seeing some other sights, you know, just generally took advantage of that day or whatever it was.

[Assistant] You remember what you stayed?

[User] It was a hotel right off Central Park. I don't remember the name of it.

[Assistant] And Peace Corps had arranged that?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Uh huh. And then, you know, on the way down and back actually zigzagged a little bit seeing some other sights, you know, just generally took advantage of that day or whatever it was.

[Assistant] You remember what you stayed?

[User] It was a hotel right off Central Park. I don't remember the name of it.

[Assistant] And Peace Corps had arranged that?

[User] Peace Corps had arranged that.

[Assistant] So you could report in early and that was OK.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] It was a hotel right off Central Park. I don't remember the name of it.

[Assistant] And Peace Corps had arranged that?

[User] Peace Corps had arranged that.

[Assistant] So you could report in early and that was OK.

[User] I think maybe we had to pay for one extra day or one extra night and we came up with that.

[Assistant] And so New York was just the staging.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Peace Corps had arranged that.

[Assistant] So you could report in early and that was OK.

[User] I think maybe we had to pay for one extra day or one extra night and we came up with that.

[Assistant] And so New York was just the staging.

[User] Yeah, they really didn't do anything there except convene us and get us on the same flight. You know, there wasn't really staging per se there.

[Assistant] By then, had those of you who were finally selected, been selected, had you come together at all as a group?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, they really didn't do anything there except convene us and get us on the same flight. You know, there wasn't really staging per se there.

[Assistant] By then, had those of you who were finally selected, been selected, had you come together at all as a group?

[User] Well, we did some, you know, before. There were some friendships, particularly in these camp out groups, because that was the group that you really ended up knowing the best. The group that you were in your language training with.

[Assistant] Right.

[User] And you know, you were sad when one of them was deselected or whatever. And because you had your language with them, you had your, um, your camp out with them. And actually, those groups might not have been. That may have been too separate. They may have evolved separately as the time went on, as people progressed differently in language, I'm not exactly sure. But those were the groups of people that you probably knew the best.

[Assistant] Were you close friends with any other married couples?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, we did some, you know, before. There were some friendships, particularly in these camp out groups, because that was the group that you really ended up knowing the best. The group that you were in your language training with.

[Assistant] Right.

[User] And you know, you were sad when one of them was deselected or whatever. And because you had your language with them, you had your, um, your camp out with them. And actually, those groups might not have been. That may have been too separate. They may have evolved separately as the time went on, as people progressed differently in language, I'm not exactly sure. But those were the groups of people that you probably knew the best.

[Assistant] Were you close friends with any other married couples?

[User] Um, well, there was one other married couple and they left early. She found out she was pregnant and they weren't in the training group. They were fairly close to our age, just a couple of few years older. Oh, actually, there was one other one. Yeah, somewhat close to. Actually, there was one that was in their forties that we were sort of close to. And then there were some single people that we were close to also. But you know, things were a little bit different because of the situation. But yes, by the time we got there, you know, we had a lot of fun together and you know, we'd all made it through the first stage and we were getting ready to go to the second phase of training.

[Assistant] Yeah. So going down there was going to be additional training and you knew that.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And you know, you were sad when one of them was deselected or whatever. And because you had your language with them, you had your, um, your camp out with them. And actually, those groups might not have been. That may have been too separate. They may have evolved separately as the time went on, as people progressed differently in language, I'm not exactly sure. But those were the groups of people that you probably knew the best.

[Assistant] Were you close friends with any other married couples?

[User] Um, well, there was one other married couple and they left early. She found out she was pregnant and they weren't in the training group. They were fairly close to our age, just a couple of few years older. Oh, actually, there was one other one. Yeah, somewhat close to. Actually, there was one that was in their forties that we were sort of close to. And then there were some single people that we were close to also. But you know, things were a little bit different because of the situation. But yes, by the time we got there, you know, we had a lot of fun together and you know, we'd all made it through the first stage and we were getting ready to go to the second phase of training.

[Assistant] Yeah. So going down there was going to be additional training and you knew that.

[User] Right.

[Assistant] It wasn't a charter flight, was it?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Um, well, there was one other married couple and they left early. She found out she was pregnant and they weren't in the training group. They were fairly close to our age, just a couple of few years older. Oh, actually, there was one other one. Yeah, somewhat close to. Actually, there was one that was in their forties that we were sort of close to. And then there were some single people that we were close to also. But you know, things were a little bit different because of the situation. But yes, by the time we got there, you know, we had a lot of fun together and you know, we'd all made it through the first stage and we were getting ready to go to the second phase of training.

[Assistant] Yeah. So going down there was going to be additional training and you knew that.

[User] Right.

[Assistant] It wasn't a charter flight, was it?

[User] No, it was commercial.

[Assistant] All right. How do you get to Ecuador?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Right.

[Assistant] It wasn't a charter flight, was it?

[User] No, it was commercial.

[Assistant] All right. How do you get to Ecuador?

[User] To Puerto Rico, that was the next stage.

[Assistant] Oh my goodness.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] To Puerto Rico, that was the next stage.

[Assistant] Oh my goodness.

[User] Yeah. Uh huh. That was the, um, Puerto Rico was the next stage of the training. That was during the time that they had the big training camp in Puerto Rico with the survival training and everything.

[Assistant] Outward Bound.

[User] Oh yes, which reminds me that I forgot to mention one aspect of the training in Bozeman. We had like one hour a day free time every afternoon right before dinner. And because I didn't know how to swim, I went and took a swimming lesson every day. We didn't have any pools in our area and so on, so I never learned to swim. And my uncle trying to teach me one time had thrown me into a strip mine pit and had to rescue me because, you know, of course, I was terrified. And so I was really afraid of water. I actually took a swimming lesson every day up until the very last day of training, and my camp out leaders were there. One of them was also the swimming instructor, and they were there, you know, cheering me on. Ecuador's only 20 feet away. Ecuador is only 15 feet away. Ecuador is only 12 feet away. Ecuador is only five feet away. You can do it!

[Assistant] Was that because they knew in Puerto Rico you were going to have to swim or just?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah. Uh huh. That was the, um, Puerto Rico was the next stage of the training. That was during the time that they had the big training camp in Puerto Rico with the survival training and everything.

[Assistant] Outward Bound.

[User] Oh yes, which reminds me that I forgot to mention one aspect of the training in Bozeman. We had like one hour a day free time every afternoon right before dinner. And because I didn't know how to swim, I went and took a swimming lesson every day. We didn't have any pools in our area and so on, so I never learned to swim. And my uncle trying to teach me one time had thrown me into a strip mine pit and had to rescue me because, you know, of course, I was terrified. And so I was really afraid of water. I actually took a swimming lesson every day up until the very last day of training, and my camp out leaders were there. One of them was also the swimming instructor, and they were there, you know, cheering me on. Ecuador's only 20 feet away. Ecuador is only 15 feet away. Ecuador is only 12 feet away. Ecuador is only five feet away. You can do it!

[Assistant] Was that because they knew in Puerto Rico you were going to have to swim or just?

[User] Well, they did have that survival training where they put them in the gunny sacks and threw them in the lake and everything. Actually, I was terrified.

[Assistant] Not them. I mean, you.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, they did have that survival training where they put them in the gunny sacks and threw them in the lake and everything. Actually, I was terrified.

[Assistant] Not them. I mean, you.

[User] Yeah, the trainees, right. Where they put the trainees, except I didn't end up having to do it. That's another story. But, you know, we knew that that camp was the next stage of the training. And so, you know, passing the swimming test. Yeah, probably Dave and I were afraid that I wasn't going to make it through swimming if anything. And then that part was really terrifying to me.

[Assistant] Puerto Rico?

[User] Mm hmm. As we left New York. You know, can I do this? Because we were heading to this camp for more language training and this survival training.

[Assistant] And describe the situation at the camp.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Mm hmm. As we left New York. You know, can I do this? Because we were heading to this camp for more language training and this survival training.

[Assistant] And describe the situation at the camp.

[User] Well, actually, when we got there, they didn't take us to this camp. They took us to another nearby camp for the weekend and at the end of the weekend, they told us that the camp had too many people in it. And that they had decided to divide our group in half based on language ability, and that half of us would go out and spend the next month with an assigned extension agent out in the island.

[Assistant] Oh.

[User] And luckily, Dave and I were two of them that got to go out to an extension office, and we went out to the extension office in Aguas Buenas.

[Assistant] Say that again.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, actually, when we got there, they didn't take us to this camp. They took us to another nearby camp for the weekend and at the end of the weekend, they told us that the camp had too many people in it. And that they had decided to divide our group in half based on language ability, and that half of us would go out and spend the next month with an assigned extension agent out in the island.

[Assistant] Oh.

[User] And luckily, Dave and I were two of them that got to go out to an extension office, and we went out to the extension office in Aguas Buenas.

[Assistant] Say that again.

[User] Aguas Buenas. Good water. Yeah, and I don't say it very well anymore. But anyway, we went out there and it was very undefined. They gave us some money and told us how to find the bus in that general direction and told us who to report to. And we got there luckily just before the extension office closed for the day. It was a long ways.

[Assistant] Was it just you and Dave going?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And luckily, Dave and I were two of them that got to go out to an extension office, and we went out to the extension office in Aguas Buenas.

[Assistant] Say that again.

[User] Aguas Buenas. Good water. Yeah, and I don't say it very well anymore. But anyway, we went out there and it was very undefined. They gave us some money and told us how to find the bus in that general direction and told us who to report to. And we got there luckily just before the extension office closed for the day. It was a long ways.

[Assistant] Was it just you and Dave going?

[User] Mm hmm. Well, other people went other places. You know, like half of the group went out more or less and half of them went to the camp.

[Assistant] But the village you were going to, it was just the two of you.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Aguas Buenas. Good water. Yeah, and I don't say it very well anymore. But anyway, we went out there and it was very undefined. They gave us some money and told us how to find the bus in that general direction and told us who to report to. And we got there luckily just before the extension office closed for the day. It was a long ways.

[Assistant] Was it just you and Dave going?

[User] Mm hmm. Well, other people went other places. You know, like half of the group went out more or less and half of them went to the camp.

[Assistant] But the village you were going to, it was just the two of you.

[User] Right. And so we got there and reported to the Puerto Rican ag agent and home economist in the town there.

[Assistant] Were they expecting you?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Mm hmm. Well, other people went other places. You know, like half of the group went out more or less and half of them went to the camp.

[Assistant] But the village you were going to, it was just the two of you.

[User] Right. And so we got there and reported to the Puerto Rican ag agent and home economist in the town there.

[Assistant] Were they expecting you?

[User] Yes, they were expecting us, amazingly. And they had. So the first problem was, where are we going to stay? And they knew of a public health nurse who occasionally rented rooms, and the home economist had actually contacted her to see whether it might be possible. And so we went over and talked with her and rented a room from her.

[Assistant] Had you been given pocket money to cover this?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Right. And so we got there and reported to the Puerto Rican ag agent and home economist in the town there.

[Assistant] Were they expecting you?

[User] Yes, they were expecting us, amazingly. And they had. So the first problem was, where are we going to stay? And they knew of a public health nurse who occasionally rented rooms, and the home economist had actually contacted her to see whether it might be possible. And so we went over and talked with her and rented a room from her.

[Assistant] Had you been given pocket money to cover this?

[User] Yeah, we had living money, a certain amount of money, to cover it and you know, it came out, you know, pretty, pretty well. And I think they didn't, you know, I think they hadn't had a lot of notice that this was happening. So they, I think, weren't really sure what to do with these people who didn't speak Spanish very well. Because now so many Puerto Ricans, you know, are very bilingual. But back then in this town, the home economists spoke English, some English. The ag agent did not, as I'm recalling. And the public health nurse with whom we stayed spoke some. And then there was a local bar owner in town who spoke some, and that was a pretty good sized town. That was the extent of it in that town. And so it was a good place to learn more Spanish because, you know, sort of sink or swim. You had to, you know, go and, you know, get your meals and.

[Assistant] How did you do that?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, you know, first, it was very stressful, but you know, we managed. And toward the, in the beginning, he took us out on his visits out to the, he is the ag agent, to farmers and mostly we went with the ag agent. And then as time went on, he would do things like give us. It was really good experience, you know, increasing independence on doing things that we could sort of handle. And not any real teaching or anything. But the first thing was to send us out in the collectivos by ourselves, to get off at a certain place with a little hand-drawn map to hike up into the campo into a certain area. And he would explain, you know, that you can stop and have lunch at this school lunch program. And then I'd like for you to find and tell these people about this meeting that I'm having and, you know, the date and the time and place. And you know, it was a lot of verbal meeting notifications was what we did.

[Assistant] And on those excursions, you were pretty much operating in Spanish?

[User] Oh yeah. Oh yes, totally.

[Assistant] Did you find?

[User] Carried our dictionary around and struggled.

[Assistant] Did you find yourself relying more on Dave because he was better? If he was.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh yeah. Oh yes, totally.

[Assistant] Did you find?

[User] Carried our dictionary around and struggled.

[Assistant] Did you find yourself relying more on Dave because he was better? If he was.

[User] Maybe. Yeah, he was a little bit better. Probably. Probably because of that, and also because he was a male in that culture. Uh huh.

[Assistant] Oh, OK. How long was this period, in this village Agua?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Maybe. Yeah, he was a little bit better. Probably. Probably because of that, and also because he was a male in that culture. Uh huh.

[Assistant] Oh, OK. How long was this period, in this village Agua?

[User] We were there a month.

[Assistant] A month?

[User] A month. And so then toward the end, though.

[Assistant] Did anyone come out to see you while you were there or?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] We were there a month.

[Assistant] A month?

[User] A month. And so then toward the end, though.

[Assistant] Did anyone come out to see you while you were there or?

[User] No.

[Assistant] You're there for the month and?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] A month. And so then toward the end, though.

[Assistant] Did anyone come out to see you while you were there or?

[User] No.

[Assistant] You're there for the month and?

[User] We were there for the month and it was sort of like, OK, you report to these people in this town.

[Assistant] You could have been doing nothing.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No.

[Assistant] You're there for the month and?

[User] We were there for the month and it was sort of like, OK, you report to these people in this town.

[Assistant] You could have been doing nothing.

[User] You do what they tell you and you come back here in 30 days. Or 28 days or whatever it was. And anyway, toward the end of that time, they actually had us do some presentations. I remember doing a food demonstration with a 4-H club with the home economist, maybe a couple of them. And then I also remember us going out with the ag agent and doing some kind of presentation. I can't remember what anymore, but I remember we really worked on it. We struggled with every word, wrote it all out and everything. On the foods demonstration because you're demonstrating things, I wrote out and, you know, practiced it and everything. But you know, it isn't quite as verbal as when you're doing a lecture about some crop or whatever it was, I don't remember what we were.

[Assistant] What was your confidence growing that you could actually do this thing?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] We were there for the month and it was sort of like, OK, you report to these people in this town.

[Assistant] You could have been doing nothing.

[User] You do what they tell you and you come back here in 30 days. Or 28 days or whatever it was. And anyway, toward the end of that time, they actually had us do some presentations. I remember doing a food demonstration with a 4-H club with the home economist, maybe a couple of them. And then I also remember us going out with the ag agent and doing some kind of presentation. I can't remember what anymore, but I remember we really worked on it. We struggled with every word, wrote it all out and everything. On the foods demonstration because you're demonstrating things, I wrote out and, you know, practiced it and everything. But you know, it isn't quite as verbal as when you're doing a lecture about some crop or whatever it was, I don't remember what we were.

[Assistant] What was your confidence growing that you could actually do this thing?

[User] Yeah. Well, it was still, you know, I was still nervous. But yes, I felt that I was beginning to believe that, yes, I can do this. I mean, I could begin. I could get through all the daily things. I could get around in the collectivo. I could ask directions. I could find my way to places. You know, I could ask directions and understand them. I could.

[Assistant] And your understanding of this was somewhat like what you would be doing in Ecuador.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] You do what they tell you and you come back here in 30 days. Or 28 days or whatever it was. And anyway, toward the end of that time, they actually had us do some presentations. I remember doing a food demonstration with a 4-H club with the home economist, maybe a couple of them. And then I also remember us going out with the ag agent and doing some kind of presentation. I can't remember what anymore, but I remember we really worked on it. We struggled with every word, wrote it all out and everything. On the foods demonstration because you're demonstrating things, I wrote out and, you know, practiced it and everything. But you know, it isn't quite as verbal as when you're doing a lecture about some crop or whatever it was, I don't remember what we were.

[Assistant] What was your confidence growing that you could actually do this thing?

[User] Yeah. Well, it was still, you know, I was still nervous. But yes, I felt that I was beginning to believe that, yes, I can do this. I mean, I could begin. I could get through all the daily things. I could get around in the collectivo. I could ask directions. I could find my way to places. You know, I could ask directions and understand them. I could.

[Assistant] And your understanding of this was somewhat like what you would be doing in Ecuador.

[User] Well, I knew that I would be doing things, that my language would have to improve. You know, for the living and getting around, yes, that would be somewhat alike. But to really do the job that my language would have to improve a lot because it was at a very low level, but it was improving.

[Assistant] When they sent you out, did the training staff say, we're going to test your language when you come back? Was there any sense that this was going to be further selection?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah. Well, it was still, you know, I was still nervous. But yes, I felt that I was beginning to believe that, yes, I can do this. I mean, I could begin. I could get through all the daily things. I could get around in the collectivo. I could ask directions. I could find my way to places. You know, I could ask directions and understand them. I could.

[Assistant] And your understanding of this was somewhat like what you would be doing in Ecuador.

[User] Well, I knew that I would be doing things, that my language would have to improve. You know, for the living and getting around, yes, that would be somewhat alike. But to really do the job that my language would have to improve a lot because it was at a very low level, but it was improving.

[Assistant] When they sent you out, did the training staff say, we're going to test your language when you come back? Was there any sense that this was going to be further selection?

[User] Oh yeah, we knew there'd be further selection.

[Assistant] This is now your, you've been in the Peace Corps already.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, I knew that I would be doing things, that my language would have to improve. You know, for the living and getting around, yes, that would be somewhat alike. But to really do the job that my language would have to improve a lot because it was at a very low level, but it was improving.

[Assistant] When they sent you out, did the training staff say, we're going to test your language when you come back? Was there any sense that this was going to be further selection?

[User] Oh yeah, we knew there'd be further selection.

[Assistant] This is now your, you've been in the Peace Corps already.

[User] 12 weeks, I think. Uh huh. And yes, there was a further selection. I can't remember if anyone was deselected at that stage or if everyone went on, it almost seems like maybe there was someone.

[Assistant] Now the group, when you got to Puerto Rico, the group split into two. Some went to the village. Some went and had to do the Outward Bound training.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh yeah, we knew there'd be further selection.

[Assistant] This is now your, you've been in the Peace Corps already.

[User] 12 weeks, I think. Uh huh. And yes, there was a further selection. I can't remember if anyone was deselected at that stage or if everyone went on, it almost seems like maybe there was someone.

[Assistant] Now the group, when you got to Puerto Rico, the group split into two. Some went to the village. Some went and had to do the Outward Bound training.

[User] Right.

[Assistant] Was there resentment? A lot of those who did Outward Bound or was it, I mean.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] 12 weeks, I think. Uh huh. And yes, there was a further selection. I can't remember if anyone was deselected at that stage or if everyone went on, it almost seems like maybe there was someone.

[Assistant] Now the group, when you got to Puerto Rico, the group split into two. Some went to the village. Some went and had to do the Outward Bound training.

[User] Right.

[Assistant] Was there resentment? A lot of those who did Outward Bound or was it, I mean.

[User] Um, well, actually.

[Assistant] I don't know that it was a joyous experience.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Right.

[Assistant] Was there resentment? A lot of those who did Outward Bound or was it, I mean.

[User] Um, well, actually.

[Assistant] I don't know that it was a joyous experience.

[User] Yeah, I don't know. You know, I don't really know either. I really don't know that. I really don't know. I know that I was just thrilled that I didn't have to go do it. And the interesting thing was they spent the bottom half to the Outward Bound camp because they were had the formal Spanish training, you know, continuing there. And those of us who went to the village who had tested in the top half on the language exam. And it came back and there was an even bigger spread on the language ability when we came back.

[Assistant] Which says something about how you learn a language.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Um, well, actually.

[Assistant] I don't know that it was a joyous experience.

[User] Yeah, I don't know. You know, I don't really know either. I really don't know that. I really don't know. I know that I was just thrilled that I didn't have to go do it. And the interesting thing was they spent the bottom half to the Outward Bound camp because they were had the formal Spanish training, you know, continuing there. And those of us who went to the village who had tested in the top half on the language exam. And it came back and there was an even bigger spread on the language ability when we came back.

[Assistant] Which says something about how you learn a language.

[User] Because they were around other people who spoke English. I mean, we were in this town where, you know, we could go in and drink in the bar and talk to the bartender. And that was about it. In English.

[Assistant] Now at the end of the four weeks, were you all gathered again at the camp or?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, I don't know. You know, I don't really know either. I really don't know that. I really don't know. I know that I was just thrilled that I didn't have to go do it. And the interesting thing was they spent the bottom half to the Outward Bound camp because they were had the formal Spanish training, you know, continuing there. And those of us who went to the village who had tested in the top half on the language exam. And it came back and there was an even bigger spread on the language ability when we came back.

[Assistant] Which says something about how you learn a language.

[User] Because they were around other people who spoke English. I mean, we were in this town where, you know, we could go in and drink in the bar and talk to the bartender. And that was about it. In English.

[Assistant] Now at the end of the four weeks, were you all gathered again at the camp or?

[User] I don't remember if it was at the Outward Bound camp or the one we were at originally, but anyway, we gathered in that same area, I believe.

[Assistant] How many people are now left in the program?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Because they were around other people who spoke English. I mean, we were in this town where, you know, we could go in and drink in the bar and talk to the bartender. And that was about it. In English.

[Assistant] Now at the end of the four weeks, were you all gathered again at the camp or?

[User] I don't remember if it was at the Outward Bound camp or the one we were at originally, but anyway, we gathered in that same area, I believe.

[Assistant] How many people are now left in the program?

[User] I think there were about 47 of us that went to Ecuador. I can't really remember if anyone was deselected there. I think there might have been, but I'm not positive anymore.

[Assistant] But when you got back together, there must have been a lot of storytelling about sharing, comparing experiences?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I don't remember if it was at the Outward Bound camp or the one we were at originally, but anyway, we gathered in that same area, I believe.

[Assistant] How many people are now left in the program?

[User] I think there were about 47 of us that went to Ecuador. I can't really remember if anyone was deselected there. I think there might have been, but I'm not positive anymore.

[Assistant] But when you got back together, there must have been a lot of storytelling about sharing, comparing experiences?

[User] Right. You know, who. I remember, I was even more grateful that I didn't have to go to that camp and get tied in a gunny sack and have to get out after they threw me in the lake. I would have drowned.

[Assistant] Oh yeah. But nobody had drowned.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I think there were about 47 of us that went to Ecuador. I can't really remember if anyone was deselected there. I think there might have been, but I'm not positive anymore.

[Assistant] But when you got back together, there must have been a lot of storytelling about sharing, comparing experiences?

[User] Right. You know, who. I remember, I was even more grateful that I didn't have to go to that camp and get tied in a gunny sack and have to get out after they threw me in the lake. I would have drowned.

[Assistant] Oh yeah. But nobody had drowned.

[User] No, nobody had drowned. But, you know.

[Assistant] Their Spanish did not improve that much.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Right. You know, who. I remember, I was even more grateful that I didn't have to go to that camp and get tied in a gunny sack and have to get out after they threw me in the lake. I would have drowned.

[Assistant] Oh yeah. But nobody had drowned.

[User] No, nobody had drowned. But, you know.

[Assistant] Their Spanish did not improve that much.

[User] Well, it had improved, but not as much as the ones who were out on their own using it.

[Assistant] So is there, are you finally sworn in as volunteers or? You're still in Puerto Rico. It's now at the end of the four weeks.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, nobody had drowned. But, you know.

[Assistant] Their Spanish did not improve that much.

[User] Well, it had improved, but not as much as the ones who were out on their own using it.

[Assistant] So is there, are you finally sworn in as volunteers or? You're still in Puerto Rico. It's now at the end of the four weeks.

[User] I think we actually had our swearing-in in Ecuador. When we got to Ecuador.

[Assistant] Let's get you out of Puerto Rico. At the end of the four weeks, there was nothing further.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, it had improved, but not as much as the ones who were out on their own using it.

[Assistant] So is there, are you finally sworn in as volunteers or? You're still in Puerto Rico. It's now at the end of the four weeks.

[User] I think we actually had our swearing-in in Ecuador. When we got to Ecuador.

[Assistant] Let's get you out of Puerto Rico. At the end of the four weeks, there was nothing further.

[User] No, we went back to the, I believe it was to the camp. We went back and I believe it was to the camp. I believe we had another language exam because, you know, we were told somewhere along the line that, you know, the gap was even bigger.

[Assistant] And they may have been studying the group as learning language.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I think we actually had our swearing-in in Ecuador. When we got to Ecuador.

[Assistant] Let's get you out of Puerto Rico. At the end of the four weeks, there was nothing further.

[User] No, we went back to the, I believe it was to the camp. We went back and I believe it was to the camp. I believe we had another language exam because, you know, we were told somewhere along the line that, you know, the gap was even bigger.

[Assistant] And they may have been studying the group as learning language.

[User] I'm sure they were. I'm sure they were. That was part of it, in the early days, you know, they didn't have a model for the training for Peace Corps. You know, they set up some of these things like these hike outs and so on, probably based on military training. And some of the physical training and the schedule and the discipline and so on. You know, I think that was probably the only model they had. And so they were looking at it as they went and modifying it as they went.

[Assistant] So you finally fly down to Ecuador?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, we went back to the, I believe it was to the camp. We went back and I believe it was to the camp. I believe we had another language exam because, you know, we were told somewhere along the line that, you know, the gap was even bigger.

[Assistant] And they may have been studying the group as learning language.

[User] I'm sure they were. I'm sure they were. That was part of it, in the early days, you know, they didn't have a model for the training for Peace Corps. You know, they set up some of these things like these hike outs and so on, probably based on military training. And some of the physical training and the schedule and the discipline and so on. You know, I think that was probably the only model they had. And so they were looking at it as they went and modifying it as they went.

[Assistant] So you finally fly down to Ecuador?

[User] Yeah, we fly to Ecuador. Actually, we landed, we had a stop in Caracas, Venezuela, and this was when it really hit me. I don't know about this. We landed in the airport, just supposed to be a brief stop, and there were military police with carbines all over the place. And we were there a long, long time, and at first, you know, couldn't find out what was going on. And apparently there had been sort of a terrorist incident at the airport.

[Assistant] You were on a commercial flight?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I'm sure they were. I'm sure they were. That was part of it, in the early days, you know, they didn't have a model for the training for Peace Corps. You know, they set up some of these things like these hike outs and so on, probably based on military training. And some of the physical training and the schedule and the discipline and so on. You know, I think that was probably the only model they had. And so they were looking at it as they went and modifying it as they went.

[Assistant] So you finally fly down to Ecuador?

[User] Yeah, we fly to Ecuador. Actually, we landed, we had a stop in Caracas, Venezuela, and this was when it really hit me. I don't know about this. We landed in the airport, just supposed to be a brief stop, and there were military police with carbines all over the place. And we were there a long, long time, and at first, you know, couldn't find out what was going on. And apparently there had been sort of a terrorist incident at the airport.

[Assistant] You were on a commercial flight?

[User] Yeah, we were on a commercial flight. You know someone flooding the runway with gasoline or some, I don't know exactly. You know, I never was real clear on exactly what it happened, but we were there longer than we were supposed to be.

[Assistant] Sitting on the plane?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, we fly to Ecuador. Actually, we landed, we had a stop in Caracas, Venezuela, and this was when it really hit me. I don't know about this. We landed in the airport, just supposed to be a brief stop, and there were military police with carbines all over the place. And we were there a long, long time, and at first, you know, couldn't find out what was going on. And apparently there had been sort of a terrorist incident at the airport.

[Assistant] You were on a commercial flight?

[User] Yeah, we were on a commercial flight. You know someone flooding the runway with gasoline or some, I don't know exactly. You know, I never was real clear on exactly what it happened, but we were there longer than we were supposed to be.

[Assistant] Sitting on the plane?

[User] No, we were in the terminal. But anyway, there were these MPs with, you know, weapons all over the place and I'm going, oh my gosh, what have I gotten myself into?

[Assistant] You had Peace Corps staff accompanying you, didn't you?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, we were on a commercial flight. You know someone flooding the runway with gasoline or some, I don't know exactly. You know, I never was real clear on exactly what it happened, but we were there longer than we were supposed to be.

[Assistant] Sitting on the plane?

[User] No, we were in the terminal. But anyway, there were these MPs with, you know, weapons all over the place and I'm going, oh my gosh, what have I gotten myself into?

[Assistant] You had Peace Corps staff accompanying you, didn't you?

[User] Yes, the head of Heifer Project was with us. I think just the head of Heifer Project and the person who worked for the Ecuadorian extension service. I think they may have been. At least the head of Heifer Project. His name was Don Schultz, and he was with us, and he had spent many years working in Latin America. And he.

[Assistant] In the whole period up to this time, had you met anyone from Peace Corps, Washington? Had anyone come out and talked to you or let you know or say anything?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, we were in the terminal. But anyway, there were these MPs with, you know, weapons all over the place and I'm going, oh my gosh, what have I gotten myself into?

[Assistant] You had Peace Corps staff accompanying you, didn't you?

[User] Yes, the head of Heifer Project was with us. I think just the head of Heifer Project and the person who worked for the Ecuadorian extension service. I think they may have been. At least the head of Heifer Project. His name was Don Schultz, and he was with us, and he had spent many years working in Latin America. And he.

[Assistant] In the whole period up to this time, had you met anyone from Peace Corps, Washington? Had anyone come out and talked to you or let you know or say anything?

[User] No, I don't think so. No, I believe it was all the training staff and the Heifer Project staff. Because, you know, we always, I think that's probably why we always identified more closely with Heifer Project staff than with Peace Corps staff. Although we did get well acquainted with the Peace Corps director for the coast, which they now call an APCD, I believe, or something like that. James Pines. But we identified with Heifer Project and the Ecuadorian extension service. Although we definitely, you know, identified ourselves as Peace Corps volunteers, you know.

[Assistant] So the Venezuelan military finally let you go.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, the head of Heifer Project was with us. I think just the head of Heifer Project and the person who worked for the Ecuadorian extension service. I think they may have been. At least the head of Heifer Project. His name was Don Schultz, and he was with us, and he had spent many years working in Latin America. And he.

[Assistant] In the whole period up to this time, had you met anyone from Peace Corps, Washington? Had anyone come out and talked to you or let you know or say anything?

[User] No, I don't think so. No, I believe it was all the training staff and the Heifer Project staff. Because, you know, we always, I think that's probably why we always identified more closely with Heifer Project staff than with Peace Corps staff. Although we did get well acquainted with the Peace Corps director for the coast, which they now call an APCD, I believe, or something like that. James Pines. But we identified with Heifer Project and the Ecuadorian extension service. Although we definitely, you know, identified ourselves as Peace Corps volunteers, you know.

[Assistant] So the Venezuelan military finally let you go.

[User] Well, they weren't really holding us, I think they were keeping us in a secure area, but it was a little scary. Anyway, things are finally safe for the plane to depart. We flew on to Ecuador without further incident. And then when we got there, we were greeted by some Peace Corps officials from Ecuador and Galo Plaza, who was a former president of Ecuador, who was very involved in agriculture, you know, in Ecuador and who later was Secretary General of the U.N. Or maybe previously. Anyway, he was very involved in international, very, very esteemed.

[Assistant] You weren't, it wasn't the first ag extension group, was it?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, I don't think so. No, I believe it was all the training staff and the Heifer Project staff. Because, you know, we always, I think that's probably why we always identified more closely with Heifer Project staff than with Peace Corps staff. Although we did get well acquainted with the Peace Corps director for the coast, which they now call an APCD, I believe, or something like that. James Pines. But we identified with Heifer Project and the Ecuadorian extension service. Although we definitely, you know, identified ourselves as Peace Corps volunteers, you know.

[Assistant] So the Venezuelan military finally let you go.

[User] Well, they weren't really holding us, I think they were keeping us in a secure area, but it was a little scary. Anyway, things are finally safe for the plane to depart. We flew on to Ecuador without further incident. And then when we got there, we were greeted by some Peace Corps officials from Ecuador and Galo Plaza, who was a former president of Ecuador, who was very involved in agriculture, you know, in Ecuador and who later was Secretary General of the U.N. Or maybe previously. Anyway, he was very involved in international, very, very esteemed.

[Assistant] You weren't, it wasn't the first ag extension group, was it?

[User] Yes, we were the first ag extension group in Ecuador.

[Assistant] OK. The previous group had been what?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, they weren't really holding us, I think they were keeping us in a secure area, but it was a little scary. Anyway, things are finally safe for the plane to depart. We flew on to Ecuador without further incident. And then when we got there, we were greeted by some Peace Corps officials from Ecuador and Galo Plaza, who was a former president of Ecuador, who was very involved in agriculture, you know, in Ecuador and who later was Secretary General of the U.N. Or maybe previously. Anyway, he was very involved in international, very, very esteemed.

[Assistant] You weren't, it wasn't the first ag extension group, was it?

[User] Yes, we were the first ag extension group in Ecuador.

[Assistant] OK. The previous group had been what?

[User] Well, there were two previous groups that went in, all of us within about three weeks of each other. And one was, I believe, education and one may have been like public health or something such as that.

[Assistant] All of you were, Peace Corps in Ecuador was a relatively new thing, so just in a few months.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, we were the first ag extension group in Ecuador.

[Assistant] OK. The previous group had been what?

[User] Well, there were two previous groups that went in, all of us within about three weeks of each other. And one was, I believe, education and one may have been like public health or something such as that.

[Assistant] All of you were, Peace Corps in Ecuador was a relatively new thing, so just in a few months.

[User] Well, actually probably not even a few months, you know?

[Assistant] Oh, less. Where had the others trained, you remember?