[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] We certainly had a lot of things happen that we got awful lucky about. When Apollo 13 blew up, it could have blown the whole end off of the damn thing and damaged the heat shield. Then it would have been Katie bar the door. That would have been the end of it. We just got lucky there. Maybe because we were so diligent about other things that we made the luck. Like the golfers say, it’s amazing how your luck improves when you practice. It’s true. I suspect that happened to us.

[Assistant] You got a little more knowledgeable to be able to apply your luck a little easier, didn’t you?

[User] Yes. On the Challenger accident, we weren’t lucky. On the Columbia accident we weren’t lucky. But we had indicators, but we ignored them. Weren’t smart enough to figure that out. The people at the time were not smart enough to figure that out. That’s what happens. Probably happened to Amelia Earhart, didn’t it?

[Assistant] Might have.

[User] Happened to Wiley Post over Alaska back when I was a kid. Or it happened to [Charles A.] Lindbergh going across the ocean. He got lucky as hell. Having all these hallucinations, going to sleep, etc. Persevered I guess.

[Assistant] The golfer you were telling me about yesterday. He wasn’t so lucky, was he?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes. On the Challenger accident, we weren’t lucky. On the Columbia accident we weren’t lucky. But we had indicators, but we ignored them. Weren’t smart enough to figure that out. The people at the time were not smart enough to figure that out. That’s what happens. Probably happened to Amelia Earhart, didn’t it?

[Assistant] Might have.

[User] Happened to Wiley Post over Alaska back when I was a kid. Or it happened to [Charles A.] Lindbergh going across the ocean. He got lucky as hell. Having all these hallucinations, going to sleep, etc. Persevered I guess.

[Assistant] The golfer you were telling me about yesterday. He wasn’t so lucky, was he?

[User] No. Played 71 beautiful holes and then screwed up on the 18th and lost. He’s done that twice now in the last couple months. Led the damn tournament. This one he led for 71 holes and lost. That’s tough.

[Assistant] It’s a hard day getting up today, wasn’t it?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Happened to Wiley Post over Alaska back when I was a kid. Or it happened to [Charles A.] Lindbergh going across the ocean. He got lucky as hell. Having all these hallucinations, going to sleep, etc. Persevered I guess.

[Assistant] The golfer you were telling me about yesterday. He wasn’t so lucky, was he?

[User] No. Played 71 beautiful holes and then screwed up on the 18th and lost. He’s done that twice now in the last couple months. Led the damn tournament. This one he led for 71 holes and lost. That’s tough.

[Assistant] It’s a hard day getting up today, wasn’t it?

[User] I imagine it was for him. He said his son was crying. I think that really got to him. He’s a hell of a nice guy too, [Jim] Furyk is. Well, get me out of here. You’ve had enough of me for the day.

[Assistant] Well, you probably need a break. We worked you hard today. So we appreciate you coming in.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Sure. Well, I grew up in Missouri, a small town in Missouri, Joplin, Missouri, and then spent high school in Texas, in West Texas, in a little town called San Angelo, and then went to college and applied to Peace Corps in my senior year of college and joined the Peace Corps right after I graduated. So that's kind of how I got there.

[Assistant] How did you hear about the Peace Corps, do you remember?

[User] Well, at that time, which was the seventies, the advertisements were everywhere. Television, newspaper, magazine, it was widely advertised. And the one thing that sticks out in my mind is that there was a guy one year ahead of me who joined the Peace Corps. I happened to know, I didn't know him well, but I knew who he was. So between all the advertisements and this other guy's going, I said, I started to think, you know, maybe that's something I could do.

[Assistant] And what was your motivation for going this route?

[User] Well, I didn't have any worries about the draft because I had a very high draft number and it was never going to be reached. So that was not an issue. But I came to the end of college and didn't know really what I wanted to do. And I'd always found this idea of going into the Peace Corps fascinating. So I thought, you know, this could be a great time to do that.

[Assistant] And did you have a specific country or theme that you wanted to pursue in the Peace Corps?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, at that time, which was the seventies, the advertisements were everywhere. Television, newspaper, magazine, it was widely advertised. And the one thing that sticks out in my mind is that there was a guy one year ahead of me who joined the Peace Corps. I happened to know, I didn't know him well, but I knew who he was. So between all the advertisements and this other guy's going, I said, I started to think, you know, maybe that's something I could do.

[Assistant] And what was your motivation for going this route?

[User] Well, I didn't have any worries about the draft because I had a very high draft number and it was never going to be reached. So that was not an issue. But I came to the end of college and didn't know really what I wanted to do. And I'd always found this idea of going into the Peace Corps fascinating. So I thought, you know, this could be a great time to do that.

[Assistant] And did you have a specific country or theme that you wanted to pursue in the Peace Corps?

[User] Well, ironically, my choice was Latin America. So I didn't have any particular activity that I wanted to do. But I, uh, I put down Latin America on my application, and of course, it came back India and agriculture. Well, the agriculture I was okay with because I'd worked a little bit on farms in the summer and things like that. And India I was okay with. Nothing wrong with India. So I said, okay, let's try it.

[Assistant] Great. And so you had some training in agriculture. Peace Corps presumably took you farther than that. Would you like to talk about training, where you trained, and the subjects that you were trained in?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] In India, we were trained in the south in Tansur district at an agricultural research station. And there they actually had facilities for training agricultural extension workers. So it was really pretty ideal for us to be there. And we studied all kinds of different varieties of rice. And there we started our language training and we started our, had more intense cultural training and we worked actually in India at that time. So we got to meet Indians and get to know a few of them in their homes and things.

[Assistant] Could you talk a little about how the Peace Corps managed training? Did you think they did a pretty good job? And I guess the three areas would be language, technical, and cross cultural. Um, I can't think of any other one. How did, how did they do in terms of getting, getting you ready for your assignment?

[User] Well, they did all right. There was an awful lot for them to do. And I felt when the whole thing was over that I really didn't know enough. But they only had the summer really to teach us. And same thing for language. And cultural training, well, I guess we probably learned more useful cultural things from Mike Thorburn than anything else. He kind of gave us a clue as to what it's like to be a Peace Corps volunteer and what do you have to do in order to meet the people and integrate a little bit.

[Assistant] Mike was our cross-cultural coordinator and was a volunteer, was a returned volunteer, correct?

[User] Returned volunteer.

[Assistant] And he served in Tamil Nadu or Kerala?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, they did all right. There was an awful lot for them to do. And I felt when the whole thing was over that I really didn't know enough. But they only had the summer really to teach us. And same thing for language. And cultural training, well, I guess we probably learned more useful cultural things from Mike Thorburn than anything else. He kind of gave us a clue as to what it's like to be a Peace Corps volunteer and what do you have to do in order to meet the people and integrate a little bit.

[Assistant] Mike was our cross-cultural coordinator and was a volunteer, was a returned volunteer, correct?

[User] Returned volunteer.

[Assistant] And he served in Tamil Nadu or Kerala?

[User] He served in, uh, my understanding was that he served in Karnataka, which is up near Bangalore, in the poultry project up there. So I thought, in short, I think, I thought they did the best they could given the given the time available.

[Assistant] You know, one of the things I remember about that period was that we had a psychiatrist from Peace Corps on hand. I can't remember her name now.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] He served in, uh, my understanding was that he served in Karnataka, which is up near Bangalore, in the poultry project up there. So I thought, in short, I think, I thought they did the best they could given the given the time available.

[Assistant] You know, one of the things I remember about that period was that we had a psychiatrist from Peace Corps on hand. I can't remember her name now.

[User] Helen.

[Assistant] Helen.

[User] Helen Ash.

[Assistant] Thank you. Tell me about what you think her role was. I'm interested in that aspect.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Helen.

[Assistant] Helen.

[User] Helen Ash.

[Assistant] Thank you. Tell me about what you think her role was. I'm interested in that aspect.

[User] I think her role was, was dual. One was to sort of prepare us as best she could. And the other one was to spot those of us she felt couldn't really hack it as volunteers in the village. And so it was being a dual role. Those of us who are a little uneasy probably, you know, always were careful to present a good side to Helen. And then she, uh, did probably saw through us, but we were careful never to sort of go off the deep end with Helen.

[Assistant] To your knowledge, did she, uh, actively discourage anyone, any of our group from, from pursuing, from continuing beyond training?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Helen Ash.

[Assistant] Thank you. Tell me about what you think her role was. I'm interested in that aspect.

[User] I think her role was, was dual. One was to sort of prepare us as best she could. And the other one was to spot those of us she felt couldn't really hack it as volunteers in the village. And so it was being a dual role. Those of us who are a little uneasy probably, you know, always were careful to present a good side to Helen. And then she, uh, did probably saw through us, but we were careful never to sort of go off the deep end with Helen.

[Assistant] To your knowledge, did she, uh, actively discourage anyone, any of our group from, from pursuing, from continuing beyond training?

[User] I don't recall. I thought there were one or two that she kind of questioned, let me put it that way.

[Assistant] Fair enough. Let me take a step back, please, because one of the things I wanted to ask you, and partly because I'm vague on it, is talking about our arrival in India. We came out of, uh, we came out of the Philippines via Hong Kong, as I recall, where we were caught in a typhoon.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I think her role was, was dual. One was to sort of prepare us as best she could. And the other one was to spot those of us she felt couldn't really hack it as volunteers in the village. And so it was being a dual role. Those of us who are a little uneasy probably, you know, always were careful to present a good side to Helen. And then she, uh, did probably saw through us, but we were careful never to sort of go off the deep end with Helen.

[Assistant] To your knowledge, did she, uh, actively discourage anyone, any of our group from, from pursuing, from continuing beyond training?

[User] I don't recall. I thought there were one or two that she kind of questioned, let me put it that way.

[Assistant] Fair enough. Let me take a step back, please, because one of the things I wanted to ask you, and partly because I'm vague on it, is talking about our arrival in India. We came out of, uh, we came out of the Philippines via Hong Kong, as I recall, where we were caught in a typhoon.

[User] That's right.

[Assistant] And then we arrived in Delhi.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I don't recall. I thought there were one or two that she kind of questioned, let me put it that way.

[Assistant] Fair enough. Let me take a step back, please, because one of the things I wanted to ask you, and partly because I'm vague on it, is talking about our arrival in India. We came out of, uh, we came out of the Philippines via Hong Kong, as I recall, where we were caught in a typhoon.

[User] That's right.

[Assistant] And then we arrived in Delhi.

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] Tell me about your recollections of Delhi and the trip down to the ag research station in Tamil Nadu.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] That's right.

[Assistant] And then we arrived in Delhi.

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] Tell me about your recollections of Delhi and the trip down to the ag research station in Tamil Nadu.

[User]
I have a very vivid, what I think is a very vivid recollection of that, those day or two in Delhi. And in retrospect, my feeling is, um, it wasn't kind of fair to us to give us such a raw welcome. We were taken to a large home which was sort of converted into a hotel. I think it was an old, probably an old British home or something like that. Anyway, and dinner was served. I don't know that anybody else remembers this, but dinner was served, as I recall, at a long table or maybe two tables. And then behind us stood all these bearers in uniform, which you can still see now in hotels in India, in fancy sorts of hotels in India. But I remember us all thinking, well, is this what India is like?

And the answer was, which we found out before too long, no, this is not what India's going to be like for us anyway, and certain parts of India are still like that. But I felt like, and there was a swimming pool outside in the back. It was, we were told not to drink water, but. And we got, and what was helpful was we did get some free time to go around Delhi and see parts of Delhi.

[Assistant] And then after did we go to the embassy at all? Did we, were we greeted by anyone other than the Peace Corps office that you recall, or were we greeted by the Indian government?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] Tell me about your recollections of Delhi and the trip down to the ag research station in Tamil Nadu.

[User]
I have a very vivid, what I think is a very vivid recollection of that, those day or two in Delhi. And in retrospect, my feeling is, um, it wasn't kind of fair to us to give us such a raw welcome. We were taken to a large home which was sort of converted into a hotel. I think it was an old, probably an old British home or something like that. Anyway, and dinner was served. I don't know that anybody else remembers this, but dinner was served, as I recall, at a long table or maybe two tables. And then behind us stood all these bearers in uniform, which you can still see now in hotels in India, in fancy sorts of hotels in India. But I remember us all thinking, well, is this what India is like?

And the answer was, which we found out before too long, no, this is not what India's going to be like for us anyway, and certain parts of India are still like that. But I felt like, and there was a swimming pool outside in the back. It was, we were told not to drink water, but. And we got, and what was helpful was we did get some free time to go around Delhi and see parts of Delhi.

[Assistant] And then after did we go to the embassy at all? Did we, were we greeted by anyone other than the Peace Corps office that you recall, or were we greeted by the Indian government?

[User] We must have had a greeting or two, but it just didn't stick in my mind who probably would take him to the embassy or something like that. I don't recall much.

[Assistant] And then after two days in Delhi, we took the plane?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] We must have had a greeting or two, but it just didn't stick in my mind who probably would take him to the embassy or something like that. I don't recall much.

[Assistant] And then after two days in Delhi, we took the plane?

[User] We took a plane.

[Assistant] To Madras.

[User] Went to Madras and stayed in the Woodlands Hotel. And it seemed we kept hitting woodlands all the way down. So I guess we just by luck. Anyway, stayed there for a day or two and, um, and from there take a trip, took a bus actually down to Thanjavur District. And that bus ride sticks in my mind because we were going through village after village after village and narrow streets with, you know, sharp turns. And that was our introduction to the India we were to know later on. A lot of dust and a lot of heat and.

[Assistant] Dust and heat.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] We took a plane.

[Assistant] To Madras.

[User] Went to Madras and stayed in the Woodlands Hotel. And it seemed we kept hitting woodlands all the way down. So I guess we just by luck. Anyway, stayed there for a day or two and, um, and from there take a trip, took a bus actually down to Thanjavur District. And that bus ride sticks in my mind because we were going through village after village after village and narrow streets with, you know, sharp turns. And that was our introduction to the India we were to know later on. A lot of dust and a lot of heat and.

[Assistant] Dust and heat.

[User] Dust and heat.

[Assistant] I remember that as well.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Dust and heat.

[Assistant] I remember that as well.

[User] And a lot of horns.

[Assistant] Exactly.

[User] A lot of people blowing their horns.

[Assistant] So we got down to our training site and we're there for two months. In that time, we went out and visited areas to practice our, our Tamil, which was the language of the region. Would you like to talk about our Tamil training and your first attempts to speak it and how it went over the long term?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And a lot of horns.

[Assistant] Exactly.

[User] A lot of people blowing their horns.

[Assistant] So we got down to our training site and we're there for two months. In that time, we went out and visited areas to practice our, our Tamil, which was the language of the region. Would you like to talk about our Tamil training and your first attempts to speak it and how it went over the long term?

[User] Well, I think the Tamil training was absolutely essential, and yet I don't think very many of us picked up enough Tamil in training to, to carry us through. We picked up our Tamil, we got enough to get started. But then we picked up our Tamil as we went through our village experiences and some of us had tutors and things like that in the village, and that helped. But it was a long process to really pick up enough Tamil to communicate well.

[Assistant] And did you continue your training on a regular basis once you got to the village?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] A lot of people blowing their horns.

[Assistant] So we got down to our training site and we're there for two months. In that time, we went out and visited areas to practice our, our Tamil, which was the language of the region. Would you like to talk about our Tamil training and your first attempts to speak it and how it went over the long term?

[User] Well, I think the Tamil training was absolutely essential, and yet I don't think very many of us picked up enough Tamil in training to, to carry us through. We picked up our Tamil, we got enough to get started. But then we picked up our Tamil as we went through our village experiences and some of us had tutors and things like that in the village, and that helped. But it was a long process to really pick up enough Tamil to communicate well.

[Assistant] And did you continue your training on a regular basis once you got to the village?

[User] I had a tutor who came twice a week, but, not twice a week. Once a week. But, but unfortunately, his method of training was the Indian method of training, which is rote. Say it over and over and over again. And if I didn't understand what he was saying, he would just repeat it back to me. And I found it very hard to absorb much doing that. And I wasn't getting the same sort of, uh, in the village. In training, for example, we took a pretend visit to the market and we would buy tomatoes and we would use some of our phrases and sort of get them into context. In my training in the village, there was no context whatsoever. It was just repeat, repeat, repeat. And I was somehow supposed to absorb that and know what to say. So I have to say that after three or four months, I terminated the tutoring and just proceeded on my own. And I probably learned more training, more Tamil from the people I worked with than anything else.

[Assistant] Tell me about your village.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, I think the Tamil training was absolutely essential, and yet I don't think very many of us picked up enough Tamil in training to, to carry us through. We picked up our Tamil, we got enough to get started. But then we picked up our Tamil as we went through our village experiences and some of us had tutors and things like that in the village, and that helped. But it was a long process to really pick up enough Tamil to communicate well.

[Assistant] And did you continue your training on a regular basis once you got to the village?

[User] I had a tutor who came twice a week, but, not twice a week. Once a week. But, but unfortunately, his method of training was the Indian method of training, which is rote. Say it over and over and over again. And if I didn't understand what he was saying, he would just repeat it back to me. And I found it very hard to absorb much doing that. And I wasn't getting the same sort of, uh, in the village. In training, for example, we took a pretend visit to the market and we would buy tomatoes and we would use some of our phrases and sort of get them into context. In my training in the village, there was no context whatsoever. It was just repeat, repeat, repeat. And I was somehow supposed to absorb that and know what to say. So I have to say that after three or four months, I terminated the tutoring and just proceeded on my own. And I probably learned more training, more Tamil from the people I worked with than anything else.

[Assistant] Tell me about your village.

[User] Village?

[Assistant] Well, tell me first about your first arrival in the village.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I had a tutor who came twice a week, but, not twice a week. Once a week. But, but unfortunately, his method of training was the Indian method of training, which is rote. Say it over and over and over again. And if I didn't understand what he was saying, he would just repeat it back to me. And I found it very hard to absorb much doing that. And I wasn't getting the same sort of, uh, in the village. In training, for example, we took a pretend visit to the market and we would buy tomatoes and we would use some of our phrases and sort of get them into context. In my training in the village, there was no context whatsoever. It was just repeat, repeat, repeat. And I was somehow supposed to absorb that and know what to say. So I have to say that after three or four months, I terminated the tutoring and just proceeded on my own. And I probably learned more training, more Tamil from the people I worked with than anything else.

[Assistant] Tell me about your village.

[User] Village?

[Assistant] Well, tell me first about your first arrival in the village.

[User] Ah, my first arrival. Well, total confusion and bewilderment. I was very pleased with the house. The house itself was more than adequate. It was a bedroom and a living room and a kitchen and an upstairs sort of veranda thing. But I had no idea how to live there. Where do you get drinking water? Where do you get groceries to cook with? And how do you take a bath? And of course, the well was dry, not dry, but need to be primed. And so I couldn't get water out of it.

[Assistant] So that suggests Peace Corps didn't really give you much introduction, did they just bring you to the village and drop you basically? Here's your house.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Village?

[Assistant] Well, tell me first about your first arrival in the village.

[User] Ah, my first arrival. Well, total confusion and bewilderment. I was very pleased with the house. The house itself was more than adequate. It was a bedroom and a living room and a kitchen and an upstairs sort of veranda thing. But I had no idea how to live there. Where do you get drinking water? Where do you get groceries to cook with? And how do you take a bath? And of course, the well was dry, not dry, but need to be primed. And so I couldn't get water out of it.

[Assistant] So that suggests Peace Corps didn't really give you much introduction, did they just bring you to the village and drop you basically? Here's your house.

[User]
Pretty much. They felt like, they felt that they had dropped me, dropped off my furniture and, uh, and put me in a good place. And that was good enough. And so it was pretty much catch as catch can. And I have a very vivid memory of all the children who came in to see what was going on. Very few adults, maybe one or two adults, actually poked their head in. But I wanted to be very friendly, so I didn't chase anybody off or anything. But how much talking could I do with the kids? I didn't know enough Tamil to understand most of what they were saying.

And I had a special complication because there was a volunteer who had been there from the previous group who had stayed a year and had spoiled all the kids rotten. And so when I got there, they were all looking for handouts and I didn't have anything to hand out, so uh, and I thought it was a bad idea anyway. So after a few days they kind of figured out they weren't getting anything from me and they kind of got angry. It took a while for everything to sort of settle down and to an equilibrium after that.

[Assistant] Some of our fellow volunteers were a little freaked out in those first few days by all the people and the constant staring. Did that, did that bother you?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] The name of my village was so complicated sometimes even the bus drivers didn't know and the bus went through it every day. So the name of it was Kovil Devarayan Pettai. And Kovil stands for temple. Devarayan Pettai probably was the initial name of the village. Oh, Pettai means small. So Devarayan Pettai means small place. Small village. So, um. The history of it was that when everything was Hindu, this was probably a lower caste segment of the village. Another caste, another section, which is probably the Agraharam and.

[Assistant] The Agraharam was the Brahmin, traditional Brahmin part of the village, correct?

[User] Right. Right. And, uh, and it was usually separate from the lower caste or the untouchables. And so when the Muslims had come in to South India, the upper caste people converted to Muslim, to Islam. And so that left the village half Hindu and half Muslim. Ironically, the temple, which would naturally have been located in the bristol, in the, in the Brahmin section of town, was then located in the, at the edge of the Muslim section of town. So it kind of fell into disuse and I, in fact, didn't even know it was there for probably a year. And finally I found it and went over there and explored a little bit. But anyway, so there's a village, it's on the main lot and on the main road between Thanjavur and Kumbakonam, each of them about ten, 15 miles in one direction or the other. And, uh, let's see. Did that cover what you?

[Assistant] Yes. And what was the approximate population?

[User] It wasn't large. The section I was in was maybe, I'm going to guess three or 400 people.

[Assistant] And was it on the river?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Right. Right. And, uh, and it was usually separate from the lower caste or the untouchables. And so when the Muslims had come in to South India, the upper caste people converted to Muslim, to Islam. And so that left the village half Hindu and half Muslim. Ironically, the temple, which would naturally have been located in the bristol, in the, in the Brahmin section of town, was then located in the, at the edge of the Muslim section of town. So it kind of fell into disuse and I, in fact, didn't even know it was there for probably a year. And finally I found it and went over there and explored a little bit. But anyway, so there's a village, it's on the main lot and on the main road between Thanjavur and Kumbakonam, each of them about ten, 15 miles in one direction or the other. And, uh, let's see. Did that cover what you?

[Assistant] Yes. And what was the approximate population?

[User] It wasn't large. The section I was in was maybe, I'm going to guess three or 400 people.

[Assistant] And was it on the river?

[User] Um, well, it was not too far from the river. It wasn't actually on the river. Probably if you go back about 100 yards or so, you would get one of the tributaries of the, of the river. The river by that time was in the delta, and it had, it was starting to split into tributaries and to reach the sea.

[Assistant] And you say you were 15 miles from Thanjavur and 15 miles from Kumbakonam.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] It wasn't large. The section I was in was maybe, I'm going to guess three or 400 people.

[Assistant] And was it on the river?

[User] Um, well, it was not too far from the river. It wasn't actually on the river. Probably if you go back about 100 yards or so, you would get one of the tributaries of the, of the river. The river by that time was in the delta, and it had, it was starting to split into tributaries and to reach the sea.

[Assistant] And you say you were 15 miles from Thanjavur and 15 miles from Kumbakonam.

[User] About that.

[Assistant] So did you get into those larger towns fairly often or were you usually in the village all the time?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Um, well, it was not too far from the river. It wasn't actually on the river. Probably if you go back about 100 yards or so, you would get one of the tributaries of the, of the river. The river by that time was in the delta, and it had, it was starting to split into tributaries and to reach the sea.

[Assistant] And you say you were 15 miles from Thanjavur and 15 miles from Kumbakonam.

[User] About that.

[Assistant] So did you get into those larger towns fairly often or were you usually in the village all the time?

[User] I did fairly frequently into both those places. Thanjavur we had the district headquarters, so we had to go in there sometimes to meet various people. And Kumbakonam I did my initial shopping to fill the house, to furnish the house, and I ran through my 1,000 rupee house furnishing amount very quickly, and I found out that I just had to go and live with what I had. So that was hard, but I got to know Kumbakonam a little bit and Thanjavur pretty well.

[Assistant] So you had described your house as fairly almost luxurious for the village, I would say.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] About that.

[Assistant] So did you get into those larger towns fairly often or were you usually in the village all the time?

[User] I did fairly frequently into both those places. Thanjavur we had the district headquarters, so we had to go in there sometimes to meet various people. And Kumbakonam I did my initial shopping to fill the house, to furnish the house, and I ran through my 1,000 rupee house furnishing amount very quickly, and I found out that I just had to go and live with what I had. So that was hard, but I got to know Kumbakonam a little bit and Thanjavur pretty well.

[Assistant] So you had described your house as fairly almost luxurious for the village, I would say.

[User] Yes, it was.

[Assistant] But let's be practical. Did you have running water and did you have a toilet inside the house? What did you do for that?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I did fairly frequently into both those places. Thanjavur we had the district headquarters, so we had to go in there sometimes to meet various people. And Kumbakonam I did my initial shopping to fill the house, to furnish the house, and I ran through my 1,000 rupee house furnishing amount very quickly, and I found out that I just had to go and live with what I had. So that was hard, but I got to know Kumbakonam a little bit and Thanjavur pretty well.

[Assistant] So you had described your house as fairly almost luxurious for the village, I would say.

[User] Yes, it was.

[Assistant] But let's be practical. Did you have running water and did you have a toilet inside the house? What did you do for that?

[User] No, no, that was a there was a, um, an outhouse in the back yard. That was my toilet. And then there was a pump right outside the back door. Unfortunately, if I ever left the house for a few days, the pump would go dry and I'd have to have some water to prime it again. So, um, but it was available for bathing and that sort of thing. And then I'd have to boil the water if I wanted to drink it or cook with it.

[Assistant] What did you do about eating? How did you get your meals?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, it was.

[Assistant] But let's be practical. Did you have running water and did you have a toilet inside the house? What did you do for that?

[User] No, no, that was a there was a, um, an outhouse in the back yard. That was my toilet. And then there was a pump right outside the back door. Unfortunately, if I ever left the house for a few days, the pump would go dry and I'd have to have some water to prime it again. So, um, but it was available for bathing and that sort of thing. And then I'd have to boil the water if I wanted to drink it or cook with it.

[Assistant] What did you do about eating? How did you get your meals?

[User]
Very good question. I cooked for myself or ate at local restaurants, there were a lot of little eateries around, for a week or so. And then it turned out there was another volunteer who, uh, whose family knew of a young man who could cook for me. So he came to me. He came to me and started cooking. And he knew the area and he knew what to buy. And I had my pots and pans and things that I had. So he was in business right away. An interesting story there because I thought it was totally unprepared to deal with the cook, and I think I probably would have been better off if I had a meeting with a family or had a family supply the food or whatever but.

I found that I was running out of money at the end of the month and I figured out finally that a lot of my money was disappearing on his shopping trips and he was writing his own receipts when he would come back to me. So that, we lasted a couple of months, maybe three or four months. And then I decided that either I was going to, uh, be broke for the rest of my stay in India or I was going to have to let him go. So the problem wasn't his pay. The problem was the fact that he was siphoning the money off for something else. So I let him go.

[Assistant] And after that?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I had a problem with the health. I think pretty much everybody did to a certain extent. We just did not realize, I think, to the extent to which we had to really be super careful about what we ate and what we drank, because about once a month I'd get sick and I'd be sick for a couple of days. And then, uh, and pretty much all the time I would have a stomachache and my stomach would rumble and get cramps. And one of the nicest things about coming back to the United States after it was all over was that went away. I still remember how nice it felt not to be sick.

[Assistant] Wow. You mentioned that there had been another volunteer in your village and you also mentioned that there was another volunteer who had recommended your cook to you. Tell me, how close were you to other volunteers and how often did you see them?

[User] Yeah, I was, uh, I was closer to two volunteers who were from the previous group. So they, they had been there a year already by the time we got there. I was closer to them than, physically, than I was to our own members. So one was just a mile down the road. That was Jim Emery. And the other one was, oh, maybe three or four miles away in Kabisthalam. And that was Joe English.

[Assistant] Mm hmm.

[User] And, um, so I got to know them fairly well. They were both very friendly and helpful.

[Assistant] Were they helpful in getting you to, uh, understand how, how you could best live and how you could best accomplish your work and so forth?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, I was, uh, I was closer to two volunteers who were from the previous group. So they, they had been there a year already by the time we got there. I was closer to them than, physically, than I was to our own members. So one was just a mile down the road. That was Jim Emery. And the other one was, oh, maybe three or four miles away in Kabisthalam. And that was Joe English.

[Assistant] Mm hmm.

[User] And, um, so I got to know them fairly well. They were both very friendly and helpful.

[Assistant] Were they helpful in getting you to, uh, understand how, how you could best live and how you could best accomplish your work and so forth?

[User] Well, I would say in many ways, yes. And in other things, they couldn't help me because the number one thing I think that I needed was to be able to get to know some farmers and get them to trust me. And that was probably my number one difficulty there. And each of them, uh, had met and was dealing with a few farmers, but it was always with special circumstances. One was the farmer that Joe lived with. He had a very big farm, and so he had all he could do just to work with that farmer if you wanted to. And he had plenty of money, so he was very wealthy. And so it wasn't as though it was a risky proposition for him to do something that Joe recommended.

[Assistant] Let's segue from that into your work itself. You were, I think of us as agricultural extension agents. But, but who were you working for? Who did you report to, if anyone? How in the village or in the provincial capital? And talk a little about your typical workday and what you did.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, we had our, we had our supervisor who was, uh, boss. Um.

[Assistant] Full name?

[User] Uh, Srinivas. Srinivasan. What was his full name? K Srinivasan I think.

[Assistant] Sounds right.

[User] And we called him boss. He, he was happy with that. I think that was his suggestion. And he was the one who knew a lot of the agricultural development workers in that area. He was originally an agricultural development person and he's the one who got us our assignments and helped to pick the villages and seem to know the hierarchy of the agricultural development people in the county district. So he came, I forget, maybe once a month, maybe once a quarter, um, to see how we were doing. And, um. I never learned too much from boss, to be honest. But he was there.

[Assistant] Mm hmm. What about written materials? What about things, I mean, coming out of training, did you have guidance on identifying pests in the field, that kind of thing?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah. One time I branched out into cotton and, oh, sugar cane. Sorry. And so the problem with sugar cane, what makes it so expensive and eats into the profits of the farmers, is the weeding. So a large chemical company, representatives from a large chemical company stopped by my house once or twice. And they said, you know, if you can find some farmers who are willing to try this, we have a herbicide which will kill the weeds, but it'll let the sugar cane grow. So I went to one of the wealthier farmers in the area and asked him if he would be willing to try a small plot with that. And he said yeah. So he started up a small plot, I don't know, maybe eighth of an acre or something in his. In some farmers' holdings, that's the whole thing. But in his case, it was just a small part. So we thought we were going to save some money. And we applied the herbicide, we planted the sugar cane, applied the herbicide, and lo and behold, it killed the sugar cane.

[Assistant] Ah! Oh no.

[User] So I went back to the, uh, to the guys from the chemical company and they said, I think it was ICI. And I said, we've killed this farmer's sugar cane in this trial plot. They said, yeah, we found out about that so we don't sell that anymore. And they just had no sympathy whatsoever. And I never saw those guys again. So that was a waste of time, a waste of money for this farmer. And certainly we made no progress in trying to show them how to grow things better.

[Assistant] That's right.

[User] In fact, the chemical company was doing the trial runs on farmers' land. So instead of doing it themselves.

[Assistant] Did you get any sort of, I mean, was there any accountability for the work you were doing, either from Peace Corps or from the block development officer in the Indian government? Or how, how did you, how were you judged, if you will, on this?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I think I probably did once or twice. And the, uh, and the local officials came around. They knew I had a radio and they, uh, they came around to check my radio and I showed them what it was, and they wanted to make sure I was legally licensed for that. So I showed them my permit, as I recall, and that was the end of that, and they never came back. But now remember, the whole problem with India and Pakistan was Muslim versus Hindu. Well, my village was half Hindu, half Muslim. So there was a lot of Muslim population in that area and a lot of Hindu. You'd think there would be a lot of animosity between the two groups and there was not. Leave me, leave me out of this. They just, they just continued their lives doing whatever they wanted to do, they needed to do. The farmers went to their fields and the merchants went to their shops and everybody continued doing business.

[Assistant] That's interesting. I think I agree in terms of my experience. But what about daily life apart from political events happening far away? What were the relationships between the two, between Hindus and Muslims in the village generally in terms of social contacts, cultural, etcetera?

[User] Well, not too. There was not actually that much interaction.

[Assistant] Was there physical separation?

[User] There was a physical separation. There was about 200 yards between the two sections of the village. And then, uh, there's actually, on the other side, there was actually another Muslim village and another one after that. So but there was very little interaction. If I went to a village level panchayat meeting, for example, it would be all upper-class Muslims. And the lower-class Hindus had no say in the panchayat running. So, you know, the highest level probably in my village, in the Hindu part of the village, was a teacher. We had a very well-respected teacher, but no high-level income people in that area.

[Assistant] So were the landowners mostly Muslim then?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, not too. There was not actually that much interaction.

[Assistant] Was there physical separation?

[User] There was a physical separation. There was about 200 yards between the two sections of the village. And then, uh, there's actually, on the other side, there was actually another Muslim village and another one after that. So but there was very little interaction. If I went to a village level panchayat meeting, for example, it would be all upper-class Muslims. And the lower-class Hindus had no say in the panchayat running. So, you know, the highest level probably in my village, in the Hindu part of the village, was a teacher. We had a very well-respected teacher, but no high-level income people in that area.

[Assistant] So were the landowners mostly Muslim then?

[User] Landowners were mostly Muslim and the Hindus had land, but they had very small amounts. So they didn't have extra capital, say, for example, to invest in betel cultivation, which was capital intensive.

[Assistant] This is betel vine, B-E-T-E-L.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] There was a physical separation. There was about 200 yards between the two sections of the village. And then, uh, there's actually, on the other side, there was actually another Muslim village and another one after that. So but there was very little interaction. If I went to a village level panchayat meeting, for example, it would be all upper-class Muslims. And the lower-class Hindus had no say in the panchayat running. So, you know, the highest level probably in my village, in the Hindu part of the village, was a teacher. We had a very well-respected teacher, but no high-level income people in that area.

[Assistant] So were the landowners mostly Muslim then?

[User] Landowners were mostly Muslim and the Hindus had land, but they had very small amounts. So they didn't have extra capital, say, for example, to invest in betel cultivation, which was capital intensive.

[Assistant] This is betel vine, B-E-T-E-L.

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] As opposed to beetles. Yes.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Landowners were mostly Muslim and the Hindus had land, but they had very small amounts. So they didn't have extra capital, say, for example, to invest in betel cultivation, which was capital intensive.

[Assistant] This is betel vine, B-E-T-E-L.

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] As opposed to beetles. Yes.

[User] Yes, that's right. Leaf cultivation. So they were much lower income, I would say they probably had no more than a quarter of the income that the Muslims had and it was really subsistence for them. And it was, I was pleased to see that they were still sending most of their kids to school so that the next generation maybe had a better opportunity.

[Assistant] Did your village have schooling up to high school or just or elementary?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, that's right. Leaf cultivation. So they were much lower income, I would say they probably had no more than a quarter of the income that the Muslims had and it was really subsistence for them. And it was, I was pleased to see that they were still sending most of their kids to school so that the next generation maybe had a better opportunity.

[Assistant] Did your village have schooling up to high school or just or elementary?

[User] Elementary.

[Assistant] Okay.

[User] Elementary.

[Assistant] Do you remember where kids went to for high school, how far away it was?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Elementary.

[Assistant] Do you remember where kids went to for high school, how far away it was?

[User] They probably had to go to Papanasam is my guess.

[Assistant] Okay.

[User] But I don't recall exactly where that high school was.

[Assistant] There were also other foreigners around the district, not in the village, but non Peace Corps, some of whom we knew I remember in Thanjavur. Did you work with any of those and what were your relationships?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] They probably had to go to Papanasam is my guess.

[Assistant] Okay.

[User] But I don't recall exactly where that high school was.

[Assistant] There were also other foreigners around the district, not in the village, but non Peace Corps, some of whom we knew I remember in Thanjavur. Did you work with any of those and what were your relationships?

[User] Yes, that's actually how I met my wife.

[Assistant] Ah, good. That's a good segue. Okay.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] But I don't recall exactly where that high school was.

[Assistant] There were also other foreigners around the district, not in the village, but non Peace Corps, some of whom we knew I remember in Thanjavur. Did you work with any of those and what were your relationships?

[User] Yes, that's actually how I met my wife.

[Assistant] Ah, good. That's a good segue. Okay.

[User]
We, yes, there were, there was a United Nations development project in Thanjavur, which is 15 miles away, and they were investigating the groundwater there. How far down did the groundwater go when people ran their irrigation pumps, for example? And therefore, how many pumps can we put in and how intensely can we withdraw the water before we're hurting ourselves? And so they were doing serious research, took about four years or five years for that project to finish. And I met through some of the people in Thanjavur, I met some of those people and some of the researchers there.

There was, it was an international team led by a man actually from Poland and other researchers from the Netherlands and other places besides Americans as well. So I knew a researcher there named Clyde Swenson, who knew one of the Americans on that UN team, and we were all sitting around playing cards occasionally on a weekend, maybe. And, uh, and he was one of the guys. He was the guy who introduced me then to Laura, who was an Anglo-Indian secretary working for the UN Development Project.

[Assistant] Could you explain the term Anglo-Indian?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, that's actually how I met my wife.

[Assistant] Ah, good. That's a good segue. Okay.

[User]
We, yes, there were, there was a United Nations development project in Thanjavur, which is 15 miles away, and they were investigating the groundwater there. How far down did the groundwater go when people ran their irrigation pumps, for example? And therefore, how many pumps can we put in and how intensely can we withdraw the water before we're hurting ourselves? And so they were doing serious research, took about four years or five years for that project to finish. And I met through some of the people in Thanjavur, I met some of those people and some of the researchers there.

There was, it was an international team led by a man actually from Poland and other researchers from the Netherlands and other places besides Americans as well. So I knew a researcher there named Clyde Swenson, who knew one of the Americans on that UN team, and we were all sitting around playing cards occasionally on a weekend, maybe. And, uh, and he was one of the guys. He was the guy who introduced me then to Laura, who was an Anglo-Indian secretary working for the UN Development Project.

[Assistant] Could you explain the term Anglo-Indian?

[User] Ah, yes. Anglo-Indians are almost a caste in India, but they are the descendants of Britishers primarily, but also other foreigners and Indians' intermarriages in India. And they formed a subgroup in India for probably 300 years, ever since the British arrived, and it's been a very up and down history for them. But so they speak English at home and they dress primarily like Americans, and then they worship in the Catholic Church and the Anglican Church and they study English and go to college and do all kinds of things.

[Assistant] Tell us about Laura.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Largely, a large part of that. Yeah. Naturally, growing up in that community, there were plenty of young men who, who knew her and they had many of these social activities, so they all knew each other. So he figured, why go outside of the community when you can marry inside the community? And I will say also, as a military man he was assigned to Vietnam.

[Assistant] Hmm.

[User] So he was on the U.N. Commission for Vietnam, the, what do they call them? The observers. He was one of the observers for the UN in Vietnam. And he was not impressed with American servicemen and their behavior in Vietnam. So that was a bad sign. And he decided he didn't want his daughter marrying one of these Americans. And he decided that he didn't, especially didn't want him to her to marry an American who was going to then take her outside of India. So she would be basically, suppose I was going to treat her badly. There was nobody there to be with her, to help her.

[Assistant] Interesting.

[User] So he was opposed to that pretty strongly.

[Assistant] But, but Laura's mother made, convinced him otherwise.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] So he was on the U.N. Commission for Vietnam, the, what do they call them? The observers. He was one of the observers for the UN in Vietnam. And he was not impressed with American servicemen and their behavior in Vietnam. So that was a bad sign. And he decided he didn't want his daughter marrying one of these Americans. And he decided that he didn't, especially didn't want him to her to marry an American who was going to then take her outside of India. So she would be basically, suppose I was going to treat her badly. There was nobody there to be with her, to help her.

[Assistant] Interesting.

[User] So he was opposed to that pretty strongly.

[Assistant] But, but Laura's mother made, convinced him otherwise.

[User] Convinced him otherwise, sort of did an end run around him. And he just couldn't, couldn't say no. I guess he figured he couldn't say no at that point.

[Assistant] That's fascinating. I remember your wedding as one of the most vivid events of my time in India. Would you like to talk about that event?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] So he was opposed to that pretty strongly.

[Assistant] But, but Laura's mother made, convinced him otherwise.

[User] Convinced him otherwise, sort of did an end run around him. And he just couldn't, couldn't say no. I guess he figured he couldn't say no at that point.

[Assistant] That's fascinating. I remember your wedding as one of the most vivid events of my time in India. Would you like to talk about that event?

[User] Yeah, that was an amazing event, I will say. I, you know, I appreciate you and all the other volunteers coming so that I wouldn't be all alone at my own wedding. And, uh, and but everything was handled by Laura's family. They invited all the guests and arranged for all the, arranged for the ceremony and the reception afterwards. And it was just, it was basically a Western wedding, Western reception, but in an Indian context.

[Assistant] And an Indian church.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Convinced him otherwise, sort of did an end run around him. And he just couldn't, couldn't say no. I guess he figured he couldn't say no at that point.

[Assistant] That's fascinating. I remember your wedding as one of the most vivid events of my time in India. Would you like to talk about that event?

[User] Yeah, that was an amazing event, I will say. I, you know, I appreciate you and all the other volunteers coming so that I wouldn't be all alone at my own wedding. And, uh, and but everything was handled by Laura's family. They invited all the guests and arranged for all the, arranged for the ceremony and the reception afterwards. And it was just, it was basically a Western wedding, Western reception, but in an Indian context.

[Assistant] And an Indian church.

[User] Indian church. And, um, afterwards we all went to, about 300 people went to a big reception in the big hall that they had there and stayed till almost midnight. And then we headed, headed home.

[Assistant] It was almost all Anglo-Indian, as I recall.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, that was an amazing event, I will say. I, you know, I appreciate you and all the other volunteers coming so that I wouldn't be all alone at my own wedding. And, uh, and but everything was handled by Laura's family. They invited all the guests and arranged for all the, arranged for the ceremony and the reception afterwards. And it was just, it was basically a Western wedding, Western reception, but in an Indian context.

[Assistant] And an Indian church.

[User] Indian church. And, um, afterwards we all went to, about 300 people went to a big reception in the big hall that they had there and stayed till almost midnight. And then we headed, headed home.

[Assistant] It was almost all Anglo-Indian, as I recall.

[User] Almost all Anglo-Indian.

[Assistant] Okay. And very lively.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Indian church. And, um, afterwards we all went to, about 300 people went to a big reception in the big hall that they had there and stayed till almost midnight. And then we headed, headed home.

[Assistant] It was almost all Anglo-Indian, as I recall.

[User] Almost all Anglo-Indian.

[Assistant] Okay. And very lively.

[User] Very lively.

[Assistant] They like to have fun.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Almost all Anglo-Indian.

[Assistant] Okay. And very lively.

[User] Very lively.

[Assistant] They like to have fun.

[User] Yes. They love to have fun. And they are great dancers. And they, uh, the music was all Western and about 10 to 15 years, 10 to 20 years behind. So they liked country, liked country and western. A lot of that. Jim Reeves and others. And, uh, but they played it well. They had all the guitar playing and the, whatever other instruments, you know, they had a keyboard and some other things.

[Assistant] I don't even remember. Did you have a best man?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes. They love to have fun. And they are great dancers. And they, uh, the music was all Western and about 10 to 15 years, 10 to 20 years behind. So they liked country, liked country and western. A lot of that. Jim Reeves and others. And, uh, but they played it well. They had all the guitar playing and the, whatever other instruments, you know, they had a keyboard and some other things.

[Assistant] I don't even remember. Did you have a best man?

[User] The best man was Sven.

[Assistant] Ah, good.

[User] And, uh.

[Assistant] The Danish volunteer.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] The best man was Sven.

[Assistant] Ah, good.

[User] And, uh.

[Assistant] The Danish volunteer.

[User] Danish volunteer. And the other parts, uh, groomsmen were Brian, Brian Hirschfeld, and Arnie Burmeister. And, um, let's see, was that it? I think that was it. Because Laura had herself and her three sisters. Let's see. So, no. So there's one more on, no, that's right.

[Assistant] No, that's right. Three and three.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And, uh.

[Assistant] The Danish volunteer.

[User] Danish volunteer. And the other parts, uh, groomsmen were Brian, Brian Hirschfeld, and Arnie Burmeister. And, um, let's see, was that it? I think that was it. Because Laura had herself and her three sisters. Let's see. So, no. So there's one more on, no, that's right.

[Assistant] No, that's right. Three and three.

[User] Three and three. So we had three members on each side of the bridal party and then we had ourselves. So all together that would make.

[Assistant] By this time you'd had a little exposure to the Anglo-Indian community. But those of us coming from the village did not and were astounded that this culture existed so close to our villages and was so Western and so lively and so different from the rest of.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Danish volunteer. And the other parts, uh, groomsmen were Brian, Brian Hirschfeld, and Arnie Burmeister. And, um, let's see, was that it? I think that was it. Because Laura had herself and her three sisters. Let's see. So, no. So there's one more on, no, that's right.

[Assistant] No, that's right. Three and three.

[User] Three and three. So we had three members on each side of the bridal party and then we had ourselves. So all together that would make.

[Assistant] By this time you'd had a little exposure to the Anglo-Indian community. But those of us coming from the village did not and were astounded that this culture existed so close to our villages and was so Western and so lively and so different from the rest of.

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] What we'd seen in southern India.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Three and three. So we had three members on each side of the bridal party and then we had ourselves. So all together that would make.

[Assistant] By this time you'd had a little exposure to the Anglo-Indian community. But those of us coming from the village did not and were astounded that this culture existed so close to our villages and was so Western and so lively and so different from the rest of.

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] What we'd seen in southern India.

[User] It was a world away. It was completely different from anything we had been exposed to in the village and. And in fact, to be honest, I, I didn't realize how much, how extensive that, that was.

[Assistant] Um, okay. So now bring us up to date on the last 45 years and what's happened with your family.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] What we'd seen in southern India.

[User] It was a world away. It was completely different from anything we had been exposed to in the village and. And in fact, to be honest, I, I didn't realize how much, how extensive that, that was.

[Assistant] Um, okay. So now bring us up to date on the last 45 years and what's happened with your family.

[User] So we've had, we live in Washington, D.C., now, and we have been here for almost 40, over 40 years. And after finishing graduate school, we settled down here in Washington, D.C., and we've had a girl and a boy and now we have two grandchildren. And, um, and my wife went to work for the World Bank when we came to Washington and they gave us home leave, so they sent the whole family to go to India. So we went to India like maybe ten times and got to see all the people there. And one of the things that came out of that was that our daughter met one of the young men from Laura's hometown and married him. So now they live here 5 minutes from our house and he's working in data processing, making more money than I ever made and doing very well. And she's teaching and our son is in, lives 10 minutes away and he's selling real estate so.

[Assistant] That's great. Well, this has been a great interview. But before we end up, are there other stories that come to mind that you would like to share? Anything else that I've missed here?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I'm good, thank you.

[Assistant] Ok, and also, I have to say, this is the first time using the digital recorder, but I have a tape recorder going also. OK, so the first question is for Barbara to describe her family, work, if she would like to, current residence to begin with. OK, so let's begin with that Barb Johnston.

[User] My current work?

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] OK. I am presently live in Denver, Colorado. I am a school nurse and I've been a school nurse for 20 years and planned to retire at in June.

[Assistant] And your family situation?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] My current work?

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] OK. I am presently live in Denver, Colorado. I am a school nurse and I've been a school nurse for 20 years and planned to retire at in June.

[Assistant] And your family situation?

[User] Ok, I have and I'm single and I have an adopted daughter, Abby, who's twenty 22 years old.

[Assistant] Where’s Abby from?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] OK. I am presently live in Denver, Colorado. I am a school nurse and I've been a school nurse for 20 years and planned to retire at in June.

[Assistant] And your family situation?

[User] Ok, I have and I'm single and I have an adopted daughter, Abby, who's twenty 22 years old.

[Assistant] Where’s Abby from?

[User] She was born in Guatemala.

[Assistant] Ok, if you can think back to the year before joining the Peace Corps and what you can remember, what was your life like back then? So I know you were 1980, so about 1979. Anything you might want to share with us that influenced you to become a Peace Corps volunteer?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Ok, I have and I'm single and I have an adopted daughter, Abby, who's twenty 22 years old.

[Assistant] Where’s Abby from?

[User] She was born in Guatemala.

[Assistant] Ok, if you can think back to the year before joining the Peace Corps and what you can remember, what was your life like back then? So I know you were 1980, so about 1979. Anything you might want to share with us that influenced you to become a Peace Corps volunteer?

[User] Well, at the time I was, I had worked for the migrant health program. I also lived in an apartment and I was thinking, what was I going to do next. I believe I was working part time at the hospital also or with the Visiting Nurse Association. And I happened to see in the paper where they wanted Peace Corps volunteers when I was looking for jobs and they were advertising for Peace Corps. And I thought, hmm, I'm not sure what I want to do with my life, so I'm ready to make a change. And so I applied. And originally I was going to go to Yemen in 1980, but because of there some political unrest, then I got switch to go to Nepal.

[Assistant] Ok, anything else you might want to add about why you joined the Peace Corps or is that so?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] She was born in Guatemala.

[Assistant] Ok, if you can think back to the year before joining the Peace Corps and what you can remember, what was your life like back then? So I know you were 1980, so about 1979. Anything you might want to share with us that influenced you to become a Peace Corps volunteer?

[User] Well, at the time I was, I had worked for the migrant health program. I also lived in an apartment and I was thinking, what was I going to do next. I believe I was working part time at the hospital also or with the Visiting Nurse Association. And I happened to see in the paper where they wanted Peace Corps volunteers when I was looking for jobs and they were advertising for Peace Corps. And I thought, hmm, I'm not sure what I want to do with my life, so I'm ready to make a change. And so I applied. And originally I was going to go to Yemen in 1980, but because of there some political unrest, then I got switch to go to Nepal.

[Assistant] Ok, anything else you might want to add about why you joined the Peace Corps or is that so?

[User] At that time, I was going to go with the water supply group. A couple of those people were had done just construction. A couple of people were bridge builders or engineers. They were all guys and one, a couple of women in the group. And I went with them and obviously and when I got there, I knew that that's not the training that I could do. So I was able to join a health and nutrition group. I was I was the only one, but like a lady ministry or something, let me get involved in the southern part of Nepal. So I was in the tri area called Hetauda. I went between two different villages.

[Assistant] Could you spell that village?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, at the time I was, I had worked for the migrant health program. I also lived in an apartment and I was thinking, what was I going to do next. I believe I was working part time at the hospital also or with the Visiting Nurse Association. And I happened to see in the paper where they wanted Peace Corps volunteers when I was looking for jobs and they were advertising for Peace Corps. And I thought, hmm, I'm not sure what I want to do with my life, so I'm ready to make a change. And so I applied. And originally I was going to go to Yemen in 1980, but because of there some political unrest, then I got switch to go to Nepal.

[Assistant] Ok, anything else you might want to add about why you joined the Peace Corps or is that so?

[User] At that time, I was going to go with the water supply group. A couple of those people were had done just construction. A couple of people were bridge builders or engineers. They were all guys and one, a couple of women in the group. And I went with them and obviously and when I got there, I knew that that's not the training that I could do. So I was able to join a health and nutrition group. I was I was the only one, but like a lady ministry or something, let me get involved in the southern part of Nepal. So I was in the tri area called Hetauda. I went between two different villages.

[Assistant] Could you spell that village?

[User] Yeah, H-E-T-O-U-D-A I believe [sic]. And the other was a Japong village which is a tribe and it was two or three hours away from there across the river and totally different people in that kind of thing. So I worked in those two, those two villages.

[Assistant] Ok, and now the third question, we already talked about how you heard about the Peace Corps. Can you talk a little bit about the process and the timing? For instance, some people say, oh, it took me nine months to get accepted or things of that nature. Do you remember much about how you applied? How long did it take?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] At that time, I was going to go with the water supply group. A couple of those people were had done just construction. A couple of people were bridge builders or engineers. They were all guys and one, a couple of women in the group. And I went with them and obviously and when I got there, I knew that that's not the training that I could do. So I was able to join a health and nutrition group. I was I was the only one, but like a lady ministry or something, let me get involved in the southern part of Nepal. So I was in the tri area called Hetauda. I went between two different villages.

[Assistant] Could you spell that village?

[User] Yeah, H-E-T-O-U-D-A I believe [sic]. And the other was a Japong village which is a tribe and it was two or three hours away from there across the river and totally different people in that kind of thing. So I worked in those two, those two villages.

[Assistant] Ok, and now the third question, we already talked about how you heard about the Peace Corps. Can you talk a little bit about the process and the timing? For instance, some people say, oh, it took me nine months to get accepted or things of that nature. Do you remember much about how you applied? How long did it take?

[User] The application took as long as it does now. I know people now wait several months. I might have waited several months, but I think the length of time wasn’t as long. And I do I did at the at the time I had a bachelor's degree in sociology, but I was an LPN, so I wasn’t an RN at the time.

[Assistant] Ok, did you have a specific country or project in mind yourself before you joined?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, H-E-T-O-U-D-A I believe [sic]. And the other was a Japong village which is a tribe and it was two or three hours away from there across the river and totally different people in that kind of thing. So I worked in those two, those two villages.

[Assistant] Ok, and now the third question, we already talked about how you heard about the Peace Corps. Can you talk a little bit about the process and the timing? For instance, some people say, oh, it took me nine months to get accepted or things of that nature. Do you remember much about how you applied? How long did it take?

[User] The application took as long as it does now. I know people now wait several months. I might have waited several months, but I think the length of time wasn’t as long. And I do I did at the at the time I had a bachelor's degree in sociology, but I was an LPN, so I wasn’t an RN at the time.

[Assistant] Ok, did you have a specific country or project in mind yourself before you joined?

[User] No.

[Assistant] Ok. OK, here's the fourth question. So what were your friends or family's reactions when you were accepted? For instance, was there any hesitation or reservations on their part, your part?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] The application took as long as it does now. I know people now wait several months. I might have waited several months, but I think the length of time wasn’t as long. And I do I did at the at the time I had a bachelor's degree in sociology, but I was an LPN, so I wasn’t an RN at the time.

[Assistant] Ok, did you have a specific country or project in mind yourself before you joined?

[User] No.

[Assistant] Ok. OK, here's the fourth question. So what were your friends or family's reactions when you were accepted? For instance, was there any hesitation or reservations on their part, your part?

[User] Well, I remember my father said that I need to stay home and get a regular job so I can start getting Social Security.

[Assistant] Ok, sorry we're laughing, those of you who are listening.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No.

[Assistant] Ok. OK, here's the fourth question. So what were your friends or family's reactions when you were accepted? For instance, was there any hesitation or reservations on their part, your part?

[User] Well, I remember my father said that I need to stay home and get a regular job so I can start getting Social Security.

[Assistant] Ok, sorry we're laughing, those of you who are listening.

[User] Ok, and quit moving around or have that. So I remember him saying it was important to get a good job and settle down and start getting Social Security. And that's basically family.

[Assistant] How about your mom and or your sister and brother?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, I remember my father said that I need to stay home and get a regular job so I can start getting Social Security.

[Assistant] Ok, sorry we're laughing, those of you who are listening.

[User] Ok, and quit moving around or have that. So I remember him saying it was important to get a good job and settle down and start getting Social Security. And that's basically family.

[Assistant] How about your mom and or your sister and brother?

[User] Well, I think they were accepting. My mother actually had cancer at the time, was diagnosed and she said, you've always wanted to do something like this, so you need to go.

[Assistant] Oh, wow. OK, here's the fifth question. What project were you invited to join? You've already mentioned that a little bit. So maybe we could talk about the nutrition and health then. How did you prepare yourself and others for your, it says dislocation, but like moving away, entering into two years of Peace Corps service?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, I think they were accepting. My mother actually had cancer at the time, was diagnosed and she said, you've always wanted to do something like this, so you need to go.

[Assistant] Oh, wow. OK, here's the fifth question. What project were you invited to join? You've already mentioned that a little bit. So maybe we could talk about the nutrition and health then. How did you prepare yourself and others for your, it says dislocation, but like moving away, entering into two years of Peace Corps service?

[User] Well, I lived here in Denver and I had an apartment, so I moved a lot of things home.

[Assistant] Where’s home?

[User] Wyoming. Casper, Wyoming. And then I did move some of my furniture, a few pieces, my furniture to the San Luis Valley where I had lived before, to a friend that lived out in the country. So but a lot of it just went home at the time.

[Assistant] Ok, our next question is about your Peace Corps training. This is question six. The question has to do with where were you trained? If you want to speak about the faculty, the syllabus they used, technical studies, things of that to begin with, then we have more parts to that question. Do you remember much about the training?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, I lived here in Denver and I had an apartment, so I moved a lot of things home.

[Assistant] Where’s home?

[User] Wyoming. Casper, Wyoming. And then I did move some of my furniture, a few pieces, my furniture to the San Luis Valley where I had lived before, to a friend that lived out in the country. So but a lot of it just went home at the time.

[Assistant] Ok, our next question is about your Peace Corps training. This is question six. The question has to do with where were you trained? If you want to speak about the faculty, the syllabus they used, technical studies, things of that to begin with, then we have more parts to that question. Do you remember much about the training?

[User] Well, training was wonderful meeting Nepali people who I think the cultural aspect of teaching us about different caste systems, about different things, about Nepal were wonderful in the literature they gave us. Now that I'm looking back, I think that was and also the training was fun when we had to go live with families for a while during that period of time. I’ve kind of forgotten exactly. But I remember the training taught about language, cultural situations, because Nepal has so many varied populations that, Hindu you know, some are Buddhist. And, you know, we had to learn the different cultural situations. So that was a lot of interest. I had a hard time with the language myself. I thought it was very difficult.

[Assistant] And which language did you learn?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Wyoming. Casper, Wyoming. And then I did move some of my furniture, a few pieces, my furniture to the San Luis Valley where I had lived before, to a friend that lived out in the country. So but a lot of it just went home at the time.

[Assistant] Ok, our next question is about your Peace Corps training. This is question six. The question has to do with where were you trained? If you want to speak about the faculty, the syllabus they used, technical studies, things of that to begin with, then we have more parts to that question. Do you remember much about the training?

[User] Well, training was wonderful meeting Nepali people who I think the cultural aspect of teaching us about different caste systems, about different things, about Nepal were wonderful in the literature they gave us. Now that I'm looking back, I think that was and also the training was fun when we had to go live with families for a while during that period of time. I’ve kind of forgotten exactly. But I remember the training taught about language, cultural situations, because Nepal has so many varied populations that, Hindu you know, some are Buddhist. And, you know, we had to learn the different cultural situations. So that was a lot of interest. I had a hard time with the language myself. I thought it was very difficult.

[Assistant] And which language did you learn?

[User] Nepali. Ok, I'm going to say something about the training.

[Assistant] The reaction to other trainees, unless you want to expand on the training.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, training was wonderful meeting Nepali people who I think the cultural aspect of teaching us about different caste systems, about different things, about Nepal were wonderful in the literature they gave us. Now that I'm looking back, I think that was and also the training was fun when we had to go live with families for a while during that period of time. I’ve kind of forgotten exactly. But I remember the training taught about language, cultural situations, because Nepal has so many varied populations that, Hindu you know, some are Buddhist. And, you know, we had to learn the different cultural situations. So that was a lot of interest. I had a hard time with the language myself. I thought it was very difficult.

[Assistant] And which language did you learn?

[User] Nepali. Ok, I'm going to say something about the training.

[Assistant] The reaction to other trainees, unless you want to expand on the training.

[User] Well, I just wanted to say the training is that once I got to my village doing health and nutrition, it's hard to do health and nutrition when the buffalo is, you know, wallowing in a mud puddle or something.

[Assistant] Was the buffalo a fellow student?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Nepali. Ok, I'm going to say something about the training.

[Assistant] The reaction to other trainees, unless you want to expand on the training.

[User] Well, I just wanted to say the training is that once I got to my village doing health and nutrition, it's hard to do health and nutrition when the buffalo is, you know, wallowing in a mud puddle or something.

[Assistant] Was the buffalo a fellow student?

[User] No, and so I do believe training. I wish they'd spent more time teaching about gardening, raising chickens and other things. The cultural aspect was wonderful and that kind of thing. But I wish they had spent more time training because I didn't do gardening here. I mean, you know, and maybe they think that was just automatic. But I think they wish they'd given more training on how to raise chickens, gardening, small goats, things like that.

[Assistant] About language training, I don't know if you said this, did you have to live with a family that spoke only Nepali, for instance?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, I just wanted to say the training is that once I got to my village doing health and nutrition, it's hard to do health and nutrition when the buffalo is, you know, wallowing in a mud puddle or something.

[Assistant] Was the buffalo a fellow student?

[User] No, and so I do believe training. I wish they'd spent more time teaching about gardening, raising chickens and other things. The cultural aspect was wonderful and that kind of thing. But I wish they had spent more time training because I didn't do gardening here. I mean, you know, and maybe they think that was just automatic. But I think they wish they'd given more training on how to raise chickens, gardening, small goats, things like that.

[Assistant] About language training, I don't know if you said this, did you have to live with a family that spoke only Nepali, for instance?

[User] Yes. Yeah, I lived with a couple of different families and they only spoke Nepali and we stayed with them for so many weeks. And then I think we changed to another family.

[Assistant] Ok, now I don't know the selection process, what they're doing now in 2016. But at that time many of us had a selection process. I'm assuming that they did for you, like some of the folks in your group that maybe did not make it to become a volunteer. Did you have anything you want to share with us about the selection or did you have other trainees that had to go home that couldn't finish the, I'm assuming, ten weeks of training? Whatever anything you want to share about that.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, and so I do believe training. I wish they'd spent more time teaching about gardening, raising chickens and other things. The cultural aspect was wonderful and that kind of thing. But I wish they had spent more time training because I didn't do gardening here. I mean, you know, and maybe they think that was just automatic. But I think they wish they'd given more training on how to raise chickens, gardening, small goats, things like that.

[Assistant] About language training, I don't know if you said this, did you have to live with a family that spoke only Nepali, for instance?

[User] Yes. Yeah, I lived with a couple of different families and they only spoke Nepali and we stayed with them for so many weeks. And then I think we changed to another family.

[Assistant] Ok, now I don't know the selection process, what they're doing now in 2016. But at that time many of us had a selection process. I'm assuming that they did for you, like some of the folks in your group that maybe did not make it to become a volunteer. Did you have anything you want to share with us about the selection or did you have other trainees that had to go home that couldn't finish the, I'm assuming, ten weeks of training? Whatever anything you want to share about that.

[User] Well, I just remember one woman friend in our group from California had been there before traveling and she decided not to stay in work and be there as a volunteer. So she left. But that's how I remember I'm sure there were a couple of people. But, you know, I don't know because I kind of work solo in my mind because I was with this nutrition parliament group or associated with a lady in the in this one area. I mean, there were a couple of people left, but I can't remember. I remember she left because she just didn't feel like it was going to fit in. She loved traveling there and she had traveled there before, but I don't think she wanted to work there for two years.

[Assistant] OK, do you remember how many people were in your training group?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes. Yeah, I lived with a couple of different families and they only spoke Nepali and we stayed with them for so many weeks. And then I think we changed to another family.

[Assistant] Ok, now I don't know the selection process, what they're doing now in 2016. But at that time many of us had a selection process. I'm assuming that they did for you, like some of the folks in your group that maybe did not make it to become a volunteer. Did you have anything you want to share with us about the selection or did you have other trainees that had to go home that couldn't finish the, I'm assuming, ten weeks of training? Whatever anything you want to share about that.

[User] Well, I just remember one woman friend in our group from California had been there before traveling and she decided not to stay in work and be there as a volunteer. So she left. But that's how I remember I'm sure there were a couple of people. But, you know, I don't know because I kind of work solo in my mind because I was with this nutrition parliament group or associated with a lady in the in this one area. I mean, there were a couple of people left, but I can't remember. I remember she left because she just didn't feel like it was going to fit in. She loved traveling there and she had traveled there before, but I don't think she wanted to work there for two years.

[Assistant] OK, do you remember how many people were in your training group?

[User] Oh, there might have been 10 to 15. I can't remember.

[Assistant] Ok, while we're moving on to the seventh question, what was your when you first went into the country, enter the country, your reaction to the country that you were saying, which in your case was Nepal, for instance? The project will start with that.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, I just remember one woman friend in our group from California had been there before traveling and she decided not to stay in work and be there as a volunteer. So she left. But that's how I remember I'm sure there were a couple of people. But, you know, I don't know because I kind of work solo in my mind because I was with this nutrition parliament group or associated with a lady in the in this one area. I mean, there were a couple of people left, but I can't remember. I remember she left because she just didn't feel like it was going to fit in. She loved traveling there and she had traveled there before, but I don't think she wanted to work there for two years.

[Assistant] OK, do you remember how many people were in your training group?

[User] Oh, there might have been 10 to 15. I can't remember.

[Assistant] Ok, while we're moving on to the seventh question, what was your when you first went into the country, enter the country, your reaction to the country that you were saying, which in your case was Nepal, for instance? The project will start with that.

[User] Well, not even just a project, but I remember being in Kathmandu and going out with other volunteers or going out in the evening. And just definitely a culture shock of the mass amount of poverty in the area. You know, people cooking outside, you know, no electricity, no water. You know, even in Kathmandu, you know, streets were very dark, no lighting. And I just, you know, by the mass amount of poverty, not just certain sections like you might see in the United States, but, you know, the poverty. And certainly you could see the lack of resources.

[Assistant] I never thought is this is not on the list of questions, but sometimes people talk about the smells. Do you remember or anything like that, if people were cooking outside and I'm not sure about the bathroom usage then. But anything you remember about that, the sounds, the smell, you know, people would cook outside.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh, there might have been 10 to 15. I can't remember.

[Assistant] Ok, while we're moving on to the seventh question, what was your when you first went into the country, enter the country, your reaction to the country that you were saying, which in your case was Nepal, for instance? The project will start with that.

[User] Well, not even just a project, but I remember being in Kathmandu and going out with other volunteers or going out in the evening. And just definitely a culture shock of the mass amount of poverty in the area. You know, people cooking outside, you know, no electricity, no water. You know, even in Kathmandu, you know, streets were very dark, no lighting. And I just, you know, by the mass amount of poverty, not just certain sections like you might see in the United States, but, you know, the poverty. And certainly you could see the lack of resources.

[Assistant] I never thought is this is not on the list of questions, but sometimes people talk about the smells. Do you remember or anything like that, if people were cooking outside and I'm not sure about the bathroom usage then. But anything you remember about that, the sounds, the smell, you know, people would cook outside.

[User] There were hardly any bathrooms around or there weren't any. And so a lot of times, especially the women would go in my villages would go out in the fields. But in the town of Katmandu, you just you know, there weren't a lot of there weren't those kind of things set up. A lot of the restaurants were not very clean either. I think they got used to clean them more when trekkers started coming through and they would clean the rice from the table or whatever. But, yeah, the sense of poverty and health and, you know, made there might be water spigots in the town or whatever, but definitely the poverty and lack of resources.

[Assistant] Yeah. Anything you want to share with us about the Peace Corps staff at that time?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I know they were Nepalis that, you know, were great people. You know, I, I that's all I, I know they were you know, a lot of them had later, I think some of them came to the United States or went on to school or whatever. But, you know, they were, you know, great people to meet. I mean, while I was there, I didn't continue any knowing any of them afterwards.

[Assistant] Now, how long was your training, your Peace Corps training? Don't remember?

[User] Don't remember.

[Assistant] OK.

[User] Probably the same as everybody else.

[Assistant] [00:13:54]. I know mine was ten weeks. But anyways, we're moving onwards to the eighth question, which is to talk about your assignment. So some of the examples we could use are could you tell us a little bit about the specifics of your job assignment?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Don't remember.

[Assistant] OK.

[User] Probably the same as everybody else.

[Assistant] [00:13:54]. I know mine was ten weeks. But anyways, we're moving onwards to the eighth question, which is to talk about your assignment. So some of the examples we could use are could you tell us a little bit about the specifics of your job assignment?

[User] Ok, well, I lived in. Hetauda was the main town and I walked probably forty five minutes to a village where I lived with the family and I lived upstairs and they all lived downstairs. And the ama, the mother did cook upstairs. So but anyway, I had a separate room above the tea shop. They had a tea shop down below and one room where the family lived. And I lived upstairs and it was all kind of a road just going through the town. And there were houses on each side and one school at the end of the block. And so I that's where I lived there. And then in the village I lived in the health post and in. As a health post was on one side and I stayed on the other side in a room there, and so I kind of went back and forth between the two villages.

[Assistant] Ok, so you might have said this, and I might not have I'd have recorded it. Did you ever actually work in that water supply project for a short time?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Probably the same as everybody else.

[Assistant] [00:13:54]. I know mine was ten weeks. But anyways, we're moving onwards to the eighth question, which is to talk about your assignment. So some of the examples we could use are could you tell us a little bit about the specifics of your job assignment?

[User] Ok, well, I lived in. Hetauda was the main town and I walked probably forty five minutes to a village where I lived with the family and I lived upstairs and they all lived downstairs. And the ama, the mother did cook upstairs. So but anyway, I had a separate room above the tea shop. They had a tea shop down below and one room where the family lived. And I lived upstairs and it was all kind of a road just going through the town. And there were houses on each side and one school at the end of the block. And so I that's where I lived there. And then in the village I lived in the health post and in. As a health post was on one side and I stayed on the other side in a room there, and so I kind of went back and forth between the two villages.

[Assistant] Ok, so you might have said this, and I might not have I'd have recorded it. Did you ever actually work in that water supply project for a short time?

[User] No.

[Assistant] OK, that was the initial project. OK, so you always work on nutrition and health.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Ok, well, I lived in. Hetauda was the main town and I walked probably forty five minutes to a village where I lived with the family and I lived upstairs and they all lived downstairs. And the ama, the mother did cook upstairs. So but anyway, I had a separate room above the tea shop. They had a tea shop down below and one room where the family lived. And I lived upstairs and it was all kind of a road just going through the town. And there were houses on each side and one school at the end of the block. And so I that's where I lived there. And then in the village I lived in the health post and in. As a health post was on one side and I stayed on the other side in a room there, and so I kind of went back and forth between the two villages.

[Assistant] Ok, so you might have said this, and I might not have I'd have recorded it. Did you ever actually work in that water supply project for a short time?

[User] No.

[Assistant] OK, that was the initial project. OK, so you always work on nutrition and health.

[User] Yeah, OK. I might have gone through that part of the training, then I was able to switch over.

[Assistant] OK. Can you share with us anything about your living conditions? I mean, you've already mentioned a little bit that you lived above the house. We'll start with that one. So what was your room like?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No.

[Assistant] OK, that was the initial project. OK, so you always work on nutrition and health.

[User] Yeah, OK. I might have gone through that part of the training, then I was able to switch over.

[Assistant] OK. Can you share with us anything about your living conditions? I mean, you've already mentioned a little bit that you lived above the house. We'll start with that one. So what was your room like?

[User] Well, it's just one room and I get locked out of the window down the road to see everybody coming in and out. And they had different houses on each side. And when I say houses, they were mostly wooden buildings. And then the other village was much more, they were Japong, they wore loincloths. They were the poverty there was even more. And they grew millet there and their houses were just small with thatched roofs. A lot of them were wooden with that roofs.

[Assistant] What did you use for the bathroom or outhouse or whatever?