[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And it was run by the Jesuits.

[Assistant] It should have been a good school.

[User] And it was a very, very good school. The children that were there were Ethiopian children, of course, from I guess some families that could afford to send their children there. Not only did it have, um, a business department, but there was a home economics department as well as your regular English, history, math, and science. So those children were getting a pretty good, I guess American or English background.

[Assistant] Those traditional studies as well.

[User] Right, right.

[Assistant] Had there been Peace Corps in that school before? Did you replace somebody or were you the first?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And it was a very, very good school. The children that were there were Ethiopian children, of course, from I guess some families that could afford to send their children there. Not only did it have, um, a business department, but there was a home economics department as well as your regular English, history, math, and science. So those children were getting a pretty good, I guess American or English background.

[Assistant] Those traditional studies as well.

[User] Right, right.

[Assistant] Had there been Peace Corps in that school before? Did you replace somebody or were you the first?

[User] We may have been the first. I don't, I don't know if there were other ones or not.

[Assistant] Doesn't matter, I just.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Right, right.

[Assistant] Had there been Peace Corps in that school before? Did you replace somebody or were you the first?

[User] We may have been the first. I don't, I don't know if there were other ones or not.

[Assistant] Doesn't matter, I just.

[User] Maybe there were.

[Assistant] Sometimes it's fun to be the ground breaker and sometimes it's fun to follow.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] We may have been the first. I don't, I don't know if there were other ones or not.

[Assistant] Doesn't matter, I just.

[User] Maybe there were.

[Assistant] Sometimes it's fun to be the ground breaker and sometimes it's fun to follow.

[User] Maybe there were. I don't remember. But then. But then maybe there were because there were some white volunteers in that school that I'm remembering. Maybe one or two.

[Assistant] Well, they could have been.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Maybe there were.

[Assistant] Sometimes it's fun to be the ground breaker and sometimes it's fun to follow.

[User] Maybe there were. I don't remember. But then. But then maybe there were because there were some white volunteers in that school that I'm remembering. Maybe one or two.

[Assistant] Well, they could have been.

[User] And I have to, I've got to go look at my pictures.

[Assistant] There may have been English or Canadian volunteers too.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Maybe there were. I don't remember. But then. But then maybe there were because there were some white volunteers in that school that I'm remembering. Maybe one or two.

[Assistant] Well, they could have been.

[User] And I have to, I've got to go look at my pictures.

[Assistant] There may have been English or Canadian volunteers too.

[User] And we did meet English volunteers. One young lady who came, I think, the second year that we were there. She even stayed with us for a while.

[Assistant] This is a coed school?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And I have to, I've got to go look at my pictures.

[Assistant] There may have been English or Canadian volunteers too.

[User] And we did meet English volunteers. One young lady who came, I think, the second year that we were there. She even stayed with us for a while.

[Assistant] This is a coed school?

[User] Yes, it was.

[Assistant] So there were other women on the staff at the time.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And we did meet English volunteers. One young lady who came, I think, the second year that we were there. She even stayed with us for a while.

[Assistant] This is a coed school?

[User] Yes, it was.

[Assistant] So there were other women on the staff at the time.

[User] No, there were no women staff. Oh, no, no, no. They were all men staff. We were, um, we were the women. The others were men. But the children, there were girls and boys.

[Assistant] Is it high school standard or junior high school?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, it was.

[Assistant] So there were other women on the staff at the time.

[User] No, there were no women staff. Oh, no, no, no. They were all men staff. We were, um, we were the women. The others were men. But the children, there were girls and boys.

[Assistant] Is it high school standard or junior high school?

[User] They were ninth through 12th graders. Now, the difficulties in teaching there was that the children were not English speaking. So they're, I guess at their elementary level, they learned some basic English, enough so that whatever we were teaching them, they did understand to some extent, but we were told certain words to use, certain ways to present the material. And since this was a vocational, quote, type of a situation, the teaching didn't really involve that much talking, because if you're teaching them how to type then, you know, you can say certain words enough of the language to talk, to show them what to do, how to sit, and then you do the alphabet with them and then teach them, you know, the skills.

[Assistant] They were actually just copying stuff, it didn't matter if they could read it.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, there were no women staff. Oh, no, no, no. They were all men staff. We were, um, we were the women. The others were men. But the children, there were girls and boys.

[Assistant] Is it high school standard or junior high school?

[User] They were ninth through 12th graders. Now, the difficulties in teaching there was that the children were not English speaking. So they're, I guess at their elementary level, they learned some basic English, enough so that whatever we were teaching them, they did understand to some extent, but we were told certain words to use, certain ways to present the material. And since this was a vocational, quote, type of a situation, the teaching didn't really involve that much talking, because if you're teaching them how to type then, you know, you can say certain words enough of the language to talk, to show them what to do, how to sit, and then you do the alphabet with them and then teach them, you know, the skills.

[Assistant] They were actually just copying stuff, it didn't matter if they could read it.

[User] Exactly, right. And then as they became more proficient in this, because I think they had about four years where they had the typing. And I'm thinking we taught that shorthand, but I don't really think they did that much with it. It was mainly the typing, the accounting, filing. I remember we did a lot with the filing. And maybe some introduction to business. Those basic courses is what we taught.

[Assistant] Filing in the English alphabet?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] They were ninth through 12th graders. Now, the difficulties in teaching there was that the children were not English speaking. So they're, I guess at their elementary level, they learned some basic English, enough so that whatever we were teaching them, they did understand to some extent, but we were told certain words to use, certain ways to present the material. And since this was a vocational, quote, type of a situation, the teaching didn't really involve that much talking, because if you're teaching them how to type then, you know, you can say certain words enough of the language to talk, to show them what to do, how to sit, and then you do the alphabet with them and then teach them, you know, the skills.

[Assistant] They were actually just copying stuff, it didn't matter if they could read it.

[User] Exactly, right. And then as they became more proficient in this, because I think they had about four years where they had the typing. And I'm thinking we taught that shorthand, but I don't really think they did that much with it. It was mainly the typing, the accounting, filing. I remember we did a lot with the filing. And maybe some introduction to business. Those basic courses is what we taught.

[Assistant] Filing in the English alphabet?

[User] Yes. Filing with the English alphabet. But anyway, we were able to manage with, you know, manage the instruction, no part of that. And, of course, learning enough of the language so that we could proceed with what we had to, what we had to do at that time.

[Assistant] Was anybody teaching English as a second language in that school?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Exactly, right. And then as they became more proficient in this, because I think they had about four years where they had the typing. And I'm thinking we taught that shorthand, but I don't really think they did that much with it. It was mainly the typing, the accounting, filing. I remember we did a lot with the filing. And maybe some introduction to business. Those basic courses is what we taught.

[Assistant] Filing in the English alphabet?

[User] Yes. Filing with the English alphabet. But anyway, we were able to manage with, you know, manage the instruction, no part of that. And, of course, learning enough of the language so that we could proceed with what we had to, what we had to do at that time.

[Assistant] Was anybody teaching English as a second language in that school?

[User] Yes, yes. And, of course, the Jesuits had extensive training in both languages so that they were there to, I guess, give us as much help as necessary with that part of our work.

[Assistant] Did you find that arrangement an easy one, working with Jesuit administrators and other Jesuits?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes. Filing with the English alphabet. But anyway, we were able to manage with, you know, manage the instruction, no part of that. And, of course, learning enough of the language so that we could proceed with what we had to, what we had to do at that time.

[Assistant] Was anybody teaching English as a second language in that school?

[User] Yes, yes. And, of course, the Jesuits had extensive training in both languages so that they were there to, I guess, give us as much help as necessary with that part of our work.

[Assistant] Did you find that arrangement an easy one, working with Jesuit administrators and other Jesuits?

[User] Mm hmm. I didn't have a problem with that. It was not difficult for me.

[Assistant] You had ample resources? And obviously you had typewriters.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, yes. And, of course, the Jesuits had extensive training in both languages so that they were there to, I guess, give us as much help as necessary with that part of our work.

[Assistant] Did you find that arrangement an easy one, working with Jesuit administrators and other Jesuits?

[User] Mm hmm. I didn't have a problem with that. It was not difficult for me.

[Assistant] You had ample resources? And obviously you had typewriters.

[User] Yeah, we had typewriters at that time. There were books. It was, you know, whatever else they need, the paper and so forth. Not like here in the United States, of course, but you know, they had sufficient, they had sufficient supplies. Now where they got these things from, I haven't a clue, you know? But because they were French Canadian Jesuits, I'm quite sure that they were able, they had connections and they could get things, you know. And they lived on the compound, the campus. So it was a nice campus, you know, they had home economics department building here, the business building here, the Jesuits had their house here, you know. And if you wanted a picnic, well, there was enough grounds around that sometimes they would have picnics right there on the grounds.

[Assistant] Obviously related to their religious services, did one have to be Catholic to go to the school?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Mm hmm. I didn't have a problem with that. It was not difficult for me.

[Assistant] You had ample resources? And obviously you had typewriters.

[User] Yeah, we had typewriters at that time. There were books. It was, you know, whatever else they need, the paper and so forth. Not like here in the United States, of course, but you know, they had sufficient, they had sufficient supplies. Now where they got these things from, I haven't a clue, you know? But because they were French Canadian Jesuits, I'm quite sure that they were able, they had connections and they could get things, you know. And they lived on the compound, the campus. So it was a nice campus, you know, they had home economics department building here, the business building here, the Jesuits had their house here, you know. And if you wanted a picnic, well, there was enough grounds around that sometimes they would have picnics right there on the grounds.

[Assistant] Obviously related to their religious services, did one have to be Catholic to go to the school?

[User] Oh no, no. They never forced us to attend any religious services, in fact.

[Assistant] Nor the students?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, we had typewriters at that time. There were books. It was, you know, whatever else they need, the paper and so forth. Not like here in the United States, of course, but you know, they had sufficient, they had sufficient supplies. Now where they got these things from, I haven't a clue, you know? But because they were French Canadian Jesuits, I'm quite sure that they were able, they had connections and they could get things, you know. And they lived on the compound, the campus. So it was a nice campus, you know, they had home economics department building here, the business building here, the Jesuits had their house here, you know. And if you wanted a picnic, well, there was enough grounds around that sometimes they would have picnics right there on the grounds.

[Assistant] Obviously related to their religious services, did one have to be Catholic to go to the school?

[User] Oh no, no. They never forced us to attend any religious services, in fact.

[Assistant] Nor the students?

[User] No, I don't think they forced them either. That wasn't part of it. Now as to whether those students stayed on the campus there, I think some of them did. But most of them would go home in the evenings to their family.

[Assistant] Cause you're in the city.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh no, no. They never forced us to attend any religious services, in fact.

[Assistant] Nor the students?

[User] No, I don't think they forced them either. That wasn't part of it. Now as to whether those students stayed on the campus there, I think some of them did. But most of them would go home in the evenings to their family.

[Assistant] Cause you're in the city.

[User] Right. To their families, whether the actual parents were within the city, or they had some relatives that they would live with. So they came to school each day.

[Assistant] Mm hmm. So you said you would walk, you walked.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, I don't think they forced them either. That wasn't part of it. Now as to whether those students stayed on the campus there, I think some of them did. But most of them would go home in the evenings to their family.

[Assistant] Cause you're in the city.

[User] Right. To their families, whether the actual parents were within the city, or they had some relatives that they would live with. So they came to school each day.

[Assistant] Mm hmm. So you said you would walk, you walked.

[User] Yeah, we would walk. We would walk to school.

[Assistant] So what was the time of your day, your schedule?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Right. To their families, whether the actual parents were within the city, or they had some relatives that they would live with. So they came to school each day.

[Assistant] Mm hmm. So you said you would walk, you walked.

[User] Yeah, we would walk. We would walk to school.

[Assistant] So what was the time of your day, your schedule?

[User] Well, it started approximately around 7:30, 8:00 and we stayed there to maybe 2:30, 3:00.

[Assistant] Five days a week? Six and a half?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, we would walk. We would walk to school.

[Assistant] So what was the time of your day, your schedule?

[User] Well, it started approximately around 7:30, 8:00 and we stayed there to maybe 2:30, 3:00.

[Assistant] Five days a week? Six and a half?

[User] Five days a week.

[Assistant] Five days. Wow. Did you have any non-teaching responsibilities? Did you volunteer to do anything or? OK, it doesn't matter. Doesn't matter.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, it started approximately around 7:30, 8:00 and we stayed there to maybe 2:30, 3:00.

[Assistant] Five days a week? Six and a half?

[User] Five days a week.

[Assistant] Five days. Wow. Did you have any non-teaching responsibilities? Did you volunteer to do anything or? OK, it doesn't matter. Doesn't matter.

[User] I don't remember any volunteering.

[Assistant] It was a while ago, my dear, you're entitled to forget.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I do remember, though, um. Since they had these different departments, we were asked to teach, let's say, the girls who were in the home economics, asked to teach them how to do the filing and how to do the typing. If they felt that those would be good qualities for the girls to have.

[Assistant] Sure.

[User] And I don't remember the names of any of the girls at this point, but I remember there were several of them that graduated and they got jobs using those skills.

[Assistant] Oh, OK.

[User] Perhaps in some governmental office or what have you. Most of those girls did marry very early. We got an education just from talking to the girls. Their English was pretty good, you know, they would. In fact, we had, um, we invited a group of the girls over to our house and had a little party for them there. They would tell us some cultural things there that they thought we needed to know.

[Assistant] Any of them invite you to their homes?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And I don't remember the names of any of the girls at this point, but I remember there were several of them that graduated and they got jobs using those skills.

[Assistant] Oh, OK.

[User] Perhaps in some governmental office or what have you. Most of those girls did marry very early. We got an education just from talking to the girls. Their English was pretty good, you know, they would. In fact, we had, um, we invited a group of the girls over to our house and had a little party for them there. They would tell us some cultural things there that they thought we needed to know.

[Assistant] Any of them invite you to their homes?

[User] Uh. Actually, no.

[Assistant] How about your neighbors, did they invite you into their homes?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Perhaps in some governmental office or what have you. Most of those girls did marry very early. We got an education just from talking to the girls. Their English was pretty good, you know, they would. In fact, we had, um, we invited a group of the girls over to our house and had a little party for them there. They would tell us some cultural things there that they thought we needed to know.

[Assistant] Any of them invite you to their homes?

[User] Uh. Actually, no.

[Assistant] How about your neighbors, did they invite you into their homes?

[User] Not the Ethiopians. There was, uh, there was white immigrant that moved next to us in their compound. We were invited over there several times, but I think they were only there for a year.

[Assistant] So did you feel the Ethiopians were a little bit aloof, that they were just not? Or maybe these were sophisticated Ethiopians who didn't?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Uh. Actually, no.

[Assistant] How about your neighbors, did they invite you into their homes?

[User] Not the Ethiopians. There was, uh, there was white immigrant that moved next to us in their compound. We were invited over there several times, but I think they were only there for a year.

[Assistant] So did you feel the Ethiopians were a little bit aloof, that they were just not? Or maybe these were sophisticated Ethiopians who didn't?

[User] OK, the sophisticated Ethiopians, the ones we met through, who of these guys were that were in training, because they would always find out where we were and come by, you know. Because there, even though it was a large city, all they need to do is ask, oh, there's some volunteers, do you know so-and-so? And people would say, oh yeah, they're living over such-and-such, you know? So we kept in contact with the ones that returned to Ethiopia, and they were the ones that would come by and invite us to their homes.

[Assistant] Oh, that's neat.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] OK, the sophisticated Ethiopians, the ones we met through, who of these guys were that were in training, because they would always find out where we were and come by, you know. Because there, even though it was a large city, all they need to do is ask, oh, there's some volunteers, do you know so-and-so? And people would say, oh yeah, they're living over such-and-such, you know? So we kept in contact with the ones that returned to Ethiopia, and they were the ones that would come by and invite us to their homes.

[Assistant] Oh, that's neat.

[User] And also take us to the different Ethiopian restaurants that were there and introduce us to the food.

[Assistant] Good.

[User] And if the holidays would come, they would come by and pick us up and say, oh, well, you know, we're having a particular holiday and they're going to do this, you know, I'll come and pick you up. They had cars and they would take us to where all of the activities were in front of the.

[Assistant] I was so worried that you were just sitting in your house.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh, no, no. That house thing, we were not sitting.

[Assistant] Excellent.

[User] Believe me, no.

[Assistant] Good.

[User] No, we had a lot of activities. Now, also just before my roommate and I left the hotel. Um.

[Assistant] You mean before?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Wines. Toilet paper.

[Assistant] Oh, yeah.

[User] Those kind of things. OK. Um, in the Italian stores. And so there was a lot of mixture of cultures, the Italian culture, the Ethiopian cultures, and we found we made friends with people from other countries. Indians from India. Armenians. Uh, those people from Beirut. There was the Israelis. So we had all kinds of friends at that time, you know, and they would invite us to their homes. This, what is it, this baklava? That's, I was introduced to baklava there.

[Assistant] Baklava, the sweet stuff?

[User] Right. I was introduced to that over there. Those people would invite us over. Mary and Cindy. They called me Cindy there. Come over. We're having this. And so we would, you know, get ourselves together, find out how to get there, get in a cab, and we would go. And it was lovely. We had a very, very good time while we were here.

[Assistant] Did you feel secure? You were in a big city. Was that a nice, safe place to be at that time?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Those kind of things. OK. Um, in the Italian stores. And so there was a lot of mixture of cultures, the Italian culture, the Ethiopian cultures, and we found we made friends with people from other countries. Indians from India. Armenians. Uh, those people from Beirut. There was the Israelis. So we had all kinds of friends at that time, you know, and they would invite us to their homes. This, what is it, this baklava? That's, I was introduced to baklava there.

[Assistant] Baklava, the sweet stuff?

[User] Right. I was introduced to that over there. Those people would invite us over. Mary and Cindy. They called me Cindy there. Come over. We're having this. And so we would, you know, get ourselves together, find out how to get there, get in a cab, and we would go. And it was lovely. We had a very, very good time while we were here.

[Assistant] Did you feel secure? You were in a big city. Was that a nice, safe place to be at that time?

[User] At that time, yes, it was. Yeah. And we had the guard who took care of the home.

[Assistant] At the house?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Right. I was introduced to that over there. Those people would invite us over. Mary and Cindy. They called me Cindy there. Come over. We're having this. And so we would, you know, get ourselves together, find out how to get there, get in a cab, and we would go. And it was lovely. We had a very, very good time while we were here.

[Assistant] Did you feel secure? You were in a big city. Was that a nice, safe place to be at that time?

[User] At that time, yes, it was. Yeah. And we had the guard who took care of the home.

[Assistant] At the house?

[User] At the house.

[Assistant] But it you were out in the taxi, you didn't feel uncomfortable? Could you walk around?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] At the house.

[Assistant] But it you were out in the taxi, you didn't feel uncomfortable? Could you walk around?

[User] Oh yeah, we walked around.

[Assistant] At night?

[User] Yeah, but not so much at night alone though. Women. You know, we'd tend to do things together, but we never felt as if we were insecure or afraid to go wherever we wanted to go. There was not that going on at that time, you know, you would hear people talking about the possibility of overthrowing Haile Selassie. But it wasn't a major concern.

[Assistant] Did you visit any of your former training friends out at their sites?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh yeah, we walked around.

[Assistant] At night?

[User] Yeah, but not so much at night alone though. Women. You know, we'd tend to do things together, but we never felt as if we were insecure or afraid to go wherever we wanted to go. There was not that going on at that time, you know, you would hear people talking about the possibility of overthrowing Haile Selassie. But it wasn't a major concern.

[Assistant] Did you visit any of your former training friends out at their sites?

[User] Yes, we did.

[Assistant] And how was that experience?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] That experience was an experience. I remember we took. We took a bus because we, Mary and I, were trying to decide how we were going to get to, uh, where was this place? Dire Dawa. So I think we took the bus, I know we took a train at some point. But we took a bus and that was the first time going outside of the city. And so you see a completely different type of environment.

[Assistant] Sure. Wow.

[User] And there we were on this bus. And I didn't know that Mary had a problem with heights, but Ethiopia is 8,000 miles [feet] or more above sea level.

[Assistant] Feet.

[User] So here we are on this bus and we're going down. And when you get outside, you see the mountains and you see the hills and the valleys, and it was just beautiful. And then way in the distance, you would see what they called tukuls, which is their huts, a group of them, or maybe just one with children around. But when we were up on the roads were like this and right here is a drop off. She had a fit.

[Assistant] Was she on the outside?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] So here we are on this bus and we're going down. And when you get outside, you see the mountains and you see the hills and the valleys, and it was just beautiful. And then way in the distance, you would see what they called tukuls, which is their huts, a group of them, or maybe just one with children around. But when we were up on the roads were like this and right here is a drop off. She had a fit.

[Assistant] Was she on the outside?

[User] Well, it didn't matter where she was on the outside or the inside. She could not look down. Well, I enjoyed it because that was my first time of being in a situation where you could look for miles. And if the clouds were up, it would have a shadow over there, but not where you were.

[Assistant] Beautiful, yeah.

[User] You know, and I would just look at this and I said, oh god, look at the scenery and the trees, and you know. That was that again was awakening, a sensual awakening for me, to be able to see the environment, you know, and notice the differences in the land and those kinds of things. But we took this bus and we were going up and around and around and getting up, and then, of course, the bus, you know, there with the, um, what do you call it?

[Assistant] We have to shift gears?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, it didn't matter where she was on the outside or the inside. She could not look down. Well, I enjoyed it because that was my first time of being in a situation where you could look for miles. And if the clouds were up, it would have a shadow over there, but not where you were.

[Assistant] Beautiful, yeah.

[User] You know, and I would just look at this and I said, oh god, look at the scenery and the trees, and you know. That was that again was awakening, a sensual awakening for me, to be able to see the environment, you know, and notice the differences in the land and those kinds of things. But we took this bus and we were going up and around and around and getting up, and then, of course, the bus, you know, there with the, um, what do you call it?

[Assistant] We have to shift gears?

[User] Oh yeah, oh yeah. And every time the bus would stop and shift the gear, rrrrr, you know, we wondered, is it going to make it to the top or what? So then get to the top and then you got to shift gears again and go around this hill and then you start going down and then you start going up again. So anyway, we did that. And then finally, we got to the place to visit our friends. And we stayed there, I guess, just for the weekend to visit them. And it was nice. They didn't have the comforts that we had, but it wasn't really that bad. Um. It wasn't that bad.

[Assistant] Not that bad.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] You know, and I would just look at this and I said, oh god, look at the scenery and the trees, and you know. That was that again was awakening, a sensual awakening for me, to be able to see the environment, you know, and notice the differences in the land and those kinds of things. But we took this bus and we were going up and around and around and getting up, and then, of course, the bus, you know, there with the, um, what do you call it?

[Assistant] We have to shift gears?

[User] Oh yeah, oh yeah. And every time the bus would stop and shift the gear, rrrrr, you know, we wondered, is it going to make it to the top or what? So then get to the top and then you got to shift gears again and go around this hill and then you start going down and then you start going up again. So anyway, we did that. And then finally, we got to the place to visit our friends. And we stayed there, I guess, just for the weekend to visit them. And it was nice. They didn't have the comforts that we had, but it wasn't really that bad. Um. It wasn't that bad.

[Assistant] Not that bad.

[User] No, it wasn't really that bad. I found it, you know, their home was comfortable and I just enjoyed being with them. Yeah. But now the thing is, because Mary and I were in the city, whenever there was a vacation it meant that whoever was coming in. You know, if the Peace Corps said, OK, you're on vacation and all of the volunteers have to meet in the city, invariably our house was full.

[Assistant] There was no Peace Corps rest house there?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh yeah, oh yeah. And every time the bus would stop and shift the gear, rrrrr, you know, we wondered, is it going to make it to the top or what? So then get to the top and then you got to shift gears again and go around this hill and then you start going down and then you start going up again. So anyway, we did that. And then finally, we got to the place to visit our friends. And we stayed there, I guess, just for the weekend to visit them. And it was nice. They didn't have the comforts that we had, but it wasn't really that bad. Um. It wasn't that bad.

[Assistant] Not that bad.

[User] No, it wasn't really that bad. I found it, you know, their home was comfortable and I just enjoyed being with them. Yeah. But now the thing is, because Mary and I were in the city, whenever there was a vacation it meant that whoever was coming in. You know, if the Peace Corps said, OK, you're on vacation and all of the volunteers have to meet in the city, invariably our house was full.

[Assistant] There was no Peace Corps rest house there?

[User] No. They either had to stay at the hotels or.

[Assistant] So you were it.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, it wasn't really that bad. I found it, you know, their home was comfortable and I just enjoyed being with them. Yeah. But now the thing is, because Mary and I were in the city, whenever there was a vacation it meant that whoever was coming in. You know, if the Peace Corps said, OK, you're on vacation and all of the volunteers have to meet in the city, invariably our house was full.

[Assistant] There was no Peace Corps rest house there?

[User] No. They either had to stay at the hotels or.

[Assistant] So you were it.

[User] We and whoever else. They were other volunteers that were in the city also.

[Assistant] Did you have much contact with the other volunteers?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No. They either had to stay at the hotels or.

[Assistant] So you were it.

[User] We and whoever else. They were other volunteers that were in the city also.

[Assistant] Did you have much contact with the other volunteers?

[User] Yes, we did. Yes, we did.

[Assistant] So you did communicate? You'd say, hey, I've got 15 people at my house. Who can you take?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] We and whoever else. They were other volunteers that were in the city also.

[Assistant] Did you have much contact with the other volunteers?

[User] Yes, we did. Yes, we did.

[Assistant] So you did communicate? You'd say, hey, I've got 15 people at my house. Who can you take?

[User] Yeah, you know. And of course, some of them, you know, we had a phone.

[Assistant] Oh! Oh my goodness, let me write that down.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, you know. And of course, some of them, you know, we had a phone.

[Assistant] Oh! Oh my goodness, let me write that down.

[User] So, you know, when they would get to, they would take their busses to the city. They get to the city. They would call. You know, Mary, Cindy, you got room for me? Come on over.

[Assistant] Good.

[User] You know, on the couch, on the floor, whatever. And then at that time, we would have our little parties and get togethers and what have you. So we'd catch up here.

[Assistant] Well, that's good.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] So, you know, when they would get to, they would take their busses to the city. They get to the city. They would call. You know, Mary, Cindy, you got room for me? Come on over.

[Assistant] Good.

[User] You know, on the couch, on the floor, whatever. And then at that time, we would have our little parties and get togethers and what have you. So we'd catch up here.

[Assistant] Well, that's good.

[User] So some of them stayed at our house and some of them stayed at, you know, other volunteers. [tape break] Now, this is my roommate.

[Assistant] Oh, yeah. OK. Are you still in touch with her?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] You know, on the couch, on the floor, whatever. And then at that time, we would have our little parties and get togethers and what have you. So we'd catch up here.

[Assistant] Well, that's good.

[User] So some of them stayed at our house and some of them stayed at, you know, other volunteers. [tape break] Now, this is my roommate.

[Assistant] Oh, yeah. OK. Are you still in touch with her?

[User] Yes, I am. She lives in Cleveland, Ohio.

[Assistant] OK, let's start with that. So you are in touch with your old roommate, Mary?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, I am. She lives in Cleveland, Ohio.

[Assistant] OK, let's start with that. So you are in touch with your old roommate, Mary?

[User] Yes. Yeah. We lost contact for a while. She stayed an extra year. She wanted to do three years in the Peace Corps and, um, I came home. And then. Well, I don't if I should even put this on the tape.

[Assistant] Well, don't.

[User] But anyway, I came home and, you know, I started working and what have you and few other adventure things there. And so I lost her address and her phone number. And then in the meantime, then she comes home. She goes to Cleveland and she starts doing a lot of traveling around, and she came to Buffalo, but she had my parents' home phone number. And I used to talk about Mary and my other friends there. And so anyway, Mary called and see, by that time, I had moved here, OK? So Mary called my mom and she was saying, well, I'm Mary, and I'm looking for Cynthia. So then we got in contact again after about five or six years.

[Assistant] OK, let me let me go back to Ethiopia before you're ready to leave. The longer you were at the school there, any change in your attitude about it? Did it get a lot easier? Were you bored, were you still interested?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] So for one of those Christmases, we were able to go to Jerusalem.

[Assistant] Wow.

[User]
And I'm trying to think, how did that happen? I think it was with the Jesuits. They had a tour of Jerusalem, and so we got to see Bethlehem and all of those tourist spots around there. They were having some political problems because I remember we were on the tour bus and the driver had a guard and they kept the gun with them at that time. And we were only allowed to stop at certain points. They would take us to where they wanted us to go. And then, you know, we would get out of the bus and go into various cathedrals and churches and then get back on the bus. I found that very interesting because there were so many places where they would say, oh, this is where Jesus was born or this is where Jesus died. And I'm thinking, well, how could that be so many? He's only one person. There were just hundreds of them. This is where, this is where. All right.

But we got to see a lot of those churches and those cathedrals. And the Dome of the Rock, every single time I see it on TV, I think, oh, I was there. Took my shoes off and we walked inside there. Chills up your spine, you know? And all the time I was there, I was thinking this was a Christian, um, church, and now I realize it isn't. It was Muslim.

[Assistant] It's a mosque.

[User] Yeah. But we got a chance to see the Jordan River and, you know, just a lot of things.

[Assistant] So you weren't restricted, you didn't feel confined there?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User]
And I'm trying to think, how did that happen? I think it was with the Jesuits. They had a tour of Jerusalem, and so we got to see Bethlehem and all of those tourist spots around there. They were having some political problems because I remember we were on the tour bus and the driver had a guard and they kept the gun with them at that time. And we were only allowed to stop at certain points. They would take us to where they wanted us to go. And then, you know, we would get out of the bus and go into various cathedrals and churches and then get back on the bus. I found that very interesting because there were so many places where they would say, oh, this is where Jesus was born or this is where Jesus died. And I'm thinking, well, how could that be so many? He's only one person. There were just hundreds of them. This is where, this is where. All right.

But we got to see a lot of those churches and those cathedrals. And the Dome of the Rock, every single time I see it on TV, I think, oh, I was there. Took my shoes off and we walked inside there. Chills up your spine, you know? And all the time I was there, I was thinking this was a Christian, um, church, and now I realize it isn't. It was Muslim.

[Assistant] It's a mosque.

[User] Yeah. But we got a chance to see the Jordan River and, you know, just a lot of things.

[Assistant] So you weren't restricted, you didn't feel confined there?

[User] Oh no.

[Assistant] But so one question that I neglected to ask you early on. When you first came to Ethiopia, did you feel this notorious culture shock? Did you feel?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah. But we got a chance to see the Jordan River and, you know, just a lot of things.

[Assistant] So you weren't restricted, you didn't feel confined there?

[User] Oh no.

[Assistant] But so one question that I neglected to ask you early on. When you first came to Ethiopia, did you feel this notorious culture shock? Did you feel?

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] And your response to it was?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh no.

[Assistant] But so one question that I neglected to ask you early on. When you first came to Ethiopia, did you feel this notorious culture shock? Did you feel?

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] And your response to it was?

[User] My response was I'm ready to go home.

[Assistant] Oh really? Were you close?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] And your response to it was?

[User] My response was I'm ready to go home.

[Assistant] Oh really? Were you close?

[User] Initially, my response was.

[Assistant] Close to going home?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] My response was I'm ready to go home.

[Assistant] Oh really? Were you close?

[User] Initially, my response was.

[Assistant] Close to going home?

[User] I'm ready to go home. But then here I made the commitment. It took me about six months to really get used to things and to feel comfortable with the life there, because there were so many things that you couldn't do. You know, like I mentioned about the toilet paper and eating the ice cream and boiling the water and, uh, you know. But then as you became more comfortable with your surroundings, you realized that we were in a better situation than those who were out in the boondocks. Because we did have, you know, a toilet inside, and even though the water was from up there and coming down and whatever. And even outside of the house, there was a huge water reservoir there just for our house. But my initial thing was, I didn't, I didn't want to stay there. It was a culture shock. And it's funny because when you're there, you don't want to be there. And then when you get used to being there and enjoying it, and then when you come home, you want to go back.

[Assistant] Yeah. So it took you think about six months before you felt comfortable and adjusted?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Initially, my response was.

[Assistant] Close to going home?

[User] I'm ready to go home. But then here I made the commitment. It took me about six months to really get used to things and to feel comfortable with the life there, because there were so many things that you couldn't do. You know, like I mentioned about the toilet paper and eating the ice cream and boiling the water and, uh, you know. But then as you became more comfortable with your surroundings, you realized that we were in a better situation than those who were out in the boondocks. Because we did have, you know, a toilet inside, and even though the water was from up there and coming down and whatever. And even outside of the house, there was a huge water reservoir there just for our house. But my initial thing was, I didn't, I didn't want to stay there. It was a culture shock. And it's funny because when you're there, you don't want to be there. And then when you get used to being there and enjoying it, and then when you come home, you want to go back.

[Assistant] Yeah. So it took you think about six months before you felt comfortable and adjusted?

[User] Yes. It took me about six months.

[Assistant] So then so that means you had like another year and a half of service. When did you start thinking about the future? The month before you left? Two months, six months?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I'm ready to go home. But then here I made the commitment. It took me about six months to really get used to things and to feel comfortable with the life there, because there were so many things that you couldn't do. You know, like I mentioned about the toilet paper and eating the ice cream and boiling the water and, uh, you know. But then as you became more comfortable with your surroundings, you realized that we were in a better situation than those who were out in the boondocks. Because we did have, you know, a toilet inside, and even though the water was from up there and coming down and whatever. And even outside of the house, there was a huge water reservoir there just for our house. But my initial thing was, I didn't, I didn't want to stay there. It was a culture shock. And it's funny because when you're there, you don't want to be there. And then when you get used to being there and enjoying it, and then when you come home, you want to go back.

[Assistant] Yeah. So it took you think about six months before you felt comfortable and adjusted?

[User] Yes. It took me about six months.

[Assistant] So then so that means you had like another year and a half of service. When did you start thinking about the future? The month before you left? Two months, six months?

[User] It may have been about three or four months.

[Assistant] Three or four months. What were you thinking about doing in the future? You decided not to extend.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes. It took me about six months.

[Assistant] So then so that means you had like another year and a half of service. When did you start thinking about the future? The month before you left? Two months, six months?

[User] It may have been about three or four months.

[Assistant] Three or four months. What were you thinking about doing in the future? You decided not to extend.

[User] No, I didn't want to extend. I was really ready to go home. I wanted to see my family. And then I was thinking in terms of working here in the city of Buffalo and, you know, just getting on with my life.

[Assistant] Do you remember the close of service debriefing, I think they would call it?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, I didn't want to extend. I was really ready to go home. I wanted to see my family. And then I was thinking in terms of working here in the city of Buffalo and, you know, just getting on with my life.

[Assistant] Do you remember the close of service debriefing, I think they would call it?

[User] Yeah. Not too clearly. I do remember they gave us a certificate.

[Assistant] Oh, yeah.

[User] But it wasn't. The Americans that gave us the certificate, I think the Ethiopians, because, you know, this was a joint effort. Those gentlemen, we had a meeting or we were all together, all of us volunteers. They called our names and then we went up and they presented us with the certificate of completion. Probably some of Halie Selassie's dignitaries.

[Assistant] Oh, that's fun.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah. Not too clearly. I do remember they gave us a certificate.

[Assistant] Oh, yeah.

[User] But it wasn't. The Americans that gave us the certificate, I think the Ethiopians, because, you know, this was a joint effort. Those gentlemen, we had a meeting or we were all together, all of us volunteers. They called our names and then we went up and they presented us with the certificate of completion. Probably some of Halie Selassie's dignitaries.

[Assistant] Oh, that's fun.

[User] I remember that.

[Assistant] So you have an official certificate that you'd actually served and what you had done?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] But it wasn't. The Americans that gave us the certificate, I think the Ethiopians, because, you know, this was a joint effort. Those gentlemen, we had a meeting or we were all together, all of us volunteers. They called our names and then we went up and they presented us with the certificate of completion. Probably some of Halie Selassie's dignitaries.

[Assistant] Oh, that's fun.

[User] I remember that.

[Assistant] So you have an official certificate that you'd actually served and what you had done?

[User] Right. And we did get a debriefing, but there again, I don't really remember what they said or what they would talk to us about, or anything of that nature. But I know, I know we did have some meetings.

[Assistant] Do you know at this at the final meeting, were all of the volunteers from your training group there or just some? Like was it done geographically, just those around Addis?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I remember that.

[Assistant] So you have an official certificate that you'd actually served and what you had done?

[User] Right. And we did get a debriefing, but there again, I don't really remember what they said or what they would talk to us about, or anything of that nature. But I know, I know we did have some meetings.

[Assistant] Do you know at this at the final meeting, were all of the volunteers from your training group there or just some? Like was it done geographically, just those around Addis?

[User] Yes, it was. Right. Yeah.

[Assistant] So you never saw some of the trainees ever again after you left them at the airport?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Right. And we did get a debriefing, but there again, I don't really remember what they said or what they would talk to us about, or anything of that nature. But I know, I know we did have some meetings.

[Assistant] Do you know at this at the final meeting, were all of the volunteers from your training group there or just some? Like was it done geographically, just those around Addis?

[User] Yes, it was. Right. Yeah.

[Assistant] So you never saw some of the trainees ever again after you left them at the airport?

[User] That's right, yeah, yeah.

[Assistant] That was common then.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, it was. Right. Yeah.

[Assistant] So you never saw some of the trainees ever again after you left them at the airport?

[User] That's right, yeah, yeah.

[Assistant] That was common then.

[User] Yeah, unless they came into the city and we were, you know, friends and they called and said, we can come by your house. Some of them, I never saw them again.

[Assistant] You had no reunions. Your group?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, unless they came into the city and we were, you know, friends and they called and said, we can come by your house. Some of them, I never saw them again.

[Assistant] You had no reunions. Your group?

[User] Our group per se. Maybe they did. But it may have been a situation where I just didn't go. The one big reunion, the 25th anniversary reunion in Washington, D.C.

[Assistant] Oh, yes.

[User] I got together with Mary and two of us flew down, and then we got an opportunity to see all the volunteers.

[Assistant] I was there, I didn't meet you there.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I got together with Mary and two of us flew down, and then we got an opportunity to see all the volunteers.

[Assistant] I was there, I didn't meet you there.

[User] Well, you didn't know me. But I got a chance to see a lot of the volunteers from our group.

[Assistant] That's great.

[User] But I haven't been to any of the reunions since then, and maybe I should qualify that. Buffalo, when I came home, they had a returned volunteer group, and I participated in that for a while. But it seemed like after a couple of years, you know, there was no literature being dispersed. And then we were going on with our lives and then after a while, things kind of, you know, disintegrated. And then I would get maybe every once in a while some literature from the National Peace Corps organization, and they wanted to know what group or affiliation I was with. And since there was nothing in the city of Buffalo, then sometimes I would check off Rochester or I would check off the one in Ohio. So there were a couple of times that I would go to visit my girlfriend, Mary, and her group was so active. They're still active. So I would go to their meetings. And I just kind of put my name on their list to see the different things that they were doing, and they have a large active group of returned volunteers.

[Assistant] Is there a Friends of Ethiopia group? A country group?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, you didn't know me. But I got a chance to see a lot of the volunteers from our group.

[Assistant] That's great.

[User] But I haven't been to any of the reunions since then, and maybe I should qualify that. Buffalo, when I came home, they had a returned volunteer group, and I participated in that for a while. But it seemed like after a couple of years, you know, there was no literature being dispersed. And then we were going on with our lives and then after a while, things kind of, you know, disintegrated. And then I would get maybe every once in a while some literature from the National Peace Corps organization, and they wanted to know what group or affiliation I was with. And since there was nothing in the city of Buffalo, then sometimes I would check off Rochester or I would check off the one in Ohio. So there were a couple of times that I would go to visit my girlfriend, Mary, and her group was so active. They're still active. So I would go to their meetings. And I just kind of put my name on their list to see the different things that they were doing, and they have a large active group of returned volunteers.

[Assistant] Is there a Friends of Ethiopia group? A country group?

[User] Um, there may have been. You mean here?

[Assistant] No, it would be a nationwide group in that case. You have either the geographical group like western New York or Buffalo. And also there's like the "friends of," like I'm in the Friends of Nigeria, and that covers the whole country. They may have gone by the wayside and they're not contacting you so obviously, you don't know. OK.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Um, there may have been. You mean here?

[Assistant] No, it would be a nationwide group in that case. You have either the geographical group like western New York or Buffalo. And also there's like the "friends of," like I'm in the Friends of Nigeria, and that covers the whole country. They may have gone by the wayside and they're not contacting you so obviously, you don't know. OK.

[User] Now also, while we were there in Ethiopia, not only did we get to travel to these places, but one summer, they said those of us who were in the city, you should have a complete experience. So I was placed in one of those outer lying areas. And um, there, it was just for a month. Whoever the volunteer. We exchanged. And here I was alone, actually. She lived there by herself too. In her house, I had to chop the wood, make my own firewood, which I didn't know how to do. So her lady who did the cooking, she came and showed me how to chop the wood and make a fire to cook food. But my main purpose of being there was, um, there was a hospital located nearby and they needed someone to work in the hospital in the records department. So since I had the business background, my project at that time was to go to their office and help them to organize their records. So I did that.

[Assistant] This will be on your school break project kind of thing?

[User] Yes. So I did that for one month. Now, um, of course, the records are in English as well as Amharic, the writing. But I worked with, um, some young people there, and I showed them what to do and how to alphabetize. So I had a group of young people around me to explain what to do. So we got it in, I think at that time, some semblance of order so they could find.

[Assistant] Very useful project.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, he did. And then certain things, they would not eat pork, for example. The food there, after you get used to their traditional food, which is the injera and the wat, I quite, I enjoyed it.

[Assistant] Describe.

[User] Now, the wat is a very spicy stew. You have doro wat, which is chicken. And they have a special way that they cut it up, by the way. They don't cut it up the way we do here in the United States, but they have certain ways that they cut the meat up. And actually, in preparation, what they do is they take the onions and they would fry the onions, and then they would put some of the butter in it, then the bere, which is the pepper, the red pepper.

[Assistant] OK.

[User] And then constantly, you know, kind of make a stew with that and add water. And they would boil eggs and put a whole egg in there. They would have several whole eggs in there. And then they keep, you know, boiling that and stirring it and what have you. And then when that's almost done, then they will put the pieces of chicken in. Now that's doro wat. They also have, um, the wat which can be the beef and also the wat which has, um, lamb in it as well. So there's about three or four different kinds. And that's the stew. Now the bread is similar to a pancake, that we know as pancakes, but if you look at it, it's a pancake that's only been cooked on one side, right?

[Assistant] Uh huh. OK.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Now, the wat is a very spicy stew. You have doro wat, which is chicken. And they have a special way that they cut it up, by the way. They don't cut it up the way we do here in the United States, but they have certain ways that they cut the meat up. And actually, in preparation, what they do is they take the onions and they would fry the onions, and then they would put some of the butter in it, then the bere, which is the pepper, the red pepper.

[Assistant] OK.

[User] And then constantly, you know, kind of make a stew with that and add water. And they would boil eggs and put a whole egg in there. They would have several whole eggs in there. And then they keep, you know, boiling that and stirring it and what have you. And then when that's almost done, then they will put the pieces of chicken in. Now that's doro wat. They also have, um, the wat which can be the beef and also the wat which has, um, lamb in it as well. So there's about three or four different kinds. And that's the stew. Now the bread is similar to a pancake, that we know as pancakes, but if you look at it, it's a pancake that's only been cooked on one side, right?

[Assistant] Uh huh. OK.

[User] You can see the bubbles. And they have a huge, uh, tin pan that's about this big around, and so they would pour that, uh, mixture or whatever around, and then it would cook on the bottom and the top would still have the holes in it, you know, the pancake.

[Assistant] And they cut it up right there on the pan?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] You can see the bubbles. And they have a huge, uh, tin pan that's about this big around, and so they would pour that, uh, mixture or whatever around, and then it would cook on the bottom and the top would still have the holes in it, you know, the pancake.

[Assistant] And they cut it up right there on the pan?

[User] Oh, no, no, no. They don't cut it up, they slide it over into the basket. In fact, I have one of the actual baskets behind my chair there. You see, behind you?

[Assistant] This chair?

[User] No, no, no. The actual basket is something I brought back. [inaudible] So and the injera. So they would make one injera and they would slide that off, make another injera. So there would be maybe sometimes five or six layers of the injera. And then when the mealtime came, family, friends, they would all sit around the basket. I've forgotten what the name of it is. And the injera is there. You're in your place. Then they would pour the different stews around. OK? So when it came time to eat, you'd tear off your portion of injera, dip it into whatever stew you want, and then you would eat. That's how they would do that.

[Assistant] And then it came around again and you could get a different kind of stew?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh, no, no, no. They don't cut it up, they slide it over into the basket. In fact, I have one of the actual baskets behind my chair there. You see, behind you?

[Assistant] This chair?

[User] No, no, no. The actual basket is something I brought back. [inaudible] So and the injera. So they would make one injera and they would slide that off, make another injera. So there would be maybe sometimes five or six layers of the injera. And then when the mealtime came, family, friends, they would all sit around the basket. I've forgotten what the name of it is. And the injera is there. You're in your place. Then they would pour the different stews around. OK? So when it came time to eat, you'd tear off your portion of injera, dip it into whatever stew you want, and then you would eat. That's how they would do that.

[Assistant] And then it came around again and you could get a different kind of stew?

[User] Well, yeah, you're sitting down. And if you want, you know, you could just reach around or whatever. Ok, so you will just dip it out like that.

[Assistant] Now is this, when they're feeding people that much food, what are you talking about, 15, 20 people, more?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, no, no. The actual basket is something I brought back. [inaudible] So and the injera. So they would make one injera and they would slide that off, make another injera. So there would be maybe sometimes five or six layers of the injera. And then when the mealtime came, family, friends, they would all sit around the basket. I've forgotten what the name of it is. And the injera is there. You're in your place. Then they would pour the different stews around. OK? So when it came time to eat, you'd tear off your portion of injera, dip it into whatever stew you want, and then you would eat. That's how they would do that.

[Assistant] And then it came around again and you could get a different kind of stew?

[User] Well, yeah, you're sitting down. And if you want, you know, you could just reach around or whatever. Ok, so you will just dip it out like that.

[Assistant] Now is this, when they're feeding people that much food, what are you talking about, 15, 20 people, more?

[User] You never had more than about five, six.

[Assistant] Oh, really? With all that?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Mm hmm. Five or six. And then, you know, it's enough so that you can have a meal the next day.

[Assistant] Oh, great.

[User] But you didn't put it all there.

[Assistant] Good leftovers.

[User] There were leftovers.

[Assistant] So that was fun.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] But you didn't put it all there.

[Assistant] Good leftovers.

[User] There were leftovers.

[Assistant] So that was fun.

[User] Now, um. We didn't have the facilities to cook the food there like that, but you could go to the marketplace and buy the injera. And there were different types of injera. You can find the dark injera with the dark teff. That's what their wheat was called, teff. Up from the dark teff up to the white teff. The typical color, though, is a grayish looking color, which is similar to what you see right there. That's the typical color of it. But you can get the white, which looks just like this napkin.

[Assistant] How would you spell injera in English?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I-N-J-E-R-A.

[Assistant] I-N.

[User] J-E-R-A.

[Assistant] E-R-A, OK.

[User] Injera. And wat, W-A-T.

[Assistant] OK, so it's a kind of bread plus the stew that goes with it.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] J-E-R-A.

[Assistant] E-R-A, OK.

[User] Injera. And wat, W-A-T.

[Assistant] OK, so it's a kind of bread plus the stew that goes with it.

[User] Yeah. Now, it's very spicy. The actual food is quite spicy.

[Assistant] You gave me a taste of the spicy stew.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Injera. And wat, W-A-T.

[Assistant] OK, so it's a kind of bread plus the stew that goes with it.

[User] Yeah. Now, it's very spicy. The actual food is quite spicy.

[Assistant] You gave me a taste of the spicy stew.

[User] Very spicy, very hot. But it's tasty. Once you get used to it, it's very tasty. It's very delicious.

[Assistant] So do you cook that style here?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah. Now, it's very spicy. The actual food is quite spicy.

[Assistant] You gave me a taste of the spicy stew.

[User] Very spicy, very hot. But it's tasty. Once you get used to it, it's very tasty. It's very delicious.

[Assistant] So do you cook that style here?

[User] Oh no, I have never, no.

[Assistant] Is there a decent Ethiopian restaurant in Buffalo?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Very spicy, very hot. But it's tasty. Once you get used to it, it's very tasty. It's very delicious.

[Assistant] So do you cook that style here?

[User] Oh no, I have never, no.

[Assistant] Is there a decent Ethiopian restaurant in Buffalo?

[User] I haven't found one. Now I, um, one year we went to Detroit for some reason or another, a conference I think it was, and we're walking downtown, some other friends and I, and I see Ethiopian restaurant. I said, oh, I've got to go in.

[Assistant] We are going.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh no, I have never, no.

[Assistant] Is there a decent Ethiopian restaurant in Buffalo?

[User] I haven't found one. Now I, um, one year we went to Detroit for some reason or another, a conference I think it was, and we're walking downtown, some other friends and I, and I see Ethiopian restaurant. I said, oh, I've got to go in.

[Assistant] We are going.

[User] So we went right in there. These people knew nothing about Ethiopia. They knew. I said, we're going to try this. I've got to have some of this. And even there, it was not the same. They had watered it down, you know, because Americans don't like food that is too hot.

[Assistant] But it was run by actual Ethiopians?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I haven't found one. Now I, um, one year we went to Detroit for some reason or another, a conference I think it was, and we're walking downtown, some other friends and I, and I see Ethiopian restaurant. I said, oh, I've got to go in.

[Assistant] We are going.

[User] So we went right in there. These people knew nothing about Ethiopia. They knew. I said, we're going to try this. I've got to have some of this. And even there, it was not the same. They had watered it down, you know, because Americans don't like food that is too hot.

[Assistant] But it was run by actual Ethiopians?

[User] Yes, it was. Yeah. They are Ethiopians in the city of Buffalo, but I don't think they've gotten to the point that they have Ethiopian foods. And I had an Ethiopian student last year, and I used to come to go to class, and whenever I'd see her, I would always greet her in Amharic. And she would look at me so funny as if, you know, what's wrong with this woman, how does she know this? And finally, I told her, you know, about my background. And I asked her at the end of the year if she knew where I could get some berbere. She said, yes, I'll let you know, but, you know, kids, she never got back to me.

[Assistant] Wasn't there something I was supposed to do here? OK, so did you have a future plan while you were still in Ethiopia? Or was it come back and get a job in Buffalo and carry on?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, went back to my parents' home and I taught there for a year.

[Assistant] Uh huh.

[User]
Then I, um, see before I left Ethiopia, I had met a young man who had just come back from the United States. He was an Ethiopian citizen. He had just come back from the United States, studying out at the University of Arizona. And we became friends, you know, he was a nice young man. He really didn't want me to come home. He says, why don't you stay here for a third year and so forth and so on? And I said, no, I'm ready to go home now. But anyway, we continued writing. And when I came, when I got back to the United States, I'm thinking, well, this is not exciting. You know, I want to travel, I want to do this, I want to do that. And when I started looking up my old friends, you know, the few friends that I had, they were heavily involved in relationships or they were married. They already had children. And I'm thinking, well, you know, I would invite them, let's do this. Oh, well, I can't do this. I can't. And so it was like I was out of place. And I was just lost.

So anyway, that next year I went back to Ethiopia and I married the young man.

[Assistant] Ah ha. So you were in touch with him when you got home, you were writing and calling and all that stuff?

[User] Oh yeah. He was the one calling and writing and sending flowers, and let's come back, you know? So I went back and we got married. So we were married for about four years. In fact, two of those years we came to the United States. And we were out in Kalamazoo, Michigan, and went to school, both of us. And then we went back to Ethiopia. And I think at that point, I don't know, things started to change. So the marriage didn't last.

[Assistant] Can I ask, did you have children?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User]
Then I, um, see before I left Ethiopia, I had met a young man who had just come back from the United States. He was an Ethiopian citizen. He had just come back from the United States, studying out at the University of Arizona. And we became friends, you know, he was a nice young man. He really didn't want me to come home. He says, why don't you stay here for a third year and so forth and so on? And I said, no, I'm ready to go home now. But anyway, we continued writing. And when I came, when I got back to the United States, I'm thinking, well, this is not exciting. You know, I want to travel, I want to do this, I want to do that. And when I started looking up my old friends, you know, the few friends that I had, they were heavily involved in relationships or they were married. They already had children. And I'm thinking, well, you know, I would invite them, let's do this. Oh, well, I can't do this. I can't. And so it was like I was out of place. And I was just lost.

So anyway, that next year I went back to Ethiopia and I married the young man.

[Assistant] Ah ha. So you were in touch with him when you got home, you were writing and calling and all that stuff?

[User] Oh yeah. He was the one calling and writing and sending flowers, and let's come back, you know? So I went back and we got married. So we were married for about four years. In fact, two of those years we came to the United States. And we were out in Kalamazoo, Michigan, and went to school, both of us. And then we went back to Ethiopia. And I think at that point, I don't know, things started to change. So the marriage didn't last.

[Assistant] Can I ask, did you have children?

[User] Yes, I have a daughter. We have a daughter.

[Assistant] OK. That's nice. So then you were back single again.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh yeah. He was the one calling and writing and sending flowers, and let's come back, you know? So I went back and we got married. So we were married for about four years. In fact, two of those years we came to the United States. And we were out in Kalamazoo, Michigan, and went to school, both of us. And then we went back to Ethiopia. And I think at that point, I don't know, things started to change. So the marriage didn't last.

[Assistant] Can I ask, did you have children?

[User] Yes, I have a daughter. We have a daughter.

[Assistant] OK. That's nice. So then you were back single again.

[User] Yep. And I've been single ever since. Thirty years of singlehood.

[Assistant] And your daughter is married now and you have grandchildren?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, I have a daughter. We have a daughter.

[Assistant] OK. That's nice. So then you were back single again.

[User] Yep. And I've been single ever since. Thirty years of singlehood.

[Assistant] And your daughter is married now and you have grandchildren?

[User] No, she's not married. She's, um. That's interesting because, um, maybe because of the way I am and also her father. She's a very independent young lady.

[Assistant] Nothing wrong with that.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yep. And I've been single ever since. Thirty years of singlehood.

[Assistant] And your daughter is married now and you have grandchildren?

[User] No, she's not married. She's, um. That's interesting because, um, maybe because of the way I am and also her father. She's a very independent young lady.

[Assistant] Nothing wrong with that.

[User] And she has done more traveling than I would ever have imagined. You know, she doesn't wince to pick up and say, well, I want to go this place. And the next thing I know, oh, I'm getting ready, I'm packing my bags, I'm going. She's been to India. And she's been to all of the major countries in Europe and she's been to South America.

[Assistant] Pleasure or business?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, she's not married. She's, um. That's interesting because, um, maybe because of the way I am and also her father. She's a very independent young lady.

[Assistant] Nothing wrong with that.

[User] And she has done more traveling than I would ever have imagined. You know, she doesn't wince to pick up and say, well, I want to go this place. And the next thing I know, oh, I'm getting ready, I'm packing my bags, I'm going. She's been to India. And she's been to all of the major countries in Europe and she's been to South America.

[Assistant] Pleasure or business?

[User] Some of them were business, and some of them were pleasure. And she's been to many places in the United States as well.

[Assistant] Is she based here in Buffalo or is she coming?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And she has done more traveling than I would ever have imagined. You know, she doesn't wince to pick up and say, well, I want to go this place. And the next thing I know, oh, I'm getting ready, I'm packing my bags, I'm going. She's been to India. And she's been to all of the major countries in Europe and she's been to South America.

[Assistant] Pleasure or business?

[User] Some of them were business, and some of them were pleasure. And she's been to many places in the United States as well.

[Assistant] Is she based here in Buffalo or is she coming?

[User] She's in New York City.

[Assistant] New York City.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] She's in New York City.

[Assistant] New York City.

[User] So she has a group of friends, and they also like to do a lot of traveling. And she's talented and, um, intelligent, and as I say, very independent. She's there in New York, and she's working for a major magazine company.

[Assistant] Wow.

[User] So she does well. Even one of the companies that she used to work with, um, that was one of the reasons she did all of this traveling because they would send her to these different places. Also, when they would have their management meetings, they would send the managers to the Bahamas for, what they'd call it? A regroup.

[Assistant] OK. Whatever you call it.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] So she has a group of friends, and they also like to do a lot of traveling. And she's talented and, um, intelligent, and as I say, very independent. She's there in New York, and she's working for a major magazine company.

[Assistant] Wow.

[User] So she does well. Even one of the companies that she used to work with, um, that was one of the reasons she did all of this traveling because they would send her to these different places. Also, when they would have their management meetings, they would send the managers to the Bahamas for, what they'd call it? A regroup.

[Assistant] OK. Whatever you call it.

[User] Well, I've been to the Bahamas three or four times now.

[Assistant] That's very nice.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] So she does well. Even one of the companies that she used to work with, um, that was one of the reasons she did all of this traveling because they would send her to these different places. Also, when they would have their management meetings, they would send the managers to the Bahamas for, what they'd call it? A regroup.

[Assistant] OK. Whatever you call it.

[User] Well, I've been to the Bahamas three or four times now.

[Assistant] That's very nice.

[User] So that's her life right now. I don't have any grandchildren. [inaudible]

[Assistant] But you formed her, so you live with these consequences, good or bad or whatever. And there seem to be very good consequences.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Back to my time abroad there. Not only did I get a chance to go to the Middle East, but for our vacation, a group of us young ladies got together and we went to East Africa. So I've been to Kenya, Nairobi, Mombasa. Uganda before Idi Amin. Tanzania. I've taken a safari into the treetops.

[Assistant] Oh, yeah.

[User] You know, and I've seen the White Nile, what is it, the blue? [tape break] And you know, we were just there together. And some things I think we did then, of course, you would not do now. For instance, hitchhike.

[Assistant] Oh, absolutely.

[User] We hitchhiked through Kenya. And there were a group of Indians, an Indian family, that picked us up. We're sitting in the back of their truck. They stopped and picked us up, and there we went to wherever we wanted to go. And then when we got there, you know, they'd drop us off and we said, well, where are we going now? So, you know, we'd do that until we got to a place where if we could get a bus. We would always be, not a special bus in this case. It was a bus where there were the native people, you know, with the chickens.

[Assistant] Oh yeah, oh yeah.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] You know, and I've seen the White Nile, what is it, the blue? [tape break] And you know, we were just there together. And some things I think we did then, of course, you would not do now. For instance, hitchhike.

[Assistant] Oh, absolutely.

[User] We hitchhiked through Kenya. And there were a group of Indians, an Indian family, that picked us up. We're sitting in the back of their truck. They stopped and picked us up, and there we went to wherever we wanted to go. And then when we got there, you know, they'd drop us off and we said, well, where are we going now? So, you know, we'd do that until we got to a place where if we could get a bus. We would always be, not a special bus in this case. It was a bus where there were the native people, you know, with the chickens.

[Assistant] Oh yeah, oh yeah.

[User] The chickens up above our head and they're standing up. And I remember we were, um, the two of us were sitting in chairs on the bus in the seats and here was a Masai man, and he's there with his big cane and, you know. Oh my god. But we had some experiences, really, really experiencing.

[Assistant] And I'm sure you imparted that to your daughter.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] We hitchhiked through Kenya. And there were a group of Indians, an Indian family, that picked us up. We're sitting in the back of their truck. They stopped and picked us up, and there we went to wherever we wanted to go. And then when we got there, you know, they'd drop us off and we said, well, where are we going now? So, you know, we'd do that until we got to a place where if we could get a bus. We would always be, not a special bus in this case. It was a bus where there were the native people, you know, with the chickens.

[Assistant] Oh yeah, oh yeah.

[User] The chickens up above our head and they're standing up. And I remember we were, um, the two of us were sitting in chairs on the bus in the seats and here was a Masai man, and he's there with his big cane and, you know. Oh my god. But we had some experiences, really, really experiencing.

[Assistant] And I'm sure you imparted that to your daughter.

[User] Oh yes, I did.

[Assistant] Developed in her that kind of curiosity.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] The chickens up above our head and they're standing up. And I remember we were, um, the two of us were sitting in chairs on the bus in the seats and here was a Masai man, and he's there with his big cane and, you know. Oh my god. But we had some experiences, really, really experiencing.

[Assistant] And I'm sure you imparted that to your daughter.

[User] Oh yes, I did.

[Assistant] Developed in her that kind of curiosity.

[User] Yeah. As she was growing up, I told her, I had to tell her her background about her father and my experiences as well. And then each time I would go to some of those Peace Corps meetings in Ohio, she was there. Other things I would point out to her, even the characteristics of the Ethiopians and the Indians and East Africans. I had lived there long enough that I could look at people and tell pretty much what country they were from. I didn't know the language that well, but I could listen to the accents and even now, you know, where I work we have people who work as security guards and aides in the building. And if they're new and they walk in the building, I pick up right away, oh, he's African. She's this, you know? It doesn't take me but a minute and I pick up right away that they're from a different country.

[Assistant] In your school, do you do any discussion or informational activities about Peace Corps? Do kids ask you about it?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh yes, I did.

[Assistant] Developed in her that kind of curiosity.

[User] Yeah. As she was growing up, I told her, I had to tell her her background about her father and my experiences as well. And then each time I would go to some of those Peace Corps meetings in Ohio, she was there. Other things I would point out to her, even the characteristics of the Ethiopians and the Indians and East Africans. I had lived there long enough that I could look at people and tell pretty much what country they were from. I didn't know the language that well, but I could listen to the accents and even now, you know, where I work we have people who work as security guards and aides in the building. And if they're new and they walk in the building, I pick up right away, oh, he's African. She's this, you know? It doesn't take me but a minute and I pick up right away that they're from a different country.

[Assistant] In your school, do you do any discussion or informational activities about Peace Corps? Do kids ask you about it?

[User] It's been a while, but I did.

[Assistant] When you first came back, did you talk about Peace Corps?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah. As she was growing up, I told her, I had to tell her her background about her father and my experiences as well. And then each time I would go to some of those Peace Corps meetings in Ohio, she was there. Other things I would point out to her, even the characteristics of the Ethiopians and the Indians and East Africans. I had lived there long enough that I could look at people and tell pretty much what country they were from. I didn't know the language that well, but I could listen to the accents and even now, you know, where I work we have people who work as security guards and aides in the building. And if they're new and they walk in the building, I pick up right away, oh, he's African. She's this, you know? It doesn't take me but a minute and I pick up right away that they're from a different country.

[Assistant] In your school, do you do any discussion or informational activities about Peace Corps? Do kids ask you about it?

[User] It's been a while, but I did.

[Assistant] When you first came back, did you talk about Peace Corps?

[User] Yes, I did. I did talk about it to some extent, but I found they were all apathetic. They really weren't that interested in it, but not the kids weren't interested, but I found adults were. When I first came back and that year that I was there, they were all asking me. You know, because I would tell them and they would ask questions and they were interested in it. And I had two or three boxes of slides and I would show my slides to them, you know? But now.

[Assistant] For us old timers, it seems like a long ways away. So you did attempt to get involved in one of the early Buffalo affiliates and now you're involved in the new one?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] It's been a while, but I did.

[Assistant] When you first came back, did you talk about Peace Corps?

[User] Yes, I did. I did talk about it to some extent, but I found they were all apathetic. They really weren't that interested in it, but not the kids weren't interested, but I found adults were. When I first came back and that year that I was there, they were all asking me. You know, because I would tell them and they would ask questions and they were interested in it. And I had two or three boxes of slides and I would show my slides to them, you know? But now.

[Assistant] For us old timers, it seems like a long ways away. So you did attempt to get involved in one of the early Buffalo affiliates and now you're involved in the new one?

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] You feel hopeful about that one?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, I did. I did talk about it to some extent, but I found they were all apathetic. They really weren't that interested in it, but not the kids weren't interested, but I found adults were. When I first came back and that year that I was there, they were all asking me. You know, because I would tell them and they would ask questions and they were interested in it. And I had two or three boxes of slides and I would show my slides to them, you know? But now.

[Assistant] For us old timers, it seems like a long ways away. So you did attempt to get involved in one of the early Buffalo affiliates and now you're involved in the new one?

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] You feel hopeful about that one?

[User] Yes, I do.

[Assistant] What would you like to see that group do in Buffalo? Is it, do you think of it just as a kind of a nostalgia or otherwise?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] You feel hopeful about that one?

[User] Yes, I do.

[Assistant] What would you like to see that group do in Buffalo? Is it, do you think of it just as a kind of a nostalgia or otherwise?

[User] Well, nostalgia, but I would really like to see them become involved with the international community. I don't want to say do something to help, but be around international people, continue working with them, learning about their culture, learning what has happened over there, because so much has changed. And then also learning why are they here? How do they feel? What is, um, what's going on with them? Are they having culture shock? If so, then is there anything we can do? Maybe to help them carry on their traditions, their culture.

[Assistant] Are you interested in getting involved in the International Institute with Pam Kethy?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, I do.

[Assistant] What would you like to see that group do in Buffalo? Is it, do you think of it just as a kind of a nostalgia or otherwise?

[User] Well, nostalgia, but I would really like to see them become involved with the international community. I don't want to say do something to help, but be around international people, continue working with them, learning about their culture, learning what has happened over there, because so much has changed. And then also learning why are they here? How do they feel? What is, um, what's going on with them? Are they having culture shock? If so, then is there anything we can do? Maybe to help them carry on their traditions, their culture.

[Assistant] Are you interested in getting involved in the International Institute with Pam Kethy?

[User] Yes, eventually, not right now.

[Assistant] No, no, you're busy.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, nostalgia, but I would really like to see them become involved with the international community. I don't want to say do something to help, but be around international people, continue working with them, learning about their culture, learning what has happened over there, because so much has changed. And then also learning why are they here? How do they feel? What is, um, what's going on with them? Are they having culture shock? If so, then is there anything we can do? Maybe to help them carry on their traditions, their culture.

[Assistant] Are you interested in getting involved in the International Institute with Pam Kethy?

[User] Yes, eventually, not right now.

[Assistant] No, no, you're busy.

[User] Not right now.

[Assistant] There's a little on your plate.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, eventually, not right now.

[Assistant] No, no, you're busy.

[User] Not right now.

[Assistant] There's a little on your plate.

[User] Later on, you know, maybe a couple years from now.

[Assistant] Well, that's good.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Not right now.

[Assistant] There's a little on your plate.

[User] Later on, you know, maybe a couple years from now.

[Assistant] Well, that's good.

[User] With the Peace Corps, particularly, and I would like to see the group, um, recruit, do a little bit more recruiting. I know it's difficult because Americans now tend to be so selfish. Maybe that's the wrong word, but they're all into themselves. All Americans. And I've watched this over a number of years where, uh. I know when I was growing up, the family was trying to take care of the family and make sure the children had what they were supposed to have. But I find it's even more so now. People are just into what they can do for themselves and what they can get from themselves. And if you're not involved with, you know. [inaudible]

[Assistant] Your neighborhood has undergone some changes in the 30 years?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Later on, you know, maybe a couple years from now.

[Assistant] Well, that's good.

[User] With the Peace Corps, particularly, and I would like to see the group, um, recruit, do a little bit more recruiting. I know it's difficult because Americans now tend to be so selfish. Maybe that's the wrong word, but they're all into themselves. All Americans. And I've watched this over a number of years where, uh. I know when I was growing up, the family was trying to take care of the family and make sure the children had what they were supposed to have. But I find it's even more so now. People are just into what they can do for themselves and what they can get from themselves. And if you're not involved with, you know. [inaudible]

[Assistant] Your neighborhood has undergone some changes in the 30 years?

[User] Yeah, a lot of changes. But those are the kinds of things that I would like to. The nostalgia, that's going to be there, but I'd like to see more young people get involved with having the opportunity to go abroad. Particularly young African Americans. I find that our youth are lost. They're floundering, they're reaching at some immediate goals, which may not be the very best for them. Thinking that this is going to work, but it only brings responsibilities and problems. I don't see our young African Americans taking advantage of some of the opportunities that are available.

[Assistant] That have a hard earned by their ancestors.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I see the difference in my youth when we did not have free scholarships and we didn't have, I mean no one was offering the scholarships as I see today. My parents had to pay for me to go to college. When the University of Buffalo transferred from a private institution to the state, sure, they gave us that little award, state award that they were offering, $250 a semester. But my parents had to pay for me to go to school. And then simple things like bus fare to get to high school, I shelled out the money. But nowadays, you know, our kids are looking for other folks to do for them and they're not doing for themselves, but then, you know, Buffalo provides bus passes for them, free lunches for them, free education, free books, free, free, free.

[Assistant] For all students or just for African Americans?

[User] For the majority of students if their incomes are what have you. Or if they live outside of a certain distance. But when I look at the general population of the school where I'm presently working, the majority of them are getting free bus passes. And when it comes to the end of the year when they're ready to graduate, a lot of the organizations and sororities, the city, the community agencies, they have these $500, $600 scholarships. And they're groping, they're just waiting for the kids to apply, to give away the money. Yet those children will not even go to the guidance office to look up what the scholarships are. And when it comes to filling out the applications, they don't even want to do it. So the money sits.

[Assistant] That's terrible.

[User] And yet when I was in school, they didn't have these things for us.

[Assistant] Yeah. So you managed?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] For the majority of students if their incomes are what have you. Or if they live outside of a certain distance. But when I look at the general population of the school where I'm presently working, the majority of them are getting free bus passes. And when it comes to the end of the year when they're ready to graduate, a lot of the organizations and sororities, the city, the community agencies, they have these $500, $600 scholarships. And they're groping, they're just waiting for the kids to apply, to give away the money. Yet those children will not even go to the guidance office to look up what the scholarships are. And when it comes to filling out the applications, they don't even want to do it. So the money sits.

[Assistant] That's terrible.

[User] And yet when I was in school, they didn't have these things for us.

[Assistant] Yeah. So you managed?

[User] Yeah, we managed, you know, and when the opportunity came, we took advantage. Here the opportunities are right there and the kids, I don't want that. I don't want this. Well what for, you know? So I don't. That's my biggest problem when I'm teaching, you know with the kids. I see all of this stuff and I'm thinking, they could do better, there's nothing.

[Assistant] To help or not to help. Is it worse? I don't know.