[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, I think we continued the language training. I still remember that.

[Assistant] Yeah. How long was the in-country?

[User] Probably another three or four weeks. I remember for some reason we went to Dire Dawa. I think we went to see the hospital in Dire Dawa. And there was a leper hospital facility we toured. You know, Dire Dawa is pretty far east, so that was pretty far away. So that was a real treat to go to Dire Dawa.

[Assistant] Did you fly?

[User] We were all. We were all nurses. I think the nurses went there. Yeah, we flew there. And stayed in another hotel, had some more language training, and toured these hospitals. So that was probably about three weeks, I guess.

[Assistant] Was there a clear sense emerging of what the project was going to be? You know, there was a job for you and you'd be expected to be doing this.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Probably another three or four weeks. I remember for some reason we went to Dire Dawa. I think we went to see the hospital in Dire Dawa. And there was a leper hospital facility we toured. You know, Dire Dawa is pretty far east, so that was pretty far away. So that was a real treat to go to Dire Dawa.

[Assistant] Did you fly?

[User] We were all. We were all nurses. I think the nurses went there. Yeah, we flew there. And stayed in another hotel, had some more language training, and toured these hospitals. So that was probably about three weeks, I guess.

[Assistant] Was there a clear sense emerging of what the project was going to be? You know, there was a job for you and you'd be expected to be doing this.

[User] Yeah, we were going to teach dressers. Oh yeah, we went to a dresser program. We went to a dresser school.

[Assistant] To observe or?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] We were all. We were all nurses. I think the nurses went there. Yeah, we flew there. And stayed in another hotel, had some more language training, and toured these hospitals. So that was probably about three weeks, I guess.

[Assistant] Was there a clear sense emerging of what the project was going to be? You know, there was a job for you and you'd be expected to be doing this.

[User] Yeah, we were going to teach dressers. Oh yeah, we went to a dresser program. We went to a dresser school.

[Assistant] To observe or?

[User] To observe.

[Assistant] Oh, OK. One day or?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, we were going to teach dressers. Oh yeah, we went to a dresser program. We went to a dresser school.

[Assistant] To observe or?

[User] To observe.

[Assistant] Oh, OK. One day or?

[User] Probably. No, two or three times.

[Assistant] Mm hmm. Were you champing at the bit by then saying, you know, enough already? I'm trained, you know, turn me loose.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] To observe.

[Assistant] Oh, OK. One day or?

[User] Probably. No, two or three times.

[Assistant] Mm hmm. Were you champing at the bit by then saying, you know, enough already? I'm trained, you know, turn me loose.

[User] I think so.

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah. And this training camp finally comes to an end. And what's the next step?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I think so.

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah. And this training camp finally comes to an end. And what's the next step?

[User] So then we got our assignments. And I was assigned to the Etege Menen Hospital Dresser School in Asmara, Eritrea, which at the time was part of Ethiopia.

[Assistant] OK.

[User] Etege Menen Hospital. So up I went.

[Assistant] Is Asmara on the coast?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] So then we got our assignments. And I was assigned to the Etege Menen Hospital Dresser School in Asmara, Eritrea, which at the time was part of Ethiopia.

[Assistant] OK.

[User] Etege Menen Hospital. So up I went.

[Assistant] Is Asmara on the coast?

[User] No. That's Mitsiwa. Yeah, Asmara could be called a mile high city. It's something like five thousand feet high. Probably 100 kilometers from the coast, from the Red Sea.

[Assistant] Now that was formerly an Italian colony, right?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Etege Menen Hospital. So up I went.

[Assistant] Is Asmara on the coast?

[User] No. That's Mitsiwa. Yeah, Asmara could be called a mile high city. It's something like five thousand feet high. Probably 100 kilometers from the coast, from the Red Sea.

[Assistant] Now that was formerly an Italian colony, right?

[User] It was formerly an Italian province.

[Assistant] So you didn't know Tigrinya or Italian?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No. That's Mitsiwa. Yeah, Asmara could be called a mile high city. It's something like five thousand feet high. Probably 100 kilometers from the coast, from the Red Sea.

[Assistant] Now that was formerly an Italian colony, right?

[User] It was formerly an Italian province.

[Assistant] So you didn't know Tigrinya or Italian?

[User] Right.

[Assistant] OK. But you did know medical English.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] It was formerly an Italian province.

[Assistant] So you didn't know Tigrinya or Italian?

[User] Right.

[Assistant] OK. But you did know medical English.

[User] I knew medical. I knew English. And I knew more Amharic than I would need for the next two years. Because most of the people in Eritrea were not interested in Amharic. They didn't want to speak Amharic. As you recall, the Tigrinya speaking provinces were not treated equally in Ethiopia. Haile Selassie himself was an Amhara and the Tigrinyas, you would probably call it today a quota system as far as opportunity goes. So at the University of Addis Ababa, they had a very low quota for Tigrinya speaking Eritreans. They were, there was animosity between the two groups.

[Assistant] And you were aware of all this through training. Who made the decision as to where the nurses went? Was it an Ethiopian decision or was it a Peace Corps decision?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Right.

[Assistant] OK. But you did know medical English.

[User] I knew medical. I knew English. And I knew more Amharic than I would need for the next two years. Because most of the people in Eritrea were not interested in Amharic. They didn't want to speak Amharic. As you recall, the Tigrinya speaking provinces were not treated equally in Ethiopia. Haile Selassie himself was an Amhara and the Tigrinyas, you would probably call it today a quota system as far as opportunity goes. So at the University of Addis Ababa, they had a very low quota for Tigrinya speaking Eritreans. They were, there was animosity between the two groups.

[Assistant] And you were aware of all this through training. Who made the decision as to where the nurses went? Was it an Ethiopian decision or was it a Peace Corps decision?

[User] Oh, I couldn't answer that. We were working for the Ministry of Health.

[Assistant] OK. How were you being paid, by the way? By the Peace Corps?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I knew medical. I knew English. And I knew more Amharic than I would need for the next two years. Because most of the people in Eritrea were not interested in Amharic. They didn't want to speak Amharic. As you recall, the Tigrinya speaking provinces were not treated equally in Ethiopia. Haile Selassie himself was an Amhara and the Tigrinyas, you would probably call it today a quota system as far as opportunity goes. So at the University of Addis Ababa, they had a very low quota for Tigrinya speaking Eritreans. They were, there was animosity between the two groups.

[Assistant] And you were aware of all this through training. Who made the decision as to where the nurses went? Was it an Ethiopian decision or was it a Peace Corps decision?

[User] Oh, I couldn't answer that. We were working for the Ministry of Health.

[Assistant] OK. How were you being paid, by the way? By the Peace Corps?

[User] Um, I think so. I think we were paid by the Peace Corps.

[Assistant] Yeah. Living allowance of some sort.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh, I couldn't answer that. We were working for the Ministry of Health.

[Assistant] OK. How were you being paid, by the way? By the Peace Corps?

[User] Um, I think so. I think we were paid by the Peace Corps.

[Assistant] Yeah. Living allowance of some sort.

[User] Yeah. And they kept about a third of it back for the relocation allowance.

[Assistant] Going to Asmara, is it?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Um, I think so. I think we were paid by the Peace Corps.

[Assistant] Yeah. Living allowance of some sort.

[User] Yeah. And they kept about a third of it back for the relocation allowance.

[Assistant] Going to Asmara, is it?

[User] Asmara.

[Assistant] Did you go with everything you'd need to set up housekeeping or, again, were you going and that would be done once you got there?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah. And they kept about a third of it back for the relocation allowance.

[Assistant] Going to Asmara, is it?

[User] Asmara.

[Assistant] Did you go with everything you'd need to set up housekeeping or, again, were you going and that would be done once you got there?

[User] That would be arranged once I got there. That wasn't prearranged.

[Assistant] Did you go out alone or with others?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Asmara.

[Assistant] Did you go with everything you'd need to set up housekeeping or, again, were you going and that would be done once you got there?

[User] That would be arranged once I got there. That wasn't prearranged.

[Assistant] Did you go out alone or with others?

[User] There were two other nurses, or maybe just one. There were, um, Mekelle is the next Tigray province down. And so I think that we all want to Asmara and then these others had to go by bus to their smaller dresser schools. I was rather centrally located in Asmara.

[Assistant] But you were the only Peace Corps nurse.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] That would be arranged once I got there. That wasn't prearranged.

[Assistant] Did you go out alone or with others?

[User] There were two other nurses, or maybe just one. There were, um, Mekelle is the next Tigray province down. And so I think that we all want to Asmara and then these others had to go by bus to their smaller dresser schools. I was rather centrally located in Asmara.

[Assistant] But you were the only Peace Corps nurse.

[User] No, there were two of us I think.

[Assistant] Oh, they were, OK.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] There were two other nurses, or maybe just one. There were, um, Mekelle is the next Tigray province down. And so I think that we all want to Asmara and then these others had to go by bus to their smaller dresser schools. I was rather centrally located in Asmara.

[Assistant] But you were the only Peace Corps nurse.

[User] No, there were two of us I think.

[Assistant] Oh, they were, OK.

[User] Yeah, there, actually. I guess I don't remember one year to the next, but I think there were three in the beginning. But Jane only lasted a period of weeks and she was gone. She went home.

[Assistant] And she had come with you?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, there were two of us I think.

[Assistant] Oh, they were, OK.

[User] Yeah, there, actually. I guess I don't remember one year to the next, but I think there were three in the beginning. But Jane only lasted a period of weeks and she was gone. She went home.

[Assistant] And she had come with you?

[User] Yeah, she went through all the training, got to Asmara, saw what it would be for two years. I think she left a boyfriend back on the East Coast somewhere, and she just said, I'm not going to stay. So she left. But the other one is Lorraine, and she and I were. We did the whole two years.

[Assistant] Talk about how you settled into being in Asmara, where you lived, and who you were accountable to, and how you sensed what the job was.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah. Well, we lived in a hotel in the beginning and went to the dresser school and my chief teacher's name was Mullah. And she was the head of the school, and, uh, so I was told that I would be teaching anatomy and physiology and beginning sciences. Um. And I started the year with them, so I think I started right at the beginning. But the interesting thing is they use syllabus, a syllabus, syllabi to teach their courses that had been developed by a couple of nurses before me and the school was still using them.

[Assistant] American nurses?

[User] American nurses had been at that school before me.

[Assistant] Peace Corps?

[User] Mm hmm. Yeah. So they were used to the Peace Corps nurses.

[Assistant] So you had a pretty good guide as to what you should be teaching?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] American nurses had been at that school before me.

[Assistant] Peace Corps?

[User] Mm hmm. Yeah. So they were used to the Peace Corps nurses.

[Assistant] So you had a pretty good guide as to what you should be teaching?

[User] Right.

[Assistant]
Anywhere in training, did they expose you to instructional principles or how to organize, to teach or?

No. Not really. So you had never taught?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Mm hmm. Yeah. So they were used to the Peace Corps nurses.

[Assistant] So you had a pretty good guide as to what you should be teaching?

[User] Right.

[Assistant]
Anywhere in training, did they expose you to instructional principles or how to organize, to teach or?

No. Not really. So you had never taught?

[User] Nah.

[Assistant] You'd been a student, but.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Right.

[Assistant]
Anywhere in training, did they expose you to instructional principles or how to organize, to teach or?

No. Not really. So you had never taught?

[User] Nah.

[Assistant] You'd been a student, but.

[User] Yeah, I'd been a practicing nurse, a student and a practicing nurse. In retrospect, I wish I had brought more textbooks with me to fill out the curriculum. Because the curriculum, the syllabi, were pretty simple. And uh, so I found myself, you know, what do I teach next?

[Assistant] How did you take to the teaching role?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Nah.

[Assistant] You'd been a student, but.

[User] Yeah, I'd been a practicing nurse, a student and a practicing nurse. In retrospect, I wish I had brought more textbooks with me to fill out the curriculum. Because the curriculum, the syllabi, were pretty simple. And uh, so I found myself, you know, what do I teach next?

[Assistant] How did you take to the teaching role?

[User] Oh, it was interesting. I probably made some boo boos and did some poor choices. But the students were eighth grade graduates of the Ethiopian school system, and they had started their English instruction at the fifth year of school, so they had three years of English behind them. And I think I wasn't sensitive enough to non-English speakers. I learned to simplify my language for, um, some of the slower students. And you could tell in their responses to certain, to what you taught. Did you comprehend this? And of course, they would nod yes, but sometimes they didn't.

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah. Were they all women?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, I'd been a practicing nurse, a student and a practicing nurse. In retrospect, I wish I had brought more textbooks with me to fill out the curriculum. Because the curriculum, the syllabi, were pretty simple. And uh, so I found myself, you know, what do I teach next?

[Assistant] How did you take to the teaching role?

[User] Oh, it was interesting. I probably made some boo boos and did some poor choices. But the students were eighth grade graduates of the Ethiopian school system, and they had started their English instruction at the fifth year of school, so they had three years of English behind them. And I think I wasn't sensitive enough to non-English speakers. I learned to simplify my language for, um, some of the slower students. And you could tell in their responses to certain, to what you taught. Did you comprehend this? And of course, they would nod yes, but sometimes they didn't.

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah. Were they all women?

[User] No. The first year was mixed. Second year, they put me in charge to develop an advanced dresser program, because I was one of the few nurses that had a bachelor's degree in the country. And so I worked on advanced. And the decision was made that only men would be advanced dressers. So there was one girl who had gotten in as an exception policy. Her father was an influential mufti. Mufti, the Muslim religious leader in the community. And so he got his daughter as an exception to the rule. So she was the only female in this all boys class of advanced dressers.

[Assistant] Well, let's go back to the first year. You didn't stay in the hotel.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No. The first year was mixed. Second year, they put me in charge to develop an advanced dresser program, because I was one of the few nurses that had a bachelor's degree in the country. And so I worked on advanced. And the decision was made that only men would be advanced dressers. So there was one girl who had gotten in as an exception policy. Her father was an influential mufti. Mufti, the Muslim religious leader in the community. And so he got his daughter as an exception to the rule. So she was the only female in this all boys class of advanced dressers.

[Assistant] Well, let's go back to the first year. You didn't stay in the hotel.

[User] No. Let's see. My first. My first place was a little kind of a hut hollow thing in Asmara. Asmara had another very prominent institution in town, and that was an American Army base called Kagnew Station. And I found out that Kagnew Station was sort of a listening post to the Arab world. They had a big, what do you call those big?

[Assistant] Dishes?

[User] Dishes, yeah, so they would listen in on radio and things. And so there was. I'd been an Army nurse, so I went over one day and introduced myself to the chief nurse. And there was an Army nurse and there was a, right two blocks behind her there was a place that I rented. And it was, um.

[Assistant] Off the base?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No. Let's see. My first. My first place was a little kind of a hut hollow thing in Asmara. Asmara had another very prominent institution in town, and that was an American Army base called Kagnew Station. And I found out that Kagnew Station was sort of a listening post to the Arab world. They had a big, what do you call those big?

[Assistant] Dishes?

[User] Dishes, yeah, so they would listen in on radio and things. And so there was. I'd been an Army nurse, so I went over one day and introduced myself to the chief nurse. And there was an Army nurse and there was a, right two blocks behind her there was a place that I rented. And it was, um.

[Assistant] Off the base?

[User] Yeah, oh yeah. It was off the base and it was like two rooms. And so I stayed there for six or eight months or so.

[Assistant] What did you do for food?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, oh yeah. It was off the base and it was like two rooms. And so I stayed there for six or eight months or so.

[Assistant] What did you do for food?

[User] Well, let's see. Um, there was an Italian market. You know, Asmara is a big town. A lot of Italian influence. So there was a market that we got credit from. So I guess when we get paid, we'd go down and pay the bill. And so I had some just very elementary food. And then at lunchtime, there was a nurse's cafeteria. Well, there was an eating place, and I think I just probably brought a little sandwich usually with me. Eat there. And then at nighttime, there were some little Italian restaurants, and I guess I had maybe, uh, maybe a stove of some sort. I don't remember. I'm not much of a cook, and I don't. I hardly remember what I did. Oh yeah, I had these other. There were 13 Peace Corps volunteers in town.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] There were like three nurses, and the rest mostly were high school teachers. So a lot of the times we would go to each other's place, you know, have dinner together.

[Assistant] How far were you from the school where you lived?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, let's see. Um, there was an Italian market. You know, Asmara is a big town. A lot of Italian influence. So there was a market that we got credit from. So I guess when we get paid, we'd go down and pay the bill. And so I had some just very elementary food. And then at lunchtime, there was a nurse's cafeteria. Well, there was an eating place, and I think I just probably brought a little sandwich usually with me. Eat there. And then at nighttime, there were some little Italian restaurants, and I guess I had maybe, uh, maybe a stove of some sort. I don't remember. I'm not much of a cook, and I don't. I hardly remember what I did. Oh yeah, I had these other. There were 13 Peace Corps volunteers in town.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] There were like three nurses, and the rest mostly were high school teachers. So a lot of the times we would go to each other's place, you know, have dinner together.

[Assistant] How far were you from the school where you lived?

[User] Oh, it's probably a mile, mile and a half.

[Assistant] How did you get back and forth?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] There were like three nurses, and the rest mostly were high school teachers. So a lot of the times we would go to each other's place, you know, have dinner together.

[Assistant] How far were you from the school where you lived?

[User] Oh, it's probably a mile, mile and a half.

[Assistant] How did you get back and forth?

[User] Bicycle.

[Assistant] So you bought a bike?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh, it's probably a mile, mile and a half.

[Assistant] How did you get back and forth?

[User] Bicycle.

[Assistant] So you bought a bike?

[User] We all had bikes. Bought a bike.

[Assistant] Yeah. Was there a Peace Corps office in Asmara?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Bicycle.

[Assistant] So you bought a bike?

[User] We all had bikes. Bought a bike.

[Assistant] Yeah. Was there a Peace Corps office in Asmara?

[User] Mm hmm.

[Assistant] Were you advised or were any guidelines set as far as your relations with Kagnew base?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] We all had bikes. Bought a bike.

[Assistant] Yeah. Was there a Peace Corps office in Asmara?

[User] Mm hmm.

[Assistant] Were you advised or were any guidelines set as far as your relations with Kagnew base?

[User] Oh, we were advised. We were advised. Stay away.

[Assistant] Any reason given or?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, they didn't want to ally us with any CIA, um, activities, any military, government, governmental affiliations.

[Assistant] Right.

[User] And I went over to the base occasionally, I must confess.

[Assistant] Yeah, well.

[User] Yeah. Socially there were Army nurses I got to know, and so I abused that somewhat. And actually, I got called in to the director's office one time for that.

[Assistant] Oh you did? Who was that director?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And I went over to the base occasionally, I must confess.

[Assistant] Yeah, well.

[User] Yeah. Socially there were Army nurses I got to know, and so I abused that somewhat. And actually, I got called in to the director's office one time for that.

[Assistant] Oh you did? Who was that director?

[User] I don't remember his name. I remember he was from St. John's University. I can't remember his name, but he strongly advised me to stay away.

[Assistant] He didn't threaten you, though, saying you'll be on the next plane out of here?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I don't remember his name. I remember he was from St. John's University. I can't remember his name, but he strongly advised me to stay away.

[Assistant] He didn't threaten you, though, saying you'll be on the next plane out of here?

[User] He might have.

[Assistant] Oh, OK.

[User] They felt very strongly about it.

[Assistant] Did it work the other way? There must have been some temptation on the part of soldiers based at the base to want to come out and socialize with the Peace Corps people.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] He might have.

[Assistant] Oh, OK.

[User] They felt very strongly about it.

[Assistant] Did it work the other way? There must have been some temptation on the part of soldiers based at the base to want to come out and socialize with the Peace Corps people.

[User] Don't remember that ever happening.

[Assistant] OK. They may have been under restrictions too.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] They felt very strongly about it.

[Assistant] Did it work the other way? There must have been some temptation on the part of soldiers based at the base to want to come out and socialize with the Peace Corps people.

[User] Don't remember that ever happening.

[Assistant] OK. They may have been under restrictions too.

[User] Don't remember that happening. Now that one nurse bought me a turkey at the commissary once and we had Thanksgiving. But among Peace Corps. The nurse wasn't invited. Yeah, I still remember that.

[Assistant] Was the turkey bugged?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Don't remember that happening. Now that one nurse bought me a turkey at the commissary once and we had Thanksgiving. But among Peace Corps. The nurse wasn't invited. Yeah, I still remember that.

[Assistant] Was the turkey bugged?

[User] I don't know. I don't think so. No, there wasn't much. One time there was an anesthetist nurse at the hospital and I said, would you like to come to Etege Menen to see how the anesthesia is given? So she went over there and I remember talking to her afterward and she said they're still doing the ether drip technique. We haven't used that in, you know, millennia at our hospital because they were using the machinery.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] But yeah, I, um, I was told in no uncertain terms to curtail that, that going over there. So I did. I didn't go on the base.

[Assistant] What was the living situation of the students?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I don't know. I don't think so. No, there wasn't much. One time there was an anesthetist nurse at the hospital and I said, would you like to come to Etege Menen to see how the anesthesia is given? So she went over there and I remember talking to her afterward and she said they're still doing the ether drip technique. We haven't used that in, you know, millennia at our hospital because they were using the machinery.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] But yeah, I, um, I was told in no uncertain terms to curtail that, that going over there. So I did. I didn't go on the base.

[Assistant] What was the living situation of the students?

[User] Not very good. Most of, some of them lived with their families. They were given a stipend every month of about twelve dollars. And with that, they were to buy their food and their lodging if they needed to. So those who didn't live with their families, a lot of them would live together. And I remember going to one boy's house once, and it was just a small room about the size of a big bathroom. And the common food that they ate was sort of a bean curd dish called suwa. And I guess it had the protein in it that they needed. But yeah, but it was pretty meager for them.

[Assistant] How did the students dress?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] But yeah, I, um, I was told in no uncertain terms to curtail that, that going over there. So I did. I didn't go on the base.

[Assistant] What was the living situation of the students?

[User] Not very good. Most of, some of them lived with their families. They were given a stipend every month of about twelve dollars. And with that, they were to buy their food and their lodging if they needed to. So those who didn't live with their families, a lot of them would live together. And I remember going to one boy's house once, and it was just a small room about the size of a big bathroom. And the common food that they ate was sort of a bean curd dish called suwa. And I guess it had the protein in it that they needed. But yeah, but it was pretty meager for them.

[Assistant] How did the students dress?

[User] They just barely made it. They had a uniform.

[Assistant] Khaki shorts or?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Not very good. Most of, some of them lived with their families. They were given a stipend every month of about twelve dollars. And with that, they were to buy their food and their lodging if they needed to. So those who didn't live with their families, a lot of them would live together. And I remember going to one boy's house once, and it was just a small room about the size of a big bathroom. And the common food that they ate was sort of a bean curd dish called suwa. And I guess it had the protein in it that they needed. But yeah, but it was pretty meager for them.

[Assistant] How did the students dress?

[User] They just barely made it. They had a uniform.

[Assistant] Khaki shorts or?

[User] No, it was something like you would see in the operating room today here. It was cotton pants and a kind of an operating room top. So that was the dresser uniform.

[Assistant] Within the culture that you sensed, was it prestigious to be in training for it to be a dresser or?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] They just barely made it. They had a uniform.

[Assistant] Khaki shorts or?

[User] No, it was something like you would see in the operating room today here. It was cotton pants and a kind of an operating room top. So that was the dresser uniform.

[Assistant] Within the culture that you sensed, was it prestigious to be in training for it to be a dresser or?

[User] Oh yes. Yes. They felt very, very lucky. Jobs were not too plentiful, but they had to have some courage because their obligation was to go off to a dresser station, which was normally located in a village. And they were the first line of medical care, trained Western medical care, for a whole village. So they were given a lot of responsibility.

[Assistant] Was there an existing network of local clinics, which is where the dresses would work?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, it was something like you would see in the operating room today here. It was cotton pants and a kind of an operating room top. So that was the dresser uniform.

[Assistant] Within the culture that you sensed, was it prestigious to be in training for it to be a dresser or?

[User] Oh yes. Yes. They felt very, very lucky. Jobs were not too plentiful, but they had to have some courage because their obligation was to go off to a dresser station, which was normally located in a village. And they were the first line of medical care, trained Western medical care, for a whole village. So they were given a lot of responsibility.

[Assistant] Was there an existing network of local clinics, which is where the dresses would work?

[User] Mm hmm. Would work. Now they didn't necessarily. They weren't necessarily assigned to an Eritrean clinic, village. Some of them would go all the way over to Harar, which is all the way across the country. And in fact, the sense was that they did send the Eritreans into Ethiopia. See, they all knew the Amharic language. The Amharic language was taught in the schools. So they all knew the Amharic language. Amharas didn't know Tigrinya language.

[Assistant] So they were trilingual at least.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh yes. Yes. They felt very, very lucky. Jobs were not too plentiful, but they had to have some courage because their obligation was to go off to a dresser station, which was normally located in a village. And they were the first line of medical care, trained Western medical care, for a whole village. So they were given a lot of responsibility.

[Assistant] Was there an existing network of local clinics, which is where the dresses would work?

[User] Mm hmm. Would work. Now they didn't necessarily. They weren't necessarily assigned to an Eritrean clinic, village. Some of them would go all the way over to Harar, which is all the way across the country. And in fact, the sense was that they did send the Eritreans into Ethiopia. See, they all knew the Amharic language. The Amharic language was taught in the schools. So they all knew the Amharic language. Amharas didn't know Tigrinya language.

[Assistant] So they were trilingual at least.

[User] At least. A lot of the students knew.

[Assistant] Probably knew some Italian as well.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Mm hmm. Would work. Now they didn't necessarily. They weren't necessarily assigned to an Eritrean clinic, village. Some of them would go all the way over to Harar, which is all the way across the country. And in fact, the sense was that they did send the Eritreans into Ethiopia. See, they all knew the Amharic language. The Amharic language was taught in the schools. So they all knew the Amharic language. Amharas didn't know Tigrinya language.

[Assistant] So they were trilingual at least.

[User] At least. A lot of the students knew.

[Assistant] Probably knew some Italian as well.

[User] Italian, and a lot of them had tribal languages.

[Assistant] Aside from Tigrinya?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] At least. A lot of the students knew.

[Assistant] Probably knew some Italian as well.

[User] Italian, and a lot of them had tribal languages.

[Assistant] Aside from Tigrinya?

[User] Yeah, there could be a language where as few as one hundred people spoke. And then there was a regional language, and then there was a, you know, it got bigger and bigger and more expansive all the time.

[Assistant] Right. Did you visit out to any of the clinics?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Italian, and a lot of them had tribal languages.

[Assistant] Aside from Tigrinya?

[User] Yeah, there could be a language where as few as one hundred people spoke. And then there was a regional language, and then there was a, you know, it got bigger and bigger and more expansive all the time.

[Assistant] Right. Did you visit out to any of the clinics?

[User] Yeah, I went to one or two of the clinics to see the dresser stations.

[Assistant] Your choice or just was expected of you?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, there could be a language where as few as one hundred people spoke. And then there was a regional language, and then there was a, you know, it got bigger and bigger and more expansive all the time.

[Assistant] Right. Did you visit out to any of the clinics?

[User] Yeah, I went to one or two of the clinics to see the dresser stations.

[Assistant] Your choice or just was expected of you?

[User] Uh, I think it was expected. Oh, the students had two tracks actually. They could go to the dresser stations or they could work in a hospital on the nursing staff, as a nursing aide. So, you know, if they, well, they were usually assigned. They didn't have too much to do with the assignment, as I recall.

[Assistant] And did you have anything to do about evaluating and recommending? You know, this is a person who's stronger in medical skills or more independent?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, I went to one or two of the clinics to see the dresser stations.

[Assistant] Your choice or just was expected of you?

[User] Uh, I think it was expected. Oh, the students had two tracks actually. They could go to the dresser stations or they could work in a hospital on the nursing staff, as a nursing aide. So, you know, if they, well, they were usually assigned. They didn't have too much to do with the assignment, as I recall.

[Assistant] And did you have anything to do about evaluating and recommending? You know, this is a person who's stronger in medical skills or more independent?

[User] Yeah, we had a teachers conference. Now Mullah was the one who did the, who talked to the Ministry of Health more directly than I did, but we would have faculty conferences about the students and their skills. And it was small enough that everybody pretty well knew everybody.

[Assistant] How many people were on the faculty?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Uh, I think it was expected. Oh, the students had two tracks actually. They could go to the dresser stations or they could work in a hospital on the nursing staff, as a nursing aide. So, you know, if they, well, they were usually assigned. They didn't have too much to do with the assignment, as I recall.

[Assistant] And did you have anything to do about evaluating and recommending? You know, this is a person who's stronger in medical skills or more independent?

[User] Yeah, we had a teachers conference. Now Mullah was the one who did the, who talked to the Ministry of Health more directly than I did, but we would have faculty conferences about the students and their skills. And it was small enough that everybody pretty well knew everybody.

[Assistant] How many people were on the faculty?

[User] Oh, probably four. Four of us.

[Assistant] And how many were Peace Corps?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, we had a teachers conference. Now Mullah was the one who did the, who talked to the Ministry of Health more directly than I did, but we would have faculty conferences about the students and their skills. And it was small enough that everybody pretty well knew everybody.

[Assistant] How many people were on the faculty?

[User] Oh, probably four. Four of us.

[Assistant] And how many were Peace Corps?

[User] Two American and two Ethiopian. Both of them RNs. And Mullah had gone to the American University in Beirut.

[Assistant] And Mullah was the head of the school?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh, probably four. Four of us.

[Assistant] And how many were Peace Corps?

[User] Two American and two Ethiopian. Both of them RNs. And Mullah had gone to the American University in Beirut.

[Assistant] And Mullah was the head of the school?

[User] Mm hmm.

[Assistant] So that's, yeah. So there were three Ethiopians in your work, immediate work environment.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Two American and two Ethiopian. Both of them RNs. And Mullah had gone to the American University in Beirut.

[Assistant] And Mullah was the head of the school?

[User] Mm hmm.

[Assistant] So that's, yeah. So there were three Ethiopians in your work, immediate work environment.

[User] Um.

[Assistant] The two teachers plus Mullah.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Mm hmm.

[Assistant] So that's, yeah. So there were three Ethiopians in your work, immediate work environment.

[User] Um.

[Assistant] The two teachers plus Mullah.

[User] Yeah. No. Mullah was one of those. So there were two, two of them and two of us.

[Assistant] What did you do when you weren't teaching?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Um.

[Assistant] The two teachers plus Mullah.

[User] Yeah. No. Mullah was one of those. So there were two, two of them and two of us.

[Assistant] What did you do when you weren't teaching?

[User] Preparation. Our preparation. Because the students had a lot of clinical experiences. So once we got them through the basics, and the basics were pretty basic, like teaching them how to use a telephone, proving the germ theory of disease. We'd do some experiments where you'd culture a wound or culture something dirty and put it in an incubator kind of a thing. And then put the penicillin on it and maybe see a hole where the other, where the bacterial growth was around the outside, but where the medicine was on the inside. Um, because some of them hadn't grown up with the Western concept of disease. So when I wasn't teaching, there was a preparation period. And then the nurses at the hospital were the direct supervisors of the students. But we would go and see how things were going at the various assignments. So in the afternoons, that's where you'd be, you'd be on the wards, checking students.

[Assistant] So they did classroom in the morning and then practicals in the hospital afternoons for the most part?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah. No. Mullah was one of those. So there were two, two of them and two of us.

[Assistant] What did you do when you weren't teaching?

[User] Preparation. Our preparation. Because the students had a lot of clinical experiences. So once we got them through the basics, and the basics were pretty basic, like teaching them how to use a telephone, proving the germ theory of disease. We'd do some experiments where you'd culture a wound or culture something dirty and put it in an incubator kind of a thing. And then put the penicillin on it and maybe see a hole where the other, where the bacterial growth was around the outside, but where the medicine was on the inside. Um, because some of them hadn't grown up with the Western concept of disease. So when I wasn't teaching, there was a preparation period. And then the nurses at the hospital were the direct supervisors of the students. But we would go and see how things were going at the various assignments. So in the afternoons, that's where you'd be, you'd be on the wards, checking students.

[Assistant] So they did classroom in the morning and then practicals in the hospital afternoons for the most part?

[User] Right.

[Assistant] So that put you in, you would follow, you'd be in the hospital as well. Did you get to, did you become friends with any of either the faculty or any of the staff of the hospital?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Preparation. Our preparation. Because the students had a lot of clinical experiences. So once we got them through the basics, and the basics were pretty basic, like teaching them how to use a telephone, proving the germ theory of disease. We'd do some experiments where you'd culture a wound or culture something dirty and put it in an incubator kind of a thing. And then put the penicillin on it and maybe see a hole where the other, where the bacterial growth was around the outside, but where the medicine was on the inside. Um, because some of them hadn't grown up with the Western concept of disease. So when I wasn't teaching, there was a preparation period. And then the nurses at the hospital were the direct supervisors of the students. But we would go and see how things were going at the various assignments. So in the afternoons, that's where you'd be, you'd be on the wards, checking students.

[Assistant] So they did classroom in the morning and then practicals in the hospital afternoons for the most part?

[User] Right.

[Assistant] So that put you in, you would follow, you'd be in the hospital as well. Did you get to, did you become friends with any of either the faculty or any of the staff of the hospital?

[User] Yeah, yeah. You'd go over occasionally to their homes.

[Assistant] And that wasn't awkward or?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Right.

[Assistant] So that put you in, you would follow, you'd be in the hospital as well. Did you get to, did you become friends with any of either the faculty or any of the staff of the hospital?

[User] Yeah, yeah. You'd go over occasionally to their homes.

[Assistant] And that wasn't awkward or?

[User] No. No.

[Assistant] 8 Yeah. Did you have a chance to get a sense of traditional beliefs in relation to health and body and so forth?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, yeah. You'd go over occasionally to their homes.

[Assistant] And that wasn't awkward or?

[User] No. No.

[Assistant] 8 Yeah. Did you have a chance to get a sense of traditional beliefs in relation to health and body and so forth?

[User] Yeah, occasionally. Somebody would tell a story about how somebody had been treated for this or that. Um, yeah, there was quite a little folklore. I guess we had it in training. I still have a really good booklet about some of the beliefs. For example, you know, the eyes. The flies around the eyes is a terrible problem in Ethiopia, and it leads to trachoma, which is an infection of the eyes. And so one of the, we found out that one of the local remedies or the national remedy was to put these slat slits, cut the skin and let it bleed. And that was supposed to drain out the infection, because blindness was just a terrible problem in Ethiopia. And you go into the villages and you'd see these kids with flies all over their faces and even adults who seemed to get used to it. So slitting the eyes and a lot of people walked around with those slits in their eyes.

[Assistant] And then the scars would form.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, we didn't use the word bewitched. But yeah, there were forces beyond your control that caused diseases.

[Assistant] How did you deal with that in your teaching? Obviously, you're trying to take a rational American approach. You know, this is germs do exist and so forth.

[User] Well, I think that they knew that that wasn't part of the curriculum. So I really don't remember much confrontation. Yeah. I think among themselves, they might have mixed some of the two.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] But it wasn't like, for example, later I heard, if you go down to Mali and Botswana and some of those places, they have witch doctors down there who mix up a potion. But I didn't really see much of that in Ethiopia.

[Assistant] And it wasn't any, little of it was being openly expressed in the classroom?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] But it wasn't like, for example, later I heard, if you go down to Mali and Botswana and some of those places, they have witch doctors down there who mix up a potion. But I didn't really see much of that in Ethiopia.

[Assistant] And it wasn't any, little of it was being openly expressed in the classroom?

[User] Little of it, yeah. Also, it's a great omission on my part, and I wonder today why I didn't know more about it, but you know, the female circumcision.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User]
It's practiced in Ethiopia. Now, whether it was so accepted culturally that it just wasn't brought up as a medical problem that we discussed, or whether I was just oblivious to it, that I didn't even know very much about it to be honest with you. I didn't confront that, even in the ob- gyn experiences, when the kids, when the students would accompany the home health nurse for a home delivery. And I went a couple of times, I didn't see that as a factor. Maybe it's because I just I didn't put my face right in front of the opening where the delivery was very much. But it's there and were I to go today, I would certainly bring up discussions about it in the groups.

And it's one of those cultural things, though, where you've got to be very, very cautious about disclaiming it. But you can certainly bring up some of the consequences of it. I do that today, I'm, today I'm much more able to discuss these things. I think I had some, some, I didn't want to overstep my boundaries knowing that I was bringing in a new kind of medicine for people.

[Assistant] That must have been built into training also, you know, you're defining a role with this awareness of traditional beliefs and local culture.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Little of it, yeah. Also, it's a great omission on my part, and I wonder today why I didn't know more about it, but you know, the female circumcision.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User]
It's practiced in Ethiopia. Now, whether it was so accepted culturally that it just wasn't brought up as a medical problem that we discussed, or whether I was just oblivious to it, that I didn't even know very much about it to be honest with you. I didn't confront that, even in the ob- gyn experiences, when the kids, when the students would accompany the home health nurse for a home delivery. And I went a couple of times, I didn't see that as a factor. Maybe it's because I just I didn't put my face right in front of the opening where the delivery was very much. But it's there and were I to go today, I would certainly bring up discussions about it in the groups.

And it's one of those cultural things, though, where you've got to be very, very cautious about disclaiming it. But you can certainly bring up some of the consequences of it. I do that today, I'm, today I'm much more able to discuss these things. I think I had some, some, I didn't want to overstep my boundaries knowing that I was bringing in a new kind of medicine for people.

[Assistant] That must have been built into training also, you know, you're defining a role with this awareness of traditional beliefs and local culture.

[User] Yeah, I think some of the training covered that, but I don't think it was focused on it very much.

[Assistant] You're in a more interesting crossroads of that because, you know, medicine is so specific. I mean, it's different if I'm teaching an English class. The cultural differences, you know, can be dealt with differently. But I mean, it can be just a direct clash when it comes to a science.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, I think some of the training covered that, but I don't think it was focused on it very much.

[Assistant] You're in a more interesting crossroads of that because, you know, medicine is so specific. I mean, it's different if I'm teaching an English class. The cultural differences, you know, can be dealt with differently. But I mean, it can be just a direct clash when it comes to a science.

[User] Exactly. Yeah. And um, you know, I think this open confrontation has really opened up since the sixties. For example, I remember in my early nursing days here in this country where somebody had a serious disease, you didn't always tell that person that they had that disease. You might keep it from them. So we were even suppressed in this country as far as just frankly discussing things.

[Assistant] Yeah. This was the first year you were teaching the basic courses and supervising the practicals. Did you become friends with any of the students? Was that permitted, was it appropriate?

[User] Well, not the dresser students, but almost all of us had a language teacher. So I had a Tigrinya language teacher. He was twelfth grade. He was Hilee. And Hilee and I would go for walks and into the city and he'd point out something and give me the name of it and all that. And of course, as a 12th grader, he was very interested in accelerating his English skills. So it ended up I was paying him to teach him English.

[Assistant] Yeah. Did you arrange that on your own initiative or did Peace Corps say you should do it?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Exactly. Yeah. And um, you know, I think this open confrontation has really opened up since the sixties. For example, I remember in my early nursing days here in this country where somebody had a serious disease, you didn't always tell that person that they had that disease. You might keep it from them. So we were even suppressed in this country as far as just frankly discussing things.

[Assistant] Yeah. This was the first year you were teaching the basic courses and supervising the practicals. Did you become friends with any of the students? Was that permitted, was it appropriate?

[User] Well, not the dresser students, but almost all of us had a language teacher. So I had a Tigrinya language teacher. He was twelfth grade. He was Hilee. And Hilee and I would go for walks and into the city and he'd point out something and give me the name of it and all that. And of course, as a 12th grader, he was very interested in accelerating his English skills. So it ended up I was paying him to teach him English.

[Assistant] Yeah. Did you arrange that on your own initiative or did Peace Corps say you should do it?

[User] Well, the students got handed down from one volunteer to another, and I think Hilee got handed down, as I recall, because he was readily, he was right there. I mean, I didn't have to go searching for him. But in, you know, there were 13. [tape break]

[Assistant] What finally happened to Hilee?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, not the dresser students, but almost all of us had a language teacher. So I had a Tigrinya language teacher. He was twelfth grade. He was Hilee. And Hilee and I would go for walks and into the city and he'd point out something and give me the name of it and all that. And of course, as a 12th grader, he was very interested in accelerating his English skills. So it ended up I was paying him to teach him English.

[Assistant] Yeah. Did you arrange that on your own initiative or did Peace Corps say you should do it?

[User] Well, the students got handed down from one volunteer to another, and I think Hilee got handed down, as I recall, because he was readily, he was right there. I mean, I didn't have to go searching for him. But in, you know, there were 13. [tape break]

[Assistant] What finally happened to Hilee?

[User] Well, he wrote me a letter after I got back. And he wanted me to sponsor him to come to the States. While we were there, he was interested in biking, bicycling, and he wanted to actually compete. Bicycles are kind of a luxurious form of transportation in a country that's as poor as Ethiopia. I remember learning a statistic like the average income for Ethiopian was 50 dollars a year. So there's not much money around. But he was interested in biking and I guess he was good at it and he wanted me to sponsor him so that he could eat better, so he could have more protein, more meat to eat. Which I, well, I paid him to teach me the lessons and I gave him a little bit of extra, but I didn't have a whole lot myself, so I didn't sponsor him.

[Assistant] Did you have any health problems yourself during the first year?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, the students got handed down from one volunteer to another, and I think Hilee got handed down, as I recall, because he was readily, he was right there. I mean, I didn't have to go searching for him. But in, you know, there were 13. [tape break]

[Assistant] What finally happened to Hilee?

[User] Well, he wrote me a letter after I got back. And he wanted me to sponsor him to come to the States. While we were there, he was interested in biking, bicycling, and he wanted to actually compete. Bicycles are kind of a luxurious form of transportation in a country that's as poor as Ethiopia. I remember learning a statistic like the average income for Ethiopian was 50 dollars a year. So there's not much money around. But he was interested in biking and I guess he was good at it and he wanted me to sponsor him so that he could eat better, so he could have more protein, more meat to eat. Which I, well, I paid him to teach me the lessons and I gave him a little bit of extra, but I didn't have a whole lot myself, so I didn't sponsor him.

[Assistant] Did you have any health problems yourself during the first year?

[User] No, no health problems.

[Assistant] Were you vulnerable, with the bike was it? Were bikes stolen or was security a problem at all?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, he wrote me a letter after I got back. And he wanted me to sponsor him to come to the States. While we were there, he was interested in biking, bicycling, and he wanted to actually compete. Bicycles are kind of a luxurious form of transportation in a country that's as poor as Ethiopia. I remember learning a statistic like the average income for Ethiopian was 50 dollars a year. So there's not much money around. But he was interested in biking and I guess he was good at it and he wanted me to sponsor him so that he could eat better, so he could have more protein, more meat to eat. Which I, well, I paid him to teach me the lessons and I gave him a little bit of extra, but I didn't have a whole lot myself, so I didn't sponsor him.

[Assistant] Did you have any health problems yourself during the first year?

[User] No, no health problems.

[Assistant] Were you vulnerable, with the bike was it? Were bikes stolen or was security a problem at all?

[User] No, my bike wasn't stolen. I didn't stay in that little hovel. I eventually moved in with two other women. One was Peace Corps and one was a British volunteer. And we had a, oh, we just, we never had our bike stolen. But you'd asked something else I wanted to address. Um.

[Assistant] What happened to Hilee?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, no health problems.

[Assistant] Were you vulnerable, with the bike was it? Were bikes stolen or was security a problem at all?

[User] No, my bike wasn't stolen. I didn't stay in that little hovel. I eventually moved in with two other women. One was Peace Corps and one was a British volunteer. And we had a, oh, we just, we never had our bike stolen. But you'd asked something else I wanted to address. Um.

[Assistant] What happened to Hilee?

[User] No. Oh, did I have troubles with bicycles? I actually had an accident. My chain fell off when I was going down a hill and I ended up, uh, I guess straining my rotator cuff, which is the. I'll do it on this arm. It's easier. It's the one that allows you to move your arm around like a windmill. And to this day, I have a little trouble with it. So I had that injury and I walked around like this for probably 10 years before it ever got repaired. So that's the only trouble I had with the bicycle. I guess I went for about a year without riding in a vehicle, in a car, and then I guess I got in a car. Maybe we went to Addis once in the car. I don't know. Once a year or so we'd go up to Addis Ababa for kind of a refresher thing.

[Assistant] The whole group would gather?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, my bike wasn't stolen. I didn't stay in that little hovel. I eventually moved in with two other women. One was Peace Corps and one was a British volunteer. And we had a, oh, we just, we never had our bike stolen. But you'd asked something else I wanted to address. Um.

[Assistant] What happened to Hilee?

[User] No. Oh, did I have troubles with bicycles? I actually had an accident. My chain fell off when I was going down a hill and I ended up, uh, I guess straining my rotator cuff, which is the. I'll do it on this arm. It's easier. It's the one that allows you to move your arm around like a windmill. And to this day, I have a little trouble with it. So I had that injury and I walked around like this for probably 10 years before it ever got repaired. So that's the only trouble I had with the bicycle. I guess I went for about a year without riding in a vehicle, in a car, and then I guess I got in a car. Maybe we went to Addis once in the car. I don't know. Once a year or so we'd go up to Addis Ababa for kind of a refresher thing.

[Assistant] The whole group would gather?

[User] Yeah. Yeah, I think so. That was fun.

[Assistant] So life was pretty simple. I mean, you didn't, no TV, no radio.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah. Yeah, I think so. That was fun.

[Assistant] So life was pretty simple. I mean, you didn't, no TV, no radio.

[User] Had a radio.

[Assistant] Oh, OK.

[User] I remember the night the men landed on the moon. My cat had a baby in the bed and I woke up. My feet were wet because of having the baby. So I remember the moon landing. So I had a radio. Uh, had a tape player, one of those reel-to-reel things for music. But yeah, I guess we just talked most evenings. And there was a theater in town because it had been an Italian colony. So Asmara was a more. Addis Ababa was characterized as the village, a large village, and Asmara is characterized as a city, a small city.

[Assistant] And there were restaurants


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Had a radio.

[Assistant] Oh, OK.

[User] I remember the night the men landed on the moon. My cat had a baby in the bed and I woke up. My feet were wet because of having the baby. So I remember the moon landing. So I had a radio. Uh, had a tape player, one of those reel-to-reel things for music. But yeah, I guess we just talked most evenings. And there was a theater in town because it had been an Italian colony. So Asmara was a more. Addis Ababa was characterized as the village, a large village, and Asmara is characterized as a city, a small city.

[Assistant] And there were restaurants

[User] There were restaurants, yeah, and, uh, Italian food. So you didn't have to eat Ethiopian food all the time. Now a lot of volunteers in the smaller areas of Mekelle, they ate Ethiopian food a lot. I still get tickled at this one water resources fella. He had so much trouble with Amharic in training in the Virgin Islands. I mean, he could not get the concept. A year later, we saw him at one of these recall meetings. He spoke fluent Amharic, fluent Amharic, because he was thrown into a village.

[Assistant] Live or die.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I remember the night the men landed on the moon. My cat had a baby in the bed and I woke up. My feet were wet because of having the baby. So I remember the moon landing. So I had a radio. Uh, had a tape player, one of those reel-to-reel things for music. But yeah, I guess we just talked most evenings. And there was a theater in town because it had been an Italian colony. So Asmara was a more. Addis Ababa was characterized as the village, a large village, and Asmara is characterized as a city, a small city.

[Assistant] And there were restaurants

[User] There were restaurants, yeah, and, uh, Italian food. So you didn't have to eat Ethiopian food all the time. Now a lot of volunteers in the smaller areas of Mekelle, they ate Ethiopian food a lot. I still get tickled at this one water resources fella. He had so much trouble with Amharic in training in the Virgin Islands. I mean, he could not get the concept. A year later, we saw him at one of these recall meetings. He spoke fluent Amharic, fluent Amharic, because he was thrown into a village.

[Assistant] Live or die.

[User] Well, yeah. So um yeah. Everyday life was actually pretty good. We, the water. Sometimes you'd have to save the water because it wasn't always coming through the pipes. But it wasn't a terrible problem. Hand washing the clothes. When we moved into it, when I moved in with those other two, life got pretty good because we shared so much and we had a house.

[Assistant] Did you have a servant?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, yeah. So um yeah. Everyday life was actually pretty good. We, the water. Sometimes you'd have to save the water because it wasn't always coming through the pipes. But it wasn't a terrible problem. Hand washing the clothes. When we moved into it, when I moved in with those other two, life got pretty good because we shared so much and we had a house.

[Assistant] Did you have a servant?

[User] No.

[Assistant] Oh, OK.

[User] I hired on one woman when I was in the little hovel thing, but she was like taking my. I remember she took my firewood or something, so I said, oh, that's all right. There wasn't much to do anyway around my house.

[Assistant] What did you do during vacations? There must have been breaks in the school.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No.

[Assistant] Oh, OK.

[User] I hired on one woman when I was in the little hovel thing, but she was like taking my. I remember she took my firewood or something, so I said, oh, that's all right. There wasn't much to do anyway around my house.

[Assistant] What did you do during vacations? There must have been breaks in the school.

[User] Yeah, yeah. There was a regular school year. Well, between the first and the second year, these two guys and I decided to go to Kenya and I think we wanted to climb Kilimanjaro. So I had my old army boots I remember or I got them somewhere, and an army jacket and some khaki pants. And we climbed Kilimanjaro. They had jeans and heavy jackets, and one guy had cowboy boots. And we just went up there where you go to climb Kilimanjaro and there was a team going with porters and stuff, and we had backpacks and we just latched on. And I think we probably gave them a hundred dollars, maybe, and now people spend thousands of dollars. So we climbed that and went around Nairobi. Let's see.

[Assistant] Must have seen some of the game parks.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I hired on one woman when I was in the little hovel thing, but she was like taking my. I remember she took my firewood or something, so I said, oh, that's all right. There wasn't much to do anyway around my house.

[Assistant] What did you do during vacations? There must have been breaks in the school.

[User] Yeah, yeah. There was a regular school year. Well, between the first and the second year, these two guys and I decided to go to Kenya and I think we wanted to climb Kilimanjaro. So I had my old army boots I remember or I got them somewhere, and an army jacket and some khaki pants. And we climbed Kilimanjaro. They had jeans and heavy jackets, and one guy had cowboy boots. And we just went up there where you go to climb Kilimanjaro and there was a team going with porters and stuff, and we had backpacks and we just latched on. And I think we probably gave them a hundred dollars, maybe, and now people spend thousands of dollars. So we climbed that and went around Nairobi. Let's see.

[Assistant] Must have seen some of the game parks.

[User] Uh, yeah, we did. Saw some game parks. And we even flew. And I don't remember if it was like a Christmas holiday and not summer or what, but we flew to Madagascar. These two guys. We must have been good friends. I still keep in contact with them. Yeah. So we went to Madagascar once and stayed for about a week. Where else? Within Ethiopia, there were some amazing cities that we got to see. Lalibela.

[Assistant] Yeah, I haven't seen it yet.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, yeah. There was a regular school year. Well, between the first and the second year, these two guys and I decided to go to Kenya and I think we wanted to climb Kilimanjaro. So I had my old army boots I remember or I got them somewhere, and an army jacket and some khaki pants. And we climbed Kilimanjaro. They had jeans and heavy jackets, and one guy had cowboy boots. And we just went up there where you go to climb Kilimanjaro and there was a team going with porters and stuff, and we had backpacks and we just latched on. And I think we probably gave them a hundred dollars, maybe, and now people spend thousands of dollars. So we climbed that and went around Nairobi. Let's see.

[Assistant] Must have seen some of the game parks.

[User] Uh, yeah, we did. Saw some game parks. And we even flew. And I don't remember if it was like a Christmas holiday and not summer or what, but we flew to Madagascar. These two guys. We must have been good friends. I still keep in contact with them. Yeah. So we went to Madagascar once and stayed for about a week. Where else? Within Ethiopia, there were some amazing cities that we got to see. Lalibela.

[Assistant] Yeah, I haven't seen it yet.

[User] Home of the monolithic churches. Axum, the old capital of Ethiopia and it has the stone obelisk. Yeah, that was really wonderful. And I think it's called the Church of the Queen Mary or something where the Ark of the Covenant is supposed to be sequestered and one monk devotes his whole life to guarding that.

[Assistant] You take a lot of pictures?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Home of the monolithic churches. Axum, the old capital of Ethiopia and it has the stone obelisk. Yeah, that was really wonderful. And I think it's called the Church of the Queen Mary or something where the Ark of the Covenant is supposed to be sequestered and one monk devotes his whole life to guarding that.

[Assistant] You take a lot of pictures?

[User] Not a lot. Oh yeah. One time we climbed. Another group climbed the highest mountain in Ethiopia. It's called Ras Dashen [or Ras Dejen]. And that was a 10-day trek. And that was a, that was a walk through.

[Assistant] Ten day?

[User] Yeah, that was a walk through time. I'll tell you, some of these villages were very mountainous, of course, and I think Ras Dashen is ten thousand feet high, not too high. But, you know, bartering for food with the folks and in turn giving them metal containers so that they could carry water. The metal containers were quite sought after and then we'd get, maybe they had a lamb, so they gave us part of the lamb.

[Assistant] Were there any restrictions on your travel from Peace Corps?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Not a lot. Oh yeah. One time we climbed. Another group climbed the highest mountain in Ethiopia. It's called Ras Dashen [or Ras Dejen]. And that was a 10-day trek. And that was a, that was a walk through.

[Assistant] Ten day?

[User] Yeah, that was a walk through time. I'll tell you, some of these villages were very mountainous, of course, and I think Ras Dashen is ten thousand feet high, not too high. But, you know, bartering for food with the folks and in turn giving them metal containers so that they could carry water. The metal containers were quite sought after and then we'd get, maybe they had a lamb, so they gave us part of the lamb.

[Assistant] Were there any restrictions on your travel from Peace Corps?

[User] Well, we couldn't go to south Africa. Couldn't go down there. That was our restriction. But as far as in country, no. No restrictions.

[Assistant] And Saudi Arabia or anything, but not that anyone would want to go. But who knows?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, that was a walk through time. I'll tell you, some of these villages were very mountainous, of course, and I think Ras Dashen is ten thousand feet high, not too high. But, you know, bartering for food with the folks and in turn giving them metal containers so that they could carry water. The metal containers were quite sought after and then we'd get, maybe they had a lamb, so they gave us part of the lamb.

[Assistant] Were there any restrictions on your travel from Peace Corps?

[User] Well, we couldn't go to south Africa. Couldn't go down there. That was our restriction. But as far as in country, no. No restrictions.

[Assistant] And Saudi Arabia or anything, but not that anyone would want to go. But who knows?

[User] Didn't want to go.

[Assistant] The Near East?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Didn't want to go.

[Assistant] The Near East?

[User] No, not at that time. Not that I know of. Yemen. Yemen was right across the Red Sea, but nobody ever went over there for some reason. Nobody that I know of.

[Assistant] Yeah. Yeah.

[User] And I don't even know of any, you know, you could literally take a ferry from A to B to get to the other side, but nobody that I know of ever did it. At the airport in Asmara, sometimes you'd see the Yemeni people, but I don't know anybody who tried. I guess Ethiopia was interesting for us and Kenya would have been interesting. So I think we just didn't know much about Yemen.

[Assistant] As your first year came to an end, did you do any looking back, looking forward? You know, well, I'm doing what I hope to do. Or do you recall how it was?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, not at that time. Not that I know of. Yemen. Yemen was right across the Red Sea, but nobody ever went over there for some reason. Nobody that I know of.

[Assistant] Yeah. Yeah.

[User] And I don't even know of any, you know, you could literally take a ferry from A to B to get to the other side, but nobody that I know of ever did it. At the airport in Asmara, sometimes you'd see the Yemeni people, but I don't know anybody who tried. I guess Ethiopia was interesting for us and Kenya would have been interesting. So I think we just didn't know much about Yemen.

[Assistant] As your first year came to an end, did you do any looking back, looking forward? You know, well, I'm doing what I hope to do. Or do you recall how it was?

[User] Maybe some, I don't particularly remember any decisions being made. I was getting ready to get that advanced dresser program off the ground.

[Assistant] So you knew that during the first year? They said next year you're going to.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And I don't even know of any, you know, you could literally take a ferry from A to B to get to the other side, but nobody that I know of ever did it. At the airport in Asmara, sometimes you'd see the Yemeni people, but I don't know anybody who tried. I guess Ethiopia was interesting for us and Kenya would have been interesting. So I think we just didn't know much about Yemen.

[Assistant] As your first year came to an end, did you do any looking back, looking forward? You know, well, I'm doing what I hope to do. Or do you recall how it was?

[User] Maybe some, I don't particularly remember any decisions being made. I was getting ready to get that advanced dresser program off the ground.

[Assistant] So you knew that during the first year? They said next year you're going to.

[User] Mm hmm.

[Assistant] Whose decision was that?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Maybe some, I don't particularly remember any decisions being made. I was getting ready to get that advanced dresser program off the ground.

[Assistant] So you knew that during the first year? They said next year you're going to.

[User] Mm hmm.

[Assistant] Whose decision was that?

[User] It was the Ministry of Health who wanted it.

[Assistant] OK. And how were you picked for it?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Mm hmm.

[Assistant] Whose decision was that?

[User] It was the Ministry of Health who wanted it.

[Assistant] OK. And how were you picked for it?

[User] I had the degree, a bachelor's degree. So I had quite as much education as anybody.

[Assistant] So how was it different when you went into the advanced dresser program?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] It was the Ministry of Health who wanted it.

[Assistant] OK. And how were you picked for it?

[User] I had the degree, a bachelor's degree. So I had quite as much education as anybody.

[Assistant] So how was it different when you went into the advanced dresser program?

[User] Well, it was different because I had nothing. I mean, no syllabus. No, they didn't. There weren't very many textbooks, you know, so. So I talked to some of the doctors and got the kids in on some of their physical assessment. So this one doctor taught a physical assessment program for us. But I had to, you know, do the transcribing. And in those days it was on a typewriter. I would usually type up the lesson after he gave it, and then we would send them into the emergency room and they'd learn suturing and triage in the emergency room.

[Assistant] Yeah. Now these were people who had completed the basic dresser course?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, it was different because I had nothing. I mean, no syllabus. No, they didn't. There weren't very many textbooks, you know, so. So I talked to some of the doctors and got the kids in on some of their physical assessment. So this one doctor taught a physical assessment program for us. But I had to, you know, do the transcribing. And in those days it was on a typewriter. I would usually type up the lesson after he gave it, and then we would send them into the emergency room and they'd learn suturing and triage in the emergency room.

[Assistant] Yeah. Now these were people who had completed the basic dresser course?

[User] Yeah, and they'd been in the field a couple of years so they were coming back.

[Assistant] Oh, OK.

[User] So they were an older group.

[Assistant] Yeah. Did you enjoy that more?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, and they'd been in the field a couple of years so they were coming back.

[Assistant] Oh, OK.

[User] So they were an older group.

[Assistant] Yeah. Did you enjoy that more?

[User] Uh, maybe. Maybe. Somewhat more.

[Assistant] And your living pretty much continued with the three of you living together?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Uh, maybe. Maybe. Somewhat more.

[Assistant] And your living pretty much continued with the three of you living together?

[User] Yeah, that was.

[Assistant] Comfortable circumstance.

[User] Yeah, one was a home EC teacher and the other was an English teacher, I think. And we had, you know, our group of 13 and we had some satellite villages with some of the volunteers would come in. So we'd see each other on holidays or even weekends.

[Assistant] Did you feel that you were getting enough of exposure to Ethiopian culture or Eritrean culture in what you were doing and the role you were playing? Or was it an issue at all?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, one was a home EC teacher and the other was an English teacher, I think. And we had, you know, our group of 13 and we had some satellite villages with some of the volunteers would come in. So we'd see each other on holidays or even weekends.

[Assistant] Did you feel that you were getting enough of exposure to Ethiopian culture or Eritrean culture in what you were doing and the role you were playing? Or was it an issue at all?

[User] I don't think it was an issue. I was very task oriented, you know, I was there to do the dresser program. That's pretty consuming. You know, I taught in Tennessee a couple of years too and it's very consuming to be a teacher.

[Assistant] Oh yes.

[User] Prepare. I mean, you can't just stand up there unprepared. So, yeah, so that was. And trying to get enough resources to put a program together. I don't know my legacy of what I left. I'm not sure my syllabuses were used subsequent to that.

[Assistant] So you ended up developing syllabuses for that, the advanced course?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I don't think it was an issue. I was very task oriented, you know, I was there to do the dresser program. That's pretty consuming. You know, I taught in Tennessee a couple of years too and it's very consuming to be a teacher.

[Assistant] Oh yes.

[User] Prepare. I mean, you can't just stand up there unprepared. So, yeah, so that was. And trying to get enough resources to put a program together. I don't know my legacy of what I left. I'm not sure my syllabuses were used subsequent to that.

[Assistant] So you ended up developing syllabuses for that, the advanced course?

[User] Yeah, kind of an outline.

[Assistant] Were you replaced when you left? Was there another PCV that came in?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Prepare. I mean, you can't just stand up there unprepared. So, yeah, so that was. And trying to get enough resources to put a program together. I don't know my legacy of what I left. I'm not sure my syllabuses were used subsequent to that.

[Assistant] So you ended up developing syllabuses for that, the advanced course?

[User] Yeah, kind of an outline.

[Assistant] Were you replaced when you left? Was there another PCV that came in?

[User] You know, there wasn't an overlap. I didn't meet her. I didn't meet anybody.

[Assistant] Yeah. So how did it play out as you came to the end?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, kind of an outline.

[Assistant] Were you replaced when you left? Was there another PCV that came in?

[User] You know, there wasn't an overlap. I didn't meet her. I didn't meet anybody.

[Assistant] Yeah. So how did it play out as you came to the end?

[User] Um.

[Assistant] Did you get a class?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] You know, there wasn't an overlap. I didn't meet her. I didn't meet anybody.

[Assistant] Yeah. So how did it play out as you came to the end?

[User] Um.

[Assistant] Did you get a class?

[User] Well, the school year was over.

[Assistant] Yeah, go ahead.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Um.

[Assistant] Did you get a class?

[User] Well, the school year was over.

[Assistant] Yeah, go ahead.

[User] The school year was over so, you know, it's just time to go home. My two years were up.

[Assistant] But you got one group through the advanced dresser course?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, the school year was over.

[Assistant] Yeah, go ahead.

[User] The school year was over so, you know, it's just time to go home. My two years were up.

[Assistant] But you got one group through the advanced dresser course?

[User] Mm hmm.

[Assistant] You created a syllabus. But you didn't think in terms of what might happen the next year. That's not an accusation. I mean, whether you'd be replaced or what would happen to your syllabus or?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] The school year was over so, you know, it's just time to go home. My two years were up.

[Assistant] But you got one group through the advanced dresser course?

[User] Mm hmm.

[Assistant] You created a syllabus. But you didn't think in terms of what might happen the next year. That's not an accusation. I mean, whether you'd be replaced or what would happen to your syllabus or?

[User] Um, let's see. So that was '70. Yeah, they were still sending people there. Yeah, I think I thought that I would be replaced, but I didn't look into it a lot. I wasn't into the politics of it.

[Assistant] So you also didn't particularly think, well, maybe I'll do a third year so this thing really gets established.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Mm hmm.

[Assistant] You created a syllabus. But you didn't think in terms of what might happen the next year. That's not an accusation. I mean, whether you'd be replaced or what would happen to your syllabus or?

[User] Um, let's see. So that was '70. Yeah, they were still sending people there. Yeah, I think I thought that I would be replaced, but I didn't look into it a lot. I wasn't into the politics of it.

[Assistant] So you also didn't particularly think, well, maybe I'll do a third year so this thing really gets established.

[User] No, I don't think so. I think I, two years was enough for me.

[Assistant] And was there a life after Peace Corps?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, I don't think so. I think I, two years was enough for me.

[Assistant] And was there a life after Peace Corps?

[User] Oh yeah. Three months later, I was in Vietnam.

[Assistant] Oh.

[User] I joined the Army. Joined the Army again. Well, I got back here very restless.

[Assistant] Came back to San Diego?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh yeah. Three months later, I was in Vietnam.

[Assistant] Oh.

[User] I joined the Army. Joined the Army again. Well, I got back here very restless.

[Assistant] Came back to San Diego?

[User] Yeah, to this house. And uh, I just couldn't focus on anything very much. So I said, mom and dad, I'm going back in the Army. I'm going to sign up for Vietnam.

[Assistant] Oh, interesting. But it must have been.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I joined the Army. Joined the Army again. Well, I got back here very restless.

[Assistant] Came back to San Diego?

[User] Yeah, to this house. And uh, I just couldn't focus on anything very much. So I said, mom and dad, I'm going back in the Army. I'm going to sign up for Vietnam.

[Assistant] Oh, interesting. But it must have been.

[User] But my folks, they're like, OK.

[Assistant] Yeah. And for you, I mean, were you in turmoil I mean?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, to this house. And uh, I just couldn't focus on anything very much. So I said, mom and dad, I'm going back in the Army. I'm going to sign up for Vietnam.

[Assistant] Oh, interesting. But it must have been.

[User] But my folks, they're like, OK.

[Assistant] Yeah. And for you, I mean, were you in turmoil I mean?

[User] No, no. You know, I said, you know, there's still this war going on. I'm a nurse and that's fine. I guess Ethiopia was one thing, but let's go on to the next thing now.

[Assistant] So the common strain is, I mean, is your sense of yourself as a nurse with this competence in that?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] But my folks, they're like, OK.

[Assistant] Yeah. And for you, I mean, were you in turmoil I mean?

[User] No, no. You know, I said, you know, there's still this war going on. I'm a nurse and that's fine. I guess Ethiopia was one thing, but let's go on to the next thing now.

[Assistant] So the common strain is, I mean, is your sense of yourself as a nurse with this competence in that?

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] There's clearly great need in lots of settings.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, no. You know, I said, you know, there's still this war going on. I'm a nurse and that's fine. I guess Ethiopia was one thing, but let's go on to the next thing now.

[Assistant] So the common strain is, I mean, is your sense of yourself as a nurse with this competence in that?

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] There's clearly great need in lots of settings.

[User] Yeah. Oh yeah. Yeah.

[Assistant] And it was comfortable enough going back into the Army? Was that the point at which you, after Vietnam, you finally decided to stay in?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] There's clearly great need in lots of settings.

[User] Yeah. Oh yeah. Yeah.

[Assistant] And it was comfortable enough going back into the Army? Was that the point at which you, after Vietnam, you finally decided to stay in?

[User] Well, I decided to, but they didn't let me.

[Assistant] Oh, that's right.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, I decided to, but they didn't let me.

[Assistant] Oh, that's right.

[User]
So then I went back to, uh. While I was in Ethiopia, we had a visitor, a very interesting visitor. Her last name was Luce I think. She was related to Clare Boothe Luce somewhere. And this family had endowed Emory in a nursing program, and she told me that there was this program at Emory Hospital and the master’s degree. So through her influence, I applied and got accepted to Emory. So when I finished the Peace Corps. How did that work? Oh yeah, I think that Emory was full that year, the program I wanted, it was rehabilitation nursing. And yeah, I tentatively planned to go right into my master's program, but I didn't get accepted.

So I said, well, I'll go back in the Army and then come back to that, which I did. When I set two years block of time for the Army, one year in Vietnam and one year at Fort Campbell, Kentucky. Fort Knox, Kentucky. Then it was time to get out. They weren't keeping nurses in. They literally said, no, you can't stay beyond your two-year contract in the Army. So then I reapplied to Emory and got in this time. So then I taught. I finished that one year and I taught there. And then I went to Germany to visit a nurse friend of mine, and I ended up staying, working in Germany for the Department of Defense at a high school. I was a high school nurse at Frankfurt for three years.

[Assistant] Oh, OK.

[User] Came back and joined the Army again, age of 40, and stayed until I retired.

[Assistant] Did you do any teaching in your last Army stretch?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User]
So then I went back to, uh. While I was in Ethiopia, we had a visitor, a very interesting visitor. Her last name was Luce I think. She was related to Clare Boothe Luce somewhere. And this family had endowed Emory in a nursing program, and she told me that there was this program at Emory Hospital and the master’s degree. So through her influence, I applied and got accepted to Emory. So when I finished the Peace Corps. How did that work? Oh yeah, I think that Emory was full that year, the program I wanted, it was rehabilitation nursing. And yeah, I tentatively planned to go right into my master's program, but I didn't get accepted.

So I said, well, I'll go back in the Army and then come back to that, which I did. When I set two years block of time for the Army, one year in Vietnam and one year at Fort Campbell, Kentucky. Fort Knox, Kentucky. Then it was time to get out. They weren't keeping nurses in. They literally said, no, you can't stay beyond your two-year contract in the Army. So then I reapplied to Emory and got in this time. So then I taught. I finished that one year and I taught there. And then I went to Germany to visit a nurse friend of mine, and I ended up staying, working in Germany for the Department of Defense at a high school. I was a high school nurse at Frankfurt for three years.

[Assistant] Oh, OK.

[User] Came back and joined the Army again, age of 40, and stayed until I retired.

[Assistant] Did you do any teaching in your last Army stretch?

[User] Formal program teaching? No, because I had done some teaching, but I didn't have a degree in education, nursing education. So I was clinical.

[Assistant] Was there any continuing connection, involvement, communication with Ethiopia once you? Or Eritrea?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Formal program teaching? No, because I had done some teaching, but I didn't have a degree in education, nursing education. So I was clinical.

[Assistant] Was there any continuing connection, involvement, communication with Ethiopia once you? Or Eritrea?

[User] Well, I wrote to Hilee for a while, but when he wanted to come here, I think I was sort of afraid of that. So I. In 1984, somehow I got wind that some Eritreans wanted to come to this country, the International Refugee Committee or World, Church World Relief. I somehow I got wind that Church World Relief that I could sponsor a refugee. So I went down there and sure enough, they had a list. And I said I want to sponsor an Eritrean female to come here. So I did. They first wanted to put a Hmong family in my house of 11, a family of 11. Now I'm still in the Army at this time.

[Assistant] Oh, OK.

[User] So this is when I was stationed at Fitzsimons Army Hospital in Denver. So I did. I was assigned a refugee. Turned out she was a political refugee, couldn't go back to Ethiopia.

[Assistant] She was Eritrean?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah. And we've kept up with each other.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] So that's pretty much my post experience with Eritreans. There is a community in San Diego and I know they have. For example, there was a 30 year war between Eritrea and Ethiopia, and most astonishing. By the way, there was no older woman in that labor room.

[Assistant] Oh.

[User] I saw her. And when Astaire looked at me, she thought I was an angel because I was all in white. She told her husband an angel visited me. And anyway, I guess the other nurse that told me about her told her, but um. What was I saying? Before that, my follow up here.

[Assistant] Continuing involvement. The war.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] So that's pretty much my post experience with Eritreans. There is a community in San Diego and I know they have. For example, there was a 30 year war between Eritrea and Ethiopia, and most astonishing. By the way, there was no older woman in that labor room.

[Assistant] Oh.

[User] I saw her. And when Astaire looked at me, she thought I was an angel because I was all in white. She told her husband an angel visited me. And anyway, I guess the other nurse that told me about her told her, but um. What was I saying? Before that, my follow up here.

[Assistant] Continuing involvement. The war.

[User] Oh yeah. The war. The most amazing thing is that little Eritrea, which is a country of three or four million people, won over Ethiopia, a country of, well, when I was there, they said the population's anywhere between 12 and 21 million. Because they're all these little villages, they just couldn't get a hold on the population.

[Assistant] I'm curious. When you went back into the Army having done the Peace Corps, did you mention that to your peers? I mean, how did people deal with War Corps, Peace Corps kind of thing?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I saw her. And when Astaire looked at me, she thought I was an angel because I was all in white. She told her husband an angel visited me. And anyway, I guess the other nurse that told me about her told her, but um. What was I saying? Before that, my follow up here.

[Assistant] Continuing involvement. The war.

[User] Oh yeah. The war. The most amazing thing is that little Eritrea, which is a country of three or four million people, won over Ethiopia, a country of, well, when I was there, they said the population's anywhere between 12 and 21 million. Because they're all these little villages, they just couldn't get a hold on the population.

[Assistant] I'm curious. When you went back into the Army having done the Peace Corps, did you mention that to your peers? I mean, how did people deal with War Corps, Peace Corps kind of thing?

[User] Well, they didn't have to deal with as much as I did. You know, I began to see the real futility of war. I became an environmentalist because it's, you know, the, uh, the abusiveness to the environment of the war and the Army is terrible. And so my perspective was really one of, hey, you know, what about conservation? What about negotiation? So I seem to always have a history of being kind of outside the fence of whatever group I'm in. Growing up with the military, our roots weren't in these places. I was the outsider. And then I was the outsider in the Peace Corps because of my war and in the Army, I was the outsider because of my Peace Corps.

[Assistant] I was wondering whether people looked at you askance because.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh yeah. The war. The most amazing thing is that little Eritrea, which is a country of three or four million people, won over Ethiopia, a country of, well, when I was there, they said the population's anywhere between 12 and 21 million. Because they're all these little villages, they just couldn't get a hold on the population.

[Assistant] I'm curious. When you went back into the Army having done the Peace Corps, did you mention that to your peers? I mean, how did people deal with War Corps, Peace Corps kind of thing?

[User] Well, they didn't have to deal with as much as I did. You know, I began to see the real futility of war. I became an environmentalist because it's, you know, the, uh, the abusiveness to the environment of the war and the Army is terrible. And so my perspective was really one of, hey, you know, what about conservation? What about negotiation? So I seem to always have a history of being kind of outside the fence of whatever group I'm in. Growing up with the military, our roots weren't in these places. I was the outsider. And then I was the outsider in the Peace Corps because of my war and in the Army, I was the outsider because of my Peace Corps.

[Assistant] I was wondering whether people looked at you askance because.

[User] A little bit. And what I say is, is I think the Peace Corps probably influenced my thinking.

[Assistant] Oh, I was going to ask that.