[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] To send off our, our daughter too. And we arranged to meet there. It must have been that way.

[Assistant] Was it direct telephone service?

[User] I think, yeah, but it was expensive. I think there was the mayor. Let's see. I think they had a phone in their home, yeah.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] But that was the only phone available in the whole town. I mean, if there was any phone, it was in his house.

[Assistant] Yeah. So you're starting this, another school year.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] But that was the only phone available in the whole town. I mean, if there was any phone, it was in his house.

[Assistant] Yeah. So you're starting this, another school year.

[User] Uh huh. But not fully, um, committed to what I was doing the first year because I knew it was going to be ending, you know. I don't remember spending as much time at school. It seems like I, I went there a lot, but there were other things that were going on with the mayor. They were planning a, oh, let's see. No, it couldn't have been February. When did I? There was a major, another major fiesta. And when was it? It was August, September. It couldn't have been their town fiesta. But I was a major part of the fiesta because I learned the tinikling, you know, this dance that you do between the bamboo poles?

[Assistant] Oh, yes.

[User] And I learned it fully, just like a native person knew it, you know. I knew the entire dance. And I, and this teacher, the sixth grade teacher, was my partner. And she had known it before already, but she had to brush up on some of the dance steps. But we learned it so beautifully, so well. And I was the Peace Corps in the dance at midnight, and it had just started to rain a little bit. There was a little bit of rain at the time, and but we did the entire dance. And there was just an upsurge after, when the last strains of the music, which was live music with mandolins and, I mean, it was purely just classic old traditional Filipino everything with the native dance, you know, the dress and everything and.

[Assistant] And you were in traditional dress?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] In traditional, well, the hoosee, it's called barong tagalog. It was a shirt made out, woven from pineapple fiber. And it's almost see through, but very formal. It's almost like the guayabera of Mexico.

[Assistant] Yes, yes.

[User] It's like the Mexican wedding shirt and long sleeved with cufflinks, not buttons, but cufflinks, and double over sleeve and very elaborate, um.

[Assistant] Embroidery?

[User] Hand embroidery, embroidered front, big collar, all the way down with a split on the sides all the way down to mid knee. I mean not mid knee, but mid thigh. Beautiful. It's a beautiful kind of shirt. And you have to wear that to do the dance. So.

[Assistant] How long does the dance last, I mean?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] It's like the Mexican wedding shirt and long sleeved with cufflinks, not buttons, but cufflinks, and double over sleeve and very elaborate, um.

[Assistant] Embroidery?

[User] Hand embroidery, embroidered front, big collar, all the way down with a split on the sides all the way down to mid knee. I mean not mid knee, but mid thigh. Beautiful. It's a beautiful kind of shirt. And you have to wear that to do the dance. So.

[Assistant] How long does the dance last, I mean?

[User] It seemed like it was endless. Oh, I'd say a good 10 minutes or 15 minutes even possibly.

[Assistant] It's very intricate.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Hand embroidery, embroidered front, big collar, all the way down with a split on the sides all the way down to mid knee. I mean not mid knee, but mid thigh. Beautiful. It's a beautiful kind of shirt. And you have to wear that to do the dance. So.

[Assistant] How long does the dance last, I mean?

[User] It seemed like it was endless. Oh, I'd say a good 10 minutes or 15 minutes even possibly.

[Assistant] It's very intricate.

[User] Very intricate. You have to, it's not only dancing in and out, which is a major thing just to get that board in. But then you're dancing through, turning and circling back, going around, going around. There's about ten different pairs of sticks in a circle, sort of. And you dance, the whole group dances around the whole thing once, at one point. And beautiful music, I mean I love that music. It's a one, two, three beat and it's just wonderful.

[Assistant] So that must have been kind of a high point.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] For, for doing, doing it, you know, going through with it. Roger didn't, he didn't want to have anything to do with it. But I don't know why, but he wouldn't do it. But I wanted to do it. I just thought this would be so wonderful to learn this.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] And there are schoolchildren, American schoolchildren now, who will never forget it. Because I came back and I was a teacher, I have been a teacher for the last 30 years and, you know, every class that I could possibly fit it in, I would teach that dance to them.

[Assistant] Uh huh.

[User] Or at least part of it, you know, at least 1 or 2 steps so they could learn that. So I have pictures of that, too, of kids, sixth graders in California and Mexican kids in Nogales, where I taught, learning the tinikling. It's quite important to me.

[Assistant] Uh. It must have been downhill from there to, as you're getting near the end of your. Well, did you have any thought of extending, I mean?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And there are schoolchildren, American schoolchildren now, who will never forget it. Because I came back and I was a teacher, I have been a teacher for the last 30 years and, you know, every class that I could possibly fit it in, I would teach that dance to them.

[Assistant] Uh huh.

[User] Or at least part of it, you know, at least 1 or 2 steps so they could learn that. So I have pictures of that, too, of kids, sixth graders in California and Mexican kids in Nogales, where I taught, learning the tinikling. It's quite important to me.

[Assistant] Uh. It must have been downhill from there to, as you're getting near the end of your. Well, did you have any thought of extending, I mean?

[User] Well.

[Assistant] I mean, I know mom was waiting.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, my parents were waiting. I just, I thought, well, I've committed, I've succeeded in my commitment of the two years. I thought I can always come back to it or join another group. So, but I do want to go home. But the major thing was, I wanted to not just take the Peace Corps ticket from, on Pan Am, from Manila to Los Angeles or San Francisco or whatever.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] I traded in my ticket when I got to Manila, you know, after it was all over, after I left my town.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] And I remember distinctly going to the travel agent and saying, I want to apply this, whatever it was $200 to, from here to Bangkok to blah, blah, blah, all the way. I wanted to go around the earth because I was so into traveling. So I did that. I went all the way around the other way and came back through New York. So that was the major thing in my mind. I didn't think of going back to the Peace Corps exactly. I wanted to travel. That was, that was my freedom there to travel and see more, because Hong Kong just tantalized me. I thought, Hong Kong, I got there, you know, I actually saw that place. So I want to see Bangkok and all these wonderful names I've heard about. I wanted to be there.

[Assistant] Even though you had this incredible experience that very few people do of living in the village and.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I traded in my ticket when I got to Manila, you know, after it was all over, after I left my town.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] And I remember distinctly going to the travel agent and saying, I want to apply this, whatever it was $200 to, from here to Bangkok to blah, blah, blah, all the way. I wanted to go around the earth because I was so into traveling. So I did that. I went all the way around the other way and came back through New York. So that was the major thing in my mind. I didn't think of going back to the Peace Corps exactly. I wanted to travel. That was, that was my freedom there to travel and see more, because Hong Kong just tantalized me. I thought, Hong Kong, I got there, you know, I actually saw that place. So I want to see Bangkok and all these wonderful names I've heard about. I wanted to be there.

[Assistant] Even though you had this incredible experience that very few people do of living in the village and.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] Was there talk of your being replaced, you and Roger, as you came near the end?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And I remember distinctly going to the travel agent and saying, I want to apply this, whatever it was $200 to, from here to Bangkok to blah, blah, blah, all the way. I wanted to go around the earth because I was so into traveling. So I did that. I went all the way around the other way and came back through New York. So that was the major thing in my mind. I didn't think of going back to the Peace Corps exactly. I wanted to travel. That was, that was my freedom there to travel and see more, because Hong Kong just tantalized me. I thought, Hong Kong, I got there, you know, I actually saw that place. So I want to see Bangkok and all these wonderful names I've heard about. I wanted to be there.

[Assistant] Even though you had this incredible experience that very few people do of living in the village and.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] Was there talk of your being replaced, you and Roger, as you came near the end?

[User] No, they didn't. Nothing was said about that. I, in fact, I think we asked was somebody going to take our place, and the Filipinos asked, is somebody going to come here? And we didn't know, but we thought not.

[Assistant] What, by, let's see, by '64. What had happened with the Peace Corps? Were the numbers continuing to grow?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, they didn't. Nothing was said about that. I, in fact, I think we asked was somebody going to take our place, and the Filipinos asked, is somebody going to come here? And we didn't know, but we thought not.

[Assistant] What, by, let's see, by '64. What had happened with the Peace Corps? Were the numbers continuing to grow?

[User] They were still having people in training, but they had changed. Let's see. The idea of the Peace Corps was not to train in Hawaii or Waipio Valley or Hilo or whatever. They had in-service or in- country training, so they were bringing people to Manila to do training. But I never met anybody there.

[Assistant] Right.

[User] But that's where they were doing it in, in country or even in, you know, close to the sites, closer to the sites.

[Assistant] While you were a volunteer in '63, '64, do you have any idea of the total number of volunteers in the Philippines?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] They were still having people in training, but they had changed. Let's see. The idea of the Peace Corps was not to train in Hawaii or Waipio Valley or Hilo or whatever. They had in-service or in- country training, so they were bringing people to Manila to do training. But I never met anybody there.

[Assistant] Right.

[User] But that's where they were doing it in, in country or even in, you know, close to the sites, closer to the sites.

[Assistant] While you were a volunteer in '63, '64, do you have any idea of the total number of volunteers in the Philippines?

[User] It seems in the hundreds, I think 700 were there when I was there. It was the largest group of any country that they had sent people to.

[Assistant] But you didn't feel that where every place you turned, you were bumping into volunteers?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] It seems in the hundreds, I think 700 were there when I was there. It was the largest group of any country that they had sent people to.

[Assistant] But you didn't feel that where every place you turned, you were bumping into volunteers?

[User] Not at all, not where I was stationed. I very seldom saw any unless we invited them to come, or in Manila.

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah.

[User] Sometimes in Bacolod, the Filipinos in stores or something would ask, are you Peace Corps? Are you the Peace Corps? You know, because they had seen so many coming through, but I never really bumped into many, except in Camp Brotherhood or in Manila.

[Assistant] And do you have any sense of what the overall attitude of the Filipinos was toward Peace Corps? I mean, judging from your village and?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Not at all, not where I was stationed. I very seldom saw any unless we invited them to come, or in Manila.

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah.

[User] Sometimes in Bacolod, the Filipinos in stores or something would ask, are you Peace Corps? Are you the Peace Corps? You know, because they had seen so many coming through, but I never really bumped into many, except in Camp Brotherhood or in Manila.

[Assistant] And do you have any sense of what the overall attitude of the Filipinos was toward Peace Corps? I mean, judging from your village and?

[User]
The local people, they really loved us. You know, they, they got to really be friends with us. And. [tape break]

The Philippine government, I think, got what they wanted. They got people to, almost free, teach their teachers, you know, upgrade their teaching skills over a period of time. I think that happened in many projects that I heard about that, you know, they had an in-depth teacher trainings and even some community development in some projects that were not in my project. And so the Philippines gained a lot, and I think the government was very favorable, favorable to the whole thing. The local people who understood what we were trying to do, like the teaching groups, were very favorable. I think we left with a good impression.

[Assistant] In your two year experience, did you ever encounter someone who said, why don't you go home? You mentioned the one little incident on a bus.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Sometimes in Bacolod, the Filipinos in stores or something would ask, are you Peace Corps? Are you the Peace Corps? You know, because they had seen so many coming through, but I never really bumped into many, except in Camp Brotherhood or in Manila.

[Assistant] And do you have any sense of what the overall attitude of the Filipinos was toward Peace Corps? I mean, judging from your village and?

[User]
The local people, they really loved us. You know, they, they got to really be friends with us. And. [tape break]

The Philippine government, I think, got what they wanted. They got people to, almost free, teach their teachers, you know, upgrade their teaching skills over a period of time. I think that happened in many projects that I heard about that, you know, they had an in-depth teacher trainings and even some community development in some projects that were not in my project. And so the Philippines gained a lot, and I think the government was very favorable, favorable to the whole thing. The local people who understood what we were trying to do, like the teaching groups, were very favorable. I think we left with a good impression.

[Assistant] In your two year experience, did you ever encounter someone who said, why don't you go home? You mentioned the one little incident on a bus.

[User] Never locally. I never met anybody who was antagonistic to me personally or to the idea of a Peace Corps. I never met anybody like that. Just, did I tell it already on tape about the bus situation?

[Assistant] Yeah. You mentioned that. Before I forget it, you, when we were talking about the rainy season and the rains came at 2:00 in the afternoon, there was a, some incident or anecdote you wanted to?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User]
The local people, they really loved us. You know, they, they got to really be friends with us. And. [tape break]

The Philippine government, I think, got what they wanted. They got people to, almost free, teach their teachers, you know, upgrade their teaching skills over a period of time. I think that happened in many projects that I heard about that, you know, they had an in-depth teacher trainings and even some community development in some projects that were not in my project. And so the Philippines gained a lot, and I think the government was very favorable, favorable to the whole thing. The local people who understood what we were trying to do, like the teaching groups, were very favorable. I think we left with a good impression.

[Assistant] In your two year experience, did you ever encounter someone who said, why don't you go home? You mentioned the one little incident on a bus.

[User] Never locally. I never met anybody who was antagonistic to me personally or to the idea of a Peace Corps. I never met anybody like that. Just, did I tell it already on tape about the bus situation?

[Assistant] Yeah. You mentioned that. Before I forget it, you, when we were talking about the rainy season and the rains came at 2:00 in the afternoon, there was a, some incident or anecdote you wanted to?

[User] Oh, yes. Well, I was teaching science as part of my project, and this third grade teacher, um. Well, first of all, I had put up a weather station, and so I measured the rainfall and the wind flow and temperatures and kept records and took it into the classroom to show the kids and would bring them down to the weather station. It was down away from the school.

[Assistant] Where did you get the equipment?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh, you have done this before, I can tell, because this is an emotional moment. Yeah. It was November 2nd, and it was All Saints Day. All Souls Day, I'm sorry.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User]
And so it was almost a school holiday, I think. I mean, nobody was in, was go to school that day because everybody was at the cemetery and the whole town was there. All the kids that I had taught throughout the year, or the ones that I knew from the school, and the teachers and families that lived next door or around the area, were all there, and we had said our goodbyes. I had sent home a big thing, you know, shipment, you know, freight on freight, surface freight, of all my possessions and everything. Had my suitcase, got on the bus that takes nine hours to get to Dumaguete or, I'm sorry, Bacolod City. And the only way out of town was by the cemetery. And I was, let's see, was Roger with me? I think he was not with me. He had either gone ahead or I think he had gone ahead the day before.

So I was alone on this bus with other Filipinos, though, and the bus went by this cemetery and all the people, you know, I was at the window and I was waving at them and they were waving at me. And they were, you could see they had food and they were dusting off the, the cemetery plots and things. And I just broke down. I just completely broke down.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] And then I had this nine hour ride to go through on bumpy rock roads, you know, they were rocks so they wouldn't erode away. And just so I had all that time to think about all the things that had passed the last two years.

[Assistant] Had the mayor given a going away party?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh, yeah. You bet. It was a two day affair almost.

[Assistant] Uh huh.

[User] But the one evening that they invited all the teachers and all in native dress. They gave us mounds and mounds of presents, I mean, things to remember them by, you know, homemade things or things that were typically Filipino, you know, carvings and homemade clothing for my, for parents and friends, you know, all, just all kinds of things. And it was, these fiestas seemed to last into all hours of the night always. And so this lasted well, well past midnight. Roger and I both, you know, being feted there. And they gave us each a, um, what do you call them? I'm giving my languages mixed up. Um, roosters, because a big thing in the Philippines is cockfighting. So they gave us cocks and we had to pretend to have them fighting, but they didn't have the knives on them. They would just wanted us to experience being the owners of the roosters, the cockfight.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] And we had to make speeches. We had to sing songs. We had to dance with every teacher, you know, the female teachers. They took pictures. The mayor gave a long speech, how important it was that we were there. And we had to give speeches of farewell and remembrance and all that, and they kept plying us with San Miguel beer the whole time. But that was quite a, quite a thing. Quite a farewell.

[Assistant] Do you recall if there was a termination conference in Manila of your group as you finished up?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And we had to make speeches. We had to sing songs. We had to dance with every teacher, you know, the female teachers. They took pictures. The mayor gave a long speech, how important it was that we were there. And we had to give speeches of farewell and remembrance and all that, and they kept plying us with San Miguel beer the whole time. But that was quite a, quite a thing. Quite a farewell.

[Assistant] Do you recall if there was a termination conference in Manila of your group as you finished up?

[User] Yes, there was. We had to report there by, you know, November 3rd or whatever it was, or sixth, and they de-, what do they call it? Not deselected but?

[Assistant] Debriefed?

[User] Debriefed us, yes. And, you know, I don't know what they talked about, but it was a way of parting from that, from that experience.

[Assistant] Had the group, uh, shrunk a lot? I mean, do you recall if many people hadn't completed the two years or?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, there was. We had to report there by, you know, November 3rd or whatever it was, or sixth, and they de-, what do they call it? Not deselected but?

[Assistant] Debriefed?

[User] Debriefed us, yes. And, you know, I don't know what they talked about, but it was a way of parting from that, from that experience.

[Assistant] Had the group, uh, shrunk a lot? I mean, do you recall if many people hadn't completed the two years or?

[User] Most people did. One girl went home because of some harassment that she felt from one of, a Filipino man that was stalking her or something, and she had to leave. That's the only one I particularly remember. I think maybe another person had gone home, but I don't know why.

[Assistant] Yeah. Yeah. And the group getting back together, do you recall? Were you playing can you top this with stories or?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Most people did. One girl went home because of some harassment that she felt from one of, a Filipino man that was stalking her or something, and she had to leave. That's the only one I particularly remember. I think maybe another person had gone home, but I don't know why.

[Assistant] Yeah. Yeah. And the group getting back together, do you recall? Were you playing can you top this with stories or?

[User] I'm sure we did. I remember going to restaurants and bars with people in my group, you know, small groups, not the whole group.

[Assistant] Right.

[User] Because we had already gone off into cliques by then. The people in the north were their group, and the southern people were our people, and we didn't know them as well as we did two years before. You know, they had totally different experiences.

[Assistant] Yeah. So you then had your ticket to get you around the world.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I'm sure we did. I remember going to restaurants and bars with people in my group, you know, small groups, not the whole group.

[Assistant] Right.

[User] Because we had already gone off into cliques by then. The people in the north were their group, and the southern people were our people, and we didn't know them as well as we did two years before. You know, they had totally different experiences.

[Assistant] Yeah. So you then had your ticket to get you around the world.

[User] Mm hmm.

[Assistant] At some point did you think about life after the Peace Corps, I mean, while you were still there?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Was it American Information Agency?

[Assistant] The USIS?

[User] It could have been that. Something related to.

[Assistant] CIA.

[User] Could have been CIA related. It could have been. I'm not sure, but they. But I was.

[Assistant] There was always supposed to be a separation.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Mm hmm.

[Assistant] But, okay.

[User] Between the Peace Corps and the CIA, you mean?

[Assistant] Oh yeah.

[User] Or between the USIA and the CIA?

[Assistant] No, Peace Corps and the CIA.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Or between the USIA and the CIA?

[Assistant] No, Peace Corps and the CIA.

[User] There was a separation, but because they made it very clear that it was, you would volunteer from the Peace Corps to do that. You would be, there would not be Peace Corps. I mean, it was definitely not Peace Corps. They just wanted people to do some information, you know, teaching, somehow giving Vietnamese people an idea about America.

[Assistant] Right.

[User] That's all I knew about it, and I considered that. And I considered it. They said it would be a commitment of 14 months or something. And I thought, no, I want to go home. I want to take this trip first. That was primary in my mind. Go home. And then I would consider doing that. I actually considered doing that.

[Assistant] Yeah. Did you, did you think about schooling or?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] That's all I knew about it, and I considered that. And I considered it. They said it would be a commitment of 14 months or something. And I thought, no, I want to go home. I want to take this trip first. That was primary in my mind. Go home. And then I would consider doing that. I actually considered doing that.

[Assistant] Yeah. Did you, did you think about schooling or?

[User] But then after I got home, I was in America again, and I thought I'd better do something with this. I have two years of teaching, and I had heard by then that the Peace Corps counted as two years of teaching experience. So all I needed was a fifth year, you know, to get my certificate in California.

[Assistant] Ah, okay.

[User] And so I immediately did that because I got home in December of '64. And by sixty, the September of '65, I was teaching in a regular American school then, in Los Angeles. So within a less than a year, I was, you know, I took that whole spring semester and summer and got a fifth year of a certificate.

[Assistant] Did you get an MAT or?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] But then after I got home, I was in America again, and I thought I'd better do something with this. I have two years of teaching, and I had heard by then that the Peace Corps counted as two years of teaching experience. So all I needed was a fifth year, you know, to get my certificate in California.

[Assistant] Ah, okay.

[User] And so I immediately did that because I got home in December of '64. And by sixty, the September of '65, I was teaching in a regular American school then, in Los Angeles. So within a less than a year, I was, you know, I took that whole spring semester and summer and got a fifth year of a certificate.

[Assistant] Did you get an MAT or?

[User] No, it was just a, they called it a fifth year of specialization in education. And so it wasn't even an advanced degree. It was just a graduate degree certification in California.

[Assistant] State certification. I didn't know that.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, it was just a, they called it a fifth year of specialization in education. And so it wasn't even an advanced degree. It was just a graduate degree certification in California.

[Assistant] State certification. I didn't know that.

[User] And I began teaching a sixth grade in Woodland Hills, California. And I didn't even think back to going to Vietnam. I thought by then it was really getting terrific over there, and I think I had advice from family and friends, don't even think of that, because there's a war over there. And I should have known that when I was in the hepatitis, hepatitis ward, because these guys were from the war and I got to see other wards where, you know, they had, they were, um.

[Assistant] Amputees.

[User] Amputees and other things. So I knew there was something going on over there.

[Assistant] Right. When you came back, you were 24, 25?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And I began teaching a sixth grade in Woodland Hills, California. And I didn't even think back to going to Vietnam. I thought by then it was really getting terrific over there, and I think I had advice from family and friends, don't even think of that, because there's a war over there. And I should have known that when I was in the hepatitis, hepatitis ward, because these guys were from the war and I got to see other wards where, you know, they had, they were, um.

[Assistant] Amputees.

[User] Amputees and other things. So I knew there was something going on over there.

[Assistant] Right. When you came back, you were 24, 25?

[User] I had just turned 25.

[Assistant] Were you clear of the draft or were you still subject to the draft?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Amputees and other things. So I knew there was something going on over there.

[Assistant] Right. When you came back, you were 24, 25?

[User] I had just turned 25.

[Assistant] Were you clear of the draft or were you still subject to the draft?

[User] I was still subject to the draft. But as a teacher, if I was full time teacher, I was still not draftable at that point.

[Assistant] That's right, yeah.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I had just turned 25.

[Assistant] Were you clear of the draft or were you still subject to the draft?

[User] I was still subject to the draft. But as a teacher, if I was full time teacher, I was still not draftable at that point.

[Assistant] That's right, yeah.

[User] So I was sort of safe in that sense. And that was a big reason why I went right into teaching.

[Assistant] Was it a, was it a special program recruiting volunteers to come into urban schools?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I was still subject to the draft. But as a teacher, if I was full time teacher, I was still not draftable at that point.

[Assistant] That's right, yeah.

[User] So I was sort of safe in that sense. And that was a big reason why I went right into teaching.

[Assistant] Was it a, was it a special program recruiting volunteers to come into urban schools?

[User] I was not in that program, no.

[Assistant] This was just.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] So I was sort of safe in that sense. And that was a big reason why I went right into teaching.

[Assistant] Was it a, was it a special program recruiting volunteers to come into urban schools?

[User] I was not in that program, no.

[Assistant] This was just.

[User] I was on my own.

[Assistant] On your own and.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I was not in that program, no.

[Assistant] This was just.

[User] I was on my own.

[Assistant] On your own and.

[User] Applied to a district.

[Assistant] And why did you pick Los Angeles?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I was on my own.

[Assistant] On your own and.

[User] Applied to a district.

[Assistant] And why did you pick Los Angeles?

[User] That's. That was where I had grown up.

[Assistant] Oh, okay. Okay.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Applied to a district.

[Assistant] And why did you pick Los Angeles?

[User] That's. That was where I had grown up.

[Assistant] Oh, okay. Okay.

[User] And I, for some reason, let's see. I, I checked all of the school districts around, but this one seemed to be hiring. It was a new district, and they needed new teachers. [phone rings] Ken, are you there? Oh, he got it. Okay. And so I was immediately hired, conditional on getting that certificate in the mail, you know, that I had. Because it took them rigmarole and red tape in Sacramento to get it to you. But I was provisional until I got that certificate, and I had already started teaching.

[Assistant] Did they give you salary credit for your two years in the Peace Corps?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] That's. That was where I had grown up.

[Assistant] Oh, okay. Okay.

[User] And I, for some reason, let's see. I, I checked all of the school districts around, but this one seemed to be hiring. It was a new district, and they needed new teachers. [phone rings] Ken, are you there? Oh, he got it. Okay. And so I was immediately hired, conditional on getting that certificate in the mail, you know, that I had. Because it took them rigmarole and red tape in Sacramento to get it to you. But I was provisional until I got that certificate, and I had already started teaching.

[Assistant] Did they give you salary credit for your two years in the Peace Corps?

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] So you started at the third step then?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And I, for some reason, let's see. I, I checked all of the school districts around, but this one seemed to be hiring. It was a new district, and they needed new teachers. [phone rings] Ken, are you there? Oh, he got it. Okay. And so I was immediately hired, conditional on getting that certificate in the mail, you know, that I had. Because it took them rigmarole and red tape in Sacramento to get it to you. But I was provisional until I got that certificate, and I had already started teaching.

[Assistant] Did they give you salary credit for your two years in the Peace Corps?

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] So you started at the third step then?

[User] Yes. So that was an advantage really.

[Assistant] As you began, did you then expect teaching was going to be your career?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] So you started at the third step then?

[User] Yes. So that was an advantage really.

[Assistant] As you began, did you then expect teaching was going to be your career?

[User] I sort of thought it was.

[Assistant] Yeah. I mean, sometimes we don't really choose careers, they happen.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes. So that was an advantage really.

[Assistant] As you began, did you then expect teaching was going to be your career?

[User] I sort of thought it was.

[Assistant] Yeah. I mean, sometimes we don't really choose careers, they happen.

[User] Right, they happen to you. But I enjoyed the process of teaching very much. And so I was a dedicated teacher already.

[Assistant] Yeah. At did, or in your first months back, did you have it in the back of your mind that you might want to return to the Philippines sometime?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I sort of thought it was.

[Assistant] Yeah. I mean, sometimes we don't really choose careers, they happen.

[User] Right, they happen to you. But I enjoyed the process of teaching very much. And so I was a dedicated teacher already.

[Assistant] Yeah. At did, or in your first months back, did you have it in the back of your mind that you might want to return to the Philippines sometime?

[User] Definitely. I was intending to go back. I still was corresponding with people through letters, and I wanted to go back. And eventually, you know, within a short time frame, maybe within 5 or 10 years, I would go back.

[Assistant] But the sense of going back on a visit, not going back.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Right, they happen to you. But I enjoyed the process of teaching very much. And so I was a dedicated teacher already.

[Assistant] Yeah. At did, or in your first months back, did you have it in the back of your mind that you might want to return to the Philippines sometime?

[User] Definitely. I was intending to go back. I still was corresponding with people through letters, and I wanted to go back. And eventually, you know, within a short time frame, maybe within 5 or 10 years, I would go back.

[Assistant] But the sense of going back on a visit, not going back.

[User] Right, just to visit. I was, I was already within the first few years of teaching, I knew that I was not going to be a Peace Corps volunteer again in, you know, strictly Peace Corps.

[Assistant] Did you maintain communication with people from the village?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Definitely. I was intending to go back. I still was corresponding with people through letters, and I wanted to go back. And eventually, you know, within a short time frame, maybe within 5 or 10 years, I would go back.

[Assistant] But the sense of going back on a visit, not going back.

[User] Right, just to visit. I was, I was already within the first few years of teaching, I knew that I was not going to be a Peace Corps volunteer again in, you know, strictly Peace Corps.

[Assistant] Did you maintain communication with people from the village?

[User] Yes, for years.

[Assistant] Did any of them come to the U.S.?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Right, just to visit. I was, I was already within the first few years of teaching, I knew that I was not going to be a Peace Corps volunteer again in, you know, strictly Peace Corps.

[Assistant] Did you maintain communication with people from the village?

[User] Yes, for years.

[Assistant] Did any of them come to the U.S.?

[User] Only the daughter of the mayor, and I had, I saw her one other time. She went to Chicago, but she came through Los Angeles on her way to the Philippines again. And I saw her. And I saw another person that I had known in the Philippines who came to Los Angeles just on a visit.

[Assistant] When you initially came home, I mean, you, you had just had this incredible experience. It had some bumps along the way, but clearly you ended it on, with a, on a kind of high. How did that play back home with your family, your friends, and then when you went back to school?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I thought, what is wrong with America? We don't talk to each other. We don't. They don't. You Americans are not like the Filipinos. You don't hug us. You know, you don't say, come over to my house and have a merienda and let's have something to eat. You know, Americans are very cold people, and I just couldn't get over that.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] You know, in my, in my viewpoint then, in my mind, we were cold, you know, money grabbing, cold, uncommunicative people. And I couldn't get over that. And I was here. I had 10,000 slides and diaries and all these clothes that they had given me and things to show off here's what the Philippines is like. And nobody wanted to listen. You know, they, their eyes would glaze over. And no, we don't have time to do any more slides. And, you know, I thought, there's something wrong here. What's wrong with me, or what's wrong with America, you know?

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] That was an emotional low for me to try to get through. And that, and it still is. I'm still, you know, I am so happy to see you. This is 40 years later.

[Assistant] But, uh, then as you began teaching. Did you teach, were you an English teacher?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] You know, in my, in my viewpoint then, in my mind, we were cold, you know, money grabbing, cold, uncommunicative people. And I couldn't get over that. And I was here. I had 10,000 slides and diaries and all these clothes that they had given me and things to show off here's what the Philippines is like. And nobody wanted to listen. You know, they, their eyes would glaze over. And no, we don't have time to do any more slides. And, you know, I thought, there's something wrong here. What's wrong with me, or what's wrong with America, you know?

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] That was an emotional low for me to try to get through. And that, and it still is. I'm still, you know, I am so happy to see you. This is 40 years later.

[Assistant] But, uh, then as you began teaching. Did you teach, were you an English teacher?

[User] I was a sixth grade regular, you know, every, every subject. Spelling, from spelling through math, through social studies. Heavy on the social studies because I had lots to tell them about social studies.

[Assistant] So you began finding ways to integrate your Philippine experience into your teaching.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] That was an emotional low for me to try to get through. And that, and it still is. I'm still, you know, I am so happy to see you. This is 40 years later.

[Assistant] But, uh, then as you began teaching. Did you teach, were you an English teacher?

[User] I was a sixth grade regular, you know, every, every subject. Spelling, from spelling through math, through social studies. Heavy on the social studies because I had lots to tell them about social studies.

[Assistant] So you began finding ways to integrate your Philippine experience into your teaching.

[User] Yes, definitely.

[Assistant] Whether it was, fit in the curriculum or not.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I was a sixth grade regular, you know, every, every subject. Spelling, from spelling through math, through social studies. Heavy on the social studies because I had lots to tell them about social studies.

[Assistant] So you began finding ways to integrate your Philippine experience into your teaching.

[User] Yes, definitely.

[Assistant] Whether it was, fit in the curriculum or not.

[User] Right. I just made it fit, you know?

[Assistant] Yeah, well, I was a teacher.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, definitely.

[Assistant] Whether it was, fit in the curriculum or not.

[User] Right. I just made it fit, you know?

[Assistant] Yeah, well, I was a teacher.

[User] Right. Yeah. You just, there's so much you want to tell them and about the bigger world and, uh. Yes.

[Assistant] Well, then talking, speaking 40 years after the fact, what do you think was the impact on your life of having been in the Peace Corps?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Right. I just made it fit, you know?

[Assistant] Yeah, well, I was a teacher.

[User] Right. Yeah. You just, there's so much you want to tell them and about the bigger world and, uh. Yes.

[Assistant] Well, then talking, speaking 40 years after the fact, what do you think was the impact on your life of having been in the Peace Corps?

[User] I think getting to know the bigger, the broader world, that America is really a small place compared to how people really live in the rest of the world. The, you know, the, the things they don't have, or at least then, maybe it's all changed now. But, you know, just not having water running into your bathroom, or you don't even have a bathroom. So many people in the world don't have that, and that, that, just every day I'm so grateful.

[Assistant] And has it, has it affected choices you've made in your life after?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] It was combined with the railroad. They had one square mile of railroad land that was federal government and one square mile of Navajo land every square mile along the road there. So and this, they had built a dormitory school, a huge school that was, oh, 5 or 600 kids.

[Assistant] Name?

[User] First grade through sixth grade. You want to hear the name? Okay. Dzilth-Na-O-Dith-Hle. I'll say it again. Dzilth-Na-O-Dith-Hle.

[Assistant] Okay.

[User] And it means the turning mountain, because it was built at the base of this mesa that was round like a horseshoe. And people in Navajo, this is a whole other cultural thing in Navajo, when you ride by it on a horse, it looks like it's turning with you. So they gave it the name in Navajo, The Turning Mountain. So anyway, brand new school.

[Assistant] Is it near Farmington?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And it means the turning mountain, because it was built at the base of this mesa that was round like a horseshoe. And people in Navajo, this is a whole other cultural thing in Navajo, when you ride by it on a horse, it looks like it's turning with you. So they gave it the name in Navajo, The Turning Mountain. So anyway, brand new school.

[Assistant] Is it near Farmington?

[User] Yes, 40 miles south of Farmington on Highway 44.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] So I, I just, I was absolutely in glory again. I was in the Peace Corps again in my mind. I was teaching a fifth grade class, but it was teaching English as a second language, mostly.

[Assistant] It was a boarding school?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, 40 miles south of Farmington on Highway 44.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] So I, I just, I was absolutely in glory again. I was in the Peace Corps again in my mind. I was teaching a fifth grade class, but it was teaching English as a second language, mostly.

[Assistant] It was a boarding school?

[User] A boarding school. They would grab these sobbing five year olds away from their mothers almost in those days. This was in 1969, '70, the '69-'70 school year. They would. And I was a part of it that summer, going out with a teacher who had been in another school. Going out in a car on dirt, dirty, bumpy roads and going into very small areas where there were hogans and just a small group of people, which is the traditional way of living in Navajo. And they would ask how many children they have and any new children this year, and who's going to be five? And they would tell them, sign them up right there. And the parents had to bring the student to the school, leave them off, and say goodbye for until Christmas. Five year olds. And they would cry for two weeks. And they were in a dormitory with non Navajo people. Although some of the aides and people were Navajo, but they were completely different, no familiarity.

[Assistant] Part of the idea was to deculturalize.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes. And it was still going on in the early '70s. Can you imagine? So I was part of that for one whole year, and for personal selfish reasons, I loved it. I was at the end of a road. You couldn't get out of there. There were blizzards sometimes. It was wonderful. I was teaching English as a second language. I was learning Navajo from a minister, what do you call him? A missionary. And I was just loving everything about it, except the BIA. I couldn't take the BIA and the principal. I hope he hears this somehow, or it gets back to the government, that he was a Mormon. He was narrow minded. He had been in the army and reached a certain GS level, like 14. So they put him in as a principal. He knew nothing about education, nothing about Navajos, nothing about children, nothing about anything. He was a miserable creep. And we all thought that. All of us teachers.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] And we couldn't wait to get out of there. I mean, I couldn't. 70 percent of the people left. This was the first year. It had started with all new teachers, 70 people, 70 percent left.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] And I did too. I couldn't take it.

[Assistant] Yeah. So, next adventure.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And we couldn't wait to get out of there. I mean, I couldn't. 70 percent of the people left. This was the first year. It had started with all new teachers, 70 people, 70 percent left.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] And I did too. I couldn't take it.

[Assistant] Yeah. So, next adventure.

[User] So then I went back to school myself and got a master's degree in education and went on from there, teaching and teaching and teaching in all different places.

[Assistant] Yeah. And you did find a way to get back to the Philippines or?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I had sort of planned after retiring to do that. But then the whole world changed, and I don't think I'll ever get back there. I really do not see myself getting back there.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] I have changed. I mean, I have aged so much and they have changed so much that I wouldn't know anybody, even the mayor's son that I got along with pretty well who, we were pretty close buddies. And even that teacher I worked with, you know, they'd be 60 years old now or more.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] I wouldn't know them.

[Assistant] And is it in the area where there have been serious political problems?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I have changed. I mean, I have aged so much and they have changed so much that I wouldn't know anybody, even the mayor's son that I got along with pretty well who, we were pretty close buddies. And even that teacher I worked with, you know, they'd be 60 years old now or more.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] I wouldn't know them.

[Assistant] And is it in the area where there have been serious political problems?

[User] No, pretty far from there. And that was in, for much further south.

[Assistant] What would you, uh, what would you say to a young person today as far as joining the Peace Corps?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh, I'd say do it. I would go for it. I would, yes, even though it's chancy to get on a plane even, if you're 20 years old or 22 and you're, you know, you want to see the world, I would say do that and learn something from the Peace Corps. I mean, you know, that they can train you to do something. Or maybe, I don't know how they're doing it now, but maybe you already have worked in computers for three years. Go teach somebody else in the world to do that.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] I would fully. I keep recommending people, you know, younger people to do that, even older people who have retired.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] I told them, why don't you just think, consider that since you have nothing else to do and you're not going to play golf all your life.

[Assistant] We can. Oh. Is there anything else you would like to add? And you know, the tape is going into the archive about your Peace Corps experience.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] My early twenties.

[Assistant] Okay, right out of college?

[User] Didn't graduate.

[Assistant] Okay, so you went in without a degree?

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] Yes. Okay, terrific. And let's talk about who you were. Let's back up.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Didn't graduate.

[Assistant] Okay, so you went in without a degree?

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] Yes. Okay, terrific. And let's talk about who you were. Let's back up.

[User] I was in college.

[Assistant] You were in college?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] Yes. Okay, terrific. And let's talk about who you were. Let's back up.

[User] I was in college.

[Assistant] You were in college?

[User] Yes, I was in college at the time. And after a couple of years of college, I realized I needed to find some direction. So I took a break from college and joined the Peace Corps.

[Assistant] What an interesting way to take time out and figure out what's important to you.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I was in college.

[Assistant] You were in college?

[User] Yes, I was in college at the time. And after a couple of years of college, I realized I needed to find some direction. So I took a break from college and joined the Peace Corps.

[Assistant] What an interesting way to take time out and figure out what's important to you.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] We'll get back to that.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, I was in college at the time. And after a couple of years of college, I realized I needed to find some direction. So I took a break from college and joined the Peace Corps.

[Assistant] What an interesting way to take time out and figure out what's important to you.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] We'll get back to that.

[User] Okay.

[Assistant] Where did you grow up? Where were you born?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Okay.

[Assistant] Where did you grow up? Where were you born?

[User] I was born in Appleton, Wisconsin. At age six, we moved to a small town called Thorpe, Wisconsin?

[Assistant] Near Appleton?

[User] No, it's more near Eau Claire.

[Assistant] Okay. Actually, I might mention that we're doing this interview in a place where neither one of us lives. We each drove 2 hours to a central meeting point, and we are in Tomah, Wisconsin, which is quite new to me.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I was born in Appleton, Wisconsin. At age six, we moved to a small town called Thorpe, Wisconsin?

[Assistant] Near Appleton?

[User] No, it's more near Eau Claire.

[Assistant] Okay. Actually, I might mention that we're doing this interview in a place where neither one of us lives. We each drove 2 hours to a central meeting point, and we are in Tomah, Wisconsin, which is quite new to me.

[User] Okay.

[Assistant] Drove through sleet and snow in April.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, it's more near Eau Claire.

[Assistant] Okay. Actually, I might mention that we're doing this interview in a place where neither one of us lives. We each drove 2 hours to a central meeting point, and we are in Tomah, Wisconsin, which is quite new to me.

[User] Okay.

[Assistant] Drove through sleet and snow in April.

[User] Exactly. Yeah, you never know up here.

[Assistant] That's right. That's right. Okay. So you grew up in Thorpe.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Okay.

[Assistant] Drove through sleet and snow in April.

[User] Exactly. Yeah, you never know up here.

[Assistant] That's right. That's right. Okay. So you grew up in Thorpe.

[User] Thorpe, Wisconsin, yes.

[Assistant] And talk a little bit about your family. What did your parents do?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Exactly. Yeah, you never know up here.

[Assistant] That's right. That's right. Okay. So you grew up in Thorpe.

[User] Thorpe, Wisconsin, yes.

[Assistant] And talk a little bit about your family. What did your parents do?

[User] Well, my dad was a insurance salesman. He had his own office and he sold for independent line, or he was independent and sold for other lines. My mother was a Catholic school teacher. I think she pretty much taught like sixth, seventh, eighth grade throughout her career. So the upper grades, the grades were one through eight there. Then she became principal of the school after a while and then she retired.

[Assistant] All right. Ah, I can't even imagine it would be like to be the kid of the principal.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Thorpe, Wisconsin, yes.

[Assistant] And talk a little bit about your family. What did your parents do?

[User] Well, my dad was a insurance salesman. He had his own office and he sold for independent line, or he was independent and sold for other lines. My mother was a Catholic school teacher. I think she pretty much taught like sixth, seventh, eighth grade throughout her career. So the upper grades, the grades were one through eight there. Then she became principal of the school after a while and then she retired.

[Assistant] All right. Ah, I can't even imagine it would be like to be the kid of the principal.

[User] I was pretty old by then. I was now nowhere near school age then.

[Assistant] Okay. You didn't have to.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, my dad was a insurance salesman. He had his own office and he sold for independent line, or he was independent and sold for other lines. My mother was a Catholic school teacher. I think she pretty much taught like sixth, seventh, eighth grade throughout her career. So the upper grades, the grades were one through eight there. Then she became principal of the school after a while and then she retired.

[Assistant] All right. Ah, I can't even imagine it would be like to be the kid of the principal.

[User] I was pretty old by then. I was now nowhere near school age then.

[Assistant] Okay. You didn't have to.

[User] No, no. She was my teacher in fourth grade.

[Assistant] Oh, my goodness. You must have been proud.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I was pretty old by then. I was now nowhere near school age then.

[Assistant] Okay. You didn't have to.

[User] No, no. She was my teacher in fourth grade.

[Assistant] Oh, my goodness. You must have been proud.

[User] Yeah. Yeah.

[Assistant] And you had siblings?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, no. She was my teacher in fourth grade.

[Assistant] Oh, my goodness. You must have been proud.

[User] Yeah. Yeah.

[Assistant] And you had siblings?

[User] Yes, I have two brothers and two sisters.

[Assistant] Where are you in the lineup?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah. Yeah.

[Assistant] And you had siblings?

[User] Yes, I have two brothers and two sisters.

[Assistant] Where are you in the lineup?

[User] I'm the oldest.

[Assistant] You're the oldest.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, I have two brothers and two sisters.

[Assistant] Where are you in the lineup?

[User] I'm the oldest.

[Assistant] You're the oldest.

[User] Yes, I'm the oldest.

[Assistant] Yeah. So you went to, then did you go to, you went to the Catholic school where your mother taught?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I'm the oldest.

[Assistant] You're the oldest.

[User] Yes, I'm the oldest.

[Assistant] Yeah. So you went to, then did you go to, you went to the Catholic school where your mother taught?

[User] In Thorpe. Until eighth grade.

[Assistant] Right, right. And then?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, I'm the oldest.

[Assistant] Yeah. So you went to, then did you go to, you went to the Catholic school where your mother taught?

[User] In Thorpe. Until eighth grade.

[Assistant] Right, right. And then?

[User] High school in Thorpe.

[Assistant] Uh huh. Public high school?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] In Thorpe. Until eighth grade.

[Assistant] Right, right. And then?

[User] High school in Thorpe.

[Assistant] Uh huh. Public high school?

[User] Yeah, public high school.

[Assistant] And I'm thinking about a family with five kids. Could you all cram into one car? Pretty tight.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] High school in Thorpe.

[Assistant] Uh huh. Public high school?

[User] Yeah, public high school.

[Assistant] And I'm thinking about a family with five kids. Could you all cram into one car? Pretty tight.

[User] We had two cars.

[Assistant] You had two cars. Were you, did you take family vacations?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, public high school.

[Assistant] And I'm thinking about a family with five kids. Could you all cram into one car? Pretty tight.

[User] We had two cars.

[Assistant] You had two cars. Were you, did you take family vacations?

[User] Once in a while, yeah.

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah. And, um. Oh, the light just went off.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Once in a while, yeah.

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah. And, um. Oh, the light just went off.

[User] That's okay. It's because nobody's moving around I guess.

[Assistant] We can.

[User] It's okay.

[Assistant] It's all right. We're sitting by a window here. I'm glad we chose the seat by the window.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] That's okay. It's because nobody's moving around I guess.

[Assistant] We can.

[User] It's okay.

[Assistant] It's all right. We're sitting by a window here. I'm glad we chose the seat by the window.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] I'm wondering if you ever had a chance to do any international travel with your family?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] It's okay.

[Assistant] It's all right. We're sitting by a window here. I'm glad we chose the seat by the window.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] I'm wondering if you ever had a chance to do any international travel with your family?

[User] Not with my family, no. I went to Germany on a semester abroad program when I was at Stevens Point in college.

[Assistant] Yeah. And what did you, when you were in high school, did you study Spanish?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] I'm wondering if you ever had a chance to do any international travel with your family?

[User] Not with my family, no. I went to Germany on a semester abroad program when I was at Stevens Point in college.

[Assistant] Yeah. And what did you, when you were in high school, did you study Spanish?

[User] No.

[Assistant] No. Did you have any foreign language at all?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Not with my family, no. I went to Germany on a semester abroad program when I was at Stevens Point in college.

[Assistant] Yeah. And what did you, when you were in high school, did you study Spanish?

[User] No.

[Assistant] No. Did you have any foreign language at all?

[User] None.

[Assistant] No. And your parents spoke only English?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No.

[Assistant] No. Did you have any foreign language at all?

[User] None.

[Assistant] No. And your parents spoke only English?

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah, yeah. So what kind of kid were you in high school? Did you play sports? Did you?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] None.

[Assistant] No. And your parents spoke only English?

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah, yeah. So what kind of kid were you in high school? Did you play sports? Did you?

[User] I played sports. I was an average student, you know, the normal, pretty much whatever normal kid is.

[Assistant] Regular kid, yeah, yeah.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah, yeah. So what kind of kid were you in high school? Did you play sports? Did you?

[User] I played sports. I was an average student, you know, the normal, pretty much whatever normal kid is.

[Assistant] Regular kid, yeah, yeah.

[User] I played football, yeah.

[Assistant] Oh, yeah. I'm looking at your shirt. Is that a G for the Green Bay Packers?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I played sports. I was an average student, you know, the normal, pretty much whatever normal kid is.

[Assistant] Regular kid, yeah, yeah.

[User] I played football, yeah.

[Assistant] Oh, yeah. I'm looking at your shirt. Is that a G for the Green Bay Packers?

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] All right, so sports are still important.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I played football, yeah.

[Assistant] Oh, yeah. I'm looking at your shirt. Is that a G for the Green Bay Packers?

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] All right, so sports are still important.

[User] Well, the Packers are anyway.

[Assistant] Yes, of course. We are in Wisconsin.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] All right, so sports are still important.

[User] Well, the Packers are anyway.

[Assistant] Yes, of course. We are in Wisconsin.

[User] Yeah. Yeah.

[Assistant] And I'm wondering, when you had, did you do summer jobs when you were high school?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, the Packers are anyway.

[Assistant] Yes, of course. We are in Wisconsin.

[User] Yeah. Yeah.

[Assistant] And I'm wondering, when you had, did you do summer jobs when you were high school?

[User] Oh, yes. I worked for my dad's friends who owned farms. And so we did, I did, made hay and took care of cattle, planted crops.

[Assistant] Oh, that's terrific. So you knew.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah. Yeah.

[Assistant] And I'm wondering, when you had, did you do summer jobs when you were high school?

[User] Oh, yes. I worked for my dad's friends who owned farms. And so we did, I did, made hay and took care of cattle, planted crops.

[Assistant] Oh, that's terrific. So you knew.

[User] During the summers in high school.

[Assistant] How to move around the farm.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh, yes. I worked for my dad's friends who owned farms. And so we did, I did, made hay and took care of cattle, planted crops.

[Assistant] Oh, that's terrific. So you knew.

[User] During the summers in high school.

[Assistant] How to move around the farm.

[User] Yeah, I learned it. By the time I was a senior I could do quite a few things, but when I was a freshman, I couldn't do that much.

[Assistant] But you learned on the job.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] During the summers in high school.

[Assistant] How to move around the farm.

[User] Yeah, I learned it. By the time I was a senior I could do quite a few things, but when I was a freshman, I couldn't do that much.

[Assistant] But you learned on the job.

[User] Yeah, I learned on the job.

[Assistant] Good for you. That's great. That's a rich background.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, I learned it. By the time I was a senior I could do quite a few things, but when I was a freshman, I couldn't do that much.

[Assistant] But you learned on the job.

[User] Yeah, I learned on the job.

[Assistant] Good for you. That's great. That's a rich background.

[User] Yeah, definitely.

[Assistant] So then you went to, you left Thorpe and you went to Stevens Point, Wisconsin. Went to the University of Wisconsin- Stevens Point for a couple of years.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, I learned on the job.

[Assistant] Good for you. That's great. That's a rich background.

[User] Yeah, definitely.

[Assistant] So then you went to, you left Thorpe and you went to Stevens Point, Wisconsin. Went to the University of Wisconsin- Stevens Point for a couple of years.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] And did your study abroad experience happened then before you join the Peace Corps?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, definitely.

[Assistant] So then you went to, you left Thorpe and you went to Stevens Point, Wisconsin. Went to the University of Wisconsin- Stevens Point for a couple of years.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] And did your study abroad experience happened then before you join the Peace Corps?

[User] Yes, it did.

[Assistant] Talk about that a little bit. You went to Germany?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, it did.

[Assistant] Talk about that a little bit. You went to Germany?

[User] Yes. Well, it was kind of a last-minute decision. I heard a friend or two of mine were going and then I inquired to see if there was any openings left. And there were. And then I decided to go through the interview process to go on the semester abroad.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] Because I was interested in traveling and learning in a different country and seeing what that was like.

[Assistant] Good for you. So even at that early age of probably what, 18, 19?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes. Well, it was kind of a last-minute decision. I heard a friend or two of mine were going and then I inquired to see if there was any openings left. And there were. And then I decided to go through the interview process to go on the semester abroad.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] Because I was interested in traveling and learning in a different country and seeing what that was like.

[Assistant] Good for you. So even at that early age of probably what, 18, 19?

[User] I was a sophomore.

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah. You already had this curiosity about other places.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Because I was interested in traveling and learning in a different country and seeing what that was like.

[Assistant] Good for you. So even at that early age of probably what, 18, 19?

[User] I was a sophomore.

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah. You already had this curiosity about other places.

[User] Oh yeah, much earlier than that.

[Assistant]
Did you have, earlier than that you were into travel.

Curious.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I was a sophomore.

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah. You already had this curiosity about other places.

[User] Oh yeah, much earlier than that.

[Assistant]
Did you have, earlier than that you were into travel.

Curious.

[User] Did not travel but, yeah.

[Assistant] Yeah. Did you speak German when you went there?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh yeah, much earlier than that.

[Assistant]
Did you have, earlier than that you were into travel.

Curious.

[User] Did not travel but, yeah.

[Assistant] Yeah. Did you speak German when you went there?

[User] No, it wasn't a requirement. The teachers we had at that time spoke English and taught in English.

[Assistant] Where in Germany?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, it wasn't a requirement. The teachers we had at that time spoke English and taught in English.

[Assistant] Where in Germany?

[User] We stayed in Munich and then we took classes in Munich and on weekends we had Eurail passes and we could travel.

[Assistant] Wonderful.

[User] Yeah, so that was nice.

[Assistant] That's a good education.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] We stayed in Munich and then we took classes in Munich and on weekends we had Eurail passes and we could travel.

[Assistant] Wonderful.

[User] Yeah, so that was nice.

[Assistant] That's a good education.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] So you traveled to other countries in Europe?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, so that was nice.

[Assistant] That's a good education.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] So you traveled to other countries in Europe?

[User] I traveled to the next-door countries. We tried to go to Italy, but there was a train strike, so we had to turn around and come back. And then I did make it into Austria just fine. Um, I think Austria is the only one really. We went, did go to East Germany for one day, so we crossed through Checkpoint Charlie. We could stay there one day. We had to take a certain amount of money and spend it there. So most of us just spent it at restaurants.

[Assistant] But how interesting that you got over to East Germany. The wall was still up then.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh, yeah. So that was pretty amazing to have to go through that screening process at Checkpoint Charlie by the East German officials.

[Assistant] Yeah. Yeah.

[User] It was serious business. No fooling around. No. Ask the, answer the question and move on when they tell you to. that's about it.

[Assistant] Yes, sir.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] And then, um, and then you went back to Stevens Point. Or was that your last semester?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] It was serious business. No fooling around. No. Ask the, answer the question and move on when they tell you to. that's about it.

[Assistant] Yes, sir.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] And then, um, and then you went back to Stevens Point. Or was that your last semester?

[User] It was only like a few months. It was like from August until beginning of December, one semester.

[Assistant] Right. Then you finished up that year at University of Wisconsin?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] And then, um, and then you went back to Stevens Point. Or was that your last semester?

[User] It was only like a few months. It was like from August until beginning of December, one semester.

[Assistant] Right. Then you finished up that year at University of Wisconsin?

[User] I did finish the year, yeah.

[Assistant] And were you studying any foreign languages at University of Wisconsin?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] It was only like a few months. It was like from August until beginning of December, one semester.

[Assistant] Right. Then you finished up that year at University of Wisconsin?

[User] I did finish the year, yeah.

[Assistant] And were you studying any foreign languages at University of Wisconsin?

[User] No, I didn't, no.

[Assistant] Okay. All right. So you got, you got it into your head to join the Peace Corps, did you know? Did you know any other people who were in the Peace Corps?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I did finish the year, yeah.

[Assistant] And were you studying any foreign languages at University of Wisconsin?

[User] No, I didn't, no.

[Assistant] Okay. All right. So you got, you got it into your head to join the Peace Corps, did you know? Did you know any other people who were in the Peace Corps?

[User] No. There were a couple of us. My group of friends, there were two others who wanted to join the Peace Corps. They had just graduated from college, and they suggested that I do that too, to apply, because maybe it would be an option for me since they knew I wasn't going to continue. So then I applied and they were accepted to go to Guatemala and I was accepted to go to Honduras.

[Assistant] How interesting. Were you disappointed that you didn't get to go with them?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, I didn't, no.

[Assistant] Okay. All right. So you got, you got it into your head to join the Peace Corps, did you know? Did you know any other people who were in the Peace Corps?

[User] No. There were a couple of us. My group of friends, there were two others who wanted to join the Peace Corps. They had just graduated from college, and they suggested that I do that too, to apply, because maybe it would be an option for me since they knew I wasn't going to continue. So then I applied and they were accepted to go to Guatemala and I was accepted to go to Honduras.

[Assistant] How interesting. Were you disappointed that you didn't get to go with them?

[User] No, not at all. No.

[Assistant] What, did the application process have any, uh, were you given the option of saying where you wanted to go?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No. There were a couple of us. My group of friends, there were two others who wanted to join the Peace Corps. They had just graduated from college, and they suggested that I do that too, to apply, because maybe it would be an option for me since they knew I wasn't going to continue. So then I applied and they were accepted to go to Guatemala and I was accepted to go to Honduras.

[Assistant] How interesting. Were you disappointed that you didn't get to go with them?

[User] No, not at all. No.

[Assistant] What, did the application process have any, uh, were you given the option of saying where you wanted to go?

[User] Where you didn't want to go.

[Assistant] Where you didn't.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, not at all. No.

[Assistant] What, did the application process have any, uh, were you given the option of saying where you wanted to go?

[User] Where you didn't want to go.

[Assistant] Where you didn't.

[User] Yeah. Yeah.

[Assistant] Were there places that you didn't want to go?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Where you didn't want to go.

[Assistant] Where you didn't.

[User] Yeah. Yeah.

[Assistant] Were there places that you didn't want to go?

[User] Too far away.

[Assistant] Okay. All right.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah. Yeah.

[Assistant] Were there places that you didn't want to go?

[User] Too far away.

[Assistant] Okay. All right.

[User] I didn't want to be that, way on the other side of the world. Yeah.

[Assistant] Yeah. So you're quite a, quite far away when you're in Central America, but you can still get there from here.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Too far away.

[Assistant] Okay. All right.

[User] I didn't want to be that, way on the other side of the world. Yeah.

[Assistant] Yeah. So you're quite a, quite far away when you're in Central America, but you can still get there from here.

[User] Oh, yeah. One day travel you can get back to Wisconsin if you do it right. Yeah.

[Assistant] So I'm thinking this was, this would have been 1978.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I didn't want to be that, way on the other side of the world. Yeah.

[Assistant] Yeah. So you're quite a, quite far away when you're in Central America, but you can still get there from here.

[User] Oh, yeah. One day travel you can get back to Wisconsin if you do it right. Yeah.

[Assistant] So I'm thinking this was, this would have been 1978.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] What time of year?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh, yeah. One day travel you can get back to Wisconsin if you do it right. Yeah.

[Assistant] So I'm thinking this was, this would have been 1978.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] What time of year?

[User] Well, we went to training. There were seven of us, are you talking about training?

[Assistant] Well, yeah. What time did you leave? What time of year was it when you had to say goodbye to your family?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] What time of year?

[User] Well, we went to training. There were seven of us, are you talking about training?

[Assistant] Well, yeah. What time did you leave? What time of year was it when you had to say goodbye to your family?

[User] Oh, okay. The summer of 1978, myself and six others from, six other men, young men from around the country, met at UW-Stout in Menomonie, Wisconsin. We had all applied to the Peace Corps, didn't know each other, of course. And the trainers in Washington wanted us to, because of our backgrounds, wanted us to teach industrial arts in one of eight or ten U.S. AID schools that were built in Honduras. They had built them and equipped the woodshop and metal shop area. So that's the industrial arts part. They had equipped also the home economics area of the high school, in country high schools, those dozen or so high schools that they had built. And they also equipped the science labs. So they were looking for, at that time, teachers for industrial arts.

[Assistant] Mm hmm. And so you and the other six or seven guys were all going to be doing industrial art.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] We were taken, yes, we were taken from our homes, flown to UW-Stout, Menomonie, Wisconsin.

[Assistant] Flown?

[User] Well, like if you traveled from California.

[Assistant] That's right.

[User] Or Louisiana, which one man was.

[Assistant] Oh, so these other guys were not all Wisconsinites?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, like if you traveled from California.

[Assistant] That's right.

[User] Or Louisiana, which one man was.

[Assistant] Oh, so these other guys were not all Wisconsinites?

[User] Oh, no.

[Assistant] Even though you were meeting right here.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] People from all over the United States apply for the Peace Corps.

[Assistant] Right. Yes.

[User] So they gathered those applications that thought they matched. I don't know how they did it. They got us seven together.

[Assistant] Yeah. Yeah.

[User] And we, they, we went to UW-Stout. Of course, I didn't have to fly, but that's a detail because I live close. Yeah. For that summer, we attended classes to learn how to become industrial arts teachers.

[Assistant] Okay. Here in Wisconsin?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And we, they, we went to UW-Stout. Of course, I didn't have to fly, but that's a detail because I live close. Yeah. For that summer, we attended classes to learn how to become industrial arts teachers.

[Assistant] Okay. Here in Wisconsin?

[User] Yes, all in English, all with English professors. And so in August, we completed that program, of '78. Then we were, then we went to Miami, Florida, for what they called staging. And staging was three days in Miami at a hotel. And we attended many meetings and got our shots.

[Assistant] Your shots.

[User] And then we flew to Honduras from there.

[Assistant] Before we fly Honduras, what's happening back home here? What are your parents, your mom, your dad? You've got four siblings. What did they think of what you were doing?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, all in English, all with English professors. And so in August, we completed that program, of '78. Then we were, then we went to Miami, Florida, for what they called staging. And staging was three days in Miami at a hotel. And we attended many meetings and got our shots.

[Assistant] Your shots.

[User] And then we flew to Honduras from there.

[Assistant] Before we fly Honduras, what's happening back home here? What are your parents, your mom, your dad? You've got four siblings. What did they think of what you were doing?

[User] I don't really remember.

[Assistant] Do they seem supportive?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] It was, it was a decision that I made. And my dad I remember saying, well, that's great. And my siblings, I don't know, they just weren't around. I mean, we were all in different places at different schools doing different things.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] Our lives were not connected very well at that time. We're all out of the house and.

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah.

[User] So I imagine they thought it was great. I don't know. I never really asked them.

[Assistant] But you were your own.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Our lives were not connected very well at that time. We're all out of the house and.

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah.

[User] So I imagine they thought it was great. I don't know. I never really asked them.

[Assistant] But you were your own.

[User] 33 years ago.

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah, that's a while.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] So I imagine they thought it was great. I don't know. I never really asked them.

[Assistant] But you were your own.

[User] 33 years ago.

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah, that's a while.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] Okay, so you're finished with staging in Miami and they fly you to Honduras. Just how many, did you say there were seven of you?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And then we were a little over 50 people in our group, I think 52 or 53.

[Assistant] Okay.

[User] And we were the largest group to come into Honduras at, up to that date. And so we were known as the big one.

[Assistant] Uh huh.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] And up until now, there's been no training in Spanish? It's strictly teaching methods and techniques of industrial art.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And we were the largest group to come into Honduras at, up to that date. And so we were known as the big one.

[Assistant] Uh huh.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] And up until now, there's been no training in Spanish? It's strictly teaching methods and techniques of industrial art.

[User] Oh, up until then, up until we got into country? Right, exactly.

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah, yeah.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] And up until now, there's been no training in Spanish? It's strictly teaching methods and techniques of industrial art.

[User] Oh, up until then, up until we got into country? Right, exactly.

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[User] Exactly.

[Assistant] So you knew what to do in an industrial arts classroom.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh, up until then, up until we got into country? Right, exactly.

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[User] Exactly.

[Assistant] So you knew what to do in an industrial arts classroom.

[User] Right.

[Assistant] Did they do any practice teaching here in Wisconsin in high schools with industrial arts?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Exactly.

[Assistant] So you knew what to do in an industrial arts classroom.

[User] Right.

[Assistant] Did they do any practice teaching here in Wisconsin in high schools with industrial arts?

[User] They do, but you have to be enrolled in their program. And this was only to train us in a short amount of time.

[Assistant] Yeah. So. So you didn't get any hands-on experience here before going down to Honduras.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Right.

[Assistant] Did they do any practice teaching here in Wisconsin in high schools with industrial arts?

[User] They do, but you have to be enrolled in their program. And this was only to train us in a short amount of time.

[Assistant] Yeah. So. So you didn't get any hands-on experience here before going down to Honduras.

[User] In my past, I had done some things that were similar to teaching.

[Assistant] Yeah. But I mean, Peace Corps training did not include practice teaching.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] They were from the university in Tegucigalpa. They were teachers there but, and they knew, so they knew English just fine, but they did not use English in the classroom at all or any time we saw them in the building halls, anything like that. So we were, we learned it by immersion. Yes. There were many of us in our group, however, who were fluent in Spanish for whatever reason. They took it in college. They grew up in a Hispanic family.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] For whatever reason. And they did not have to join in on the language training. So what they did was do other, they started their jobs pretty much right away.

[Assistant] Ah.

[User] They stayed with us the ten weeks in Tegucigalpa, but they were working on their programs wherever they were stationed.

[Assistant] During your training in Tegucigalpa, where were you living? Were you in a dorm?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] They stayed with us the ten weeks in Tegucigalpa, but they were working on their programs wherever they were stationed.

[Assistant] During your training in Tegucigalpa, where were you living? Were you in a dorm?

[User] I was living with a family.

[Assistant] A family.

[User] We each got placed in a family. Only one volunteer per family.

[Assistant] Oh, excellent. And I'm assuming that nobody in that family spoke English.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I was living with a family.

[Assistant] A family.

[User] We each got placed in a family. Only one volunteer per family.

[Assistant] Oh, excellent. And I'm assuming that nobody in that family spoke English.

[User] Nobody did.

[Assistant] Okay, so 6 hours a day in the classroom as a group of three or four students.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] We each got placed in a family. Only one volunteer per family.

[Assistant] Oh, excellent. And I'm assuming that nobody in that family spoke English.

[User] Nobody did.

[Assistant] Okay, so 6 hours a day in the classroom as a group of three or four students.

[User] Correct.

[Assistant] And then you're placed with the family.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Nobody did.

[Assistant] Okay, so 6 hours a day in the classroom as a group of three or four students.

[User] Correct.

[Assistant] And then you're placed with the family.

[User] Yeah. And this was done by a private company that Peace Corps had contracted with.

[Assistant] Did you find it, did you, did you find it good in terms of language learning?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Correct.

[Assistant] And then you're placed with the family.

[User] Yeah. And this was done by a private company that Peace Corps had contracted with.

[Assistant] Did you find it, did you, did you find it good in terms of language learning?

[User] I was, I was very interested in learning another language. I always had been. So, um, I was, for me the classes were great. For others, maybe they were a little bit tedious. But I, I enjoyed them a lot.

[Assistant] Oh, good, wonderful.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah. And this was done by a private company that Peace Corps had contracted with.

[Assistant] Did you find it, did you, did you find it good in terms of language learning?

[User] I was, I was very interested in learning another language. I always had been. So, um, I was, for me the classes were great. For others, maybe they were a little bit tedious. But I, I enjoyed them a lot.

[Assistant] Oh, good, wonderful.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] So. And that lasted for ten weeks.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I was, I was very interested in learning another language. I always had been. So, um, I was, for me the classes were great. For others, maybe they were a little bit tedious. But I, I enjoyed them a lot.

[Assistant] Oh, good, wonderful.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] So. And that lasted for ten weeks.

[User] Ten weeks, yes.

[Assistant] Yeah. What was the family like that you were living with during training?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] So. And that lasted for ten weeks.

[User] Ten weeks, yes.

[Assistant] Yeah. What was the family like that you were living with during training?

[User] They were very nice. Nice, open, warm, friendly people. A grandmother was there, a grandfather, and granddaughter. And those three lived in the house. Yeah.

[Assistant] Middle class family?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Ten weeks, yes.

[Assistant] Yeah. What was the family like that you were living with during training?

[User] They were very nice. Nice, open, warm, friendly people. A grandmother was there, a grandfather, and granddaughter. And those three lived in the house. Yeah.

[Assistant] Middle class family?

[User] You know, there really isn't a middle class there, so I don't know how to label the class. I just tell you what they did. She had a job at a bank, and I don't know what exactly she did there, but teller or whatever they do. And his, her grandparents just stayed home and ran the household. So it must have been her mom and dad probably was, her mom and dad, not grandparents. Her mom and dad, her parents.

[Assistant] And you ate with the family?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] They were very nice. Nice, open, warm, friendly people. A grandmother was there, a grandfather, and granddaughter. And those three lived in the house. Yeah.

[Assistant] Middle class family?

[User] You know, there really isn't a middle class there, so I don't know how to label the class. I just tell you what they did. She had a job at a bank, and I don't know what exactly she did there, but teller or whatever they do. And his, her grandparents just stayed home and ran the household. So it must have been her mom and dad probably was, her mom and dad, not grandparents. Her mom and dad, her parents.

[Assistant] And you ate with the family?

[User] Oh, yeah. They would get up, come down for breakfast. It was a, three levels. It was in the city on one of those triangle type buildings that point out to a plaza like you see in Madison, a round nose on it. You know what I'm talking about?

[Assistant] Oh. Very nice. Yes.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] You know, there really isn't a middle class there, so I don't know how to label the class. I just tell you what they did. She had a job at a bank, and I don't know what exactly she did there, but teller or whatever they do. And his, her grandparents just stayed home and ran the household. So it must have been her mom and dad probably was, her mom and dad, not grandparents. Her mom and dad, her parents.

[Assistant] And you ate with the family?

[User] Oh, yeah. They would get up, come down for breakfast. It was a, three levels. It was in the city on one of those triangle type buildings that point out to a plaza like you see in Madison, a round nose on it. You know what I'm talking about?

[Assistant] Oh. Very nice. Yes.

[User] Three stories. Yeah. So the first story was basically an entry way. Then the second story was where the kitchen, dining, living room was, or kitchen dining, and then third story was open, a patio and a small little room at the back where I stayed.

[Assistant] So you had your own room, a little privacy?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh, yeah. They would get up, come down for breakfast. It was a, three levels. It was in the city on one of those triangle type buildings that point out to a plaza like you see in Madison, a round nose on it. You know what I'm talking about?

[Assistant] Oh. Very nice. Yes.

[User] Three stories. Yeah. So the first story was basically an entry way. Then the second story was where the kitchen, dining, living room was, or kitchen dining, and then third story was open, a patio and a small little room at the back where I stayed.

[Assistant] So you had your own room, a little privacy?

[User] Yeah, I did then. Yeah.

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah. During training, did you have, did Peace Corps issue you a computer, a telephone?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Three stories. Yeah. So the first story was basically an entry way. Then the second story was where the kitchen, dining, living room was, or kitchen dining, and then third story was open, a patio and a small little room at the back where I stayed.

[Assistant] So you had your own room, a little privacy?

[User] Yeah, I did then. Yeah.

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah. During training, did you have, did Peace Corps issue you a computer, a telephone?

[User] No.

[Assistant] How did you stay in touch with your family?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, I did then. Yeah.

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah. During training, did you have, did Peace Corps issue you a computer, a telephone?

[User] No.

[Assistant] How did you stay in touch with your family?

[User] We would have to find a place that had telephones and then we would use the telephone. We'd have to pay for it, you know, and use it there. It was at the major cities' post offices.

[Assistant] Uh huh. Like a pay phone kind of thing.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No.

[Assistant] How did you stay in touch with your family?

[User] We would have to find a place that had telephones and then we would use the telephone. We'd have to pay for it, you know, and use it there. It was at the major cities' post offices.

[Assistant] Uh huh. Like a pay phone kind of thing.

[User] Yeah. It was a payphone at a major city post office.

[Assistant] How often did you find yourself calling home?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I called home one time in the two years.

[Assistant] Just once?

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah.

[User] Well, letters were more convenient and didn't cost us much.

[Assistant] That's right. That's right.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah.

[User] Well, letters were more convenient and didn't cost us much.

[Assistant] That's right. That's right.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] So different today when kids are texting their mom and dad every day.