{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00311:11", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 41.750290620122186, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We didn't work past our eight hours. No one did. You might stay a few minutes, but no one worked until eight and nine o'clock at night as they do now, nor on the weekends. But I was so excited, because when it was my project and had the responsibility of the entire vehicle, I couldn't wait until Monday morning to get back to work. Can you imagine? It was that exciting.\\n\\n I was married and ultimately had two daughters, fortunate enough to have full-time help, because that was how I could work…to make sure I had someone at my house at all times. But still, I just loved my work, just really, and still do, and I'm happy to say I'm still working."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Good. Good."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's exciting. I'll let you ask another question. I hope you can edit out all these little side things."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "We want to hear them all. When you graduated with your mathematics degree, before NACA talked to you, did you have any idea what you wanted to do with that degree?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I was going to teach, and I was going to teach high school geometry, because that's what I did my practice teaching in. But by not having any idea, when NACA recruited us and we got to Langley Field, I had never heard the word \"Mach number\" or \"Reynolds number\" or any of the terms. I knew nothing about it. And so my job was to do mathematical support for the engineers. Then as time went on, there's an old expression now, \"I used to not be able to spell engineer and now I are one.\" [Laughter]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You graduated in 1948 and went to work with NACA. Ten years later, the United States formed NASA, and you just automatically fell into that."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00311:13", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 46.38921180013576, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's exciting. I'll let you ask another question. I hope you can edit out all these little side things."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "We want to hear them all. When you graduated with your mathematics degree, before NACA talked to you, did you have any idea what you wanted to do with that degree?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I was going to teach, and I was going to teach high school geometry, because that's what I did my practice teaching in. But by not having any idea, when NACA recruited us and we got to Langley Field, I had never heard the word \"Mach number\" or \"Reynolds number\" or any of the terms. I knew nothing about it. And so my job was to do mathematical support for the engineers. Then as time went on, there's an old expression now, \"I used to not be able to spell engineer and now I are one.\" [Laughter]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You graduated in 1948 and went to work with NACA. Ten years later, the United States formed NASA, and you just automatically fell into that."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Automatically became part of NASA, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there a transition for you, or did it just fall right into place?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00311:21", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 47.40620606635537, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yes, absolutely. Absolutely. He was not dynamic at all. His wife was a cute little gal. She died very suddenly. They had been friends of a couple in New York, where the man was extremely dynamic, one of the most dynamic men I've ever met. He was vice president of Grumman [Aircraft Engineering Corporation] at the time. He dropped dead suddenly. And his wife, who is a charming, lovely, quiet gal, the two quiet people married each other, having lost their spouses."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you see a lot of Bob Gilruth during those early days?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yes. When he progressed from division chief up to the directorate—and I don't know if you're familiar with the organization of NASA. In your headquarters of the local centers, you have directors of different groups of people. As Max was director of engineering and development, so was Gilruth at Langley director of engineering. You have operations directors and what have you. As I said, we were all friends…\\n\\n And here I had a breakfast, a brunch one Sunday. I was with Gilruth in L.A., waiting for an airplane, and I said, \"You know, I want to tell Max how much I appreciate him, how much I love this man.\"\\n\\n And Bob said, \"Well, you should.\"\\n\\n And I said, \"I want to have a party.\" So I had a Sunday brunch, and Gilruth and his second wife, and the Fagets and two other couples. Did you interview any people other than JSC [Johnson Space Center] people?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Here and there."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And so I had a chance to entertain both the Gilruths and the Fagets. Of course, Nancy and I were very close friends. We were neighbors for a while up in Virginia [and] we were neighbors [here] and friends, so I've seen them for—fifty years? Yes. Great day! I wish I hadn't said that. [Laughter]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, it's been a busy and full fifty years."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00311:25", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 52.60025440290786, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And so I had a chance to entertain both the Gilruths and the Fagets. Of course, Nancy and I were very close friends. We were neighbors for a while up in Virginia [and] we were neighbors [here] and friends, so I've seen them for—fifty years? Yes. Great day! I wish I hadn't said that. [Laughter]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, it's been a busy and full fifty years."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It has. It has. Each day, even while I'm not working at the moment because of—I'll tell you that later—I stay busy. I have a desk. I have a ten-by-twelve room that I call my desk room. I can't call it my office, although it is filled with the thirty-nine years of NASA projects and Christmas presents I buy along the way. They're on the floor. This ten-by-twelve room has three file cabinets, eight bookcases, and it's crowded. [Laughter] And I'll go in there and sit down as if I'm at work. I'll go through things."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Before NASA became NASA, there was an event that occurred that took most Americans by surprise, and that was the launch of Sputnik. Of course, you were there."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was thrilled to death, frankly. It meant we would get money. We would get funding to do those ideas that people like Max and Gilruth had. Because we were an advisory committee for industry or what have you before NASA was formed. Indeed, we would advise companies in how to design or help them in their airplane design. P-51s, for instance, and, I think, P-47… Those were helped by NACA engineers."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were you surprised? Was the group at Langley surprised to hear this, or did they know?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00311:27", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 12, "return_to_go": 57.33361600323095, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It has. It has. Each day, even while I'm not working at the moment because of—I'll tell you that later—I stay busy. I have a desk. I have a ten-by-twelve room that I call my desk room. I can't call it my office, although it is filled with the thirty-nine years of NASA projects and Christmas presents I buy along the way. They're on the floor. This ten-by-twelve room has three file cabinets, eight bookcases, and it's crowded. [Laughter] And I'll go in there and sit down as if I'm at work. I'll go through things."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Before NASA became NASA, there was an event that occurred that took most Americans by surprise, and that was the launch of Sputnik. Of course, you were there."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was thrilled to death, frankly. It meant we would get money. We would get funding to do those ideas that people like Max and Gilruth had. Because we were an advisory committee for industry or what have you before NASA was formed. Indeed, we would advise companies in how to design or help them in their airplane design. P-51s, for instance, and, I think, P-47… Those were helped by NACA engineers."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were you surprised? Was the group at Langley surprised to hear this, or did they know?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I wish I could remember that. When it was launched, my husband and I and children were driving to Florida to his twin brother's graduation, getting a master's in something. Well, we were excited about that, because we knew how it would help us, but whether we knew it or not, I don't remember. That's a question you'd have to ask Max. [Laughter] Those people. I don't remember."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But you saw a change afterwards?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00311:107", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 14.486257887470277, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But using that past experience."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yes. Each door or each step took us up higher on the ladder, technically."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That night on your way home, did you think about the time that Max Faget had told you that we were going to go to the moon?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. And interestingly enough, I didn't think about the time when I was ten and sitting out in New Orleans looking at the stars, and knowing we were going to the moon. That didn't enter my head then. I think I was tired, I felt sorry for myself that everybody else was partying and I wasn't. [Laughter] I did not think—I'm sorry to say I did not think about those fabulous things. I do now."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And even the time when you heard—or heard about—Kennedy making the challenge to America that we should do that, what were your first thoughts on that?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00311:109", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 6, "return_to_go": 14.984730986078086, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yes. Each door or each step took us up higher on the ladder, technically."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That night on your way home, did you think about the time that Max Faget had told you that we were going to go to the moon?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. And interestingly enough, I didn't think about the time when I was ten and sitting out in New Orleans looking at the stars, and knowing we were going to the moon. That didn't enter my head then. I think I was tired, I felt sorry for myself that everybody else was partying and I wasn't. [Laughter] I did not think—I'm sorry to say I did not think about those fabulous things. I do now."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And even the time when you heard—or heard about—Kennedy making the challenge to America that we should do that, what were your first thoughts on that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I knew we'd do it. Of course, with the Apollo fire, which was an awful experience, but one that was necessary, apparently, Johnny and I and another couple were driving to New Orleans to go to a Mardi Gras ball. When we got to the motel, the radio, for some reason, was on in our room, and they were talking about the fire on the Apollo. I said, \"It's not due to lift off now…”\\n\\n Well…we go to dinner, and Johnny has to catch a plane to come back to help on the investigation of [the fire], so I stay with this couple, because we're in our car. We go to the ball… But [the fire] was an awful experience, and it's a shame that some lessons have to be learned through tragedy…"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you ever have any doubt that America would pick up its program and begin again?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00311:121", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.1889353401000005, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, because each was unique, had its own challenge. I can't say that I was happier any time than another. I enjoyed it all, absolutely loved every [day]—I had a boss tell me—and he was assistant division chief—he said, \"Dottie, if you were a man, you would have been a boss.\" I don't remember what I said, but I would not have wanted it. I had the best job at JSC, absolutely. And being that manager toward the end did involve some personnel activity and some necessary paperwork and getting money, but, no, I liked doing what I did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When you began your career, it was during a time period in America that women were not easily recognized or even encouraged to go into the fields that you did."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you feel like your gender held you back at all from progressing through your career?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I did not get, in the beginning, raises as the others because I wasn't a graduate engineer. Ultimately I did. It just took a little longer. And the men, oh, they liked me, they just didn't really want me to be their equal. Chauvinism existed more then than now. They'd want to help me. I don't object to being helped in the car. Fine. I want to be a woman first. But I don't want to be recognized because I'm a woman; I want to be recognized because I can do the job. That would be the only thing that would make me resent being rewarded [if only] because I'm a woman."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Being remembered for all that you've done, if you had to pick, is there one area that you would like to be remembered for, for your contributions more than all the rest that you've been able to do?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00311:123", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.5432614890000003, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you feel like your gender held you back at all from progressing through your career?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I did not get, in the beginning, raises as the others because I wasn't a graduate engineer. Ultimately I did. It just took a little longer. And the men, oh, they liked me, they just didn't really want me to be their equal. Chauvinism existed more then than now. They'd want to help me. I don't object to being helped in the car. Fine. I want to be a woman first. But I don't want to be recognized because I'm a woman; I want to be recognized because I can do the job. That would be the only thing that would make me resent being rewarded [if only] because I'm a woman."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Being remembered for all that you've done, if you had to pick, is there one area that you would like to be remembered for, for your contributions more than all the rest that you've been able to do?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, the first thing that comes to mind is the story I told you, based on what I told those men about status of aeroheating in Shuttle. They would recommend to the President we'd launch. I guess I would want to be remembered that I did my work professionally, with a professional attitude, but with a sense of humor and graciously. I am appreciative of the men who touched my life, and I'd want to be remembered by those whose [lives] I touched. I'm extremely proud of what I did. And I guess that would be a way to end, wouldn't it. [Laughter] Unless you have more questions."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'm going to ask Carol and Sandra if they have some questions for you."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00311:125", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.93695721, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I did not get, in the beginning, raises as the others because I wasn't a graduate engineer. Ultimately I did. It just took a little longer. And the men, oh, they liked me, they just didn't really want me to be their equal. Chauvinism existed more then than now. They'd want to help me. I don't object to being helped in the car. Fine. I want to be a woman first. But I don't want to be recognized because I'm a woman; I want to be recognized because I can do the job. That would be the only thing that would make me resent being rewarded [if only] because I'm a woman."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Being remembered for all that you've done, if you had to pick, is there one area that you would like to be remembered for, for your contributions more than all the rest that you've been able to do?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, the first thing that comes to mind is the story I told you, based on what I told those men about status of aeroheating in Shuttle. They would recommend to the President we'd launch. I guess I would want to be remembered that I did my work professionally, with a professional attitude, but with a sense of humor and graciously. I am appreciative of the men who touched my life, and I'd want to be remembered by those whose [lives] I touched. I'm extremely proud of what I did. And I guess that would be a way to end, wouldn't it. [Laughter] Unless you have more questions."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'm going to ask Carol and Sandra if they have some questions for you."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "If that's okay with you."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00311:127", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.3743969, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, the first thing that comes to mind is the story I told you, based on what I told those men about status of aeroheating in Shuttle. They would recommend to the President we'd launch. I guess I would want to be remembered that I did my work professionally, with a professional attitude, but with a sense of humor and graciously. I am appreciative of the men who touched my life, and I'd want to be remembered by those whose [lives] I touched. I'm extremely proud of what I did. And I guess that would be a way to end, wouldn't it. [Laughter] Unless you have more questions."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'm going to ask Carol and Sandra if they have some questions for you."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "If that's okay with you."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Certainly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you have anything?\n\nProbably lots, but I don't want to waste all your time. [Laughter]"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00311:129", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.860441, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "If that's okay with you."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Certainly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you have anything?\n\nProbably lots, but I don't want to waste all your time. [Laughter]"}, {"role": "user", "content": "This is quite a compliment to me that I am being part of this historical—"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "One question, I guess, is that you went to college at a time when it wasn't that usual for women to go right into college after high school. Was that something that you just accepted as you were growing up, that that's the way it was going to be?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00311:131", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 5.40049, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Certainly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you have anything?\n\nProbably lots, but I don't want to waste all your time. [Laughter]"}, {"role": "user", "content": "This is quite a compliment to me that I am being part of this historical—"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "One question, I guess, is that you went to college at a time when it wasn't that usual for women to go right into college after high school. Was that something that you just accepted as you were growing up, that that's the way it was going to be?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I knew I was going to college when I was a little child. Again, I was a very fortunate child, being the only one in the family and there were means to let me go. Interestingly enough, in New Orleans the high schools were such that it was all girls or all boys, and in camp in the summer it was all girls. Then I go to college, where it's all girls. I never had a football team. [Laughter] Consequently, when my girls went to a high school here, every Friday night we went to the football games. [Laughter] But I knew. I was just lucky, very, very fortunate child and person.\\n\\n Part of that fortunate bit, as a child they would put me in a room and bring the clothes. I could say yes or no to whatever they brought in, and I received many clothes from the time I was little. To this day I can't walk into a department store and buy my clothes. I have a friend who owns a shop in Dickinson. She'll buy for me when she goes to market or she has trunk shows, and if I can't make it, she'll say, \"Dottie'll want that.\" …When she sells the shop, I don't know what I'm going to do. [Laughter] And I, likewise, have spoiled my girls, I'm sorry to say. However, my daughters inherit my clothes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Now that you brought it up, I really want to ask, all those times you were at Wallops Island, at a time when women didn't wear pants—"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00311:140", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.9, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Never. And today when I read about women that—what is it they call it? Harassment? Not that I want to say that they ask for it, and I'm not a beauty like my mother, but I was never embarrassed. If they embarrassed me, I didn't know it. I was too naive and I brushed it off and dismissed it as if it was a joke for the day. Never would I have any occasion to have to—of course, I worked with professional men and in an environment, a very sheltered world. NASA really provided a very sheltered world. I never had a problem."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's great. A lot of your social activities were with folks that you worked with as well?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. I remember one Christmas Johnny and I had the Christmas party and New Year's Eve party at our house. I had more energy in those days. [Laughter]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Especially for the clean-up. [Laughter]"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, and making the food."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "We didn't have stores that provided all that."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00311:142", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 1.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. I remember one Christmas Johnny and I had the Christmas party and New Year's Eve party at our house. I had more energy in those days. [Laughter]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Especially for the clean-up. [Laughter]"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, and making the food."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "We didn't have stores that provided all that."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Pre-packaged food for you to put out on a table. Everything was done by hand."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00311:144", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, and making the food."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "We didn't have stores that provided all that."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Pre-packaged food for you to put out on a table. Everything was done by hand."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Thank goodness for Sam's. Of course, you see the same food at all the parties. I'm not embarrassed to say I use their meatballs and all. It is easier."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I've always heard people praise Fred Astaire for all his accomplishments, but I've always heard the other part, that Ginger Rogers did everything backwards and in high heels. So after spending the afternoon with you, that's what it reminds me of. You've had such great accomplishments, yet you were always accomplishing more challenges and looking for more opportunities. So we certainly thank you for your time today."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00311:146", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Pre-packaged food for you to put out on a table. Everything was done by hand."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Thank goodness for Sam's. Of course, you see the same food at all the parties. I'm not embarrassed to say I use their meatballs and all. It is easier."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I've always heard people praise Fred Astaire for all his accomplishments, but I've always heard the other part, that Ginger Rogers did everything backwards and in high heels. So after spending the afternoon with you, that's what it reminds me of. You've had such great accomplishments, yet you were always accomplishing more challenges and looking for more opportunities. So we certainly thank you for your time today."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, I've enjoyed this. Thank you for letting me do all the talking."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you did very well at it."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00303:22", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 15, "return_to_go": 15.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Two, three hours. It wasn’t bad. They were not huge, challenging EVAs that way. It went through at least two orbits, so you had day and night, but they had lights, there were lights mounted along them, so they could turn them on and do their thing, even in the dark. Sometimes, they noticed it was colder, the suits were earlier, so it was a little bit colder. They were Apollo suits, basically. In Apollo, you were always in daylight on the Moon, so you didn’t notice that as much. They were good to handle warm; they weren’t so much at heating you up; you had to do the heating, they were good at pumping your heat away."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Pretty amazing."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Anything else we can do in here?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No, I don’t think so. It’s up to you because you know it better than I do."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Any questions on here. Sometimes I don’t want to bore you with too much stuff."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No, it’s not, ever."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00649:3", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 7, "return_to_go": 52.52326872388588, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Correct. That’s a fundamental tenet of the way NASA does their Chief Engineer function at JSC. We’re independently funded. We actually come from the institutional side. I’m EA [organization code for Engineering]-badged if you will, Engineering-badged. As opposed to GA [organization code for Orion]-badged. I’m not badged to the Program. The Program Manager is my customer, not strictly my boss, which also makes for a [more] pleasant life."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Every time I see you in the Office I think that you are affiliated and part of that. I did not realize that. That’s an interesting distinction."}, {"role": "user", "content": "One of their fundamental tenets under their technical authority is that I’m supposed to be independently funded."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Is that because of the risks associated with engineering and issues of safety?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "They never really used to call it tech authority, that came out of Columbia. I think it’s really just more to keep a balance. The Program Manager worries about cost and schedule. Of course our program managers worry about technical as well. When you look at the Program Manager you think about them balancing cost and schedule with risk. They want them to have an independent adviser who’s really not dependent on that Program Manager for their performance award, not dependent on that Program Manager for their feedback as to how well they did. I think of it more of as an adviser and a peer as opposed to an employee. It’s easier for me to say no in some ways to a Program Manager than it is for a direct report. That’s why they do it, I think."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That’s fascinating. This isn’t a question that we’ve asked everyone, but I am definitely curious about it. We were talking with Mark [S.] Geyer this morning, and we’ve talked with Carol [L.] Webber. It seems like Mike [Michael D.] Griffin, who was the Administrator early on when CEV was being designed, was very heavily involved in its design and the architecture of Constellation. I’m wondering as an engineer what you and the other engineers thought about his involvement and his inclusion in the design process itself."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00289:57", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 9.401650240000002, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yes, in terms of providing a lot of the write up that went into Frank Culbertson's report and so forth. Since the emphasis was on safety, we had to do a lot of that. We had to provide a big formal briefing or I had to do that to the Stafford Committee, and I also had to brief Fred Gregory and the HEDS (Human Exploration and Development of Space) Assurance Group, which is a bigger panel, too. Frank Culbertson had to provide a briefing, too, but I was there to support him and I had a major briefing, and really going through what our safety process was and so forth. At that time we were in the process of developing this criteria, so I went through that we had developed this criteria and what we were doing to assess it against that criteria and all of that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do any other names stand out along with your own initiative?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think Goldin himself made the final decisions in that. Fred Gregory at NASA Headquarters was heavily involved. My boss particularly got involved in this safety John Casper was involved. Each one of the working groups Bob Peercy. The people supported me very heavily in putting together these presentations. Linda Gavin from Frank Culbertson's office pulled together a lot of the work and was interfacing with the IG's office. George Nield and Jim Van Laak, a lot of people in his office were heavily involved in that. Let's see if there was any I think that's probably all that comes to mind, at least offhand."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It seems like a lot of people made the effort."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Can you tell me a little bit more about what you see as this whole program in itself benefiting Space Station, and then, in a general perspective, just the Earth and people, other nations in general?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:3", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 11.631121495885397, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, okay."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And we'll go from there."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I was in school, in undergraduate school at the University of California in Northridge, and I heard about the Peace Corps. In fact, I saw the TV program that President Kennedy gave the speech, you know, about."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "The inaugural?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "The inaugural, well, the speech. Yes. That was the inaugural. When he said."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Ask not, right."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:7", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 14.359409254179502, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "The inaugural, well, the speech. Yes. That was the inaugural. When he said."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Ask not, right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "What you can do for your country."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And so I teared up and thought, yes, that's what I really want to do."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. What was, what had you been studying at Northridge?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:9", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 13.732676949088335, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "What you can do for your country."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And so I teared up and thought, yes, that's what I really want to do."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. What was, what had you been studying at Northridge?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, psychology. That was my major for a two year, I mean, four year degree."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And when were you due to get your degree?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:11", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 13.03630772120926, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And so I teared up and thought, yes, that's what I really want to do."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. What was, what had you been studying at Northridge?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, psychology. That was my major for a two year, I mean, four year degree."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And when were you due to get your degree?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "In 1960. Let's see. '62 I got the degree."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "June of '62."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:13", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 13.373675245788066, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, psychology. That was my major for a two year, I mean, four year degree."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And when were you due to get your degree?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "In 1960. Let's see. '62 I got the degree."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "June of '62."}, {"role": "user", "content": "June, uh huh. And went in, by the November I went to training."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. Where had you grown up?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:17", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 11.572438575046995, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "June, uh huh. And went in, by the November I went to training."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. Where had you grown up?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mostly in California, in Los Angeles, around the San Fernando Valley. That's where my, I grew up. And, you know, from teenage years through."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And high school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Through high school and college, had you done any kind of international travel or service work or?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:19", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 9.524931750052216, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mostly in California, in Los Angeles, around the San Fernando Valley. That's where my, I grew up. And, you know, from teenage years through."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And high school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Through high school and college, had you done any kind of international travel or service work or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No service work. But I had a good friend that was bilingual from birth because his parents were from Mexico. And we went to elementary school together and grew up together. And he's still a good friend, and he was bilingual. And so at age 18, after high school, I went to visit him in, in Mexico. And that was my first out of country experience."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And was it a reasonably affluent family or modest?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:21", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 9.472146388946907, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And high school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Through high school and college, had you done any kind of international travel or service work or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No service work. But I had a good friend that was bilingual from birth because his parents were from Mexico. And we went to elementary school together and grew up together. And he's still a good friend, and he was bilingual. And so at age 18, after high school, I went to visit him in, in Mexico. And that was my first out of country experience."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And was it a reasonably affluent family or modest?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'd say middle class family in Chihuahua, Mexico."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. And did you try to speak Spanish while you were there?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:23", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.191273765496564, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No service work. But I had a good friend that was bilingual from birth because his parents were from Mexico. And we went to elementary school together and grew up together. And he's still a good friend, and he was bilingual. And so at age 18, after high school, I went to visit him in, in Mexico. And that was my first out of country experience."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And was it a reasonably affluent family or modest?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'd say middle class family in Chihuahua, Mexico."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. And did you try to speak Spanish while you were there?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yes. I had been learning Spanish in high school due to this Edward, Eduardo, he knew Spanish, you know, perfectly. And I thought, why don't I? So I really tried. And he was my mentor and my ideal of, you know, to learn a second language."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you actually did. You were?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:25", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 7.990304183885071, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'd say middle class family in Chihuahua, Mexico."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. And did you try to speak Spanish while you were there?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yes. I had been learning Spanish in high school due to this Edward, Eduardo, he knew Spanish, you know, perfectly. And I thought, why don't I? So I really tried. And he was my mentor and my ideal of, you know, to learn a second language."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you actually did. You were?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was getting to be fluent. I mean, I was starting to understand very rapidly and, you know, and talk back rapidly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And how long did you stay in Chihuahua? Was it just a?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:27", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.655893537650078, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yes. I had been learning Spanish in high school due to this Edward, Eduardo, he knew Spanish, you know, perfectly. And I thought, why don't I? So I really tried. And he was my mentor and my ideal of, you know, to learn a second language."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you actually did. You were?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was getting to be fluent. I mean, I was starting to understand very rapidly and, you know, and talk back rapidly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And how long did you stay in Chihuahua? Was it just a?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Just a summer, I think it was less than a month."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. And then finished high school?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:31", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.10604140450627, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Just a summer, I think it was less than a month."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. And then finished high school?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "And that was after I had finished high school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And then after that I did just some traveling for family reasons to Chicago, and moved my aunt and uncle back to Los Angeles and so on. But then I started college after that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay, so you were actually in your fourth year of college when Kennedy became president?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:33", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.895601560562522, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And that was after I had finished high school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And then after that I did just some traveling for family reasons to Chicago, and moved my aunt and uncle back to Los Angeles and so on. But then I started college after that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay, so you were actually in your fourth year of college when Kennedy became president?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And, uh, you said you mentioned that you remembered the inaugural address."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:35", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 8.772890622847246, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And then after that I did just some traveling for family reasons to Chicago, and moved my aunt and uncle back to Los Angeles and so on. But then I started college after that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay, so you were actually in your fourth year of college when Kennedy became president?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And, uh, you said you mentioned that you remembered the inaugural address."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "At that point, what did you do, I mean, during that fourth year of college?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:39", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.6702353368484526, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "At that point, what did you do, I mean, during that fourth year of college?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, as you know, Vietnam was heating up at the time, and I was draftable and had signed up for the draft and had been given a, you know, that I could be drafted. So I had also, as well as applying to the Peace Corps, applied to the Air Force. And I wanted to get in graduate or not graduate school, but a program, a four year program for officers training in Langley, Texas, I think it was. And so those two applications were being processed during this time when I was a senior in college."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And so I didn't know which would come first, I really didn't. But fortunately, the Peace Corps sent me a telegram and said respond with a telegram within three days if you would accept going to the Philippines, the Philippine project. And I had to scramble to look up where the Philippines was."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh, okay."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:45", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.8000484730431445, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And you know, what the languages were and everything."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I took the full three days to decide between the two, because there were advantages of being in the Air Force, you know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So it came up that the Peace Corps had the most advantages to me personally, because I just thought that would be the ideal situation to be in."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you remember filling out the application and taking the entrance exam? There was a long."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:47", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 4.222276081159049, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I took the full three days to decide between the two, because there were advantages of being in the Air Force, you know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So it came up that the Peace Corps had the most advantages to me personally, because I just thought that would be the ideal situation to be in."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you remember filling out the application and taking the entrance exam? There was a long."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "At that time, did you indicate any preference?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:53", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.420131798572084, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I said South America or a Spanish speaking country."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And when they said, you know, say yes or no to the Philippines. I thought, oh, that's a Spanish speaking country, from what I could read in the encyclopedia."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But of course it wasn't. But officially a Spanish speaking country."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Maybe Peace Corps didn't know either."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:55", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 4.911257553968982, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And when they said, you know, say yes or no to the Philippines. I thought, oh, that's a Spanish speaking country, from what I could read in the encyclopedia."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But of course it wasn't. But officially a Spanish speaking country."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Maybe Peace Corps didn't know either."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Maybe by then. No. Not that early."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you had indicated, obviously, South America."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:57", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 4.3458417266322025, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But of course it wasn't. But officially a Spanish speaking country."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Maybe Peace Corps didn't know either."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Maybe by then. No. Not that early."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you had indicated, obviously, South America."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I assumed it would be South America because I had some Spanish background."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. Telegram came. This must have been what, in June?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:59", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.717601918480225, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Maybe by then. No. Not that early."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you had indicated, obviously, South America."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I assumed it would be South America because I had some Spanish background."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. Telegram came. This must have been what, in June?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, it was later in the summer, I think. I don't exactly remember. Later in the summer."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you had graduated and you were just sort of waiting for an answer from either of these two?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:61", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.130668798311361, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I assumed it would be South America because I had some Spanish background."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. Telegram came. This must have been what, in June?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, it was later in the summer, I think. I don't exactly remember. Later in the summer."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you had graduated and you were just sort of waiting for an answer from either of these two?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Had your draft board given you a, we're going to get you by such and such a date or?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:67", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.666212343362634, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it hadn't come to that. And I was in the San Fernando Valley, which had a very large pool of young men."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "At that time. And so my number hadn't come up and probably didn't come up, I don't know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't think it did, because I heard that they drafted from Peace Corps in service, from men in the service already in country. They had drafted somebody in an earlier group in the Philippines."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That was rare, very rare. Most boards accepted Peace Corps service at least as a deferment."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:69", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.295791492625149, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "At that time. And so my number hadn't come up and probably didn't come up, I don't know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't think it did, because I heard that they drafted from Peace Corps in service, from men in the service already in country. They had drafted somebody in an earlier group in the Philippines."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That was rare, very rare. Most boards accepted Peace Corps service at least as a deferment."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So what was your reaction, your family's reaction, your friends when?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:75", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.525091210734085, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, they thought this was something really good and they thought it would be a good thing to do. My parents, especially my mother, didn't cater to the Air Force very much. She didn't like military."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And she thought it would be better to do a civilian kind of job."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Even though it was a couple of years."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did your friends think you were crazy or were they?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:77", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 8.361212456371206, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And she thought it would be better to do a civilian kind of job."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Even though it was a couple of years."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did your friends think you were crazy or were they?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, I really never knew completely. They, they, you know, wished me well, I, there was never a big, oh, you're doing the right thing. It wasn't that kind of thing. It's more like, oh, you're going to do that, huh? Well, good luck."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you were pretty much convinced it was a good choice?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:79", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 9.290236062634673, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Even though it was a couple of years."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did your friends think you were crazy or were they?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, I really never knew completely. They, they, you know, wished me well, I, there was never a big, oh, you're doing the right thing. It wasn't that kind of thing. It's more like, oh, you're going to do that, huh? Well, good luck."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you were pretty much convinced it was a good choice?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I was convinced."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, because everyone in California is crazy."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:81", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 10.322484514038525, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, I really never knew completely. They, they, you know, wished me well, I, there was never a big, oh, you're doing the right thing. It wasn't that kind of thing. It's more like, oh, you're going to do that, huh? Well, good luck."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you were pretty much convinced it was a good choice?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I was convinced."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, because everyone in California is crazy."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Oh, yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Sorry about that."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:83", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 11.469427237820582, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I was convinced."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, because everyone in California is crazy."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Oh, yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Sorry about that."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And my friends were among them. The craziest."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And so on, fairly short notice, you were ready to move."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:85", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 7, "return_to_go": 12.743808042022868, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Oh, yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Sorry about that."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And my friends were among them. The craziest."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And so on, fairly short notice, you were ready to move."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You got the telegram and how, how soon after did you have to report?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:87", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.382008935580965, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And my friends were among them. The craziest."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And so on, fairly short notice, you were ready to move."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You got the telegram and how, how soon after did you have to report?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I had to, it was late November I think that we started training in Hilo, Hawaii. So it must have been, you know, October or something that we all met, gathered in San Francisco and had some training meetings, you know, some preliminary meetings and told about deselection and all that. And you're not Peace Corps volunteers yet until you go through the training. That was a big, everybody was on edge about that. And then we, they flew us to Hilo or to Honolulu and then Hilo, and we stayed there for, I guess, two full months."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How big a group was it, do you remember?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:95", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 8.355447242159677, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And it was winnowed down to about, I think, what was it, 80 something. I think there was 40 percent deselection."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Wow."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And self deselection too."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So it was, it was winnowed out quite, pretty well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And can you describe the training?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:97", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 9.283830269066307, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And self deselection too."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So it was, it was winnowed out quite, pretty well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And can you describe the training?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "We stayed in."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, let's go, I'm sorry, let's go back. You, you had a few days in San Francisco. The group gathered. You then, was it a charter flight to Hawaii?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:99", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 10.315366965629229, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So it was, it was winnowed out quite, pretty well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And can you describe the training?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "We stayed in."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, let's go, I'm sorry, let's go back. You, you had a few days in San Francisco. The group gathered. You then, was it a charter flight to Hawaii?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, probably, I don't really remember."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you recall your reaction to the others in the group? You know, you had committed to doing this. You had some sense of, you know, it's what Kennedy had described and you felt you were doing it. Do you do you recall the others?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:103", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 10.265885142752134, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, probably, I don't really remember."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you recall your reaction to the others in the group? You know, you had committed to doing this. You had some sense of, you know, it's what Kennedy had described and you felt you were doing it. Do you do you recall the others?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, we were mostly 20 and 22 year olds and 23 year olds. So I just felt within a group that I could very much identify with because we were all very enthusiastic, idealistic, all with some background in college, most of us college graduates."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I felt, you know, that there was no negativity. We were all just on edge to, to complete the service and do a good job of it and try to get in."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And from the get-go, the, the staff had made it clear that training was a selection process?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:105", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 11.40653904750237, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, we were mostly 20 and 22 year olds and 23 year olds. So I just felt within a group that I could very much identify with because we were all very enthusiastic, idealistic, all with some background in college, most of us college graduates."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I felt, you know, that there was no negativity. We were all just on edge to, to complete the service and do a good job of it and try to get in."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And from the get-go, the, the staff had made it clear that training was a selection process?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Which created a certain amount of tension."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:107", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 12.673932275002633, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I felt, you know, that there was no negativity. We were all just on edge to, to complete the service and do a good job of it and try to get in."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And from the get-go, the, the staff had made it clear that training was a selection process?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Which created a certain amount of tension."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. And I understood that they were also just learning how to do the training. I mean, I got the feeling that they were trying to get experts from various fields over there and they didn't know exactly what, you know, how to do it precisely. But they were working on setting up a scheduling and a, the right way to do it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So what were the components of training?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:109", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 10.748813638891814, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Which created a certain amount of tension."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. And I understood that they were also just learning how to do the training. I mean, I got the feeling that they were trying to get experts from various fields over there and they didn't know exactly what, you know, how to do it precisely. But they were working on setting up a scheduling and a, the right way to do it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So what were the components of training?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "There was WEOG. I remember WEOG. I don't remember exactly what it stood for. Something about learning to be a good volunteer. It turned out to be just how to be a good volunteer. There were many area studies. I remember that distinctly. We had language from the first day, language studies with native Filipino teachers, and they had already divided us into language groups, and they knew that some people were going to the northern part of the archipelago of the Philippines, and some were going to the middle or the southern."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. And what's the three? Are there three different languages?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:113", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 8.702239060360263, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "There was WEOG. I remember WEOG. I don't remember exactly what it stood for. Something about learning to be a good volunteer. It turned out to be just how to be a good volunteer. There were many area studies. I remember that distinctly. We had language from the first day, language studies with native Filipino teachers, and they had already divided us into language groups, and they knew that some people were going to the northern part of the archipelago of the Philippines, and some were going to the middle or the southern."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. And what's the three? Are there three different languages?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, there were 70 something dialects."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And we, but we were divided into two major dialect regions, the Ilocano in the north and the Cebuano, or what was it called? It was another name, Hiligaynon, I think, for the southern part. [phone rings, tape break]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Are both of those dialects of Tagalog, is that?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:117", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 7.286714889333657, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And we, but we were divided into two major dialect regions, the Ilocano in the north and the Cebuano, or what was it called? It was another name, Hiligaynon, I think, for the southern part. [phone rings, tape break]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Are both of those dialects of Tagalog, is that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, in a way, they're Malayan tongues. Malayan."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Dialects, actually of Malayan, and Tagalog is sort of, well, the, became the most, the richest one and the one that most people learned because they had to in school. They learned their native dialect, they called it, and then Tagalog and then English also. So kids in elementary school learn three languages."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was the official language of the country?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:121", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 7.761376406584762, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Dialects, actually of Malayan, and Tagalog is sort of, well, the, became the most, the richest one and the one that most people learned because they had to in school. They learned their native dialect, they called it, and then Tagalog and then English also. So kids in elementary school learn three languages."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was the official language of the country?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Tagalog. They call it Filipino."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That was the official language. But the unofficial lingua franca was English."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How was the language training structured?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:123", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.290418229538624, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Tagalog. They call it Filipino."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That was the official language. But the unofficial lingua franca was English."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How was the language training structured?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "In our training? Well, they had, as I said, native speakers come and at dinner time we had to eat in our dialect. You know, we had to try to talk while we were sitting there eating and not talking much at all. And then during the each day we had at least an hour. I don't remember the exact scheduling, but maybe an hour each day of intensive training in that language and sort of an immersion kind of program. The, usually they were, I think they were all women who were the teachers, and they would just sit there and talk to us and we would have, we would memorize dialogs that they passed out."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So they create situations about going to the store and you'd."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:125", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.878242477265138, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That was the official language. But the unofficial lingua franca was English."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How was the language training structured?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "In our training? Well, they had, as I said, native speakers come and at dinner time we had to eat in our dialect. You know, we had to try to talk while we were sitting there eating and not talking much at all. And then during the each day we had at least an hour. I don't remember the exact scheduling, but maybe an hour each day of intensive training in that language and sort of an immersion kind of program. The, usually they were, I think they were all women who were the teachers, and they would just sit there and talk to us and we would have, we would memorize dialogs that they passed out."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So they create situations about going to the store and you'd."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Memorize the dialog. Did you also have a chance to work in the language lab where you, you would speak and have it then?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:129", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 7.257089478105108, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Memorize the dialog. Did you also have a chance to work in the language lab where you, you would speak and have it then?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, they didn't have a language lab at all."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They just had regular teachers."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Where, where, where in Hilo was this going on?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:131", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.730099420116787, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, they didn't have a language lab at all."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They just had regular teachers."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Where, where, where in Hilo was this going on?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, about I'd say five miles or 5 to 10 miles from the downtown section of Hilo, up sort of on a hillside next to, um, a very famous waterfall in that area that's called Rainbow Falls."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was the institution that was?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:137", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.253908669570351, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was a, it had been a hospital. And the dormitories for us were in the nurses quarters, which were dormitories formerly for the nurses."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I had a room right overlooking the falls. I could hear it all night. Sometimes it kept me awake."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was a very beautiful campus, you might say."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And so it was just a building and then the entire staff was imported to, to work there?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:139", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.837676299522612, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I had a room right overlooking the falls. I could hear it all night. Sometimes it kept me awake."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was a very beautiful campus, you might say."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And so it was just a building and then the entire staff was imported to, to work there?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mm hmm. And I think there were several buildings, a main hospital building and several smaller buildings and then the dormitories, as I said. So it was really set up to be a hospital. And our training were in rooms, you know, they were possibly operating rooms or whatever. They looked like laboratories or large theaters of, you know, hospitals."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there a, there was a training staff?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:141", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 6.486306999469569, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was a very beautiful campus, you might say."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And so it was just a building and then the entire staff was imported to, to work there?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mm hmm. And I think there were several buildings, a main hospital building and several smaller buildings and then the dormitories, as I said. So it was really set up to be a hospital. And our training were in rooms, you know, they were possibly operating rooms or whatever. They looked like laboratories or large theaters of, you know, hospitals."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there a, there was a training staff?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there a permanent training staff that was with you the whole time or did people just come?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:145", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.662107406752554, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there a permanent training staff that was with you the whole time or did people just come?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, there was a core staff that was always there, especially the psychologists. They watched us every minute and we thought they had, they had, you know, audio visual things all over the place to watch us, but they really didn't."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And then they had invited staff from various, you know, all over the United States or other universities to tell about specific problems, about communism, for one thing. You know, about don't talk about communism. You know, that was a big thing that they stressed, and don't get into arguments with people. Just say you're here to do this job and whatever and pass it off that way."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you also did American Studies, where you studied about the structure of the United States Constitution and?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:147", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 6.291230451947282, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, there was a core staff that was always there, especially the psychologists. They watched us every minute and we thought they had, they had, you know, audio visual things all over the place to watch us, but they really didn't."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And then they had invited staff from various, you know, all over the United States or other universities to tell about specific problems, about communism, for one thing. You know, about don't talk about communism. You know, that was a big thing that they stressed, and don't get into arguments with people. Just say you're here to do this job and whatever and pass it off that way."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you also did American Studies, where you studied about the structure of the United States Constitution and?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You don't recall specifically any of the speakers that or faculty who did that?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:149", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 5.879144946608091, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And then they had invited staff from various, you know, all over the United States or other universities to tell about specific problems, about communism, for one thing. You know, about don't talk about communism. You know, that was a big thing that they stressed, and don't get into arguments with people. Just say you're here to do this job and whatever and pass it off that way."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you also did American Studies, where you studied about the structure of the United States Constitution and?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You don't recall specifically any of the speakers that or faculty who did that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I have a lot of material that I could look up right now, but I don't recall out of my, just off of my head any names. Mr. Stalker is one of the top people, but I don't remember any specific speakers who came there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So did you have a sense, were you being tested at all about whether you were learning about communism, American institutions, and so forth?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:153", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.0236357365531985, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I have a lot of material that I could look up right now, but I don't recall out of my, just off of my head any names. Mr. Stalker is one of the top people, but I don't remember any specific speakers who came there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So did you have a sense, were you being tested at all about whether you were learning about communism, American institutions, and so forth?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It seems that, not formal tests that I remember, but we had a periodic evaluations and it wasn't about subject matter. It was more about 1-to-1 interviews about how we were getting along and how you get along with other people. And then we had ratings within the group, say within one study group, if we were divided into several groups so they could schedule during the day, and so maybe 30 people would be in one room and that was considered a group, and they would ask everybody in the group to rate each person in the group on a, on a list, a checkoff sort of."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Sociogram."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Exactly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But you knew that that was part of selection?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:155", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.69292859617022, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It seems that, not formal tests that I remember, but we had a periodic evaluations and it wasn't about subject matter. It was more about 1-to-1 interviews about how we were getting along and how you get along with other people. And then we had ratings within the group, say within one study group, if we were divided into several groups so they could schedule during the day, and so maybe 30 people would be in one room and that was considered a group, and they would ask everybody in the group to rate each person in the group on a, on a list, a checkoff sort of."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Sociogram."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Exactly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But you knew that that was part of selection?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there any resistance to that sort of thing?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:157", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.436587329078022, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Exactly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But you knew that that was part of selection?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there any resistance to that sort of thing?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Lots of resistance to that. I remember groups refusing and striking. They wouldn't evaluate each other. They would rather have themselves evaluated, but not each other."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were you in such a group?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:159", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 8.262874810086691, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there any resistance to that sort of thing?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Lots of resistance to that. I remember groups refusing and striking. They wouldn't evaluate each other. They would rather have themselves evaluated, but not each other."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were you in such a group?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. And I felt the same way."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were you threatened? I mean, did they say you can't do that? I mean, or did they simply?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:161", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 9.180972011207434, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Lots of resistance to that. I remember groups refusing and striking. They wouldn't evaluate each other. They would rather have themselves evaluated, but not each other."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were you in such a group?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. And I felt the same way."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were you threatened? I mean, did they say you can't do that? I mean, or did they simply?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I think maybe a few people did it, and from that they got some data. But not everybody turned in those papers. We would throw them away. We were a pretty independent group. And even then, even risking our own, you know, the psychologists were watching us and even risking that, we said no, we don't want to interview or to rate other people."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was the source of your independence? I mean, why do you think you were independent?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:163", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 10.201080012452705, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. And I felt the same way."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were you threatened? I mean, did they say you can't do that? I mean, or did they simply?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I think maybe a few people did it, and from that they got some data. But not everybody turned in those papers. We would throw them away. We were a pretty independent group. And even then, even risking our own, you know, the psychologists were watching us and even risking that, we said no, we don't want to interview or to rate other people."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was the source of your independence? I mean, why do you think you were independent?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, because, um, we had all been college graduates and learned, had learned to evaluate things and not be forced into things. I think that was the main thing.\n\nWas the group or the subgroup sort of developing its own esprit and?\n\nOnly in reaction to that kind of thing. But as far as socially, we were all one group. We felt a strong, you know, oneness as a group."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there anything at all like technical studies saying that when you get to the Philippines, this is the job you're going to be doing, and we're going to try to?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:169", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 8.437695490332928, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, would you repeat that again, the first part?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Technical training."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, the technical. Yes. I would say rate that as very good because we were just college graduates, you know, liberal arts people who had never taught, most of us."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And they said, you are now going to be teacher's aides, and you're going to be learning how to teach English as a second language and science, and you're going to be teaching Filipino teachers how to do that same thing. So they were very intense about that. And we even had to go to local schools and teach adults, Japanese Americans or Japanese immigrants, to speak English. And that was a big part of it. Every evening, about 3:00 or 4:00 in the afternoon, we would go to a school and the teachers would cooperate. The regular teachers in those schools cooperated with us to have us come in and teach for 20 minutes or something, and we had to plan lessons based on the, the daily lessons that we had, you know, in the, in the school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So someone, I mean, was defining a, the probable role for you when you got to the Philippines?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:173", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 10.4169080127567, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And they said, you are now going to be teacher's aides, and you're going to be learning how to teach English as a second language and science, and you're going to be teaching Filipino teachers how to do that same thing. So they were very intense about that. And we even had to go to local schools and teach adults, Japanese Americans or Japanese immigrants, to speak English. And that was a big part of it. Every evening, about 3:00 or 4:00 in the afternoon, we would go to a school and the teachers would cooperate. The regular teachers in those schools cooperated with us to have us come in and teach for 20 minutes or something, and we had to plan lessons based on the, the daily lessons that we had, you know, in the, in the school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So someone, I mean, was defining a, the probable role for you when you got to the Philippines?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. And we had the name teachers aides, or I'm sorry, educational aides is what we were."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "There was a running joke about that. What are we supposed to be doing being education aides? We didn't know exactly what that meant."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Did, um, did anyone come out from Washington during training? Do you recall any visitors?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:179", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 9.21386558677188, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I remember Jay Rockefeller running and walking and hiking with us."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "He was a young man at that time, about 20, in his 20s, I think. And, uh, I don't specifically remember none of the, you know, top level people. We didn't have Kennedy. We didn't have Shriver. We didn't have any of the top people. There may have been some, a couple people from Washington who lectured about communism. I have a feeling, that's in the back of my mind."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Somebody from Washington was there one day to lecture to the entire group about, you know, politics."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Were, uh, what was the physical ed program? How was it structured?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:189", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.5307381780756293, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And most, about 18 of them made it to the very top because they had been very athletic in college."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Most of the group didn't make it all the way to the very top, you know, lacking several hundred yards only. But there was no air."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So we just dropped."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How high up is it, do you remember?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:191", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 3.9230424200840326, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Most of the group didn't make it all the way to the very top, you know, lacking several hundred yards only. But there was no air."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So we just dropped."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How high up is it, do you remember?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think it's 14,000 something. Yeah, it's very high."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So selection was clearly a big thing. Were there different points in during the training? How long was the training program altogether?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:195", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.497583234671645, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think it's 14,000 something. Yeah, it's very high."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So selection was clearly a big thing. Were there different points in during the training? How long was the training program altogether?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Two months."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Eight weeks?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Eight weeks."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh, did, was there a mid selection process?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:197", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.7750924829684944, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Two months."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Eight weeks?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Eight weeks."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh, did, was there a mid selection process?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, a mid point deselection."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How was that handled, do you recall?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:199", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.083436092187216, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Eight weeks."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh, did, was there a mid selection process?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, a mid point deselection."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How was that handled, do you recall?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did they take people out and shoot them or?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:201", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 3.42604010243024, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, a mid point deselection."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How was that handled, do you recall?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did they take people out and shoot them or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "They took them out and tied them to poles. No. They gave us little pieces of paper that each person received a paper that was folded and had a number of a room, like a little office room number. There were several offices down the hallways. And I was to report to room two, for instance. And then the person in there said, you have not been deselected and you're going to continue on. But people who went down the hall to room number 13, they were told individually that they would be deselected and they would have to pack up and leave. And that was very difficult."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When was this, on a Friday? Do you remember or, I mean?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:203", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.6956001138113774, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did they take people out and shoot them or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "They took them out and tied them to poles. No. They gave us little pieces of paper that each person received a paper that was folded and had a number of a room, like a little office room number. There were several offices down the hallways. And I was to report to room two, for instance. And then the person in there said, you have not been deselected and you're going to continue on. But people who went down the hall to room number 13, they were told individually that they would be deselected and they would have to pack up and leave. And that was very difficult."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When was this, on a Friday? Do you remember or, I mean?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't remember what day of the week, but I really don't. Probably, could be a Friday."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you remember the impact on the group?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:207", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.3279013750757747, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't remember what day of the week, but I really don't. Probably, could be a Friday."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you remember the impact on the group?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, very tremendous impact because we were, as I said, you know, a strong, one group that we're all going to make it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And then when someone that you had gotten to know and eaten with and been in classes with and hiked on mountains with suddenly had to leave, it was quite stressful for everybody. There was a lot of tears."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Any protest, any protests?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:211", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.1085202161429315, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And then when someone that you had gotten to know and eaten with and been in classes with and hiked on mountains with suddenly had to leave, it was quite stressful for everybody. There was a lot of tears."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Any protest, any protests?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, not directly that I remember to the administration, but there were, you know, lots of, lots of questioning. Why? How come? Why would that be? She was fine. He always answered the right questions. He was a good guy."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But they never really understood. And I still have that in my mind. I don't understand why a girl from California was deselected. She seemed just perfect."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Your group was also early enough that they were doing FBI background checks on you."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:213", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.565022462381035, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, not directly that I remember to the administration, but there were, you know, lots of, lots of questioning. Why? How come? Why would that be? She was fine. He always answered the right questions. He was a good guy."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But they never really understood. And I still have that in my mind. I don't understand why a girl from California was deselected. She seemed just perfect."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Your group was also early enough that they were doing FBI background checks on you."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yes. I heard from family and neighbors even that they came down the street and talked to several neighbors around my parents' home."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. Um. So the midpoint of training, it was kind of traumatic. But in some ways, since you were a survivor, you could, you could deal with it. Did anyone ever at the beginning of training, midpoint, try to articulate the standards by which you were being judged?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:219", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.6941323215103348, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I believe they did. They, they mentioned sociograms, and they mentioned that there were several levels of, you know, evaluation, our psychological abilities to, you know, to be in a foreign country, you know, that there's been so much done about that, you know, in, in university studies that they pretty, they were pretty well aware of who could possibly stand culture shock and who couldn't. And we were evaluated, I'm sure, on, you know, knowing what they taught us. But I don't remember being tested directly about that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But I think that would show up in in other ways. There was a large amount of trying to get us into smaller groups and interacting with the person who was lecturing and, you know, getting our ideas or what, what we would say in this situation, even some role playing, I remember. And, you know, individuals taken out of the group and sat in the front and grilled in front of us, you know, in a mock kind of thing, you know, what would you say to this kind of thing? And there was a lot of talk about communism. And I just remember that, you know, what would you say in this situation if somebody had came up with you, to you and said something when. That actually happened to me on a bus in the Philippines near Manila."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Two students were behind me while my roommate and I were on a bus and the two students behind us were Filipinos, and they started sort of heckling us and saying, how come you're here? You're a Peace Corps. What does that Peace Corps mean? What do you mean? What are you doing here? What are you really doing? So we had to sort of calm it down because we could see it was getting pretty tense, and they were ready to either push us off the bus or start a fight or whatever. So we just sort of modulated that down."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So once you got in the field, you realized that there was some value, although at the time it may have seemed awkward. I mean, role playing is not a."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:221", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.882369246122594, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But I think that would show up in in other ways. There was a large amount of trying to get us into smaller groups and interacting with the person who was lecturing and, you know, getting our ideas or what, what we would say in this situation, even some role playing, I remember. And, you know, individuals taken out of the group and sat in the front and grilled in front of us, you know, in a mock kind of thing, you know, what would you say to this kind of thing? And there was a lot of talk about communism. And I just remember that, you know, what would you say in this situation if somebody had came up with you, to you and said something when. That actually happened to me on a bus in the Philippines near Manila."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Two students were behind me while my roommate and I were on a bus and the two students behind us were Filipinos, and they started sort of heckling us and saying, how come you're here? You're a Peace Corps. What does that Peace Corps mean? What do you mean? What are you doing here? What are you really doing? So we had to sort of calm it down because we could see it was getting pretty tense, and they were ready to either push us off the bus or start a fight or whatever. So we just sort of modulated that down."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So once you got in the field, you realized that there was some value, although at the time it may have seemed awkward. I mean, role playing is not a."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. And I thought the training was excellent to, in the face of what we faced over there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you recall the pen and pencil psychological test that you did?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:223", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.09152138458066, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Two students were behind me while my roommate and I were on a bus and the two students behind us were Filipinos, and they started sort of heckling us and saying, how come you're here? You're a Peace Corps. What does that Peace Corps mean? What do you mean? What are you doing here? What are you really doing? So we had to sort of calm it down because we could see it was getting pretty tense, and they were ready to either push us off the bus or start a fight or whatever. So we just sort of modulated that down."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So once you got in the field, you realized that there was some value, although at the time it may have seemed awkward. I mean, role playing is not a."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. And I thought the training was excellent to, in the face of what we faced over there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you recall the pen and pencil psychological test that you did?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Vaguely."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "The MMPI [Minnesota Multiphasic Personality Inventory] was one of them?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:231", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.8160667346146313, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I possibly it was the MMPI."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think so. And then there were just check lists of, you know, this person, you know, does well under pressure. Yes or no?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't remember the names of the tests at all."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were there psychiatric interviews?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:233", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.0178519273495903, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think so. And then there were just check lists of, you know, this person, you know, does well under pressure. Yes or no?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't remember the names of the tests at all."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were there psychiatric interviews?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. There were psychologists and possibly psychiatrists."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. Did everyone get to see?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:235", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.2420576970551003, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't remember the names of the tests at all."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were there psychiatric interviews?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. There were psychologists and possibly psychiatrists."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. Did everyone get to see?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, everyone did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That must have shaken up the group, because most people at that point did not have experience of psychiatrists."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:239", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.7679724655001237, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, everyone did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That must have shaken up the group, because most people at that point did not have experience of psychiatrists."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's right. And that sort of eased our mind because we thought, well, these people were deselected but probably for a good reason, because there was a psychologist there testing them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And interviewing them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Coming near the end of the eight weeks is going to be another evaluation. Did people in the second half of training, did a certain number of people simply resign, I mean?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:243", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.41724995740756, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And interviewing them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Coming near the end of the eight weeks is going to be another evaluation. Did people in the second half of training, did a certain number of people simply resign, I mean?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "There were several I remember, yes. Maybe, I don't remember the percentages, but I'd say at least 5 to 7 people just said, I've had it. That's it. I'm not going to continue with this."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And they left."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Do you remember the approximate male female split in the group?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:245", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.796944397119511, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "There were several I remember, yes. Maybe, I don't remember the percentages, but I'd say at least 5 to 7 people just said, I've had it. That's it. I'm not going to continue with this."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And they left."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Do you remember the approximate male female split in the group?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "About equal. I'd say it was about equal."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And there were married couples?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:247", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.218827107910568, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And they left."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Do you remember the approximate male female split in the group?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "About equal. I'd say it was about equal."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And there were married couples?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Several married couples in our group. And at least two, two couples I remember, you know, met there and subsequently got married."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah. Did anyone, either Filipino or American, who was working in the project in the field, come to training?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:253", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.787142809205168, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, the language teachers did. They, they were from the Philippines. So they came to Hawaii and then went back with us."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They went back home as we were going to the Philippines."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But, yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And there were. Yes. I don't remember names or faces, but I remember one of the country reps was with us there and then went with us to the country. But he had been there before."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Wasn't Larry Fuchs?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:255", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 6.430158676894631, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They went back home as we were going to the Philippines."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But, yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And there were. Yes. I don't remember names or faces, but I remember one of the country reps was with us there and then went with us to the country. But he had been there before."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Wasn't Larry Fuchs?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. It was Larry Fuchs."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Okay. Yeah."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:261", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.448777334560535, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I, in fact, I knew him, uh, for, when we had a camp of brotherhood that was called Camp Brotherhood for children of the, of the workers of the field hands."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And he was there to inaugurate a Kennedy statue one day."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "He and his wife. Did you know him, too?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, some. I'll tell you later."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:263", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 8.276419260622816, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And he was there to inaugurate a Kennedy statue one day."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "He and his wife. Did you know him, too?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, some. I'll tell you later."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Um, training is coming near an end. Just when you reported to training, had you been advised as to what to buy and to prepare yourself, you know, clothing and all the stuff?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:265", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 9.196021400692018, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "He and his wife. Did you know him, too?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, some. I'll tell you later."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Um, training is coming near an end. Just when you reported to training, had you been advised as to what to buy and to prepare yourself, you know, clothing and all the stuff?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. I remember a list, check list sort of thing. The things that would be recommended to take with you."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So the point at which you left home to go into training, that was it? I mean, you know, the next you would be back two years later."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:267", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 9.106690445213353, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Um, training is coming near an end. Just when you reported to training, had you been advised as to what to buy and to prepare yourself, you know, clothing and all the stuff?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. I remember a list, check list sort of thing. The things that would be recommended to take with you."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So the point at which you left home to go into training, that was it? I mean, you know, the next you would be back two years later."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Two years later. I assumed that would be true, and I intended to stay the two years at least."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And at the end of the training program, what? What happened at that point then?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:275", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 8.362582602062723, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "In Hilo."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And then soon after that went to Honolulu for, they called it R&R. For about a week we had."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Wow."}, {"role": "user", "content": "R&R. And then they said, get ready to go to Manila, where we're having further in-country indoctrination or whatever they called it, in-country service information."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So did you go by charter?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:281", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.753885599537344, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I really don't know. It seemed like we filled the plane, but I had a feeling there were other people on it too. It was a large, you know, big jumbo jet. Pan Am, I think."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And we spent overnight in Tokyo."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, wonderful."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I mean, it was a big hotel. The first time I'd ever tasted sushi and all that. And then the next morning to Manila."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. How about describing your arrival?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:283", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 8.615428443930382, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And we spent overnight in Tokyo."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, wonderful."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I mean, it was a big hotel. The first time I'd ever tasted sushi and all that. And then the next morning to Manila."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. How about describing your arrival?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It's vague in my mind. In Manila I don't remember too much. I just remember we."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there a ceremony at the airport, do you recall that? You got off the plane?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:285", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 9.572698271033758, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I mean, it was a big hotel. The first time I'd ever tasted sushi and all that. And then the next morning to Manila."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. How about describing your arrival?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It's vague in my mind. In Manila I don't remember too much. I just remember we."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there a ceremony at the airport, do you recall that? You got off the plane?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not in Manila. No, I don't remember anything like that in Manila. There was further down when I got to my town. Or near my town."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So arrival in Manila. Now it's time for the in-country training."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:289", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.003331198807108, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not in Manila. No, I don't remember anything like that in Manila. There was further down when I got to my town. Or near my town."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So arrival in Manila. Now it's time for the in-country training."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We had training. It was just brief. I think it was about a week or so or less. We just went for daily, I think it was only mornings we had to talk about, you know, the places we were going, possibly going to, because they weren't organized well enough to find out, to know exactly where we were, each person was going. In fact, I remember distinctly at that point I didn't know if I would be alone in the place I was going to be, or with a roommate or with, you know, other people or near other people."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And then finally, by the end of that week, period, whatever it was, then I was paired with another Peace Corps man. And, and then we knew."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "During that time, were there Filipino educational officials who came and spoke to you?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:291", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 7.781479109785675, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We had training. It was just brief. I think it was about a week or so or less. We just went for daily, I think it was only mornings we had to talk about, you know, the places we were going, possibly going to, because they weren't organized well enough to find out, to know exactly where we were, each person was going. In fact, I remember distinctly at that point I didn't know if I would be alone in the place I was going to be, or with a roommate or with, you know, other people or near other people."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And then finally, by the end of that week, period, whatever it was, then I was paired with another Peace Corps man. And, and then we knew."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "During that time, were there Filipino educational officials who came and spoke to you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I believe there were. I just, that whole part of it doesn't even, it's not in part of my memory."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Let's jump back briefly to training. Was there a final exam or a matching up of level with the language, at the end of language training?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:293", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.5349767886507495, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And then finally, by the end of that week, period, whatever it was, then I was paired with another Peace Corps man. And, and then we knew."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "During that time, were there Filipino educational officials who came and spoke to you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I believe there were. I just, that whole part of it doesn't even, it's not in part of my memory."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Let's jump back briefly to training. Was there a final exam or a matching up of level with the language, at the end of language training?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. That seemed to be a big thing, that the people that did well in the language, um, possibly were paired with people who weren't, who didn't do as well. I have a feeling that was true in my case, and I know of one other possible case of that. Uh, two female volunteers near, well, maybe several hours away, but on the same island, who one was strong and the other one was not. So I had a feeling that we were paired on the basis of that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were you in the upper group in language?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:295", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 8.372196431834166, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I believe there were. I just, that whole part of it doesn't even, it's not in part of my memory."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Let's jump back briefly to training. Was there a final exam or a matching up of level with the language, at the end of language training?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. That seemed to be a big thing, that the people that did well in the language, um, possibly were paired with people who weren't, who didn't do as well. I have a feeling that was true in my case, and I know of one other possible case of that. Uh, two female volunteers near, well, maybe several hours away, but on the same island, who one was strong and the other one was not. So I had a feeling that we were paired on the basis of that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were you in the upper group in language?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. When you, during even the first week in Manila, did you have a. [tape break] First week you tried, but without great success to use the language."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:297", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 9.30244047981574, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. That seemed to be a big thing, that the people that did well in the language, um, possibly were paired with people who weren't, who didn't do as well. I have a feeling that was true in my case, and I know of one other possible case of that. Uh, two female volunteers near, well, maybe several hours away, but on the same island, who one was strong and the other one was not. So I had a feeling that we were paired on the basis of that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were you in the upper group in language?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. When you, during even the first week in Manila, did you have a. [tape break] First week you tried, but without great success to use the language."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We talked among ourselves, the ones who were in that same language group. We, I'm sure we did a lot of practicing, but in Manila, it's such a big city that we couldn't find anybody to talk to in that, in our dialect. Our dialect."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. You, you met the Peace Corps staff when you got, while you were in Manila?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:299", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 10.336044977573044, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. When you, during even the first week in Manila, did you have a. [tape break] First week you tried, but without great success to use the language."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We talked among ourselves, the ones who were in that same language group. We, I'm sure we did a lot of practicing, but in Manila, it's such a big city that we couldn't find anybody to talk to in that, in our dialect. Our dialect."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. You, you met the Peace Corps staff when you got, while you were in Manila?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And then you received your assignment?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:301", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 11.484494419525605, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We talked among ourselves, the ones who were in that same language group. We, I'm sure we did a lot of practicing, but in Manila, it's such a big city that we couldn't find anybody to talk to in that, in our dialect. Our dialect."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. You, you met the Peace Corps staff when you got, while you were in Manila?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And then you received your assignment?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did someone take you aside and said, this is where you're going and sort of brief you on it or?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:303", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 10.538327132806227, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And then you received your assignment?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did someone take you aside and said, this is where you're going and sort of brief you on it or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. I remember somebody said, you're going to the southern central. You'll be on the island of Negros in the province of Negros Oriental. And I remember that distinctly. That was quite a big emotional moment for me to know exactly where I was going."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. And, uh. At, before you left Manila, it was, someone else was assigned with you?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:305", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 6, "return_to_go": 10.598141258673586, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did someone take you aside and said, this is where you're going and sort of brief you on it or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. I remember somebody said, you're going to the southern central. You'll be on the island of Negros in the province of Negros Oriental. And I remember that distinctly. That was quite a big emotional moment for me to know exactly where I was going."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. And, uh. At, before you left Manila, it was, someone else was assigned with you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. There was a whole group that got on the plane to go to Cebu. It was Cebu. Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And then tell me how you got from Manila to where you eventually ended up."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:307", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.109045842970651, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. I remember somebody said, you're going to the southern central. You'll be on the island of Negros in the province of Negros Oriental. And I remember that distinctly. That was quite a big emotional moment for me to know exactly where I was going."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. And, uh. At, before you left Manila, it was, someone else was assigned with you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. There was a whole group that got on the plane to go to Cebu. It was Cebu. Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And then tell me how you got from Manila to where you eventually ended up."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They put us on a PAL plane, Philippines Airlines, and I think there, let's see, there were two, four, six, about eight of us, I believe, who were on this plane to land in Cebu City. And then, uh, two. One got off there and the rest of us went to Dumaguete Airport and where the University of Silliman, Silliman University is. And then this small group was met by the city officials and the mayor and several people from the university. It was a very warm hearted kind of welcoming. And then within about a day or so after that, I think it was just overnight, we stayed in one of the area rep's homes and then dispersed by bus to our locales."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was anyone assigned to the university?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:311", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 6.30746400366747, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They put us on a PAL plane, Philippines Airlines, and I think there, let's see, there were two, four, six, about eight of us, I believe, who were on this plane to land in Cebu City. And then, uh, two. One got off there and the rest of us went to Dumaguete Airport and where the University of Silliman, Silliman University is. And then this small group was met by the city officials and the mayor and several people from the university. It was a very warm hearted kind of welcoming. And then within about a day or so after that, I think it was just overnight, we stayed in one of the area rep's homes and then dispersed by bus to our locales."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was anyone assigned to the university?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We were all a rural group."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So this was a, uh, but that was the regional center for the, for the. And what was the town that was the regional center?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:313", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.897182226297189, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We were all a rural group."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So this was a, uh, but that was the regional center for the, for the. And what was the town that was the regional center?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Dumaguete City, they called it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Dumaguete. Okay. I want to just jump back briefly to training period. As you were doing the technical studies, you know, to being prepared to become educational aides. Was it also, were you also trained or encouraged to expect to do community development? Was that ever explicit?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:315", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 6.552424695885765, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We were all a rural group."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So this was a, uh, but that was the regional center for the, for the. And what was the town that was the regional center?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Dumaguete City, they called it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Dumaguete. Okay. I want to just jump back briefly to training period. As you were doing the technical studies, you know, to being prepared to become educational aides. Was it also, were you also trained or encouraged to expect to do community development? Was that ever explicit?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, not in our groups. We were specifically trained to be teachers, and language teachers specifically, plus some amount of science teaching because the Filipino government had requested volunteers to upgrade the teaching of second languages, especially English, and to upgrade the science curriculum that they had in their own public schools."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. So now you're going out to the town. How did you get out there?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:317", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 5.058249662095295, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Dumaguete City, they called it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Dumaguete. Okay. I want to just jump back briefly to training period. As you were doing the technical studies, you know, to being prepared to become educational aides. Was it also, were you also trained or encouraged to expect to do community development? Was that ever explicit?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, not in our groups. We were specifically trained to be teachers, and language teachers specifically, plus some amount of science teaching because the Filipino government had requested volunteers to upgrade the teaching of second languages, especially English, and to upgrade the science curriculum that they had in their own public schools."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. So now you're going out to the town. How did you get out there?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, there was, I just remember we were several days in Dumaguete, but at least overnight, possibly two overnights. My roommate and I had to go to a smaller town nearby Dumaguete, maybe an hour away or less, to do a little, just an orientation to see what the schools were like there. You know, just to see what a rural school was like, because we knew we were going to a rural school. So we spent some time talking to the teachers. They encouraged us to talk to all the teachers, go through the school, be introduced around and meet the students and parents and whoever else was around in the local area. And so that was sort of to prepare us for what we were going to eventually see."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So, and that was about a two week period?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:319", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.509166291216994, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, not in our groups. We were specifically trained to be teachers, and language teachers specifically, plus some amount of science teaching because the Filipino government had requested volunteers to upgrade the teaching of second languages, especially English, and to upgrade the science curriculum that they had in their own public schools."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. So now you're going out to the town. How did you get out there?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, there was, I just remember we were several days in Dumaguete, but at least overnight, possibly two overnights. My roommate and I had to go to a smaller town nearby Dumaguete, maybe an hour away or less, to do a little, just an orientation to see what the schools were like there. You know, just to see what a rural school was like, because we knew we were going to a rural school. So we spent some time talking to the teachers. They encouraged us to talk to all the teachers, go through the school, be introduced around and meet the students and parents and whoever else was around in the local area. And so that was sort of to prepare us for what we were going to eventually see."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So, and that was about a two week period?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it was several, just a few days, maybe two days or not more than two days."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Where did you stay?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:321", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.010184768018882, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, there was, I just remember we were several days in Dumaguete, but at least overnight, possibly two overnights. My roommate and I had to go to a smaller town nearby Dumaguete, maybe an hour away or less, to do a little, just an orientation to see what the schools were like there. You know, just to see what a rural school was like, because we knew we were going to a rural school. So we spent some time talking to the teachers. They encouraged us to talk to all the teachers, go through the school, be introduced around and meet the students and parents and whoever else was around in the local area. And so that was sort of to prepare us for what we were going to eventually see."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So, and that was about a two week period?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it was several, just a few days, maybe two days or not more than two days."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Where did you stay?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, I think we stayed in teachers' homes. We stayed, they had pre-arranged to have teachers accept, you know, a guest or two in their homes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So now what was the process of, uh, adjusting to the environment that you were going through at that point? You're still not at your assignment, but you're in the Philippines."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:331", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 7.373680787174858, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I didn't know that they had open sewers."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And already we were missing, I was missing milk and ice cream products because, you know, we hadn't had much of that. They, eventually in training, I mean, the first part of the training was very healthy American type meals, but then they were slowly getting us off onto rice every meal and lots of vegetables and fruits and less and less American food."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So we didn't have many. So by then, you know, almost three months into the thing, we were sort of missing having a glass of milk."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Even spending the two nights in the, in the village, was that, was that difficult?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:335", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 7.868741712561553, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So we didn't have many. So by then, you know, almost three months into the thing, we were sort of missing having a glass of milk."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Even spending the two nights in the, in the village, was that, was that difficult?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "For myself, it was not. I enjoyed it, but it was all new of course, and I was wondering if I would, if I could spend two years doing this. For other people, the females in the group, they were having somewhat of a problem with that. I know they were talking about a lot about it, and they didn't know if they could handle it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Just?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Just with, among ourselves."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, okay. The, was there a big difference in the way, generally, culturally, in the way male and female are treated, I mean?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:339", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 7.368816929088337, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Just with, among ourselves."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, okay. The, was there a big difference in the way, generally, culturally, in the way male and female are treated, I mean?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "In the Philippines culture, yes. And we were very well aware of that, made well aware of that, in training that the Filipino, you know, the women must be always modest and always sort of secondary, you know, in a very traditional culture."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And even though they're American women, they had to cool it and be, you know, more modest in their clothing, especially wearing clothing, what they said, who they hung out with, and always being together with another, other females, whether Filipinos or Americans."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. You, two days and then you go out and now you're going getting to the village where you're going to work."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:345", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 4.895496473372204, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Finally, we took our nine hour bus ride up to Canlaon City."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Conlon?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Canlaon City. It was almost 2,000 feet up the side of a volcano, and the volcano was the predominant land, land form and behind the town. I mean, it was just always there and it was not dormant. In fact, recently I found out online that in 1998 it had a major explosion and killed several people."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Huh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So it wasn't a dormant volcano, but there was always steam coming out of the top of it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It's something else to worry about."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:349", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.3401191029286474, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So it wasn't a dormant volcano, but there was always steam coming out of the top of it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It's something else to worry about."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And there was this little, little town, but they called it a city. They called it Canlaon City because the mayor had great plans, and it was just a large marketplace, because it was a central area for farming. And all the farmers would come down twice a week and bring all of their goods to sell. And it was a market day twice a week, Sunday and Thursday, I think."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And because we were the volunteers, they specifically made us be in that place because there was a central school. It was a very large school, maybe over 200 students."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. Uh, what? Yeah, do you have any idea what the approximate population of the city was?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:351", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.600132336587386, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And there was this little, little town, but they called it a city. They called it Canlaon City because the mayor had great plans, and it was just a large marketplace, because it was a central area for farming. And all the farmers would come down twice a week and bring all of their goods to sell. And it was a market day twice a week, Sunday and Thursday, I think."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And because we were the volunteers, they specifically made us be in that place because there was a central school. It was a very large school, maybe over 200 students."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. Uh, what? Yeah, do you have any idea what the approximate population of the city was?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, within the town itself, maybe 900 to 1,000 people actually lived within."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But then there were all these satellite communities around it, little farming?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:353", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.8890359295415395, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And because we were the volunteers, they specifically made us be in that place because there was a central school. It was a very large school, maybe over 200 students."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. Uh, what? Yeah, do you have any idea what the approximate population of the city was?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, within the town itself, maybe 900 to 1,000 people actually lived within."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But then there were all these satellite communities around it, little farming?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Small farming. Just farms really."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What did people farm?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:355", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.2100399217128217, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, within the town itself, maybe 900 to 1,000 people actually lived within."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But then there were all these satellite communities around it, little farming?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Small farming. Just farms really."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What did people farm?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, vegetables. Lots of cabbage. Different kinds of fruit. Onions. Um. You know, staple crops."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do they grow rice?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:357", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.5667110241253575, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Small farming. Just farms really."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What did people farm?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, vegetables. Lots of cabbage. Different kinds of fruit. Onions. Um. You know, staple crops."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do they grow rice?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right in that region, right where we lived, no. But the whole island of Negros was a major rice producing island of the whole country."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Manioc, things like that?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:359", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.963012249028175, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, vegetables. Lots of cabbage. Different kinds of fruit. Onions. Um. You know, staple crops."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do they grow rice?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right in that region, right where we lived, no. But the whole island of Negros was a major rice producing island of the whole country."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Manioc, things like that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Manioc?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It's a root."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:361", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.403346943364639, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right in that region, right where we lived, no. But the whole island of Negros was a major rice producing island of the whole country."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Manioc, things like that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Manioc?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It's a root."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. I don't remember hearing or seeing that. There possibly was."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Had there been a volunteer in that, Peace Corps volunteer in that village?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:363", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.892607714849599, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Manioc?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It's a root."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. I don't remember hearing or seeing that. There possibly was."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Had there been a volunteer in that, Peace Corps volunteer in that village?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, we were the first."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So the two you were."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:369", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.711396042317694, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We were the first."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, great."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And apparently, you know, they had done some very, the Peace Corps had done some very good preliminary planning because the mayor of the town knew we were coming, and thereby the whole political structure of the town knew that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "One of his lower political people, I don't forget exactly what he did, but he had the only house that was actually painted. It was painted a yellow, it was a two story wooden home with just open windows, with blinds, you know, with wooden blinds, shutters. And they gave us, very kindly gave us, you know, two men, separate rooms in the upper story, just divided by one wall. And it was, you know, a very perfect place. And they had really thought about this, I got the feeling."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And this had all been arranged?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:375", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 9.206304584797934, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "All prearranged."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Running water?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, we had a."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Outside latrine?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And what about eating arrangements?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:377", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 10.229227316442149, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, we had a."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Outside latrine?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And what about eating arrangements?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was not cold enough to have heat."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No, I mean eating, not heating."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:379", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 8.03247479604683, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And what about eating arrangements?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was not cold enough to have heat."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No, I mean eating, not heating."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Eating. I'm sorry. Eating. Oh, okay. Uh, we, they had told us we should hire a cook and a cleaning lady. So the same person did both. And she would cook for us every, two meals a day. And she was there to clean things and just be around. So we hired her at a very minimal wage per week or month, whatever it was, and she cooked for us every morning, and we would give her money to go to the market and buy whatever staples we needed."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Can you describe your first week as you settled in and first met and encountered the school?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:385", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 8.412173931477133, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Hmm, Some of that has left. This is 40 years ago almost."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But it was so exciting to me. I just, I was so enthusiastic about getting to the school. I think the first day I was there, I went to the school. I don't remember if it was a school day even, but just going there to meet the principal. I think the principal met us when we got off the bus, in fact."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And to meet the teachers. I remember meeting teachers and learning their names and trying to use the dialect as much as possible. My roommate was struggling with it still, and so he would, he was mostly in English, but we were always together most of the time in the first part of the service and went to the school. It was just so exciting and so, all so new to me. And yet we had heard about it before. But the actual reality of being there was just overwhelming."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Describe the school. You said it had 200 students."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:387", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 4.902415479419036, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But it was so exciting to me. I just, I was so enthusiastic about getting to the school. I think the first day I was there, I went to the school. I don't remember if it was a school day even, but just going there to meet the principal. I think the principal met us when we got off the bus, in fact."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And to meet the teachers. I remember meeting teachers and learning their names and trying to use the dialect as much as possible. My roommate was struggling with it still, and so he would, he was mostly in English, but we were always together most of the time in the first part of the service and went to the school. It was just so exciting and so, all so new to me. And yet we had heard about it before. But the actual reality of being there was just overwhelming."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Describe the school. You said it had 200 students."}, {"role": "user", "content": "200 students. It was a very large school with stairways on each side going, you know, maybe 30 steps up to the school. It was on a prominent hill overlooking the town. You know, schools are a big political thing in the country. The schools were set up pretty much like our schools were because the, in 1903 or something, they had a contingent of what would be called Peace Corps volunteers to us these days. But they were educators, and they went there from the Midwest and the East Coast and set up the school system. So it was well, well thought out. They had, you know, rooms, books, and everything all set up. And but the most important thing was the hierarchy of the school, the principal, the vice principal, the head teacher. And, you know, everything was already what we were familiar with from our own schooling."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh, what was the school level, from kindergarten to eighth grade or?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:391", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.7066857770605393, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "200 students. It was a very large school with stairways on each side going, you know, maybe 30 steps up to the school. It was on a prominent hill overlooking the town. You know, schools are a big political thing in the country. The schools were set up pretty much like our schools were because the, in 1903 or something, they had a contingent of what would be called Peace Corps volunteers to us these days. But they were educators, and they went there from the Midwest and the East Coast and set up the school system. So it was well, well thought out. They had, you know, rooms, books, and everything all set up. And but the most important thing was the hierarchy of the school, the principal, the vice principal, the head teacher. And, you know, everything was already what we were familiar with from our own schooling."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh, what was the school level, from kindergarten to eighth grade or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "To sixth grade."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "To sixth."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That was all free education. They didn't have to pay for it. But after sixth, only parents who could afford it to send their kids to high school or, you know, you know, from seventh through high school, could pay for it. The other kids, most of the kids in that school did not go to high school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Uh, were there church run schools?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:393", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.118539752289488, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "To sixth grade."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "To sixth."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That was all free education. They didn't have to pay for it. But after sixth, only parents who could afford it to send their kids to high school or, you know, you know, from seventh through high school, could pay for it. The other kids, most of the kids in that school did not go to high school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Uh, were there church run schools?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, they were Filipino. You know, political. Politically run schools."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was, were most people Catholic?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:395", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.576155280321653, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That was all free education. They didn't have to pay for it. But after sixth, only parents who could afford it to send their kids to high school or, you know, you know, from seventh through high school, could pay for it. The other kids, most of the kids in that school did not go to high school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Uh, were there church run schools?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, they were Filipino. You know, political. Politically run schools."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was, were most people Catholic?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Most of the country is Catholic."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So in the town where you were living, there must have been at least one Catholic church."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:397", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 5.08461697813517, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, they were Filipino. You know, political. Politically run schools."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was, were most people Catholic?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Most of the country is Catholic."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So in the town where you were living, there must have been at least one Catholic church."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yes. One church. And they had a private high school there, you know, parochial high school where the mayor's children or other people who could afford it would go to send their students, their children."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How did, how did you figure out what you were going to be doing at the school, I mean?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:401", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.042737010043419, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yes. One church. And they had a private high school there, you know, parochial high school where the mayor's children or other people who could afford it would go to send their students, their children."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How did, how did you figure out what you were going to be doing at the school, I mean?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "That was the hardest part. We didn't know what educational aides, we still didn't know what they did, you know. They had given us whole reams of paper describing what the possibilities were. But we, we just had to sort of fit in. So we made our own curriculum. And what I mostly did was, um, stayed with one teacher, a sixth grade teacher, throughout the first year at least, and stayed, you know, went to, reported to her room every day as she did and either sat with her or planned lessons with her, or sat, you know, watching her teach to get familiar with her methods. And then sometimes she would let me take over and teach because she was a younger teacher and she spoke pretty good English, but she didn't know exactly techniques of teaching it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I would plan lessons to show her how, how we had been taught to do it. So we were, I was a minor expert in her room and she appreciated that. And I think you."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you get? Oh go ahead, I'm sorry."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:403", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.603041122270466, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That was the hardest part. We didn't know what educational aides, we still didn't know what they did, you know. They had given us whole reams of paper describing what the possibilities were. But we, we just had to sort of fit in. So we made our own curriculum. And what I mostly did was, um, stayed with one teacher, a sixth grade teacher, throughout the first year at least, and stayed, you know, went to, reported to her room every day as she did and either sat with her or planned lessons with her, or sat, you know, watching her teach to get familiar with her methods. And then sometimes she would let me take over and teach because she was a younger teacher and she spoke pretty good English, but she didn't know exactly techniques of teaching it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I would plan lessons to show her how, how we had been taught to do it. So we were, I was a minor expert in her room and she appreciated that. And I think you."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you get? Oh go ahead, I'm sorry."}, {"role": "user", "content": "This was going on in all of the schools from, that our group was in, were in."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you, uh, did you get to meet with her outside the class?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:405", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 6.225601246967184, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I would plan lessons to show her how, how we had been taught to do it. So we were, I was a minor expert in her room and she appreciated that. And I think you."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you get? Oh go ahead, I'm sorry."}, {"role": "user", "content": "This was going on in all of the schools from, that our group was in, were in."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you, uh, did you get to meet with her outside the class?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And she wasn't, school's over, I got to go home kind of thing?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:407", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.806223607741315, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "This was going on in all of the schools from, that our group was in, were in."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you, uh, did you get to meet with her outside the class?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And she wasn't, school's over, I got to go home kind of thing?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. Most of the teachers were very dedicated. They'd stay at least an hour afterwards to finish up lessons, plan lessons or whatever. And at that time, that's what I used the time to plan with her. What are we going to do tomorrow? And, you know, it was."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "During the first year, did you work exclusively with the sixth grade teacher or did you?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:411", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 6.057066182396685, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. Most of the teachers were very dedicated. They'd stay at least an hour afterwards to finish up lessons, plan lessons or whatever. And at that time, that's what I used the time to plan with her. What are we going to do tomorrow? And, you know, it was."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "During the first year, did you work exclusively with the sixth grade teacher or did you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not exclusively, but she was sort of what I considered my home teacher."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I would go into other rooms. The other teachers would request me, you know, and so that was sort of the basis upon which I was in the school. I would say on Thursdays, for instance, I would be available in the afternoon to go to any teacher, and they would ask me to come in and teach this lesson or tell them how to do this or whatever."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you get to do anything in the name of science?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:413", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.618962424885206, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not exclusively, but she was sort of what I considered my home teacher."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I would go into other rooms. The other teachers would request me, you know, and so that was sort of the basis upon which I was in the school. I would say on Thursdays, for instance, I would be available in the afternoon to go to any teacher, and they would ask me to come in and teach this lesson or tell them how to do this or whatever."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you get to do anything in the name of science?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I remember teaching a lot of science in a third grade. There was another teacher that was, sort of adopted me, and she wanted to know what's going on in science. She had a very old curriculum where the kids just sat and memorized things. You know, you know, about magnetism or something. They would just memorize magnetism is caused by blah, blah, blah and repeat it. But then they said, well, you can bring in magnets and you can show them how they work and what materials are magnetized and so on."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you get any assistance from Peace Corps in this, with the science teaching? Like a science teaching kits or?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:415", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.243291583205784, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I would go into other rooms. The other teachers would request me, you know, and so that was sort of the basis upon which I was in the school. I would say on Thursdays, for instance, I would be available in the afternoon to go to any teacher, and they would ask me to come in and teach this lesson or tell them how to do this or whatever."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you get to do anything in the name of science?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I remember teaching a lot of science in a third grade. There was another teacher that was, sort of adopted me, and she wanted to know what's going on in science. She had a very old curriculum where the kids just sat and memorized things. You know, you know, about magnetism or something. They would just memorize magnetism is caused by blah, blah, blah and repeat it. But then they said, well, you can bring in magnets and you can show them how they work and what materials are magnetized and so on."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you get any assistance from Peace Corps in this, with the science teaching? Like a science teaching kits or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Let's see. I remember some educational materials, but they were very limited. They were in small boxes and there wasn't much there. So I would supplement by buying things or making things. [phone rings, tape break]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. Go ahead."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:417", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.936990648006427, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I remember teaching a lot of science in a third grade. There was another teacher that was, sort of adopted me, and she wanted to know what's going on in science. She had a very old curriculum where the kids just sat and memorized things. You know, you know, about magnetism or something. They would just memorize magnetism is caused by blah, blah, blah and repeat it. But then they said, well, you can bring in magnets and you can show them how they work and what materials are magnetized and so on."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you get any assistance from Peace Corps in this, with the science teaching? Like a science teaching kits or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Let's see. I remember some educational materials, but they were very limited. They were in small boxes and there wasn't much there. So I would supplement by buying things or making things. [phone rings, tape break]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. Go ahead."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. And so I really enjoyed that part of it because it was, I could see that it was so different for the kids. You know, they, they were almost, they thought, well, what is, what is he doing that for? You know, I was doing experiments or I remember a small simple machines kind of experiments that each kid had to make a little simple machine or draw a picture of it or something. And they weren't used to that kind of teaching. They were used to sitting with something in front of them and memorize what the teacher was telling them to memorize."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mm hmm. Yeah."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:419", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 7.707767386673807, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Let's see. I remember some educational materials, but they were very limited. They were in small boxes and there wasn't much there. So I would supplement by buying things or making things. [phone rings, tape break]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. Go ahead."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. And so I really enjoyed that part of it because it was, I could see that it was so different for the kids. You know, they, they were almost, they thought, well, what is, what is he doing that for? You know, I was doing experiments or I remember a small simple machines kind of experiments that each kid had to make a little simple machine or draw a picture of it or something. And they weren't used to that kind of teaching. They were used to sitting with something in front of them and memorize what the teacher was telling them to memorize."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mm hmm. Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So it was a different kind of way of teaching to them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You must have been a real novelty anyway."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:421", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.341963762970897, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. And so I really enjoyed that part of it because it was, I could see that it was so different for the kids. You know, they, they were almost, they thought, well, what is, what is he doing that for? You know, I was doing experiments or I remember a small simple machines kind of experiments that each kid had to make a little simple machine or draw a picture of it or something. And they weren't used to that kind of teaching. They were used to sitting with something in front of them and memorize what the teacher was telling them to memorize."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mm hmm. Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So it was a different kind of way of teaching to them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You must have been a real novelty anyway."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh. Every, even in the town market on market days, I'd been there a year and a half, and I'd walk in and everybody would stop and just stare."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Now the total non-Filipino population of the town was just the two of you or were there others?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:425", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.60736267033444, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh. Every, even in the town market on market days, I'd been there a year and a half, and I'd walk in and everybody would stop and just stare."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Now the total non-Filipino population of the town was just the two of you or were there others?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, we were."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No missionaries?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No missionaries. Although the priest, I think, was the priest who ran the high school and never really got to know them very much, and they seemed to change often, but he was either a Spaniard or a German or something, but we didn't get to know him very much."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What did you do for medical care?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:429", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 6.922669963375851, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No missionaries. Although the priest, I think, was the priest who ran the high school and never really got to know them very much, and they seemed to change often, but he was either a Spaniard or a German or something, but we didn't get to know him very much."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What did you do for medical care?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, there was what they called a pure culture center there, but I never went there. It was mostly closed most of the time. I had some major medical problems while over there, so I would have to send a telegram, because there was a way to send a telegram from the town to the nearest big city. There was a Peace Corps doctor there. No. Let's see. There was a doctor, a Filipino doctor, who was connected with the Peace Corps, and I had to make arrangements to get there, which was a nine hour bus ride to have the problem solved."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Wow."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So the medical care was almost nonexistent. There were, the, there was a doctor in the town, but I'd never really. I spoke to him, but never was treated by him."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you lose much time through illness, say, during the first year?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:431", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 5.469633292639834, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, there was what they called a pure culture center there, but I never went there. It was mostly closed most of the time. I had some major medical problems while over there, so I would have to send a telegram, because there was a way to send a telegram from the town to the nearest big city. There was a Peace Corps doctor there. No. Let's see. There was a doctor, a Filipino doctor, who was connected with the Peace Corps, and I had to make arrangements to get there, which was a nine hour bus ride to have the problem solved."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Wow."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So the medical care was almost nonexistent. There were, the, there was a doctor in the town, but I'd never really. I spoke to him, but never was treated by him."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you lose much time through illness, say, during the first year?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not in the first year hardly, very much, not too much, although I had a lot of colds and things. But not too much time from teaching. But the second year, two months of my whole."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Was the climate tropical where you were?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:433", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.8551481029331494, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So the medical care was almost nonexistent. There were, the, there was a doctor in the town, but I'd never really. I spoke to him, but never was treated by him."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you lose much time through illness, say, during the first year?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not in the first year hardly, very much, not too much, although I had a lot of colds and things. But not too much time from teaching. But the second year, two months of my whole."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Was the climate tropical where you were?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Tropical. And yet it was at 2,000 feet. So there was a lot of, when there was a rain, it was a two day rain. It was, you know, like a tropical typhoon would be going by. So it was cool. We had to wear sweaters."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there a rainy season, dry season, rainy season, dry season?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:437", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.759442102386604, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Tropical. And yet it was at 2,000 feet. So there was a lot of, when there was a rain, it was a two day rain. It was, you know, like a tropical typhoon would be going by. So it was cool. We had to wear sweaters."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there a rainy season, dry season, rainy season, dry season?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So it was tropical, definitely."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you settled into this teaching, and there are two teachers particularly who you were able to work with. Did, were all the teachers female?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:439", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.2882690026517825, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So it was tropical, definitely."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you settled into this teaching, and there are two teachers particularly who you were able to work with. Did, were all the teachers female?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. There was several males, but mostly female."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. Did, did either of them become, you know, like a close friend or an informant about the bigger world that you were in where you could possibly joke or?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:449", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.583987878967946, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But they stayed there for nine months of the year in a sort of a rooming house."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And so they would have parties there, just the teachers and the Peace Corps."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Peace Corps. And we would be invited always. You know, we were almost at an equal level with them. And they were, there was a lot of joking, a lot of, you know, partying and familiarity among us."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Was, um, the, uh, what was the educational background of the two teachers that you worked most with that first year?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:451", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 8.426653198853273, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And so they would have parties there, just the teachers and the Peace Corps."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Peace Corps. And we would be invited always. You know, we were almost at an equal level with them. And they were, there was a lot of joking, a lot of, you know, partying and familiarity among us."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Was, um, the, uh, what was the educational background of the two teachers that you worked most with that first year?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Just a typical, I guess, a four year college degree that they had in teaching. I'm not sure, I really."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It probably would have been like our old normal school."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:453", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 8.251836887614747, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Peace Corps. And we would be invited always. You know, we were almost at an equal level with them. And they were, there was a lot of joking, a lot of, you know, partying and familiarity among us."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Was, um, the, uh, what was the educational background of the two teachers that you worked most with that first year?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Just a typical, I guess, a four year college degree that they had in teaching. I'm not sure, I really."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It probably would have been like our old normal school."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right, a normal school kind of training. And that was it. Probably at Silliman University too, because that was the teacher training normal school there too."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Within the town, were they considered, were they looked up to?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:455", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 9.168707652905274, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Just a typical, I guess, a four year college degree that they had in teaching. I'm not sure, I really."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It probably would have been like our old normal school."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right, a normal school kind of training. And that was it. Probably at Silliman University too, because that was the teacher training normal school there too."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Within the town, were they considered, were they looked up to?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, definitely. Oh, teachers had a great amount of respect."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What, did you get involved at all in the life of the town?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:457", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 9, "return_to_go": 10.187452947672526, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right, a normal school kind of training. And that was it. Probably at Silliman University too, because that was the teacher training normal school there too."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Within the town, were they considered, were they looked up to?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, definitely. Oh, teachers had a great amount of respect."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What, did you get involved at all in the life of the town?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, very much, very deeply."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How, can you?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:461", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.4659912934228707, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, very much, very deeply."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How, can you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "The very first, uh, we got there in the, near the 1st of February to the actual location, and February 14th, which is our Valentine's Day, is the town Saint's Day. I think it was Saint Joseph, but I'm not sure. Anyway, they celebrated. That was the big festival of the year, where people, all the people from around the area, would come and stay with each other and have this big all day, maybe all week affair with dances, all night dances sometimes and musicians, you know. And they had, they strung electric lights even, and had a generator for the thing."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And that was a big thing because we had no electricity and, or only the mayor did. And, you know, they had dances and singing and special presentations and the queen, you know, the princess and the queen and her court of the, of the festival of the, of the town fiesta. And it was a very big thing. So I was immediately involved with that. Both of us were, we were sat on the stage and said, these are, you are the Peace Corps, and we are, you know, they made speeches. We had to make speeches. They made speeches about us. It was very good."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Now, at this point at the fiesta, were you making a speech in the local dialect or?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:463", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.6288792149143008, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "The very first, uh, we got there in the, near the 1st of February to the actual location, and February 14th, which is our Valentine's Day, is the town Saint's Day. I think it was Saint Joseph, but I'm not sure. Anyway, they celebrated. That was the big festival of the year, where people, all the people from around the area, would come and stay with each other and have this big all day, maybe all week affair with dances, all night dances sometimes and musicians, you know. And they had, they strung electric lights even, and had a generator for the thing."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And that was a big thing because we had no electricity and, or only the mayor did. And, you know, they had dances and singing and special presentations and the queen, you know, the princess and the queen and her court of the, of the festival of the, of the town fiesta. And it was a very big thing. So I was immediately involved with that. Both of us were, we were sat on the stage and said, these are, you are the Peace Corps, and we are, you know, they made speeches. We had to make speeches. They made speeches about us. It was very good."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Now, at this point at the fiesta, were you making a speech in the local dialect or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mostly in English. Mostly in English."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When you wanted to get a laugh, you would."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:467", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.010961993721359, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mostly in English. Mostly in English."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When you wanted to get a laugh, you would."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right, then try the dialect. Ha ha."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "At that point."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So during the first year, most of the language exchanges between you and all the people around you were in English."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:473", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 2.7585212533900667, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "For myself, I tried to do it only in the dialect. I was really, really trying."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I did most, except in school of course, I was committed to English, so I was teaching in English and trying to get the kids to hear it more. But off-time was I, you know, in the market, if I went down to buy something, it was always, I tried to do only in the dialect."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "The other person I was with really didn't ever grasp it, did not have the interest or the whatever it takes to learn a second language. So he just functioned in English."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was his name, by the way?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:475", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.9539125037667406, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I did most, except in school of course, I was committed to English, so I was teaching in English and trying to get the kids to hear it more. But off-time was I, you know, in the market, if I went down to buy something, it was always, I tried to do only in the dialect."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "The other person I was with really didn't ever grasp it, did not have the interest or the whatever it takes to learn a second language. So he just functioned in English."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was his name, by the way?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Roger."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Roger. Okay. And was Roger working in the same school that you were?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:477", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.1710138930741563, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "The other person I was with really didn't ever grasp it, did not have the interest or the whatever it takes to learn a second language. So he just functioned in English."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was his name, by the way?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Roger."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Roger. Okay. And was Roger working in the same school that you were?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. The first year."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. And without making unpleasant comparisons, did, what role did he end up playing for that first year?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:481", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.5691529544125389, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. The first year."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. And without making unpleasant comparisons, did, what role did he end up playing for that first year?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, similar to mine."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "He was adopted by several teachers and, and taught somewhat and went into classrooms. But then maybe it was within the first year he decided that that was my school, and he wanted to go to a barrio school, what they called a barrio, further down the road, about maybe a half hour walk to. He had his own school. He wanted to get more familiar with that principal and that group of teachers."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "In a much smaller school, I would think."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:483", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.7435032826805987, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, similar to mine."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "He was adopted by several teachers and, and taught somewhat and went into classrooms. But then maybe it was within the first year he decided that that was my school, and he wanted to go to a barrio school, what they called a barrio, further down the road, about maybe a half hour walk to. He had his own school. He wanted to get more familiar with that principal and that group of teachers."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "In a much smaller school, I would think."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And he, I don't know, really know what he did. I really don't know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, he did he move to that, to the barrio?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:489", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.3916368761050735, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, he stayed in in our house, but he would go there many mornings."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But you see, he was more involved with a larger scale thing. He had been, had some experience in community development, so he, he was very focused on creating a playground, an athletic ground with swings and a track and, you know, things like that. So he was working more with the mayor, doing sort of that kind of community development type of thing."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So he wasn't always at his school or even at the central school. He was more working the political angle and the, you know, community development."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But for you, I mean, most of your, your work time was strictly at the central school."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:491", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.657374306783415, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But you see, he was more involved with a larger scale thing. He had been, had some experience in community development, so he, he was very focused on creating a playground, an athletic ground with swings and a track and, you know, things like that. So he was working more with the mayor, doing sort of that kind of community development type of thing."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So he wasn't always at his school or even at the central school. He was more working the political angle and the, you know, community development."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But for you, I mean, most of your, your work time was strictly at the central school."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was it just by chance that you ended up close with a sixth and a third grade teacher or had?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:499", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.050258050271932, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We just clicked, you know. And she was quite astute. She was very well educated and probably from a higher family because she wasn't from the town, you know, she was from a more middle class family and."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And we just connected, you know. She knew what, she knew some techniques of teaching, but she was unfamiliar with others. And she wanted to pick my brain."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So she sort of adopted me just so I could help her."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Theoretically, you should have been working with all the teachers in the school."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:501", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.500286722524368, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And we just connected, you know. She knew what, she knew some techniques of teaching, but she was unfamiliar with others. And she wanted to pick my brain."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So she sort of adopted me just so I could help her."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Theoretically, you should have been working with all the teachers in the school."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, and I was aware of that. Very much so."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, to whom were you accountable?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:503", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.000318580582631, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So she sort of adopted me just so I could help her."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Theoretically, you should have been working with all the teachers in the school."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, and I was aware of that. Very much so."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, to whom were you accountable?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "To the principal of the school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And how was that, how did that play out?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:505", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.555909533980701, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, and I was aware of that. Very much so."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, to whom were you accountable?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "To the principal of the school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And how was that, how did that play out?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, he kept his distance in a way. He didn't know what our job was exactly. And he didn't want to be threatened, so he just kept his distance. But he would always, when we had teachers meetings with all the teachers in the school, you know, he would mention the Peace Corps and what we're doing, but that was a sideline to the main agenda of his agenda of we must do this now. We must do this now and this and that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay, so he never really quite figured out what you were all about."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:507", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.173232815534113, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "To the principal of the school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And how was that, how did that play out?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, he kept his distance in a way. He didn't know what our job was exactly. And he didn't want to be threatened, so he just kept his distance. But he would always, when we had teachers meetings with all the teachers in the school, you know, he would mention the Peace Corps and what we're doing, but that was a sideline to the main agenda of his agenda of we must do this now. We must do this now and this and that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay, so he never really quite figured out what you were all about."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not exactly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But he had, had he requested you being there or had the mayor or?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:511", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.621275080906312, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not exactly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But he had, had he requested you being there or had the mayor or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I have a feeling the mayor may have gotten wind of this first and then talked to the principal and said, we are going to have two Peace Corps here."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "You know, I think it was very hierarchical. I could feel that always, extremely hierarchical."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Again, sticking with the first year, can you describe a typical day? You know, what time do you get up and meals and?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:525", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 5.923674355627878, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That was it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I messed that up. No, they would have to go home. But some kids didn't, couldn't go home because it was so far. So they did bring their lunch and they ate it at school. That was it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But the teachers would go home. I went home and we would have the big meal of the day."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How far were you from the school?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:527", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.470749284030976, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I messed that up. No, they would have to go home. But some kids didn't, couldn't go home because it was so far. So they did bring their lunch and they ate it at school. That was it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But the teachers would go home. I went home and we would have the big meal of the day."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How far were you from the school?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was within visual distance, about less than a quarter mile."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. And you would then, what would be a typical lunch you'd get?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:535", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.881495631810663, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, something similar to that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Very salty. But they were good on rice, cut up on rice, and fresh vegetables. And lots of fruit. Papaya almost every day. Bananas every day. Some citrus fruits."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Coffee, lots of coffee. And lots of Coca-Cola. That was, and, well. And you either drink Coca-Cola or San Miguel beer. And I think I lived on San Miguel beer."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Where did they come from?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:537", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.42388403534518, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Very salty. But they were good on rice, cut up on rice, and fresh vegetables. And lots of fruit. Papaya almost every day. Bananas every day. Some citrus fruits."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Coffee, lots of coffee. And lots of Coca-Cola. That was, and, well. And you either drink Coca-Cola or San Miguel beer. And I think I lived on San Miguel beer."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Where did they come from?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "From Manila."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "All the way? And the system was good enough that."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:543", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.971034342037283, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, there was, I think in each city there was a bottling company."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "At least the major cities, the major city closest to us was not Dumaguete. It was Bacolod City, which was on the east coast. And it was, it was still nine hours to get there, but it was a better road than going to Dumaguete."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And it was all, almost all paved when you got down to a certain, to a certain distance. But that's where I remember there was a bottling company of Coca-Cola and some other thing that. I think the main brewery of San Miguel beer, though, was in Manila."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So generally the, there were food supplies available. I mean, it wasn't a prosperous setting, but the people weren't starving."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:545", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.5233714911525364, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "At least the major cities, the major city closest to us was not Dumaguete. It was Bacolod City, which was on the east coast. And it was, it was still nine hours to get there, but it was a better road than going to Dumaguete."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And it was all, almost all paved when you got down to a certain, to a certain distance. But that's where I remember there was a bottling company of Coca-Cola and some other thing that. I think the main brewery of San Miguel beer, though, was in Manila."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So generally the, there were food supplies available. I mean, it wasn't a prosperous setting, but the people weren't starving."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. Oh, it was, most people were pretty healthy."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. You've had lunch and a beer and siesta?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:547", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.13707943461393, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And it was all, almost all paved when you got down to a certain, to a certain distance. But that's where I remember there was a bottling company of Coca-Cola and some other thing that. I think the main brewery of San Miguel beer, though, was in Manila."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So generally the, there were food supplies available. I mean, it wasn't a prosperous setting, but the people weren't starving."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. Oh, it was, most people were pretty healthy."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. You've had lunch and a beer and siesta?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Siesta."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And then you have to get yourself back together."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:549", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 6.818977149571033, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. Oh, it was, most people were pretty healthy."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. You've had lunch and a beer and siesta?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Siesta."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And then you have to get yourself back together."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When did you head? [tape break] Tape two. And we were sort of going through a typical school day."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:553", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.850589073544486, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When did you head? [tape break] Tape two. And we were sort of going through a typical school day."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And we'd had lunch, and then it was time to go back to school for the afternoon."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Around 3:00?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Around 3:00, possibly 2:30. I'm not sure exactly, but it was early afternoon anyway. And we had to struggle through the mud to get back to school. Although there were rocks, you know, as I said, pebbles and cobblestones up part of the road, but the part of it was inundated with water."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you dress the same style as the other teacher, as the male teachers?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:561", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 4.63433786548466, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I did, I didn't try to become part of the teaching staff in that way."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I just wore American clothes. Um. And so the rain always stopped right at 2:30 or 3:00. And I have a little story about that, if we have time to do that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Sure."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And so then back to school and the afternoon wore on, whatever I was doing. If there was a teachers meeting after school, then I would be there. And sometimes it was arranged that I would give a presentation. I don't remember any specific ones, but it was probably about language teaching, you know, general concepts."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When did, for the children, when did the school day end?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:563", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.038153183871844, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I just wore American clothes. Um. And so the rain always stopped right at 2:30 or 3:00. And I have a little story about that, if we have time to do that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Sure."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And so then back to school and the afternoon wore on, whatever I was doing. If there was a teachers meeting after school, then I would be there. And sometimes it was arranged that I would give a presentation. I don't remember any specific ones, but it was probably about language teaching, you know, general concepts."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When did, for the children, when did the school day end?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'd say around 4:00."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. And the teachers tended to stay on for another hour?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:565", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.486836870968716, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And so then back to school and the afternoon wore on, whatever I was doing. If there was a teachers meeting after school, then I would be there. And sometimes it was arranged that I would give a presentation. I don't remember any specific ones, but it was probably about language teaching, you know, general concepts."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When did, for the children, when did the school day end?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'd say around 4:00."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. And the teachers tended to stay on for another hour?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And occasionally you would make a presentation to the staff."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:567", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 4.985374301076351, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'd say around 4:00."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. And the teachers tended to stay on for another hour?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And occasionally you would make a presentation to the staff."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were there extracurricular activities at the school?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:571", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.920215186514013, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were there extracurricular activities at the school?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "The major one was education related. The principal really wanted to have a very large garden, a vegetable garden, and he was stressing new ways of, of farming because it's a farming community. And his training, of course, was from, he was not from that area himself. So he was in a way a community development worker, you know. And the Filipino government knew this and used the school in that way to do community development and bring people up in education and health things and always. So his project, and therefore the school's project, was this big garden. It was part of, a whole part of a hillside where the kids, instead of having recess, they would go out and dig weeds. They would be planting. They, the children themselves, I remember the sixth graders who were, you know, they were already teenagers. Some of them were, you know, 13, 14 years old."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They were building out of logs and bricks and rocks, a large garden, sort of like a greenhouse sort of effect, to keep, to grow little plants that they would replant out in the fields and so on. So they were actually learning about gardening and, you know, gardening techniques."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you participate in that?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:575", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 6.074339736437052, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They were building out of logs and bricks and rocks, a large garden, sort of like a greenhouse sort of effect, to keep, to grow little plants that they would replant out in the fields and so on. So they were actually learning about gardening and, you know, gardening techniques."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you participate in that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not at all. I wish I had now that I think about it. This is bringing back a lot of things that I could have done."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well."}, {"role": "user", "content": "You know, and I wish I had, I have a lot of slide pictures of that because they were so proud of it. And they, they not only grew crops to eat, but flowers and all sorts of plants that were beautiful plants."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. So on those days, if you weren't making a presentation to the staff, you still tended to stay an additional hour at school?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:577", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.638155262707835, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not at all. I wish I had now that I think about it. This is bringing back a lot of things that I could have done."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well."}, {"role": "user", "content": "You know, and I wish I had, I have a lot of slide pictures of that because they were so proud of it. And they, they not only grew crops to eat, but flowers and all sorts of plants that were beautiful plants."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. So on those days, if you weren't making a presentation to the staff, you still tended to stay an additional hour at school?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Sometimes, depending on what was going on. If I was interested in the lesson for the next day, I would stay definitely to practice with the teacher or, you know, explain that with her."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And then you head home. And what would be a typical, I guess, at leisure afternoon, evening?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:579", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.264616958564261, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "You know, and I wish I had, I have a lot of slide pictures of that because they were so proud of it. And they, they not only grew crops to eat, but flowers and all sorts of plants that were beautiful plants."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. So on those days, if you weren't making a presentation to the staff, you still tended to stay an additional hour at school?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Sometimes, depending on what was going on. If I was interested in the lesson for the next day, I would stay definitely to practice with the teacher or, you know, explain that with her."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And then you head home. And what would be a typical, I guess, at leisure afternoon, evening?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, then it was dinner time. We'd have a very small supper, usually. I was always writing things down, writing my diary, and expecting the mail which had come during the day."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How did the mail get to you?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:581", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.960685509515845, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Sometimes, depending on what was going on. If I was interested in the lesson for the next day, I would stay definitely to practice with the teacher or, you know, explain that with her."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And then you head home. And what would be a typical, I guess, at leisure afternoon, evening?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, then it was dinner time. We'd have a very small supper, usually. I was always writing things down, writing my diary, and expecting the mail which had come during the day."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How did the mail get to you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It didn't get, no. We had to go down and get it. I'm sorry. We had to go down to, I don't remember if there was a post office. I don't think there was a post office. There was a building that the busses that came through daily would leave things off at. And you had to claim it there. It wasn't a post office, though. And so I was always looking for mail because, you know, just friends, family, or whoever would be sending me mail. Other Peace Corps volunteers in the field."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you keep up a fairly regular correspondence with back home?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:583", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 7.734095010573161, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, then it was dinner time. We'd have a very small supper, usually. I was always writing things down, writing my diary, and expecting the mail which had come during the day."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How did the mail get to you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It didn't get, no. We had to go down and get it. I'm sorry. We had to go down to, I don't remember if there was a post office. I don't think there was a post office. There was a building that the busses that came through daily would leave things off at. And you had to claim it there. It wasn't a post office, though. And so I was always looking for mail because, you know, just friends, family, or whoever would be sending me mail. Other Peace Corps volunteers in the field."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you keep up a fairly regular correspondence with back home?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yes. [tape break]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And yeah, we're talking about Camp Brotherhood."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:587", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 3.745796309349582, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yes. [tape break]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And yeah, we're talking about Camp Brotherhood."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mm hmm. Yes. Okay. The camp was started by this, the group before us, and they wanted to see it continue. And it was in a large sort of combination dormitory and rec hall and eating hall. And the kids, there were, oh, a good many children, probably 150 to 200 children came during this summer time, which could have been as much as a month."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Ages?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Three weeks to a month. And they were, oh, I'd say 6 or 7 years old, up to 10 or 12."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And where did they come from in relation to where the camp was?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:589", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.050884788166202, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mm hmm. Yes. Okay. The camp was started by this, the group before us, and they wanted to see it continue. And it was in a large sort of combination dormitory and rec hall and eating hall. And the kids, there were, oh, a good many children, probably 150 to 200 children came during this summer time, which could have been as much as a month."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Ages?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Three weeks to a month. And they were, oh, I'd say 6 or 7 years old, up to 10 or 12."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And where did they come from in relation to where the camp was?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "They were bused in. I mean, they came, the busses brought them from places all around the area within maybe 20 or 30 miles of the Camp Brotherhood site itself. And they were the children of hacienderos, or growers, of the sugar cane."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were they the, the field workers or the?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:591", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.3898719868513356, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Three weeks to a month. And they were, oh, I'd say 6 or 7 years old, up to 10 or 12."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And where did they come from in relation to where the camp was?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "They were bused in. I mean, they came, the busses brought them from places all around the area within maybe 20 or 30 miles of the Camp Brotherhood site itself. And they were the children of hacienderos, or growers, of the sugar cane."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were they the, the field workers or the?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I meant the, yes, they were the children of the field workers, of the laborers who worked the sugarcane."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And who, did the owner of the, the plantation owners, would they, did they select who would go or?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:601", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.8448779604249617, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And at that time they were at the height of it. And so the people who owned the lands had, you know, money, money, money. They would, they hobnobbed with the Marcos family."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I mean, they were all in that political hierarchy."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That pyramid. And, uh, but they, they saw the good of it. I'm sure that having the children have an experience of, you know, good nutrition, learning crafts and things together, and having an experience out of the barrio. I think they saw that it was a good idea."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No fears of the political implications of it, I mean?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:603", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 3.1609755115832905, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I mean, they were all in that political hierarchy."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That pyramid. And, uh, but they, they saw the good of it. I'm sure that having the children have an experience of, you know, good nutrition, learning crafts and things together, and having an experience out of the barrio. I think they saw that it was a good idea."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No fears of the political implications of it, I mean?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not that I heard of. No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. So, and the oldest, the children would be as old as 15 or 16?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:605", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.4010839017592116, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That pyramid. And, uh, but they, they saw the good of it. I'm sure that having the children have an experience of, you know, good nutrition, learning crafts and things together, and having an experience out of the barrio. I think they saw that it was a good idea."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No fears of the political implications of it, I mean?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not that I heard of. No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. So, and the oldest, the children would be as old as 15 or 16?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, maybe 12. 12 or 13. Pre-teens level."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did any of them work on the cane plantations?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:609", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.964301113282977, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, maybe 12. 12 or 13. Pre-teens level."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did any of them work on the cane plantations?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'm sure a lot of the older kids did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But this was their sort of a summer break for them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you had the camp, uh, staff. How many staff were there?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:611", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.2936679036477523, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'm sure a lot of the older kids did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But this was their sort of a summer break for them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you had the camp, uh, staff. How many staff were there?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, maybe 30 to 40 people."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were they all Peace Corps volunteers?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:613", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.659631004053058, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But this was their sort of a summer break for them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you had the camp, uh, staff. How many staff were there?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, maybe 30 to 40 people."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were they all Peace Corps volunteers?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, less than half of them were Peace Corps volunteers. There were many Filipino people that were teachers who weren't teaching, you know, regular school year teachers who came there, or interested Filipinos. Some of them were related to the families that owned the plantations possibly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did, did the Filipino staff get paid for?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:615", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.0662566711700645, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, maybe 30 to 40 people."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were they all Peace Corps volunteers?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, less than half of them were Peace Corps volunteers. There were many Filipino people that were teachers who weren't teaching, you know, regular school year teachers who came there, or interested Filipinos. Some of them were related to the families that owned the plantations possibly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did, did the Filipino staff get paid for?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. They got, there was a stipend for everybody there except the Peace Corps people themselves."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And how many children?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:619", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 5.020069964407487, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. They got, there was a stipend for everybody there except the Peace Corps people themselves."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And how many children?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I wish I could get it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Approximately?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'd say 150 to 200 children."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. And they were expected to stay 4 to 8 weeks?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:621", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.3556332937860964, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I wish I could get it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Approximately?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'd say 150 to 200 children."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. And they were expected to stay 4 to 8 weeks?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Well, four weeks probably. No longer than a month, I would think."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. Did it, did two groups come in? In other words, there was a session one and session two, or was it just?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:623", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 3.728481437540107, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'd say 150 to 200 children."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. And they were expected to stay 4 to 8 weeks?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Well, four weeks probably. No longer than a month, I would think."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. Did it, did two groups come in? In other words, there was a session one and session two, or was it just?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I think it was just one session. One full session."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And what was your role in all this?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:627", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.3684956019013668, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I think it was just one session. One full session."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And what was your role in all this?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I came late after it had started already because I was still recuperating. And that was one thing I wanted to get out of the hospital to do was to get to Camp Brotherhood, because I had a commitment to it, and I'm trying to think of how that happened. I was still, I think, when it had already started, Roger and I had gone to Clark Air Force Base, back to Clark Air Force Base to get other supplies, to get more things for the camp. That's how that happened."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I was, I helped teach crafts. I was sort of overseeing the, the schedule. I was more like a scheduler, but I had contact with the kids too. And I remember making one little art project that a teacher had developed that they could all make out of a little wood. And then they painted things on it. They cut up tree limbs and cut them on an angle so it looked like a little frame. And then on the light piece in the middle, they would paint pictures. And it was, then they'd shellac it and they'd put a hole in it and hang it on the wall. It was sort of like a little gift. So, you know, I did things like that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But no, no background or training in crafts work?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:631", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.1586365455572425, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I was, I helped teach crafts. I was sort of overseeing the, the schedule. I was more like a scheduler, but I had contact with the kids too. And I remember making one little art project that a teacher had developed that they could all make out of a little wood. And then they painted things on it. They cut up tree limbs and cut them on an angle so it looked like a little frame. And then on the light piece in the middle, they would paint pictures. And it was, then they'd shellac it and they'd put a hole in it and hang it on the wall. It was sort of like a little gift. So, you know, I did things like that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But no, no background or training in crafts work?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Just minimal. I'm an artist myself, so."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Ah, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But yeah, but I just related to that. That's what sticks out in my mind."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. And they were with the, the camp was broken into age groups and they had a schedule."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:633", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.62070727284138, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Just minimal. I'm an artist myself, so."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Ah, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But yeah, but I just related to that. That's what sticks out in my mind."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. And they were with the, the camp was broken into age groups and they had a schedule."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And a range of activities each day."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:635", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.134119192045977, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But yeah, but I just related to that. That's what sticks out in my mind."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. And they were with the, the camp was broken into age groups and they had a schedule."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And a range of activities each day."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Athletics and crafts and singing. Singing and dancing. Somewhat hikes. I remember going on a hike to a waterfall with one group."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were you near any swimmable water?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:637", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.704576880051086, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And a range of activities each day."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Athletics and crafts and singing. Singing and dancing. Somewhat hikes. I remember going on a hike to a waterfall with one group."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were you near any swimmable water?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. They had a swimming pool there, a large swimming pool made of just rocks. It wasn't what we would consider, you know, a swimming pool by patio pools or something. But it was a slimy green thing that was made out of volcanic rock and, but smooth rock. And it was, uh, no filters or anything on it. So that's why it was slimy and you couldn't see to the bottom of it. But it was very cool and very nice."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I trust you stayed out of the water coming off your hepatitis."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:641", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 7.042687506235908, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. They had a swimming pool there, a large swimming pool made of just rocks. It wasn't what we would consider, you know, a swimming pool by patio pools or something. But it was a slimy green thing that was made out of volcanic rock and, but smooth rock. And it was, uh, no filters or anything on it. So that's why it was slimy and you couldn't see to the bottom of it. But it was very cool and very nice."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I trust you stayed out of the water coming off your hepatitis."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think I didn't go in."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And what kind of experience was that as compared to, you know, your involvement at the school?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:645", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.879861118809763, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And what kind of experience was that as compared to, you know, your involvement at the school?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, it was a very patriotic feeling I had because it was Camp Brotherhood. And it was for, you know, the meeting of the American and Filipino cultures. And it was dedicated to John F. Kennedy. And there was, somebody had made a statue and there was a dedication day, in fact. And Fuchs, what was his name again?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Larry."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Larry Fuchs and his wife came down and spent the night and had the big celebration. The unveiling of the statue with an American flag pulled off of it, and speeches and music and dancing."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Who had done the statue?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:647", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.310956798677514, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, it was a very patriotic feeling I had because it was Camp Brotherhood. And it was for, you know, the meeting of the American and Filipino cultures. And it was dedicated to John F. Kennedy. And there was, somebody had made a statue and there was a dedication day, in fact. And Fuchs, what was his name again?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Larry."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Larry Fuchs and his wife came down and spent the night and had the big celebration. The unveiling of the statue with an American flag pulled off of it, and speeches and music and dancing."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Who had done the statue?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "A local artist from Bacolod City."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was it a woodcarving or?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:653", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.913520985840212, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was a plaster carving, a plaster casting."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Just in plaster. It should have been in bronze, but it was just a light gray color. Just a head down to the neck."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But it was a good resemblance of him."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. And so there was recognition also, at least, with the country director coming."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:655", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.5705788731557915, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Just in plaster. It should have been in bronze, but it was just a light gray color. Just a head down to the neck."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But it was a good resemblance of him."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. And so there was recognition also, at least, with the country director coming."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And it was the second year?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:657", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.300643192395324, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But it was a good resemblance of him."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. And so there was recognition also, at least, with the country director coming."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And it was the second year?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was the second year of our tour."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Did, were there, uh, cross-cultural activities planned, like celebration of American customs and Filipino customs?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:659", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 8.111825769328137, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And it was the second year?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was the second year of our tour."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Did, were there, uh, cross-cultural activities planned, like celebration of American customs and Filipino customs?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, yes. They tried to work that in, I think, because it was a, you know, a dual cultural thing. I don't remember specifically anything except the singing. We taught them songs and I played the guitar at that time. I don't think I had my guitar with me, but several people played guitars and we'd share and taught them American songs. That was a big thing."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Michael, row the boat ashore."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:661", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 9.013139743697929, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was the second year of our tour."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Did, were there, uh, cross-cultural activities planned, like celebration of American customs and Filipino customs?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, yes. They tried to work that in, I think, because it was a, you know, a dual cultural thing. I don't remember specifically anything except the singing. We taught them songs and I played the guitar at that time. I don't think I had my guitar with me, but several people played guitars and we'd share and taught them American songs. That was a big thing."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Michael, row the boat ashore."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Especially that one. Especially that one."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So it was really just a four week period then?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:663", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 8.903488604108809, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, yes. They tried to work that in, I think, because it was a, you know, a dual cultural thing. I don't remember specifically anything except the singing. We taught them songs and I played the guitar at that time. I don't think I had my guitar with me, but several people played guitars and we'd share and taught them American songs. That was a big thing."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Michael, row the boat ashore."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Especially that one. Especially that one."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So it was really just a four week period then?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I believe it was only a month, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. At the end of the four weeks, your, how was your health?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:667", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 5.06603531371458, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I believe it was only a month, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. At the end of the four weeks, your, how was your health?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was fine by then. So I remember going back to Manila and meeting a Peace Corps girl that I knew who was on our island also. Well, I didn't meet her there, but we had taken the same. We had the same idea to go on a, to Hong Kong for a week, and it was only across the strait of, the China Sea strait. So I took an overnight boat and she had flown over there. But there were several other people involved too, and we somehow met there. We didn't know we were both going, but we met on the streets in the shopping center anyway. But I went to Hong Kong for a week, just for my R&R."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And the very, when I, when my, um. Let's see. Did I fly there? How did that happen that I was at the airport? Somehow I was at the airport and the Beatles came the very same day that I was at the airport. And so there were these big crowds. I looked out of the, why was I on a plane if I took a boat? I may have flown over there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Maybe meeting her?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:677", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.651298605758912, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I had gotten in my hotel before they got there. And then I, when I looked down here where the Beatles, you know, crowds of people and cars and limousines and black limousines and the one that they were in pulled up right in front of the door on a red carpet. And I saw the tops of their heads as they went into the hotel. So that was a big thing to me."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And so and then I did this shopping, and I ran into Linda Creamer, who was in my group. We had trained together, and we met, I don't remember, in a shopping center and she was buying a camera, and I already had my camera that I had bought on the way over, I bought it in Tokyo. So I took pictures of us, and I still have pictures of her buying a camera and trying to talk the guy out of how much he was selling it for."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "She was bargaining with him."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. You were entitled to leave and you got leave pay, I think, for the."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:679", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.279220673065458, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And so and then I did this shopping, and I ran into Linda Creamer, who was in my group. We had trained together, and we met, I don't remember, in a shopping center and she was buying a camera, and I already had my camera that I had bought on the way over, I bought it in Tokyo. So I took pictures of us, and I still have pictures of her buying a camera and trying to talk the guy out of how much he was selling it for."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "She was bargaining with him."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. You were entitled to leave and you got leave pay, I think, for the."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, we got."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "There was a separate payment for that."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:681", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 6.9769118589616195, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "She was bargaining with him."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. You were entitled to leave and you got leave pay, I think, for the."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, we got."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "There was a separate payment for that."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Leave pay, right. A per diem kind of thing."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. And so you spent a week in Hong Kong, having met the Beatles, the real historic moment in your two years."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:689", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.268879528976709, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I don't think they had air conditioning. And I went up there just on my own and toured and met a few Chinese teachers. We didn't, we couldn't communicate because they were not English speakers."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I knew no Chinese, but I indicated I wanted to take pictures of them, and they said that would be fine. And I took several slides of them teaching Chinese to the, to little kids about 5 or 6 years old."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And that was so fascinating to me that the way the Chinese did it, they had the school right in the place where the kids lived."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes. Yes. Was it Peace Corps policy that you not travel to your, to the United States on leave?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:697", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.326900669069819, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And maybe some people who had independent money could have done that, but I don't know of anybody that did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But politically, we were advised not to go to Chinese, um, Communist China. But I defied that in a way. I took a train from, I went, well, I stayed in Kowloon, which is the mainland, right? Yeah, I think it was that way. And I took a train up to the border of Communist China and went right up to the border and took pictures of the signs that were in English and Chinese. And I guess those were the only two languages that said that you cannot pass this, you know, you can't go any further than this and so on. But that was a fascinating little day trip."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "To go to get that close to China, to Communist China. ."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. And, um, vacation's over and?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:701", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 5.341852677863974, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "To go to get that close to China, to Communist China. ."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. And, um, vacation's over and?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Took my boat back. That's when I took the boat back and slept, it was the lowest class that I could pay for, and it was right next to the motor underneath, under, below water level, you know?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Noisiest trip I've ever been on."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How long is it, a day or two or?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:707", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.349592150705039, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It seemed that it was overnight. I got in in the afternoon and got back, got in the morning. And the morning I got back there was a major typhoon in Manila that was inundated, the city of Manila is below sea level. The most of the city, the major part is below sea level, and there are dikes along the bay."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But the bay was flooded and everything was flooded 5 or 6 feet deep everywhere. I mean, you had to take a boat from, or walk up to your hips in most places."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Wow."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was a major disaster."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And, but you, you were able to work your way through it."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:709", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.7217690563389323, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But the bay was flooded and everything was flooded 5 or 6 feet deep everywhere. I mean, you had to take a boat from, or walk up to your hips in most places."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Wow."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was a major disaster."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And, but you, you were able to work your way through it."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Somehow, yeah, I remember that even the Peace Corps building was flooded, although it was on the second floor. You had to go upstairs to get to the, the main offices of the Peace Corps. But the first floor was flooded and all."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Was there any talk of the Peace Corps trying to help with flood relief or does, I mean?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:711", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.1352989514877025, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was a major disaster."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And, but you, you were able to work your way through it."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Somehow, yeah, I remember that even the Peace Corps building was flooded, although it was on the second floor. You had to go upstairs to get to the, the main offices of the Peace Corps. But the first floor was flooded and all."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Was there any talk of the Peace Corps trying to help with flood relief or does, I mean?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't remember anything like that. It was so total all over the city that the whole city was just. No, I don't think that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How long did it take to dry out?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:715", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.105307347515682, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't remember anything like that. It was so total all over the city that the whole city was just. No, I don't think that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How long did it take to dry out?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I guess they have ways of letting the water flow off somehow. They have channels, but it was just inundated by that time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And there was just, they just waited until it just flowed away or sunk in."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. So you got the Beatles on one side and then a typhoon."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:717", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.672563719461868, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I guess they have ways of letting the water flow off somehow. They have channels, but it was just inundated by that time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And there was just, they just waited until it just flowed away or sunk in."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. So you got the Beatles on one side and then a typhoon."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you didn't know, you figured you'd get back and the volcano would blow."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:719", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 6.302848577179853, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And there was just, they just waited until it just flowed away or sunk in."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. So you got the Beatles on one side and then a typhoon."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you didn't know, you figured you'd get back and the volcano would blow."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. You never knew. Or what the next disease was going to be."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. But you headed back to the village?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:723", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.8430229347899423, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. You never knew. Or what the next disease was going to be."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. But you headed back to the village?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. After, soon after that. I spent just a few days in Manila. Oh, I went to Baguio City, which is an R&R place for Filipinos and Americans. It's very high in the mountains of Northern Luzon. And it's a, it's a very, sort of was then, it was a modern city. They had lots of movie theaters. And there was, I think, an Air Force base. Well, it was, it's close to our Clark Air Force Base. And that's where people went for R&R because it was cool. It was away from the coast, you know. And they had facilities there that Americans would like, you know, movie theaters and jazz bars and stuff, you know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And so that was a nice thing to see. And I met several people in my group there, and we had R&R together."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there a midpoint conference then, or had you missed it because you were in the hospital?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:725", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.158914371988825, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. After, soon after that. I spent just a few days in Manila. Oh, I went to Baguio City, which is an R&R place for Filipinos and Americans. It's very high in the mountains of Northern Luzon. And it's a, it's a very, sort of was then, it was a modern city. They had lots of movie theaters. And there was, I think, an Air Force base. Well, it was, it's close to our Clark Air Force Base. And that's where people went for R&R because it was cool. It was away from the coast, you know. And they had facilities there that Americans would like, you know, movie theaters and jazz bars and stuff, you know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And so that was a nice thing to see. And I met several people in my group there, and we had R&R together."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there a midpoint conference then, or had you missed it because you were in the hospital?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, I don't remember that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Because your time is funny."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:729", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 3.899894286405957, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, I don't remember that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Because your time is funny."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I must have missed, yeah, I must have missed it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't remember a midterm. I think it was in the hospital then."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. So another week of vacation or so, and."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:731", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.2221047626732853, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I must have missed, yeah, I must have missed it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't remember a midterm. I think it was in the hospital then."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. So another week of vacation or so, and."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And then I flew back on PAL Airlines to, let's see, Bacolod City, right. That was the closest. And then took a bus. And I was so anxious to get back there. I really wanted to get back to see everybody."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Now at that point, you were matching up to the beginning of another school year."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:733", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.580116402970317, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't remember a midterm. I think it was in the hospital then."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. So another week of vacation or so, and."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And then I flew back on PAL Airlines to, let's see, Bacolod City, right. That was the closest. And then took a bus. And I was so anxious to get back there. I really wanted to get back to see everybody."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Now at that point, you were matching up to the beginning of another school year."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mm hmm. Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And now we're in September of '64, I guess."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:741", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.8503526946659297, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Or maybe August because there were pre-school conferences and things."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I knew that I only had 2 or 3 months left."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But I still wanted to get back and do things. And by that time, let's see. The playground had been built, the athletic field had been built. Kids had graduated from school. So I, you know, I didn't know the next crop of the early, you know, the kindergartners or whatever they were. They weren't kindergartners, first graders. And some of the teachers had changed or, you know, and but the same teacher I worked with was still there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "The sixth grade teacher."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:743", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.167058549628811, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I knew that I only had 2 or 3 months left."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But I still wanted to get back and do things. And by that time, let's see. The playground had been built, the athletic field had been built. Kids had graduated from school. So I, you know, I didn't know the next crop of the early, you know, the kindergartners or whatever they were. They weren't kindergartners, first graders. And some of the teachers had changed or, you know, and but the same teacher I worked with was still there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "The sixth grade teacher."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But it was a new class."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:745", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.518953944032012, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But I still wanted to get back and do things. And by that time, let's see. The playground had been built, the athletic field had been built. Kids had graduated from school. So I, you know, I didn't know the next crop of the early, you know, the kindergartners or whatever they were. They weren't kindergartners, first graders. And some of the teachers had changed or, you know, and but the same teacher I worked with was still there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "The sixth grade teacher."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But it was a new class."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you got back, and did the mayor?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:747", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.9099488267022355, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But it was a new class."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you got back, and did the mayor?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, they were very welcoming to both of us."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did they know you were coming back?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:751", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.8270973169163405, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, they were very welcoming to both of us."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did they know you were coming back?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yes. We must have written or called or."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Somehow communicated with them. Oh, in fact we had seen them somehow in Manila to send off one of their other daughters to study in the United States. She was going to study in California. In fact, she visited my parents, one of the older daughters of the mayor. So we saw her off and spend some time with the mayor in Manila during that same time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How did you communicate such information? I mean, you're in Manila. They're in, back in the village, how did?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:755", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.95937940360042, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Somehow communicated with them. Oh, in fact we had seen them somehow in Manila to send off one of their other daughters to study in the United States. She was going to study in California. In fact, she visited my parents, one of the older daughters of the mayor. So we saw her off and spend some time with the mayor in Manila during that same time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How did you communicate such information? I mean, you're in Manila. They're in, back in the village, how did?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think we sent letters. Somehow we kept in communication. I must have sent whole letters to them saying I was in the hospital, I was going to be in Manila at certain times, and they must have sent back, oh, we're going to be there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "To send off our, our daughter too. And we arranged to meet there. It must have been that way."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was it direct telephone service?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:759", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 7.35725852296348, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "To send off our, our daughter too. And we arranged to meet there. It must have been that way."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was it direct telephone service?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think, yeah, but it was expensive. I think there was the mayor. Let's see. I think they had a phone in their home, yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But that was the only phone available in the whole town. I mean, if there was any phone, it was in his house."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. So you're starting this, another school year."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:763", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.502788299954914, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But that was the only phone available in the whole town. I mean, if there was any phone, it was in his house."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. So you're starting this, another school year."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh huh. But not fully, um, committed to what I was doing the first year because I knew it was going to be ending, you know. I don't remember spending as much time at school. It seems like I, I went there a lot, but there were other things that were going on with the mayor. They were planning a, oh, let's see. No, it couldn't have been February. When did I? There was a major, another major fiesta. And when was it? It was August, September. It couldn't have been their town fiesta. But I was a major part of the fiesta because I learned the tinikling, you know, this dance that you do between the bamboo poles?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, yes."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I learned it fully, just like a native person knew it, you know. I knew the entire dance. And I, and this teacher, the sixth grade teacher, was my partner. And she had known it before already, but she had to brush up on some of the dance steps. But we learned it so beautifully, so well. And I was the Peace Corps in the dance at midnight, and it had just started to rain a little bit. There was a little bit of rain at the time, and but we did the entire dance. And there was just an upsurge after, when the last strains of the music, which was live music with mandolins and, I mean, it was purely just classic old traditional Filipino everything with the native dance, you know, the dress and everything and."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you were in traditional dress?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:769", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 6.313838545891514, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "In traditional, well, the hoosee, it's called barong tagalog. It was a shirt made out, woven from pineapple fiber. And it's almost see through, but very formal. It's almost like the guayabera of Mexico."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes, yes."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It's like the Mexican wedding shirt and long sleeved with cufflinks, not buttons, but cufflinks, and double over sleeve and very elaborate, um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Embroidery?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Hand embroidery, embroidered front, big collar, all the way down with a split on the sides all the way down to mid knee. I mean not mid knee, but mid thigh. Beautiful. It's a beautiful kind of shirt. And you have to wear that to do the dance. So."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How long does the dance last, I mean?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:771", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.79315393987946, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It's like the Mexican wedding shirt and long sleeved with cufflinks, not buttons, but cufflinks, and double over sleeve and very elaborate, um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Embroidery?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Hand embroidery, embroidered front, big collar, all the way down with a split on the sides all the way down to mid knee. I mean not mid knee, but mid thigh. Beautiful. It's a beautiful kind of shirt. And you have to wear that to do the dance. So."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How long does the dance last, I mean?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It seemed like it was endless. Oh, I'd say a good 10 minutes or 15 minutes even possibly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It's very intricate."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:773", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.325726599866067, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Hand embroidery, embroidered front, big collar, all the way down with a split on the sides all the way down to mid knee. I mean not mid knee, but mid thigh. Beautiful. It's a beautiful kind of shirt. And you have to wear that to do the dance. So."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How long does the dance last, I mean?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It seemed like it was endless. Oh, I'd say a good 10 minutes or 15 minutes even possibly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It's very intricate."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Very intricate. You have to, it's not only dancing in and out, which is a major thing just to get that board in. But then you're dancing through, turning and circling back, going around, going around. There's about ten different pairs of sticks in a circle, sort of. And you dance, the whole group dances around the whole thing once, at one point. And beautiful music, I mean I love that music. It's a one, two, three beat and it's just wonderful."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So that must have been kind of a high point."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:781", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.771569272772545, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "For, for doing, doing it, you know, going through with it. Roger didn't, he didn't want to have anything to do with it. But I don't know why, but he wouldn't do it. But I wanted to do it. I just thought this would be so wonderful to learn this."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And there are schoolchildren, American schoolchildren now, who will never forget it. Because I came back and I was a teacher, I have been a teacher for the last 30 years and, you know, every class that I could possibly fit it in, I would teach that dance to them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Or at least part of it, you know, at least 1 or 2 steps so they could learn that. So I have pictures of that, too, of kids, sixth graders in California and Mexican kids in Nogales, where I taught, learning the tinikling. It's quite important to me."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh. It must have been downhill from there to, as you're getting near the end of your. Well, did you have any thought of extending, I mean?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:783", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.41285474752505, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And there are schoolchildren, American schoolchildren now, who will never forget it. Because I came back and I was a teacher, I have been a teacher for the last 30 years and, you know, every class that I could possibly fit it in, I would teach that dance to them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Or at least part of it, you know, at least 1 or 2 steps so they could learn that. So I have pictures of that, too, of kids, sixth graders in California and Mexican kids in Nogales, where I taught, learning the tinikling. It's quite important to me."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh. It must have been downhill from there to, as you're getting near the end of your. Well, did you have any thought of extending, I mean?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I mean, I know mom was waiting."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:789", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.463449585082373, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, my parents were waiting. I just, I thought, well, I've committed, I've succeeded in my commitment of the two years. I thought I can always come back to it or join another group. So, but I do want to go home. But the major thing was, I wanted to not just take the Peace Corps ticket from, on Pan Am, from Manila to Los Angeles or San Francisco or whatever."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I traded in my ticket when I got to Manila, you know, after it was all over, after I left my town."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I remember distinctly going to the travel agent and saying, I want to apply this, whatever it was $200 to, from here to Bangkok to blah, blah, blah, all the way. I wanted to go around the earth because I was so into traveling. So I did that. I went all the way around the other way and came back through New York. So that was the major thing in my mind. I didn't think of going back to the Peace Corps exactly. I wanted to travel. That was, that was my freedom there to travel and see more, because Hong Kong just tantalized me. I thought, Hong Kong, I got there, you know, I actually saw that place. So I want to see Bangkok and all these wonderful names I've heard about. I wanted to be there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Even though you had this incredible experience that very few people do of living in the village and."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:791", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.070499538980415, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I traded in my ticket when I got to Manila, you know, after it was all over, after I left my town."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I remember distinctly going to the travel agent and saying, I want to apply this, whatever it was $200 to, from here to Bangkok to blah, blah, blah, all the way. I wanted to go around the earth because I was so into traveling. So I did that. I went all the way around the other way and came back through New York. So that was the major thing in my mind. I didn't think of going back to the Peace Corps exactly. I wanted to travel. That was, that was my freedom there to travel and see more, because Hong Kong just tantalized me. I thought, Hong Kong, I got there, you know, I actually saw that place. So I want to see Bangkok and all these wonderful names I've heard about. I wanted to be there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Even though you had this incredible experience that very few people do of living in the village and."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there talk of your being replaced, you and Roger, as you came near the end?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:793", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 6.744999487756016, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I remember distinctly going to the travel agent and saying, I want to apply this, whatever it was $200 to, from here to Bangkok to blah, blah, blah, all the way. I wanted to go around the earth because I was so into traveling. So I did that. I went all the way around the other way and came back through New York. So that was the major thing in my mind. I didn't think of going back to the Peace Corps exactly. I wanted to travel. That was, that was my freedom there to travel and see more, because Hong Kong just tantalized me. I thought, Hong Kong, I got there, you know, I actually saw that place. So I want to see Bangkok and all these wonderful names I've heard about. I wanted to be there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Even though you had this incredible experience that very few people do of living in the village and."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there talk of your being replaced, you and Roger, as you came near the end?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, they didn't. Nothing was said about that. I, in fact, I think we asked was somebody going to take our place, and the Filipinos asked, is somebody going to come here? And we didn't know, but we thought not."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What, by, let's see, by '64. What had happened with the Peace Corps? Were the numbers continuing to grow?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:797", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.092591960192611, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, they didn't. Nothing was said about that. I, in fact, I think we asked was somebody going to take our place, and the Filipinos asked, is somebody going to come here? And we didn't know, but we thought not."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What, by, let's see, by '64. What had happened with the Peace Corps? Were the numbers continuing to grow?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "They were still having people in training, but they had changed. Let's see. The idea of the Peace Corps was not to train in Hawaii or Waipio Valley or Hilo or whatever. They had in-service or in- country training, so they were bringing people to Manila to do training. But I never met anybody there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But that's where they were doing it in, in country or even in, you know, close to the sites, closer to the sites."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "While you were a volunteer in '63, '64, do you have any idea of the total number of volunteers in the Philippines?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:799", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.880657733547346, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They were still having people in training, but they had changed. Let's see. The idea of the Peace Corps was not to train in Hawaii or Waipio Valley or Hilo or whatever. They had in-service or in- country training, so they were bringing people to Manila to do training. But I never met anybody there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But that's where they were doing it in, in country or even in, you know, close to the sites, closer to the sites."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "While you were a volunteer in '63, '64, do you have any idea of the total number of volunteers in the Philippines?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It seems in the hundreds, I think 700 were there when I was there. It was the largest group of any country that they had sent people to."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But you didn't feel that where every place you turned, you were bumping into volunteers?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:803", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.506984856231292, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It seems in the hundreds, I think 700 were there when I was there. It was the largest group of any country that they had sent people to."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But you didn't feel that where every place you turned, you were bumping into volunteers?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not at all, not where I was stationed. I very seldom saw any unless we invited them to come, or in Manila."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Sometimes in Bacolod, the Filipinos in stores or something would ask, are you Peace Corps? Are you the Peace Corps? You know, because they had seen so many coming through, but I never really bumped into many, except in Camp Brotherhood or in Manila."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And do you have any sense of what the overall attitude of the Filipinos was toward Peace Corps? I mean, judging from your village and?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:805", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 8.341094284701436, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not at all, not where I was stationed. I very seldom saw any unless we invited them to come, or in Manila."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Sometimes in Bacolod, the Filipinos in stores or something would ask, are you Peace Corps? Are you the Peace Corps? You know, because they had seen so many coming through, but I never really bumped into many, except in Camp Brotherhood or in Manila."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And do you have any sense of what the overall attitude of the Filipinos was toward Peace Corps? I mean, judging from your village and?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "The local people, they really loved us. You know, they, they got to really be friends with us. And. [tape break]\n\nThe Philippine government, I think, got what they wanted. They got people to, almost free, teach their teachers, you know, upgrade their teaching skills over a period of time. I think that happened in many projects that I heard about that, you know, they had an in-depth teacher trainings and even some community development in some projects that were not in my project. And so the Philippines gained a lot, and I think the government was very favorable, favorable to the whole thing. The local people who understood what we were trying to do, like the teaching groups, were very favorable. I think we left with a good impression."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "In your two year experience, did you ever encounter someone who said, why don't you go home? You mentioned the one little incident on a bus."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:807", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 9.267882538557151, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Sometimes in Bacolod, the Filipinos in stores or something would ask, are you Peace Corps? Are you the Peace Corps? You know, because they had seen so many coming through, but I never really bumped into many, except in Camp Brotherhood or in Manila."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And do you have any sense of what the overall attitude of the Filipinos was toward Peace Corps? I mean, judging from your village and?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "The local people, they really loved us. You know, they, they got to really be friends with us. And. [tape break]\n\nThe Philippine government, I think, got what they wanted. They got people to, almost free, teach their teachers, you know, upgrade their teaching skills over a period of time. I think that happened in many projects that I heard about that, you know, they had an in-depth teacher trainings and even some community development in some projects that were not in my project. And so the Philippines gained a lot, and I think the government was very favorable, favorable to the whole thing. The local people who understood what we were trying to do, like the teaching groups, were very favorable. I think we left with a good impression."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "In your two year experience, did you ever encounter someone who said, why don't you go home? You mentioned the one little incident on a bus."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Never locally. I never met anybody who was antagonistic to me personally or to the idea of a Peace Corps. I never met anybody like that. Just, did I tell it already on tape about the bus situation?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. You mentioned that. Before I forget it, you, when we were talking about the rainy season and the rains came at 2:00 in the afternoon, there was a, some incident or anecdote you wanted to?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:809", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 10.297647265063501, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "The local people, they really loved us. You know, they, they got to really be friends with us. And. [tape break]\n\nThe Philippine government, I think, got what they wanted. They got people to, almost free, teach their teachers, you know, upgrade their teaching skills over a period of time. I think that happened in many projects that I heard about that, you know, they had an in-depth teacher trainings and even some community development in some projects that were not in my project. And so the Philippines gained a lot, and I think the government was very favorable, favorable to the whole thing. The local people who understood what we were trying to do, like the teaching groups, were very favorable. I think we left with a good impression."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "In your two year experience, did you ever encounter someone who said, why don't you go home? You mentioned the one little incident on a bus."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Never locally. I never met anybody who was antagonistic to me personally or to the idea of a Peace Corps. I never met anybody like that. Just, did I tell it already on tape about the bus situation?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. You mentioned that. Before I forget it, you, when we were talking about the rainy season and the rains came at 2:00 in the afternoon, there was a, some incident or anecdote you wanted to?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yes. Well, I was teaching science as part of my project, and this third grade teacher, um. Well, first of all, I had put up a weather station, and so I measured the rainfall and the wind flow and temperatures and kept records and took it into the classroom to show the kids and would bring them down to the weather station. It was down away from the school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Where did you get the equipment?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:817", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.951451402322055, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, you have done this before, I can tell, because this is an emotional moment. Yeah. It was November 2nd, and it was All Saints Day. All Souls Day, I'm sorry."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And so it was almost a school holiday, I think. I mean, nobody was in, was go to school that day because everybody was at the cemetery and the whole town was there. All the kids that I had taught throughout the year, or the ones that I knew from the school, and the teachers and families that lived next door or around the area, were all there, and we had said our goodbyes. I had sent home a big thing, you know, shipment, you know, freight on freight, surface freight, of all my possessions and everything. Had my suitcase, got on the bus that takes nine hours to get to Dumaguete or, I'm sorry, Bacolod City. And the only way out of town was by the cemetery. And I was, let's see, was Roger with me? I think he was not with me. He had either gone ahead or I think he had gone ahead the day before.\n\nSo I was alone on this bus with other Filipinos, though, and the bus went by this cemetery and all the people, you know, I was at the window and I was waving at them and they were waving at me. And they were, you could see they had food and they were dusting off the, the cemetery plots and things. And I just broke down. I just completely broke down."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And then I had this nine hour ride to go through on bumpy rock roads, you know, they were rocks so they wouldn't erode away. And just so I had all that time to think about all the things that had passed the last two years."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Had the mayor given a going away party?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:823", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 5.557546505242874, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yeah. You bet. It was a two day affair almost."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But the one evening that they invited all the teachers and all in native dress. They gave us mounds and mounds of presents, I mean, things to remember them by, you know, homemade things or things that were typically Filipino, you know, carvings and homemade clothing for my, for parents and friends, you know, all, just all kinds of things. And it was, these fiestas seemed to last into all hours of the night always. And so this lasted well, well past midnight. Roger and I both, you know, being feted there. And they gave us each a, um, what do you call them? I'm giving my languages mixed up. Um, roosters, because a big thing in the Philippines is cockfighting. So they gave us cocks and we had to pretend to have them fighting, but they didn't have the knives on them. They would just wanted us to experience being the owners of the roosters, the cockfight."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And we had to make speeches. We had to sing songs. We had to dance with every teacher, you know, the female teachers. They took pictures. The mayor gave a long speech, how important it was that we were there. And we had to give speeches of farewell and remembrance and all that, and they kept plying us with San Miguel beer the whole time. But that was quite a, quite a thing. Quite a farewell."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you recall if there was a termination conference in Manila of your group as you finished up?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:827", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.392032722522066, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And we had to make speeches. We had to sing songs. We had to dance with every teacher, you know, the female teachers. They took pictures. The mayor gave a long speech, how important it was that we were there. And we had to give speeches of farewell and remembrance and all that, and they kept plying us with San Miguel beer the whole time. But that was quite a, quite a thing. Quite a farewell."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you recall if there was a termination conference in Manila of your group as you finished up?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, there was. We had to report there by, you know, November 3rd or whatever it was, or sixth, and they de-, what do they call it? Not deselected but?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Debriefed?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Debriefed us, yes. And, you know, I don't know what they talked about, but it was a way of parting from that, from that experience."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Had the group, uh, shrunk a lot? I mean, do you recall if many people hadn't completed the two years or?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:829", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.8800363583578505, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, there was. We had to report there by, you know, November 3rd or whatever it was, or sixth, and they de-, what do they call it? Not deselected but?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Debriefed?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Debriefed us, yes. And, you know, I don't know what they talked about, but it was a way of parting from that, from that experience."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Had the group, uh, shrunk a lot? I mean, do you recall if many people hadn't completed the two years or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Most people did. One girl went home because of some harassment that she felt from one of, a Filipino man that was stalking her or something, and she had to leave. That's the only one I particularly remember. I think maybe another person had gone home, but I don't know why."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Yeah. And the group getting back together, do you recall? Were you playing can you top this with stories or?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:833", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.913625133775124, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Most people did. One girl went home because of some harassment that she felt from one of, a Filipino man that was stalking her or something, and she had to leave. That's the only one I particularly remember. I think maybe another person had gone home, but I don't know why."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Yeah. And the group getting back together, do you recall? Were you playing can you top this with stories or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'm sure we did. I remember going to restaurants and bars with people in my group, you know, small groups, not the whole group."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Because we had already gone off into cliques by then. The people in the north were their group, and the southern people were our people, and we didn't know them as well as we did two years before. You know, they had totally different experiences."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. So you then had your ticket to get you around the world."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:835", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.45958348197236, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'm sure we did. I remember going to restaurants and bars with people in my group, you know, small groups, not the whole group."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Because we had already gone off into cliques by then. The people in the north were their group, and the southern people were our people, and we didn't know them as well as we did two years before. You know, they had totally different experiences."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. So you then had your ticket to get you around the world."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "At some point did you think about life after the Peace Corps, I mean, while you were still there?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:845", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.874110453982896, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Was it American Information Agency?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "The USIS?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It could have been that. Something related to."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "CIA."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Could have been CIA related. It could have been. I'm not sure, but they. But I was."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "There was always supposed to be a separation."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:851", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 9.690137796958705, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Between the Peace Corps and the CIA, you mean?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Or between the USIA and the CIA?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No, Peace Corps and the CIA."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:855", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 8.382886169084822, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Or between the USIA and the CIA?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No, Peace Corps and the CIA."}, {"role": "user", "content": "There was a separation, but because they made it very clear that it was, you would volunteer from the Peace Corps to do that. You would be, there would not be Peace Corps. I mean, it was definitely not Peace Corps. They just wanted people to do some information, you know, teaching, somehow giving Vietnamese people an idea about America."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's all I knew about it, and I considered that. And I considered it. They said it would be a commitment of 14 months or something. And I thought, no, I want to go home. I want to take this trip first. That was primary in my mind. Go home. And then I would consider doing that. I actually considered doing that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Did you, did you think about schooling or?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:859", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.5591187272652114, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's all I knew about it, and I considered that. And I considered it. They said it would be a commitment of 14 months or something. And I thought, no, I want to go home. I want to take this trip first. That was primary in my mind. Go home. And then I would consider doing that. I actually considered doing that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Did you, did you think about schooling or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "But then after I got home, I was in America again, and I thought I'd better do something with this. I have two years of teaching, and I had heard by then that the Peace Corps counted as two years of teaching experience. So all I needed was a fifth year, you know, to get my certificate in California."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Ah, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And so I immediately did that because I got home in December of '64. And by sixty, the September of '65, I was teaching in a regular American school then, in Los Angeles. So within a less than a year, I was, you know, I took that whole spring semester and summer and got a fifth year of a certificate."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you get an MAT or?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:861", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 3.9545763636280125, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But then after I got home, I was in America again, and I thought I'd better do something with this. I have two years of teaching, and I had heard by then that the Peace Corps counted as two years of teaching experience. So all I needed was a fifth year, you know, to get my certificate in California."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Ah, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And so I immediately did that because I got home in December of '64. And by sixty, the September of '65, I was teaching in a regular American school then, in Los Angeles. So within a less than a year, I was, you know, I took that whole spring semester and summer and got a fifth year of a certificate."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you get an MAT or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it was just a, they called it a fifth year of specialization in education. And so it wasn't even an advanced degree. It was just a graduate degree certification in California."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "State certification. I didn't know that."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:865", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.6476251402814968, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it was just a, they called it a fifth year of specialization in education. And so it wasn't even an advanced degree. It was just a graduate degree certification in California."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "State certification. I didn't know that."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I began teaching a sixth grade in Woodland Hills, California. And I didn't even think back to going to Vietnam. I thought by then it was really getting terrific over there, and I think I had advice from family and friends, don't even think of that, because there's a war over there. And I should have known that when I was in the hepatitis, hepatitis ward, because these guys were from the war and I got to see other wards where, you know, they had, they were, um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Amputees."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Amputees and other things. So I knew there was something going on over there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. When you came back, you were 24, 25?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:867", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.052916822534996, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I began teaching a sixth grade in Woodland Hills, California. And I didn't even think back to going to Vietnam. I thought by then it was really getting terrific over there, and I think I had advice from family and friends, don't even think of that, because there's a war over there. And I should have known that when I was in the hepatitis, hepatitis ward, because these guys were from the war and I got to see other wards where, you know, they had, they were, um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Amputees."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Amputees and other things. So I knew there was something going on over there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. When you came back, you were 24, 25?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I had just turned 25."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were you clear of the draft or were you still subject to the draft?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:869", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.503240913927773, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Amputees and other things. So I knew there was something going on over there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. When you came back, you were 24, 25?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I had just turned 25."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were you clear of the draft or were you still subject to the draft?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was still subject to the draft. But as a teacher, if I was full time teacher, I was still not draftable at that point."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's right, yeah."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:871", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.0036010154753034, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I had just turned 25."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were you clear of the draft or were you still subject to the draft?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was still subject to the draft. But as a teacher, if I was full time teacher, I was still not draftable at that point."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's right, yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I was sort of safe in that sense. And that was a big reason why I went right into teaching."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was it a, was it a special program recruiting volunteers to come into urban schools?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:873", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.559556683861448, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was still subject to the draft. But as a teacher, if I was full time teacher, I was still not draftable at that point."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's right, yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I was sort of safe in that sense. And that was a big reason why I went right into teaching."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was it a, was it a special program recruiting volunteers to come into urban schools?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was not in that program, no."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "This was just."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:875", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.177285204290498, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I was sort of safe in that sense. And that was a big reason why I went right into teaching."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was it a, was it a special program recruiting volunteers to come into urban schools?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was not in that program, no."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "This was just."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was on my own."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "On your own and."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:877", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.863650226989442, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was not in that program, no."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "This was just."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was on my own."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "On your own and."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Applied to a district."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And why did you pick Los Angeles?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:879", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 7.626278029988269, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was on my own."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "On your own and."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Applied to a district."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And why did you pick Los Angeles?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's. That was where I had grown up."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, okay. Okay."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:881", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.251420033320299, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Applied to a district."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And why did you pick Los Angeles?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's. That was where I had grown up."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, okay. Okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I, for some reason, let's see. I, I checked all of the school districts around, but this one seemed to be hiring. It was a new district, and they needed new teachers. [phone rings] Ken, are you there? Oh, he got it. Okay. And so I was immediately hired, conditional on getting that certificate in the mail, you know, that I had. Because it took them rigmarole and red tape in Sacramento to get it to you. But I was provisional until I got that certificate, and I had already started teaching."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did they give you salary credit for your two years in the Peace Corps?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:883", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.946022259244776, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's. That was where I had grown up."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, okay. Okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I, for some reason, let's see. I, I checked all of the school districts around, but this one seemed to be hiring. It was a new district, and they needed new teachers. [phone rings] Ken, are you there? Oh, he got it. Okay. And so I was immediately hired, conditional on getting that certificate in the mail, you know, that I had. Because it took them rigmarole and red tape in Sacramento to get it to you. But I was provisional until I got that certificate, and I had already started teaching."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did they give you salary credit for your two years in the Peace Corps?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you started at the third step then?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:885", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.717802510271973, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I, for some reason, let's see. I, I checked all of the school districts around, but this one seemed to be hiring. It was a new district, and they needed new teachers. [phone rings] Ken, are you there? Oh, he got it. Okay. And so I was immediately hired, conditional on getting that certificate in the mail, you know, that I had. Because it took them rigmarole and red tape in Sacramento to get it to you. But I was provisional until I got that certificate, and I had already started teaching."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did they give you salary credit for your two years in the Peace Corps?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you started at the third step then?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. So that was an advantage really."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "As you began, did you then expect teaching was going to be your career?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:887", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 8.575336122524414, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you started at the third step then?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. So that was an advantage really."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "As you began, did you then expect teaching was going to be your career?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I sort of thought it was."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. I mean, sometimes we don't really choose careers, they happen."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:889", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 9.52815124724935, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. So that was an advantage really."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "As you began, did you then expect teaching was going to be your career?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I sort of thought it was."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. I mean, sometimes we don't really choose careers, they happen."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right, they happen to you. But I enjoyed the process of teaching very much. And so I was a dedicated teacher already."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. At did, or in your first months back, did you have it in the back of your mind that you might want to return to the Philippines sometime?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:891", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 9.475723608054832, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I sort of thought it was."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. I mean, sometimes we don't really choose careers, they happen."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right, they happen to you. But I enjoyed the process of teaching very much. And so I was a dedicated teacher already."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. At did, or in your first months back, did you have it in the back of your mind that you might want to return to the Philippines sometime?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Definitely. I was intending to go back. I still was corresponding with people through letters, and I wanted to go back. And eventually, you know, within a short time frame, maybe within 5 or 10 years, I would go back."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But the sense of going back on a visit, not going back."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:893", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 9.41747067561648, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right, they happen to you. But I enjoyed the process of teaching very much. And so I was a dedicated teacher already."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. At did, or in your first months back, did you have it in the back of your mind that you might want to return to the Philippines sometime?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Definitely. I was intending to go back. I still was corresponding with people through letters, and I wanted to go back. And eventually, you know, within a short time frame, maybe within 5 or 10 years, I would go back."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But the sense of going back on a visit, not going back."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right, just to visit. I was, I was already within the first few years of teaching, I knew that I was not going to be a Peace Corps volunteer again in, you know, strictly Peace Corps."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you maintain communication with people from the village?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:895", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 9.352745195129422, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Definitely. I was intending to go back. I still was corresponding with people through letters, and I wanted to go back. And eventually, you know, within a short time frame, maybe within 5 or 10 years, I would go back."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But the sense of going back on a visit, not going back."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right, just to visit. I was, I was already within the first few years of teaching, I knew that I was not going to be a Peace Corps volunteer again in, you know, strictly Peace Corps."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you maintain communication with people from the village?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, for years."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did any of them come to the U.S.?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:897", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 10.391939105699358, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right, just to visit. I was, I was already within the first few years of teaching, I knew that I was not going to be a Peace Corps volunteer again in, you know, strictly Peace Corps."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you maintain communication with people from the village?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, for years."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did any of them come to the U.S.?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Only the daughter of the mayor, and I had, I saw her one other time. She went to Chicago, but she came through Los Angeles on her way to the Philippines again. And I saw her. And I saw another person that I had known in the Philippines who came to Los Angeles just on a visit."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When you initially came home, I mean, you, you had just had this incredible experience. It had some bumps along the way, but clearly you ended it on, with a, on a kind of high. How did that play back home with your family, your friends, and then when you went back to school?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:907", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 11.74590442801632, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I thought, what is wrong with America? We don't talk to each other. We don't. They don't. You Americans are not like the Filipinos. You don't hug us. You know, you don't say, come over to my house and have a merienda and let's have something to eat. You know, Americans are very cold people, and I just couldn't get over that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "You know, in my, in my viewpoint then, in my mind, we were cold, you know, money grabbing, cold, uncommunicative people. And I couldn't get over that. And I was here. I had 10,000 slides and diaries and all these clothes that they had given me and things to show off here's what the Philippines is like. And nobody wanted to listen. You know, they, their eyes would glaze over. And no, we don't have time to do any more slides. And, you know, I thought, there's something wrong here. What's wrong with me, or what's wrong with America, you know?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That was an emotional low for me to try to get through. And that, and it still is. I'm still, you know, I am so happy to see you. This is 40 years later."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But, uh, then as you began teaching. Did you teach, were you an English teacher?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:909", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 13.051004920018134, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "You know, in my, in my viewpoint then, in my mind, we were cold, you know, money grabbing, cold, uncommunicative people. And I couldn't get over that. And I was here. I had 10,000 slides and diaries and all these clothes that they had given me and things to show off here's what the Philippines is like. And nobody wanted to listen. You know, they, their eyes would glaze over. And no, we don't have time to do any more slides. And, you know, I thought, there's something wrong here. What's wrong with me, or what's wrong with America, you know?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That was an emotional low for me to try to get through. And that, and it still is. I'm still, you know, I am so happy to see you. This is 40 years later."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But, uh, then as you began teaching. Did you teach, were you an English teacher?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was a sixth grade regular, you know, every, every subject. Spelling, from spelling through math, through social studies. Heavy on the social studies because I had lots to tell them about social studies."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you began finding ways to integrate your Philippine experience into your teaching."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:911", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 14.501116577797927, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That was an emotional low for me to try to get through. And that, and it still is. I'm still, you know, I am so happy to see you. This is 40 years later."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But, uh, then as you began teaching. Did you teach, were you an English teacher?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was a sixth grade regular, you know, every, every subject. Spelling, from spelling through math, through social studies. Heavy on the social studies because I had lots to tell them about social studies."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you began finding ways to integrate your Philippine experience into your teaching."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, definitely."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Whether it was, fit in the curriculum or not."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:913", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 16.112351753108808, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was a sixth grade regular, you know, every, every subject. Spelling, from spelling through math, through social studies. Heavy on the social studies because I had lots to tell them about social studies."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you began finding ways to integrate your Philippine experience into your teaching."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, definitely."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Whether it was, fit in the curriculum or not."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. I just made it fit, you know?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, well, I was a teacher."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:915", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 17.902613059009784, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, definitely."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Whether it was, fit in the curriculum or not."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. I just made it fit, you know?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, well, I was a teacher."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Yeah. You just, there's so much you want to tell them and about the bigger world and, uh. Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, then talking, speaking 40 years after the fact, what do you think was the impact on your life of having been in the Peace Corps?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:917", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 19.89179228778865, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. I just made it fit, you know?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, well, I was a teacher."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Yeah. You just, there's so much you want to tell them and about the bigger world and, uh. Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, then talking, speaking 40 years after the fact, what do you think was the impact on your life of having been in the Peace Corps?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think getting to know the bigger, the broader world, that America is really a small place compared to how people really live in the rest of the world. The, you know, the, the things they don't have, or at least then, maybe it's all changed now. But, you know, just not having water running into your bathroom, or you don't even have a bathroom. So many people in the world don't have that, and that, that, just every day I'm so grateful."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And has it, has it affected choices you've made in your life after?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:929", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 16.253379561962, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was combined with the railroad. They had one square mile of railroad land that was federal government and one square mile of Navajo land every square mile along the road there. So and this, they had built a dormitory school, a huge school that was, oh, 5 or 600 kids."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Name?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "First grade through sixth grade. You want to hear the name? Okay. Dzilth-Na-O-Dith-Hle. I'll say it again. Dzilth-Na-O-Dith-Hle."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And it means the turning mountain, because it was built at the base of this mesa that was round like a horseshoe. And people in Navajo, this is a whole other cultural thing in Navajo, when you ride by it on a horse, it looks like it's turning with you. So they gave it the name in Navajo, The Turning Mountain. So anyway, brand new school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Is it near Farmington?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:933", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 10, "return_to_go": 16.4856537802, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And it means the turning mountain, because it was built at the base of this mesa that was round like a horseshoe. And people in Navajo, this is a whole other cultural thing in Navajo, when you ride by it on a horse, it looks like it's turning with you. So they gave it the name in Navajo, The Turning Mountain. So anyway, brand new school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Is it near Farmington?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, 40 miles south of Farmington on Highway 44."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I, I just, I was absolutely in glory again. I was in the Peace Corps again in my mind. I was teaching a fifth grade class, but it was teaching English as a second language, mostly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It was a boarding school?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:935", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 5, "return_to_go": 7.206281978, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, 40 miles south of Farmington on Highway 44."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I, I just, I was absolutely in glory again. I was in the Peace Corps again in my mind. I was teaching a fifth grade class, but it was teaching English as a second language, mostly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It was a boarding school?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "A boarding school. They would grab these sobbing five year olds away from their mothers almost in those days. This was in 1969, '70, the '69-'70 school year. They would. And I was a part of it that summer, going out with a teacher who had been in another school. Going out in a car on dirt, dirty, bumpy roads and going into very small areas where there were hogans and just a small group of people, which is the traditional way of living in Navajo. And they would ask how many children they have and any new children this year, and who's going to be five? And they would tell them, sign them up right there. And the parents had to bring the student to the school, leave them off, and say goodbye for until Christmas. Five year olds. And they would cry for two weeks. And they were in a dormitory with non Navajo people. Although some of the aides and people were Navajo, but they were completely different, no familiarity."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Part of the idea was to deculturalize."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:941", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.7918820000000002, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. And it was still going on in the early '70s. Can you imagine? So I was part of that for one whole year, and for personal selfish reasons, I loved it. I was at the end of a road. You couldn't get out of there. There were blizzards sometimes. It was wonderful. I was teaching English as a second language. I was learning Navajo from a minister, what do you call him? A missionary. And I was just loving everything about it, except the BIA. I couldn't take the BIA and the principal. I hope he hears this somehow, or it gets back to the government, that he was a Mormon. He was narrow minded. He had been in the army and reached a certain GS level, like 14. So they put him in as a principal. He knew nothing about education, nothing about Navajos, nothing about children, nothing about anything. He was a miserable creep. And we all thought that. All of us teachers."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And we couldn't wait to get out of there. I mean, I couldn't. 70 percent of the people left. This was the first year. It had started with all new teachers, 70 people, 70 percent left."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I did too. I couldn't take it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. So, next adventure."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:943", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.9909800000000002, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And we couldn't wait to get out of there. I mean, I couldn't. 70 percent of the people left. This was the first year. It had started with all new teachers, 70 people, 70 percent left."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I did too. I couldn't take it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. So, next adventure."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So then I went back to school myself and got a master's degree in education and went on from there, teaching and teaching and teaching in all different places."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. And you did find a way to get back to the Philippines or?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:951", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.8, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I had sort of planned after retiring to do that. But then the whole world changed, and I don't think I'll ever get back there. I really do not see myself getting back there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I have changed. I mean, I have aged so much and they have changed so much that I wouldn't know anybody, even the mayor's son that I got along with pretty well who, we were pretty close buddies. And even that teacher I worked with, you know, they'd be 60 years old now or more."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I wouldn't know them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And is it in the area where there have been serious political problems?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:953", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 2.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I have changed. I mean, I have aged so much and they have changed so much that I wouldn't know anybody, even the mayor's son that I got along with pretty well who, we were pretty close buddies. And even that teacher I worked with, you know, they'd be 60 years old now or more."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I wouldn't know them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And is it in the area where there have been serious political problems?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, pretty far from there. And that was in, for much further south."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What would you, uh, what would you say to a young person today as far as joining the Peace Corps?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00181:959", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, I'd say do it. I would go for it. I would, yes, even though it's chancy to get on a plane even, if you're 20 years old or 22 and you're, you know, you want to see the world, I would say do that and learn something from the Peace Corps. I mean, you know, that they can train you to do something. Or maybe, I don't know how they're doing it now, but maybe you already have worked in computers for three years. Go teach somebody else in the world to do that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I would fully. I keep recommending people, you know, younger people to do that, even older people who have retired."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I told them, why don't you just think, consider that since you have nothing else to do and you're not going to play golf all your life."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "We can. Oh. Is there anything else you would like to add? And you know, the tape is going into the archive about your Peace Corps experience."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:1", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.480925484519519, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "My early twenties."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay, right out of college?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Didn't graduate."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay, so you went in without a degree?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes. Okay, terrific. And let's talk about who you were. Let's back up."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:3", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 7.201028316132798, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Didn't graduate."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay, so you went in without a degree?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes. Okay, terrific. And let's talk about who you were. Let's back up."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was in college."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You were in college?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:5", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.890031462369776, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes. Okay, terrific. And let's talk about who you were. Let's back up."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was in college."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You were in college?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I was in college at the time. And after a couple of years of college, I realized I needed to find some direction. So I took a break from college and joined the Peace Corps."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What an interesting way to take time out and figure out what's important to you."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:7", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.655590513744195, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was in college."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You were in college?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I was in college at the time. And after a couple of years of college, I realized I needed to find some direction. So I took a break from college and joined the Peace Corps."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What an interesting way to take time out and figure out what's important to you."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "We'll get back to that."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:9", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 8.506211681937994, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I was in college at the time. And after a couple of years of college, I realized I needed to find some direction. So I took a break from college and joined the Peace Corps."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What an interesting way to take time out and figure out what's important to you."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "We'll get back to that."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Where did you grow up? Where were you born?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:13", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.452113187577772, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Where did you grow up? Where were you born?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was born in Appleton, Wisconsin. At age six, we moved to a small town called Thorpe, Wisconsin?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Near Appleton?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it's more near Eau Claire."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. Actually, I might mention that we're doing this interview in a place where neither one of us lives. We each drove 2 hours to a central meeting point, and we are in Tomah, Wisconsin, which is quite new to me."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:15", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.946792430641969, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was born in Appleton, Wisconsin. At age six, we moved to a small town called Thorpe, Wisconsin?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Near Appleton?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it's more near Eau Claire."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. Actually, I might mention that we're doing this interview in a place where neither one of us lives. We each drove 2 hours to a central meeting point, and we are in Tomah, Wisconsin, which is quite new to me."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Drove through sleet and snow in April."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:17", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.496436034046631, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it's more near Eau Claire."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. Actually, I might mention that we're doing this interview in a place where neither one of us lives. We each drove 2 hours to a central meeting point, and we are in Tomah, Wisconsin, which is quite new to me."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Drove through sleet and snow in April."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Exactly. Yeah, you never know up here."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's right. That's right. Okay. So you grew up in Thorpe."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:19", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 6.1071511489407015, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Drove through sleet and snow in April."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Exactly. Yeah, you never know up here."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's right. That's right. Okay. So you grew up in Thorpe."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Thorpe, Wisconsin, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And talk a little bit about your family. What did your parents do?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:21", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.3412790543785573, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Exactly. Yeah, you never know up here."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's right. That's right. Okay. So you grew up in Thorpe."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Thorpe, Wisconsin, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And talk a little bit about your family. What did your parents do?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, my dad was a insurance salesman. He had his own office and he sold for independent line, or he was independent and sold for other lines. My mother was a Catholic school teacher. I think she pretty much taught like sixth, seventh, eighth grade throughout her career. So the upper grades, the grades were one through eight there. Then she became principal of the school after a while and then she retired."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "All right. Ah, I can't even imagine it would be like to be the kid of the principal."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:23", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 2.6014211715317304, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Thorpe, Wisconsin, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And talk a little bit about your family. What did your parents do?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, my dad was a insurance salesman. He had his own office and he sold for independent line, or he was independent and sold for other lines. My mother was a Catholic school teacher. I think she pretty much taught like sixth, seventh, eighth grade throughout her career. So the upper grades, the grades were one through eight there. Then she became principal of the school after a while and then she retired."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "All right. Ah, I can't even imagine it would be like to be the kid of the principal."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was pretty old by then. I was now nowhere near school age then."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. You didn't have to."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:25", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.7793568572574783, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, my dad was a insurance salesman. He had his own office and he sold for independent line, or he was independent and sold for other lines. My mother was a Catholic school teacher. I think she pretty much taught like sixth, seventh, eighth grade throughout her career. So the upper grades, the grades were one through eight there. Then she became principal of the school after a while and then she retired."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "All right. Ah, I can't even imagine it would be like to be the kid of the principal."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was pretty old by then. I was now nowhere near school age then."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. You didn't have to."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, no. She was my teacher in fourth grade."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, my goodness. You must have been proud."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:27", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.9770631747305314, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was pretty old by then. I was now nowhere near school age then."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. You didn't have to."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, no. She was my teacher in fourth grade."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, my goodness. You must have been proud."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you had siblings?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:29", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.1967368608117015, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, no. She was my teacher in fourth grade."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, my goodness. You must have been proud."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you had siblings?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I have two brothers and two sisters."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Where are you in the lineup?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:31", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.440818734235224, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you had siblings?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I have two brothers and two sisters."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Where are you in the lineup?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'm the oldest."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You're the oldest."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:33", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 2.7120208158169152, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I have two brothers and two sisters."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Where are you in the lineup?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'm the oldest."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You're the oldest."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I'm the oldest."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. So you went to, then did you go to, you went to the Catholic school where your mother taught?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:35", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.9022453509076838, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'm the oldest."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You're the oldest."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I'm the oldest."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. So you went to, then did you go to, you went to the Catholic school where your mother taught?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "In Thorpe. Until eighth grade."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right, right. And then?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:37", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.113605945452982, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I'm the oldest."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. So you went to, then did you go to, you went to the Catholic school where your mother taught?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "In Thorpe. Until eighth grade."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right, right. And then?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "High school in Thorpe."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. Public high school?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:39", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.348451050503313, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "In Thorpe. Until eighth grade."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right, right. And then?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "High school in Thorpe."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. Public high school?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, public high school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And I'm thinking about a family with five kids. Could you all cram into one car? Pretty tight."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:41", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.6093900561147922, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "High school in Thorpe."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. Public high school?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, public high school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And I'm thinking about a family with five kids. Could you all cram into one car? Pretty tight."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We had two cars."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You had two cars. Were you, did you take family vacations?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:43", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.8993222845719915, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, public high school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And I'm thinking about a family with five kids. Could you all cram into one car? Pretty tight."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We had two cars."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You had two cars. Were you, did you take family vacations?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Once in a while, yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah. And, um. Oh, the light just went off."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:47", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.579410227866656, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Once in a while, yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah. And, um. Oh, the light just went off."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's okay. It's because nobody's moving around I guess."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "We can."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It's okay."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It's all right. We're sitting by a window here. I'm glad we chose the seat by the window."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:49", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 3.9771224754073953, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's okay. It's because nobody's moving around I guess."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "We can."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It's okay."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It's all right. We're sitting by a window here. I'm glad we chose the seat by the window."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'm wondering if you ever had a chance to do any international travel with your family?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:51", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.1968027504526613, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It's okay."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It's all right. We're sitting by a window here. I'm glad we chose the seat by the window."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'm wondering if you ever had a chance to do any international travel with your family?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not with my family, no. I went to Germany on a semester abroad program when I was at Stevens Point in college."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. And what did you, when you were in high school, did you study Spanish?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:53", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.4408919449474014, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'm wondering if you ever had a chance to do any international travel with your family?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not with my family, no. I went to Germany on a semester abroad program when I was at Stevens Point in college."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. And what did you, when you were in high school, did you study Spanish?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No. Did you have any foreign language at all?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:55", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.712102161052668, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not with my family, no. I went to Germany on a semester abroad program when I was at Stevens Point in college."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. And what did you, when you were in high school, did you study Spanish?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No. Did you have any foreign language at all?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "None."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No. And your parents spoke only English?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:57", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.0134468456140753, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No. Did you have any foreign language at all?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "None."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No. And your parents spoke only English?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah, yeah. So what kind of kid were you in high school? Did you play sports? Did you?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:59", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.348274272904528, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "None."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No. And your parents spoke only English?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah, yeah. So what kind of kid were you in high school? Did you play sports? Did you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I played sports. I was an average student, you know, the normal, pretty much whatever normal kid is."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Regular kid, yeah, yeah."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:61", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.7203047476716975, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah, yeah. So what kind of kid were you in high school? Did you play sports? Did you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I played sports. I was an average student, you know, the normal, pretty much whatever normal kid is."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Regular kid, yeah, yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I played football, yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, yeah. I'm looking at your shirt. Is that a G for the Green Bay Packers?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:63", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 4.1336719418574415, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I played sports. I was an average student, you know, the normal, pretty much whatever normal kid is."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Regular kid, yeah, yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I played football, yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, yeah. I'm looking at your shirt. Is that a G for the Green Bay Packers?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "All right, so sports are still important."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:65", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.481857713174935, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I played football, yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, yeah. I'm looking at your shirt. Is that a G for the Green Bay Packers?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "All right, so sports are still important."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, the Packers are anyway."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes, of course. We are in Wisconsin."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:67", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.8687307924165943, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "All right, so sports are still important."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, the Packers are anyway."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes, of course. We are in Wisconsin."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And I'm wondering, when you had, did you do summer jobs when you were high school?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:69", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.298589769351771, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, the Packers are anyway."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes, of course. We are in Wisconsin."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And I'm wondering, when you had, did you do summer jobs when you were high school?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yes. I worked for my dad's friends who owned farms. And so we did, I did, made hay and took care of cattle, planted crops."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, that's terrific. So you knew."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:71", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.776210854835301, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And I'm wondering, when you had, did you do summer jobs when you were high school?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yes. I worked for my dad's friends who owned farms. And so we did, I did, made hay and took care of cattle, planted crops."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, that's terrific. So you knew."}, {"role": "user", "content": "During the summers in high school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How to move around the farm."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:73", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.306900949817001, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yes. I worked for my dad's friends who owned farms. And so we did, I did, made hay and took care of cattle, planted crops."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, that's terrific. So you knew."}, {"role": "user", "content": "During the summers in high school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How to move around the farm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I learned it. By the time I was a senior I could do quite a few things, but when I was a freshman, I couldn't do that much."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But you learned on the job."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:75", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.896556610907778, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "During the summers in high school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How to move around the farm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I learned it. By the time I was a senior I could do quite a few things, but when I was a freshman, I couldn't do that much."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But you learned on the job."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I learned on the job."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Good for you. That's great. That's a rich background."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:77", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.5517295676753085, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I learned it. By the time I was a senior I could do quite a few things, but when I was a freshman, I couldn't do that much."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But you learned on the job."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I learned on the job."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Good for you. That's great. That's a rich background."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, definitely."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So then you went to, you left Thorpe and you went to Stevens Point, Wisconsin. Went to the University of Wisconsin- Stevens Point for a couple of years."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:79", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.279699519639231, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I learned on the job."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Good for you. That's great. That's a rich background."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, definitely."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So then you went to, you left Thorpe and you went to Stevens Point, Wisconsin. Went to the University of Wisconsin- Stevens Point for a couple of years."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And did your study abroad experience happened then before you join the Peace Corps?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:81", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 8.088555021821367, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, definitely."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So then you went to, you left Thorpe and you went to Stevens Point, Wisconsin. Went to the University of Wisconsin- Stevens Point for a couple of years."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And did your study abroad experience happened then before you join the Peace Corps?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, it did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Talk about that a little bit. You went to Germany?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:85", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 7.516734594841195, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, it did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Talk about that a little bit. You went to Germany?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Well, it was kind of a last-minute decision. I heard a friend or two of mine were going and then I inquired to see if there was any openings left. And there were. And then I decided to go through the interview process to go on the semester abroad."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Because I was interested in traveling and learning in a different country and seeing what that was like."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Good for you. So even at that early age of probably what, 18, 19?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:87", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.240816216490217, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Well, it was kind of a last-minute decision. I heard a friend or two of mine were going and then I inquired to see if there was any openings left. And there were. And then I decided to go through the interview process to go on the semester abroad."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Because I was interested in traveling and learning in a different country and seeing what that was like."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Good for you. So even at that early age of probably what, 18, 19?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was a sophomore."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah. You already had this curiosity about other places."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:89", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 8.045351351655796, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Because I was interested in traveling and learning in a different country and seeing what that was like."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Good for you. So even at that early age of probably what, 18, 19?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was a sophomore."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah. You already had this curiosity about other places."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh yeah, much earlier than that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you have, earlier than that you were into travel.\n\nCurious."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:91", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 8.939279279617551, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was a sophomore."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah. You already had this curiosity about other places."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh yeah, much earlier than that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you have, earlier than that you were into travel.\n\nCurious."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Did not travel but, yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Did you speak German when you went there?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:93", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 9.93253253290839, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh yeah, much earlier than that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you have, earlier than that you were into travel.\n\nCurious."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Did not travel but, yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Did you speak German when you went there?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it wasn't a requirement. The teachers we had at that time spoke English and taught in English."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Where in Germany?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:97", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 9.793250040627642, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it wasn't a requirement. The teachers we had at that time spoke English and taught in English."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Where in Germany?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "We stayed in Munich and then we took classes in Munich and on weekends we had Eurail passes and we could travel."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Wonderful."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, so that was nice."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's a good education."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:99", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 5, "return_to_go": 10.881388934030714, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We stayed in Munich and then we took classes in Munich and on weekends we had Eurail passes and we could travel."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Wonderful."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, so that was nice."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's a good education."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you traveled to other countries in Europe?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:101", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 6.534876593367458, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, so that was nice."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's a good education."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you traveled to other countries in Europe?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I traveled to the next-door countries. We tried to go to Italy, but there was a train strike, so we had to turn around and come back. And then I did make it into Austria just fine. Um, I think Austria is the only one really. We went, did go to East Germany for one day, so we crossed through Checkpoint Charlie. We could stay there one day. We had to take a certain amount of money and spend it there. So most of us just spent it at restaurants."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But how interesting that you got over to East Germany. The wall was still up then."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:107", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 7.592423310517774, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yeah. So that was pretty amazing to have to go through that screening process at Checkpoint Charlie by the East German officials."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was serious business. No fooling around. No. Ask the, answer the question and move on when they tell you to. that's about it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes, sir."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And then, um, and then you went back to Stevens Point. Or was that your last semester?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:109", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 5.102692567241971, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was serious business. No fooling around. No. Ask the, answer the question and move on when they tell you to. that's about it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes, sir."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And then, um, and then you went back to Stevens Point. Or was that your last semester?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was only like a few months. It was like from August until beginning of December, one semester."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Then you finished up that year at University of Wisconsin?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:111", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.558547296935523, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And then, um, and then you went back to Stevens Point. Or was that your last semester?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was only like a few months. It was like from August until beginning of December, one semester."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Then you finished up that year at University of Wisconsin?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I did finish the year, yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And were you studying any foreign languages at University of Wisconsin?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:113", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 5.065052552150581, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was only like a few months. It was like from August until beginning of December, one semester."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Then you finished up that year at University of Wisconsin?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I did finish the year, yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And were you studying any foreign languages at University of Wisconsin?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I didn't, no."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. All right. So you got, you got it into your head to join the Peace Corps, did you know? Did you know any other people who were in the Peace Corps?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:115", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.51672505794509, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I did finish the year, yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And were you studying any foreign languages at University of Wisconsin?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I didn't, no."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. All right. So you got, you got it into your head to join the Peace Corps, did you know? Did you know any other people who were in the Peace Corps?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. There were a couple of us. My group of friends, there were two others who wanted to join the Peace Corps. They had just graduated from college, and they suggested that I do that too, to apply, because maybe it would be an option for me since they knew I wasn't going to continue. So then I applied and they were accepted to go to Guatemala and I was accepted to go to Honduras."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How interesting. Were you disappointed that you didn't get to go with them?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:117", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.018583397716766, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I didn't, no."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. All right. So you got, you got it into your head to join the Peace Corps, did you know? Did you know any other people who were in the Peace Corps?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. There were a couple of us. My group of friends, there were two others who wanted to join the Peace Corps. They had just graduated from college, and they suggested that I do that too, to apply, because maybe it would be an option for me since they knew I wasn't going to continue. So then I applied and they were accepted to go to Guatemala and I was accepted to go to Honduras."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How interesting. Were you disappointed that you didn't get to go with them?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, not at all. No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What, did the application process have any, uh, were you given the option of saying where you wanted to go?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:119", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.576203775240851, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. There were a couple of us. My group of friends, there were two others who wanted to join the Peace Corps. They had just graduated from college, and they suggested that I do that too, to apply, because maybe it would be an option for me since they knew I wasn't going to continue. So then I applied and they were accepted to go to Guatemala and I was accepted to go to Honduras."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How interesting. Were you disappointed that you didn't get to go with them?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, not at all. No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What, did the application process have any, uh, were you given the option of saying where you wanted to go?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Where you didn't want to go."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Where you didn't."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:121", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.195781972489834, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, not at all. No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What, did the application process have any, uh, were you given the option of saying where you wanted to go?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Where you didn't want to go."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Where you didn't."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were there places that you didn't want to go?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:123", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.884202191655371, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Where you didn't want to go."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Where you didn't."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were there places that you didn't want to go?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Too far away."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. All right."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:125", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.649113546283745, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were there places that you didn't want to go?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Too far away."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. All right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I didn't want to be that, way on the other side of the world. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. So you're quite a, quite far away when you're in Central America, but you can still get there from here."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:127", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 8.499015051426383, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Too far away."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. All right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I didn't want to be that, way on the other side of the world. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. So you're quite a, quite far away when you're in Central America, but you can still get there from here."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yeah. One day travel you can get back to Wisconsin if you do it right. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So I'm thinking this was, this would have been 1978."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:129", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 9.443350057140426, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I didn't want to be that, way on the other side of the world. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. So you're quite a, quite far away when you're in Central America, but you can still get there from here."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yeah. One day travel you can get back to Wisconsin if you do it right. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So I'm thinking this was, this would have been 1978."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What time of year?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:131", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 5, "return_to_go": 10.492611174600473, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yeah. One day travel you can get back to Wisconsin if you do it right. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So I'm thinking this was, this would have been 1978."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What time of year?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, we went to training. There were seven of us, are you talking about training?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, yeah. What time did you leave? What time of year was it when you had to say goodbye to your family?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:133", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.102901305111636, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What time of year?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, we went to training. There were seven of us, are you talking about training?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, yeah. What time did you leave? What time of year was it when you had to say goodbye to your family?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, okay. The summer of 1978, myself and six others from, six other men, young men from around the country, met at UW-Stout in Menomonie, Wisconsin. We had all applied to the Peace Corps, didn't know each other, of course. And the trainers in Washington wanted us to, because of our backgrounds, wanted us to teach industrial arts in one of eight or ten U.S. AID schools that were built in Honduras. They had built them and equipped the woodshop and metal shop area. So that's the industrial arts part. They had equipped also the home economics area of the high school, in country high schools, those dozen or so high schools that they had built. And they also equipped the science labs. So they were looking for, at that time, teachers for industrial arts."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mm hmm. And so you and the other six or seven guys were all going to be doing industrial art."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:139", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.025927716202517, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We were taken, yes, we were taken from our homes, flown to UW-Stout, Menomonie, Wisconsin."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Flown?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, like if you traveled from California."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Or Louisiana, which one man was."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, so these other guys were not all Wisconsinites?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:141", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 6.695475240225019, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, like if you traveled from California."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Or Louisiana, which one man was."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, so these other guys were not all Wisconsinites?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, no."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Even though you were meeting right here."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:147", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 5, "return_to_go": 6.701612126508941, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "People from all over the United States apply for the Peace Corps."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Yes."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So they gathered those applications that thought they matched. I don't know how they did it. They got us seven together."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And we, they, we went to UW-Stout. Of course, I didn't have to fly, but that's a detail because I live close. Yeah. For that summer, we attended classes to learn how to become industrial arts teachers."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. Here in Wisconsin?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:151", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.1007557117394335, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And we, they, we went to UW-Stout. Of course, I didn't have to fly, but that's a detail because I live close. Yeah. For that summer, we attended classes to learn how to become industrial arts teachers."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. Here in Wisconsin?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, all in English, all with English professors. And so in August, we completed that program, of '78. Then we were, then we went to Miami, Florida, for what they called staging. And staging was three days in Miami at a hotel. And we attended many meetings and got our shots."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Your shots."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And then we flew to Honduras from there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Before we fly Honduras, what's happening back home here? What are your parents, your mom, your dad? You've got four siblings. What did they think of what you were doing?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:153", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.3341730130438147, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, all in English, all with English professors. And so in August, we completed that program, of '78. Then we were, then we went to Miami, Florida, for what they called staging. And staging was three days in Miami at a hotel. And we attended many meetings and got our shots."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Your shots."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And then we flew to Honduras from there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Before we fly Honduras, what's happening back home here? What are your parents, your mom, your dad? You've got four siblings. What did they think of what you were doing?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't really remember."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do they seem supportive?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:159", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 3.2018834198131887, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was, it was a decision that I made. And my dad I remember saying, well, that's great. And my siblings, I don't know, they just weren't around. I mean, we were all in different places at different schools doing different things."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Our lives were not connected very well at that time. We're all out of the house and."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I imagine they thought it was great. I don't know. I never really asked them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But you were your own."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:161", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.4465371331257653, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Our lives were not connected very well at that time. We're all out of the house and."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I imagine they thought it was great. I don't know. I never really asked them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But you were your own."}, {"role": "user", "content": "33 years ago."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah, that's a while."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:163", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.718374592361961, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I imagine they thought it was great. I don't know. I never really asked them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But you were your own."}, {"role": "user", "content": "33 years ago."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah, that's a while."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay, so you're finished with staging in Miami and they fly you to Honduras. Just how many, did you say there were seven of you?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:173", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.60359124178557, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And then we were a little over 50 people in our group, I think 52 or 53."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And we were the largest group to come into Honduras at, up to that date. And so we were known as the big one."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And up until now, there's been no training in Spanish? It's strictly teaching methods and techniques of industrial art."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:175", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.115101379761744, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And we were the largest group to come into Honduras at, up to that date. And so we were known as the big one."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And up until now, there's been no training in Spanish? It's strictly teaching methods and techniques of industrial art."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, up until then, up until we got into country? Right, exactly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah, yeah."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:177", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.683445977513049, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And up until now, there's been no training in Spanish? It's strictly teaching methods and techniques of industrial art."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, up until then, up until we got into country? Right, exactly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah, yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Exactly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you knew what to do in an industrial arts classroom."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:179", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.314939975014499, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, up until then, up until we got into country? Right, exactly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah, yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Exactly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you knew what to do in an industrial arts classroom."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did they do any practice teaching here in Wisconsin in high schools with industrial arts?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:181", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.016599972238333, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Exactly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you knew what to do in an industrial arts classroom."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did they do any practice teaching here in Wisconsin in high schools with industrial arts?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "They do, but you have to be enrolled in their program. And this was only to train us in a short amount of time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. So. So you didn't get any hands-on experience here before going down to Honduras."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:183", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 7.796222191375925, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did they do any practice teaching here in Wisconsin in high schools with industrial arts?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "They do, but you have to be enrolled in their program. And this was only to train us in a short amount of time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. So. So you didn't get any hands-on experience here before going down to Honduras."}, {"role": "user", "content": "In my past, I had done some things that were similar to teaching."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. But I mean, Peace Corps training did not include practice teaching."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:191", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.9314467175368475, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They were from the university in Tegucigalpa. They were teachers there but, and they knew, so they knew English just fine, but they did not use English in the classroom at all or any time we saw them in the building halls, anything like that. So we were, we learned it by immersion. Yes. There were many of us in our group, however, who were fluent in Spanish for whatever reason. They took it in college. They grew up in a Hispanic family."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "For whatever reason. And they did not have to join in on the language training. So what they did was do other, they started their jobs pretty much right away."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Ah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They stayed with us the ten weeks in Tegucigalpa, but they were working on their programs wherever they were stationed."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "During your training in Tegucigalpa, where were you living? Were you in a dorm?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:195", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.3845021204158607, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They stayed with us the ten weeks in Tegucigalpa, but they were working on their programs wherever they were stationed."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "During your training in Tegucigalpa, where were you living? Were you in a dorm?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was living with a family."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "A family."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We each got placed in a family. Only one volunteer per family."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, excellent. And I'm assuming that nobody in that family spoke English."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:197", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.6494468004620675, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was living with a family."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "A family."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We each got placed in a family. Only one volunteer per family."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, excellent. And I'm assuming that nobody in that family spoke English."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Nobody did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay, so 6 hours a day in the classroom as a group of three or four students."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:199", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.943829778291186, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We each got placed in a family. Only one volunteer per family."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, excellent. And I'm assuming that nobody in that family spoke English."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Nobody did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay, so 6 hours a day in the classroom as a group of three or four students."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Correct."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And then you're placed with the family."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:201", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.2709219758790957, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Nobody did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay, so 6 hours a day in the classroom as a group of three or four students."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Correct."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And then you're placed with the family."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. And this was done by a private company that Peace Corps had contracted with."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you find it, did you, did you find it good in terms of language learning?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:203", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.634357750976773, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Correct."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And then you're placed with the family."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. And this was done by a private company that Peace Corps had contracted with."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you find it, did you, did you find it good in terms of language learning?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was, I was very interested in learning another language. I always had been. So, um, I was, for me the classes were great. For others, maybe they were a little bit tedious. But I, I enjoyed them a lot."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, good, wonderful."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:205", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.038175278863081, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. And this was done by a private company that Peace Corps had contracted with."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you find it, did you, did you find it good in terms of language learning?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was, I was very interested in learning another language. I always had been. So, um, I was, for me the classes were great. For others, maybe they were a little bit tedious. But I, I enjoyed them a lot."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, good, wonderful."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So. And that lasted for ten weeks."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:207", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.486861420958979, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was, I was very interested in learning another language. I always had been. So, um, I was, for me the classes were great. For others, maybe they were a little bit tedious. But I, I enjoyed them a lot."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, good, wonderful."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So. And that lasted for ten weeks."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Ten weeks, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. What was the family like that you were living with during training?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:209", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.98540157884331, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So. And that lasted for ten weeks."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Ten weeks, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. What was the family like that you were living with during training?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "They were very nice. Nice, open, warm, friendly people. A grandmother was there, a grandfather, and granddaughter. And those three lived in the house. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Middle class family?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:211", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 5.5393350876036775, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Ten weeks, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. What was the family like that you were living with during training?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "They were very nice. Nice, open, warm, friendly people. A grandmother was there, a grandfather, and granddaughter. And those three lived in the house. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Middle class family?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "You know, there really isn't a middle class there, so I don't know how to label the class. I just tell you what they did. She had a job at a bank, and I don't know what exactly she did there, but teller or whatever they do. And his, her grandparents just stayed home and ran the household. So it must have been her mom and dad probably was, her mom and dad, not grandparents. Her mom and dad, her parents."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you ate with the family?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:213", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 5.0437056528929745, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They were very nice. Nice, open, warm, friendly people. A grandmother was there, a grandfather, and granddaughter. And those three lived in the house. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Middle class family?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "You know, there really isn't a middle class there, so I don't know how to label the class. I just tell you what they did. She had a job at a bank, and I don't know what exactly she did there, but teller or whatever they do. And his, her grandparents just stayed home and ran the household. So it must have been her mom and dad probably was, her mom and dad, not grandparents. Her mom and dad, her parents."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you ate with the family?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yeah. They would get up, come down for breakfast. It was a, three levels. It was in the city on one of those triangle type buildings that point out to a plaza like you see in Madison, a round nose on it. You know what I'm talking about?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh. Very nice. Yes."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:215", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.270784058769972, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "You know, there really isn't a middle class there, so I don't know how to label the class. I just tell you what they did. She had a job at a bank, and I don't know what exactly she did there, but teller or whatever they do. And his, her grandparents just stayed home and ran the household. So it must have been her mom and dad probably was, her mom and dad, not grandparents. Her mom and dad, her parents."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you ate with the family?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yeah. They would get up, come down for breakfast. It was a, three levels. It was in the city on one of those triangle type buildings that point out to a plaza like you see in Madison, a round nose on it. You know what I'm talking about?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh. Very nice. Yes."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Three stories. Yeah. So the first story was basically an entry way. Then the second story was where the kitchen, dining, living room was, or kitchen dining, and then third story was open, a patio and a small little room at the back where I stayed."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you had your own room, a little privacy?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:217", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.523093398633302, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yeah. They would get up, come down for breakfast. It was a, three levels. It was in the city on one of those triangle type buildings that point out to a plaza like you see in Madison, a round nose on it. You know what I'm talking about?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh. Very nice. Yes."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Three stories. Yeah. So the first story was basically an entry way. Then the second story was where the kitchen, dining, living room was, or kitchen dining, and then third story was open, a patio and a small little room at the back where I stayed."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you had your own room, a little privacy?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I did then. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah. During training, did you have, did Peace Corps issue you a computer, a telephone?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:219", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.803437109592558, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Three stories. Yeah. So the first story was basically an entry way. Then the second story was where the kitchen, dining, living room was, or kitchen dining, and then third story was open, a patio and a small little room at the back where I stayed."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you had your own room, a little privacy?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I did then. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah. During training, did you have, did Peace Corps issue you a computer, a telephone?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How did you stay in touch with your family?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:221", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.1149301217695085, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I did then. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah. During training, did you have, did Peace Corps issue you a computer, a telephone?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How did you stay in touch with your family?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "We would have to find a place that had telephones and then we would use the telephone. We'd have to pay for it, you know, and use it there. It was at the major cities' post offices."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. Like a pay phone kind of thing."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:223", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 3.4610334686327873, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How did you stay in touch with your family?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "We would have to find a place that had telephones and then we would use the telephone. We'd have to pay for it, you know, and use it there. It was at the major cities' post offices."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. Like a pay phone kind of thing."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. It was a payphone at a major city post office."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How often did you find yourself calling home?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:229", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.3759032491533434, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I called home one time in the two years."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Just once?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, letters were more convenient and didn't cost us much."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's right. That's right."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:231", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 3.7510036101703816, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, letters were more convenient and didn't cost us much."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's right. That's right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So different today when kids are texting their mom and dad every day."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:233", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.0566706779670905, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, letters were more convenient and didn't cost us much."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's right. That's right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So different today when kids are texting their mom and dad every day."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I just visited Honduras a few weeks ago and I was able to call up here, no problem. And I still call my friends there from here with my cell phone now."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Good. I look forward to talking more about your continuing contacts."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:235", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.3963007532967673, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So different today when kids are texting their mom and dad every day."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I just visited Honduras a few weeks ago and I was able to call up here, no problem. And I still call my friends there from here with my cell phone now."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Good. I look forward to talking more about your continuing contacts."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Okay, sure."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Let's see. During training, this was late 1970s. Did the concept of deselection exist? Did they tell you when you started training that a certain number of you were not going to make it through to the end of training?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:237", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 3.773667503663075, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I just visited Honduras a few weeks ago and I was able to call up here, no problem. And I still call my friends there from here with my cell phone now."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Good. I look forward to talking more about your continuing contacts."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Okay, sure."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Let's see. During training, this was late 1970s. Did the concept of deselection exist? Did they tell you when you started training that a certain number of you were not going to make it through to the end of training?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No. So you didn't have that."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:241", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.424280868719846, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No. So you didn't have that."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They wanted us to get an FSI of two or above in language. The need was high and people who got ones were allowed to work. If you got a zero, you had to go a couple more weeks of language training."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Language training."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And so we just got that one so you could survive."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So language was the determining factor there?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:243", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.8047565207998284, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They wanted us to get an FSI of two or above in language. The need was high and people who got ones were allowed to work. If you got a zero, you had to go a couple more weeks of language training."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Language training."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And so we just got that one so you could survive."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So language was the determining factor there?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, but you could make it up."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You could do it."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:249", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 5.219144747324867, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was your choice if you wanted to leave."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They didn't say, oh, you have to leave because you have a zero. They said, oh, you if you want to work in your place where you are assigned, you need to get at least a one so you can be able to take a bus and. So we, they will set you up with more training. So everybody who went through language training ended up working."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "There were a couple of people that dropped out, but it wasn't for reasons of language. It was other personal reasons."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes. And you didn't have, um, then interviews with psychologists?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:255", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.676467417455236, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, not like the early sixties, not the first group kind of thing."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, we just, we got back from a, uh, I just got back from a conference, Peace Corps Honduras reunion."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And they had the, uh, in New Orleans. And there were two women there from the very first group that went to Honduras. And what you're talking about is what they went through."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's right. Yeah. And what I went through in Nigeria."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:259", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.77341656475955, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And they had the, uh, in New Orleans. And there were two women there from the very first group that went to Honduras. And what you're talking about is what they went through."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's right. Yeah. And what I went through in Nigeria."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, okay. What year was that then?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, '65."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, we didn't do any of that. They were describing what they went through, not knowing none of that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It was very different by '78."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:263", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.127674771308086, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, we didn't do any of that. They were describing what they went through, not knowing none of that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It was very different by '78."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Didn't do anything they did, didn't, yeah, nothing. Get on the plane. Go down there. Go through training."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Learn language."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. How was your health during training?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:265", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.919638634786762, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Didn't do anything they did, didn't, yeah, nothing. Get on the plane. Go down there. Go through training."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Learn language."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. How was your health during training?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, it was excellent during training, I thought. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there any, um, in the classroom parts were, when you talked about culture, was there discussion about political things, United States involvement in Honduras?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:267", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 8.799598483096402, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. How was your health during training?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, it was excellent during training, I thought. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there any, um, in the classroom parts were, when you talked about culture, was there discussion about political things, United States involvement in Honduras?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it wasn't about that at all. It was about the culture of the people of Honduras."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. So then the ten weeks are up and there must have been some kind of ceremony. Was there a swearing in?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:269", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 9.77733164788489, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, it was excellent during training, I thought. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there any, um, in the classroom parts were, when you talked about culture, was there discussion about political things, United States involvement in Honduras?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it wasn't about that at all. It was about the culture of the people of Honduras."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. So then the ten weeks are up and there must have been some kind of ceremony. Was there a swearing in?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "There was a little swearing in ceremony, yeah. There was a nice little ceremony we went to, sure. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And then they told you, or at some point you were told where in Honduras you were going to?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:271", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 10.863701830983212, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it wasn't about that at all. It was about the culture of the people of Honduras."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. So then the ten weeks are up and there must have been some kind of ceremony. Was there a swearing in?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "There was a little swearing in ceremony, yeah. There was a nice little ceremony we went to, sure. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And then they told you, or at some point you were told where in Honduras you were going to?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, yeah, during the training. We would meet with our heads of the departments and because, of course, they wanted to meet with us and work with us. So that was their job. So they steered us in the right direction."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mm hmm. Where did you wind up? Where were, where did they send you?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:275", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 7.85642201355952, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, yeah, during the training. We would meet with our heads of the departments and because, of course, they wanted to meet with us and work with us. So that was their job. So they steered us in the right direction."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mm hmm. Where did you wind up? Where were, where did they send you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, at first, the seven industrial arts teachers and one or two science teachers, we really didn't have anything to do because it was on school break for summer break."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Which, um. So what, what we ended up doing is going to La Mosquitia in Honduras. It would be the, the place where it's the most remote. It has a border with Nicaragua. And then the border of, the northern border would be the Caribbean Sea. And it's all jungle. The people that live there are called Misquitos [Miskito]. That's M-I-S-Q-U-I- T-O. Has nothing to do with the bug. That's just their name of their, the name of the Indians there. So that would be in the east. And then in the west, of course, is the Lenca Indians. But that's another story and I don't know much about them.\n\nBut anyway, we went there because we didn't have school to teach and somebody came up with an idea that we were going to build a raft, raft it down a major river system to the mouth where it met the sea, to go out to a ship, to put lumber on the raft from the ship, and then take the lumber back to the mainland and rebuild a small village that had been devastated by a hurricane."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, how fascinating."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:277", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 7.6182466817328, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, at first, the seven industrial arts teachers and one or two science teachers, we really didn't have anything to do because it was on school break for summer break."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Which, um. So what, what we ended up doing is going to La Mosquitia in Honduras. It would be the, the place where it's the most remote. It has a border with Nicaragua. And then the border of, the northern border would be the Caribbean Sea. And it's all jungle. The people that live there are called Misquitos [Miskito]. That's M-I-S-Q-U-I- T-O. Has nothing to do with the bug. That's just their name of their, the name of the Indians there. So that would be in the east. And then in the west, of course, is the Lenca Indians. But that's another story and I don't know much about them.\n\nBut anyway, we went there because we didn't have school to teach and somebody came up with an idea that we were going to build a raft, raft it down a major river system to the mouth where it met the sea, to go out to a ship, to put lumber on the raft from the ship, and then take the lumber back to the mainland and rebuild a small village that had been devastated by a hurricane."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, how fascinating."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Fascinating, yes, but seven people can't do that. How are seven people going to build a town? I mean, that. And I didn't see this project through to the end. I mean, it was a lot of fun. We were in a different place completely from where we grew up or anything. It was just amazing. The people were amazing. It was like being in a National Geographic movie."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I can, yes."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:279", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.242496313036444, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Which, um. So what, what we ended up doing is going to La Mosquitia in Honduras. It would be the, the place where it's the most remote. It has a border with Nicaragua. And then the border of, the northern border would be the Caribbean Sea. And it's all jungle. The people that live there are called Misquitos [Miskito]. That's M-I-S-Q-U-I- T-O. Has nothing to do with the bug. That's just their name of their, the name of the Indians there. So that would be in the east. And then in the west, of course, is the Lenca Indians. But that's another story and I don't know much about them.\n\nBut anyway, we went there because we didn't have school to teach and somebody came up with an idea that we were going to build a raft, raft it down a major river system to the mouth where it met the sea, to go out to a ship, to put lumber on the raft from the ship, and then take the lumber back to the mainland and rebuild a small village that had been devastated by a hurricane."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, how fascinating."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Fascinating, yes, but seven people can't do that. How are seven people going to build a town? I mean, that. And I didn't see this project through to the end. I mean, it was a lot of fun. We were in a different place completely from where we grew up or anything. It was just amazing. The people were amazing. It was like being in a National Geographic movie."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I can, yes."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But I, I wanted to get back to my school. I wanted to start working, get ready for the year. So I stayed out there probably three or four weeks. The other guys did complete the barge. USAID supplied two out, twin, two outboard motors for it. They did go to the mouth."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you get as far as that?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:285", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.217416067265355, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "The ship did not arrive."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I always questioned that part. You know, that's, it's the Caribbean, but it's not just gentle seas. I mean, there's storms and everything there and there's sandbars and reefs and stuff. So a big ship can't get into shore. But I never could figure out why they just didn't fly it in and. But anyway, it didn't, doesn't matter, because I didn't stay. And the guys that went had a great time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I bet."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They got some kind of, they did some surveying and put some couple huts up or something. I don't really know what they ended up doing there as a final result of the project. I just knew that I was getting kind of worried that I wouldn't be ready for school. So I just, and my, my, uh, what do you call? I want to say jefe because that's the head of our education department. She really wanted us to go do that. She didn't really care for us being out in the jungle so."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "She was happy to see you come back."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:287", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.908240074739283, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I always questioned that part. You know, that's, it's the Caribbean, but it's not just gentle seas. I mean, there's storms and everything there and there's sandbars and reefs and stuff. So a big ship can't get into shore. But I never could figure out why they just didn't fly it in and. But anyway, it didn't, doesn't matter, because I didn't stay. And the guys that went had a great time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I bet."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They got some kind of, they did some surveying and put some couple huts up or something. I don't really know what they ended up doing there as a final result of the project. I just knew that I was getting kind of worried that I wouldn't be ready for school. So I just, and my, my, uh, what do you call? I want to say jefe because that's the head of our education department. She really wanted us to go do that. She didn't really care for us being out in the jungle so."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "She was happy to see you come back."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, she was happy to see us come back and get started."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So up there in the jungle there, La Mosquitia?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:289", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.6758223052658705, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They got some kind of, they did some surveying and put some couple huts up or something. I don't really know what they ended up doing there as a final result of the project. I just knew that I was getting kind of worried that I wouldn't be ready for school. So I just, and my, my, uh, what do you call? I want to say jefe because that's the head of our education department. She really wanted us to go do that. She didn't really care for us being out in the jungle so."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "She was happy to see you come back."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, she was happy to see us come back and get started."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So up there in the jungle there, La Mosquitia?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Um, what? Describe the people who live out there."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:293", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 9.476323833661569, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Um, what? Describe the people who live out there."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, boy."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Are they?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Garifuna."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Garifuna. So they're African in origin?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:295", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 10.52924870406841, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, boy."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Are they?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Garifuna."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Garifuna. So they're African in origin?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Going back centuries."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:297", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 10.588054115631566, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Garifuna."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Garifuna. So they're African in origin?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Going back centuries."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Many Garifuna live there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Speaking some kind of English?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:309", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 8.684810008319955, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Instead of somebody from the outside settling in like Garifunas did. So yeah. There is a difference. And where, back then, where we were, there really weren't any Garifuna. They were all Miskitos. Nowadays on the north coast, the Garifunas have expanded from Trujillo towards the, towards La Mosquitia and have, you know, they're settled. They've got towns there now where they didn't used to have, just because like every place else, everything's growing."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I believe that the people we worked with and spent our time with there were Miskito Indians."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Their language was never written down. There was a compound there with some people who were doing religious work and nursing medical work combination. They, I believe they were from Canada and one of the guys had sat down and made a Miskito dictionary by hand."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And that was the first orthography they ever had of that language?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:319", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 8.900760399532512, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So that was pretty neat."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um. And so I still have the notebook from that day. And so I've got like a page of Spanish words and Miskito words. Definitions and Miskito words with Spanish definitions."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How interesting."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Even though this was a very short time you were there."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:321", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 9.889733777258346, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um. And so I still have the notebook from that day. And so I've got like a page of Spanish words and Miskito words. Definitions and Miskito words with Spanish definitions."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How interesting."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Even though this was a very short time you were there."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It opened your eyes to an aspect of Honduras you wouldn't have seen."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:323", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 8.766370863620384, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Even though this was a very short time you were there."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It opened your eyes to an aspect of Honduras you wouldn't have seen."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Yeah. Like I said, just like out of a National Geographic movie. They just discovered the White City there. It was, it was. It was a legend when I was there, but I think about a year ago they discover, somebody discovered it, and who knows what they'll find there. It's an archeological type site, you know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you had that experience and you left to enter what was going to be your real."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:325", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 8.629300959578206, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It opened your eyes to an aspect of Honduras you wouldn't have seen."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Yeah. Like I said, just like out of a National Geographic movie. They just discovered the White City there. It was, it was. It was a legend when I was there, but I think about a year ago they discover, somebody discovered it, and who knows what they'll find there. It's an archeological type site, you know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you had that experience and you left to enter what was going to be your real."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I went to Olanchito."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Olanchito. And where is Olanchito?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:327", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 7.365889955086896, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Yeah. Like I said, just like out of a National Geographic movie. They just discovered the White City there. It was, it was. It was a legend when I was there, but I think about a year ago they discover, somebody discovered it, and who knows what they'll find there. It's an archeological type site, you know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you had that experience and you left to enter what was going to be your real."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I went to Olanchito."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Olanchito. And where is Olanchito?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It's in the Aguan Valley and the Department of Yoro."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And I'm writing this down so that we can figure out how to spell these things. Where in Honduras is Olanchito?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:329", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 7.073211061207662, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I went to Olanchito."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Olanchito. And where is Olanchito?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It's in the Aguan Valley and the Department of Yoro."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And I'm writing this down so that we can figure out how to spell these things. Where in Honduras is Olanchito?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Olanchito would be, well, La Ceiba is on the north coast and it is towards the. I believe it's towards the eastern. See, east and west befuddle me there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Because Central America swings."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:333", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 6.263223532355138, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Olanchito would be, well, La Ceiba is on the north coast and it is towards the. I believe it's towards the eastern. See, east and west befuddle me there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Because Central America swings."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So if you would say that like Amapala is more southwestern than I would say that La Ceiba would be northeastern. And it's 60 kilometers south of La Ceiba. It was a city of about 30,000 when I worked there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Olanchito?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Olanchito about 30,000 population in '78 and now it's over 300,000."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh my goodness. Ten times bigger."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:335", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.848026147061264, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So if you would say that like Amapala is more southwestern than I would say that La Ceiba would be northeastern. And it's 60 kilometers south of La Ceiba. It was a city of about 30,000 when I worked there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Olanchito?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Olanchito about 30,000 population in '78 and now it's over 300,000."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh my goodness. Ten times bigger."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. It's in the Aguan Valley where Standard Fruit has its banana farms. So a lot of people who live in Olanchito also work in the banana farms."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And it's a town that, with 30,000 people, had a secondary school."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:337", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.497806830068071, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Olanchito about 30,000 population in '78 and now it's over 300,000."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh my goodness. Ten times bigger."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. It's in the Aguan Valley where Standard Fruit has its banana farms. So a lot of people who live in Olanchito also work in the banana farms."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And it's a town that, with 30,000 people, had a secondary school."}, {"role": "user", "content": "One. Now there's several. Oh, now there's one, but there's a couple of universities there now."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But at the time you were there, that secondary school might have been."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:339", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 7.219785366742301, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. It's in the Aguan Valley where Standard Fruit has its banana farms. So a lot of people who live in Olanchito also work in the banana farms."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And it's a town that, with 30,000 people, had a secondary school."}, {"role": "user", "content": "One. Now there's several. Oh, now there's one, but there's a couple of universities there now."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But at the time you were there, that secondary school might have been."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No universities, it was the only one. It was built by, with AID funds. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So let's talk about your personal life in Olanchito, where you lived. Did you live with a family as you did in training?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:341", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 4.688650407491446, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "One. Now there's several. Oh, now there's one, but there's a couple of universities there now."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But at the time you were there, that secondary school might have been."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No universities, it was the only one. It was built by, with AID funds. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So let's talk about your personal life in Olanchito, where you lived. Did you live with a family as you did in training?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I lived with, uh, I lived with a volunteer for a few months. And then she was, she wanted to work in a different town up the road called Tocoa. Wasn't too far away then, it was probably an hour away, and now it's about 20 minutes away because there's a paved road there now."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Oh, so there was not a paved road going into Olanchito?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:345", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.442778280853637, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I lived with, uh, I lived with a volunteer for a few months. And then she was, she wanted to work in a different town up the road called Tocoa. Wasn't too far away then, it was probably an hour away, and now it's about 20 minutes away because there's a paved road there now."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Oh, so there was not a paved road going into Olanchito?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. No, in fact, we had to go on La Culebra over the mountains and it was named La Culebra after, that's the word for snake."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Snake."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Because it was a two track road snaking through the mountains, very steep. So to go 60 kilometers took about four, four and a half hours."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It's a dirt road. So when it rains it would be."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:351", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 4.722603951788253, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, it was a treacherous road, yeah, definitely. We would go in small pickup trucks and we'd be standing room only in the back. And there they would go. If we got to a river, they had to take the fan belt off the engine, put the exhaust on the manifold and try to make it across."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Wow."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So that was pretty amazing. It was a great trip if you're the explorer or adventure type, but it was also dangerous at the same time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So getting there on your very, when you first arrived in Olanchito."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:353", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 4.136226613098058, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So that was pretty amazing. It was a great trip if you're the explorer or adventure type, but it was also dangerous at the same time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So getting there on your very, when you first arrived in Olanchito."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Took a flight from Tegucigalpa to Coyoles, which was where the airstrip was. And then from there, taxi to Olanchito."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And were you alone in that taxi going to Olanchito, or did somebody from the school or Peace Corps accompany?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:355", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 3.484696236775621, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So that was pretty amazing. It was a great trip if you're the explorer or adventure type, but it was also dangerous at the same time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So getting there on your very, when you first arrived in Olanchito."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Took a flight from Tegucigalpa to Coyoles, which was where the airstrip was. And then from there, taxi to Olanchito."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And were you alone in that taxi going to Olanchito, or did somebody from the school or Peace Corps accompany?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I think there were other people in it because to go to Olanchito from Coyoles was probably about, you know, five or ten miles. So they wouldn't just go for one person, they'd fill the taxi. Or there might even have been a pickup truck, I don't recall. But it was ground transportation for that a little bit."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But Coyoles was big enough to have an airport?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:357", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.7607735964173563, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Took a flight from Tegucigalpa to Coyoles, which was where the airstrip was. And then from there, taxi to Olanchito."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And were you alone in that taxi going to Olanchito, or did somebody from the school or Peace Corps accompany?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I think there were other people in it because to go to Olanchito from Coyoles was probably about, you know, five or ten miles. So they wouldn't just go for one person, they'd fill the taxi. Or there might even have been a pickup truck, I don't recall. But it was ground transportation for that a little bit."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But Coyoles was big enough to have an airport?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Coyoles was very small, but it's right where Standard Fruit had built their airport."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Therefore the airport. Yeah."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:359", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 3.067526218241507, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I think there were other people in it because to go to Olanchito from Coyoles was probably about, you know, five or ten miles. So they wouldn't just go for one person, they'd fill the taxi. Or there might even have been a pickup truck, I don't recall. But it was ground transportation for that a little bit."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But Coyoles was big enough to have an airport?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Coyoles was very small, but it's right where Standard Fruit had built their airport."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Therefore the airport. Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And now it doesn't exist and they don't have an airport in, in Olanchito. But there's talk of building one again."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh, uh huh. So you get there and how did you find a place? Oh, was there already a volunteer there? You said that you."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:361", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.2972513536016743, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Coyoles was very small, but it's right where Standard Fruit had built their airport."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Therefore the airport. Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And now it doesn't exist and they don't have an airport in, in Olanchito. But there's talk of building one again."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh, uh huh. So you get there and how did you find a place? Oh, was there already a volunteer there? You said that you."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Barbara was there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Barbara was already there. So there was a house identified as the Peace Corps house, I guess."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:365", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.725001671113178, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Barbara was there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Barbara was already there. So there was a house identified as the Peace Corps house, I guess."}, {"role": "user", "content": "She was living with a family."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So it wasn't identified as a Peace Corps house. It was the gringo that lived with the family, I guess. Um, no. It was, I know what you mean. In the bigger cities, there's usually a house that kind of, you know, just like college. You know, people keep using it, new groups keep using the same place. But no, Olanchito didn't have that many volunteers. I think Barbara was like the third. I might have been the fourth or fifth."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And while you were there, there was just the two of you."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:367", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.9166685234590866, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "She was living with a family."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So it wasn't identified as a Peace Corps house. It was the gringo that lived with the family, I guess. Um, no. It was, I know what you mean. In the bigger cities, there's usually a house that kind of, you know, just like college. You know, people keep using it, new groups keep using the same place. But no, Olanchito didn't have that many volunteers. I think Barbara was like the third. I might have been the fourth or fifth."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And while you were there, there was just the two of you."}, {"role": "user", "content": "For a few months. She was a nurse. I was a teacher."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you lived with her for a while and then?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:369", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 2.1296316927323184, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So it wasn't identified as a Peace Corps house. It was the gringo that lived with the family, I guess. Um, no. It was, I know what you mean. In the bigger cities, there's usually a house that kind of, you know, just like college. You know, people keep using it, new groups keep using the same place. But no, Olanchito didn't have that many volunteers. I think Barbara was like the third. I might have been the fourth or fifth."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And while you were there, there was just the two of you."}, {"role": "user", "content": "For a few months. She was a nurse. I was a teacher."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you lived with her for a while and then?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Her, the family she was staying with had an extra room in back. And since I didn't have any place to stay, the wife of the family, the mom of the family, well, they didn't have kids. They were just two, young couple. So the lady, she invited me to stay in the back room, and so I paid her rent. And then Barbara had her bedroom up in front and, yeah, we stayed together in that house."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah, yeah. Did you eat?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:371", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.2551463252581314, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "For a few months. She was a nurse. I was a teacher."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you lived with her for a while and then?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Her, the family she was staying with had an extra room in back. And since I didn't have any place to stay, the wife of the family, the mom of the family, well, they didn't have kids. They were just two, young couple. So the lady, she invited me to stay in the back room, and so I paid her rent. And then Barbara had her bedroom up in front and, yeah, we stayed together in that house."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah, yeah. Did you eat?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "But that didn't last very long because Barbara and I found a place, a house that was big enough and had enough bedrooms and stuff so that we could share it. And so we shared that house for I don't remember how long. It wasn't real long though, three or four months. She wanted to move because at her place where she worked, the health building, her counterpart and she, um. Barbara was really trying, but her counterpart was not giving her enough. I don't know what you want to call it. Enough sympathy, I guess, because Barbara, of course, like most of us, came out of the language training with a basic knowledge of Spanish but, and most of the people there would be patient with that. But she found that her counterpart really wasn't patient enough. And after a while, Barbara decided to try a different place."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "A different workplace?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:373", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.3946070280645904, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Her, the family she was staying with had an extra room in back. And since I didn't have any place to stay, the wife of the family, the mom of the family, well, they didn't have kids. They were just two, young couple. So the lady, she invited me to stay in the back room, and so I paid her rent. And then Barbara had her bedroom up in front and, yeah, we stayed together in that house."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah, yeah. Did you eat?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "But that didn't last very long because Barbara and I found a place, a house that was big enough and had enough bedrooms and stuff so that we could share it. And so we shared that house for I don't remember how long. It wasn't real long though, three or four months. She wanted to move because at her place where she worked, the health building, her counterpart and she, um. Barbara was really trying, but her counterpart was not giving her enough. I don't know what you want to call it. Enough sympathy, I guess, because Barbara, of course, like most of us, came out of the language training with a basic knowledge of Spanish but, and most of the people there would be patient with that. But she found that her counterpart really wasn't patient enough. And after a while, Barbara decided to try a different place."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "A different workplace?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. In a different town?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:375", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.5495633645162115, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But that didn't last very long because Barbara and I found a place, a house that was big enough and had enough bedrooms and stuff so that we could share it. And so we shared that house for I don't remember how long. It wasn't real long though, three or four months. She wanted to move because at her place where she worked, the health building, her counterpart and she, um. Barbara was really trying, but her counterpart was not giving her enough. I don't know what you want to call it. Enough sympathy, I guess, because Barbara, of course, like most of us, came out of the language training with a basic knowledge of Spanish but, and most of the people there would be patient with that. But she found that her counterpart really wasn't patient enough. And after a while, Barbara decided to try a different place."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "A different workplace?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. In a different town?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Yeah. But I don't even know if I should be telling that story, because that's not my story."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay, so let's hear."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:379", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.9130411907607547, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Yeah. But I don't even know if I should be telling that story, because that's not my story."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay, so let's hear."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's the story of Barbara."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "You asked me a few times, you know, how many times, how long we lived together and all that and why she left. So I explain, that's the only way I can explain it is to tell her story, and I'm not really sure that she would want me to have this on there. So I don't have her permission to tell it, but to explain to you that's what happened. So after that, I found a house to rent, a small one room, one bathroom house to rent, and I stayed there the rest of my time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you had to do your own shopping, your own cooking?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:381", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.1256013230675053, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's the story of Barbara."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "You asked me a few times, you know, how many times, how long we lived together and all that and why she left. So I explain, that's the only way I can explain it is to tell her story, and I'm not really sure that she would want me to have this on there. So I don't have her permission to tell it, but to explain to you that's what happened. So after that, I found a house to rent, a small one room, one bathroom house to rent, and I stayed there the rest of my time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you had to do your own shopping, your own cooking?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And was that okay with you?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:383", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.3617792478527835, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "You asked me a few times, you know, how many times, how long we lived together and all that and why she left. So I explain, that's the only way I can explain it is to tell her story, and I'm not really sure that she would want me to have this on there. So I don't have her permission to tell it, but to explain to you that's what happened. So after that, I found a house to rent, a small one room, one bathroom house to rent, and I stayed there the rest of my time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you had to do your own shopping, your own cooking?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And was that okay with you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Having to do all that? Had you cooked for yourself before?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:385", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 2.6241991642808706, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And was that okay with you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Having to do all that? Had you cooked for yourself before?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh yeah. I'd camped. My mom taught me how to cook because I was always in the kitchen and finally she said she might as well put me to work. So I learned to cook from my mom and I'm an outdoor person. So we did a lot of camping. Yeah, cooking. And I was in college living on my own too, so cooking was never a problem for me."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. And when you went to shop for food, describe the market situation in Olanchito. Where would you buy?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:387", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.8046657380898559, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Having to do all that? Had you cooked for yourself before?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh yeah. I'd camped. My mom taught me how to cook because I was always in the kitchen and finally she said she might as well put me to work. So I learned to cook from my mom and I'm an outdoor person. So we did a lot of camping. Yeah, cooking. And I was in college living on my own too, so cooking was never a problem for me."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. And when you went to shop for food, describe the market situation in Olanchito. Where would you buy?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, basically you have a market and you go to the market, buy what you need. If you want fresh meat, at that time, you had to get up early on a certain day when they butchered it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. There was one day a week they would be butchering."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:391", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.2279823927035256, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, basically you have a market and you go to the market, buy what you need. If you want fresh meat, at that time, you had to get up early on a certain day when they butchered it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. There was one day a week they would be butchering."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Something like that. I, I didn't, I really didn't buy a lot of fresh meat because they had some stores there with the refrigeration and freezers and they had frozen chickens. And so I usually went for frozen chickens if I wanted meat."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Or I went and bought something at a restaurant or a tienda that had maybe ground meat in it. I ate a lot of meals at a family's house where I would pay them and other people ate there too. Not just me. There were other people who passed that way on their way to work or whatever would stop in and eat there too. There were some places like that where a family would just open up their house to people who needed breakfast and lunch and dinner. And so that's where I ate most of my meals. So really my shopping, I didn't shop very much at all. By the time you buy all that stuff and you don't have a place to store it properly, it's more of a headache than it was just to do it this way."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Sure. So in your little, very small apartment, did you have electricity?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:393", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.4755359918928064, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Something like that. I, I didn't, I really didn't buy a lot of fresh meat because they had some stores there with the refrigeration and freezers and they had frozen chickens. And so I usually went for frozen chickens if I wanted meat."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Or I went and bought something at a restaurant or a tienda that had maybe ground meat in it. I ate a lot of meals at a family's house where I would pay them and other people ate there too. Not just me. There were other people who passed that way on their way to work or whatever would stop in and eat there too. There were some places like that where a family would just open up their house to people who needed breakfast and lunch and dinner. And so that's where I ate most of my meals. So really my shopping, I didn't shop very much at all. By the time you buy all that stuff and you don't have a place to store it properly, it's more of a headache than it was just to do it this way."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Sure. So in your little, very small apartment, did you have electricity?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was a house. It had electricity. It had a bedroom, a living room, and a bathroom shower."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Ah, running water."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:395", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.7505955465475624, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Or I went and bought something at a restaurant or a tienda that had maybe ground meat in it. I ate a lot of meals at a family's house where I would pay them and other people ate there too. Not just me. There were other people who passed that way on their way to work or whatever would stop in and eat there too. There were some places like that where a family would just open up their house to people who needed breakfast and lunch and dinner. And so that's where I ate most of my meals. So really my shopping, I didn't shop very much at all. By the time you buy all that stuff and you don't have a place to store it properly, it's more of a headache than it was just to do it this way."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Sure. So in your little, very small apartment, did you have electricity?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was a house. It had electricity. It had a bedroom, a living room, and a bathroom shower."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Ah, running water."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Oh, that's, that's quite comfy."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:397", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.056217273941736, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was a house. It had electricity. It had a bedroom, a living room, and a bathroom shower."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Ah, running water."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Oh, that's, that's quite comfy."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It had a little screen porch on the back."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Very nice. Yeah, yeah, yeah."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:399", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.3957969710463733, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Oh, that's, that's quite comfy."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It had a little screen porch on the back."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Very nice. Yeah, yeah, yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was very nice."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And there weren't other Peace Corps volunteers in the area."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:401", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 3.7731077456070814, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It had a little screen porch on the back."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Very nice. Yeah, yeah, yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was very nice."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And there weren't other Peace Corps volunteers in the area."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not when I was there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Not, not while you were there."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:403", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.0812308284523127, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was very nice."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And there weren't other Peace Corps volunteers in the area."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not when I was there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Not, not while you were there."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Towards the end, another one came. Lawrence is his name. He came towards the end of my stay. He taught science in the."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "In the same school?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:405", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.4235898093914585, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not when I was there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Not, not while you were there."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Towards the end, another one came. Lawrence is his name. He came towards the end of my stay. He taught science in the."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "In the same school?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, in the same school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So for most of the time that you were there, if you needed to socialize with people and hang out with people, you were hanging out with Hondurans."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:407", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.8039886771016205, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Towards the end, another one came. Lawrence is his name. He came towards the end of my stay. He taught science in the."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "In the same school?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, in the same school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So for most of the time that you were there, if you needed to socialize with people and hang out with people, you were hanging out with Hondurans."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you were, and it was all happening in Spanish."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:409", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.226654085668467, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, in the same school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So for most of the time that you were there, if you needed to socialize with people and hang out with people, you were hanging out with Hondurans."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you were, and it was all happening in Spanish."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. How was that for you in the beginning? Um, like everybody else there who didn't grow up speaking Spanish, your Spanish was basic."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:411", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.696282317409407, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you were, and it was all happening in Spanish."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. How was that for you in the beginning? Um, like everybody else there who didn't grow up speaking Spanish, your Spanish was basic."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "In the beginning."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:413", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 5.21809146378823, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. How was that for you in the beginning? Um, like everybody else there who didn't grow up speaking Spanish, your Spanish was basic."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "In the beginning."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, Barbara and I knew English. She introduced me to a man that had, uh, a businessman who knew English and another businessman who knew English. And I met a guy my age who knew English. But outside of those five people, I don't recall anybody else, speaking English with anyone else."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Yeah. Let's go to work. You, then you settle in your little house, and then you go to the secondary school. What was the name of the school?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:415", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 4.686768293098034, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "In the beginning."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, Barbara and I knew English. She introduced me to a man that had, uh, a businessman who knew English and another businessman who knew English. And I met a guy my age who knew English. But outside of those five people, I don't recall anybody else, speaking English with anyone else."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Yeah. Let's go to work. You, then you settle in your little house, and then you go to the secondary school. What was the name of the school?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Francisco Mejia."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. And who was it, is that some person?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:417", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.9852981034422594, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, Barbara and I knew English. She introduced me to a man that had, uh, a businessman who knew English and another businessman who knew English. And I met a guy my age who knew English. But outside of those five people, I don't recall anybody else, speaking English with anyone else."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Yeah. Let's go to work. You, then you settle in your little house, and then you go to the secondary school. What was the name of the school?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Francisco Mejia."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. And who was it, is that some person?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't remember. You know, when we went back there, I took a. Last month I took a picture of his bust at the school. There was no descriptive plaque or anything, and Martine told me, but I forgot! It's not important I guess."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I guess not. What was the school? The school you were saying had been built with USAID funds."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:419", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.3169978927136214, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Francisco Mejia."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. And who was it, is that some person?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't remember. You know, when we went back there, I took a. Last month I took a picture of his bust at the school. There was no descriptive plaque or anything, and Martine told me, but I forgot! It's not important I guess."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I guess not. What was the school? The school you were saying had been built with USAID funds."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And equipped, the industrial arts area."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:423", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.09505912680694, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And equipped, the industrial arts area."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Those three areas."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Industrial arts, science, and home ec."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah, yeah. How many students? How big was the school?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:429", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.61736505734834, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, gosh. It was big. How many students I couldn't even guess. I see, I saw up to 50 in the shop."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Wow."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But not all day long."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I never really. There was a lot of kids."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You had 50 at a time?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:435", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 5.483353988132153, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It just was a full shop."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Next hour would come, it wouldn't be that full. And then the next hour would come, it would be fuller. I had a, I didn't count on it. I have no idea."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. How many, how many classes a day?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:437", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.8703933201468366, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It just was a full shop."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Next hour would come, it wouldn't be that full. And then the next hour would come, it would be fuller. I had a, I didn't count on it. I have no idea."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. How many, how many classes a day?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "There were morning and afternoon classes I would get. I don't recall, but I'm guessing there were probably 6 to 8. I'm guessing. I don't recall."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's a really full day."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:449", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.441949943920089, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Every morning when I woke up, I thought, I'm going to help my counterpart. I'm going to help my, that's my job."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And so that's what I did. And all that other stuff to do with teaching and all this, you know, all the things a teacher does up here that doesn't have to do with teaching, or maybe is for preparation for teaching for the next day or the next week or whatever. He did all that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Ah, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I was just there to help."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Yeah. Well, that sounds pretty ideal. You weren't alone with the kids. You didn't have to worry about discipline."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:451", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 3.8243888265778767, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And so that's what I did. And all that other stuff to do with teaching and all this, you know, all the things a teacher does up here that doesn't have to do with teaching, or maybe is for preparation for teaching for the next day or the next week or whatever. He did all that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Ah, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I was just there to help."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Yeah. Well, that sounds pretty ideal. You weren't alone with the kids. You didn't have to worry about discipline."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, no, they wouldn't do that because Peace Corps wants you to work with the with a counterpart. They would never put you alone there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Yeah. What kind of projects?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:455", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 3.486899785898613, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, no, they wouldn't do that because Peace Corps wants you to work with the with a counterpart. They would never put you alone there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Yeah. What kind of projects?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I, he did the woodworking projects. I taught them a couple of metal working projects because metals wasn't his thing. He was a, he's a, he's an artist actually. I call him an artist. I don't know if he is an artist, but he would make those carved doors, the doors for somebody's home with relief figures. The Mayan relief figures. I don't know. I don't see them around anymore. But back then they were popular. They were popular in the United States too then. And so that was his thing. So he would teach the woodworking. And he's still doing wood carving today."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Huh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What's his name?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:457", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.7632219843317922, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I, he did the woodworking projects. I taught them a couple of metal working projects because metals wasn't his thing. He was a, he's a, he's an artist actually. I call him an artist. I don't know if he is an artist, but he would make those carved doors, the doors for somebody's home with relief figures. The Mayan relief figures. I don't know. I don't see them around anymore. But back then they were popular. They were popular in the United States too then. And so that was his thing. So he would teach the woodworking. And he's still doing wood carving today."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Huh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What's his name?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Israel."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. And you would work with metals."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:459", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 3.070246649257547, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What's his name?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Israel."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. And you would work with metals."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. The sheet metal. We made a dustpan and some funnels and stuff like that. So they would learn how to work with sheet metal and sheet metal tools. And let's see, what else did I have them do? Oh, leather working. We made belts."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And this is stuff you had learned about up here in Wisconsin in that earliest part of your training? Sheet metal, leather."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:461", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.3002740547306075, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Israel."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. And you would work with metals."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. The sheet metal. We made a dustpan and some funnels and stuff like that. So they would learn how to work with sheet metal and sheet metal tools. And let's see, what else did I have them do? Oh, leather working. We made belts."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And this is stuff you had learned about up here in Wisconsin in that earliest part of your training? Sheet metal, leather."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Basically, we knew how to. Basically, yeah, we did do projects at Stout but their main emphasis was how to be a teacher."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. Okay. Yeah."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:465", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.8398445120130957, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Basically, we knew how to. Basically, yeah, we did do projects at Stout but their main emphasis was how to be a teacher."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. Okay. Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Training us to be teachers. We already had the carpentry and metal skills, you know. We, we, they would review them with us in the shop and teach us new things. But basically they were more concerned that we knew how to teach as a teacher would instead of somebody who's a carpenter coming in and doesn't have any idea about teaching methods."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "What a teacher does, but can teach, can show somebody how to build a house, you know, or show somebody how to build a cabinet, but they don't know the other part."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you find that useful when you were there in the classroom in your school in Olanchito? Did you find that the training you had been given in Wisconsin up here for teacher training, that that was useful? Were you able to actually use any of that training?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:469", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.505980879028513, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "What a teacher does, but can teach, can show somebody how to build a house, you know, or show somebody how to build a cabinet, but they don't know the other part."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you find that useful when you were there in the classroom in your school in Olanchito? Did you find that the training you had been given in Wisconsin up here for teacher training, that that was useful? Were you able to actually use any of that training?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, it was very useful. None of us were teachers."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So only one was a teacher. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Oh, well good."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:471", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.8955343100316813, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, it was very useful. None of us were teachers."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So only one was a teacher. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Oh, well good."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So it was very useful for us. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'm wondering why, why do you think U.S.? Why do you think USAID put all that effort into building these schools?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:473", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.328371455590757, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So only one was a teacher. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Oh, well good."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So it was very useful for us. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'm wondering why, why do you think U.S.? Why do you think USAID put all that effort into building these schools?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I don't know. It happened before. I mean, the school was not brand, brand new. It had happened in the past. I don't know when and I don't know why."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But Standard Oil had their."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:475", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 4.809301617323063, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So it was very useful for us. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'm wondering why, why do you think U.S.? Why do you think USAID put all that effort into building these schools?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I don't know. It happened before. I mean, the school was not brand, brand new. It had happened in the past. I don't know when and I don't know why."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But Standard Oil had their."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Standard Fruit."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Standard Fruit, rather, and they had a big, they grew bananas around there."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:477", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.232557352581182, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I don't know. It happened before. I mean, the school was not brand, brand new. It had happened in the past. I don't know when and I don't know why."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But Standard Oil had their."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Standard Fruit."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Standard Fruit, rather, and they had a big, they grew bananas around there."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's a cautionary phrase, too, because it's changed hands so many times, those corporations. So if it was Standard Fruit then, it could be Dole now, it could be, I don't know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But probably an American corporation."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:479", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.7028415028679795, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Standard Fruit."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Standard Fruit, rather, and they had a big, they grew bananas around there."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's a cautionary phrase, too, because it's changed hands so many times, those corporations. So if it was Standard Fruit then, it could be Dole now, it could be, I don't know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But probably an American corporation."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't know. There's a lot of international investment in what they call developing nations now, and not just the U.S."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. It can get complicated."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:481", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.225379447631088, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's a cautionary phrase, too, because it's changed hands so many times, those corporations. So if it was Standard Fruit then, it could be Dole now, it could be, I don't know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But probably an American corporation."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't know. There's a lot of international investment in what they call developing nations now, and not just the U.S."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. It can get complicated."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I imagine so. Yeah. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you, it's. I'm picking up that this was pretty satisfying, that you had a good relationship with the kids. It was, you enjoyed. You're smiling."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:483", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.805977164034542, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't know. There's a lot of international investment in what they call developing nations now, and not just the U.S."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. It can get complicated."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I imagine so. Yeah. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you, it's. I'm picking up that this was pretty satisfying, that you had a good relationship with the kids. It was, you enjoyed. You're smiling."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I enjoyed my work. Definitely. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. And then at the end of the school day, you'd come home."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:485", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.4510857378161575, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I imagine so. Yeah. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you, it's. I'm picking up that this was pretty satisfying, that you had a good relationship with the kids. It was, you enjoyed. You're smiling."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I enjoyed my work. Definitely. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. And then at the end of the school day, you'd come home."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Um, how did you fill your after school hours?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:487", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.167873042017953, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I enjoyed my work. Definitely. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. And then at the end of the school day, you'd come home."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Um, how did you fill your after school hours?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I would stop by at my friend's house and we'd talk about what happened in town that day. Or he'd, he really likes to read the newspapers. He reads three or four of them a day."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Now, is this an American friend or a Honduran?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:491", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 8.849225977799941, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I would stop by at my friend's house and we'd talk about what happened in town that day. Or he'd, he really likes to read the newspapers. He reads three or four of them a day."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Now, is this an American friend or a Honduran?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "He is Honduran."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I'd stop by his house and his wife would be there and his two children would be there, and we would visit. And sometimes he would invite me for supper and sometimes I would go to the comedor for supper."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. Uh huh. Sounds very friendly."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:493", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 9.8324733086666, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "He is Honduran."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I'd stop by his house and his wife would be there and his two children would be there, and we would visit. And sometimes he would invite me for supper and sometimes I would go to the comedor for supper."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. Uh huh. Sounds very friendly."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was very friendly, yes. And those are the same people I went back to visit."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "To visit. You're still in touch."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:495", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 10.924970342962888, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I'd stop by his house and his wife would be there and his two children would be there, and we would visit. And sometimes he would invite me for supper and sometimes I would go to the comedor for supper."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. Uh huh. Sounds very friendly."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was very friendly, yes. And those are the same people I went back to visit."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "To visit. You're still in touch."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "After all those years."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:499", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 13.48761770736159, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "After all those years."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yeah. We kept in touch. We were very good friends."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Terrific."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'd like to talk more about your current connections with Honduras, but let's, let's finish up talking about when you were there as a Peace Corps volunteer."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:501", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 14.986241897068433, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yeah. We kept in touch. We were very good friends."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Terrific."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'd like to talk more about your current connections with Honduras, but let's, let's finish up talking about when you were there as a Peace Corps volunteer."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Sure."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were you expected then to have other volunteer projects outside of your main teaching job?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:505", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 9.242273946998065, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Sure."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were you expected then to have other volunteer projects outside of your main teaching job?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "We were not expected to, but I fell into one. There was a volunteer man and woman that were on that La Culebra road in a little town called Las Flores Este. But they were not assigned there for two years. They were just there to help build a three room schoolhouse. So they, uh, I went and helped them and there's where we did the mix, mixing of concrete by hand."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, boy."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And all the, all the hard labor work to build the schoolhouse. But the village men and women pitched in. So Carlos and Vicky basically had the job of coordinating the village to build this school, and it was done through the partnership program, a school in the United States. They would have fundraisers and stuff and they'd send the money to Las Flores Estes, go to Peace Corps, to that that department of Peace Corps that was doing those things. And that would be that, it was called School Partnership back then. And I don't even know if they do it anymore. But then, and then. So what the school in the States got was pictures and stuff of the progress of this building of the school sent to them. And then Vicky would write up, you know, Honduran cultural whatever things."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, it's very nice."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:507", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 8.046971052220073, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We were not expected to, but I fell into one. There was a volunteer man and woman that were on that La Culebra road in a little town called Las Flores Este. But they were not assigned there for two years. They were just there to help build a three room schoolhouse. So they, uh, I went and helped them and there's where we did the mix, mixing of concrete by hand."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, boy."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And all the, all the hard labor work to build the schoolhouse. But the village men and women pitched in. So Carlos and Vicky basically had the job of coordinating the village to build this school, and it was done through the partnership program, a school in the United States. They would have fundraisers and stuff and they'd send the money to Las Flores Estes, go to Peace Corps, to that that department of Peace Corps that was doing those things. And that would be that, it was called School Partnership back then. And I don't even know if they do it anymore. But then, and then. So what the school in the States got was pictures and stuff of the progress of this building of the school sent to them. And then Vicky would write up, you know, Honduran cultural whatever things."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, it's very nice."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So that was the exchange. The Las Flores would get the money and have the school and well and then the school in the States would learn about the culture. And they built a school and got it done and it didn't take that long, probably took three or four months, and then they went off to wherever their assignments were. And so I helped them a little bit. On weekends, I would go up there and help."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you stay pretty healthy for the whole two years?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:509", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.8299678358000815, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And all the, all the hard labor work to build the schoolhouse. But the village men and women pitched in. So Carlos and Vicky basically had the job of coordinating the village to build this school, and it was done through the partnership program, a school in the United States. They would have fundraisers and stuff and they'd send the money to Las Flores Estes, go to Peace Corps, to that that department of Peace Corps that was doing those things. And that would be that, it was called School Partnership back then. And I don't even know if they do it anymore. But then, and then. So what the school in the States got was pictures and stuff of the progress of this building of the school sent to them. And then Vicky would write up, you know, Honduran cultural whatever things."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, it's very nice."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So that was the exchange. The Las Flores would get the money and have the school and well and then the school in the States would learn about the culture. And they built a school and got it done and it didn't take that long, probably took three or four months, and then they went off to wherever their assignments were. And so I helped them a little bit. On weekends, I would go up there and help."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you stay pretty healthy for the whole two years?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I think so. I was probably in the best physical condition I've been in in many years. You don't, I don't know about building muscle and all that stuff, but I felt healthy. I went in overweight and I came back right in my normal weight height ratio. But that was because I think we ate so much protein and little starch. So I don't know really. Hot weather, walked everywhere. Meals were just not big meals like we have here. Yeah. So all that stuff combined."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Yeah. Sounds good."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:511", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 8.69996426200009, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So that was the exchange. The Las Flores would get the money and have the school and well and then the school in the States would learn about the culture. And they built a school and got it done and it didn't take that long, probably took three or four months, and then they went off to wherever their assignments were. And so I helped them a little bit. On weekends, I would go up there and help."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you stay pretty healthy for the whole two years?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I think so. I was probably in the best physical condition I've been in in many years. You don't, I don't know about building muscle and all that stuff, but I felt healthy. I went in overweight and I came back right in my normal weight height ratio. But that was because I think we ate so much protein and little starch. So I don't know really. Hot weather, walked everywhere. Meals were just not big meals like we have here. Yeah. So all that stuff combined."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Yeah. Sounds good."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You, uh, eventually there was a school holiday somewhere in that two years."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:517", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 10.69953945404676, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Semana Santa, for sure."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Holy Week."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Christmas."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, there's holidays. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What did you do when there was a, when you had a week off?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:519", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 11.888377171163068, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Christmas."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, there's holidays. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What did you do when there was a, when you had a week off?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I would celebrate with my friends in Olanchito."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You stayed there?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:523", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 14.677008853287736, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I would celebrate with my friends in Olanchito."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You stayed there?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, if it was Semana Santa, yeah. Celebrate with them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I never really took any vacations to anyplace exotic."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You didn't ever leave Honduras?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:525", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 11.863343170319707, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, if it was Semana Santa, yeah. Celebrate with them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I never really took any vacations to anyplace exotic."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You didn't ever leave Honduras?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I went to Utila, which is an island off the north coast of Honduras, which is part of Honduras, for a few days, because I'd never been to a tropical island before. But other than that, I didn't. Oh, I went to Guatemala one, one week to visit my friends. That was the first, the second Christmas I was there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, these are the Wisconsin guys that?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:527", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 5, "return_to_go": 12.07038130035523, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I never really took any vacations to anyplace exotic."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You didn't ever leave Honduras?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I went to Utila, which is an island off the north coast of Honduras, which is part of Honduras, for a few days, because I'd never been to a tropical island before. But other than that, I didn't. Oh, I went to Guatemala one, one week to visit my friends. That was the first, the second Christmas I was there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, these are the Wisconsin guys that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I went to visit them. So I did leave the country for that. And Utila I didn't leave the country because that was part of it. So yeah. Mm hmm. So that was the two times I left. Otherwise, I stayed in town."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Is there anything else you'd like to talk about regarding the time that you were there as a Peace Corps volunteer? Are we leaving out anything?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:531", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 8.728865802907691, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I went to visit them. So I did leave the country for that. And Utila I didn't leave the country because that was part of it. So yeah. Mm hmm. So that was the two times I left. Otherwise, I stayed in town."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Is there anything else you'd like to talk about regarding the time that you were there as a Peace Corps volunteer? Are we leaving out anything?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I think one of the most significant things that happened there, at least the most significant thing was the military was in power. Policarpo Paz Garcia, the president at that time, was a general in the military. So when we went to La Mosquitia, for example, we would have to go to the Air Force Base and an Air Force pilot would fly us out there. So there weren't any commercial airlines. The military owned a lot of things in Honduras. So Policarpo, what's significant about him was, he's the last military president because the second year I was there, his term was up and they were, for the first time ever in the history of the nation, having general elections."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, boy."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was that like?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:533", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.365406447675213, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I think one of the most significant things that happened there, at least the most significant thing was the military was in power. Policarpo Paz Garcia, the president at that time, was a general in the military. So when we went to La Mosquitia, for example, we would have to go to the Air Force Base and an Air Force pilot would fly us out there. So there weren't any commercial airlines. The military owned a lot of things in Honduras. So Policarpo, what's significant about him was, he's the last military president because the second year I was there, his term was up and they were, for the first time ever in the history of the nation, having general elections."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, boy."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was that like?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "That was different. What I remember of it was people were very excited about it. Of course, sides were formed quickly and there was a lot of healthy and positive banter between the groups, you know, just like here, in the old days anyway. So I thought it was a very exciting time. An interesting thing that they did was if you voted for the Liberal Party, you would get a red paint, red fingernail paint on your little pinky. And if you voted for the National Party, you'd get blue."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, so there's no secrecy about where you stand."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:537", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.7474153675002615, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That was different. What I remember of it was people were very excited about it. Of course, sides were formed quickly and there was a lot of healthy and positive banter between the groups, you know, just like here, in the old days anyway. So I thought it was a very exciting time. An interesting thing that they did was if you voted for the Liberal Party, you would get a red paint, red fingernail paint on your little pinky. And if you voted for the National Party, you'd get blue."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, so there's no secrecy about where you stand."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I guess you went in, yeah, I guess when you went in there, you didn't, they weren't colored. But when you came out. I don't remember how it worked. I just remember my friends going, look, I got a pink one. I got a blue one."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And that doesn't happen anymore. It was for some kind of vote counting. Not vote counting, but they wanted to know. I don't remember. Honest, I don't. I'd have to ask my buddy again if he remembers. But that was exciting. I mean, the other thing that was really exciting was I think the U.S. played them in soccer for the World Cup."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh my goodness."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:539", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 7.497128186111402, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I guess you went in, yeah, I guess when you went in there, you didn't, they weren't colored. But when you came out. I don't remember how it worked. I just remember my friends going, look, I got a pink one. I got a blue one."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And that doesn't happen anymore. It was for some kind of vote counting. Not vote counting, but they wanted to know. I don't remember. Honest, I don't. I'd have to ask my buddy again if he remembers. But that was exciting. I mean, the other thing that was really exciting was I think the U.S. played them in soccer for the World Cup."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh my goodness."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And they lost."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And the game was there, in Honduras?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:541", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 7.219031317901558, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And that doesn't happen anymore. It was for some kind of vote counting. Not vote counting, but they wanted to know. I don't remember. Honest, I don't. I'd have to ask my buddy again if he remembers. But that was exciting. I mean, the other thing that was really exciting was I think the U.S. played them in soccer for the World Cup."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh my goodness."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And they lost."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And the game was there, in Honduras?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't know where it was, but Honduras lost. And I didn't go out that night."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I was going to say."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:543", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.910034797668398, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And they lost."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And the game was there, in Honduras?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't know where it was, but Honduras lost. And I didn't go out that night."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I was going to say."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, the guy down the street was kicking in his wagon wheel and. Yeah. So that was, that was different. That was pretty unique. They are, people in Latin America love soccer, just like we love football."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, that's right. It's the big thing. Yeah. Very emotional connections."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:545", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 7.677816441853775, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't know where it was, but Honduras lost. And I didn't go out that night."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I was going to say."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, the guy down the street was kicking in his wagon wheel and. Yeah. So that was, that was different. That was pretty unique. They are, people in Latin America love soccer, just like we love football."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, that's right. It's the big thing. Yeah. Very emotional connections."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "During those two years that you were up in Olanchito, did anybody from Peace Corps come up to visit you, see how you're doing?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:547", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.308684935393083, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, the guy down the street was kicking in his wagon wheel and. Yeah. So that was, that was different. That was pretty unique. They are, people in Latin America love soccer, just like we love football."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, that's right. It's the big thing. Yeah. Very emotional connections."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "During those two years that you were up in Olanchito, did anybody from Peace Corps come up to visit you, see how you're doing?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Hmm. I don't think so. My friend. Oh, yeah. Anna Rossar, our director of education, she sent my friend Kip to see how I was doing. Yep, she did. She paid for his trip to see how things were going, because she couldn't make it out there when she was supposed to. So she sent him."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you didn't make trips down into Tegucigalpa?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:551", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 5, "return_to_go": 6.677388809127263, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Hmm. I don't think so. My friend. Oh, yeah. Anna Rossar, our director of education, she sent my friend Kip to see how I was doing. Yep, she did. She paid for his trip to see how things were going, because she couldn't make it out there when she was supposed to. So she sent him."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you didn't make trips down into Tegucigalpa?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I did once in a while, not too often. It was an awful long ride."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Eight or 12 hour ride. So I didn't go often."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were you summoned for Peace Corps meetings or something?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:555", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.070850381638596, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Eight or 12 hour ride. So I didn't go often."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were you summoned for Peace Corps meetings or something?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "One time we went to a, uh, twice. We went to, once each year we went to a Department of Education meeting. One was in Tela on the north coast and then another one was down, uh, down the south end of Honduras doesn't have much of a coastline, but it was done in that area. San Lorenzo, I think. I don't recall. Yeah. So yeah, a couple of times. And we, oh, we also had one. Yeah, we had one in western Honduras too, in a small town in the mountains. Santa Barbara."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. So three times I remember we went for professional development things."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "As you got towards the end of your two years, were things sort of changing for you in terms of your relationship to your job or your, were you starting to turn and look, look forward more towards coming home? What was it like towards the end?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:559", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.4454942983192538, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. So three times I remember we went for professional development things."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "As you got towards the end of your two years, were things sort of changing for you in terms of your relationship to your job or your, were you starting to turn and look, look forward more towards coming home? What was it like towards the end?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was raining a lot."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It was?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. I was leaving during the rainy season. I remember that. I also remember having a hard time deciding whether or not I wanted to return home."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Ah. Were you offered the opportunity of extending for a third year?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:563", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 1.7845608621225355, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. I was leaving during the rainy season. I remember that. I also remember having a hard time deciding whether or not I wanted to return home."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Ah. Were you offered the opportunity of extending for a third year?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, but I was trying to think of a way to stay. I just really loved Olanchito and my friends so much. I did not want to leave them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, but, you know, I just let things go along. I couldn't really think of a reason that I should stay for Peace Corps. I thought about maybe teaching English but, you know, people really didn't do that then. Now you go there, there's English schools everywhere."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. Uh huh."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:567", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.9685936569414016, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, but, you know, I just let things go along. I couldn't really think of a reason that I should stay for Peace Corps. I thought about maybe teaching English but, you know, people really didn't do that then. Now you go there, there's English schools everywhere."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. Uh huh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "English language schools. Most people who can afford to go to school, they'll have, they'll be in a bilingual school where they'll teach English half the day and Spanish half the day. I mean, this is at very young ages, kindergarten and up."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But then there was nothing like that. I don't know if people were that interested in learning it then. I don't think they were, or they just didn't have an opportunity to get it. No one ever came to me and said, hey, will you teach me English?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It wasn't their top priority."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:569", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.0762151743793351, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "English language schools. Most people who can afford to go to school, they'll have, they'll be in a bilingual school where they'll teach English half the day and Spanish half the day. I mean, this is at very young ages, kindergarten and up."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But then there was nothing like that. I don't know if people were that interested in learning it then. I don't think they were, or they just didn't have an opportunity to get it. No one ever came to me and said, hey, will you teach me English?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It wasn't their top priority."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Not then."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:575", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.4762896767892113, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I knew a lot of people by then."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Sure, sure."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. And their children and their families and extended families."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was amazing."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So saying goodbye must have been."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:577", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.6403218630991236, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. And their children and their families and extended families."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was amazing."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So saying goodbye must have been."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Very difficult."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Difficult. Did they have a big send off for you?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:579", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.8225798478879152, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was amazing."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So saying goodbye must have been."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Very difficult."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Difficult. Did they have a big send off for you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yeah. I had a despedida."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was that like, your despedida?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:581", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.0250887198754612, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Very difficult."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Difficult. Did they have a big send off for you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yeah. I had a despedida."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was that like, your despedida?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't remember."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I guess you had a good time."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:583", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.250098577639401, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yeah. I had a despedida."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was that like, your despedida?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't remember."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I guess you had a good time."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. It was with family and friends that we hung around, that I hung around with for two years. So it was a very nice time. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. And then you had to pack up your suitcase. You have a big trunk or?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:585", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.5001095307104455, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't remember."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I guess you had a good time."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. It was with family and friends that we hung around, that I hung around with for two years. So it was a very nice time. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. And then you had to pack up your suitcase. You have a big trunk or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I just had one of those backpacks with the internal frame."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. Uh huh. So you had to stuff things in there. Did you, did you bring home things from Honduras?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:587", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.7778994785671616, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. It was with family and friends that we hung around, that I hung around with for two years. So it was a very nice time. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. And then you had to pack up your suitcase. You have a big trunk or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I just had one of those backpacks with the internal frame."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. Uh huh. So you had to stuff things in there. Did you, did you bring home things from Honduras?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Just."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Artifacts or weavings or?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:589", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.086554976185735, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I just had one of those backpacks with the internal frame."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. Uh huh. So you had to stuff things in there. Did you, did you bring home things from Honduras?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Just."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Artifacts or weavings or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Nothing to speak of, no. I wasn't interested in that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Had you already decided to go back and finish your degree at University of Wisconsin? You left, you left here after two years."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:593", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.6994505878836232, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Nothing to speak of, no. I wasn't interested in that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Had you already decided to go back and finish your degree at University of Wisconsin? You left, you left here after two years."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, that's where, that's what I did. I went back to finish my degree."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I wasn't going to, but then another volunteer talked me into it. That was another one of my friends from the original group of seven shop teachers. He was at the time was in Puerto Cortes. And we both were in the same group and that whole thing. So he went to Menomonie and got enrolled and called me up and asked me if I want to do that. And I says, yeah. He says, I really can't think of anything else. So he goes, oh good, I need a roommate so."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "All right. So this is not Stevens Point now, it's a different."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:597", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.332655046769905, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I wasn't going to, but then another volunteer talked me into it. That was another one of my friends from the original group of seven shop teachers. He was at the time was in Puerto Cortes. And we both were in the same group and that whole thing. So he went to Menomonie and got enrolled and called me up and asked me if I want to do that. And I says, yeah. He says, I really can't think of anything else. So he goes, oh good, I need a roommate so."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "All right. So this is not Stevens Point now, it's a different."}, {"role": "user", "content": "UW-Stout."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "UW-Stout, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Where we went for our training."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. So you went back there to finish up?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:599", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.7029500519665612, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "UW-Stout."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "UW-Stout, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Where we went for our training."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. So you went back there to finish up?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. And was this buddy the one who went to the Peace Corps in Guatemala? Or somebody else?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:601", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 4.1143889466295125, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Where we went for our training."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. So you went back there to finish up?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. And was this buddy the one who went to the Peace Corps in Guatemala? Or somebody else?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. The seven of us all went to Honduras. None of us went anywhere else."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay, yeah. So you finished up two years back at the University of Wisconsin."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:603", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.46043216292168, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. And was this buddy the one who went to the Peace Corps in Guatemala? Or somebody else?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. The seven of us all went to Honduras. None of us went anywhere else."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay, yeah. So you finished up two years back at the University of Wisconsin."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, took about two years."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You got a degree in what?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:605", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 3.844924625468533, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. The seven of us all went to Honduras. None of us went anywhere else."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay, yeah. So you finished up two years back at the University of Wisconsin."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, took about two years."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You got a degree in what?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Industrial, at that time, what the heck did they call it? They changed the name. They called it, they changed it to industrial education. And now it's called tech ed, technology education."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, sure. That's right. Yes. Yeah. So you were teaching industrial ed or tech ed in public high schools in Wisconsin."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:607", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.1610273616317035, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, took about two years."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You got a degree in what?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Industrial, at that time, what the heck did they call it? They changed the name. They called it, they changed it to industrial education. And now it's called tech ed, technology education."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, sure. That's right. Yes. Yeah. So you were teaching industrial ed or tech ed in public high schools in Wisconsin."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, not all in Wisconsin. One week. Let's see. A combination of in rehab, rehabilitation places, and high schools in Florida and Wisconsin."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. Uh huh. Yeah. You came back speaking Spanish."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:609", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.512252624035226, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Industrial, at that time, what the heck did they call it? They changed the name. They called it, they changed it to industrial education. And now it's called tech ed, technology education."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, sure. That's right. Yes. Yeah. So you were teaching industrial ed or tech ed in public high schools in Wisconsin."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, not all in Wisconsin. One week. Let's see. A combination of in rehab, rehabilitation places, and high schools in Florida and Wisconsin."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. Uh huh. Yeah. You came back speaking Spanish."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Just an extra skill that you wouldn't have had otherwise."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:611", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.9025029155946953, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, not all in Wisconsin. One week. Let's see. A combination of in rehab, rehabilitation places, and high schools in Florida and Wisconsin."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. Uh huh. Yeah. You came back speaking Spanish."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Just an extra skill that you wouldn't have had otherwise."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Have you found ways to use that up here?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:613", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.336114350660773, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Just an extra skill that you wouldn't have had otherwise."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Have you found ways to use that up here?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Never really used it to, for a job. Or I, I had a couple of students who only spoke Spanish throughout my career, so I used it then. I can remember two occasions."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Spanish speaking students up here in the States."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:615", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.817904834067525, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Have you found ways to use that up here?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Never really used it to, for a job. Or I, I had a couple of students who only spoke Spanish throughout my career, so I used it then. I can remember two occasions."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Spanish speaking students up here in the States."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You've maintained your contact with your friends, your Honduran friends, over all these years."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:617", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 5.353227593408361, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Never really used it to, for a job. Or I, I had a couple of students who only spoke Spanish throughout my career, so I used it then. I can remember two occasions."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Spanish speaking students up here in the States."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You've maintained your contact with your friends, your Honduran friends, over all these years."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Yeah, I have."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It's been, uh."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:621", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 5.37435505359057, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Yeah, I have."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It's been, uh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "33 years."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "33 years."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Or more even actually, if you finished in 1980."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:623", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.6381722817672997, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "33 years."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "33 years."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Or more even actually, if you finished in 1980."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. We are, we were saying 33 years in February. But I don't know. It could be 34. Yeah. Maintain contact with them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How often have you been back?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:625", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.9313025352969997, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Or more even actually, if you finished in 1980."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. We are, we were saying 33 years in February. But I don't know. It could be 34. Yeah. Maintain contact with them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How often have you been back?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "That one time just last month."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Just last, oh, so that was. You hadn't been back to Honduras in."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:627", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.2570028169966663, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. We are, we were saying 33 years in February. But I don't know. It could be 34. Yeah. Maintain contact with them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How often have you been back?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "That one time just last month."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Just last, oh, so that was. You hadn't been back to Honduras in."}, {"role": "user", "content": "33 years."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "33 years when you went back there just a few months ago."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:629", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.6188920188851847, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That one time just last month."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Just last, oh, so that was. You hadn't been back to Honduras in."}, {"role": "user", "content": "33 years."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "33 years when you went back there just a few months ago."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right, right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh my goodness. Did you recognize people, places?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:631", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.020991132094649, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "33 years."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "33 years when you went back there just a few months ago."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right, right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh my goodness. Did you recognize people, places?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "They recognized you?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:633", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.4677679245496105, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right, right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh my goodness. Did you recognize people, places?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "They recognized you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yeah. And honestly, I've never felt so loved."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, oh, wonderful."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:635", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 4.9641865828329, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "They recognized you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yeah. And honestly, I've never felt so loved."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, oh, wonderful."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was just wonderful, yeah. I have 1,000 pictures on my camera and probably 50 little videos."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah. Oh, what a beautiful thing."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:645", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.43046721000000016, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. And there's, you, you can't imagine, I guess, I couldn't imagine how many people did remember me. It just wasn't that core family, it was their friends, families of friends. And it was an incredible experience, as it was in '78 and '80."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. So I can't wait to go back again."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Ah, terrific."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Would you say that your experience in Honduras has affected your life post Peace Corps? Has it pointed you in directions you might not have gone in, other than visiting Honduras?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:651", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.5904900000000002, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Teaching."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Teaching?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I probably would have gone into business with my dad."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. Okay. But you got a taste of teaching and you liked it?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:653", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.6561000000000001, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I probably would have gone into business with my dad."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. Okay. But you got a taste of teaching and you liked it?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. It gave me more independence than I knew. Being in business with my dad in a small town, I wouldn't be that independent."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, right. Yeah."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:655", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.7290000000000001, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I probably would have gone into business with my dad."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh. Okay. But you got a taste of teaching and you liked it?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. It gave me more independence than I knew. Being in business with my dad in a small town, I wouldn't be that independent."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, right. Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I liked that part of it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Would you recommend Peace Corps to young people today?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:657", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.81, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. It gave me more independence than I knew. Being in business with my dad in a small town, I wouldn't be that independent."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, right. Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I liked that part of it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Would you recommend Peace Corps to young people today?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I would. I really would. It, uh, it really turned things around for me. I discovered a career because of it. I was successful at that career, and just really, really enjoyed meeting the people that I did in Honduras. And they're still friends today. So, you know, it can't get much better than that, you know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It's a very happy story."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:659", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.9, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I liked that part of it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Would you recommend Peace Corps to young people today?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I would. I really would. It, uh, it really turned things around for me. I discovered a career because of it. I was successful at that career, and just really, really enjoyed meeting the people that I did in Honduras. And they're still friends today. So, you know, it can't get much better than that, you know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It's a very happy story."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Is there anything else you'd like to say?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00014:661", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 1.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I would. I really would. It, uh, it really turned things around for me. I discovered a career because of it. I was successful at that career, and just really, really enjoyed meeting the people that I did in Honduras. And they're still friends today. So, you know, it can't get much better than that, you know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It's a very happy story."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Is there anything else you'd like to say?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Hmm. Not really, no."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. Thank you very much. It's been a very interesting interview."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00226:71", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 1.81, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "These were Peace Corps nurses that we had. They came and visited a lot of our sites and they did come and visit me, which was fun. I did have a visit, I believe, once from my APCD, Francisco Garces, who I love, who was our forestry APCD, who is just an inspiration and a really wonderful guy, but I was very isolated so. And I think in a lot of other volunteers maybe had more visits from Francisco based on his travel patterns. But he did visit me once and I was able to show him my work and some of the communities where I worked, and that was really great. But in general, I mostly interacted with Peace Corps staff when I came into the capital for really normally for medical issues, for either shots or issues that I was having. Or, you know, we had a mid-term conference and our COS conference where we were required to essentially go back to the Quito area. So that was mostly when I interacted with employees of Peace Corps. But you know, in general, I probably had less interaction with them and more interaction with my host agency folks. But we also, we didn't have a phone in my neighborhood, in my town. The nearest phone was a five hour bus ride. So I mean, even if I could have went and called someone and asked for advice, I mean, it was difficult to do so."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Five hours for a phone?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Five hours for a phone, five hours for money, five hours for a lot of, you know, for a lot of food really that you couldn't get in my little town. You know, you'd bulk up on, you know, peanut butter and tuna and things five hours away. And that was, you know, that was my nearest phone to call my family as well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Has that changed now or do you know or? Do they have cell phones?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't know. I think, I know that they, I heard that they had paved and improved the road going to my town. So I'm sure that that's changed things quite a bit."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "As far as you know, they still don't have electricity?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00226:73", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.9, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Five hours for a phone, five hours for money, five hours for a lot of, you know, for a lot of food really that you couldn't get in my little town. You know, you'd bulk up on, you know, peanut butter and tuna and things five hours away. And that was, you know, that was my nearest phone to call my family as well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Has that changed now or do you know or? Do they have cell phones?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't know. I think, I know that they, I heard that they had paved and improved the road going to my town. So I'm sure that that's changed things quite a bit."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "As far as you know, they still don't have electricity?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "They do have, I think, electricity now. It started, they started building the infrastructure right at the end of my service but were having a very hard time with it because they were using hydropower and had a tremendous amount of energy, and not enough places to send the energy, because there weren't that many people living in the area. And we lived next to this Rio San Juan, which was a raging river that separates Colombia and Ecuador. And so my understanding is that they do have electricity now, but I think they still, you know, it's not, it kind of comes and goes, because I think they've been having trouble with the system. But yeah, and I'm sure it's changed quite a bit, actually. And that's why I'm very curious and I'm also kind of trepidatious about returning and seeing how things have changed. But I know that they still don't have."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What do you think it would take to get you back?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00226:75", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 1.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't know. I think, I know that they, I heard that they had paved and improved the road going to my town. So I'm sure that that's changed things quite a bit."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "As far as you know, they still don't have electricity?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "They do have, I think, electricity now. It started, they started building the infrastructure right at the end of my service but were having a very hard time with it because they were using hydropower and had a tremendous amount of energy, and not enough places to send the energy, because there weren't that many people living in the area. And we lived next to this Rio San Juan, which was a raging river that separates Colombia and Ecuador. And so my understanding is that they do have electricity now, but I think they still, you know, it's not, it kind of comes and goes, because I think they've been having trouble with the system. But yeah, and I'm sure it's changed quite a bit, actually. And that's why I'm very curious and I'm also kind of trepidatious about returning and seeing how things have changed. But I know that they still don't have."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What do you think it would take to get you back?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh gosh, a break in my work schedule probably. And a little bit of money. But no, I would really love to go back and I am planning to go back fairly soon. But I know that they still don't have phones. I know that they still, my friends at least who call me still have to go to the capital five hours away to call me. But, you know, I mean, that's calling the U.S. but."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "If it's anything like my experience, you know, they didn't tell me at the time that they valued me and I didn't know if it was worthwhile. But when I did go back, they really laid it on. So I think that the same will probably happen to you."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00226:77", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They do have, I think, electricity now. It started, they started building the infrastructure right at the end of my service but were having a very hard time with it because they were using hydropower and had a tremendous amount of energy, and not enough places to send the energy, because there weren't that many people living in the area. And we lived next to this Rio San Juan, which was a raging river that separates Colombia and Ecuador. And so my understanding is that they do have electricity now, but I think they still, you know, it's not, it kind of comes and goes, because I think they've been having trouble with the system. But yeah, and I'm sure it's changed quite a bit, actually. And that's why I'm very curious and I'm also kind of trepidatious about returning and seeing how things have changed. But I know that they still don't have."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What do you think it would take to get you back?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh gosh, a break in my work schedule probably. And a little bit of money. But no, I would really love to go back and I am planning to go back fairly soon. But I know that they still don't have phones. I know that they still, my friends at least who call me still have to go to the capital five hours away to call me. But, you know, I mean, that's calling the U.S. but."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "If it's anything like my experience, you know, they didn't tell me at the time that they valued me and I didn't know if it was worthwhile. But when I did go back, they really laid it on. So I think that the same will probably happen to you."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. It would be fun to go back now too because I've been gone for about 10 years."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Ten years, yeah."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00226:79", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh gosh, a break in my work schedule probably. And a little bit of money. But no, I would really love to go back and I am planning to go back fairly soon. But I know that they still don't have phones. I know that they still, my friends at least who call me still have to go to the capital five hours away to call me. But, you know, I mean, that's calling the U.S. but."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "If it's anything like my experience, you know, they didn't tell me at the time that they valued me and I didn't know if it was worthwhile. But when I did go back, they really laid it on. So I think that the same will probably happen to you."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. It would be fun to go back now too because I've been gone for about 10 years."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Ten years, yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So to go back and see how things have changed. And I have heard little stories about, you know, some of the kids I used to teach getting married and having, you know, different lives of their own now. So it'd be really fun to go back and see everyone. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "OK, well I think that's pretty much it unless there's anything else you want to say. [tape break]"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00226:81", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. It would be fun to go back now too because I've been gone for about 10 years."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Ten years, yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So to go back and see how things have changed. And I have heard little stories about, you know, some of the kids I used to teach getting married and having, you know, different lives of their own now. So it'd be really fun to go back and see everyone. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "OK, well I think that's pretty much it unless there's anything else you want to say. [tape break]"}, {"role": "user", "content": "And you know and hope that more people join and that we keep it going."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, thank you very much."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:0", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 9, "return_to_go": 24.20495558251207, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't need to talk to, in that direction."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Today is December 9th, 2019. This is Randolph Adams, and I'm interviewing Mary Quattro, who was a Peace Corps volunteer in Malaysia from August 1968 to November 1970. She worked in secondary education. Morning, Mary. How are you doing today?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'm well, thank you."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "We're going to start off the interview just by talking a little about what your life was like before joining the Peace Corps, childhood, education. Any experiences that are relevant to maybe having influenced you to become a volunteer?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:2", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 16.894395091680078, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Today is December 9th, 2019. This is Randolph Adams, and I'm interviewing Mary Quattro, who was a Peace Corps volunteer in Malaysia from August 1968 to November 1970. She worked in secondary education. Morning, Mary. How are you doing today?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'm well, thank you."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "We're going to start off the interview just by talking a little about what your life was like before joining the Peace Corps, childhood, education. Any experiences that are relevant to maybe having influenced you to become a volunteer?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Okay. Um, I grew up in a little town in Davis, called Davis, West Virginia. It was a coal town, um, mostly made up of at that time, uh, immigrants from Italy and Poland. And, uh, so I didn't hear much of a West Virginia accent. I heard European accents. Uh, my, uh, father was first generation, and my grandmother and her and my granddad were, had come over and started a family here. Um, I think one of the things originally that, uh, I heard about, uh. Uh, it was a very small town, so we didn't have a lot of, of outside influence. But I always understood that about a broader world and wanted to be able to see that.\n\nAnd one of the first things that I wanted to do was when I went on to college, and I was the, the first in my family to actually get a college degree. But when I went on to college, I had heard about, um, VISTA volunteers, uh, which were in the Appalachian regions, most of them. And I wanted to do that, but I wasn't accepted into, uh, VISTA volunteers, and I was, not until later anyway. At first I wasn't accepted there, and I was really upset about that. And Peace Corps had just been, I think Peace Corps was in the early, about '64 started?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "'61 announced and '62 started."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:8", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 13.010144158683232, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Started, yeah. So I was concerned that it would be gone by the time I was old enough to, you know, time I got out of college. So I was very hopeful that that would be a possibility for me, to go to the Peace Corps. Um, I liked the whole idea of, of having it, like, you know, of course, John Kennedy was an inspiration to everyone.\n\nUm, but my family was not excited about me leaving, so, um, I didn't tell them about it until, I didn't tell them I had taken the test. I didn't tell them that I'd been accepted until it was getting down to the wire, and I needed to do things like, um, get my shots and get my, uh, tickets and get ready to, to leave. Um, I think they were just afraid for me, and they didn't want me to go. Um, my mother had lived all her life within 20 miles of where she was born, as had my dad. So it was, uh, it was a daunting prospect. We might need to stop just a second."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Let's just go back a step. Uh, where did you go to college?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I went to, um, undergraduate. I did my undergraduate work at Shepherd College in Shepherdstown, West Virginia. It's now Shepherd University. And I later did graduate work at University of Virginia."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "In?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Charlottesville."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "In education or?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:10", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 5, "return_to_go": 14.455715731870258, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I went to, um, undergraduate. I did my undergraduate work at Shepherd College in Shepherdstown, West Virginia. It's now Shepherd University. And I later did graduate work at University of Virginia."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "In?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Charlottesville."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "In education or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, in education. In guidance and education. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Um, continue talking about your, your family. What happened after you finally told them?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:12", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 10.506350813189176, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Charlottesville."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "In education or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, in education. In guidance and education. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Um, continue talking about your, your family. What happened after you finally told them?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "My dad was really opposed to it. He, he did not, didn't want me to go, but I was adamant. So I was gone. So they, they eventually, I think, you know, did what they could do to help, help me, you know, in terms of getting the medical things approved and all that. But it was, I think it was a big stretch for them to have me go.\n\nUm, so I left out of a little tiny airport in Elkins, West Virginia. Had got on like a little honest to God prop plane almost, and flew up to, uh, Pittsburgh airport and left out of, out of Pittsburgh. And my dad took me over to the airport. But he was, he was very sad to do that. Um. So I, and that was the first time I'd ever flown. So I flew from, uh, from Pittsburgh to, out to California. And I was in the group called, uh, Group 20, Malaysia 20. And most of the, of that group were, uh, education and, uh, some rural, uh, rural health projects."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you have siblings?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:14", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 11.67372312576575, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, in education. In guidance and education. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Um, continue talking about your, your family. What happened after you finally told them?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "My dad was really opposed to it. He, he did not, didn't want me to go, but I was adamant. So I was gone. So they, they eventually, I think, you know, did what they could do to help, help me, you know, in terms of getting the medical things approved and all that. But it was, I think it was a big stretch for them to have me go.\n\nUm, so I left out of a little tiny airport in Elkins, West Virginia. Had got on like a little honest to God prop plane almost, and flew up to, uh, Pittsburgh airport and left out of, out of Pittsburgh. And my dad took me over to the airport. But he was, he was very sad to do that. Um. So I, and that was the first time I'd ever flown. So I flew from, uh, from Pittsburgh to, out to California. And I was in the group called, uh, Group 20, Malaysia 20. And most of the, of that group were, uh, education and, uh, some rural, uh, rural health projects."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you have siblings?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I did. I had, uh, there were six, six of us. Uh, two older sisters. And then, um, I was the middle kid. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So how did they react to you leaving?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:16", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 11.859692361961944, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "My dad was really opposed to it. He, he did not, didn't want me to go, but I was adamant. So I was gone. So they, they eventually, I think, you know, did what they could do to help, help me, you know, in terms of getting the medical things approved and all that. But it was, I think it was a big stretch for them to have me go.\n\nUm, so I left out of a little tiny airport in Elkins, West Virginia. Had got on like a little honest to God prop plane almost, and flew up to, uh, Pittsburgh airport and left out of, out of Pittsburgh. And my dad took me over to the airport. But he was, he was very sad to do that. Um. So I, and that was the first time I'd ever flown. So I flew from, uh, from Pittsburgh to, out to California. And I was in the group called, uh, Group 20, Malaysia 20. And most of the, of that group were, uh, education and, uh, some rural, uh, rural health projects."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you have siblings?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I did. I had, uh, there were six, six of us. Uh, two older sisters. And then, um, I was the middle kid. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So how did they react to you leaving?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I, I think, uh, my sisters, they were fine with it actually. My youngest sister, Bec, was just a kid. She was just young. And the funny part was, when I came back, I was like, I felt like I'd been gone forever. And she, she was, like, on the edge of being a teenager. When I came back, she was just kind of grown person. Um, what happened to these people? Now I think they were, my siblings were pretty supportive, but, but I just think my parents were more afraid than anything else."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So why did you join the Peace Corps?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:18", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 13.177435957735494, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I did. I had, uh, there were six, six of us. Uh, two older sisters. And then, um, I was the middle kid. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So how did they react to you leaving?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I, I think, uh, my sisters, they were fine with it actually. My youngest sister, Bec, was just a kid. She was just young. And the funny part was, when I came back, I was like, I felt like I'd been gone forever. And she, she was, like, on the edge of being a teenager. When I came back, she was just kind of grown person. Um, what happened to these people? Now I think they were, my siblings were pretty supportive, but, but I just think my parents were more afraid than anything else."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So why did you join the Peace Corps?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I, part of it was to be able to travel, but I think the other part was to be able to, to serve in a way. My dad always talked about doing service. Uh, his idea of doing service, though, was what he called for this family. It was always, you know, you took care of your own family. Uh, but there was a real, uh, um, strong emphasis on emphasis on that. And he, uh, you know, we, we heard that growing up, and we did that and all my, all my siblings have been very, very active, uh, in their personal life, active socially, and doing been politically. So I think we learned it well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Um, how did you hear about the Peace Corps?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:20", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 13.530484397483882, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I, I think, uh, my sisters, they were fine with it actually. My youngest sister, Bec, was just a kid. She was just young. And the funny part was, when I came back, I was like, I felt like I'd been gone forever. And she, she was, like, on the edge of being a teenager. When I came back, she was just kind of grown person. Um, what happened to these people? Now I think they were, my siblings were pretty supportive, but, but I just think my parents were more afraid than anything else."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So why did you join the Peace Corps?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I, part of it was to be able to travel, but I think the other part was to be able to, to serve in a way. My dad always talked about doing service. Uh, his idea of doing service, though, was what he called for this family. It was always, you know, you took care of your own family. Uh, but there was a real, uh, um, strong emphasis on emphasis on that. And he, uh, you know, we, we heard that growing up, and we did that and all my, all my siblings have been very, very active, uh, in their personal life, active socially, and doing been politically. So I think we learned it well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Um, how did you hear about the Peace Corps?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "You know, I'm not sure. I'm sure. Maybe some guidance counselor somewhere along the way told me, but somehow I had heard. Well, I mean, I certainly knew about it from the news about being founded, but, uh. And, you know, once I was familiar with the Appalachian volunteers and VISTA volunteers. So I think it just was a something I'd heard about over growing up."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And when you tried to get into VISTA, was that for education also or what was?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:22", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 15.033871552759868, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I, part of it was to be able to travel, but I think the other part was to be able to, to serve in a way. My dad always talked about doing service. Uh, his idea of doing service, though, was what he called for this family. It was always, you know, you took care of your own family. Uh, but there was a real, uh, um, strong emphasis on emphasis on that. And he, uh, you know, we, we heard that growing up, and we did that and all my, all my siblings have been very, very active, uh, in their personal life, active socially, and doing been politically. So I think we learned it well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Um, how did you hear about the Peace Corps?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "You know, I'm not sure. I'm sure. Maybe some guidance counselor somewhere along the way told me, but somehow I had heard. Well, I mean, I certainly knew about it from the news about being founded, but, uh. And, you know, once I was familiar with the Appalachian volunteers and VISTA volunteers. So I think it just was a something I'd heard about over growing up."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And when you tried to get into VISTA, was that for education also or what was?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. I mean, I was, you know, I was going in education. I, you know, the part about that is I think that later on I was accepted, initially I wasn't, was not, but some of that might have been just because I wasn't finished with school when I applied."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you remember, um, the application process you had to go through?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:24", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 15.593190614177631, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "You know, I'm not sure. I'm sure. Maybe some guidance counselor somewhere along the way told me, but somehow I had heard. Well, I mean, I certainly knew about it from the news about being founded, but, uh. And, you know, once I was familiar with the Appalachian volunteers and VISTA volunteers. So I think it just was a something I'd heard about over growing up."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And when you tried to get into VISTA, was that for education also or what was?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. I mean, I was, you know, I was going in education. I, you know, the part about that is I think that later on I was accepted, initially I wasn't, was not, but some of that might have been just because I wasn't finished with school when I applied."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you remember, um, the application process you had to go through?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not much, because I was, I did it. I mean, I took, you know, there were tests and things, and I think we were able to take the test at, at Shepherd. Uh, I honestly don't recall a whole lot of that because I just, I just knew I was applying and taking, you know, doing what I needed to do and trying to make sure that, that my parents weren't going to stop it in the process because they, I didn't tell them about it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Um, did you have a specific country in mind?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:26", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 16.214656237975145, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. I mean, I was, you know, I was going in education. I, you know, the part about that is I think that later on I was accepted, initially I wasn't, was not, but some of that might have been just because I wasn't finished with school when I applied."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you remember, um, the application process you had to go through?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not much, because I was, I did it. I mean, I took, you know, there were tests and things, and I think we were able to take the test at, at Shepherd. Uh, I honestly don't recall a whole lot of that because I just, I just knew I was applying and taking, you know, doing what I needed to do and trying to make sure that, that my parents weren't going to stop it in the process because they, I didn't tell them about it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Um, did you have a specific country in mind?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I did. I was hoping to, uh, to go. I didn't want, I didn't ask for Malaysia. I was hoping to go somewhere like Thailand or something like that. That seemed more exotic to me, but, uh, I ended up being selected for Malaysia and it turned out to be a good thing."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And obviously you were interested in the education program."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:28", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 18.01628470886127, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not much, because I was, I did it. I mean, I took, you know, there were tests and things, and I think we were able to take the test at, at Shepherd. Uh, I honestly don't recall a whole lot of that because I just, I just knew I was applying and taking, you know, doing what I needed to do and trying to make sure that, that my parents weren't going to stop it in the process because they, I didn't tell them about it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Um, did you have a specific country in mind?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I did. I was hoping to, uh, to go. I didn't want, I didn't ask for Malaysia. I was hoping to go somewhere like Thailand or something like that. That seemed more exotic to me, but, uh, I ended up being selected for Malaysia and it turned out to be a good thing."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And obviously you were interested in the education program."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was your reaction when you were accepted?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:30", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 18.906983009845856, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I did. I was hoping to, uh, to go. I didn't want, I didn't ask for Malaysia. I was hoping to go somewhere like Thailand or something like that. That seemed more exotic to me, but, uh, I ended up being selected for Malaysia and it turned out to be a good thing."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And obviously you were interested in the education program."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was your reaction when you were accepted?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was, I was happy about it. I was like, but then, oh, I guess I'll have to, guess I'll have to let the rest of the crowd in on this one now. So I waited a few, few weeks."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you have time to prepare? How quickly?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:32", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 16.563314455384283, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was your reaction when you were accepted?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was, I was happy about it. I was like, but then, oh, I guess I'll have to, guess I'll have to let the rest of the crowd in on this one now. So I waited a few, few weeks."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you have time to prepare? How quickly?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I did because I, you know, I, it was, it was like late August or September. So I mean, I was out of school by, I'd graduated by like May. So yes, I had the months to do that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Remember what you did? Did you look up where Malaysia was?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:34", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 18.403682728204757, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was, I was happy about it. I was like, but then, oh, I guess I'll have to, guess I'll have to let the rest of the crowd in on this one now. So I waited a few, few weeks."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you have time to prepare? How quickly?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I did because I, you know, I, it was, it was like late August or September. So I mean, I was out of school by, I'd graduated by like May. So yes, I had the months to do that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Remember what you did? Did you look up where Malaysia was?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I did. Looked up where it was and, and just, you know, just trying to go through the process of knowing what medical things I needed to do. And, um. I just remember just the time, just going quickly, it seemed to me. But I was ready to go. I was anxious to go. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Let's talk a little about training. Um, you mentioned, um, before we started the interview that you trained in Hawaii."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:36", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 20.448536364671952, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I did because I, you know, I, it was, it was like late August or September. So I mean, I was out of school by, I'd graduated by like May. So yes, I had the months to do that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Remember what you did? Did you look up where Malaysia was?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I did. Looked up where it was and, and just, you know, just trying to go through the process of knowing what medical things I needed to do. And, um. I just remember just the time, just going quickly, it seemed to me. But I was ready to go. I was anxious to go. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Let's talk a little about training. Um, you mentioned, um, before we started the interview that you trained in Hawaii."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was that like?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:38", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 21.609484849635503, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I did. Looked up where it was and, and just, you know, just trying to go through the process of knowing what medical things I needed to do. And, um. I just remember just the time, just going quickly, it seemed to me. But I was ready to go. I was anxious to go. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Let's talk a little about training. Um, you mentioned, um, before we started the interview that you trained in Hawaii."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was that like?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Wonderful. Wonderful, wonderful. That was one, we were, I think, either the last or the next to last group to train, uh, in country, uh, for Malaysia. Uh, later on, everybody went directly in country to, to train. But we were, uh, were there for three months. Uh, we lived in, uh, there were two or three training groups. We, our group was the smaller one. Um, and we had, uh, Malaysia cikgus, teachers, who came to Hawaii to, uh, teach us. Uh, there were in my group only two, two women, uh, and there was one married, one married woman and two single women. The rest were, were male trainees. So we had a smaller group."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "The other groups were also for Malaysia?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:40", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 20.67720538848389, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was that like?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Wonderful. Wonderful, wonderful. That was one, we were, I think, either the last or the next to last group to train, uh, in country, uh, for Malaysia. Uh, later on, everybody went directly in country to, to train. But we were, uh, were there for three months. Uh, we lived in, uh, there were two or three training groups. We, our group was the smaller one. Um, and we had, uh, Malaysia cikgus, teachers, who came to Hawaii to, uh, teach us. Uh, there were in my group only two, two women, uh, and there was one married, one married woman and two single women. The rest were, were male trainees. So we had a smaller group."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "The other groups were also for Malaysia?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "They were going to Malaysia, but they were going to West Malaysia. We didn't know that at the time, but that's what it turned out to be, that a lot of our group went to East Malaysia, to the island of Borneo."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What did training cover?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:42", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 22.97467265387099, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Wonderful. Wonderful, wonderful. That was one, we were, I think, either the last or the next to last group to train, uh, in country, uh, for Malaysia. Uh, later on, everybody went directly in country to, to train. But we were, uh, were there for three months. Uh, we lived in, uh, there were two or three training groups. We, our group was the smaller one. Um, and we had, uh, Malaysia cikgus, teachers, who came to Hawaii to, uh, teach us. Uh, there were in my group only two, two women, uh, and there was one married, one married woman and two single women. The rest were, were male trainees. So we had a smaller group."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "The other groups were also for Malaysia?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "They were going to Malaysia, but they were going to West Malaysia. We didn't know that at the time, but that's what it turned out to be, that a lot of our group went to East Malaysia, to the island of Borneo."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What did training cover?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, mostly language. Uh. You know, we did some, uh, we learned some things about the schools. Um. But it was mostly just intensive language."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you recall, were all of you, um, previous teachers or?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:44", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 25.527414059856653, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They were going to Malaysia, but they were going to West Malaysia. We didn't know that at the time, but that's what it turned out to be, that a lot of our group went to East Malaysia, to the island of Borneo."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What did training cover?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, mostly language. Uh. You know, we did some, uh, we learned some things about the schools. Um. But it was mostly just intensive language."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you recall, were all of you, um, previous teachers or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um. Well, a lot of us were newbies. I mean, we were just out of college, a lot of us. So there were a couple men who, who were older and had done some, uh, I mean, had worked as engineers or other kinds of things. But most of us were, were young, fairly young, fairly inexperienced."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you didn't really get any technical training in terms of teaching techniques or things like that?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:46", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 7, "return_to_go": 25.03046006650739, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, mostly language. Uh. You know, we did some, uh, we learned some things about the schools. Um. But it was mostly just intensive language."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you recall, were all of you, um, previous teachers or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um. Well, a lot of us were newbies. I mean, we were just out of college, a lot of us. So there were a couple men who, who were older and had done some, uh, I mean, had worked as engineers or other kinds of things. But most of us were, were young, fairly young, fairly inexperienced."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you didn't really get any technical training in terms of teaching techniques or things like that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Some. I mean, that's what I was saying. I think that it depends on if you were going to a secondary school or to, a couple of people taught in the, the, uh, it wasn't really a college level, but it was, it was in a sense college level classes. And so there were different training courses for that. And so we got a little bit of an idea. I mean, it was based on the English method of the, because Malaysia had been a British protectorate and a British colony for 100 years. And so the method of teaching was similar, something that we could relate to."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And what about the language? What language were you being trained in?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:54", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 20.691144743952737, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Um. In retrospect, were there aspects of training you wish you had had?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I felt pretty well prepared. I thought it was good. I thought they were, uh, they worked pretty closely with Malaysian government trying to learn, you know what they needed. Uh, so I think, I think, uh, as far as the training itself was concerned. Now, placements were a little bit different question, I think. And that should have been done better. But uh, the training overall was, I think was suitable for the areas. Again, we, you know, Malaysia is the island of Borneo and then the, the West Malaysia, which is very much a different kind of atmosphere."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "One last thing about the training. What about the cultural aspects? Were they, uh, sessions presented by Americans or Malaysians or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Both. Uh, some of the, the instructors and some of the people who worked in country already, uh, came to provide training. Another thing about, about that was that Malaysia at that time, as it is now, very much an Islamic country after the revolution, after the Iranian revolution. When we went there, it was, it was not. I mean, they were, they were uh, uh, Muslim, but they were not strict Muslim. I mean, they weren't Muslim, fundamentalist Muslim in the way they are now, like they did not wear the, didn't cover their heads. In fact, most of the Malay women wore beautiful saris. And, you know, over at the time after we left and after the Iranian revolution, then they started taking on the, the hijab and all that. They didn't do that when we were there.\n\nSo it was a different, it was a very interesting time because Malaysia itself didn't know what it was doing. I mean, didn't know what it was becoming. And it, it became more and more an Islamic country. But at that, up to that point that its influence was really much more British."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You said after the revolution. What?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:56", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 5, "return_to_go": 22.99016082661415, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I felt pretty well prepared. I thought it was good. I thought they were, uh, they worked pretty closely with Malaysian government trying to learn, you know what they needed. Uh, so I think, I think, uh, as far as the training itself was concerned. Now, placements were a little bit different question, I think. And that should have been done better. But uh, the training overall was, I think was suitable for the areas. Again, we, you know, Malaysia is the island of Borneo and then the, the West Malaysia, which is very much a different kind of atmosphere."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "One last thing about the training. What about the cultural aspects? Were they, uh, sessions presented by Americans or Malaysians or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Both. Uh, some of the, the instructors and some of the people who worked in country already, uh, came to provide training. Another thing about, about that was that Malaysia at that time, as it is now, very much an Islamic country after the revolution, after the Iranian revolution. When we went there, it was, it was not. I mean, they were, they were uh, uh, Muslim, but they were not strict Muslim. I mean, they weren't Muslim, fundamentalist Muslim in the way they are now, like they did not wear the, didn't cover their heads. In fact, most of the Malay women wore beautiful saris. And, you know, over at the time after we left and after the Iranian revolution, then they started taking on the, the hijab and all that. They didn't do that when we were there.\n\nSo it was a different, it was a very interesting time because Malaysia itself didn't know what it was doing. I mean, didn't know what it was becoming. And it, it became more and more an Islamic country. But at that, up to that point that its influence was really much more British."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You said after the revolution. What?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "The Iranian, after the Iranian."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "The Iranian revolution. Okay."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:58", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 19.989067585126833, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Both. Uh, some of the, the instructors and some of the people who worked in country already, uh, came to provide training. Another thing about, about that was that Malaysia at that time, as it is now, very much an Islamic country after the revolution, after the Iranian revolution. When we went there, it was, it was not. I mean, they were, they were uh, uh, Muslim, but they were not strict Muslim. I mean, they weren't Muslim, fundamentalist Muslim in the way they are now, like they did not wear the, didn't cover their heads. In fact, most of the Malay women wore beautiful saris. And, you know, over at the time after we left and after the Iranian revolution, then they started taking on the, the hijab and all that. They didn't do that when we were there.\n\nSo it was a different, it was a very interesting time because Malaysia itself didn't know what it was doing. I mean, didn't know what it was becoming. And it, it became more and more an Islamic country. But at that, up to that point that its influence was really much more British."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You said after the revolution. What?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "The Iranian, after the Iranian."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "The Iranian revolution. Okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And then all that spread. I mean, all the whole idea of a more fundamentalist approach to Islam. Because in Malaysia, even though they were Muslim, they had for, for hundreds of years been under British rule and then their own rule. But the Chinese and the Malays were not, obviously not Muslim. I mean, you had changes like in Philippines or in, in some of the other countries making an influence on Malaysia."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Interesting. Um, what about the trainees? Were any asked to leave during training?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:60", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 21.09896398347426, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "The Iranian, after the Iranian."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "The Iranian revolution. Okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And then all that spread. I mean, all the whole idea of a more fundamentalist approach to Islam. Because in Malaysia, even though they were Muslim, they had for, for hundreds of years been under British rule and then their own rule. But the Chinese and the Malays were not, obviously not Muslim. I mean, you had changes like in Philippines or in, in some of the other countries making an influence on Malaysia."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Interesting. Um, what about the trainees? Were any asked to leave during training?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "A couple. Um, we had some who, you know, Vietnam was still on. Some got drafted."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right out of training?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:62", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 23.4432933149714, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And then all that spread. I mean, all the whole idea of a more fundamentalist approach to Islam. Because in Malaysia, even though they were Muslim, they had for, for hundreds of years been under British rule and then their own rule. But the Chinese and the Malays were not, obviously not Muslim. I mean, you had changes like in Philippines or in, in some of the other countries making an influence on Malaysia."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Interesting. Um, what about the trainees? Were any asked to leave during training?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "A couple. Um, we had some who, you know, Vietnam was still on. Some got drafted."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right out of training?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right out of training. I, we, none of us ever got quite over that. That, you know, here we were Peace Corps volunteers and we had at least two that I can recall, maybe more, who were drafted and had to go home."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did any decide to leave on their own because, for whatever reason, they said it wasn't probably had something they had to do?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:64", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 26.048103683301555, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "A couple. Um, we had some who, you know, Vietnam was still on. Some got drafted."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right out of training?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right out of training. I, we, none of us ever got quite over that. That, you know, here we were Peace Corps volunteers and we had at least two that I can recall, maybe more, who were drafted and had to go home."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did any decide to leave on their own because, for whatever reason, they said it wasn't probably had something they had to do?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "We had a couple. I, I mean, for whatever, you know, personal reasons, I don't think. There was a married couple that left, left early. They decided they didn't really want to stay. I, uh, for our group, not so many, though. I can't, I really don't recall other people just leaving on their own accord."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I know in your time period, there were, in other training centers like yours, they usually had psychologists and psychiatrists."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:66", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 28.942337425890617, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right out of training. I, we, none of us ever got quite over that. That, you know, here we were Peace Corps volunteers and we had at least two that I can recall, maybe more, who were drafted and had to go home."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did any decide to leave on their own because, for whatever reason, they said it wasn't probably had something they had to do?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "We had a couple. I, I mean, for whatever, you know, personal reasons, I don't think. There was a married couple that left, left early. They decided they didn't really want to stay. I, uh, for our group, not so many, though. I can't, I really don't recall other people just leaving on their own accord."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I know in your time period, there were, in other training centers like yours, they usually had psychologists and psychiatrists."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you went through some of those assessments?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:68", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 31.04704158432291, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We had a couple. I, I mean, for whatever, you know, personal reasons, I don't think. There was a married couple that left, left early. They decided they didn't really want to stay. I, uh, for our group, not so many, though. I can't, I really don't recall other people just leaving on their own accord."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I know in your time period, there were, in other training centers like yours, they usually had psychologists and psychiatrists."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you went through some of those assessments?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "We did. We had several, several assessments. Yeah. They came on site and were there with us for a couple of weeks, I guess."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Any reaction to that?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:70", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 34.496712871469896, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you went through some of those assessments?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "We did. We had several, several assessments. Yeah. They came on site and were there with us for a couple of weeks, I guess."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Any reaction to that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Some people got de-, I think there were some deselections based on that. That's what they would call it. You've been deselected. So. But not many."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was the size of your group?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:72", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 10, "return_to_go": 37.21856985718877, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We did. We had several, several assessments. Yeah. They came on site and were there with us for a couple of weeks, I guess."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Any reaction to that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Some people got de-, I think there were some deselections based on that. That's what they would call it. You've been deselected. So. But not many."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was the size of your group?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "You know, I. Malaysia 20 was. I'm thinking we probably weren't more than, say, 35 to 40 at the most. Maybe not even that many. I'd say around that number. But there were different training groups going on at the time, depending on what part of the, the country you were in. And some were, some came in like even a couple, uh, a month after we had started. So that was a new another group, 21 or 22, you know. So there were several groups training."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And once you then went to Malaysia, how did that work? What was the country entry like?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:82", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 18.446662699095263, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yeah. Yeah, I mean, I was, the jungle was, I was surrounded by the jungle. People would say to me, did you not see the snakes? I said, I didn't look at them. I didn't see any. They were there. I just didn't look at them. So I managed to spend almost two years not seeing snakes that were there. I just didn't want to see them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Um, was this a small community or a small town?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, the town itself was called Lundu town, Lundu bazaar. And it was, you know, shopkeepers, a lot of Chinese shopkeepers, um. The, the Malay, there were some Malays because they had a, uh, a mosque. They also had a little tiny church that an English priest had been there for, since birth I think, he was a very old man. And he had, he had like, uh, Girl Guides and Boy Scouts that he'd done forever. He was very British. Um, but, but it's, the center was the bazaar, and it wasn't huge. It wasn't big. But there was also a military post there. And then the school was, you know, some distance, a couple miles from the town, quote, town."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So was your area considered a suburb or a community of itself?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was just considered the school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Just the school?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:84", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 19.385180776772515, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, the town itself was called Lundu town, Lundu bazaar. And it was, you know, shopkeepers, a lot of Chinese shopkeepers, um. The, the Malay, there were some Malays because they had a, uh, a mosque. They also had a little tiny church that an English priest had been there for, since birth I think, he was a very old man. And he had, he had like, uh, Girl Guides and Boy Scouts that he'd done forever. He was very British. Um, but, but it's, the center was the bazaar, and it wasn't huge. It wasn't big. But there was also a military post there. And then the school was, you know, some distance, a couple miles from the town, quote, town."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So was your area considered a suburb or a community of itself?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was just considered the school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Just the school?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. The kids, we had, the Chinese students came in every morning. Most of them lived in the bazaar, in the town. The other kids, the Iban and Malay kids, lived in there, on site. They lived at the school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So were they walking from a great distance or transportation?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:86", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 5, "return_to_go": 20.42797864085835, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was just considered the school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Just the school?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. The kids, we had, the Chinese students came in every morning. Most of them lived in the bazaar, in the town. The other kids, the Iban and Malay kids, lived in there, on site. They lived at the school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So were they walking from a great distance or transportation?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. There was no, there wasn't a bus or anything. They usually rode their bikes, and though it was like a mile, mile and a half at the most. It wasn't much."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What about your typical workday? How would you describe that?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:96", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 20.44383247956502, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Who was, who was cooking the meals?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Cook father. I had a guy who was cook father, he, he cooked for, uh, for everybody. I mean, he cooked for the kids, and then he cooked for us as well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "At night?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Usually evening. Evening, evening."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You would do that?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:98", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 21.6042583106278, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Cook father. I had a guy who was cook father, he, he cooked for, uh, for everybody. I mean, he cooked for the kids, and then he cooked for us as well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "At night?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Usually evening. Evening, evening."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You would do that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Yeah, in the morning I would just get tea or something, a biscuit or something like that. But he would, uh, cook for us."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were the, the, how many teachers? You said there were two male teachers and others."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:100", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 24.004731456253108, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Usually evening. Evening, evening."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You would do that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Yeah, in the morning I would just get tea or something, a biscuit or something like that. But he would, uh, cook for us."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were the, the, how many teachers? You said there were two male teachers and others."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. I think we probably had, uh, uh. We probably had about, uh, I wish I had that picture I could show you. We had about ten teachers."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "The others lived nearby?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:102", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 25.56081272917012, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Yeah, in the morning I would just get tea or something, a biscuit or something like that. But he would, uh, cook for us."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were the, the, how many teachers? You said there were two male teachers and others."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. I think we probably had, uh, uh. We probably had about, uh, I wish I had that picture I could show you. We had about ten teachers."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "The others lived nearby?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Some lived in the little town. Uh, one. Actually the first, the first year, uh, one of the Chinese teachers lived with. She and I lived together, and then she later left, and I had my own little place. That was interesting too, because when we lived, when, uh, we lived together, um, again, the insurgency was still going on, and it wasn't uncommon to, I mean, sometimes the Malay soldiers who were posted by were nearby. They would come by and they'd visit, you know, these two single females, but they would come by and visit us. And it was not unusual to have 5 or 6 guns stacked up on the outside of your house, because I didn't want them in, but they needed to bring them. And so it was just a different thing. You just kind of accepted that, I guess."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So what about connecting with other volunteers during your service?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:104", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 10, "return_to_go": 23.9564585879668, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. I think we probably had, uh, uh. We probably had about, uh, I wish I had that picture I could show you. We had about ten teachers."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "The others lived nearby?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Some lived in the little town. Uh, one. Actually the first, the first year, uh, one of the Chinese teachers lived with. She and I lived together, and then she later left, and I had my own little place. That was interesting too, because when we lived, when, uh, we lived together, um, again, the insurgency was still going on, and it wasn't uncommon to, I mean, sometimes the Malay soldiers who were posted by were nearby. They would come by and they'd visit, you know, these two single females, but they would come by and visit us. And it was not unusual to have 5 or 6 guns stacked up on the outside of your house, because I didn't want them in, but they needed to bring them. And so it was just a different thing. You just kind of accepted that, I guess."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So what about connecting with other volunteers during your service?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "We would go into town. There were a number of volunteers who were in Kuching, in the main town, which was where the Peace Corps office was. So we would go in there sometimes on the weekend. It was a big trek, though. I mean, if you were going to do it, you had to do it. Um, I did, I didn't have my friend Don, who came the second year I was there. He lived in the town. Um, so he, he would, if he came up, he'd ride his bicycle up in the evenings or something. And we'd sit there and discuss the problems of the world and what we were doing in the middle of the jungle. And say, say, I'm not sure if I'm up for one more goddamn enchanted evening because it was always in the jungle supposed to be enchanted evenings. And we were like, yeah, well, we'll see."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Um, what was your relationship to Peace Corps staff? Did they help out at all?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:116", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 13.865054800000001, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We did. We went to Singapore and we went to, uh, Brunei. We traveled in country mostly. The only exception was when we did go to Singapore. But otherwise we'd travel in country and go to see other Peace Corps volunteers."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It sounds like your living arrangements were pretty steady throughout your entire time period."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I think we were very fortunate. I mean, we had, we had, you know, it wasn't primitive. I mean, we certainly had running water, although I didn't know. The first time I was there, we had, they would store the water in these big cement things inside your house. Well, I, I didn't know what my door. You were supposed to go in and dip the water and take your shower. Well, I didn't know that. I got in the cement thing. Well, I'll tell you, my roommate just, oh my God, she was horrified. She's like, what the hell is wrong with this woman? I'm sure she thought to herself. But I thought, it must be a shower. But it was awful, it was difficult to get into, but I thought, what do I know? So I'm in here ruining the whole water supply, you know, taking my shower. Like, no, no, let me explain. Just dip it. Okay. Splash and dip. Okay. Got it. So I only did that one time.\n\nUm, but, I mean, it was nice. We did have running water. I could cook if I wanted to, although God knows I didn't want to, but we had, like, you know, gas. Uh, I guess it was propane stoves and stuff. And toilets, which was very, very nice to have toilets."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Electricity?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Yeah. Yeah. It was, I mean, the British did something right. So we had a few things that were nice."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Um, looking back, what would you consider your, your main accomplishment as a volunteer?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00168:120", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 12.17908, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Yeah. Yeah. It was, I mean, the British did something right. So we had a few things that were nice."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Um, looking back, what would you consider your, your main accomplishment as a volunteer?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I think just being able, uh, you know, I did, uh, you had asked about did I have any contact with students? My friend Don still has contact with one, uh, woman, uh, who's, who we both taught, and now her daughter also writes to them. So I hear about her. But I think it was in what we did was say, this is how America looks. Um, because there was a war going on. There was, you know, we were in Vietnam and we were not telling the truth about what we were doing there. You know, we would listen to, uh, Armed Forces Radio and they'd say, well, we knew there were troops in country, for God's sake we could see them, you know? So, so, I think, uh, I mean, we just were not telling the truth.\n\nAnd I think, um, the fact that there was the insurrection that was going on with Indonesia, uh, we got, we learned, you know, I mean, there was, there was a lot of unsettled things. And somehow we were a little bit, there was some stability, but there was also a different face to us. We weren't necessarily all the people that were fighting all the time. We were trying to do something. And I know, I know my, like my girls, I mean, they were young girls. They were young, you know, ten, 12 years, 13 years old. But they appreciated, uh, what we were doing."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What, what grade levels did you teach?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was forms one through, uh, three, which is like, uh, middle, little middle school, kind of. Yeah, yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Um, have any regrets? But did you suggest changing sites? Just wondered about that. Was that an option? You were pretty deep into your second year already."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:5", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 14, "return_to_go": 33.829526767754245, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was born and raised in St. Louis in a suburb of Webster Groves, a very white, middle class community. My father was a lawyer, my mother a homemaker, and would have been an artist if she hadn't been a mother. And I had two older brothers, two and four years older. One of them became a lawyer. One of them tried to and ended up being a consultant in computer data processing they called it at the time. And I was the youngest of the three. A little more sensitive, a little more artistic, and not as good a student as my brothers. But then I went to University of Missouri for two years and then returned to St. Louis to go to Washington University and worked in a bookstore called the Book Nook. So I had a very middle class Midwest background for going to UCLA and then on to Ethiopia."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So your mother would have been an artist, but I'll bet she did a little of that artwork because frankly, I've seen some of your artwork and it's significant."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, you've probably also seen a little bit of hers too. She grew up in Illinois and went to a couple of colleges, ended up at Northwestern. And when she married my father, they moved to Colorado, where he went to law school and she got a master's in fine arts. And while my two brothers were very, very young, she was doing quite a bit of art at home, had some exhibitions at the St. Louis Art Museum, along with other amateurs in the community. And throughout her life and later after my father died, she did pursue her art through a study group. She also taught later as a widow in high school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So I'm not surprised now, now that I know of where your talent emerges."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Thank you."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. So there you are. You and Courtney are newlyweds and you immediately go off to Peace Corps training at UCLA. So tell us about that."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:13", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 24.73636148110691, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "History, culture, the ethnic groups, health, how to deliver a baby. But most of all, it was how to speak Amharic, which was the language of about 40 percent of Ethiopia, but it was the ruling class. So we did learn some Amharic and learned it fairly well. But by the time we got to Ethiopia as English teachers, I don't think our language improved a lot more after that because we felt our obligation was to use English with our students and we were with our students, not only throughout the class day, but just about every evening we would have students over just out of curiosity. They wanted to see who we were. See our kerosene generated refrigerator. Learn about America and see if maybe we would take them with us when we went home."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you're jumping into Ethiopia and understandably. And that's all right. Let me. Before I let you go from training and we might have something more, you might have something more to share about that. But I'm curious. So married couples, there were how many married couples in the group?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "20."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "20 married couples. And so you each had a little dorm room of your own, so they didn't put you in a communal space."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you did have some privacy."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:15", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 27.48484609011879, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "20."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "20 married couples. And so you each had a little dorm room of your own, so they didn't put you in a communal space."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you did have some privacy."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, that was civilized. OK, so and your training was, um, it was thorough it sounds like, and it had still had that physical training dimension, which was characteristic of the early years of Peace Corps training."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:17", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 28.316495655687543, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you did have some privacy."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, that was civilized. OK, so and your training was, um, it was thorough it sounds like, and it had still had that physical training dimension, which was characteristic of the early years of Peace Corps training."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I don't. What I've learned since then, I think probably the first and second years, particularly for those going to Latin America, was a lot more difficult. And from some people that I've talked to since then, it was a much more modified program. The physical demands were not great. It was mostly just a lot of class time learning about Ethiopia and how to work there and how to be teachers, frankly, because I think most of us were simply college graduates. So we did do some, uh, we monitored some classes in Los Angeles and did a lot of practice teaching. We had teachers trying to teach us how to do that. I think they did fairly well and we did the best we could."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was your own personal preparation in terms of college major?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:19", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 29.240550728541713, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, that was civilized. OK, so and your training was, um, it was thorough it sounds like, and it had still had that physical training dimension, which was characteristic of the early years of Peace Corps training."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I don't. What I've learned since then, I think probably the first and second years, particularly for those going to Latin America, was a lot more difficult. And from some people that I've talked to since then, it was a much more modified program. The physical demands were not great. It was mostly just a lot of class time learning about Ethiopia and how to work there and how to be teachers, frankly, because I think most of us were simply college graduates. So we did do some, uh, we monitored some classes in Los Angeles and did a lot of practice teaching. We had teachers trying to teach us how to do that. I think they did fairly well and we did the best we could."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was your own personal preparation in terms of college major?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I had several majors in college. French history, Russian history, art. Ended up with English literature, having no idea how I would apply that in the real world. But I wanted to be a writer or a teacher of English."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "OK, so this education was a new, a new bent for you."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:21", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 32.48950080949079, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I don't. What I've learned since then, I think probably the first and second years, particularly for those going to Latin America, was a lot more difficult. And from some people that I've talked to since then, it was a much more modified program. The physical demands were not great. It was mostly just a lot of class time learning about Ethiopia and how to work there and how to be teachers, frankly, because I think most of us were simply college graduates. So we did do some, uh, we monitored some classes in Los Angeles and did a lot of practice teaching. We had teachers trying to teach us how to do that. I think they did fairly well and we did the best we could."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was your own personal preparation in terms of college major?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I had several majors in college. French history, Russian history, art. Ended up with English literature, having no idea how I would apply that in the real world. But I wanted to be a writer or a teacher of English."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "OK, so this education was a new, a new bent for you."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mm hmm. Very much so."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Sounds like very much for other people in the group as well."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:23", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 11, "return_to_go": 36.099445343878656, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I had several majors in college. French history, Russian history, art. Ended up with English literature, having no idea how I would apply that in the real world. But I wanted to be a writer or a teacher of English."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "OK, so this education was a new, a new bent for you."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mm hmm. Very much so."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Sounds like very much for other people in the group as well."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So, OK. So we're at the end of training and you're raring to go, no doubt, to get to Ethiopia at long last. So tell us about that transition."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:25", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 27.88827260430962, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mm hmm. Very much so."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Sounds like very much for other people in the group as well."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So, OK. So we're at the end of training and you're raring to go, no doubt, to get to Ethiopia at long last. So tell us about that transition."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They gave us shots before we left UCLA. One of them is gamma globulin, which makes it virtually impossible to sit on a plane to fly from California to St. Louis and Kansas City. And before we left, one of the major concerns I think a lot of trainees had was the term selected out. There are several people who were selected out, one of whom was a man named Conrad Hirsch, who was probably one of the brightest and most creative of the volunteers. I don't know firsthand why he was selected out, but there were three, two or three reasons given in rumors around the campus. One was that he went to Reed College, which was quite liberal. Another was that he had a beard and none of the rest of us did in those days. I later did.\n\nAnd the third was that he had actually lived with a woman he was not married to. So my understanding was that he was selected out because somebody decided he wasn't going to be a desirable volunteer. When we finally got to Ethiopia, it was several days later, Conrad was already there and he became one of the best volunteers. I don't know how he got back into the Peace Corps, but it worked. When we left UCLA and flew to St. Louis and Kansas City to say goodbye to our families, we sold my car, which was a car that I'd inherited from my family, a little Ford Falcon. And we used the money while we were in New York to go to Boston to the Parker House, to spend the night and have Parker House rolls before we went to Ethiopia."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Tell us about Parker House rolls because not everybody knows that."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:27", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 5, "return_to_go": 30.986969560344022, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So, OK. So we're at the end of training and you're raring to go, no doubt, to get to Ethiopia at long last. So tell us about that transition."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They gave us shots before we left UCLA. One of them is gamma globulin, which makes it virtually impossible to sit on a plane to fly from California to St. Louis and Kansas City. And before we left, one of the major concerns I think a lot of trainees had was the term selected out. There are several people who were selected out, one of whom was a man named Conrad Hirsch, who was probably one of the brightest and most creative of the volunteers. I don't know firsthand why he was selected out, but there were three, two or three reasons given in rumors around the campus. One was that he went to Reed College, which was quite liberal. Another was that he had a beard and none of the rest of us did in those days. I later did.\n\nAnd the third was that he had actually lived with a woman he was not married to. So my understanding was that he was selected out because somebody decided he wasn't going to be a desirable volunteer. When we finally got to Ethiopia, it was several days later, Conrad was already there and he became one of the best volunteers. I don't know how he got back into the Peace Corps, but it worked. When we left UCLA and flew to St. Louis and Kansas City to say goodbye to our families, we sold my car, which was a car that I'd inherited from my family, a little Ford Falcon. And we used the money while we were in New York to go to Boston to the Parker House, to spend the night and have Parker House rolls before we went to Ethiopia."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Tell us about Parker House rolls because not everybody knows that."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I'm sure that they're better than what we were buying in the grocery stores, but I don't remember them frankly, it's been so long."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Obviously, it was a destination you wanted to get to."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:31", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 5, "return_to_go": 32.08267846956052, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I'm sure that they're better than what we were buying in the grocery stores, but I don't remember them frankly, it's been so long."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Obviously, it was a destination you wanted to get to."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was one of the few things we thought we could afford to do and had time to do before we all got on the plane to fly TWA to Addis Ababa. The flight, I recall we ended up in sitting in Khartoum for several hours before we could complete the flight. Other than that, it was fairly interesting. We did stop in Athens and watched a new king's marriage I believe it was. It was the first time we pledged to ourselves we would never, ever again stand on the street corner for royalty. It was an exhausting, embarrassing experience and we actually missed most of it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So this wedding was taking place in a public outdoor area?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, it was. Athens was celebrating. I believe it was the wedding of the king. And all I remember about the hotel because they, when we landed in Athens, everyone had, I think we had two or three rooms. You could just kind of catch a nap, but most people wanted to go out and see things. It was the first time I ever saw a bidet and I thought it was the place where you brush your teeth. So I think I can fairly say that both Courtney and I were very young, very naive, very impressionable, and we were about to enter a country that was not naive and was very impressive and in some ways very frightening."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you're on your way now. You stop over in Greece and then you catch another flight on to Addis Ababa. So tell us about landing there and what did you do when you got there?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:43", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 27.031558478853764, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was. In order to get there from Addis, although we went to Dire Dawa to take a Land Rover to Asebe Teferi, generally what you'd do is you get on the train and ride about seven hours to a little desert town called Mieso, which is about halfway to Dire Dawa. And you get off the train in Mieso and you wait for a bus, a little, you know, a 20-seater bus that has a lot of loud music. And that bus will drive you up into the mountains to up to Asebe Teferi. And that's about maybe 45 minutes or an hour ride."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And that's the way you had to travel when you were on your own, when you didn't have the opportunity to meet the Peace Corps doctor."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. And usually in order to get from Asebe Teferi to Addis, we would take the bus back down to Mieso and get on a night train. And that's one of the more exciting experiences of life in Ethiopia. There were three classes of train and we took the third class car and I generally ended up tucked under a bench along with some trussed chickens. People sitting above us on the benches were Ethiopian women taking their chickens to market. And when I wanted a little fresh air, I would go to the end of the car. And I don't recall that there were doors on these cars. You just kind of grab on to a railing before you would step off the train. But this train is going quite fast through the dark and the desert, and you could just hang on to that bar and sit on that lower step and just feel the cold desert air running by and in the darkness see little lights off in the distance."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And that's how you got fresh air."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Good fun."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Memorable. And so why did you end up under a bench along with the chickens?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:45", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 30.03506497650418, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. And usually in order to get from Asebe Teferi to Addis, we would take the bus back down to Mieso and get on a night train. And that's one of the more exciting experiences of life in Ethiopia. There were three classes of train and we took the third class car and I generally ended up tucked under a bench along with some trussed chickens. People sitting above us on the benches were Ethiopian women taking their chickens to market. And when I wanted a little fresh air, I would go to the end of the car. And I don't recall that there were doors on these cars. You just kind of grab on to a railing before you would step off the train. But this train is going quite fast through the dark and the desert, and you could just hang on to that bar and sit on that lower step and just feel the cold desert air running by and in the darkness see little lights off in the distance."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And that's how you got fresh air."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Good fun."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Memorable. And so why did you end up under a bench along with the chickens?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "They were always crowded, particularly third class. I don't think that first class had many customers. And we just, I don't know what, I don't remember what the price was for first class. But it seemed ridiculously high."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And not in your budget as a Peace Corps volunteer."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:47", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 33.37229441833798, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Good fun."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Memorable. And so why did you end up under a bench along with the chickens?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "They were always crowded, particularly third class. I don't think that first class had many customers. And we just, I don't know what, I don't remember what the price was for first class. But it seemed ridiculously high."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And not in your budget as a Peace Corps volunteer."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Did any of the Ethiopians ask you why you weren't riding first class since you were obviously an expat?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:49", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 37.08032713148664, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They were always crowded, particularly third class. I don't think that first class had many customers. And we just, I don't know what, I don't remember what the price was for first class. But it seemed ridiculously high."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And not in your budget as a Peace Corps volunteer."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Did any of the Ethiopians ask you why you weren't riding first class since you were obviously an expat?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't think we had many conversations with Ethiopians on the night train. Most of them on third class didn't speak any English, and we were just absolutely strange to them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Subjects of observation and puzzlement. Right."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:51", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 6, "return_to_go": 41.2003634794296, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Did any of the Ethiopians ask you why you weren't riding first class since you were obviously an expat?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't think we had many conversations with Ethiopians on the night train. Most of them on third class didn't speak any English, and we were just absolutely strange to them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Subjects of observation and puzzlement. Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Or they really didn't care."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's, yes, a possibility too, isn't it? So tell us about your life in your village."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:53", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 6, "return_to_go": 39.111514977144, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't think we had many conversations with Ethiopians on the night train. Most of them on third class didn't speak any English, and we were just absolutely strange to them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Subjects of observation and puzzlement. Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Or they really didn't care."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's, yes, a possibility too, isn't it? So tell us about your life in your village."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We, the four of us, Pat, Eileen, Courtney and I, were driven to a seven-room house that was directly behind the school, which is called, uh. Let's see. Uppaseitom. I've remembered this all of my life. Let's see. In Amharic it's [inaudible], but this particular one's [inaudible]. No. [name in Amharic] And it was a school for probably kindergarten through eighth grade, and we were to be the four teachers that would augment the current Ethiopian staff so they could start a ninth and then a 10th grade in the school.\n\nAnd I think that most of these students had very good support from their parents because they wanted us to. They wanted these children to learn and stay in their own town instead of having to, uh. Many of these students came from little villages all around and even down near Mieso in the desert. So they were able to come to this school rather than go way down to the larger, much larger town of Dire Dawa at a school where many of them would get into trouble. So because we were able to offer additional grades in the school, which after we left became a twelve grade school. We got a lot of support from the parents about making sure the children were there and very committed to their studies. And most of those kids were very good students and tried very hard."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So it sounds like this was a new school then that was being developed by the government or by the local community? Who was behind it?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:71", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 31.924127732810724, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yep."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. What did this man teach when he was teaching?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I believe he was teaching English, but I think every teacher had several classes. They taught different classes. For example, I taught English, social studies, math. And Courtney taught English and geography and a couple of other courses. She also got to teach in some of the lower grades, but mostly for the four of us as teachers in the school, we were teaching in seventh and eighth and ninth and then tenth grades."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "As the year went on or as the two years went on? Because you were adding a year each year."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "OK, so tell us about your experience of teaching. We've already talked about how education as a methodology and as a discipline was new to you. You were trained, you were introduced to it in training in terms of how you would, how people learn and how the best way to be a good, effective teacher. And then you were dropped in this village and asked to teach, assigned to teach in a high school."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:73", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 10, "return_to_go": 35.47125303645636, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I believe he was teaching English, but I think every teacher had several classes. They taught different classes. For example, I taught English, social studies, math. And Courtney taught English and geography and a couple of other courses. She also got to teach in some of the lower grades, but mostly for the four of us as teachers in the school, we were teaching in seventh and eighth and ninth and then tenth grades."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "As the year went on or as the two years went on? Because you were adding a year each year."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "OK, so tell us about your experience of teaching. We've already talked about how education as a methodology and as a discipline was new to you. You were trained, you were introduced to it in training in terms of how you would, how people learn and how the best way to be a good, effective teacher. And then you were dropped in this village and asked to teach, assigned to teach in a high school."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What kind of resources did you find and how did you put together your, the content of your curriculum?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:81", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 37.587643707447576, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And what were the Ethiopian teachers using, if they. I'm assuming they had no textbooks either."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Technically they were supposed to be teaching in English after the sixth grade, but I don't think that all of them did. So they might have been relying on textbooks in Amharic from the government school system."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And some of those were available at the school?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Or in the personal libraries, perhaps, of the teachers."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:83", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 9, "return_to_go": 39.54182634160841, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Technically they were supposed to be teaching in English after the sixth grade, but I don't think that all of them did. So they might have been relying on textbooks in Amharic from the government school system."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And some of those were available at the school?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Or in the personal libraries, perhaps, of the teachers."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think as is probably the habit with many teachers who taught for several years, they developed their own little curriculum and their own set of information to use over and over each year. We didn't have that kind of experience, so we needed some fresh material."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Was there a prescribed curriculum that you had to cover?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:85", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 19, "return_to_go": 33.93536260178712, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Or in the personal libraries, perhaps, of the teachers."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think as is probably the habit with many teachers who taught for several years, they developed their own little curriculum and their own set of information to use over and over each year. We didn't have that kind of experience, so we needed some fresh material."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Was there a prescribed curriculum that you had to cover?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I'm sure there was. I don't remember what it was, but it was. For example, a Courtney was supposed to, in geography, teach each continent separately. And, you know, one semester you taught North America and another you taught Europe and another Asia and then Latin America. And she thought it. What she experienced was a little bit of a backlash from students who resented having to spend an entire semester on North America. Because at those times we were having, even before the Vietnam War, there were many issues about U.S. involvement in other countries in Africa and. While they really were interested in what we had to say, they were being, they were very suspicious of what our views were about Elvis Presley or Cassius Clay or any of the conflicts in the world."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So they were curious, right. And opened up these conversations with you."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:93", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 22.763850940080953, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. And so because he had a different name in the United States, you did not know with whom you were working up until. And I wonder if he knew. Did he know your name?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, he didn't."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "In your Voice of America capacity?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "As far as I know, based on the telephone conversation we had after he'd returned to Atlanta, he was not aware of who I was or who the person was that was supervising the broadcast, because I didn't go on the air. I was just an administrator. I would work with government officials in Ethiopia and occasionally travel there to try to negotiate more licenses for stringers. But other than that, I was not a presence on the broadcasts."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Other people were speaking and broadcasting. Uh huh. Right."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:95", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 25.293167711201058, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, he didn't."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "In your Voice of America capacity?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "As far as I know, based on the telephone conversation we had after he'd returned to Atlanta, he was not aware of who I was or who the person was that was supervising the broadcast, because I didn't go on the air. I was just an administrator. I would work with government officials in Ethiopia and occasionally travel there to try to negotiate more licenses for stringers. But other than that, I was not a presence on the broadcasts."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Other people were speaking and broadcasting. Uh huh. Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And it wasn't until you telephoned him that he knew your name."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:97", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 28.103519679112285, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "As far as I know, based on the telephone conversation we had after he'd returned to Atlanta, he was not aware of who I was or who the person was that was supervising the broadcast, because I didn't go on the air. I was just an administrator. I would work with government officials in Ethiopia and occasionally travel there to try to negotiate more licenses for stringers. But other than that, I was not a presence on the broadcasts."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Other people were speaking and broadcasting. Uh huh. Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And it wasn't until you telephoned him that he knew your name."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Heard your name and he remembered you."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:99", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 31.226132976791426, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And it wasn't until you telephoned him that he knew your name."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Heard your name and he remembered you."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And what about this guitar he made? Do you and Courtney still have that by chance?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:101", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 8, "return_to_go": 33.58459219643492, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Heard your name and he remembered you."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And what about this guitar he made? Do you and Courtney still have that by chance?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, we don't, and I don't know what happened to it. As with many decades of life, there are some things that we have lost and that's one of them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes. Well, you've had several moves across the country and things get lost in that. Wow, so that's a great story of a former student who has made a major impact to record this language that otherwise had never been written. Is that?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:103", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 28.427324662705466, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And what about this guitar he made? Do you and Courtney still have that by chance?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, we don't, and I don't know what happened to it. As with many decades of life, there are some things that we have lost and that's one of them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes. Well, you've had several moves across the country and things get lost in that. Wow, so that's a great story of a former student who has made a major impact to record this language that otherwise had never been written. Is that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. In fact, when later in my life on an AID contract to propose a media training center in Addis for Ethiopia, Eritrea, Kenya, Uganda, and Tanzania. The U.S. government was interested in creating this training center in Addis and wanted me to explore the possibility and interview people in each of those countries to see if it was possible and propose a curriculum, a way of funding it, which I did. But while I was there, I did run into, uh, I didn't run into. I actually had an appointment to meet with Mingesha Woltom McHale, who was another one of our young students. Mingesha was one of the most earnest and dedicated students that we knew. Very, very young.\n\nAll these boys, the younger boys, were barefoot and wore torn shorts and torn shirts. They were all from very poor families and Mingesha was one that was almost every afternoon at our house and just so curious about who we were and how much he could learn. He may not have been the absolute most, the brightest student in the class, but he was the most dedicated to learning. And he did become quite a good friend of ours over the years, although he never came to the United States and died several years ago."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you get to find him when you were in Addis Ababa?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:119", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 27.67670657819782, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not much. Because we were inexperienced teachers and had, at least in the beginning, very few resources to prepare for classes, we spent just about every weekday evening sitting at a little table in our house with a Chinese macho. It's called the Aeroplane, A-E-R-O-P-L-A-N-E, was the brand of the kerosene lantern from China that had a very large hood over it. And we would sit on either side of the table from this macho lantern that gave us our light and do our lesson plans and just do all of the work that a teacher is supposed to be doing at night. Friday nights, we would often go to a bar called the Rocket Bar, and this would all at that time be spelled in the particular alphabet of the Amharic language.\n\nAnd incidentally, when I went back many years later. After the one particular government, the Derg, was replaced and there was more of an effort by the new government to create ethnic diversity within the country, the Oromo region, which we lived in, decided to adopt the Roman alphabet. And so when I went back to visit the Rocket Bar with Mingesha, I could spell it because it was all in English."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Uh huh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not in the Amharic language."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was interesting the very change that had occurred."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So the same bar was there, the same name, but inscribed in different alphabet."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:121", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 28.529673975775356, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not in the Amharic language."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was interesting the very change that had occurred."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So the same bar was there, the same name, but inscribed in different alphabet."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Very little changed in the 20 or 30 years since we were teachers there. And with the exception of the fact that there was a brand- new school a little further up the valley. Not a very modern school, and unfortunately, because of Mengesha's illness, I wasn't able to see it. But did see my old school, which was at the time, I think, abandoned."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Hmm. So it wasn't operating then."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:125", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 5, "return_to_go": 35.22181972317945, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Very little changed in the 20 or 30 years since we were teachers there. And with the exception of the fact that there was a brand- new school a little further up the valley. Not a very modern school, and unfortunately, because of Mengesha's illness, I wasn't able to see it. But did see my old school, which was at the time, I think, abandoned."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Hmm. So it wasn't operating then."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Very hard."}, {"role": "user", "content": "What was your question? I think I might have missed something here."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No, I think. I asked about your social life."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:129", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 35.0886663249129, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "What was your question? I think I might have missed something here."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No, I think. I asked about your social life."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh. The social life. On the weekends we would go hiking and the mountain at the end of our valley was called Jelo Mountain, which in English we were told either means crooked finger or crooked penis. I don't recall whether anyone argued better for one translation or the other. But it was a beautiful mountain and we would take a couple of donkeys and some students and we would hike up to the top of the mountain and camp. And we did this at least once. And one night Muhammad Tahir and I were out trying to corral the one of the runaway donkeys. But it was exciting to him. It was a beautiful country. Most of the trees were eucalyptus, which was an imported tree from Australia.\n\nAnd in fact, when I went back many years later to Asebe Teferi and I mentioned that almost nothing had changed. The one thing that had changed was that they had adopted a new tree that people there called the Truman tree, which is a smaller, less magnificent tree, but apparently has something to do with reducing the population of flies."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Flies were something that Courtney and I became very aware of before we got to Ethiopia, when we had, uh, let me go back a bit. When I called Courtney from Washington, D.C., and announced that we'd had an invitation to go to Ethiopia, and she said yes, we were at her parents' house either before or after the wedding and were watching a television show. Ironically, it was showing Peace Corps volunteers. And they were talking about their work, and they kept waving their hands in front of their faces, trying to keep the flies away. I don't think flies were that big a problem in Ethiopia, but for some it did. And for the town of Asebe Teferi, it was very, they were very grateful to have their Truman trees because they thought it reduced the fly population."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But you don't know that for a fact?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:131", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 7, "return_to_go": 38.987407027681, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh. The social life. On the weekends we would go hiking and the mountain at the end of our valley was called Jelo Mountain, which in English we were told either means crooked finger or crooked penis. I don't recall whether anyone argued better for one translation or the other. But it was a beautiful mountain and we would take a couple of donkeys and some students and we would hike up to the top of the mountain and camp. And we did this at least once. And one night Muhammad Tahir and I were out trying to corral the one of the runaway donkeys. But it was exciting to him. It was a beautiful country. Most of the trees were eucalyptus, which was an imported tree from Australia.\n\nAnd in fact, when I went back many years later to Asebe Teferi and I mentioned that almost nothing had changed. The one thing that had changed was that they had adopted a new tree that people there called the Truman tree, which is a smaller, less magnificent tree, but apparently has something to do with reducing the population of flies."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Flies were something that Courtney and I became very aware of before we got to Ethiopia, when we had, uh, let me go back a bit. When I called Courtney from Washington, D.C., and announced that we'd had an invitation to go to Ethiopia, and she said yes, we were at her parents' house either before or after the wedding and were watching a television show. Ironically, it was showing Peace Corps volunteers. And they were talking about their work, and they kept waving their hands in front of their faces, trying to keep the flies away. I don't think flies were that big a problem in Ethiopia, but for some it did. And for the town of Asebe Teferi, it was very, they were very grateful to have their Truman trees because they thought it reduced the fly population."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But you don't know that for a fact?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'll never know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. In your own house, did you have screens on your windows and doors?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:139", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 7, "return_to_go": 48.75385921, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Ammina and Mohammed are, at least as of today I believe, in very good health. Older. They have many sons, I think one daughter. And during the course of raising their family, they offered to send any one of their children to our care in the United States, but we didn't accept the invitation."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So, all right. Before we talk about sort of your close of service and leaving Ethiopia and your next phase of life, are there other stories or events that you want to include?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I think that's it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You think you've covered a lot of the things about your years of service."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Some of it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Some of it, right. Some of it. All right. What about now as you approach the end of your two years as a Peace Corps volunteer in the village? What was your feeling and how did you proceed towards your departure?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:141", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 21, "return_to_go": 46.3931769, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I think that's it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You think you've covered a lot of the things about your years of service."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Some of it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Some of it, right. Some of it. All right. What about now as you approach the end of your two years as a Peace Corps volunteer in the village? What was your feeling and how did you proceed towards your departure?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "We were. We had enjoyed our two years. I think both of us were concerned about what was going on in the United States at that time. Many things had occurred and in fact later we've always felt a little hole in the history of our hearts about not being able to experience some of the things that went on in the United States during that time. We were eager to come home, but Peace Corps was looking for experienced volunteers to serve in Micronesia. And we considered it but decided it was really time to go home. So when we left, we did the obligatory travel through Europe and go to Istanbul, Beirut, Athens, Munich. Buy a Volkswagen in Munich, have it shipped home. Then go to France and England and then go to New York and wait for the car to arrive."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And how long did that take? How many weeks did you travel?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:151", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 12, "return_to_go": 12.81, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Well, before we close this wonderful, lively interview. Thank you so much. Are there any other final comments you would like to make?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "The one about the term Peace Corps applies to everything we have done and did. But my feeling about the experiences. I'm extremely grateful to the federal agency for the opportunity to spend that two years in Ethiopia and to open my eyes to the rest of the world. But I think what had the greater impact to me was Ethiopia and the people who lived there and the students we worked with and what we learned about ourselves as a very young couple trying to be schoolteachers in a faraway country."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "An enlightening."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Mm hmm. Very much so."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. And one last quick question here to bring us up to date. So you and Courtney were married just before you went into Peace Corps and when you came back I know you had two children. Will you tell us just a bit about your children?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00059:159", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Certainly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "As I recall."}, {"role": "user", "content": "When we were, we did when we were living in Nairobi. Both of them decided they wanted to come over and live with us for six months or a year. So they had their own international experience in that way. And it was wonderful for all of us."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Absolutely."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Probably the best time in our lives."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Wonderful. Thank you again, David, for a very, very interesting conversation."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00477:53", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 2.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think everybody can step outside their boxes and contribute, and as they do, it’s generally recognized. I think those are the fun things. If you find a solution in the box, that’s fun, but if you find a better one outside the box, that’s even more fun. It doesn’t hurt to have leaders that say, “Within a decade.”"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "There’s right. Well, if you don’t mind, I’d like to have Sandra and Jennifer step outside their box running the equipment and step into their historian mode and ask some questions, if they have any."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Sure."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I don’t actually think I have any right now. Thank you."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Thank you."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I was just wondering, you were talking about the escape vehicle and how much different what they came up with was from what they actually used, the Soyuz. Was it just as simple?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00454:3", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 36.87830949741054, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, this is the one that's in Gene's [Eugene F. Kranz] book, Failure is Not an Option, and then the others are kept by Ron [Ronald C.] Epps over in MOD [Missions Operations Directorate]. I assume when he retires he's going to hand those over to someone else. We kept all of our old console logs, too, and we have a curator of all the old console logs because periodically one of these people that's wanting to write a book, they'll say, \"Come talk to me about Apollo 12,\" or Gemini 76 [Gemini VII/Gemini VI] or something. The thing is, you can do is go get that log book and look in there and refresh your memory of what happened in great detail. So it was our console log."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So those are kept on site still? Does somebody else now keep them?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Well, Ron Epps has both the Captain REFSMMAT and the logs, either that or someone in his organization. He has the Flight Design Division now, and there may be one of the people at a different level that are actually keeping those."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, that's certainly a valuable item to hang onto, as you said."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It is nice to be able to go back and remember."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes. Well, thank you for bringing that in and sharing it with us."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00454:5", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 10, "return_to_go": 40.975899441567265, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Well, Ron Epps has both the Captain REFSMMAT and the logs, either that or someone in his organization. He has the Flight Design Division now, and there may be one of the people at a different level that are actually keeping those."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, that's certainly a valuable item to hang onto, as you said."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It is nice to be able to go back and remember."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes. Well, thank you for bringing that in and sharing it with us."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Okay. You're welcome."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Last time we had talked about most of the early Apollo missions, and we had kind of built up to Apollo 13. Obviously, that was a very involved time for everyone once the mission got underway and things started to happen. If you could tell us some about your involvement on that. You were on Gene Kranz's team during the mission. So if you could tell us about what was happening when it first started. What were you thinking? How serious was it recognized to be at first? Kind of work us through the mission, if you would."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00454:39", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 54.32570148219833, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It has pretty much this drawing. Probably all these symbols weren't on here. But otherwise, pretty much this drawing and every version that was turned in as a suggestion."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, that would certainly be interesting. We could make copies. What did you say the band represented? I think you started to say, but—"}, {"role": "user", "content": "This part?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You said the band going across."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, it was just a way to get the words on there, and I kind of let it overlap and go around to show that it was sort of encompassing this part of the space program.\\n\\n The sigma was Gene's idea. As you know, the sigma represents science and engineering and it's the sum of it all. So I thought that would be a good way to do that. That's pretty much exactly the sigma that I drew. McCall I don't think changed that part at all."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's certainly interesting."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00454:41", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 60.36189053577593, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "This part?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You said the band going across."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, it was just a way to get the words on there, and I kind of let it overlap and go around to show that it was sort of encompassing this part of the space program.\\n\\n The sigma was Gene's idea. As you know, the sigma represents science and engineering and it's the sum of it all. So I thought that would be a good way to do that. That's pretty much exactly the sigma that I drew. McCall I don't think changed that part at all."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's certainly interesting."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I didn't know that was in there. That's neat."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes. The mission control, mission operations team certainly did have a huge part to play in the mission, so it's fitting."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00454:43", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 67.06876726197325, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, it was just a way to get the words on there, and I kind of let it overlap and go around to show that it was sort of encompassing this part of the space program.\\n\\n The sigma was Gene's idea. As you know, the sigma represents science and engineering and it's the sum of it all. So I thought that would be a good way to do that. That's pretty much exactly the sigma that I drew. McCall I don't think changed that part at all."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's certainly interesting."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I didn't know that was in there. That's neat."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes. The mission control, mission operations team certainly did have a huge part to play in the mission, so it's fitting."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And that was just another item like Captain REFSMMAT and the patches. Gene was always interested in things that would make the spirit and the morale of the people because he knew that we had a tough job. We were spending a lot of time away from our families, so he wanted to do things that would make us feel a little better about what we were doing. I don't think a lot of the people perhaps consciously acknowledged that. I think subconsciously they probably enjoyed a lot of the things that he did or felt better about them and their morale was better, but I'm not sure that it really struck them that it was something he was doing to try to help the organization."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It certainly is important to try and keep that whole team atmosphere and that morale, keep everyone working together."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00454:45", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 18, "return_to_go": 74.52085251330361, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I didn't know that was in there. That's neat."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes. The mission control, mission operations team certainly did have a huge part to play in the mission, so it's fitting."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And that was just another item like Captain REFSMMAT and the patches. Gene was always interested in things that would make the spirit and the morale of the people because he knew that we had a tough job. We were spending a lot of time away from our families, so he wanted to do things that would make us feel a little better about what we were doing. I don't think a lot of the people perhaps consciously acknowledged that. I think subconsciously they probably enjoyed a lot of the things that he did or felt better about them and their morale was better, but I'm not sure that it really struck them that it was something he was doing to try to help the organization."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It certainly is important to try and keep that whole team atmosphere and that morale, keep everyone working together."}, {"role": "user", "content": "What we had was not any good at all unless the team all worked together. Everyone had to be a team player. We had so many exceptional people who, by themselves, could do so much, that it was difficult sometimes to make them want to be team players, because they had the capability to go be superstars, you know. That was all part of it, too, was to be team players."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, the team changed a little bit in between the Apollo and Skylab missions and Shuttle when you moved into the Apollo-Soyuz mission, had a completely different aspect on things, bringing in the Russians, who you'd previously been in competition with and in some circles were actually considered enemies, on the military front to an extent.\\n\\n Could you tell us something about your involvement in that side of Apollo-Soyuz and how that may have affected the atmosphere, both at NASA and in general?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00454:63", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 62.20742629154961, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "There was not much hint of whether there might be additional ones. After having gone through that, the people that worked it hoped that there would, because we rather enjoyed it, more from the standpoint of just a cooperative thing and learning a little bit more about how they did business and how we could do business together.\\n\\n The other side of that was we felt a little bit cheated that they got a lot more technical insight and benefit out of it than we did. It was not fifty-fifty as far as the technical part of it. But once you past that and said, \"Okay, I understand that,\" then it was nice to have a project that was cooperative and international that worked. So, you know, there was interest in NASA, but I guess it just never quite came together until this Space Station thing."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "A few years later, but hopefully they were able to build on some of these experiences that you had learned."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I think maybe we'll take a brief break here."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And then we'll finish off with Shuttle.\\n\\n [Recording interrupted]\n\n...after Apollo-Soyuz, and you had already been working in the Mission Plans and Requirements section, and you talked a little bit about that earlier on, for Shuttle and planning for the Shuttle missions. Before Shuttle became fully operational, in '77, I think, you moved into the Operations Integration Branch. What were you working on there and what was your ties?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00454:65", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 43, "return_to_go": 65.7860292128329, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I think maybe we'll take a brief break here."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And then we'll finish off with Shuttle.\\n\\n [Recording interrupted]\n\n...after Apollo-Soyuz, and you had already been working in the Mission Plans and Requirements section, and you talked a little bit about that earlier on, for Shuttle and planning for the Shuttle missions. Before Shuttle became fully operational, in '77, I think, you moved into the Operations Integration Branch. What were you working on there and what was your ties?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Actually, the Integrations Branch was a continuation of the planning for the Shuttle control center, for the procedures. We needed a starting point for the flight rules, and we, of course, had not—this was a very different-type program because, for example, we didn't land in the water; we would land on runways. So we needed to have a group of people go out and establish a starting point for where would be the places we could land and then how many of these would we want to equip so that we could land. So I had a group of people that started planning for what you might call a runway landing plan for the Shuttle, and that was going on, and we were also doing the planning for evolving the actual control center itself. That was the largest part of it.\\n\\n And how we would work in the control center in detail, who would do what, how many shifts a day would you work? We were doing the planning for the overall team. So the mission plans that we had would go across the whole team, and then what we would want to do is use the technology that was coming up, but what we had learned from the earlier programs, fold that into the procedures that we would have for the control center. So that was really our main challenge there.\\n\\n About a year before the first Shuttle was supposed to launch, I was selected as a branch chief in the Flight Planning Branch. I don't know if you had that on your list or not."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I don't know that I did. Was this when you were operations division chief and assistant for operations in MOD?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00454:79", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.2314410000000002, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was quite different, and it took a while to have that feel comfortable."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "More on-the-job training of sorts as you were going through all of this, learning as you went on."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Throughout this time frame, when you were working on the Shuttle program in all these different areas, are there any events, either related to missions or related to planning budgets or anything in there, that stand out in your mind? Any memorable moments or even things relating to people?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Let's see. Well, one of the really bright moments was the first time that we were able to use our new control center. That was completely different technology. It was going to allow us to operate in a quite different way because we had always been very dependent on, as I mentioned earlier, the large computers and centralized. This would allow us to use a distributed computing system and PCs. The problem that it presented was, our controllers had to have extra training because they had to know how to operate the computer part of it.\\n\\n But bringing that system on line was a really proud day for me because we had seen, probably from seven or eight years before that, coming up with the ideas about what we needed, just drawing little squares on pieces of paper for what we were going to need in a control center, and now to see the control center actually open for business was really a proud moment.\\n\\n I guess seeing that first Shuttle land and all that working was outstanding, too, because we had done the approach and landing test where we dropped it off of the back of the carrier aircraft. We'd done those in California. But we'd never really done landing out of orbit before. Of course, these all had to be pinpoint landings. You wanted to be there at the landing strip. So that was pretty exciting and made me feel really proud to have it come back and land right where it was supposed to."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you get to be out there at the landing strip to watch it, or were you watching it from mission control, watched the landing?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00454:81", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 3.59049, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Throughout this time frame, when you were working on the Shuttle program in all these different areas, are there any events, either related to missions or related to planning budgets or anything in there, that stand out in your mind? Any memorable moments or even things relating to people?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Let's see. Well, one of the really bright moments was the first time that we were able to use our new control center. That was completely different technology. It was going to allow us to operate in a quite different way because we had always been very dependent on, as I mentioned earlier, the large computers and centralized. This would allow us to use a distributed computing system and PCs. The problem that it presented was, our controllers had to have extra training because they had to know how to operate the computer part of it.\\n\\n But bringing that system on line was a really proud day for me because we had seen, probably from seven or eight years before that, coming up with the ideas about what we needed, just drawing little squares on pieces of paper for what we were going to need in a control center, and now to see the control center actually open for business was really a proud moment.\\n\\n I guess seeing that first Shuttle land and all that working was outstanding, too, because we had done the approach and landing test where we dropped it off of the back of the carrier aircraft. We'd done those in California. But we'd never really done landing out of orbit before. Of course, these all had to be pinpoint landings. You wanted to be there at the landing strip. So that was pretty exciting and made me feel really proud to have it come back and land right where it was supposed to."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you get to be out there at the landing strip to watch it, or were you watching it from mission control, watched the landing?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, from the control center.\\n\\n That's probably the high points for me."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Looking back over your whole career with NASA, Shuttle, early programs, what would you consider your most significant accomplishment or contribution, and what would you consider your biggest challenge throughout that time?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00454:95", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Okay. Thanks."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Looking back, would you ever have imagined where your career would have led you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not at all. As a matter of fact, I had this vision when I was getting ready to graduate from college that I wanted to work for NASA, and as I mentioned to you, it was my very last offer, but it was just sort of a \"gleam in your eye\" type thing. Frankly, the whole space program unfolded almost from nothing during the period of time when I was working there. Looking back on it, I really feel so fortunate to have been in the right place, because there are talented people coming out of college right now, and the most exciting thing they're going to have to do is, if they sit down around the table with me and we talked about it, they would be disappointed, because we really had the cream of the crop as far as excitement and experiences and opportunities. I'm so grateful for that, that I did have that opportunity.\\n\\n You could almost see within a program sometimes how it was going to unfold, but then when the next program came along, it was so different, and it just captured your imagination and whisked you away. We in the group, my age group, that were in NASA were extremely fortunate to have the opportunity, because if one day they go back to the Moon, I think the people that are involved in that will love it. Of course, they'll have a lot of new things available to them, but that's the kind of thing that possibly will never happen again."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You certainly were fortunate, and we're fortunate that you've shared those experiences with us.\\n\\n Is there anything you can think of that we haven't touched on?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'd like to thank you all for doing this. I think it's a great idea, and hopefully there'll be some benefit down the road. Of course, I want to thank my family for being there for me."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, thank you very much. We certainly do hope this will be of benefit. It's been a benefit to us, and we appreciate you coming in."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00310:25", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 88.76279011309666, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, of course, during the mission, you blot all that out of your mind. You get extremely focused, just as Kranz would say failure is not an option. Let’s focus on what we have to do now to get this crew back. So our only thoughts were, “What’s the oxygen margin? What’s the water margin? What’s the power margin? How are the systems holding up? You mean you found a way to charge the command module batteries? That’s wonderful!” Just day at a time, hour at a time. “Why does the trajectory keep”—was it steepening or shallowing? I’m trying to remember. On the way back, they had them on the perfect trajectory to the entry corridor. I think it shallowed out a little bit."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They made a couple of mid-course corrections. It turned out, after the mission, somebody said it was the lunar module water boiler that was causing this very slight delta-V that would cause it to shallow out. Trying to figure out mysteries like that and stay focused, and hoping the crew was okay. Watching as they dealt with Fred [W.] Haise’s [Jr.] kidney infection and all of that afterward.\\n\\n Only then did you think a little bit about the investigation. I wasn’t involved in that in any substantive way, so it seemed to me that they rather rapidly and fortunately discovered the anomaly in the handling of that oxygen tank and the anomalous way in which it had been emptied, I believe, after a test, as I recall, and were able therefore to pinpoint the cause and write it off with confidence, inspect the histories and the hardware in the subsequent service modules and say, “We’re go.” So it didn’t seem to take that long, actually."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No, it didn’t."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I’m trying to remember what the dates were. April 1970 was Apollo 13. And when did we fly 14?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It was January '71."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00310:27", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 97.51421123677406, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They made a couple of mid-course corrections. It turned out, after the mission, somebody said it was the lunar module water boiler that was causing this very slight delta-V that would cause it to shallow out. Trying to figure out mysteries like that and stay focused, and hoping the crew was okay. Watching as they dealt with Fred [W.] Haise’s [Jr.] kidney infection and all of that afterward.\\n\\n Only then did you think a little bit about the investigation. I wasn’t involved in that in any substantive way, so it seemed to me that they rather rapidly and fortunately discovered the anomaly in the handling of that oxygen tank and the anomalous way in which it had been emptied, I believe, after a test, as I recall, and were able therefore to pinpoint the cause and write it off with confidence, inspect the histories and the hardware in the subsequent service modules and say, “We’re go.” So it didn’t seem to take that long, actually."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No, it didn’t."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I’m trying to remember what the dates were. April 1970 was Apollo 13. And when did we fly 14?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It was January '71."}, {"role": "user", "content": "January of ’71. I mean, that’s really short. Look at how long it took us after the\\n\\n Challenger\\n\\n accident to get back to flying."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "In this case you had Al Shepard finally getting his ride on 14."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00310:29", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 108.34912359641562, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I’m trying to remember what the dates were. April 1970 was Apollo 13. And when did we fly 14?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It was January '71."}, {"role": "user", "content": "January of ’71. I mean, that’s really short. Look at how long it took us after the\\n\\n Challenger\\n\\n accident to get back to flying."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "In this case you had Al Shepard finally getting his ride on 14."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Al finally getting his ride, yes. Isn’t that good?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "After being put out for his inner ear problem."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00310:31", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 119.27680399601736, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "January of ’71. I mean, that’s really short. Look at how long it took us after the\\n\\n Challenger\\n\\n accident to get back to flying."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "In this case you had Al Shepard finally getting his ride on 14."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Al finally getting his ride, yes. Isn’t that good?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "After being put out for his inner ear problem."}, {"role": "user", "content": "His Meniere’s Syndrome. Yes, it was good to see both Al and eventually Deke get that ride. They tell me that Deke always used to submit two crew recommendations, one with him on it and the other one without him on it. Finally, they accepted one with him on it. It was very nice."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you have a professional opinion on either of their medical problems?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00310:33", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 130.30755999557485, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Al finally getting his ride, yes. Isn’t that good?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "After being put out for his inner ear problem."}, {"role": "user", "content": "His Meniere’s Syndrome. Yes, it was good to see both Al and eventually Deke get that ride. They tell me that Deke always used to submit two crew recommendations, one with him on it and the other one without him on it. Finally, they accepted one with him on it. It was very nice."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you have a professional opinion on either of their medical problems?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I think Al’s was handled pretty well. I think they were both handled pretty well, but Al’s in particular, a significant period of time went by, the symptoms had subsided, there was no residual damage to the vestibular system, and he was certified for flight in a relatively routine fashion.\\n\\n Deke’s problem was more difficult because it was arrhythmia, and those things do tend to recur, and if they recur, they’re usually not harmful. You could have made the argument back in 1962, I guess it was, and some of the doctors did make the argument, that this atrial fibrillation was intermittent, would not have interfered in a short mission, and it was just that overwhelming conservatism that said, “We know it probably doesn’t matter, but if you can find another crew member who hadn’t got that problem, it’s just one less thing to worry about.” It’s too bad, because Deke was a splendid crew member and a good leader and would have been a good commander on an Apollo mission. It was not to be. I think he quit smoking at some point early on in there, and had had a stretch now of several years without fibrillation recurring, and that’s what made them feel that they were safe in sending him up. And they were right, he didn’t have a problem in flight."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you have any involvement with any of the flights after 13?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00310:35", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 41, "return_to_go": 144.78617777286095, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "His Meniere’s Syndrome. Yes, it was good to see both Al and eventually Deke get that ride. They tell me that Deke always used to submit two crew recommendations, one with him on it and the other one without him on it. Finally, they accepted one with him on it. It was very nice."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you have a professional opinion on either of their medical problems?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I think Al’s was handled pretty well. I think they were both handled pretty well, but Al’s in particular, a significant period of time went by, the symptoms had subsided, there was no residual damage to the vestibular system, and he was certified for flight in a relatively routine fashion.\\n\\n Deke’s problem was more difficult because it was arrhythmia, and those things do tend to recur, and if they recur, they’re usually not harmful. You could have made the argument back in 1962, I guess it was, and some of the doctors did make the argument, that this atrial fibrillation was intermittent, would not have interfered in a short mission, and it was just that overwhelming conservatism that said, “We know it probably doesn’t matter, but if you can find another crew member who hadn’t got that problem, it’s just one less thing to worry about.” It’s too bad, because Deke was a splendid crew member and a good leader and would have been a good commander on an Apollo mission. It was not to be. I think he quit smoking at some point early on in there, and had had a stretch now of several years without fibrillation recurring, and that’s what made them feel that they were safe in sending him up. And they were right, he didn’t have a problem in flight."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you have any involvement with any of the flights after 13?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not in the Apollo sequence, no. I went from there right to full-time training for Skylab."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Now, after having been an astronaut for several years, you finally get your seat on a flight. Take us through the training regimen that you went through to prepare for your specific mission."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00310:67", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 5.6, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, it’s learned a lot that are by now so deeply ingrained into it that it would be almost hard to point them out, but the habitability, the diet and exercise, the workday structure, a lot of those things.\\n\\n As a matter of fact, one thing I find that’s good about this long gap between Skylab and Space Station is that it’s kept me usefully employed for twenty-five years. [Laughter] People still come and ask for data. “How did you guys do that? How did you manage this? Give us a little seminar, get some people together, and tell us about managing science on the Skylab. How did you manage to do that so efficiently? What did you do wrong, that we shouldn’t repeat?” We had a lot of things that we did wrong that should not be done that way again.\\n\\n So I figure that once the International Space Station has been in operation for about two years, Skylab will be as interesting as Columbus’ voyage. [Laughter] All those lessons will have been learned over again and new ones will be being learned. But now we’re still popular, so it’s kind of fun."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It’s good to know that your mission back then is still proving valuable today."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. It was a good mission, a beautiful medical data set. Still, I think, the best, most complete medical data set on nine people that exists for weightlessness. Again, I can’t wait for Space Station to do a much, much better job of that and to refine the exercise prescriptions and the diet prescriptions and the other countermeasures that will allow us to go for six months and a year safely, overcome physical, psychological, and environmental problems, and go to Mars."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "We can only hope that that comes sooner rather than later."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That’s right. Amen."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What’s your role in the International Space Station today?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00310:69", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 4.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. It was a good mission, a beautiful medical data set. Still, I think, the best, most complete medical data set on nine people that exists for weightlessness. Again, I can’t wait for Space Station to do a much, much better job of that and to refine the exercise prescriptions and the diet prescriptions and the other countermeasures that will allow us to go for six months and a year safely, overcome physical, psychological, and environmental problems, and go to Mars."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "We can only hope that that comes sooner rather than later."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That’s right. Amen."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What’s your role in the International Space Station today?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I manage a contractor now, a fairly small contractor called Wylie Laboratories, which is the support contractor to the medical effort at the Johnson Space Center. So my people are extra hands and feet for the research laboratories, the medical operations and training, the medical equipment development, building the crew healthcare system and the exercise hardware for Space Station. So I’m now a supporter, a contractor, rather than a manager at NASA, but still on the team, still helping the Space Station to get on with it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Great. I have just a few sweeping questions, I guess, for you to kind of reflect back on. What do you think of the role of life sciences and medical experiments, these types of things, in NASA from the time you joined through Skylab and Shuttle and now International Space Station? How do you think that’s changed over time?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00310:77", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don’t think it was anything in management; I think it was just conducting that Skylab mission properly. Carrying out the good work that was planned by the teams on the ground."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "On a related note, what do you think the greatest challenge for you was?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Getting that solar panel up. [Laughter]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That was certainly an achievement in of itself, because if that wasn’t running, then who knows what would have happened to the other missions going up there, as well."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Exactly. That bailed out the program."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I wanted to give you a chance to make any final remarks before we run out of time today."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00310:79", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Getting that solar panel up. [Laughter]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That was certainly an achievement in of itself, because if that wasn’t running, then who knows what would have happened to the other missions going up there, as well."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Exactly. That bailed out the program."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I wanted to give you a chance to make any final remarks before we run out of time today."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I can’t think of anything either wise or funny to say, so we might as well just knock it off. I enjoyed it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It’s been a pleasure for me, and I’d like to thank you again for joining us."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00403:11", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 65.637868913024, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I lucked in at the right time at the right place."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What sort of activities were going on at White Sands Test Facility when you arrived?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "The entire installation at that time was dedicated specifically to supporting Project Apollo, and as a former name of the installation, Propulsion Systems Development Facility, indicated, it was focused entirely on testing the rocket engines for the Apollo spacecraft, and “spacecraft” particularly meaning the part that operates in space once you get up off of the ground. So it was the Apollo lunar module and the command and service module. It wasn’t the big engines for the Saturn V. They couldn’t test those things out here. Those engines are just too big, and the engines put out a lot of heat. A lot of heat requires a lot of water to quench it. Also, the vehicles are so big that, you might remember, they traveled by barge. We don’t have very many barges here in New Mexico! So they focused on the smaller rocket engines for the lunar module and the command and service module. And that was really the primary focus, just rocket engine testing. [At the time], the laboratories existed merely as a support function providing [cleaning and] chemistry and metallurgical support, analytical work to support the rocket engine test stands."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So what were your first duties or responsibilities when you first came to White Sands?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I was a fledgling liquid propulsion systems engineer, and back then NASA had an unstructured but pretty effective mentor and protégé system of getting the new employees up to speed. I don’t remember going to more than one or two classes whatsoever, but [I] just hung around and shadowed a veteran engineer and followed what he did throughout the whole day, learned not only his duties, but also the interactions, the documentation necessary, the people that were necessary to talk to—some of the thought patterns and philosophies of a successful propulsion systems engineer."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you find that program to be successful?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:5", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 25.72037074629154, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, the crew is picked for you. The chief [of the Astronaut Office] picks the whole crew. I did the same when I was chief. There’s a method to it. You got to balance it out. All astronauts are equal, but some are more equal than others. You got to balance the crew with the right talent. You want to give new guys experience and fly them with the right experienced guys. You also want to be fair in the rotation. You can’t fly the same person right after another. You got to wait your turn a little bit. Then you also have to pick based on what skills are needed for what’s being done on the flight. It’s a pretty complex problem. But no, I inherited the whole crew as they were, and it was a great crew."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You mentioned that you traveled all over the world training for this flight. Was the training flow really long because you were working with so many investigators in so many countries?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I can’t remember if the payload crew got assigned a little bit sooner. I think we were all assigned about the same [time]. It was about a year. It was a normal year training flow. Right after I got back from that flight, Dave [David C.] Leestma was Director of Flight Crew Operations [FCOD], that’s when Dave asked me to be chief of the Astronaut Office. Of course I said yes. We were just finishing up all our postflight stuff. Those guys got to travel everywhere, and I couldn’t go with them, because I had a really hard new job."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You had other responsibilities."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They were over in Italy doing all kinds of neat stuff."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "We interviewed Leroy Chiao many years ago. He mentioned that he thought on launch day you guys were going to go out; you weren’t going to launch. They were surprised that you guys actually ended up launching on that day."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:7", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 27.4670786069906, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I can’t remember if the payload crew got assigned a little bit sooner. I think we were all assigned about the same [time]. It was about a year. It was a normal year training flow. Right after I got back from that flight, Dave [David C.] Leestma was Director of Flight Crew Operations [FCOD], that’s when Dave asked me to be chief of the Astronaut Office. Of course I said yes. We were just finishing up all our postflight stuff. Those guys got to travel everywhere, and I couldn’t go with them, because I had a really hard new job."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You had other responsibilities."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They were over in Italy doing all kinds of neat stuff."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "We interviewed Leroy Chiao many years ago. He mentioned that he thought on launch day you guys were going to go out; you weren’t going to launch. They were surprised that you guys actually ended up launching on that day."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We launched on time. I remember on ascent Leroy, he took his mirror, and he was looking out the overhead window at the plume, and he couldn’t believe all the flame that he was seeing out the window. I remember him commenting about that, pretty impressive. I was more focused on the gauges and where we were going."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Your last mission you had flown Discovery but this time as you pointed out you flew on Columbia."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:9", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 29.407865118878444, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They were over in Italy doing all kinds of neat stuff."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "We interviewed Leroy Chiao many years ago. He mentioned that he thought on launch day you guys were going to go out; you weren’t going to launch. They were surprised that you guys actually ended up launching on that day."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We launched on time. I remember on ascent Leroy, he took his mirror, and he was looking out the overhead window at the plume, and he couldn’t believe all the flame that he was seeing out the window. I remember him commenting about that, pretty impressive. I was more focused on the gauges and where we were going."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Your last mission you had flown Discovery but this time as you pointed out you flew on Columbia."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Actually my last one was Endeavour. My first two were Discovery, then Columbia, then Endeavour."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were there any differences between the vehicles?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:11", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 29.34207235430938, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We launched on time. I remember on ascent Leroy, he took his mirror, and he was looking out the overhead window at the plume, and he couldn’t believe all the flame that he was seeing out the window. I remember him commenting about that, pretty impressive. I was more focused on the gauges and where we were going."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Your last mission you had flown Discovery but this time as you pointed out you flew on Columbia."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Actually my last one was Endeavour. My first two were Discovery, then Columbia, then Endeavour."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were there any differences between the vehicles?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Columbia looked different for a number of reasons. It was heavier. The tiles were different, the way the pattern was. At one time it had ejection seats, so some of the closeout panels inside were a little bit different, but as far as how it operated, how it flew, you couldn’t tell the difference between the Orbiters. They all flew essentially the same.\\n\\n In fact if you were in Discovery, Atlantis, or Endeavour, unless you knew, you couldn’t tell one from the other. Columbia was a little bit different, being a little older. It was pretty neat to be able to fly Columbia, the very first Space Shuttle to fly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You mentioned that this was an EDO mission. Were there any other differences besides that extended duration toilet that are worthy of pointing out?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:13", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 31.491191504788198, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Actually my last one was Endeavour. My first two were Discovery, then Columbia, then Endeavour."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were there any differences between the vehicles?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Columbia looked different for a number of reasons. It was heavier. The tiles were different, the way the pattern was. At one time it had ejection seats, so some of the closeout panels inside were a little bit different, but as far as how it operated, how it flew, you couldn’t tell the difference between the Orbiters. They all flew essentially the same.\\n\\n In fact if you were in Discovery, Atlantis, or Endeavour, unless you knew, you couldn’t tell one from the other. Columbia was a little bit different, being a little older. It was pretty neat to be able to fly Columbia, the very first Space Shuttle to fly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You mentioned that this was an EDO mission. Were there any other differences besides that extended duration toilet that are worthy of pointing out?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, being up 15 days is a long time in a Space Shuttle."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "In that small space."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:15", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 11, "return_to_go": 32.767990560875774, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Columbia looked different for a number of reasons. It was heavier. The tiles were different, the way the pattern was. At one time it had ejection seats, so some of the closeout panels inside were a little bit different, but as far as how it operated, how it flew, you couldn’t tell the difference between the Orbiters. They all flew essentially the same.\\n\\n In fact if you were in Discovery, Atlantis, or Endeavour, unless you knew, you couldn’t tell one from the other. Columbia was a little bit different, being a little older. It was pretty neat to be able to fly Columbia, the very first Space Shuttle to fly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You mentioned that this was an EDO mission. Were there any other differences besides that extended duration toilet that are worthy of pointing out?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, being up 15 days is a long time in a Space Shuttle."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "In that small space."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was a little over 15 days. It was learning how to operate and get all the experiments done. You get into a routine, a pattern. Space Shuttles are a little more of a sprint than the International Space Station. A lot of work gets crammed in, because you’re up there for a shorter period of time. The Space Station assembly missions were extremely challenging because they put so much into them. You want to accomplish everything. [STS]-65 was a great mission, really enjoyed it. It was a great first command, just went really well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You flew three very different missions. You had a deploy mission, you had a DoD [Department of Defense] mission, then you had a Spacelab mission. Can you compare and contrast flying those missions for us?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:23", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 29.19980271433588, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don’t know if that was the first flight. I think it might have been. We had a camera in the crew cabin, and it was mounted between the rear windows on the back and showing forward, so you could see the back of the heads of the four guys on the flight deck, the gauges, and see out the front windows. It really turned out to be a neat video.\\n\\n The other neat thing about it was on the ground, when you watch a launch, you don’t hear what’s going on on the ICS (intercommunication system) in the cabin. All you hear is the air-to-ground and Mission Control talking. So we also downlinked what we were actually saying to each other. You can go on YouTube and google STS-65 ascent, and you’ll see it. There’s also an entry video. You can see the entire entry from deorbit burn to touchdown. That’s out there on YouTube somewhere too. I got a DVD [Digital Video Disc] of it also, the whole crew does. We had videotapes, and we converted them to DVD. It’s really a neat video."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was that your idea to film that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it was something that we’d talked about in the Office, and we decided to do it. We volunteered to be the first crew that got it ready in time so that we could do it. It turned out really well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did Mission Control learn anything that they applied to future missions from that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I think it was a neat training [thing]. It was nice to be able to show guys that hadn’t flown before what actually was going on in the cockpit on ascent. I think it was more a great memory but a nice insight for folks to see, just makes it a little more human. Then it became the norm after that. I think pretty much all the flights have it since then. I got it for my last flight too, on [STS]-88, ascent and entry."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It seemed unusual. I notice that you did the SAREX [Shuttle Amateur Radio Experiment] on this flight. Can you talk about that?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:25", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 32.44422523815098, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it was something that we’d talked about in the Office, and we decided to do it. We volunteered to be the first crew that got it ready in time so that we could do it. It turned out really well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did Mission Control learn anything that they applied to future missions from that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I think it was a neat training [thing]. It was nice to be able to show guys that hadn’t flown before what actually was going on in the cockpit on ascent. I think it was more a great memory but a nice insight for folks to see, just makes it a little more human. Then it became the norm after that. I think pretty much all the flights have it since then. I got it for my last flight too, on [STS]-88, ascent and entry."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It seemed unusual. I notice that you did the SAREX [Shuttle Amateur Radio Experiment] on this flight. Can you talk about that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "KC5HBV."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That’s your call sign?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:27", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 32.71580582016775, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I think it was a neat training [thing]. It was nice to be able to show guys that hadn’t flown before what actually was going on in the cockpit on ascent. I think it was more a great memory but a nice insight for folks to see, just makes it a little more human. Then it became the norm after that. I think pretty much all the flights have it since then. I got it for my last flight too, on [STS]-88, ascent and entry."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It seemed unusual. I notice that you did the SAREX [Shuttle Amateur Radio Experiment] on this flight. Can you talk about that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "KC5HBV."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That’s your call sign?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I still keep it up to date. Haven’t used it in a while. In our spare time we talked to schools. We did hookups with schools around the world, got to talk to them, got their cards. We mailed back and forth. That was fun. Ham radio is a neat way to communicate with kids on the ground. Technology has changed so much. You look at Scott [J.] Kelly on International Space Station now with Twitter. We didn’t have all that stuff back then. Ham radio was another way that you could communicate on a personal basis with folks, and it was unique, that somebody on the ground could talk to you in space."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you have a chance to talk to your kids while you were in space on SAREX?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:29", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 36.35089535574195, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "KC5HBV."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That’s your call sign?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I still keep it up to date. Haven’t used it in a while. In our spare time we talked to schools. We did hookups with schools around the world, got to talk to them, got their cards. We mailed back and forth. That was fun. Ham radio is a neat way to communicate with kids on the ground. Technology has changed so much. You look at Scott [J.] Kelly on International Space Station now with Twitter. We didn’t have all that stuff back then. Ham radio was another way that you could communicate on a personal basis with folks, and it was unique, that somebody on the ground could talk to you in space."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you have a chance to talk to your kids while you were in space on SAREX?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Talked to some schools. Had a ham radio hookup. Worked out well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Sounds like a neat experiment. I noticed you also gave some tours of the vehicle while you were up in space. Can you talk about that? Talk about some of the TV programs you talked with."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:31", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 39.27877261749105, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I still keep it up to date. Haven’t used it in a while. In our spare time we talked to schools. We did hookups with schools around the world, got to talk to them, got their cards. We mailed back and forth. That was fun. Ham radio is a neat way to communicate with kids on the ground. Technology has changed so much. You look at Scott [J.] Kelly on International Space Station now with Twitter. We didn’t have all that stuff back then. Ham radio was another way that you could communicate on a personal basis with folks, and it was unique, that somebody on the ground could talk to you in space."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you have a chance to talk to your kids while you were in space on SAREX?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Talked to some schools. Had a ham radio hookup. Worked out well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Sounds like a neat experiment. I noticed you also gave some tours of the vehicle while you were up in space. Can you talk about that? Talk about some of the TV programs you talked with."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, I can’t remember, but it’s something that we pretty much did on all the flights just to share the experience. Starting on the flight deck and videotaping it and going down through the middeck and just floating through and back in through the tunnel into the laboratory and allowing folks to see firsthand. Did the same thing on 88 when we went inside the Space Station for the first time to share that with the folks on the ground. Now it’s commonplace to look up and see astronauts floating around in space with all the cameras. Didn’t have so much live video in the past, although [we had] some. [It was] just an opportunity to share. Also turns out having those videotapes afterwards, it’s nice to be able to help remember."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I saw that you talked with the Today show and The Larry King Show while you were up in orbit."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:33", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 42.53196957499006, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Talked to some schools. Had a ham radio hookup. Worked out well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Sounds like a neat experiment. I noticed you also gave some tours of the vehicle while you were up in space. Can you talk about that? Talk about some of the TV programs you talked with."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, I can’t remember, but it’s something that we pretty much did on all the flights just to share the experience. Starting on the flight deck and videotaping it and going down through the middeck and just floating through and back in through the tunnel into the laboratory and allowing folks to see firsthand. Did the same thing on 88 when we went inside the Space Station for the first time to share that with the folks on the ground. Now it’s commonplace to look up and see astronauts floating around in space with all the cameras. Didn’t have so much live video in the past, although [we had] some. [It was] just an opportunity to share. Also turns out having those videotapes afterwards, it’s nice to be able to help remember."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I saw that you talked with the Today show and The Larry King Show while you were up in orbit."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, Jennifer, I can’t even remember what I said, but it’s standard stuff. You get to hook up. They ask their questions, and you talk to them about what it’s like in space, the experiments you’re doing, and why they’re important. None of that has really changed. It’s pretty much the same message today as it was 20 years ago. The importance of why we’re up there, what we’re learning, how it applies to life here on Earth, and how it applies to helping us advance as a civilization, as a nation, the importance of science and technology, our ability to explore beyond our home planet eventually. So it’s pretty much all the same stuff, just got to keep reinforcing it. People never get tired of asking, of seeing it firsthand, of being able to relate to it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I also read that Dan [Daniel S.] Goldin called your flight while you were up there. Were you surprised to hear from the Administrator?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:35", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 12, "return_to_go": 46.14663286110006, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, I can’t remember, but it’s something that we pretty much did on all the flights just to share the experience. Starting on the flight deck and videotaping it and going down through the middeck and just floating through and back in through the tunnel into the laboratory and allowing folks to see firsthand. Did the same thing on 88 when we went inside the Space Station for the first time to share that with the folks on the ground. Now it’s commonplace to look up and see astronauts floating around in space with all the cameras. Didn’t have so much live video in the past, although [we had] some. [It was] just an opportunity to share. Also turns out having those videotapes afterwards, it’s nice to be able to help remember."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I saw that you talked with the Today show and The Larry King Show while you were up in orbit."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, Jennifer, I can’t even remember what I said, but it’s standard stuff. You get to hook up. They ask their questions, and you talk to them about what it’s like in space, the experiments you’re doing, and why they’re important. None of that has really changed. It’s pretty much the same message today as it was 20 years ago. The importance of why we’re up there, what we’re learning, how it applies to life here on Earth, and how it applies to helping us advance as a civilization, as a nation, the importance of science and technology, our ability to explore beyond our home planet eventually. So it’s pretty much all the same stuff, just got to keep reinforcing it. People never get tired of asking, of seeing it firsthand, of being able to relate to it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I also read that Dan [Daniel S.] Goldin called your flight while you were up there. Were you surprised to hear from the Administrator?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it was cool. I’ll tell you another Dan Goldin story. I don’t know, can’t share all my stories."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You can share, we can always edit them."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:39", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 5, "return_to_go": 39.93411464333341, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it was cool. I’ll tell you another Dan Goldin story. I don’t know, can’t share all my stories."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You can share, we can always edit them."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We were over in Shep’s Bar. Ken [Kenneth D.] Bowersox was training for his mission. It was after Shep’s first mission, right around that timeframe. I can’t remember exactly. In the basement of Cottage 3 in Star City, where the astronauts live—there’s three cottages that they live in while they’re training over there. Shep, when he was training, was the first one to move in. They had just finished Cottage 3. They were still working on the others. There was a weight room in the basement. They were duplexes, but the basements were connected. There was a weight room in one, and Shep built this bar in the other one. We had a Ping-Pong table down there and television for watching movies.\\n\\n It was a social gathering place for all the folks that were working and training in Russia. We’d invite the Russians and have parties, and we’d have cookouts; shashlik, it’s a Russian kebab that they grill outside. It was a great social gathering place. The bar has been signed. Tom Hanks signed it when he was there. It’s got patches and stickers and everybody’s signature all over it. We were playing liar’s dice one night, and when I was chief of the Astronaut Office I called back to the States. We had decided to call Mr. [W.S.] Abbey. George was Center Director then. George said, “I think you need to talk to Mr. Goldin.” He had us on hold. The next thing I know he’s connected us to DC and we’re talking to the Administrator from Shep’s Bar."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "There was a pretty significant anniversary when you guys were up in space for 65 and that was Apollo 11."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was. That was the twenty-fifth anniversary of the Apollo landing. We flew."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Would you talk about that?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:43", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 43.1285365967079, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was. That was the twenty-fifth anniversary of the Apollo landing. We flew."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Would you talk about that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "At the last minute they had all these twenty-fifth anniversary commemorative Apollo landing flags, and the idea was to fly them all and give everybody at NASA one. I’ve still got mine mounted somewhere, and it’s signed by, I think, the Administrator; I can’t remember. They came in at the last minute. They were trying to get them all stowed on board. We wanted to stow a lot of stuff; there’s stowage space back in the laboratory, but it had already been closed out, so they crammed those things everywhere. They were in lockers. Then we had to move things around, but we got them all on board.\\n\\n That was pretty cool. At 25 years to the date and time that they did the burn to go to the Moon, the TLI burn (translunar injection burn), the ground sent us up a PAD for a TLI burn for the Orbiter to go to the Moon. Unfortunately we didn’t have quite enough propellant, but it would have been pretty cool."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That would have been cool. How exciting. You had a lot of historic things going on during that mission."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, it was cool."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What did it mean to you to be in space and hold that record for a short time of the longest spaceflight at that point?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:45", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 44.587262885231, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "At the last minute they had all these twenty-fifth anniversary commemorative Apollo landing flags, and the idea was to fly them all and give everybody at NASA one. I’ve still got mine mounted somewhere, and it’s signed by, I think, the Administrator; I can’t remember. They came in at the last minute. They were trying to get them all stowed on board. We wanted to stow a lot of stuff; there’s stowage space back in the laboratory, but it had already been closed out, so they crammed those things everywhere. They were in lockers. Then we had to move things around, but we got them all on board.\\n\\n That was pretty cool. At 25 years to the date and time that they did the burn to go to the Moon, the TLI burn (translunar injection burn), the ground sent us up a PAD for a TLI burn for the Orbiter to go to the Moon. Unfortunately we didn’t have quite enough propellant, but it would have been pretty cool."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That would have been cool. How exciting. You had a lot of historic things going on during that mission."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, it was cool."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What did it mean to you to be in space and hold that record for a short time of the longest spaceflight at that point?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was cool. We got a neat plaque from the FAI (Federation Aeronautique Internationale) recognizing the record. Like I said, records were made to be broken. I think 18 days ended up being the longest Shuttle mission that we flew. It was cool to have it for a while."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "This was a mission that included a woman. You had never flown with a woman before. Was that any different for you?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:47", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 48.43029209470111, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, it was cool."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What did it mean to you to be in space and hold that record for a short time of the longest spaceflight at that point?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was cool. We got a neat plaque from the FAI (Federation Aeronautique Internationale) recognizing the record. Like I said, records were made to be broken. I think 18 days ended up being the longest Shuttle mission that we flew. It was cool to have it for a while."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "This was a mission that included a woman. You had never flown with a woman before. Was that any different for you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. It’s like anything else. You just respect people’s privacy. It’s no different. We all got along fine. I had Nancy Currie on my last flight. It’s like anywhere. It’s easily done."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How did you handle issue of privacy and things of that nature?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:49", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 52.7003245496679, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was cool. We got a neat plaque from the FAI (Federation Aeronautique Internationale) recognizing the record. Like I said, records were made to be broken. I think 18 days ended up being the longest Shuttle mission that we flew. It was cool to have it for a while."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "This was a mission that included a woman. You had never flown with a woman before. Was that any different for you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. It’s like anything else. You just respect people’s privacy. It’s no different. We all got along fine. I had Nancy Currie on my last flight. It’s like anywhere. It’s easily done."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How did you handle issue of privacy and things of that nature?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "There’s plenty of space on board the Shuttle. When a female needed privacy from all the guys—the WCS [Waste Collection System], the way the door opened up and the curtains were on it, there was a private space there where she could be while the rest of us were getting cleaned up or whatever out on the middeck. Again just respect each other’s privacy. It wasn’t even an issue."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What about the fact that she was from a different culture? Was that any sort of issue? She was from Japan."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:51", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 54.11147172185322, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. It’s like anything else. You just respect people’s privacy. It’s no different. We all got along fine. I had Nancy Currie on my last flight. It’s like anywhere. It’s easily done."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How did you handle issue of privacy and things of that nature?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "There’s plenty of space on board the Shuttle. When a female needed privacy from all the guys—the WCS [Waste Collection System], the way the door opened up and the curtains were on it, there was a private space there where she could be while the rest of us were getting cleaned up or whatever out on the middeck. Again just respect each other’s privacy. It wasn’t even an issue."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What about the fact that she was from a different culture? Was that any sort of issue? She was from Japan."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I’d lived in Japan for two years in the Marine Corps, two separate times, a year at a time, in Iwakuni. That’s another thing. The Japanese are very respectful of other people’s privacy. When you live in a nation where everybody is so close and walls are paper-thin in some houses, you learn to respect other people. Be unto yourself; respect other people’s property and privacy."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "As you mentioned, this was almost a dress rehearsal for Space Station. What lessons learned did you pass on to folks that were applied to ISS [International Space Station]?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:53", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 55.67941302428135, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "There’s plenty of space on board the Shuttle. When a female needed privacy from all the guys—the WCS [Waste Collection System], the way the door opened up and the curtains were on it, there was a private space there where she could be while the rest of us were getting cleaned up or whatever out on the middeck. Again just respect each other’s privacy. It wasn’t even an issue."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What about the fact that she was from a different culture? Was that any sort of issue? She was from Japan."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I’d lived in Japan for two years in the Marine Corps, two separate times, a year at a time, in Iwakuni. That’s another thing. The Japanese are very respectful of other people’s privacy. When you live in a nation where everybody is so close and walls are paper-thin in some houses, you learn to respect other people. Be unto yourself; respect other people’s property and privacy."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "As you mentioned, this was almost a dress rehearsal for Space Station. What lessons learned did you pass on to folks that were applied to ISS [International Space Station]?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think how we operated the experiments, the training, it evolved. It was a good model. We weren’t the first Spacelab mission either. IML-1 was before us. There was USML [U.S. Microgravity Laboratory], and there were some flights, Neurolab, that focused on the human system and biological system. I think it’s something that evolved over time. We get better at it all the time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I thought we’d turn now to talking about being chief of the Astronaut Office. You mentioned that Dave Leestma had asked you to take that position. What were your thoughts when he approached you? Were you surprised that you would be getting into management?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:71", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 18.399566947739185, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They might have been spies, I don’t know. Checking me out but I could give them directions in Russian. It was great."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "After you came back from that first trip and saw what Norm and Bonnie were dealing with and some of the hardships that they faced, what changes did you start to implement or what discussions did you start?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "We had a great program. Our life sciences guys are awesome and the psychological help that they provide—I think the real challenge wasn’t so much the technical part. We worked on that, but I think what our docs did working with the Russian docs to get folks qualified, making sure that from a psychological point of view the crew had [support]. We worked very hard to ensure that the crews had good support in Russia, that we were taking good care of them. We had a DOR (Director of Operations-Russia), an astronaut, working in Star City that was a direct interface with the Russian in charge of training. We were providing the right support to our crews. They were being taken care of.\\n\\n They had good support and comfort over there, because it was a harsh environment to be thrown into to learn. I can’t remember which mission it was now. Scott [E.] Parazynski wanted to fly on Mir, so we sent him over there to get him measured. I didn’t share this story last time, did I?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I think it was too tall, too short."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. All right, I ain’t going to tell that story again."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It’s a good story though."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:73", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 20.443963275265762, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We had a great program. Our life sciences guys are awesome and the psychological help that they provide—I think the real challenge wasn’t so much the technical part. We worked on that, but I think what our docs did working with the Russian docs to get folks qualified, making sure that from a psychological point of view the crew had [support]. We worked very hard to ensure that the crews had good support in Russia, that we were taking good care of them. We had a DOR (Director of Operations-Russia), an astronaut, working in Star City that was a direct interface with the Russian in charge of training. We were providing the right support to our crews. They were being taken care of.\\n\\n They had good support and comfort over there, because it was a harsh environment to be thrown into to learn. I can’t remember which mission it was now. Scott [E.] Parazynski wanted to fly on Mir, so we sent him over there to get him measured. I didn’t share this story last time, did I?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I think it was too tall, too short."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. All right, I ain’t going to tell that story again."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It’s a good story though."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It is a good story."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It does show that progression."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:75", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 19.38218141696196, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. All right, I ain’t going to tell that story again."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It’s a good story though."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It is a good story."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It does show that progression."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But it was prior to the [Soyuz] TMA, the modifications that we did to allow a greater buttocks-to-knee length in the vehicle. It was really hard finding folks that fit in a Soyuz TM that could actually fly to Mir that wanted to do it. Wendy [B.] Lawrence and Scott Parazynski, too tall and too small."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You told us last time that it was really hard to get people to want to go live and work in Russia and train. Were there any folks in the Office that were just really excited to go over there and willing to step up?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:77", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 6, "return_to_go": 20.42464601884662, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It is a good story."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It does show that progression."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But it was prior to the [Soyuz] TMA, the modifications that we did to allow a greater buttocks-to-knee length in the vehicle. It was really hard finding folks that fit in a Soyuz TM that could actually fly to Mir that wanted to do it. Wendy [B.] Lawrence and Scott Parazynski, too tall and too small."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You told us last time that it was really hard to get people to want to go live and work in Russia and train. Were there any folks in the Office that were just really excited to go over there and willing to step up?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think all the folks that went. Mike Foale wanted to go. Andy Thomas wanted to go. I think the folks that went over there wanted to do it. That makes a big difference, to do something begrudgingly or to do something because you want to do it. Finding the right people was important. You wouldn’t just assign somebody just to assign somebody. You needed to assign somebody for the right reasons. They had to want to be there, or it would never have worked."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "While you were chief of the Astronaut, Carolyn [L.] Huntoon was Center Director and then George Abbey. Would you talk about working with both of them?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:85", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 7, "return_to_go": 20.613696111639413, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I love George to death. I don’t know of anybody that was more concerned about America, our space program, and doing the right thing for the space program than George. I loved interfaces with him. I don’t know how much to say here.\\n\\n I remember taking crew [assignments to him]. I worked really hard on getting good crew assignments. Dave Leestma and I would go bring the crews to George. I had a master spreadsheet where I had all the logic laid out, and I’d explain it all to Dave. We’d write down all the names. We’d take it to George, and we’d sit across the table from him. When you got to the meat of the discussion you’d finally get talking about the crew.\\n\\n You’d move it across and explain why. Piece of paper would be sitting there on the table. Eventually he’d pick it up, slide it, fold it in half, and put it in his pocket. All right, that’s a good crew. Or else, all of a sudden, it would come back across the table to you."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Without any explanation?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, but if you changed it, if you weren’t right the first time, what makes you think you’re right the second time?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you learn that or was that something Dave had told you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, but I knew the right reasons why we had the crew. So I’d just bring the same crew back the second time and explain why. It always worked out. We ended up getting the crews assigned. I really enjoyed interfacing with Mr. Abbey. He’s a good man."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Looking at the context of the times, the NASA budget at that time was really in turmoil when you were chief of the Astronaut Office. There were a lot of cuts. Dan Goldin said, “Nothing is sacred.” I wondered if that impacted, or how it impacted the Astronaut Office at that point."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:93", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 13.342015106903538, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. When you have people flying in space, the critical things get done. I look back. Supporting human spaceflight operations and the Space Station, that’s always well supported for the critical operations that need to get done. People understand human life is at risk and it’s going to get supported."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Would you talk about your role as chief of the office and working with other heads at JSC, like MOD [Mission Operations Directorate], Space Shuttle, all those different offices?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I’ll share another favorite story. Brewster [H.] Shaw was Program Manager for the Space Station Program. I’d been chief for about a year. He had a little side conference room off his office over on the fifth floor of Building 1, and we were having a meeting in there. The conference table was full, couple guys standing in the back. Had the folks at Marshall and KSC on the line. I can’t even remember what it was now I presented to them. It was something that we needed to do. Brewster almost got mad at me. He wasn’t mad, “No, we’re not going to do that.” I thought, “That was the right thing to do.” He was just vehement about it. He pointed at me and said, “I want to see you in my office.” Oh, dang.\\n\\n I get in his office and he says, “You were absolutely right; I’m going to do what you wanted to do. But I didn’t want those other guys online to think I was being soft on the Astronaut Office.” Thanks, Brewster."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Had to keep his image."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Like anything else, if you have good technical rationale for what you want to do and you present your data well, you’re going to get what you want. I just made sure that whenever I interfaced with any of the other programs I had good data to support what it was we were doing so we could make informed decisions."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "There were several astronaut classes that came in during that time."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:97", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 14.125944576424121, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Like anything else, if you have good technical rationale for what you want to do and you present your data well, you’re going to get what you want. I just made sure that whenever I interfaced with any of the other programs I had good data to support what it was we were doing so we could make informed decisions."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "There were several astronaut classes that came in during that time."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I really enjoyed being on those Astronaut Selection Boards. Prior to being chief of the office I was screening a couple Boards prior to that. I think, really, when you look at an astronaut candidate class and how you get to that, when you’ve got 3,500, 4,000 applicants, and you neck it down to 120 that you interview to pick 20 or whatever the number is, you can pick any week’s interviewees and have a good class. To sort through, you’re really splitting hairs when you get to deciding on who you’re going to select. It’s a very fair process. It was really interesting being able to talk to all those folks and learn about their experiences and their backgrounds."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You guys took a pretty big class at one point; I think the Sardines came in. How did that impact the Office?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "With all the Shuttle missions we were flying and the folks that we needed for International Space Station, at one time I had 115 astronauts in the astronaut corps, if I included the international partners. It was huge. I think we’re down to around 45 right now or something like that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It’s pretty small."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:99", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 15.69549397380458, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I really enjoyed being on those Astronaut Selection Boards. Prior to being chief of the office I was screening a couple Boards prior to that. I think, really, when you look at an astronaut candidate class and how you get to that, when you’ve got 3,500, 4,000 applicants, and you neck it down to 120 that you interview to pick 20 or whatever the number is, you can pick any week’s interviewees and have a good class. To sort through, you’re really splitting hairs when you get to deciding on who you’re going to select. It’s a very fair process. It was really interesting being able to talk to all those folks and learn about their experiences and their backgrounds."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You guys took a pretty big class at one point; I think the Sardines came in. How did that impact the Office?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "With all the Shuttle missions we were flying and the folks that we needed for International Space Station, at one time I had 115 astronauts in the astronaut corps, if I included the international partners. It was huge. I think we’re down to around 45 right now or something like that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It’s pretty small."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I’d go back and fly again though, if they got desperate. I’m ready."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You want to fly commercial crew?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:101", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 17.439437748671754, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "With all the Shuttle missions we were flying and the folks that we needed for International Space Station, at one time I had 115 astronauts in the astronaut corps, if I included the international partners. It was huge. I think we’re down to around 45 right now or something like that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It’s pretty small."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I’d go back and fly again though, if they got desperate. I’m ready."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You want to fly commercial crew?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Sure."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You’d fly anywhere, wouldn’t you?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:103", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 18.266041942968616, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I’d go back and fly again though, if they got desperate. I’m ready."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You want to fly commercial crew?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Sure."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You’d fly anywhere, wouldn’t you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "If it gets me out of a meeting, sign me up. I’ll go to Mars. I’m old. I can take that radiation. It’s okay. I can still pass the physical."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You just want to fly in jets again, right?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:105", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 20.295602158854017, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Sure."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You’d fly anywhere, wouldn’t you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "If it gets me out of a meeting, sign me up. I’ll go to Mars. I’m old. I can take that radiation. It’s okay. I can still pass the physical."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You just want to fly in jets again, right?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Absolutely. Yes, that was a big class. Lot of good folks in it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I can imagine your Office was bursting at that point."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:107", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 20.32844684317113, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "If it gets me out of a meeting, sign me up. I’ll go to Mars. I’m old. I can take that radiation. It’s okay. I can still pass the physical."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You just want to fly in jets again, right?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Absolutely. Yes, that was a big class. Lot of good folks in it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I can imagine your Office was bursting at that point."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We had a lot of work too. Everybody was working hard to get everything done. When you’re flying eight flights a year with five to seven people on every flight, right there that’s at least 50 folks in a year that are flying in space. You can’t just turn them around. They have some time off between flights. When you’re flying 50 folks in space a year, you need a pretty good size astronaut corps.\\n\\n Most of what astronauts do is not fly in space. It’s support other people flying in space. You’re working in SAIL [Shuttle Avionics Integration Laboratory]. You’re working on software. You’re working in Mission Control. All kinds of collateral duties that still have to be supported, which are also good learning tools."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Any particularly memorable missions when you were chief of the Astronaut Office or anecdotes you want to share?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:109", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 22.587163159079033, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Absolutely. Yes, that was a big class. Lot of good folks in it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I can imagine your Office was bursting at that point."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We had a lot of work too. Everybody was working hard to get everything done. When you’re flying eight flights a year with five to seven people on every flight, right there that’s at least 50 folks in a year that are flying in space. You can’t just turn them around. They have some time off between flights. When you’re flying 50 folks in space a year, you need a pretty good size astronaut corps.\\n\\n Most of what astronauts do is not fly in space. It’s support other people flying in space. You’re working in SAIL [Shuttle Avionics Integration Laboratory]. You’re working on software. You’re working in Mission Control. All kinds of collateral duties that still have to be supported, which are also good learning tools."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Any particularly memorable missions when you were chief of the Astronaut Office or anecdotes you want to share?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Those two Mir missions where we had the fire and the collision with Mir and lost pressure in the module. Those were exciting."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How did you find out about both of those?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:111", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 21.763514621198926, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We had a lot of work too. Everybody was working hard to get everything done. When you’re flying eight flights a year with five to seven people on every flight, right there that’s at least 50 folks in a year that are flying in space. You can’t just turn them around. They have some time off between flights. When you’re flying 50 folks in space a year, you need a pretty good size astronaut corps.\\n\\n Most of what astronauts do is not fly in space. It’s support other people flying in space. You’re working in SAIL [Shuttle Avionics Integration Laboratory]. You’re working on software. You’re working in Mission Control. All kinds of collateral duties that still have to be supported, which are also good learning tools."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Any particularly memorable missions when you were chief of the Astronaut Office or anecdotes you want to share?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Those two Mir missions where we had the fire and the collision with Mir and lost pressure in the module. Those were exciting."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How did you find out about both of those?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don’t remember how I got the telephone call or how I found out. But boy, we got together quick. I remember getting over to see Frank Culbertson and trying to get more information and find out what was going on. Our communications have improved greatly since then too. The International Space Station Program is different from the Shuttle-Mir Program in that during Shuttle-Mir we didn’t have a control center here in the United States. We had our folks over in the Russian control center.\\n\\n Bill Gerstenmaier worked on console in the TsUP over in Moscow in the Russian control center while Shannon was on orbit. He was her controller down on the ground in Moscow. Today information flows much more freely. It’s easier to get information. We got the information, but it wasn’t quite as easy as it is now."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mainly telephones and faxes."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:113", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 24.18168291244325, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Those two Mir missions where we had the fire and the collision with Mir and lost pressure in the module. Those were exciting."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How did you find out about both of those?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don’t remember how I got the telephone call or how I found out. But boy, we got together quick. I remember getting over to see Frank Culbertson and trying to get more information and find out what was going on. Our communications have improved greatly since then too. The International Space Station Program is different from the Shuttle-Mir Program in that during Shuttle-Mir we didn’t have a control center here in the United States. We had our folks over in the Russian control center.\\n\\n Bill Gerstenmaier worked on console in the TsUP over in Moscow in the Russian control center while Shannon was on orbit. He was her controller down on the ground in Moscow. Today information flows much more freely. It’s easier to get information. We got the information, but it wasn’t quite as easy as it is now."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mainly telephones and faxes."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, absolutely. You want a lot of information right away, and it’s hard to get the details."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you go over to Russia to find answers?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:115", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 25.757425458270276, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don’t remember how I got the telephone call or how I found out. But boy, we got together quick. I remember getting over to see Frank Culbertson and trying to get more information and find out what was going on. Our communications have improved greatly since then too. The International Space Station Program is different from the Shuttle-Mir Program in that during Shuttle-Mir we didn’t have a control center here in the United States. We had our folks over in the Russian control center.\\n\\n Bill Gerstenmaier worked on console in the TsUP over in Moscow in the Russian control center while Shannon was on orbit. He was her controller down on the ground in Moscow. Today information flows much more freely. It’s easier to get information. We got the information, but it wasn’t quite as easy as it is now."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mainly telephones and faxes."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, absolutely. You want a lot of information right away, and it’s hard to get the details."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you go over to Russia to find answers?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I traveled over there a lot while I was chief of the office to interface with the Russians on crew assignments and how things were going and seeing how our folks were doing over in Russia, and then just for verification of some stuff and learning. Most of the technical details were handled through the Shuttle-Mir Program Office."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What do you think was your biggest challenge being chief of the office?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:117", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 28.619361620300307, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, absolutely. You want a lot of information right away, and it’s hard to get the details."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you go over to Russia to find answers?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I traveled over there a lot while I was chief of the office to interface with the Russians on crew assignments and how things were going and seeing how our folks were doing over in Russia, and then just for verification of some stuff and learning. Most of the technical details were handled through the Shuttle-Mir Program Office."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What do you think was your biggest challenge being chief of the office?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Having 115 type A personalities working for me and keeping everybody in line. It’s like having 115 teenagers, only you got more control over your own kids."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I guess you can ground them or something."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:119", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 31.799290689222563, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I traveled over there a lot while I was chief of the office to interface with the Russians on crew assignments and how things were going and seeing how our folks were doing over in Russia, and then just for verification of some stuff and learning. Most of the technical details were handled through the Shuttle-Mir Program Office."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What do you think was your biggest challenge being chief of the office?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Having 115 type A personalities working for me and keeping everybody in line. It’s like having 115 teenagers, only you got more control over your own kids."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I guess you can ground them or something."}, {"role": "user", "content": "You can ground astronauts too. Don’t want to do that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "While you were chief of the Astronaut Office you got assigned to the first assembly mission. How did you juggle your task as commander?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:121", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 35.33254521024729, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Having 115 type A personalities working for me and keeping everybody in line. It’s like having 115 teenagers, only you got more control over your own kids."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I guess you can ground them or something."}, {"role": "user", "content": "You can ground astronauts too. Don’t want to do that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "While you were chief of the Astronaut Office you got assigned to the first assembly mission. How did you juggle your task as commander?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Got assigned to the first assembly mission. Actually when I got assigned to that mission, I stepped down as being chief."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You did, okay."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:123", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 37.03616134471921, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "You can ground astronauts too. Don’t want to do that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "While you were chief of the Astronaut Office you got assigned to the first assembly mission. How did you juggle your task as commander?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Got assigned to the first assembly mission. Actually when I got assigned to that mission, I stepped down as being chief."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You did, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. After three years I had a choice. I could quit being chief and fly in space, or I could stay being chief and not fly in space. They were doing things a little different. When Dan [Daniel C.] Brandenstein was chief of the office, he actually had an acting chief while he trained and flew his mission, then came back and was chief again. They’d gone to a model where if you were going to do that then you weren’t going to be chief anymore, and I really wanted to fly that first Space Station assembly mission. I wanted to fly in space again."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Tell us about the crew. As chief of the office did you get a chance to—"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:125", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 9, "return_to_go": 41.15129038302135, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Got assigned to the first assembly mission. Actually when I got assigned to that mission, I stepped down as being chief."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You did, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. After three years I had a choice. I could quit being chief and fly in space, or I could stay being chief and not fly in space. They were doing things a little different. When Dan [Daniel C.] Brandenstein was chief of the office, he actually had an acting chief while he trained and flew his mission, then came back and was chief again. They’d gone to a model where if you were going to do that then you weren’t going to be chief anymore, and I really wanted to fly that first Space Station assembly mission. I wanted to fly in space again."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Tell us about the crew. As chief of the office did you get a chance to—"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I picked that crew."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Talk about that. I think that’s interesting."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:133", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 47.631901208689754, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I’d never flown with any of them, but as chief of the office I knew them all. I knew all the astronauts in the office. I got to know everybody really well. I probably spent time in the simulator with everybody at one point during the three years that I was chief. I knew them by reputation, I knew them by the jobs that they’d held in the Office and what they’d done. It worked out."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Would you talk about the crew relationship and building that team?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I didn’t tell you the dog crew story last time, did I?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You told us about dog crews."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I guess I did tell you, all right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "We talked about Dave [David M.] Walker and the dogmobile."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:135", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 7, "return_to_go": 52.92433467632195, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I didn’t tell you the dog crew story last time, did I?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You told us about dog crews."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I guess I did tell you, all right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "We talked about Dave [David M.] Walker and the dogmobile."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So this was a stealth dog crew."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That’s right. Yes, you did tell us that."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:137", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 51.02703852924661, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I guess I did tell you, all right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "We talked about Dave [David M.] Walker and the dogmobile."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So this was a stealth dog crew."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That’s right. Yes, you did tell us that."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So that built camaraderie. Our trips, our traveling together, we went to Russia for training. Can’t remember if it was December or January. We were out walking around the Kremlin at night. There’s this one wall where there’s a huge hill, and these kids were sliding down it on cardboard. Newman and I, we grabbed cardboard and started sliding down with the kids. The rest of the crew thought we were nuts, thought I was going to get hurt.\\n\\n We did a lot of fun stuff together just traveling around. We were in a Russian grocery store before they’d all been converted to Western stores. Under the Russian system, I think it was a jobs program. You went into a store. There was a produce section, a dairy section, and a meat section. If you wanted to buy something from the meat counter, you went up to the meat counter. You waited in line to get to the meat counter, and you said, “Okay, I want a pound of that.” You got a little chit, went back to the cash register, and paid for it. Then you got back in line to give them the chit to show that you paid for it, so that they would give you what you paid for.\\n\\n We were in the store, and Newman wanted to buy some milk. Moloko is the Russian word for milk but he couldn’t remember it, so he just holds his hand out like this [demonstrates]. He goes, “Moo.” He got his milk. Common international language there. It was a great crew."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Talk about bringing in a Russian to the crew."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:139", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 10, "return_to_go": 56.696709476940676, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So this was a stealth dog crew."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That’s right. Yes, you did tell us that."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So that built camaraderie. Our trips, our traveling together, we went to Russia for training. Can’t remember if it was December or January. We were out walking around the Kremlin at night. There’s this one wall where there’s a huge hill, and these kids were sliding down it on cardboard. Newman and I, we grabbed cardboard and started sliding down with the kids. The rest of the crew thought we were nuts, thought I was going to get hurt.\\n\\n We did a lot of fun stuff together just traveling around. We were in a Russian grocery store before they’d all been converted to Western stores. Under the Russian system, I think it was a jobs program. You went into a store. There was a produce section, a dairy section, and a meat section. If you wanted to buy something from the meat counter, you went up to the meat counter. You waited in line to get to the meat counter, and you said, “Okay, I want a pound of that.” You got a little chit, went back to the cash register, and paid for it. Then you got back in line to give them the chit to show that you paid for it, so that they would give you what you paid for.\\n\\n We were in the store, and Newman wanted to buy some milk. Moloko is the Russian word for milk but he couldn’t remember it, so he just holds his hand out like this [demonstrates]. He goes, “Moo.” He got his milk. Common international language there. It was a great crew."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Talk about bringing in a Russian to the crew."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That was easy. Sergei, his English skills are excellent. He’s just a genuinely nice guy, smart, congenial. He fit right in. We had a great time. It was no issue at all. Worked out really well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Would you talk about working with the mission directors and the lead flight director and FAO [Flight Activities Officer]? Putting this mission together was pretty significant."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:171", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 43.135732395989365, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. We did that on a lot of Shuttle missions. Even though it’s a couple hundred miles above the Earth, it still has decay. The Progress vehicle regularly boosts Station. The ATV [Automated Transfer Vehicle] had the capability to boost Station. [We use] these vehicles now that we don’t have Shuttle anymore.\\n\\n We always used whatever extra propellant we could while we were up there to give Station a little boost to keep it to a higher altitude. Where Zarya was launched on the Proton, and then we got all joined up, we had extra prop. With there being a delay until the Service Module could get there, we wanted to get it as high as we possibly could, so it wouldn’t come down too much before the Service Module got launched."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Would you talk about the media interest in this flight? This was a first."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, there was a lot. First Space Station assembly mission, a lot of media interest, kind of standard."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Just standard? Nothing stood out?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, we did a lot of media interviews on orbit and on the ground afterwards. It was the beginning. I look back on Space Station, and it’s really a phenomenal accomplishment. Folks didn’t think we’d be able to do all the EVAs to get Space Station done, and they all went flawlessly. There were hiccups along the way, things didn’t go right, but the crews overcame so much and were able to fix things that couldn’t have been done autonomously with the issues that we had. I look at the solar array deploys and how we worked through that issue. It wasn’t until Luca Parmitano had that issue with the water in his helmet here about a year ago that we really had an issue on an EVA where we had to cut it short. Pretty amazing how well everything went."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Would you talk about undocking to Space Station, pulling back, and your memories of that?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:173", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 44.59525821776596, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, there was a lot. First Space Station assembly mission, a lot of media interest, kind of standard."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Just standard? Nothing stood out?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, we did a lot of media interviews on orbit and on the ground afterwards. It was the beginning. I look back on Space Station, and it’s really a phenomenal accomplishment. Folks didn’t think we’d be able to do all the EVAs to get Space Station done, and they all went flawlessly. There were hiccups along the way, things didn’t go right, but the crews overcame so much and were able to fix things that couldn’t have been done autonomously with the issues that we had. I look at the solar array deploys and how we worked through that issue. It wasn’t until Luca Parmitano had that issue with the water in his helmet here about a year ago that we really had an issue on an EVA where we had to cut it short. Pretty amazing how well everything went."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Would you talk about undocking to Space Station, pulling back, and your memories of that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Being a good commander, I had to train my pilot and give him some experience. As much as I would have liked to have flown undocking and fly around the Space Station while we took pictures of it, I let Rick Sturckow do that. I just watched and supervised. When we undocked, Rick got to do the undocking and the fly-around. That prepared him for his command going to Space Station where he did a rendezvous with the Space Station. It was pretty cool when we backed away. Got some really neat pictures that ended up on the cover of Aviation Week.\\n\\n The one that’s on Aviation Week wasn’t the one I think was the best. They picked one where you could see the Earth and the clouds behind it. My favorite is just the blackness of space behind it. It’s the beginning of the ISS silhouetted with that black void of space behind it, and it really looks neat in my opinion."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was that an image you took?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:197", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 23.275989018302244, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think it was great looking forward to the future, to Constellation, and where we were going and what we were doing. It was very disappointing when that all came to an end. A lot of folks had put a lot into it. Huge challenge to stand up a program and move forward.\\n\\n If you look back on what the Augustine Commission said in their report, it wasn’t that it was a poorly managed program. It was an underfunded program. Where we were going, what we were doing, had it been funded properly, we could have made that happen.\\n\\n Where we are with SLS [Space Launch System] and Orion, of course Orion survived Constellation, and SLS is a different rocket from what the Ares V would have been. Using the resources we have and the budget that we have, this is the right answer for what we’re doing now, although we got to be careful that it’s not underfunded also. In 2010 when that Program got canceled, that was a real hit to everybody. I was at KSC at the time. That was hard."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When Beak asked you to be his Deputy Director, what were your thoughts?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, sir. Good marine. Randy [Brock R.] Stone was retiring and Beak asked me to do it, and I said, “Okay.”"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Had you worked with Beak much?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, didn’t know him from Adam. Yes, he was a fighter pilot; I was an attack pilot in the Marine Corps. Knew of him only by reputation and having been Director of Flight Crew Ops when Beak came on board, knowing him from that point of view. Working on crew assignments and astronaut selections and loss of Columbia, but I had not known him prior to that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What’s the role of the Deputy Director at JSC? Can you share some of those [details]?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:199", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 6, "return_to_go": 24.751098909224716, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, sir. Good marine. Randy [Brock R.] Stone was retiring and Beak asked me to do it, and I said, “Okay.”"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Had you worked with Beak much?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, didn’t know him from Adam. Yes, he was a fighter pilot; I was an attack pilot in the Marine Corps. Knew of him only by reputation and having been Director of Flight Crew Ops when Beak came on board, knowing him from that point of view. Working on crew assignments and astronaut selections and loss of Columbia, but I had not known him prior to that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What’s the role of the Deputy Director at JSC? Can you share some of those [details]?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think it varies depending on who the Director is. Beak, having worked for SAIC, was very much not involved in some things like fee-determining boards and source evaluation boards. From a contractual point of view, I was the fee-determining official on a lot of the contracts at JSC. I consulted with him. At one point he said I wasn’t keeping him well enough informed on what I was doing, so I started informing him on everything I was doing."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You went overboard."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:205", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 6, "return_to_go": 23.499449806892606, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "He said, “Okay, enough.” He pretty much allowed me to run the Center, and he worried about the up and out kind of stuff. I worried about the down and in kind of stuff. It worked out well.\\n\\n When Mike Coats came on board, we kept the same model. Mike, I had known for a long time. Mike is one of the finest individuals I know. He is a really really good man. He’d actually tried to get me to come work for Lockheed Martin at one time. I wanted to stay where I was. I’ve only worked for one person since I graduated from high school, and that’s Uncle Sam. I went to the Naval Academy [Annapolis, MD], I went in the Marine Corps, and I came to NASA. I think what we’re doing is really important and I really enjoy being part of this team here at NASA. So I wasn’t ready to leave and do something else. I really enjoyed working for Mike. He’s a good man, good friend, and I’d do anything for him. It worked out well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What are your memories of that return to flight after Columbia? You were Deputy Director then. How involved were you in that effort?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "A lot. Was very concerned that it would go well. We put a lot of work into it. The crew worked hard to make sure that it all went well. It was an interesting crew assignment in that that was supposed to be the next crew, and we didn’t really change it. We allowed that crew to be the crew that continued to fly. Ken Bowersox was the Director of FCOD and it all worked out well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Any special memories?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I’m trying to think. At that point Kent [V.] Rominger was still chief of the Astronaut Office then. Or had Charlie [Charles J.] Precourt taken over yet?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I’d have to check the dates. I can’t speak with certainty."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:207", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 19.44383311876956, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "A lot. Was very concerned that it would go well. We put a lot of work into it. The crew worked hard to make sure that it all went well. It was an interesting crew assignment in that that was supposed to be the next crew, and we didn’t really change it. We allowed that crew to be the crew that continued to fly. Ken Bowersox was the Director of FCOD and it all worked out well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Any special memories?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I’m trying to think. At that point Kent [V.] Rominger was still chief of the Astronaut Office then. Or had Charlie [Charles J.] Precourt taken over yet?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I’d have to check the dates. I can’t speak with certainty."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I have to go back and look. I can’t remember. My memory is not as good as it used to be, too much stuff to keep track of. There is a lot. I’ve been very blessed. I look back on all the things that I’ve gotten to be a part of, and I often thank George for giving me the opportunity to be an astronaut back in 1985. I wish I’d made it in ’84, but it’s okay. I was really disappointed when PJ [Paul J.] Weitz called me, and I wasn’t selected. I’ll never forget. He said, “We’re going to take some more next year. We’d like you to try again.” “Yes, sir.” PJ is another good man. I think the world of him. He’s enjoying life out in Arizona, he deserves to.\\n\\n The second time I interviewed George said, “Yes, we’re looking for some Marines to guard the gates.” “Whatever you want, sir.”"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "On that return to flight there was a tile strike. Were you surprised by that?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:215", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 23.843671877411307, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, that was a joke. Yes, we always worked the budget for the Center. The guys came up when I went away, and they had a Cabana buck and presented me with it. What they also did was—I forget which Mexican restaurant it is. They got those little empty thread spools that are red and green. You turn it green if you want more and red if you don’t. The guys made up one for me that was red on both ends. Just say no."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Probably needed it after being Deputy Director."}, {"role": "user", "content": "To budget requests, to more money. I had a hard time not giving folks the money they needed to do what they were doing, but you had a limited budget. You had to allocate it fairly and do the right thing, always a challenge."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "There was a pretty big challenge when you were Deputy Director and Mike Coats became head of the Center, and that was the shooting out at Building 44."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Would you talk about that and the role you played?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:217", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 24.270746530457007, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "To budget requests, to more money. I had a hard time not giving folks the money they needed to do what they were doing, but you had a limited budget. You had to allocate it fairly and do the right thing, always a challenge."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "There was a pretty big challenge when you were Deputy Director and Mike Coats became head of the Center, and that was the shooting out at Building 44."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Would you talk about that and the role you played?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Watching that on TV, just what was going on, and working through all that, that was a scary time. Now that you bring it up, I can’t remember where I was. I have to go back and think about that. It was just working through all that and the hostage situation. Jackie [Reese] of the Employee Assistance Program did an awesome job after that working with folks to work through all that. That’s one thing I think NASA does extremely well, our Employee Assistance Programs at the various Centers. Really provides good support for a lot of personnel issues and personal issues that folks have, helping them work through it. I think we do well in providing that service to our folks. That was a scary time. It was very sad, but I think given what happened we worked through it well. We responded, and we took care of it afterwards and provided the right support in the aftermath to take care of folks that were impacted by it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were there any lessons learned that you applied to the Center?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:229", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 24.129577000000005, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Be a lot easier if you asked me about Kennedy."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, I’m sure. That’s a whole other oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It’s been an amazing seven plus years at KSC with a huge transition.\\n\\n If I had to pick one thing, one of the things I’m most proud of—it’s hard to pick one thing. The first Space Station assembly mission, having that success, having it go as well as it did, and setting the stage for the construction of the International Space Station, setting the tone for how it was to be done, how to work with our international partners, how to be successful on orbit, how to work with the team on the ground, all the testing that we did, everything. That was a huge accomplishment. I’m really proud of that, how well it went. I was very fortunate to be the commander, and I think it went extremely well. But that’s flying in space, that’s technical.\\n\\n I think working with the Columbia families in the recovery after Columbia and getting us flying again from a team point of view, from an emotional point of view, dealing with all of that, I think that was important. I think we did the right things to get us back to flying again. I feel very badly that it had to happen, but I don’t think we could have done it better than we did on the recovery and return to flight and how we dealt with the families. I think that was all done extremely well. I’m very proud to have been a part of that.\\n\\n I’m proud of how all the missions went while I was chief of the Astronaut Office. That was an awesome three years. We did a lot."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes, there was quite a few missions under your belt there."}, {"role": "user", "content": "A lot of things went well, but I had a great team supporting me."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You’ve had quite a long career."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00055:240", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 7.3, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They made a whole lot more money than I did. That’s okay, I get to tell them what to do."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I was about to say you’ve got this. Can you talk a little bit about how that relationship still continues today?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It’s no different than working with the Russians. A lot of my astronaut buddies are senior managers, VPs [vice-presidents] within the space industry now. So we still work together, but we have a relationship. We have established trust. Frank Culbertson, a classmate from the Naval Academy, we were test pilots together, astronauts together, even though he got selected a year ahead of me, I beat him to space. There’s a trust. He’s working for Orbital ATK now. We’re getting ready to return the Cygnus to flight here on December 3rd on an Atlas V. Just being at the flight readiness review, knowing Frank, knowing his experience and what he’s doing, there’s a trust that’s there.\\n\\n No different than working with the Russians. You establish your relationship. You establish trust. You work together. Kent Rominger is one of my closest friends, dearest friends, working for Orbital ATK out in Utah. Rommel is an awesome pilot. I love flying with him. We used to go up and do formation aerobatics together in a T-38. That was a hoot. I took him up in my Decathlon when he was in Florida here a couple weeks ago. We went flying."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Just a little while ago there was an announcement that there’s going to be yet one more class, or another class of astronauts, this selection."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I’m glad I got selected when I did. These guys today, they’re so smart, and they have so many advanced degrees. They’ve done all these things to make them more qualified to be selected. I always say if you just work hard and do the right thing it’ll all work out."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Just have to be one of the few that get chosen now."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00399:37", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 5, "return_to_go": 36.67951522885929, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Closed shop."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Then was there a lot of cultural challenges when you started broadening that? Because all of a sudden now it wasn’t a controlled factor as much as it was a communicated factor."}, {"role": "user", "content": "There is some."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Or is some of that going away now?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was surprisingly little actually. I think because it unfolded incrementally. There was some shock like that. Certainly when we started Station and it became an International Space Station. I mentioned that the MOD position early on was no element ops. If they want to play they come here. That changed gradually where we wound up with an ESA Control Center, a JAXA Control Center, and the Russians sitting in Russia. They won’t come here. We’re interacting with those people. That happened over time. I think it was not as much of a culture shock because it happened over time. The more recent element, when we canceled the Constellation Program and the administration’s decision was to put more emphasis on commercial vendors, which I personally think is a great idea, the reality I think of you can’t own it all yourself anymore started settling in.\\n\\n You really had two choices. Either you got with the new program or you went and found yourself something else to do. I think it added another layer on modifying the culture to recognize that our future was dependent on our willingness to be a bit part player rather than to own the whole show ourselves."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Interesting way of looking at that."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:1", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 14.264638501236657, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think there's a lot of reasons. The main reason is I just wanted to help people. Whenever I was young, I saw the movie Dirty Dancing and Baby's character talked about joining the Peace Corps. And I asked my mom, what is the Peace Corps? I was pretty young, I think, whenever it came out. And so she told me about it. And I was interested and in college, there was a recruiter that came and talked to us, but I'd already accepted a job for after college, so I decided to go ahead and postpone that dream. And then I was flying and I was flight attendant for American Airlines. They declared bankruptcy in 2012. So I decided to take a voluntary furlough and try to join the Peace Corps. And it was just perfect timing. My apartment lease was up and my car was paid off and I'd wanted to do it for so long. And so I just decided to go."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Great. So where did you go, where did you grow up?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I grew up in Dallas area, all in North Texas, but pretty much in the Dallas area. So from the time I was born until I went to school in Lubbock, Texas, which is about 6 hours away, and I went to a semester abroad in Mexico when I was in college. But until then it was all basically right here in North Texas."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What did your family and friends think about you joining the Peace Corps?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "They were excited. They were really excited. Some were a little scared about me going all the way to Georgia. In fact, whenever I had my interview, my initial interviews, my recruiter thought for sure because I spoke Spanish that I would go to South America. And I was a little disappointed. I really had my hopes on Africa. I was hoping, I don't know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you apply for Africa?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:3", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 14.738487223596286, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I grew up in Dallas area, all in North Texas, but pretty much in the Dallas area. So from the time I was born until I went to school in Lubbock, Texas, which is about 6 hours away, and I went to a semester abroad in Mexico when I was in college. But until then it was all basically right here in North Texas."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What did your family and friends think about you joining the Peace Corps?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "They were excited. They were really excited. Some were a little scared about me going all the way to Georgia. In fact, whenever I had my interview, my initial interviews, my recruiter thought for sure because I spoke Spanish that I would go to South America. And I was a little disappointed. I really had my hopes on Africa. I was hoping, I don't know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you apply for Africa?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I didn't, at the time that I applied, you couldn't really choose. I definitely put it as my first choice. And I said on the little essay that we could write that I would obviously go anywhere they wanted to send me that they thought was best, because I thought they knew best. But I really hoped to learn another language. And Africa was like my top choice. And I said, if you, if there's any choice in the matter, I would definitely prefer a much warmer climate than a cooler climate because I'm a big wimp for cold weather. But whenever I got my invitation, it was to the country of Georgia and I was like, what?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Georgia's not warm?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:5", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 16.376096915106984, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They were excited. They were really excited. Some were a little scared about me going all the way to Georgia. In fact, whenever I had my interview, my initial interviews, my recruiter thought for sure because I spoke Spanish that I would go to South America. And I was a little disappointed. I really had my hopes on Africa. I was hoping, I don't know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you apply for Africa?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I didn't, at the time that I applied, you couldn't really choose. I definitely put it as my first choice. And I said on the little essay that we could write that I would obviously go anywhere they wanted to send me that they thought was best, because I thought they knew best. But I really hoped to learn another language. And Africa was like my top choice. And I said, if you, if there's any choice in the matter, I would definitely prefer a much warmer climate than a cooler climate because I'm a big wimp for cold weather. But whenever I got my invitation, it was to the country of Georgia and I was like, what?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Georgia's not warm?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not warm at all. But it ended up being a really great time. I would have never, ever thought to go to Georgia on my own. So I'm so glad that I was sent there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was your education background?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:7", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 14.862329905674425, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I didn't, at the time that I applied, you couldn't really choose. I definitely put it as my first choice. And I said on the little essay that we could write that I would obviously go anywhere they wanted to send me that they thought was best, because I thought they knew best. But I really hoped to learn another language. And Africa was like my top choice. And I said, if you, if there's any choice in the matter, I would definitely prefer a much warmer climate than a cooler climate because I'm a big wimp for cold weather. But whenever I got my invitation, it was to the country of Georgia and I was like, what?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Georgia's not warm?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not warm at all. But it ended up being a really great time. I would have never, ever thought to go to Georgia on my own. So I'm so glad that I was sent there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was your education background?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I had studied Spanish and hotel restaurant management in college. And I did have a little bit of experience working as teaching. I did substitute teaching for the past four years before I left for Peace Corps, and I did a lot of volunteer work teaching English as a second language. So I guess that's what they needed in Georgia at the time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you were in an English language, a TEFL program?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:9", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 16.513699895193806, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not warm at all. But it ended up being a really great time. I would have never, ever thought to go to Georgia on my own. So I'm so glad that I was sent there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was your education background?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I had studied Spanish and hotel restaurant management in college. And I did have a little bit of experience working as teaching. I did substitute teaching for the past four years before I left for Peace Corps, and I did a lot of volunteer work teaching English as a second language. So I guess that's what they needed in Georgia at the time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you were in an English language, a TEFL program?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Exactly, exactly. My primary project was teaching English."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And so you were applied, you applied, you were accepted. And how many people were in your group?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:11", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 17.237444327993117, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I had studied Spanish and hotel restaurant management in college. And I did have a little bit of experience working as teaching. I did substitute teaching for the past four years before I left for Peace Corps, and I did a lot of volunteer work teaching English as a second language. So I guess that's what they needed in Georgia at the time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you were in an English language, a TEFL program?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Exactly, exactly. My primary project was teaching English."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And so you were applied, you applied, you were accepted. And how many people were in your group?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "There were 30 of us in my original cohort. Yeah. And we, we all, but well there was a couple in PST that did not make it through the entire training."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What is PST?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:15", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 21.28079546665817, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "There were 30 of us in my original cohort. Yeah. And we, we all, but well there was a couple in PST that did not make it through the entire training."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What is PST?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Pre-service training."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Sorry. And then one had to be medically evacuated. She would have been there the entire time had she not, but the rest of us all made it through together."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So in 2013 was all of the training overseas at that point?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:17", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 8, "return_to_go": 23.645328296286856, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Pre-service training."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Sorry. And then one had to be medically evacuated. She would have been there the entire time had she not, but the rest of us all made it through together."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So in 2013 was all of the training overseas at that point?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was, it was. All of it was there in Georgia."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So where did you all meet to?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:19", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 17.383698106985396, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Sorry. And then one had to be medically evacuated. She would have been there the entire time had she not, but the rest of us all made it through together."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So in 2013 was all of the training overseas at that point?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was, it was. All of it was there in Georgia."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So where did you all meet to?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "So we met in Philadelphia and we were there for, I think, just one evening, and then we left. The next day we took a bus from Philadelphia to JFK, New York, and left from there. And we were, we went through Turkey and Istanbul, and then we went straight to Georgia. And then we were in Georgia in like a little compound area for about three or four days, learning the basics and trying to figure out which cluster they would put us in for our training for the three months of training. And then we left for our villages."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you were in Georgia's Tbilisi?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:21", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 19.31522011887266, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was, it was. All of it was there in Georgia."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So where did you all meet to?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "So we met in Philadelphia and we were there for, I think, just one evening, and then we left. The next day we took a bus from Philadelphia to JFK, New York, and left from there. And we were, we went through Turkey and Istanbul, and then we went straight to Georgia. And then we were in Georgia in like a little compound area for about three or four days, learning the basics and trying to figure out which cluster they would put us in for our training for the three months of training. And then we left for our villages."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you were in Georgia's Tbilisi?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Tbilisi is the capital, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you were in Tbilisi for the first couple?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:23", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 7, "return_to_go": 20.350244576525178, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So we met in Philadelphia and we were there for, I think, just one evening, and then we left. The next day we took a bus from Philadelphia to JFK, New York, and left from there. And we were, we went through Turkey and Istanbul, and then we went straight to Georgia. And then we were in Georgia in like a little compound area for about three or four days, learning the basics and trying to figure out which cluster they would put us in for our training for the three months of training. And then we left for our villages."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you were in Georgia's Tbilisi?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Tbilisi is the capital, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you were in Tbilisi for the first couple?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "For the first three or four days, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And then, explain that you were divided, how were you divided up?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:25", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 14.833605085027978, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Tbilisi is the capital, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you were in Tbilisi for the first couple?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "For the first three or four days, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And then, explain that you were divided, how were you divided up?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "So we were divided into groups of about five or six each. They kept all of the education volunteers together and all of the IODs, so like individual. I'm not sure what that acronym even stands for, but it's basically like the NGO type volunteers together in their clusters. And then we were each. The main town that we were around was called Khashuri, and we were each in clusters around that town in little villages. And my village was called Kvishkheti and there were six of us there. And we'd have language classes Monday through Saturday from 9:00 a.m. to 1:00 p.m., would break for lunch and have, we would alternate at different people in my, uh, different volunteers in my cluster’s homes' for the lunches. And that way we could alternate and not have to be too much of a burden on each family, you know, every week, every day."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Each one lived in a separate family?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:27", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 5, "return_to_go": 15.370672316697753, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "For the first three or four days, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And then, explain that you were divided, how were you divided up?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "So we were divided into groups of about five or six each. They kept all of the education volunteers together and all of the IODs, so like individual. I'm not sure what that acronym even stands for, but it's basically like the NGO type volunteers together in their clusters. And then we were each. The main town that we were around was called Khashuri, and we were each in clusters around that town in little villages. And my village was called Kvishkheti and there were six of us there. And we'd have language classes Monday through Saturday from 9:00 a.m. to 1:00 p.m., would break for lunch and have, we would alternate at different people in my, uh, different volunteers in my cluster’s homes' for the lunches. And that way we could alternate and not have to be too much of a burden on each family, you know, every week, every day."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Each one lived in a separate family?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. We all had different families. Two of them were relative families, but they had different homes. And then in the afternoon we'd have our technical training in Khashuri. And so we would go take a bus, a marshrutka, which is a bus, to the town of Khashuri."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So talk a little bit about your home stay. What was the family like?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:31", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 12.803299156416978, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. We all had different families. Two of them were relative families, but they had different homes. And then in the afternoon we'd have our technical training in Khashuri. And so we would go take a bus, a marshrutka, which is a bus, to the town of Khashuri."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So talk a little bit about your home stay. What was the family like?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was amazing. My family was a really beautiful family, very sweet family. I had two little brothers and sisters. Dachi was three and Anano was seven, six at the time. She turned seven while I was there. But the family. So in the homes there, whenever a son gets married, his wife comes to live in the house and their family ends up living there as well. And then the daughter, when they get married, they go and live with the husbands of their family. And it was. I had a great grandmother, a grandmother, grandfather, mother and father, and the two siblings."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Wow."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. It was a lot of, a lot of people in one home, but their homes are huge. They're not very warm, but they're huge. They have one petchi, which is like a wood burning stove, to keep the entire house warm. So that's where everyone kind of hangs out."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When you say it's a big house, are these big old houses?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:33", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 13.114776840463309, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was amazing. My family was a really beautiful family, very sweet family. I had two little brothers and sisters. Dachi was three and Anano was seven, six at the time. She turned seven while I was there. But the family. So in the homes there, whenever a son gets married, his wife comes to live in the house and their family ends up living there as well. And then the daughter, when they get married, they go and live with the husbands of their family. And it was. I had a great grandmother, a grandmother, grandfather, mother and father, and the two siblings."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Wow."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. It was a lot of, a lot of people in one home, but their homes are huge. They're not very warm, but they're huge. They have one petchi, which is like a wood burning stove, to keep the entire house warm. So that's where everyone kind of hangs out."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When you say it's a big house, are these big old houses?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Very old, yes. So they all started out probably like a very like moderate size. And just people add on there. There's not Home Depot type things, so there's a lot of like DIY type additions onto their homes, which again explains."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, each family, as the family grows."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:37", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 12.857749185757172, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Very old, yes. So they all started out probably like a very like moderate size. And just people add on there. There's not Home Depot type things, so there's a lot of like DIY type additions onto their homes, which again explains."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, each family, as the family grows."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right, as the family grows, they'll just add more rooms so."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I see."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, and a lot of the homes end up adding addition of a bathroom because most of the bathrooms are outdoor in Georgia. And so eventually those will come indoor as well. So they're interesting to say the least. My bathroom at my permanent site was an addition onto the house. And during the winter, a whole side of the, one side of the bathroom would freeze and have a block of ice on it the entire winter. And the condensation, whenever you took a shower. We had warm water, which was amazing. So the condensation from the steam would freeze in between showers. And so, like once you finally get the room warm enough to take off all of your clothes and take a shower, these ice pellets would fall on you about the same ratio as the warm water was coming out of the shower. So it was definitely interesting during the summer."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You mean during the winter."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:39", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 13.175276873063524, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right, as the family grows, they'll just add more rooms so."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I see."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, and a lot of the homes end up adding addition of a bathroom because most of the bathrooms are outdoor in Georgia. And so eventually those will come indoor as well. So they're interesting to say the least. My bathroom at my permanent site was an addition onto the house. And during the winter, a whole side of the, one side of the bathroom would freeze and have a block of ice on it the entire winter. And the condensation, whenever you took a shower. We had warm water, which was amazing. So the condensation from the steam would freeze in between showers. And so, like once you finally get the room warm enough to take off all of your clothes and take a shower, these ice pellets would fall on you about the same ratio as the warm water was coming out of the shower. So it was definitely interesting during the summer."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You mean during the winter."}, {"role": "user", "content": "During the winter, yes. Exactly. The families were so amazingly warm. The word for guest in Georgian is stumari and it literally means gift from God and they definitely treat you as such."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did they speak English at all?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:41", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 14.639196525626136, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, and a lot of the homes end up adding addition of a bathroom because most of the bathrooms are outdoor in Georgia. And so eventually those will come indoor as well. So they're interesting to say the least. My bathroom at my permanent site was an addition onto the house. And during the winter, a whole side of the, one side of the bathroom would freeze and have a block of ice on it the entire winter. And the condensation, whenever you took a shower. We had warm water, which was amazing. So the condensation from the steam would freeze in between showers. And so, like once you finally get the room warm enough to take off all of your clothes and take a shower, these ice pellets would fall on you about the same ratio as the warm water was coming out of the shower. So it was definitely interesting during the summer."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You mean during the winter."}, {"role": "user", "content": "During the winter, yes. Exactly. The families were so amazingly warm. The word for guest in Georgian is stumari and it literally means gift from God and they definitely treat you as such."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did they speak English at all?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "My host mother spoke a little bit of English. She had been practicing whenever she got married and she was studying. She actually has a dream of becoming an LCF, which is a language coordinating, coordinator facilitator. Language? No, language and culture facilitator for Peace Corps. That's her dream is to help do that in the future. So hopefully she will get there one day. She had another baby since I left so the dream is slowing down. But yeah, she's, she speaks English. She definitely at that time, I thought, spoke English amazingly well because my Georgian was so minuscule that it was very helpful to have her speaking the English that she did speak. And then after I think I realized that, you know, it wasn't quite as advanced as I had thought it was. But at the time since I."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Compared to your Georgian."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:43", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 16.265773917362374, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "During the winter, yes. Exactly. The families were so amazingly warm. The word for guest in Georgian is stumari and it literally means gift from God and they definitely treat you as such."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did they speak English at all?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "My host mother spoke a little bit of English. She had been practicing whenever she got married and she was studying. She actually has a dream of becoming an LCF, which is a language coordinating, coordinator facilitator. Language? No, language and culture facilitator for Peace Corps. That's her dream is to help do that in the future. So hopefully she will get there one day. She had another baby since I left so the dream is slowing down. But yeah, she's, she speaks English. She definitely at that time, I thought, spoke English amazingly well because my Georgian was so minuscule that it was very helpful to have her speaking the English that she did speak. And then after I think I realized that, you know, it wasn't quite as advanced as I had thought it was. But at the time since I."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Compared to your Georgian."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right, exactly, compared to my Georgian and the amount of English I was able to speak with most people in the village, yes, she spoke very well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And so each one. And then you said you had meals."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:45", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 15.850859908180412, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "My host mother spoke a little bit of English. She had been practicing whenever she got married and she was studying. She actually has a dream of becoming an LCF, which is a language coordinating, coordinator facilitator. Language? No, language and culture facilitator for Peace Corps. That's her dream is to help do that in the future. So hopefully she will get there one day. She had another baby since I left so the dream is slowing down. But yeah, she's, she speaks English. She definitely at that time, I thought, spoke English amazingly well because my Georgian was so minuscule that it was very helpful to have her speaking the English that she did speak. And then after I think I realized that, you know, it wasn't quite as advanced as I had thought it was. But at the time since I."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Compared to your Georgian."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right, exactly, compared to my Georgian and the amount of English I was able to speak with most people in the village, yes, she spoke very well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And so each one. And then you said you had meals."}, {"role": "user", "content": "At all of the families' homes. So it was really nice. So yeah. So each volunteer, you know, we would rotate around at their homes and again they treat. These people don't have a whole lot. Like whenever Russia left, pulled out of Georgia, they took a lot of the infrastructure and jobs with them when they left. I mean, factories they just completely gutted and took everything with them. And so a lot of the people that were very prosperous in Soviet times, now were left with nothing and no real skill sets because whatever they had done in the factories were not useful anymore because they didn't have those same jobs. So a lot of people just live off their land and some people work for the railroads and people will work for or they'll teach or they work in little shops. But other than that, there's not much work."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What did the husband in the host family do?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:47", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 17.612066564644902, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right, exactly, compared to my Georgian and the amount of English I was able to speak with most people in the village, yes, she spoke very well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And so each one. And then you said you had meals."}, {"role": "user", "content": "At all of the families' homes. So it was really nice. So yeah. So each volunteer, you know, we would rotate around at their homes and again they treat. These people don't have a whole lot. Like whenever Russia left, pulled out of Georgia, they took a lot of the infrastructure and jobs with them when they left. I mean, factories they just completely gutted and took everything with them. And so a lot of the people that were very prosperous in Soviet times, now were left with nothing and no real skill sets because whatever they had done in the factories were not useful anymore because they didn't have those same jobs. So a lot of people just live off their land and some people work for the railroads and people will work for or they'll teach or they work in little shops. But other than that, there's not much work."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What did the husband in the host family do?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "My host dad did not have a job at that time. Now he works for the police department. He started training and worked for the police department now. My mom wasn't working. My grandmother, she just worked at the house, and my grandfather worked on the railroad. So."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And during Soviet times, what did they do?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:49", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 18.457851738494334, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "At all of the families' homes. So it was really nice. So yeah. So each volunteer, you know, we would rotate around at their homes and again they treat. These people don't have a whole lot. Like whenever Russia left, pulled out of Georgia, they took a lot of the infrastructure and jobs with them when they left. I mean, factories they just completely gutted and took everything with them. And so a lot of the people that were very prosperous in Soviet times, now were left with nothing and no real skill sets because whatever they had done in the factories were not useful anymore because they didn't have those same jobs. So a lot of people just live off their land and some people work for the railroads and people will work for or they'll teach or they work in little shops. But other than that, there's not much work."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What did the husband in the host family do?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "My host dad did not have a job at that time. Now he works for the police department. He started training and worked for the police department now. My mom wasn't working. My grandmother, she just worked at the house, and my grandfather worked on the railroad. So."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And during Soviet times, what did they do?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "One worked in a, um, like a material factory, like making textiles and stuff like this. And the dad was working. When the government changes there, a lot of people will lose their jobs because they're affiliated with that type of government. So when the government changed, I'm not even 100% sure what he was doing prior, but he lost his job because of the change. So he kind of just had to like wait until there was a different change, until it went back to the other."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So it's all patronage, you get the job through the party."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:51", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 19.397613042771482, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "My host dad did not have a job at that time. Now he works for the police department. He started training and worked for the police department now. My mom wasn't working. My grandmother, she just worked at the house, and my grandfather worked on the railroad. So."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And during Soviet times, what did they do?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "One worked in a, um, like a material factory, like making textiles and stuff like this. And the dad was working. When the government changes there, a lot of people will lose their jobs because they're affiliated with that type of government. So when the government changed, I'm not even 100% sure what he was doing prior, but he lost his job because of the change. So he kind of just had to like wait until there was a different change, until it went back to the other."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So it's all patronage, you get the job through the party."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Exactly. And so but he's happy working for the police department now. So that's good. And my grandfather, I guess, was the breadwinner because he worked for the railroad. But like my host grandmother, great grandmother, I'm sorry, she would make cheese and butter and she would sell that in the bazaar in Tbilisi on the weekends so they could make a little bit of extra money here and there if they needed to."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was the training like? So you lived with the family and you had language instruction."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:53", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 20.44179226974609, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "One worked in a, um, like a material factory, like making textiles and stuff like this. And the dad was working. When the government changes there, a lot of people will lose their jobs because they're affiliated with that type of government. So when the government changed, I'm not even 100% sure what he was doing prior, but he lost his job because of the change. So he kind of just had to like wait until there was a different change, until it went back to the other."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So it's all patronage, you get the job through the party."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Exactly. And so but he's happy working for the police department now. So that's good. And my grandfather, I guess, was the breadwinner because he worked for the railroad. But like my host grandmother, great grandmother, I'm sorry, she would make cheese and butter and she would sell that in the bazaar in Tbilisi on the weekends so they could make a little bit of extra money here and there if they needed to."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was the training like? So you lived with the family and you had language instruction."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. So language instruction was in the morning."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What else was going on in the training?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:55", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 20.49088029971788, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Exactly. And so but he's happy working for the police department now. So that's good. And my grandfather, I guess, was the breadwinner because he worked for the railroad. But like my host grandmother, great grandmother, I'm sorry, she would make cheese and butter and she would sell that in the bazaar in Tbilisi on the weekends so they could make a little bit of extra money here and there if they needed to."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was the training like? So you lived with the family and you had language instruction."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. So language instruction was in the morning."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What else was going on in the training?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "We learned a lot of cultural and technical stuff too. So the afternoon, like obviously a lot of us did have education background, but teaching in Georgia is completely different than teaching in the United States, so they would just go over a different. They would have current volunteers give trainings along with Georgian counterparts. So that way we could get an idea of like what both people, what they expected and what the expectation versus reality might be as well. So, uh, and then we like language, the cultural type stuff, we had like dance classes. We had one Saturday where we just got to make all kinds of Georgian food. And that was really fun. One where we did like dance classes, because dance is a huge part of their culture as well.\n\nEach region of Georgia, it's a very small country, but each region is very proud and very distinct. And so they each have their certain like typical dance and even khachapuri, which is like the most delicious thing on earth. It's a cheese filled bread. Each region of Georgia had a different khachapuri, so that was neat. We got to learn how to make all of those."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So this was all during training?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:59", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 22.82824728360232, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We learned a lot of cultural and technical stuff too. So the afternoon, like obviously a lot of us did have education background, but teaching in Georgia is completely different than teaching in the United States, so they would just go over a different. They would have current volunteers give trainings along with Georgian counterparts. So that way we could get an idea of like what both people, what they expected and what the expectation versus reality might be as well. So, uh, and then we like language, the cultural type stuff, we had like dance classes. We had one Saturday where we just got to make all kinds of Georgian food. And that was really fun. One where we did like dance classes, because dance is a huge part of their culture as well.\n\nEach region of Georgia, it's a very small country, but each region is very proud and very distinct. And so they each have their certain like typical dance and even khachapuri, which is like the most delicious thing on earth. It's a cheese filled bread. Each region of Georgia had a different khachapuri, so that was neat. We got to learn how to make all of those."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So this was all during training?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "All doing training, right. All during those first three months. It was a lot of fun. PST, I hear a lot of people talk about how pre-service training is not fun. But it was one of the highlights of my service for sure. Just because you form such good bonds and your families are so, to us, were so vital and so important in our, and our LCF as well. Our language cultural facilitator was just such an integral part of our service, our happiness in our service in Georgia. So."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's great."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, it was really great."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And after training, where were you then placed?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:63", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 6, "return_to_go": 21.022527510620147, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, it was really great."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And after training, where were you then placed?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was placed in the booming metropolis of Khashuri, which was about 20 minutes away from where I was, where our hub city was, where we had our technical training in the afternoons. And originally I was slightly disappointed in where I was placed because Georgia is an amazing, beautiful country with mountains everywhere, and Khashuri is basically in the middle of the country with not many mountains around. And I just knew Khashuri and I was like, why did I get placed here? I thought it was not the best thing in the world in the beginning, but luckily a few of my friends helped me see. They were like, of course they put you there, Melissa, because Khashuri was where the next training would be and they wanted to put someone there. Well, I don't know that this is true. This is what people have said. That would be able to make good contacts and good relationships, and that way there would be more families that would want to host.\n\nAnd it just turned out to be really lucky because everyone would always come back to her Khashuri or a village close to there, because that was where they had done their service, their pre-service training. And again, these families were so important and so special to us that everyone would always come back to visit their families. So I had visitors all the time, so and I was right in the middle of the country. So it was very easy to get to the capital. It was very easy to get to the Black Sea. It was very easy to get to the mountains. So it ended up being like a really great location, actually."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And what was your living arrangement there?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "There I lived with the family as well. I had a brother and sister. My sister got married almost immediately after I got there. We arrived in July and she got married in September."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That must have been fun."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:77", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 5, "return_to_go": 21.141758415369505, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, beforehand. And I told her, I was like, just wait. And I had told her, you know, the person I thought I loved when I was 15, I'm very happy I'm not with him now, you know, but it's different. It's completely different. And that was really hard for me in the beginning too. I mean, you know, they tell you to go in it with no judgment and no, uh, what's the word they use? Just with a completely open mind. And that's so difficult even though you think that you have an open mind, you think you have no judgments. You're thinking, what are you doing? That's not smart. And that's, it's just different, you know? So I'm happy for her now."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I guess her family didn't think it was such a great idea either so."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, they were very sad in the beginning. And I figured if they had let her do more things, then I think that it would have been. Because they let their son go on vacation with his friends and it wasn't like she was going on vacation alone with him. She was going 4 hours away. It wasn't like she was going somewhere crazy, and they were going to be with a lot of friends. And in Georgia, people are very well behaved, so like it would have been fine. But Dito said, like, if they don't let me take you to the Black Sea, then I'd have to take you as my wife. And he did that so. Crazy but interesting."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "OK, so that was your living arrangement."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Exactly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was your work arrangement?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:79", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 17.93528712818834, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, they were very sad in the beginning. And I figured if they had let her do more things, then I think that it would have been. Because they let their son go on vacation with his friends and it wasn't like she was going on vacation alone with him. She was going 4 hours away. It wasn't like she was going somewhere crazy, and they were going to be with a lot of friends. And in Georgia, people are very well behaved, so like it would have been fine. But Dito said, like, if they don't let me take you to the Black Sea, then I'd have to take you as my wife. And he did that so. Crazy but interesting."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "OK, so that was your living arrangement."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Exactly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was your work arrangement?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I worked my first. I don't remember if it was the first year or the first semester. I worked every day except for, well, not every day. I'm sorry. Every school day except for Friday. So I had Fridays off, which was really lucky."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But where did you work?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:81", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 18.816985697987043, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Exactly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was your work arrangement?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I worked my first. I don't remember if it was the first year or the first semester. I worked every day except for, well, not every day. I'm sorry. Every school day except for Friday. So I had Fridays off, which was really lucky."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But where did you work?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was at a school. I was at Khashuri school number five."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And this is an elementary school?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:83", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 16.463317442207828, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I worked my first. I don't remember if it was the first year or the first semester. I worked every day except for, well, not every day. I'm sorry. Every school day except for Friday. So I had Fridays off, which was really lucky."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But where did you work?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was at a school. I was at Khashuri school number five."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And this is an elementary school?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It's, um, so in Georgia, all of the schools go first grade through 12th grade. So I taught almost every grade level. That first year I didn't teach 12th grade because a lot of times in Georgia, when you're in 12th grade, the kids don't come to school very often. And they, a lot of people have their own private tutors and if they're interested in studying, then they'll go to these private tutors to pass their exams. And if they're not interested in passing the exams or going to college, then they just don't come to school in general unless they want to see their friends every once in a while. So I just taught first through 11th the first year. And the second year I taught 12th just because the 11th graders, I loved them. And so I wanted to follow them to 12th as well. But it's all in the same school building, which is quite interesting. But we had about 400 kids in our school throughout each grade."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And boys and girls together?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:85", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 18.292574935786476, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was at a school. I was at Khashuri school number five."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And this is an elementary school?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It's, um, so in Georgia, all of the schools go first grade through 12th grade. So I taught almost every grade level. That first year I didn't teach 12th grade because a lot of times in Georgia, when you're in 12th grade, the kids don't come to school very often. And they, a lot of people have their own private tutors and if they're interested in studying, then they'll go to these private tutors to pass their exams. And if they're not interested in passing the exams or going to college, then they just don't come to school in general unless they want to see their friends every once in a while. So I just taught first through 11th the first year. And the second year I taught 12th just because the 11th graders, I loved them. And so I wanted to follow them to 12th as well. But it's all in the same school building, which is quite interesting. But we had about 400 kids in our school throughout each grade."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And boys and girls together?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Boys and girls together, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Very good. And let me back up to training. How good was your Georgian and what is Georgian like? Is it like Russian or?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:89", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 21.472314735538856, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Boys and girls together, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Very good. And let me back up to training. How good was your Georgian and what is Georgian like? Is it like Russian or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "And it's completely different than any other language. They have their own alphabet. There's about 4 million people speak it in the world. So it's super obscure. But it's a really, I think it's a pretty language and it's definitely looks beautiful written. It's kind of symbols, not like letters, like we have."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Cyrillic?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It's not Cyrillic, it's its own alphabet. The Georgian alphabet is very unique. There's 32 letters. And there's several ta, ca, and there was one more. Ca, ta, and. Well, you know, I'm not 100% sure what the other letter was, but there are several of these letters that are very repetitive. They just slightly change the accent or the pronunciation is slightly different, but they all sound very similar to me. And then you're missing a few of the letters that we have, like the F and the W. But my Georgian was really pretty decent. I mean, obviously there was, like I said, like the ca and the ta, there are some of these that were like maybe a little bit off. But when we did our LPI, our language proficiency interviews, I believe I scored moderate high. So I think that's pretty good. And I felt like I was able communicate."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "This is after training?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:91", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 23.858127483932062, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And it's completely different than any other language. They have their own alphabet. There's about 4 million people speak it in the world. So it's super obscure. But it's a really, I think it's a pretty language and it's definitely looks beautiful written. It's kind of symbols, not like letters, like we have."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Cyrillic?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It's not Cyrillic, it's its own alphabet. The Georgian alphabet is very unique. There's 32 letters. And there's several ta, ca, and there was one more. Ca, ta, and. Well, you know, I'm not 100% sure what the other letter was, but there are several of these letters that are very repetitive. They just slightly change the accent or the pronunciation is slightly different, but they all sound very similar to me. And then you're missing a few of the letters that we have, like the F and the W. But my Georgian was really pretty decent. I mean, obviously there was, like I said, like the ca and the ta, there are some of these that were like maybe a little bit off. But when we did our LPI, our language proficiency interviews, I believe I scored moderate high. So I think that's pretty good. And I felt like I was able communicate."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "This is after training?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "After training, correct. And I was, I continued to learn. My host family was really great about wanting to teach me and they were very patient. So it was really helpful. They loved to learn English too, so it was really good. In fact, every time I made like a visual aid, whenever. My coping mechanism during Peace Corps was, when I would get frustrated, I would make a visual aid for my classroom because it just helped me get some stress out, I guess. And every time I made a visual aid for my class, my host would be like, oh, can you make one for the house as well? We can hang them up here and I was like, OK."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And what were these visual aids like?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:117", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 15.36186929071323, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Correct, correct. So we worked directly with the English teachers and, you know, I guess like people think like the main reason that we were there was to teach English to the kids, but a lot of it was just to transfer our skills to those teachers. So it could still be, you know, going long after we were gone, or at least their desire to keep learning long after we were gone is still there, right? And to keep improving their teaching. And it was really cool too, because we would do different games and different things. And then I noticed, like other teachers from different subjects would come and be like, Melissa, we're playing this game. What do you think? We're going to do this. And they would. And it was so neat to see like, and maybe they were already coming up with these things on their own. Maybe they were from different trainings, because Georgia was really starting to take education seriously, a lot more serious than it had. I told you, like a lot of times people would go to these private tutors instead of actually coming to school, especially once they got older and in certain subjects. So it was just really neat to see all of that like in these like beginning phases start to come to fruition."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you went back in '20, in uh, just now?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right, in March, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you go to the school?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, for sure. Of course."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do think any of these techniques have taken hold?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:119", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 17.068743656348033, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right, in March, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you go to the school?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, for sure. Of course."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do think any of these techniques have taken hold?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, for sure. There was a Peace Corps volunteer after I left as well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there one before you were there?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:121", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 14.52082628483115, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, for sure. Of course."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do think any of these techniques have taken hold?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, for sure. There was a Peace Corps volunteer after I left as well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there one before you were there?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not a Peace Corps volunteer, just this TLG, the Teach Learn Georgia volunteer. So she was amazing as well. And she was much more, um, I guess. She had them like in shape. So I think I laid a really great foundation for what she was able to do later, because I think she was a much more take charge and like, let's get this ball rolling from day one. I was much more like kind of timid, I guess, in the beginning. I wanted to make sure like I didn't step on any toes or do anything like this.\n\nBut I think she got there and felt so comfortable that she kept a lot going. And my counterpart, one of them is now teaching in Tbilisi in the capital, because she moved with her family. But the other one is still doing so many different trainings. And Keti, the one that moved to the capital, is also, keeps doing trainings. In fact, one of the Peace Corps coordinators from whenever I was in PST, in the training, she does a lot of English TOTs, like teacher, training of the teachers. And she was recently, Keti, my counterpart, was recently in one. The day that I went and went to visit this school and then had a supra, a big meal with the teachers afterwards, Keti came in town. And she was like, I'm sorry I'm late. I was with Kvansah who was doing this TOT for us for English teaching. So I'm really happy that they're all still super active and super motivated. It's just really cool to see."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's great. Did you make other friends in town?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:129", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.519930322864117, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, extensively. The country is gorgeous. It's, like I said, it's a very small country. It's about the size of South Carolina. But it is amazing, gorgeous. There's the Caucasus Mountains mountain range to the north and to the south, and the Lower Caucasus and the Greater Caucasus. And it's just amazingly gorgeous. And I think it's like ten of the 14 climates in the world as well. So, I mean, you have like the rocky beaches by the Black Sea and then you have this like desert, Davit Garedja, near the capital and then you have like really lush areas as well in Guria and a region that has like all kinds of trees and rolling hills. And then of course, you have the beautiful mountains. So I was able to travel."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Sounds like you really liked Georgia."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I love it. I love Georgia. It's a very special place in my heart because of obviously the beauty of the country and everything, but more because of the people."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Georgia is known for wine as well."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They are. If you ask anyone from Georgia, it is the birthplace of wine and the cradle of wine, they call it. So according to Georgians, and everyone I guess has a different view, but according to Georgians, that is where, it has, I guess, like remains of the oldest human. And there are these qvevris, which is, um, which are these containers that they had underground to store the wine. So like I said, Georgia has, like everyone has their villages. They have a thing called Rtveli in October, I believe? I think it's October maybe. No, I think it's October for sure. October, where you go and pick all the grapes and then you, every, every house has their own house wine. So it was not as delicious is going to the, I shouldn't say that, scratch that. It was definitely delicious. It was quite different than the wine that we have in the United States but um it was."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How is it different?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:131", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 8.355478136515686, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I love it. I love Georgia. It's a very special place in my heart because of obviously the beauty of the country and everything, but more because of the people."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Georgia is known for wine as well."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They are. If you ask anyone from Georgia, it is the birthplace of wine and the cradle of wine, they call it. So according to Georgians, and everyone I guess has a different view, but according to Georgians, that is where, it has, I guess, like remains of the oldest human. And there are these qvevris, which is, um, which are these containers that they had underground to store the wine. So like I said, Georgia has, like everyone has their villages. They have a thing called Rtveli in October, I believe? I think it's October maybe. No, I think it's October for sure. October, where you go and pick all the grapes and then you, every, every house has their own house wine. So it was not as delicious is going to the, I shouldn't say that, scratch that. It was definitely delicious. It was quite different than the wine that we have in the United States but um it was."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How is it different?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Much more like vinegary. So I guess just the way of distilling it. So in Georgia, they keep all of the stems and the skin of the grape on whenever they're fermenting. So they have different colors. They have like a kind of like a pinkish. It's not like a rosé. It's more, I guess more of an amber type of wine. But they have so many delicious ones as well. But every house has their own wine. And my home, we had three different wines. We had dark red, a red, and then we had a white. And probably the white and the dark red were my very favorite. But they have many different kinds of grapes there and it's a really cool."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'm glad I asked about it."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:133", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 9.28386459612854, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They are. If you ask anyone from Georgia, it is the birthplace of wine and the cradle of wine, they call it. So according to Georgians, and everyone I guess has a different view, but according to Georgians, that is where, it has, I guess, like remains of the oldest human. And there are these qvevris, which is, um, which are these containers that they had underground to store the wine. So like I said, Georgia has, like everyone has their villages. They have a thing called Rtveli in October, I believe? I think it's October maybe. No, I think it's October for sure. October, where you go and pick all the grapes and then you, every, every house has their own house wine. So it was not as delicious is going to the, I shouldn't say that, scratch that. It was definitely delicious. It was quite different than the wine that we have in the United States but um it was."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How is it different?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Much more like vinegary. So I guess just the way of distilling it. So in Georgia, they keep all of the stems and the skin of the grape on whenever they're fermenting. So they have different colors. They have like a kind of like a pinkish. It's not like a rosé. It's more, I guess more of an amber type of wine. But they have so many delicious ones as well. But every house has their own wine. And my home, we had three different wines. We had dark red, a red, and then we had a white. And probably the white and the dark red were my very favorite. But they have many different kinds of grapes there and it's a really cool."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'm glad I asked about it."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right? Me too. I would almost skip that, which would have been a horror for any Georgian if they had heard this later. Like, why did you not talk about the wine?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When you were there, did you stay in touch with your family back in the United States?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:143", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 14.198148310942672, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I was able to have Wi-Fi. So I could, from my smartphone, like look at things or from my iPad or from my. Yeah, it was great. I was like, what? I have Wi-Fi. I'm in like Georgia and like since I had been in this very tiny remote village and now I'm in the big city of Khashuri I had Wi-Fi, so it was pretty awesome to be able to be that connected."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And are you staying connected to your family and friends now?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "For sure. Back in Georgia?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I mean, the world is so much smaller now than it used to be."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So using Facebook?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:147", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 14.195244828324284, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I mean, the world is so much smaller now than it used to be."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So using Facebook?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Facebook is probably the biggest. But we also do like Facebook Messenger. We'll like call each other or leave voice messages."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh really?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, because to call is very expensive. But you can call in like the Messenger app on Facebook. My friends in Mexico and I always use WhatsApp and that really hasn't taken off in Georgia yet, which I'm surprised. But Facebook Messenger is pretty prevalent there. So yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It's very different than when I was in the Peace Corps."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:151", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 17.524993615215166, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, because to call is very expensive. But you can call in like the Messenger app on Facebook. My friends in Mexico and I always use WhatsApp and that really hasn't taken off in Georgia yet, which I'm surprised. But Facebook Messenger is pretty prevalent there. So yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It's very different than when I was in the Peace Corps."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So different. So different. I can't imagine like."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I was very, very lucky."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Very different. So you spent two years there."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:153", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 5, "return_to_go": 19.47221512801685, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So different. So different. I can't imagine like."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I was very, very lucky."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Very different. So you spent two years there."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And as you reflect back, what do you think the impact of Peace Corps has been on your life?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:155", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 16.08023903112983, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I was very, very lucky."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Very different. So you spent two years there."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And as you reflect back, what do you think the impact of Peace Corps has been on your life?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I mean, I think it's immeasurable the impact it's had on my life. And it's, I mean, definitely just like made me grow as a person. You know, I had so many great experiences there and there are so many times that I really thought about leaving and coming home. And my friends convinced me not to because there were times when it was really hard. And I think being there, and there's such an importance of family. And I left when I was 33. I turned 34 when I was there and 35. And then I had my 36th birthday right when I left. And I thought, you know, like there was times when I would really question like the reason I was there and if I was making an impact. And I thought, I just need to go home and start having children, like what am I doing? And I'm so glad I didn't do. Not that I didn't want children or anything like that.\n\nBut I'm so glad I didn't leave because every single day that was there was important to the whole journey there. And the amount of relationships that I made, both with people in Georgia as well as like my other Peace Corps volunteers, our government issued friends. Those are relationships that are still such a huge part of my life and that make you thankful for all the things that you have here."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Everybody says that these are such deep relationships. Why do you think they're so deep?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:169", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 12.115380700000001, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I should have, I should have."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You could still do that now."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I could. But unfortunately, a lot of the things you can't get here, like even like vanilla there is a powdered form. It's not a liquid form. So that makes a huge difference in how things taste and they are much more into, um, not so moist. So like they would make cakes and they were delicious as well, but much more dry than we are here, so than we have here. And like cookies, they're pretty nonexistent there. They did have some things, Britannia, which is like a Russian cookie, but it's much more less flavorful and much more hard and."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. So they. Snickerdoodles to them, which snickerdoodles is one that's not so hard. My host family, they have all of my recipes written down and they love them. But I don't know how often they make them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You could have a Melissa Bakery."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:171", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 12.350423000000001, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I could. But unfortunately, a lot of the things you can't get here, like even like vanilla there is a powdered form. It's not a liquid form. So that makes a huge difference in how things taste and they are much more into, um, not so moist. So like they would make cakes and they were delicious as well, but much more dry than we are here, so than we have here. And like cookies, they're pretty nonexistent there. They did have some things, Britannia, which is like a Russian cookie, but it's much more less flavorful and much more hard and."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. So they. Snickerdoodles to them, which snickerdoodles is one that's not so hard. My host family, they have all of my recipes written down and they love them. But I don't know how often they make them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You could have a Melissa Bakery."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right? No, one of the language coordinating, language cultural facilitators, when I was there in March. She was like, Melissa, I have this business plan. You have to come and we have to open this, a bakery in Tbilisi. And I was like, OK, Ana, if I ever get like, you know, enough money and enough like excitement to come back here and live across the world again, that would be a fun job for sure. Because I loved baking when I was there. There was so much time. Even though we were working hard and doing a lot of things, you still had so much free time because you're not driving anywhere. You're not going to the movies, you're not doing any of these. In fact, I never went out to eat with my host family, not once. They don't go out to dinner or anything like that. They have dinner at home. That's just how it is. So we had lots of time to cook lots of things."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So what do you think your impact was in Georgia or in your town?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00122:187", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I'm a flight attendant still."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I went back to flying. I've been back there about a year and a half, but I also substitute teach as well at the same school that I've been for about ten years. And so they are very kind and they will let me, every March, do a big presentation for Peace Corps and the kids go crazy because I'll write their names in Georgian. And in fact, I like have like a little piece of paper that I basically just Xeroxed and I put it on red because Georgia's color, Georgia's color, the flag is red and white. But I write the whole alphabet for them and its English letter translation. And so they're able. One little girl was like writing all of her, all of her like diary entries, journal entries for school, in Georgian letters. But English words, but with Georgian letters. And that to me is really cool. And they like, they learn the word gaumarjos and. Or not gaumarjos. Gamarjoba, which is hello. Gaumarjos is cheers. I did not teach them that one, but yeah. So it's really neat.\n\nAnd I mean on the airplane as well. Like people will say, oh, you speak Spanish so well. I'm like, yeah, and they're like, that's so cool. You're bilingual. I'm like, actually, I speak more than two. And they're like, what other language? And so I'm able to share a little bit then as well. So it's nice. It's really nice."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Excellent. Excellent."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Thanks."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So it's a really good interview. Thank you."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:9", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 17.40252935188381, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I think, no one. Everybody, you know. I had really few close friends in college. I had a few friends. But because of my kind of reticence to be out there, people made friends with me and I accepted their friendship, but I didn't really hang out with the guy as much or do things. So I didn't have a lot of close friends who would be asking me personal questions. They just said, oh yeah, he's going off to the Peace Corps. So off I went. There wasn't any. And at home, they were, you know, they were, you know, some concern about me going off far away, but not really. They were just glad that I had a mission and a goal and some place that I wanted to do, something that I wanted to do."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What project were you invited to join and how did you prepare yourself and others for being away two years?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I think I was just pretty naive, and I figured I'd just go and see how things worked out. I think when I got to Utah, then they started telling us some of the things we wouldn't be eating. You know, I bought some gear, some rough gear, heavy shoes and stuff. And I bought a pair of postal shoes, postmen's shoes. There was a place, I think it was maybe like a Army-Navy surplus store they recommend we go to. So I did some shopping there. Those shoes, I used a lot."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Now that was in Salt Lake?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "That was in Salt Lake City, so I didn't really get prepared until I went there and started the training because I just, you know, I figured things would happened as I needed to have them happen. So we got our Peace Corps trunk there, and we just filled it up and sent it off and. It's just kind of, that's kind of how my life is. I take a step and then see where I am and see what I need to do to make the next step."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So did you train fully in Salt Lake City or did you train some in Ethiopia?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:13", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 15.929048582572605, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That was in Salt Lake City, so I didn't really get prepared until I went there and started the training because I just, you know, I figured things would happened as I needed to have them happen. So we got our Peace Corps trunk there, and we just filled it up and sent it off and. It's just kind of, that's kind of how my life is. I take a step and then see where I am and see what I need to do to make the next step."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So did you train fully in Salt Lake City or did you train some in Ethiopia?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was fully in Utah. It wasn't fully in Salt Lake City."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, OK."}, {"role": "user", "content": "The story they tell us, they told us, was that the director of training had visited Ethiopia the year before and was in such culture shock that he designed, redesigned, the training so that we spent four weeks, three or four weeks of our training in the desert of Utah, living in tents in red mud or dirt, depending on the weather. They scraped off the topsoil, planted these tents there. It was across the street from a school. They bussed in Native American children from the reservation, and they were guinea pigs for TESL. So we had three to four weeks at least, it might have been six, but I think it was three to four weeks of training in this place in the desert. But the rest of it was back in Salt Lake City at a university, so it was sort of semi in-country training. His best attempt at in-country training, which was the director's vision of how challenging Ethiopia would be."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Now did you have language training there?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:15", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 17.698942869525116, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was fully in Utah. It wasn't fully in Salt Lake City."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, OK."}, {"role": "user", "content": "The story they tell us, they told us, was that the director of training had visited Ethiopia the year before and was in such culture shock that he designed, redesigned, the training so that we spent four weeks, three or four weeks of our training in the desert of Utah, living in tents in red mud or dirt, depending on the weather. They scraped off the topsoil, planted these tents there. It was across the street from a school. They bussed in Native American children from the reservation, and they were guinea pigs for TESL. So we had three to four weeks at least, it might have been six, but I think it was three to four weeks of training in this place in the desert. But the rest of it was back in Salt Lake City at a university, so it was sort of semi in-country training. His best attempt at in-country training, which was the director's vision of how challenging Ethiopia would be."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Now did you have language training there?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, we did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How was that?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:17", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 15.221047632805684, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "The story they tell us, they told us, was that the director of training had visited Ethiopia the year before and was in such culture shock that he designed, redesigned, the training so that we spent four weeks, three or four weeks of our training in the desert of Utah, living in tents in red mud or dirt, depending on the weather. They scraped off the topsoil, planted these tents there. It was across the street from a school. They bussed in Native American children from the reservation, and they were guinea pigs for TESL. So we had three to four weeks at least, it might have been six, but I think it was three to four weeks of training in this place in the desert. But the rest of it was back in Salt Lake City at a university, so it was sort of semi in-country training. His best attempt at in-country training, which was the director's vision of how challenging Ethiopia would be."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Now did you have language training there?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, we did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How was that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "We had Ethiopian speakers, university students staying in the United States, taking classes as university students in the States, and they gave us our language training. We had, I don't remember the schedule, but we had several hours a day, and we had, I think there were tapes we could listen to also and practice."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "OK, kind of talk about the faculty or the syllabus or technical studies and your reaction to other trainees."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:19", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 16.91227514756187, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, we did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How was that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "We had Ethiopian speakers, university students staying in the United States, taking classes as university students in the States, and they gave us our language training. We had, I don't remember the schedule, but we had several hours a day, and we had, I think there were tapes we could listen to also and practice."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "OK, kind of talk about the faculty or the syllabus or technical studies and your reaction to other trainees."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We had culture studies, we had language studies, we have kind of history. We had a history of Ethiopia for part and the part where we're just doing the culture. Some of that was linked with language studies. Some of it was a kind of a separate kind of a thing. But we spent a lot of time in terms of trying to understand the culture and trying to figure out how we would actually interact in that culture. And then the language is the language, you know, how you need to do some, how you get to the marketplace and how you do all the different things that you need to do in order to live a daily life. And then there was the regular TESL, you know, teaching us how to be TESL teachers. So that's not something that I had done before, but it was. We had those different kinds of classes, and everybody knew their stuff very well, and I think they did a really good job of getting us."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "OK, what about the selection process? Were there are surprises, disappointments, enjoyments? Like how many started out and how many made it?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:27", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 5, "return_to_go": 24.252819917027693, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Loosen up and relate to people. So I enjoyed it. I like to dance and stuff like that. So it was fine. It's just that my intensity was that I wanted to study the language. So I got there. I would stay in my tent while they were going off partying or going off on trips to the mountain or whatever."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, it was kind of the same with me. I trained in Portland, Oregon, for about a month and I really wanted to study the language and several people would go to the mountains or the ocean. And I didn't go and I stayed behind, but I made it anyway."}, {"role": "user", "content": "You made it in. Well, yeah. So those stories are very true. The language struggle is a big one, and I think it's a challenging one. So it's a lot of pressure, and I was worried. But I felt, you know, a good feeling from all the trainers and everybody. I think them slipping me the word that I needed to be more social through my these buddies was, you know, a good thing for them to have done. So I'm grateful for the whole thing."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So it sounds like the training prepared you, and it was pretty useful as part of your service."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I thought it was. They did fine. I was prepared as much as anybody could be prepared to do such things. I wasn't, you know, being a teacher in TESL means I was going to a traditional school and I was going to be teaching in the classroom or something. It wasn't, you know, many projects are a lot more open-ended than mine. So I was prepared fine for my project."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you pretty much knew what you were going to do and you knew how to do it. What about your initial entry into and reaction to the country?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:29", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 21.39202213003077, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "You made it in. Well, yeah. So those stories are very true. The language struggle is a big one, and I think it's a challenging one. So it's a lot of pressure, and I was worried. But I felt, you know, a good feeling from all the trainers and everybody. I think them slipping me the word that I needed to be more social through my these buddies was, you know, a good thing for them to have done. So I'm grateful for the whole thing."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So it sounds like the training prepared you, and it was pretty useful as part of your service."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I thought it was. They did fine. I was prepared as much as anybody could be prepared to do such things. I wasn't, you know, being a teacher in TESL means I was going to a traditional school and I was going to be teaching in the classroom or something. It wasn't, you know, many projects are a lot more open-ended than mine. So I was prepared fine for my project."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you pretty much knew what you were going to do and you knew how to do it. What about your initial entry into and reaction to the country?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was in awe. There was, it was a very harsh introduction in a way to Ethiopia. Because we got there at dusk. We flew in. It was beautiful, you know, coming in over the mountains into Addis Ababa at night. And as usual, I stayed in the hotel. Some people were going out. And at one point we heard this commotion downstairs. We were out on the balcony looking out at the night in the city and stuff like that. And some other people went down. Later on that evening, we heard that there were a couple of married couples in our group, and several people had been standing out by the curb and a taxi had gotten out of control and it smashed into the crowd and the wife died."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "One of the volunteers?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:33", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 25.17533596300095, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was in awe. There was, it was a very harsh introduction in a way to Ethiopia. Because we got there at dusk. We flew in. It was beautiful, you know, coming in over the mountains into Addis Ababa at night. And as usual, I stayed in the hotel. Some people were going out. And at one point we heard this commotion downstairs. We were out on the balcony looking out at the night in the city and stuff like that. And some other people went down. Later on that evening, we heard that there were a couple of married couples in our group, and several people had been standing out by the curb and a taxi had gotten out of control and it smashed into the crowd and the wife died."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "One of the volunteers?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "One of the volunteers. The wife died and the husband went back home. So that was our first night in the area."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Sheesh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So it was pretty, you know, serious business. You were there. And people, I don't think anybody else left at that point. But it was, you know, you knew this was, we're in here for keeps. This is, we're not messing around here. You've got to, you know, cause things can happen. I mean, it's kind of like, things can happen, are you ready for this or not?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That was just like a freak accident?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:35", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 26.86148440333439, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "One of the volunteers. The wife died and the husband went back home. So that was our first night in the area."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Sheesh."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So it was pretty, you know, serious business. You were there. And people, I don't think anybody else left at that point. But it was, you know, you knew this was, we're in here for keeps. This is, we're not messing around here. You've got to, you know, cause things can happen. I mean, it's kind of like, things can happen, are you ready for this or not?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That was just like a freak accident?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was just a freak accident. It just, I mean, it was just a terrible, terrible thing. That was our first night. And I think everybody kind of banded together and just took a real deep breath and said, OK, well, we're here. We're going to do it. But it sure is hard."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, I guess you never did mention like how many started out and how many ended up, approximately?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:37", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 29.846093781482654, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So it was pretty, you know, serious business. You were there. And people, I don't think anybody else left at that point. But it was, you know, you knew this was, we're in here for keeps. This is, we're not messing around here. You've got to, you know, cause things can happen. I mean, it's kind of like, things can happen, are you ready for this or not?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That was just like a freak accident?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was just a freak accident. It just, I mean, it was just a terrible, terrible thing. That was our first night. And I think everybody kind of banded together and just took a real deep breath and said, OK, well, we're here. We're going to do it. But it sure is hard."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, I guess you never did mention like how many started out and how many ended up, approximately?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I don't know in terms of numbers. I think we were less than 100. I think maybe 50 or 60 people. And I think probably, you know, 45 to 50 people went over. A few self-selected and a few are selected out. I can't really remember the numbers at this point anymore. I still have my book from training of all the pictures of all the people, and I could look at it, I guess, and figure that out."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, cause in our group, we started with a hundred and we ended up with 50 and we didn't know until the day before we were going to go who was. And we didn't even get a chance to go back home."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:39", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 11, "return_to_go": 29.828993090536283, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was just a freak accident. It just, I mean, it was just a terrible, terrible thing. That was our first night. And I think everybody kind of banded together and just took a real deep breath and said, OK, well, we're here. We're going to do it. But it sure is hard."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, I guess you never did mention like how many started out and how many ended up, approximately?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I don't know in terms of numbers. I think we were less than 100. I think maybe 50 or 60 people. And I think probably, you know, 45 to 50 people went over. A few self-selected and a few are selected out. I can't really remember the numbers at this point anymore. I still have my book from training of all the pictures of all the people, and I could look at it, I guess, and figure that out."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, cause in our group, we started with a hundred and we ended up with 50 and we didn't know until the day before we were going to go who was. And we didn't even get a chance to go back home."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh really? Oh, well, we were much more. I got a chance to go back home before I left. I left, actually, you know, from my family's home to Chicago then to New York City, then flying across the ocean. So yeah, we got to go back home. And it wasn't that, it wasn't. I mean, we knew, you know, the last two weeks. You know, after that session in the desert, if we got through that part, we were pretty much sure we were going. We did have to pass the language test and that was like the last hurdle. But if you pass the language test then. I was at a T2? I forget, something like that. A level two or a level three or something. And then if you got that, you're pretty much going at that point. Unless you decided not to."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Can you describe your project, the PC staff, the impression of local people, physical environment?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:47", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 21.661321582893283, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We were there for a long time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So how large was this?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, there was, um. It was a very provincial provisional capital. There were, uh, just at the end of the first year there was a bakery started. It was kind of more like a what you would call a Western or European bakery. I tried some of their bread, it was. They needed to take care of rodent protection, rodent control. It was a little, you had to pick through it. But you know, the only other businesses were the local market and, you know, the local tea houses and coffee houses and places where you could go. You know, there were restaurants, but very local restaurants. Very good food. You got used to the food that way. And the local markets that were. In the city there were, you know, Western style restaurants and Western style hotels and stuff like that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How far away was the city? Is that Addis Ababa?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Addis Ababa? I went there, um, at the end of the semester and at the end of the year. I went there twice in that first year."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you couldn't like go out once a month to a city?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:49", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 24.06813509210365, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, there was, um. It was a very provincial provisional capital. There were, uh, just at the end of the first year there was a bakery started. It was kind of more like a what you would call a Western or European bakery. I tried some of their bread, it was. They needed to take care of rodent protection, rodent control. It was a little, you had to pick through it. But you know, the only other businesses were the local market and, you know, the local tea houses and coffee houses and places where you could go. You know, there were restaurants, but very local restaurants. Very good food. You got used to the food that way. And the local markets that were. In the city there were, you know, Western style restaurants and Western style hotels and stuff like that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How far away was the city? Is that Addis Ababa?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Addis Ababa? I went there, um, at the end of the semester and at the end of the year. I went there twice in that first year."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you couldn't like go out once a month to a city?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You were really stuck."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:51", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 25.6312612134485, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Addis Ababa? I went there, um, at the end of the semester and at the end of the year. I went there twice in that first year."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you couldn't like go out once a month to a city?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You were really stuck."}, {"role": "user", "content": "There was no going out to a city. That's why the second year they sent married couples there, the next year."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Because we had pretty much, we lived, I was in a village and we needed to go into the big city, you know, at least once a month."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:53", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 26.256956903831664, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You were really stuck."}, {"role": "user", "content": "There was no going out to a city. That's why the second year they sent married couples there, the next year."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Because we had pretty much, we lived, I was in a village and we needed to go into the big city, you know, at least once a month."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We didn't have that chance. One, you couldn't go because you couldn't, you had to fly. Actually at Easter time, the way we left was on horseback. We had some horses. I had a horse and a couple of the other guys had a horse. So the four of us rode a horse to a town that was across the river and we took a bus from there. So that's how we got out at Easter time. That was the first time we've been out since we went there in September."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Boy, that was really. Did people come to see you or they couldn't get in?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:55", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 7, "return_to_go": 29.17439655981296, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "There was no going out to a city. That's why the second year they sent married couples there, the next year."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Because we had pretty much, we lived, I was in a village and we needed to go into the big city, you know, at least once a month."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We didn't have that chance. One, you couldn't go because you couldn't, you had to fly. Actually at Easter time, the way we left was on horseback. We had some horses. I had a horse and a couple of the other guys had a horse. So the four of us rode a horse to a town that was across the river and we took a bus from there. So that's how we got out at Easter time. That was the first time we've been out since we went there in September."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Boy, that was really. Did people come to see you or they couldn't get in?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Nobody could get in. Nobody could get in here."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That is really, I've never heard of anything like that."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:57", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 24.638218399792176, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We didn't have that chance. One, you couldn't go because you couldn't, you had to fly. Actually at Easter time, the way we left was on horseback. We had some horses. I had a horse and a couple of the other guys had a horse. So the four of us rode a horse to a town that was across the river and we took a bus from there. So that's how we got out at Easter time. That was the first time we've been out since we went there in September."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Boy, that was really. Did people come to see you or they couldn't get in?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Nobody could get in. Nobody could get in here."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That is really, I've never heard of anything like that."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, we managed. I did get pneumonia the first fall, and that's stayed with me for about 20 years. Every fall, I would get that in my chest. But there was a Belgian doctor there. There was a doctor from Belgium. Oh, not, I'm sorry, Bulgaria, there's a Bulgarian doctor there and he treated me. I think my friends came by and they noticed I was doing pretty poorly. And so that must have been November, late November or something. And they, you know, he came by and he gave me shots that must have been penicillin. But I got better."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What were your living conditions? Did you live with the other volunteers?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:59", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 24.042464888657975, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Nobody could get in. Nobody could get in here."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That is really, I've never heard of anything like that."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, we managed. I did get pneumonia the first fall, and that's stayed with me for about 20 years. Every fall, I would get that in my chest. But there was a Belgian doctor there. There was a doctor from Belgium. Oh, not, I'm sorry, Bulgaria, there's a Bulgarian doctor there and he treated me. I think my friends came by and they noticed I was doing pretty poorly. And so that must have been November, late November or something. And they, you know, he came by and he gave me shots that must have been penicillin. But I got better."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What were your living conditions? Did you live with the other volunteers?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "We all had separate houses because the year before, the four volunteers had had one house together and that hadn't worked out really well. There had been some conflicts. So they decided that this year we should all have separate houses, which was a little bit ridiculous. But so we all had separate houses. And we would visit each other, you know, Friday nights, I'd go to Bernie's house, but pretty much always there were four of us. We'd all kind of congregate. There was one person who had been in the town the year before, and three of us were new. So we all kind of congregated at the one guy's house and we had a good radio. We could listen to his radio and listen to music and tapes, and he played guitar. So we would kind of get a bottle of wine from the market and cook some food and have a Friday night together and stuff like that. So that's how we kind of socialize that way with each other.\n\nAnd we were discouraged really from going out into the town. One of the volunteers the year before had been very much in the town and had kind of gotten a bad reputation for the volunteers. So we were kind of making a new reputation for the volunteers not being quite so, uh, in it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was it all women or was it?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:61", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 26.713849876286638, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, we managed. I did get pneumonia the first fall, and that's stayed with me for about 20 years. Every fall, I would get that in my chest. But there was a Belgian doctor there. There was a doctor from Belgium. Oh, not, I'm sorry, Bulgaria, there's a Bulgarian doctor there and he treated me. I think my friends came by and they noticed I was doing pretty poorly. And so that must have been November, late November or something. And they, you know, he came by and he gave me shots that must have been penicillin. But I got better."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What were your living conditions? Did you live with the other volunteers?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "We all had separate houses because the year before, the four volunteers had had one house together and that hadn't worked out really well. There had been some conflicts. So they decided that this year we should all have separate houses, which was a little bit ridiculous. But so we all had separate houses. And we would visit each other, you know, Friday nights, I'd go to Bernie's house, but pretty much always there were four of us. We'd all kind of congregate. There was one person who had been in the town the year before, and three of us were new. So we all kind of congregated at the one guy's house and we had a good radio. We could listen to his radio and listen to music and tapes, and he played guitar. So we would kind of get a bottle of wine from the market and cook some food and have a Friday night together and stuff like that. So that's how we kind of socialize that way with each other.\n\nAnd we were discouraged really from going out into the town. One of the volunteers the year before had been very much in the town and had kind of gotten a bad reputation for the volunteers. So we were kind of making a new reputation for the volunteers not being quite so, uh, in it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was it all women or was it?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "We were all four guys. We were all four guys."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Four guys, OK."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:63", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 7, "return_to_go": 29.682055418096265, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We all had separate houses because the year before, the four volunteers had had one house together and that hadn't worked out really well. There had been some conflicts. So they decided that this year we should all have separate houses, which was a little bit ridiculous. But so we all had separate houses. And we would visit each other, you know, Friday nights, I'd go to Bernie's house, but pretty much always there were four of us. We'd all kind of congregate. There was one person who had been in the town the year before, and three of us were new. So we all kind of congregated at the one guy's house and we had a good radio. We could listen to his radio and listen to music and tapes, and he played guitar. So we would kind of get a bottle of wine from the market and cook some food and have a Friday night together and stuff like that. So that's how we kind of socialize that way with each other.\n\nAnd we were discouraged really from going out into the town. One of the volunteers the year before had been very much in the town and had kind of gotten a bad reputation for the volunteers. So we were kind of making a new reputation for the volunteers not being quite so, uh, in it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was it all women or was it?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "We were all four guys. We were all four guys."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Four guys, OK."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We were four guys, and the year before I guess started with four guys too. One of them got into the culture pretty deeply, I guess."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What about the influence of Haile Selassie, did he still have some?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:77", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 18.158786766329158, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I was a loner."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I spent my life being a loner and it was, I was, I liked my little town and it's beautiful. I liked the sunsets. I liked watching, my house was on the main street and I would just love to watch the people coming to the market. You know, the little kids coming to the market to get the oil to cook up for the night and just, you know, I just loved being there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Now how was that transition made? Did you request that or did they tell you to go?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "They told, basically told us that they're going to put two. There were four guys in this town. They told us they're going to put two married couples there, so we have to go someplace. One of them actually was a, one of the people who went back home, because he had been a Nigeria volunteer actually. But he had been switched to Ethiopia when the Nigerian civil war broke out. And so he came back to the States after one year. And the other, one of the other volunteers was his second year, so he came back to the States. And then Bernie was the kind of the same level I was, he went to another town. And so when I went to this town."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you have any choice in that or they just, it was picked out for you?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:85", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 19.979860945479587, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I would say that I got better at it. I would say that I wish I'd gotten a lot better. I was able to follow conversations and occasionally put in something, but I wasn't really able to, you know, speak in front of a group or start a conversation or, you know, deeply get into a conversation. I could kind of bounce along the edges and get along. But and I could go to the market and I could get what I needed. The second year, I had one student who lived with me, but I did a lot of the market stuff myself by them."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you were the only English speaker, basically?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, the only native English speaker. There were two university students who were doing a year of service. There were like, I think there were. I think they had already gone four years, but they would have to go another year when they came back, or something like that. I don't know, maybe they were doing this, I don't remember exactly, but there were two university students, so they were fairly verbal and they liked to speak English and we didn't hang out a lot together. We hung out some together. And then I was. There was Weyizero Salama Weet. Weyizero was Mrs. Mrs. Weet. She was the high school, she was the school economic, home economics teacher, and I gave her some lessons on how to use. I had a gas abuta stove. I had a gas stove. So I gave her some lessons on how to cook with that stove because I figured when I left, it might just go to the school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Now that was given to you by the Peace Corps?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "The Peace Corps, you know, when I moved to that place, my area rep equipped me fully."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, we were the first one. They called it efer gas in Turkey. And you know, we were the first ones to introduce that."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:87", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 22.199845494977318, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, the only native English speaker. There were two university students who were doing a year of service. There were like, I think there were. I think they had already gone four years, but they would have to go another year when they came back, or something like that. I don't know, maybe they were doing this, I don't remember exactly, but there were two university students, so they were fairly verbal and they liked to speak English and we didn't hang out a lot together. We hung out some together. And then I was. There was Weyizero Salama Weet. Weyizero was Mrs. Mrs. Weet. She was the high school, she was the school economic, home economics teacher, and I gave her some lessons on how to use. I had a gas abuta stove. I had a gas stove. So I gave her some lessons on how to cook with that stove because I figured when I left, it might just go to the school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Now that was given to you by the Peace Corps?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "The Peace Corps, you know, when I moved to that place, my area rep equipped me fully."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, we were the first one. They called it efer gas in Turkey. And you know, we were the first ones to introduce that."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right, right. I had to go. I wasn't sure how much was in the canister. So at one point I took a bus to try to go get another one. That was a disaster. But it was a very good disaster anyway."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Now you know at the end of the first year that you'd be leaving or did the people know that you would be leaving?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:91", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 24.073883327132492, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right, right. I had to go. I wasn't sure how much was in the canister. So at one point I took a bus to try to go get another one. That was a disaster. But it was a very good disaster anyway."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Now you know at the end of the first year that you'd be leaving or did the people know that you would be leaving?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Because I was switching towns?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think it probably happened over the summer, so I didn't really get to say goodbye or anything. I don't think I ever got to. I think it just kind of happened over the summer, because we each had summer projects we went to over the summer, and mine was in a whole different town. They tried to get you to be someplace else and do something different. So I went to a whole different town for that first summer in between the two years."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "After the first year, what was some of your joys and woes and unexpected things, relationships, health problems, vacation, travel?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:109", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 11.157874841081233, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And that was a kind of fun to travel because you got to be a little more local and see what was going on a little bit better. But the train ride was really cool too, because we went across the Rift Valley. That was so powerful to see the Rift Valley because we were just going along the edge of it. And you could see like the edge was straight down and you know, 50, 60, 100 miles across. You can see the other edge and you can see the Earth that had just gone, whoosh. This great Rift Valley. And so it was kind of cool to go just along the edge and see it from that perspective. So I remember that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How would you compare your first year to your second year?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, my second year was much calmer and slower. It just, kind of just flew by. The first year was a bit bulky. We had our celebration times together, but we got together and on the weekends go out. But the first year was pretty grueling because we were up in the mountains and the rain. It rained a lot and you had to wear these boots and you had to. The mud was muddy and just the mud stuck to your boots. You didn't walk through, you globbed through, you know, and it was day after day after day. It was a little challenging, but we made it. And it was, we made ourselves happy through it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I think you mentioned that you had a foot locker with books. Do you read a lot?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yes, we did. I did a lot of reading. They sent us a good book locker. And then second year I got another."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What other things did you do for leisure?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:111", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 10.175416490090258, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, my second year was much calmer and slower. It just, kind of just flew by. The first year was a bit bulky. We had our celebration times together, but we got together and on the weekends go out. But the first year was pretty grueling because we were up in the mountains and the rain. It rained a lot and you had to wear these boots and you had to. The mud was muddy and just the mud stuck to your boots. You didn't walk through, you globbed through, you know, and it was day after day after day. It was a little challenging, but we made it. And it was, we made ourselves happy through it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I think you mentioned that you had a foot locker with books. Do you read a lot?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yes, we did. I did a lot of reading. They sent us a good book locker. And then second year I got another."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What other things did you do for leisure?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, reading, just hiking. We did a lot of hiking, and just going to the market. In the first town there was a big hill right behind the school, Koba Hill, and it was just, it must have been 100 feet up there and there's this big huge mound of hill. And you could just go up there and just look far, far, because it was pretty level land for a long, long way away from the mountains. Behind you were mountains. But if you're looking out, it was just beautiful. And we did a lot of trips just going around seeing the various rivers and how they followed the land, and going to springs and things like that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What about lot of water, could you drink the water?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:113", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 10.194907211211397, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yes, we did. I did a lot of reading. They sent us a good book locker. And then second year I got another."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What other things did you do for leisure?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, reading, just hiking. We did a lot of hiking, and just going to the market. In the first town there was a big hill right behind the school, Koba Hill, and it was just, it must have been 100 feet up there and there's this big huge mound of hill. And you could just go up there and just look far, far, because it was pretty level land for a long, long way away from the mountains. Behind you were mountains. But if you're looking out, it was just beautiful. And we did a lot of trips just going around seeing the various rivers and how they followed the land, and going to springs and things like that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What about lot of water, could you drink the water?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I boiled it and filtered it in both towns. We had a double canister system. It could hold a couple, two or three gallons of water. So I'd boil the water and then filter it. I never tried drinking it. I just didn't take that risk."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "OK. At the end of your tour, what was your sense of achievement and failure, your pluses and minuses, relations and work with the people of Ethiopia, regrets, satisfactions?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:123", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 8, "return_to_go": 14.369264866824832, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I've never been back. I've never been able to. I wouldn't know who to write to or where to write to somebody. I suppose it's possible to look things up on the internet now and try to figure out, but people have the same names a lot. I could, you know, I could look up Atu Bulagata and I could probably find his last name somewhere, but would I get the right Atu Bulagata? I don't know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I went back a couple of times in Turkey, and I didn't let anybody know I was coming. I just showed up and they welcomed me back like a king. It was unbelievable. I wish I had known that at the time, you know? They really, they never told me while I was there that."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But yours, that you meant something special to them?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, yeah, so when I came back they really did."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I think that would probably be the case. You know, the children would always be very intent about the ferengis, the foreigners, and they would be very much in your face a lot. I'm sure that, if I had been able to go back fairly soon, it would have been difficult, because of the political situation at that time. For about 20 years, it was very difficult. I think people have started going back now. But I very much. It was a very blessed, big blessing in my life, and it made a lot of differences to me and gave me a lot of confidence that I could, you know, enter unusual situations and enjoy them and come out with a good feeling about it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you have any plans for the future there at all or while you were there?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:133", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 9.414663867000002, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It's all in English. The reason for that is they needed college. They wanted to have their own colleges and universities there. So they were just, they needed some language. They could have gone with French, they could have gone English. Later on, they went with Russian. So that's the way it came. So we were teaching English so that they could have a college so they can have English speaking students in college. And whether that was really a valid thing for their country, I don't know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But it was. I was, I did what I was called to do and I was good, and maybe it was the best that anybody could do at that particular time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Whether, you know, looking at it from a bigger perspective, was it the best thing for their country? It wasn't my decision to make. So when I came to the back to the States, I decided to do something different. But that's all. I think we did a good job teaching."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Because that's what the country wanted and you provided it."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:135", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 10.46073763, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But it was. I was, I did what I was called to do and I was good, and maybe it was the best that anybody could do at that particular time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Whether, you know, looking at it from a bigger perspective, was it the best thing for their country? It wasn't my decision to make. So when I came to the back to the States, I decided to do something different. But that's all. I think we did a good job teaching."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Because that's what the country wanted and you provided it."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We did it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "OK, and the second goal is to promote better understanding of the U.S. How do you feel you did in that?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:137", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 10.5119307, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Whether, you know, looking at it from a bigger perspective, was it the best thing for their country? It wasn't my decision to make. So when I came to the back to the States, I decided to do something different. But that's all. I think we did a good job teaching."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Because that's what the country wanted and you provided it."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We did it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "OK, and the second goal is to promote better understanding of the U.S. How do you feel you did in that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I think it was, I hope I did OK. Sometimes I wonder. I think they met a real person from the United States who came into their lives, did some dumb things maybe, but did some good things too, and was basically a good person. And hopefully showed them that Americans can be good people besides all the dumb things they do."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "OK, and the third goal is to promote better understanding of other peoples by Americans."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:139", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 11.679923, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We did it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "OK, and the second goal is to promote better understanding of the U.S. How do you feel you did in that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I think it was, I hope I did OK. Sometimes I wonder. I think they met a real person from the United States who came into their lives, did some dumb things maybe, but did some good things too, and was basically a good person. And hopefully showed them that Americans can be good people besides all the dumb things they do."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "OK, and the third goal is to promote better understanding of other peoples by Americans."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I've, since I come back, I've participated in my classroom. [tape break]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Third goal of the Peace Corps, which is to promote better understanding of other peoples by Americans."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:141", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 10.75547, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I think it was, I hope I did OK. Sometimes I wonder. I think they met a real person from the United States who came into their lives, did some dumb things maybe, but did some good things too, and was basically a good person. And hopefully showed them that Americans can be good people besides all the dumb things they do."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "OK, and the third goal is to promote better understanding of other peoples by Americans."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I've, since I come back, I've participated in my classroom. [tape break]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Third goal of the Peace Corps, which is to promote better understanding of other peoples by Americans."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, when I got back to the States, I had all my slides, had color slides, and I developed a slide show that I would, I gave it to friends and family and I've given it to several organizations. And then I also gave it in my classes at school, specially during the Peace Corps, the month when we kind of emphasize the Peace Corps in the spring. So when I actually was able to give it to other, show to other classes at those different schools where I was, I would say, open invitation, I'll come to your class. I had some artifacts, baskets and basketry that was made in Ethiopia, and I would put on my gabi. I have a piece of apparel, clothing, that would be used, worn by somebody in Ethiopia, so I could show them how to use that and talk about the culture and different things like that and show the pictures and tell them about the work that I did over there.\n\nSo I feel like I spread the word about other countries, especially Ethiopia as a country that I had been in. And my students would sometimes ask me after that, you know, tell me some more about Ethiopia. It kind of opened up their eyes to that there was another place in the world where they lived, people live differently. The children don't have shoes all the time. Sometimes they do, but a lot of times they don't. How that works and what that means and all that kind of."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Have you had any continued kind of involvement with your country or contact with the people from that country?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:147", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 6, "return_to_go": 8.43, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I've subscribed to the, you know, there's a local, there's a regional group, an Ethiopian group that. I don't think I've signed up every year, but most years I've signed up to be a part of that and get the newsletters. I haven't really responded to any appeals of, I think there was a book campaign and different things like that. I never thought that I could respond to those. I kind of kept in touch by listening and being aware of what's going on, but not really making contact."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Have you had any other continuing Peace Corps involvement at all?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I've been kind of an activist kind of a person, I guess, whenever they're trying to get legislation passed or trying to get this happening in Congress or something like that. I've tried to be, you know, sending letters or now it's not letters anymore, it's emails. So in the early days, you would send a letter. Now you send emails off to different places. So I've tried to be as helpful as I can in keeping the Peace Corps idea going, writing my Congresspeople, emphasizing that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "OK, now we're going to talk about the effect on you of your Peace Corps service. What's, you know, what was your immediate effect and then changing yourself, career plans, long term?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, when I first got back, I remember my dad picked me up at O'Hare Airport in Chicago and we hopped on the expressway. And that was pretty traumatic."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, the same thing happened to me. I came back by boat and I landed in New York, and my aunt picked me up in New York and got on the freeway. And I was in the back seat and I was shaking, I hadn't seen anything like that for, you know, two years and I was scared."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:155", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I think programs like this need to grow and grow and grow. It kind of gets a lid put on it, and I think if we had been growing and growing and growing instead of having a lid put on it, we'd be in a whole different place in the world. The rest of the world would be in a different place, and so would we. Volunteerism catches on, and it has caught on, and there's some of it going on. But we need to be doing this much more than, oh, solving our problems with the guns and bullets that we tend to solve them with."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, that's for sure."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We could have a whole different world if you could just convince enough people that training people and sending them overseas for two years would make a bigger difference, a long-lasting difference in our country and in other countries, if we could only get that established as the goal. Because we just, we have had so many chances. You know, we had the '60s, we had the '70s. We had a little bit of the '80s and then we really shut down. It's been a really long shutdown. Things are starting to open up a little bit now, I hope. But I think we're seeing, a lot of people don't realize how much change is necessary because we've let it go so long. There's a lot of change that's necessary right now. And it's just, it's going to be overwhelming to us unless we're going to start making some steps to go forward. And volunteerism is a very big step that we need to be able to take."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, I think there always has been, I never thought of it that way, a lid on the Peace Corps, at least as far as numbers. Because, you know, I think they wanted to get up to 10,000 at one point. But I don't think they've ever achieved that."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That would just be a drop in the bucket of what's needed in our world."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But even that, like you say, there's a lid on that and more money goes to Iraq or whatever."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:157", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We could have a whole different world if you could just convince enough people that training people and sending them overseas for two years would make a bigger difference, a long-lasting difference in our country and in other countries, if we could only get that established as the goal. Because we just, we have had so many chances. You know, we had the '60s, we had the '70s. We had a little bit of the '80s and then we really shut down. It's been a really long shutdown. Things are starting to open up a little bit now, I hope. But I think we're seeing, a lot of people don't realize how much change is necessary because we've let it go so long. There's a lot of change that's necessary right now. And it's just, it's going to be overwhelming to us unless we're going to start making some steps to go forward. And volunteerism is a very big step that we need to be able to take."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, I think there always has been, I never thought of it that way, a lid on the Peace Corps, at least as far as numbers. Because, you know, I think they wanted to get up to 10,000 at one point. But I don't think they've ever achieved that."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That would just be a drop in the bucket of what's needed in our world."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But even that, like you say, there's a lid on that and more money goes to Iraq or whatever."}, {"role": "user", "content": "The immediate needs of oil. Well, soon the immediate needs of oil will be come crashing down on us and we won't. You won't be able to. We'll either respond with more bullets and more guns and really destroy the world, or we'll find another way. And I'm hoping, I'm working locally so we can find another way."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, well, you're an inspiration. I lived a straight life for a long time, then I kind of just let it all go. And now I'm regretting that. But I admire your perseverance."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:159", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That would just be a drop in the bucket of what's needed in our world."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But even that, like you say, there's a lid on that and more money goes to Iraq or whatever."}, {"role": "user", "content": "The immediate needs of oil. Well, soon the immediate needs of oil will be come crashing down on us and we won't. You won't be able to. We'll either respond with more bullets and more guns and really destroy the world, or we'll find another way. And I'm hoping, I'm working locally so we can find another way."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, well, you're an inspiration. I lived a straight life for a long time, then I kind of just let it all go. And now I'm regretting that. But I admire your perseverance."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, thank you. I'm just giving it my best shot. This is my one time around, and I'm going to live it as slowly as I can. And living fully means living thoughtfully and respectfully of other people as much as I can. It's been a challenge sometimes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You've stuck with it, and it's good to hear. Any other, uh. That's a good ending, but unless you had any pearls of wisdom you want to add?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00243:161", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "The immediate needs of oil. Well, soon the immediate needs of oil will be come crashing down on us and we won't. You won't be able to. We'll either respond with more bullets and more guns and really destroy the world, or we'll find another way. And I'm hoping, I'm working locally so we can find another way."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, well, you're an inspiration. I lived a straight life for a long time, then I kind of just let it all go. And now I'm regretting that. But I admire your perseverance."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, thank you. I'm just giving it my best shot. This is my one time around, and I'm going to live it as slowly as I can. And living fully means living thoughtfully and respectfully of other people as much as I can. It's been a challenge sometimes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You've stuck with it, and it's good to hear. Any other, uh. That's a good ending, but unless you had any pearls of wisdom you want to add?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think that's it. I'd like us to be able to move forward in the ways that we need to move forward and not go backwards. There's so much of a push in our country to go backwards right now."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Boy, boy. Back to what?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:1", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 11.005882622805174, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Why did I join the Peace Corps? Um, I was raised in a little town on the plains in Colorado. Greeley, Colorado. And it seemed like a great way to."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Get out of?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "See the real world and contribute at the same time. Uh, I also thought it might help me get into graduate school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How did you even find out about Peace Corps?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's a good question. I don't really know how I first heard about the Peace Corps. No one in my family had done it or anything like that. Um, you know, I was one of the first to even get a."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "This was after college or before college?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:3", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 11.117647358672416, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "See the real world and contribute at the same time. Uh, I also thought it might help me get into graduate school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How did you even find out about Peace Corps?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's a good question. I don't really know how I first heard about the Peace Corps. No one in my family had done it or anything like that. Um, you know, I was one of the first to even get a."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "This was after college or before college?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, well, I applied while I was in college. I went pretty much like four months after I graduated. Um, I must have heard it from a colleague or on campus. I went to some informational sessions on campus, but I'm not sure where I first heard about it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And what did your parents think about this?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:5", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 12.352941509636018, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's a good question. I don't really know how I first heard about the Peace Corps. No one in my family had done it or anything like that. Um, you know, I was one of the first to even get a."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "This was after college or before college?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, well, I applied while I was in college. I went pretty much like four months after I graduated. Um, I must have heard it from a colleague or on campus. I went to some informational sessions on campus, but I'm not sure where I first heard about it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And what did your parents think about this?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's a good question. My parents were very supportive until they heard about the job offers I had. And my mom was still supportive. My stepdad swallowed. I was, I had an engineering degree, so the job offers looked pretty darn good to him at that stage, but my mom was always supportive and he was supportive too."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Job offers, where? Real jobs?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:7", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 13.725490566262241, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, well, I applied while I was in college. I went pretty much like four months after I graduated. Um, I must have heard it from a colleague or on campus. I went to some informational sessions on campus, but I'm not sure where I first heard about it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And what did your parents think about this?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's a good question. My parents were very supportive until they heard about the job offers I had. And my mom was still supportive. My stepdad swallowed. I was, I had an engineering degree, so the job offers looked pretty darn good to him at that stage, but my mom was always supportive and he was supportive too."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Job offers, where? Real jobs?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Real jobs, yeah, real jobs. Engineering jobs coming out of school, which paid pretty well for that at that time. And, uh, but they were both supportive in the end. It's just he was like, ooh, that's a lot of money to walk away from."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And what about your friends?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:9", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 15.250545073624712, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's a good question. My parents were very supportive until they heard about the job offers I had. And my mom was still supportive. My stepdad swallowed. I was, I had an engineering degree, so the job offers looked pretty darn good to him at that stage, but my mom was always supportive and he was supportive too."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Job offers, where? Real jobs?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Real jobs, yeah, real jobs. Engineering jobs coming out of school, which paid pretty well for that at that time. And, uh, but they were both supportive in the end. It's just he was like, ooh, that's a lot of money to walk away from."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And what about your friends?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, I think they sort of figured it was par for the course."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "This is something Jed would do."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:11", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 16.945050081805235, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Real jobs, yeah, real jobs. Engineering jobs coming out of school, which paid pretty well for that at that time. And, uh, but they were both supportive in the end. It's just he was like, ooh, that's a lot of money to walk away from."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And what about your friends?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, I think they sort of figured it was par for the course."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "This is something Jed would do."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, it's something that Jed would do."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay, so did you. What, what part of the world did you want to go in? Did you apply for a certain part of the world, or did you know you wanted to go to Micronesia?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:13", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 15.494500090894704, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, I think they sort of figured it was par for the course."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "This is something Jed would do."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, it's something that Jed would do."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay, so did you. What, what part of the world did you want to go in? Did you apply for a certain part of the world, or did you know you wanted to go to Micronesia?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, no. I had never heard of Micronesia. Um, I had requested Pacific, Asia or Pacific were I think what I, my preferences were. So they gave me that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's great. And what was the job you had in Peace Corps? Was it related to engineering?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:17", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 15.425308754190992, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, no. I had never heard of Micronesia. Um, I had requested Pacific, Asia or Pacific were I think what I, my preferences were. So they gave me that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's great. And what was the job you had in Peace Corps? Was it related to engineering?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, not really. It was half, half time health, half time English teacher. Uh, Micronesia's, uh, landmass is about the size of Rhode Island, spread out across an ocean larger than the continental United States."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So they speak many languages, but chose English as their primary national language so that they could speak to each other. Um, and so exams to get into high school are in English. All the schools teach English. So having people who can help teach their teachers and teach English is beneficial for the country."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you teach at um, elementary level or what?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:19", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 5, "return_to_go": 14.917009726878879, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, not really. It was half, half time health, half time English teacher. Uh, Micronesia's, uh, landmass is about the size of Rhode Island, spread out across an ocean larger than the continental United States."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So they speak many languages, but chose English as their primary national language so that they could speak to each other. Um, and so exams to get into high school are in English. All the schools teach English. So having people who can help teach their teachers and teach English is beneficial for the country."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you teach at um, elementary level or what?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Seventh and eighth grade. So the kids prepping for the high school exams."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, let's, let's start with Peace Corps. So you got a notice. You're accepted to the Peace Corps. And where did you meet up with folks? What was your training like?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:21", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 5, "return_to_go": 11.018899696532088, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So they speak many languages, but chose English as their primary national language so that they could speak to each other. Um, and so exams to get into high school are in English. All the schools teach English. So having people who can help teach their teachers and teach English is beneficial for the country."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you teach at um, elementary level or what?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Seventh and eighth grade. So the kids prepping for the high school exams."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, let's, let's start with Peace Corps. So you got a notice. You're accepted to the Peace Corps. And where did you meet up with folks? What was your training like?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, so we met, got together in Hilo in Hawaii, at University of Hawaii, um, for the three day pre-departure stuff. Um, then there was a group of, I want to say like 60 of us for Micronesia. They had one group a year. Um, and we all flew to Chuuk, which was where I ended up being posted so."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Is that the capital or?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:23", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.687666329480099, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Seventh and eighth grade. So the kids prepping for the high school exams."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, let's, let's start with Peace Corps. So you got a notice. You're accepted to the Peace Corps. And where did you meet up with folks? What was your training like?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, so we met, got together in Hilo in Hawaii, at University of Hawaii, um, for the three day pre-departure stuff. Um, then there was a group of, I want to say like 60 of us for Micronesia. They had one group a year. Um, and we all flew to Chuuk, which was where I ended up being posted so."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Is that the capital or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, no, it's not the capital. There are four states. Um, Pohnpei is the capital. Um. Koshirae, Yap, and Chuuk. But our pre- service training for three months was at a Catholic high school in Chuuk, which was also they ended up being the state where I was assigned as well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And talk a little bit about training. Do you think the, did it prepare you for the Peace Corps experience? What was good about it?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:27", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.145267073432221, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, no, it's not the capital. There are four states. Um, Pohnpei is the capital. Um. Koshirae, Yap, and Chuuk. But our pre- service training for three months was at a Catholic high school in Chuuk, which was also they ended up being the state where I was assigned as well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And talk a little bit about training. Do you think the, did it prepare you for the Peace Corps experience? What was good about it?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't know what could prepare you for the Peace Corps experience. Um, I was terrified at teaching. I was more comfortable with the health side of things. I had been a paramedic in college, so that to me seemed more universal."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, um, but truth be told, I think the, the three months of training as a teacher really did prepare me to at least be functional in a classroom. And I give them huge credit for that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "This was at the, who was doing the training, University of Hawaii or?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:29", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.939185637146911, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't know what could prepare you for the Peace Corps experience. Um, I was terrified at teaching. I was more comfortable with the health side of things. I had been a paramedic in college, so that to me seemed more universal."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, um, but truth be told, I think the, the three months of training as a teacher really did prepare me to at least be functional in a classroom. And I give them huge credit for that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "This was at the, who was doing the training, University of Hawaii or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, no, this was in Chuuk."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, in Chuuk."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:31", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 8.821317374607679, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, um, but truth be told, I think the, the three months of training as a teacher really did prepare me to at least be functional in a classroom. And I give them huge credit for that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "This was at the, who was doing the training, University of Hawaii or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, no, this was in Chuuk."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, in Chuuk."}, {"role": "user", "content": "This was in country. I think it was. There were some higher trainers who were, you know, experienced volunteers, some with advanced training in teaching. And then I think half, you know, the outgoing volunteers helped. Um, and, uh, didn't do a whole lot of health related training that I recall at all. So it was mostly English and, I mean, teaching and then the language, because we had to have language training as well. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And what language did you learn?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:35", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 9.655947376058862, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "This was in country. I think it was. There were some higher trainers who were, you know, experienced volunteers, some with advanced training in teaching. And then I think half, you know, the outgoing volunteers helped. Um, and, uh, didn't do a whole lot of health related training that I recall at all. So it was mostly English and, I mean, teaching and then the language, because we had to have language training as well. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And what language did you learn?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Chuukese."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Chuukese."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's what myself and, uh, 50,000 other people speak that language. I wish I could say I speak it well, now I don't really."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I was going to say, did you become fluent?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:39", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 4.883885649455383, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's what myself and, uh, 50,000 other people speak that language. I wish I could say I speak it well, now I don't really."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I was going to say, did you become fluent?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I got pretty good. I don't know about fluent, but I got, I got pretty good. I could definitely make my way around, um. And even, even in Chuukese, because the islands are separated, um, people instantly could tell where I lived in Chuuk. Chuukese people would go, oh, you're from Udot? Which was the island I was on, my island, as we say. Um, it was a, I was on a big island, 2.9 square miles."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Wow."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, that was one of the largest islands. Most of the Chuuk volunteers were on much smaller islands down to 0.5 square miles, 0.4 square mile islands."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So coming from a place like Colorado, how did that feel? Big open spaces to 2.9 miles."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:41", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.315428499394869, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I got pretty good. I don't know about fluent, but I got, I got pretty good. I could definitely make my way around, um. And even, even in Chuukese, because the islands are separated, um, people instantly could tell where I lived in Chuuk. Chuukese people would go, oh, you're from Udot? Which was the island I was on, my island, as we say. Um, it was a, I was on a big island, 2.9 square miles."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Wow."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, that was one of the largest islands. Most of the Chuuk volunteers were on much smaller islands down to 0.5 square miles, 0.4 square mile islands."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So coming from a place like Colorado, how did that feel? Big open spaces to 2.9 miles."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, it was, uh, you know, it didn't feel claustrophobic to me at all. Um, unlike, I think, having gotten to know lots of other volunteers and other volunteer experiences, you didn't move around a lot because even though the other island wasn't a mile away, if you didn't have a boat, you couldn't go. And there wasn't public transport, so you had to pay for the fuel and hire a boat, which really meant just paying for the fuel. But, um, that was a lot of money and so volunteers didn't do that often. Um, and it was a pretty dangerous place. So you would only go when you knew there was someone there to receive you and take you in. You didn't just go exploring, certainly not in Chuuk on your own."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was dangerous about it?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:45", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.327689505425764, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, it was, uh, you know, it didn't feel claustrophobic to me at all. Um, unlike, I think, having gotten to know lots of other volunteers and other volunteer experiences, you didn't move around a lot because even though the other island wasn't a mile away, if you didn't have a boat, you couldn't go. And there wasn't public transport, so you had to pay for the fuel and hire a boat, which really meant just paying for the fuel. But, um, that was a lot of money and so volunteers didn't do that often. Um, and it was a pretty dangerous place. So you would only go when you knew there was someone there to receive you and take you in. You didn't just go exploring, certainly not in Chuuk on your own."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What was dangerous about it?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, it was pretty lawless, in fact. So your protection as a volunteer. We all lived with families in Chuuk. It was the clan or the family with which you lived. Over time, you know, your island, others get to know you and your network of supporters grows. Um. Uh, and I have an interesting tale where I was at the port getting supplies from the state capital, going back to my island, and a, you know, a drunk man accosted me. And like 75 boys ran to protect me, like a few of which I recognized, all of whom were from my island. So they all, you know, and they, it wasn't trouble, but I was having difficulty with this drunk guy, and they all came out to, to support me and be sure that I was taken care of. And they were certainly weren't all from my clan. They were just mainly people from my island who had taken me as part of their own as well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's really great."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And that's the way everybody, certainly in Chuuk, that was your source of protection."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So it's very much of a clan based protection system, is it?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:47", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.919655006028626, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, it was pretty lawless, in fact. So your protection as a volunteer. We all lived with families in Chuuk. It was the clan or the family with which you lived. Over time, you know, your island, others get to know you and your network of supporters grows. Um. Uh, and I have an interesting tale where I was at the port getting supplies from the state capital, going back to my island, and a, you know, a drunk man accosted me. And like 75 boys ran to protect me, like a few of which I recognized, all of whom were from my island. So they all, you know, and they, it wasn't trouble, but I was having difficulty with this drunk guy, and they all came out to, to support me and be sure that I was taken care of. And they were certainly weren't all from my clan. They were just mainly people from my island who had taken me as part of their own as well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's really great."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And that's the way everybody, certainly in Chuuk, that was your source of protection."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So it's very much of a clan based protection system, is it?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. I mean they have laws and they have police, but, um, that wouldn't serve to protect you in most cases. I mean, each island had a police officer, um, and, uh. So that was your source of protection. And the tribal, you know, if someone was wronged, the tribal ways were more often than not applied to reconcile, you know, if someone was wronged, um, they would tribal elders would negotiate and say, okay, you're giving this piece of land to this family because of this wrong that this person did this. Frankly, it was trees because food was everything there. And so they'd say, you're giving this breadfruit tree to this family now as compensation for what he did when, you know, this boy did when he was drunk or whatever. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you said food was the problem. Was there not sufficient food?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:49", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 6.577394451142918, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And that's the way everybody, certainly in Chuuk, that was your source of protection."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So it's very much of a clan based protection system, is it?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. I mean they have laws and they have police, but, um, that wouldn't serve to protect you in most cases. I mean, each island had a police officer, um, and, uh. So that was your source of protection. And the tribal, you know, if someone was wronged, the tribal ways were more often than not applied to reconcile, you know, if someone was wronged, um, they would tribal elders would negotiate and say, okay, you're giving this piece of land to this family because of this wrong that this person did this. Frankly, it was trees because food was everything there. And so they'd say, you're giving this breadfruit tree to this family now as compensation for what he did when, you know, this boy did when he was drunk or whatever. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you said food was the problem. Was there not sufficient food?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, food is the center of their culture. In fact, the greeting is eta mwonga, which is come eat. Um, uh, because, I mean, now much of the food is imported, though there's not much money to buy the food. The fishing is difficult. Um, and so breadfruit and taro are still grown, but as the population grows, you know, there's no more land to cultivate. So, um, food becomes the center of the of the culture in a very big way. Um, there wasn't starvation and that kind of hunger, but there was real hunger for the families that didn't have resources to buy food, because you had to buy food to supplement what you could grow and, and fish. Unfortunately, the reefs near the islands were pretty much fished out, so you had to have a boat and gas to get to an outer reef where the fishing was more plentiful."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "For somebody who knows nothing about Micronesia, that's just fascinating. So talk a little bit about, um, your assignment. You were assigned to teach in a?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:51", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.1971049457143526, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. I mean they have laws and they have police, but, um, that wouldn't serve to protect you in most cases. I mean, each island had a police officer, um, and, uh. So that was your source of protection. And the tribal, you know, if someone was wronged, the tribal ways were more often than not applied to reconcile, you know, if someone was wronged, um, they would tribal elders would negotiate and say, okay, you're giving this piece of land to this family because of this wrong that this person did this. Frankly, it was trees because food was everything there. And so they'd say, you're giving this breadfruit tree to this family now as compensation for what he did when, you know, this boy did when he was drunk or whatever. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you said food was the problem. Was there not sufficient food?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, food is the center of their culture. In fact, the greeting is eta mwonga, which is come eat. Um, uh, because, I mean, now much of the food is imported, though there's not much money to buy the food. The fishing is difficult. Um, and so breadfruit and taro are still grown, but as the population grows, you know, there's no more land to cultivate. So, um, food becomes the center of the of the culture in a very big way. Um, there wasn't starvation and that kind of hunger, but there was real hunger for the families that didn't have resources to buy food, because you had to buy food to supplement what you could grow and, and fish. Unfortunately, the reefs near the islands were pretty much fished out, so you had to have a boat and gas to get to an outer reef where the fishing was more plentiful."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "For somebody who knows nothing about Micronesia, that's just fascinating. So talk a little bit about, um, your assignment. You were assigned to teach in a?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I taught at Udot Elementary School and then served in the health clinic some."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And what was the school? Let's talk about the school first. So you showed up and?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:53", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.885672161904836, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, food is the center of their culture. In fact, the greeting is eta mwonga, which is come eat. Um, uh, because, I mean, now much of the food is imported, though there's not much money to buy the food. The fishing is difficult. Um, and so breadfruit and taro are still grown, but as the population grows, you know, there's no more land to cultivate. So, um, food becomes the center of the of the culture in a very big way. Um, there wasn't starvation and that kind of hunger, but there was real hunger for the families that didn't have resources to buy food, because you had to buy food to supplement what you could grow and, and fish. Unfortunately, the reefs near the islands were pretty much fished out, so you had to have a boat and gas to get to an outer reef where the fishing was more plentiful."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "For somebody who knows nothing about Micronesia, that's just fascinating. So talk a little bit about, um, your assignment. You were assigned to teach in a?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I taught at Udot Elementary School and then served in the health clinic some."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And what was the school? Let's talk about the school first. So you showed up and?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I showed up, and."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Said hi, here I am."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:55", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 7.650746846560929, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I taught at Udot Elementary School and then served in the health clinic some."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And what was the school? Let's talk about the school first. So you showed up and?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I showed up, and."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Said hi, here I am."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Here I am. They knew I was coming. Um, they assigned me to start off teaching English in the seventh and eighth grade. Um, so reading, spelling, English language. Um, uh, it was pretty terrifying, to be honest, at first. Um, the smaller classes, I mean, I had eight in one and then 27 in the other. They grew though once people knew I was there, I think kids started coming back to school that may not have been going. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Had there been Peace Corps volunteers in that school before?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:57", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 7.389718718401032, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I showed up, and."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Said hi, here I am."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Here I am. They knew I was coming. Um, they assigned me to start off teaching English in the seventh and eighth grade. Um, so reading, spelling, English language. Um, uh, it was pretty terrifying, to be honest, at first. Um, the smaller classes, I mean, I had eight in one and then 27 in the other. They grew though once people knew I was there, I think kids started coming back to school that may not have been going. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Had there been Peace Corps volunteers in that school before?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, certainly, but not in some time. Micronesia and Chuuk in particular is a very high ET rate, somewhere between 70 and 80 percent."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "ET meaning what?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:59", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 7.099687464890036, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Here I am. They knew I was coming. Um, they assigned me to start off teaching English in the seventh and eighth grade. Um, so reading, spelling, English language. Um, uh, it was pretty terrifying, to be honest, at first. Um, the smaller classes, I mean, I had eight in one and then 27 in the other. They grew though once people knew I was there, I think kids started coming back to school that may not have been going. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Had there been Peace Corps volunteers in that school before?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, certainly, but not in some time. Micronesia and Chuuk in particular is a very high ET rate, somewhere between 70 and 80 percent."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "ET meaning what?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, early termination. So a lot of volunteers quit. In fact, my group of 15 for Chuuk State, only five finished. And that's about typical. Um, it's a, I mean, with the violence, isolation, it's, you know, illnesses as well as, of course, fixing."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Let's get back to that, because that's another whole subject. So the kids started coming back to school."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:61", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.777430516544484, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, certainly, but not in some time. Micronesia and Chuuk in particular is a very high ET rate, somewhere between 70 and 80 percent."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "ET meaning what?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, early termination. So a lot of volunteers quit. In fact, my group of 15 for Chuuk State, only five finished. And that's about typical. Um, it's a, I mean, with the violence, isolation, it's, you know, illnesses as well as, of course, fixing."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Let's get back to that, because that's another whole subject. So the kids started coming back to school."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Kids started coming back. I think we, uh, had a really good group the first year of dedicated kids who were interested in going to high school and had supportive families. And then more came, uh, in fact, I think some families shifted kids, you know, went, moved to a different family to come join the class. Um, and I think I got pretty good at it at the end. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did the kids have to sleep there, away from home?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:63", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 7.530478351716094, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, early termination. So a lot of volunteers quit. In fact, my group of 15 for Chuuk State, only five finished. And that's about typical. Um, it's a, I mean, with the violence, isolation, it's, you know, illnesses as well as, of course, fixing."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Let's get back to that, because that's another whole subject. So the kids started coming back to school."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Kids started coming back. I think we, uh, had a really good group the first year of dedicated kids who were interested in going to high school and had supportive families. And then more came, uh, in fact, I think some families shifted kids, you know, went, moved to a different family to come join the class. Um, and I think I got pretty good at it at the end. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did the kids have to sleep there, away from home?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, we were all on the, we were all on the same island, so they had to walk."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. Not that far?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:69", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 5.254428466002872, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I mean, my walk to school was about 40 minutes. Um, some folks, some kids probably had to walk a little bit further than that, but not a whole lot."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, uh, and I think also the fact that I went every school day, regardless of the weather, kind of pressured the other teachers to do the same thing, because if it were raining, they'd often say, I'm not going to go, and it rains a lot in the Pacific. So, um, but I went every day, uh, unless it was like a hurricane or a typhoon. So I think attendance went up with the teachers and then expectations rose. The second year I did, I shared some of the lessons I learned from Peace Corps about teaching with some of the other teachers."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, you know, at first they would ask informally or what was that you were doing? And then I got a little bit more formal towards the end."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "These were Micronesians?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:71", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.727142740003191, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, uh, and I think also the fact that I went every school day, regardless of the weather, kind of pressured the other teachers to do the same thing, because if it were raining, they'd often say, I'm not going to go, and it rains a lot in the Pacific. So, um, but I went every day, uh, unless it was like a hurricane or a typhoon. So I think attendance went up with the teachers and then expectations rose. The second year I did, I shared some of the lessons I learned from Peace Corps about teaching with some of the other teachers."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, you know, at first they would ask informally or what was that you were doing? And then I got a little bit more formal towards the end."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "These were Micronesians?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Micronesian teachers because there was, I was, there was a Micronesian teacher. He taught social studies and math and geography and the other topics. I didn't want to, I didn't want to replace him."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. There were only, there were only two of you? Only two teachers, or how many?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:75", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.835978691361964, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Micronesian teachers because there was, I was, there was a Micronesian teacher. He taught social studies and math and geography and the other topics. I didn't want to, I didn't want to replace him."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. There were only, there were only two of you? Only two teachers, or how many?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, no. No. It was a big school. So there was a teacher for every grade."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, I mean, the lower grades, the classes were 40 or 50 kids. I don't know how they managed. Um, so I, you know, I would just step in for the English teacher in the seventh grade and in the eighth grade and teach the English courses. Um, and sometimes they would sit in and listen, some, most of the time not though. They'd go have a cigarette. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How do you think your teaching was different from what they were doing, other than showing up every day?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:79", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 6.093800853533288, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, I mean, the lower grades, the classes were 40 or 50 kids. I don't know how they managed. Um, so I, you know, I would just step in for the English teacher in the seventh grade and in the eighth grade and teach the English courses. Um, and sometimes they would sit in and listen, some, most of the time not though. They'd go have a cigarette. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How do you think your teaching was different from what they were doing, other than showing up every day?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, I think I was a little more methodical about it, especially once I got the hang of it. Um, you know, if I noticed they had trouble pronunciation, with pronunciation, because there are some sounds in English that are not in their language. You know, we would have games, we would play out that a lot. I think interesting games in general was somewhat new to them. They were very much a dictation kind of approach. Um, and I think games, and I wrote questions in the style of the national exam, which I don't think they had thought of doing before."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And so I know the sixth, seventh, and eighth grade teachers all started switching their tests and quizzes to be in the same formats as the exam, so kids would be comfortable with the style of questions. Um, and I think that's just because I had a copy of an old exam, which was a publicly available, and mimicked it. Uh, and, you know, they were, they supported that. That's totally fine."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did your kids pass the exam?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:83", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.288643029053443, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And so I know the sixth, seventh, and eighth grade teachers all started switching their tests and quizzes to be in the same formats as the exam, so kids would be comfortable with the style of questions. Um, and I think that's just because I had a copy of an old exam, which was a publicly available, and mimicked it. Uh, and, you know, they were, they supported that. That's totally fine."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did your kids pass the exam?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um. The first year I had four kids pass exam out of eight. Um, the second year we had a really much bigger class. It was 28, but I think we still had like 16 kids pass the exam the second year. Um, in the previous three years, no one had passed the exam."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Wow."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So, um, the second year, actually, the state gave me an award for the most improved, gave the school an award for the most improved performance in a school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, that's excellent."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:85", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.987381143392714, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um. The first year I had four kids pass exam out of eight. Um, the second year we had a really much bigger class. It was 28, but I think we still had like 16 kids pass the exam the second year. Um, in the previous three years, no one had passed the exam."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Wow."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So, um, the second year, actually, the state gave me an award for the most improved, gave the school an award for the most improved performance in a school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, that's excellent."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, it was, it was, it was really great."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And then where did they go to high school?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:87", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.763756825991904, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So, um, the second year, actually, the state gave me an award for the most improved, gave the school an award for the most improved performance in a school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, that's excellent."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, it was, it was, it was really great."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And then where did they go to high school?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, there was a state high school, a boarding high school in the, in the state capital. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you have to, they have to go board. And do they have to then pay for that?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:89", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 8.626396473324338, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, it was, it was, it was really great."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And then where did they go to high school?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, there was a state high school, a boarding high school in the, in the state capital. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you have to, they have to go board. And do they have to then pay for that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, I don't, they don't have to pay for boarding, but I think they have to have a stipend for food because I don't think they feed them. I think they get lunch, but they don't get breakfast or dinner. Um, or if they have family in the state capital, which many of them did, they could stay there instead."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, I see."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:93", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 9.415304288054736, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, I don't, they don't have to pay for boarding, but I think they have to have a stipend for food because I don't think they feed them. I think they get lunch, but they don't get breakfast or dinner. Um, or if they have family in the state capital, which many of them did, they could stay there instead."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, I see."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, most people had some form of extended family there. Most, especially the girls would generally stay with extended family. Um, there was also a private Jesuit high school, which two of my students passed the exam to get into, which was a, was essentially the premier high school in the whole country."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, happened to be in the same state capital. It was actually the location of the Peace Corps training too. Um, and, and a couple of my students passed that exam and got to attend that as well, which was a, that's a big, that was a big deal."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's great. Well, that encourages other kids to come as well, come back to school, because they can see you can move forward."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:95", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 10.461449208949707, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, most people had some form of extended family there. Most, especially the girls would generally stay with extended family. Um, there was also a private Jesuit high school, which two of my students passed the exam to get into, which was a, was essentially the premier high school in the whole country."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, happened to be in the same state capital. It was actually the location of the Peace Corps training too. Um, and, and a couple of my students passed that exam and got to attend that as well, which was a, that's a big, that was a big deal."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's great. Well, that encourages other kids to come as well, come back to school, because they can see you can move forward."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Parents insisting their kids go, yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And so what did you do on the health side?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:105", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 10.248182372181924, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They knew how, there were several. Lots of boys knew how to build a tank and they had the designs. I made lots of copies so they knew how to scale their 1,000 gallon version down, um, to, uh, to a, to a family size. So I'm hoping that helped, because even when there isn't a drought, a catchment tank is a much cleaner, better source of water than the, the well and the pipe that they used, which generally was contaminated, uh, for drinking at any rate. That was fine for washing dishes and doing clothes, but um, wasn't safe for drinking in a catchment."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Because of the pipes, old pipes or what?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, the pipes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was it the water itself?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, the water, I don't know, we weren't able to test it, but, um. Uh, definitely the, they were contaminated with, you know, there were pigs and chickens on the island and feces, fecal contamination. If nothing else, I got sick all the time from it, so I know they were a little hardier. Uh, but, um, but it certainly was not clean water for drinking, and they knew it. They would boil it in general for visitors, but they didn't, obviously didn't boil it enough for themselves. Kids regularly got sick."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Is drought a major problem there, or is it just that year?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:109", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 7.960718978002376, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, the water, I don't know, we weren't able to test it, but, um. Uh, definitely the, they were contaminated with, you know, there were pigs and chickens on the island and feces, fecal contamination. If nothing else, I got sick all the time from it, so I know they were a little hardier. Uh, but, um, but it certainly was not clean water for drinking, and they knew it. They would boil it in general for visitors, but they didn't, obviously didn't boil it enough for themselves. Kids regularly got sick."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Is drought a major problem there, or is it just that year?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It happens, not that often. That was a very severe drought, apparently. Um, I mean, there's a dry season, but usually the wells, you know, they slow, but they don't, um, they don't stop flowing. Um, but this year, they're, in the end, and I don't remember how many people were on the island, but there were only three water sources left on the island."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Wow."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, and they were like, trickles that would take, you know, ten minutes to fill a gallon of water. So that's a, a big hazard."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So hopefully those water tanks still are there and working."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:111", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.734132197780418, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It happens, not that often. That was a very severe drought, apparently. Um, I mean, there's a dry season, but usually the wells, you know, they slow, but they don't, um, they don't stop flowing. Um, but this year, they're, in the end, and I don't remember how many people were on the island, but there were only three water sources left on the island."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Wow."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, and they were like, trickles that would take, you know, ten minutes to fill a gallon of water. So that's a, a big hazard."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So hopefully those water tanks still are there and working."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Some of them probably are. That was a long time ago. Hopefully, hopefully most of them got built. That to me would be a big accomplishment."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there Peace Corps there after you?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:113", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 8.59348021975602, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, and they were like, trickles that would take, you know, ten minutes to fill a gallon of water. So that's a, a big hazard."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So hopefully those water tanks still are there and working."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Some of them probably are. That was a long time ago. Hopefully, hopefully most of them got built. That to me would be a big accomplishment."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there Peace Corps there after you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "There was a volunteer assigned after me, yes. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "They might have continued then."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:115", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 9.548311355284465, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Some of them probably are. That was a long time ago. Hopefully, hopefully most of them got built. That to me would be a big accomplishment."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there Peace Corps there after you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "There was a volunteer assigned after me, yes. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "They might have continued then."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'm sure they did. Yeah. Um, I got to meet them, but I can't for the life of me remember the name."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. Well, let's go back to this whole, um, high attrition rate. And you had mentioned violence, and then you said isolation. Um, did Peace Corps prepare you all for that, or how did they deal with it, or did they just?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:117", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 10.60923483920496, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "There was a volunteer assigned after me, yes. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "They might have continued then."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'm sure they did. Yeah. Um, I got to meet them, but I can't for the life of me remember the name."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. Well, let's go back to this whole, um, high attrition rate. And you had mentioned violence, and then you said isolation. Um, did Peace Corps prepare you all for that, or how did they deal with it, or did they just?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Lived with high attrition rate?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:119", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 11.788038710227733, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'm sure they did. Yeah. Um, I got to meet them, but I can't for the life of me remember the name."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. Well, let's go back to this whole, um, high attrition rate. And you had mentioned violence, and then you said isolation. Um, did Peace Corps prepare you all for that, or how did they deal with it, or did they just?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Lived with high attrition rate?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, you know. It would be difficult to, I'm not sure what you could do to prepare other than tell people. And certainly the, the volunteers who worked with us during training shared the challenges. Um. Even on, uh, just because it was difficult to see other volunteers and get together. Um. And, uh, and so the violence is also isolating because if you're not, you can't even go exploring your own island if it's not, if you're not safe. And I mean, it's definitely worse for women than men, but, um, but, you know, even then you're susceptible to being victimized."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And that was stealing property or?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:121", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 13.097820789141926, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Lived with high attrition rate?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, you know. It would be difficult to, I'm not sure what you could do to prepare other than tell people. And certainly the, the volunteers who worked with us during training shared the challenges. Um. Even on, uh, just because it was difficult to see other volunteers and get together. Um. And, uh, and so the violence is also isolating because if you're not, you can't even go exploring your own island if it's not, if you're not safe. And I mean, it's definitely worse for women than men, but, um, but, you know, even then you're susceptible to being victimized."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And that was stealing property or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Stealing. You could be held, you know, at knifepoint. Uh, theft. You could be beaten if you wronged them for some reason you didn't know about. Um, or, uh, uh, or you could just be the victim that somebody else in your clan wronged somebody that you didn't, you know nothing about, and you happen to be in a vulnerable spot, so they'll take it out on you because they can't get back at your clan otherwise. Especially because the volunteers are a high profile member of the clan regardless."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you became a member of the clan?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:125", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 16.17014912239744, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Stealing. You could be held, you know, at knifepoint. Uh, theft. You could be beaten if you wronged them for some reason you didn't know about. Um, or, uh, uh, or you could just be the victim that somebody else in your clan wronged somebody that you didn't, you know nothing about, and you happen to be in a vulnerable spot, so they'll take it out on you because they can't get back at your clan otherwise. Especially because the volunteers are a high profile member of the clan regardless."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you became a member of the clan?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Absolutely. Yeah. And they, they definitely, which is a plus and a minus because the clan then has say over what you do. It's like, oh, you can't go there because we have a grievance with that group. So, you know, you shouldn't go there. Um, in my, and in my case, it usually meant let us find someone who can go with you."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Like, our clan can't go with you there. But you know, the clan, you know, just on the other side of the village can go with you to be sure you're okay there in that part of the island or whatever. Again, over time, most of this went away and my island began to own me. And so I didn't have, certainly had, didn't have any difficulties on my island. But if you were to travel to visit another volunteer, you know, they had to be there to catch you and take you in their clan fold, or you could be open to being a victim."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So that really is very isolating for them as well, right? Because you have to, you can't travel, you can't really go places."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:127", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 17.966832358219378, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Absolutely. Yeah. And they, they definitely, which is a plus and a minus because the clan then has say over what you do. It's like, oh, you can't go there because we have a grievance with that group. So, you know, you shouldn't go there. Um, in my, and in my case, it usually meant let us find someone who can go with you."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Like, our clan can't go with you there. But you know, the clan, you know, just on the other side of the village can go with you to be sure you're okay there in that part of the island or whatever. Again, over time, most of this went away and my island began to own me. And so I didn't have, certainly had, didn't have any difficulties on my island. But if you were to travel to visit another volunteer, you know, they had to be there to catch you and take you in their clan fold, or you could be open to being a victim."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So that really is very isolating for them as well, right? Because you have to, you can't travel, you can't really go places."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not a lot. And then even if to leave the country, you have to go on a flight because it's so far away. And so most volunteers get one flight out at mid-service. That's the only time you ever leave your, essentially your state or your island."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Where did you, where did you go, I mean?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:129", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 15.518702620243753, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Like, our clan can't go with you there. But you know, the clan, you know, just on the other side of the village can go with you to be sure you're okay there in that part of the island or whatever. Again, over time, most of this went away and my island began to own me. And so I didn't have, certainly had, didn't have any difficulties on my island. But if you were to travel to visit another volunteer, you know, they had to be there to catch you and take you in their clan fold, or you could be open to being a victim."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So that really is very isolating for them as well, right? Because you have to, you can't travel, you can't really go places."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not a lot. And then even if to leave the country, you have to go on a flight because it's so far away. And so most volunteers get one flight out at mid-service. That's the only time you ever leave your, essentially your state or your island."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Where did you, where did you go, I mean?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "So we held our mid service conference in Guam, which is part of the region of Micronesia, though that's an American territory. So Peace Corps paid to fly us all to Guam. And then from Guam you could catch a flight. I went to Thailand with a friend, but you know, that was all of my money I could possibly save just to get to Thailand and back. Because, you know, you're flying on Continental Airlines, you know, that's expensive."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you got the flight to Guam, but not to Thailand?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:133", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 14.59099088918982, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So we held our mid service conference in Guam, which is part of the region of Micronesia, though that's an American territory. So Peace Corps paid to fly us all to Guam. And then from Guam you could catch a flight. I went to Thailand with a friend, but you know, that was all of my money I could possibly save just to get to Thailand and back. Because, you know, you're flying on Continental Airlines, you know, that's expensive."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you got the flight to Guam, but not to Thailand?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. And then I flew back to Guam, and then Peace Corps would cover the flight back from because, um, yeah, um, on Continental Airlines was the airline, still is. One of the most profitable wings is Air Micronesia, which is Continental Airlines, which is owned by somebody else now."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But, um, the island hopper still flies the same route. Hawaii to Kwajalein, to Majuro, to Pohnpei, to Chuuk, to Guam, and back. It takes 14 hours."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And that's, those are the flights in and out?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:135", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 15.101100987988689, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. And then I flew back to Guam, and then Peace Corps would cover the flight back from because, um, yeah, um, on Continental Airlines was the airline, still is. One of the most profitable wings is Air Micronesia, which is Continental Airlines, which is owned by somebody else now."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But, um, the island hopper still flies the same route. Hawaii to Kwajalein, to Majuro, to Pohnpei, to Chuuk, to Guam, and back. It takes 14 hours."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And that's, those are the flights in and out?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Or you could, I mean, you could go to Guam and fly the other way because it goes Guam, Chuuk, Pohnpei, go another direction. Um, yeah. So it's, it's located halfway between Hawaii and the Philippines. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Far away from everything else."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:137", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 5, "return_to_go": 16.77900109776521, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But, um, the island hopper still flies the same route. Hawaii to Kwajalein, to Majuro, to Pohnpei, to Chuuk, to Guam, and back. It takes 14 hours."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And that's, those are the flights in and out?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Or you could, I mean, you could go to Guam and fly the other way because it goes Guam, Chuuk, Pohnpei, go another direction. Um, yeah. So it's, it's located halfway between Hawaii and the Philippines. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Far away from everything else."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But Hawaii is halfway there, so if that gives you a sense of scale."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Well, talk a little bit about your family and your clan."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:141", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 10.097532219463224, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But Hawaii is halfway there, so if that gives you a sense of scale."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Well, talk a little bit about your family and your clan."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So the Beckys. Thomas Becky and Betty Becky. Um, they had eight children. We all lived in the same house. Um, their oldest daughter, Roxanne, was in my eighth grade class. I guess that would make her 12 at the time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, he was a police officer, so that helped. Um, and he was very, luckily he was very highly regarded. He wasn't like a chief or anything, but he was highly regarded and spoke very good English, um, which was also helpful. Um. Uh, and so they were very supportive. Um, but, you know, my contribution, I would buy rice and fish whenever they were available to contribute to the family's requirements. They gave me a small room, so I had a private room, whereas the rest of them slept in a big, one big room together essentially.\n\nUm, there's a funny thing about Micronesians is that they, if they're, if they're residents of the Federated States of Micronesia, they can travel freely to the U.S. They don't need visas. And so my entire host family now lives in Portland, Oregon. I was going to go back and visit them, and they all live in Portland, Oregon."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And why did they move to Portland, Oregon?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:145", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 12.466089159831139, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, he was a police officer, so that helped. Um, and he was very, luckily he was very highly regarded. He wasn't like a chief or anything, but he was highly regarded and spoke very good English, um, which was also helpful. Um. Uh, and so they were very supportive. Um, but, you know, my contribution, I would buy rice and fish whenever they were available to contribute to the family's requirements. They gave me a small room, so I had a private room, whereas the rest of them slept in a big, one big room together essentially.\n\nUm, there's a funny thing about Micronesians is that they, if they're, if they're residents of the Federated States of Micronesia, they can travel freely to the U.S. They don't need visas. And so my entire host family now lives in Portland, Oregon. I was going to go back and visit them, and they all live in Portland, Oregon."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And why did they move to Portland, Oregon?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, I lost touch with them for a little bit, but the story goes, they moved first to Guam for high school when, when the three older kids were all in high school, the school was better than the state school. They'd all tested in, but still."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So they moved to Guam so their kids could get a better high school education. And then they moved to Hawaii when the oldest daughter got into college. So the whole family moved to Hawaii. Um, and then, um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How did they support themselves in Guam and Hawaii and?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:149", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 9.83467797510017, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So they moved to Guam so their kids could get a better high school education. And then they moved to Hawaii when the oldest daughter got into college. So the whole family moved to Hawaii. Um, and then, um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How did they support themselves in Guam and Hawaii and?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "You know, I really don't know. Um, I think they just worked odd jobs like I think new immigrants do. I mean, they're legal, so it's not like. But, um. Uh, and then they ended up, I'm not sure what. There's a large Micronesian population in Portland."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "In Portland."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Tacoma and Washington. There's a lot of Pacific Islanders there. And so I'm sure that's why they ended up there. Um, but so it's kind of funny, they're all on Facebook, and I see them all with kids and grandkids. And my host father passed away last year actually. But, um, so they're not back in Udot and Chuuk."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You can't go visit them."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:151", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 10.927419972333523, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "You know, I really don't know. Um, I think they just worked odd jobs like I think new immigrants do. I mean, they're legal, so it's not like. But, um. Uh, and then they ended up, I'm not sure what. There's a large Micronesian population in Portland."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "In Portland."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Tacoma and Washington. There's a lot of Pacific Islanders there. And so I'm sure that's why they ended up there. Um, but so it's kind of funny, they're all on Facebook, and I see them all with kids and grandkids. And my host father passed away last year actually. But, um, so they're not back in Udot and Chuuk."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You can't go visit them."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Can't go visit them. In fact I'm not even sure who would be there to visit, to be honest. I know one of the daughters went back to work for a little while. Um, the talented one, the, I mean, the smartest one. Um, she got a job at the bank in the state capital, but I don't think that lasted very long. And she moved back to the U.S."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, what was your daily routine like? You went and taught at school and then?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:153", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 12.141577747037248, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Tacoma and Washington. There's a lot of Pacific Islanders there. And so I'm sure that's why they ended up there. Um, but so it's kind of funny, they're all on Facebook, and I see them all with kids and grandkids. And my host father passed away last year actually. But, um, so they're not back in Udot and Chuuk."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You can't go visit them."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Can't go visit them. In fact I'm not even sure who would be there to visit, to be honest. I know one of the daughters went back to work for a little while. Um, the talented one, the, I mean, the smartest one. Um, she got a job at the bank in the state capital, but I don't think that lasted very long. And she moved back to the U.S."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, what was your daily routine like? You went and taught at school and then?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I taught at school half day. Um, and then usually stayed there to work with kids or talk to the teachers. Um, and then would come home and I'd start a garden or lesson plan. Swim, could swim in the ocean, which was wonderful. Um, for a while we had a basketball court, total absolute Peace Corps cartoon. You know, a hoop on, on palm trees, dirt, just like what you'd picture, um, just for fun and to keep the boys out of trouble. Um, but mainly it was walking back and forth to, to school and then."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, did you socialize with the family or did you just stay to yourself when you were in your room? Or how did?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:155", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 13.490641941152498, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Can't go visit them. In fact I'm not even sure who would be there to visit, to be honest. I know one of the daughters went back to work for a little while. Um, the talented one, the, I mean, the smartest one. Um, she got a job at the bank in the state capital, but I don't think that lasted very long. And she moved back to the U.S."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, what was your daily routine like? You went and taught at school and then?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I taught at school half day. Um, and then usually stayed there to work with kids or talk to the teachers. Um, and then would come home and I'd start a garden or lesson plan. Swim, could swim in the ocean, which was wonderful. Um, for a while we had a basketball court, total absolute Peace Corps cartoon. You know, a hoop on, on palm trees, dirt, just like what you'd picture, um, just for fun and to keep the boys out of trouble. Um, but mainly it was walking back and forth to, to school and then."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, did you socialize with the family or did you just stay to yourself when you were in your room? Or how did?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh no, I would, it was too hot to be inside. So it was, I was always sitting outside talking to somebody. Sometimes the, you know, the, the. I mean, I was, I was somewhere in between because I was young enough to be youth, but I think most of them treated me more like an adult, even though I was in age wise, was definitely in their youth cohort that wouldn't have been given a voice in a meeting or anything like that. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But you were a teacher."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:157", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 13.878491045724997, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I taught at school half day. Um, and then usually stayed there to work with kids or talk to the teachers. Um, and then would come home and I'd start a garden or lesson plan. Swim, could swim in the ocean, which was wonderful. Um, for a while we had a basketball court, total absolute Peace Corps cartoon. You know, a hoop on, on palm trees, dirt, just like what you'd picture, um, just for fun and to keep the boys out of trouble. Um, but mainly it was walking back and forth to, to school and then."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, did you socialize with the family or did you just stay to yourself when you were in your room? Or how did?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh no, I would, it was too hot to be inside. So it was, I was always sitting outside talking to somebody. Sometimes the, you know, the, the. I mean, I was, I was somewhere in between because I was young enough to be youth, but I think most of them treated me more like an adult, even though I was in age wise, was definitely in their youth cohort that wouldn't have been given a voice in a meeting or anything like that. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But you were a teacher."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was a teacher. And so that, so I was kind of in the middle. Sometimes I would hang out with the boys, um, but not too much. It was mostly talking to more of the older, the younger parents. Um, another big problem there is the culture doesn't mix well with Western culture. And so alcoholism and suicide are really big problems in Micronesia, particularly for the men. Um, and so there were, there were large."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Because of lack of job opportunities or why is that?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:159", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 15.420545606361108, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh no, I would, it was too hot to be inside. So it was, I was always sitting outside talking to somebody. Sometimes the, you know, the, the. I mean, I was, I was somewhere in between because I was young enough to be youth, but I think most of them treated me more like an adult, even though I was in age wise, was definitely in their youth cohort that wouldn't have been given a voice in a meeting or anything like that. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But you were a teacher."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was a teacher. And so that, so I was kind of in the middle. Sometimes I would hang out with the boys, um, but not too much. It was mostly talking to more of the older, the younger parents. Um, another big problem there is the culture doesn't mix well with Western culture. And so alcoholism and suicide are really big problems in Micronesia, particularly for the men. Um, and so there were, there were large."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Because of lack of job opportunities or why is that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No way for the young men to prove themselves or gain esteem in their clan or their family. Um, there wasn't even enough land to farm, and fishing was kind of fished out. And so if you were lucky enough to get a job, that would work. But there were almost, you know, so few jobs. And if you didn't speak English and, you know, weren't really smart and connected, it was pretty difficult to find work. Um, and so they were rather, it was a difficult spot for young men in their culture to find a landing, a way to become an established part of their clan."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And this is a U.S. territory basically. Is it?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:161", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 5, "return_to_go": 17.133939562623453, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was a teacher. And so that, so I was kind of in the middle. Sometimes I would hang out with the boys, um, but not too much. It was mostly talking to more of the older, the younger parents. Um, another big problem there is the culture doesn't mix well with Western culture. And so alcoholism and suicide are really big problems in Micronesia, particularly for the men. Um, and so there were, there were large."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Because of lack of job opportunities or why is that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No way for the young men to prove themselves or gain esteem in their clan or their family. Um, there wasn't even enough land to farm, and fishing was kind of fished out. And so if you were lucky enough to get a job, that would work. But there were almost, you know, so few jobs. And if you didn't speak English and, you know, weren't really smart and connected, it was pretty difficult to find work. Um, and so they were rather, it was a difficult spot for young men in their culture to find a landing, a way to become an established part of their clan."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And this is a U.S. territory basically. Is it?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was then."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It was, yeah."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:165", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 12.757950077312904, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was then."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It was, yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was then. Now it's an independent country. In fact, while I was there, they became an independent country. But it's still very closely aligned with the U.S. We have a, it's called a, um, there's a special treaty, which is part of the reason why Micronesians can travel to the U.S. without visas. Um, the U.S. retains basing rights where we ever needed to put military soldiers there. Um, it is, the Chuuk lagoon, Chuuk lagoon, which some people know as Truk, was the largest Japanese naval base outside of Japan during World War II, um, in the state I was in. And so in the, towards the end of World War II, the U.S. blockaded it and bombed it and sank 60 ships in the lagoon. So it's a Japanese Pearl Harbor."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So even today, they, you know, they stick out of the water and you can scuba dive on them. And there's World War II wreckage, including all these gigantic ships sunk in the harbor there. Um, and it's fantastic scuba diving. Um, but, uh, so it had some strategic value in the Pacific. I'm not sure that's still the case today, but, um, certainly at the end of World War II, when the U.S. took it over, it had great strategic value. Um, and they have, because it was, they were, the U.S. blockaded it. So there was no food for the 50,000 Japanese soldiers that were there. So it was the Japanese soldiers were beginning to starve. They were very, very abusive to the Chuukese. Um, killed them and ate them, really horrible stories. So when the Americans came, they were very highly regarded and to this day are still very highly regarded to be an American. You know, they have very high regard for the U.S., which is a, a gift when you're a Peace Corps volunteer."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were there other Americans besides Peace Corps volunteers that you interacted with or?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:169", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 14.515987749769016, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So even today, they, you know, they stick out of the water and you can scuba dive on them. And there's World War II wreckage, including all these gigantic ships sunk in the harbor there. Um, and it's fantastic scuba diving. Um, but, uh, so it had some strategic value in the Pacific. I'm not sure that's still the case today, but, um, certainly at the end of World War II, when the U.S. took it over, it had great strategic value. Um, and they have, because it was, they were, the U.S. blockaded it. So there was no food for the 50,000 Japanese soldiers that were there. So it was the Japanese soldiers were beginning to starve. They were very, very abusive to the Chuukese. Um, killed them and ate them, really horrible stories. So when the Americans came, they were very highly regarded and to this day are still very highly regarded to be an American. You know, they have very high regard for the U.S., which is a, a gift when you're a Peace Corps volunteer."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were there other Americans besides Peace Corps volunteers that you interacted with or?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "There were two Jesuit priests and three other Americans. One was a volunteer who stayed. Another was a former volunteer who had come back to work with the state Department of Education. And one was the attorney general, because they couldn't have, they couldn't have their own attorney general. They had to have an external attorney general, it was a lawyer who came back. So that, five non volunteer Americans in the state. Um, you get to know them pretty quickly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, they were in the state. So you were in the."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They were in the state capital. I was on an island outside the state capital, but. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you never went by boat to other places?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:171", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 16.12887527752113, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "There were two Jesuit priests and three other Americans. One was a volunteer who stayed. Another was a former volunteer who had come back to work with the state Department of Education. And one was the attorney general, because they couldn't have, they couldn't have their own attorney general. They had to have an external attorney general, it was a lawyer who came back. So that, five non volunteer Americans in the state. Um, you get to know them pretty quickly."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, they were in the state. So you were in the."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They were in the state capital. I was on an island outside the state capital, but. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you never went by boat to other places?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Occasionally. I mean, obviously we'd go to the capital to get our mail, and there was a Peace Corps office in the state capital for our mail and support. Um, then you see other volunteers there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did Peace Corps come out to you?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:173", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 6, "return_to_go": 14.587639197245698, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They were in the state capital. I was on an island outside the state capital, but. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you never went by boat to other places?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Occasionally. I mean, obviously we'd go to the capital to get our mail, and there was a Peace Corps office in the state capital for our mail and support. Um, then you see other volunteers there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did Peace Corps come out to you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, I had one official visit. Actually the country director visited my village and the, and the nurse for the whole country. The actual Peace Corps office was in Pohnpei, which was the national capital, um, which was two hour flight away. So, um. Uh, so that was the only visit. But we, we'd sometimes arrange visits. So, you know, several of the other volunteers came to my island for a day once, and we had a big dinner and walked around the island and stuff. Um, and I went to a few other people's islands on occasion. One island was very near mine, and, um, I could bum a canoe if I really wanted to and canoe over there. Um, it was like literally about 1,000 yards, but, um, but you couldn't swim it. It was too, the current was pretty rough there. So you, but you could canoe it or boat over it. And I went over there once, once or twice. She was a year ahead of me, so she was only there for the first year I was there, uh, a volunteer on that island."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And then when you all met in Guam, what, what was the. Was everybody's experience similar to yours, or were there different kinds of experiences?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:183", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 12.197563374901685, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, they'd seen a broken paddle, but, um. And so they all sat and learned how to carve paddles with, well, he was carving mine and actually had two. I had one for a friend carved at the same time. Um, they all learned and carved their own paddles."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, neat."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Because the young men in their 20s were the ones that ran the boats that did run. And so having a Chuukese, in fact, it was an island specific paddle, uh, became a source of pride. And so they all learned to carve their own paddles, which I thought was very cool."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It is, yeah. So what did Peace Corps, how did it influence you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, it set the course of my life pretty much. Uh, I became, uh, so I studied public health when I came back, went and got a master's degree in public health, and became a diplomat with USAID doing foreign assistance projects in the developing world for my whole career. So it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Never would have thought of that, right?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:185", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 13.552848194335207, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Because the young men in their 20s were the ones that ran the boats that did run. And so having a Chuukese, in fact, it was an island specific paddle, uh, became a source of pride. And so they all learned to carve their own paddles, which I thought was very cool."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It is, yeah. So what did Peace Corps, how did it influence you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, it set the course of my life pretty much. Uh, I became, uh, so I studied public health when I came back, went and got a master's degree in public health, and became a diplomat with USAID doing foreign assistance projects in the developing world for my whole career. So it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Never would have thought of that, right?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, not at all."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You were going into engineering?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:187", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 12.836497993705786, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, it set the course of my life pretty much. Uh, I became, uh, so I studied public health when I came back, went and got a master's degree in public health, and became a diplomat with USAID doing foreign assistance projects in the developing world for my whole career. So it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Never would have thought of that, right?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, not at all."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You were going into engineering?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Engineering, yes. And, uh, no, I would not have gone that route without Peace Corps for sure. Um, and so it set the course of my, you know, can't. Very difficult to get a job at USAID when you're not, haven't been a Peace Corps volunteer. To become a foreign service officer with USAID as opposed to State, they're separate, um, you have to speak a foreign language, have lived two years in the developing world, have a master's degree. I mean, where do Americans get two years in the developing world and learn a foreign language other than the Peace Corps, I mean?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I wasn't aware of those requirements. Was that always the case or is, I guess I'm an older generation. I wonder if the speaking of foreign language, maybe, but two years overseas experience. That's interesting."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:189", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 10.92944221522865, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, not at all."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You were going into engineering?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Engineering, yes. And, uh, no, I would not have gone that route without Peace Corps for sure. Um, and so it set the course of my, you know, can't. Very difficult to get a job at USAID when you're not, haven't been a Peace Corps volunteer. To become a foreign service officer with USAID as opposed to State, they're separate, um, you have to speak a foreign language, have lived two years in the developing world, have a master's degree. I mean, where do Americans get two years in the developing world and learn a foreign language other than the Peace Corps, I mean?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I wasn't aware of those requirements. Was that always the case or is, I guess I'm an older generation. I wonder if the speaking of foreign language, maybe, but two years overseas experience. That's interesting."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That was, that was a requirement for U.S. AID. At State Department, you take the exam. If you pass the exam, you're in State Department. AID hires specialists. So I was hired as a health officer. I had to have a graduate degree in public health, two years experience in the developing world, and experience with a foreign language so that I, they, I, they knew I had proficiency. I didn't have to be fluent, but I had to show an ability because I was going to have to be fluent in order to stay in the Foreign Service to become tenured. So USAID, that was the basic requirements to become a foreign service officer. Um, and so."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What did your parents say about all of that? Your father, your stepfather expected you to be an engineer, right?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:191", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 6, "return_to_go": 12.14382468358739, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Engineering, yes. And, uh, no, I would not have gone that route without Peace Corps for sure. Um, and so it set the course of my, you know, can't. Very difficult to get a job at USAID when you're not, haven't been a Peace Corps volunteer. To become a foreign service officer with USAID as opposed to State, they're separate, um, you have to speak a foreign language, have lived two years in the developing world, have a master's degree. I mean, where do Americans get two years in the developing world and learn a foreign language other than the Peace Corps, I mean?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I wasn't aware of those requirements. Was that always the case or is, I guess I'm an older generation. I wonder if the speaking of foreign language, maybe, but two years overseas experience. That's interesting."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That was, that was a requirement for U.S. AID. At State Department, you take the exam. If you pass the exam, you're in State Department. AID hires specialists. So I was hired as a health officer. I had to have a graduate degree in public health, two years experience in the developing world, and experience with a foreign language so that I, they, I, they knew I had proficiency. I didn't have to be fluent, but I had to show an ability because I was going to have to be fluent in order to stay in the Foreign Service to become tenured. So USAID, that was the basic requirements to become a foreign service officer. Um, and so."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What did your parents say about all of that? Your father, your stepfather expected you to be an engineer, right?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I, no, that, that was long since gone. I actually, when I came back, my first job back was as an engineer. So I got a job as an engineer while I went to graduate school. Um, but no, being a diplomat was, was good enough."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. And where were you stationed afterwards?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:193", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.826471870652655, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That was, that was a requirement for U.S. AID. At State Department, you take the exam. If you pass the exam, you're in State Department. AID hires specialists. So I was hired as a health officer. I had to have a graduate degree in public health, two years experience in the developing world, and experience with a foreign language so that I, they, I, they knew I had proficiency. I didn't have to be fluent, but I had to show an ability because I was going to have to be fluent in order to stay in the Foreign Service to become tenured. So USAID, that was the basic requirements to become a foreign service officer. Um, and so."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What did your parents say about all of that? Your father, your stepfather expected you to be an engineer, right?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I, no, that, that was long since gone. I actually, when I came back, my first job back was as an engineer. So I got a job as an engineer while I went to graduate school. Um, but no, being a diplomat was, was good enough."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. And where were you stationed afterwards?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "So I, first, when I first, I was newly married and my first posting was Tanzania. My wife actually ended up, who was also a Peace Corps volunteer from a different place. We met in graduate school, but she ended up starting the HIV AIDS program in Tanzania, became staff at the Peace Corps office there. Um, we went from there to the Philippines, um, back to Washington, then, uh, Nepal for a couple of years. Uh, actually we reopened with AID, U.S. AID, we helped fund and create, restart the Peace Corps program back in Nepal while I was there with USAID funding from my office. Um, uh, and then my last posting was in, actually in Germany for Libya. I was running the programs in Libya, but our embassy was closed at the time, so I was based in Frankfurt."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What do you think Peace Corps' impact has been on U.S. AID?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:201", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 9.032878937132532, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, well, USAID as an organization is probably even today, 50 to 60 percent returned Peace Corps volunteers."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Wow."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, because of the requirements. I mean, there are other ways to get those skill sets, but by and large, Americans generally go to the Peace Corps route."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, and if you go to the Peace Corps route, then you often develop an affinity for wanting to help the developing world. So it feeds on itself. Um, I mean, that, that working in the village, living, is the basis of how we do effective development. So it's fundamental to how the U.S. works, um, in a foreign assistance realm for sure. Um, and is often, now volunteers are part of our foreign assistance. They're often HIV AIDS outreach workers or, um, funded by U.S. foreign assistance will help support Peace Corps who hires and does their own thing. But the money goes to Peace Corps to place HIV AIDS volunteers. Do the same thing with a program on food security. So we'll fund Peace Corps to, to send volunteers to certain countries to help work on food security programs, which are important to USAID's goals even today."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you think that's good? In the, in the old days, we were considered separate, very separate from official government."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:205", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 11.151702391521644, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, and if you go to the Peace Corps route, then you often develop an affinity for wanting to help the developing world. So it feeds on itself. Um, I mean, that, that working in the village, living, is the basis of how we do effective development. So it's fundamental to how the U.S. works, um, in a foreign assistance realm for sure. Um, and is often, now volunteers are part of our foreign assistance. They're often HIV AIDS outreach workers or, um, funded by U.S. foreign assistance will help support Peace Corps who hires and does their own thing. But the money goes to Peace Corps to place HIV AIDS volunteers. Do the same thing with a program on food security. So we'll fund Peace Corps to, to send volunteers to certain countries to help work on food security programs, which are important to USAID's goals even today."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you think that's good? In the, in the old days, we were considered separate, very separate from official government."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And, and on the ground they still are. So the volunteers would not recognize themselves as part of the USAID activity. They may know the pipeline feeds back, um, but I think that distinction is helpful in the field."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "The fact that USAID realizes that these outreach workers can be helpful, I think is fine. As long as there's a bit of an arm's length, I think that's helpful, um, for sure. Um, because I think the Peace Corps is better served if they are viewed as volunteers on their own. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And so, I mean, USAID is criticized very often for not being on the ground enough, and too many contractors and, and all of that. I guess you have a different perspective with so many Peace Corps volunteers who have that on the ground experience."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:207", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 12.390780435024048, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And, and on the ground they still are. So the volunteers would not recognize themselves as part of the USAID activity. They may know the pipeline feeds back, um, but I think that distinction is helpful in the field."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "The fact that USAID realizes that these outreach workers can be helpful, I think is fine. As long as there's a bit of an arm's length, I think that's helpful, um, for sure. Um, because I think the Peace Corps is better served if they are viewed as volunteers on their own. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And so, I mean, USAID is criticized very often for not being on the ground enough, and too many contractors and, and all of that. I guess you have a different perspective with so many Peace Corps volunteers who have that on the ground experience."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I guess you would, you would say that's not a fair criticism."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:209", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 13.767533816693387, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "The fact that USAID realizes that these outreach workers can be helpful, I think is fine. As long as there's a bit of an arm's length, I think that's helpful, um, for sure. Um, because I think the Peace Corps is better served if they are viewed as volunteers on their own. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And so, I mean, USAID is criticized very often for not being on the ground enough, and too many contractors and, and all of that. I guess you have a different perspective with so many Peace Corps volunteers who have that on the ground experience."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I guess you would, you would say that's not a fair criticism."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, no."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'm not criticizing."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:217", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 16.0181890210233, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, I mean, we are on the ground in almost every country we work in, so that, that's very real, as opposed to Treasury who's not, or Commerce that's not, or other government agencies that are not on the ground in these countries. USAID has offices in all these countries with large staffs, most of which are locally hired."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mm hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So there'll be a handful of Americans and then, you know, 8 or 10 to 1 local hires who."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Who are connected with the communities there. Um, we do pass off the resources to someone else to implement. That's the way the institution works these days. Um, uh, and in pretty much not since the Vietnam War has USAID implemented its own programs with USAID staff. So that's been phased out. I mean, we're the ultimate in outsourcing as a government agency can be pretty much. Um, but we can hire good grantees in particular and contractors too when need be."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Who are probably also staffed with former Peace Corps volunteers."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:219", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 6, "return_to_go": 17.797987801136998, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So there'll be a handful of Americans and then, you know, 8 or 10 to 1 local hires who."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Who are connected with the communities there. Um, we do pass off the resources to someone else to implement. That's the way the institution works these days. Um, uh, and in pretty much not since the Vietnam War has USAID implemented its own programs with USAID staff. So that's been phased out. I mean, we're the ultimate in outsourcing as a government agency can be pretty much. Um, but we can hire good grantees in particular and contractors too when need be."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Who are probably also staffed with former Peace Corps volunteers."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, you bet. Yep. Almost exclusively volunteers, in fact. Um, and they stay longer."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So Peace Corps has really been a training ground for development workers."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:221", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 13.108875334596663, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Who are connected with the communities there. Um, we do pass off the resources to someone else to implement. That's the way the institution works these days. Um, uh, and in pretty much not since the Vietnam War has USAID implemented its own programs with USAID staff. So that's been phased out. I mean, we're the ultimate in outsourcing as a government agency can be pretty much. Um, but we can hire good grantees in particular and contractors too when need be."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Who are probably also staffed with former Peace Corps volunteers."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, you bet. Yep. Almost exclusively volunteers, in fact. Um, and they stay longer."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So Peace Corps has really been a training ground for development workers."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It is the training ground for U.S. Foreign Service, foreign assistance, foreign service officers, development workers. It is the training ground. I mean, if there's Georgetown's University of Foreign Service for State Department diplomats, Peace Corps is the one and only training ground for development professionals for the United States. And almost every country, every, all the other donor countries are very jealous of the fact that almost everybody at AID comes with very real on the ground in the village substantive experience, which no other donor, Japanese, Brits, French, Germans, nobody else has that at all. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Is that something Peace Corps should be touting, or should that be kept as a secret?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:223", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 11.232083705107403, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, you bet. Yep. Almost exclusively volunteers, in fact. Um, and they stay longer."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So Peace Corps has really been a training ground for development workers."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It is the training ground for U.S. Foreign Service, foreign assistance, foreign service officers, development workers. It is the training ground. I mean, if there's Georgetown's University of Foreign Service for State Department diplomats, Peace Corps is the one and only training ground for development professionals for the United States. And almost every country, every, all the other donor countries are very jealous of the fact that almost everybody at AID comes with very real on the ground in the village substantive experience, which no other donor, Japanese, Brits, French, Germans, nobody else has that at all. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Is that something Peace Corps should be touting, or should that be kept as a secret?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it's, it's touted. In fact, in the, when we went to the Hill, that was part of the talking points, was it is the training ground for all of our foreign assistance professionals across the U.S. government, whether it's grantee, contractor, or in the government itself. Like I said, there are other avenues. It's not the only one, but, you know, all the others maybe make up 10 percent when you put them all together. The Jesuit volunteers, the Lutheran volunteers. You can go work for some companies that work in the developing world, but even then, you're not likely to be in the village. You're still going to be in the capital. Um, so it is, it's a very."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, a young friend of, of mine was in the Peace Corps in, in West Africa and then joined Médecins Sans Frontieres afterwards, but they probably hired him because of the Peace Corps experience."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:225", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 11.368981894563781, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It is the training ground for U.S. Foreign Service, foreign assistance, foreign service officers, development workers. It is the training ground. I mean, if there's Georgetown's University of Foreign Service for State Department diplomats, Peace Corps is the one and only training ground for development professionals for the United States. And almost every country, every, all the other donor countries are very jealous of the fact that almost everybody at AID comes with very real on the ground in the village substantive experience, which no other donor, Japanese, Brits, French, Germans, nobody else has that at all. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Is that something Peace Corps should be touting, or should that be kept as a secret?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it's, it's touted. In fact, in the, when we went to the Hill, that was part of the talking points, was it is the training ground for all of our foreign assistance professionals across the U.S. government, whether it's grantee, contractor, or in the government itself. Like I said, there are other avenues. It's not the only one, but, you know, all the others maybe make up 10 percent when you put them all together. The Jesuit volunteers, the Lutheran volunteers. You can go work for some companies that work in the developing world, but even then, you're not likely to be in the village. You're still going to be in the capital. Um, so it is, it's a very."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, a young friend of, of mine was in the Peace Corps in, in West Africa and then joined Médecins Sans Frontieres afterwards, but they probably hired him because of the Peace Corps experience."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, absolutely, yeah. Especially MSF, yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And now he's at USAID so full circle. So he's, he's come back."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:227", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 11.521090993959756, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it's, it's touted. In fact, in the, when we went to the Hill, that was part of the talking points, was it is the training ground for all of our foreign assistance professionals across the U.S. government, whether it's grantee, contractor, or in the government itself. Like I said, there are other avenues. It's not the only one, but, you know, all the others maybe make up 10 percent when you put them all together. The Jesuit volunteers, the Lutheran volunteers. You can go work for some companies that work in the developing world, but even then, you're not likely to be in the village. You're still going to be in the capital. Um, so it is, it's a very."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, a young friend of, of mine was in the Peace Corps in, in West Africa and then joined Médecins Sans Frontieres afterwards, but they probably hired him because of the Peace Corps experience."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, absolutely, yeah. Especially MSF, yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And now he's at USAID so full circle. So he's, he's come back."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. And that's, that's quite, quite common. In fact, it's very difficult to get in USAID now. I mean, while I say those are the minimum criteria, most people have much more experience than that to get in the door at USAID. The minimum criteria is two years in a foreign language and an advanced degree, but most people don't join until they have ten years in the developing country and speak two languages. And, you know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So you've talked about the impact on USAID, on maybe that's the answer to the third question. You know, the impact on the United States in our communities, bringing Peace Corps, bringing the world back to the United States. Do you think there's been an impact there?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:235", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 9.436200265142134, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, and so that expands that individually for sure. Um, I mean, I've been in Washington mostly, which is certainly more globally aware as far as cities in the U.S. go. Um, so I'm not sure how much of a role I've played other than the impact on my family and talks in my hometown on occasion. Um, but I do think that flipping it around a little bit, almost every person in the developing world that has met an American, it's probably was a Peace Corps volunteer. And that is a good impression. You know, they're not the stereotype that one sees on TV. You know, it's not Baywatch."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "When you bump into a Peace Corps volunteer in Benin. Um, and, you know, I've interacted with diplomats my entire career. Almost to a one, they will say they knew a Peace Corps volunteer when they were young, and that created a very positive impression of the U.S. I mean, there probably are 40 ambassadors to the U.S. right now who were taught by Peace Corps volunteers, you know, from Africa and Asian countries. I even have, I've even met ambassadors who were fed by U.S. government programs."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But almost always it's been a Peace Corps volunteer who's been their contact. And that is, I think the diplomatic value of that is absolutely incalculably valuable, far more than even your best ambassador, your country team could no way over, bring more value than those volunteers, especially with some continuity if the program lasts. That impact they'll have on that country's view of Americans for the positive, you know. And Peace Corps volunteers have their flaws, but their flaws."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "They're people, yeah."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:237", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 10.484666961269037, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "When you bump into a Peace Corps volunteer in Benin. Um, and, you know, I've interacted with diplomats my entire career. Almost to a one, they will say they knew a Peace Corps volunteer when they were young, and that created a very positive impression of the U.S. I mean, there probably are 40 ambassadors to the U.S. right now who were taught by Peace Corps volunteers, you know, from Africa and Asian countries. I even have, I've even met ambassadors who were fed by U.S. government programs."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But almost always it's been a Peace Corps volunteer who's been their contact. And that is, I think the diplomatic value of that is absolutely incalculably valuable, far more than even your best ambassador, your country team could no way over, bring more value than those volunteers, especially with some continuity if the program lasts. That impact they'll have on that country's view of Americans for the positive, you know. And Peace Corps volunteers have their flaws, but their flaws."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "They're people, yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They're flaws of people. They're not flaws of, of an institution or a flaws of a country. And people can see them for that and know, by and large, these are wonderful people that Americans are and view Americans that way because of it. And again, no other country has that in the whole world. And so the goodwill that buys us in so many ways, in so many venues, is beyond the, the, the, you know, a calculable price."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And that continues to this day, obviously."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:241", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 11.832922174406217, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They're flaws of people. They're not flaws of, of an institution or a flaws of a country. And people can see them for that and know, by and large, these are wonderful people that Americans are and view Americans that way because of it. And again, no other country has that in the whole world. And so the goodwill that buys us in so many ways, in so many venues, is beyond the, the, the, you know, a calculable price."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And that continues to this day, obviously."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Absolutely. Even if we ended the program today, not that we should."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That value would continue for those, and probably several generations past that, in fact."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You were, you were in country, just going back. You were in country when Micronesia became independent. Did you, can you talk a little bit about that whole transition, what that was like from a village up perspective, as opposed to?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:251", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 4.458876821633249, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, not at all. No. Um, and in many respects, they thought of themselves as an independent country, even though every law they passed had to be signed by some deputy assistant secretary of agriculture in Washington. Um. Now that's no longer the case. Um, in some respects, that oversight may have been beneficial, particularly in the beginning, but I think the neglect outweighed what benefit there might come from that over the long term."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So when you said that the education system was kept functioning, that's under, under the American?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Under American oversight."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "As well as post. So you were there, what, one year during the Americans and one year after?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You didn't feel any real difference?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:253", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.843196468481387, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Under American oversight."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "As well as post. So you were there, what, one year during the Americans and one year after?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You didn't feel any real difference?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. Because the U.S. government was granting money to the government, which paid the teacher salaries. Um, and that was how, that's how the whole country still functions today. And that grant didn't substantively change, uh, with this turnover. Um, they chartered it. With the turnover, they became an independent country. They got a seat in the United Nations. Um, you know, they had to open an embassy here in Washington. Um, now, I think the grant, the amount of money the U.S. government support provides has been dropping in stages since then, um, probably to the great detriment of Micronesia, I imagine. But, um, at the time it didn't. There was no tangible difference other than they had a vote in the United Nations.\n\nAnd, I mean, even then they issued their own passports. So they, that must have been happening for some time up, even though it was a U.S. territory they had their own passports. Unlike Guam, which is part of the United States proper. If you're born in Guam, you're an American citizen. You get an American passport."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, like the Northern Marianas was, was also."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:255", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.270218298312652, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Um."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You didn't feel any real difference?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. Because the U.S. government was granting money to the government, which paid the teacher salaries. Um, and that was how, that's how the whole country still functions today. And that grant didn't substantively change, uh, with this turnover. Um, they chartered it. With the turnover, they became an independent country. They got a seat in the United Nations. Um, you know, they had to open an embassy here in Washington. Um, now, I think the grant, the amount of money the U.S. government support provides has been dropping in stages since then, um, probably to the great detriment of Micronesia, I imagine. But, um, at the time it didn't. There was no tangible difference other than they had a vote in the United Nations.\n\nAnd, I mean, even then they issued their own passports. So they, that must have been happening for some time up, even though it was a U.S. territory they had their own passports. Unlike Guam, which is part of the United States proper. If you're born in Guam, you're an American citizen. You get an American passport."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, like the Northern Marianas was, was also."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yep."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "A different category."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:257", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.744686998125169, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. Because the U.S. government was granting money to the government, which paid the teacher salaries. Um, and that was how, that's how the whole country still functions today. And that grant didn't substantively change, uh, with this turnover. Um, they chartered it. With the turnover, they became an independent country. They got a seat in the United Nations. Um, you know, they had to open an embassy here in Washington. Um, now, I think the grant, the amount of money the U.S. government support provides has been dropping in stages since then, um, probably to the great detriment of Micronesia, I imagine. But, um, at the time it didn't. There was no tangible difference other than they had a vote in the United Nations.\n\nAnd, I mean, even then they issued their own passports. So they, that must have been happening for some time up, even though it was a U.S. territory they had their own passports. Unlike Guam, which is part of the United States proper. If you're born in Guam, you're an American citizen. You get an American passport."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, like the Northern Marianas was, was also."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yep."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "A different category."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It's the same."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Puerto Rico, Virgin Islands. Guam."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:259", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.271874442361298, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yep."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "A different category."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It's the same."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Puerto Rico, Virgin Islands. Guam."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Are American."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And then there is a second tier."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:261", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 5.857638269290331, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It's the same."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Puerto Rico, Virgin Islands. Guam."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Are American."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And then there is a second tier."}, {"role": "user", "content": "These are called trust territories."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Trust territories. I don't understand the difference."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:265", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.997084283074482, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "These are called trust territories."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Trust territories. I don't understand the difference."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. The same, very similar arrangement with Marianas. Um, and the trust territory relationship."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Uh, and so now it's a treaty as opposed to a trust territory relationship, but they still retain basing rights. And for those basing rights, the U.S. continues to make support payments to the government, which essentially keeps the governments running because they have no tax base."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, when we were talking before, you said, you know, how should you prepare? I said, what, you know, think of stories you want to tell. Are there any stories that you want to tell that I didn't ask you about?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:275", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.01116747629, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I was like, that is a difference. If those other moms think to give ORS when their babies are sick, that may actually make a difference."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So what, I don't know what ORS is."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, I'm sorry. Oral rehydration solution."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So it's, oh, it's just a powder."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It's a little packet of minerals you mix with water to treat diarrhea."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh. We didn't have those."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:281", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.3870610099999998, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So, I mean, it's a, it's a. It's universally reduced diarrheal disease around the world."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Hmm."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um. Doesn't taste very good. Um. But it's, uh, essentially like a."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Electrolytes?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Electrolytes, yes. Designed for sick people and children in particular. Um, and, um, because you eventually got."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So every Peace Corps volunteer should have packets."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:283", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.5411788999999998, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um. Doesn't taste very good. Um. But it's, uh, essentially like a."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Electrolytes?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Electrolytes, yes. Designed for sick people and children in particular. Um, and, um, because you eventually got."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So every Peace Corps volunteer should have packets."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And they, every Peace Corps volunteer gets packets of these for themselves."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, I see."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:287", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.9026899999999998, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And they, every Peace Corps volunteer gets packets of these for themselves."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, I see."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Because they're like, if you get diarrhea, you need to drink this stuff. But you can buy them for pennies anywhere. And Peace Corps buries their volunteers in them. So I had plenty. So I left them with her so she didn't have to buy them. But they're readily available everywhere in the world, frankly. Um, but people don't always use them because they don't taste very well and they don't believe they work. And, you know, and, you know, they give it to them and one baby dies. So they say, oh, this is useless. Um, but that baby lived. And that mom believed that was part of the reason why and was teaching other moms. I was like, that may actually make a difference in this village to save a baby's life someday. Um, that made me very, very happy. If I could have done more of that, it would have been great."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's great."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um. Total luck. Not any particular skill."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No, not total luck."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:289", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.1140999999999996, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Because they're like, if you get diarrhea, you need to drink this stuff. But you can buy them for pennies anywhere. And Peace Corps buries their volunteers in them. So I had plenty. So I left them with her so she didn't have to buy them. But they're readily available everywhere in the world, frankly. Um, but people don't always use them because they don't taste very well and they don't believe they work. And, you know, and, you know, they give it to them and one baby dies. So they say, oh, this is useless. Um, but that baby lived. And that mom believed that was part of the reason why and was teaching other moms. I was like, that may actually make a difference in this village to save a baby's life someday. Um, that made me very, very happy. If I could have done more of that, it would have been great."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's great."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um. Total luck. Not any particular skill."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No, not total luck."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But, uh."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, you knew what to do."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:291", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.3489999999999998, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um. Total luck. Not any particular skill."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No, not total luck."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But, uh."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, you knew what to do."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I knew something to do."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Um. So that's a really good story."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:293", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.61, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But, uh."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, you knew what to do."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I knew something to do."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Um. So that's a really good story."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Any other stories you want to? I'm out of questions."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:297", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 1.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Any other stories you want to? I'm out of questions."}, {"role": "user", "content": "What is the, what's, what's the fun one I always tell, which is the shark story. You live in a Pacific island, you got to have a shark story."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes. Okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So first week or two, you know, when you go through training, they're like, well, if you're unsure what to do, just do whatever the, you know, your host family, your locals do. Whatever they're doing you can, you know, do that, you should be okay. So we went reef fishing. So you go, we went to an outer reef and swimming in the reef. And I'm just taking pictures with my camera because I'm not going to be able to spear a fish to save my life. Um, and I'm swimming around snorkeling, and I look and I'm like, oh, there's a shark. So I look around and the other guys are still fishing. So I'm like, okay, it must be okay. Shark goes away. Ten minutes later, there are two sharks. Big sharks. All right, look around there. Guys are still fishing. It's okay. All right, I'm doing good.\n\nCome up, I turn, there are four sharks. And I stick my head out of the water and all the guys are up on the shore. I'm like? And they're like, don't you see the shark? I'm like, yeah! Why didn't you tell me? And I get scrambling out of the water and get out of the shark. Like, so much for following what the locals do. They didn't care for me at all. They left me to the sharks. It's like, don't you see the shark? Like, yeah! But it all turned out fine."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So sharks don't necessarily attack right away, is that it?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:305", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Um, that was less common. Overfishing was just there were more people than the reefs could support. Um, uh, a little bit of dynamite fishing, but that was illegal and kind of frowned upon, so you couldn't. By the time I was there, you couldn't sell dynamited fish. And they can usually tell when a fish has been dynamited versus caught."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Doesn't look too good."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I mean, I mean, they're, they, they, they're. I'm not sure how they could tell, but they said they could generally tell dynamited fish from regular fish. And you could sell them individually, but you couldn't sell them to a fishmonger."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "He wouldn't buy dynamited fish. Um, and so it was less common. It still happened, but was less common then. And you could, snorkeling you could see. You're like, oh, that was dynamite there. You could just see a big circle of dead coral. You're like, that was dynamite."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It's really too bad."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:307", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I mean, I mean, they're, they, they, they're. I'm not sure how they could tell, but they said they could generally tell dynamited fish from regular fish. And you could sell them individually, but you couldn't sell them to a fishmonger."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "He wouldn't buy dynamited fish. Um, and so it was less common. It still happened, but was less common then. And you could, snorkeling you could see. You're like, oh, that was dynamite there. You could just see a big circle of dead coral. You're like, that was dynamite."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It's really too bad."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, and they can get it because the Japanese ships are all there. They can snorkel down to a ship and pull out a, you know, a torpedo and take it apart and get the powder out of it. I mean, there's tens of thousands of them still there. So if they really, I mean, they can readily available to make their own dynamite, which of course is not the wisest thing to do either. Um, but it wasn't hard for them to get even in a tiny island out there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, why don't we end with the dynamite story?"}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:309", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "He wouldn't buy dynamited fish. Um, and so it was less common. It still happened, but was less common then. And you could, snorkeling you could see. You're like, oh, that was dynamite there. You could just see a big circle of dead coral. You're like, that was dynamite."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It's really too bad."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, and they can get it because the Japanese ships are all there. They can snorkel down to a ship and pull out a, you know, a torpedo and take it apart and get the powder out of it. I mean, there's tens of thousands of them still there. So if they really, I mean, they can readily available to make their own dynamite, which of course is not the wisest thing to do either. Um, but it wasn't hard for them to get even in a tiny island out there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, why don't we end with the dynamite story?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'd call it, I'm gonna call it a dynamite story from now on."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Dynamite story. So thanks so much."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:311", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, and they can get it because the Japanese ships are all there. They can snorkel down to a ship and pull out a, you know, a torpedo and take it apart and get the powder out of it. I mean, there's tens of thousands of them still there. So if they really, I mean, they can readily available to make their own dynamite, which of course is not the wisest thing to do either. Um, but it wasn't hard for them to get even in a tiny island out there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, why don't we end with the dynamite story?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'd call it, I'm gonna call it a dynamite story from now on."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Dynamite story. So thanks so much."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, thank you. This was fun."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It was fun."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:313", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'd call it, I'm gonna call it a dynamite story from now on."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Dynamite story. So thanks so much."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, thank you. This was fun."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It was fun."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Nobody else wants to listen to my Peace Corps stories anymore."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I want to listen."}]}
{"block_id": "returned-peace-corps-volunteers-00039:315", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, thank you. This was fun."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It was fun."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Nobody else wants to listen to my Peace Corps stories anymore."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I want to listen."}, {"role": "user", "content": "You were very nice."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And now, and now other people will listen as well."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00935:37", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 10.306741, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I was actually very surprised at how well it came out. There are certain areas if you get the lighting just right you can sort of see the brushstrokes in it, the roller marks. But most of the time when you’re viewing it I don’t think you’d have any idea that it was actually roller-applied. I don’t think the public has got any idea that that’s how we did it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What are your feelings as Enterprise is set to go to New York?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I’m a little sad in a way. It’ll be neat to get the [OV-103] Discovery, but I think of all the work that we put into the Enterprise. I’m really proud of all the work we did, and I hate to see it go. It’s nice to be able to look at it on a regular basis and think, “We did that.” But it won’t be too far away so hopefully we’ll be able to visit it up there too."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I imagine they’ll be calling on your expertise."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, we’re certainly always willing to help. If they need help with anything, that’s what we’re here for."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Rebecca, do you have any questions?\n\nI just have one. Is there a special memory that you have of working on that project?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00935:55", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was, it was a lot of work."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you have any schematics from NASA in order to rebuild those?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, nothing. I don’t think there was anything available. I don’t remember now what the exact history of them was, whether it was actually NASA that built them or if they had them contracted out, but both of them were a little bit different. The construction was slightly different inside, the bracing and such. We tried to replicate as much as possible the way they had originally done it.\\n\\n We did make some improvements. We added some additional bracing inside just to make sure that if there was any rot that we couldn’t see or couldn’t get to, that they were plenty strong enough for when we had to hoist them up and put them onto the Shuttle. I ended up also being part of the team that installed the OMS pods after they were refurbished, and part of the team that took them off a couple months ago when we were getting ready for Enterprise to go."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "A sad moment, bittersweet."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Bittersweet, yes. It’ll be neat to get Discovery in, but it will be sad to see Enterprise go."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, we thank you very much for your time this morning."}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00001:3", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 43.69690711577078, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Yeah. With military service, it was actually, I think, almost 43 years. So, yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Wow! Yeah, a long, long time."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Long time. It was an interesting career. I have to say that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes. So going back to the very beginning of your NARA service, you said that NARA contacted you. How did that work?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, at that time, when you took the PACE exam, I think you put down what sort of work you would like to do. It was so long ago. But I indicated that I was interested in working in archives. And I guess if you score high enough, you know, your name is referred to different agencies. And I think I also indicated that I was interested in staying in St. Louis. And so that also, I guess, narrowed it down. At that time, NPRC was participating pretty aggressively in the CIDS program, bringing on people. And with that, you came in as a GS-5 and, if you were successful in the training program, in two years, you were advanced through to a GS-9. And I was an archives specialist at that time. There was not an opening for an archivist at that time. Those positions were filled, but there was a need for archives specialists. And so that was the position I was offered, and I did accept it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. And where did this training take place? Was this at 9700 Page Avenue?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00001:5", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 7, "return_to_go": 46.32989679530086, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Long time. It was an interesting career. I have to say that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes. So going back to the very beginning of your NARA service, you said that NARA contacted you. How did that work?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, at that time, when you took the PACE exam, I think you put down what sort of work you would like to do. It was so long ago. But I indicated that I was interested in working in archives. And I guess if you score high enough, you know, your name is referred to different agencies. And I think I also indicated that I was interested in staying in St. Louis. And so that also, I guess, narrowed it down. At that time, NPRC was participating pretty aggressively in the CIDS program, bringing on people. And with that, you came in as a GS-5 and, if you were successful in the training program, in two years, you were advanced through to a GS-9. And I was an archives specialist at that time. There was not an opening for an archivist at that time. Those positions were filled, but there was a need for archives specialists. And so that was the position I was offered, and I did accept it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. And where did this training take place? Was this at 9700 Page Avenue?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "At that time, NPRC had two facilities. I guess they have two now as well. But yes, there was the military building at 9700 Page, and then there was also the civilian record center, which was at 111 Winnebago Street near downtown St. Louis. And in training, you had a complete training overview of the operations of both centers, both buildings. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Wow. Okay. And what did they have you doing during the training?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00001:53", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 14.551932370978442, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think it almost doubled the holdings of the National Archives. Something like that. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Wow. Very significant. Is that why the National Archives was established in St. Louis? Because of those records?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. That's why there was an archival unit there. Exactly. When the records became permanent, they had to establish an archival unit there which had not existed before. Yeah, the only archival function in St. Louis prior to the reappraisal of the individual service records was the appraisal that I mentioned. The appraisal function that was directed at, not the personnel records, but at the military field command records that had landed in St. Louis mainly because there was room and that were unscheduled. And so that was the only archival work that happened in St. Louis up until 1999, when the individual military service records were reappraised as permanent. Then there had to be an archival unit established. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. And was that established at the new building, the One Archives Drive location? Or was that at the—?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it began at 9700 Page Avenue still. Yes. We were at 9700 Page until 2011, and the Preservation Unit was established in 2000, and the Archival Unit was established in 2004. So we were there at 9700 Page from 2004 until 2011. What is that, seven years? And then we moved into the new building at One Archives Drive now."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But at this time, you were the senior archivist?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00001:55", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 16.1688137455316, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. That's why there was an archival unit there. Exactly. When the records became permanent, they had to establish an archival unit there which had not existed before. Yeah, the only archival function in St. Louis prior to the reappraisal of the individual service records was the appraisal that I mentioned. The appraisal function that was directed at, not the personnel records, but at the military field command records that had landed in St. Louis mainly because there was room and that were unscheduled. And so that was the only archival work that happened in St. Louis up until 1999, when the individual military service records were reappraised as permanent. Then there had to be an archival unit established. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. And was that established at the new building, the One Archives Drive location? Or was that at the—?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it began at 9700 Page Avenue still. Yes. We were at 9700 Page until 2011, and the Preservation Unit was established in 2000, and the Archival Unit was established in 2004. So we were there at 9700 Page from 2004 until 2011. What is that, seven years? And then we moved into the new building at One Archives Drive now."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But at this time, you were the senior archivist?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you help with the move?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00001:57", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 15.743126383924, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it began at 9700 Page Avenue still. Yes. We were at 9700 Page until 2011, and the Preservation Unit was established in 2000, and the Archival Unit was established in 2004. So we were there at 9700 Page from 2004 until 2011. What is that, seven years? And then we moved into the new building at One Archives Drive now."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But at this time, you were the senior archivist?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you help with the move?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yes. Yeah. Yeah. My staff, we did tremendous work to physically move the records. And of course, we had to plan. We had a wonderful unit within the archives. The archival—they change the name all the time—I forget. The National Archives in St. Louis is what we eventually were called. And we had a team of management analysts in the Archives at St. Louis who worked on the planning and designing of the new building, because it was to hold archival records. So I mean, yeah, that was a huge, huge effort. Did you say you interviewed Bryan McGraw? He was brought in as the head of the archives basically to develop that new building. I mean, he had had a lot of experience from working as an Air Force officer in logistics and so forth. Anyway, he hired—I think we had at least three management analysts working on the design of the new building. Yeah, it was quite an operation."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "In terms of the whole archives then moving to this new building, what were some of the challenges, you know, starting fresh in a new building?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00001:69", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 12.443764000000002, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, yes. When they converted to an electronic OMPF, the technicians had to become proficient in accessing them, and there was negotiation with the service departments establishing the conditions under which they could have direct access to those records. And then the issue of where and how those records would be brought into NARA and how that—I mean, I was not directly involved in all of that—but it changed how the individual correspondence technicians at the NPRC would do their work because, you know, at that point they were looking at a record that was online. But also prior to that, there was a period when the military services were microfilming, not microfilming—what's the other term? Not microfilm, but micro...the little cards..."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Microfiche?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "They were microfiching records. And of course, copies of the fiche had to come to NPRC because the records didn't exist in paper. They were on fiche. So that process gradually became subject to using different technology: microfiche readers. And then eventually, the records were on a computer and they had to be able to access those and print out documents for the customers, the members of the public that were coming in to want their records or I should say the veteran or next of kin. Those records—obviously they're still subject to Privacy Act restrictions because they're the newer record—but they are a permanent series that will eventually come into NARA’s legal custody. They will transfer from the agency to NARA. So yeah, that was a major change."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Lots of changes. Let's see here. 2017. That's when you retired from the National Archives, right?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you remember your last day?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00001:71", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 9.381960000000001, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They were microfiching records. And of course, copies of the fiche had to come to NPRC because the records didn't exist in paper. They were on fiche. So that process gradually became subject to using different technology: microfiche readers. And then eventually, the records were on a computer and they had to be able to access those and print out documents for the customers, the members of the public that were coming in to want their records or I should say the veteran or next of kin. Those records—obviously they're still subject to Privacy Act restrictions because they're the newer record—but they are a permanent series that will eventually come into NARA’s legal custody. They will transfer from the agency to NARA. So yeah, that was a major change."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Lots of changes. Let's see here. 2017. That's when you retired from the National Archives, right?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you remember your last day?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think my last day—I have by me here the copy they sent me of the oral history interview. And I think I did that, it says September 20, 2017. And I think my last day was the 30th of September. So like a week later. Yeah. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did they do anything special for you when you retired?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00001:73", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 6, "return_to_go": 10.4244, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you remember your last day?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think my last day—I have by me here the copy they sent me of the oral history interview. And I think I did that, it says September 20, 2017. And I think my last day was the 30th of September. So like a week later. Yeah. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did they do anything special for you when you retired?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I didn't want anything special, but my employees did. We had dinner, which was great. They insisted that we all went out to dinner. It was a lot of fun. I didn't want a big retirement ceremony in the building. I just wasn't interested in that. But I did have a wonderful retirement dinner with my staff, and we enjoyed it. And I've been in touch with a lot of them over the years since then. We get together. A bunch of us are trivia enthusiasts, and so we have a team of about eight or ten of us that very often participates in trivia events around the St. Louis area. Yeah. And we do pretty well. Yeah, we do pretty well. Archivists, you know, are full of a lot of general information, so yeah. Yeah, yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's fun! That's great! Yeah. We're coming up on the end of our interview here. Was there anything that we didn't cover that you would like to add or any memories that you have? You know, anything that was interesting or unusual or anything that you might want to add?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00001:75", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 4.916, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think my last day—I have by me here the copy they sent me of the oral history interview. And I think I did that, it says September 20, 2017. And I think my last day was the 30th of September. So like a week later. Yeah. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did they do anything special for you when you retired?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I didn't want anything special, but my employees did. We had dinner, which was great. They insisted that we all went out to dinner. It was a lot of fun. I didn't want a big retirement ceremony in the building. I just wasn't interested in that. But I did have a wonderful retirement dinner with my staff, and we enjoyed it. And I've been in touch with a lot of them over the years since then. We get together. A bunch of us are trivia enthusiasts, and so we have a team of about eight or ten of us that very often participates in trivia events around the St. Louis area. Yeah. And we do pretty well. Yeah, we do pretty well. Archivists, you know, are full of a lot of general information, so yeah. Yeah, yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's fun! That's great! Yeah. We're coming up on the end of our interview here. Was there anything that we didn't cover that you would like to add or any memories that you have? You know, anything that was interesting or unusual or anything that you might want to add?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, thinking back, especially working in the Records Reconstruction Branch in those early years, in the early '80s, it was just the privilege of working with people who were a generation ahead of me, people that lived through and worked through and served in the services during the Second World War, in the Korean War. They were just really a remarkable group of people. I mean, I was in my early 30s, I guess, and they were in their 50s and 60s. And you just learned a tremendous amount from them. And they were just terrific folks. So that was a real privilege. Yeah. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I think sometimes the people you work with really make a job."}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00001:79", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.6, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, thinking back, especially working in the Records Reconstruction Branch in those early years, in the early '80s, it was just the privilege of working with people who were a generation ahead of me, people that lived through and worked through and served in the services during the Second World War, in the Korean War. They were just really a remarkable group of people. I mean, I was in my early 30s, I guess, and they were in their 50s and 60s. And you just learned a tremendous amount from them. And they were just terrific folks. So that was a real privilege. Yeah. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I think sometimes the people you work with really make a job."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yeah. I mean, they knew so much. I mean, it was direct knowledge for how the military worked in those years. And as I say, the men, a lot of them, were veterans. And the women worked very often for the Army and the Army Air Corps or the Navy during the Second World War and the postwar years, the Korean War. And I mean, they just knew how records were and the reasons and the purposes for the records being created, and they had a tremendous amount of direct knowledge and that's what made, to me, the Reconstruction Branch so incredible in those years. And hopefully the people there now are benefiting from that. Well, there’s our various operating procedures. It was all documented, what you were supposed to do, where you were supposed to go for record information in order to reconstruct the stuff lost in the fire. And those procedures and those reference materials are still there. And hopefully the people working there today are using them. But when I was there, there were people with direct personal knowledge. That's when those processes were put in place, and they knew a heck of a lot. Yeah, it was great."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. So when you get them written down, you can pass them on and everyone will know the steps."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Hopefully so. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, hopefully. Right."}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00001:81", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 4.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yeah. I mean, they knew so much. I mean, it was direct knowledge for how the military worked in those years. And as I say, the men, a lot of them, were veterans. And the women worked very often for the Army and the Army Air Corps or the Navy during the Second World War and the postwar years, the Korean War. And I mean, they just knew how records were and the reasons and the purposes for the records being created, and they had a tremendous amount of direct knowledge and that's what made, to me, the Reconstruction Branch so incredible in those years. And hopefully the people there now are benefiting from that. Well, there’s our various operating procedures. It was all documented, what you were supposed to do, where you were supposed to go for record information in order to reconstruct the stuff lost in the fire. And those procedures and those reference materials are still there. And hopefully the people working there today are using them. But when I was there, there were people with direct personal knowledge. That's when those processes were put in place, and they knew a heck of a lot. Yeah, it was great."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. So when you get them written down, you can pass them on and everyone will know the steps."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Hopefully so. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, hopefully. Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Exactly. I guess that's about all I can think of."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. So, well, hey, I want to thank you again for agreeing to participate in this oral history project. You've just had such an amazing career. You've gone through different branches and had so many different experiences. It's just been really interesting hearing about all of this. So thank you. And I'll be in touch with you soon. And I don't suppose you would have maybe a photograph that we could post along with your transcript when we get that online? You can think about it if you want."}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00001:83", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Hopefully so. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah, hopefully. Right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Exactly. I guess that's about all I can think of."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. So, well, hey, I want to thank you again for agreeing to participate in this oral history project. You've just had such an amazing career. You've gone through different branches and had so many different experiences. It's just been really interesting hearing about all of this. So thank you. And I'll be in touch with you soon. And I don't suppose you would have maybe a photograph that we could post along with your transcript when we get that online? You can think about it if you want."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I will. I'll see if there's something. I'll see what I can come up with. I think they did something at the facility there at one point, and somebody said that there's a photograph that's still up there. So, I don't know, maybe I can figure out where that is. But, anyhow, the other thing I definitely will do is see if I can come up with contact information for Wendy Hollingsworth. I think she would be a tremendous person to be in touch with, because she was there. I mean, she actively participated in the recovery after the fire. She was working there on July 12, and she was there for the next 30 years or so. Wendy would be a wonderful resource to include in this. So I'll try to find out and follow up on that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. I really appreciate that because, yeah, she was not on our list yet."}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00001:85", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Exactly. I guess that's about all I can think of."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. So, well, hey, I want to thank you again for agreeing to participate in this oral history project. You've just had such an amazing career. You've gone through different branches and had so many different experiences. It's just been really interesting hearing about all of this. So thank you. And I'll be in touch with you soon. And I don't suppose you would have maybe a photograph that we could post along with your transcript when we get that online? You can think about it if you want."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I will. I'll see if there's something. I'll see what I can come up with. I think they did something at the facility there at one point, and somebody said that there's a photograph that's still up there. So, I don't know, maybe I can figure out where that is. But, anyhow, the other thing I definitely will do is see if I can come up with contact information for Wendy Hollingsworth. I think she would be a tremendous person to be in touch with, because she was there. I mean, she actively participated in the recovery after the fire. She was working there on July 12, and she was there for the next 30 years or so. Wendy would be a wonderful resource to include in this. So I'll try to find out and follow up on that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. I really appreciate that because, yeah, she was not on our list yet."}, {"role": "user", "content": "All right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, thank you so much. And I hope you have a nice rest of your week."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:1", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 73.6930197209177, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was born in Hillside, New Jersey."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And were you raised in New Jersey, as well?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Went to school, graduated high school there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you attend college?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you marry?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:3", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 81.88113302324189, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Went to school, graduated high school there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you attend college?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you marry?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you have any children?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:5", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 52, "return_to_go": 90.97903669249098, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you marry?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you have any children?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How did you become employed by NACA?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:13", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 55.555611480705664, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "He lived at Stanford University campus and also taught there. As a member of both, he would spend early A.M. hours at NACA then would go to the National Academy of Sciences’ offices on Constitution Avenue."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When you heard about this position at NACA, did you do any sort of research to find out what NACA was and what it did?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I didn’t. Whenever I told someone I worked for NACA, I would be asked, “What’s that?” The only thing is, when you’re in high school—you graduated high school—did they ask you what you wanted to pursue?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "At some point, yes, I think so."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They printed it in our yearbook—aviation. Some of the other students, my buddies and friends, “Aviation? What are you going to do? Aviation? You’re going to pursue aviation?”\\n\\n I said, “Well, that’s what I put down, because I used to like to go to the airport and hang around and watch all the airplanes come in and out, and so forth,” since I didn’t live too far from the airport. But anyway, that’s what I chose.\\n\\n But they said, “Well, listen, we’re going to Washington.” The graduating class always went to Washington. That was a big deal. I don’t know where your graduation class—you probably went to Spain, like my niece. [Laughs] Where did you go?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "They didn’t have any trips when I graduated."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:15", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 61.72845720078407, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I didn’t. Whenever I told someone I worked for NACA, I would be asked, “What’s that?” The only thing is, when you’re in high school—you graduated high school—did they ask you what you wanted to pursue?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "At some point, yes, I think so."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They printed it in our yearbook—aviation. Some of the other students, my buddies and friends, “Aviation? What are you going to do? Aviation? You’re going to pursue aviation?”\\n\\n I said, “Well, that’s what I put down, because I used to like to go to the airport and hang around and watch all the airplanes come in and out, and so forth,” since I didn’t live too far from the airport. But anyway, that’s what I chose.\\n\\n But they said, “Well, listen, we’re going to Washington.” The graduating class always went to Washington. That was a big deal. I don’t know where your graduation class—you probably went to Spain, like my niece. [Laughs] Where did you go?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "They didn’t have any trips when I graduated."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They didn’t?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No. No, we didn’t go anywhere."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:17", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 38, "return_to_go": 68.58717466753785, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They printed it in our yearbook—aviation. Some of the other students, my buddies and friends, “Aviation? What are you going to do? Aviation? You’re going to pursue aviation?”\\n\\n I said, “Well, that’s what I put down, because I used to like to go to the airport and hang around and watch all the airplanes come in and out, and so forth,” since I didn’t live too far from the airport. But anyway, that’s what I chose.\\n\\n But they said, “Well, listen, we’re going to Washington.” The graduating class always went to Washington. That was a big deal. I don’t know where your graduation class—you probably went to Spain, like my niece. [Laughs] Where did you go?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "They didn’t have any trips when I graduated."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They didn’t?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No. No, we didn’t go anywhere."}, {"role": "user", "content": "How come? Did the school ever have it?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I think that there may have been some opportunities to go on smaller trips, but not necessarily the entire class."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:27", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 11, "return_to_go": 17.461895489403467, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Teach other secretaries. Hey, wait a minute. When you hire somebody, you’re hiring because of the qualifications they have. I have to teach them something? I have to teach them this? No way. I told him, “I thank you very much for trying.” He tried to create this new job. But he was willing to do that, and I said, “No, I can’t accept that. I don’t want to teach anyone.”\\n\\n Because I felt like telling him, “Look, I had to know what to do in order to get a job, so the people they hire today, they don’t take civil service exams anymore.” I don’t know how they hire; I really don’t. I don’t know how they get their jobs. When I was hired, you had to pass a test, and they held tests all over the country. That’s how they hired people for civil service. It’s changed. Everything’s changed.\\n\\n An opening came in the Aerodynamics Section across the street. We had another building; the two buildings were close. So I accepted that. I said, “I’ll go to Aerodynamics. I know those people over there.” So that’s how that worked."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Let me ask you some more questions about NACA."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Sure."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When you first started working for NACA, this is the late thirties. What were working conditions like over at NACA?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "The conditions, well, I tell you, I started in ’42."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, you started in ’42."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:37", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.894960946677279, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Just worked, that’s all. I don’t know what I can tell you about that. It was a war town. A lot of soldiers in town, always."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there a dress code at NACA? Was there a dress code at Headquarters?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "A dress code?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. But those days, they don’t dress like today, of course. You wore what you had to wear. You were covered. [Laughs]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And what would you wear to work, typically?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:39", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 8.77217882964142, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "A dress code?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. But those days, they don’t dress like today, of course. You wore what you had to wear. You were covered. [Laughs]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And what would you wear to work, typically?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I wore sport clothes most of the time. Fully dressed. Dresses all the time, never pants, never."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you wear a hat?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:43", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 7.126146703261012, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I wore sport clothes most of the time. Fully dressed. Dresses all the time, never pants, never."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you wear a hat?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I never wore a hat. From the very beginning, my mother couldn’t get me to wear a hat. I wouldn’t even wear a scarf in the wintertime. No, I was bareheaded most of the time, even when I went to school. I own one hat, which I don’t wear. It’s been in the box for years. The feather might just be [makes sound]. [Laughter] No, we dressed normally. Not like today.\\n\\n Hey, I was at the mall yesterday, San Jose Mall, at the end of the car line or whatever; I don’t know where it was. Uh, terrible. Well, it’s the same way in Washington. I’ll tell you, I don’t know how the girls—I used to—if you’re recording this, I don’t want to tell you that, but anyway, you know, we covered ourselves up. We were not naked from here and here. See-through blouses? Oh, god, forget it. No, we were fully dressed. I can’t tell you anything about that other than we were fully dressed."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That’s all."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You said that there were around fifty people working there. Did you have any social activities, Christmas parties?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:45", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.695718559178903, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I never wore a hat. From the very beginning, my mother couldn’t get me to wear a hat. I wouldn’t even wear a scarf in the wintertime. No, I was bareheaded most of the time, even when I went to school. I own one hat, which I don’t wear. It’s been in the box for years. The feather might just be [makes sound]. [Laughter] No, we dressed normally. Not like today.\\n\\n Hey, I was at the mall yesterday, San Jose Mall, at the end of the car line or whatever; I don’t know where it was. Uh, terrible. Well, it’s the same way in Washington. I’ll tell you, I don’t know how the girls—I used to—if you’re recording this, I don’t want to tell you that, but anyway, you know, we covered ourselves up. We were not naked from here and here. See-through blouses? Oh, god, forget it. No, we were fully dressed. I can’t tell you anything about that other than we were fully dressed."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That’s all."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You said that there were around fifty people working there. Did you have any social activities, Christmas parties?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "We had picnics, NACA picnics. One time we had one that was held in Maryland, and it was at a regular picnic ground, when Langley Aeronautical Laboratory people came up from Hampton, Virginia. Yes, a group came up, and they—what did they do? It was their own invention, I guess. I don’t know. I have never seen anything like it. They set up aluminum sheets with hooks on them and added pieces of chicken on the hooks. A fire was built which cooked them. They were delicious. I remember that one picnic very well. Then they had a place where you could play baseball, ride swings, and dance."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you spend a lot of time with people who you worked with in the office outside of the office?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:47", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 6.328576176865448, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That’s all."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You said that there were around fifty people working there. Did you have any social activities, Christmas parties?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "We had picnics, NACA picnics. One time we had one that was held in Maryland, and it was at a regular picnic ground, when Langley Aeronautical Laboratory people came up from Hampton, Virginia. Yes, a group came up, and they—what did they do? It was their own invention, I guess. I don’t know. I have never seen anything like it. They set up aluminum sheets with hooks on them and added pieces of chicken on the hooks. A fire was built which cooked them. They were delicious. I remember that one picnic very well. Then they had a place where you could play baseball, ride swings, and dance."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you spend a lot of time with people who you worked with in the office outside of the office?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not I. No, I didn’t."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Give me an idea of what sort of equipment you were working with when you first started at NACA and how that changed when you left in ’72."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:51", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.3439212060067245, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not I. No, I didn’t."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Give me an idea of what sort of equipment you were working with when you first started at NACA and how that changed when you left in ’72."}, {"role": "user", "content": "[Laughs] Well, when I was in the secretarial pool, I was assigned a desk next to a huge window. There were about four desks in one row, in four—you know, like that. My desk was made of metal with a center drop for the typewriter. Everybody else had manual typewriters.\\n\\n All of a sudden—I don’t know when they started, but I was the first one to be issued an IBM (International Business Machines) electric machine. That machine had the whatever they call the—it didn’t have this kind of printing. [Demonstrates] Now, let me see. Yes. Yes, it did. I forget what they call this kind of printing. The newspaper printing is different from what that is, because every time you made a mistake—if you had a capital M, and you wanted it to be an N, you had to know exactly how many backspaces you had to go. How many–one, two, three, four, five. Okay, cut that out. Then you’d hit N, and that would only take four, say. That’s executive type; I think that’s what they called the executive type.\\n\\n Anyway, I was issued this electric IBM machine, the first, and let me tell you, even with a felt pad this thick [demonstrates], with a typewriter on it, on a metal base, noisy. Boy, was it noisy. [Laughs] I felt sorry for everybody else, but Miss Wheeler issued that machine to me because I was typing all of the minutes of the meetings, the different meetings. So anyway, I was the first one to get that IBM machine. I thought, “Oh, boy.”"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What other equipment did you have besides that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "That’s all. That and a telephone—no, I didn’t even have a telephone. Did I? I don’t remember a telephone."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did that change at all over the years?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:55", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.597433587662622, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That’s all. That and a telephone—no, I didn’t even have a telephone. Did I? I don’t remember a telephone."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did that change at all over the years?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, sure, you know. I don’t remember that. That I don’t remember—telephone? Well, when you had your own office, then you got your telephone, but I never had my own office at NACA. We were always in a group."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was it common for most people to have telephones when you first started?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "The engineers had telephones on their desk, and if they needed us, they’d buzz. [Laughs]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So did you have some box on your desk so you knew when you were needed?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:57", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.33048176406958, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, sure, you know. I don’t remember that. That I don’t remember—telephone? Well, when you had your own office, then you got your telephone, but I never had my own office at NACA. We were always in a group."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was it common for most people to have telephones when you first started?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "The engineers had telephones on their desk, and if they needed us, they’d buzz. [Laughs]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So did you have some box on your desk so you knew when you were needed?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, no. No room for it, because when you had the typewriter here and then a little bit here for the drawers, and over here. [Demonstrates]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You mentioned that you were typing minutes from the meetings. Did you get to attend those meetings and take notes in shorthand?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:63", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 10.055530540561838, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. Only the engineer would attend the meetings. He would report on the progress of the whole meeting. Then he would dictate them to me. Do you want to know something?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Sure."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, you can’t print this stuff. I can’t tell you that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "All right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Cut it all."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So what sort of skills did you have to have to be a secretary? You mentioned that you had to have these skills when you came on board that not necessarily everyone had."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:65", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 11.172811711735376, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, you can’t print this stuff. I can’t tell you that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "All right."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Cut it all."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So what sort of skills did you have to have to be a secretary? You mentioned that you had to have these skills when you came on board that not necessarily everyone had."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, being a high school graduate, what other skills do you have? Either you’re good at typing and good at taking dictation. Other than that, you don’t have—you know, like colleges, you don’t have all this extra. I didn’t have that. I didn’t go to college. I’m just an ordinary high school kid. The only course I took was the commercial course, which included typing, stenography, bookkeeping; duties that required office work."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you learn shorthand?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:67", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 12.414235235261529, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Cut it all."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So what sort of skills did you have to have to be a secretary? You mentioned that you had to have these skills when you came on board that not necessarily everyone had."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, being a high school graduate, what other skills do you have? Either you’re good at typing and good at taking dictation. Other than that, you don’t have—you know, like colleges, you don’t have all this extra. I didn’t have that. I didn’t go to college. I’m just an ordinary high school kid. The only course I took was the commercial course, which included typing, stenography, bookkeeping; duties that required office work."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you learn shorthand?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh yes. I was good at both shorthand and typing. I was playing basketball at one of the places downtown, and, of course, you know how many girls are on a basketball team. You know, five on each side, right? Well, I was under the basket with a bunch of other girls, and we were all trying to get the ball. I guess I jumped the highest since the ball came down and hit my finger, breaking the first joint. You see this? Well, that’s the way it is."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, my goodness."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:71", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 13.103994117606826, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh yes. I was good at both shorthand and typing. I was playing basketball at one of the places downtown, and, of course, you know how many girls are on a basketball team. You know, five on each side, right? Well, I was under the basket with a bunch of other girls, and we were all trying to get the ball. I guess I jumped the highest since the ball came down and hit my finger, breaking the first joint. You see this? Well, that’s the way it is."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, my goodness."}, {"role": "user", "content": "The basketball did that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Ouch."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Broke this connection here, from this—the end of this bone hit the end of this bone, and the chip is sitting up there, [demonstrates] and they couldn’t do anything about it. So here I am. After a week I go to the doctor, who said, “You have a chip there, but I can’t do any—.” What happens, if you let it go too long, the fluid hardens in between the broken chip, the chip there, and the connection to the bone. The doctor didn’t do anything but give me a splint. So here I am with a splint on my finger like this [demonstrates], straight as could be, and I’m typing the minutes of the meetings on this electric typewriter, with this splint. And it’s been that way since. It healed, but it’s crooked. Not like that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "There’s quite a large difference."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:73", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 14.559993464007583, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "The basketball did that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Ouch."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Broke this connection here, from this—the end of this bone hit the end of this bone, and the chip is sitting up there, [demonstrates] and they couldn’t do anything about it. So here I am. After a week I go to the doctor, who said, “You have a chip there, but I can’t do any—.” What happens, if you let it go too long, the fluid hardens in between the broken chip, the chip there, and the connection to the bone. The doctor didn’t do anything but give me a splint. So here I am with a splint on my finger like this [demonstrates], straight as could be, and I’m typing the minutes of the meetings on this electric typewriter, with this splint. And it’s been that way since. It healed, but it’s crooked. Not like that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "There’s quite a large difference."}, {"role": "user", "content": "You’re darn tootin’. But they said, “What are you doing, typing with a splint on your finger?” With an electric typewriter you don’t have to do this [demonstrates], you just touch. Well, you know that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Much easier than a manual, where you have to really—"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:77", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 17.97530057284887, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "You’re darn tootin’. But they said, “What are you doing, typing with a splint on your finger?” With an electric typewriter you don’t have to do this [demonstrates], you just touch. Well, you know that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Much easier than a manual, where you have to really—"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Absolutely."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "—type hard."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, right. You didn’t have to do that, see?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you belong to any sort of national secretarial organizations?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:79", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 19.9725561920543, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Absolutely."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "—type hard."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, right. You didn’t have to do that, see?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you belong to any sort of national secretarial organizations?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I never joined anything."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you recall, was there any sort of competition between the NACA Laboratories that you recall?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:81", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 22.191729102282554, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, right. You didn’t have to do that, see?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you belong to any sort of national secretarial organizations?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I never joined anything."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you recall, was there any sort of competition between the NACA Laboratories that you recall?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "What was the question?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there any sort of competition between the NACA Laboratories while you were working in Headquarters?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:83", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 24.65747678031395, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I never joined anything."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you recall, was there any sort of competition between the NACA Laboratories that you recall?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "What was the question?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there any sort of competition between the NACA Laboratories while you were working in Headquarters?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "What kind of competition are you talking about?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Any sort of competition. Competition in research or—"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:85", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 27.397196422571053, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "What was the question?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there any sort of competition between the NACA Laboratories while you were working in Headquarters?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "What kind of competition are you talking about?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Any sort of competition. Competition in research or—"}, {"role": "user", "content": "The research end, that’s out of the secretary’s mind. All they do is do what the boss tells you to do, so I don’t know that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Let’s see here. Did you have a sense of what NACA’s relationship was like with the various administrations while you were working as a secretary for NACA?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:87", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 29.33021824730117, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "What kind of competition are you talking about?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Any sort of competition. Competition in research or—"}, {"role": "user", "content": "The research end, that’s out of the secretary’s mind. All they do is do what the boss tells you to do, so I don’t know that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Let’s see here. Did you have a sense of what NACA’s relationship was like with the various administrations while you were working as a secretary for NACA?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, there were a lot of things that went on up on the Hill, but I never went up on the Hill to hear. Even in the budget hearings, we were not allowed to attend."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What impact do you think Sputnik had on NACA? Or what are your memories of that time at NACA?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:89", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 31.478020274779077, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "The research end, that’s out of the secretary’s mind. All they do is do what the boss tells you to do, so I don’t know that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Let’s see here. Did you have a sense of what NACA’s relationship was like with the various administrations while you were working as a secretary for NACA?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, there were a lot of things that went on up on the Hill, but I never went up on the Hill to hear. Even in the budget hearings, we were not allowed to attend."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What impact do you think Sputnik had on NACA? Or what are your memories of that time at NACA?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, it was an exciting time when you saw that thing up in the sky, you know, but we did just what we had to do. We would just follow what the brains, the Drydens and the heads did. There was nothing we could—you know. We did what our bosses told us to do."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When Dryden became the Director of NACA, did that change anything at NACA Headquarters?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:91", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 6, "return_to_go": 34.97557808308786, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, there were a lot of things that went on up on the Hill, but I never went up on the Hill to hear. Even in the budget hearings, we were not allowed to attend."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What impact do you think Sputnik had on NACA? Or what are your memories of that time at NACA?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, it was an exciting time when you saw that thing up in the sky, you know, but we did just what we had to do. We would just follow what the brains, the Drydens and the heads did. There was nothing we could—you know. We did what our bosses told us to do."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When Dryden became the Director of NACA, did that change anything at NACA Headquarters?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. When he came to NACA?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When he became Director."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:93", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 8, "return_to_go": 32.19508675898651, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, it was an exciting time when you saw that thing up in the sky, you know, but we did just what we had to do. We would just follow what the brains, the Drydens and the heads did. There was nothing we could—you know. We did what our bosses told us to do."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When Dryden became the Director of NACA, did that change anything at NACA Headquarters?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. When he came to NACA?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When he became Director."}, {"role": "user", "content": "When he became the Director? He succeeded Dr. Lewis who had medical problems. Nothing changed when he took over; it was the same. Incidentally, many of us old NACA-ers don’t like the idea that it’s now the John H. Glenn [Research Center, previously the Lewis Research Center, Cleveland, Ohio] facility. I still refer to it as the Lewis Lab."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Why is that?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:95", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 26.883429732207237, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. When he came to NACA?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When he became Director."}, {"role": "user", "content": "When he became the Director? He succeeded Dr. Lewis who had medical problems. Nothing changed when he took over; it was the same. Incidentally, many of us old NACA-ers don’t like the idea that it’s now the John H. Glenn [Research Center, previously the Lewis Research Center, Cleveland, Ohio] facility. I still refer to it as the Lewis Lab."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Why is that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "When you dedicate something to somebody, like the Washington Monument, for instance, would you change that to John Adams? Whoever heard of changing anything that was dedicated to a person because he contributed all—and Dr. Lewis was responsible for the Lewis Research Center being in operation, built. It’s sad. Everybody was sad about that. Even Harry [Harold B.] Finger wrote letters to congressmen saying, “Hey, in the first place, John Glenn should have refused and said, ‘Oh, no, please don’t name that after me. I didn’t do any—.’” What did he do? He didn’t do anything to create this Laboratory up here. What is this? Oh, we were [makes sound]—.\\n\\n The girl who worked for Dr. Dryden first, she lives in Ohio, and she’s still living, Helen Smith. Oh, boy. I said, “Helen, what do you think of this?”\\n\\n “What do I think of it?” she asked. That was her boss, Dr. Lewis, yes. Then she became Dr. Dryden’s boss—I mean, secretary to him. Terrible. Anyway, would you do that? I wouldn’t think of that. You know, John Glenn had this named after him and that named after him, a highway named after him. What else do you want? For heaven’s sake. To me, I still refer it as the Lewis [Flight Propulsion] Lab[oratory]. [Laughs]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you. I think a number of people still do."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:101", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 6, "return_to_go": 28.92102843924175, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, sure they do. You ask any NACA-er, and they’ll tell you. But they fought it. They tried to fight it, some of the people at Lewis. They didn’t get anywhere. I don’t think that’s right. I really don’t. They’re not changing Kennedy’s, are they? You know, they tried to change something over in Florida. What was it, anyway? Yes, I think they tried to—what was the—what’s the address for the Kennedy Space Center nowadays? What is it?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I think it’s just Cape Canaveral, Florida."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Canaveral, Cape Canaveral. That’s what it is, Cape Canaveral. It’s not Cape Kennedy. Cape Canaveral."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Let me ask you a couple more questions about NACA—"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Go ahead."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "—and then I wanted to ask you a couple of questions about the transition to NASA. But if you had to look back over your time at NACA, could you point to something and say that that was your most significant accomplishment while working there?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:103", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 25.467809376935275, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Canaveral, Cape Canaveral. That’s what it is, Cape Canaveral. It’s not Cape Kennedy. Cape Canaveral."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Let me ask you a couple more questions about NACA—"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Go ahead."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "—and then I wanted to ask you a couple of questions about the transition to NASA. But if you had to look back over your time at NACA, could you point to something and say that that was your most significant accomplishment while working there?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "The whole ten years were. The whole time I worked. When I first went in ’42 until the time we became ’58, they were perfect. Great days to work, yes. I can tell you that those were the best days of my life, working in the government. There’s nothing like it. Hey, these reunions prove it, right?\\n\\n Okay, when I retired, they held a party for me in the NASA Building, okay? And I’m looking over all these people. I have to stand there and give this little speech of some sort. And I said, “I see a lot of my old NACA friends here,” and I happened to mention that aloud, and then those faces lit up, you know. Well, they were. Some of them were still NASA, too, but a number of them were not working, but they were old NACA friends, and that’s when I mentioned, “Oh, wouldn’t it be nice to have a reunion of the old NACA people?” And that’s when they badgered me to hold this first reunion, which I ran, in ’76. So after that, well, you can see what’s happened. I suppose my most significant accomplishment was starting the first NACA reunion. So far we’ve had eleven, and I hear Langley has committed to hold the next one, perhaps in two years."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Why do you think it’s so important for former NACA employees to come to these reunions, and why do they come?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:111", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 6, "return_to_go": 22.84378810689723, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "[Laughs] Do you want to know if they dated and all?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Sure. Dated, played any pranks on each other."}, {"role": "user", "content": "One thing they used to do, one of the Budget Officers used to have a pool every time we got checks, our checks, they’d take the numbers or something, and whatever numbers came up, that person won—well, the contribution, I guess, was a dollar; whatever they did, I don’t know; budget men did all this stuff—and would win the prize every two weeks, whenever we got paid. That was one of the things they used to do, and I guess there were others that I don’t know about. I really don’t. [Laughs]\\n\\n Whenever we needed help from other Laboratories, they would send up maybe two or three girls from the Center—or I say the Laboratory—from the Laboratory to help us out with the reports. These engineers, whenever they did any work, would write a report, and reports were called “research memorandums” or “technical notes,” and some were classified; some were not. Whenever we needed these people, they only worked a short time and then were sent back to the Lab, and we always liked when they came to help us out, you know, to relieve us of the overload that we had. That was always nice. So we got to know some of the people at the Labs; mostly women, of course, the girls, yes. I know one friend of mine who worked at NACA, Helen Williams, she had two Langley girls working, living with her in her apartment, who came from Langley Field. To this day, they are still friends with this lady."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How neat."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh yes. They’re still in touch. It’s wonderful, isn’t it?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes. And did you have that same opportunity to go out to the Laboratories while you were working for NACA?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:119", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 14.918134593655278, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, you get a tour of the whole Lab. You get a tour wherever they take you. They take you through the wind tunnels, everywhere. Whatever work they were doing, it was a complete inspection of the entire area. Then they would take you to lunch. I remember when we went, at Langley this one time, we had lunch in their cafeteria. Guess who was sitting next to me? Orville Wright."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You met Orville Wright?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. He was sitting right next to me. We were eating together at the table. When I told them they said, “What? You were sitting next to Orville Wright?”\\n\\n I said, “Sure.” And do you know, at this the other night—I don’t know whether you heard about it—but what is she, a grandniece or great-grandniece, happened to be here in this hotel, and she saw “NACA.” Oh, well this sparked her. She came, and wouldn’t you know that she is—I don’t know what the relationship is, but she is related to the Wright brothers. Her son will be writing a book about the Wright brothers.\\n\\n Well, when she saw “NACA,” that meant something to her. It doesn’t mean anything to you—well, you work for NASA, so you would know. But any ordinary people walking in the street, “What’s NACA?” Nobody knows what NACA is, but she did. Her father was with her. We said, “Won’t you have dinner with us?” Here she was mingling around with everybody and obviously excited to be included in this unexpected encounter."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That’s nice."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That was nice, yes. I know she was happy to be among us Friday night. They left Saturday morning."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When you were sitting next to Orville Wright, do you remember the conversation?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:121", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 16.57570510406142, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. He was sitting right next to me. We were eating together at the table. When I told them they said, “What? You were sitting next to Orville Wright?”\\n\\n I said, “Sure.” And do you know, at this the other night—I don’t know whether you heard about it—but what is she, a grandniece or great-grandniece, happened to be here in this hotel, and she saw “NACA.” Oh, well this sparked her. She came, and wouldn’t you know that she is—I don’t know what the relationship is, but she is related to the Wright brothers. Her son will be writing a book about the Wright brothers.\\n\\n Well, when she saw “NACA,” that meant something to her. It doesn’t mean anything to you—well, you work for NASA, so you would know. But any ordinary people walking in the street, “What’s NACA?” Nobody knows what NACA is, but she did. Her father was with her. We said, “Won’t you have dinner with us?” Here she was mingling around with everybody and obviously excited to be included in this unexpected encounter."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That’s nice."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That was nice, yes. I know she was happy to be among us Friday night. They left Saturday morning."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When you were sitting next to Orville Wright, do you remember the conversation?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I don’t. I don’t remember."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Let me ask you a couple of questions about the transition from NACA to NASA."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:123", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 17.30633900451269, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That was nice, yes. I know she was happy to be among us Friday night. They left Saturday morning."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When you were sitting next to Orville Wright, do you remember the conversation?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I don’t. I don’t remember."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Let me ask you a couple of questions about the transition from NACA to NASA."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Busy days. Busy, busy days. That’s all I can tell you. Let me tell you, visits up the Hill and you know. Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And at this point, were you going to Capitol Hill?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:125", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 19.229265560569655, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I don’t. I don’t remember."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Let me ask you a couple of questions about the transition from NACA to NASA."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Busy days. Busy, busy days. That’s all I can tell you. Let me tell you, visits up the Hill and you know. Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And at this point, were you going to Capitol Hill?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, no. We were working at the office."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were you typing up testimony or what sort of things were you working on?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:127", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 19.14362840063295, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Busy days. Busy, busy days. That’s all I can tell you. Let me tell you, visits up the Hill and you know. Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And at this point, were you going to Capitol Hill?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, no. We were working at the office."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were you typing up testimony or what sort of things were you working on?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, Paul [G.] Dembling, who didn’t come to this reunion this time, he wrote the Space Act, and we did what we had to do. There was just so much going on at that time, so much."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You were Dryden’s secretary. What was your feeling when Dryden wasn’t selected as the Administrator of NASA?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:129", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 21.270698222925496, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, no. We were working at the office."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were you typing up testimony or what sort of things were you working on?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, Paul [G.] Dembling, who didn’t come to this reunion this time, he wrote the Space Act, and we did what we had to do. There was just so much going on at that time, so much."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You were Dryden’s secretary. What was your feeling when Dryden wasn’t selected as the Administrator of NASA?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, we knew the reason, we thought. It was—I don’t know. I took it philosophically. I knew that politics is politics. Glennan was the Administrator. He was in touch quite often with Dr. Dryden. You know what I mean? And same way when Webb got on board. Yes. These men knew how to handle it. Yes. I guess it was sad for the family and for all of us."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So did anything change when Glennan came on board or when Webb became the Administrator?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:131", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 12, "return_to_go": 23.634109136583884, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, Paul [G.] Dembling, who didn’t come to this reunion this time, he wrote the Space Act, and we did what we had to do. There was just so much going on at that time, so much."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You were Dryden’s secretary. What was your feeling when Dryden wasn’t selected as the Administrator of NASA?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, we knew the reason, we thought. It was—I don’t know. I took it philosophically. I knew that politics is politics. Glennan was the Administrator. He was in touch quite often with Dr. Dryden. You know what I mean? And same way when Webb got on board. Yes. These men knew how to handle it. Yes. I guess it was sad for the family and for all of us."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So did anything change when Glennan came on board or when Webb became the Administrator?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it was basically a very smooth transition at the time, very smooth, as far as I know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What were some of the things that you recall Dryden was working on at that point?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:143", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.8247691401000004, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No indeed. This is his signature."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I’m going to have to go to the archives and put that piece of paper up against a letter. [Laughs]"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, you want to do that? You could do that. That’s how he wrote. Crowley and the other boss I had, he was—[writes]. That’s Crowley. Hey, I wrote to Helen Smith, the secretary before me, and I said, “Helen, do you recognize this?” She lives in Ohio.\\n\\n “Where did you get that?”\\n\\n I told her I had written it.\\n\\n “Oh, for heaven’s sake.”\\n\\n Sometimes I would sign letters that were not very important if he wasn’t available to do so. “Do you want me to sign that for you?” And, of course, I put the little “J. D.” down there to make sure."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When Dr. Dryden wasn’t there, what were some of the tasks that you would work on while he was out of town?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "There was always a lot of work to do, even if he wasn’t there. Work always came through the desk all the time. And when he got sick, I used to go to the NIH, (National Institutes of Health), hospital unit in Bethesda, Maryland. I used to take the latest mail; he wanted that. He wanted to write, sign his name to the letters, and anything that was official, of course, I took out, and he signed them. He wanted to read them all, keep him up to date on what was going on at the office when he was hospitalized. It was very sad."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You must have had a very strong bond, a very strong relationship."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:145", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.249743489, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, you want to do that? You could do that. That’s how he wrote. Crowley and the other boss I had, he was—[writes]. That’s Crowley. Hey, I wrote to Helen Smith, the secretary before me, and I said, “Helen, do you recognize this?” She lives in Ohio.\\n\\n “Where did you get that?”\\n\\n I told her I had written it.\\n\\n “Oh, for heaven’s sake.”\\n\\n Sometimes I would sign letters that were not very important if he wasn’t available to do so. “Do you want me to sign that for you?” And, of course, I put the little “J. D.” down there to make sure."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When Dr. Dryden wasn’t there, what were some of the tasks that you would work on while he was out of town?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "There was always a lot of work to do, even if he wasn’t there. Work always came through the desk all the time. And when he got sick, I used to go to the NIH, (National Institutes of Health), hospital unit in Bethesda, Maryland. I used to take the latest mail; he wanted that. He wanted to write, sign his name to the letters, and anything that was official, of course, I took out, and he signed them. He wanted to read them all, keep him up to date on what was going on at the office when he was hospitalized. It was very sad."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You must have had a very strong bond, a very strong relationship."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh yes. Yes. His wife often said, “I so appreciate your taking care of my husband.”\\n\\n I would keep people from going into his office. I’d close the door. He needed that privacy.\\n\\n Have you got this on?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes. Do you want me to take it off."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:147", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.72193721, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "There was always a lot of work to do, even if he wasn’t there. Work always came through the desk all the time. And when he got sick, I used to go to the NIH, (National Institutes of Health), hospital unit in Bethesda, Maryland. I used to take the latest mail; he wanted that. He wanted to write, sign his name to the letters, and anything that was official, of course, I took out, and he signed them. He wanted to read them all, keep him up to date on what was going on at the office when he was hospitalized. It was very sad."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You must have had a very strong bond, a very strong relationship."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh yes. Yes. His wife often said, “I so appreciate your taking care of my husband.”\\n\\n I would keep people from going into his office. I’d close the door. He needed that privacy.\\n\\n Have you got this on?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes. Do you want me to take it off."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Well, I won’t tell you this. It’s all right. But I would try to keep people from going in there, because I knew that he was suffering. He was suffering so much. He had two doors; one led to the inner sanctum, you know what I mean? I often heard him go in there to go to the bathroom. Poor guy. I’d see him sitting at his desk. Because I think maybe the pressure from the cancer was getting to him so much."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Let me just ask you a couple more questions. I don’t want to take up too much of your time."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:149", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 5.2465969, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh yes. Yes. His wife often said, “I so appreciate your taking care of my husband.”\\n\\n I would keep people from going into his office. I’d close the door. He needed that privacy.\\n\\n Have you got this on?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes. Do you want me to take it off."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Well, I won’t tell you this. It’s all right. But I would try to keep people from going in there, because I knew that he was suffering. He was suffering so much. He had two doors; one led to the inner sanctum, you know what I mean? I often heard him go in there to go to the bathroom. Poor guy. I’d see him sitting at his desk. Because I think maybe the pressure from the cancer was getting to him so much."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Let me just ask you a couple more questions. I don’t want to take up too much of your time."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, you ask me questions; let me tell you all these details."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Who would often come by Dr. Dryden’s office? Anyone from the administration or from other agencies?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:153", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.02049, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, you ask me questions; let me tell you all these details."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Who would often come by Dr. Dryden’s office? Anyone from the administration or from other agencies?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "People? He never turned anybody down, never. No matter, he saw them all. He wouldn’t refuse anybody, anytime. He always had time for whoever wanted to see him, not only adults but youngsters too. When work came in, it didn’t sit this high on his desk. [Demonstrates] He’d look at it, [gestures], or put it aside to answer, always. He did things [snaps fingers], pretty darn quick. Never anything backlogged. No backlog, no anything, and read—he could go through mail with uncanny speed. It takes something to read fast. I don’t read fast, myself; I don’t know about you.\\n\\n His English was impeccable. Grammar, impeccable. You couldn’t find fault with his English. Punctuation, he’d do everything, and he wouldn’t dictate. He wrote, wrote out in his little old handwriting, the little I showed you. But he wrote. He liked to write things out himself. Incredible. Incredible person. You just can’t—spiritually and intelligent, my god. He knew everything. He liked mystery books."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "He did?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, and one of the gals, Helen Frye [phonetic], she read a lot of mysteries, and she supplied him sometimes with mysteries. He liked mystery books.\\n\\n You like to know about him, maybe—I should have told you—maybe you should meet Michael [H.] Gorn and see what he’s got on his tape."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Sure. Sure. Well, and I can forward him a copy of this as well, if you’d like."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:155", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.3561, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "People? He never turned anybody down, never. No matter, he saw them all. He wouldn’t refuse anybody, anytime. He always had time for whoever wanted to see him, not only adults but youngsters too. When work came in, it didn’t sit this high on his desk. [Demonstrates] He’d look at it, [gestures], or put it aside to answer, always. He did things [snaps fingers], pretty darn quick. Never anything backlogged. No backlog, no anything, and read—he could go through mail with uncanny speed. It takes something to read fast. I don’t read fast, myself; I don’t know about you.\\n\\n His English was impeccable. Grammar, impeccable. You couldn’t find fault with his English. Punctuation, he’d do everything, and he wouldn’t dictate. He wrote, wrote out in his little old handwriting, the little I showed you. But he wrote. He liked to write things out himself. Incredible. Incredible person. You just can’t—spiritually and intelligent, my god. He knew everything. He liked mystery books."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "He did?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, and one of the gals, Helen Frye [phonetic], she read a lot of mysteries, and she supplied him sometimes with mysteries. He liked mystery books.\\n\\n You like to know about him, maybe—I should have told you—maybe you should meet Michael [H.] Gorn and see what he’s got on his tape."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Sure. Sure. Well, and I can forward him a copy of this as well, if you’d like."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, anyway, I don’t know. I don’t know whether I told him as much as I told you. He asked different questions. Go ahead."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Any other anecdotes or memories that you recall?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:161", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.9, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "About him, you mean?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Helen, his former secretary, told me when I went up to talk to her when she knew I was going to take the job, “Well, you’ll find out,” she said, “that Dr. Dryden wears one suit a week, and the next week he’ll wear something else. You’ll notice that.”\\n\\n I said, “Oh, Helen. Oh, okay.” He wasn’t a flashy dresser, like some men are. They have the right tie and—no, he wasn’t flashy at all.\\n\\n He had a very faithful driver who chauffeured him home, got him to work and home. John Freeman [phonetic] was his driver, black man, who also said to me, “Hey, Jo, one of these days,” he said, “I’m going to dance at your wedding. Don’t forget.” He even told me that when I retired.\\n\\n I said, “Yes, John, you’ll dance at—.” I never married, so never got the chance. [Laughter]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That’s nice."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. He was a very nice person. He was so fond of Dr. Dryden, and Dr. Dryden always called him “John,” you know, just “John.” Very nice. And so, what else?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, I think we’ve pretty much covered everything. I’m just curious if you have anything else you’d like to say."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:163", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 1.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Helen, his former secretary, told me when I went up to talk to her when she knew I was going to take the job, “Well, you’ll find out,” she said, “that Dr. Dryden wears one suit a week, and the next week he’ll wear something else. You’ll notice that.”\\n\\n I said, “Oh, Helen. Oh, okay.” He wasn’t a flashy dresser, like some men are. They have the right tie and—no, he wasn’t flashy at all.\\n\\n He had a very faithful driver who chauffeured him home, got him to work and home. John Freeman [phonetic] was his driver, black man, who also said to me, “Hey, Jo, one of these days,” he said, “I’m going to dance at your wedding. Don’t forget.” He even told me that when I retired.\\n\\n I said, “Yes, John, you’ll dance at—.” I never married, so never got the chance. [Laughter]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That’s nice."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. He was a very nice person. He was so fond of Dr. Dryden, and Dr. Dryden always called him “John,” you know, just “John.” Very nice. And so, what else?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, I think we’ve pretty much covered everything. I’m just curious if you have anything else you’d like to say."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don’t have anything. I went overboard, I think, in telling you [things]."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, I certainly appreciate your time today, and I’ve enjoyed hearing your stories and learning more about Headquarters."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:167", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don’t have anything. I went overboard, I think, in telling you [things]."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, I certainly appreciate your time today, and I’ve enjoyed hearing your stories and learning more about Headquarters."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Because I couldn’t answer all those things that they had in that sheet that I received from Rebecca [Wright]."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, sure."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Forget it. I couldn’t answer any of those questions. Those are technical things, you know. I didn’t know anything about technical work."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, you’ve given me some good social history, I think."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00961:169", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Because I couldn’t answer all those things that they had in that sheet that I received from Rebecca [Wright]."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, sure."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Forget it. I couldn’t answer any of those questions. Those are technical things, you know. I didn’t know anything about technical work."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, you’ve given me some good social history, I think."}, {"role": "user", "content": "But that’s about it, you know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That’s important. I can’t stress that enough."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00992:58", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 8.583124234909821, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "So that I could go back and forth. Because I had to meet with the Navy people a lot and also the Grumman [Corporation] people in Long Island [New York]. I knew that I was going to have a constant battle trying to get my trips approved. So I was able to persuade the navy to set up a special travel fund for me."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "In that position, how was the reception when you were speaking with Grumman and with the Navy people? Did they accept you in the position?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, absolutely. The first Navy person that I worked with, they called them the class desk, that was their title. It was a commander. He’s a retired admiral now, lives here in San Diego, and we’re still good friends. [Laughs]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That’s fun."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I had a little trouble with some of the Grumman people. I don’t think that was because I was a woman, although I thought some of them might have thought that I was going to be easier to push around because I was a woman, but mostly they liked working with the Navy. They did a lot of things. The Navy just gave them money. A lot of times they didn’t really watch what Grumman did. NASA was, I think, much better at overseeing those kinds of things. I watched Grumman very closely. I knew what they were doing, and I think sometimes they got a little angry at that. But I had the total support of the Navy, so it went well. I think it went well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you feel the people at Dryden, your management or maybe others, other than your management, seemed to scrutinize your work more than they would have somebody else’s?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00992:60", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 9.536804705455356, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, absolutely. The first Navy person that I worked with, they called them the class desk, that was their title. It was a commander. He’s a retired admiral now, lives here in San Diego, and we’re still good friends. [Laughs]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That’s fun."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I had a little trouble with some of the Grumman people. I don’t think that was because I was a woman, although I thought some of them might have thought that I was going to be easier to push around because I was a woman, but mostly they liked working with the Navy. They did a lot of things. The Navy just gave them money. A lot of times they didn’t really watch what Grumman did. NASA was, I think, much better at overseeing those kinds of things. I watched Grumman very closely. I knew what they were doing, and I think sometimes they got a little angry at that. But I had the total support of the Navy, so it went well. I think it went well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you feel the people at Dryden, your management or maybe others, other than your management, seemed to scrutinize your work more than they would have somebody else’s?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don’t think so. Not at that time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, they must have thought you were doing a good job, because they gave you another project site."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00992:62", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 9.485338561617063, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I had a little trouble with some of the Grumman people. I don’t think that was because I was a woman, although I thought some of them might have thought that I was going to be easier to push around because I was a woman, but mostly they liked working with the Navy. They did a lot of things. The Navy just gave them money. A lot of times they didn’t really watch what Grumman did. NASA was, I think, much better at overseeing those kinds of things. I watched Grumman very closely. I knew what they were doing, and I think sometimes they got a little angry at that. But I had the total support of the Navy, so it went well. I think it went well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you feel the people at Dryden, your management or maybe others, other than your management, seemed to scrutinize your work more than they would have somebody else’s?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don’t think so. Not at that time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, they must have thought you were doing a good job, because they gave you another project site."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Well, the first one was the F-15. I worked then with the F-15 project manager, and we got along fine. He ended up making me his deputy project manager. So I had had some of the management experience before I got the F-14 job."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were you watching more women come in to work for Dryden at this time?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00992:64", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 10.539265068463402, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don’t think so. Not at that time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, they must have thought you were doing a good job, because they gave you another project site."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Well, the first one was the F-15. I worked then with the F-15 project manager, and we got along fine. He ended up making me his deputy project manager. So I had had some of the management experience before I got the F-14 job."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were you watching more women come in to work for Dryden at this time?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you see more coming other than secretaries and aides?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00992:66", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 11.710294520514891, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Well, the first one was the F-15. I worked then with the F-15 project manager, and we got along fine. He ended up making me his deputy project manager. So I had had some of the management experience before I got the F-14 job."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were you watching more women come in to work for Dryden at this time?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you see more coming other than secretaries and aides?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Oh, absolutely. In fact, that’s probably had a big effect on me. John had a woman working for him that he made one of his branch chiefs. I think she’s probably the first one, but there were other women coming in, a lot of other engineers coming in. At that time I wouldn’t say very many of them really got a lot of the opportunity either, maybe somewhat better than I did, but really not that much. It was even later, I think.\\n\\n I don’t know how it is now, except I do read the little Dryden paper, and I see a lot of women in top jobs. But when a lot of these women came in and when I saw, well, this one in particular getting ahead and some of the others also, I saw them going faster than I had, that was, I think, a time when I sort of reinvented myself, if you will. See, my daughter was getting ready to go to college, and, as I said, when I went back to school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Just time for a new phase of your life."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00992:68", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 13.011438356127657, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you see more coming other than secretaries and aides?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Oh, absolutely. In fact, that’s probably had a big effect on me. John had a woman working for him that he made one of his branch chiefs. I think she’s probably the first one, but there were other women coming in, a lot of other engineers coming in. At that time I wouldn’t say very many of them really got a lot of the opportunity either, maybe somewhat better than I did, but really not that much. It was even later, I think.\\n\\n I don’t know how it is now, except I do read the little Dryden paper, and I see a lot of women in top jobs. But when a lot of these women came in and when I saw, well, this one in particular getting ahead and some of the others also, I saw them going faster than I had, that was, I think, a time when I sort of reinvented myself, if you will. See, my daughter was getting ready to go to college, and, as I said, when I went back to school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Just time for a new phase of your life."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. I think it was a little bit of a challenge to me in that when I came back I was—it wasn’t a sudden thing, but I decided, “Enough. I’m going to start applying for these positions,” and I did. I started applying for a number of positions. Up until then, I hadn’t aggressively pursued anything, and now I was. I think it took a little time to, I’m not sure if it’s it the right word, but get their attention."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Because you had changed and in their eyes—"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00992:70", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 14.45715372903073, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Oh, absolutely. In fact, that’s probably had a big effect on me. John had a woman working for him that he made one of his branch chiefs. I think she’s probably the first one, but there were other women coming in, a lot of other engineers coming in. At that time I wouldn’t say very many of them really got a lot of the opportunity either, maybe somewhat better than I did, but really not that much. It was even later, I think.\\n\\n I don’t know how it is now, except I do read the little Dryden paper, and I see a lot of women in top jobs. But when a lot of these women came in and when I saw, well, this one in particular getting ahead and some of the others also, I saw them going faster than I had, that was, I think, a time when I sort of reinvented myself, if you will. See, my daughter was getting ready to go to college, and, as I said, when I went back to school."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Just time for a new phase of your life."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. I think it was a little bit of a challenge to me in that when I came back I was—it wasn’t a sudden thing, but I decided, “Enough. I’m going to start applying for these positions,” and I did. I started applying for a number of positions. Up until then, I hadn’t aggressively pursued anything, and now I was. I think it took a little time to, I’m not sure if it’s it the right word, but get their attention."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Because you had changed and in their eyes—"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was still just the meek little Harriet that would sit in the corner and do all these mathematical calculations. [Laughter]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Now here was the Harriett that wanted—"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00992:72", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 16.063504143367478, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. I think it was a little bit of a challenge to me in that when I came back I was—it wasn’t a sudden thing, but I decided, “Enough. I’m going to start applying for these positions,” and I did. I started applying for a number of positions. Up until then, I hadn’t aggressively pursued anything, and now I was. I think it took a little time to, I’m not sure if it’s it the right word, but get their attention."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Because you had changed and in their eyes—"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was still just the meek little Harriet that would sit in the corner and do all these mathematical calculations. [Laughter]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Now here was the Harriett that wanted—"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I mean, I’m exaggerating."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No, but now here is the Harriet that wanted the opportunity to do more."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00992:74", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 17.848337937074977, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was still just the meek little Harriet that would sit in the corner and do all these mathematical calculations. [Laughter]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Now here was the Harriett that wanted—"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I mean, I’m exaggerating."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No, but now here is the Harriet that wanted the opportunity to do more."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "“Give me more. I can do more.”"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00992:76", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 19.831486596749972, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I mean, I’m exaggerating."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No, but now here is the Harriet that wanted the opportunity to do more."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "“Give me more. I can do more.”"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you have a favorite project while you were there?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00992:78", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 6, "return_to_go": 22.034985107499967, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "“Give me more. I can do more.”"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you have a favorite project while you were there?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, the F-14."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And how long of a span was that in your life? Not hours."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00992:80", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 17.816650119444407, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you have a favorite project while you were there?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, the F-14."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And how long of a span was that in your life? Not hours."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. Let’s see. I guess it was like [19]‘78 that I got that job. Then I left to go to work for Congress in [19]‘82. I worked on the F-15 from [19]‘77 to [19]‘78. There were other things that—it’s hard to remember going back and all the different jobs that I had, and there were certain times that I enjoyed my work a lot.\\n\\n I worked with a guy, Larry [Lawrence W.] Taylor, [Jr.], for a number of years, and he was a very challenging person to work with, and I really enjoyed working with him. Again, at that time that was when computers were coming in and we did a lot of work. We did a lot of our own programming on the computer. We were doing, oh, it was called human describing functions, where we would try to mathematically model a pilot. Those things were interesting. They weren’t part of the mainstream of Dryden, though. I enjoyed doing it, but like I said, it was not part of the mainstream.\\n\\n Then I got into—we were doing a lot of derivative calculations using flight data and some programs that were developed. Mostly it was Larry and a professor at UCLA, and I worked in that area. That was very interesting. So, as I said, over the years there were a lot of things that were interesting. But it wasn’t until later that I really got more involved in the mainstream activities at the center."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "One of the things when I was reading over some of the history that we had on you, you were able to help with one and then actual author a publication in the mid-fifties. Was that quite an accomplishment during that time for a woman to have done that?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00992:86", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 15.290329381953914, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, see that was the first job I was assigned to. I was put in this X-3 loads office. I don’t know that that was—I did not find that terribly exciting, frankly. That was when I was working in the office with the guy who was doing the X-3 wing loads. I was doing the horizontal tail loads, and he was working on the wing loads. And I was doing a lot of his mundane work. Writing the report, I did not find that overly challenging. It was because we had so many models to work with, so I looked at other reports and just—"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Just did it."}, {"role": "user", "content": "—wrote up the data. I wrote a number of other reports, and I was trying to remember what some of them were. I know I wrote one on supersonic flybys and computing the flow. Then I did a lot of work on the wake vortex, when like a small aircraft gets in the wake of a large aircraft landing. I did a report on that. Then I did a paper on—well, I know I did a couple papers, I think, on the Lifting Body."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You were involved somewhat in that project."}, {"role": "user", "content": "In the Lifting Body. Yeah, I was working on that project. Bertha Ryan was there at the time, and she and I were both working on the first one, was the M-2/F-1. That was when I had the problems with [Paul] Bikle not letting me go in the hangar.\\n\\n Then the next lifting body was the HL-10. Then I left the program. That’s when I started working with Larry Taylor on some of these other things. I wrote some papers with him and at least one by myself on these describing functions. I gave a paper at MIT at the time on that. I wasn’t as prolific as some of the engineers, but I wrote a number of papers. I just can’t remember now what they all were."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was this all part of your normal day activities or was this something you had to do on your own, on your own time?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00992:112", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 14.535721107477576, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, we interviewed a lot of the NASA people to find out how they went about signing off on flights and this kind of thing, to see where they could have done things differently, maybe tightened things up. Then there were, I guess, three groups. We put out a big fat report, which I always wonder how many people read those things. [Laughs]\\n\\n I guess I don’t know that I could see anything really that NASA could do differently, other than they pushed too hard. There was at that time a great deal of emphasis on trying to make the Shuttle a routine transportation. I think that that kind of filtered all the way down, and they probably weren’t as cautious as they could have been."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were you working closely with the [Chairman William P.] Rogers Commission [Presidential Commission on the Space Shuttle Challenger Accident] or were you a separate—?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "We were separate, but we met with him, with Rogers, not his whole committee. But he would come and meet with our committee."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Certainly a different time in your life than just a few years or before."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What a different scope that you were working on. How long were you in this position?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00992:124", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 6.541501847786848, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Manuel said, “What do I want with this?” So he says, “You want it?”\\n\\n So I said, “Sure.”\\n\\n They had given me a silk scarf, and I don’t wear scarves, and his wife, Jean, did. So I said, “Here. I’ll make a swap.” I gave him the scarf. Because they always give you little gifts and things, so I got that. That was real fun trip.\\n\\n Then we went to Genoa. We went to Italy. All these things, this is—\n\nJapan.\n\nYeah, we went to Japan. These things are such a joke. Taxpayers really ought to be a little more concerned about these things, because the congressmen would decide where they wanted to go. Now, this was not always the case. The one to China, I think actually there was some real serious interest in going there. But a lot of times they just want to go on a trip. They take their wives with them.\\n\\n When we went to China, the wives weren’t there. It was just the staffers. It was a much different trip. But most of them, they’d take their wives along. They would decide where all they wanted to go, and then they would have one of their staffers put together kind of an itinerary of where all to go to oversee something."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "The rationale."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. The rationale always came afterwards. But anyway, who am I to say? I mean, this one staffer who was the committee staff director, the Republican staff director, he decided he didn’t want to do it. He thought that was obscene. But he soon learned that him standing on principle wasn’t going to save the taxpayer a nickel, because they were going to continue doing it. If he didn’t go, somebody else would. So he started going."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Certainly a long way from the Edwards Air Force Base and the sands around them, wasn’t it?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You could have still been in one of those offices, and here you were in China. That was quite a stretch."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00992:156", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.915395753096946, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That’s right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Not only have you had an adjustment in work atmosphere, but leaving Dryden and moving to D.C. was quite an adjustment as well."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Washington, D.C., it’s an interesting place to live. Well, it’s an interesting place to work. I didn’t live in D.C. I lived in Virginia, and we commuted. But that whole area, northern Virginia, it’s all in the Beltway. I mean, I know personally what it means to be in the Beltway or out of the Beltway. We lived in the Beltway. It’s exciting.\\n\\n In fact, I had kind of withdrawal pains when I came back, because everybody here, they kind of pooh-pooh Congress. They think all congressmen are dishonest and they don’t do anything and congressional staff doesn’t do anything, and that’s just not true. Congressmen work very, very hard.\\n\\n The thing that I think they ought to do is to come up with ways of not giving them so many benefits other than their salary. They should make more money, but they should not have the power to do things that—the lobbyists do things for them. That’s the kind of thing that’s bad, and I think it kind of corrupts.\\n\\n But most congressmen are basically very honest. They want to help their constituents. They work very hard. Staffers work long, long, long hours, much longer than most people."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It seems like you have to have a lot of the answers before the questions are asked."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Well, see, when they had hearings, we wrote all the questions for the members. These members come across looking so smart. It’s the staffers that provide all the questions for them and all the answers so they know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What to expect and not to expect?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00992:158", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 4.136345340325029, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah. Washington, D.C., it’s an interesting place to live. Well, it’s an interesting place to work. I didn’t live in D.C. I lived in Virginia, and we commuted. But that whole area, northern Virginia, it’s all in the Beltway. I mean, I know personally what it means to be in the Beltway or out of the Beltway. We lived in the Beltway. It’s exciting.\\n\\n In fact, I had kind of withdrawal pains when I came back, because everybody here, they kind of pooh-pooh Congress. They think all congressmen are dishonest and they don’t do anything and congressional staff doesn’t do anything, and that’s just not true. Congressmen work very, very hard.\\n\\n The thing that I think they ought to do is to come up with ways of not giving them so many benefits other than their salary. They should make more money, but they should not have the power to do things that—the lobbyists do things for them. That’s the kind of thing that’s bad, and I think it kind of corrupts.\\n\\n But most congressmen are basically very honest. They want to help their constituents. They work very hard. Staffers work long, long, long hours, much longer than most people."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It seems like you have to have a lot of the answers before the questions are asked."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Well, see, when they had hearings, we wrote all the questions for the members. These members come across looking so smart. It’s the staffers that provide all the questions for them and all the answers so they know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What to expect and not to expect?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Looking back over your career with the government, what was the greatest challenge that you had to meet and overcome in order for you to keep moving along?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00992:160", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.302256982613208, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Well, see, when they had hearings, we wrote all the questions for the members. These members come across looking so smart. It’s the staffers that provide all the questions for them and all the answers so they know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What to expect and not to expect?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Looking back over your career with the government, what was the greatest challenge that you had to meet and overcome in order for you to keep moving along?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I think I’ve already kind of gone over that, and that was sort of the reinvention of myself to convince myself. I mean, maybe reinventing myself isn’t quite the thing, but to change from being just an employee and a wife and a mother—I mean, I worked there for the paycheck, and to make that transition to somebody who was looking for a career, that didn’t happen to me until I was probably close to forty. I think a lot of it was the times. I was forty in—\n\n[19]‘74.\n\n—in 1974. That was when things started changing. So it was a combination of my second wind, if you will, and women getting more opportunities."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you have an opportunity in this second wind to help other women along, or were you so busy in the sense that you didn’t have those types of opportunities because of the stage you were in?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00992:162", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.780285536236898, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Looking back over your career with the government, what was the greatest challenge that you had to meet and overcome in order for you to keep moving along?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I think I’ve already kind of gone over that, and that was sort of the reinvention of myself to convince myself. I mean, maybe reinventing myself isn’t quite the thing, but to change from being just an employee and a wife and a mother—I mean, I worked there for the paycheck, and to make that transition to somebody who was looking for a career, that didn’t happen to me until I was probably close to forty. I think a lot of it was the times. I was forty in—\n\n[19]‘74.\n\n—in 1974. That was when things started changing. So it was a combination of my second wind, if you will, and women getting more opportunities."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you have an opportunity in this second wind to help other women along, or were you so busy in the sense that you didn’t have those types of opportunities because of the stage you were in?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "The only thing I can remember is that we had—and I don’t know who set it up, but we had a meeting. It was not a meeting so much as all these women came. It was in the little auditorium at NASA, and I was one of the speakers. They had me talking about—\n\nIt was a career thing, wasn’t it?\n\nYeah, it was some kind of a career. But other than that, I don’t know of any—"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "At least you’ve been able to watch other women move up—"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00992:164", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.311428373596553, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I think I’ve already kind of gone over that, and that was sort of the reinvention of myself to convince myself. I mean, maybe reinventing myself isn’t quite the thing, but to change from being just an employee and a wife and a mother—I mean, I worked there for the paycheck, and to make that transition to somebody who was looking for a career, that didn’t happen to me until I was probably close to forty. I think a lot of it was the times. I was forty in—\n\n[19]‘74.\n\n—in 1974. That was when things started changing. So it was a combination of my second wind, if you will, and women getting more opportunities."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you have an opportunity in this second wind to help other women along, or were you so busy in the sense that you didn’t have those types of opportunities because of the stage you were in?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "The only thing I can remember is that we had—and I don’t know who set it up, but we had a meeting. It was not a meeting so much as all these women came. It was in the little auditorium at NASA, and I was one of the speakers. They had me talking about—\n\nIt was a career thing, wasn’t it?\n\nYeah, it was some kind of a career. But other than that, I don’t know of any—"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "At least you’ve been able to watch other women move up—"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "—and have opportunities to do all types of work and not just have an application reviewed and marked as a typist because they were female."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00992:168", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.901587081773948, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "The only thing I can remember is that we had—and I don’t know who set it up, but we had a meeting. It was not a meeting so much as all these women came. It was in the little auditorium at NASA, and I was one of the speakers. They had me talking about—\n\nIt was a career thing, wasn’t it?\n\nYeah, it was some kind of a career. But other than that, I don’t know of any—"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "At least you’ve been able to watch other women move up—"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "—and have opportunities to do all types of work and not just have an application reviewed and marked as a typist because they were female."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I’m glad that you’ve been able to watch that happen and see that work as well."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00992:172", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.557318979748831, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "—and have opportunities to do all types of work and not just have an application reviewed and marked as a typist because they were female."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I’m glad that you’ve been able to watch that happen and see that work as well."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I don’t think that would ever happen today."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No, and that’s the good news."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00992:174", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 8.346151467, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I’m glad that you’ve been able to watch that happen and see that work as well."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, I don’t think that would ever happen today."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No, and that’s the good news."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So the doors are open. You’ve done so much, even in your first wind and your second wind phase of your life, but is there something that you feel like you’re the most proudest of while you worked for the government that you’re so glad if nothing else you at least had that opportunity to do that project or that task?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00992:192", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 3.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "[Laughs] You were asking about my first impression. Muroc at that time particularly was very desolate, but I don’t remember being particularly shocked by it.\n\nThat’s because you lived and grew up in Bakersfield. It’s barren anyway."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It was a time to begin."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It was a beginning that you kept growing."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. As I said, I lived in the dormitory with the other women, and I made some good friends there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Had an opportunity to go back in your other part of your career."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00992:201", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And they all said, “Well, how did you get that?” So I had to explain what I did, and they said, “Oh.” The Langley paper was correct.\\n\\n So then later I found out that Roxy apparently had been asked by De, “How is the new computer working out?” or whatever, and she said, “Well, she’d like something more challenging.” So it was clear to me later that it wasn’t that they needed this done. They were convinced they had the right answer. They just gave it to me just to amuse me. [Laughs]"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oops."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Maybe to see what she’d do."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you tested well."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Anyway, I still remember that incident. But the thing that I can remember is De Beeler just totally ignoring me in the office. I was such a scared little bunny at the time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, like you said, you were a woman of those times."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00992:203", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Maybe to see what she’d do."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And you tested well."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Anyway, I still remember that incident. But the thing that I can remember is De Beeler just totally ignoring me in the office. I was such a scared little bunny at the time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, like you said, you were a woman of those times."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You got an opportunity to grow into the woman of the new times."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00992:205", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Anyway, I still remember that incident. But the thing that I can remember is De Beeler just totally ignoring me in the office. I was such a scared little bunny at the time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, like you said, you were a woman of those times."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You got an opportunity to grow into the woman of the new times."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Now you’re enjoying your life in these times."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00992:207", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You got an opportunity to grow into the woman of the new times."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Now you’re enjoying your life in these times."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It’s a good life to look back on."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00992:209", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Now you’re enjoying your life in these times."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It’s a good life to look back on."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It is. It is. I was very fortunate. I feel particularly fortunate because I never felt like I personally chose my career. As I said, I didn’t know what was available, and I did get sort of pushed into something that turned out to be very fulfilling."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I think that’s a good place to stop."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:13", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 18.00396684692653, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, there’s a story—"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "The—crew were very—"}, {"role": "user", "content": "——there’s a story that at one point Gus hung a lemon somewhere, perhaps on the spacecraft, when he was frustrated with one of the tests. And I think that was real frustration. And it was a bit of a condition that was in the program at that time in that Apollo was a big step, a lot of complicated equipment onboard, and it was difficult to make it work first time out. Actually, in a kind of a way that’s sad, the Apollo fire probably contributed to not only the time, but perhaps a renewed sense of attention. And I don’t mean to say that people weren’t paying attention before. But a different kind of attention, perhaps, was applied to the Apollo spacecraft hardware. And it paid off. It paid off in that during the Apollo flights, Earth orbit, and going to the Moon, for the most part—except for Apollo 13—for the most part, the command service module performed extremely well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I’ve heard it said that the Apollo 1 fire, in a very peculiar way, actually had to happen before the Apollo spacecraft and the space program could go ahead. That it was an accident waiting to happen—"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well,—"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "—because nobody really saw that it was there. From an engineer’s point of view, would you go along with that?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:15", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 7, "return_to_go": 20.004407607696145, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "——there’s a story that at one point Gus hung a lemon somewhere, perhaps on the spacecraft, when he was frustrated with one of the tests. And I think that was real frustration. And it was a bit of a condition that was in the program at that time in that Apollo was a big step, a lot of complicated equipment onboard, and it was difficult to make it work first time out. Actually, in a kind of a way that’s sad, the Apollo fire probably contributed to not only the time, but perhaps a renewed sense of attention. And I don’t mean to say that people weren’t paying attention before. But a different kind of attention, perhaps, was applied to the Apollo spacecraft hardware. And it paid off. It paid off in that during the Apollo flights, Earth orbit, and going to the Moon, for the most part—except for Apollo 13—for the most part, the command service module performed extremely well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I’ve heard it said that the Apollo 1 fire, in a very peculiar way, actually had to happen before the Apollo spacecraft and the space program could go ahead. That it was an accident waiting to happen—"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well,—"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "—because nobody really saw that it was there. From an engineer’s point of view, would you go along with that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think—I don’t know that it had to happen for Apollo to go forward. But, it was there; and it was just not paid—it just didn’t pay enough attention to it. I don’t know if I can say “overlooked,” because I’m sure somewhere in the system people paid some attention to it and were concerned about it. But the flammability risk was there and just was not treated as significantly as it—nowhere near as significantly, I don’t think, as a number of the other risks that were inherent in the program."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It took about a year to redesign and rebuild that spacecraft. That’s a remarkably short time, isn’t it?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:17", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 14.449341786329049, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well,—"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "—because nobody really saw that it was there. From an engineer’s point of view, would you go along with that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think—I don’t know that it had to happen for Apollo to go forward. But, it was there; and it was just not paid—it just didn’t pay enough attention to it. I don’t know if I can say “overlooked,” because I’m sure somewhere in the system people paid some attention to it and were concerned about it. But the flammability risk was there and just was not treated as significantly as it—nowhere near as significantly, I don’t think, as a number of the other risks that were inherent in the program."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It took about a year to redesign and rebuild that spacecraft. That’s a remarkably short time, isn’t it?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It really is. When you go back and look at it: January ’67 was the fire, and then in about October of ’68 we flew the Apollo 7 mission. And that included not only an awful lot of redesign, but it also included then getting the—getting that redesign put into the spacecraft and getting the spacecraft ready to fly, shipped to the Cape [Canaveral, Florida], going through the checkout, and so on. So that’s, what? Close to 20 months, 21 months. But the truth is, the redesign was probably done in half that time. And then the rest of the time was spent getting that redesign built into the spacecraft and tested."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there any pressure, other than among yourselves, to get that job done as rapidly as it was done?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:19", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 13, "return_to_go": 16.054824207032276, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think—I don’t know that it had to happen for Apollo to go forward. But, it was there; and it was just not paid—it just didn’t pay enough attention to it. I don’t know if I can say “overlooked,” because I’m sure somewhere in the system people paid some attention to it and were concerned about it. But the flammability risk was there and just was not treated as significantly as it—nowhere near as significantly, I don’t think, as a number of the other risks that were inherent in the program."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It took about a year to redesign and rebuild that spacecraft. That’s a remarkably short time, isn’t it?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It really is. When you go back and look at it: January ’67 was the fire, and then in about October of ’68 we flew the Apollo 7 mission. And that included not only an awful lot of redesign, but it also included then getting the—getting that redesign put into the spacecraft and getting the spacecraft ready to fly, shipped to the Cape [Canaveral, Florida], going through the checkout, and so on. So that’s, what? Close to 20 months, 21 months. But the truth is, the redesign was probably done in half that time. And then the rest of the time was spent getting that redesign built into the spacecraft and tested."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was there any pressure, other than among yourselves, to get that job done as rapidly as it was done?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "The recovery from the fire that is?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yeah. To get that spacecraft redesigned, redeveloped, built?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:27", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.656034456686898, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "We, the media, tended to downplay that somewhat. We kept it up, of course; but basically we didn’t know that much about what the Russians were doing anyway."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That’s true."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "They’d just do something, and we knew what was going on here. So we, to a great degree, tended to say, “Okay, NASA’s doing this,” and ignore what the Russians were doing. Until they had done it."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When, of course, is a bad time to have big news come to the fore. They went through, however, the failure of their big booster. They lost not one but two crews during a key period of time."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:29", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.1733716185409975, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That’s true."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "They’d just do something, and we knew what was going on here. So we, to a great degree, tended to say, “Okay, NASA’s doing this,” and ignore what the Russians were doing. Until they had done it."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When, of course, is a bad time to have big news come to the fore. They went through, however, the failure of their big booster. They lost not one but two crews during a key period of time."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And there were decisions, which I’d like to get to in a couple of minutes, made by NASA, which generated the resurgence of the Apollo Program—"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:31", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.748190687267774, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When, of course, is a bad time to have big news come to the fore. They went through, however, the failure of their big booster. They lost not one but two crews during a key period of time."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And there were decisions, which I’d like to get to in a couple of minutes, made by NASA, which generated the resurgence of the Apollo Program—"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "—and eventually—you won the race."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:33", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 6.386878541408638, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And there were decisions, which I’d like to get to in a couple of minutes, made by NASA, which generated the resurgence of the Apollo Program—"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "—and eventually—you won the race."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So, let’s get to that; and, as we move along—."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:35", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.985420601565154, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "—and eventually—you won the race."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So, let’s get to that; and, as we move along—."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I think it was real. We felt it, and we were in the same boat that you were. We were not privy, most of the folks here were not privy, to any intelligence briefings as to what was going on. If indeed there even were some, and I have heard that there had been but I don’t—I can’t attest to that. But we had this sense of a big competitor who was continuing to do things; and sometimes they did things which seemed to us were a little hard to figure out, why they did them and so on. But nevertheless, they were continuing to press it. And we felt very much like we were in a race, a competition. And our competitor had the advantage of being somewhat shrouded in secrecy. That’s also a disadvantage, we’ve come to learn. But that left us always feeling like he was ahead of us or breathing down our neck if we were ahead at any particular time. So, there was not a leeway, not any slack, in the sense of feeling any relief in that competition. It was there all the time. And I don’t know that it was the first thing people thought of when they woke up in the morning, but it was an environmental background for us; and it was very real."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Against that background, along came Apollo 7. And here came Commander Walter M. [\"Wally\"]…Schirra along with his crew. And they started getting the spacecraft prepared. You were lead flight director for that mission."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:37", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 6.650467335072393, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So, let’s get to that; and, as we move along—."}, {"role": "user", "content": "And I think it was real. We felt it, and we were in the same boat that you were. We were not privy, most of the folks here were not privy, to any intelligence briefings as to what was going on. If indeed there even were some, and I have heard that there had been but I don’t—I can’t attest to that. But we had this sense of a big competitor who was continuing to do things; and sometimes they did things which seemed to us were a little hard to figure out, why they did them and so on. But nevertheless, they were continuing to press it. And we felt very much like we were in a race, a competition. And our competitor had the advantage of being somewhat shrouded in secrecy. That’s also a disadvantage, we’ve come to learn. But that left us always feeling like he was ahead of us or breathing down our neck if we were ahead at any particular time. So, there was not a leeway, not any slack, in the sense of feeling any relief in that competition. It was there all the time. And I don’t know that it was the first thing people thought of when they woke up in the morning, but it was an environmental background for us; and it was very real."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Against that background, along came Apollo 7. And here came Commander Walter M. [\"Wally\"]…Schirra along with his crew. And they started getting the spacecraft prepared. You were lead flight director for that mission."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I was."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So, can we relive some of the preparation stage, right now, before the launch? Living through that phase when Wally was working with the spacecraft, and his crew were working with the spacecraft? And what you and your flight directors were doing with Mission Control to make it all happen?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:45", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.088046540271898, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well—"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Would that be a fair statement or not?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "——well, I think—I mean, I think it’s fair to say that everybody—safety is everybody’s problem. And I think, in the flight business especially, people know that going in. I think the accident, though, the fire, caused the crews to be more vocal about concerns that they might have had in—prior to the fire but not as—expressed as—perhaps as strongly as they would have expressed them afterwards. So, I think the program saw a rededication, also, and a—more of an inclination to be vocal about things that the crews would view as a safety concern.\\n\\n So, I think it was there all along. I mean, I think both the people on the ground, the engineering teams, the designers, the safety and reliability people, all tried to do the best they could at—before, and during, and afterwards. And I think what we saw, also, was that the crew became more vocal and more willing to jump into a subject and rattle it around in order to be sure that they were satisfied. But they didn’t—frankly, that’s a very healthy thing. I mean to experience."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Some of that took place during the flight."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "On open air-to-ground."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:47", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.875607266968775, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "——well, I think—I mean, I think it’s fair to say that everybody—safety is everybody’s problem. And I think, in the flight business especially, people know that going in. I think the accident, though, the fire, caused the crews to be more vocal about concerns that they might have had in—prior to the fire but not as—expressed as—perhaps as strongly as they would have expressed them afterwards. So, I think the program saw a rededication, also, and a—more of an inclination to be vocal about things that the crews would view as a safety concern.\\n\\n So, I think it was there all along. I mean, I think both the people on the ground, the engineering teams, the designers, the safety and reliability people, all tried to do the best they could at—before, and during, and afterwards. And I think what we saw, also, was that the crew became more vocal and more willing to jump into a subject and rattle it around in order to be sure that they were satisfied. But they didn’t—frankly, that’s a very healthy thing. I mean to experience."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Some of that took place during the flight."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "On open air-to-ground."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So, the world shared your problem, as the flight director—"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:49", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 8.750674741076416, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "On open air-to-ground."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So, the world shared your problem, as the flight director—"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "—with the crew as you were wrangling these problems back and forth."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:51", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 9.722971934529351, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So, the world shared your problem, as the flight director—"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "—with the crew as you were wrangling these problems back and forth."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And I wonder what effect, if any, that had on the way in which that flight was flown."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:53", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 10.803302149477057, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "—with the crew as you were wrangling these problems back and forth."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And I wonder what effect, if any, that had on the way in which that flight was flown."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I don’t—in the end, I don’t think it had any effect on the flight itself in terms of the accomplishments and what we were trying to do. I think it was unfortunate in that it left a kind of a sour taste in people’s mouth. And certainly—certainly there’s a way to make a point, especially when you’re in public—or, in this case, in front of the whole world—there’s a way to make a point that’s less confrontational than some of the means that were chosen. But, you know, we are who we are, and we do what we think we have to do at the time. And, so I’ve sort of mellowed about it a little bit. But it was difficult at the time.\\n\\n Didn’t affect the mission. Didn’t affect what we were trying to do, I don’t believe. But it was an irritant. It was more than an irritant. It was a major annoyance and difficulty, and I mean it’s like a marriage. When people get to shouting at each other, then the communications is really not what it ought to be and something is going to suffer for that, one way or another. In our case, none of the mission parameters suffered. But there was a kind of an emotional feeling to it that was unfortunate."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "The fact the crew had a bad cold—all of them, collectively—had something to do with that, too, didn’t it?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:55", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 12.003669054974507, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And I wonder what effect, if any, that had on the way in which that flight was flown."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I don’t—in the end, I don’t think it had any effect on the flight itself in terms of the accomplishments and what we were trying to do. I think it was unfortunate in that it left a kind of a sour taste in people’s mouth. And certainly—certainly there’s a way to make a point, especially when you’re in public—or, in this case, in front of the whole world—there’s a way to make a point that’s less confrontational than some of the means that were chosen. But, you know, we are who we are, and we do what we think we have to do at the time. And, so I’ve sort of mellowed about it a little bit. But it was difficult at the time.\\n\\n Didn’t affect the mission. Didn’t affect what we were trying to do, I don’t believe. But it was an irritant. It was more than an irritant. It was a major annoyance and difficulty, and I mean it’s like a marriage. When people get to shouting at each other, then the communications is really not what it ought to be and something is going to suffer for that, one way or another. In our case, none of the mission parameters suffered. But there was a kind of an emotional feeling to it that was unfortunate."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "The fact the crew had a bad cold—all of them, collectively—had something to do with that, too, didn’t it?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, it probably did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You had some of that here in Mission Control, I’ve heard."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:57", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 13.337410061082785, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I don’t—in the end, I don’t think it had any effect on the flight itself in terms of the accomplishments and what we were trying to do. I think it was unfortunate in that it left a kind of a sour taste in people’s mouth. And certainly—certainly there’s a way to make a point, especially when you’re in public—or, in this case, in front of the whole world—there’s a way to make a point that’s less confrontational than some of the means that were chosen. But, you know, we are who we are, and we do what we think we have to do at the time. And, so I’ve sort of mellowed about it a little bit. But it was difficult at the time.\\n\\n Didn’t affect the mission. Didn’t affect what we were trying to do, I don’t believe. But it was an irritant. It was more than an irritant. It was a major annoyance and difficulty, and I mean it’s like a marriage. When people get to shouting at each other, then the communications is really not what it ought to be and something is going to suffer for that, one way or another. In our case, none of the mission parameters suffered. But there was a kind of an emotional feeling to it that was unfortunate."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "The fact the crew had a bad cold—all of them, collectively—had something to do with that, too, didn’t it?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, it probably did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You had some of that here in Mission Control, I’ve heard."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Probably did. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Some of your flight controllers had caught the same bug at about the same time."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:59", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 14.819344512314206, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah, it probably did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You had some of that here in Mission Control, I’ve heard."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Probably did. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Some of your flight controllers had caught the same bug at about the same time."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Well, that was an effect, I think, that caused them to be upset. So—."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you learn anything from those problems that affected future missions and the ways in which they were trained, simulated?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:61", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 14.243716124793561, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Probably did. Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Some of your flight controllers had caught the same bug at about the same time."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Well, that was an effect, I think, that caused them to be upset. So—."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you learn anything from those problems that affected future missions and the ways in which they were trained, simulated?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don’t think we did anything in a procedural sense to change anything. But if Apollo 7 could be viewed as a kind of a schism that was opened up between the air crews and the ground crews, I think the follow-on crews, starting with Apollo 8 and then on, fixed that problem by their performance and the way in which they cooperated with it all around—both prior to flights and during flights and so. So—and I think that got healed on the next flight, for example. And most of them felt like this was too important to let emotional baggage be a problem of any kind. We had to depend too much on each other; and, therefore, they worked very hard, I think. And, I mean, you followed the other flights, the follow-on flights. And the performance of the crews and the interaction with the ground was exactly as it had been in the past. So, in that sense, Apollo 7 was a bit of an anomaly on the front of the interaction between the ground and the air crews."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, your next commander was [James A.] McDivitt."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:63", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 15.826351249770623, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Well, that was an effect, I think, that caused them to be upset. So—."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you learn anything from those problems that affected future missions and the ways in which they were trained, simulated?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don’t think we did anything in a procedural sense to change anything. But if Apollo 7 could be viewed as a kind of a schism that was opened up between the air crews and the ground crews, I think the follow-on crews, starting with Apollo 8 and then on, fixed that problem by their performance and the way in which they cooperated with it all around—both prior to flights and during flights and so. So—and I think that got healed on the next flight, for example. And most of them felt like this was too important to let emotional baggage be a problem of any kind. We had to depend too much on each other; and, therefore, they worked very hard, I think. And, I mean, you followed the other flights, the follow-on flights. And the performance of the crews and the interaction with the ground was exactly as it had been in the past. So, in that sense, Apollo 7 was a bit of an anomaly on the front of the interaction between the ground and the air crews."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, your next commander was [James A.] McDivitt."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it was—"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No, it wasn’t."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:65", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 16.473723610856247, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don’t think we did anything in a procedural sense to change anything. But if Apollo 7 could be viewed as a kind of a schism that was opened up between the air crews and the ground crews, I think the follow-on crews, starting with Apollo 8 and then on, fixed that problem by their performance and the way in which they cooperated with it all around—both prior to flights and during flights and so. So—and I think that got healed on the next flight, for example. And most of them felt like this was too important to let emotional baggage be a problem of any kind. We had to depend too much on each other; and, therefore, they worked very hard, I think. And, I mean, you followed the other flights, the follow-on flights. And the performance of the crews and the interaction with the ground was exactly as it had been in the past. So, in that sense, Apollo 7 was a bit of an anomaly on the front of the interaction between the ground and the air crews."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, your next commander was [James A.] McDivitt."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it was—"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No, it wasn’t."}, {"role": "user", "content": "——it was Frank [Borman]."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "The next was up to the Moon."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:67", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 17.19302623428472, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it was—"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "No, it wasn’t."}, {"role": "user", "content": "——it was Frank [Borman]."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "The next was up to the Moon."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Frank Borman."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Perhaps the most daring choice of them all."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:69", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 19.103362482538575, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "——it was Frank [Borman]."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "The next was up to the Moon."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Frank Borman."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Perhaps the most daring choice of them all."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Let me—let me get into that—"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:71", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 21.22595831393175, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Frank Borman."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Perhaps the most daring choice of them all."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Let me—let me get into that—"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "—then, because now—now we are into a real ballgame. Here you had just had this troublesome flight, but it worked perfectly."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:73", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 23.58439812659083, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Let me—let me get into that—"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "—then, because now—now we are into a real ballgame. Here you had just had this troublesome flight, but it worked perfectly."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "As a matter of fact, I think Wally Schirra said, “We were 110% successful.”"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:77", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 13, "return_to_go": 29.116540897025715, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "As a matter of fact, I think Wally Schirra said, “We were 110% successful.”"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think we quoted that after the flight."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think we did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So, now you’ve had this tremendously successful event. And at that point, can you scene set as to the way in which the decision was made on Apollo 8 to go to the Moon, and the influencing factors?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:89", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 7, "return_to_go": 26.043231322057785, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "—and the practical side of the house, which you’ve just explained very carefully as being a thoroughly practical mission, even though it seemed like a daring gamble at the time."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Very. Well, that’s why I think—I call it “a stroke of genius,” which to me usually means someone comes up with a solution that really fixes a whole bunch of problems that everybody’s worried about but they didn’t know how to put it together and come to the solution. The solution came as the right answer to the conditions that existed within the Apollo Program. Now, I have heard and read various accounts, and maybe speculation, that there was some intelligence information about what the Soviets were doing that might’ve played a part in that decision. I have no knowledge—no personal knowledge of that and I don’t know whether that was true or not. Nobody ever explained it to me, which was fine. I didn’t necessarily feel like I needed to know that kind of stuff.\\n\\n But just on its merits, within the program, it was almost immediately embraced by people after, you know, an initial reaction. Embraced in the sense that, “Boy, that seems like the right answer! Why didn’t I think of that? It just fits everything that we have, solves it, and takes us a great big step forward! Rather than just tooling around and around in some other kind of a mission, it goes out and addresses a whole bunch of problems that we’re going to have to learn how to solve and deal with before we ever do get to land.” So, that was a—I think it was a breakthrough, genius class of decision."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right now, Glynn, we’re sitting in a room that’s filled with ghosts and memories. And I imagine one of the memories that’s contained within this room that must be still in your mind would be the thought as first that spacecraft came around from the far side of the Moon."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Can you go through that for us?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:101", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 13.817585248518238, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Lots of room up there, yeah. And—but it was our first tripping over it in flight, especially when the crew called down and asked us to pay some special attention to what’s on the recorder. And the fact that they reported it indicated that it was significant to them. And so, off we went beginning to learn that, indeed, some of these things could happen to even our most fearless, toughest fighter pilots that we could find."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That’s what’s really amazing, that—"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "—they’re pilots!"}, {"role": "user", "content": "And of course, they were. And—but it shows the human body can be affected by things, and we’re all subject to some of that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Along then after this marvelous and spectacular mission came Apollo 9. And essentially, this one was terribly important within the framework of Apollo. But to the public at large, it was almost ignored. It was a very quiet mission."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:111", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 18.82772824013656, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I—"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You weren’t working the mission."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don’t relate to that, so I don’t—I mean I don’t have a sense of anything that would address that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh okay. Well, let’s—let’s move on then—"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "—perhaps rightly so, to Apollo 10 where you had a very strong commander and a very strong crew. And basically, you were going in for a full dress rehearsal of the real thing."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:113", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 5, "return_to_go": 20.919698044596178, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don’t relate to that, so I don’t—I mean I don’t have a sense of anything that would address that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh okay. Well, let’s—let’s move on then—"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "—perhaps rightly so, to Apollo 10 where you had a very strong commander and a very strong crew. And basically, you were going in for a full dress rehearsal of the real thing."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Where were you for Apollo 10?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:115", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 17.688553382884642, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Okay."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "—perhaps rightly so, to Apollo 10 where you had a very strong commander and a very strong crew. And basically, you were going in for a full dress rehearsal of the real thing."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Where were you for Apollo 10?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was the lead flight director for Apollo 10. I had worked Apollo 7 as lead and Apollo 8 as a shift guy, and skipped 9, and then I was working Apollo 10. And what was interesting for me was that I had worked as the lead flight director for Gemini IX—Tom [Thomas P.] Stafford and Gene [Eugene A.] Cernan. And, of course, John [W.] Young was added to the Apollo 10 crew, with the three-man command module. So, I was involved in all of the planning for the Apollo 10 mission. We had the debates that you could expect like, “Well, if we’re going all the way there, why don’t we go ahead and land?” But it basically became a—kind of a, “How much of this rascal do you want to try to bite off at a time?” kind of a discussion.\\n\\n And the descent itself and then the EVA [extravehicular activity]—the surface work—was a significant addition to all of the other things we were trying to do with the lunar module in the Apollo 10 mission, which involved all of the navigation, guidance work around the Moon, and then conducting the rendezvous exercises to be sure that that worked in the lunar environment the way we expected it to, too. So in retrospect, you know, it was the correct thing to do. But we had some debates early on about, “Well, why don’t we go all the way on Apollo 10?”"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Why didn’t you?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:123", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 23.911832621375765, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yeah."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "They were even using some language that was a little unusual for astronauts."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. It was unusual, yes. But it—you know, that was just a reflection of the fact that they were completely surprised. And I can’t remember the exact details of it, but I think what happened is: they either switched into—they probably—I think they switched into a mode that had been set up to do something that they were not expecting. It was set up to go someplace else in terms of the attitude of the vehicle. This was not affecting the trajectory of the vehicle in any way. It was affecting the attitude of the vehicle as it coasted around in lunar orbit. And they switched into this system that they thought was going to do this, and it turned out doing that. And it surprised them quite a bit. But they rather quickly got the vehicle back under control. You know, a good reaction on the part of the crew. Certainly not the—the spinning of the vehicle was not something that you wanted to propagate very long, or that in itself can induce some physical problems for people—including blacking out. But, they caught it pretty quickly and got it back under control; and we were fine."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "From the standpoint of world at large, too, we were looking over your shoulder on that mission. And for the first time, we were getting literally hours and hours of color television."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "They shared that whole mission with us."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:125", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 26.56870291263974, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. It was unusual, yes. But it—you know, that was just a reflection of the fact that they were completely surprised. And I can’t remember the exact details of it, but I think what happened is: they either switched into—they probably—I think they switched into a mode that had been set up to do something that they were not expecting. It was set up to go someplace else in terms of the attitude of the vehicle. This was not affecting the trajectory of the vehicle in any way. It was affecting the attitude of the vehicle as it coasted around in lunar orbit. And they switched into this system that they thought was going to do this, and it turned out doing that. And it surprised them quite a bit. But they rather quickly got the vehicle back under control. You know, a good reaction on the part of the crew. Certainly not the—the spinning of the vehicle was not something that you wanted to propagate very long, or that in itself can induce some physical problems for people—including blacking out. But, they caught it pretty quickly and got it back under control; and we were fine."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "From the standpoint of world at large, too, we were looking over your shoulder on that mission. And for the first time, we were getting literally hours and hours of color television."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "They shared that whole mission with us."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mainly because Stafford and Cernan felt that they should."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:127", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 5, "return_to_go": 29.520781014044154, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "They shared that whole mission with us."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Mainly because Stafford and Cernan felt that they should."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "But did that mean anything to you here in Mission Control?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:135", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 36.138974263136944, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Apollo 10 really was the first pioneering effort on the part of a crew to deliver to Mission Control, and through Mission Control to the world at large the television that we saw."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Yes. I would say that probably all the crews, if they—if the right timing and the right circumstances, would have stepped up to that. But in this case, Gene and Tom were naturals for it. I mean, they had a strong desire to make that available, to share it in effect. But share it for more than just sharing purposes. It actually was of help to us in the Control Center. And to provide that and to support that. Because sometimes the initial arguments about getting a television onboard the spacecraft were somewhat heated. Some people didn’t want to do it at all. And once we started using it, it was hard to imagine getting along without it. Right? It was hard to imagine that. “Why could—why have we waited to so long? Why have we waited so long to get these cameras onboard? We can see what’s going on!”\\n\\n And today the—the folks use it—use them in a very interactive way in terms of diagnostics, troubleshooting, etc. It’s even gotten to the point where they have a digital still camera that they can show very high accurate—high-definition pictures of. And all of that stuff is a tremendous assistance. As a matter of fact, today, when you envision the Space Station, and something that large with crews doing things with it—EVA or otherwise—the television is just going to make it so much easier for the ground controllers to know what the crews are doing and to appreciate it. And for them to contribute to whatever the crews are trying to do at a given point."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Now when you say EVA, in the time of Apollo an EVA was a walk on the Moon."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And I think we’re about ready for that right now as we’re coming up on Apollo 11."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:137", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 15, "return_to_go": 39.043304736818826, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Yes. I would say that probably all the crews, if they—if the right timing and the right circumstances, would have stepped up to that. But in this case, Gene and Tom were naturals for it. I mean, they had a strong desire to make that available, to share it in effect. But share it for more than just sharing purposes. It actually was of help to us in the Control Center. And to provide that and to support that. Because sometimes the initial arguments about getting a television onboard the spacecraft were somewhat heated. Some people didn’t want to do it at all. And once we started using it, it was hard to imagine getting along without it. Right? It was hard to imagine that. “Why could—why have we waited to so long? Why have we waited so long to get these cameras onboard? We can see what’s going on!”\\n\\n And today the—the folks use it—use them in a very interactive way in terms of diagnostics, troubleshooting, etc. It’s even gotten to the point where they have a digital still camera that they can show very high accurate—high-definition pictures of. And all of that stuff is a tremendous assistance. As a matter of fact, today, when you envision the Space Station, and something that large with crews doing things with it—EVA or otherwise—the television is just going to make it so much easier for the ground controllers to know what the crews are doing and to appreciate it. And for them to contribute to whatever the crews are trying to do at a given point."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Now when you say EVA, in the time of Apollo an EVA was a walk on the Moon."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And I think we’re about ready for that right now as we’re coming up on Apollo 11."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Apollo 11."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So, here we go. What is your memory of that flight?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:157", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 23.354420578695304, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, anyway, you know, it kind of went on to watch how things were going. And just went nominal. The crews had a great time, you know. The—Pete and Alan Bean bouncing around on the Moon, they had a wonderful time visiting that Surveyor, taking some—"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "They brought pieces of it back."}, {"role": "user", "content": "——some pieces of it back. Cutting them off and bringing them back proved that we could, indeed, land at a particular point. So, that set the basis for the scientific planning for the traverses that was in work and was going to be accentuated over the next couple of missions. And came back, and essentially had a fairly normal flight from their point of view of all the standard phases that we worry about. But landing by the Surveyor was done. And it was a set of techniques that had been developed to help these planners, that would, you know, convert it into things that we could actually do with ourselves and with the ground crew—with the air crews and—and get the vehicle knowing where it was and where it wanted to go, and get there properly. So, it worked fine and set us up for the later lunar exploration missions."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Set you up, also, for what was going to happen next, which we’ve covered in a prior interview. Set you up for Apollo 13."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Apollo 13."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Because by the time 12 had come and gone, you’d been through two lunar missions that had been very successful."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:159", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 25.949356198550337, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "——some pieces of it back. Cutting them off and bringing them back proved that we could, indeed, land at a particular point. So, that set the basis for the scientific planning for the traverses that was in work and was going to be accentuated over the next couple of missions. And came back, and essentially had a fairly normal flight from their point of view of all the standard phases that we worry about. But landing by the Surveyor was done. And it was a set of techniques that had been developed to help these planners, that would, you know, convert it into things that we could actually do with ourselves and with the ground crew—with the air crews and—and get the vehicle knowing where it was and where it wanted to go, and get there properly. So, it worked fine and set us up for the later lunar exploration missions."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Set you up, also, for what was going to happen next, which we’ve covered in a prior interview. Set you up for Apollo 13."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Apollo 13."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Because by the time 12 had come and gone, you’d been through two lunar missions that had been very successful."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right, right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So, it was—it somewhat took people here by surprise when 13 ran into trouble, didn’t it?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:161", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 28.832617998389264, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Apollo 13."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Because by the time 12 had come and gone, you’d been through two lunar missions that had been very successful."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right, right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "So, it was—it somewhat took people here by surprise when 13 ran into trouble, didn’t it?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh! Well, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "To say the least."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:165", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 35.59582468936946, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh! Well, yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "To say the least."}, {"role": "user", "content": "To say the least. Not only that, certainly the extent of the trouble—"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "user", "content": "—how it played itself out. But, you know. Yes, it was quite a shock to all of us. And this had been a lot of—there was a lot of talk about how the coverage of the Apollo flights had decreased over time. And there was a noticeable drop off in the coverage that went with Apollo 13."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You’re talking the television, the media."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:175", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 39.790385424595605, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. I gather that there was a set of things that occurred in terms of the crew assignments that could have been the case."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Probably just as well it worked out the way that it did."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Probably. But again, as I said, to me the crews were relatively interchangeable. I think either crew could’ve ended up with either mission, and it would’ve come out about the same."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "As you moved into Apollo 15, however, here was a different matter. Now you began seeing the science side of the house exercising itself."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Dave [David R.] Scott was the commander."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:177", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 8, "return_to_go": 41.98931713843956, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Probably. But again, as I said, to me the crews were relatively interchangeable. I think either crew could’ve ended up with either mission, and it would’ve come out about the same."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "As you moved into Apollo 15, however, here was a different matter. Now you began seeing the science side of the house exercising itself."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Dave [David R.] Scott was the commander."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Dave Scott and Jim [James] Irwin and—"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Al [Alfred M.] Worden."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00382:195", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 42.53081281521885, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh very."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "—of handling the media."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Very good. Very good at that—"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Of course, being the Russian commander."}, {"role": "user", "content": "——very good at that, and I would say in other things. Very good at being a capitalist probably. And probably in America would have been a gangbusters capitalist. But that’s an accident of where we’re born, you know, and we don’t have a heck of a lot that we can say or do about that. We just are born in one place or another; and actually for me, having spent years dealing with people there, ultimately, you know, on a fairly personal basis, where you get to know people pretty well and their families and so on, they became human beings for me. Not stereotypes. And you know, today, I’ve been struck with, because of the difficulties that the—that Russia is going through—economic difficulties—that reflects itself in so much hardship on their people, an awful lot of people over there are suffering because of some decisions and actions that people took 75, 85 years ago and played out through history. And it’s just amazing how many hundreds of millions of people, in that country alone, have been affected, adversely now, by bad decisions, bad implementation, and so on. And I feel for them. I mean, I feel sorry for them. No fault of their own.\\n\\n They were born where they were born. They did the best they could, probably, or tried to survive in—with the rules of the game as they were laid out for them. Like filling out your IRS [internal revenue service] forms. I mean, we don’t make them, we just have to comply with them. And, you know, most of them are in the same condition. And they’re just trying to take care of themselves and raise their families and so on. And—difficult for them. I mean, they’re in a difficult situation, and it’s going to take them a long time to recover from it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "As you moved into that arena, for the first time you really had an opportunity to study the Russian hardware—"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00823:17", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 67.69691960094917, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No. The only thing I really remember about Hubble is I know that there were some issues about—because this was being part of the Management Council and hearing what the various organizations were talking about. There were issues about the specifications and the tradeoffs between spacecraft versus instrument, and payload versus shuttle. Goddard was doing a lot of the instruments. The spacecraft was being done by [NASA] Marshall [Space Flight Center, Huntsville, Alabama].\\n\\n There was a fair amount of inter-center rivalry going on there, and there also was a manned versus unmanned space rivalry, that I am confident still exists. And so you’d hear things like that, about how, “Are these requirements that the Shuttle Program is now putting on?” All of a sudden they’d come up with new—according to the people I was talking to, which were the Goddard ones, they’d say all of a sudden they would get these new sets of requirements from the Shuttle Program about vibration or this or that or something, which would make them go back a long way and start requalifying and doing a whole bunch of stuff. And they just were very unhappy, from time to time, over that. But I don’t think there were any big legal things that I remember. It’s just something that I remember was a very active topic of discussion around the Center when I was there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Also during that time, the Solar Max [satellite] repair mission took place."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. I do remember that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were there any issues related to that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I remember when the mission took place, and I remember all the presentations and the results. I honestly don’t recall. That’s a long time ago. That has to have been, what, eighteen years ago."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It’s been a while."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00823:19", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 74.10768844549908, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. I do remember that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were there any issues related to that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I remember when the mission took place, and I remember all the presentations and the results. I honestly don’t recall. That’s a long time ago. That has to have been, what, eighteen years ago."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It’s been a while."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, because I left in October of [19]’85."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you feel like your aerospace background, as far as being an engineer, helped you in that position?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00823:87", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 19.514000714344306, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "[Typing on computer keyboard.] I don’t know if I spelled embassy right. Yes, lunar embassy world headquarters."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Maybe it should be loony embassy."}, {"role": "user", "content": "[Reading] Buy yourself some space."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Goodness."}, {"role": "user", "content": "[Reading] Christmas orders. Get your Christmas order in soon. Christmas is nearly upon us. Don’t worry if you’re late in ordering. At the end of our—or to make it available to you, register to receive this."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "This would be interesting if people start putting in prior claims and then they—"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00823:93", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 21.692730746700004, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Absolutely. Christmas orders. Let’s see. What’s this all about? It’s just bizarre. Here’s the latest news. Look at pictures, latest news. But anyway, quick buy. I’ve got to do that one. It says copyright to 1980, so it’s been around for a while."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Goodness gracious."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Okay. [Reads] Register. Archive for fifteen bucks. Lunar properties, an acre, 19.99. Prime lunar properties with a deed with your name printed on it, as opposed to being without it, is 22.49. Yes, it’s just crazy. I mean, I guess there’s no reason you can’t do that, because there’s—here’s prime view Martian properties are also 22—same price."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Same price."}, {"role": "user", "content": "You can get an atmosphere for the same price, just a thin atmosphere. So, at least one of them will also go and, like I said, you can buy stars or the entire asteroid belt or something. It’s crazy. But they’re just saying—they’re wrong. That’s all I can tell you. Or if they’re not wrong, it doesn’t matter."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You talked about what you felt was your significant accomplishment. What do you think was the most challenging point of your career with NASA?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00823:95", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 24.103034163000004, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Okay. [Reads] Register. Archive for fifteen bucks. Lunar properties, an acre, 19.99. Prime lunar properties with a deed with your name printed on it, as opposed to being without it, is 22.49. Yes, it’s just crazy. I mean, I guess there’s no reason you can’t do that, because there’s—here’s prime view Martian properties are also 22—same price."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Same price."}, {"role": "user", "content": "You can get an atmosphere for the same price, just a thin atmosphere. So, at least one of them will also go and, like I said, you can buy stars or the entire asteroid belt or something. It’s crazy. But they’re just saying—they’re wrong. That’s all I can tell you. Or if they’re not wrong, it doesn’t matter."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You talked about what you felt was your significant accomplishment. What do you think was the most challenging point of your career with NASA?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Challenging in which way?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Challenging to you personally."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00823:97", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 26.781149070000005, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "You can get an atmosphere for the same price, just a thin atmosphere. So, at least one of them will also go and, like I said, you can buy stars or the entire asteroid belt or something. It’s crazy. But they’re just saying—they’re wrong. That’s all I can tell you. Or if they’re not wrong, it doesn’t matter."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "You talked about what you felt was your significant accomplishment. What do you think was the most challenging point of your career with NASA?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Challenging in which way?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Challenging to you personally."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Getting through the Challenger accident. Getting through the Challenger accident. There’s no doubt about it. That was awful, personally. Professionally it was fine. I did okay as a lawyer. But so many people that you knew so well. It was just so hostile and for so long, that that was really, really hard. I think that would clearly be the time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Have you been involved in any of the work relating to the Columbia disaster, as a consultant?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00823:99", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 29.756832300000006, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Challenging in which way?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Challenging to you personally."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Getting through the Challenger accident. Getting through the Challenger accident. There’s no doubt about it. That was awful, personally. Professionally it was fine. I did okay as a lawyer. But so many people that you knew so well. It was just so hostile and for so long, that that was really, really hard. I think that would clearly be the time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Have you been involved in any of the work relating to the Columbia disaster, as a consultant?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Very little. No, very little. I’ve gotten a couple of phone calls asking about what do I remember about this or that. A couple of reporters have called me. I was very happy I wasn’t there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I would imagine."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00823:101", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 33.06314700000001, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Getting through the Challenger accident. Getting through the Challenger accident. There’s no doubt about it. That was awful, personally. Professionally it was fine. I did okay as a lawyer. But so many people that you knew so well. It was just so hostile and for so long, that that was really, really hard. I think that would clearly be the time."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Have you been involved in any of the work relating to the Columbia disaster, as a consultant?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Very little. No, very little. I’ve gotten a couple of phone calls asking about what do I remember about this or that. A couple of reporters have called me. I was very happy I wasn’t there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I would imagine."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Couldn’t have done a—I could have, but I wouldn’t have wanted to do a second one. I don’t want anyone to ever have to do a third one. But it was just not—"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you think NASA was better prepared for this event than they were for the Challenger, legally?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00823:103", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 36.736830000000005, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Very little. No, very little. I’ve gotten a couple of phone calls asking about what do I remember about this or that. A couple of reporters have called me. I was very happy I wasn’t there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I would imagine."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Couldn’t have done a—I could have, but I wouldn’t have wanted to do a second one. I don’t want anyone to ever have to do a third one. But it was just not—"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you think NASA was better prepared for this event than they were for the Challenger, legally?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Legally? No, I don’t think so. I think they were legally just about the same place. The problem—the thing is, not the problem; the thing is it was no longer an unimaginable event, and so it got a moderate amount of attention, but nothing like Challenger did; just nothing like Challenger did, which I’m glad for the people who had to live through it. Not saying that this has been good, because it certainly hasn’t, and they’re not through with it yet and I think there’s still more hearings coming up and all that. And who knows what’s going to happen to the Shuttle system.\\n\\n But you didn’t have the accusations of criminality and the moral stuff, and the stuff that was really heart-wrenching, other than, obviously—and please don’t make it sound like I’m not saying that it wasn’t heart-wrenching to see what happened to the families and the people and those—and they’re wonderful people who died, and all that. But the extra stuff that was going on that was sort of the extracurricular stuff out of Challenger was much, much greater.\\n\\n I think that part of it’s just it’s the second one, and I think the country has become more inured and are probably a little harder now, and less empathetic. You know, whatever. I don’t know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When you decided to retire from NASA, you had been in the General Counsel position longer than anyone else."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00823:105", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 10, "return_to_go": 40.81870000000001, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Couldn’t have done a—I could have, but I wouldn’t have wanted to do a second one. I don’t want anyone to ever have to do a third one. But it was just not—"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you think NASA was better prepared for this event than they were for the Challenger, legally?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Legally? No, I don’t think so. I think they were legally just about the same place. The problem—the thing is, not the problem; the thing is it was no longer an unimaginable event, and so it got a moderate amount of attention, but nothing like Challenger did; just nothing like Challenger did, which I’m glad for the people who had to live through it. Not saying that this has been good, because it certainly hasn’t, and they’re not through with it yet and I think there’s still more hearings coming up and all that. And who knows what’s going to happen to the Shuttle system.\\n\\n But you didn’t have the accusations of criminality and the moral stuff, and the stuff that was really heart-wrenching, other than, obviously—and please don’t make it sound like I’m not saying that it wasn’t heart-wrenching to see what happened to the families and the people and those—and they’re wonderful people who died, and all that. But the extra stuff that was going on that was sort of the extracurricular stuff out of Challenger was much, much greater.\\n\\n I think that part of it’s just it’s the second one, and I think the country has become more inured and are probably a little harder now, and less empathetic. You know, whatever. I don’t know."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "When you decided to retire from NASA, you had been in the General Counsel position longer than anyone else."}, {"role": "user", "content": "By quite a bit."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What brought about your decision to retire when you did?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:1", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 10.748472911475424, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's fine with me."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "All right. Could you start out with talking about your career more broadly speaking? Do you mind giving an overview of your career at the National Archives?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I went to the center in 1964, and I was a file clerk at that time. And then I became the supervisor of a file unit in 1965. And from there I went to different things. I went to the Accession unit downstairs, where we accessioned records into the center. And from there I went to the mailroom. I was supervisor of the mailroom then. And then from there, I went to the chief of the Army correspondence section. And I retired from there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. It sounds like you wore a lot of different hats throughout your career."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How many years in total did you work for the National Archives?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:3", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 10.831636568306028, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I went to the center in 1964, and I was a file clerk at that time. And then I became the supervisor of a file unit in 1965. And from there I went to different things. I went to the Accession unit downstairs, where we accessioned records into the center. And from there I went to the mailroom. I was supervisor of the mailroom then. And then from there, I went to the chief of the Army correspondence section. And I retired from there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. It sounds like you wore a lot of different hats throughout your career."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How many years in total did you work for the National Archives?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "35 years."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "35. Okay. That's some dedication, I would say, to the agency. Can you talk about what your responsibilities were at your different jobs that you did for the National Archives?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:5", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 7.590707298117807, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How many years in total did you work for the National Archives?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "35 years."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "35. Okay. That's some dedication, I would say, to the agency. Can you talk about what your responsibilities were at your different jobs that you did for the National Archives?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Okay. When I was a file clerk, when records were pulled to be sent to the correspondence units to answer correspondence, then they had to be returned to the files. My job was to put them back in the files where they came from, whether it was Army, Navy, or whatever files they came from. And when I was supervisor of that, then I was the supervisor of getting the records from the correspondence section, having people get them from the correspondence units, and putting them in order and getting back in file. Also we filed loose papers that needed to be inserted in the records. Maybe documents that were sent from the Department of the Army or Navy, and they needed to be put in the person's record. Then from there, I went to the accession downstairs where you accessioned the new records coming into the center. They had to be keypunched in and put into the computer system at that time. Then we had a registry file, and it didn't make any difference what service you were in, Army, Navy, Coast Guard, Air Force, you were assigned a number and put in order in this file. That was the registry file. That's where I was at the time of the fire."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. I think you mentioned in our earlier conversation that you were actually in the Navy prior to joining the National Archives. Is that correct?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:7", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 7.323008109019785, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "35 years."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "35. Okay. That's some dedication, I would say, to the agency. Can you talk about what your responsibilities were at your different jobs that you did for the National Archives?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Okay. When I was a file clerk, when records were pulled to be sent to the correspondence units to answer correspondence, then they had to be returned to the files. My job was to put them back in the files where they came from, whether it was Army, Navy, or whatever files they came from. And when I was supervisor of that, then I was the supervisor of getting the records from the correspondence section, having people get them from the correspondence units, and putting them in order and getting back in file. Also we filed loose papers that needed to be inserted in the records. Maybe documents that were sent from the Department of the Army or Navy, and they needed to be put in the person's record. Then from there, I went to the accession downstairs where you accessioned the new records coming into the center. They had to be keypunched in and put into the computer system at that time. Then we had a registry file, and it didn't make any difference what service you were in, Army, Navy, Coast Guard, Air Force, you were assigned a number and put in order in this file. That was the registry file. That's where I was at the time of the fire."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. I think you mentioned in our earlier conversation that you were actually in the Navy prior to joining the National Archives. Is that correct?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was in the Navy, yes. From 1958 to '61 on active duty."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Great. Can you talk about what it was like transitioning from the Navy to working at the National Archives? Was there anything about being in the Navy that influenced your decision to work at the National Archives?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:11", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 6.5716149494071425, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was in the Navy, yes. From 1958 to '61 on active duty."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Great. Can you talk about what it was like transitioning from the Navy to working at the National Archives? Was there anything about being in the Navy that influenced your decision to work at the National Archives?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It helped me. When I got out of the service, I started at the Post Office, really, when I got out of the service. I had nothing but day and night shifts, and I didn't particularly like that change. So there were openings at the center, and I applied for it. I thought that was interesting the more I got into it. It was very interesting and also enlightening as to all the stuff that goes on in the military that you don't even think about."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What sorts of things? Do you remember? Do you recall what those things were?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I mean, all the records that you get from all over, and they're the files of all the people that served in the service. And it just brings to light how great a country it really is."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Can you talk a little bit about your impressions when you first started working at the agency? I know you just said it kind of expanded how you thought about the military, the U.S. military, and their operations and the manpower that it takes to do all of that. Do you mind talking a little bit about some of your other impressions that you had of the National Archives, in particular?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:13", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.968461054896825, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It helped me. When I got out of the service, I started at the Post Office, really, when I got out of the service. I had nothing but day and night shifts, and I didn't particularly like that change. So there were openings at the center, and I applied for it. I thought that was interesting the more I got into it. It was very interesting and also enlightening as to all the stuff that goes on in the military that you don't even think about."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What sorts of things? Do you remember? Do you recall what those things were?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I mean, all the records that you get from all over, and they're the files of all the people that served in the service. And it just brings to light how great a country it really is."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Can you talk a little bit about your impressions when you first started working at the agency? I know you just said it kind of expanded how you thought about the military, the U.S. military, and their operations and the manpower that it takes to do all of that. Do you mind talking a little bit about some of your other impressions that you had of the National Archives, in particular?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. The day that I was interviewed, it happened that the supervisor took me through there. We went to the Marine Corps and the Navy section, and he showed us the files. Here these files were nine shelves high in cabinets. And the records were filed by the person's service number. That was the Marine Corps. And I'm thinking, \"Wow!\" These records went back to, I mean, in the Marine Corps, went back into the 1800s and then came forward. I'm thinking, \"Wow!\" And then as you went along, you just found out that it went up to the present time. And then the Navy files were similar, only they were filed alphabetically by your name. I'm thinking, \"Oh, wow! Look at all these people.\" And you could tell at that time people were identified by their service numbers."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes, I'm sure the amount of records that they had even back then was pretty astounding to see."}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:15", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.409401172107583, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I mean, all the records that you get from all over, and they're the files of all the people that served in the service. And it just brings to light how great a country it really is."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Can you talk a little bit about your impressions when you first started working at the agency? I know you just said it kind of expanded how you thought about the military, the U.S. military, and their operations and the manpower that it takes to do all of that. Do you mind talking a little bit about some of your other impressions that you had of the National Archives, in particular?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. The day that I was interviewed, it happened that the supervisor took me through there. We went to the Marine Corps and the Navy section, and he showed us the files. Here these files were nine shelves high in cabinets. And the records were filed by the person's service number. That was the Marine Corps. And I'm thinking, \"Wow!\" These records went back to, I mean, in the Marine Corps, went back into the 1800s and then came forward. I'm thinking, \"Wow!\" And then as you went along, you just found out that it went up to the present time. And then the Navy files were similar, only they were filed alphabetically by your name. I'm thinking, \"Oh, wow! Look at all these people.\" And you could tell at that time people were identified by their service numbers."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes, I'm sure the amount of records that they had even back then was pretty astounding to see."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was! For somebody that was not used to seeing such a thing, it really opened your eyes as to what it really, really takes to put things together as far as your military."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. And I'm sure you probably felt a little bit like you're part of a long line of people that have been in the military and have served in the military."}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:17", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 4.899334635675093, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. The day that I was interviewed, it happened that the supervisor took me through there. We went to the Marine Corps and the Navy section, and he showed us the files. Here these files were nine shelves high in cabinets. And the records were filed by the person's service number. That was the Marine Corps. And I'm thinking, \"Wow!\" These records went back to, I mean, in the Marine Corps, went back into the 1800s and then came forward. I'm thinking, \"Wow!\" And then as you went along, you just found out that it went up to the present time. And then the Navy files were similar, only they were filed alphabetically by your name. I'm thinking, \"Oh, wow! Look at all these people.\" And you could tell at that time people were identified by their service numbers."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes, I'm sure the amount of records that they had even back then was pretty astounding to see."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was! For somebody that was not used to seeing such a thing, it really opened your eyes as to what it really, really takes to put things together as far as your military."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. And I'm sure you probably felt a little bit like you're part of a long line of people that have been in the military and have served in the military."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes!"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Can you talk about the sort of training that the National Archives provided you when you first started?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:19", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.332594039638991, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was! For somebody that was not used to seeing such a thing, it really opened your eyes as to what it really, really takes to put things together as far as your military."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. And I'm sure you probably felt a little bit like you're part of a long line of people that have been in the military and have served in the military."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes!"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Can you talk about the sort of training that the National Archives provided you when you first started?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, they taught me the record systems of how they were filed and how they got started. As you went along, you learned different things. My first ones were with the Marine Corps and in the Navy section where the medical records for the Navy, for example, they were separate from the personnel file. And so you had two files for a Navy person. The Marine Corps, their medical records were in that, too, because they were part of the Navy system. It was just interesting how that was put together. As you went along, you learned a little bit about each year and how they retired these records."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Got it. In terms of the actual work itself, I know you did quite a few different things. It sounds like you had a lot of different experiences at the National Archives. Can you talk about the parts of the work that you really enjoyed and your day-to-day going into the office?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:21", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.813993377376657, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes!"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Can you talk about the sort of training that the National Archives provided you when you first started?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, they taught me the record systems of how they were filed and how they got started. As you went along, you learned different things. My first ones were with the Marine Corps and in the Navy section where the medical records for the Navy, for example, they were separate from the personnel file. And so you had two files for a Navy person. The Marine Corps, their medical records were in that, too, because they were part of the Navy system. It was just interesting how that was put together. As you went along, you learned a little bit about each year and how they retired these records."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Got it. In terms of the actual work itself, I know you did quite a few different things. It sounds like you had a lot of different experiences at the National Archives. Can you talk about the parts of the work that you really enjoyed and your day-to-day going into the office?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I really, really enjoyed the accessioning of the records because you got the records in and then you keypunched them into the computer and they were labeled, and then they would go on the shelves for service, and you felt you were actually putting records to make them available for people to respond for correspondence. I thought that was pretty good because you had to make sure they were keypunched in right and they were filed right. And you have some interesting things there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It sounds like it was very precise work. As in you had to be very, as you said, things were keypunched in correctly. Everything is dotting your I's and crossing your T's."}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:25", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.943201700465009, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I really, really enjoyed the accessioning of the records because you got the records in and then you keypunched them into the computer and they were labeled, and then they would go on the shelves for service, and you felt you were actually putting records to make them available for people to respond for correspondence. I thought that was pretty good because you had to make sure they were keypunched in right and they were filed right. And you have some interesting things there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It sounds like it was very precise work. As in you had to be very, as you said, things were keypunched in correctly. Everything is dotting your I's and crossing your T's."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Then the people had to label them up. And then the people that were putting them together had to be conscientious and get that done. I had a good group of people that did that and then had some young men that took the files up and put them in file order. They did a remarkable job of getting that done because you have to lift and put the boxes on the shelves in order. That was good."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "We'll get to more stuff about the fire in a minute. But just to round out your history of your career with the National Archives, can you talk briefly about what were some of the fire-related challenges that you faced in your career with the agency? Because I know you were there both before and after the fire occurred."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'm wondering exactly what you're asking about."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's okay. Were there any challenges related to the fire that impacted your career?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:27", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.603557444961121, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. Then the people had to label them up. And then the people that were putting them together had to be conscientious and get that done. I had a good group of people that did that and then had some young men that took the files up and put them in file order. They did a remarkable job of getting that done because you have to lift and put the boxes on the shelves in order. That was good."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "We'll get to more stuff about the fire in a minute. But just to round out your history of your career with the National Archives, can you talk briefly about what were some of the fire-related challenges that you faced in your career with the agency? Because I know you were there both before and after the fire occurred."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'm wondering exactly what you're asking about."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's okay. Were there any challenges related to the fire that impacted your career?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Other than the fact that you'd seen a whole lot of records that were burned, and you just wondered, a lot of their personal Army history was lost. There was not a whole lot that could be done and bring that back. That was awful sad."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes, I can imagine. Losing that many files, and there's really nothing you can do to replace them and bring them back is, I'm sure, really frustrating for someone whose life is about preserving these files and making sure that they continue into the future. Could you talk about any changes in Presidential administrations or administrations of the Archivist of the United States? Did that have any impact on your work at all, or do you recall any of those changes, specifically?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:29", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 3, "return_to_go": 7.337286049956801, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'm wondering exactly what you're asking about."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's okay. Were there any challenges related to the fire that impacted your career?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Other than the fact that you'd seen a whole lot of records that were burned, and you just wondered, a lot of their personal Army history was lost. There was not a whole lot that could be done and bring that back. That was awful sad."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes, I can imagine. Losing that many files, and there's really nothing you can do to replace them and bring them back is, I'm sure, really frustrating for someone whose life is about preserving these files and making sure that they continue into the future. Could you talk about any changes in Presidential administrations or administrations of the Archivist of the United States? Did that have any impact on your work at all, or do you recall any of those changes, specifically?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't recall any changes like that. It seemed like whatever they needed to get things done, it seemed like they provided the funds to do whatever needed to be done. Where I was, I got almost anything that was practical and necessary to get the job done."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. That's good to hear. Did you make any interesting discoveries through your work at the National Archives? I know, for instance, you said earlier that seeing all of those military records was really eye opening. Were there any other interesting discoveries that you feel like you made?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:33", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.3546741357491365, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't recall any changes like that. It seemed like whatever they needed to get things done, it seemed like they provided the funds to do whatever needed to be done. Where I was, I got almost anything that was practical and necessary to get the job done."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. That's good to hear. Did you make any interesting discoveries through your work at the National Archives? I know, for instance, you said earlier that seeing all of those military records was really eye opening. Were there any other interesting discoveries that you feel like you made?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, it was interesting. This is just funny. One of the things in the correspondence section, for example, when I worked, people used to write in and want copies of something from Elvis Presley's records. His records were at the center, but they were with the Department of the Army. But they could get certain documents from that. So you'd have to get his records and they would answer it and you'd send it back. And I'm thinking, \"Wow, all the people in the world and here's a person that you’d just seen in the thing...\" But there were others like that. I remember that, I didn't see it, but they had to pull records of anybody that made national news, like when Kennedy got shot. They pulled the records and sent them to Washington. But I wasn't in on any of those as far as pulling the records are concerned."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's funny, though, that a lot of people wanted Elvis Presley's records."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right! Yes, it was interesting because I never even thought about things like that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Of course. Did you observe any major technological advancements during your career? How did you see those impacting the National Archives?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:35", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.9496379286101515, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, it was interesting. This is just funny. One of the things in the correspondence section, for example, when I worked, people used to write in and want copies of something from Elvis Presley's records. His records were at the center, but they were with the Department of the Army. But they could get certain documents from that. So you'd have to get his records and they would answer it and you'd send it back. And I'm thinking, \"Wow, all the people in the world and here's a person that you’d just seen in the thing...\" But there were others like that. I remember that, I didn't see it, but they had to pull records of anybody that made national news, like when Kennedy got shot. They pulled the records and sent them to Washington. But I wasn't in on any of those as far as pulling the records are concerned."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's funny, though, that a lot of people wanted Elvis Presley's records."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right! Yes, it was interesting because I never even thought about things like that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Of course. Did you observe any major technological advancements during your career? How did you see those impacting the National Archives?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, I saw a lot! One of the things is that being computerized helped things an awful lot because you could search on a computer and find out if you had a record on file rather quickly and then you could go and get it. Otherwise, you had to get a name and walk out there and find it alphabetically or numerically and that took a little more time. Sometimes with records where, for example, if you had Navy, you had a medical and you had a personnel record. Sometimes if you needed them both, you had to go to two different files to get it. You would still have to do that, but on a computer search, they would both come up and tell you where they were."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, wow. That's much more convenient."}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:37", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.610708809566835, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right! Yes, it was interesting because I never even thought about things like that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Of course. Did you observe any major technological advancements during your career? How did you see those impacting the National Archives?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, I saw a lot! One of the things is that being computerized helped things an awful lot because you could search on a computer and find out if you had a record on file rather quickly and then you could go and get it. Otherwise, you had to get a name and walk out there and find it alphabetically or numerically and that took a little more time. Sometimes with records where, for example, if you had Navy, you had a medical and you had a personnel record. Sometimes if you needed them both, you had to go to two different files to get it. You would still have to do that, but on a computer search, they would both come up and tell you where they were."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, wow. That's much more convenient."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'm sure that saved you a lot of time. Do you remember around what time things were computerized in the National Archives?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:41", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.828035567366462, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'm sure that saved you a lot of time. Do you remember around what time things were computerized in the National Archives?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "They started the registry file, I think, in 1964. It started off kind of slow. That was for people that were discharged after 1964."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Got it."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That was the year that they started the registry system, and they were just getting started. And then they kept adding to that as we went along. The Air Force and the Navy and Marine Corps and Coast Guard made up the first part of that, and then eventually we started getting more Army records."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. Do you remember if people and staff in general really embraced the computerization of the records? Or was it tough to adjust to changes like that?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:43", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.364483963740513, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They started the registry file, I think, in 1964. It started off kind of slow. That was for people that were discharged after 1964."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Got it."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That was the year that they started the registry system, and they were just getting started. And then they kept adding to that as we went along. The Air Force and the Navy and Marine Corps and Coast Guard made up the first part of that, and then eventually we started getting more Army records."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. Do you remember if people and staff in general really embraced the computerization of the records? Or was it tough to adjust to changes like that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think they really embraced it, except that it was new and most of us were not in the computer age and how this was working. That was interesting how that was going to work. But, I mean, you get a record in and you assign a number to it and you put it in the computer and it tells you to go out and look at record 11, and that's where that record would be. Then you had to just get familiar with that instead of going out and looking alphabetically or numerically for this file, because you needed to know the person's full name and maybe a service number. And at that time, a lot of people did not always know their service numbers."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, I see. Okay. Got it. Can you talk about your relationship with other federal agencies? Did changes with those agencies impact your work? I'm thinking maybe the VA or the Army."}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:47", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.62281970832162, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think they really embraced it, except that it was new and most of us were not in the computer age and how this was working. That was interesting how that was going to work. But, I mean, you get a record in and you assign a number to it and you put it in the computer and it tells you to go out and look at record 11, and that's where that record would be. Then you had to just get familiar with that instead of going out and looking alphabetically or numerically for this file, because you needed to know the person's full name and maybe a service number. And at that time, a lot of people did not always know their service numbers."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Oh, I see. Okay. Got it. Can you talk about your relationship with other federal agencies? Did changes with those agencies impact your work? I'm thinking maybe the VA or the Army."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I didn't really have a lot. I worked mainly with CPR, the civilian side, because they were in the computer system, too. So you could touch base with them and see if they knew things. But mainly the records were sent from the thing and received from the departments. I had no real contact with those people that retired the records there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Got it."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We just got them by shipments and worked them from there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. You were at the National Archives when it became independent of GSA in 1985, correct?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:49", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 7.3586885648018, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I didn't really have a lot. I worked mainly with CPR, the civilian side, because they were in the computer system, too. So you could touch base with them and see if they knew things. But mainly the records were sent from the thing and received from the departments. I had no real contact with those people that retired the records there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Got it."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We just got them by shipments and worked them from there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. You were at the National Archives when it became independent of GSA in 1985, correct?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you notice any differences or any changes when that happened? Did that impact your work at all?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:51", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 8.176320627557555, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We just got them by shipments and worked them from there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. You were at the National Archives when it became independent of GSA in 1985, correct?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you notice any differences or any changes when that happened? Did that impact your work at all?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It didn't impact anything that I was doing other than that you knew all the supervisors and center director directly. And that was nice."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I see. Okay. Well, I think now would be a good time to start talking about the fire. Because you were there both before the fire and after the fire. You were involved in the immediate aftermath of that. Can you talk about what you recall about the fire?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:53", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.86257847506395, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I was."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you notice any differences or any changes when that happened? Did that impact your work at all?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It didn't impact anything that I was doing other than that you knew all the supervisors and center director directly. And that was nice."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I see. Okay. Well, I think now would be a good time to start talking about the fire. Because you were there both before the fire and after the fire. You were involved in the immediate aftermath of that. Can you talk about what you recall about the fire?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "The morning after the fire had been put out I received a call that my boss, he wanted me and another fella to come up to the center and that we would have permission to get on the lot, because it was all closed off. And I said, \"Well, we can do that.\" So we went up there and then he told us what the plans were, that and to basically go home and get some work clothes on and come in, and we're going to go inside and make a survey of what the building looked like on the inside because some of them had been inside, but not a lot of people had been inside at that time. So we went and did all of that, and we got back and we went inside of the building. You saw the water in the hallways. It was water from the sixth floor, which had drained all the way down to the second floor and through the stairwells and the escalators. You kind of walked around this. On our second floor, there were correspondence units and files, and we just surveyed a little bit of that floor. Then later on, we got to go down and look at our areas to see if water damage or anything was bad or got the records."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And was it? Had the water damage been pretty bad during your survey?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:59", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.95689777100679, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, my section was on the first floor. It was down in the basement, sort of. And there was water on the floors in areas, but for the most part, no records were really damaged with water. But naturally, the musty smell was there. A little bit of water had to be cleaned up. But, fortunately, no records were damaged that was in that area."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Well, that's good. Can you describe what the building looked like when you arrived? You said that there was water all in the hallways, and obviously it did not smell very good."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. When we got there, there was a lot of broken glass on the sixth floor. There was a lot of glass at the National Archives on Page Avenue there, and a lot of the windows were broken because the firemen were trying to put out the fire and broken windows just from probably the heat of the building. It just looked like, “Wow, there's a lot more damage in there than you really know.” You couldn't see anything and the smell outside was still there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'm sure. Did you mention that your boss had called you to tell you basically to come in with work clothes? Was it you and one other employee? Or how many were there?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, that morning he just called me and a fellow named Felix. Felix worked in the A and D section. He basically was organizational records. He helped access and dispose of our organizational records, such as hospital records."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I see. Okay. And it's Felix, correct? You said Felix?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:61", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 6.618775301118655, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. When we got there, there was a lot of broken glass on the sixth floor. There was a lot of glass at the National Archives on Page Avenue there, and a lot of the windows were broken because the firemen were trying to put out the fire and broken windows just from probably the heat of the building. It just looked like, “Wow, there's a lot more damage in there than you really know.” You couldn't see anything and the smell outside was still there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'm sure. Did you mention that your boss had called you to tell you basically to come in with work clothes? Was it you and one other employee? Or how many were there?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, that morning he just called me and a fellow named Felix. Felix worked in the A and D section. He basically was organizational records. He helped access and dispose of our organizational records, such as hospital records."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I see. Okay. And it's Felix, correct? You said Felix?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What did your boss have you and Felix doing that day in the immediate response to the fire?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:63", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.131972556798505, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, that morning he just called me and a fellow named Felix. Felix worked in the A and D section. He basically was organizational records. He helped access and dispose of our organizational records, such as hospital records."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I see. Okay. And it's Felix, correct? You said Felix?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What did your boss have you and Felix doing that day in the immediate response to the fire?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "We were just looking for the water damage in some of the areas. Felix, he came to the center when it was originally put in the St. Louis area there. I'm not exactly sure of the exact year that they got there, but he came there and he knew all the organizational records pretty good."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I see. Okay. Are there any other anecdotes about the impact of the fire in the National Archives that you can recall? How it impacted the operations of the National Archives?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:65", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.702191729776117, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Yes."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What did your boss have you and Felix doing that day in the immediate response to the fire?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "We were just looking for the water damage in some of the areas. Felix, he came to the center when it was originally put in the St. Louis area there. I'm not exactly sure of the exact year that they got there, but he came there and he knew all the organizational records pretty good."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I see. Okay. Are there any other anecdotes about the impact of the fire in the National Archives that you can recall? How it impacted the operations of the National Archives?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "At the beginning of it, it made it hard to respond to some of these people that wrote in to the center, because first of all, you had to find out if you had a record, number one. Number two, the files weren't complete, so it took you a long time to process all the burnt records and get all the burned files together. A lot of times you didn't have anything to go on to help verify their service or create things. So you weren't really able to help at times."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'm sure that was a frustrating experience."}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:67", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 6.335768588640129, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We were just looking for the water damage in some of the areas. Felix, he came to the center when it was originally put in the St. Louis area there. I'm not exactly sure of the exact year that they got there, but he came there and he knew all the organizational records pretty good."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I see. Okay. Are there any other anecdotes about the impact of the fire in the National Archives that you can recall? How it impacted the operations of the National Archives?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "At the beginning of it, it made it hard to respond to some of these people that wrote in to the center, because first of all, you had to find out if you had a record, number one. Number two, the files weren't complete, so it took you a long time to process all the burnt records and get all the burned files together. A lot of times you didn't have anything to go on to help verify their service or create things. So you weren't really able to help at times."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'm sure that was a frustrating experience."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think it was awful, that, because, at that time, a lot of the records in that burned area, they needed service numbers and different things, and a lot of people didn't know their service numbers. You had to get the right information to know whether you had a record or not, names and what have you. That wasn't always easy to get."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I know that immediately after the fire, I think there was a really big tent operation essentially set up in the parking lot of the building. Can you talk about what that was like? What was your involvement in that? At the time, you were the supervisor of the accessions records unit, right?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:69", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.595298431822366, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "At the beginning of it, it made it hard to respond to some of these people that wrote in to the center, because first of all, you had to find out if you had a record, number one. Number two, the files weren't complete, so it took you a long time to process all the burnt records and get all the burned files together. A lot of times you didn't have anything to go on to help verify their service or create things. So you weren't really able to help at times."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'm sure that was a frustrating experience."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think it was awful, that, because, at that time, a lot of the records in that burned area, they needed service numbers and different things, and a lot of people didn't know their service numbers. You had to get the right information to know whether you had a record or not, names and what have you. That wasn't always easy to get."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I know that immediately after the fire, I think there was a really big tent operation essentially set up in the parking lot of the building. Can you talk about what that was like? What was your involvement in that? At the time, you were the supervisor of the accessions records unit, right?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. I didn't have a lot to do with what we called \"Tent City\" out there. They had tents out there where they helped shade them. Basically, they got the boxes from the records from the burn area, and they would go through them, and the records that had enough material to make it a record or any documents that made a record, they put it in a box to say, \"This is this is a record. We're going to accession this in.\" Over time, they would accumulate so many boxes of this stuff. How many boxes, I don't know. But, then they loaded them on a truck and they took them out to McDonnell Douglas or Boeing. They put them in their freeze-dried area, which helped get the moisture out of the files and made them easier to handle in Accessions because the more you handle them, sometimes the burn edges would get off."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "They would crumble a little bit."}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:73", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.2040721380523034, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right. I didn't have a lot to do with what we called \"Tent City\" out there. They had tents out there where they helped shade them. Basically, they got the boxes from the records from the burn area, and they would go through them, and the records that had enough material to make it a record or any documents that made a record, they put it in a box to say, \"This is this is a record. We're going to accession this in.\" Over time, they would accumulate so many boxes of this stuff. How many boxes, I don't know. But, then they loaded them on a truck and they took them out to McDonnell Douglas or Boeing. They put them in their freeze-dried area, which helped get the moisture out of the files and made them easier to handle in Accessions because the more you handle them, sometimes the burn edges would get off."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "They would crumble a little bit."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, right. It was kind of dirty, but then when they would come back and they were records, then they would come down to our area and then we would keypunch them in from that standpoint. Then we loaded them into the burnt file, that's what we called it, the burnt file. You keypunched whatever they sent, whatever we could keypunch in, we did. Sometimes it was a record, so we keypunched it in. We didn't know exactly what was there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. I mean, what was it like handling those burned files? Were they still extremely fragile when you were keypunching them in and accessioning them in?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Every time, because you handled them, you had to turn them to do that and the burn edges were off. Most of the time, the keypunch operators, and other people also, they wore smocks or plastic smocks they could put on so the burnt ends wouldn't get on them and be as clean as possible to make sure that, if there was anything bad on it health-wise, that they were okay."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Was there any concern about the health of the workers in your unit who were handling these?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:75", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.560080153391448, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, right. It was kind of dirty, but then when they would come back and they were records, then they would come down to our area and then we would keypunch them in from that standpoint. Then we loaded them into the burnt file, that's what we called it, the burnt file. You keypunched whatever they sent, whatever we could keypunch in, we did. Sometimes it was a record, so we keypunched it in. We didn't know exactly what was there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. I mean, what was it like handling those burned files? Were they still extremely fragile when you were keypunching them in and accessioning them in?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Every time, because you handled them, you had to turn them to do that and the burn edges were off. Most of the time, the keypunch operators, and other people also, they wore smocks or plastic smocks they could put on so the burnt ends wouldn't get on them and be as clean as possible to make sure that, if there was anything bad on it health-wise, that they were okay."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Was there any concern about the health of the workers in your unit who were handling these?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, not really. It was just that you handled all of this burnt stuff on your hands. It's more stuff you haven't done in your life, maybe."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. It's kind of unpleasant to handle those types of things. Do you think that the fire impacted your work in the long term beyond just the immediate aftermath?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:77", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 3.955644614879387, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. Every time, because you handled them, you had to turn them to do that and the burn edges were off. Most of the time, the keypunch operators, and other people also, they wore smocks or plastic smocks they could put on so the burnt ends wouldn't get on them and be as clean as possible to make sure that, if there was anything bad on it health-wise, that they were okay."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Was there any concern about the health of the workers in your unit who were handling these?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, not really. It was just that you handled all of this burnt stuff on your hands. It's more stuff you haven't done in your life, maybe."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. It's kind of unpleasant to handle those types of things. Do you think that the fire impacted your work in the long term beyond just the immediate aftermath?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't think it affected my thing. The center getting them accessioned in was an asset, I know. I do think that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How long did it take to get all the burned files all accessioned in again?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:79", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.2840495720882075, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, not really. It was just that you handled all of this burnt stuff on your hands. It's more stuff you haven't done in your life, maybe."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. It's kind of unpleasant to handle those types of things. Do you think that the fire impacted your work in the long term beyond just the immediate aftermath?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't think it affected my thing. The center getting them accessioned in was an asset, I know. I do think that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How long did it take to get all the burned files all accessioned in again?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, gosh, they were accessioning burned files for oh, months that it took them. But also they had some records that were sent from other places for the burned files to help. And we got those from other places."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'm sure it was a really big task. It wasn't done in just a couple of days."}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:81", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.648943968986897, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I don't think it affected my thing. The center getting them accessioned in was an asset, I know. I do think that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How long did it take to get all the burned files all accessioned in again?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, gosh, they were accessioning burned files for oh, months that it took them. But also they had some records that were sent from other places for the burned files to help. And we got those from other places."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'm sure it was a really big task. It wasn't done in just a couple of days."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it wasn't. I don't know the time frame of some of that because it is probably continuing on in different ways now, even."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you think that there were any reorganization efforts that were done after the fire? Did you see any of that?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:83", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 4.054382187763219, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, gosh, they were accessioning burned files for oh, months that it took them. But also they had some records that were sent from other places for the burned files to help. And we got those from other places."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'm sure it was a really big task. It wasn't done in just a couple of days."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it wasn't. I don't know the time frame of some of that because it is probably continuing on in different ways now, even."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you think that there were any reorganization efforts that were done after the fire? Did you see any of that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I didn't see any of that, but I know that towards the end of my career that a lot of the services were going to microfilms and the records and computer things. So that makes a little difference."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Just out of curiosity, were you working in the Records Reconstruction Branch after the fire at all?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:85", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.393757986403576, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, it wasn't. I don't know the time frame of some of that because it is probably continuing on in different ways now, even."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you think that there were any reorganization efforts that were done after the fire? Did you see any of that?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I didn't see any of that, but I know that towards the end of my career that a lot of the services were going to microfilms and the records and computer things. So that makes a little difference."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Just out of curiosity, were you working in the Records Reconstruction Branch after the fire at all?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I didn't work in the Reconstruction Branch."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay, great. Well, you must have been there when the records moved from the 9700 page location to Spanish Lake?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:87", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 3.7708422071150847, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I didn't see any of that, but I know that towards the end of my career that a lot of the services were going to microfilms and the records and computer things. So that makes a little difference."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Just out of curiosity, were you working in the Records Reconstruction Branch after the fire at all?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I didn't work in the Reconstruction Branch."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay, great. Well, you must have been there when the records moved from the 9700 page location to Spanish Lake?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I was not. I was retired."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's right because that was later. But I'm sure you probably heard about the move that they made."}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:89", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.189824674572316, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I didn't work in the Reconstruction Branch."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay, great. Well, you must have been there when the records moved from the 9700 page location to Spanish Lake?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I was not. I was retired."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's right because that was later. But I'm sure you probably heard about the move that they made."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I did. Yes, I did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you feel that that was a good move to move everything to the new location? Because you were familiar with the 9700 Page location."}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:91", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 4.655360749524795, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I was not. I was retired."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That's right because that was later. But I'm sure you probably heard about the move that they made."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I did. Yes, I did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you feel that that was a good move to move everything to the new location? Because you were familiar with the 9700 Page location."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I think it was probably good and probably good for the records. Give it a fresh start and all the new things that are coming along and all the computer ages that have come along with the records. I think it was probably a good thing."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were there any procedures or policies that were put in place after the fire that were done because of the fire?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:93", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.17262305502755, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I did. Yes, I did."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you feel that that was a good move to move everything to the new location? Because you were familiar with the 9700 Page location."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I think it was probably good and probably good for the records. Give it a fresh start and all the new things that are coming along and all the computer ages that have come along with the records. I think it was probably a good thing."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were there any procedures or policies that were put in place after the fire that were done because of the fire?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not that I am aware of. The part that I was in, it was just changes, the normal changes, the fire didn't have anything to do with them. They were just normal things. Maybe to help make better copies. Just work related, not policy."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Got it. Okay. Were you familiar with the decision to make the official military personnel files permanent? Because that happened after the fire, I think."}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:95", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 5.747358950030611, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I think it was probably good and probably good for the records. Give it a fresh start and all the new things that are coming along and all the computer ages that have come along with the records. I think it was probably a good thing."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were there any procedures or policies that were put in place after the fire that were done because of the fire?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not that I am aware of. The part that I was in, it was just changes, the normal changes, the fire didn't have anything to do with them. They were just normal things. Maybe to help make better copies. Just work related, not policy."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Got it. Okay. Were you familiar with the decision to make the official military personnel files permanent? Because that happened after the fire, I think."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Were you involved in that decision? Do you think there were any benefits to that or did that bring up any new challenges for you?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:97", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 6.385954388922901, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not that I am aware of. The part that I was in, it was just changes, the normal changes, the fire didn't have anything to do with them. They were just normal things. Maybe to help make better copies. Just work related, not policy."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Got it. Okay. Were you familiar with the decision to make the official military personnel files permanent? Because that happened after the fire, I think."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Were you involved in that decision? Do you think there were any benefits to that or did that bring up any new challenges for you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I wasn't involved in any of the decisions like that and it really didn't affect me at all."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. Just, more generally, zooming out a little bit. Can you talk a little bit about the culture at NPRC, at the agency, and the work culture and specifically within your unit, the Accession unit, during the fire?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:99", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 7.095504876581001, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Were you involved in that decision? Do you think there were any benefits to that or did that bring up any new challenges for you?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I wasn't involved in any of the decisions like that and it really didn't affect me at all."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. Just, more generally, zooming out a little bit. Can you talk a little bit about the culture at NPRC, at the agency, and the work culture and specifically within your unit, the Accession unit, during the fire?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'm not sure what you're asking there, but we had data keypunch operators that punched stuff into the things, and they did their job. Then you had to take the punch cards and turn them in and get the labels for them. And then we had a group of people that we would assign to label up whatever records needed to be labeled up. They worked in teams, because sometimes you would have maybe 20 or 30 boxes of records that needed to be labeled. So they would get that done. Then the boys would know that they were ready to go to file, and then they had to make room for the next group of records that were coming on these conveyor belts."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Got it. Can you talk briefly about what do you think the impact was of the fire at the National Archives? Was there a larger impact that you felt there was on the agency in general?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:101", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 5.661672085090001, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I wasn't involved in any of the decisions like that and it really didn't affect me at all."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. Just, more generally, zooming out a little bit. Can you talk a little bit about the culture at NPRC, at the agency, and the work culture and specifically within your unit, the Accession unit, during the fire?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'm not sure what you're asking there, but we had data keypunch operators that punched stuff into the things, and they did their job. Then you had to take the punch cards and turn them in and get the labels for them. And then we had a group of people that we would assign to label up whatever records needed to be labeled up. They worked in teams, because sometimes you would have maybe 20 or 30 boxes of records that needed to be labeled. So they would get that done. Then the boys would know that they were ready to go to file, and then they had to make room for the next group of records that were coming on these conveyor belts."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Got it. Can you talk briefly about what do you think the impact was of the fire at the National Archives? Was there a larger impact that you felt there was on the agency in general?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I'm not sure about that. I'm sure that it had an impact on the center because I can remember when I first started there that one of the things that some people said was that in the place on Page that there was no fire system in the building. I would think that the new place has the updated codes for whatever that is. I don't know why or why not they didn't have one at that time. But I did hear that conversation in the early days, and I never thought it was good, bad, indifferent because it was just conversation."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. What do you remember from what you first thought when you heard that there was a fire at the agency and that essentially your boss was calling you in to help survey the damage?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:107", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 2.6909082100000004, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "When you heard that, I thought, \"Well, they'll probably have that put out before you know it.\" Then as time went along and they were still working on it, I'm thinking, \"Wow, this is...\" And then as the news got out—I was getting my information from the news, mostly because it was still an active fire up there and still putting water on it—I'm thinking, \"Oh, this is bigger than anyone thought.\" Then you're thinking, \"Okay, what impact is that going to have on jobs? When can you get in?\" Then when I did get the call and I walked there and I thought, \"Whoa, whoa,\" because there was no really electric. There were no escalators, there was nothing. I'm thinking \"By the time they check all of this out and make it work-worthy that, wow, this is not going to be overnight!\""}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. I think you had mentioned in a previous conversation that you guys had squeegees and you were trying to just remove as much water as possible that first day."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, that first day! First day, they had some squeegees about four feet, three, four feet wide. And several of us, we would push water down the hallway and out the front door and down the stairwells. Then down on the next floor they were doing the same thing. There was just a lot of water draining from all of the above. Standing there, you really realize that this was not going to be easy nor fun."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Yes, certainly not fun."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I think you had mentioned, too, that you showed up and started squeegeeing and there weren't necessarily hardhats on the job either."}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:109", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.8787869000000004, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, that first day! First day, they had some squeegees about four feet, three, four feet wide. And several of us, we would push water down the hallway and out the front door and down the stairwells. Then down on the next floor they were doing the same thing. There was just a lot of water draining from all of the above. Standing there, you really realize that this was not going to be easy nor fun."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. Yes, certainly not fun."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I think you had mentioned, too, that you showed up and started squeegeeing and there weren't necessarily hardhats on the job either."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, no, at that time there wasn't. But when we went in, when we got back, they gave us boots to walk around in the building with, with the water. But on the first day, we didn't have hardhats. But then it was required that you have a hardhat after that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'm sure that walking around was probably pretty gross with all the burnt stuff. And I think you said there was broken glass as well."}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:111", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 2.0875410000000003, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That's right."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I think you had mentioned, too, that you showed up and started squeegeeing and there weren't necessarily hardhats on the job either."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, no, at that time there wasn't. But when we went in, when we got back, they gave us boots to walk around in the building with, with the water. But on the first day, we didn't have hardhats. But then it was required that you have a hardhat after that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'm sure that walking around was probably pretty gross with all the burnt stuff. And I think you said there was broken glass as well."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, it was from the windows that were broken up above. If you were standing on the outside, every once in a while a piece of glass would fall out that you had worked loose and come down on the ground and you're thinking, \"Wow, okay, don't stand too close to that.\" You could get hit by a piece of glass from above not even thinking of that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. It's kind of miraculous then that you weren't injured at all during this."}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:113", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 2.31949, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, no, at that time there wasn't. But when we went in, when we got back, they gave us boots to walk around in the building with, with the water. But on the first day, we didn't have hardhats. But then it was required that you have a hardhat after that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'm sure that walking around was probably pretty gross with all the burnt stuff. And I think you said there was broken glass as well."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, it was from the windows that were broken up above. If you were standing on the outside, every once in a while a piece of glass would fall out that you had worked loose and come down on the ground and you're thinking, \"Wow, okay, don't stand too close to that.\" You could get hit by a piece of glass from above not even thinking of that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. It's kind of miraculous then that you weren't injured at all during this."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, no. I mean we were pretty cautious about it. It's just that you're just standing there, and all of the things going through your head just thinking, \"Wow, they have to fix all the glass and get this all back.\" I mean, all the pieces that you think about, seeing this building that you work in has to be put back together so you can come back to work."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Sure. I'm sure it was pretty astounding to see the level of damage that there was to the building itself. I'm sure it's very odd to see a building that you work in have so much fire damage to it."}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:115", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 1.4661, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, it was from the windows that were broken up above. If you were standing on the outside, every once in a while a piece of glass would fall out that you had worked loose and come down on the ground and you're thinking, \"Wow, okay, don't stand too close to that.\" You could get hit by a piece of glass from above not even thinking of that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Right. It's kind of miraculous then that you weren't injured at all during this."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, no. I mean we were pretty cautious about it. It's just that you're just standing there, and all of the things going through your head just thinking, \"Wow, they have to fix all the glass and get this all back.\" I mean, all the pieces that you think about, seeing this building that you work in has to be put back together so you can come back to work."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Sure. I'm sure it was pretty astounding to see the level of damage that there was to the building itself. I'm sure it's very odd to see a building that you work in have so much fire damage to it."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. And I did not go up to the sixth floor where the fire was. They were very cautious about that because I don't know if they didn't know if there was any structural damage from the heat or how safe it was. But they had a group of fellows that worked up there that actually helped process the records out of there. That was a good team of workers up there. I don't know all of them that worked up there, but I'm sure they had some exciting days with how to get this off of the shelf."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'm sure they definitely did. Well, just to close out the interview, do you mind talking about how you view your time at the National Archives, whether it's related to the fire. It sounds like you were pretty integral to being there in the immediate aftermath of the fire. But how do you view your time at the National Archives?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:119", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 1.81, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. And I did not go up to the sixth floor where the fire was. They were very cautious about that because I don't know if they didn't know if there was any structural damage from the heat or how safe it was. But they had a group of fellows that worked up there that actually helped process the records out of there. That was a good team of workers up there. I don't know all of them that worked up there, but I'm sure they had some exciting days with how to get this off of the shelf."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'm sure they definitely did. Well, just to close out the interview, do you mind talking about how you view your time at the National Archives, whether it's related to the fire. It sounds like you were pretty integral to being there in the immediate aftermath of the fire. But how do you view your time at the National Archives?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, I thought it was a great career! I really enjoyed that, working from the files to accessing records. I learned an awful lot and I really, really appreciate all the veterans that served no matter when they served. I have an extra thing about all the things they did. And they absolutely were in the war and they did things, they were in the service. Every once in a while, I get choked up when it's a certain thing and they play the national anthem. It means a lot more."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'm sure it must be pretty breathtaking too. I mean, you witnessed firsthand taking care of their records, in a way, helping and taking care of veterans themselves."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. From my standpoint personally, everybody at the center did an awesome job of trying to help veterans and help get things that they could help, maybe get their VA benefits and things that they were looking for and provide service to them. They were just a good group of people to work with."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It sounds like you had a pretty long and dedicated career with the National Archives in St. Louis."}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:121", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.9, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Oh, I thought it was a great career! I really enjoyed that, working from the files to accessing records. I learned an awful lot and I really, really appreciate all the veterans that served no matter when they served. I have an extra thing about all the things they did. And they absolutely were in the war and they did things, they were in the service. Every once in a while, I get choked up when it's a certain thing and they play the national anthem. It means a lot more."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I'm sure it must be pretty breathtaking too. I mean, you witnessed firsthand taking care of their records, in a way, helping and taking care of veterans themselves."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. From my standpoint personally, everybody at the center did an awesome job of trying to help veterans and help get things that they could help, maybe get their VA benefits and things that they were looking for and provide service to them. They were just a good group of people to work with."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It sounds like you had a pretty long and dedicated career with the National Archives in St. Louis."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I did. Like I say, I enjoyed every day that I went in, and I never really didn't like to go in."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Is there anything else that you'd like to add to the interview? Anything else that I missed asking about? Anything about the fire?"}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:123", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 1.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. From my standpoint personally, everybody at the center did an awesome job of trying to help veterans and help get things that they could help, maybe get their VA benefits and things that they were looking for and provide service to them. They were just a good group of people to work with."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It sounds like you had a pretty long and dedicated career with the National Archives in St. Louis."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I did. Like I say, I enjoyed every day that I went in, and I never really didn't like to go in."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Is there anything else that you'd like to add to the interview? Anything else that I missed asking about? Anything about the fire?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not really. I just hope I kind of gave an overshot of the fire. Some of the stuff that I said is from my memory and what I went through, and I hope that people could understand that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I think you did a wonderful job. I think everything that you said is extremely helpful and really interesting as well. So I'm really glad you were able to do the interview."}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:125", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I did. Like I say, I enjoyed every day that I went in, and I never really didn't like to go in."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Is there anything else that you'd like to add to the interview? Anything else that I missed asking about? Anything about the fire?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not really. I just hope I kind of gave an overshot of the fire. Some of the stuff that I said is from my memory and what I went through, and I hope that people could understand that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I think you did a wonderful job. I think everything that you said is extremely helpful and really interesting as well. So I'm really glad you were able to do the interview."}, {"role": "user", "content": "There's one thing that might be interesting that I just happened to think about. A lot of the states that had records on file for various reasons—a lot of states had DD 214s of people that served in the service—a lot of them had copies, and they sent them to the center so that we could create a record for a lot of veterans. And I'm sure that helped create some of the burned files. But it also put the documents in a place where they're made available for many people and for years to come."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Got it! Well, thank you so much for doing the interview. If there's nothing more that you'd like to add, I think we can close out the interview. So, thank you very, very much."}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:127", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not really. I just hope I kind of gave an overshot of the fire. Some of the stuff that I said is from my memory and what I went through, and I hope that people could understand that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I think you did a wonderful job. I think everything that you said is extremely helpful and really interesting as well. So I'm really glad you were able to do the interview."}, {"role": "user", "content": "There's one thing that might be interesting that I just happened to think about. A lot of the states that had records on file for various reasons—a lot of states had DD 214s of people that served in the service—a lot of them had copies, and they sent them to the center so that we could create a record for a lot of veterans. And I'm sure that helped create some of the burned files. But it also put the documents in a place where they're made available for many people and for years to come."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Got it! Well, thank you so much for doing the interview. If there's nothing more that you'd like to add, I think we can close out the interview. So, thank you very, very much."}, {"role": "user", "content": "You're welcome."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "All right, well, Mickey, have a great rest of your day and thanks again. And I will be in touch through email with Mary."}]}
{"block_id": "nprc-oral-histories-00008:129", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "There's one thing that might be interesting that I just happened to think about. A lot of the states that had records on file for various reasons—a lot of states had DD 214s of people that served in the service—a lot of them had copies, and they sent them to the center so that we could create a record for a lot of veterans. And I'm sure that helped create some of the burned files. But it also put the documents in a place where they're made available for many people and for years to come."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Got it! Well, thank you so much for doing the interview. If there's nothing more that you'd like to add, I think we can close out the interview. So, thank you very, very much."}, {"role": "user", "content": "You're welcome."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "All right, well, Mickey, have a great rest of your day and thanks again. And I will be in touch through email with Mary."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Okay. You do that and I'll try to respond."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Alright. Thank you so much. Have a great day."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00128:8", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 6, "return_to_go": 66.11463352617287, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I asked Caldwell, “Okay, how many people am I authorized?” He said, “How the hell should I know? That’s up to you.” A lot of my fellow branch heads, as I put it, went out to the Gulf Freeway [Interstate 45] and stopped cars. It wasn’t quite that bad. I was very selective in picking only the people that I thought would really make a contribution. That turned out to be a bad career move, because these other guys made division chief and I never did. They would hire 30 or 40 people, and I hired six or eight. I didn’t want to get people that were more of a drag than a contributor."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you go out and recruit, or did you have people seeking employment and you were able to pick from that pool?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was a combination of those things. I called on friends. One of the people I brought in was Don [L.] Teegarden that you may have spoken with. He still lives in El Lago [Texas]. Don and I had worked together at Edwards and gotten along very well. He was working on the X-15 [airplane] program at Edwards as a propulsion engineer. The propulsion engineer at Edwards had total complete control of what was done to those engines, and they had only a tech rep [technical representative] from the contractor. They did all the work in house; so he got some really wonderful rocket engine experience. So I called up my friend Don. I said, “Don, come join me, I need you.” He came in as my deputy, which was a great blessing to me. So you might want to talk with Don sometime. He’s still there. That was an exciting 18-month or so interval."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Guess that experience in Korea working those 16-, 18-hour days paid off for here."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Well, I repeated that. I was still young enough to be able to do that then. I don’t do that anymore."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were any one of those subsystems more challenging for you than the others to get up and running in that small timeframe?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00128:24", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 44.87441430480355, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I had at most three people."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you have authority to make changes at Bethpage as the NASA representative? Or did you have to go back and have someone tell Grumman?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "If it was procedural changes and that sort of thing, I had the authority. If it was hardware changes, it had to go to the Configuration Change Board. I attended those, but the sponsor of the change was the guy that made the presentation to primarily George [M.] Low, the program manager. I’d sit close by and be there to object if something came up that I thought was going to hinder our schedule or reliability or whatever. I was in an advisory role for that rather than a deputy role."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you exchange information with the other vehicle managers and share information between you all?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "We shared information and tried to stay close together. One of the things I was proudest of on Lunar Module 5 was I made it my practice, when I was up at Bethpage checking everything out preparatory to shipping to the Cape, to make a daily telecon to the Mission Control [Center] guy that was in charge of the Lunar Module and brief him on what was taking place and the anomalies we’d had and what we’d done to resolve them. He was so appreciative of it that he made me a member of the Mission Control team and gave me one of their cups, which I have somewhere in a box. Apparently I was the first guy that had troubled himself to call them up and tell them what was going on, but I just thought that was part of the task that I had before me, and it didn’t occur to me not to do so."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It certainly seems like that would help the Mission Control team to understand if you were sharing information on a daily basis."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00128:28", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 54.289400376300684, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "We shared information and tried to stay close together. One of the things I was proudest of on Lunar Module 5 was I made it my practice, when I was up at Bethpage checking everything out preparatory to shipping to the Cape, to make a daily telecon to the Mission Control [Center] guy that was in charge of the Lunar Module and brief him on what was taking place and the anomalies we’d had and what we’d done to resolve them. He was so appreciative of it that he made me a member of the Mission Control team and gave me one of their cups, which I have somewhere in a box. Apparently I was the first guy that had troubled himself to call them up and tell them what was going on, but I just thought that was part of the task that I had before me, and it didn’t occur to me not to do so."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It certainly seems like that would help the Mission Control team to understand if you were sharing information on a daily basis."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. They needed to know these things, because they were apt to experience the same problems that we had in flight. If it occurred once, it was apt to happen again, so they needed to know what happened and what was done to correct it. I let them know those things because I thought that was part of what I was assigned to do. Never occurred to me to do otherwise, but apparently that was unique."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I understand one of your LTAs was the Eagle [Apollo 11 Lunar Module (LM)] that landed on the Moon. Can you share with us what that was like knowing that your assignment actually went to the Moon?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was scary, that’s what it was. There was a million things that could have gone wrong and didn’t. It’s been my contention for all these years that the good Lord was with us or it would not have happened. That may sound hokey to you, but I mean it quite sincerely that there was some power greater than those group of humans behind that succeeding."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I think at this recent 40th anniversary celebration, lots of people talked about so many things that went right that could have gone wrong."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00128:30", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 9, "return_to_go": 60.32155597366742, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. They needed to know these things, because they were apt to experience the same problems that we had in flight. If it occurred once, it was apt to happen again, so they needed to know what happened and what was done to correct it. I let them know those things because I thought that was part of what I was assigned to do. Never occurred to me to do otherwise, but apparently that was unique."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I understand one of your LTAs was the Eagle [Apollo 11 Lunar Module (LM)] that landed on the Moon. Can you share with us what that was like knowing that your assignment actually went to the Moon?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was scary, that’s what it was. There was a million things that could have gone wrong and didn’t. It’s been my contention for all these years that the good Lord was with us or it would not have happened. That may sound hokey to you, but I mean it quite sincerely that there was some power greater than those group of humans behind that succeeding."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I think at this recent 40th anniversary celebration, lots of people talked about so many things that went right that could have gone wrong."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That’s right, yes. So it wasn’t just skill and integrity and hard work. It was something beyond that that worked for us."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you have any insight you can share with us on how many people that had your skills and integrity? The group of engineers and the group of managers that were there worked so well together and brought this technological feat to success. But yet, as you mentioned already, so many of you had strong opinions on how things should be done. How was it able that you all came together at the end and supported each other’s decisions to create the success?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00128:40", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 1, "return_to_go": 59.23632233173707, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "“First to land on the Moon.”"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "“First to land on the Moon.”"}, {"role": "user", "content": "That was a wry note, and the reason it was wry was because achieving that meant that many of the Grumman people got laid off three months earlier than they’d all anticipated. It was a mixed blessing, so far as many people were concerned. I’ve since been told that the Russians had a vehicle in orbit with us for Apollo 11, and it turned out in recent years they found out it was an unmanned landing probe that failed. We didn’t know at the time but what it was a manned spacecraft that Russia was preparing to land while we were in orbit around the Moon before we landed."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How much information were you given about the Russians? I know that upper management was in meetings."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Very little. Very little. All I knew was that there was something in orbit with us, and they suspected it was a Russian spacecraft. They didn’t have any knowledge of whether it was manned or unmanned. They didn’t even know for sure who it belonged to."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was this after the launch that you learned this?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00128:42", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 64.70702481304119, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That was a wry note, and the reason it was wry was because achieving that meant that many of the Grumman people got laid off three months earlier than they’d all anticipated. It was a mixed blessing, so far as many people were concerned. I’ve since been told that the Russians had a vehicle in orbit with us for Apollo 11, and it turned out in recent years they found out it was an unmanned landing probe that failed. We didn’t know at the time but what it was a manned spacecraft that Russia was preparing to land while we were in orbit around the Moon before we landed."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "How much information were you given about the Russians? I know that upper management was in meetings."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Very little. Very little. All I knew was that there was something in orbit with us, and they suspected it was a Russian spacecraft. They didn’t have any knowledge of whether it was manned or unmanned. They didn’t even know for sure who it belonged to."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was this after the launch that you learned this?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was after we were in orbit around the Moon when I first heard about it. But people weren’t talking very much, because it was, I guess, considered a deep dark secret that they knew how to detect such things. We thought it was a very nip and tuck situation up until the time that Neil [A. Armstrong] put his foot on the Moon."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I find it interesting that you have worked so closely with Buzz Aldrin since then. I’m sure you’ve had a chance to talk to him about his perspective on your bird."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00128:44", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 2, "return_to_go": 71.89669423671242, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Very little. Very little. All I knew was that there was something in orbit with us, and they suspected it was a Russian spacecraft. They didn’t have any knowledge of whether it was manned or unmanned. They didn’t even know for sure who it belonged to."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Was this after the launch that you learned this?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "It was after we were in orbit around the Moon when I first heard about it. But people weren’t talking very much, because it was, I guess, considered a deep dark secret that they knew how to detect such things. We thought it was a very nip and tuck situation up until the time that Neil [A. Armstrong] put his foot on the Moon."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I find it interesting that you have worked so closely with Buzz Aldrin since then. I’m sure you’ve had a chance to talk to him about his perspective on your bird."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Not in any serious way. He’s always just made that joke about, “This is the guy that gave me an overweight Lunar Module.”"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "What an interesting, almost simple way to lessen that burden, by leaving the backpacks and the flight plans. That’s still weight, certainly nothing that they needed to return home with."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00128:52", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 95.39505294423475, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, that was another thing that went right. We got it done, and that was I think an important thing, because it’s been my contention ever since that that lunar landing was at least as important as the fall of the Berlin Wall in getting us out of the situation of being in a far worse situation than we’re in today with regard to the Russians."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Do you feel like the momentum at the Space Center changed at all after you had the first lunar landing?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Of course it did. It was almost entirely lost; it carried on just through inertia. Later, I was a party to LM-15 as my last such assignment. Because there were five of us, I went from LM-5 to LM-10 or Apollo 15. LM-10 was another interesting assignment, because the decision had been made before I was given that assignment to have Apollo 15 be the first to stay three days and to carry the [Lunar] Rover, which was a very significant modification to the vehicle. I had to look after getting those things done, which was another interesting drill. There again it worked well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you spend a lot of time at [NASA] Marshall [Space Flight Center, Huntsville, Alabama], or at all?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I didn’t worry about the Rover itself. I worried only about getting it stowed in the Lunar Module, which was not easy, having it where the flight crew could get it out and get it to work on the Moon. But the Lunar Module itself was what I was concerned with. The Lunar Rover I just steered completely away from that because it was Marshall’s responsibility, and I wasn’t about to touch it because I didn’t want any hint of my being responsible for it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I imagine you had enough to do."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00128:54", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 4, "return_to_go": 105.99450327137194, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Of course it did. It was almost entirely lost; it carried on just through inertia. Later, I was a party to LM-15 as my last such assignment. Because there were five of us, I went from LM-5 to LM-10 or Apollo 15. LM-10 was another interesting assignment, because the decision had been made before I was given that assignment to have Apollo 15 be the first to stay three days and to carry the [Lunar] Rover, which was a very significant modification to the vehicle. I had to look after getting those things done, which was another interesting drill. There again it worked well."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Did you spend a lot of time at [NASA] Marshall [Space Flight Center, Huntsville, Alabama], or at all?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I didn’t worry about the Rover itself. I worried only about getting it stowed in the Lunar Module, which was not easy, having it where the flight crew could get it out and get it to work on the Moon. But the Lunar Module itself was what I was concerned with. The Lunar Rover I just steered completely away from that because it was Marshall’s responsibility, and I wasn’t about to touch it because I didn’t want any hint of my being responsible for it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I imagine you had enough to do."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I had plenty to do without that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were a lot of modifications made to the LM at that point?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00128:56", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 9, "return_to_go": 113.32722585707994, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I didn’t worry about the Rover itself. I worried only about getting it stowed in the Lunar Module, which was not easy, having it where the flight crew could get it out and get it to work on the Moon. But the Lunar Module itself was what I was concerned with. The Lunar Rover I just steered completely away from that because it was Marshall’s responsibility, and I wasn’t about to touch it because I didn’t want any hint of my being responsible for it."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "I imagine you had enough to do."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, I had plenty to do without that."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Were a lot of modifications made to the LM at that point?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes. We had to put in additional cryogenic storage for the fuel cells, for example. We had to be sure that the ascent propulsion system, which used supercritical helium as its pressurant, was sufficiently well insulated to last for the additional time on the Moon. That system, by the way, is the only one that caused a comment to be made by George Low directed my way during the countdown for the Apollo 11 launch. There was an issue that came up between a guy at the Cape and me as to whether or not we had the ability to turn around the next day if we had to stop for some reason. The KSC guy raised alarm that no, the supercritical helium will heat it up too much, and we’d be out of limits and couldn’t go. My numbers said otherwise, so we had that discussion on the loop with George Low listening. He finally said, “You guys get off the loop and solve this offline.” We did, and I won the fuss, but that was not even necessary, because we didn’t have to wait. We launched the day we intended to. That’s some of my adventures. I hope that helps."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "It does. It reminded me—again, with the recent 40th anniversary—it came up on a couple discussions about the lack of specific knowledge on how the Lunar Module would land on what was there. Some thought maybe it would go down 10 feet into the dust."}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00128:86", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "Yes, there’s something to that. You know what the vernier thrusters are on the Orbiter?"}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Yes."}, {"role": "user", "content": "They have little tiny motors that help control it. Well, that came about from a conversation that my next door neighbor, Henry [O.] Pohl, and I had on his front yard one Sunday morning, because those 1,000-pound thrusters are just too big to give you the delicate control you need. So Henry stopped his lawn mower and he and I decided we needed to add the vernier thrusters in order to give people the finer mode of control. It would pay off greatly by conserving a lot of propellant we’d otherwise waste. There was some of that that went on. It wasn’t as frequent as you might think, because we didn’t have that much time for social life. But it did happen, and it was useful to have people living together in Nassau Bay and El Lago and Clear Lake City and the communities around there."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Must have been nice at least with the commute. You didn’t have to go very far to go home at night."}, {"role": "user", "content": "That’s right. I only had to drive three miles to work, and I had the sun at my back going and coming."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "That sounds like a good deal. Were there some other areas that you wanted to talk about before we close today?"}]}
{"block_id": "jsc-oral-history-00463:51", "domain": "oral_history", "factual_novelty_score": 0, "return_to_go": 0.0, "messages": [{"role": "system", "content": "Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history."}, {"role": "user", "content": "I’d say don’t worry about the long-term part of it, but if you have the drive and the interest in doing important work for the nation in the area of discovering unknowns, and you don’t mind long hours and hard work, you will enjoy this agency. You’ll enjoy the people you work with, because they’re all of like mind, and I think you’ll enjoy the values that we share. Now, if you’re coming here for the money, for the retirement plan, for the location of the Center, for example, forget about it. That’s not why people come to this agency. They will be disappointed in all those other things. If they’re not turned on by the mission that we have, then we probably don’t need to take them on."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "And why do you think people, the majority of people, come to this agency?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "I think the majority of people that come to this agency do so because they like the mission."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Is there anything else that we haven’t talked about on any of these subjects that you’d like to mention?"}, {"role": "user", "content": "No, I don’t think so."}, {"role": "assistant", "content": "Okay. I appreciate your time today."}]}