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65,771 | I am a recently graduated engineer and have just joined a small software company in India. Our company is divided into project teams that are further divided into groups of three people.
My first project is starting soon and I've been assigned to a group with two women. Unfortunately I'm come from a traditional background, am rather shy and was in a male-dominated college track which means that I only rarely interacted with women. While some might think this is a stupid question, I'm feeling very nervous about working together in this group.
**How should I build and maintain a professional relationship with my female coworkers?** | 2016/04/23 | [
"https://workplace.stackexchange.com/questions/65771",
"https://workplace.stackexchange.com",
"https://workplace.stackexchange.com/users/49295/"
] | Why does them being a woman have any bearing on how you interact with them in a professional workplace? To have a professional relationship, **you should interact with them in the same manner as you do with men in a professional setting - with respect.** Colleagues, irrespective of male or female, appreciate and expect professionalism, respect, and recognition for the merit of work well done.
A colleague's gender is irrelevant to how one should conduct oneself in a workplace, and no special preference should be shown in one's professional conduct **solely due to the colleague being female.** To show special deference, or to apply different standards of conduct when interacting with women **can even be perceived as insulting.** She is no different from any other colleague, other than she is a woman.
Some of the comments below say this might be dangerous or ill -advised because of one's behavior with men. **If you treat men "roughly" because its accepted within your culture, then no you should not extend this treatment to women.** As mentioned by @ Matthew Read in a comment, rather than look for the lowest common denominator and adapt to the "culture", be the change you want to see and treat all with respect.
In the end, I will borrow a quote from @ Patricia Shanahan and say this "**You should speak and interact with them just like male colleagues."** | >
> In my college days ,we had group of only boys and I rarely speak/ interact with girls.
>
>
>
Personally I am very skeptical of gender-separated education for exactly this reason: It insufficiently prepares people for interactions with the other gender which will be necessary during their work-life.
>
> How should speak / interact with them?
>
>
>
Just like you would with a male in the same professional context.
>
> Will I get trepanned by these project partners to do the whole group work alone?
>
>
>
The risk of one person doing all the work while the others lay back and get all the reward exists in any team. But that has nothing to do with gender. Remember that they need to prove themselves just as much as you do (in fact even more as they are fighting against gender bias) and can not afford to stand out as lazy either. Also, they likely went through the same education you went through, so do not assume that their skills are any better or worse than your own until you see evidence to the contrary.
>
> How should I maintain professional relationship with the opposite gender ( female) project partners?
>
>
>
Just like with any male partners. Do not flirt, do not be condescending. When you want to praise or criticize their work, be honest but [do not attribute their skill to their gender](https://xkcd.com/385/). |
65,771 | I am a recently graduated engineer and have just joined a small software company in India. Our company is divided into project teams that are further divided into groups of three people.
My first project is starting soon and I've been assigned to a group with two women. Unfortunately I'm come from a traditional background, am rather shy and was in a male-dominated college track which means that I only rarely interacted with women. While some might think this is a stupid question, I'm feeling very nervous about working together in this group.
**How should I build and maintain a professional relationship with my female coworkers?** | 2016/04/23 | [
"https://workplace.stackexchange.com/questions/65771",
"https://workplace.stackexchange.com",
"https://workplace.stackexchange.com/users/49295/"
] | As a fellow Indian, I'll offer this:
Education here works in the way that till you're in middle school(fifth grade), boys and girls are made to sit on common benches, and interaction between them is normal, as is between people of the same sex(why are people shy of using this word? It's more appropriate than gender here in meaning).
Then from middle school onward, they're made to sit separately, and even their social circles separate to the point that in high school, being near a boy/girl is seen from your peers as suspicious/ridiculous (we're just kids, I get it).
Then, all of a sudden, in college and workplaces it's expected that they should be working as a team. This'll be hard - they've had to be socially separate for the last eight years! Naturally it's hard. Also, there's the angle of changing viewpoints as you get older - Here's a quote for you(interesting thread - give it a read):
<http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/id-2565381/hell-wrong.html>
>
> **MU\_Engineer**
>
> you are about the age where they start becoming interesting instead of cootie-infested and icky
>
>
>
That's even more reason to be shy.
But I say, step out of your comfort zone. Approach and talk to them as you will with any other colleague of yours. Of course, there are some unwritten rules of etiquette with women, and follow them, they're important - but still it isn't as hard as it appears.
Another thing I'd like to say that in our culture some people are of the belief that males have been and will be inherently superior to females. Don't hold this belief. If you have any female seniors or superiors, treat them with the respect they're due. It might feel awkward at first(it did to me), but you'll get used to it eventually. And with time you'll form a relationship with everyone in the office and learn to work as a team, and that'll be a wonderful feeling when that happens.
Till then - best of luck, and congratulations on your new job! | Some of the comments suggest that treating your female coworkers the same way you would normally treat male coworkers might not be a great idea, assuming there are less-kind treatments that are acceptable in your society between men, but not from men to women.
The fact that you are concerned with treating your coworkers properly is a good thing. I suggest that you think of your question as not only about your female coworkers, but about **all** of your coworkers. They should all be treated with the same respect and professionalism. In addition, it will be much easier to train yourself to treat all of your coworkers well if you treat them **all the same way**.
You may be thinking, "Todd, surely I should treat my boss with the utmost respect, care, and professionalism!" I agree with that, you *should* treat your boss that well. So I'm suggesting that you **treat all your coworkers as well as you treat your boss(es)**.
Anything that you wouldn't say or do to your boss, don't say or do to any coworkers, male or female.
As an aside, you may very well find that learning to be on a team with two women will be a valuable personal growth experience for you. Not only will you learn how to work with people with whom you might not easily feel comfortable around (which is something we all have to do, regardless of gender), if your society does have an emphasis on traditional gender roles, then it's likely you will find your female teammates have fresh perspectives that male colleagues would not have. This is an excellent opportunity for you to grow and foster in yourself a unique perspective, that will make you a better employee and coworker and even a better person overall. |
65,771 | I am a recently graduated engineer and have just joined a small software company in India. Our company is divided into project teams that are further divided into groups of three people.
My first project is starting soon and I've been assigned to a group with two women. Unfortunately I'm come from a traditional background, am rather shy and was in a male-dominated college track which means that I only rarely interacted with women. While some might think this is a stupid question, I'm feeling very nervous about working together in this group.
**How should I build and maintain a professional relationship with my female coworkers?** | 2016/04/23 | [
"https://workplace.stackexchange.com/questions/65771",
"https://workplace.stackexchange.com",
"https://workplace.stackexchange.com/users/49295/"
] | Why does them being a woman have any bearing on how you interact with them in a professional workplace? To have a professional relationship, **you should interact with them in the same manner as you do with men in a professional setting - with respect.** Colleagues, irrespective of male or female, appreciate and expect professionalism, respect, and recognition for the merit of work well done.
A colleague's gender is irrelevant to how one should conduct oneself in a workplace, and no special preference should be shown in one's professional conduct **solely due to the colleague being female.** To show special deference, or to apply different standards of conduct when interacting with women **can even be perceived as insulting.** She is no different from any other colleague, other than she is a woman.
Some of the comments below say this might be dangerous or ill -advised because of one's behavior with men. **If you treat men "roughly" because its accepted within your culture, then no you should not extend this treatment to women.** As mentioned by @ Matthew Read in a comment, rather than look for the lowest common denominator and adapt to the "culture", be the change you want to see and treat all with respect.
In the end, I will borrow a quote from @ Patricia Shanahan and say this "**You should speak and interact with them just like male colleagues."** | Some of the comments suggest that treating your female coworkers the same way you would normally treat male coworkers might not be a great idea, assuming there are less-kind treatments that are acceptable in your society between men, but not from men to women.
The fact that you are concerned with treating your coworkers properly is a good thing. I suggest that you think of your question as not only about your female coworkers, but about **all** of your coworkers. They should all be treated with the same respect and professionalism. In addition, it will be much easier to train yourself to treat all of your coworkers well if you treat them **all the same way**.
You may be thinking, "Todd, surely I should treat my boss with the utmost respect, care, and professionalism!" I agree with that, you *should* treat your boss that well. So I'm suggesting that you **treat all your coworkers as well as you treat your boss(es)**.
Anything that you wouldn't say or do to your boss, don't say or do to any coworkers, male or female.
As an aside, you may very well find that learning to be on a team with two women will be a valuable personal growth experience for you. Not only will you learn how to work with people with whom you might not easily feel comfortable around (which is something we all have to do, regardless of gender), if your society does have an emphasis on traditional gender roles, then it's likely you will find your female teammates have fresh perspectives that male colleagues would not have. This is an excellent opportunity for you to grow and foster in yourself a unique perspective, that will make you a better employee and coworker and even a better person overall. |
65,771 | I am a recently graduated engineer and have just joined a small software company in India. Our company is divided into project teams that are further divided into groups of three people.
My first project is starting soon and I've been assigned to a group with two women. Unfortunately I'm come from a traditional background, am rather shy and was in a male-dominated college track which means that I only rarely interacted with women. While some might think this is a stupid question, I'm feeling very nervous about working together in this group.
**How should I build and maintain a professional relationship with my female coworkers?** | 2016/04/23 | [
"https://workplace.stackexchange.com/questions/65771",
"https://workplace.stackexchange.com",
"https://workplace.stackexchange.com/users/49295/"
] | Just try to be "normal" as you are with your male friends or neighbors etc.
DO not try to shy away. Speak with them casually , informally as friends.
In about 2-3 weeks you will start feeling comfortable with them. in about 3-4 months , you will forget about all your shyness. Relax and do not put any pressure on yourself. | Why does them being a woman have any bearing on how you interact with them in a professional workplace? To have a professional relationship, **you should interact with them in the same manner as you do with men in a professional setting - with respect.** Colleagues, irrespective of male or female, appreciate and expect professionalism, respect, and recognition for the merit of work well done.
A colleague's gender is irrelevant to how one should conduct oneself in a workplace, and no special preference should be shown in one's professional conduct **solely due to the colleague being female.** To show special deference, or to apply different standards of conduct when interacting with women **can even be perceived as insulting.** She is no different from any other colleague, other than she is a woman.
Some of the comments below say this might be dangerous or ill -advised because of one's behavior with men. **If you treat men "roughly" because its accepted within your culture, then no you should not extend this treatment to women.** As mentioned by @ Matthew Read in a comment, rather than look for the lowest common denominator and adapt to the "culture", be the change you want to see and treat all with respect.
In the end, I will borrow a quote from @ Patricia Shanahan and say this "**You should speak and interact with them just like male colleagues."** |
65,771 | I am a recently graduated engineer and have just joined a small software company in India. Our company is divided into project teams that are further divided into groups of three people.
My first project is starting soon and I've been assigned to a group with two women. Unfortunately I'm come from a traditional background, am rather shy and was in a male-dominated college track which means that I only rarely interacted with women. While some might think this is a stupid question, I'm feeling very nervous about working together in this group.
**How should I build and maintain a professional relationship with my female coworkers?** | 2016/04/23 | [
"https://workplace.stackexchange.com/questions/65771",
"https://workplace.stackexchange.com",
"https://workplace.stackexchange.com/users/49295/"
] | As a fellow Indian, I'll offer this:
Education here works in the way that till you're in middle school(fifth grade), boys and girls are made to sit on common benches, and interaction between them is normal, as is between people of the same sex(why are people shy of using this word? It's more appropriate than gender here in meaning).
Then from middle school onward, they're made to sit separately, and even their social circles separate to the point that in high school, being near a boy/girl is seen from your peers as suspicious/ridiculous (we're just kids, I get it).
Then, all of a sudden, in college and workplaces it's expected that they should be working as a team. This'll be hard - they've had to be socially separate for the last eight years! Naturally it's hard. Also, there's the angle of changing viewpoints as you get older - Here's a quote for you(interesting thread - give it a read):
<http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/id-2565381/hell-wrong.html>
>
> **MU\_Engineer**
>
> you are about the age where they start becoming interesting instead of cootie-infested and icky
>
>
>
That's even more reason to be shy.
But I say, step out of your comfort zone. Approach and talk to them as you will with any other colleague of yours. Of course, there are some unwritten rules of etiquette with women, and follow them, they're important - but still it isn't as hard as it appears.
Another thing I'd like to say that in our culture some people are of the belief that males have been and will be inherently superior to females. Don't hold this belief. If you have any female seniors or superiors, treat them with the respect they're due. It might feel awkward at first(it did to me), but you'll get used to it eventually. And with time you'll form a relationship with everyone in the office and learn to work as a team, and that'll be a wonderful feeling when that happens.
Till then - best of luck, and congratulations on your new job! | Why does them being a woman have any bearing on how you interact with them in a professional workplace? To have a professional relationship, **you should interact with them in the same manner as you do with men in a professional setting - with respect.** Colleagues, irrespective of male or female, appreciate and expect professionalism, respect, and recognition for the merit of work well done.
A colleague's gender is irrelevant to how one should conduct oneself in a workplace, and no special preference should be shown in one's professional conduct **solely due to the colleague being female.** To show special deference, or to apply different standards of conduct when interacting with women **can even be perceived as insulting.** She is no different from any other colleague, other than she is a woman.
Some of the comments below say this might be dangerous or ill -advised because of one's behavior with men. **If you treat men "roughly" because its accepted within your culture, then no you should not extend this treatment to women.** As mentioned by @ Matthew Read in a comment, rather than look for the lowest common denominator and adapt to the "culture", be the change you want to see and treat all with respect.
In the end, I will borrow a quote from @ Patricia Shanahan and say this "**You should speak and interact with them just like male colleagues."** |
65,771 | I am a recently graduated engineer and have just joined a small software company in India. Our company is divided into project teams that are further divided into groups of three people.
My first project is starting soon and I've been assigned to a group with two women. Unfortunately I'm come from a traditional background, am rather shy and was in a male-dominated college track which means that I only rarely interacted with women. While some might think this is a stupid question, I'm feeling very nervous about working together in this group.
**How should I build and maintain a professional relationship with my female coworkers?** | 2016/04/23 | [
"https://workplace.stackexchange.com/questions/65771",
"https://workplace.stackexchange.com",
"https://workplace.stackexchange.com/users/49295/"
] | Just try to be "normal" as you are with your male friends or neighbors etc.
DO not try to shy away. Speak with them casually , informally as friends.
In about 2-3 weeks you will start feeling comfortable with them. in about 3-4 months , you will forget about all your shyness. Relax and do not put any pressure on yourself. | >
> In my college days ,we had group of only boys and I rarely speak/ interact with girls.
>
>
>
Personally I am very skeptical of gender-separated education for exactly this reason: It insufficiently prepares people for interactions with the other gender which will be necessary during their work-life.
>
> How should speak / interact with them?
>
>
>
Just like you would with a male in the same professional context.
>
> Will I get trepanned by these project partners to do the whole group work alone?
>
>
>
The risk of one person doing all the work while the others lay back and get all the reward exists in any team. But that has nothing to do with gender. Remember that they need to prove themselves just as much as you do (in fact even more as they are fighting against gender bias) and can not afford to stand out as lazy either. Also, they likely went through the same education you went through, so do not assume that their skills are any better or worse than your own until you see evidence to the contrary.
>
> How should I maintain professional relationship with the opposite gender ( female) project partners?
>
>
>
Just like with any male partners. Do not flirt, do not be condescending. When you want to praise or criticize their work, be honest but [do not attribute their skill to their gender](https://xkcd.com/385/). |
65,771 | I am a recently graduated engineer and have just joined a small software company in India. Our company is divided into project teams that are further divided into groups of three people.
My first project is starting soon and I've been assigned to a group with two women. Unfortunately I'm come from a traditional background, am rather shy and was in a male-dominated college track which means that I only rarely interacted with women. While some might think this is a stupid question, I'm feeling very nervous about working together in this group.
**How should I build and maintain a professional relationship with my female coworkers?** | 2016/04/23 | [
"https://workplace.stackexchange.com/questions/65771",
"https://workplace.stackexchange.com",
"https://workplace.stackexchange.com/users/49295/"
] | Just try to be "normal" as you are with your male friends or neighbors etc.
DO not try to shy away. Speak with them casually , informally as friends.
In about 2-3 weeks you will start feeling comfortable with them. in about 3-4 months , you will forget about all your shyness. Relax and do not put any pressure on yourself. | Some of the comments suggest that treating your female coworkers the same way you would normally treat male coworkers might not be a great idea, assuming there are less-kind treatments that are acceptable in your society between men, but not from men to women.
The fact that you are concerned with treating your coworkers properly is a good thing. I suggest that you think of your question as not only about your female coworkers, but about **all** of your coworkers. They should all be treated with the same respect and professionalism. In addition, it will be much easier to train yourself to treat all of your coworkers well if you treat them **all the same way**.
You may be thinking, "Todd, surely I should treat my boss with the utmost respect, care, and professionalism!" I agree with that, you *should* treat your boss that well. So I'm suggesting that you **treat all your coworkers as well as you treat your boss(es)**.
Anything that you wouldn't say or do to your boss, don't say or do to any coworkers, male or female.
As an aside, you may very well find that learning to be on a team with two women will be a valuable personal growth experience for you. Not only will you learn how to work with people with whom you might not easily feel comfortable around (which is something we all have to do, regardless of gender), if your society does have an emphasis on traditional gender roles, then it's likely you will find your female teammates have fresh perspectives that male colleagues would not have. This is an excellent opportunity for you to grow and foster in yourself a unique perspective, that will make you a better employee and coworker and even a better person overall. |
65,771 | I am a recently graduated engineer and have just joined a small software company in India. Our company is divided into project teams that are further divided into groups of three people.
My first project is starting soon and I've been assigned to a group with two women. Unfortunately I'm come from a traditional background, am rather shy and was in a male-dominated college track which means that I only rarely interacted with women. While some might think this is a stupid question, I'm feeling very nervous about working together in this group.
**How should I build and maintain a professional relationship with my female coworkers?** | 2016/04/23 | [
"https://workplace.stackexchange.com/questions/65771",
"https://workplace.stackexchange.com",
"https://workplace.stackexchange.com/users/49295/"
] | Why does them being a woman have any bearing on how you interact with them in a professional workplace? To have a professional relationship, **you should interact with them in the same manner as you do with men in a professional setting - with respect.** Colleagues, irrespective of male or female, appreciate and expect professionalism, respect, and recognition for the merit of work well done.
A colleague's gender is irrelevant to how one should conduct oneself in a workplace, and no special preference should be shown in one's professional conduct **solely due to the colleague being female.** To show special deference, or to apply different standards of conduct when interacting with women **can even be perceived as insulting.** She is no different from any other colleague, other than she is a woman.
Some of the comments below say this might be dangerous or ill -advised because of one's behavior with men. **If you treat men "roughly" because its accepted within your culture, then no you should not extend this treatment to women.** As mentioned by @ Matthew Read in a comment, rather than look for the lowest common denominator and adapt to the "culture", be the change you want to see and treat all with respect.
In the end, I will borrow a quote from @ Patricia Shanahan and say this "**You should speak and interact with them just like male colleagues."** | **TL;DR**
You're a human being. Human beings feel naturally uncomfortable when experiencing physical and or emotional attraction to another, and you're not wrong in asking this question or feeling the way you do. Keep it professional, respect the equality you share, and respect the differences between your genders.
**Long Version - Make sure to keep hydrated.**
As a complimentary answer, there's something that you need to take into consideration when reading the answers here. From the looks of it, these answers are coming from a "Western" cultural perspective. You need to understand that in this cultural/world view, even the language that you use to ask this question is cause for many from this sphere to get really upset. Heck, they might even go so far as to create a new trending hashtag on twitter (oh my goodness watch out, here comes #YoureNotAllowedToBeShy).
We're bored, or something of this nature in "the west". My theory is that since we stopped striving to increase in knowledge and pursuit of discovery, and turned to pointless consumerism and 60 hour work weeks to support the consumerism machine, we have nothing better to do than find a "cause" to take up. In this case, you're kicking at the nest of those who have taken up the cause of gender equality.
Equality is great, equal wages are great, all these things are great and there was a time when this cause was a good one. In this day and age however, this cause has turned radical. Case in point is people like my wife, who are stay at home mothers, are described on popular media with a vulgar tone and being told that women like her can "go make a sandwich, b\*\*\*ch" by television hosts like Ana Kasparian (Young Turks). Gender equality in the west has actually turned into the same sexism that it started out to prevent.
Anyway, it's offensive to suggest that you'd feel different or uncomfortable being a heterosexual male working closely with a female simply because of this very volatile cultural phenomenon that's taking place. So, you're going to get answers that basically tell you to treat them like a man and more than that, a man that has authority over you. I agree with [Learner\_101](https://workplace.stackexchange.com/a/65774/41761)'s answer, but would suggest that you don't go completely informal.
Respect your culture, where there is a clear difference between a man and a woman. Obviously women are equal in the fact that they deserve every bit of opportunity and respect that you do, but they are in fact different. Respect that part of your culture, treat them with the kind of delicacy and respect that a gentleman would. Again, because of this psychotic western issue, I have to explicitly clarify that "delicacy" does not mean treat them as if they are weak. I mean this in the sense that you honor and respect the things that are different about them, differences that they most certainly are proud to identify themselves by.
Be calm, be yourself, be professional. Definitely don't act casual as if they are "men", and let me explain. When men are casual around other men, especially in a work environment, we're usually obnoxious and rough with our verbal and body language. I'd argue that, especially in your culture, women are not this way. Again, a difference between men and women that is perfectly fine! So, consider this, conduct yourself in a way that is respectful of the differences between you, while also embracing and respecting the equality you both share.
As for the other answers and comments here that are telling you that there's basically something wrong with you or that your feelings are sexist, well now you know why I wrote this long answer. They're dead wrong, the majority of human beings are heterosexual and when these human beings are around members of the opposite sex, they're generally going to feel some degree of attraction, and feeling uncomfortable when experiencing these feelings is also as old and normal as humanity itself. That is absolutely not wrong. These people need to give being human a try, then they'll change their perspective.
Thank you for asking this question and navigating the minefield that is the western idea of morality and social justice. |
74,040 | Is the following a correct past perfect sentence?
>
> I would have killed the snake if I had hit him hard with a stick.
>
>
> | 2012/07/10 | [
"https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/74040",
"https://english.stackexchange.com",
"https://english.stackexchange.com/users/23330/"
] | It is a perfectly normal English construction and is an example of what foreign learners are sometimes taught as the Third Conditional. The speaker imagines something that didn't actually happen (in this case, he didn't hit the snake) and speculates what the consequence would have been if it had happened (he would have killed the snake). | Yes, it is. It's the third conditional, where you talk about an action in the past that didn't take place. Aside from that, you are missing *the* or *a* in your sentence.
>
> I would have killed the snake if I had hit him hard with **the or a** stick.
>
>
> |
56,619 | I am working on a Final Cut Server setup with an associate and one of the things we need to do is setup XSan2 with two Apple XServe RAID units.
I am able to get into the RAID Administrator and configure arrays etc, however regardless of the configuration I set I am unable to have the LUNs presented to XSan in order to tag them for a storage pool.
I have tried:
* Blank configuration (No Arrays)
* RAID5 array
* JBOD configuration (this I would expect to work, however.. no)
Unfortunately I can't seem to find the information I need in the XSan or XServe RAID documentation, and the same goes for web searches and looking through the training books from Peach Pit.
**To elaborate on our setup**:
* We have 4x Apple XServe servers, two with Fiber cards which will the the XSan Metadata controllers (1x master, 1x backup)
* We have two Apple XServe RAID units with a total capacity (approx.) of 2.75Tb for each controller.
* We have a fiber switch interconnecting the 2x Metadata Controllers, the 4x RAID controllers, plus, when we've installed the system, 2x Mac Pro edit suites for Edit-in place.
* There is also a Gigabit switch for connecting the servers and the RAID controllers for management.
Essentially we will have the two remaining XServes running as QMaster nodes interfacing with Finalcut server. The Edit Suites will be direcly attached to the SAN via Fiber on the same fabric as the servers. QMatic nodes and regular workstations will access the data over AFP shares, though if the QMatic machines are experiencing bottlenecks with disk access we can upgrade them to be attached via the Fabric.
In regards to the LUN tagging for the storage pools we have the following planned:
* HD Video configuration (Metadata/Journal, Video, Audio and Other tags)
* 1x 80gb Mirror for Metadata/Journal
* 2x 2.75Tb RAID5 arrays for Video
* 1x 2.75Tb RAID5 array for Audio
* 1x 1.xxTB RAID5 array for Other
Anyone know how to make this stuff hum? | 2009/08/20 | [
"https://serverfault.com/questions/56619",
"https://serverfault.com",
"https://serverfault.com/users/1263/"
] | Remember that a differential is not the same as an incremental. For example, if you have a 100MB database, and make 5MB of changes, each differential backup will be at least 5MB. With Incremental, if you have a 100MB database and make 5MB of changes on Monday, and no changes on Tuesday, you'll have a 100MB full backup, a 5MB incremental for Monday, and a small sub 1MB backup for Tuesday.
For differential, if you have 100MB database, and do 5, 1, 3, and 5MB of changes over the next 4 days, you will have differential backups of 5, 6, 9, and 14MB. | Are you *entirely certain* that there is no activity on that database at all? Perhaps you could run profiler to see if there's anything happening that you aren't expecting, and also check maintenance plans or scheduled tasks for anything there that might be modifying data.
That said... I realize I don't have a true answer. The daily differentials I do on one particular database (~6GB) always increase over the weekend, even when there is theoretically nobody logged into the application that uses the database. I haven't bothered to look into it as I know that there are services on that server that occasionally read/write to that database on demand, though infrequently. |
56,619 | I am working on a Final Cut Server setup with an associate and one of the things we need to do is setup XSan2 with two Apple XServe RAID units.
I am able to get into the RAID Administrator and configure arrays etc, however regardless of the configuration I set I am unable to have the LUNs presented to XSan in order to tag them for a storage pool.
I have tried:
* Blank configuration (No Arrays)
* RAID5 array
* JBOD configuration (this I would expect to work, however.. no)
Unfortunately I can't seem to find the information I need in the XSan or XServe RAID documentation, and the same goes for web searches and looking through the training books from Peach Pit.
**To elaborate on our setup**:
* We have 4x Apple XServe servers, two with Fiber cards which will the the XSan Metadata controllers (1x master, 1x backup)
* We have two Apple XServe RAID units with a total capacity (approx.) of 2.75Tb for each controller.
* We have a fiber switch interconnecting the 2x Metadata Controllers, the 4x RAID controllers, plus, when we've installed the system, 2x Mac Pro edit suites for Edit-in place.
* There is also a Gigabit switch for connecting the servers and the RAID controllers for management.
Essentially we will have the two remaining XServes running as QMaster nodes interfacing with Finalcut server. The Edit Suites will be direcly attached to the SAN via Fiber on the same fabric as the servers. QMatic nodes and regular workstations will access the data over AFP shares, though if the QMatic machines are experiencing bottlenecks with disk access we can upgrade them to be attached via the Fabric.
In regards to the LUN tagging for the storage pools we have the following planned:
* HD Video configuration (Metadata/Journal, Video, Audio and Other tags)
* 1x 80gb Mirror for Metadata/Journal
* 2x 2.75Tb RAID5 arrays for Video
* 1x 2.75Tb RAID5 array for Audio
* 1x 1.xxTB RAID5 array for Other
Anyone know how to make this stuff hum? | 2009/08/20 | [
"https://serverfault.com/questions/56619",
"https://serverfault.com",
"https://serverfault.com/users/1263/"
] | **Something is changing your database!**
Things like index rebuilds or defrags will cause page changes. Changes that are rolled back may have changed pages, so they count as well.
In addition differential backups are considered 'fuzzy' and so will have transaction log data in the backup, which it needs for consistency.
Paul Randal wrote a [very cool script](http://www.sqlskills.com/BLOGS/PAUL/post/New-script-How-much-of-the-database-has-changed-since-the-last-full-backup.aspx) a while back that will tell you how many extents have changed since your last full backup, so you can use this to calculate how big your differential is going to be.
In addition, you should be able to use this script to tell you what pages have changed in your db. This may help you solve your changing data mystery. | Remember that a differential is not the same as an incremental. For example, if you have a 100MB database, and make 5MB of changes, each differential backup will be at least 5MB. With Incremental, if you have a 100MB database and make 5MB of changes on Monday, and no changes on Tuesday, you'll have a 100MB full backup, a 5MB incremental for Monday, and a small sub 1MB backup for Tuesday.
For differential, if you have 100MB database, and do 5, 1, 3, and 5MB of changes over the next 4 days, you will have differential backups of 5, 6, 9, and 14MB. |
56,619 | I am working on a Final Cut Server setup with an associate and one of the things we need to do is setup XSan2 with two Apple XServe RAID units.
I am able to get into the RAID Administrator and configure arrays etc, however regardless of the configuration I set I am unable to have the LUNs presented to XSan in order to tag them for a storage pool.
I have tried:
* Blank configuration (No Arrays)
* RAID5 array
* JBOD configuration (this I would expect to work, however.. no)
Unfortunately I can't seem to find the information I need in the XSan or XServe RAID documentation, and the same goes for web searches and looking through the training books from Peach Pit.
**To elaborate on our setup**:
* We have 4x Apple XServe servers, two with Fiber cards which will the the XSan Metadata controllers (1x master, 1x backup)
* We have two Apple XServe RAID units with a total capacity (approx.) of 2.75Tb for each controller.
* We have a fiber switch interconnecting the 2x Metadata Controllers, the 4x RAID controllers, plus, when we've installed the system, 2x Mac Pro edit suites for Edit-in place.
* There is also a Gigabit switch for connecting the servers and the RAID controllers for management.
Essentially we will have the two remaining XServes running as QMaster nodes interfacing with Finalcut server. The Edit Suites will be direcly attached to the SAN via Fiber on the same fabric as the servers. QMatic nodes and regular workstations will access the data over AFP shares, though if the QMatic machines are experiencing bottlenecks with disk access we can upgrade them to be attached via the Fabric.
In regards to the LUN tagging for the storage pools we have the following planned:
* HD Video configuration (Metadata/Journal, Video, Audio and Other tags)
* 1x 80gb Mirror for Metadata/Journal
* 2x 2.75Tb RAID5 arrays for Video
* 1x 2.75Tb RAID5 array for Audio
* 1x 1.xxTB RAID5 array for Other
Anyone know how to make this stuff hum? | 2009/08/20 | [
"https://serverfault.com/questions/56619",
"https://serverfault.com",
"https://serverfault.com/users/1263/"
] | Remember that a differential is not the same as an incremental. For example, if you have a 100MB database, and make 5MB of changes, each differential backup will be at least 5MB. With Incremental, if you have a 100MB database and make 5MB of changes on Monday, and no changes on Tuesday, you'll have a 100MB full backup, a 5MB incremental for Monday, and a small sub 1MB backup for Tuesday.
For differential, if you have 100MB database, and do 5, 1, 3, and 5MB of changes over the next 4 days, you will have differential backups of 5, 6, 9, and 14MB. | A differential backup backs up 8K pages that have been "touched".
If all your changes are small and in the same area, you'll have a small backup. Which is unlikely.
A differential backup may not grow if you keep dirtying the same pages (also unlikely)
Some things that will dirty a page:
* Statistics are updated (stored in system tables which have pages allocated)
* Indexes are rebuilt (lots of data shuffled around)
* Page splits of data (which means 4 dirty pages for 2 small inserts)
* ... and page splits of index structures |
56,619 | I am working on a Final Cut Server setup with an associate and one of the things we need to do is setup XSan2 with two Apple XServe RAID units.
I am able to get into the RAID Administrator and configure arrays etc, however regardless of the configuration I set I am unable to have the LUNs presented to XSan in order to tag them for a storage pool.
I have tried:
* Blank configuration (No Arrays)
* RAID5 array
* JBOD configuration (this I would expect to work, however.. no)
Unfortunately I can't seem to find the information I need in the XSan or XServe RAID documentation, and the same goes for web searches and looking through the training books from Peach Pit.
**To elaborate on our setup**:
* We have 4x Apple XServe servers, two with Fiber cards which will the the XSan Metadata controllers (1x master, 1x backup)
* We have two Apple XServe RAID units with a total capacity (approx.) of 2.75Tb for each controller.
* We have a fiber switch interconnecting the 2x Metadata Controllers, the 4x RAID controllers, plus, when we've installed the system, 2x Mac Pro edit suites for Edit-in place.
* There is also a Gigabit switch for connecting the servers and the RAID controllers for management.
Essentially we will have the two remaining XServes running as QMaster nodes interfacing with Finalcut server. The Edit Suites will be direcly attached to the SAN via Fiber on the same fabric as the servers. QMatic nodes and regular workstations will access the data over AFP shares, though if the QMatic machines are experiencing bottlenecks with disk access we can upgrade them to be attached via the Fabric.
In regards to the LUN tagging for the storage pools we have the following planned:
* HD Video configuration (Metadata/Journal, Video, Audio and Other tags)
* 1x 80gb Mirror for Metadata/Journal
* 2x 2.75Tb RAID5 arrays for Video
* 1x 2.75Tb RAID5 array for Audio
* 1x 1.xxTB RAID5 array for Other
Anyone know how to make this stuff hum? | 2009/08/20 | [
"https://serverfault.com/questions/56619",
"https://serverfault.com",
"https://serverfault.com/users/1263/"
] | Remember that a differential is not the same as an incremental. For example, if you have a 100MB database, and make 5MB of changes, each differential backup will be at least 5MB. With Incremental, if you have a 100MB database and make 5MB of changes on Monday, and no changes on Tuesday, you'll have a 100MB full backup, a 5MB incremental for Monday, and a small sub 1MB backup for Tuesday.
For differential, if you have 100MB database, and do 5, 1, 3, and 5MB of changes over the next 4 days, you will have differential backups of 5, 6, 9, and 14MB. | I am (basically a java developer) facing the same prob that my live db is 7.5 GB and its diff backups per day are 1.5 GB. (in fact we take diff backups for 1 hr) When i ran randy's script for the half day (i.e at lunch time which is half of a complete business day) I got following output:
total change percentage
125658 17169 13.66
I am sure this is a old application and very few ppl use this but how can this be possible to show 17169 changed extents which is causing: 17169 \* 64k => 1098.816 MB (nearly 1GB differential) for such a less used application. Please share your ideas on this...how can I debug this further ?? I mean how can I reduce extents further down to get small differentials. |
56,619 | I am working on a Final Cut Server setup with an associate and one of the things we need to do is setup XSan2 with two Apple XServe RAID units.
I am able to get into the RAID Administrator and configure arrays etc, however regardless of the configuration I set I am unable to have the LUNs presented to XSan in order to tag them for a storage pool.
I have tried:
* Blank configuration (No Arrays)
* RAID5 array
* JBOD configuration (this I would expect to work, however.. no)
Unfortunately I can't seem to find the information I need in the XSan or XServe RAID documentation, and the same goes for web searches and looking through the training books from Peach Pit.
**To elaborate on our setup**:
* We have 4x Apple XServe servers, two with Fiber cards which will the the XSan Metadata controllers (1x master, 1x backup)
* We have two Apple XServe RAID units with a total capacity (approx.) of 2.75Tb for each controller.
* We have a fiber switch interconnecting the 2x Metadata Controllers, the 4x RAID controllers, plus, when we've installed the system, 2x Mac Pro edit suites for Edit-in place.
* There is also a Gigabit switch for connecting the servers and the RAID controllers for management.
Essentially we will have the two remaining XServes running as QMaster nodes interfacing with Finalcut server. The Edit Suites will be direcly attached to the SAN via Fiber on the same fabric as the servers. QMatic nodes and regular workstations will access the data over AFP shares, though if the QMatic machines are experiencing bottlenecks with disk access we can upgrade them to be attached via the Fabric.
In regards to the LUN tagging for the storage pools we have the following planned:
* HD Video configuration (Metadata/Journal, Video, Audio and Other tags)
* 1x 80gb Mirror for Metadata/Journal
* 2x 2.75Tb RAID5 arrays for Video
* 1x 2.75Tb RAID5 array for Audio
* 1x 1.xxTB RAID5 array for Other
Anyone know how to make this stuff hum? | 2009/08/20 | [
"https://serverfault.com/questions/56619",
"https://serverfault.com",
"https://serverfault.com/users/1263/"
] | **Something is changing your database!**
Things like index rebuilds or defrags will cause page changes. Changes that are rolled back may have changed pages, so they count as well.
In addition differential backups are considered 'fuzzy' and so will have transaction log data in the backup, which it needs for consistency.
Paul Randal wrote a [very cool script](http://www.sqlskills.com/BLOGS/PAUL/post/New-script-How-much-of-the-database-has-changed-since-the-last-full-backup.aspx) a while back that will tell you how many extents have changed since your last full backup, so you can use this to calculate how big your differential is going to be.
In addition, you should be able to use this script to tell you what pages have changed in your db. This may help you solve your changing data mystery. | Are you *entirely certain* that there is no activity on that database at all? Perhaps you could run profiler to see if there's anything happening that you aren't expecting, and also check maintenance plans or scheduled tasks for anything there that might be modifying data.
That said... I realize I don't have a true answer. The daily differentials I do on one particular database (~6GB) always increase over the weekend, even when there is theoretically nobody logged into the application that uses the database. I haven't bothered to look into it as I know that there are services on that server that occasionally read/write to that database on demand, though infrequently. |
56,619 | I am working on a Final Cut Server setup with an associate and one of the things we need to do is setup XSan2 with two Apple XServe RAID units.
I am able to get into the RAID Administrator and configure arrays etc, however regardless of the configuration I set I am unable to have the LUNs presented to XSan in order to tag them for a storage pool.
I have tried:
* Blank configuration (No Arrays)
* RAID5 array
* JBOD configuration (this I would expect to work, however.. no)
Unfortunately I can't seem to find the information I need in the XSan or XServe RAID documentation, and the same goes for web searches and looking through the training books from Peach Pit.
**To elaborate on our setup**:
* We have 4x Apple XServe servers, two with Fiber cards which will the the XSan Metadata controllers (1x master, 1x backup)
* We have two Apple XServe RAID units with a total capacity (approx.) of 2.75Tb for each controller.
* We have a fiber switch interconnecting the 2x Metadata Controllers, the 4x RAID controllers, plus, when we've installed the system, 2x Mac Pro edit suites for Edit-in place.
* There is also a Gigabit switch for connecting the servers and the RAID controllers for management.
Essentially we will have the two remaining XServes running as QMaster nodes interfacing with Finalcut server. The Edit Suites will be direcly attached to the SAN via Fiber on the same fabric as the servers. QMatic nodes and regular workstations will access the data over AFP shares, though if the QMatic machines are experiencing bottlenecks with disk access we can upgrade them to be attached via the Fabric.
In regards to the LUN tagging for the storage pools we have the following planned:
* HD Video configuration (Metadata/Journal, Video, Audio and Other tags)
* 1x 80gb Mirror for Metadata/Journal
* 2x 2.75Tb RAID5 arrays for Video
* 1x 2.75Tb RAID5 array for Audio
* 1x 1.xxTB RAID5 array for Other
Anyone know how to make this stuff hum? | 2009/08/20 | [
"https://serverfault.com/questions/56619",
"https://serverfault.com",
"https://serverfault.com/users/1263/"
] | Are you *entirely certain* that there is no activity on that database at all? Perhaps you could run profiler to see if there's anything happening that you aren't expecting, and also check maintenance plans or scheduled tasks for anything there that might be modifying data.
That said... I realize I don't have a true answer. The daily differentials I do on one particular database (~6GB) always increase over the weekend, even when there is theoretically nobody logged into the application that uses the database. I haven't bothered to look into it as I know that there are services on that server that occasionally read/write to that database on demand, though infrequently. | I am (basically a java developer) facing the same prob that my live db is 7.5 GB and its diff backups per day are 1.5 GB. (in fact we take diff backups for 1 hr) When i ran randy's script for the half day (i.e at lunch time which is half of a complete business day) I got following output:
total change percentage
125658 17169 13.66
I am sure this is a old application and very few ppl use this but how can this be possible to show 17169 changed extents which is causing: 17169 \* 64k => 1098.816 MB (nearly 1GB differential) for such a less used application. Please share your ideas on this...how can I debug this further ?? I mean how can I reduce extents further down to get small differentials. |
56,619 | I am working on a Final Cut Server setup with an associate and one of the things we need to do is setup XSan2 with two Apple XServe RAID units.
I am able to get into the RAID Administrator and configure arrays etc, however regardless of the configuration I set I am unable to have the LUNs presented to XSan in order to tag them for a storage pool.
I have tried:
* Blank configuration (No Arrays)
* RAID5 array
* JBOD configuration (this I would expect to work, however.. no)
Unfortunately I can't seem to find the information I need in the XSan or XServe RAID documentation, and the same goes for web searches and looking through the training books from Peach Pit.
**To elaborate on our setup**:
* We have 4x Apple XServe servers, two with Fiber cards which will the the XSan Metadata controllers (1x master, 1x backup)
* We have two Apple XServe RAID units with a total capacity (approx.) of 2.75Tb for each controller.
* We have a fiber switch interconnecting the 2x Metadata Controllers, the 4x RAID controllers, plus, when we've installed the system, 2x Mac Pro edit suites for Edit-in place.
* There is also a Gigabit switch for connecting the servers and the RAID controllers for management.
Essentially we will have the two remaining XServes running as QMaster nodes interfacing with Finalcut server. The Edit Suites will be direcly attached to the SAN via Fiber on the same fabric as the servers. QMatic nodes and regular workstations will access the data over AFP shares, though if the QMatic machines are experiencing bottlenecks with disk access we can upgrade them to be attached via the Fabric.
In regards to the LUN tagging for the storage pools we have the following planned:
* HD Video configuration (Metadata/Journal, Video, Audio and Other tags)
* 1x 80gb Mirror for Metadata/Journal
* 2x 2.75Tb RAID5 arrays for Video
* 1x 2.75Tb RAID5 array for Audio
* 1x 1.xxTB RAID5 array for Other
Anyone know how to make this stuff hum? | 2009/08/20 | [
"https://serverfault.com/questions/56619",
"https://serverfault.com",
"https://serverfault.com/users/1263/"
] | **Something is changing your database!**
Things like index rebuilds or defrags will cause page changes. Changes that are rolled back may have changed pages, so they count as well.
In addition differential backups are considered 'fuzzy' and so will have transaction log data in the backup, which it needs for consistency.
Paul Randal wrote a [very cool script](http://www.sqlskills.com/BLOGS/PAUL/post/New-script-How-much-of-the-database-has-changed-since-the-last-full-backup.aspx) a while back that will tell you how many extents have changed since your last full backup, so you can use this to calculate how big your differential is going to be.
In addition, you should be able to use this script to tell you what pages have changed in your db. This may help you solve your changing data mystery. | A differential backup backs up 8K pages that have been "touched".
If all your changes are small and in the same area, you'll have a small backup. Which is unlikely.
A differential backup may not grow if you keep dirtying the same pages (also unlikely)
Some things that will dirty a page:
* Statistics are updated (stored in system tables which have pages allocated)
* Indexes are rebuilt (lots of data shuffled around)
* Page splits of data (which means 4 dirty pages for 2 small inserts)
* ... and page splits of index structures |
56,619 | I am working on a Final Cut Server setup with an associate and one of the things we need to do is setup XSan2 with two Apple XServe RAID units.
I am able to get into the RAID Administrator and configure arrays etc, however regardless of the configuration I set I am unable to have the LUNs presented to XSan in order to tag them for a storage pool.
I have tried:
* Blank configuration (No Arrays)
* RAID5 array
* JBOD configuration (this I would expect to work, however.. no)
Unfortunately I can't seem to find the information I need in the XSan or XServe RAID documentation, and the same goes for web searches and looking through the training books from Peach Pit.
**To elaborate on our setup**:
* We have 4x Apple XServe servers, two with Fiber cards which will the the XSan Metadata controllers (1x master, 1x backup)
* We have two Apple XServe RAID units with a total capacity (approx.) of 2.75Tb for each controller.
* We have a fiber switch interconnecting the 2x Metadata Controllers, the 4x RAID controllers, plus, when we've installed the system, 2x Mac Pro edit suites for Edit-in place.
* There is also a Gigabit switch for connecting the servers and the RAID controllers for management.
Essentially we will have the two remaining XServes running as QMaster nodes interfacing with Finalcut server. The Edit Suites will be direcly attached to the SAN via Fiber on the same fabric as the servers. QMatic nodes and regular workstations will access the data over AFP shares, though if the QMatic machines are experiencing bottlenecks with disk access we can upgrade them to be attached via the Fabric.
In regards to the LUN tagging for the storage pools we have the following planned:
* HD Video configuration (Metadata/Journal, Video, Audio and Other tags)
* 1x 80gb Mirror for Metadata/Journal
* 2x 2.75Tb RAID5 arrays for Video
* 1x 2.75Tb RAID5 array for Audio
* 1x 1.xxTB RAID5 array for Other
Anyone know how to make this stuff hum? | 2009/08/20 | [
"https://serverfault.com/questions/56619",
"https://serverfault.com",
"https://serverfault.com/users/1263/"
] | **Something is changing your database!**
Things like index rebuilds or defrags will cause page changes. Changes that are rolled back may have changed pages, so they count as well.
In addition differential backups are considered 'fuzzy' and so will have transaction log data in the backup, which it needs for consistency.
Paul Randal wrote a [very cool script](http://www.sqlskills.com/BLOGS/PAUL/post/New-script-How-much-of-the-database-has-changed-since-the-last-full-backup.aspx) a while back that will tell you how many extents have changed since your last full backup, so you can use this to calculate how big your differential is going to be.
In addition, you should be able to use this script to tell you what pages have changed in your db. This may help you solve your changing data mystery. | I am (basically a java developer) facing the same prob that my live db is 7.5 GB and its diff backups per day are 1.5 GB. (in fact we take diff backups for 1 hr) When i ran randy's script for the half day (i.e at lunch time which is half of a complete business day) I got following output:
total change percentage
125658 17169 13.66
I am sure this is a old application and very few ppl use this but how can this be possible to show 17169 changed extents which is causing: 17169 \* 64k => 1098.816 MB (nearly 1GB differential) for such a less used application. Please share your ideas on this...how can I debug this further ?? I mean how can I reduce extents further down to get small differentials. |
56,619 | I am working on a Final Cut Server setup with an associate and one of the things we need to do is setup XSan2 with two Apple XServe RAID units.
I am able to get into the RAID Administrator and configure arrays etc, however regardless of the configuration I set I am unable to have the LUNs presented to XSan in order to tag them for a storage pool.
I have tried:
* Blank configuration (No Arrays)
* RAID5 array
* JBOD configuration (this I would expect to work, however.. no)
Unfortunately I can't seem to find the information I need in the XSan or XServe RAID documentation, and the same goes for web searches and looking through the training books from Peach Pit.
**To elaborate on our setup**:
* We have 4x Apple XServe servers, two with Fiber cards which will the the XSan Metadata controllers (1x master, 1x backup)
* We have two Apple XServe RAID units with a total capacity (approx.) of 2.75Tb for each controller.
* We have a fiber switch interconnecting the 2x Metadata Controllers, the 4x RAID controllers, plus, when we've installed the system, 2x Mac Pro edit suites for Edit-in place.
* There is also a Gigabit switch for connecting the servers and the RAID controllers for management.
Essentially we will have the two remaining XServes running as QMaster nodes interfacing with Finalcut server. The Edit Suites will be direcly attached to the SAN via Fiber on the same fabric as the servers. QMatic nodes and regular workstations will access the data over AFP shares, though if the QMatic machines are experiencing bottlenecks with disk access we can upgrade them to be attached via the Fabric.
In regards to the LUN tagging for the storage pools we have the following planned:
* HD Video configuration (Metadata/Journal, Video, Audio and Other tags)
* 1x 80gb Mirror for Metadata/Journal
* 2x 2.75Tb RAID5 arrays for Video
* 1x 2.75Tb RAID5 array for Audio
* 1x 1.xxTB RAID5 array for Other
Anyone know how to make this stuff hum? | 2009/08/20 | [
"https://serverfault.com/questions/56619",
"https://serverfault.com",
"https://serverfault.com/users/1263/"
] | A differential backup backs up 8K pages that have been "touched".
If all your changes are small and in the same area, you'll have a small backup. Which is unlikely.
A differential backup may not grow if you keep dirtying the same pages (also unlikely)
Some things that will dirty a page:
* Statistics are updated (stored in system tables which have pages allocated)
* Indexes are rebuilt (lots of data shuffled around)
* Page splits of data (which means 4 dirty pages for 2 small inserts)
* ... and page splits of index structures | I am (basically a java developer) facing the same prob that my live db is 7.5 GB and its diff backups per day are 1.5 GB. (in fact we take diff backups for 1 hr) When i ran randy's script for the half day (i.e at lunch time which is half of a complete business day) I got following output:
total change percentage
125658 17169 13.66
I am sure this is a old application and very few ppl use this but how can this be possible to show 17169 changed extents which is causing: 17169 \* 64k => 1098.816 MB (nearly 1GB differential) for such a less used application. Please share your ideas on this...how can I debug this further ?? I mean how can I reduce extents further down to get small differentials. |
356,269 | I'm building an application which uses SQLite, and now want to add settings that are stored between sessions
I'm considering if I'm going to store the settings in a **config file** or if I'm going to use **a table in the database** for this
(Please note that I'm using SQLite which stores data locally and doesn't have a user accounts)
The reason I'm thinking of using the database is that *I'd like to avoid adding more complexity* and since I have already set up my SQLite database I'm thinking that I might as well use it for settings as well
**What do I need to consider when choosing between these two options?**
I'm leaning towards using a table in the database but am a bit worried because [this answer](https://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com/a/179577/196326) says that storing settings inside the database is a *bad separation of concerns*.
However I'm not sure what practical drawbacks there would be. In terms of the code being self-documenting and in terms of readability it's clear where the settings are if the db table is just called "settings"
(One drawback I can think of might be if I expect the settings to change much more quickly than the db schema, since that would mean changing the database which is more complicated than changing the settings)
Grateful for help with this!
Similar questions:
* [Should I use a config file or database for storing business rules?](https://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com/questions/179572/should-i-use-a-config-file-or-database-for-storing-business-rules) --- similar to my question but more specific (about storing business rules). I would like to know about what general considerations to make when choosing between the different options
* [How are typical settings stored in a program?](https://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com/questions/334877/how-are-typical-settings-stored-in-a-program) | 2017/08/25 | [
"https://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com/questions/356269",
"https://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com",
"https://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com/users/196326/"
] | I don't agree that storing settings in a database table is a bad separation of concerns. Your "concerns" will be separated by not defining a relationship between the settings table and other tables in your database. This is fine.
The main thing to consider is how you expect the administrator of your system to make changes to the settings. It's much easier for most people to just open a configuration file and make changes. If you store your configuration in a database, you'll have to give access to users/admins to make changes. If they're not comfortable making changes directly in the database, you may have to provide a screen in your application for making those changes. I've done this in both web and mobile applications and it works fine. (Since the changes are made through the application itself, it even bypasses the need to restart the application like you would if changes were made externally by editing a file.) | It all depends on how big your settings are. If it was a couple of values, then it would be simpler and less overhead to store it in a file. Especially that this file could be an XML that is easy to handle.
If you need to store your settings somewhere safe (e.g. saving credentials), then a database would be a slightly better option. Of course you should encrypt those credentials when you either save them on a file or in a table.
From an architectural point of view, you should save at least one piece of information in a file, i.e. your database connection string, so that you would not hard code it (bad practice). |
356,269 | I'm building an application which uses SQLite, and now want to add settings that are stored between sessions
I'm considering if I'm going to store the settings in a **config file** or if I'm going to use **a table in the database** for this
(Please note that I'm using SQLite which stores data locally and doesn't have a user accounts)
The reason I'm thinking of using the database is that *I'd like to avoid adding more complexity* and since I have already set up my SQLite database I'm thinking that I might as well use it for settings as well
**What do I need to consider when choosing between these two options?**
I'm leaning towards using a table in the database but am a bit worried because [this answer](https://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com/a/179577/196326) says that storing settings inside the database is a *bad separation of concerns*.
However I'm not sure what practical drawbacks there would be. In terms of the code being self-documenting and in terms of readability it's clear where the settings are if the db table is just called "settings"
(One drawback I can think of might be if I expect the settings to change much more quickly than the db schema, since that would mean changing the database which is more complicated than changing the settings)
Grateful for help with this!
Similar questions:
* [Should I use a config file or database for storing business rules?](https://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com/questions/179572/should-i-use-a-config-file-or-database-for-storing-business-rules) --- similar to my question but more specific (about storing business rules). I would like to know about what general considerations to make when choosing between the different options
* [How are typical settings stored in a program?](https://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com/questions/334877/how-are-typical-settings-stored-in-a-program) | 2017/08/25 | [
"https://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com/questions/356269",
"https://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com",
"https://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com/users/196326/"
] | The largish legacy application I maintain has gone back and forth on this over the years, but has evolved towards keeping most settings in the DB. Yes, the DB connection string is read from the config file. This is a desktop application that heavily uses a DB and which has quite a few settings. If you have very few this will be less applicable, but these are the first reasons that come to mind:
* Config files are typically read only on startup, changes mean restarting the application. (Not a hard rule, but intended use.)
* Settings from the DB can be edited via a GUI that is part of the application and directly updated using the already existing DB routines without needing to access some external file.
* Changes made by the GUI can easily be used to raise events and the new values can be used immediately. You really don't want to be monitoring changes to an external file - see first bullet.
* The DB is not accessible to regular users and changes there can be restricted and validated. A config file is exposed and can be changed with any editor, with no validation of values.
* We have sets of settings - "Profiles" - that are customized on a per-installation basis. This would be somewhat cumbersome to maintain with a config file. | It all depends on how big your settings are. If it was a couple of values, then it would be simpler and less overhead to store it in a file. Especially that this file could be an XML that is easy to handle.
If you need to store your settings somewhere safe (e.g. saving credentials), then a database would be a slightly better option. Of course you should encrypt those credentials when you either save them on a file or in a table.
From an architectural point of view, you should save at least one piece of information in a file, i.e. your database connection string, so that you would not hard code it (bad practice). |
356,269 | I'm building an application which uses SQLite, and now want to add settings that are stored between sessions
I'm considering if I'm going to store the settings in a **config file** or if I'm going to use **a table in the database** for this
(Please note that I'm using SQLite which stores data locally and doesn't have a user accounts)
The reason I'm thinking of using the database is that *I'd like to avoid adding more complexity* and since I have already set up my SQLite database I'm thinking that I might as well use it for settings as well
**What do I need to consider when choosing between these two options?**
I'm leaning towards using a table in the database but am a bit worried because [this answer](https://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com/a/179577/196326) says that storing settings inside the database is a *bad separation of concerns*.
However I'm not sure what practical drawbacks there would be. In terms of the code being self-documenting and in terms of readability it's clear where the settings are if the db table is just called "settings"
(One drawback I can think of might be if I expect the settings to change much more quickly than the db schema, since that would mean changing the database which is more complicated than changing the settings)
Grateful for help with this!
Similar questions:
* [Should I use a config file or database for storing business rules?](https://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com/questions/179572/should-i-use-a-config-file-or-database-for-storing-business-rules) --- similar to my question but more specific (about storing business rules). I would like to know about what general considerations to make when choosing between the different options
* [How are typical settings stored in a program?](https://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com/questions/334877/how-are-typical-settings-stored-in-a-program) | 2017/08/25 | [
"https://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com/questions/356269",
"https://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com",
"https://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com/users/196326/"
] | The largish legacy application I maintain has gone back and forth on this over the years, but has evolved towards keeping most settings in the DB. Yes, the DB connection string is read from the config file. This is a desktop application that heavily uses a DB and which has quite a few settings. If you have very few this will be less applicable, but these are the first reasons that come to mind:
* Config files are typically read only on startup, changes mean restarting the application. (Not a hard rule, but intended use.)
* Settings from the DB can be edited via a GUI that is part of the application and directly updated using the already existing DB routines without needing to access some external file.
* Changes made by the GUI can easily be used to raise events and the new values can be used immediately. You really don't want to be monitoring changes to an external file - see first bullet.
* The DB is not accessible to regular users and changes there can be restricted and validated. A config file is exposed and can be changed with any editor, with no validation of values.
* We have sets of settings - "Profiles" - that are customized on a per-installation basis. This would be somewhat cumbersome to maintain with a config file. | I don't agree that storing settings in a database table is a bad separation of concerns. Your "concerns" will be separated by not defining a relationship between the settings table and other tables in your database. This is fine.
The main thing to consider is how you expect the administrator of your system to make changes to the settings. It's much easier for most people to just open a configuration file and make changes. If you store your configuration in a database, you'll have to give access to users/admins to make changes. If they're not comfortable making changes directly in the database, you may have to provide a screen in your application for making those changes. I've done this in both web and mobile applications and it works fine. (Since the changes are made through the application itself, it even bypasses the need to restart the application like you would if changes were made externally by editing a file.) |
12,496 | Almost all WWII movies depicts Nazi officers and soldiers as well-dressed and handsome.
On the other hand, allied officers and soldiers are always shown wearing torn uniforms, etc.
Why? | 2013/07/14 | [
"https://movies.stackexchange.com/questions/12496",
"https://movies.stackexchange.com",
"https://movies.stackexchange.com/users/-1/"
] | My answer here is to the point of history and not movie making ... Please remember what Hitler was trying to build and exemplify, that of the "master race". His Nazis would have fit that mold to a tee. Blond, blue eyed, blah, blah, blah. You get the picture. This may now be a bit over done in movies, but it is what it is. The dress may very well just be an extension of this. Allied troops overseas would not have the supply chains available to them to keep their uniforms freshly pressed and tidy. | @Paulster2 well you have a point, which is true. The 1st reason is that half of the time these movies are about what they did rather about the war so mostly they were captors of some people or whatever the situation was germans were in much safer locations. The 2nd reason is the color of the uniforms. Allied uniforms were often brown (dark or light brown), but the germans wore black / dark green / olive green uniforms, so the color affects you thinking that brown is less formal than black and dark green. The 3rd reason is that you often see less allies commanding officers than german officers. And pay attention to any other movie, usually the badguys are richer, well funded and the good guys are poor or not well-funded. And this fact applies to the majority but not all, regardless if the fact it's about a war, about mafia, or drug dealers. These plus what our friend said about Hitler's Agenda. |
46,928,286 | I'm using Apple's Core ML to visually recognize items in an image but it's returning incorrect answers sometimes identifying shoes as a knife etc. Is there a way to provide feedback about CoreML and hopefully guide it towards correctly identifying the items in an image? | 2017/10/25 | [
"https://Stackoverflow.com/questions/46928286",
"https://Stackoverflow.com",
"https://Stackoverflow.com/users/-1/"
] | You're probably giving the Core ML model inputs that it does not expect. I wrote a blog post about the most common mistakes: <http://machinethink.net/blog/help-core-ml-gives-wrong-output/> | I would open a feedback ticket at <https://developer.apple.com/bug-reporting/>
Apple is really glad to get devs feedback. Try to detail yours as deeply as possible :)
EDIT : I would also suggest that you try another CoreML model ! I had a few tries with Inception V3 which worked like a charm with my apps. <https://developer.apple.com/machine-learning/> |
493,007 | [According to Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antithesis):
>
> An antithesis must always contain two ideas within one statement
>
>
>
A similar effect (parallelism emphasizing opposition of ideas) can be created in which the first element is implied by some famous phrase that is so well known that it cannot be mistaken. What is the name of this rhetorical device?
I'm also interested in famous examples (which may not exist because once the variant became famous, the effect would be lessened).
Some examples of this device might be:
* "the land of the free and the home of the **slaves**"
* "baby it's **code** outside"
* "I am the way, the truth and the life. No one comes to the **Sewer** except through me."
* "Some men just want to watch the world **bloom**" | 2019/04/08 | [
"https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/493007",
"https://english.stackexchange.com",
"https://english.stackexchange.com/users/343134/"
] | I think there are a few words that could be used, depending on how the sentence is changed.
A **parody**, which as defined by Oxford Dictionary is, "imitation of the style of a particular writer, artist, or genre with deliberate exaggeration for comic effect." Though, in this case, it's not necessarily for comedic effect.
or "purposeful **catachresis**." Dictionary.com defines it as "misuse or strained use of words, as in a mixed metaphor, occurring either in error or for *rhetorical* effect." Your examples, of course, are more of the latter. | It is called "antithetic parallelism". The Bible offers many examples:
* A **wise son** maketh **a glad father**, but a **foolish son** is **the heaviness of his mother**.
Proverbs 10:1
* For the Lord knoweth **the way of the righteous**; but **the way of the ungodly** shall perish. Psalms 1:6
* **The fear of the Lord prolongs** days, but **the years of the wicked** will be **shortened**. Proverbs 10:27 |
493,007 | [According to Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antithesis):
>
> An antithesis must always contain two ideas within one statement
>
>
>
A similar effect (parallelism emphasizing opposition of ideas) can be created in which the first element is implied by some famous phrase that is so well known that it cannot be mistaken. What is the name of this rhetorical device?
I'm also interested in famous examples (which may not exist because once the variant became famous, the effect would be lessened).
Some examples of this device might be:
* "the land of the free and the home of the **slaves**"
* "baby it's **code** outside"
* "I am the way, the truth and the life. No one comes to the **Sewer** except through me."
* "Some men just want to watch the world **bloom**" | 2019/04/08 | [
"https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/493007",
"https://english.stackexchange.com",
"https://english.stackexchange.com/users/343134/"
] | I think there are a few words that could be used, depending on how the sentence is changed.
A **parody**, which as defined by Oxford Dictionary is, "imitation of the style of a particular writer, artist, or genre with deliberate exaggeration for comic effect." Though, in this case, it's not necessarily for comedic effect.
or "purposeful **catachresis**." Dictionary.com defines it as "misuse or strained use of words, as in a mixed metaphor, occurring either in error or for *rhetorical* effect." Your examples, of course, are more of the latter. | I would recommend
***CACOGRAPHY***:
According to [Merriam-Webster's Dictionary:](https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/cacography#note-1)
***cacography***
: bad spelling
As a stylistic device it's defined in [Wikipedia](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cacography?wprov=sfla1):
"***Cacography*** is deliberate comic misspelling, a type of humour similar to malapropism". |
76,987 | I can't remember for the life of me, and google isn't making it easy. e.g. the things labeled 24/40 etc., as in this picture:
[](https://i.stack.imgur.com/9SC81.jpg) | 2017/06/28 | [
"https://chemistry.stackexchange.com/questions/76987",
"https://chemistry.stackexchange.com",
"https://chemistry.stackexchange.com/users/17821/"
] | Those are called **Keck Clips**. 24/40 is the size of the joint. | They are called Keck clamps.
Here's a link to the page for ChemGlass: <http://www.chemglass.com/product_view.asp?pnr=CG-145> |
76,987 | I can't remember for the life of me, and google isn't making it easy. e.g. the things labeled 24/40 etc., as in this picture:
[](https://i.stack.imgur.com/9SC81.jpg) | 2017/06/28 | [
"https://chemistry.stackexchange.com/questions/76987",
"https://chemistry.stackexchange.com",
"https://chemistry.stackexchange.com/users/17821/"
] | Those are called **Keck Clips**. 24/40 is the size of the joint. | The clips are named after Hermann Keck - Chemistry World's Classic Kit columnist, Andrea Sella, spoke to him to get the story of the invention before he died a few years ago. <https://www.chemistryworld.com/opinion/classic-kit-keck-clip/3004921.article> |
76,987 | I can't remember for the life of me, and google isn't making it easy. e.g. the things labeled 24/40 etc., as in this picture:
[](https://i.stack.imgur.com/9SC81.jpg) | 2017/06/28 | [
"https://chemistry.stackexchange.com/questions/76987",
"https://chemistry.stackexchange.com",
"https://chemistry.stackexchange.com/users/17821/"
] | They are called Keck clamps.
Here's a link to the page for ChemGlass: <http://www.chemglass.com/product_view.asp?pnr=CG-145> | The clips are named after Hermann Keck - Chemistry World's Classic Kit columnist, Andrea Sella, spoke to him to get the story of the invention before he died a few years ago. <https://www.chemistryworld.com/opinion/classic-kit-keck-clip/3004921.article> |
174,653 | I'd like to use the Wiimote (accelerometers, gyroscopes, infrared camera, etc, etc, etc) on various applications.
It's a bluetooth device, and I know others have connected it to their computer.
* What's the easiest way to start using it in my software - are there libraries for C#, for instance?
* I want my software to be usable and easily installable - what's the current easiest way to connect a wiimote to the computer? Can I make that process part of my software installation?
-Adam | 2008/10/06 | [
"https://Stackoverflow.com/questions/174653",
"https://Stackoverflow.com",
"https://Stackoverflow.com/users/2915/"
] | Have you seen [Johnny Chung Lee's 'Procrastineering' Blog](http://procrastineering.blogspot.com/)? He's written a lot on the subject of using wii remotes and has some fantastic demonstration videos. **[Edit]** I just found out Mr Lee did [a TED talk](http://www.ted.com/index.php/talks/johnny_lee_demos_wii_remote_hacks.html) which gives a good introduction to the stuff he's done too...
There's a wealth of information over on [Wiibrew.org](http://wiibrew.org) - check out their [Wiimote Library](http://wiibrew.org/wiki/Wiimote_Library) page for some other APIs if you want to look beyond c#. As an avid Python fan, I'm quite curious to have a play with [the pyWiimote library](http://code.google.com/p/pywiimote/) :-) | Coding4Fun had a managed C# library up that would allow you to interface with it but it seems their site is down right now. Though I think they used the Robotics Studio so that may be a place to start.
Found it... <http://www.codeplex.com/WiimoteLib>
Oh and I forgot to post a link to these videos I saw quite some time ago. <http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~johnny/projects/wii/> |
174,653 | I'd like to use the Wiimote (accelerometers, gyroscopes, infrared camera, etc, etc, etc) on various applications.
It's a bluetooth device, and I know others have connected it to their computer.
* What's the easiest way to start using it in my software - are there libraries for C#, for instance?
* I want my software to be usable and easily installable - what's the current easiest way to connect a wiimote to the computer? Can I make that process part of my software installation?
-Adam | 2008/10/06 | [
"https://Stackoverflow.com/questions/174653",
"https://Stackoverflow.com",
"https://Stackoverflow.com/users/2915/"
] | Coding4Fun had a managed C# library up that would allow you to interface with it but it seems their site is down right now. Though I think they used the Robotics Studio so that may be a place to start.
Found it... <http://www.codeplex.com/WiimoteLib>
Oh and I forgot to post a link to these videos I saw quite some time ago. <http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~johnny/projects/wii/> | If you use WiimoteLib (from Coding4Fun as mentioned in another answer), there is an example application called WiimoteTest. This tests all of the Wiimote inputs and outputs, including for multiple Wiimotes at the same time, so it is a good starting point for your own Wiimote code as it gives you an example of how to do pretty much anything you would want to.
For the second part of your question, connecting the Wiimote to the computer is pretty much the same as connecting any other Bluetooth device. I don't know that it would be very suitable to have this done at installation as it is likely to be connected and disconnected a lot, especially since the Wiimote will turn itself off if not used for a while. However, it's pretty much a matter of following a standard Windows wizard to connect to it, so it's not too hard. This assumes you have a Bluetooth driver that will work with the Wiimote - more information on that is available at the Coding4Fun website. It worked for me with the default driver that already came with my laptop but if it doesn't for you, the one they recommend is BlueSoleil. |
174,653 | I'd like to use the Wiimote (accelerometers, gyroscopes, infrared camera, etc, etc, etc) on various applications.
It's a bluetooth device, and I know others have connected it to their computer.
* What's the easiest way to start using it in my software - are there libraries for C#, for instance?
* I want my software to be usable and easily installable - what's the current easiest way to connect a wiimote to the computer? Can I make that process part of my software installation?
-Adam | 2008/10/06 | [
"https://Stackoverflow.com/questions/174653",
"https://Stackoverflow.com",
"https://Stackoverflow.com/users/2915/"
] | Coding4Fun had a managed C# library up that would allow you to interface with it but it seems their site is down right now. Though I think they used the Robotics Studio so that may be a place to start.
Found it... <http://www.codeplex.com/WiimoteLib>
Oh and I forgot to post a link to these videos I saw quite some time ago. <http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~johnny/projects/wii/> | >
> what's the current easiest way to
> connect a wiimote to the computer?
>
>
>
I not found solution for connect wiimote within my software, you have to connect manually into Windows, but on Windows register bluetooth device it very take time, Try Toshiba bluetooth stack it more convenient. |
174,653 | I'd like to use the Wiimote (accelerometers, gyroscopes, infrared camera, etc, etc, etc) on various applications.
It's a bluetooth device, and I know others have connected it to their computer.
* What's the easiest way to start using it in my software - are there libraries for C#, for instance?
* I want my software to be usable and easily installable - what's the current easiest way to connect a wiimote to the computer? Can I make that process part of my software installation?
-Adam | 2008/10/06 | [
"https://Stackoverflow.com/questions/174653",
"https://Stackoverflow.com",
"https://Stackoverflow.com/users/2915/"
] | Have you seen [Johnny Chung Lee's 'Procrastineering' Blog](http://procrastineering.blogspot.com/)? He's written a lot on the subject of using wii remotes and has some fantastic demonstration videos. **[Edit]** I just found out Mr Lee did [a TED talk](http://www.ted.com/index.php/talks/johnny_lee_demos_wii_remote_hacks.html) which gives a good introduction to the stuff he's done too...
There's a wealth of information over on [Wiibrew.org](http://wiibrew.org) - check out their [Wiimote Library](http://wiibrew.org/wiki/Wiimote_Library) page for some other APIs if you want to look beyond c#. As an avid Python fan, I'm quite curious to have a play with [the pyWiimote library](http://code.google.com/p/pywiimote/) :-) | If you use WiimoteLib (from Coding4Fun as mentioned in another answer), there is an example application called WiimoteTest. This tests all of the Wiimote inputs and outputs, including for multiple Wiimotes at the same time, so it is a good starting point for your own Wiimote code as it gives you an example of how to do pretty much anything you would want to.
For the second part of your question, connecting the Wiimote to the computer is pretty much the same as connecting any other Bluetooth device. I don't know that it would be very suitable to have this done at installation as it is likely to be connected and disconnected a lot, especially since the Wiimote will turn itself off if not used for a while. However, it's pretty much a matter of following a standard Windows wizard to connect to it, so it's not too hard. This assumes you have a Bluetooth driver that will work with the Wiimote - more information on that is available at the Coding4Fun website. It worked for me with the default driver that already came with my laptop but if it doesn't for you, the one they recommend is BlueSoleil. |
174,653 | I'd like to use the Wiimote (accelerometers, gyroscopes, infrared camera, etc, etc, etc) on various applications.
It's a bluetooth device, and I know others have connected it to their computer.
* What's the easiest way to start using it in my software - are there libraries for C#, for instance?
* I want my software to be usable and easily installable - what's the current easiest way to connect a wiimote to the computer? Can I make that process part of my software installation?
-Adam | 2008/10/06 | [
"https://Stackoverflow.com/questions/174653",
"https://Stackoverflow.com",
"https://Stackoverflow.com/users/2915/"
] | Have you seen [Johnny Chung Lee's 'Procrastineering' Blog](http://procrastineering.blogspot.com/)? He's written a lot on the subject of using wii remotes and has some fantastic demonstration videos. **[Edit]** I just found out Mr Lee did [a TED talk](http://www.ted.com/index.php/talks/johnny_lee_demos_wii_remote_hacks.html) which gives a good introduction to the stuff he's done too...
There's a wealth of information over on [Wiibrew.org](http://wiibrew.org) - check out their [Wiimote Library](http://wiibrew.org/wiki/Wiimote_Library) page for some other APIs if you want to look beyond c#. As an avid Python fan, I'm quite curious to have a play with [the pyWiimote library](http://code.google.com/p/pywiimote/) :-) | >
> what's the current easiest way to
> connect a wiimote to the computer?
>
>
>
I not found solution for connect wiimote within my software, you have to connect manually into Windows, but on Windows register bluetooth device it very take time, Try Toshiba bluetooth stack it more convenient. |
174,653 | I'd like to use the Wiimote (accelerometers, gyroscopes, infrared camera, etc, etc, etc) on various applications.
It's a bluetooth device, and I know others have connected it to their computer.
* What's the easiest way to start using it in my software - are there libraries for C#, for instance?
* I want my software to be usable and easily installable - what's the current easiest way to connect a wiimote to the computer? Can I make that process part of my software installation?
-Adam | 2008/10/06 | [
"https://Stackoverflow.com/questions/174653",
"https://Stackoverflow.com",
"https://Stackoverflow.com/users/2915/"
] | If you use WiimoteLib (from Coding4Fun as mentioned in another answer), there is an example application called WiimoteTest. This tests all of the Wiimote inputs and outputs, including for multiple Wiimotes at the same time, so it is a good starting point for your own Wiimote code as it gives you an example of how to do pretty much anything you would want to.
For the second part of your question, connecting the Wiimote to the computer is pretty much the same as connecting any other Bluetooth device. I don't know that it would be very suitable to have this done at installation as it is likely to be connected and disconnected a lot, especially since the Wiimote will turn itself off if not used for a while. However, it's pretty much a matter of following a standard Windows wizard to connect to it, so it's not too hard. This assumes you have a Bluetooth driver that will work with the Wiimote - more information on that is available at the Coding4Fun website. It worked for me with the default driver that already came with my laptop but if it doesn't for you, the one they recommend is BlueSoleil. | >
> what's the current easiest way to
> connect a wiimote to the computer?
>
>
>
I not found solution for connect wiimote within my software, you have to connect manually into Windows, but on Windows register bluetooth device it very take time, Try Toshiba bluetooth stack it more convenient. |
1,776,761 | I'm trying to get started with an iPhone application, I had a look around at other questions but i'm still sorta stuck so hopefully someone can help...
First thing is I'm totally confused with the whole view concept, I'm more used to visual studio so I'm going to use the term 'form' to describe what I have in my head.
I want to achieve a home screen in an application with say 9 icons (much like the iphone home screen) which each lead to a different 'form'. Each form may have a different function so say one might be a simple calculator, one might play a video etc.
How do I do this, its destroying my soul trying to do something so simple... If you guys even have any links to get me on the right track it would be greatly appreciated | 2009/11/21 | [
"https://Stackoverflow.com/questions/1776761",
"https://Stackoverflow.com",
"https://Stackoverflow.com/users/216228/"
] | [File::ChangeNotify](http://search.cpan.org/dist/File-ChangeNotify/) sounds like a cross-platform way to do this. | While I don't know of a specific cross platform solution there is inotify on linux (well on modern kernels from 2.6.13) and from the [Inotify](http://search.cpan.org/dist/Linux-Inotify) module from CPAN. As for OS X, there is apparently the `kqueue` syscall but I have no experience of using it. |
1,776,761 | I'm trying to get started with an iPhone application, I had a look around at other questions but i'm still sorta stuck so hopefully someone can help...
First thing is I'm totally confused with the whole view concept, I'm more used to visual studio so I'm going to use the term 'form' to describe what I have in my head.
I want to achieve a home screen in an application with say 9 icons (much like the iphone home screen) which each lead to a different 'form'. Each form may have a different function so say one might be a simple calculator, one might play a video etc.
How do I do this, its destroying my soul trying to do something so simple... If you guys even have any links to get me on the right track it would be greatly appreciated | 2009/11/21 | [
"https://Stackoverflow.com/questions/1776761",
"https://Stackoverflow.com",
"https://Stackoverflow.com/users/216228/"
] | [File::ChangeNotify](http://search.cpan.org/dist/File-ChangeNotify/) sounds like a cross-platform way to do this. | For systems where [famd](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File_alteration_monitor "famd") can run (Irix, Linux, BSDs, most Unices) there is [SGI::FAM](http://search.cpan.org/~jglick/SGI-FAM-1.002/lib/SGI/FAM.pm "SGI::FAM") and [Sys::Gamin](http://search.cpan.org/~garnacho/Sys-Gamin-0.1/lib/Sys/Gamin.pm "Sys::Gamin"), both of which do not build straight out of CPAN or tarball, but do work well once you get them working. |
5,840 | There are a few games, like [TIS-100](http://www.zachtronics.com/tis-100/) that are based on programming. We've had a couple questions that ask for a review of code written in games like these, and all of them have been tagged [game](https://codereview.stackexchange.com/questions/tagged/game "show questions tagged 'game'").
I'm not sure if these questions should be tagged, and the ambiguous description of [game](https://codereview.stackexchange.com/questions/tagged/game "show questions tagged 'game'") doesn't help either.
Should questions like these be tagged with [game](https://codereview.stackexchange.com/questions/tagged/game "show questions tagged 'game'")? | 2015/08/01 | [
"https://codereview.meta.stackexchange.com/questions/5840",
"https://codereview.meta.stackexchange.com",
"https://codereview.meta.stackexchange.com/users/53251/"
] | No. Code written for the [tis-100](https://codereview.stackexchange.com/questions/tagged/tis-100 "show questions tagged 'tis-100'") game should not be tagged with [game](https://codereview.stackexchange.com/questions/tagged/game "show questions tagged 'game'"). The game tag should be reserved for its typical use of developing a game of some sort. As far as Code Review is concerned, tis-100 is just another language. Adding the game tag to these questions doesn't add any information or context.
---
I just got around to removing [game](https://codereview.stackexchange.com/questions/tagged/game "show questions tagged 'game'") from the [tis-100](https://codereview.stackexchange.com/questions/tagged/tis-100 "show questions tagged 'tis-100'") questions, but someone beat me to it. [status-completed](https://codereview.stackexchange.com/questions/tagged/status-completed "show questions tagged 'status-completed'") | Yes, questions like this should be tagged [game](https://codereview.stackexchange.com/questions/tagged/game "show questions tagged 'game'"). Here is the tag excerpt for [game](https://codereview.stackexchange.com/questions/tagged/game "show questions tagged 'game'"):
>
> For questions requesting reviews of game-themed code.
>
>
>
The code that is in the post is "game-themed" because it is code about and/or relating to a game. |
20,948 | In Matthew 23 Jesus goes into a lengthy rebuke of the scribes and Pharisees. In verses 13, 14, 15, 23, 25, 27, 29 (some translations omit 14), He begins by saying:
>
> “But woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites!..." (ESV)
>
>
>
Is it clear that Jesus is calling the scribes and Pharisees hypocrites? Or is it possible that while He is focused on the scribes and Pharisees, He is including others who are hypocrites but are not a scribe or Pharisee?
---
Note – some view "hypocrite" as problematic since there may not have been an Aramaic or Hebrew word with that meaning. This fails to consider the nature of oral communication. There is nothing restricting a person's vocabulary to their own language. The Greek *hypokritai* is used in the Septuagint (Job 34:30 and 36:13) indicating the word was present before the birth of Christ. The absence of an Aramaic equivalent to hypocrite (if this was the case) could be seen as a reason to believe that Jesus used *hypokritai*. | 2015/12/16 | [
"https://hermeneutics.stackexchange.com/questions/20948",
"https://hermeneutics.stackexchange.com",
"https://hermeneutics.stackexchange.com/users/8450/"
] | As a stub answer that someone can fill out later with a Masters' thesis, it's improbable that there are three classes being addressed here (scribes, Pharisees, and hypocrites).
If the author had intended there to be three terms, there are two common Greek idioms for that with fancy names: one would be "polysyndeton", having an "and" between each of the enumerated terms, and the other would be "asyndeton", having no "and" at all. You can see two examples of polysyndeton in verse 23, "mint and dill and cumin", and "justice and mercy and faithfulness". There's no fancy name for "a and b [and omitted] c" because it's not a common rhetorical figure.
Instead, the audience would have understood "hypocrites" to be modifying a previous noun. The only real syntactic ambiguity would be whether it applies to both scribes and Pharisees or only the latter, but the semantics are pretty clear there that it's both. | Strictly speaking, Jesus could not have called anyone a hypocrite, as the word did not exist either in Aramaic or Hebrew. The word 'hypocrites' comes from the Greek ὑποκριταί, which refers to a play-actor. Frank Stern (*[A Rabbi Looks at Jesus' Parables](https://books.google.com.au/books?id=FF4N2auokDQC&pg=PA81&lpg=PA81&dq=hypocrite%20%20in%20aramaic&source=bl&ots=NXRKaOl2bB&sig=NsPcYr2WmDh0osQglw62hIuFclc&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwikq_W039_JAhVKE5QKHW9qCNoQ6AEINjAF#v=onepage&q=hypocrite%20%20in%20aramaic&f=false)*, page 81) explains that Jesus might have said the equivalent to 'sinners' or 'wicked people' - but the translation into Greek and then Latin and English ought to be 'sinners' or 'wicked people'. We now know that *Matthew* was written in Greek, so its author was using a word his readers would understand, not a word Jesus would have used.
>
> Matthew 23:13-15: But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in. Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye devour widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayer: therefore ye shall receive the greater damnation. Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves.
>
>
>
This is clearly a reference to corrupt religious leaders, who take from widows, make great pretence at prayer and go to extraordinary lengths to win converts to the Jewish faith but leave them in the lurch. From what we know of first-century Judaism, verses 23-29 can be a description of some Pharisees, more so than of scribes. |
83,720 | I have sixteen students in my class who sit in four rows of four. Each week they sit in a different order.
After a number of weeks every student has sat next to every other student, next meaning side by side, one behind the other, or sitting diagonally together. What is the fewest number of weeks in which this can happen?
How many if my students were 25? | 2019/05/07 | [
"https://puzzling.stackexchange.com/questions/83720",
"https://puzzling.stackexchange.com",
"https://puzzling.stackexchange.com/users/19026/"
] | A quick intuitive answer:
For 16 students:
>
> 6 weeks
>
>
>
Reasoning (edited to account for the corner case, as pointed out by hexomino);
>
> 2nd week: swap 1st and 3rd columns. 3rd week: swap 2nd and 4th columns. Do the same operations with the rows over the next two weeks. Before swapping, either the first or the preceding week's formation can be taken as the starting point. 5th week: swap the two middle columns. 6th week: swap the middle rows. At the beginning of the 7th week, each student would have been next to each other student.
>
>
>
For 25 students:
>
> 8 weeks
>
>
>
Reasoning:
>
> Follow the above reasoning, except that the rows/columns to be swapped would be 1st/4th, 2nd/5th, 2nd/3rd, and 3rd/4th.
>
>
> | The first question i believe it's
>
> 256
>
>
>
and the second one it's
>
> 625
>
>
>
I think the solution of this one is to multiply the two numbers given. An other example is:find all the combinations of these words `PANEL`(wich i'll use the same equation). |
8,334,602 | i'm starting now on Rails, i looked in the forum, but i didn't find anything that could solve my problem.
Here it goes, I have a Category table, and it has only name for a column (there is no repetition in categories) so i would like name to be the primary key, then i have a Product table that has name, main\_photo, description and i would like to say that a product only has a category, do i need to add a column named category as a foreign key in products?
A Category is suposed to have many products.
Then in category models how do i say that name is the primary Key, and how can i do the correspondence between the suposed primary key name in categories and category in products? | 2011/11/30 | [
"https://Stackoverflow.com/questions/8334602",
"https://Stackoverflow.com",
"https://Stackoverflow.com/users/1074432/"
] | Foreign key constraints in Active Record aren't used very often as the ideology behind Active Record says that this kind of logic should belong in the model and not in the database - the database is just a dumb store: <http://guides.rubyonrails.org/migrations.html#active-record-and-referential-integrity>.
The Rails way is to have an ID column on all tables including your Categories table, and in your Products table, have a column called Category\_ID. Notice that the table names are plurals.
Then in your model you define the relationships between the entities Product and Category. Read the article [*A Guide to Active Record Associations*](http://guides.rubyonrails.org/association_basics.html) and it will answer all your questions, especially sections 2.1, 2.2 and 3.3. | There are many valid reasons to have foreign keys in your database. See [Does Rails need database-level constraints?](https://stackoverflow.com/questions/2589509/does-rails-need-database-level-constraints/2589875#2589875)
I recommend [Foreigner](https://github.com/matthuhiggins/foreigner) if you want to easily add foreign keys to your Rails app. |
6,025,336 | Is there a Java library for making [Bitly](http://bit.ly) requests? I'm looking to both shorten links, and look up info on clicks, etc. of links. Yes, I know it's a straight-forward [HTML API](http://bit.ly/apidocs) and I could just code directly to the HTML or write a library myself, but surely someone else has written such a library, and it would save me a couple of steps to use it. | 2011/05/17 | [
"https://Stackoverflow.com/questions/6025336",
"https://Stackoverflow.com",
"https://Stackoverflow.com/users/85348/"
] | This looks promising: <http://code.google.com/p/bitlyj/> | for the look up part i did it using php [Bitly-PHP](https://github.com/TareqBajjlay/Bitly-PHP) to get stats (FB, TW Clicks) |
328,473 | My company manages a lot of web sites, and we are currently working without a VCS. I want to propose a VCS for a few reasons, but I think our requirements may be too unique. We work off of a shared drive that is mapped to windows explorer that has a mirror for each site. When edits are made they get pushed to staging, then when approved to the live site.
I'm not too familiar with VCS, but i have looked into Git and SVN, and I don't think we would be able to use them (correct me if I'm wrong). The problem is, we have so many sites, and we are constantly working on different sites, that keeping a local version of every site to push to the shared drive would be too much.
What i picture, ideally, is something that is stored on the shared drive that the developer can "branch" and work on a temporary file that merged back to the file that the developer opened. Also, it is important that another developer that has never worked on one of the sites before be able to start editing without too much setup. Having a system that tracks changes without changing our workflow too much (or no one will use it or even consider implementing it) and gets rid of the tons of "\*\_backupTodaysdate.html" files is the goal. | 2016/08/16 | [
"https://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com/questions/328473",
"https://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com",
"https://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com/users/242275/"
] | I would quit using a shared drive for shared editing. Go with a proper version control system and personal work spaces. Shared work spaces lead to all sort of issues including lost changes.
There is no reason to have all the sites checked out all the time. Checkout the sites you need and remove the related work space when you are done with the site. Your work flows will need to change accordingly.
I'll avoid repeating a lengthy answer. This question is similar to: [What version control system can manage all aspects?](https://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com/questions/120613/what-version-control-system-can-manage-all-aspects/120620#120620) | The Short Answer is: ***DON'T DO THAT!*** This won't just end in tears. it will probably end up on the 10 o'clock News as a workplace mass shooting!
With modern DVCS (Mercurial or Git) there is no sane reason to use a shared drive / directory *for anything!* Each dev has their own machine / directory. They pull from a "master repository" (although with a DVCS this is more of an opinion than a fact), they do *whatever*, and then they either push to the master, or request that someone higher up the food chain pull from their repository.
Our standard workflow is N dev machines with their own copies, a staging repository on the production machine (or an *exact duplicate*), and a master / stable repository. We have scripts to handle most of the scut work, including a *revert* script to go back to the previous version *now* just in case all hell breaks loose when the production server goes Tits Up on the latest "stable" release! |
328,473 | My company manages a lot of web sites, and we are currently working without a VCS. I want to propose a VCS for a few reasons, but I think our requirements may be too unique. We work off of a shared drive that is mapped to windows explorer that has a mirror for each site. When edits are made they get pushed to staging, then when approved to the live site.
I'm not too familiar with VCS, but i have looked into Git and SVN, and I don't think we would be able to use them (correct me if I'm wrong). The problem is, we have so many sites, and we are constantly working on different sites, that keeping a local version of every site to push to the shared drive would be too much.
What i picture, ideally, is something that is stored on the shared drive that the developer can "branch" and work on a temporary file that merged back to the file that the developer opened. Also, it is important that another developer that has never worked on one of the sites before be able to start editing without too much setup. Having a system that tracks changes without changing our workflow too much (or no one will use it or even consider implementing it) and gets rid of the tons of "\*\_backupTodaysdate.html" files is the goal. | 2016/08/16 | [
"https://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com/questions/328473",
"https://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com",
"https://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com/users/242275/"
] | I would quit using a shared drive for shared editing. Go with a proper version control system and personal work spaces. Shared work spaces lead to all sort of issues including lost changes.
There is no reason to have all the sites checked out all the time. Checkout the sites you need and remove the related work space when you are done with the site. Your work flows will need to change accordingly.
I'll avoid repeating a lengthy answer. This question is similar to: [What version control system can manage all aspects?](https://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com/questions/120613/what-version-control-system-can-manage-all-aspects/120620#120620) | >
> The problem is, we have so many sites, and we are constantly working on different sites, that keeping a local version of every site to push to the shared drive would be too much.
>
>
>
This is not an unusual situation in the least. I regularly use git clones of 20 microservices I have push access to and another 10 or so from open source projects or other teams in the company I have dependencies on. I still have around 200Gb of free disk space, but if I didn't, cloning typically takes under 10 seconds. I think nothing of cloning a repo just for the duration of a code review, for example.
My suggestion is to just try git out on your local machine for a few days, so you have a better idea of what the workflow and overhead would be. Svn is a little harder to set up for local use, but might be a better fit if you share a lot of files between projects in a hierarchy. |
45,684 | Imagine you have a number of strips in the VSE and you want the white balance, the exposure, or the color balance to match between each strip. Would there be a setup that would enable you to display for example strip 1 (with strip modifiers if any) in a window and strip 2 in another window? If such setup was possible, one would them add strip modifiers to strip 2 to match strip 1 (eyeballing).
Thanks | 2016/01/26 | [
"https://blender.stackexchange.com/questions/45684",
"https://blender.stackexchange.com",
"https://blender.stackexchange.com/users/21247/"
] | There are 2 ways to do this:
1. You could stack the strips above each other and make a new preview window for each strip. At the bottom of the preview window is a channel number, simply set this for the strip you want to see.
[](https://i.stack.imgur.com/ZZrdz.jpg)
2. Or you can make 2 preview windows and turn on the Ghost offset function in the preview window. Simply turn on the ghost button and enter the frame offset so the black line lands on the shot you want to compare. Then toggle down the *Overlay* menu next to the offset and select "reference". The other preview window should show "Current", this will display whatever the green play indicator is stopped on.
[](https://i.stack.imgur.com/yCTca.jpg) | Just use two **Transform** *Effect Strip*s for temporary side-by-side display and do your Color Balancing on top of these. Afterwards you can select your untransformed Strips and **Copy** your Modifiers **to Selected Strips**.
Your *Effect Strip*s **Blend Type** has be set to **OverDrop** *(or AlphaOver)* and you need to Scale and translate it accordingly (I uniform scaled both to around 0.55 of their size and translated their position into the corners).
Then you can apply a Color Balance Strip Modifier to them... To not get confused with or have unwanted side-effects from the underlying strips you might mute the source strips of your Transform strips.
You have to copy your Strips to be at the same Frame on different Channels as you cannot simultaneously show two different frames in Blender. |
12,407,622 | I would like to use Doctrine 2 in ZF2 project. I have done some researches. I found this:
<http://www.jasongrimes.org/2012/01/using-doctrine-2-in-zend-framework-2/>
Unfortunately, I don't have CURL nor composer installed. And when I tried to install CURL first. I had errors i don't manage to solve.
Is there an easy solution to integrate Doctrine 2 in ZF2 ? | 2012/09/13 | [
"https://Stackoverflow.com/questions/12407622",
"https://Stackoverflow.com",
"https://Stackoverflow.com/users/-1/"
] | I spent a lot of days trying to find a good solution to integrate Doctrine 2 into ZF2. Finally, I managed to do it with this skeleton application: <https://github.com/iwalz/zf2-doctrine2-getting-started>
It has a very good readme, if you follow the steps, success is guaranteed! | You have the official Doctrine ZF2 Module written by Doctrine team
<https://github.com/doctrine/DoctrineModule>
Composer or CURL are a easy way of download that sources and register the namespace. You can do the same downloading the sources and registering the module |
18,327 | I tried hand soap, but it didn’t work. I also tried hand sanitizer; same thing didn’t work. Hair spray didn’t really work either. My hands are now all pinkish red and it’s sorta staining the walls and carpets when I touch them. | 2018/03/26 | [
"https://lifehacks.stackexchange.com/questions/18327",
"https://lifehacks.stackexchange.com",
"https://lifehacks.stackexchange.com/users/24116/"
] | Try following steps:
1. Get your hands greasy in a fatty substance like hand cream. Oil or fat suitable for eating will do, as will baby oil.
2. Wipe it off with paper or an old rag you will throw away. Instead of just wiping you can also scrape it off with something straight but not sharp.
3. Re-apply and wipe till no colour comes off when wiping.
4. Now re-apply and wash your hands, first with normal soap.
5. Then, if needed, with 'garage' soap. That is soap which is strong and has sand or some other gritty bits in it.
At the end of all cleaning, make sure you have your hands protected with cream and leave that to soak in for a while. | try Washing your hands with kerosene |
18,327 | I tried hand soap, but it didn’t work. I also tried hand sanitizer; same thing didn’t work. Hair spray didn’t really work either. My hands are now all pinkish red and it’s sorta staining the walls and carpets when I touch them. | 2018/03/26 | [
"https://lifehacks.stackexchange.com/questions/18327",
"https://lifehacks.stackexchange.com",
"https://lifehacks.stackexchange.com/users/24116/"
] | Try following steps:
1. Get your hands greasy in a fatty substance like hand cream. Oil or fat suitable for eating will do, as will baby oil.
2. Wipe it off with paper or an old rag you will throw away. Instead of just wiping you can also scrape it off with something straight but not sharp.
3. Re-apply and wipe till no colour comes off when wiping.
4. Now re-apply and wash your hands, first with normal soap.
5. Then, if needed, with 'garage' soap. That is soap which is strong and has sand or some other gritty bits in it.
At the end of all cleaning, make sure you have your hands protected with cream and leave that to soak in for a while. | Rub it with a bit of WD-40 then wash with soap and water |
18,327 | I tried hand soap, but it didn’t work. I also tried hand sanitizer; same thing didn’t work. Hair spray didn’t really work either. My hands are now all pinkish red and it’s sorta staining the walls and carpets when I touch them. | 2018/03/26 | [
"https://lifehacks.stackexchange.com/questions/18327",
"https://lifehacks.stackexchange.com",
"https://lifehacks.stackexchange.com/users/24116/"
] | Rub it with a bit of WD-40 then wash with soap and water | try Washing your hands with kerosene |
36,882 | Last weekend I was re-assembling my engine, and three holes stripped, is there any way to see if a screw hole needs to be re-threaded before it strips? | 2016/09/28 | [
"https://mechanics.stackexchange.com/questions/36882",
"https://mechanics.stackexchange.com",
"https://mechanics.stackexchange.com/users/15910/"
] | If you want to eliminate the angle of ground that visually looks flat, measure the weight then turn the whole lot around and measure the weight again. The mean average fo these two readings should give you a fairly accurate idea of the true, level nose weight. | That's close enough! Especially if you're not pushing the limits.
Tongue weight influences the stability of the rig (too much and the front wheels may tend to lift, too little – especially with a heavy load – and the "tail starts to wag the dog") and the load on the towing vehicle's suspension. You've got some latitude there, probably more than the difference that a hard to see slope in your driveway would amount to. |
15,497 | I was trying to transcribe my cat's noises into IPA. For example, her wanting to be petted is like [njæː] or [njaː]. But purring doesn't seem to fit any existing notation, except maybe [ʜ]. Has anyone ever mapped a cat's phonetic inventory? Their vocal tracts don't seem to be much different than ours. | 2016/01/12 | [
"https://linguistics.stackexchange.com/questions/15497",
"https://linguistics.stackexchange.com",
"https://linguistics.stackexchange.com/users/4943/"
] | Sure, why not? The main problem you will run into is establishing contrastiveness. I strongly recommend reading ch. 4 of the Handbook of the IPA. You can hear two different cats purring at the [wiki page](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purr), so the question is whether those are two different purr phonemes (technically known as "purreme") or one with a big variation in realization? You could transcribe it as [ʔ̆ɨ̥̃̆ʔ̆ɨ̥̃̆ʔ̆ɨ̥̃̆ʔ̆ɨ̥̃̆ʔ̆ɨ̥̃̆ʔ̆ɨ̥̃̆], though you might have to explain that the breve implies a duration of about 5 msc. Apart from the inconvenience of writing all this junk, there is a deeper scientific question of whether it's wrong to imply that a purr is really made up of lots of tiny segments. So this is where, in dealing with language, somebody would propose a new symbol for this newly discovered sound. You could then propose [ﮛ] to represent this sound, but I doubt it would get approved.
With real language, the IPA symbol [a] represents a wide range of physical sounds, not a precise single physical sound (that doesn't even mean anything). At a certain point, an apparent "a" is far enough back that it sounds like the range of sounds represented as [ɑ], and then you can argue that writing "a" is an error and instead "ɑ" should be used. But that's only possible because there are languages that contrast [a] and [ɑ], so we know that [a] and [ɑ] are different things. The [a] of Arabic and the [a] of English (not US English) are different, but that doesn't motivate inventing new vowel letters: because, IPA is not a system for reducing arbitrary acoustic waveforms to combinations of letters. | If you'd like to transcribe how we perceive cat language (as opposed to how cats do), you might be interested in the corresponding problem for bird song, which has at least some literature. I found a reference to an LSA talk from 1977 by Donegan and Stampe, "Old Sam Peabody, Peabody, Peabody". |
15,497 | I was trying to transcribe my cat's noises into IPA. For example, her wanting to be petted is like [njæː] or [njaː]. But purring doesn't seem to fit any existing notation, except maybe [ʜ]. Has anyone ever mapped a cat's phonetic inventory? Their vocal tracts don't seem to be much different than ours. | 2016/01/12 | [
"https://linguistics.stackexchange.com/questions/15497",
"https://linguistics.stackexchange.com",
"https://linguistics.stackexchange.com/users/4943/"
] | Sure, why not? The main problem you will run into is establishing contrastiveness. I strongly recommend reading ch. 4 of the Handbook of the IPA. You can hear two different cats purring at the [wiki page](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purr), so the question is whether those are two different purr phonemes (technically known as "purreme") or one with a big variation in realization? You could transcribe it as [ʔ̆ɨ̥̃̆ʔ̆ɨ̥̃̆ʔ̆ɨ̥̃̆ʔ̆ɨ̥̃̆ʔ̆ɨ̥̃̆ʔ̆ɨ̥̃̆], though you might have to explain that the breve implies a duration of about 5 msc. Apart from the inconvenience of writing all this junk, there is a deeper scientific question of whether it's wrong to imply that a purr is really made up of lots of tiny segments. So this is where, in dealing with language, somebody would propose a new symbol for this newly discovered sound. You could then propose [ﮛ] to represent this sound, but I doubt it would get approved.
With real language, the IPA symbol [a] represents a wide range of physical sounds, not a precise single physical sound (that doesn't even mean anything). At a certain point, an apparent "a" is far enough back that it sounds like the range of sounds represented as [ɑ], and then you can argue that writing "a" is an error and instead "ɑ" should be used. But that's only possible because there are languages that contrast [a] and [ɑ], so we know that [a] and [ɑ] are different things. The [a] of Arabic and the [a] of English (not US English) are different, but that doesn't motivate inventing new vowel letters: because, IPA is not a system for reducing arbitrary acoustic waveforms to combinations of letters. | I would like to encourage you in your transcription efforts on cat's phoneme inventory! I am a student of linguistics (B.Sc.) and I have two cats, too - that's why I have been thinking of doing the same one day. We often face men, even scientists, who claim that speech as a unique feature to the human race. When it comes up to explore speech in other species, the research is no longer free or open to new ideas but blocked as the results may question no less than the human supremacy: If we had evidence that various species do have language and use it on purpose (this requires advanced cognitive skills), it would be increasingly hard to keep up the human centric view on the world. So keep on noting down the distinctions that you recongnize in your cat's utterances and do not be discouraged if this would require creating a new kind of IPA chart for the felidae. |
15,497 | I was trying to transcribe my cat's noises into IPA. For example, her wanting to be petted is like [njæː] or [njaː]. But purring doesn't seem to fit any existing notation, except maybe [ʜ]. Has anyone ever mapped a cat's phonetic inventory? Their vocal tracts don't seem to be much different than ours. | 2016/01/12 | [
"https://linguistics.stackexchange.com/questions/15497",
"https://linguistics.stackexchange.com",
"https://linguistics.stackexchange.com/users/4943/"
] | Sure, why not? The main problem you will run into is establishing contrastiveness. I strongly recommend reading ch. 4 of the Handbook of the IPA. You can hear two different cats purring at the [wiki page](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purr), so the question is whether those are two different purr phonemes (technically known as "purreme") or one with a big variation in realization? You could transcribe it as [ʔ̆ɨ̥̃̆ʔ̆ɨ̥̃̆ʔ̆ɨ̥̃̆ʔ̆ɨ̥̃̆ʔ̆ɨ̥̃̆ʔ̆ɨ̥̃̆], though you might have to explain that the breve implies a duration of about 5 msc. Apart from the inconvenience of writing all this junk, there is a deeper scientific question of whether it's wrong to imply that a purr is really made up of lots of tiny segments. So this is where, in dealing with language, somebody would propose a new symbol for this newly discovered sound. You could then propose [ﮛ] to represent this sound, but I doubt it would get approved.
With real language, the IPA symbol [a] represents a wide range of physical sounds, not a precise single physical sound (that doesn't even mean anything). At a certain point, an apparent "a" is far enough back that it sounds like the range of sounds represented as [ɑ], and then you can argue that writing "a" is an error and instead "ɑ" should be used. But that's only possible because there are languages that contrast [a] and [ɑ], so we know that [a] and [ɑ] are different things. The [a] of Arabic and the [a] of English (not US English) are different, but that doesn't motivate inventing new vowel letters: because, IPA is not a system for reducing arbitrary acoustic waveforms to combinations of letters. | The hiss sounds like an [x].
The best purring sound I can make is the Spanish trill [r] with my mouth almost closed, or modulating my mouth so that it fills with air, it leaks out, repeat. |
15,497 | I was trying to transcribe my cat's noises into IPA. For example, her wanting to be petted is like [njæː] or [njaː]. But purring doesn't seem to fit any existing notation, except maybe [ʜ]. Has anyone ever mapped a cat's phonetic inventory? Their vocal tracts don't seem to be much different than ours. | 2016/01/12 | [
"https://linguistics.stackexchange.com/questions/15497",
"https://linguistics.stackexchange.com",
"https://linguistics.stackexchange.com/users/4943/"
] | If you'd like to transcribe how we perceive cat language (as opposed to how cats do), you might be interested in the corresponding problem for bird song, which has at least some literature. I found a reference to an LSA talk from 1977 by Donegan and Stampe, "Old Sam Peabody, Peabody, Peabody". | I would like to encourage you in your transcription efforts on cat's phoneme inventory! I am a student of linguistics (B.Sc.) and I have two cats, too - that's why I have been thinking of doing the same one day. We often face men, even scientists, who claim that speech as a unique feature to the human race. When it comes up to explore speech in other species, the research is no longer free or open to new ideas but blocked as the results may question no less than the human supremacy: If we had evidence that various species do have language and use it on purpose (this requires advanced cognitive skills), it would be increasingly hard to keep up the human centric view on the world. So keep on noting down the distinctions that you recongnize in your cat's utterances and do not be discouraged if this would require creating a new kind of IPA chart for the felidae. |
15,497 | I was trying to transcribe my cat's noises into IPA. For example, her wanting to be petted is like [njæː] or [njaː]. But purring doesn't seem to fit any existing notation, except maybe [ʜ]. Has anyone ever mapped a cat's phonetic inventory? Their vocal tracts don't seem to be much different than ours. | 2016/01/12 | [
"https://linguistics.stackexchange.com/questions/15497",
"https://linguistics.stackexchange.com",
"https://linguistics.stackexchange.com/users/4943/"
] | If you'd like to transcribe how we perceive cat language (as opposed to how cats do), you might be interested in the corresponding problem for bird song, which has at least some literature. I found a reference to an LSA talk from 1977 by Donegan and Stampe, "Old Sam Peabody, Peabody, Peabody". | The hiss sounds like an [x].
The best purring sound I can make is the Spanish trill [r] with my mouth almost closed, or modulating my mouth so that it fills with air, it leaks out, repeat. |
3,058 | In Paul Simon's album Graceland there is a song, "[All Around the World](https://genius.com/Paul-simon-all-around-the-world-or-the-myth-of-fingerprints-lyrics)". This song has a repeating theme in its verses, always some variation of:
>
> There was no doubt about it,
>
> It was the myth of fingerprints
>
>
>
The three instances are:
* >
> He says there's no doubt about it,
>
> It was the myth of fingerprints
>
>
>
* >
> And there's no doubt about it
>
> It was the myth of fingerprints
>
>
>
* >
> He said there's no doubt about it
>
> It was the myth of fingerprints
>
>
>
What is the "myth of fingerprints"? | 2017/07/20 | [
"https://literature.stackexchange.com/questions/3058",
"https://literature.stackexchange.com",
"https://literature.stackexchange.com/users/186/"
] | The "myth of fingerprints" is that by focusing on trivial aspects of ourselves, we appear to be very different when in fact we have much more in common with one another. It's also a literal myth: [fingerprints are highly differential but they are not unique](http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/2016/03/14/why-your-fingerprints-may-not-be-unique/).
As user @PeterShor very helpfully observed in the comments, our commonality is emphasised by this line, where "they" is fingerprints:
>
> I have seen them all, and man, they're all the same
>
>
>
While our differences are stressed by the final verse:
>
> Lives a former talk-show host
>
> And far and wide his name was known
>
> He said, “There’s no doubt about it
>
> It was the myth of fingerprints
>
> That’s why we must learn to live alone”
>
>
>
The myth of fingerprints condemns us to live alone - as atomised, quarrelsome individuals - when we could instead enjoy the fruits of living in harmony. It's interesting that the subject of the song is a talk show host, someone who makes a living interviewing the rich and famous and thus focussing on what makes them "different" from everyday people.
The previous verse becomes interesting in this context:
>
> Out in the Indian Ocean somewhere
>
> There’s a former army post
>
> Abandoned now just like the war
>
> And there’s no doubt about it
>
> It was the myth of fingerprints
>
> That’s what that old army post was for
>
>
>
Armies are required because we fight over our differences: it's what "the old army post was for". There is, however, hope that we might learn. The army post is abandoned. There is also only one US army base in the Indian Ocean - Diego Garcia. [Its inhabitants were forcibly removed by the US navy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diego_Garcia#Arrival_of_the_US_Navy) prior to building the base.
It's worth remembering that this is the closing track on an album which features critiques of racism as a major theme. Racism is founded on differences - the myth of fingerprints. This is all over other repeated structures in the song. "Watermelon" is a common racist motif in the US. "Black pit town," could be a mining town, or also a mining town populated by people of colour.
The lyrics about the sun rising and falling ("bloody" - another conflict motif) and "all around the world" suggest this has been going on essentially forever. We notice it - "somebody says what's a better thing to do" - but do nothing.
So this is a song about how conflict and oppression are built on emphasizing small differences between people. It opines that this is human nature and that we must, to some extent, learn to live with it. But that it shouldn't stop us asking questions and doing what we can to improve matters, even if we must, eventually, "learn to live alone". | Paul Simon was in South Africa during 1985 and 1986. There was a boycott against South Africa because of apartheid. For South Africans, the word associations arising from ‘fingerprints’ are typically police, passbooks and apartheid. The Myth of Fingerprints immediately suggests a political song with an anti-apartheid theme.
One of the cornerstone apartheid laws related to the passbook. A black man was always obliged to carry his passbook with him. It was an identity document with photograph, fingerprints and other information. Without a passbook you could be arrested and sent back to your homeland. The situation changed on July 23, 1986 when the South African government lifted the requirement to carry passbooks.
The topic of passbooks was newsworthy for many months, especially on talk radio.
John Berks was active while Paul Simon was doing his South African project. John was a pioneer of talk radio. His job as a talk show host was to engender opinions, instil debate and communicate. The job was risky because there was no free speech in South Africa. He vigorously defended his right to say what he wished while on air and regularly offended listeners from all walks of life. Given the political situation and the censorship laws, he needed to be outside the country to do his job.
John worked for Capital Radio 604, a radio station that broadcast to listeners in South Africa from transmitters located in Port St Johns, Transkei using Medium Wave (AM) on 603 kHz.
Port St Johns is the border town on the Indian Ocean coast that is over the mountains. John Berks lived there. At the border post your fingerprints are checked. Once the system of passbooks was scrapped the border post was abandoned and the whole reason for homelands such as the Transkei disappeared. Words like 'war' and 'army' are accurate. In the 1980s South Africa deployed the army to control civil unrest.
In summary, the Myth of Fingerprints suggests a future scenario in South Africa where there is equality before the law for all people regardless of the fingerprints in their passbook. |
124,085 | I have been working in a research position in a DOE lab in the United States for the past year or so, and my mentor wrote me letters of recommendation for my graduate school application. I have been, to put it bluntly, worse at my job recently than I had been when he wrote the letter, and I would quite like to leave soon as:
* It has always been a poor fit for my interests, and I am rapidly losing the motivation to continue;
* I have not been challenged/learned anything new for months, and I do not have the discretion to change this;
* I am not vital to any of the ongoing projects in my group;
* I have saved enough to support myself through matriculation.
I am very worried that, given my recent job performance, if I leave soon, my mentor might try to contact graduate programs to which I submitted applications 1+ months ago to give an update on his impression of my character/abilities/etc. Is this a real possibility? If so, how would graduate schools react, receiving this so long after submission, or if they've already accepted me? | 2019/01/31 | [
"https://academia.stackexchange.com/questions/124085",
"https://academia.stackexchange.com",
"https://academia.stackexchange.com/users/103786/"
] | Anything is possible, of course, but (warning - opinion coming), I think it would be very unlikely. First, I doubt that your mentor would do that, though I don't know the person so can't be definitive. I would not, anyway. Second, if you have been accepted (and told them you are coming) you have at least an informal contract that is unlikely to be broken. In some places it would likely be against regulations to withdraw an offer after acceptance. But again, I suppose it is possible that it would happen.
However, you might be questioned by your mentor or others about this, so be prepared to give an honest reply. People learn as they live and they change their minds about things. Other people generally understand that and accept it as long as it doesn't cause disruption.
But I think your worry is probably based on very little. (Sorry about all the "weasel words" here.) | >
> Is this a real possibility?
>
>
>
I can only speak for myself, but I would have to be VERY angry before I would take the time and do something as drastic as this. At worst, I can imagine someone rescinding their letter without sending an update, but even that would be far beyond something I would consider doing for an average case.
>
> If so, how would graduate schools react, receiving this so long after submission, or if they've already accepted me?
>
>
>
If the new letter described some really egregious conduct (e.g., fraud, stealing), this would certainly affect the decision. For the sort of minor matters you describe, I think it would reflect poorly on the sender, though whether it also reflected poorly on the student (particularly to the point of changing the decision) is hard to predict.
>
> I have been, to put it bluntly, worse at my job recently
>
>
>
Unsolicited advice: consider leaving soon (or rededicating yourself). It's possible the problem hasn't even been noted yet, and people are unlikely to be offended by your decision to pursue other paths. But if this continues for months, you will likely burn a bridge. |
156,413 | Suppose I'm playing a character that has a flying speed (such as a [Variant (Winged) Tiefling](https://www.dndbeyond.com/races/tiefling#VariantTiefling) or an [Aarakocra](https://www.dndbeyond.com/races/aarakocra)) and get critically hit. The DM rolls on the [Lingering Injuries table](https://www.dndbeyond.com/sources/dmg/dungeon-masters-workshop#Injuries) and after rolling a 3 tells me I lose a leg. The table says (emphasis mine):
>
> **Lose a Foot or Leg.** Your speed **on foot** is halved, and you must use a cane or crutch to move unless you have a peg leg or other prosthesis. **You fall prone after using the Dash action.** You have disadvantage on Dexterity checks made to balance. Magic such as the regenerate spell can restore the lost appendage.
>
>
>
If I'm using my flying movement, I know from reading this that my speed isn't reduced (I'm not walking with my feet, I'm flying with my wings). But reading this seems to imply that if I Dash while flying, I still fall prone (and arguably am in worse trouble than if I were trying to run on foot). Is that the case, or am I missing something here? | 2019/09/17 | [
"https://rpg.stackexchange.com/questions/156413",
"https://rpg.stackexchange.com",
"https://rpg.stackexchange.com/users/55869/"
] | The rules simply didn't take the flying case into account. You'll notice there is no reference in any of the entries in the table to losing a wing instead of an arm. I think it was simply written before these flying races became playable.
The highlighted text makes perfect sense if you are restricted to using your legs to move around but makes no sense if you are flying and wasn't landing at the end of your movement.
But, rules as written, it says what it says. I would suggest that a DM that makes you fall prone is taking the rules too literally. | By Rules As Written, Probably.
==============================
Out of context, the sentence is unambiguous: *You fall prone after using the Dash action.* Done.
By Rules As Interpreted, Probably Not.
======================================
In context, the sentence derives from the title and preceding sentence about moving *on foot*, hence that modifying clause can be implied, and the effect doesn't necessarily apply to other types of movement.
At my table, Probably.
======================
Because I would change it to "Lose a Wing or Wingtip" if the damage came from a direction more likely to hit wings than legs. |
235,882 | I have a directory on my server at
/home/dave/www/images/site (ext3)
which I want to mount directly to my Windows computer so that I can transfer data easily via command line tool. Is that something possible? | 2011/01/20 | [
"https://superuser.com/questions/235882",
"https://superuser.com",
"https://superuser.com/users/63319/"
] | If the server is located within your "local" network (i.e: not across the internet) it might actually be considerably less hassle to set up a SMB (i.e.: Windows) share on the Linux server and let your Windows box access it in that manner.
Depending on your server configuration, if may already have the necessary software (Samba) installed - check your package manager for more details. | Check out these links on using Samba:
[Install Samba Server on Ubuntu](http://www.howtogeek.com/howto/ubuntu/install-samba-server-on-ubuntu/)
[Configuring SAMBA](https://help.ubuntu.com/6.06/ubuntu/serverguide/C/configuring-samba.html)
[The Unofficial Samba HOWTO](http://www.oregontechsupport.com/samba/) |
235,882 | I have a directory on my server at
/home/dave/www/images/site (ext3)
which I want to mount directly to my Windows computer so that I can transfer data easily via command line tool. Is that something possible? | 2011/01/20 | [
"https://superuser.com/questions/235882",
"https://superuser.com",
"https://superuser.com/users/63319/"
] | If the server is local, you may want to look into creating Samba shares, which will behave exactly like a standard Windows share if configured correctly.
FTP and SCP also come to mind. If this server will be reached across the internet, I would highly recommend SCP.
[WinSCP](http://winscp.net/eng/docs/commandline) has a great command-line utility, as well as a corresponding graphical version. | If the server is located within your "local" network (i.e: not across the internet) it might actually be considerably less hassle to set up a SMB (i.e.: Windows) share on the Linux server and let your Windows box access it in that manner.
Depending on your server configuration, if may already have the necessary software (Samba) installed - check your package manager for more details. |
235,882 | I have a directory on my server at
/home/dave/www/images/site (ext3)
which I want to mount directly to my Windows computer so that I can transfer data easily via command line tool. Is that something possible? | 2011/01/20 | [
"https://superuser.com/questions/235882",
"https://superuser.com",
"https://superuser.com/users/63319/"
] | If the server is local, you may want to look into creating Samba shares, which will behave exactly like a standard Windows share if configured correctly.
FTP and SCP also come to mind. If this server will be reached across the internet, I would highly recommend SCP.
[WinSCP](http://winscp.net/eng/docs/commandline) has a great command-line utility, as well as a corresponding graphical version. | Check out these links on using Samba:
[Install Samba Server on Ubuntu](http://www.howtogeek.com/howto/ubuntu/install-samba-server-on-ubuntu/)
[Configuring SAMBA](https://help.ubuntu.com/6.06/ubuntu/serverguide/C/configuring-samba.html)
[The Unofficial Samba HOWTO](http://www.oregontechsupport.com/samba/) |
448,713 | In QM and assuming you could repeat the same exact bond-breaking experiment arbitrary number of times, do bonds always break at the same stretch length, or does the uncertainty principle require some variability in the stretch length at which the atoms debond? | 2018/12/16 | [
"https://physics.stackexchange.com/questions/448713",
"https://physics.stackexchange.com",
"https://physics.stackexchange.com/users/128404/"
] | A direct answer to this question is not simple. The main difficulty is related to the formal definition of what a chemical bond is.
The most useful definitions of bond in the case of molecules and condensed matter either rely on the introduction of molecular orbitals, analyzing the role played by orbitals and their energy on the cohesive property of the system, or are based on a careful analysis of the topological properties of the electronic charge density (this is the modern approach of "*atoms in molecules*" proposed by [Bader and coworkers](https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/pdf/10.1002/jcc.20528) a couple of decades ago.
At the best of my knowledge, all the attempts to put on a more formal base the concept of chemical bond hinge on electronic density or electronic wavefunctions, which means that the concept of bonding, bond formation, bond stretching or bond breaking, are all based on quantities which already embody in their definition some average statistical behavior. Electron density is an average quantity. An orbital allows to evaluate its associated probability density and therefore averages and uncertainties (standard deviations). Therefore, every statement about bonds is based on **properties of the whole statistical ensemble** underlying the statistical interpretation of quantum mechanics.
On the basis of these considerations, my answer is that **bonds always break at the same stretch length** due to the existing definitions of bond. | The way quantum mechanics sees molecular bonding is the existence of a bound state (By the states I mean the energy eigenstates for the electrons in the potential provided by the protons ) which has energy lesser than the bound states in the constituent atoms. The potential between two atoms is usually modelled using morse-potential or morse-potential like potentials. [](https://i.stack.imgur.com/szgSf.png)
This model tells us that if we excite the electron to a higher energy state it becomes more and more delocalised because the wave function is more spread out.
[](https://i.stack.imgur.com/8MIjn.png)
Now, this is how we explain the electron having a high probability of leaving the molecule and ionising it. Now, let's try to turn this idea on its head.
**\*I am taking a bit of freedom here, would be happy to receive feedback from the peer \***
Now if we look at the Morse potential and think that the atomic nucleus is slowly moving away from each other (so slow that it is almost stationary for the electron). Then we can see that we are automatically pushing our electron to a higher more and more delocalised wavefunction for this potential. So now the electron is moving around a lot more.
But as we move the atoms away from each other the potential of individual atom starts coming into play.
[](https://i.stack.imgur.com/F8sxQ.gif)
Now the moment the potential well for an individual atom is deeper than the potential well for morse potential, the electron will then move to the individual atoms leaving the molecular state. This is how I think bonds are broken.
Now, in this picture, I think bond breaking is not a discrete event because at some point during this transition the morse potential and the atomic potential would be comparable and there will be an asymmetric potential well with the electron tunnelling between the two wells. And hence we indeed will have an uncertainty in the bond breaking length but I am not sure it is in any way analogous to the uncertainity principle. It is more like a transition state with a finite probability of both molecular and atomic state existence.
---
Follow up: Too long for comment
Hi SuchDoge, I am sorry, I do not see a solution to this problem. Firstly, because the Morse potential I have mentioned is an assumption which breaks down at higher energy levels. And as far as I know, most potential which are entered by hand do break down at higher energy levels. Most research I tried to look for focus on energy states in the molecular form, many did mention decay into an atomic form but gave no explanation for that. And about the order of magnitude estimate, I think there is definitely no such general estimate that uniquely emerges from quantum mechanics. I think if one goes down the road of too simple upper and lower bounds then even normal electrodynamics and maybe even simple geometry may give you some bounds. |
29,993,615 | I am in the process of submitting my first Ionic application to the store. However I am receiving an error every single time that I try to submit my binary to the store:
**Invalid Signature** - A sealed resource is missing or invalid. The binary at path [Who Paid Last?.app/Who Paid Last?] contains an invalid signature. Make sure you have signed your application with a distribution certificate, not an ad hoc certificate or a development certificate....
I have verified that my certificates are correct. I have even tried moving my .git folder outside of the directory, but still no luck. I have tried about 7 different configurations and still the same result time and time again.
The crazy thing is that after my archive has been built, I validate using XCode's validator. The validator says that my .ipa has zero errors and that it is ready for submission, but iTunes Connect says differently.
I have also tried following this [tutorial on troubleshooting](https://stackoverflow.com/questions/21853083/invalid-signature-invalid-binary-on-itunes-connect) but without any luck. | 2015/05/01 | [
"https://Stackoverflow.com/questions/29993615",
"https://Stackoverflow.com",
"https://Stackoverflow.com/users/2438309/"
] | The issue had to do with the name of my app. The name of my application is Who Paid Last?, and come to find out, the "?" in the name is what was causing the issue. As soon as I removed it, the app was submitted just fine with out any issues. | I had a similar issue, but my error message was "Invalid Signature. Code object is not signed at all. The binary at path [myApp.app/www/js/02\_jshint.js] contains an invalid signature...."
Deleting the #!/usr/bin/env directive from the top of my 02\_jshint.js file, then building the iOS version of your project from the CLI worked for me. |
9,084,552 | I have a requirement to produce PDF's for one my .Net web applications currently hosted on Appharbor.
Traditionally, I would simply install latex on the machine, and create PDF's on the fly with pdflatex. This requirement is to display sections in HTML to end users, but also have a downloadable PDF - so it's slightly different.
I have found several (free) external HTML to PDF converters which may be applicable in this instance. However, I haven't found any libraries allowing me to do this purely programatically.
What advice would you give if I plan to continue using Appharbor?
Should I set up a seperate EC2 (or similar) instance to run such an application from? Or is there a better alternative? | 2012/01/31 | [
"https://Stackoverflow.com/questions/9084552",
"https://Stackoverflow.com",
"https://Stackoverflow.com/users/892397/"
] | I'd recommend using something like [DocRaptor](http://docraptor.com/). Note that you can probably continue with your current scheme if you place the relevant pdflatex executable (and it doesn't require the entire Latex runtime) alongside the code you push to AppHarbor. AppHarbor will also be introducing [background workers](http://feedback.appharbor.com/forums/95687-general/suggestions/1370747-background-jobs), which might be a good fit for this sort of work. | Note that if you're trying to use Rotativa or using wkhtmltopdf with routes obtained from HttpContext you'll need to use this workaround:
<http://support.appharbor.com/kb/getting-started/workaround-for-generating-absolute-urls-without-port-number>
or install the premotion fix from Nuget:
<https://github.com/trilobyte/Premotion-AspNet-AppHarbor-Integration> |
204,438 | So, I got a fancy new computer and I'd like to move adobe flash's saved data from computer a to computer b.
Side note: computer a is win 7 64 bit, and computer b is ubuntu 64 bit. However, I may fall back to win 7 so answering with the generic process of backing up and restoring the saved data is great. | 2010/10/28 | [
"https://superuser.com/questions/204438",
"https://superuser.com",
"https://superuser.com/users/4612/"
] | You are asking how to transfer flash cookies from one PC to another. That's answered in a previous SuperUser question: [Folder location of Flash cookies on Windows Vista](https://superuser.com/questions/31457/what-folder-contains-flash-cookies-on-vista). Just copy the contents of the appropriate folder from one PC to the other (while your web browser and any Adobe AIR applications are NOT running) and all should be well.
If the data is stored on a server, instead of your PC, obviously this won't help, but that folder is the only place Flash Player is permitted to store its persistent information. | If you're asking for what I think you're asking for, cached Flash files downloaded from the web, you'll want to look through your cache directory for `*.swf` files, and move those to wherever Machine B expects to find them.
I could, however, be misunderstanding the question ... |
8 | I'm interested in finding out:
1. what the process of choosing the books of the New Testament was,
2. when did it occur,
3. who did the choosing, and
4. what are the supporting evidences | 2011/08/23 | [
"https://christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/8",
"https://christianity.stackexchange.com",
"https://christianity.stackexchange.com/users/19/"
] | This is hard to reference because it's a fairly organic process, but the works translated by [St. Jerome](http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/08341a.htm) into Latin to make up the Vulgate (People's) Bible are the ones that were read during early liturgies.
From a doctrinal stand point, this is the other answer:
>
> The Synod of Hippo, in northern Africa, in 393, approved the New
> Testament, as it stands today, together with the Septuagint books, as
> did the Councils of Carthage in 397 and 419. St. Augustine regarded
> the scriptural canon as closed, as did Pope Damasus I and the Council
> of Rome in 382. Damasus' commissioning of the Latin Vulgate edition of
> the Bible, c. 383, was instrumental in the fixation of the canon in
> the Latin speaking world.
>
>
>
[Source](http://www.rev-know-it-all.com/2010/2010---06-13.html) | When the Canon of the Scripture was closed, it already contained a list of books that were widely accepted as authoritative in the Christian communities spread all over the known world.
What we know today as deuterocanonical (or apocryphal) books of the New Testament were considered heretic very early in the history of the Christian communities. So there was never really a given time when people gathered and examined books to decide which ones would be included and which ones wouldn't.
[Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biblical_canon#Christian_canons) has some interesting information about the Christian Canon. |
8 | I'm interested in finding out:
1. what the process of choosing the books of the New Testament was,
2. when did it occur,
3. who did the choosing, and
4. what are the supporting evidences | 2011/08/23 | [
"https://christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/8",
"https://christianity.stackexchange.com",
"https://christianity.stackexchange.com/users/19/"
] | The canon developed gradually over the course of more than 300 years. In many cases, when decisions were made, they were simply to acknowledge what was already being read in the churches.
The process started early. Already in 2 Peter 3:16, there is a reference to the letters of Paul:
>
> There are some things in them hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other scriptures.
>
>
>
So at least some of the churches were already circulating Paul's letters and reading them as scripture.
The Gospels were written after Paul's letters, and the Apostolic Fathers quoted most often from Matthew, but also sometimes from Mark and Luke, and eventually from John.
By the late 2nd century, Irenaeus ([Against Heresies 3.11.8](http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/anf01.ix.iv.xii.html)) was claiming that the canon must contain exactly four gospels:
>
> It is not possible that the Gospels can be either more or fewer in number than they are. For, since there are four zones of the world in which we live, and four principal winds, while the Church is scattered throughout all the world, and the “pillar and ground” of the Church is the Gospel and the spirit of life; it is fitting that she should have four pillars, breathing out immortality on every side, and vivifying men afresh.
>
>
>
This was to counter fringe groups that were producing their own gospels, as well as Marcion, who argued for just one gospel (Luke).
We don't know who compiled the list known as the [Muratorian Fragment](http://www.ntcanon.org/Muratorian_Canon.shtml), but it also dates from the second century and contains this canon:
* Four gospels (the existing fragment begins by naming Luke as the third and John as the fourth)
* The Book of Acts
* Thirteen letters of Paul (and then names two letters attributed to Paul but not accepted as genuine)
* Jude
* Two letters from John
* Revelations "of John and Peter"
* "the Wisdom written by friends of Solomon in his honour"
Hebrews, James, 2 Peter, and 3 John were not yet accepted.
The fragment also recommends the [Shepherd of Hermas](http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/anf02.ii.i.html) as being worth reading but not qualifying for the canon because it was written "quite lately in our time".
By the early fourth century, the church historian Eusebius ([Church History 3.25](http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf201.iii.viii.xxv.html)) sorts the known early writings into cateogories.
The first category is:
* Four Gospels plus Acts
Next in importance are:
* The letters of Paul
* One letter each from John and Peter
These are the writings that are universally accepted by the church. Eusebius adds that some believe Revelation should be included in this set.
The next category includes books that are disputed by some:
* James
* Jude
* 2 and 3 John
* 2 Peter
These would all eventually be added to the canon.
The next category includes books that rejected from the canon but worth reading:
* Acts of Paul
* The Shepherd
* Apocalypse of Peter
* Letter from Barnabas
* The Teaching of the Apostles
He mentions that some would place Revelation in this group, and others would include the Gospel of the Hebrews.
And finally, Eusebius mentions other writings that are considered heretical, which he says should be "cast aside as absurd and impious." These include the gospels of Peter and Thomas, among others.
The first known list of canon that matches today's New Testament is found in the [Easter Letter of Athanasius](http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf204.xxv.iii.iii.xxv.html) for the year 367:
>
> Again it is not tedious to speak of the [books] of the New Testament. These are, the four Gospels, according to Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John. Afterwards, the Acts of the Apostles and Epistles (called Catholic), seven, viz. of James, one; of Peter, two; of John, three; after these, one of Jude. In addition, there are fourteen Epistles of Paul, written in this order. The first, to the Romans; then two to the Corinthians; after these, to the Galatians; next, to the Ephesians; then to the Philippians; then to the Colossians; after these, two to the Thessalonians, and that to the Hebrews; and again, two to Timothy; one to Titus; and lastly, that to Philemon. And besides, the Revelation of John.
>
>
>
Athanasius then adds that other books—the Wisdom of Solomon, the Shepherd, the Teaching of the Apostles, et al.—should be read by new converts. So even as the canon was being defined, there was recognition that among the excluded books were some that were part of the church teaching, and some that were not.
Following Athanasius, we see the beginning of a general agreement throughout the church. The Synod of Hippo in 393 [published a list](http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf214.xv.iv.iv.xxv.html) of New Testament books identical to Athanasius' list, but also included an Old Testament canon. The Council of Carthage of 397 published a similar list, but is notable for separating Hebrews from the letters of Paul. The Latin Vulgate translation, commissioned by Pope Damasus in 382 and completed by Jerome in 405, contains the same set of books listed in these. The [Decretum Gelasianum](http://www.tertullian.org/decretum_eng.htm), widely thought to be associated with the same Pope Damasus, lists the same 27 books but makes a distinction among the letters of John ("of the Apostle John, one letter, of the other John the Elder, two letters").
The Council of Carthage of 419 lists the same books, but does not make a distinction between two writers named John, and does not separate Hebrews from the letters of Paul.
In the East, there would still be disagreement for more than a century. The Council of Laodicea of 364 accepted all of the current New Testament books except Revelation. The Apostolic Constitutions, compiled around 380, [has a Bible canon](http://www.bible-researcher.com/apostolic.html) including this same list, but adding three writings attributed to Clement of Rome.
The first version of the Peshitta, the Syriac translation of the Bible, omitted the books of 2 Peter, 2-3 John, Jude, and Revelation; these books would not be translated into Syriac until the 6th century.
The Quinisext Council or Council in Trullo was held in Constantinople in 692 to reaffirm the rulings of the Fifth and Sixth Ecumencal Councils; while this council did not publish a formal Bible canon, it did reaffirm the canons previously published, including those of Athanasius and others with the Book of Revelation. This set the stage for the 7th Ecumenical Council (Second Council of Nicea) in 787, which finally established what we now know as the 27-book New Testament canon for the entire church. | When the Canon of the Scripture was closed, it already contained a list of books that were widely accepted as authoritative in the Christian communities spread all over the known world.
What we know today as deuterocanonical (or apocryphal) books of the New Testament were considered heretic very early in the history of the Christian communities. So there was never really a given time when people gathered and examined books to decide which ones would be included and which ones wouldn't.
[Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biblical_canon#Christian_canons) has some interesting information about the Christian Canon. |
8 | I'm interested in finding out:
1. what the process of choosing the books of the New Testament was,
2. when did it occur,
3. who did the choosing, and
4. what are the supporting evidences | 2011/08/23 | [
"https://christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/8",
"https://christianity.stackexchange.com",
"https://christianity.stackexchange.com/users/19/"
] | Let me give you the original document of Council Of Carthage AD 419
>
> Canon 24. (Greek xxvii.)
>
>
> That nothing be read in church besides the Canonical Scripture
>
>
> Item, that besides the Canonical Scriptures nothing be read in church under the name of divine Scripture.
>
>
> But the Canonical Scriptures are as follows:
>
>
> Genesis.
>
> Exodus.
>
> Leviticus.
>
> Numbers.
>
> Deuteronomy.
>
> Joshua the Son of Nun.
>
> The Judges.
>
> Ruth.
>
> The Kings, iv. books.
>
> The Chronicles, ij. books.
>
> Job.
>
> The Psalter.
>
> The Five books of Solomon.
>
> The Twelve Books of the Prophets.
>
> Isaiah.
>
> Jeremiah.
>
> Ezechiel.
>
> Daniel.
>
> Tobit.
>
> Judith.
>
> Esther.
>
> Ezra, ij. books.
>
> Macchabees, ij. books.
>
> The New Testament.
>
> The Gospels, iv. books.
>
> The Acts of the Apostles, j. book.
>
> The Epistles of Paul, xiv.
>
> The Epistles of Peter, the Apostle, ij.
>
> The Epistles of John the Apostle, iij.
>
> The Epistles of James the Apostle, j.
>
> The Epistle of Jude the Apostle, j.
>
> The Revelation of John, j. book.
>
> Let this be sent to our brother and fellow bishop, Boniface, and to the other bishops of those parts, that they may confirm this canon, for these are the things which we have received from our fathers to be read in church.
>
>
>
Here, the council take a decision to send the list to BONIFACE bishop of Rome, again in the council of Hippo, it was mentioned that "send the list to Rome and ratify it" It was the Roman Church who decided the canon, based on apostolic tradition.. | When the Canon of the Scripture was closed, it already contained a list of books that were widely accepted as authoritative in the Christian communities spread all over the known world.
What we know today as deuterocanonical (or apocryphal) books of the New Testament were considered heretic very early in the history of the Christian communities. So there was never really a given time when people gathered and examined books to decide which ones would be included and which ones wouldn't.
[Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biblical_canon#Christian_canons) has some interesting information about the Christian Canon. |
8 | I'm interested in finding out:
1. what the process of choosing the books of the New Testament was,
2. when did it occur,
3. who did the choosing, and
4. what are the supporting evidences | 2011/08/23 | [
"https://christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/8",
"https://christianity.stackexchange.com",
"https://christianity.stackexchange.com/users/19/"
] | The New Testament Books were written by various authors, to various geographic regions (from Galatia to Rome), spread across time (from ~45 AD to as late as ~95 AD). It took time for them to spread, being copied and carried by hand across vast distances.
As such, if a church father did not mention a book from the new testament, the typical reason was simply that he hadn’t seen it yet!
To answer your question, let's start by reviewing how these books spread over time, in both acceptance and usage in the church.
~155 AD: Justin Martyr refers to the gospels.
---------------------------------------------
>
> Justin Martyr, [The First Apology](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0126.htm), Chapter 66. Of the Eucharist
>
>
> For the apostles, in the memoirs composed by them, which are called Gospels, have thus delivered unto us what was enjoined upon them; that Jesus took bread, and when He had given thanks, said, This do in remembrance of Me, this is My body; and that, after the same manner, having taken the cup and given thanks, He said, This is My blood; and gave it to them alone.
>
>
>
~170 AD: The Muratorian fragment lists 22 of the 27 New Testament books.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
* It excludes James, 1 & 2 Peter, Hebrews, and 3 John.
* Curiously, it also includes the Deuterocanonical Old Testament Book of Wisdom in its New Testament canon.
* It notes that some accept Apocalypse of Peter.
* It also says that The Shepherd of Hermas should be read but not on same level as other scripture.
* Finally, it explicitly rejects several Apocrypha.
* [The full text is available here](http://www.bible-researcher.com/muratorian.html).
~180 AD: Irenaeus quotes explicitly from 21 of the 27 New Testament books.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
* Matthew 1:1 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103316.htm), Chapter 16, Section 2
* Mark 16:19 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103310.htm), Chapter 10, Section 5
* Luke 1:2 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103314.htm), Chapter 14, Section 2
* John 1:1 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103311.htm), Chapter 11, Section 1
* Acts 20:5-6 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103314.htm), Chapter 14, Section 1
* Romans 1:1-4 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103316.htm), Chapter 16, Section 3
* 1 Corinthians 1:18 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book I](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103103.htm), Chapter 3, Section 5
* 2 Corinthians 4:4 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103307.htm), Chapter 7, Section 1
* Galatians 4:4 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103322.htm), Chapter 22, Section 1
* Ephesians 5:30 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book V](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103502.htm), Chapter 2, Section 3
* Philippians 4:18 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book IV](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103418.htm), Chapter 18, Section 4
* Colossians 3:11 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book I](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103418.htm), Chapter 3, Section 4
* 1 Thessalonians 5:23 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book V](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103506.htm), Chapter 6, Section 1
* 2 Thessalonians 2:8 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book V](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103525.htm), Chapter 25, Section 3
* 1 Timothy 1:4 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book I](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103100.htm), Preface, Section 1
* 2 Timothy 4:10-11 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103100.htm), Chapter 14, Section 1
* Titus 3:10 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103100.htm), Chapter 3, Section 4
* 1 Peter 1:8 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book IV](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103409.htm), Chapter 9, Section 2
* 1 John 5:1 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103409.htm), Chapter 16, Section 8
* 2 John 1:11 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book I](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103116.htm), Chapter 16, Section 3
* Revelation 3:7 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book IV](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103420.htm), Chapter 20, Section 2
Of the 6 books remaining, he may refer to Hebrews, James, and 2 Peter.
* Hebrews 1:3 maybe(?) quoted in [Against Heresies, Book II, Chapter 30](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103230.htm), Section 9
* James 2:23 maybe(?) quoted in [Against Heresies, Book IV](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103416.htm), Chapter 16, Section 2
* 2 Peter 3:8 maybe(?) quoted in [Against Heresies, Book V](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103528.htm), Chapter 28, Section 3
He does not quote from Philemon, 3 John or Jude.
Irenaeus identifies The Shepherd of Hermas as Scripture.
>
> Irenaeus, [Against Heresies, Book IV](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103420.htm), Chapter 20, Section 2
>
>
> Truly, then, the Scripture declared, which says, "First of all believe that there is one God, who has established all things, and completed them, and having caused that from what had no being, all things should come into existence: He who contains all things, and is Himself contained by no one." [The Shepherd of Hermas, Book 2, First Commandment]
>
>
>
He also seems to identify the letter of 1 Clement as authoritative in [Against Heresies Book III, Chapter 3, Section 3](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103303.htm) - as well as condemning the Gospel of Judas in [Against Heresies, Book I, Chapter 31, Section 1 + Section 4](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103131.htm).
~250 AD: Origen's New Testament list includes 26 of the 27 NT books
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Origen's list excludes Revelation.
>
> Origen, [Homilies on Joshua](https://books.google.com/books/about/Homilies_on_Joshua.html?id=Yq6reMY6KMUC), 7.1
>
>
> But when our Lord Jesus Christ comes, whose arrival that prior son of Nun designated, he sends priests, his apostles, bearing “trumpets hammered thin,” the magnificent and heavenly instruction of proclamation. Matthew first sounded the priestly trumpet in his Gospel; Mark also; Luke and John each played their own priestly trumpets. Even Peter cries out with trumpets in two of his epistles; also James and Jude. In addition, John also sounds the trumpet through his epistles [and Revelation], and Luke, as he describes the Acts of the Apostles. And now that last one comes, the one who said, “I think God displays us apostles last,” and in fourteen of his epistles, thundering with trumpets, he casts down the walls of Jericho and all the devices of idolatry and dogmas of philosophers, all the way to the foundations.
>
>
>
He does quote from Revelation elsewhere in his writings, though.
>
> Origen, Expositions on the Gospel of John
>
>
> The one who reclined on Jesus' breast, John, who left behind one gospel while admitting that he could produce so many that the world would not be able to contain them [John 21:25]. He also wrote the Apocalypse, after being ordered to be silent and not to write what the seven thunders said [Rev 10:3-4]...
>
>
>
~350 AD: Cyril of Jerusalem's New Testament list includes 26 of the 27 NT books
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Cyril of Jerusalem's list excludes Revelation.
>
> Cyril of Jerusalem, [Catechetical Lecture 4](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/310104.htm), #36
>
>
> Then of the New Testament there are the four Gospels only, for the rest have false titles and are mischievous. The Manichæans also wrote a Gospel according to Thomas, which being tinctured with the fragrance of the evangelic title corrupts the souls of the simple sort. Receive also the Acts of the Twelve Apostles; and in addition to these the seven Catholic Epistles of James, Peter, John, and Jude; and as a seal upon them all, and the last work of the disciples, the fourteen Epistles of Paul. But let all the rest be put aside in a secondary rank. And whatever books are not read in Churches, these read not even by yourself, as you have heard me say.
>
>
>
367 AD: Athanasius's New Testament list includes all 27 books
-------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Athanasius, [Letter 39](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/2806039.htm)
>
>
> Again it is not tedious to speak of the [books] of the New Testament. These are, the four Gospels, according to Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John. Afterwards, the Acts of the Apostles and Epistles (called Catholic), seven, viz. of James, one; of Peter, two; of John, three; after these, one of Jude. In addition, there are fourteen Epistles of Paul, written in this order. The first, to the Romans; then two to the Corinthians; after these, to the Galatians; next, to the Ephesians; then to the Philippians; then to the Colossians; after these, two to the Thessalonians, and that to the Hebrews; and again, two to Timothy; one to Titus; and lastly, that to Philemon. And besides, the Revelation of John.
>
>
>
Noteworthy is that in that same letter Athanasius gives an Old Testament list which includes the Deuterocanonical book of Baruch, but excludes the book of Esther.
382 AD: Council of Rome's New Testament list includes all 27 books
------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> [Council of Rome](http://www.tertullian.org/decretum_eng.htm)
>
>
> Now indeed the issue of the divine scriptures must be discussed, which the universal Catholic church receives or which it is required to avoid...
>
>
> LIKEWISE THE ORDER OF THE SCRIPTURES OF THE NEW TESTAMENT which the holy and catholic Roman church upholds and is venerated:
>
>
> Four books of the Gospels: according to Mathew, according to Mark, according to Luke, according to John. Likewise the acts of the apostles. The letters of the apostle Paul in number fourteen: to the Romans, to the Corinthians two letters, to the Ephesians, to the Thesalonians two letters, to the Galatians, to the Philippians, to the Colossians, to Timothy two letters, to Titus, to the Philemon, to the Hebrews. Likewise the apocalypse of John. Likewise the canonical [catholic] letters in number seven: of the apostle Peter two letters, of the apostle James one letter, of the apostle John one letter, of the other John the elder two letters, of the apostle Judas the Zealot one letter.
>
>
> HERE ENDS THE CANON OF THE NEW TESTAMENT.
>
>
>
In addition to including all 27 New Testament books, it includes the Deuterocanonical books in the Old Testament (which Protestants reject).
~390 AD: Gregory of Nazianzus' New Testament list includes 26 of the 27 NT books
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gregory of Nazianzus's list excludes Revelation.
>
> [Concerning the Genuine Books of Divinely Inspired Scripture](http://www.bible-researcher.com/gregory.html) (poem)
>
>
> Now count also those of the new mystery. Matthew wrote the miracles of Christ for the Hebrews, Mark for Italy, Luke for Greece; John for all, the great herald, who walked in the heavens. Then the acts of the wise apostles. Of Paul there are fourteen epistles. And the seven catholic, [which include] one of James, two of Peter, three of John also; and Jude is the seventh. You have them all. And if there are any beyond these, they are not genuine.
>
>
>
393 AD: Council of Hippo's New Testament list includes all 27 books
-------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> [Council of Hippo](http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf214.xv.iv.iv.xxv.html)
>
>
> Item, that besides the Canonical Scriptures nothing be read in church under the name of divine Scripture.
>
>
> But the Canonical Scriptures are as follows: Genesis. Exodus. Leviticus. Numbers. Deuteronomy. Joshua the Son of Nun. The Judges. Ruth. The Kings, iv. books.
>
>
> The Chronicles, ij. books. Job. The Psalter. The Five books of Solomon. The Twelve Books of the Prophets. Isaiah. Jeremiah. Ezechiel. Daniel. Tobit. Judith. Esther. Ezra, ij. books. Macchabees, ij. books.
>
>
> The New Testament. The Gospels, iv. books. The Acts of the Apostles, j. book. The Epistles of Paul, xiv. The Epistles of Peter, the Apostle, ij. The Epistles of John the Apostle, iij. The Epistles of James the Apostle, j. The Epistle of Jude the Apostle, j. The Revelation of John, j. book.
>
>
>
In addition to including all 27 New Testament books, it includes the Deuterocanonical books in the Old Testament (which Protestants reject).
397 AD: Council of Carthage's New Testament list includes all 27 books
----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> [Synod of 397](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Councils_of_Carthage#Synod_of_397)
>
>
> It was also determined that besides the Canonical Scriptures nothing be read in the Church under the title of divine Scriptures. The Canonical Scriptures are these: Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, Deuteronomy, Joshua the son of Nun, Judges, Ruth, four books of Kings, two books of Paraleipomena, Job, the Psalter, five books of Solomon, the books of the twelve prophets, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezechiel, Daniel, Tobit, Judith, Esther, two books of Esdras, two books of the Maccabees. Of the New Testament: four books of the Gospels, one book of the Acts of the Apostles, thirteen Epistles of the Apostle Paul, one epistle of the same [writer] to the Hebrews, two Epistles of the Apostle Peter, three of John, one of James, one of Jude, one book of the Apocalypse of John.
>
>
>
In addition to including all 27 New Testament books, it includes the Deuterocanonical books in the Old Testament (which Protestants reject).
Consensus Period
----------------
At this point, with Jerome's Latin Vulgate translation, the New Testament translation was set and remained unchanged for a thousand years, until the Reformation came...
1534 AD: Martin Luther's New Testament list includes all 27 books... kind of.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
In 1534, Luther’s Bible translation was published. In it, he moves Deuterocanon to the end of his Old Testament and labels them "Apocrypha".
>
> Apocrypha (Deuterocanon) introduction, Luther’s Bible
>
>
> These books are not held equal to the Scriptures, but are useful and good to read
>
>
>
Similar to his Apocrypha, he was skeptical of Hebrews, James, Jude and Revelation, and stuck them at the end of his New Testament, saying "Up to this point we have had to do with the true and certain chief books of the New Testament. The four which follow have from ancient times had a different reputation."
>
> [Preface to the Epistle to the Hebrews](http://www.godrules.net/library/luther/NEW1luther_f8.htm)
>
>
> Up to this point we have had to do with the true and certain chief books of the New Testament. The four which follow have from ancient times had a different reputation... This seems, as it stands, to be against all the Gospels and St. Paul’s epistles... [The Epistle to the Hebrews] we cannot put it on the same level with the apostolic epistles.
>
>
> [Preface to the Epistles of St. James and St. Jude](http://www.godrules.net/library/luther/NEW1luther_f8.htm)
>
>
> ...I do not regard it [the epistle of St. James] as the writing of an apostle; and my reasons follow. In the first place it is flatly against St. Paul and all the rest of Scripture in ascribing justification to works... He mangles the Scriptures and thereby opposes Paul and all Scripture... Therefore, I will not have him in my Bible to be numbered among the true chief books
>
>
> [Preface to the Epistles of St. James and St. Jude](http://www.godrules.net/library/luther/NEW1luther_f8.htm)
>
>
> Concerning the epistle of St. Jude... it is an epistle that need not be counted among the chief books which are supposed to lay the foundations of faith.
>
>
> [Preface to the Revelation of St. John](http://www.godrules.net/library/luther/NEW1luther_f8.htm)
>
>
> About this book of the Revelation of John... it makes me consider it to be neither apostolic nor prophetic... I can in no way detect that the Holy Spirit produced it.
>
>
>
Luther did not dare to remove these New Testament books, or the Deuterocanonical books, as they'd both been in the Christian bible for a thousand years.
His followers and subsequent reformers backed away from his New Testament Antilegomena division, but they kept his Old Testament Apocrypha division. The Apocrypha remained in Protestant bibles until the English civil war, which lasted from 1642 to 1649. The English Long Parliament of 1644 decreed that the Deuterocanonical books would not be read in the Church of England, and in 1647 the Westminster Confession of Faith was issued which decreed the modern Protestant bible with the Deuterocanon completely removed (no longer in a separate section in the back).
With the restoration of the monarchy to Charles II of England (1660-1685), the Church of England was once again governed by the Thirty-Nine Articles and the Deuterocanon was included again in their bible, but the genie was out of the bottle - the Westminster Confession of faith continued to exist, and Presbyterians and Baptists (among many other denominations) accept the canon it declared with the Deuterocanonical books completely removed.
So in summary, the New Testament books were not specifically chosen at a single moment in time. They spread gradually geographically, and a consensus was fairly rapidly established around most of the books. A couple edge cases existed until the councils in the late fourth century, and from those councils on they were fully established until the Reformation - which poked at them a bit, and then backed off.
[The above references were taken from here](https://teachthe.net/index.php?title=Why_do_Catholics_have_extra_books_in_their_bibles%3F#NT_Canon_formation) | When the Canon of the Scripture was closed, it already contained a list of books that were widely accepted as authoritative in the Christian communities spread all over the known world.
What we know today as deuterocanonical (or apocryphal) books of the New Testament were considered heretic very early in the history of the Christian communities. So there was never really a given time when people gathered and examined books to decide which ones would be included and which ones wouldn't.
[Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biblical_canon#Christian_canons) has some interesting information about the Christian Canon. |
8 | I'm interested in finding out:
1. what the process of choosing the books of the New Testament was,
2. when did it occur,
3. who did the choosing, and
4. what are the supporting evidences | 2011/08/23 | [
"https://christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/8",
"https://christianity.stackexchange.com",
"https://christianity.stackexchange.com/users/19/"
] | The canon developed gradually over the course of more than 300 years. In many cases, when decisions were made, they were simply to acknowledge what was already being read in the churches.
The process started early. Already in 2 Peter 3:16, there is a reference to the letters of Paul:
>
> There are some things in them hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other scriptures.
>
>
>
So at least some of the churches were already circulating Paul's letters and reading them as scripture.
The Gospels were written after Paul's letters, and the Apostolic Fathers quoted most often from Matthew, but also sometimes from Mark and Luke, and eventually from John.
By the late 2nd century, Irenaeus ([Against Heresies 3.11.8](http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/anf01.ix.iv.xii.html)) was claiming that the canon must contain exactly four gospels:
>
> It is not possible that the Gospels can be either more or fewer in number than they are. For, since there are four zones of the world in which we live, and four principal winds, while the Church is scattered throughout all the world, and the “pillar and ground” of the Church is the Gospel and the spirit of life; it is fitting that she should have four pillars, breathing out immortality on every side, and vivifying men afresh.
>
>
>
This was to counter fringe groups that were producing their own gospels, as well as Marcion, who argued for just one gospel (Luke).
We don't know who compiled the list known as the [Muratorian Fragment](http://www.ntcanon.org/Muratorian_Canon.shtml), but it also dates from the second century and contains this canon:
* Four gospels (the existing fragment begins by naming Luke as the third and John as the fourth)
* The Book of Acts
* Thirteen letters of Paul (and then names two letters attributed to Paul but not accepted as genuine)
* Jude
* Two letters from John
* Revelations "of John and Peter"
* "the Wisdom written by friends of Solomon in his honour"
Hebrews, James, 2 Peter, and 3 John were not yet accepted.
The fragment also recommends the [Shepherd of Hermas](http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/anf02.ii.i.html) as being worth reading but not qualifying for the canon because it was written "quite lately in our time".
By the early fourth century, the church historian Eusebius ([Church History 3.25](http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf201.iii.viii.xxv.html)) sorts the known early writings into cateogories.
The first category is:
* Four Gospels plus Acts
Next in importance are:
* The letters of Paul
* One letter each from John and Peter
These are the writings that are universally accepted by the church. Eusebius adds that some believe Revelation should be included in this set.
The next category includes books that are disputed by some:
* James
* Jude
* 2 and 3 John
* 2 Peter
These would all eventually be added to the canon.
The next category includes books that rejected from the canon but worth reading:
* Acts of Paul
* The Shepherd
* Apocalypse of Peter
* Letter from Barnabas
* The Teaching of the Apostles
He mentions that some would place Revelation in this group, and others would include the Gospel of the Hebrews.
And finally, Eusebius mentions other writings that are considered heretical, which he says should be "cast aside as absurd and impious." These include the gospels of Peter and Thomas, among others.
The first known list of canon that matches today's New Testament is found in the [Easter Letter of Athanasius](http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf204.xxv.iii.iii.xxv.html) for the year 367:
>
> Again it is not tedious to speak of the [books] of the New Testament. These are, the four Gospels, according to Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John. Afterwards, the Acts of the Apostles and Epistles (called Catholic), seven, viz. of James, one; of Peter, two; of John, three; after these, one of Jude. In addition, there are fourteen Epistles of Paul, written in this order. The first, to the Romans; then two to the Corinthians; after these, to the Galatians; next, to the Ephesians; then to the Philippians; then to the Colossians; after these, two to the Thessalonians, and that to the Hebrews; and again, two to Timothy; one to Titus; and lastly, that to Philemon. And besides, the Revelation of John.
>
>
>
Athanasius then adds that other books—the Wisdom of Solomon, the Shepherd, the Teaching of the Apostles, et al.—should be read by new converts. So even as the canon was being defined, there was recognition that among the excluded books were some that were part of the church teaching, and some that were not.
Following Athanasius, we see the beginning of a general agreement throughout the church. The Synod of Hippo in 393 [published a list](http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf214.xv.iv.iv.xxv.html) of New Testament books identical to Athanasius' list, but also included an Old Testament canon. The Council of Carthage of 397 published a similar list, but is notable for separating Hebrews from the letters of Paul. The Latin Vulgate translation, commissioned by Pope Damasus in 382 and completed by Jerome in 405, contains the same set of books listed in these. The [Decretum Gelasianum](http://www.tertullian.org/decretum_eng.htm), widely thought to be associated with the same Pope Damasus, lists the same 27 books but makes a distinction among the letters of John ("of the Apostle John, one letter, of the other John the Elder, two letters").
The Council of Carthage of 419 lists the same books, but does not make a distinction between two writers named John, and does not separate Hebrews from the letters of Paul.
In the East, there would still be disagreement for more than a century. The Council of Laodicea of 364 accepted all of the current New Testament books except Revelation. The Apostolic Constitutions, compiled around 380, [has a Bible canon](http://www.bible-researcher.com/apostolic.html) including this same list, but adding three writings attributed to Clement of Rome.
The first version of the Peshitta, the Syriac translation of the Bible, omitted the books of 2 Peter, 2-3 John, Jude, and Revelation; these books would not be translated into Syriac until the 6th century.
The Quinisext Council or Council in Trullo was held in Constantinople in 692 to reaffirm the rulings of the Fifth and Sixth Ecumencal Councils; while this council did not publish a formal Bible canon, it did reaffirm the canons previously published, including those of Athanasius and others with the Book of Revelation. This set the stage for the 7th Ecumenical Council (Second Council of Nicea) in 787, which finally established what we now know as the 27-book New Testament canon for the entire church. | This is hard to reference because it's a fairly organic process, but the works translated by [St. Jerome](http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/08341a.htm) into Latin to make up the Vulgate (People's) Bible are the ones that were read during early liturgies.
From a doctrinal stand point, this is the other answer:
>
> The Synod of Hippo, in northern Africa, in 393, approved the New
> Testament, as it stands today, together with the Septuagint books, as
> did the Councils of Carthage in 397 and 419. St. Augustine regarded
> the scriptural canon as closed, as did Pope Damasus I and the Council
> of Rome in 382. Damasus' commissioning of the Latin Vulgate edition of
> the Bible, c. 383, was instrumental in the fixation of the canon in
> the Latin speaking world.
>
>
>
[Source](http://www.rev-know-it-all.com/2010/2010---06-13.html) |
8 | I'm interested in finding out:
1. what the process of choosing the books of the New Testament was,
2. when did it occur,
3. who did the choosing, and
4. what are the supporting evidences | 2011/08/23 | [
"https://christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/8",
"https://christianity.stackexchange.com",
"https://christianity.stackexchange.com/users/19/"
] | This is hard to reference because it's a fairly organic process, but the works translated by [St. Jerome](http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/08341a.htm) into Latin to make up the Vulgate (People's) Bible are the ones that were read during early liturgies.
From a doctrinal stand point, this is the other answer:
>
> The Synod of Hippo, in northern Africa, in 393, approved the New
> Testament, as it stands today, together with the Septuagint books, as
> did the Councils of Carthage in 397 and 419. St. Augustine regarded
> the scriptural canon as closed, as did Pope Damasus I and the Council
> of Rome in 382. Damasus' commissioning of the Latin Vulgate edition of
> the Bible, c. 383, was instrumental in the fixation of the canon in
> the Latin speaking world.
>
>
>
[Source](http://www.rev-know-it-all.com/2010/2010---06-13.html) | The New Testament Books were written by various authors, to various geographic regions (from Galatia to Rome), spread across time (from ~45 AD to as late as ~95 AD). It took time for them to spread, being copied and carried by hand across vast distances.
As such, if a church father did not mention a book from the new testament, the typical reason was simply that he hadn’t seen it yet!
To answer your question, let's start by reviewing how these books spread over time, in both acceptance and usage in the church.
~155 AD: Justin Martyr refers to the gospels.
---------------------------------------------
>
> Justin Martyr, [The First Apology](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0126.htm), Chapter 66. Of the Eucharist
>
>
> For the apostles, in the memoirs composed by them, which are called Gospels, have thus delivered unto us what was enjoined upon them; that Jesus took bread, and when He had given thanks, said, This do in remembrance of Me, this is My body; and that, after the same manner, having taken the cup and given thanks, He said, This is My blood; and gave it to them alone.
>
>
>
~170 AD: The Muratorian fragment lists 22 of the 27 New Testament books.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
* It excludes James, 1 & 2 Peter, Hebrews, and 3 John.
* Curiously, it also includes the Deuterocanonical Old Testament Book of Wisdom in its New Testament canon.
* It notes that some accept Apocalypse of Peter.
* It also says that The Shepherd of Hermas should be read but not on same level as other scripture.
* Finally, it explicitly rejects several Apocrypha.
* [The full text is available here](http://www.bible-researcher.com/muratorian.html).
~180 AD: Irenaeus quotes explicitly from 21 of the 27 New Testament books.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
* Matthew 1:1 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103316.htm), Chapter 16, Section 2
* Mark 16:19 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103310.htm), Chapter 10, Section 5
* Luke 1:2 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103314.htm), Chapter 14, Section 2
* John 1:1 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103311.htm), Chapter 11, Section 1
* Acts 20:5-6 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103314.htm), Chapter 14, Section 1
* Romans 1:1-4 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103316.htm), Chapter 16, Section 3
* 1 Corinthians 1:18 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book I](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103103.htm), Chapter 3, Section 5
* 2 Corinthians 4:4 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103307.htm), Chapter 7, Section 1
* Galatians 4:4 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103322.htm), Chapter 22, Section 1
* Ephesians 5:30 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book V](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103502.htm), Chapter 2, Section 3
* Philippians 4:18 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book IV](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103418.htm), Chapter 18, Section 4
* Colossians 3:11 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book I](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103418.htm), Chapter 3, Section 4
* 1 Thessalonians 5:23 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book V](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103506.htm), Chapter 6, Section 1
* 2 Thessalonians 2:8 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book V](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103525.htm), Chapter 25, Section 3
* 1 Timothy 1:4 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book I](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103100.htm), Preface, Section 1
* 2 Timothy 4:10-11 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103100.htm), Chapter 14, Section 1
* Titus 3:10 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103100.htm), Chapter 3, Section 4
* 1 Peter 1:8 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book IV](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103409.htm), Chapter 9, Section 2
* 1 John 5:1 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103409.htm), Chapter 16, Section 8
* 2 John 1:11 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book I](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103116.htm), Chapter 16, Section 3
* Revelation 3:7 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book IV](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103420.htm), Chapter 20, Section 2
Of the 6 books remaining, he may refer to Hebrews, James, and 2 Peter.
* Hebrews 1:3 maybe(?) quoted in [Against Heresies, Book II, Chapter 30](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103230.htm), Section 9
* James 2:23 maybe(?) quoted in [Against Heresies, Book IV](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103416.htm), Chapter 16, Section 2
* 2 Peter 3:8 maybe(?) quoted in [Against Heresies, Book V](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103528.htm), Chapter 28, Section 3
He does not quote from Philemon, 3 John or Jude.
Irenaeus identifies The Shepherd of Hermas as Scripture.
>
> Irenaeus, [Against Heresies, Book IV](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103420.htm), Chapter 20, Section 2
>
>
> Truly, then, the Scripture declared, which says, "First of all believe that there is one God, who has established all things, and completed them, and having caused that from what had no being, all things should come into existence: He who contains all things, and is Himself contained by no one." [The Shepherd of Hermas, Book 2, First Commandment]
>
>
>
He also seems to identify the letter of 1 Clement as authoritative in [Against Heresies Book III, Chapter 3, Section 3](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103303.htm) - as well as condemning the Gospel of Judas in [Against Heresies, Book I, Chapter 31, Section 1 + Section 4](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103131.htm).
~250 AD: Origen's New Testament list includes 26 of the 27 NT books
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Origen's list excludes Revelation.
>
> Origen, [Homilies on Joshua](https://books.google.com/books/about/Homilies_on_Joshua.html?id=Yq6reMY6KMUC), 7.1
>
>
> But when our Lord Jesus Christ comes, whose arrival that prior son of Nun designated, he sends priests, his apostles, bearing “trumpets hammered thin,” the magnificent and heavenly instruction of proclamation. Matthew first sounded the priestly trumpet in his Gospel; Mark also; Luke and John each played their own priestly trumpets. Even Peter cries out with trumpets in two of his epistles; also James and Jude. In addition, John also sounds the trumpet through his epistles [and Revelation], and Luke, as he describes the Acts of the Apostles. And now that last one comes, the one who said, “I think God displays us apostles last,” and in fourteen of his epistles, thundering with trumpets, he casts down the walls of Jericho and all the devices of idolatry and dogmas of philosophers, all the way to the foundations.
>
>
>
He does quote from Revelation elsewhere in his writings, though.
>
> Origen, Expositions on the Gospel of John
>
>
> The one who reclined on Jesus' breast, John, who left behind one gospel while admitting that he could produce so many that the world would not be able to contain them [John 21:25]. He also wrote the Apocalypse, after being ordered to be silent and not to write what the seven thunders said [Rev 10:3-4]...
>
>
>
~350 AD: Cyril of Jerusalem's New Testament list includes 26 of the 27 NT books
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Cyril of Jerusalem's list excludes Revelation.
>
> Cyril of Jerusalem, [Catechetical Lecture 4](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/310104.htm), #36
>
>
> Then of the New Testament there are the four Gospels only, for the rest have false titles and are mischievous. The Manichæans also wrote a Gospel according to Thomas, which being tinctured with the fragrance of the evangelic title corrupts the souls of the simple sort. Receive also the Acts of the Twelve Apostles; and in addition to these the seven Catholic Epistles of James, Peter, John, and Jude; and as a seal upon them all, and the last work of the disciples, the fourteen Epistles of Paul. But let all the rest be put aside in a secondary rank. And whatever books are not read in Churches, these read not even by yourself, as you have heard me say.
>
>
>
367 AD: Athanasius's New Testament list includes all 27 books
-------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Athanasius, [Letter 39](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/2806039.htm)
>
>
> Again it is not tedious to speak of the [books] of the New Testament. These are, the four Gospels, according to Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John. Afterwards, the Acts of the Apostles and Epistles (called Catholic), seven, viz. of James, one; of Peter, two; of John, three; after these, one of Jude. In addition, there are fourteen Epistles of Paul, written in this order. The first, to the Romans; then two to the Corinthians; after these, to the Galatians; next, to the Ephesians; then to the Philippians; then to the Colossians; after these, two to the Thessalonians, and that to the Hebrews; and again, two to Timothy; one to Titus; and lastly, that to Philemon. And besides, the Revelation of John.
>
>
>
Noteworthy is that in that same letter Athanasius gives an Old Testament list which includes the Deuterocanonical book of Baruch, but excludes the book of Esther.
382 AD: Council of Rome's New Testament list includes all 27 books
------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> [Council of Rome](http://www.tertullian.org/decretum_eng.htm)
>
>
> Now indeed the issue of the divine scriptures must be discussed, which the universal Catholic church receives or which it is required to avoid...
>
>
> LIKEWISE THE ORDER OF THE SCRIPTURES OF THE NEW TESTAMENT which the holy and catholic Roman church upholds and is venerated:
>
>
> Four books of the Gospels: according to Mathew, according to Mark, according to Luke, according to John. Likewise the acts of the apostles. The letters of the apostle Paul in number fourteen: to the Romans, to the Corinthians two letters, to the Ephesians, to the Thesalonians two letters, to the Galatians, to the Philippians, to the Colossians, to Timothy two letters, to Titus, to the Philemon, to the Hebrews. Likewise the apocalypse of John. Likewise the canonical [catholic] letters in number seven: of the apostle Peter two letters, of the apostle James one letter, of the apostle John one letter, of the other John the elder two letters, of the apostle Judas the Zealot one letter.
>
>
> HERE ENDS THE CANON OF THE NEW TESTAMENT.
>
>
>
In addition to including all 27 New Testament books, it includes the Deuterocanonical books in the Old Testament (which Protestants reject).
~390 AD: Gregory of Nazianzus' New Testament list includes 26 of the 27 NT books
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gregory of Nazianzus's list excludes Revelation.
>
> [Concerning the Genuine Books of Divinely Inspired Scripture](http://www.bible-researcher.com/gregory.html) (poem)
>
>
> Now count also those of the new mystery. Matthew wrote the miracles of Christ for the Hebrews, Mark for Italy, Luke for Greece; John for all, the great herald, who walked in the heavens. Then the acts of the wise apostles. Of Paul there are fourteen epistles. And the seven catholic, [which include] one of James, two of Peter, three of John also; and Jude is the seventh. You have them all. And if there are any beyond these, they are not genuine.
>
>
>
393 AD: Council of Hippo's New Testament list includes all 27 books
-------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> [Council of Hippo](http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf214.xv.iv.iv.xxv.html)
>
>
> Item, that besides the Canonical Scriptures nothing be read in church under the name of divine Scripture.
>
>
> But the Canonical Scriptures are as follows: Genesis. Exodus. Leviticus. Numbers. Deuteronomy. Joshua the Son of Nun. The Judges. Ruth. The Kings, iv. books.
>
>
> The Chronicles, ij. books. Job. The Psalter. The Five books of Solomon. The Twelve Books of the Prophets. Isaiah. Jeremiah. Ezechiel. Daniel. Tobit. Judith. Esther. Ezra, ij. books. Macchabees, ij. books.
>
>
> The New Testament. The Gospels, iv. books. The Acts of the Apostles, j. book. The Epistles of Paul, xiv. The Epistles of Peter, the Apostle, ij. The Epistles of John the Apostle, iij. The Epistles of James the Apostle, j. The Epistle of Jude the Apostle, j. The Revelation of John, j. book.
>
>
>
In addition to including all 27 New Testament books, it includes the Deuterocanonical books in the Old Testament (which Protestants reject).
397 AD: Council of Carthage's New Testament list includes all 27 books
----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> [Synod of 397](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Councils_of_Carthage#Synod_of_397)
>
>
> It was also determined that besides the Canonical Scriptures nothing be read in the Church under the title of divine Scriptures. The Canonical Scriptures are these: Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, Deuteronomy, Joshua the son of Nun, Judges, Ruth, four books of Kings, two books of Paraleipomena, Job, the Psalter, five books of Solomon, the books of the twelve prophets, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezechiel, Daniel, Tobit, Judith, Esther, two books of Esdras, two books of the Maccabees. Of the New Testament: four books of the Gospels, one book of the Acts of the Apostles, thirteen Epistles of the Apostle Paul, one epistle of the same [writer] to the Hebrews, two Epistles of the Apostle Peter, three of John, one of James, one of Jude, one book of the Apocalypse of John.
>
>
>
In addition to including all 27 New Testament books, it includes the Deuterocanonical books in the Old Testament (which Protestants reject).
Consensus Period
----------------
At this point, with Jerome's Latin Vulgate translation, the New Testament translation was set and remained unchanged for a thousand years, until the Reformation came...
1534 AD: Martin Luther's New Testament list includes all 27 books... kind of.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
In 1534, Luther’s Bible translation was published. In it, he moves Deuterocanon to the end of his Old Testament and labels them "Apocrypha".
>
> Apocrypha (Deuterocanon) introduction, Luther’s Bible
>
>
> These books are not held equal to the Scriptures, but are useful and good to read
>
>
>
Similar to his Apocrypha, he was skeptical of Hebrews, James, Jude and Revelation, and stuck them at the end of his New Testament, saying "Up to this point we have had to do with the true and certain chief books of the New Testament. The four which follow have from ancient times had a different reputation."
>
> [Preface to the Epistle to the Hebrews](http://www.godrules.net/library/luther/NEW1luther_f8.htm)
>
>
> Up to this point we have had to do with the true and certain chief books of the New Testament. The four which follow have from ancient times had a different reputation... This seems, as it stands, to be against all the Gospels and St. Paul’s epistles... [The Epistle to the Hebrews] we cannot put it on the same level with the apostolic epistles.
>
>
> [Preface to the Epistles of St. James and St. Jude](http://www.godrules.net/library/luther/NEW1luther_f8.htm)
>
>
> ...I do not regard it [the epistle of St. James] as the writing of an apostle; and my reasons follow. In the first place it is flatly against St. Paul and all the rest of Scripture in ascribing justification to works... He mangles the Scriptures and thereby opposes Paul and all Scripture... Therefore, I will not have him in my Bible to be numbered among the true chief books
>
>
> [Preface to the Epistles of St. James and St. Jude](http://www.godrules.net/library/luther/NEW1luther_f8.htm)
>
>
> Concerning the epistle of St. Jude... it is an epistle that need not be counted among the chief books which are supposed to lay the foundations of faith.
>
>
> [Preface to the Revelation of St. John](http://www.godrules.net/library/luther/NEW1luther_f8.htm)
>
>
> About this book of the Revelation of John... it makes me consider it to be neither apostolic nor prophetic... I can in no way detect that the Holy Spirit produced it.
>
>
>
Luther did not dare to remove these New Testament books, or the Deuterocanonical books, as they'd both been in the Christian bible for a thousand years.
His followers and subsequent reformers backed away from his New Testament Antilegomena division, but they kept his Old Testament Apocrypha division. The Apocrypha remained in Protestant bibles until the English civil war, which lasted from 1642 to 1649. The English Long Parliament of 1644 decreed that the Deuterocanonical books would not be read in the Church of England, and in 1647 the Westminster Confession of Faith was issued which decreed the modern Protestant bible with the Deuterocanon completely removed (no longer in a separate section in the back).
With the restoration of the monarchy to Charles II of England (1660-1685), the Church of England was once again governed by the Thirty-Nine Articles and the Deuterocanon was included again in their bible, but the genie was out of the bottle - the Westminster Confession of faith continued to exist, and Presbyterians and Baptists (among many other denominations) accept the canon it declared with the Deuterocanonical books completely removed.
So in summary, the New Testament books were not specifically chosen at a single moment in time. They spread gradually geographically, and a consensus was fairly rapidly established around most of the books. A couple edge cases existed until the councils in the late fourth century, and from those councils on they were fully established until the Reformation - which poked at them a bit, and then backed off.
[The above references were taken from here](https://teachthe.net/index.php?title=Why_do_Catholics_have_extra_books_in_their_bibles%3F#NT_Canon_formation) |
8 | I'm interested in finding out:
1. what the process of choosing the books of the New Testament was,
2. when did it occur,
3. who did the choosing, and
4. what are the supporting evidences | 2011/08/23 | [
"https://christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/8",
"https://christianity.stackexchange.com",
"https://christianity.stackexchange.com/users/19/"
] | The canon developed gradually over the course of more than 300 years. In many cases, when decisions were made, they were simply to acknowledge what was already being read in the churches.
The process started early. Already in 2 Peter 3:16, there is a reference to the letters of Paul:
>
> There are some things in them hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other scriptures.
>
>
>
So at least some of the churches were already circulating Paul's letters and reading them as scripture.
The Gospels were written after Paul's letters, and the Apostolic Fathers quoted most often from Matthew, but also sometimes from Mark and Luke, and eventually from John.
By the late 2nd century, Irenaeus ([Against Heresies 3.11.8](http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/anf01.ix.iv.xii.html)) was claiming that the canon must contain exactly four gospels:
>
> It is not possible that the Gospels can be either more or fewer in number than they are. For, since there are four zones of the world in which we live, and four principal winds, while the Church is scattered throughout all the world, and the “pillar and ground” of the Church is the Gospel and the spirit of life; it is fitting that she should have four pillars, breathing out immortality on every side, and vivifying men afresh.
>
>
>
This was to counter fringe groups that were producing their own gospels, as well as Marcion, who argued for just one gospel (Luke).
We don't know who compiled the list known as the [Muratorian Fragment](http://www.ntcanon.org/Muratorian_Canon.shtml), but it also dates from the second century and contains this canon:
* Four gospels (the existing fragment begins by naming Luke as the third and John as the fourth)
* The Book of Acts
* Thirteen letters of Paul (and then names two letters attributed to Paul but not accepted as genuine)
* Jude
* Two letters from John
* Revelations "of John and Peter"
* "the Wisdom written by friends of Solomon in his honour"
Hebrews, James, 2 Peter, and 3 John were not yet accepted.
The fragment also recommends the [Shepherd of Hermas](http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/anf02.ii.i.html) as being worth reading but not qualifying for the canon because it was written "quite lately in our time".
By the early fourth century, the church historian Eusebius ([Church History 3.25](http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf201.iii.viii.xxv.html)) sorts the known early writings into cateogories.
The first category is:
* Four Gospels plus Acts
Next in importance are:
* The letters of Paul
* One letter each from John and Peter
These are the writings that are universally accepted by the church. Eusebius adds that some believe Revelation should be included in this set.
The next category includes books that are disputed by some:
* James
* Jude
* 2 and 3 John
* 2 Peter
These would all eventually be added to the canon.
The next category includes books that rejected from the canon but worth reading:
* Acts of Paul
* The Shepherd
* Apocalypse of Peter
* Letter from Barnabas
* The Teaching of the Apostles
He mentions that some would place Revelation in this group, and others would include the Gospel of the Hebrews.
And finally, Eusebius mentions other writings that are considered heretical, which he says should be "cast aside as absurd and impious." These include the gospels of Peter and Thomas, among others.
The first known list of canon that matches today's New Testament is found in the [Easter Letter of Athanasius](http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf204.xxv.iii.iii.xxv.html) for the year 367:
>
> Again it is not tedious to speak of the [books] of the New Testament. These are, the four Gospels, according to Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John. Afterwards, the Acts of the Apostles and Epistles (called Catholic), seven, viz. of James, one; of Peter, two; of John, three; after these, one of Jude. In addition, there are fourteen Epistles of Paul, written in this order. The first, to the Romans; then two to the Corinthians; after these, to the Galatians; next, to the Ephesians; then to the Philippians; then to the Colossians; after these, two to the Thessalonians, and that to the Hebrews; and again, two to Timothy; one to Titus; and lastly, that to Philemon. And besides, the Revelation of John.
>
>
>
Athanasius then adds that other books—the Wisdom of Solomon, the Shepherd, the Teaching of the Apostles, et al.—should be read by new converts. So even as the canon was being defined, there was recognition that among the excluded books were some that were part of the church teaching, and some that were not.
Following Athanasius, we see the beginning of a general agreement throughout the church. The Synod of Hippo in 393 [published a list](http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf214.xv.iv.iv.xxv.html) of New Testament books identical to Athanasius' list, but also included an Old Testament canon. The Council of Carthage of 397 published a similar list, but is notable for separating Hebrews from the letters of Paul. The Latin Vulgate translation, commissioned by Pope Damasus in 382 and completed by Jerome in 405, contains the same set of books listed in these. The [Decretum Gelasianum](http://www.tertullian.org/decretum_eng.htm), widely thought to be associated with the same Pope Damasus, lists the same 27 books but makes a distinction among the letters of John ("of the Apostle John, one letter, of the other John the Elder, two letters").
The Council of Carthage of 419 lists the same books, but does not make a distinction between two writers named John, and does not separate Hebrews from the letters of Paul.
In the East, there would still be disagreement for more than a century. The Council of Laodicea of 364 accepted all of the current New Testament books except Revelation. The Apostolic Constitutions, compiled around 380, [has a Bible canon](http://www.bible-researcher.com/apostolic.html) including this same list, but adding three writings attributed to Clement of Rome.
The first version of the Peshitta, the Syriac translation of the Bible, omitted the books of 2 Peter, 2-3 John, Jude, and Revelation; these books would not be translated into Syriac until the 6th century.
The Quinisext Council or Council in Trullo was held in Constantinople in 692 to reaffirm the rulings of the Fifth and Sixth Ecumencal Councils; while this council did not publish a formal Bible canon, it did reaffirm the canons previously published, including those of Athanasius and others with the Book of Revelation. This set the stage for the 7th Ecumenical Council (Second Council of Nicea) in 787, which finally established what we now know as the 27-book New Testament canon for the entire church. | Let me give you the original document of Council Of Carthage AD 419
>
> Canon 24. (Greek xxvii.)
>
>
> That nothing be read in church besides the Canonical Scripture
>
>
> Item, that besides the Canonical Scriptures nothing be read in church under the name of divine Scripture.
>
>
> But the Canonical Scriptures are as follows:
>
>
> Genesis.
>
> Exodus.
>
> Leviticus.
>
> Numbers.
>
> Deuteronomy.
>
> Joshua the Son of Nun.
>
> The Judges.
>
> Ruth.
>
> The Kings, iv. books.
>
> The Chronicles, ij. books.
>
> Job.
>
> The Psalter.
>
> The Five books of Solomon.
>
> The Twelve Books of the Prophets.
>
> Isaiah.
>
> Jeremiah.
>
> Ezechiel.
>
> Daniel.
>
> Tobit.
>
> Judith.
>
> Esther.
>
> Ezra, ij. books.
>
> Macchabees, ij. books.
>
> The New Testament.
>
> The Gospels, iv. books.
>
> The Acts of the Apostles, j. book.
>
> The Epistles of Paul, xiv.
>
> The Epistles of Peter, the Apostle, ij.
>
> The Epistles of John the Apostle, iij.
>
> The Epistles of James the Apostle, j.
>
> The Epistle of Jude the Apostle, j.
>
> The Revelation of John, j. book.
>
> Let this be sent to our brother and fellow bishop, Boniface, and to the other bishops of those parts, that they may confirm this canon, for these are the things which we have received from our fathers to be read in church.
>
>
>
Here, the council take a decision to send the list to BONIFACE bishop of Rome, again in the council of Hippo, it was mentioned that "send the list to Rome and ratify it" It was the Roman Church who decided the canon, based on apostolic tradition.. |
8 | I'm interested in finding out:
1. what the process of choosing the books of the New Testament was,
2. when did it occur,
3. who did the choosing, and
4. what are the supporting evidences | 2011/08/23 | [
"https://christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/8",
"https://christianity.stackexchange.com",
"https://christianity.stackexchange.com/users/19/"
] | The canon developed gradually over the course of more than 300 years. In many cases, when decisions were made, they were simply to acknowledge what was already being read in the churches.
The process started early. Already in 2 Peter 3:16, there is a reference to the letters of Paul:
>
> There are some things in them hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other scriptures.
>
>
>
So at least some of the churches were already circulating Paul's letters and reading them as scripture.
The Gospels were written after Paul's letters, and the Apostolic Fathers quoted most often from Matthew, but also sometimes from Mark and Luke, and eventually from John.
By the late 2nd century, Irenaeus ([Against Heresies 3.11.8](http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/anf01.ix.iv.xii.html)) was claiming that the canon must contain exactly four gospels:
>
> It is not possible that the Gospels can be either more or fewer in number than they are. For, since there are four zones of the world in which we live, and four principal winds, while the Church is scattered throughout all the world, and the “pillar and ground” of the Church is the Gospel and the spirit of life; it is fitting that she should have four pillars, breathing out immortality on every side, and vivifying men afresh.
>
>
>
This was to counter fringe groups that were producing their own gospels, as well as Marcion, who argued for just one gospel (Luke).
We don't know who compiled the list known as the [Muratorian Fragment](http://www.ntcanon.org/Muratorian_Canon.shtml), but it also dates from the second century and contains this canon:
* Four gospels (the existing fragment begins by naming Luke as the third and John as the fourth)
* The Book of Acts
* Thirteen letters of Paul (and then names two letters attributed to Paul but not accepted as genuine)
* Jude
* Two letters from John
* Revelations "of John and Peter"
* "the Wisdom written by friends of Solomon in his honour"
Hebrews, James, 2 Peter, and 3 John were not yet accepted.
The fragment also recommends the [Shepherd of Hermas](http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/anf02.ii.i.html) as being worth reading but not qualifying for the canon because it was written "quite lately in our time".
By the early fourth century, the church historian Eusebius ([Church History 3.25](http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf201.iii.viii.xxv.html)) sorts the known early writings into cateogories.
The first category is:
* Four Gospels plus Acts
Next in importance are:
* The letters of Paul
* One letter each from John and Peter
These are the writings that are universally accepted by the church. Eusebius adds that some believe Revelation should be included in this set.
The next category includes books that are disputed by some:
* James
* Jude
* 2 and 3 John
* 2 Peter
These would all eventually be added to the canon.
The next category includes books that rejected from the canon but worth reading:
* Acts of Paul
* The Shepherd
* Apocalypse of Peter
* Letter from Barnabas
* The Teaching of the Apostles
He mentions that some would place Revelation in this group, and others would include the Gospel of the Hebrews.
And finally, Eusebius mentions other writings that are considered heretical, which he says should be "cast aside as absurd and impious." These include the gospels of Peter and Thomas, among others.
The first known list of canon that matches today's New Testament is found in the [Easter Letter of Athanasius](http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf204.xxv.iii.iii.xxv.html) for the year 367:
>
> Again it is not tedious to speak of the [books] of the New Testament. These are, the four Gospels, according to Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John. Afterwards, the Acts of the Apostles and Epistles (called Catholic), seven, viz. of James, one; of Peter, two; of John, three; after these, one of Jude. In addition, there are fourteen Epistles of Paul, written in this order. The first, to the Romans; then two to the Corinthians; after these, to the Galatians; next, to the Ephesians; then to the Philippians; then to the Colossians; after these, two to the Thessalonians, and that to the Hebrews; and again, two to Timothy; one to Titus; and lastly, that to Philemon. And besides, the Revelation of John.
>
>
>
Athanasius then adds that other books—the Wisdom of Solomon, the Shepherd, the Teaching of the Apostles, et al.—should be read by new converts. So even as the canon was being defined, there was recognition that among the excluded books were some that were part of the church teaching, and some that were not.
Following Athanasius, we see the beginning of a general agreement throughout the church. The Synod of Hippo in 393 [published a list](http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf214.xv.iv.iv.xxv.html) of New Testament books identical to Athanasius' list, but also included an Old Testament canon. The Council of Carthage of 397 published a similar list, but is notable for separating Hebrews from the letters of Paul. The Latin Vulgate translation, commissioned by Pope Damasus in 382 and completed by Jerome in 405, contains the same set of books listed in these. The [Decretum Gelasianum](http://www.tertullian.org/decretum_eng.htm), widely thought to be associated with the same Pope Damasus, lists the same 27 books but makes a distinction among the letters of John ("of the Apostle John, one letter, of the other John the Elder, two letters").
The Council of Carthage of 419 lists the same books, but does not make a distinction between two writers named John, and does not separate Hebrews from the letters of Paul.
In the East, there would still be disagreement for more than a century. The Council of Laodicea of 364 accepted all of the current New Testament books except Revelation. The Apostolic Constitutions, compiled around 380, [has a Bible canon](http://www.bible-researcher.com/apostolic.html) including this same list, but adding three writings attributed to Clement of Rome.
The first version of the Peshitta, the Syriac translation of the Bible, omitted the books of 2 Peter, 2-3 John, Jude, and Revelation; these books would not be translated into Syriac until the 6th century.
The Quinisext Council or Council in Trullo was held in Constantinople in 692 to reaffirm the rulings of the Fifth and Sixth Ecumencal Councils; while this council did not publish a formal Bible canon, it did reaffirm the canons previously published, including those of Athanasius and others with the Book of Revelation. This set the stage for the 7th Ecumenical Council (Second Council of Nicea) in 787, which finally established what we now know as the 27-book New Testament canon for the entire church. | The New Testament Books were written by various authors, to various geographic regions (from Galatia to Rome), spread across time (from ~45 AD to as late as ~95 AD). It took time for them to spread, being copied and carried by hand across vast distances.
As such, if a church father did not mention a book from the new testament, the typical reason was simply that he hadn’t seen it yet!
To answer your question, let's start by reviewing how these books spread over time, in both acceptance and usage in the church.
~155 AD: Justin Martyr refers to the gospels.
---------------------------------------------
>
> Justin Martyr, [The First Apology](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0126.htm), Chapter 66. Of the Eucharist
>
>
> For the apostles, in the memoirs composed by them, which are called Gospels, have thus delivered unto us what was enjoined upon them; that Jesus took bread, and when He had given thanks, said, This do in remembrance of Me, this is My body; and that, after the same manner, having taken the cup and given thanks, He said, This is My blood; and gave it to them alone.
>
>
>
~170 AD: The Muratorian fragment lists 22 of the 27 New Testament books.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
* It excludes James, 1 & 2 Peter, Hebrews, and 3 John.
* Curiously, it also includes the Deuterocanonical Old Testament Book of Wisdom in its New Testament canon.
* It notes that some accept Apocalypse of Peter.
* It also says that The Shepherd of Hermas should be read but not on same level as other scripture.
* Finally, it explicitly rejects several Apocrypha.
* [The full text is available here](http://www.bible-researcher.com/muratorian.html).
~180 AD: Irenaeus quotes explicitly from 21 of the 27 New Testament books.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
* Matthew 1:1 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103316.htm), Chapter 16, Section 2
* Mark 16:19 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103310.htm), Chapter 10, Section 5
* Luke 1:2 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103314.htm), Chapter 14, Section 2
* John 1:1 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103311.htm), Chapter 11, Section 1
* Acts 20:5-6 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103314.htm), Chapter 14, Section 1
* Romans 1:1-4 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103316.htm), Chapter 16, Section 3
* 1 Corinthians 1:18 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book I](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103103.htm), Chapter 3, Section 5
* 2 Corinthians 4:4 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103307.htm), Chapter 7, Section 1
* Galatians 4:4 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103322.htm), Chapter 22, Section 1
* Ephesians 5:30 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book V](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103502.htm), Chapter 2, Section 3
* Philippians 4:18 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book IV](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103418.htm), Chapter 18, Section 4
* Colossians 3:11 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book I](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103418.htm), Chapter 3, Section 4
* 1 Thessalonians 5:23 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book V](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103506.htm), Chapter 6, Section 1
* 2 Thessalonians 2:8 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book V](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103525.htm), Chapter 25, Section 3
* 1 Timothy 1:4 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book I](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103100.htm), Preface, Section 1
* 2 Timothy 4:10-11 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103100.htm), Chapter 14, Section 1
* Titus 3:10 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103100.htm), Chapter 3, Section 4
* 1 Peter 1:8 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book IV](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103409.htm), Chapter 9, Section 2
* 1 John 5:1 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103409.htm), Chapter 16, Section 8
* 2 John 1:11 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book I](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103116.htm), Chapter 16, Section 3
* Revelation 3:7 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book IV](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103420.htm), Chapter 20, Section 2
Of the 6 books remaining, he may refer to Hebrews, James, and 2 Peter.
* Hebrews 1:3 maybe(?) quoted in [Against Heresies, Book II, Chapter 30](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103230.htm), Section 9
* James 2:23 maybe(?) quoted in [Against Heresies, Book IV](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103416.htm), Chapter 16, Section 2
* 2 Peter 3:8 maybe(?) quoted in [Against Heresies, Book V](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103528.htm), Chapter 28, Section 3
He does not quote from Philemon, 3 John or Jude.
Irenaeus identifies The Shepherd of Hermas as Scripture.
>
> Irenaeus, [Against Heresies, Book IV](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103420.htm), Chapter 20, Section 2
>
>
> Truly, then, the Scripture declared, which says, "First of all believe that there is one God, who has established all things, and completed them, and having caused that from what had no being, all things should come into existence: He who contains all things, and is Himself contained by no one." [The Shepherd of Hermas, Book 2, First Commandment]
>
>
>
He also seems to identify the letter of 1 Clement as authoritative in [Against Heresies Book III, Chapter 3, Section 3](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103303.htm) - as well as condemning the Gospel of Judas in [Against Heresies, Book I, Chapter 31, Section 1 + Section 4](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103131.htm).
~250 AD: Origen's New Testament list includes 26 of the 27 NT books
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Origen's list excludes Revelation.
>
> Origen, [Homilies on Joshua](https://books.google.com/books/about/Homilies_on_Joshua.html?id=Yq6reMY6KMUC), 7.1
>
>
> But when our Lord Jesus Christ comes, whose arrival that prior son of Nun designated, he sends priests, his apostles, bearing “trumpets hammered thin,” the magnificent and heavenly instruction of proclamation. Matthew first sounded the priestly trumpet in his Gospel; Mark also; Luke and John each played their own priestly trumpets. Even Peter cries out with trumpets in two of his epistles; also James and Jude. In addition, John also sounds the trumpet through his epistles [and Revelation], and Luke, as he describes the Acts of the Apostles. And now that last one comes, the one who said, “I think God displays us apostles last,” and in fourteen of his epistles, thundering with trumpets, he casts down the walls of Jericho and all the devices of idolatry and dogmas of philosophers, all the way to the foundations.
>
>
>
He does quote from Revelation elsewhere in his writings, though.
>
> Origen, Expositions on the Gospel of John
>
>
> The one who reclined on Jesus' breast, John, who left behind one gospel while admitting that he could produce so many that the world would not be able to contain them [John 21:25]. He also wrote the Apocalypse, after being ordered to be silent and not to write what the seven thunders said [Rev 10:3-4]...
>
>
>
~350 AD: Cyril of Jerusalem's New Testament list includes 26 of the 27 NT books
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Cyril of Jerusalem's list excludes Revelation.
>
> Cyril of Jerusalem, [Catechetical Lecture 4](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/310104.htm), #36
>
>
> Then of the New Testament there are the four Gospels only, for the rest have false titles and are mischievous. The Manichæans also wrote a Gospel according to Thomas, which being tinctured with the fragrance of the evangelic title corrupts the souls of the simple sort. Receive also the Acts of the Twelve Apostles; and in addition to these the seven Catholic Epistles of James, Peter, John, and Jude; and as a seal upon them all, and the last work of the disciples, the fourteen Epistles of Paul. But let all the rest be put aside in a secondary rank. And whatever books are not read in Churches, these read not even by yourself, as you have heard me say.
>
>
>
367 AD: Athanasius's New Testament list includes all 27 books
-------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Athanasius, [Letter 39](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/2806039.htm)
>
>
> Again it is not tedious to speak of the [books] of the New Testament. These are, the four Gospels, according to Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John. Afterwards, the Acts of the Apostles and Epistles (called Catholic), seven, viz. of James, one; of Peter, two; of John, three; after these, one of Jude. In addition, there are fourteen Epistles of Paul, written in this order. The first, to the Romans; then two to the Corinthians; after these, to the Galatians; next, to the Ephesians; then to the Philippians; then to the Colossians; after these, two to the Thessalonians, and that to the Hebrews; and again, two to Timothy; one to Titus; and lastly, that to Philemon. And besides, the Revelation of John.
>
>
>
Noteworthy is that in that same letter Athanasius gives an Old Testament list which includes the Deuterocanonical book of Baruch, but excludes the book of Esther.
382 AD: Council of Rome's New Testament list includes all 27 books
------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> [Council of Rome](http://www.tertullian.org/decretum_eng.htm)
>
>
> Now indeed the issue of the divine scriptures must be discussed, which the universal Catholic church receives or which it is required to avoid...
>
>
> LIKEWISE THE ORDER OF THE SCRIPTURES OF THE NEW TESTAMENT which the holy and catholic Roman church upholds and is venerated:
>
>
> Four books of the Gospels: according to Mathew, according to Mark, according to Luke, according to John. Likewise the acts of the apostles. The letters of the apostle Paul in number fourteen: to the Romans, to the Corinthians two letters, to the Ephesians, to the Thesalonians two letters, to the Galatians, to the Philippians, to the Colossians, to Timothy two letters, to Titus, to the Philemon, to the Hebrews. Likewise the apocalypse of John. Likewise the canonical [catholic] letters in number seven: of the apostle Peter two letters, of the apostle James one letter, of the apostle John one letter, of the other John the elder two letters, of the apostle Judas the Zealot one letter.
>
>
> HERE ENDS THE CANON OF THE NEW TESTAMENT.
>
>
>
In addition to including all 27 New Testament books, it includes the Deuterocanonical books in the Old Testament (which Protestants reject).
~390 AD: Gregory of Nazianzus' New Testament list includes 26 of the 27 NT books
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gregory of Nazianzus's list excludes Revelation.
>
> [Concerning the Genuine Books of Divinely Inspired Scripture](http://www.bible-researcher.com/gregory.html) (poem)
>
>
> Now count also those of the new mystery. Matthew wrote the miracles of Christ for the Hebrews, Mark for Italy, Luke for Greece; John for all, the great herald, who walked in the heavens. Then the acts of the wise apostles. Of Paul there are fourteen epistles. And the seven catholic, [which include] one of James, two of Peter, three of John also; and Jude is the seventh. You have them all. And if there are any beyond these, they are not genuine.
>
>
>
393 AD: Council of Hippo's New Testament list includes all 27 books
-------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> [Council of Hippo](http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf214.xv.iv.iv.xxv.html)
>
>
> Item, that besides the Canonical Scriptures nothing be read in church under the name of divine Scripture.
>
>
> But the Canonical Scriptures are as follows: Genesis. Exodus. Leviticus. Numbers. Deuteronomy. Joshua the Son of Nun. The Judges. Ruth. The Kings, iv. books.
>
>
> The Chronicles, ij. books. Job. The Psalter. The Five books of Solomon. The Twelve Books of the Prophets. Isaiah. Jeremiah. Ezechiel. Daniel. Tobit. Judith. Esther. Ezra, ij. books. Macchabees, ij. books.
>
>
> The New Testament. The Gospels, iv. books. The Acts of the Apostles, j. book. The Epistles of Paul, xiv. The Epistles of Peter, the Apostle, ij. The Epistles of John the Apostle, iij. The Epistles of James the Apostle, j. The Epistle of Jude the Apostle, j. The Revelation of John, j. book.
>
>
>
In addition to including all 27 New Testament books, it includes the Deuterocanonical books in the Old Testament (which Protestants reject).
397 AD: Council of Carthage's New Testament list includes all 27 books
----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> [Synod of 397](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Councils_of_Carthage#Synod_of_397)
>
>
> It was also determined that besides the Canonical Scriptures nothing be read in the Church under the title of divine Scriptures. The Canonical Scriptures are these: Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, Deuteronomy, Joshua the son of Nun, Judges, Ruth, four books of Kings, two books of Paraleipomena, Job, the Psalter, five books of Solomon, the books of the twelve prophets, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezechiel, Daniel, Tobit, Judith, Esther, two books of Esdras, two books of the Maccabees. Of the New Testament: four books of the Gospels, one book of the Acts of the Apostles, thirteen Epistles of the Apostle Paul, one epistle of the same [writer] to the Hebrews, two Epistles of the Apostle Peter, three of John, one of James, one of Jude, one book of the Apocalypse of John.
>
>
>
In addition to including all 27 New Testament books, it includes the Deuterocanonical books in the Old Testament (which Protestants reject).
Consensus Period
----------------
At this point, with Jerome's Latin Vulgate translation, the New Testament translation was set and remained unchanged for a thousand years, until the Reformation came...
1534 AD: Martin Luther's New Testament list includes all 27 books... kind of.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
In 1534, Luther’s Bible translation was published. In it, he moves Deuterocanon to the end of his Old Testament and labels them "Apocrypha".
>
> Apocrypha (Deuterocanon) introduction, Luther’s Bible
>
>
> These books are not held equal to the Scriptures, but are useful and good to read
>
>
>
Similar to his Apocrypha, he was skeptical of Hebrews, James, Jude and Revelation, and stuck them at the end of his New Testament, saying "Up to this point we have had to do with the true and certain chief books of the New Testament. The four which follow have from ancient times had a different reputation."
>
> [Preface to the Epistle to the Hebrews](http://www.godrules.net/library/luther/NEW1luther_f8.htm)
>
>
> Up to this point we have had to do with the true and certain chief books of the New Testament. The four which follow have from ancient times had a different reputation... This seems, as it stands, to be against all the Gospels and St. Paul’s epistles... [The Epistle to the Hebrews] we cannot put it on the same level with the apostolic epistles.
>
>
> [Preface to the Epistles of St. James and St. Jude](http://www.godrules.net/library/luther/NEW1luther_f8.htm)
>
>
> ...I do not regard it [the epistle of St. James] as the writing of an apostle; and my reasons follow. In the first place it is flatly against St. Paul and all the rest of Scripture in ascribing justification to works... He mangles the Scriptures and thereby opposes Paul and all Scripture... Therefore, I will not have him in my Bible to be numbered among the true chief books
>
>
> [Preface to the Epistles of St. James and St. Jude](http://www.godrules.net/library/luther/NEW1luther_f8.htm)
>
>
> Concerning the epistle of St. Jude... it is an epistle that need not be counted among the chief books which are supposed to lay the foundations of faith.
>
>
> [Preface to the Revelation of St. John](http://www.godrules.net/library/luther/NEW1luther_f8.htm)
>
>
> About this book of the Revelation of John... it makes me consider it to be neither apostolic nor prophetic... I can in no way detect that the Holy Spirit produced it.
>
>
>
Luther did not dare to remove these New Testament books, or the Deuterocanonical books, as they'd both been in the Christian bible for a thousand years.
His followers and subsequent reformers backed away from his New Testament Antilegomena division, but they kept his Old Testament Apocrypha division. The Apocrypha remained in Protestant bibles until the English civil war, which lasted from 1642 to 1649. The English Long Parliament of 1644 decreed that the Deuterocanonical books would not be read in the Church of England, and in 1647 the Westminster Confession of Faith was issued which decreed the modern Protestant bible with the Deuterocanon completely removed (no longer in a separate section in the back).
With the restoration of the monarchy to Charles II of England (1660-1685), the Church of England was once again governed by the Thirty-Nine Articles and the Deuterocanon was included again in their bible, but the genie was out of the bottle - the Westminster Confession of faith continued to exist, and Presbyterians and Baptists (among many other denominations) accept the canon it declared with the Deuterocanonical books completely removed.
So in summary, the New Testament books were not specifically chosen at a single moment in time. They spread gradually geographically, and a consensus was fairly rapidly established around most of the books. A couple edge cases existed until the councils in the late fourth century, and from those councils on they were fully established until the Reformation - which poked at them a bit, and then backed off.
[The above references were taken from here](https://teachthe.net/index.php?title=Why_do_Catholics_have_extra_books_in_their_bibles%3F#NT_Canon_formation) |
8 | I'm interested in finding out:
1. what the process of choosing the books of the New Testament was,
2. when did it occur,
3. who did the choosing, and
4. what are the supporting evidences | 2011/08/23 | [
"https://christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/8",
"https://christianity.stackexchange.com",
"https://christianity.stackexchange.com/users/19/"
] | Let me give you the original document of Council Of Carthage AD 419
>
> Canon 24. (Greek xxvii.)
>
>
> That nothing be read in church besides the Canonical Scripture
>
>
> Item, that besides the Canonical Scriptures nothing be read in church under the name of divine Scripture.
>
>
> But the Canonical Scriptures are as follows:
>
>
> Genesis.
>
> Exodus.
>
> Leviticus.
>
> Numbers.
>
> Deuteronomy.
>
> Joshua the Son of Nun.
>
> The Judges.
>
> Ruth.
>
> The Kings, iv. books.
>
> The Chronicles, ij. books.
>
> Job.
>
> The Psalter.
>
> The Five books of Solomon.
>
> The Twelve Books of the Prophets.
>
> Isaiah.
>
> Jeremiah.
>
> Ezechiel.
>
> Daniel.
>
> Tobit.
>
> Judith.
>
> Esther.
>
> Ezra, ij. books.
>
> Macchabees, ij. books.
>
> The New Testament.
>
> The Gospels, iv. books.
>
> The Acts of the Apostles, j. book.
>
> The Epistles of Paul, xiv.
>
> The Epistles of Peter, the Apostle, ij.
>
> The Epistles of John the Apostle, iij.
>
> The Epistles of James the Apostle, j.
>
> The Epistle of Jude the Apostle, j.
>
> The Revelation of John, j. book.
>
> Let this be sent to our brother and fellow bishop, Boniface, and to the other bishops of those parts, that they may confirm this canon, for these are the things which we have received from our fathers to be read in church.
>
>
>
Here, the council take a decision to send the list to BONIFACE bishop of Rome, again in the council of Hippo, it was mentioned that "send the list to Rome and ratify it" It was the Roman Church who decided the canon, based on apostolic tradition.. | The New Testament Books were written by various authors, to various geographic regions (from Galatia to Rome), spread across time (from ~45 AD to as late as ~95 AD). It took time for them to spread, being copied and carried by hand across vast distances.
As such, if a church father did not mention a book from the new testament, the typical reason was simply that he hadn’t seen it yet!
To answer your question, let's start by reviewing how these books spread over time, in both acceptance and usage in the church.
~155 AD: Justin Martyr refers to the gospels.
---------------------------------------------
>
> Justin Martyr, [The First Apology](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0126.htm), Chapter 66. Of the Eucharist
>
>
> For the apostles, in the memoirs composed by them, which are called Gospels, have thus delivered unto us what was enjoined upon them; that Jesus took bread, and when He had given thanks, said, This do in remembrance of Me, this is My body; and that, after the same manner, having taken the cup and given thanks, He said, This is My blood; and gave it to them alone.
>
>
>
~170 AD: The Muratorian fragment lists 22 of the 27 New Testament books.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
* It excludes James, 1 & 2 Peter, Hebrews, and 3 John.
* Curiously, it also includes the Deuterocanonical Old Testament Book of Wisdom in its New Testament canon.
* It notes that some accept Apocalypse of Peter.
* It also says that The Shepherd of Hermas should be read but not on same level as other scripture.
* Finally, it explicitly rejects several Apocrypha.
* [The full text is available here](http://www.bible-researcher.com/muratorian.html).
~180 AD: Irenaeus quotes explicitly from 21 of the 27 New Testament books.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
* Matthew 1:1 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103316.htm), Chapter 16, Section 2
* Mark 16:19 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103310.htm), Chapter 10, Section 5
* Luke 1:2 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103314.htm), Chapter 14, Section 2
* John 1:1 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103311.htm), Chapter 11, Section 1
* Acts 20:5-6 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103314.htm), Chapter 14, Section 1
* Romans 1:1-4 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103316.htm), Chapter 16, Section 3
* 1 Corinthians 1:18 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book I](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103103.htm), Chapter 3, Section 5
* 2 Corinthians 4:4 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103307.htm), Chapter 7, Section 1
* Galatians 4:4 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103322.htm), Chapter 22, Section 1
* Ephesians 5:30 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book V](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103502.htm), Chapter 2, Section 3
* Philippians 4:18 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book IV](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103418.htm), Chapter 18, Section 4
* Colossians 3:11 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book I](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103418.htm), Chapter 3, Section 4
* 1 Thessalonians 5:23 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book V](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103506.htm), Chapter 6, Section 1
* 2 Thessalonians 2:8 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book V](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103525.htm), Chapter 25, Section 3
* 1 Timothy 1:4 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book I](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103100.htm), Preface, Section 1
* 2 Timothy 4:10-11 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103100.htm), Chapter 14, Section 1
* Titus 3:10 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103100.htm), Chapter 3, Section 4
* 1 Peter 1:8 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book IV](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103409.htm), Chapter 9, Section 2
* 1 John 5:1 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book III](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103409.htm), Chapter 16, Section 8
* 2 John 1:11 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book I](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103116.htm), Chapter 16, Section 3
* Revelation 3:7 quoted in [Against Heresies, Book IV](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103420.htm), Chapter 20, Section 2
Of the 6 books remaining, he may refer to Hebrews, James, and 2 Peter.
* Hebrews 1:3 maybe(?) quoted in [Against Heresies, Book II, Chapter 30](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103230.htm), Section 9
* James 2:23 maybe(?) quoted in [Against Heresies, Book IV](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103416.htm), Chapter 16, Section 2
* 2 Peter 3:8 maybe(?) quoted in [Against Heresies, Book V](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103528.htm), Chapter 28, Section 3
He does not quote from Philemon, 3 John or Jude.
Irenaeus identifies The Shepherd of Hermas as Scripture.
>
> Irenaeus, [Against Heresies, Book IV](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103420.htm), Chapter 20, Section 2
>
>
> Truly, then, the Scripture declared, which says, "First of all believe that there is one God, who has established all things, and completed them, and having caused that from what had no being, all things should come into existence: He who contains all things, and is Himself contained by no one." [The Shepherd of Hermas, Book 2, First Commandment]
>
>
>
He also seems to identify the letter of 1 Clement as authoritative in [Against Heresies Book III, Chapter 3, Section 3](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103303.htm) - as well as condemning the Gospel of Judas in [Against Heresies, Book I, Chapter 31, Section 1 + Section 4](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103131.htm).
~250 AD: Origen's New Testament list includes 26 of the 27 NT books
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Origen's list excludes Revelation.
>
> Origen, [Homilies on Joshua](https://books.google.com/books/about/Homilies_on_Joshua.html?id=Yq6reMY6KMUC), 7.1
>
>
> But when our Lord Jesus Christ comes, whose arrival that prior son of Nun designated, he sends priests, his apostles, bearing “trumpets hammered thin,” the magnificent and heavenly instruction of proclamation. Matthew first sounded the priestly trumpet in his Gospel; Mark also; Luke and John each played their own priestly trumpets. Even Peter cries out with trumpets in two of his epistles; also James and Jude. In addition, John also sounds the trumpet through his epistles [and Revelation], and Luke, as he describes the Acts of the Apostles. And now that last one comes, the one who said, “I think God displays us apostles last,” and in fourteen of his epistles, thundering with trumpets, he casts down the walls of Jericho and all the devices of idolatry and dogmas of philosophers, all the way to the foundations.
>
>
>
He does quote from Revelation elsewhere in his writings, though.
>
> Origen, Expositions on the Gospel of John
>
>
> The one who reclined on Jesus' breast, John, who left behind one gospel while admitting that he could produce so many that the world would not be able to contain them [John 21:25]. He also wrote the Apocalypse, after being ordered to be silent and not to write what the seven thunders said [Rev 10:3-4]...
>
>
>
~350 AD: Cyril of Jerusalem's New Testament list includes 26 of the 27 NT books
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Cyril of Jerusalem's list excludes Revelation.
>
> Cyril of Jerusalem, [Catechetical Lecture 4](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/310104.htm), #36
>
>
> Then of the New Testament there are the four Gospels only, for the rest have false titles and are mischievous. The Manichæans also wrote a Gospel according to Thomas, which being tinctured with the fragrance of the evangelic title corrupts the souls of the simple sort. Receive also the Acts of the Twelve Apostles; and in addition to these the seven Catholic Epistles of James, Peter, John, and Jude; and as a seal upon them all, and the last work of the disciples, the fourteen Epistles of Paul. But let all the rest be put aside in a secondary rank. And whatever books are not read in Churches, these read not even by yourself, as you have heard me say.
>
>
>
367 AD: Athanasius's New Testament list includes all 27 books
-------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Athanasius, [Letter 39](http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/2806039.htm)
>
>
> Again it is not tedious to speak of the [books] of the New Testament. These are, the four Gospels, according to Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John. Afterwards, the Acts of the Apostles and Epistles (called Catholic), seven, viz. of James, one; of Peter, two; of John, three; after these, one of Jude. In addition, there are fourteen Epistles of Paul, written in this order. The first, to the Romans; then two to the Corinthians; after these, to the Galatians; next, to the Ephesians; then to the Philippians; then to the Colossians; after these, two to the Thessalonians, and that to the Hebrews; and again, two to Timothy; one to Titus; and lastly, that to Philemon. And besides, the Revelation of John.
>
>
>
Noteworthy is that in that same letter Athanasius gives an Old Testament list which includes the Deuterocanonical book of Baruch, but excludes the book of Esther.
382 AD: Council of Rome's New Testament list includes all 27 books
------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> [Council of Rome](http://www.tertullian.org/decretum_eng.htm)
>
>
> Now indeed the issue of the divine scriptures must be discussed, which the universal Catholic church receives or which it is required to avoid...
>
>
> LIKEWISE THE ORDER OF THE SCRIPTURES OF THE NEW TESTAMENT which the holy and catholic Roman church upholds and is venerated:
>
>
> Four books of the Gospels: according to Mathew, according to Mark, according to Luke, according to John. Likewise the acts of the apostles. The letters of the apostle Paul in number fourteen: to the Romans, to the Corinthians two letters, to the Ephesians, to the Thesalonians two letters, to the Galatians, to the Philippians, to the Colossians, to Timothy two letters, to Titus, to the Philemon, to the Hebrews. Likewise the apocalypse of John. Likewise the canonical [catholic] letters in number seven: of the apostle Peter two letters, of the apostle James one letter, of the apostle John one letter, of the other John the elder two letters, of the apostle Judas the Zealot one letter.
>
>
> HERE ENDS THE CANON OF THE NEW TESTAMENT.
>
>
>
In addition to including all 27 New Testament books, it includes the Deuterocanonical books in the Old Testament (which Protestants reject).
~390 AD: Gregory of Nazianzus' New Testament list includes 26 of the 27 NT books
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gregory of Nazianzus's list excludes Revelation.
>
> [Concerning the Genuine Books of Divinely Inspired Scripture](http://www.bible-researcher.com/gregory.html) (poem)
>
>
> Now count also those of the new mystery. Matthew wrote the miracles of Christ for the Hebrews, Mark for Italy, Luke for Greece; John for all, the great herald, who walked in the heavens. Then the acts of the wise apostles. Of Paul there are fourteen epistles. And the seven catholic, [which include] one of James, two of Peter, three of John also; and Jude is the seventh. You have them all. And if there are any beyond these, they are not genuine.
>
>
>
393 AD: Council of Hippo's New Testament list includes all 27 books
-------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> [Council of Hippo](http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf214.xv.iv.iv.xxv.html)
>
>
> Item, that besides the Canonical Scriptures nothing be read in church under the name of divine Scripture.
>
>
> But the Canonical Scriptures are as follows: Genesis. Exodus. Leviticus. Numbers. Deuteronomy. Joshua the Son of Nun. The Judges. Ruth. The Kings, iv. books.
>
>
> The Chronicles, ij. books. Job. The Psalter. The Five books of Solomon. The Twelve Books of the Prophets. Isaiah. Jeremiah. Ezechiel. Daniel. Tobit. Judith. Esther. Ezra, ij. books. Macchabees, ij. books.
>
>
> The New Testament. The Gospels, iv. books. The Acts of the Apostles, j. book. The Epistles of Paul, xiv. The Epistles of Peter, the Apostle, ij. The Epistles of John the Apostle, iij. The Epistles of James the Apostle, j. The Epistle of Jude the Apostle, j. The Revelation of John, j. book.
>
>
>
In addition to including all 27 New Testament books, it includes the Deuterocanonical books in the Old Testament (which Protestants reject).
397 AD: Council of Carthage's New Testament list includes all 27 books
----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> [Synod of 397](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Councils_of_Carthage#Synod_of_397)
>
>
> It was also determined that besides the Canonical Scriptures nothing be read in the Church under the title of divine Scriptures. The Canonical Scriptures are these: Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, Deuteronomy, Joshua the son of Nun, Judges, Ruth, four books of Kings, two books of Paraleipomena, Job, the Psalter, five books of Solomon, the books of the twelve prophets, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezechiel, Daniel, Tobit, Judith, Esther, two books of Esdras, two books of the Maccabees. Of the New Testament: four books of the Gospels, one book of the Acts of the Apostles, thirteen Epistles of the Apostle Paul, one epistle of the same [writer] to the Hebrews, two Epistles of the Apostle Peter, three of John, one of James, one of Jude, one book of the Apocalypse of John.
>
>
>
In addition to including all 27 New Testament books, it includes the Deuterocanonical books in the Old Testament (which Protestants reject).
Consensus Period
----------------
At this point, with Jerome's Latin Vulgate translation, the New Testament translation was set and remained unchanged for a thousand years, until the Reformation came...
1534 AD: Martin Luther's New Testament list includes all 27 books... kind of.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
In 1534, Luther’s Bible translation was published. In it, he moves Deuterocanon to the end of his Old Testament and labels them "Apocrypha".
>
> Apocrypha (Deuterocanon) introduction, Luther’s Bible
>
>
> These books are not held equal to the Scriptures, but are useful and good to read
>
>
>
Similar to his Apocrypha, he was skeptical of Hebrews, James, Jude and Revelation, and stuck them at the end of his New Testament, saying "Up to this point we have had to do with the true and certain chief books of the New Testament. The four which follow have from ancient times had a different reputation."
>
> [Preface to the Epistle to the Hebrews](http://www.godrules.net/library/luther/NEW1luther_f8.htm)
>
>
> Up to this point we have had to do with the true and certain chief books of the New Testament. The four which follow have from ancient times had a different reputation... This seems, as it stands, to be against all the Gospels and St. Paul’s epistles... [The Epistle to the Hebrews] we cannot put it on the same level with the apostolic epistles.
>
>
> [Preface to the Epistles of St. James and St. Jude](http://www.godrules.net/library/luther/NEW1luther_f8.htm)
>
>
> ...I do not regard it [the epistle of St. James] as the writing of an apostle; and my reasons follow. In the first place it is flatly against St. Paul and all the rest of Scripture in ascribing justification to works... He mangles the Scriptures and thereby opposes Paul and all Scripture... Therefore, I will not have him in my Bible to be numbered among the true chief books
>
>
> [Preface to the Epistles of St. James and St. Jude](http://www.godrules.net/library/luther/NEW1luther_f8.htm)
>
>
> Concerning the epistle of St. Jude... it is an epistle that need not be counted among the chief books which are supposed to lay the foundations of faith.
>
>
> [Preface to the Revelation of St. John](http://www.godrules.net/library/luther/NEW1luther_f8.htm)
>
>
> About this book of the Revelation of John... it makes me consider it to be neither apostolic nor prophetic... I can in no way detect that the Holy Spirit produced it.
>
>
>
Luther did not dare to remove these New Testament books, or the Deuterocanonical books, as they'd both been in the Christian bible for a thousand years.
His followers and subsequent reformers backed away from his New Testament Antilegomena division, but they kept his Old Testament Apocrypha division. The Apocrypha remained in Protestant bibles until the English civil war, which lasted from 1642 to 1649. The English Long Parliament of 1644 decreed that the Deuterocanonical books would not be read in the Church of England, and in 1647 the Westminster Confession of Faith was issued which decreed the modern Protestant bible with the Deuterocanon completely removed (no longer in a separate section in the back).
With the restoration of the monarchy to Charles II of England (1660-1685), the Church of England was once again governed by the Thirty-Nine Articles and the Deuterocanon was included again in their bible, but the genie was out of the bottle - the Westminster Confession of faith continued to exist, and Presbyterians and Baptists (among many other denominations) accept the canon it declared with the Deuterocanonical books completely removed.
So in summary, the New Testament books were not specifically chosen at a single moment in time. They spread gradually geographically, and a consensus was fairly rapidly established around most of the books. A couple edge cases existed until the councils in the late fourth century, and from those councils on they were fully established until the Reformation - which poked at them a bit, and then backed off.
[The above references were taken from here](https://teachthe.net/index.php?title=Why_do_Catholics_have_extra_books_in_their_bibles%3F#NT_Canon_formation) |
5,112 | I need to vent a room in an uninsulated cabin - the ceiling is also the roof - so I don't need soffit tubing or anything like that. I am looking for a fairly cheap item that has a large cfm ability.
(This is for venting steam from a maple syrup evaporator)
EDIT
We ended up just putting in two vents in the roof. (Maybe 12"x12" each - though maybe a little smaller than that)
We did not need a fan. We still get a tiny bit of condensation on the ceiling but not even close to what it was before. We are happy with the two vents but may add one more.
First we put in one vent and it was FAR superior to just having windows open. We could actually see across the room when boiling/evaporating. Then we put in a second vent and that made a difference too.
The next vent will be fed directly from a steam hood we will put over the evaporating pan. | 2011/03/11 | [
"https://diy.stackexchange.com/questions/5112",
"https://diy.stackexchange.com",
"https://diy.stackexchange.com/users/823/"
] | You'll want to use glazing compound, which comes in both oil-based, and latex, and can be found in both cans or tubes.
Once you have the glass removed, and the frame cleaned up.
* Run a bead of glazing compound around the frame (where the glass will sit).
* Set the glass in the compound giving it a little wiggle to work out any air bubbles, and to make sure the glass is set in properly (don't worry about a little excess oozing out, you can trim it off later when it cures).
* Using a putty knife push in glazing points every 6-8 in.
* Install the interior trim, and wait for the glazing compound to cure.
* Once the compound has cured enough (24-72 hours), using a utility knife carefully trim off any compound that has oozed out.
* If you are not using interior trim, you will want to apply a bead of glazing compound to the interior side of the frame, and use a putty knife to smooth it to a nice finish.
* After 7-10 days you can paint the glazing compound to match the frame. | You should use putty to bed the glass into the frame.
This will form an air- and water-tight seal.
You could even put the wood strips back on. |
3,793 | I am creating a model in ArcMap 10 and I need to use the Buffer Wizard tool to create multiple buffers within a polygon feature class. The problem is, I can't seem to place the Buffer Wizard within my model. I can place the Buffer or Multiple Ring Buffer command into my model, but they don't automatically populate a FromBufferDistance or ToBufferDistance value for each ring like the Buffer Wizard does. I need these values for a field calculator equation later in the model. I may be able to get by with just using the Multiple Ring Buffer tool, but it would be much more efficient to use the Buffer Wizard.
If I am unable to include the buffer wizard in my model, is there a way to run it in a script? This seems unlikely, but worth a try. | 2010/11/23 | [
"https://gis.stackexchange.com/questions/3793",
"https://gis.stackexchange.com",
"https://gis.stackexchange.com/users/230/"
] | The Buffer Wizard (and other wizards like the GeoStatistical Wizard) is a UI functionality.
There is no scripting/programming API for it in any version of ArcGIS 9.x or 10.x, and since it is not a geoprocessing tool so it cannot be used in ModelBuilder. | You could try using an iterator in ModelBuilder for buffering multiple distances.
<http://help.arcgis.com/en/arcgisdesktop/10.0/help/index.html#//00400000001n000000.htm> |
221,816 | Is there a way to hide specific messages in chat?
Sometimes people send things to chat channels that I personally find offensive or cause distress, the only option I can find is to hide all posts by the user that posted the message. or to flag the message for mods to deal with. I can imagine that mods have better things to do than moderate chat messages that I personally have a problem with, that might not bother other people.
I would prefer a way to hide just specific messages, so that I can still see what a user is saying but without the one or two messages that hurt my eyes, and without getting moderators involved.
Is there a way to do this? If not, what avenue should I pursue in order to suggest it to be added to the chat functionality of the site. | 2014/02/18 | [
"https://meta.stackexchange.com/questions/221816",
"https://meta.stackexchange.com",
"https://meta.stackexchange.com/users/-1/"
] | There are some other "workarounds" for this in the mean time (this request just came up again recently):
* Ask an RO to move the message somewhere else. If it's within the message edit time limit you could also ask the person who posted it to remove it, if you're comfortable with that.
* In rooms with lots of activity, wait until the message scrolls off the screen, optionally temporarily ignoring the user while you wait.
* If you have AdBlock installed, you can block specific images by right-clicking and adjusting the slider to an appropriate level that blocks that particular URL ([demo](https://i.stack.imgur.com/v4iyt.gif)).
* Write a userscript to do it and contribute it to <http://stackapps.com>! There [might even be something there already](https://stackapps.com/search?q=%5Bchat%5D+hide). | If a message is truly offensive, just flag as spam/offensive. You don't want to simply hide such stuff for yourself, but remove it for all users.
There is no way to hide individual messages without a user script or something like that. |
59,629,988 | I have one table(**1 cr records**) in Oracle 12g which is getting updated(from other/ETL source) everyday at 4:00 AM which is my user master table.
I am using this table to authenticate my user.
So simple way is get it from database but instead I am thinking to move/update the table into Redis everyday after ETL operation so that I don't have to connect DB for each authentication.
One way is write a scheduler/Cron job in Java which will run after ETL operation to copy table record and insert into Redis.
Is there any better way to do so? like use **oRedis** to update Redis cache directly from Oracle database or something else?
PS: Right now I am using Redis with Java(**redisson**) for caching.
I am using **Netflix Zuul** filter for the authentication so each request will be authenticated at Zuul filter so it seems costly operation to connect database for each request. | 2020/01/07 | [
"https://Stackoverflow.com/questions/59629988",
"https://Stackoverflow.com",
"https://Stackoverflow.com/users/1944816/"
] | >
> One way is write a scheduler/Cron job in Java which will run after ETL operation to copy table record and insert into Redis.
>
>
>
Oracle supports the stored procedures which can be written in Java
<https://docs.oracle.com/cd/B19306_01/java.102/b14187/chfive.htm>
In this case your code will be closer to data, thus it may work **much faster** than just a desktop java app.
Then, you may need to schedule daily synchronization using Oracle DBMS\_SCHEDULER
<https://docs.oracle.com/database/121/ARPLS/d_sched.htm#ARPLS72235>
The fastest access to oracle table is access by **rowid**
<https://docs.oracle.com/cd/B19306_01/server.102/b14200/pseudocolumns008.htm>
thus, the period of synchronization depends on how often rows are inserting.
You need to access your table only for daily/hourly data using **rowid**.
Please note, that **rowid** might be changed during database migration/movement/major maintenance actions.
[What can cause an Oracle ROWID to change?](https://stackoverflow.com/questions/435109/what-can-cause-an-oracle-rowid-to-change) | Since you already know the time of ETL update to your table, I do think whatever you have proposed is already optimal. But here's a different perspective on the same problem. See if this flavour suits. :)
Oracle RAC supports reliable CQN (Continuous Query Notifications) termed in Oracle world as DCN. This can either be an Object Change event listener or Query change event listener. If you register a listener to either of those, along with the rowids option, your registered component will get the rowids which you can directly fetch via select to get the updated rows. This was your select will be much faster (assuming you are not already using a Date range partition on an update\_date column and selecting those).
Refs: <https://docs.oracle.com/cd/E11882_01/java.112/e16548/dbchgnf.htm#JJDBC28815> |
151,835 | I have an Hp/Compaq laptop, intel, 2 processors, using 64 bit.
I want to install Java 5 SDK, I see references to AMD 64 bit, I am assuming that is different from intel?
Is there a Java 5 sdk for my environment? | 2010/06/16 | [
"https://serverfault.com/questions/151835",
"https://serverfault.com",
"https://serverfault.com/users/8160/"
] | You see AMD 64 because AMD developed a 64 bit architecture before Intel and thus the name amd64 stuck, but any binary labeled amd64 works on a Intel 64 bit processor.
You can download the amd64 build of the JDK and install it on your laptop without problems for running software such as Tomcat or Eclipse, however a 32-bit browser might not be able to run a 64-bit Java browser plugin (i.e. you may have problems running Java applets from a browser). | I tried to install just the runtime environment, but in seems to be an error, since I cannot start Eclipse. When I run the command "eclipse -vm" I get "Access is denied". In fact, Java SE is not supported for Windows Server 2008 R2: <http://www.oracle.com/technetwork/java/javase/system-configurations-135212.html>
So, we'll just have to wait to get it supported, untill then maibe win 7 x64 will be the alternative. |
11,728,289 | I have a testing FEST app which uses an AWT robot for simulating certain actions over a Swing interface. My problem is that it seems like moving the mouse pointer during the robot-test execution cancels some of the programatic actions, like pressing a column header. If you dont touch anything during execution, then cursor moves alone to the target and hits it.
Is there any way to block mouse user input for that app until test is finished?
Maybe not a block but a way to ignore events, force EDT finish or shielding robot would be appreciated of course | 2012/07/30 | [
"https://Stackoverflow.com/questions/11728289",
"https://Stackoverflow.com",
"https://Stackoverflow.com/users/1352530/"
] | Maybe you could disable the keyboard and mouse using the native terminal commands. I.e cmd.exe for Windows and terminal for Linux (depending if application has to be portable just [check os name](https://stackoverflow.com/questions/228477/how-do-i-programmatically-determine-operating-system-in-java) and then run the correct command) however I'm not sure if this would render the `Robot` useless. I think not though.
Windows:
>
> cmd.exe /c %Homedrive%\windows\rundll32.exe mouse,disable
>
>
> cmd.exe /c %Homedrive%\windows\rundll32.exe keyboard,disable
>
>
>
and for Linux see [here](http://wpkg.org/Disable_/_enable_keyboard_and_mouse_in_Linux)
**Addendum**:
In my knowledge it is not possible in pure Java without using JNI to disable keyboard and mouse input from the user.
Here is a great link for the disbaling mouse and keyboard using JNI in Java: [Java Global Keyboard / Mouse Hook - JNI](http://www.jotschi.de/?p=90) | If you are hardy to evolve with end-to-end tests using AWT robot, then try to separate tests to able to run only part that checks touched functionality while all bunch of end-to-end tests should run on build server.
Here is result of end-to-end testing by AWT robot for Swing application that completes on head-less build-server:
<http://travis-ci.org/#!/plokhotnyuk/calculator/jobs/1979904/L538> |
5,158,069 | I am wondering if Fastcgi supports unicode functions like wprintf. I receive a buffer via fread and get char\* that has unicode characters in it. I mean bytes with value above 128 . How do I process them inside fastcgi main function. A call to mbstowcs fails.
I meant that I was using the FastCGI Developers Kit library. A java client is sending data encoded with UTF-8 , I decoded it server side using mbstring functions in php , but what is the equivalent of that gcc . What ever it is does not seem to work inside the FastCGI amin function. I looked at Fascgipp but I dont know how much it is used and how stable it is . Further I dont find lugging a huge library like boost justified for a small utility. | 2011/03/01 | [
"https://Stackoverflow.com/questions/5158069",
"https://Stackoverflow.com",
"https://Stackoverflow.com/users/639811/"
] | Fastcgi is protocol not an API.
So it depend on the library you are choosing.
Yes see library
<http://www.nongnu.org/fastcgipp/> | >
> I receive a buffer via fread and get char\* that has unicode characters in it. I mean bytes with value above 128 .
>
>
>
Unicode is not the only encoding that has bytes above 128 in it. In fact, most other encodings do. You need to find out which encoding is exactly used in your web application. In any case, I don't think wprintf is going to be useful to you in any way. |
5,158,069 | I am wondering if Fastcgi supports unicode functions like wprintf. I receive a buffer via fread and get char\* that has unicode characters in it. I mean bytes with value above 128 . How do I process them inside fastcgi main function. A call to mbstowcs fails.
I meant that I was using the FastCGI Developers Kit library. A java client is sending data encoded with UTF-8 , I decoded it server side using mbstring functions in php , but what is the equivalent of that gcc . What ever it is does not seem to work inside the FastCGI amin function. I looked at Fascgipp but I dont know how much it is used and how stable it is . Further I dont find lugging a huge library like boost justified for a small utility. | 2011/03/01 | [
"https://Stackoverflow.com/questions/5158069",
"https://Stackoverflow.com",
"https://Stackoverflow.com/users/639811/"
] | Fastcgi is protocol not an API.
So it depend on the library you are choosing.
Yes see library
<http://www.nongnu.org/fastcgipp/> | FastCGI expects a byte stream, so your safest bet is UTF-8.
That being said, the program should work with non-UTF-8 input; iconv is ideal for this.
You can use wprintf, but only in the form of wsnprintf, after which buffer contents are converted to UTF-8 and then written to the correct FCGI stream. |
5,158,069 | I am wondering if Fastcgi supports unicode functions like wprintf. I receive a buffer via fread and get char\* that has unicode characters in it. I mean bytes with value above 128 . How do I process them inside fastcgi main function. A call to mbstowcs fails.
I meant that I was using the FastCGI Developers Kit library. A java client is sending data encoded with UTF-8 , I decoded it server side using mbstring functions in php , but what is the equivalent of that gcc . What ever it is does not seem to work inside the FastCGI amin function. I looked at Fascgipp but I dont know how much it is used and how stable it is . Further I dont find lugging a huge library like boost justified for a small utility. | 2011/03/01 | [
"https://Stackoverflow.com/questions/5158069",
"https://Stackoverflow.com",
"https://Stackoverflow.com/users/639811/"
] | If you need Unicode, use UTF-8 and not "wide" characters. They are much more suitable for the web. | >
> I receive a buffer via fread and get char\* that has unicode characters in it. I mean bytes with value above 128 .
>
>
>
Unicode is not the only encoding that has bytes above 128 in it. In fact, most other encodings do. You need to find out which encoding is exactly used in your web application. In any case, I don't think wprintf is going to be useful to you in any way. |
5,158,069 | I am wondering if Fastcgi supports unicode functions like wprintf. I receive a buffer via fread and get char\* that has unicode characters in it. I mean bytes with value above 128 . How do I process them inside fastcgi main function. A call to mbstowcs fails.
I meant that I was using the FastCGI Developers Kit library. A java client is sending data encoded with UTF-8 , I decoded it server side using mbstring functions in php , but what is the equivalent of that gcc . What ever it is does not seem to work inside the FastCGI amin function. I looked at Fascgipp but I dont know how much it is used and how stable it is . Further I dont find lugging a huge library like boost justified for a small utility. | 2011/03/01 | [
"https://Stackoverflow.com/questions/5158069",
"https://Stackoverflow.com",
"https://Stackoverflow.com/users/639811/"
] | If you need Unicode, use UTF-8 and not "wide" characters. They are much more suitable for the web. | FastCGI expects a byte stream, so your safest bet is UTF-8.
That being said, the program should work with non-UTF-8 input; iconv is ideal for this.
You can use wprintf, but only in the form of wsnprintf, after which buffer contents are converted to UTF-8 and then written to the correct FCGI stream. |
49,516 | Given that hubs are essentially the same as switches, as far as I know, except they share bandwidth between all connected devices, while switches do not, resulting in faster connections. I am simply wondering if there is any reasonable purpose for hubs in modern networks. | 2018/03/30 | [
"https://networkengineering.stackexchange.com/questions/49516",
"https://networkengineering.stackexchange.com",
"https://networkengineering.stackexchange.com/users/46197/"
] | For the most part, no. Hubs are also known as *repeaters* - meaning that they basically echo whatever is coming **in** to a given port **out** all other ports in the domain. The idea is (or, more properly, **was**) to replicate the behavior of a shared piece of coaxial cable, meaning that the individual hosts had to assure that only one member of the LAN was transmitting at a given time (...managing this is where the notion of collisions and CSMA/CD comes in).
Switches, in turn, a actually multi-port bridges. Switches learn what hardware addresses are on what ports and then (ideally) only transmit traffic to the host(s) on a particular port.
As a really crude example, imagine 4 hosts on a network: A, B, C and D. On a hub a conversation between A and B is seen, in full, by C and D. As such, if there's a second conversation between C and D it is now sharing the same bandwidth with the traffic being sent back and forth between A and B. In contrast, on a switch these conversations are kept entirely separate - thus allowing both sets of hosts to communicate at full speed without effecting one another. This (among other behaviors) *massively* improves overall scalability and performance on most networks.
The other issue here is that as Ethernet speeds have gotten faster the basic mechanisms mentioned above (collision detection) have actually disappeared. In 10 and 100 megabit there were absolutely modes for half-duplex (i.e. single host transmitting at a time) communication while in gigabit it was largely deprecated/unimplemented (there were some 10/100 hubs that *bridged* to FDX gigabit connections but very few - if any - gigabit hubs) and in 10 gigabit (and beyond) it's nonexistent (...meaning a switch is now the only option).
So is there a reasonable purpose for a hub nowadays? I'd say generally not. Some gigantic portion of modern equipment doesn't even *support* half-duplex at this point, and 100M is becoming fairly uncommon in its own right. There used to be an argument for hubs as a good way to easily monitor traffic without the use of SPAN ports or taps, but that was a fairly uncommon use-case even 15 years ago. | Hubs are bad news, from both a network performance as well as a security point of view.
As a network admin you may find it handy to have a hub or two sitting in the store for the day when you want to do a packet capture (which for some reason cannot be done in the usual way (span etc.)), but don't leave them running in a production network. |
49,516 | Given that hubs are essentially the same as switches, as far as I know, except they share bandwidth between all connected devices, while switches do not, resulting in faster connections. I am simply wondering if there is any reasonable purpose for hubs in modern networks. | 2018/03/30 | [
"https://networkengineering.stackexchange.com/questions/49516",
"https://networkengineering.stackexchange.com",
"https://networkengineering.stackexchange.com/users/46197/"
] | For the most part, no. Hubs are also known as *repeaters* - meaning that they basically echo whatever is coming **in** to a given port **out** all other ports in the domain. The idea is (or, more properly, **was**) to replicate the behavior of a shared piece of coaxial cable, meaning that the individual hosts had to assure that only one member of the LAN was transmitting at a given time (...managing this is where the notion of collisions and CSMA/CD comes in).
Switches, in turn, a actually multi-port bridges. Switches learn what hardware addresses are on what ports and then (ideally) only transmit traffic to the host(s) on a particular port.
As a really crude example, imagine 4 hosts on a network: A, B, C and D. On a hub a conversation between A and B is seen, in full, by C and D. As such, if there's a second conversation between C and D it is now sharing the same bandwidth with the traffic being sent back and forth between A and B. In contrast, on a switch these conversations are kept entirely separate - thus allowing both sets of hosts to communicate at full speed without effecting one another. This (among other behaviors) *massively* improves overall scalability and performance on most networks.
The other issue here is that as Ethernet speeds have gotten faster the basic mechanisms mentioned above (collision detection) have actually disappeared. In 10 and 100 megabit there were absolutely modes for half-duplex (i.e. single host transmitting at a time) communication while in gigabit it was largely deprecated/unimplemented (there were some 10/100 hubs that *bridged* to FDX gigabit connections but very few - if any - gigabit hubs) and in 10 gigabit (and beyond) it's nonexistent (...meaning a switch is now the only option).
So is there a reasonable purpose for a hub nowadays? I'd say generally not. Some gigantic portion of modern equipment doesn't even *support* half-duplex at this point, and 100M is becoming fairly uncommon in its own right. There used to be an argument for hubs as a good way to easily monitor traffic without the use of SPAN ports or taps, but that was a fairly uncommon use-case even 15 years ago. | In general, no, there's no reason to use a hub over a switch, but they do still have a purpose in some special cases. One case is if you need to capture traffic to a host but the host can't run a capture utility itself and the switch it connects to also can't do a capture or span port. In this case, you could connect a hub between the host and switch, and connect another device to the hub that can do the captures. For example, plug a laptop into the same hub, with Wireshark installed on it, and perform the capture there. Due to the way hubs work (versus how a switch works) all packets are sent out all ports, so you will be able to see all traffic passing through the hub destined to or sourced from the server you need to capture traffic for. |
41,433 | I am stuck with this problem. I posted an [earlier problem](https://math.stackexchange.com/questions/41257/find-remaining-vertices-of-a-square-given-2) with a square, where rotation with i of 90 degrees was possible. This one is a rhombus, how should I proceed?
>
> Given ABCD is a rhombus with AC = 2BD, and b = 3 + i, d = 1 - 3i. Find a and c.
>
>
>
Thanks for your help. | 2011/05/26 | [
"https://math.stackexchange.com/questions/41433",
"https://math.stackexchange.com",
"https://math.stackexchange.com/users/11343/"
] | Since you're given opposite vertices and information about the lengths of the diagonals, it is probably useful to know some things about specific quadrilaterals. Kites—quadrilaterals where two consecutive sides are congruent and the other two (consecutive) sides are congruent—have perpendicular diagonals. Parallelograms have diagonals that bisect each other (that intersect at their midpoints). Rhombi (rhombuses) are simultaneously kites and parallelograms, which gives you some information about the diagonals of the rhombus in your particular problem. | Hint: What is true about all the sides of a rhombus? |
93,914 | I am trying to create a process via Lightning process builder.
Basically it checks whether the opportunity belongs to a particular record type and if it is then sets the owner as a specific user.
By default it appears and I have not added it to the above process.
[](https://i.stack.imgur.com/cWKvl.jpg)
Can someone tell me how am I supposed to remove the second diamond box (and the associated schedule boxes) from the above the flow chart ?.
I am not able to drag and drop and as such I am stuck and unable to proceed further. | 2015/09/27 | [
"https://salesforce.stackexchange.com/questions/93914",
"https://salesforce.stackexchange.com",
"https://salesforce.stackexchange.com/users/7755/"
] | It is there to allow you to add an additional logic check. Other than being an empty spot on the page it is not doing anything. At this point you just have to "deal with it" as it is purely aesthetics...and cannot currently be removed | I think you are asking this because you cant activate this Process Builder. It is not the extra criteria that is the issue. As the others have said, this is aesthetic and should be ignored.
The reason you cant activate it is you have no action if the first criteria is TRUE. |
6,211,551 | I'm toying with the idea of a pet project..
I wanna make our coffee machine remote controlled by a web interface.
The idea is to hit a "make me coffee button" and have it poll the router get the MAC address list to see who's in the office and send them a growl notification (we all use macs) asking if they'd like coffee and then doing something with a relay to turn the coffee machine on..
Can you recommend a programmable wifi relay or small embedded system for this? | 2011/06/02 | [
"https://Stackoverflow.com/questions/6211551",
"https://Stackoverflow.com",
"https://Stackoverflow.com/users/415286/"
] | Not as far as the client is concerned, no.
The difference for the server is that you have the full power of PHP to do something with before initiating the download, which is not the case if Apache handles the download directly. It also means that the whole cruft of PHP needs to be loaded and executed before a download can start and it'll occupy one PHP process until the download is finished. | ***If*** your "normal" download would supply *those exact headers*, then ***no***.
However, a number of things could cause the server to decide to send different headers:
* If **[gzip](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gzip#Other_uses)** is turned on (and browser accepts it)
* If the [request](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_HTTP_header_fields#Requests) sent an **If-Modified-Since** header and the content has not been modified
* If the server decides to send a **Last-Modified** time
* If the server has some other sort of [cache-control logic](http://httpd.apache.org/docs/2.2/caching.html) |
6,211,551 | I'm toying with the idea of a pet project..
I wanna make our coffee machine remote controlled by a web interface.
The idea is to hit a "make me coffee button" and have it poll the router get the MAC address list to see who's in the office and send them a growl notification (we all use macs) asking if they'd like coffee and then doing something with a relay to turn the coffee machine on..
Can you recommend a programmable wifi relay or small embedded system for this? | 2011/06/02 | [
"https://Stackoverflow.com/questions/6211551",
"https://Stackoverflow.com",
"https://Stackoverflow.com/users/415286/"
] | Not as far as the client is concerned, no.
The difference for the server is that you have the full power of PHP to do something with before initiating the download, which is not the case if Apache handles the download directly. It also means that the whole cruft of PHP needs to be loaded and executed before a download can start and it'll occupy one PHP process until the download is finished. | I would think this would also let you create a download for a resource that is normally forbidden for a user to directly access. It also seems like you could use this for a file that only exists in memory, without having to write it out to disk first. |
6,211,551 | I'm toying with the idea of a pet project..
I wanna make our coffee machine remote controlled by a web interface.
The idea is to hit a "make me coffee button" and have it poll the router get the MAC address list to see who's in the office and send them a growl notification (we all use macs) asking if they'd like coffee and then doing something with a relay to turn the coffee machine on..
Can you recommend a programmable wifi relay or small embedded system for this? | 2011/06/02 | [
"https://Stackoverflow.com/questions/6211551",
"https://Stackoverflow.com",
"https://Stackoverflow.com/users/415286/"
] | ***If*** your "normal" download would supply *those exact headers*, then ***no***.
However, a number of things could cause the server to decide to send different headers:
* If **[gzip](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gzip#Other_uses)** is turned on (and browser accepts it)
* If the [request](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_HTTP_header_fields#Requests) sent an **If-Modified-Since** header and the content has not been modified
* If the server decides to send a **Last-Modified** time
* If the server has some other sort of [cache-control logic](http://httpd.apache.org/docs/2.2/caching.html) | I would think this would also let you create a download for a resource that is normally forbidden for a user to directly access. It also seems like you could use this for a file that only exists in memory, without having to write it out to disk first. |
304 | The title says it all... but I'll elaborate:
* Initially we see techniques derived from **a single chakra element** (Katon, Doton, Suiton, Fuuton and Raiton). These are the most common, since usually a ninja can master only one chakra nature (since normally ninjas tend to have an affiliation with only one chakra nature)
* Later we discover these can be combined in a number of ways, **creating new elements** (Mokuton=Doton+Suiton, Ranton=Raiton+Suiton, Youton=Katon+Doton, among several others). From what I understand, these are usually transmitted as a Kekkei Genkai. But I believe they can also be created by the combinations of the elements, by ninja who didn't inherit it from other generations (correct me if I'm wrong). These are not uncommon, but less frequent than the ones above (there are ninja who can master and possess affiliation to more than one chakra nature: Sasuke comes to mind, since he can master both Katon and Raiton. Katon is his clan's natural affiliation, and he mastered Raiton too. However, I don't **remember** if he has ever combined the both of them)
* Even later, we find about combinations of **even more elements** by ninja who can master several elements, such as Muu (Nidaime Tsuchikage) and Oonoki (Sandaime Tsuchikage), who can combine Katon, Doton and Fuuton, to create Jinton. These are called Kekkei Touta. I don't know if they can also be transmitted through Kekkei Genkai, or if they can only be taught. They are even rarer than the ones above, since ninja can rarely master or be naturally affiliated to more than two chakra natures (Terumii Mei the Godaime Mizukage, can also master Doton, Katon and Suiton, but I don't think she ever combines more than two at each time).
My questions are:
* **Are combinations of chakra natures taught or only transmitted by Kekkei Genkai (or both)?**
* **Are combinations of more than three chakra natures possible?**
* And the above question created a new one for me: **Can a ninja master more than three chakra natures?** (I think Kakashi does, but I am not quite sure about this) | 2012/12/13 | [
"https://anime.stackexchange.com/questions/304",
"https://anime.stackexchange.com",
"https://anime.stackexchange.com/users/49/"
] | >
> Are combinations of chakra natures taught or only transmitted by Kekkei Genkai (or both)?
>
>
>
I think combinations of Chakra are generally possible only through Kekkei Genkai, even if some can be "passed" by transplantation (e.g. Kakashi and the Sharingan).
Although, there's the issue of Lord Tsuchikage that in the Manga claims his master passed on to him the ability to combine *Earth*, *Wind* and *Fire*. It's not revealed whether they share some blood relation so I'd treat this with a grain of salt.
>
> Are combinations of more than three chakra natures possible?
>
>
>
There is *Kekkei Tōta* which is a combination of three elements (such as the Dust Release), and this is already classified as *advanced*, so I guess that for now, they aren't revealed as possible.
>
> And the above question created a new one for me: Can a ninja master more than three chakra natures? (I think Kakashi does, but I am not quite sure about this)
>
>
>
Yes, Kakashi masters four natures but one of them only according to the Anime, and they are:
**Douton** - *Earth*;
**Suiton** - *Water*;
**Raiton** - *Lightning*;
**Katon** - *Fire* (only anime). | Yes but mostly only by the Uchiha clan like Sasuke, Itachi etc. Because they have the copy wheel eyes (aka sharingan )they can learn all five jitsu by copying and observing them. |
304 | The title says it all... but I'll elaborate:
* Initially we see techniques derived from **a single chakra element** (Katon, Doton, Suiton, Fuuton and Raiton). These are the most common, since usually a ninja can master only one chakra nature (since normally ninjas tend to have an affiliation with only one chakra nature)
* Later we discover these can be combined in a number of ways, **creating new elements** (Mokuton=Doton+Suiton, Ranton=Raiton+Suiton, Youton=Katon+Doton, among several others). From what I understand, these are usually transmitted as a Kekkei Genkai. But I believe they can also be created by the combinations of the elements, by ninja who didn't inherit it from other generations (correct me if I'm wrong). These are not uncommon, but less frequent than the ones above (there are ninja who can master and possess affiliation to more than one chakra nature: Sasuke comes to mind, since he can master both Katon and Raiton. Katon is his clan's natural affiliation, and he mastered Raiton too. However, I don't **remember** if he has ever combined the both of them)
* Even later, we find about combinations of **even more elements** by ninja who can master several elements, such as Muu (Nidaime Tsuchikage) and Oonoki (Sandaime Tsuchikage), who can combine Katon, Doton and Fuuton, to create Jinton. These are called Kekkei Touta. I don't know if they can also be transmitted through Kekkei Genkai, or if they can only be taught. They are even rarer than the ones above, since ninja can rarely master or be naturally affiliated to more than two chakra natures (Terumii Mei the Godaime Mizukage, can also master Doton, Katon and Suiton, but I don't think she ever combines more than two at each time).
My questions are:
* **Are combinations of chakra natures taught or only transmitted by Kekkei Genkai (or both)?**
* **Are combinations of more than three chakra natures possible?**
* And the above question created a new one for me: **Can a ninja master more than three chakra natures?** (I think Kakashi does, but I am not quite sure about this) | 2012/12/13 | [
"https://anime.stackexchange.com/questions/304",
"https://anime.stackexchange.com",
"https://anime.stackexchange.com/users/49/"
] | I think that if a shinobi can use all of the chakra elements, it doesn't guarantee that you can combine them. All of the answers above are correct in my opinion (we can't assume anything, unless we've seen them, and I'm the "only anime guy", so I have no idea about manga), but if I can speculate, I would answer:
**Question 1: Are combinations of chakra natures taught or only transmitted by Kekkei Genkai (or both)?**
I think it's by teaching someone (but I won't exclude Kekkei Genkai). Just think about it.
For example, Sasuke can master both Katon and Raiton, from which is (not guaranteed) born the Enton (Blaze Release). We can assume that his affinity is for Fire (Uchiha clan/Hidden Leaf) yet he was able of learning the Lightning style, and he learned all by himself the combination of those ('cause I can't remember seeing someone else from the Uchiha's with that release).
Another example is the Dust Release, which was described about: Ohnoki was taught, and yes, I think he and Mu weren't from the same family, so that's with the teaching.
I won't exclude Kekkei Genkai, because that's something "not uncommon yet powerful" so it can help the ninja.
**Question 2: Are combinations of more than three chakra natures possible?**
Practically, it's a smaller version of the main question. My answer is: if you can combine 3, you can combine 5. I can't expand the answer for this question, since we haven't seen such high skill combination. The Dust Release is 3, the Boil Release is 2 (but the Fifth Mizukage can use 3 types too).
**Question 3: Can a ninja master more than three chakra natures?**
Absolutely! Yep, you're right: Kakashi can use at least 4 (Fire, Lightning, Water, Earth) plus some idea about the Wind, but I think that's only because he's got the Sharingan. If he hadn't possess an eye like that, he would know like 2 types. To be honest, the only shinobi I could think of being capable of using at least 3, 4 for sure, don't know about 5, it's: Madara Uchiha. I'm not sure about the lightning style, but **he can** use the other 4.
I've just remembered, everything was created by the Sage of the Six Path, according to the Narutoverse, therefore he used (and possessed) all of the five natures, that's another fact!!! (I don't know about combining them, sure he was capable of that too)
In the end, I give you a big yes for the question, and I hope that I won't die until the end of this anime (manga). They have such potential and they can achieve far more than I could ever imagine. I am curious what would be the name of the release that includes all of the 5 chakra natures. We should ask Hagoromo Otsutsuki. I'm sure, he knows it :D | In the episode where Kakashi battles Kakuzu, Kakuzu attacks with a massive fire attack. To counter this, Naruto and Yamato combine a water element attack and a wind element attack. They were successful in averting the attack.
Now, the order in which the above mentioned elements come are
water -> fire -> wind -> lightening -> earth -> water.
what we can see here is: water + wind = strong attack and fire + wind = strong attack.
So, can it be assumed that there are some elements that are more like support to the other elements, like in this case wind is the support element to both water and fire. |
304 | The title says it all... but I'll elaborate:
* Initially we see techniques derived from **a single chakra element** (Katon, Doton, Suiton, Fuuton and Raiton). These are the most common, since usually a ninja can master only one chakra nature (since normally ninjas tend to have an affiliation with only one chakra nature)
* Later we discover these can be combined in a number of ways, **creating new elements** (Mokuton=Doton+Suiton, Ranton=Raiton+Suiton, Youton=Katon+Doton, among several others). From what I understand, these are usually transmitted as a Kekkei Genkai. But I believe they can also be created by the combinations of the elements, by ninja who didn't inherit it from other generations (correct me if I'm wrong). These are not uncommon, but less frequent than the ones above (there are ninja who can master and possess affiliation to more than one chakra nature: Sasuke comes to mind, since he can master both Katon and Raiton. Katon is his clan's natural affiliation, and he mastered Raiton too. However, I don't **remember** if he has ever combined the both of them)
* Even later, we find about combinations of **even more elements** by ninja who can master several elements, such as Muu (Nidaime Tsuchikage) and Oonoki (Sandaime Tsuchikage), who can combine Katon, Doton and Fuuton, to create Jinton. These are called Kekkei Touta. I don't know if they can also be transmitted through Kekkei Genkai, or if they can only be taught. They are even rarer than the ones above, since ninja can rarely master or be naturally affiliated to more than two chakra natures (Terumii Mei the Godaime Mizukage, can also master Doton, Katon and Suiton, but I don't think she ever combines more than two at each time).
My questions are:
* **Are combinations of chakra natures taught or only transmitted by Kekkei Genkai (or both)?**
* **Are combinations of more than three chakra natures possible?**
* And the above question created a new one for me: **Can a ninja master more than three chakra natures?** (I think Kakashi does, but I am not quite sure about this) | 2012/12/13 | [
"https://anime.stackexchange.com/questions/304",
"https://anime.stackexchange.com",
"https://anime.stackexchange.com/users/49/"
] | >
> Are combinations of chakra natures taught or only transmitted by Kekkei Genkai (or both)?
>
>
>
I think combinations of Chakra are generally possible only through Kekkei Genkai, even if some can be "passed" by transplantation (e.g. Kakashi and the Sharingan).
Although, there's the issue of Lord Tsuchikage that in the Manga claims his master passed on to him the ability to combine *Earth*, *Wind* and *Fire*. It's not revealed whether they share some blood relation so I'd treat this with a grain of salt.
>
> Are combinations of more than three chakra natures possible?
>
>
>
There is *Kekkei Tōta* which is a combination of three elements (such as the Dust Release), and this is already classified as *advanced*, so I guess that for now, they aren't revealed as possible.
>
> And the above question created a new one for me: Can a ninja master more than three chakra natures? (I think Kakashi does, but I am not quite sure about this)
>
>
>
Yes, Kakashi masters four natures but one of them only according to the Anime, and they are:
**Douton** - *Earth*;
**Suiton** - *Water*;
**Raiton** - *Lightning*;
**Katon** - *Fire* (only anime). | I know this is a very old question but since I saw a lot of small mistakes and stuff forgotten I have to lay light on them.
**My answer contains spoilers from events that take place after the Masked Man's identity was revealed.**
1. The Kekkei Genkai can be passed by teaching if the student has the required chakra nature - for a proof check what Oonoki said about Muu: that he learnt his Jinton from him. So Muu taught him the Jinton since Oonoki already had the required chakra natures.
Another way to have a Kekkei Genkai is through transplantation. Examples of this include Kakashi's Sharingan, Nagato's and Obito's Rinnegan, Danzo's Sharingan, Madara's Wood Style, etc.
2. It is possible to have more Kekkei Touta since changes in chakra nature have no limits. Actually, each couple of episodes we see some new jutsu from a combination of certain chakra natures, as long as you get creative enough. An example of this are Deidara's Explosion Release: it is, in fact, combined Earth and Lightning releases, but it is also clay that explodes. So we can think about it like this: it is Earth + Water forming clay, then adding Fire or Lightning to create the explosion (but it was already decided what Deidara's Explosions Release is, so we need to get creative, and maybe Water + Fire gives Boil, which when using Lightning with the steam will be filled with electricity, since water is a supporter for lightning).
Some people speculate that no matter how you think about it, with any combination of more than 2 chakra natures, one of them will negate at least one of the others (Earth + Water gives Wood, with Lightning the wood will be destroyed since it's made of earth, so it's weak for lightning; Water + Wind gives Ice, with fire you melt the ice, or combining it with Earth or Lightning it makes no sense).
Personally I think there can be a way around it, so we can have more Kekkei Touta.
3. No sir, a Shinobi cannot master more than one chakra nature. But they can learn how to use more than one chakra nature — there are limits to what your body as a Shinobi can do, of course.
[](https://i.stack.imgur.com/mDZxM.png)
The Third Hokage, Sarutobi Hiruzen, is able to use the 5 main chakra natures. He uses Yin and Yang too, and that's why he was called the Professor of Konoha, and as I recall the god of Shinobi or the god of Jutsu, for knowing so many chakra natures and every jutsu in Konoha.
[](https://i.stack.imgur.com/sSjSH.png)
Another fact is that Rinnegan users can use all chakra natures and their combinations with no exception, as Madara showed us after gaining the power of the Six Paths: he used the Ranton (Water+ Lightning), and Madara normally only had Fire style. With the Rinnegan, we know, he had all chakra natures and he also used combinations.
Also, Kakashi doesn't use the chakra natures in his 1000 jutsu: he just copies the chakra flow and hand signs to make the jutsu like its owners.
And Kakuzu only uses chakra support system: Water to enhance Lightning, and Wind to enhance Fire. But he doesn't use combinations — Kekkei Genkai — and he only mastered earth style, the others are from different Shinobi. |
304 | The title says it all... but I'll elaborate:
* Initially we see techniques derived from **a single chakra element** (Katon, Doton, Suiton, Fuuton and Raiton). These are the most common, since usually a ninja can master only one chakra nature (since normally ninjas tend to have an affiliation with only one chakra nature)
* Later we discover these can be combined in a number of ways, **creating new elements** (Mokuton=Doton+Suiton, Ranton=Raiton+Suiton, Youton=Katon+Doton, among several others). From what I understand, these are usually transmitted as a Kekkei Genkai. But I believe they can also be created by the combinations of the elements, by ninja who didn't inherit it from other generations (correct me if I'm wrong). These are not uncommon, but less frequent than the ones above (there are ninja who can master and possess affiliation to more than one chakra nature: Sasuke comes to mind, since he can master both Katon and Raiton. Katon is his clan's natural affiliation, and he mastered Raiton too. However, I don't **remember** if he has ever combined the both of them)
* Even later, we find about combinations of **even more elements** by ninja who can master several elements, such as Muu (Nidaime Tsuchikage) and Oonoki (Sandaime Tsuchikage), who can combine Katon, Doton and Fuuton, to create Jinton. These are called Kekkei Touta. I don't know if they can also be transmitted through Kekkei Genkai, or if they can only be taught. They are even rarer than the ones above, since ninja can rarely master or be naturally affiliated to more than two chakra natures (Terumii Mei the Godaime Mizukage, can also master Doton, Katon and Suiton, but I don't think she ever combines more than two at each time).
My questions are:
* **Are combinations of chakra natures taught or only transmitted by Kekkei Genkai (or both)?**
* **Are combinations of more than three chakra natures possible?**
* And the above question created a new one for me: **Can a ninja master more than three chakra natures?** (I think Kakashi does, but I am not quite sure about this) | 2012/12/13 | [
"https://anime.stackexchange.com/questions/304",
"https://anime.stackexchange.com",
"https://anime.stackexchange.com/users/49/"
] | Chakra element combination is supposedly a born trait. A shinobi is *born* with one chakra element, and can master a few more (secondary elements).
However, in some clans, such as the Senju, they were born with *two* elements, (both Earth and Water), and they could naturally combine them to form the Wood element.
Since we only thought that two element combinations were possible, and we discovered that three were indeed possible, I see no reason why there isn't a possibility for four or more.
>
> ***EDIT!*** Based on the latest manga chapters, it seems as if at least 4 element combination is possible. Although it's an initial estimate and the Third *might* be wrong about it.
>
>
>
We do have some examples for ninja mastering all five chakra elements, Kakuzu is a great example. He had all five chakra elements, Water, Earth, Fire, Lightning and Wind, in one body (though he did cheat and used 5 different hearts for it). So it *is* possible. It is also said that those who awaken the Rinnegan can master all *six* elements (Including the YinYang element).
About *mixing* them together, since that hasn't happened yet, we can't be sure.
EDIT!
-----
>
> Six Paths Sage Chakra, which creates the Gudodama is called **Kekkei-Mora** and was confirmed to be a combination of all 6 elements: Fire, water, earth, lightning, wind and YinYang.
>
>
> | Yes but mostly only by the Uchiha clan like Sasuke, Itachi etc. Because they have the copy wheel eyes (aka sharingan )they can learn all five jitsu by copying and observing them. |
304 | The title says it all... but I'll elaborate:
* Initially we see techniques derived from **a single chakra element** (Katon, Doton, Suiton, Fuuton and Raiton). These are the most common, since usually a ninja can master only one chakra nature (since normally ninjas tend to have an affiliation with only one chakra nature)
* Later we discover these can be combined in a number of ways, **creating new elements** (Mokuton=Doton+Suiton, Ranton=Raiton+Suiton, Youton=Katon+Doton, among several others). From what I understand, these are usually transmitted as a Kekkei Genkai. But I believe they can also be created by the combinations of the elements, by ninja who didn't inherit it from other generations (correct me if I'm wrong). These are not uncommon, but less frequent than the ones above (there are ninja who can master and possess affiliation to more than one chakra nature: Sasuke comes to mind, since he can master both Katon and Raiton. Katon is his clan's natural affiliation, and he mastered Raiton too. However, I don't **remember** if he has ever combined the both of them)
* Even later, we find about combinations of **even more elements** by ninja who can master several elements, such as Muu (Nidaime Tsuchikage) and Oonoki (Sandaime Tsuchikage), who can combine Katon, Doton and Fuuton, to create Jinton. These are called Kekkei Touta. I don't know if they can also be transmitted through Kekkei Genkai, or if they can only be taught. They are even rarer than the ones above, since ninja can rarely master or be naturally affiliated to more than two chakra natures (Terumii Mei the Godaime Mizukage, can also master Doton, Katon and Suiton, but I don't think she ever combines more than two at each time).
My questions are:
* **Are combinations of chakra natures taught or only transmitted by Kekkei Genkai (or both)?**
* **Are combinations of more than three chakra natures possible?**
* And the above question created a new one for me: **Can a ninja master more than three chakra natures?** (I think Kakashi does, but I am not quite sure about this) | 2012/12/13 | [
"https://anime.stackexchange.com/questions/304",
"https://anime.stackexchange.com",
"https://anime.stackexchange.com/users/49/"
] | Chakra element combination is supposedly a born trait. A shinobi is *born* with one chakra element, and can master a few more (secondary elements).
However, in some clans, such as the Senju, they were born with *two* elements, (both Earth and Water), and they could naturally combine them to form the Wood element.
Since we only thought that two element combinations were possible, and we discovered that three were indeed possible, I see no reason why there isn't a possibility for four or more.
>
> ***EDIT!*** Based on the latest manga chapters, it seems as if at least 4 element combination is possible. Although it's an initial estimate and the Third *might* be wrong about it.
>
>
>
We do have some examples for ninja mastering all five chakra elements, Kakuzu is a great example. He had all five chakra elements, Water, Earth, Fire, Lightning and Wind, in one body (though he did cheat and used 5 different hearts for it). So it *is* possible. It is also said that those who awaken the Rinnegan can master all *six* elements (Including the YinYang element).
About *mixing* them together, since that hasn't happened yet, we can't be sure.
EDIT!
-----
>
> Six Paths Sage Chakra, which creates the Gudodama is called **Kekkei-Mora** and was confirmed to be a combination of all 6 elements: Fire, water, earth, lightning, wind and YinYang.
>
>
> | I think that combinations are Kekkei Genkai, only, as all combinations shown were Kekkai Genkais.
I don't think that combinations of more than three are possible, because then, one nature would block the other (compare Suiton and Katon). Because there are five "base natures", there can't be a combination with more than four natures without blocking one. A ninjutsu with all five would just... do nothing, I guess. As written in the comments (thanks to JNat), it's possible to combine up to 4 elements at a time, if you order them correctly.
Yes, they can. In NARUTO Hiden: Sha no Sho is stated, that shinobi can learn more than two and theoretically up to five natures. However, using them all at once in one attack could be... complicated. |
304 | The title says it all... but I'll elaborate:
* Initially we see techniques derived from **a single chakra element** (Katon, Doton, Suiton, Fuuton and Raiton). These are the most common, since usually a ninja can master only one chakra nature (since normally ninjas tend to have an affiliation with only one chakra nature)
* Later we discover these can be combined in a number of ways, **creating new elements** (Mokuton=Doton+Suiton, Ranton=Raiton+Suiton, Youton=Katon+Doton, among several others). From what I understand, these are usually transmitted as a Kekkei Genkai. But I believe they can also be created by the combinations of the elements, by ninja who didn't inherit it from other generations (correct me if I'm wrong). These are not uncommon, but less frequent than the ones above (there are ninja who can master and possess affiliation to more than one chakra nature: Sasuke comes to mind, since he can master both Katon and Raiton. Katon is his clan's natural affiliation, and he mastered Raiton too. However, I don't **remember** if he has ever combined the both of them)
* Even later, we find about combinations of **even more elements** by ninja who can master several elements, such as Muu (Nidaime Tsuchikage) and Oonoki (Sandaime Tsuchikage), who can combine Katon, Doton and Fuuton, to create Jinton. These are called Kekkei Touta. I don't know if they can also be transmitted through Kekkei Genkai, or if they can only be taught. They are even rarer than the ones above, since ninja can rarely master or be naturally affiliated to more than two chakra natures (Terumii Mei the Godaime Mizukage, can also master Doton, Katon and Suiton, but I don't think she ever combines more than two at each time).
My questions are:
* **Are combinations of chakra natures taught or only transmitted by Kekkei Genkai (or both)?**
* **Are combinations of more than three chakra natures possible?**
* And the above question created a new one for me: **Can a ninja master more than three chakra natures?** (I think Kakashi does, but I am not quite sure about this) | 2012/12/13 | [
"https://anime.stackexchange.com/questions/304",
"https://anime.stackexchange.com",
"https://anime.stackexchange.com/users/49/"
] | >
> Are combinations of chakra natures taught or only transmitted by Kekkei Genkai (or both)?
>
>
>
I think combinations of Chakra are generally possible only through Kekkei Genkai, even if some can be "passed" by transplantation (e.g. Kakashi and the Sharingan).
Although, there's the issue of Lord Tsuchikage that in the Manga claims his master passed on to him the ability to combine *Earth*, *Wind* and *Fire*. It's not revealed whether they share some blood relation so I'd treat this with a grain of salt.
>
> Are combinations of more than three chakra natures possible?
>
>
>
There is *Kekkei Tōta* which is a combination of three elements (such as the Dust Release), and this is already classified as *advanced*, so I guess that for now, they aren't revealed as possible.
>
> And the above question created a new one for me: Can a ninja master more than three chakra natures? (I think Kakashi does, but I am not quite sure about this)
>
>
>
Yes, Kakashi masters four natures but one of them only according to the Anime, and they are:
**Douton** - *Earth*;
**Suiton** - *Water*;
**Raiton** - *Lightning*;
**Katon** - *Fire* (only anime). | I think that if a shinobi can use all of the chakra elements, it doesn't guarantee that you can combine them. All of the answers above are correct in my opinion (we can't assume anything, unless we've seen them, and I'm the "only anime guy", so I have no idea about manga), but if I can speculate, I would answer:
**Question 1: Are combinations of chakra natures taught or only transmitted by Kekkei Genkai (or both)?**
I think it's by teaching someone (but I won't exclude Kekkei Genkai). Just think about it.
For example, Sasuke can master both Katon and Raiton, from which is (not guaranteed) born the Enton (Blaze Release). We can assume that his affinity is for Fire (Uchiha clan/Hidden Leaf) yet he was able of learning the Lightning style, and he learned all by himself the combination of those ('cause I can't remember seeing someone else from the Uchiha's with that release).
Another example is the Dust Release, which was described about: Ohnoki was taught, and yes, I think he and Mu weren't from the same family, so that's with the teaching.
I won't exclude Kekkei Genkai, because that's something "not uncommon yet powerful" so it can help the ninja.
**Question 2: Are combinations of more than three chakra natures possible?**
Practically, it's a smaller version of the main question. My answer is: if you can combine 3, you can combine 5. I can't expand the answer for this question, since we haven't seen such high skill combination. The Dust Release is 3, the Boil Release is 2 (but the Fifth Mizukage can use 3 types too).
**Question 3: Can a ninja master more than three chakra natures?**
Absolutely! Yep, you're right: Kakashi can use at least 4 (Fire, Lightning, Water, Earth) plus some idea about the Wind, but I think that's only because he's got the Sharingan. If he hadn't possess an eye like that, he would know like 2 types. To be honest, the only shinobi I could think of being capable of using at least 3, 4 for sure, don't know about 5, it's: Madara Uchiha. I'm not sure about the lightning style, but **he can** use the other 4.
I've just remembered, everything was created by the Sage of the Six Path, according to the Narutoverse, therefore he used (and possessed) all of the five natures, that's another fact!!! (I don't know about combining them, sure he was capable of that too)
In the end, I give you a big yes for the question, and I hope that I won't die until the end of this anime (manga). They have such potential and they can achieve far more than I could ever imagine. I am curious what would be the name of the release that includes all of the 5 chakra natures. We should ask Hagoromo Otsutsuki. I'm sure, he knows it :D |
304 | The title says it all... but I'll elaborate:
* Initially we see techniques derived from **a single chakra element** (Katon, Doton, Suiton, Fuuton and Raiton). These are the most common, since usually a ninja can master only one chakra nature (since normally ninjas tend to have an affiliation with only one chakra nature)
* Later we discover these can be combined in a number of ways, **creating new elements** (Mokuton=Doton+Suiton, Ranton=Raiton+Suiton, Youton=Katon+Doton, among several others). From what I understand, these are usually transmitted as a Kekkei Genkai. But I believe they can also be created by the combinations of the elements, by ninja who didn't inherit it from other generations (correct me if I'm wrong). These are not uncommon, but less frequent than the ones above (there are ninja who can master and possess affiliation to more than one chakra nature: Sasuke comes to mind, since he can master both Katon and Raiton. Katon is his clan's natural affiliation, and he mastered Raiton too. However, I don't **remember** if he has ever combined the both of them)
* Even later, we find about combinations of **even more elements** by ninja who can master several elements, such as Muu (Nidaime Tsuchikage) and Oonoki (Sandaime Tsuchikage), who can combine Katon, Doton and Fuuton, to create Jinton. These are called Kekkei Touta. I don't know if they can also be transmitted through Kekkei Genkai, or if they can only be taught. They are even rarer than the ones above, since ninja can rarely master or be naturally affiliated to more than two chakra natures (Terumii Mei the Godaime Mizukage, can also master Doton, Katon and Suiton, but I don't think she ever combines more than two at each time).
My questions are:
* **Are combinations of chakra natures taught or only transmitted by Kekkei Genkai (or both)?**
* **Are combinations of more than three chakra natures possible?**
* And the above question created a new one for me: **Can a ninja master more than three chakra natures?** (I think Kakashi does, but I am not quite sure about this) | 2012/12/13 | [
"https://anime.stackexchange.com/questions/304",
"https://anime.stackexchange.com",
"https://anime.stackexchange.com/users/49/"
] | I think that if a shinobi can use all of the chakra elements, it doesn't guarantee that you can combine them. All of the answers above are correct in my opinion (we can't assume anything, unless we've seen them, and I'm the "only anime guy", so I have no idea about manga), but if I can speculate, I would answer:
**Question 1: Are combinations of chakra natures taught or only transmitted by Kekkei Genkai (or both)?**
I think it's by teaching someone (but I won't exclude Kekkei Genkai). Just think about it.
For example, Sasuke can master both Katon and Raiton, from which is (not guaranteed) born the Enton (Blaze Release). We can assume that his affinity is for Fire (Uchiha clan/Hidden Leaf) yet he was able of learning the Lightning style, and he learned all by himself the combination of those ('cause I can't remember seeing someone else from the Uchiha's with that release).
Another example is the Dust Release, which was described about: Ohnoki was taught, and yes, I think he and Mu weren't from the same family, so that's with the teaching.
I won't exclude Kekkei Genkai, because that's something "not uncommon yet powerful" so it can help the ninja.
**Question 2: Are combinations of more than three chakra natures possible?**
Practically, it's a smaller version of the main question. My answer is: if you can combine 3, you can combine 5. I can't expand the answer for this question, since we haven't seen such high skill combination. The Dust Release is 3, the Boil Release is 2 (but the Fifth Mizukage can use 3 types too).
**Question 3: Can a ninja master more than three chakra natures?**
Absolutely! Yep, you're right: Kakashi can use at least 4 (Fire, Lightning, Water, Earth) plus some idea about the Wind, but I think that's only because he's got the Sharingan. If he hadn't possess an eye like that, he would know like 2 types. To be honest, the only shinobi I could think of being capable of using at least 3, 4 for sure, don't know about 5, it's: Madara Uchiha. I'm not sure about the lightning style, but **he can** use the other 4.
I've just remembered, everything was created by the Sage of the Six Path, according to the Narutoverse, therefore he used (and possessed) all of the five natures, that's another fact!!! (I don't know about combining them, sure he was capable of that too)
In the end, I give you a big yes for the question, and I hope that I won't die until the end of this anime (manga). They have such potential and they can achieve far more than I could ever imagine. I am curious what would be the name of the release that includes all of the 5 chakra natures. We should ask Hagoromo Otsutsuki. I'm sure, he knows it :D | Yes but mostly only by the Uchiha clan like Sasuke, Itachi etc. Because they have the copy wheel eyes (aka sharingan )they can learn all five jitsu by copying and observing them. |
304 | The title says it all... but I'll elaborate:
* Initially we see techniques derived from **a single chakra element** (Katon, Doton, Suiton, Fuuton and Raiton). These are the most common, since usually a ninja can master only one chakra nature (since normally ninjas tend to have an affiliation with only one chakra nature)
* Later we discover these can be combined in a number of ways, **creating new elements** (Mokuton=Doton+Suiton, Ranton=Raiton+Suiton, Youton=Katon+Doton, among several others). From what I understand, these are usually transmitted as a Kekkei Genkai. But I believe they can also be created by the combinations of the elements, by ninja who didn't inherit it from other generations (correct me if I'm wrong). These are not uncommon, but less frequent than the ones above (there are ninja who can master and possess affiliation to more than one chakra nature: Sasuke comes to mind, since he can master both Katon and Raiton. Katon is his clan's natural affiliation, and he mastered Raiton too. However, I don't **remember** if he has ever combined the both of them)
* Even later, we find about combinations of **even more elements** by ninja who can master several elements, such as Muu (Nidaime Tsuchikage) and Oonoki (Sandaime Tsuchikage), who can combine Katon, Doton and Fuuton, to create Jinton. These are called Kekkei Touta. I don't know if they can also be transmitted through Kekkei Genkai, or if they can only be taught. They are even rarer than the ones above, since ninja can rarely master or be naturally affiliated to more than two chakra natures (Terumii Mei the Godaime Mizukage, can also master Doton, Katon and Suiton, but I don't think she ever combines more than two at each time).
My questions are:
* **Are combinations of chakra natures taught or only transmitted by Kekkei Genkai (or both)?**
* **Are combinations of more than three chakra natures possible?**
* And the above question created a new one for me: **Can a ninja master more than three chakra natures?** (I think Kakashi does, but I am not quite sure about this) | 2012/12/13 | [
"https://anime.stackexchange.com/questions/304",
"https://anime.stackexchange.com",
"https://anime.stackexchange.com/users/49/"
] | Since it's very hard to answer if it's *possible* to mix more than 3 chakra types (I doubt it was stated anywhere in the manga), I'll try to answer the two other parts of the question.
Lets start from the easiest one: *Can a ninja master more than three chakra natures?*
This depends on what do you mean by "master", but the generic answer, I believe, will be "yes". Kakashi is shown to use 4 elements (earth, fire (only in anime), water and lightning). He didn't use any Wind techniques, but he was able to help Naruto in his training, so he at least knows something about them. Also note that:
* he has natural affinity to the Lightning
* he has used Water techniques on the level that matched the level of Zabuza, who is a water specialist
So we can say that he is a "master" of at least two elements, and definitely can use another two (he uses fire only in the anime, though). Now, taking that into account, I think it's safe to assume that it *is* possible to use all the elements. I've also seen opinions in the Internet (unconfirmed, though) that every shinobi can actually learn techniques of every element, but they just chose not to, and only use the element they have natural affinity to. This is a debatable, but interesting opinion.
Now, to the question *Are combinations of chakra natures taught or only transmitted by Kekkei Genkai (or both)?*
I believe, both. At least three techniques: Jinton, Yōton, and Jiton have more than one user with no apparent blood relations to each other. Also Ōnoki has stated that the secrets of Jinton were passed to him by Mū, so it implies (or at least suggests) that these abilities may not only be transmitted by Kekkei Genkai. So I would say that both of the ways are *plausible*. However, given the information we have now, it's impossible to be absolutely sure.
sources: [one](http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Dust_Release), [two](http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Kakashi_Hatake), [three](http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Lava_Release), [four](http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Magnet_Release) | In the episode where Kakashi battles Kakuzu, Kakuzu attacks with a massive fire attack. To counter this, Naruto and Yamato combine a water element attack and a wind element attack. They were successful in averting the attack.
Now, the order in which the above mentioned elements come are
water -> fire -> wind -> lightening -> earth -> water.
what we can see here is: water + wind = strong attack and fire + wind = strong attack.
So, can it be assumed that there are some elements that are more like support to the other elements, like in this case wind is the support element to both water and fire. |
304 | The title says it all... but I'll elaborate:
* Initially we see techniques derived from **a single chakra element** (Katon, Doton, Suiton, Fuuton and Raiton). These are the most common, since usually a ninja can master only one chakra nature (since normally ninjas tend to have an affiliation with only one chakra nature)
* Later we discover these can be combined in a number of ways, **creating new elements** (Mokuton=Doton+Suiton, Ranton=Raiton+Suiton, Youton=Katon+Doton, among several others). From what I understand, these are usually transmitted as a Kekkei Genkai. But I believe they can also be created by the combinations of the elements, by ninja who didn't inherit it from other generations (correct me if I'm wrong). These are not uncommon, but less frequent than the ones above (there are ninja who can master and possess affiliation to more than one chakra nature: Sasuke comes to mind, since he can master both Katon and Raiton. Katon is his clan's natural affiliation, and he mastered Raiton too. However, I don't **remember** if he has ever combined the both of them)
* Even later, we find about combinations of **even more elements** by ninja who can master several elements, such as Muu (Nidaime Tsuchikage) and Oonoki (Sandaime Tsuchikage), who can combine Katon, Doton and Fuuton, to create Jinton. These are called Kekkei Touta. I don't know if they can also be transmitted through Kekkei Genkai, or if they can only be taught. They are even rarer than the ones above, since ninja can rarely master or be naturally affiliated to more than two chakra natures (Terumii Mei the Godaime Mizukage, can also master Doton, Katon and Suiton, but I don't think she ever combines more than two at each time).
My questions are:
* **Are combinations of chakra natures taught or only transmitted by Kekkei Genkai (or both)?**
* **Are combinations of more than three chakra natures possible?**
* And the above question created a new one for me: **Can a ninja master more than three chakra natures?** (I think Kakashi does, but I am not quite sure about this) | 2012/12/13 | [
"https://anime.stackexchange.com/questions/304",
"https://anime.stackexchange.com",
"https://anime.stackexchange.com/users/49/"
] | You must have read the manga up until the last chapter, as this does include very late game information. From manga chapter 695 or something:
>
> The Sage of Six Paths was capable of mastering all 5 elemental chakras. We got this from the fourth Shinobi war, when Tenten, someone inept at ninjutsu, picked up a Sage of Six Paths tool/fan and was capable of utilising all 5 chakras, which exhausted her very quickly. Secondly, when Naruto was given power by the Sage of Six Paths, the Sage of Six Paths gave Naruto chakra of all the bijuu. Bijuu each having their own nature, e.g. Son Goku's Lava style (Fire + Earth), which means Naruto had mastered all Kekkai Genkai, and if he was capable of using his wind style to make a Lava Rasen Shuriken, I see no reason why it isn't possible to master all 5 natures, as well as the secondary and tertiary, or even quarternary natures.
>
>
>
It is possible to master and use every single chakra type. | In the episode where Kakashi battles Kakuzu, Kakuzu attacks with a massive fire attack. To counter this, Naruto and Yamato combine a water element attack and a wind element attack. They were successful in averting the attack.
Now, the order in which the above mentioned elements come are
water -> fire -> wind -> lightening -> earth -> water.
what we can see here is: water + wind = strong attack and fire + wind = strong attack.
So, can it be assumed that there are some elements that are more like support to the other elements, like in this case wind is the support element to both water and fire. |
304 | The title says it all... but I'll elaborate:
* Initially we see techniques derived from **a single chakra element** (Katon, Doton, Suiton, Fuuton and Raiton). These are the most common, since usually a ninja can master only one chakra nature (since normally ninjas tend to have an affiliation with only one chakra nature)
* Later we discover these can be combined in a number of ways, **creating new elements** (Mokuton=Doton+Suiton, Ranton=Raiton+Suiton, Youton=Katon+Doton, among several others). From what I understand, these are usually transmitted as a Kekkei Genkai. But I believe they can also be created by the combinations of the elements, by ninja who didn't inherit it from other generations (correct me if I'm wrong). These are not uncommon, but less frequent than the ones above (there are ninja who can master and possess affiliation to more than one chakra nature: Sasuke comes to mind, since he can master both Katon and Raiton. Katon is his clan's natural affiliation, and he mastered Raiton too. However, I don't **remember** if he has ever combined the both of them)
* Even later, we find about combinations of **even more elements** by ninja who can master several elements, such as Muu (Nidaime Tsuchikage) and Oonoki (Sandaime Tsuchikage), who can combine Katon, Doton and Fuuton, to create Jinton. These are called Kekkei Touta. I don't know if they can also be transmitted through Kekkei Genkai, or if they can only be taught. They are even rarer than the ones above, since ninja can rarely master or be naturally affiliated to more than two chakra natures (Terumii Mei the Godaime Mizukage, can also master Doton, Katon and Suiton, but I don't think she ever combines more than two at each time).
My questions are:
* **Are combinations of chakra natures taught or only transmitted by Kekkei Genkai (or both)?**
* **Are combinations of more than three chakra natures possible?**
* And the above question created a new one for me: **Can a ninja master more than three chakra natures?** (I think Kakashi does, but I am not quite sure about this) | 2012/12/13 | [
"https://anime.stackexchange.com/questions/304",
"https://anime.stackexchange.com",
"https://anime.stackexchange.com/users/49/"
] | I know this is a very old question but since I saw a lot of small mistakes and stuff forgotten I have to lay light on them.
**My answer contains spoilers from events that take place after the Masked Man's identity was revealed.**
1. The Kekkei Genkai can be passed by teaching if the student has the required chakra nature - for a proof check what Oonoki said about Muu: that he learnt his Jinton from him. So Muu taught him the Jinton since Oonoki already had the required chakra natures.
Another way to have a Kekkei Genkai is through transplantation. Examples of this include Kakashi's Sharingan, Nagato's and Obito's Rinnegan, Danzo's Sharingan, Madara's Wood Style, etc.
2. It is possible to have more Kekkei Touta since changes in chakra nature have no limits. Actually, each couple of episodes we see some new jutsu from a combination of certain chakra natures, as long as you get creative enough. An example of this are Deidara's Explosion Release: it is, in fact, combined Earth and Lightning releases, but it is also clay that explodes. So we can think about it like this: it is Earth + Water forming clay, then adding Fire or Lightning to create the explosion (but it was already decided what Deidara's Explosions Release is, so we need to get creative, and maybe Water + Fire gives Boil, which when using Lightning with the steam will be filled with electricity, since water is a supporter for lightning).
Some people speculate that no matter how you think about it, with any combination of more than 2 chakra natures, one of them will negate at least one of the others (Earth + Water gives Wood, with Lightning the wood will be destroyed since it's made of earth, so it's weak for lightning; Water + Wind gives Ice, with fire you melt the ice, or combining it with Earth or Lightning it makes no sense).
Personally I think there can be a way around it, so we can have more Kekkei Touta.
3. No sir, a Shinobi cannot master more than one chakra nature. But they can learn how to use more than one chakra nature — there are limits to what your body as a Shinobi can do, of course.
[](https://i.stack.imgur.com/mDZxM.png)
The Third Hokage, Sarutobi Hiruzen, is able to use the 5 main chakra natures. He uses Yin and Yang too, and that's why he was called the Professor of Konoha, and as I recall the god of Shinobi or the god of Jutsu, for knowing so many chakra natures and every jutsu in Konoha.
[](https://i.stack.imgur.com/sSjSH.png)
Another fact is that Rinnegan users can use all chakra natures and their combinations with no exception, as Madara showed us after gaining the power of the Six Paths: he used the Ranton (Water+ Lightning), and Madara normally only had Fire style. With the Rinnegan, we know, he had all chakra natures and he also used combinations.
Also, Kakashi doesn't use the chakra natures in his 1000 jutsu: he just copies the chakra flow and hand signs to make the jutsu like its owners.
And Kakuzu only uses chakra support system: Water to enhance Lightning, and Wind to enhance Fire. But he doesn't use combinations — Kekkei Genkai — and he only mastered earth style, the others are from different Shinobi. | I think that if a shinobi can use all of the chakra elements, it doesn't guarantee that you can combine them. All of the answers above are correct in my opinion (we can't assume anything, unless we've seen them, and I'm the "only anime guy", so I have no idea about manga), but if I can speculate, I would answer:
**Question 1: Are combinations of chakra natures taught or only transmitted by Kekkei Genkai (or both)?**
I think it's by teaching someone (but I won't exclude Kekkei Genkai). Just think about it.
For example, Sasuke can master both Katon and Raiton, from which is (not guaranteed) born the Enton (Blaze Release). We can assume that his affinity is for Fire (Uchiha clan/Hidden Leaf) yet he was able of learning the Lightning style, and he learned all by himself the combination of those ('cause I can't remember seeing someone else from the Uchiha's with that release).
Another example is the Dust Release, which was described about: Ohnoki was taught, and yes, I think he and Mu weren't from the same family, so that's with the teaching.
I won't exclude Kekkei Genkai, because that's something "not uncommon yet powerful" so it can help the ninja.
**Question 2: Are combinations of more than three chakra natures possible?**
Practically, it's a smaller version of the main question. My answer is: if you can combine 3, you can combine 5. I can't expand the answer for this question, since we haven't seen such high skill combination. The Dust Release is 3, the Boil Release is 2 (but the Fifth Mizukage can use 3 types too).
**Question 3: Can a ninja master more than three chakra natures?**
Absolutely! Yep, you're right: Kakashi can use at least 4 (Fire, Lightning, Water, Earth) plus some idea about the Wind, but I think that's only because he's got the Sharingan. If he hadn't possess an eye like that, he would know like 2 types. To be honest, the only shinobi I could think of being capable of using at least 3, 4 for sure, don't know about 5, it's: Madara Uchiha. I'm not sure about the lightning style, but **he can** use the other 4.
I've just remembered, everything was created by the Sage of the Six Path, according to the Narutoverse, therefore he used (and possessed) all of the five natures, that's another fact!!! (I don't know about combining them, sure he was capable of that too)
In the end, I give you a big yes for the question, and I hope that I won't die until the end of this anime (manga). They have such potential and they can achieve far more than I could ever imagine. I am curious what would be the name of the release that includes all of the 5 chakra natures. We should ask Hagoromo Otsutsuki. I'm sure, he knows it :D |
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