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So, that is the one that is drawing some fire tonight -- the choice of Senator Murray. |
COOPER: David, we still haven't heard any names on the Republican side. What do you make of the three names that we've heard tonight? Will there be more just finger-pointing, blaming as we've seen over the last several days? Or do you think these three people will look at compromise, will look at all options on the tab... |
DAVID GERGEN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Anderson, all of the indications right now are there'd be some very tough fights ahead. There could easily be a stalemate in this committee. |
But I must say, the Democrats generally are very supportive of Senator Reid's choices. They think they're good experienced legislators who have been willing to be bipartisan in the past. And so, there's general happiness I think on the Democratic side. |
But on the Republican side, there's a view that these three -- in particular Senator Murray -- are very political. That she -- that not only will she be out there raising money, but her number one job is to protect Democrats who are up for reelection. There are 23 are up for reelection next year. She's -- you know, she... |
So, Republicans are saying, A, we think these people are too way too political and, B, we're going to put some people in there who will not raise revenues. And these people are not going to have deep cuts in entitlements. |
That suggests hard fights ahead. |
COOPER: Gloria, it certainly does sound like hard fights ahead. |
GLORIA BORGER, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL ANALYST (via telephone): Yes, it does. And I just got an e-mail from a Republican Senate leadership aid who said to me -- the Democratic Senate Campaign Committee chair, they're running against Medicare reform over there. So, clearly, Republicans just don't think this is a great appoi... |
One name that I've heard on the Republican side, Anderson, from a lot of Republicans in the Senate that keeps coming up is Senator Rob Portman of Ohio who is a former head of the Office of Management and Budget. Lots of people think including Democrats that he'd be a good balance on this committee because he knows how ... |
But I think one reason she is there also, Anderson, is to protect the liberal flank so that liberals can say, OK, she's going to look out for our interests on this committee. That may not bode well for a result, but I think that's one of the reasons she's there. |
COOPER: Yes, John, certainly, I mean if both sides are going into this with thoughts of just how to protect their flanks, that doesn't really bode well at all. |
John, when do we anticipate hearing more names on the committee? |
KING: You know, Leader McConnell in the Senate Republican side has been home in Kentucky this week. Has said that he will appoint serious people and he will get there in the near future. |
It needs to be done within about a week and a half now. They had two weeks from the president to sign the legislation. They will obviously get the speakers' picks, we'll get Leader Pelosi's picks on the Democratic side of the House. |
And, Anderson, look, these are political leaders. You don't get to be speaker of the House or Democratic leader of either chamber, the leaders, without being a politician. So, we know they're going to have politicians. |
The question is, for example, no one from the "gang of six" so far in the Senate. Harry Reid deciding to overpass the Democrats on the "gang of six." So, they're deliberately looking for people who are viewed as loyal to the leadership -- at least from what we've seen so far. The question is, for all the politics invol... |
And will what has happened in recent days, the debt downgrade, the demands from the market to have a bigger, more credible deficit reduction package -- will that provide enough moral impetus, policy impetus, to overcome the very significant political divides on this committee? That remains a giant question mark even as... |
COOPER: Yes, it certainly does. John, David, Gloria, thanks very much. |
A very busy night. A lot happening, not just here in Somalia, but also in England where we've been watching rioting and more rioting tonight in Manchester. You follow me on Twitter, @AndersonCooper. I'll try to tweet tonight although the reception here is spotty at best. |
When we come back, a group known as al Shabaab, what they are doing to Somalia, and a threat that some of them might pose to United States, to Europe, the rest of the world. We'll have a lot from here. |
Also tonight, the threat for kids facing starvation, facing famine in the south and even here in Mogadishu. |
Also, Isha Sesay is following stories for us. |
Isha, what are you covering? |
ISHA SESAY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Anderson. |
To you point, we are closely following the troubling news out of Great Britain. A fortnight of looting and rioting. A major fire now burning in London. Britain's (INAUDIBLE) cities also feeling the heat. |
We'll bring you late coming reporting from the streets and new developments as they happen. |
That and much more when 360 continues. |
COOPER: More on our breaking news. You heard at the top of the hour we tell you that the top supplier of food aid in Somalia could be out of food in just three weeks given the current level of supplies that they have and the current level of donations in the pipeline. That means the famine here could deepen and more ki... |
And none of it had to happen. That's the frustrating thing. None of it was preordained. |
The famine, yes, it's caused by one of the worst droughts in 60 years. But it's become a catastrophe especially in southern Somalia because of a group of Islamic extremists. They're called the al Shabaab which means the youth. |
And they have kicked foreign aid workers. They have kidnapped them. They have killed some. They have not allowed children to be -- to be vaccinated, to be inoculated. |
So, we're seeing kids dying of measles, something that is preventable. |
Take a look at this video. You're looking at rule under al Shabaab, a prelude to a beheading, a man, alleged a Christian convert. The video was posted online as a warning to others, as a boast. |
Here in the capital of Mogadishu, al Shabaab has been battling against thousands of Ugandan soldiers, part of a contingent of African Union peacekeepers that were sent here in 2007. |
Al Shabaab has shown terror, some of it at the hands of Somali Americans who have come here to kill. |
Take a look at this. This is the work of one of them -- the aftermath of an attack reportedly by a suicide bomber from Seattle. His name was Omar Mahmoud. The bomber reportedly drove a car into an African Union base not far from where we're coming to you from tonight, killing himself and 21 peacekeepers. A building ver... |
Here's another bomber, blew himself up killing 29 at a United Nations base north of here. And just a couple of months ago, a Somali American named Farah Mohamed Beledi was shot and killed before he could trigger his suicide vest in an African Union checkpoint. |
It is very dangerous for African Union peacekeepers. You can see the detonator on his jacket. Had he reached that, dozens might have died. |
And there may be dozens more Somali American killers out there. Young men who've disappeared in the United States possibly to turn up here, training for attacks or as many experts feared future jihad back in the United States or elsewhere, here in Africa or Europe. |
As for here and now, al Shabaab has deepened the crisis by expelling foreign aid workers in the south, refusing to let them work, claiming they're spies. They've even, as I said, refused to let kids be vaccinated from measles and other childhood diseases, claiming the vaccines are part of a Western plot to kill Somali ... |
Now, for a long time it seems al Shabaab had the upper hand, but in just the last few days, in Mogadishu, that has suddenly changed. On Friday, al Shabaab retreated from the capital. They withdrew from the capital today as with Ugandan peacekeepers. |
And as they entered they entered the city's central marketplace, a place they have fought and failed to reach for years now. A place that al Shabaab has controlled and profited -- had profited heavily from. |
The battle for the market has been one of the most intense here in the last few years -- and with al Shabaab's sudden departure, the battle for now seems to have changed. Take a look. |
COOPER (voice-over): African Union peacekeepers arrive in Mogadishu's Bakara market today in a convoy of armored vehicles. Al Shabaab fighters may have pulled out but Lt. Col. Paddy Ankunda isn't taking any chances, and he doesn't want to stay long. |
(on camera): In recent days you've still seen snipers? |
LT. COL. PADDY ANKUNDA, ANISOM: Just last week. |
ANKUNDA: They're in this building. |
COOPER: In this building here? |
ANKUNDA: We couldn't even cross the street with our forces who are just there. |
COOPER: So even though al Shabaab left there are still maybe some sort of a presence in the city of snipers, others who are in the population. |
ANKUNDA: Yes, hiding within the community. |
COOPER (voice-over): Shell casings littered the streets, signs of the months of fierce fighting that are taking place for control of the market. |
(on camera): Why is this so important of al Shabaab, this market? |
ANKUNDA: Very important because it has all the businesses, all of the money is right here. |
COOPER: So they extorted money, they own businesses here. That's where they made a lot of their income? |
ANKUNDA: They tax people. They're all businesses. They've extorted money. They've had a big deal here. |
COOPER: Why do you think they left? |
ANKUNDA: I mean they left because they couldn't stand and fight. We are pushing them to the wall. And they thought they had to preserve their lives and go away. |
COOPER: Do you worry they're going to come back, though? |
ANKUNDA: Well, I don't think they can easily get into Mogadishu once again. But we need more troops. The area has become too large. But if we don't get troops, there are going to be gaps, no doubt. |
COOPER: And they can -- even if they don't come back in force, they can still come back with suicide bombers. |
ANKUNDA: Yes. We're going to see more of, I mean, visible fronts where they're going to use more suicide bombing, kidnapping and assassinations. |
COOPER: That's what you think is the future here? |
COOPER (voice-over): The African Union peacekeepers say they now control about 90 percent of Mogadishu, but they rarely go out on foot patrol and they're stretched very thin. |
(on camera): Al Shabaab may be gone but they haven't been defeated. They still control large parts of southern Somalia. And they say they're going to return to the city. They say they were just making a tactical retreat. |
The African Union peacekeepers are very confident. They say there's no way they're going to be able to get back in the city. |
But you talk to other people here, you talked to residents in Mogadishu, and they're not so sure. There's only about 9,000 African Union peacekeepers. There's no way they can occupy the entire city and protect the entire city if al Shabaab decides to return. So the future of Mogadishu is still very much in doubt. |
(voice-over): For more than a year, the peacekeepers have been asking for 11,000 additional troops, as well as air and sea support. But so far, they haven't received any additional resources. |
(on camera): You think there's an opportunity for the international community to rebuild Mogadishu now, and to move quickly to solidify again? |
ANKUNDA: Yes. The time is now or never. The world has the opportunity today to restore the state of Somalia. If that is not done now, then the Al-Shabaab are going to rebuild themselves and come back. |
COOPER: So there's an opportunity right now. Time is short? |
COOPER (voice-over): After about 30 minutes in Bakara market, the peacekeepers decide it's time to leave. They want to return to the relative safety of their base. Night is coming. |
Despite the gains of the past few days, Mogadishu is still a very dangerous place. |
(END VIDEOTAPE) COOPER: I'm joined now by CNN national security analyst Peter Bergen and also a CNN correspondent Nima Elbagir who has spent a lot of time here in Mogadishu. |
You've been here now for a couple of weeks, right? |
NIMA ELBAGIR, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes. Yes. |
COOPER: Before we talk about al Shabaab, and you were caught in a firefight with al Shabaab just last week, I want to talk about the food situation. You talked to people from the World Food Program who are saying they are running out of food. |
ELBAGIR: They have less than a month. |
COOPER: Less than a month of food supplies. |
ELBAGIR: They have less -- if the donations remain as they are -- I mean, we're talking about a huge shortfall, over $500 million for the whole of the Horn of Africa. And people just aren't delivering on that pledges -- in addition to people who aren't even pledging in the first place. |
COOPER: It's an extraordinary difficult situation. It's now compounded with the situation of al Shabaab which is actually probably the best news that's occurred here, al Shabaab leaving on Friday. |
You were, as I said, in a firefight with al Shabaab just last week. You were caught in the middle between African Union peacekeepers and Al-Shabaab. What was that like? What were they like as fighters? |
ELBAGIR: I wouldn't say they're incredible competent. You know I've been on the other side of that front line, on the al Shabaab side. And the strength of al Shabaab has always been that their strength comes just from the fact that they hold territory, that they have a presence here. |
And so, that brings in foreign fighters from other territories like -- they used to come from Iraq, they come from Afghanistan. And it's that training that has helped them. |
COOPER: And there are now great divisions within al Shabaab and that may be behind why they've left. |
ELBAGIR: There's a huge issue over this allowing in foreign aid groups and the way that it's really eroded their grassroots support. And there are actually some al Shabaab leaders who are saying, does it matter if these aid is coming in from Christian countries, our people are dying. And there are other al Shabaab lead... |
And so, they're fighting amongst themselves and they -- and that's also splitting the resources that are coming in to them. |
COOPER: It's interesting, Peter. It's almost the same mistake and error that al Shabaab in Iraq made of once they're actually in power -- people begin to see how extreme they are and how unpleasant it is to live under them. |
PETER BERGEN, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: Yes, it seems to be encoded in the sort of DNA of these jihadist militant groups that when they actually control population and control territory, they impose Taliban-like policies on the population which eventually leads to their downfall. |
COOPER: And in terms of what they were doing to people -- I mean, they have this strict interpretation of Sharia law. They were beheading people, public executions, public torture in some cases, stonings. They're draconian to say the least. |
ELBAGIR: I mean, it went beyond draconian. Some of it was just completely insane. They have these little triangular pastries called samosas. |
COOPER: Right. Samosas are everywhere in East Africa. It's a common dish. |
ELBAGIR: This was (INAUDIBLE) al Shabaab banned them. They said that that's half of the crucifix. So nobody -- I mean, these people don't have any food. And what little food they can scrounge up al Shabaab is saying no. We're even going to get involved in how you run your kitchens now. |
COOPER: Peter, it's interesting because a number of Americans, not all Somali nationals, but a number of Americans have actually joined Al-Shabaab and become suicide fighters here. |
BERGEN: Yes. The first American suicide attacker in history was -- Anderson, was somebody who killed himself in Somalia and I think, Anderson, in term of a threat to the United States or Europe, because of the very high death rates these fighters have in Somalia, I don't think -- I don't see them as being a big threat. |
But you can certainly see that al Shabaab has attacked in Uganda. They've also tried to kill a Danish cartoonist in Denmark in the last year or so. So they've shown some ability to do out-of-area operations and quite an ability to attract both Americans and Europeans to come and fight in Somalia. |
COOPER: In terms of dangers from al Shabaab, I mean, the concern now is that even if they don't come back en masse into this city which they could very well do despite the kind of bravado of some of the peacekeepers here saying there's no way that can happen, they could also just come back in in big numbers in terms of... |
There was a suicide bombing in the location we're at just a few hundred feet away from where we're standing last year. |
ELBAGIR: Yes, absolutely. I mean, that is the huge concern, is that they will disrupt any attempt to bring about any normality to people's lives. |
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