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**Adam Stacoviak:** Yeah, I know the Go world a little bit. I was actually really excited to see, and I thought it was a little weird - I didn't expect it, so that's why it's weird, but it's not a weird thing... It's [Rooby](https://github.com/rooby-lang/rooby), the Ruby lang written in Go. I think that's kind of inter... |
**Carlisia Thompson:** I'll just plus one that, can I? Because I thought the same. And by the way, do you wanna introduce yourself? |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Me? |
**Carlisia Thompson:** Mm-hm. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Let me see... I'm me. |
**Carlisia Thompson:** Your name and who are you, because -- I didn't realize you were gonna be on... Awesome! |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Well, for the folks who are listening, I'm usually the person behind the scenes. I'm here every single show. This is episode 45 - I've been here all 45 episodes. It's been a lot of fun. My name's Adam Stacoviak, editor in chief of Changelog. I've been doing this for a while. I started the Changelog ... |
I like meeting people. I love the hacker community, it's a lot of fun to do this and to do awesome shows like GoTime. |
**Erik St. Martin:** And if you happen to be around 3 PM Eastern Time - well, I guess really it's 4-5 PM EST - the after show, Adam usually comes on after we... |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Oh, yes... I appear there, too. |
**Erik St. Martin:** Yes. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Sometimes. |
**Carlisia Thompson:** And Adam will also be at [GopherCon](https://www.gophercon.com). |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Yeah, I'll be at GopherCon. I usually have random jobs there... Sometimes I grab the trash \[laughter\], I help out the staff, other times I have a camera in my hand. And sometimes I'm just standing there with a weird face, because I don't know what's going on, but I try... Anyways, Rooby - pretty i... |
**Erik St. Martin:** Alright, what have we got next? |
**Carlisia Thompson:** The next question... |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Are we going linear down this list? |
**Carlisia Thompson:** Why not? |
**Adam Stacoviak:** \[08:02\] "Where do each of you put Go lang in two years' time, maybe five years?" So basically, pontificate... Where is Go going, 2-5 years? |
**Erik St. Martin:** Yeah, these future visions are always difficult... Right now, it really is the language of the cloud, right? Most distributed systems software is being written in it, all the tooling surrounding that, monitoring and metrics systems are all written in Go... I feel like it's gonna continue to grow th... |
We keep seeing a little bit of hints at it on the phone and on embedded devices, but I think that the catalyst has kind of already happened in the distributed systems world. How about you, Brian? You love these things. I think they pinned your tweet on the GoTimeFM Twitter... |
**Carlisia Thompson:** Where's Brian? |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Brian's doing barbecue. |
**Erik St. Martin:** Did we lose him? |
**Adam Stacoviak:** He's muted, or something. |
**Brian Ketelsen:** That would explain why you guys didn't laugh at the thing I said earlier, because I was muted! \[laughter\] |
**Adam Stacoviak:** We'll laugh now. What did you say? |
**Brian Ketelsen:** I said that you were the prince of podcasts, the royalty of radio, and the Ocelot of open source. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Whooow, okay... That's pretty interesting. |
**Brian Ketelsen:** I thought that was pretty good, because I couldn't think of anything that was royalty that started with an O, and I needed to get open source in there, so you're an Ocelot. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** That's good. Yeah, I like that. I dig it. |
**Erik St. Martin:** Now you need a new business card. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Had I heard that, I would have laughed. |
**Brian Ketelsen:** See? |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Yeah, thank you. |
**Brian Ketelsen:** You bet. I'm here for you. So I think that Go in two years will continue the trajectory it's on now, but in five years Go will be THE dominant server-side language, taking over the spot of Java. A lot of the really big server-side stuff that you see now, especially in the open source infrastructure ... |
**Adam Stacoviak:** What do you think is perpetuating that? |
**Brian Ketelsen:** Single binary deploy... If you've ever tried to administer a [Kafka](https://kafka.apache.org) cluster, or a [ZooKeeper](https://zookeeper.apache.org) cluster, or any of that... I mean, just the whole deploying JVM requires a masters degree in deploying JVMs. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Wow, that's a shame. |
**Brian Ketelsen:** And Go is significantly easier to deploy. I honestly think the DevOps movement, the serverless movement - all of those things fit really nicely into a language that has a single binary deploy. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** As sort of a flipside to that question - what do you say to somebody who's like "Rust or Go"? |
**Brian Ketelsen:** I think it should be Rust AND Go. There are sweet spots for both languages, there's no reason that you have to choose one over the other, and there are places and times for each of them. I really like Rust for extreme memory safety, but I also think that Rust isn't the language to choose if you want... |
**Erik St. Martin:** I was gonna add to that too, that I think a lot of it too is that these pieces of software for distributed systems are often complex and large, and a lot of moving parts, so I think that having a language that's much easier to fit the whole language in your head at one time I think really helps peo... |
**Carlisia Thompson:** \[12:11\] I agree completely with Brian, even with the timeframe. I think in five years Go will take over a lot of space that's taken up by Java right now, it will become more enterprisy... And I say this because I think over the past years, independently of Go, it just has become easier to devel... |
I don't think Go is going to be the homogeneous, THE language that's going to be used - that will never happen, no matter what the language is, because it doesn't even make sense - but I think it will take up chunks and enough to be the dominant language, because of all the attributes that Go has. |
Now, in the next two years what I see happening, with [Steve Francia](https://twitter.com/spf13) coming on board to be the sort of like product manager - he has a different title, but that's one idea of what he does - and the Development Working Group coming together, I think these next four years we're going to see a ... |
**Erik St. Martin:** How about you, Adam? Do you wanna take a stab at this? |
**Adam Stacoviak:** It's above my paygrade. \[laughter\] |
**Erik St. Martin:** Alright, what's our next question? |
**Adam Stacoviak:** That was Martin T., I'm assuming, von-SomethingLong, a cool name, who asked that question, and Martin Moudy who asked the previous question, so that was good. If we're going linear, I don't know who asked this next one; there's no name attached to that. Do you wanna camp there or do you wanna skip i... |
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