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[808.14 --> 808.84] That's a huge deal. |
[809.06 --> 811.90] And they're spinning up another dozen next year. |
[812.14 --> 819.12] So with pricing 30 to 50% cheaper than those big hyperscalers that want to lock into their platform with $100, you get free credit. |
[819.28 --> 820.64] And it's a great way to support the show. |
[820.74 --> 821.80] Why not go check them out? |
[822.22 --> 823.58] Their community support runs deep. |
[823.68 --> 825.48] Their commitment to these platforms runs deep. |
[825.48 --> 827.54] And they've been doing it for nearly 19 years. |
[828.20 --> 834.34] So go sign up today, support the show, and get $100 to try it out when you go to linode.com slash SSH. |
[834.42 --> 837.42] That's linode.com slash SSH. |
[837.42 --> 844.28] Well, the headline writer in me is not one to miss out on an opportunity for some alliteration. |
[844.28 --> 848.20] And so I was watching, I think it was Linus again. |
[848.26 --> 854.02] This turns out to be a heavily Linus-influenced video where he went on a rant about Plex on the WAN show. |
[854.58 --> 858.42] And it got me thinking that, okay, so what's your solution? |
[858.42 --> 861.42] Is it to just not work with Plex anymore and just to rant about it? |
[861.44 --> 863.14] Or is there some action you can take? |
[863.14 --> 870.76] And I thought, our audience, why don't we put together a call to action, not just for the hosts, but also for the audience as well. |
[870.76 --> 878.74] So for the month of January, we are going to completely disable our Plex servers and switch to Jellyfin. |
[879.24 --> 879.60] Yes. |
[880.66 --> 887.86] And, you know, I just recently tried Jellyfin, skidded off the surface, bounced off the atmosphere, and went into orbit around Plex again. |
[888.22 --> 891.36] So we'll see how this goes for me, but I'm willing to do it. |
[891.40 --> 892.58] I just have a couple of questions. |
[892.96 --> 899.86] Before I commit to disrupting the beautiful Odroid setup that I just got working, what do you think ultimately the goal is? |
[899.88 --> 906.74] You think at the end of January you're hoping that we've sort of sorted out our Jellyfin issues and we just stay with Jellyfin going forward? |
[906.74 --> 909.80] I mean, in a perfect world, I suppose so, yeah. |
[909.98 --> 929.76] It's not that I have anything against Plex per se, but I think we all know deep down that one day Plex are probably going to make some move that alienates us to a point where we're like, yeah, I can't keep using this anymore. |
[929.76 --> 938.08] And there has to be a viable alternative at that moment in time, whether it's a year's time or 10 years time, who knows? |
[938.68 --> 953.42] But there have got to be a few things in place for me as a server admin, you know, monitoring tools, for example, on the back end that I need, as well as some basics for non-techie people like TV clients and stuff in place. |
[953.42 --> 957.06] And I know the Jellyfin project are working on this heavily, heavily, heavily. |
[957.52 --> 965.66] But I think the ultimate goal of this challenge, of this Jellyfin January challenge, is to raise the profile of Jellyfin, number one. |
[965.78 --> 977.88] I think a lot of people in our audience already do know about it, but they maybe haven't quite had enough of a push or impetus to actually try it and or to just kick the tires. |
[977.88 --> 979.46] Maybe we make this an annual thing. |
[979.54 --> 980.00] Who knows? |
[980.48 --> 993.12] I like it because I feel like if we, you and I and Brent and Wes and others, if we won't use it and our audience won't use it, then literally there probably is not a customer base, right? |
[994.04 --> 1006.20] We have got to use this stuff in order to bang on it, get people out there, advocate for it, get more people using it, grow the user base and help the developers, you know, turn it into something sustainable. |
[1006.20 --> 1008.84] And if we don't do that, it'll just fade away. |
[1009.24 --> 1019.76] So that's been my thinking about Jellyfin is I also I think Plex is a good product, but I also have to agree with the thread on the self-hosted subreddit that you started. |
[1019.76 --> 1027.60] It was a pleasant thread, just kind of gently asking people, has there been something with Plex recently that you didn't like? |
[1027.60 --> 1041.64] And by 97 points, the top comment is focusing on things that the core customers never asked for, which I think if you boil down my complaints and your complaints, it's essentially just that. |
[1042.34 --> 1042.36] Yeah. |
[1042.42 --> 1049.72] If we think about where Plex was, I don't know, three, four, five years ago, there was very little cloud connectivity. |
[1049.72 --> 1059.24] I think the authentication has been cloud based for a long time, and that is a consistent piece of feedback in this Reddit thread, which will be linked in the show notes if you're interested. |
[1060.02 --> 1073.06] But on top of the kind of cloud authentication, there's been a huge pushover, certainly the last two or three years since we spoke with Elon, really, on this show to add their free ad supported media stuff. |
[1073.06 --> 1084.02] The podcast stuff, which I think has been removed now, and just a whole bunch of stuff that is not core to streaming files from a hard drive in my basement. |
[1084.72 --> 1092.30] And you and I recognized, I think at the very start of the show, a couple of years ago, this was going to be a problem because you can kind of nail that. |
[1092.40 --> 1094.14] And then where do you go from there to build a business? |
[1094.42 --> 1101.14] And if you want to build a big business, you have to be seen as reputable and legitimate by the rest of the industry. |
[1101.14 --> 1110.60] And so to do that, ostensibly, Plex needs to be like this master streaming media application that's supposedly bringing streams in from all these different locations. |
[1110.80 --> 1115.14] And your local media, it's just one of the options. |
[1116.02 --> 1118.68] It's not like our core focus is pirated content. |
[1118.98 --> 1120.90] It's just one of the options if they happen to have it. |
[1121.24 --> 1126.58] And they had to position it like that, I think, to be considered a legitimate business by the rest of the industry. |
[1126.58 --> 1131.36] And I think you and I recognized a long time ago that was going to create conflict with the user base. |
[1132.10 --> 1133.08] 100% agree. |
[1133.56 --> 1143.48] There is a way that the company conducts itself to, I mean, Plex in general, with its user base of, is it fair to criticize Plex for the way in which they conduct themselves as a business? |
[1143.48 --> 1147.90] Because they obviously have VC money to repay. |
[1148.08 --> 1152.24] They have salaries and payroll to meet, all that kind of stuff. |
[1152.96 --> 1167.76] And so when I look at, you know, them adding air quotes, cool new feature, and I disable it in my pinned sources bar, and then two weeks later, for some reason, it's back again without me requesting it. |
[1167.76 --> 1176.18] That kind of behavior really pisses me off, and I don't ever envisage something like that happening with a free software project like Jellyfin. |
[1176.84 --> 1183.16] And, you know, it's the same thread that goes throughout this whole show of how do I own my data? |
[1183.16 --> 1189.96] And ultimately, there is a link between my Plex ID and some data on a Plex server. |
[1190.74 --> 1195.38] Whether it's an insidious link now, probably not. |
[1195.76 --> 1201.10] Whether it's an insidious link in 10 years that's then sold to advertisers, we just don't know. |
[1201.40 --> 1210.36] And, you know, I'm not here to cast aspersions about Plex in general and say it's crap, because actually I still think it's probably the most polished solution that we have. |
[1210.36 --> 1217.94] But hopefully, by the end of January, we'll know, having stuck with Jellyfin for the month, what all the areas of improvement are. |
[1218.26 --> 1228.88] So I thought in that vein, we'd invite Mr. Brent along and give him a chance to give some feedback on his – because you're a big Jellyfin user already, aren't you? |
[1229.62 --> 1233.80] Well, you know, you mentioned maybe we might do this as an annual check-in for Jellyfin. |
[1233.80 --> 1237.00] And if I'm remembering correctly, I think I am. |
[1237.20 --> 1241.90] I actually gave Jellyfin as a gift last year for Christmas. |
[1242.32 --> 1243.76] The gift of Jellyfin? |
[1244.14 --> 1244.62] Well, I did. |
[1244.80 --> 1249.70] I ripped a bunch of DVDs and – because our internet here is terrible and my brother lives like 100 feet away. |
[1249.90 --> 1253.66] And his wife has like this massive DVD collection that she loves. |
[1254.32 --> 1257.52] And that's back when our internet was far worse. |
[1257.60 --> 1259.26] We did a bunch of changes and fixed that. |
[1259.44 --> 1262.40] So I set up some instances and had a great time with it. |
[1262.40 --> 1270.56] There were a few little things that didn't quite work the way I was hoping, like local media streaming for music, because I'm a big music listener. |
[1270.70 --> 1272.38] That was a little choppy at the time. |
[1272.76 --> 1274.08] I think I've sorted that out since. |
[1274.20 --> 1281.18] But it just never became the daily use model that I was hoping for. |
[1281.18 --> 1293.50] So what I'm hoping for this year is that revisiting it, it might just really get integrated more so, especially if we're tearing down all of our Plex infrastructure collectively. |
[1293.82 --> 1296.60] I think I'm excited to see what has changed in a year. |
[1296.70 --> 1297.88] And I'm hoping there's quite a bit. |
[1297.96 --> 1300.34] From what I can tell on their GitHub, super active. |
[1300.52 --> 1303.20] So there's got to be a lot of good stuff that we're new to. |
[1303.54 --> 1303.62] Yeah. |
[1303.66 --> 1305.92] When you say active, you do mean active. |
[1305.92 --> 1311.02] I mean, like 90 PRs this last month that were accepted. |
[1311.52 --> 1316.76] I mean, like 800 contributors in the lifetime of the project. |
[1317.04 --> 1321.70] That seems like a massive success to me if you're looking at it from that perspective. |
[1321.96 --> 1322.62] It's very impressive. |
[1323.36 --> 1323.56] Yeah. |
[1324.20 --> 1324.96] Momentum is building. |
[1325.46 --> 1330.46] I'll be curious, Brent, to hear if you get a chance to try out the Watch Together stuff. |
[1330.46 --> 1332.10] Because I know you and Wes are thinking about it. |
[1332.10 --> 1333.18] Because Wes is going to be in on this too. |
[1333.28 --> 1335.98] Because we're going to, it's a Linux unplugged self-hosted joint effort. |
[1336.58 --> 1344.28] And I'm hopeful that you get a chance to try that and report back on how the joint play together stuff works. |
[1344.54 --> 1344.64] Yeah. |
[1344.64 --> 1347.42] The last time we visited it, it did work well. |
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