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**Adam Stacoviak:** Yeah. |
**Anurag Goel:** And that might lead to what from the outside might appear to be sort of a boring platform. But our numbers say otherwise, and our revenue says otherwise. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Well, you need to follow that boring tech mentality, too. I think there's a certain recipe of innovation, and there's a certain recipe combining that with boring. Boring is stable. |
**Anurag Goel:** Boring is stable. Boring is secure. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Right. Boring is capable. |
**Anurag Goel:** Yeah. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** It's not going to fall over necessarily in the middle of the night, and cause me and my team headaches because I chose Render's super-innovative next thing. It's more like "Well --" That's kind of funny, that your next innovation is object storage. |
Okay, so you've got -- you currently have GPUs running, so you're running inference... |
**Anurag Goel:** No, we're not. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Okay, you're not. |
**Anurag Goel:** No, no. I was just saying we can't rule that out. So some of that $80 million might go towards figuring out the GPU situation. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Do you think it'd be $20 million? I was just joking about that number, but man, I can imagine if you had to stack some GPUs, it'd probably be about $20 million to outfit a proper setup. |
**Anurag Goel:** Yeah, I don't know... I don't want to spend $20 million on GPUs. \[laughter\] I just don't. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Who does, right? |
**Anurag Goel:** Yeah, who does? |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Because two years from now or three years from now, when the demand curve swings back, you'd have probably paid 3x, 4x more than you should have. |
**Anurag Goel:** \[53:59\] Yeah, but the good thing is there's a bunch of people who already spent that money on GPUs, and they are looking to make some money from it, because they're just lying there, being wasted. And so there is a marketplace approach to this, and there are companies that are becoming effectively GP... |
**Adam Stacoviak:** So without revealing or me asking you to reveal too much of your cards, or even beyond my question mentioning Temporal ever again, in terms of this in particular, is the next thing you're trying to build that retry world where you don't have an application fallover? Because going back to your origin... |
**Anurag Goel:** Yeah. So the way people manage it today is exactly what you said, which is you run a background worker, and you have a Redis queue, and you run something like Celery, or whatever. And I think, again, that architecture served us well for maybe 10 years, but it's showing its age, based on the new kinds o... |
And so when we think about not just for AI APIs, but even async tasks, things that need to happen, you need to make sure that they happen once and only once, and then you need to have conditional events happen, and so you basically build out a whole graph of activity... And you want to be able to just express that in y... |
And so there are a lot of these questions and answers that we are thinking about as we think about this next product... |
And I think it's really exciting. I think it's fundamentally changing the abstraction level of how people run a bunch of distributed tasks, and making sure that we give people the same -- again, it's all about what your infra team would do for you if you were on AWS. |
\[58:10\] Your infra team would set up Temporal, and they would train you on how to use Temporal, and then developers would have to learn Temporal. We're replacing a lot of that, and we're saying, again, "Application devs, if you want all of this, here it is." And you don't have to worry about how many Temporal workers... |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Are you friendly with other CEOs? |
**Anurag Goel:** It depends on the CEO. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Are you friendly with Samar, for example, Temporal's CEO? |
**Anurag Goel:** I don't know him. I don't know him. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Okay. I've talked to him before. You guys seem passionate about solving this problem, so I bet you guys would be good friends. |
**Anurag Goel:** Sure, yeah. Yeah. I mean, again, I think what they've built is great. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** I think -- yeah, when I look at what you should focus on, it seems, in my prior examinations of what I assumed Render was, and then now my examinations of what Render is based on this conversation with you, you look at the marketplace of being a developer, in particular an application developer, bec... |
**Anurag Goel:** You just described our business strategy. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** There you go. |
**Anurag Goel:** Yes, that is exactly what it is. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Okay. So when it comes to, I suppose, this -- if you want to say it, this $80 million that you've got... Did you need that money? Did you need to raise another round, or did you do it because it was time, it was necessary? Why raise a series C? Why that for you all? I know you have to innovate. Do y... |
**Anurag Goel:** Yeah. So I think for us there are two big reasons. One, increased legitimacy. I think there are a lot of people, both customers and potential hires. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Perception, essentially. |
**Anurag Goel:** A lot of it has to do with perception, because you look at a series A company, and they have this product, and it might be great, but they're like -- series A companies die at a much higher rate than series C companies. Everyone just knows that. And there are people who will join a series C company bec... |
And so it was important to us to continue to have this public perception of stability and long-term viability, given what we do. And as soon as we announced the round, the number of people building serious things on Render, that has taken off. So there's that. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** \[01:01:55.00\] Okay. How do you maintain an awareness to that? Answer the rest of your question, and then come back to that one, because I want to hear what you were saying. I was just thinking about that in the moment... I'm like "Gosh, how do you pay attention to serious applications, or not seri... |
**Anurag Goel:** Yeah, I'll get to that. But the second reason is - of course, we need the money to hire more people. I need to build out a marketing team. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Marketing... |
**Anurag Goel:** Yeah, marketing and sales. We have one -- again, a lot of people might not be interested in Render after hearing this, but we have one account exec. That's it. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** If I was a salesperson who had no job or wanted to transition to a new job, I would kill for that job. You know why? I can make all the money. Or a lot of money, because if you've got one across - I don't even know what your revenue rate is, but I'm sure it's going to grow, being a series C... Well,... |
**Anurag Goel:** Yeah, but the thing is, most people who use Render never need to or want to talk to sales. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Sad. I mean, happy, but sad. |
**Anurag Goel:** Sad for the salesperson, yeah. \[laughs\] |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Well, I think that's the way to go, right? You want to have that sort of on-demand to the application developer. That's the way they think. An application developer is not going to want to sit down with somebody. However, sometimes they're going to need to convince other people, and that's where the... |
**Anurag Goel:** Yeah. And we have a sales engineer. Also just one sales engineer. So I think part of it is just there are people who just want to talk to someone, like you said. And it might not even be to legitimize it to anyone else, it would just be for their own comfort. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** A real email address, a real person. |
**Anurag Goel:** Yeah, a real person. They want to get on a Zoom call. They want to make sure that they hear from someone how things are going to go... And then they have this person's contact now, and if things don't go well, this is a person they call. And so there is that level of human interaction that a lot of peo... |
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