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FWSY - starting levain
I am fairly new to bread baking, and have slowly been working my way through FWSY. I am about to start making my first levain and have a few questions:I understand from the book that once I have a mature levain, it can be maintained using smaller proportions at each feed. My question is, do I nee... | STOP!!!!!!
Before you go down the rabbit hole and attempt Forkish's levain, please - Don't!Forkish has wonderful recipes but his ways are eccentric. Before you know it you'll be swimming in a pool of levain. Have you read the story of the "magic porridge pot"?If you still wish to use his method may I suggest you do a m... |
What am I doing?
Hi there: I used to have a lot of trouble baking sourdough, and eventually, by accident, I figured it out, and am now able to consistently bake a well risen, lightweight, tasty, naturally risen bread.My overall technique differs from everything out there, though, which leads me to wonder what am I mak... | You're doing just fine
Here is a 40% for youhttp://www.thefreshloaf.com//node/15532/miche-pointeàcallièreCompare to Shiao-ping's and check out her blog. It's just the way one looks at building a levain. Building a levain gradually, usually yields a milder tasting crumb. What do you say?What are your temperatures? ... |
How to feed my donated starter
Hello all! This is my first post here, though I’ve been known to spend my time reading a few posts from this awesome community!I have a question for you guys. An amazing baker I know left me some of ther sourdough starter (small quantity, about 30 grams). It was a gift but she wasn’t ther... | Feeding your new starter
I could be wrong but you probably should approach the care and feeding on the premise that it's an established starter since it was a gift from a talented baker. Take half of it and put that half in an air tight plastic storage container. Put that in the refrigerator. Put the other 15 g or so i... |
Using stiff sourdough discard
I am working on a NMNF starter, but currently I have discard of 62.5% hydration to use. I want to make a loaf of bread, but I don't know where to begin. I want to use as much discard as I can. The discard has been refrigerated for about 3 days. If I have a 8stiff sourdough discard at 62.5%... | If it's discard
Then make a yeasted loaf replacing some of the flour and water with the discard. If you're working on a rye starter then keep the starter percentage relatively low otherwise the dough will behave differently. If the weather is cool and you're building a starter from scratch then you might be running int... |
Starter Revival; edited
EDITED to clean up after the copying from MSWord Fiasco.I joined back in November and you were all very helpful while I struggled with getting my starter going - thank you! It did eventually take flight and since then I've watched an embarrassing number of tutorials and baked three or four times... | Excellent news!
I'm impressed that it worked, and that you got it to do so. By the way, did you type your ideas in Word and then paste them here? There's a lot of trash in your post, and that might be the source. You could probably use Notepad or whatever simpler thing, instead of Word, to avoid the random-trash proble... |
What is actually happening between my levain and my dough?
Hi all,I've been using spelt flours (whole and white) and a whole rye starter (mainly at 100%) for nearly my whole sourdough adventure (6+ months and over 150 loaves). I typically like to think about baking from a chemistry perspective, and thought I had a fair... | Read this!
Really good info in there and there is even a paragraph supporting my guess of too much acid load degrading the dough. http://www.sfbi.com/pdfs/NewsF04a.pdf |
Low-hydration (65%) starter sticky problem
I combined 80g of 100%-hydration starter (the seed) and 21g of AP flour to make 101g of 65%-hydration starter (new starter). Of the seed starter, 62% came from a starter I started months ago; the remainder of the seed was from today's refreshing done 1 hour prior to the 65%-hy... | My guess would be
80g of starter + 21g AP flour vs. Just 20% starter in a doughIt's sticky because a starter is normally fermented more so then a dough plus in your 65% hydrated starter you used 380% starter.try building a 65% hydrated starter in the same way as you build a dough...10g starter32-33g water50g flourUnles... |
First Sourdough Bread
First, thank you for the advice for my sourdough starter! It works and today I tried making my first sourdough bread.I used the recipe from the link below:https://www.feastingathome.com/sourdough-bread/#tasty-recipes-35045-jump-targetand halved the recipe, bulked proof it for 6 hours because it's ... | Yes I agree it is under
Yes I agree it is under fermented. I don’t use the poke test for end of bulk, I’m not sure that it is accurate for that. It is much better used to determine the end of final proof and only on warm (not cold retarded) dough. The gumminess is typical for under fermented bread.ProofingTo assess ... |
Commercial mixers and their RPM
I am presently reading Advanced Baking and Pastry by Michel Suas. He makes mention of the desired dough temperature (DDT).I want to know the revolution of a typical commercial mixer at first and second speed. I use an Ankarsrum and I have determined the speeds at different settings. I am... | I agree that RPM ...
...must be meaningful, but I wonder how much practical difference the size, shape, and material of the parts also contribute. (Silly example to prove a silly point: Imagine a huge heavy metal beater and bowl that are cooled by liquid nitrogen; RPM would hardly matter at all.) |
Collapsing starter - not feeding enough? Double in bulk before or after deflation?
Hello gentlefolk,
I have a question about the look-and-feel of a well-maintained sourdough starter. To summarise, at the end of a feed cycle, my starter collapses back to original volume when deflated. I am wondering if I'm doing somet... | That's fine. It's just
That's fine. It's just overproofed and collapsing back down. The airiness or volume of the starter doesn't matter in the least. And since it clearly shows the starter is active and alive, the fact that it's collapsing is a very good sign!
Feeding once very 12 hours should be more than enough. I'd... |
Help this Beginner with His Sourdough Starter! (On Day 8)
Dear Fresh Loaf Folk, I began to-make a sourdough starter on 1/23. Tomorrow, 1/31, will be day-9. For day-1, my recipe instructed me to mix 100g of filtered, room-temp water and 100g of AP flour. For day-2, the recipe said to "discard all but 100g of starter,"... | Your mistake was not a bad one
In fact it might have been beneficial for helping the PH level of the starter to become acidic. Better than the common mistake of over feeding in the vain attempt of speeding things up.If your starter is showing activity then now might be the time to change your procedure. In order to str... |
Sourdough - bought a 150ml 'mother'... What next?
Hi all, I am a crumpet maker in London trying to diversify my range and offer sourdough which I have never worked with before.Today I received a 150ml container of sourdough mother. There were limited instructions on the container starting to feed it with an additional ... | You're fine
If you store it room temperature, you will have to feed it every day. The only rule is BE CONSISTENT. Feed the same quantities of cold water and strong white bread flour. Here is a good tutorial: https://search.kingarthurflour.com/baking/Sourdough-Starter-InstructionsEstablish a routine that works for y... |
Basic White Sourdough
This is the basic white sour I've been making regularly. Probably pretty similar to the Tartine formula but I haven't actually looked at that formula in a long while so it may be a touch different. This post is going to be pretty photo heavy so everyone can follow along and see if there are plac... | Are you kidding?
Those are amazing! Is there a reason for yeast and sourdough?Keep on baking. Carole |
From Emmanuel Hadjiandreou's...
"How To Make Bread". We have a Chocolate Sourdough with Currants and a Tomato Sourdough. Two lovely recipes which are delicious. Sweet currants compliment the pure cocoa and a lovely combination of tomato, rosemary and nigella seeds with olive oil. | I just recently purchased this book,
to donate to my local library, which doesn't have even one book on Sourdough. I'd like to check out a couple of recipes before turning it over to them. Do you have any favorites? Thanks, marybeth |
Sourdough Starter - Ready or Not???
Hello baking world! My apologies for coming so late to the baking game.I come to this site, new to bread baking, and I’m starting with Sourdough due to the needs of gluten intolerant family members who are able to tolerate sourdough breads.I have a question for those of you with muc... | Frank, You aren't missing anything
and seems like you have a nice starter. Imho, it's too soon for that nice sour odor. Mine took a long time b/f it smelled sour. How long?.... sorry I have no idea. I was able to bake bread with it, but of course it wasn't all that sour. It was likely 3 + months b/f mine was sour ... |
Ear troubleshooting (and dough sticking to banneton)
In the image, you can see the two loaves from my latest batch. The loaf in the back formed a good ear, whereas the one in the front did not. I've been getting a good ear maybe half of the time, the other half it looks something like the loaf in the front. What can... | your loaves look wonderful
That top loaf looks perfect to me. Took me a long time until I got scoring right. Really a long time. Are you using steam?My dough also used to stick. I now use a combination of white flour and rice flour and rub it into the interstices of the bannetons I use. It took me a while until they... |
1st Time Share- White Sourdough
Hi all! I've been following this group for a few months, and wanted to first thank you all for the amazing treasure trove of resources and advice. I started taking bread more seriously around March 2018, and just started baking sourdough 3 or 4 months ago. I wanted to share this recipe a... | Good bake!
Hi lilgarbanzobean! Welcome! I'm a bit new here myself but have been passively following the action for a while, just like you have done until now. The loaf looks fantastic! I love the shallow scoring that allowed for some artful decoration. As for the crumb, believe that the stretch and folds for produce a ... |
Help with very little bloom...
I am very happy with my light rye loaves however I am getting very little bloom (it seems that the score opening is cooking too quick and sealing before it has a chance to really open up!). recipe is;100g dark rye flour400g white wheat flour375g water100g leaven (rye/wheat and passes floa... | If possible, please send an
If possible, please send an image of the crumb. A common issue with lack of bloom/oven spring is over fermentation.Dan |
Starter only has tiny bubbles and not rising
Hi, this is my first time making sourdough starter. Started my starter seven days ago. I went with 60g whole wheat & 60g water, then I discard half and fed it with 60g bread flour (bleached because it's hard to buy unbleached flour here). On the second day it doubled, but th... | I think a basic rule of thumb
I think a basic rule of thumb is not to feed it if it does not respond. In a layman term, it means the yeasts are not consuming (if they are there at all) so don't feed them more food until they are hungry and ready to produce gas. Bacteria could be consuming the food without producing CO2... |
RE-ACTIVATING STARTER
Hi All - I'm new to sourdough and this site. I have a starter which has been in the fridge for about 4 months. I took it out today, and there was a bit of hooch on top, but also a gelatinous disk. I threw this out! Did I make an error? Have I thrown out the mother?? I've started feeding the st... | Observe...
...how it reacts over the next few days. Don't panic. Don't suddenly make a lot of other changes. Just watch and wait. Worst possible is having to start again, and having to start again isn't that bad. But don't just decide to start again - first, patiently observe. |
An old 'The food programme' about sourdough
https://bbc.in/2MB2gfcSheila Dillon finds out why sourdough bread is undergoing a major revival. It is the world's oldest leaven bread dating back to Ancient Egypt and it is now experiencing a renaissance. Baker Dan de Gustibus explains how the bread is made from a sourdough ... | Dan de Gustibus?
With a name like that, I guess nobody is allowed to argue with him, or about him, or something. Must be nice to be him. ? |
First time share - Question about crust
Hello, I am still new to sourdough, but I noticed on the last two of my bakes, the bottom crust of the loaves comes out so hard, it is a struggle to cut through it!I use a pre-heated 450 degree oven, cold bake in a non-preheated enamel pot. Bake for 50 minutes. The loaves are ver... | Welcome, Monica!
I’m not sure this will solve your problem, but it may be worth a try. Try preheating the pot before loading the dough.Are you baking the bread near the middle of the oven? If baked near the bottom of the oven, that might be an issue.If you have a thermometer bake until the middle of the crumb is 205 - ... |
Calculating nutrition for sourdough starter
hello! I am a bit new to this, but I use myfitnesspal.com to calculate my recipes. you insert the ingredients and put in the servings and fitnesspal provides you with calories, fat, fiber, carbs, protein, ect. However, I am still not sure how to put in sourdough starter in my... | The problem with nutrition caluculations
of starters, which is that it is always changing and alive. Water is evaporating, CO2 is being released, ethanol acids and other compounds are being created, mass is being metabolized creating energy, enzymes are creating sugars from starches and who knows what else is going on... |
Experiment wrong = result good!
I had not baked sourdough for a few months so I refreshed my starter a few times then tried a little experiment! I usually keep just a rye starter but during the refresh process I decided to feed two versions, one pure white, the other pure wholemeal rye.My plan then was to make one loa... | How do you manage
to get big holes in your breads. In mine the holes are always small. |
Starter contaminated?
I keep my sourdough starter in fridge - and even if it's not fed for a few months it always comes back quickly when I start feeding it again. However this time after not baking for a while I noticed that I hadn't shut the lid off in the jar properly and when I looked at the starter the top layer w... | If you leave it on the
If you leave it on the counter for a while (like a couple days) does it go sour again? (This will bring up the lactobacillus population.) If not, start over. |
My first sourdough- please critique
He's the crumb shot of my first sourdough loaf! I had so much fun making it and it tasted great. I think there's much room for improvement though and looking for some advice.Why the big air bubbles at top? Also, it was slightly gummy/shiny inside. Does that mean it's over proofed or ... | Shiny and...
...and gummy, are not the same thing, nor do they need to happen together. A sort of shine inside can simply come from well-developed gluten. But then again, there's probably more than one kind of shine. ? Since you say you used the recipe as close as you could, what changes did you have to make? Some chan... |
Question on Rye Starter
I have, for the last 3 years, been keeping a rye starter from a KAF Rye bread class somewhat alive but not sure I am doing the best for it.I have religiously kept 1/3 by weight of the old starter and added back in 1/3 water 1/3 whole grain Rye {Hodgson Mills} and it rises somewhat in about 10 ho... | Several Questions
Does it raise bread?When is the starter going back into the fridge? After a feeding? After the first peak? How does the starter taste before and immediately after feeding? (Try to add enough flour and water so that it tastes like wet flour.)most important... What temp is the starter? I would use... |
A question on levain percentages
Consider a levain that is 100% hydration. If I added 200g of that levain to 1kg of flour, would the percentage of levain be 20% or 18%?Levain proportion can also be expressed as percentage of prefermented flour. In the above example, would the percentage of prefermented flour be 10% or ... | Levain is flour and water
So 20%. If we're talking about prefermented flour then one should state this is what they're talking about as a levain is not just flour. |
A useful Q&A video for sourdough
I like Patrick Ryan, here is a rather useful video with a few tips that might help some ....... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0CvE0jK0-4 | And another one :)
This one might help a few beginners too :) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTAiDki7AQA |
Extending Retard?
Hi, All!I've been following The Perfect Loaf's Spelt Sourdough Bread recipe (85% hydration), and it turned out amazingly! Now, as for schedule limitations, I was wondering if I could extend the proof/retard stage - which is now overnight - by 24 hours. Overall, the original recipe calls for:Morning - ... | Longer bulk fermentation
Hi Arnon,love the bold color and bet it smells amazing.I think the crumb ( and crust) would improve with a longer bulk fermentation. What you called “rest” above. It’s almost there, just a bit more time before shaping. What about :overnight - build levainmorning- autolyse, mix, restmid afternoo... |
Raisins yeast water - now what?
Hello everyone!I'm in the process of making my very first yeast water. I started last Saturday and today all the raisins were floating and if you shake the container you can see lots of tiny bubbles going up. It smells fruity, maybe a tab alcoholic. I'd like to make an artisan loaf but I... | Type raisin yeast water ...
... or similar (e.g. apple yeast water) into the search box and you will be spoilt for choice as to your next steps; good luck! |
My sourdough has lost its mojo
I baked bread for the first time in over a month. I was busy baking cakes, bars, and mochi for various social gatherings and for a retreat at my Zen center.Aagh! Two failure-to-rise loaves. I had disregarded the scribbled note at the bottom of my printed out recipe (kept in a binder near ... | You need to explain
how you keep your starter and how you get it ready for making bread. And yes, you can use dense bread for bread pudding. I am making bread pudding right now with a spiced cranberry raisin loaf that got forgotten in the freezer. It had dried out quite a bit when I thawed it so bread pudding it is! |
Sourdough population
]I have started using sourdough starter lately and I find it fascinating..I have made delicious breads with it;https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OxN887AFzuUhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LOGh85smSx4 It seem to started awfully good with my sourdough starter, mixing 40 gr' Whole Wheat flour with 10gr'... | When making a starter
It's usual for the starter to show a lot of activity in days 1-3 or 4 and then it can slow down or even go quiet. You mention that your starter was ready in 3 to 4 days and made good bread but now your starter has slowed down. What one normally has to do is "ride the storm" (or quiet in the this c... |
over stretched in first bulk proof period?
Hello all, I need advice. I’ve been baking sourdough bread for a year with some success. Tonight I was preparing my favorite bread from Josey Baker, seed feast. I usually have no problem with this bread but this time after the stretch and fold and maybe little longer then norm... | It sounds like your dough may
It sounds like your dough may have degraded. The gluten may have broken down. Did you increase the percentage of starter/levain or maybe it fermented at warmer temperatures.Just a thought.Dan |
Converting from wet to firm sourdough starter
I am a newbie, having just been feeding my new sourdough starter for a few weeks. I came across a recipe that discussed using a firm starter/levain, which is less messy to deal with once or twice a day. How do I convert mine to the less liquidy form? | The next time you feed it,
The next time you feed it, add more flour than water. Say you have a 100% hydration starter, and you normally feed at 1:2:2. That would mean you would normally take 10 grams of starter, add 20 grams of water, and 20 grams of flour - leaving you with 50 grams of starter, 25 of those grams ... |
What do you suggest as a cover for cultures?
I used to cover my culture with a loosely fastened paper towel which had the advantage of letting air and evaporation pass. I switched to a loose silicon cover, which lets air pass, since it's loose, but retains evaporation, so my culture doesn't dry so much (its sitting on ... | Cover for Culyure
I keep mine in a 6 oz, plastic jar with a plastic cover and I keep it in the refrigerator. I refresh it at two week intervals. I am not saying my method is better, just that it suits me.Ford |
Too cold to get my starter going
Hey guys, been trying to get my starter going for over a week with no success. Following the NMNF recipe, using 100% rye flour and spring water. But realized my house was way too cold after re-reading many posts here.I live in Montreal where it's been around -20C/-4F outside for the pas... | I have, at times, used all of the following:
Oven with a candle in itOven with a hot water bottle in itHeating padTop of the fridge at the backIn the airing cupboard, by the hot water tankAt the back of my stoveOn a shelf above the radiatorA friend's oven with pilot lightI have also packed my starter with bubble wrap a... |
MASSIVE holes through entire loaf
Hi all, Been having this issue with my loaves for a while now and can't seem to get past it. It wasn't an issue until about a month or two ago and ever since then I have struggled to avoid this issue. I have thought it to be under proofing, over proofing, improper shaping, but no matte... | p.s. I incorporate the salt
p.s. I incorporate the salt during the S&F's |
Maximum chlorine levels for starter?
Our city water is good, with chlorine about 0.6ppm, but it seems to kill my white starter, so I use a chlorine filter. Does anyone have an idea the maximum level of chlorine that should be used with starter? | Have you tried...
... running some water the night before, and letting it sit in the refrigerator overnight until time to use it? That might be enough for the majority of the chlorine to escape. |
A kind of mould is growing on top of my sourdough
My sourdough is covered with a thin layer of what looks like mould. Each day when I feed it I incorporate the mould but is it healthy? I use wholemeal seeded flour. | Discard it
And start a new one.That kind of mould is not healthy unfortunately.You can also ask a friend to give you a bit of their starter or ask for some in a bakery if you don't want to start a new one from scratch.But definitely get rid of that one you've got :) |
A Simple Sourdough
Here is a simple sourdough recipe with compliments from Vanessa at www.bakerybits.co.ukFrom their "Sourdough Special" Vanessa was asked... "Is there an easy recipe to get me going"?To which she replied... "Yes! See my overnight sourdough recipe" This is a common topic on these forums, when someone is... | Just lovely.. Is that your loaf?
The scoring is wonderful. I wish my oven was here so I could bake that.I note that the salt is just 1%, which I like. We use way too much salt here. I read that in France the commercial bakeries are not legally permitted to use more than 1.5% salt. 1% is even better, imho.Great job.h... |
So disappointed. Flat again!
So disappointed. Flat again!I really wanted the Ken Forkish Overnight Country Blond to work. But, alas, I think it fell prey to overproofing or at least that’s how it seems. It didn’t pass the “finger-dent” test just before baking. Didn’t spring back when poked. Dough was damp and sticky. T... | Sadly, people use hours instead of
volume with Forkish recipes where is time are way, way off for bulk and final proof and that is what you get- flat loaves with no spring. They also use his levain builds which are also really crazy. |
How to make non-sourdough?
Hi everybody! I have been making bread at home in the past two years and now experimenting a lot with sourdough. As much as I love the concept, my family apparently does not. For them, the bread is too sour and in general has some unwanted taste. I tried 100% starters and 60% starters, I trie... | Use commercial yeast.
Simple. That's exactly why commercial yeast exists. No use compromising, just switch. And continue to make enough sourdough to keep yourself happy as well. There's nothing special, superior, or noble, about sourdough. |
On top my sourdough starter
Hi, i have 7 days old starter and there is a layer of hairy, velvet-like on top. When i touch it, it doesn’t stick to my finger. I tried to discard it but then after 24 hours it appears again. This start to happened at day 4. My starter rise almost double in size in 12-18 hours. It smell nic... | That sounds like mold...
None if my starters have ever done that. I would start over making sure that what I used was sterilized by placing in boiling water or a dishwasher. Next time, in addition to the above, I suggest you use pineapple juice for the first two feedings. That drops the pH and helps things get to the r... |
compacted dough in wholemeal sourdough
I wondered if anyone has any ideas about this one. I've been upping the hydration to 100% on an 80% WM sourdough with generally good results. The dough is much less dense and very moist and springy, BUT I am getting a little line of compacted under proofed/baked dough as can be se... | with the higher hydration
Have you had to reduce the fermentation times? How does the outside crust colour compare to earlier loaves? The crumb looks like it is falling or compacting above the bottom crust. Why? Overproofed or underdeveloped gluten matrix comes to mind. Might be helpful to see the whole crust crum... |
Sourdough Critique, please.
New to the forum. New to sourdough. We baked these loaves yesterday and made mistakes along the way. The pleasure is already present and the first loaf is very pleasant to eat. (Maybe I'm just happy it wasn't total garbage!) I followed a recipe for Beginners Sourdough from The Perfect Loaf.... | First of all
A one week old starter is young! It'll continue to improve over the coming weeks. Having said that you have produced a lovely loaf with such a young starter. You did well to watch the dough and not the clock. A lovely thin crust and a nice crumb. Height can be because of the high hydration which makes it m... |
How much dough for 5 qt. Cast Iron
I just bought a Lodge 5 quart double dutch cast iron oven. It's a little less that 10 inches in diameter. I'm thinking that I'd like to use the shallow part for the bottom of the DO and the deeper part for the top. That way I can easily drop the dough into the shallow part and easily ... | Sounds like a good plan
I have a 4 qt dutch oven and to get close to filling it up I need a batch of dough made from 4 cups of flour. I use a lot of whole grain so I may not get quite the volume of a white bread but still, to fill up a five quart dutch oven I think it's going to take 5 cups of flour. My dough is too sl... |
Are sourdough starters exchangeable with different bread recipes?
Hello all, I'm new to baking bread but having been baking almost daily for the last ten days and have benefited greatly already from this site. I have been baking straight doughs and ones with pre-ferments and have been fairly successful. I... | You need to check out the No Fuss No Muss
starter from Dabrownman on this site. Basically, it is a very thick starter that lives in the fridge. When you want to make bread, you take a small quantity and feed that in stages until you have enough for your recipe. Usually 3-4 stages will do it. This way, there is no waste... |
Starter,Levain, Maturity and Percentage
Hi there folks, im fairly new in the sourdough baking. Im baking for roughly one year now. And i have became very upset with my result at baking with sourdough. My starter is one years old. I saw some people use levain and some just throw the starter in the mix(TrevorJay) but i k... | Hi Viktor
Welcome. I am far from and expert, but I will tell you what I do. Your questions in order:(1). I always feed my starter before using it to make bread dough. Twice at least>(2) Let's say I need 100 gm of levain. I will make 130 - 135 b/c some sticks to jar. So in the morning I might take out 15 gms and ... |
Good but not perfect
i just finished my second time of baking the double loaf recipe of Maurizio’s Beginner Sourdough. Better than the first try but it was good too. I followed his directions with oven thermometers, dough temp measurements, a proofer that kept everything at 78, exact gram weighing, identical starte... | Pictures of good not perfect
Maybe pics would help. The one on the left slopes a bit. The one on the right was put in a wider basket. Think that’s why it’s shorter. Seems like they could be a little higher too.
58FEE0EB-24A7-4D9F-8829-D3983EFF8AFB.jpeg
66D4826C-C8ED-4803-BAF0-5242053F4CB4.jpeg |
Fresh milled. 100% whole grain. Flat loaf.
I had my first very flat loaf this morning and am wondering what went wrong. Changed a lot of inputs: 15% fresh milled rye. 85% fresh milled red fife. 10% prefermented levain, NMNF rye.Starter was retarded 40 hours after near doubling after 3rd feeding. Starter fed at 32c to p... | difficult recipe
90% hydration and 100% whole wheat is a difficult recipe to properly proof and shape. I am on a mission to pull it off, but, haven't had much success yet.In my opinion, your loaves look like they had one of the following two problems or both:The dough was not handled well enough to produce enough elast... |
High Fermentation/Proof Temp Needed w/ Rye Starter
I need to bulk ferment and proof at 85℉ in the B & T proofer to get anywhere near the timings in the B & T manual (Country Sourdough) or in Hamelman's Bread (Pain au Levain with Whole Wheat). The formulas have DDT's around 76℉ but I don't get the fermentation/proofing... | I know others here have great
I know others here have great experience with rye starters and hopefully they can help you out. I personally struggled with a rye starter and switched to white flour. I’ve had much more success.With my rye starter, I would feed 1:5:5 and wait for it to double before re-feeding. In hind ... |
Gluten Strength
What part of the procedure most affects the sourdough structure; autolayse, mixing/kneading; S&F, hydration, proving, etc? Example: I’ve made what appears to be a very good 80% hydration dough. Used 80% hydration starter as welll. Autolayse (without salt) about an hour. Pretty standard stuff from there.... | 80% hydration is very high
Can you send pictures so we can see. And your recipe? And what type flour you are using>I've been baking with help from this site for about 3-4 years and the only time I did that high a hydration was with a Danish Roggenbrot. 80% is very high for a white flour and imho only very experienced... |
Need some help incorporating my starter
Im new to this and I think I need some help please.I have made a 100% hydration starter (50/50 Flour and water). It is alive and well, living in the fridge. It's bubbly, it smells nutty with a hint of wine or vinegar. A spoonful of it floats in water.I have made Bertinets basic l... | Flour
You wrote that Bertinet’s recipe has 500 g flour to 350 g water.In your recipe it looks like you have 350 + 50 or 400 g flour.Did I misread something? Should it be 450 + 50 for flour? |
The more I know the less I know
Hi All I have been baking bread for a few months now and after reading advice on here I have created my starter My plan was to make a sourdough loaf after reviewing advice and recipes, with the thoughts of autolyse, etc in my head , however I have been given Andrew Mortons , Brilliant Br... | There are a million ways
to make bread. I suggest you try one method a few times, and if you don’t like what you get, try something else. It is best though if you stick to the same recipe and just change one thing at a time. Did I ever do that? I have to admit no! ? But the results always taste good even if it might no... |
Critique my first Tartine country loaf
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Hi everyone, I was hoping to get some feedback on the first Tartine country loaf I have baked from some more experienced bakers. Pretty happy with the result! The bottom of the crumb is a little bit denser than I would like... | Nothing wrong with that loaf!
You were smart to keep the hydration low until you get the hang of this. Many people have struggled because of the hydration but you nailed it! Lovely loaf! |
sourdough fermentation
does anyone know why this happened to my sourdough loaf? | See this thread for ideas...
http://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/58512/sourdough-what-did-i-do-wrong |
I am looking for some help troubleshooting a sourdough loaf/upping my game!
Hello fresh loaf! I am pretty new to baking proper bread - I started making the classic Jim Lahey no-knead bread halfway through last year, and after experimenting with various commercial yeast preferements I have started the new year with a re... | looks like a shaping issue to me
The only problem, to my eyes, is a shaping one. It's not over fermented, or under mixed....it's just not well-shaped. Think of shaping as your last chance to make an impact on the dough. Don't be afraid to handle a slack/high high hydration dough. That big fat bubble in your crust n... |
Recipe gave me bread with uncooked dough in middle.. Please help troubleshoot?
Evening all. Just cut into a bread that I baked earlier today and I am flabbergasted as to what went wrong.I followed this recipe: 700g flour (100 spelt, 100 sprouted wheat, 500 white) 550g h20 125g starter 18g salt4 hours bulk ferment with ... | The malt could certainly have
The malt could certainly have done that, but if you have a 1400 g loaf and bake it straight from the fridge, then one hour bake may be insufficient. I have not baked breads this big in quite a while, but my records tell me of 75-80 min bakes, with room temperature proof. |
Retarding and oven spring
I usually retard my loafs overnight at around 42F, and I get decent results. Recently I've been playing around with room temperature final proofs, and seem to get bigger oven spring with a room temp proof. I wonder if my yeast strain takes a while to "wake up" if it is cold. Perhaps some strai... | Your loaves might be overproofing
while in the fridge. I keep my fridge at 38F and with about 11% prefermented flour, I get my best oven spring at 9-10 hours of retardation. As soon as I go longer than that, I notice a clear difference. So you are probably catching your loaves at a better stage of proofing when you do ... |
Experiment: Non-Traditional Starters from Scratch (Probiotics, Honey, Thyme)
Sourdough Starters Hello everyone!I’m brand new to cultivating starters from scratch, and this website has been a wealth of fantastic information. I’ve read a number of Debra Wink’s very informative posts about the different LAB bacteria and t... | .
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Hi from Toronto
Hi all, I've been reading through quite a bit and you all have been a great help so far. I've got a million questions but here I'll start with one having to do with using the starter and how much to use... So I've made a starter (pineapple solution = #1, came together nicely and I've got some activity t... | Patrick, first, remember
Patrick, first, remember that for every question about sourdough, you can get many different answers. Second, I don't know enough about Canadian flour, but for US flour, we look for similar signs to see when bulk fermentation and final proofing are done as we would with commercial yeast. S... |
Strange behavior
Hi there, I wanted your insights on something very strange I'm noticing with my starter - Starting the bulk by mixing the starter and the water then adding the flour (instead of adding the starter after an autolyze) doesn't work for me, the fermentation stalls and only reach proper pH after it's too ... | Are you saying that you
think something is going on in the autolyse preventing the sourdough starter from breaking down the protein matrix when compared to starter added directly Into flour and water without an autolyse?What is the pH of the autolyse before and after the flour has "soaked?" |
Acetic vs. Lactic Flavor
My latest endeavor is learning to bake a sourdough bread that heavily favors the Lactic Acid flavor. In an effort to achieve this goal I have baked about 2 dozen loaves back to back and often 5 or so days a week. I’ve come to some conclusions.For me, it is informative to read that a certain met... | I am learning a lot
from your posts so keep it up! Question though: What is your percentage of Pre-fermented flour? I am impressed that you are doing 17 hour bulk ferments! Not that I plan to start doing that! I spend enough time as it is with sprouting, milling, sifting, and toasting, not to mention the bulk phase. |
New toy
Hi Baker's,I recently received a new toy, a cloche baking dome. I got it because it is better designed to put the dough into than my large iron casserole. Should I, do you, preheat it (lid and all) before putting in the dough (that has come form the fridge) in it? I just don't seem to get as much spring as I d... | Which one did you get? The
Which one did you get? The different manufacturers have different suggestions. I believe Emille Henry says it is okay to put their cloche directly into a hot oven, some others say you need to avoid thermal shock, and suggest it be put into a cold oven. Some here preheat the cloche in th... |
Preferred method of baking? Dutch oven v out on a stone?
Made 2 sourdough loaves this morning from same batch of dough and baked the 2 loaves using different methods. The dough is tartins country loaf, 77% hydration with 10% blend of ww/ryeOne did overnight proof in a banneton basket and the other in a pyrex cassarole ... | I was expecting the opposite
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Defiant Starter
Its been over 2 weeks now and I have gone through 5 starters in an attempt to make a sourdough with no luck. I only have access to white lily bread flour which is what I have been using. I have been mixing 70g flour with 70mL water, and feeding once every 24hrs. I have been keeping the temp around 72... | Helping out your starter
While these tips won't guarantee that you will get the 800 pound gorilla among all starters, they've proven to help my efforts. First, consider your water. If you're using tap water or filtered water from a fridge, buy a jug of spring water, not distilled water, at your local Walmart or superma... |
My 5th sourdough bake.. getting better
First post.. and firstly i have to say that there is so much helpful content here which has helped me get up and running. This morning i baked a few loafs which im very happy with, i feel im starting to make good progress. I would love a more open crumb but i think its down to my... | Great looking bread, Anthony!
Great looking bread, Anthony! Glad you decided to post.Dan |
85% Hydration Starter?
Hi Everyone I have another question about starter hydration! Can some one explain to me in painful detail how one would go about changing their 100% hydration starter (I feed my 50 grams of starter 50 grams water and 50 grams flour). How much starter do I start with to convert my 100% hydration s... | Easy
For every 100g flour you'll need 85g flour for an 85% hydration starter.To make this really simple all you'll need to do is the following... Take 40g of your 100% hydration starter (which is 20g water + 20g flour)and feed that with 65g water + 80g flour.Allow that to mature and use 150g in your recipe.You'll have ... |
French Culinary Institute book
The book is called Fundamental Techniques of Classic Bread Baking.The book's recipes use a starter (levain) at 125% hydration. My starter is 100% hydration. I am assuming that I can change it to 125%. If my refresh is 4 oz starter and 4 oz of flour, then I would multiply 4 oz x 125% whi... | You can change it to anything you like
within reason. Your formulation is correct. You do want it to ferment fully before using it, but adding water or reducing water is how you change hydration, obviously.A note: Higher hydration favors lactic acid where lower hydration increases acetic acid. Lactic is 'sweeter' so if... |
How much Starter should be used for Bread
The Night before Baking I make a Leaven with 1 Tbsp of my Rye Starter.I use this formula.500g of Flour and from that I use 20% which is 100g which I divide by 2 , which is 2x 50.I use 50 g of that for Flour and 50g for the Water.I mix it and let it sit over Night, it will be ni... | I'm sorry, Petra
but I don't understand exactly what you do. Consequently, I assume you mix 1 tablespoon of your rye stater (approximately 14g) with 50g of Water and 50g of Flour, and let it ferment overnight. I've no idea what you do the other 50g of flour. If that's correct then you are using 10% of the "final dough ... |
King Arthur classic starter questions
I bough the KA classic starter and it is now on its 2nd day. Since it was a 1 oz starter, could I assume it was 0.5 oz flour and 0.5 oz water? Would that make it 50% hydration?I have just read posts here that said it is not a good idea to use the discard of a starter. Does that mea... | Equal amounts of
Equal amounts of flour and water by weight makes it 100% hydration. You only say it's a 1 oz starter. Does the packet/package with with more specs or instructions? When you get a starter you need to carry on the process of feeding it to bring it back to good health before using. This will involve some ... |
Time baking vs temperature of bread
Which is most important? The amount of time baking that the recipe calls for OR the temperature my MK4 gives me? I assumed that they would both be close. Every sourdough boule I bake seems to reach the internal temperature quickly, and I still have 15-20 minutes left on my timer. No ... | Time over temperature. A
Time over temperature. A temperature reading is only that - how hot is the dough. I thought Martin Philip gives a great concise comment on this in his book: "Baking loaves reach 190F or 'done' just tho-thirds of the way through baking. I promise that the bread is not even close to done." I th... |
Sourdough schedule help
Hello all. Long time reader, first time poster.I am a culinary teacher at a local high school in Ontario Canada. We do all hands on classes and some of that hands on covers sourdough breads. On of the fundraisers we do is a sourdough clubPeople pay in advance and for a number of weeks they r... | Similar schedule
Hi De,Every week, I bake a 60% whole wheat, naturally leavened hearth bread (miche) on a schedule remarkably similar to yours. For what it's worth, here's mine:Day 1: Serially refresh starter: 1st, early morning, 2nd, early afternoon and 3rd, before bed for overnight growth. The last one over-matures... |
Convection Oven and Steam
I know convection is more efficient but I wonder if it vents the steam more as circulation occurs. I have switched from Dutch oven to just using a stone with steam generated by a pan of lava rocks. Great results although now I have to be careful not to burn the bread! My first attempt was yest... | Convection after steam
In a word, yes. Decidedly different results would be expected if convection were used during steaming, compared to applying convection after steaming, or not using it at all. Think about it: the primary purpose of steaming a bread oven is to keep the surface of the dough moist and extensible so... |
Experiment - Any thoughts?
Been working on my sourdough for a while now, and I'm making some pretty darn good loaves. But a friend of mine recently brought me a loaf of Boudin's from San Fran and it seems my "San Francisco style" sourdough is no where near as sour as it should be. Everything else was pretty spot on as ... | Required reading
http://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/1040/lesson-squeeze-more-sour-your-sourdoughThere are other discussions on how to achieve more sourness (use the Search tool) but this should get you closer to your goal. Let me offer a gentle challenge to your notion that a sourdough bread “should” be really, really so... |
Need advice on bulk ferment for sourdough
Levain40g starter80g WW80g H2ODough374g Bread Flour55g WW Flour25g Rye350g H2O9g salt92g LevainI've been at this off and on for a year, and make a decent sourdough like the one shown. But I'm baffled by my bulk rise, and hope someone can help me figure it out.So my starter and ... | That is puzzling
Your levain is 20%. You're bulk fermenting at 75-80°F and it's taking 8-12 hours!?For me 4-6 hours at around 70°F on average. Perhaps it's more to do with recognising when it's done. A dough doesn't have to necessarily double. You want to look for an aerated dough with a good matrix of bubbles. Then on... |
English muffins using sourdough discard and ripe sourdough
The first sourdough English muffins I tried turned out perfectly, except they were a little floury on the outside. The next recipe I tried didn't turn out so well. They were a cross between a hard roll and a biscuit. I rolled the dough out to 1/2", but these th... | First thought
what is your idea of an English muffin? Despites speaking English, many English speaking countries vary in the definition of "muffin." Then get the right recipe for the right "muffin."For example my E-muffins are made in a hot frying pan (with or without ring forms) flipping them over to brown. Not bake... |
Help with Sourdough Troubleshooting
I've been baking sourdough for a couple of years now and the inconsistent results are killing me. I've been following TPL's Best Sourdough Recipe or Beginner's Sourdough with great results sometimes, and horrible pancake-y overproofed loaves other times — most recently my loaves have... | Can't see anything wrong per se in the method
But link doesn't show photo of the bread. See many other photos but non of the loaf. |
Why did this happen
Hi, So I've taken a step back from sourdough and baking in general lately so just wanted to get some advice as to why this might have happened. The dough is 75% hydration mostly strong white flour with about 50g of wholemeal. Autolysed with slightly warm water as its cold at the moment. Bulk ferment... | Kitchen Temperature?
"My initial loaves were brilliant, then the crust completely pulled away from the rest of the loaf ...."In The Bread Baker's Apprentice (a great book, by the way), Peter Reinhart observes with regard to instant yeast that "Yeast will double its rate of fermentation for every increase of 17 degrees ... |
Gluten rich flour for feeding?
So I've read that you can feed the starter with any kind of flower. But if I feed it with a flour that has low gluten, doesn't that mean that my dough will have lower gluten vs. if I feed it with rich gluten flour (the same type I use for the dough)? | For me, feeding a starter
with a lot of gluten is a waste. The gluten deteriorates in the starter becoming a sticky muck (think overfermented dough) and the starter is more interested in the carbohydrates and trace minerals than the protein. Sure it may raise the overal gluten level but what kind of gluten quality ar... |
Another beauty
Still getting pretty good results in the Dutch oven. I'm using the tartine recipe with a little added rye flour.
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IMG_20181222_090023.jpg | Good results, indeed!
That is some lovely bread. Paul |
Help me refrain from slicing my first sourdough loaf!
It's coming out of the oven in about 15 minutes from the time I'm typing this sentence -- unless the crust isn't dark enough, or the interior temperature not high enough.Tell me why it's so harmful to a loaf of bread to slice it before it has (almost?) thoroughly co... | It's still baking
When you take it out of the oven it's still baking. The flavour also continues to improve. Even more so a day or two later but at least wait until it's cooled. |
Sourdough starter experiment with probiotic capsule
I just started experimenting with probiotic capsules containing heterofermentative bacteria. After the first 12 hours of waiting, I fed them again.Here Ingredients:Lactobacillus Acidophilus 3,0 Billion CFUBifidobacterium Longum 2,5 Billion CFUBifidobacter... | I'm feeding them with whole
I'm feeding them with whole wheat flour. |
1st dough fermentation - Panettone
Can I seek some advise from the panettone expert out there?1) Should the 1st dough fermentation be strictly 12hr or just need to triple in volume even if its take less than 12hr?2) What will happen if ferment for more than 12hr and it's its dough is deflated?Would appreciate if you co... | Mine doesn't rise
Sorry to hijack your thread, but I'm also currently waiting for my 1st dough fermentation. After 8 hours it doesn't look like it's risen much at all (and last time I used this recipe it hadn't risen after 24 hours), do you think I could add yeast for the 2nd fermentation if it's still not rising?The r... |
Need help with high hydration dough proofing
I have been baking bread for over a year and occasionally have the problem that once taking 80% dough out of the proofing basket – it deflates. Many times the dough somehow keeps itself during pre-shaping and shaping, but it looks like it is losing its structure while sittin... | I am about the last one to
I am about the last one to offer much help, but it sounds like over proofing to me. The basket helps the dough hold its structure so when you take it out, and it does not have that help, it collapses. That would also make sense when you are using a high percentage of starter, since it will ... |
Changes when mixing sun flower seeds
I'd like to mix sun flower seeds into the dough. Are there any changes to the recipe / preparation? E.g. hydration. Should I pour them into the mixer in the last minute of the mix or put them in when shaping? | No changes, and you can mix
No changes, and you can mix them at any time. |
The illusive cracking crust...how?
I just can't make it happen!!Everything else is perfect, shape, taste, texture, rise in the oven even.I slash it, spray it, have extra steam in the oven, it rises and cooks beautifully but the slashes just don't 'open'.Maybe I should just be happy with my delicious loaf of sourdough -... | Have you tried turning off
Have you tried turning off the fan assist to see if your results are different? If you are unable to turn off the fan assist, try cooking the bread in a cover vessel. Your bread is very nice...Dan |
Hydration
Can someone get me close to that % hydration I would have given some of these details. I starter with a starter that was 100% but over time my feeding have come to this: 1/2 up starter1/2 cup water1/2 cup AP flour1/2 cup whole wheat...... is this still 100%. it is a stiff starter now compared to what I starte... | Let's roughly convert to grams
Knowing ingredients in weight is the only sure way to know.1 cup flour = "about" 120g - 125g1 cup water = 236g 1/2 cup starter ?1/2 cup water = 118g1 cup flour = 120g - 125gSo I'd say if this is your regular feed then its near enough 100% hydration. Or 94 - 98% |
brown rice flour starter?
i'm allergic to modern wheat, and my previous starters were made with spelt, usually white spelt. they started out pretty active, smelled and tasted great, but after a while they all failed or became too hard to maintain. maybe it's me, but i thought i'd try a brown rice sourdough starter us... | There were a few posters here
There were a few posters here that developed some very nice GF starters and recipes but both went on to write books and have websites to purchase their information. One of them has even deleted their links and posts from this site. Use the search feature here and see what you can find-they... |
Final Disappointment
My last sourdough preparations were going so well.My final proving had risen more than usual, and the dough rolled out perfectly from by banneton into my Dutch Oven due to its covering of semolina ..... but the final loaf hadn't risen and was flat, hard and moist, with the toughest crust ever.What ... | With the very limited info
With no photos, recipe or procedure I'd say over fermenting/proofing.Please can you provide as much info as possible. |
Rye sour starter from Stanley Ginsberg's 'The Rye Baker'
Hi!I am following the instructions on pages 36, 37 of Stanley Ginsberg's The Rye Baker for the starter sour to the letter:on Thursday I mixed 70g Bob's Red Mill Dark rye with 70g water at 104F° (using a yoghurt thermometer, whose tip did not touch the pan's botto... | Carry on
Persevere and carry on. Starters can go through an array of smells at this early stage. Continue with what you've been doing and don't worry. If Stanley himself describes this smell then why do you think it's gone wrong? |
Hints for sourdough rolls?
I've been making some good loaves with 100% white flour, 70% hydration (no additives). I decided to experiment with using the same dough making rolls, with mixed results (see photo), baking them at 200deg C for 30 minutes. On one dimension they are fine (good crumb inside) but the crust was a... | Used to using a banneton
Try draping a floured tea towel over a muffin pan and start filling with rolls from the middle.Actually you might be able to give the rolls more support with a decorative folding or shape like rolling out snakes and tying knots with them. You might also find that a slight drop in hydration may... |
Beauty, the sourdough facial
Sourdough as purfume-free Facial Mask: I made myself a cup of java and was flipping over my 75g sachet of liquid Natur Sauerteig and there states (it was on the second of a two package deal) that sourdough cleans and promotes circulation! "An old secret recipe." Sounds interesting, I re... | My hands are so soft...
MiniOven,That's what I call creative marketing. Maybe that's why my hands have been so smooth lately. Now I can capture my daughter's interest with this new application, a whole new dimension of sourdough.Bill |
Tin vs dutch oven - temperature and time
I tend to work with 2-loaf batches. I can fit one dutch oven and one tin in my oven so that's what I do. I use a Pyrex dish upturned on the tin to hold steam for the first 20 mins (and the lid on the DO of course).Generally the tin loaf gets a darker crust (all over) than the DO... | Probably just talking to
Probably just talking to myself but I had an idea about this after all my roast vegies were burnt on the bottom by the same oven yesterday.The dutch oven is bare stainless steel. The loaf tin is black. Especially without a fan, a lot of the heat transfer will be radiative and the black will abs... |
looking for a starting place due to lower ambient temps
Hi:I had great bakes with my starter through the summer and fall, when my ambient temps ranged 75-85F. The most consistent success came from "lower" hydration of 62-65%, and using 20% starter (that was at 100% hydration). Typical routine was an autolyse with sta... | So what did work for you? Can you send a pic?
Why not try a recipe that available. LIke Hamelman's Vermont SD or this iteration which varies only slightly from his...http://www.wildyeastblog.com/my-new-favorite-sourdough/Or just try using slightly lower levain %age, like 17% or something. Just inch it down, increase ... |
Reinhart whole-grain bread without commercial yeast?
Has anyone here tried making the 100% wholegrain delayed-fermentation method Reinhart breads from 'Whole Grain Breads' without using commercial yeast in the final dough?I'm thinking of having a go at the wholewheat hearth bread just using a sourdough starter.There ar... | Reinhart
Made PR's Oat Bran Broom Bread with SD starter. If you use the search function for FLBaker you'll see loaf/changes. there. Have made several of the recipes by using the 100% starter and just adjusted liquid /flour from there. You'll be able to do this,too. |
65% sourdough sticky as glue
Hello all,I've been lurking about on this site and been reading lots of different posts that have helped me to finally cultivate my own starter (which strangely enough, took about 3 weeks instead of the usual 5-7 days which i've come to see so often).I thought the difficult part was over, b... | 65% toughts
A few thoughts:- 13% protein is pretty high (on the N. American standard for measuring...and that = 11% as they typically measure in France, and 11% is just fine for making bread). It could still be an issue with the flour, but I wouldn't call that low protein. (see: http://www.theartisan.net/flour_ash_con... |
Amount of sourdough starter kept
I am sure my question will show I truly don't understand sourdough starter as I should but it is the reason for my question. How much starter does someone actually keep in their jar to eventually make levain from? ThanksDave | Everyone will keep different amounts
According to their needs. Those who bake often will keep more and vice versa. If you're finding that you're having to discard before feeding because it's been too long since the last feed and you haven't whittled it down enough in order not to discard then you're keeping too much. I... |
Getting cozy with my recipe but shaping needs work...
First, a huge thank you to this community and all the useful knowledge being shared here. I've been baking sourdough since March or April of this year, and have come a long way from the dense, flat, disaster loaves of the early days. Recently I've been baking a loaf... | Symmetry has flavor?
Exquisite scoring, Lauren. Works of art. Don't be losing sleep over their shapes. Since when should handmade bread be even and symmetrical? This shape works for me (and Chad Robertson, obviously). If symmetry imparts a flavor it's too subtle for this toad's tongue. You've clearly pulled a nic... |
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