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Sourdough not rising enough - please help I am using the same steps & timing as I was late last year (all fermentation at 72F), but the bread isn't rising as much.Starter - overnight and had risen to 2xBulk fermentation - 5 1/2 hrs at 72F. Pre-shape & rest for 30min. Shape & refrigerated for ~18 hrs. Baked covered with...	A recipe will help From the photos it looks under fermented. If you are bulk fermenting for 5.5 hours at 72°F and it's still under fermented you're either using very little starter or your starter is not performing well. A recipe will help to diagnose if it's just a timing issue or a starter issue.
100% wholegrain organic einkorn sourdough with tangzhong My usual recipe for Einkorn is as follows... Flour 100% (400g)Water 70% (280g)Salt 2% (8g)Starter 20% @ 70% hydration (80g) However I decided to include some oil and a tangzhong. So did a quick recalculation like so... flour 380gwater 180g (less 1tbsp)salt 8goliv...	Looks great! i agree the mistake was meant to be to get some good results ... looks yummy and is a very healthy grain to use!what is tangzhong? thank you!
Salt Rising (risen) bread I have been mostly successful at making salt risen bread. I'm looking to start selling srb next spring.Does anyone know if you can carry the starter over to the next batch, similar to sourdough or if you need to completely start over everytime?	I don't know the answer to your question but Salt-rising bread is my husband's favorite. Would love to see your recipe. With regular sd starters there is no problem using the original starter, as long as it's healthy and resupplied.But an old thread on this subject might be of interest to you:http://www.thefreshloaf....
Great article on Sourdough In case you missed it, here's the link. (Included a photo of the loaf I made for my husband!)http://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2016/10/28/499363379/discovering-the-science-secrets-of-sourdough-you-can-help	Nice article. sounds like a Nice article. sounds like a fun project.
Have my yeast gone to sleep? Well, this fool has managed to make Debra Wink's "foolproof" pineapple juice method not-so-foolproof (URL: http://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/10901/pineapple-juice-solution-part-2?page=3). Does anyone else have trouble building their starter past the pineapple juice phase?After reading Debra'...	The pH of pinapple juice is 3.5 and the pH of orange juice acan be as loaw as 3.3 or as high as 4.19. I assume that pineapple juice varies a bit as well.The idea of adding an acid to the mix at the beginning is to reduce the reproductive rate of the bad LAB which don't like a low pH and to reduce the activity of the n...
What is your sourdough starter made of? Hi Folks,I just came across this article that describes a new "Sourdough Project" run by Rob Dunn, a biologist at North Carolina State University. The project is to study the biome (the microscopic beasties that make up our starters) and he is asking for people to sign up on th...	Cool! Thanks for the link. Reminds me of thishttps://experiment.com/projects/mapping-the-sour-beer-microbiome
Sourdough 5 days ago I decided I was finally going to make a sourdough starter, so I followed the pineapple juice solution, and now the wild yeast have finally awoken.A few questions have come with that awakening, First I want to eventually convert this into a fridge starter but I want to let it mature first, how often...	Various ways Well done! There are a lot of ways to do this, and it's a big waste of flour and time to maintain a non-fridge starter, so unless you bake a few times a week, keeping it in the fridge is a must.My practice has evolved to not feeding at all in the fridge. The day before I want to bake, I wake it up with a...
anyone do a water glaze after the bake SD? Hello again bakers!I've finally tried the Norwich SD that I've read about here and found it a very easy recipe to follow. Still didn't do it quite right as i under-proofed the dough due to circumstances but the bread came out looking decent...hopefully it tastes good as well.I...	In terms of crust, I like the In terms of crust, I like the look of the top one because it is showing less flour so you can see the great color of the crust (good job with the cooking time).On a different note, I think you are overlapping your scoring too much. The lines should be parallel to the long axis, but overlap...
Sourdough Starter begining Help pls Greetings Bakers I am SO sorry if this post is very repetitive, I have tried in the past three times to start a SD Starter and have never been successful.I have spent hours trawling through this Forum trying to find an easy basic UN-wasteful way to start and maintain a Healthy SD St...	Well, here's a link to one of the expert's posts. http://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/40918/no-muss-no-fuss-starterI thought T55 was mostly for pastries and not bread.
Trouble with Hamelman's Sourdough Preferment In reference to the Whole Rye recipe on page 210 of Hamelman's 2nd edition.The sourdough preferment was prepared and incubated as directed from a very active all rye sourdough culture (his recipe) that was at the height of vitality when used to make the preferment.The prefer...	Not sure exactly which one that is, but Are you sure it hadn't grown at all? I'm at a loss to explain why it wouldn't work. Don't give up.I just made the one with whole rye with whole wheat, which is the second or third one in the rye section. I made the "rye sourdough" (preferment) after feeding rye to my fridged s...
todays sourdough class produced this:Couple of happy bakers today!-Gordon	OMG, I wish I was there. Just lovely.
Starter won't double in size with 100% Canadian AP flour Hi everyone 👋I am having a problem where my dough won't double in size if I don't use commercial yeast together with my sourdough starter.My starter is generally pretty active. I feed it twice a day 20g AP unbleached flour and 5g rye flour. It normally triples i...	Starter woes Endless apologies if you already knew this: the most frequently reported problems with starter cultivation over many years of archived posts are due to water quality. If you are using municipal (city tap) water be advised that the water department can introduce additives like chlorine and chloromines "with...
yogurt sourdough starter i accidentally added flour to the milk at the same time as the yogurt. will it still work or should I discard the whole lot?	Yogurt starter? I'm not quite sure what it is you're trying to make, actually. Can you provide more information? Generally a starter consists of liquid (usually water) and flour. It sounds like you're trying to kick-start the bacteria by adding yogurt, but if you could give us your recipe or the source of your inspirat...
Tartine Troubleshooting - Final Rise Hi guys!I've been baking bread at home for a while. I've had hit or miss success with my Tartine Basic Country Loaf. (And the successes have always been when I have NOT proofed in the fridge, but this would really be most convenient for me!)I follow the ratios and suggested times an...	Why do you refrigerate for the final proof? Part of the recipe or do you prefer it? If your dough is not ready when taken out of the fridge then continue at room temperature.
looking for the right SD deli rye Greetings folks!I've been working on finding a nice deli rye that I enjoy and have tried a couple of recipes. I did Hamelmans Light Rye bread (from Bread) and Reinhart's Onion Rye (from BBA). Next bake I plan on trying Sour Rye Bread by Greenstein but thought I'd ask if people had othe...	A way around the first clear flour issue jimt,I've made the "Greenstein" Jewish Deli Rye by way of David Snyder's posts of same. I generally stick to "low-end" flours from the local supermarket, so I also had no inclination to spend the milk money on a shipment of First Clear. But I found a way around the first clear...
Discussion On Low Hydration & Learning To Shape Like so many others, learning to work with high hydration dough is tough, especially when very new to the game, as am I.While I've had successes with higher hydration (72-75%), trying to form a proper boule is less than pleasurable and they've always been in a Dutch oven....	Your loaf looks just lovely and perfect to eat w butter and cheese (my favorites).It doesn't look gummy and under baked to my eyes. It looks like the crumb is just wonderfulQuestion: why are you adding vital wheat gluten and do you autolyse?hester
Sourdough feedings Hi everyone, got an amazing rye starter going 100 rye 2 feedings a day 1:1:. But I am starting to struggle to keep up with the feedings especially Since I will soon to be going away every weekend for 2 nights. Anybody got any ideas how I could reduce the feedings to once a day during the week and non...	refrigerate You can slow the activity of the starter by placing it in the refrigerator. I can hold mine for a month by refrigerating it and feeding once a month.Ford
Why is it that few days after I bake, my SD loaf tastes more sour than when it was first baked This question of whether the LAB's are still present or active after it has been baked comes up again and again, from friends, customers, fellow bakers etc...Does anyone know of any scientific research papers etc, that proves...	The 2 rules of SD is that it tastes better toasted and is mire sour the next day. I think the bread dries out and the moisture water that dilutes the acid is removed allowing the bread to become more sour. If I saute vinegar to remove he water it too gets more vinegary tasting.Plus things just get better with age:-)
Starter Advice, Please My main starter, the first I made, was 50/50 WW/WAP @ 100% hydration. I kept it that way through numerous feedings and some failures and several (somewhat) successful loaves.For some reason, I neglected to feed it the same "blend" and only fed with bleached white for a while. I think I just about...	how hot was the water? do you know?I'd just try first to really get your starter working b/f trying to bake.
My third loaf Hi all, Here is my third loaf.66.2% bread dough hydration, 800g total weight, 50g levain (WW starter fed with BF and Rye flour) of 100% hydration; its orimerly white bread flour with some 45g WW and Rye flour together. I am pleased with my improvememt and progress. But as always practice makes it perfect ...	Well Done!!!! I love the crumb, and I'm sure the taste is wonderful. Looks like your crust is nice and crisp as well! Jamie
Whole Wheat Starter Hello: I have been maintaining a white flour starter and a whole wheat starter (that I made from the white starter) for some time now, but since I don't bake much, it seems wasteful. I make more whole wheat bread than white, so could I just keep the whole wheat starter and use it on white bread reci...	You could use either starter for any loaf. Just take it out a day or so ahead of time and remove a bit and refresh it with whichever flour you are planning to use. Good luck
Little rise, weird crumb Hey all, It's my first time posting here and I'm really looking forward to the opportunity to ask questions and learn more. For background, my wife and I have been baking whole wheat sourdough each week for about 3 months now. We've experimented a little (some rye here, some durum there), but n...	Your starter passed the float test But from the photo it looks like the starter wasn't mature enough. Seems to be conflicting. So while I still think it was all in the starter (from the photo) perhaps it could be some other issue.So assuming it's not the starter what else could be the issue?You have 40% starter and bul...
My starter has died. Can I use a piece of my sourdough bread as a seed to make a new starter? Hello all, My three year old stiff (65% hydration/all bread flour) starter died in the last two days. I have back ups in the freezer as well as dehydrated flakes in a zip lock. I am leaving tomorrow on a vacation ...	Once bread had been baked the yeast has been killed off. Dehydrated starter takes a couple of days to reactivate anyway. Just before you leave add enough water to the dehydrated starter to make a paste. Then feed this paste 1:2:2 and leave it at room temperature while you're away for a couple of days. This way by the t...
Sourdough Starter Tutorial. A nice video for everyone, not just a beginner. What, How, & Why of a Sourdough Starter Video of What, How, & Why of a Sourdough Starter	What a great video!!!!!!!! thanks so much!!!!!!!!!!!!!
flat sourdough bread hi all,i know there are few topics on this but there doesn't seem to be one that quite fits my issue.i've made sourdough about 4 or 5 times now and each time it comes out flat (and the scoring seems to disappear into the dough)my starter is strong enough, i feed it a few days into baking, 2x a day,...	Is your bulk fermentation at room temp and your final rise a cold (refrigerated) retardation?His bulk fermentation is about 78 dF. If your apartment is 70 dF it should take a lot longer
First 1:2:3 Recipe - A Success Hello all. Past couple of weeks have been busy with RL issues, including a week away from home teaching classes and some family issues. But back in the kitchen now and things are working fairly well.So, I found the 1:2:3 "recipe" and thought "This is too simple", so yesterday I tried it o...	Beautiful! its wonderful and the crumb is sooo good! may I ask you, how did you succeed in shaping of the boule (making the tight surface)? Thank you!
Sourdough Country Loaf - is this how its supposed to be ? Hello Fellow Bakers I have question about baking sourdough bread. I have been using the Tartine country loaf sourdough recipe. The loaves look really good. However, when they are cut open , the crumb is quite chewy and a bit gelatinous . I baked them at 230 degr...	Cooling Did you let it fully cool? Or did you cut into it too early. It should be cooked given the time (an instant thermometer is helpful here), but if you cut into it too early it will be gelatinous.
Major trouble having Sourdough not stick to the shaping bowl = loosing it's shape when turned onto baking sheet I've been trying to make this for weeks. It always tastes pretty good and actually turns out ok but it's not right. http://www.wildyeastblog.com/2007/07/08/my-new-favorite-sourdough/comment-page-4/#comment-48...	Try lining the bowl with a Try lining the bowl with a tea towel or piece of linen, and coat the fabric generously with flour. You can "prime" the fabric by misting it lightly with water so that the flour will stick. While the cloth may still stick a little bit to your loaf, you can carefully peel it off the dough witho...
Filoni also called francesini This is a simple bread that I often do. Quick and tasty, I enjoy doing it. I'd like to play a game with you: I put the photos and leave the comment to you, after I say my considerations.RecipePoolish wheat flour W360 200 gWater 200 gFresh yeast 10 gWheat flour 400 gWater 220 gSalt 13 gFre...	Wow! Crust and crumb are perfect! I see summery picnics just by looking at these beauties.
My second loaf Hi all,Here is my second loaf! Even though, it has room for perfection, It's a huge improvement! The bread is 66.7% hydration and has a large portion of whole grains in it. Taste, texture, open crumb and crunchy crust were the highlights of the loaf!I still have to work on the rise/oven spring. The facto...	Looking good Scoring is so so hard. I read that some baker said it took him a full year of working in a bakery to learn to score properly. A full year. David had some great videos on scoring. I'll try to dig them up.
Whole Wheat Starter in an AP Bread Recipe Hello,I've been cultivating my first starter for about 10 days now, and I believe it's ready to bake since it rises and falls in a consistent manner. It's a whole wheat starter that I feed twice a day at 100% hydration, 50% seed (so total it's 20% seed, 40% flour, and 40% wate...	Should work out fine. Should work out fine.
How long can I retard for Recipe 255g levain @ 50% hydration (80% bread flour, 20% whole rye) 241g bread flour66g whole wheat flour243g water8g salt If I get this into the fridge after the bulk ferment on Wednesday evening can I bake it on Friday evening?	48 hours Seems like a long time, but i don't know if it's too long or not. The longest I've retarded for is 19 hours.I'm very interested to see how it turns out if you try it. Sorry i can't be more helpful.
Fermenting Fruit Water/ Starter Question Hi everyoneI have a week-old-thing going made of 2 apples and some mulberries. It's cloudy and only has little bubbles and I was going to throw it out but decided to use some of the water to make a poolish tonight (I added equal amounts of this and flour to an established starte...	Yeast water In many French bakeries, a levain (sourdough starter) is begun with a mix of rotting (not rotten, but fruit that you wouldn't want to eat) and dried fruit and VERY warm water, all left to party together in a warm place for about 24 hours. The resulting water is bubbly and cloudy, lots of sugars and yeasts a...
Stiff Starter Daily use straight into Panettone This is my first post. Over the years I have had bread questions and something from the fresh loaf always pops up on google. Great content on here from all contributors so I’d like to start off by saying thank you to everyone.Especially those dealing with panettone, as ev...	No Panettone experience I don't have any panettone experience but one of the things that popped into my head was a question about the water you are using. Depending on where you are located and if you are using water out of the tap, your water could be impacting this challenging dough very detrimentally. I would chec...
How Long a Fermentation in Cold can be? (more within) Hi guy,I have been baking sourdough breads based on the "classic" algorithm (autolysis, 6x30 min fold, final shape, fridge fermentation) with great success. However, I believe I can reach new highest, and I decided to ask for the opinion of people with more experien...	I don't know the upper limit, I don't know the upper limit, but I use 100% home milled whole wheat, and I use a 5% levian and a 24 hour fermentation in the 50's F, then a 24 hr final proof in the fridge pretty regularly. For pizza dough, many users cold ferment 3 to 5 days.
A Sourdough Starter Having A Bath It really is a pet! Giving a Sourdough Starter a Bath - Part 1 Video of Giving a Sourdough Starter a Bath - Part 1 Giving a Sourdough Starter a Bath Part 2 Video of Giving a Sourdough Starter a Bath Part 2	Very interesting videos Thank you for posting. Very interesting vids with a lot of info on sourdough.Finding the location of the Bread Center took almost as long as watching the videos! Apparently they are located in Belgium but they allude to activities in the US However, I can only find local email contacts listed in...
Kosher San Francisco Starter Hi there, has anyone ever had experience in acquiring a sourdough starter from San Francisco. I'd love to buy, and don't know where to turn! If anyone got a clue, I'd be very greatful!! Thank you	You're only 1 week or so away from making your own.If you wish for kosher starter but don't wish to make your own then either get some starter from someone who keeps kosher and made their own. And since starter is never cooked and bakeries will be very strict it should only be flour and water then it should be kosher a...
Continuing my quest for the perfect tang So now I have rethought my mother culture maintenance and my levain build for more tang (basically lower hydration for both, including some wholegrain and using when its overly ripe) I still have a question or two.If bacteria like a warm and wet environment why does a dryer moth...	It doesn't Hi Abe.It doesn't, necessarily. With a lower hydration and cooler temperatures what you do get is a slower development of acids overall (TTA). In addition the balance will shift towards more acetic in mixes drier and colder. But this is just acid we're talking here. Flavour is a bigger part of the picture.Wi...
Help with recovering frozen starter Hi All,3 weeks ago I fed and 3 hours later I put my starter in the freezer. This monday, I took it out, let it thaw and the I discarded some and fed it 1:2:2. Nothing happened. So, I fed it on tuesday (without discarding) and then twice today (also without discarding) and this is how...	The thing about freezing starter is that water expands when it freezes into ice and it explodes the cell walls of teh wee beasties, They have a hard time recovering from that, Way better to just dry a schmear on parchment and store it in a glass jar in a cool place - for years!Good luck with the project some of the ...
I've just read up on spontaneous fermentation in bread baking There is a method to mix a liquid dough and wait until it bubbles then bake. Essentially is this not the first stage in making a sourdough starter and using the leuconostoc activity to raise the dough? Doesn't sound too appetising to me especially when one o...	It would probably be safe to eat. Pasteurization of milk requires that the milk be heated to 145F for 30 minutes or 161F for 15 seconds. The typical loaf of bread has an internal temperature of close to 200F (+/- depending on the bread), so the internal temperature along with the time would meet both criteria, so it is...
seems too wet HiI have been trying to make a white brad from a recipe using a poolish starter it isn't firming at all I have folded it and rested it but it is still not workable it is so sticky.I am at my wits end how can I make this work	What's the recipe? Few more details please. What's the recipe? What flour are you using? What have you done so far?
Goldrush sourdough starter - has anyone used it? I just purchased a packet of Goldrush brand "old fashioned San Francisco Style Sourdough Starter," and I'm wondering if anybody's used this particular brand, or a similar product with any success. It's basically a dry mix of sourdough culture and white flour. I'm plannin...	first i heard of it but will first i heard of it but will look into it
Spelt first try, advices? Hello. I got some spelt flour for the first time. What should I do with it? :)I mean, is it suitable to be baked alone? Or should I mix it with regular flour?Also, hints and advices please.its a french T110 spelt flour.thanksHBvk	Some tips Don't overwork it and watch out for the quicker fermenting / proofing times.Will need less water than its wheat relative.An all spelt loaf is tasty but you won't get as much rise as wheat.Follow a recipe first to get to know what you're dealing with.
First sourdough bread Hi all, While we are bracing for hurricane Matthew, I was able to bake my first sourdough bread this morning! Woohoo!After my first unsuccessful attempt (described in my post about starter - I updated it with the new info), here is my first sourdough bread. While in process of nurturing it, I had...	Hi I've been waiting for this bake. It's very late here in the UK so I'm going to keep this short and promise to write more. In one sentence... Your starter works but you have to get used to sourdough. I think it's just a timing issue and sourdough is totally different from yeasted breads in this aspect. The more you u...
Wondering if yeast nutrient Wondering if yeast nutrient, common when making alcohol, will also have a positive affect on sourdough starters. Yeast nutrient is often nitrogen based and can have b vitamins too. It helps for a good fermentation and prevents any stalling as well. One can find many different varieties sold ...	Wouldn't it be basically the Wouldn't it be basically the same as nutritional yeast or yeast extract? You could just try adding a spoon of marmite :)
Making multi starters for my weekend bake hi this is my first post... I want to bake several different breads this weekend and each needs approx 400g of starter. I only have one mother starter right now at about 100g. How do I gross up to get almost 2 litre of starter for my baking. Sorry if this seems obvious -- Any a...	One way ... The way I build a "production levian" from my starter is what some folks here refer to as 1:2:2 - that means divide the final quantity by 5, then one fifth starter, 2/5 flour + 2/5 water. So for 400g of final levian, take 80g starter, add 160g flour and 160g water.If you need 2Kg of active starter, then you...
How do you know when your starter is ideal for baking the best bread? I was wondering if anyone could give me answer to this question. I just never know when its the best time to use my started in baking. For example an hour after feeding it, a couple hours after feeding it, 6 hours after feeding it, 12 hours after fee...	Good question Like most people I store mine in the fridge. I don't feed it. Best practice? Perhaps not. But it's still alive. A day or two before I want to bake, I take out a small amount and start building it again, feeding once every 12 hours or so. You can either build the same amount, discard and rebuild, or ...
Help! Inactive Starter... I recently tried a new starter with half all purpose flour and half rye .I've read really good things about a rye starter so I thought I'd give it a try. The first starter, the second day of feeding had the most rise I've ever seen in any of my starters! It was high, light, and bubbly! I was s...	You did the opposite of what you should have done A starter does go quiet after the initial bubbling up. After it has bubbled up the first time and you've fed it then you wait till it begins to show signs of life again. Instead you went into a feeding frenzy which was counterproductive and eventually you had discarded ...
Terminology I know this may seem obvious but I've been baking and using sourdough for quite a while now however sometimes I feel as if I know what to do but I don't know what I'm doing. But every so often something clicks and I begin to understand why it is done this way. Terminology is to blame for a lot of this.My st...	Interesting how you label your stages. I label mine slightly differently. The culture I keep in the fridge is my starter and the bit I take from that and feed, I consider my levain just like you. However, it doesn't change names for me when I add it to my dough.Levain probably comes from the French "lever" which means ...
more holes than bread- help! hi- I'm hoping for some help from all you experienced bakers! my bread lately has been turning out with a slightly dense crumb and great big holes. I read the other post from Danni3ll3 about big holes, and don't think mine are a result of shaping (though I could be wrong- still learning a...	degas I dont do tartine but I'm sure many are going to suggest degassing before you preshape. I used to be afraid to degas because i was afraid of killing all the bubbles but the final rise should produce nice even crumb without extra large bubbles and often times at the crust edges which is another interesting thing ...
How long for bulk ferment I'm following this recipe here as a way to encourage more tang http://brodandtaylor.com/make-sourdough-more-or-less-sour-part-2/I've converted my mother culture and I'm going to build the Levain soon. Would like to know if I can do an all night bulk ferment for this recipe. The dough is meant ...	Oops TFL went haywire in me and now a double post
First Real SD Loaf Turned Out Like a Brick! Ok, so I thought I'd try some new "more advanced" techniques (this normally gets me into trouble!) and, well... things didn't go exactly as planned. Here's the story...I've had a starter going for a few months now (all AP @ 100%) from which I build my levain for each bake. Un...	How long did you wait before slicing into it? I make my family wait a minimum of two hours and preferably 8 hours before slicing. That allows the moisture to redistribute within the loaf and prevents gumminess. The other thing is that you might not have baked it long enough. I bake till I get a minimum internal tempera...
Starter smells like plastic First time attempting to make a sourdough starter without inoculation, and it smells like plastic, with perhaps a slight hint of gasoline. I've seen many mentions of what I would call normal fermentation odors--alcohol, bananas, vinegar, acetone--and smells that indicate spoilage (garbage, v...	Not all the smells you mentioned Mean spoilage. In fact bad smells at this stage are part of the process. With careful maintenence you should still produce a viable starter and it'll smell nicer. What have you done so far and is it bubbling?
How long for bulk ferment I'm following this recipe here as a way to encourage more tang http://brodandtaylor.com/make-sourdough-more-or-less-sour-part-2/I've converted my mother culture and I'm going to build the Levain soon. Would like to know if I can do an all night bulk ferment for this recipe. The dough is meant ...	Problem solved Will have time after all. Phew!
unsuccessful first attempt Hi all!Today, Stella was doing great and I decided to try baking my first soughdough. She is 7 days old.Well, it did not get to even being shaped. It did not hold the shape. As you see in the picture - it did have bubbles, but did not hold the shape at all. This pictire was taken right before...	Definitely activity there What's the smell like? This is also an indicator. See how it does with what you've just fed it. Wrap and elastic band around the harvest the level of the starter now. Tonight take another photo side on and we'll see how much it has risen above the band. Difficult to explain how to add a photo ...
New 'difficult' starter...any help or ideas? Hi Everyone, I just joined, though I've been baking and doing sourdough for about 12 years now. I just started a new sourdough culture and it's really perplexing me. Any ideas or help would be amazing. Thank you!About 6 weeks ago I decided that it would be fun to do a new so...	Hi. I had similar experiences Hi. I had similar experiences last year I worked with a sourdough starter, WW stone ground flour and rye WW stone ground flour. At one point I noticed that all the gluten had disappeared from a dough I brought outside the house to rise on a very warm day. I did the test massaging a piece ...
Advice - Starter too active Sorry if I' repeating a thread, did have a look but some of them are a little too different for me to gauge anything useful.So the issue is my starter appears to be peaking quite quickly for my liking - something like 8-12 hours but ideally due to my life schedule I would prefer it to maybe ...	Either you need A very low hydration starter. Something like 50% or less. Or refrigeration.
Hamelman's Mixed Flour Miche Took the liberty of adding the sesame seeds. It's cooling and the recommended time to wait is 12 hours.	Oo oo, looks wonderful Perfect for cheese and butter.... lol
Rye Starter In a Day Yesterday I mixed organic rye flour and water to create a new starter. To my surprise it was bubbling and it doubled in less than a day! I have made every kind of starter imaginable and I have never seen such a thing. Has anyone experienced this before? The starter smells fresh and fruity - just...	Really? No, not experienced or heard of it before, not with yeast anyway. Bacteria, yes. Check the bag and see if it is an all inclusive mix. :)
Traveling with sourdough starter into the UK? I'd like to take some sourdough starter with me when I travel from Aus to the UK but don't want to get there and have customs take it off me if it isn't allowed in (I know that it won't be allowed back into Aus). I can't find anywhere if sourdough is OK to bring into the UK...	Sourdough transport I took sourdough starter home to the UK from the US by simply putting some recently fed starter into a plastic freezer bag, evacuating as much air as possible, and putting this bag into a second plastic bag in case of leakage. I put the whole thing into my checked on luggage and had no problem with ...
Sourdough With Long Autolyze Just wondering if anyone does this on a regular basis, and I'm talking long as in 4 hours plus for an autolyze.Jamie	autolyse I have just made my first loaf using this method and it said leave 4 hours I actually made it wrong as I thought ot wastoo wet and added more four
Saturday Morning Sourdough In my "Tale Of Two Starters" thread, Gordon (drogon) posted a link to a simple sourdough recipe he posted in blogs. I started that last night and finished this morning. I followed the recipe as closely as possible with the ingredients available and used my first starter, a 50/50 WW/AP @ 100%....	That looks just perfect. Very well done indeed! All white is pretty boring taste and not nearly as naturally healthy. I say get used to it - that is some fine bread you have there:-)Happy baking
100% rye, third attempt I finally found my oven spring but didn't plan for it this time. This is using Mini-oven's 100% rye ratio recipe that I've now attempted for the third time. The first two tries I used a banneton and deflated the loaves when they went into the oven. All three have been made with the same recipe w...	One thing & a few more tips I never use a banneton with this recipe. Too wet and the dough is too delicate to "flip" it. Begging for collapse. :)I wait a few hours after mixing (covered bowl) and then spoon the rising paste into a well buttered and floured/seeded/or crumbed form, be it the cold DO or a loaf pan. ...
Starter Ratios - Which to Use and When? First post (other than the intro, of course...) and appropriately I'll start with, well, starters!Me? I grew up in the Bay Area and was basically raised on San Francisco sourdough bread - love the stuff - very firm sourness most times. Mom always had a starter in the fridge. I ne...	The amount of prefermented flour I use depends on how much time I have to get the loaf done, the temperature and how long it will be retarded. Generally speaking the longer the process the better tasting the bread so using as little prefermented flour as possible will give you the best tasting bread. The higher the t...
Shorted my bulk rising time—what now? I decided to give my youngish starter a whirl with Susan's Simple Sourdough formula. Bulk fermentation was moving verrry slowly today and instead of just sitting it out like a patient and smart baker, I moved to shaping when the dough had risen maybe by about 2/3rd (around 6 hrs @ ...	You haven't lost it! You can knock back a second time and shape again if you think it'll benefit from it. Doubling isn't always an indicator of when the bulk ferment is done. It is a good one but not the only way. Some dough's don't have to double. It all depends how aireated the dough is, billowy and how it feels. How...
First Sourdough Loaf A week ago I started my first sourdough starter. Yesterday it seemed to become mutant and doubled 90 mins after a feeding, so on the advice of a couple of very knowledgeable and generous members, it was time to bake.I had already decided on Susan's simple sourdough as my first recipe, and followed ...	Yowsers! What a mighty fine loaf. I really mean it. Just perfect in every way. Crust, crumb, oven spring, ear!Bon Appetit.Now you want to think of finding your starter a home in your fridge. Working out a maintenance schedule that fits your timetable according to how much you like to bake.
Promising dough turned to soup. Help! Hi all! This is my first post but I've been lurking for a couple weeks now and you guys have saved my bacon more than once. I'll keep this quick. I've been playing with a sourdough recipe from The Perfect Loaf that's based on a Tartine formula. It's 78% hydration, mostly AP with ab...	Overfermented? I would add some flour (and maybe some water), add some salt to keep it at balance, mix it, ferment it for a short time. Now the fermentation will be very quick as you have all that yeast and LAB already developed, so keep an eye on the dough. Then proceed as normal.The dough needs more fresh gluten as i...
Back to front dough behaviour Hi all.Just posting out of curiosity really as ive noticed my sourdough...er..doughs seem to behave the opposite way to how i see them on YouTube tutorials and wondered if anyone else had experienced this.For context i have been making sourdough country loaves at around 75% hydration for f...	Pictures Hey, It would be helpful to see pictures, however ai had similar issues when my levain was too acidic. R
Slow fermentation in my white dough Hello. I've being finding my white dough to be very slow. The last one I did (100% Flour \| 70%H20 \| 2%starter) took 9 hours to go to the oven, and I think it could have fermented a bit more. This not counting the 12hr pre ferment of 25% of the flour. I though my starter was becoming ...	2% starter? I'm surprised it didn't take a week.Hang on a minute... what do you mean by 2% starter then a pre-fermented 25% of the flour?The pre-ferment will be a starter!Can you explain?I'm a bit confused but 25% shouldn't take 9 hours.What's the difference if you feed your starter, take some off and use in your bread...
I have questions about my new, from scratch, sourdough starter Hi to all! I am very new to making sourdough starter and growing wild yeast. I did start with a very in-depth research, and now trying to grow my new pet Stella.i will describe what I did up to this point and then ask my questions. If anybody can please giv...	Answers 1. The first bubbling up is bacteria not yeasts. This happens quite quickly and everyone thinks a starter is born and then wonders where it all went wrong after the second feed. Do not fret. This is normal! Trick is to wait till your starter comes back to life then start the feeding schedule again just like aft...
A Tale Of Two Starters, And A Couple Of Questions The one on the left is all rye @ 100% hydration and is less than 36 hours old. I'm pleased with it's progress so far. The right one, 1/2 & 1/2 APW and WW @ 100% hydration, I started 5 days ago, but thought I had killed it day before yesterday when I had a brain fart and...	Tap water... FWIW: I've only ever used tap water - however my tap water is quite nice - lightly chlorinated (not chloramine). It's also slightly acidic which you'ld never be able to tell unless you boiled 1000s of litres of it in big kettles - which the local steam railway folks do... However if you've been instructed ...
newbie starter question Hi everyone! I have a starter that is about a week old, it's my first time trying to make my own starter. Been following Tartine's recipe for making leaven, and doing daily feedings of 50g warm water and 50g of a whole wheat / white flour blend. So far getting some nice bubble action, fragrant a...	Double in 12 Hi, novels!If your starter doubles in volume in 12 hours or less, you can bake with it. Catch it at peak or even shortly before or after and you're golden.Murph
Keep old starter or start over? Hi allI have an old rye starter that I began from scratch about 2 years ago. For the first year, I kept it in the fridge and fed it (fairly) reliably. A few times a month passed, and I was able to bring it back to normal.Now it has sat in the fridge unfed for (blush) almost a year. No ba...	I've heard of starters being revived After a year. However if it takes longer than making one from scratch I see no point as you haven't gained anything. The fruity smell wouldn't bother me as I don't think it's a sign of anything bad. What I would do is give it a good feeding and not do anything else till it shows sig...
Moving New Starter to No Muss No Fuss--Timing Hi TFLers,I am a longtime reader of TFL posting for the first time. First I want to thank this wonderful community for all of the knowledge you share so generously. I've learned so much from all of you.I'm getting back into sourdough bread baking after a long hiatus. I'm on...	I put mine in the fridge at 2 weeks. It worked perfectly. I did refresh it after a couple of months though.
Dough with big bubbles before shaping After my preferment and first rise, when I go shape my boules of sourdough, I always end up with fairly dense dough which has large pockets/bubbles, rather than a uniformly pillowy and fluffy dough. Any advice? I'm using a mix of whole wheat and white flour, a mature levain starter...	Are you completing the bulk ferment properly? Important to know when the bulk ferment is sufficiently done. Not de-gassing the dough while doing stretch and folds will help. Each time the dough is de-gassed it'll make a tighter crumb. When shaping it is also important to not take out all the bubbles. Knock the big ones...
How to USE yeast water, not make it So I've been reading several threads on here about Yeast Water. I've also read several blogs and so on. I can't seem to find how to convert a regular recipe to use yeast water. I'm not very interested in sourdough, so just regular bread (think lesson 1). I autolyze my wheat flour wit...	It's all just yeast Hey, SugarOwl!Yeast water is just yeast. Just another way to levain dough. Nothing more, nothing less. It's pretty cool stuff.I think the standard reply will be to substitute half of whatever yeast you're already using with yeast water. The experts will be along post haste. I'll be following this th...
sourdough 101 help! Thanks all for your help on my question on the sourdough 101 post.Ok so like I said, by day 3 I had a nice bubbly starter (which I've now been told is bad bacteria) I added day 4 ingredients and am yet to get a doubled rise. As per suggestions, I added 2 tbsp whole wheat flour and 1 tbsp water on da...	Ok So its been a few days since all went quiet. Since then you have stirred it every 12 hours and gave it a teaspoon or two of fresh flour to offset the bad bacteria. It is now bubbling (which is promising) but not doubling. Sounds as if it is over the bad bacteria stage but because it hasn't had a big feed in a while ...
3 Questions on Starter Maintenance I have been working my way through Ken Forkish's Four, Water, Salt, Yeast and made my first hybrid sour dough loaf this week. I think it was pretty successful.Having read some posts here about Ken's method for maintaining the Levain, the prevailing view seems to be that it wastes a l...	Josh, once you get your Josh, once you get your starter going, it is pretty durable. There are many different ways to maintain a starter. I refresh it nice a week and keep it in the fridge, in between refreshments, so yes , it can definitely last in the fridge a week without being fed. Second, as long as the r...
Optimum time to put sourdough starter in fridge? After feeding starter..... or after feeding and allowing it to double in size?	After it has doubled in size After it has doubled in size for more yeast activity compared to bacterial.
Sourdough Recipe Question So, I have a new "pet". Today I started a sourdough starter. I've read, and studied, read some more and studied even more. But.................Nearly every recipe I've looked at, if not all, makes 2 loves or 1 ginormous one. Is there any reason I can't 1/2 any single particular recipe?Also, be...	The great thing about bread making ... ... is that there are 1000's of ways to do it!So yes - make less, make more, reduce the hydration, free-form, use whatever works for you.How about a colander lined with a linen tea towel well dusted with flour?500g of flour plus your starter is a good large loaf - my daily recipe ...
Sourdough advice appreciated! Hello!I am a new sourdough baker and this is my 3rd attempt!My last loaf went pretty good following this Perfect Loaf's recipe. (photo 1)https://www.theperfectloaf.com/beginners-sourdough-bread/I am using the same starter(50/50 rye&AP 100% hydration) but this time, I had to bake at night s...	Overfermented Only way to rescue now is to add more flour till you get a semblance of a dough (make sure to add more salt in the right ratio, if adding too much, so keep track of how much extra flour). Give it a brief knead then shape and go straight into final proofing. It'll be a short proof so keep an eye on it. Bak...
Open crumb? How about a huge hole! Okay, gurus of sourdough, what happened? Under proofed, not tight enough shaping, not enough degassing, what? This is a first for me! I love an open crumb but this is ridiculous!	You make the boule by Folding inwards, into the middle, going round the dough. Am I correct?
Starter - Humidity Affect On Hydration I live in a dry climate in winter, and with electric heat, that makes it even worse. It's not abnormal to see 25-30% Rh indoors. Do you ever have to adjust for evaporation in any way?	Yes, that is why we cover the dough while fermenting and proofing. You don't want your dough forming a hard skin that will impede rising.
Weekday bake and rye question In tribute to the weekend bake thread, I figured I'd post my mid-week bake. I've been doing a lot of sourdough lately and wanted to try a few different things...a few successes and a few flails. All is good in the end because the bread is delicious.I used four different recipes for five lo...	rye with much less spring--curious how to get more action Buckwheat sourdough using wheat starter refreshed with buckwheat: city loaf girl meets rye--white/wheat sourdough:City loaf:Spelt/honey/oatmeal--the crust on this went soft almost as soon as it came out of the oven:buckwheat:finally the rye:I have a couple ideas...
Where do you guys usually dump sourdough starter? Currently I accumulate dumped sourdough in layered plastic bag. I have been thinking too much about where my starter go after I dump it. Like, how does the trash guy handle that pocket of funky smelled goo. I live in apartment, when I dump it, it will fall to the when ...	I don't have much to waste because I do builds but the bit that is left over gets diluted with water and dumped down the sink. I have occasionally put some in the trash but like you, I am afraid it might make a big mess. I suggest you do a search for the No fuss, no muss starter on this site. It will give you an idea o...
Fridge bulk rise Hi folks, Long time lurker, first time poster here...I have recently plucked up the courage to try a basic Tartine sourdough using some of the tips posted on here and got some good success. I'm now ready to vary my schedule a bit (up to now, I have mixed early afternoon, bulk risen at room temp, prove...	I generally refrigerate at the final proofing stage So i'll leave that question to someone more qualified. But I will say this... cover in the fridge. Preferably in a plastic bag.
How long do I keep my starter at room temp, prior to putting it in the fridge? Hello all - I would like to know the optimum time I should keep my sourdough starter at room temperature after feeding, before tucking it away in the refrigerator. I've read different ways of doing it: a good thread on this forum advocates ...	It. Just. Won't... DIE! Hi, southernsourdough!Once you have a successful starter, you can't kill it. Go ahead. Try!... I'll give you a quarter...Seriously, just about any way you store it is going to work but your success is ensured if you give it more flour (food) than less. Your REAL question is how long and how much...
Sourdough baguettes? I am beginning to make my own sourdough, and due to a bunch of food intolerances I need to keep the ingredients very simple. I am making sourdough with just water, sprouted flour, salt and starter. I was wondering if I would have good results if I cooked it in a baguette style loaf. But whenever I ...	Proper baguette will have Proper baguette will have only four ingredients: flour, water, leavening, and salt. So, I don't see why you should not be able to make a baguette the way you want to make it.
Baking Sourdough in a bamboo proving basket!! Has anyone heard of this? I recently visited a street market where they were selling fresh bread, I was admiring their sourdough and asked about proving/ baking methods. They told me that they second prove and then bake their sourdough still in the proving basket, which are...	Baked in a bamboo basket? Never heard of it. Sure it wasn't a misunderstanding? Or could they have been talking about a 'Panibois'? Actually I think they were. Look them up on Google. They should be careful when advising as such so they're not misunderstood. One must never bake in a banneton.
Combining flours to raise the protein level I have some bread flour with 12% protein and another quantity with 14% protein. Using simple mathematics I can calculate the right mix of the two flour quantities that would give me protein at a desired percent above the 12% and up to the 14% levels. For example the ratio is ...	glutenin and gliadin You can attempt to balance glutenin and gliadin ratios to get the right balance of elasticity and plasticity. Your flour probably does not report this so you would most likely have to do this empirically. There is lots of related technical discussion you can find on this site searching for those...
Mutant Sourdough This question isn't really about a problem, but it's one that's been on my mind for some time, So, I thought I'd finally throw it out here and see what kind of info I could get.I have this sourdough starter that's kind of.....weird. Not that it's unhealthy, or strange-tasting, or anything like that. ...	Mutant starter here, too The same thing is happening here. I'd been baking several loaves per week before summer and then vacation happened. I left three jars of starter in the fridge for a couple of months. When I returned to baking last week, the starters were all very "hoochy."I tried Jim Lahey's no-knead recipe fr...
Using sourdough starter without refreshing I have been making sourdough bread for a little over a year now, and I bake 1 or 2 loaves every week. My routine has always been taking the starter out of the fridge the night before using it, and refreshing it twice: once at night and once in the morning before leaving for w...	Using mature starter First off, if the bread tastes better to you, you do not have a problem.My own routine is much like what you describe - generally an activation feed then another feeding that gets used in making bread. Now, if I want to increase sourness, one way is to feed a firm starter and refrigerate it for up ...
My sourdough's surface is mat! Hello everybody! It's been very hot weather lately and I didn't put my sourdough in the frigde. Now the surface of my sourdough is mat, not bright. What do you think??	Just stir it up, it will be fine. Oh and keep feeding it! You might have to feed it a bit more often in the heat.
A little overproofed? What do you think? So does it looks a little over proofed?	I don't see signs of over proofing What makes you think it is?What is the recipe? Depending on the flour and hydration will produce different results. It's not sunken in. Did it reach it's full oven spring potential? Well it all depends on a few factors. Was it high hydration? Did you bake it free standing? Did you get...
100% rye attempts Greetings folks.I've decided to give a couple of 100% sourdough rye loaves a try. I decided on two that I found through the search engine here.First one is Mini oven's 1/3.5/4.16 formula. I followed the formula fairly closely though no added altus. I'm pretty sure I let it proof a bit longer than I sh...	Excellent first rye loaf! Looks like you baked it in the nick of time. Curious to see the inside but the outside looks promising. The second loaf... might want to try a narrower loaf pan next time. Try smearing the pan with butter and dusting it with bread crumbs or rye flour to prevent sticking. Enjoy!
Sour Baguettes Made Pretty Simple Just began attempting to improve my sourdough baguettes, and found a way that works pretty well for me. I don't know about most of you, but making a nice baguette has been a challenge for me. Shaping and rolling them out, then moving them to a proofing area, next transferring them to...	Well done! Those are super nice!! Thank you for the details on how you got those. They will be very helpful next time I make baguettes.
Does Liquid Starter also Double in Size? I've been feeding my starter for a week now. It's 100% hydration based off Jeffrey Hamelman's instructions (though 100% instead of 125% hydration, as the flour I use isn't as strong as US flour), and it does get a lot of bubbles on the top but it rises maybe 1 inch (in a measuri...	Escaping gas What you suspect is true, a liquid-ey starter will not expand as much as a thicker one, though they may be equally active. When bubbles of carbon dioxide generated by the microbes reach the surface, if not sufficiently trapped by the mixture, they will tend to pop and release into the atmosphere. You can m...
Wanted: A sourdough semolina ciabatta recipe Does anyone have an easy sourdough semolina recipe they can recommend? Should be nice and easy, a pleasure to make, and able to do it all by hand.Thank you.	Ciabatta I have been baking this for years and it has always worked spectacularly. Also easy as pie.https://figjamandlimecordial.com/2011/03/23/ciabatta-con-semola-rimacinata-di-grano-duro/
building the levain Trying to get some consistency in my bread and really working on my levain timing/mix. Finally paying more attention makes me realize that I am also a bit confused.I use 2 different 50/50 starters (one rye and one white/wheat) that I keep in the refrigerator. I bake once a week and try to use each s...	Hey jimt What I found works well for me is to take 30g of seed culture 100g of bread flour, 100g of whole wheat flour and 190g of boiled water that is at room temperature. I like to use boiled water because it doesn't have chlorine in it which can inhibit yeast activity.I leave it for about 8 to 12hrs. If it has risen...
Sourdough, air pocket at the top of the loaf Hi - The sourdough tastes nice and gets good overspring, it just touches the inside of the lid, but what could be causing the air pocket at the top of the loaf? Recipe: 123 Sourdough150 g- levain300 g- water450g- AP flour (for those in Canada, it's the Loblaw, no-name...	Looks great! Just a tiny shaping issue...popping any large gas bubbles while shaping the loaf. I want a bite into the crust, it looks so crispy. :)

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