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[1804.26 --> 1816.20] And I think that I'll probably keep my config in Lua going forward and just kind of adopt the new features as they come in, like, being able to set auto groups and things or, like, auto commands and things like that.
[1816.70 --> 1820.68] But, yeah, right now that's just glorified Vim in strings being called.
[1820.82 --> 1828.10] Like, if, you know, someone was starting today and they made their config in Lua, I wouldn't be like, switch it back to VimScript, it's better or something.
[1828.24 --> 1831.00] And I wouldn't really do the same, like, vice versa either.
[1831.00 --> 1840.30] I think, you know, if it's working for you and you're, like, happy with the end result, there's no reason to, like, spend a bunch of time switching the language to be something else.
[1840.62 --> 1845.62] I think they're both, like, really good options for, like, configuration at this time.
[1846.04 --> 1846.06] Yeah.
[1846.90 --> 1850.30] I made the decision that I was going to start it in Lua because I'm, like, I'm starting fresh.
[1850.42 --> 1851.14] I'm starting in Lua.
[1851.74 --> 1853.04] And then Nick showed me his.
[1853.22 --> 1859.74] And I'm like, nah, I'm going to go back to knit.vim because I can just copy-paste those right in when I want them without thinking.
[1860.36 --> 1860.76] Totally.
[1861.38 --> 1873.80] The other kind of little bit challenging thing is depending on, like, if you, you know, spend your free time perusing .files on GitHub, if you find something cool in Lua, you either have to translate it to Vim if you're not using Lua or vice versa.
[1874.14 --> 1878.36] And understanding how to do that translation is going to be fun for everybody.
[1879.18 --> 1880.98] Not the most transferable of skills.
[1881.28 --> 1882.74] You know, you're not going to put that on your resume.
[1882.74 --> 1886.62] I can translate configurations between VimScript and Lua.
[1886.90 --> 1887.28] Oh, wow.
[1887.70 --> 1888.60] Speak for yourself.
[1888.60 --> 1901.30] Speaking of translating VimScript to Lua, there's an interesting project that I have on my long-term horizon to explore that I've already written, like, a decent amount of stuff for.
[1901.30 --> 1909.38] Which is trying to basically transpile VimScript, the new language that Bram is making, into Lua.
[1909.82 --> 1915.04] And then keeping as much of the semantics as we can between the two.
[1915.04 --> 1920.92] One of my goals is, like, I would hope that we can keep Vim and NeoVim, like, as close and friendly as possible.
[1921.16 --> 1924.94] Like, no one on the NeoVim team has any animosity with people on the Vim team.
[1925.14 --> 1926.52] I don't really think vice versa either.
[1926.98 --> 1935.90] So, like, it's a long-term project that I can't decide if it's real or not or how much of my life I will devote to it.
[1935.90 --> 1942.58] But I have, like, some preliminary things and I can generate, like, valid Lua from Vim9 script.
[1942.80 --> 1951.94] So, there's, like, still, even in places where people might, at first glance, think that it's going to be impossible for Vim and NeoVim to, like, live together and be friendly.
[1952.40 --> 1954.80] I still have goals to make them be friends.
[1954.80 --> 1965.56] That's interesting because that's been one of my kind of lines of questioning that I'm thinking about here is that I'm starting to see, most recently, we'll get into TreeSitter and stuff like that.
[1965.66 --> 1967.92] But most recently, starting to see some plug-ins.
[1968.00 --> 1973.74] There's one called Limelight, which was written in Lua for NeoVim using TreeSitter for better dimming.
[1974.64 --> 1979.80] And it was the first time, because, you know, I watch a lot of these things, what people are working on, et cetera, for ChangeLog News.
[1980.08 --> 1982.96] And a lot of times, it's like, this is a Vim slash NeoVim thing.
[1982.96 --> 1984.34] And that was, like, for years.
[1984.66 --> 1987.32] It was either Vim only or Vim slash NeoVim.
[1987.44 --> 1989.48] And I'm starting to see, like, this is a NeoVim thing.
[1990.28 --> 1991.46] And there's no Vim equivalent.
[1991.60 --> 1997.60] There's no, they didn't take the time, whatever you have to do, to maybe write it twice or whatever it is.
[1998.12 --> 2001.82] And so, I started wondering, like, will that start to pull people away from Vim onto NeoVim?
[2001.86 --> 2004.76] And it's interesting, your perspective of, like, you don't necessarily want that to happen.
[2005.42 --> 2008.08] Yeah, I mean, some of them are just impossible, at least today.
[2008.08 --> 2013.64] Like, there's no way to get TreeSitter, at least that I know of, like, inside of them, right?
[2013.72 --> 2025.94] So, no matter what you do, if you want to build something on top of TreeSitter, which is a really powerful and interesting technology, like, that's going to most likely end up being NeoVim-only, like, plug-in.
[2025.94 --> 2038.66] And, I mean, even for me, like, you know, I will probably talk about Telescope a little bit, but, like, Telescope's NeoVim-only because it uses a ton of NeoVim-specific APIs that are only available in NeoVim.
[2038.66 --> 2043.68] And, like, uses the window things in complicated and interesting ways.
[2043.68 --> 2058.18] And, like, it relies heavily on the fact that you have Luogit installed and uses native C modules that we can link against C that, optionally, you can use to do sorting to make sorting even faster.
[2058.18 --> 2066.00] So, I think, like, there will be plug-ins that exist that are only for NeoVim, and there will be plug-ins that exist only for Vim, and that's fine.
[2066.24 --> 2076.18] My goal, and, like, the NeoVim team goal, I think, that I was trying to say before is basically just, like, we're not actively trying to make the community not work for both, right?
[2076.30 --> 2076.50] Yeah.
[2076.92 --> 2086.36] Well, I really appreciate that perspective because so many times when there are projects and efforts like these, so often it's like a hostile takeover kind of a thing or a long con.
[2086.36 --> 2092.58] Like, well, we're going to slowly take over, and I think that, I mean, at the end of the day, it's Vim, you know?
[2092.68 --> 2093.64] It's a different Vim.
[2093.76 --> 2094.54] It's a newer Vim.
[2094.64 --> 2097.30] It's got things Vim doesn't have, and it takes things out.
[2098.28 --> 2102.62] But still the same editor that we all know and love that's been around for all these years.
[2103.28 --> 2104.52] Like, why would you want to crush that?
[2104.60 --> 2105.42] Why would you want to kill it?
[2105.88 --> 2109.10] Yeah, and I mean, like, I respect Bram a lot.
[2109.10 --> 2115.46] Like, he's made an incredible piece of software, and it's, like, pretty bonkers if you just think about, like,
[2115.46 --> 2119.22] where it started to where it is now and all the things that he's done for it.
[2119.32 --> 2124.92] And, like, plus, Neovim is literally a fork, and so it's, like, we share a bunch of code that we never wrote.
[2125.06 --> 2125.56] Like, I don't know.
[2125.58 --> 2130.28] It feels kind of not very grateful and, like, not very thankful to just be, like,
[2130.78 --> 2134.70] and now we're our own thing, and I don't, like, you know, it's like an angry teenager.
[2134.82 --> 2136.62] Like, I don't even like you, Dad.
[2136.74 --> 2137.04] You know?
[2137.04 --> 2145.28] So, like, it's not exactly, like, the pinnacle of maturity, I think, necessarily all the time to, like, have that kind of situation.
[2145.70 --> 2149.58] And so it frustrates me when I see it online between people as well.
[2149.62 --> 2151.76] It's just, like, if they want to use Vim, that's cool.
[2151.88 --> 2153.50] Why would you be mad about that?
[2153.56 --> 2154.06] You know what I mean?
[2154.06 --> 2156.84] That just seems cool to have them do that.
[2156.88 --> 2157.34] That's great.
[2157.62 --> 2157.86] Yeah.
[2158.14 --> 2160.56] If we're going to hate on something, hate on the Emacs people.
[2160.64 --> 2160.98] Come on.
[2161.10 --> 2161.58] What's wrong with you?
[2161.58 --> 2167.52] Well, I mean, Emacs is now closer to Vim and NeoVim in spirit than many other places, right?
[2167.60 --> 2169.72] So not to name any other names, obviously.
[2171.26 --> 2171.70] Yeah.
[2171.86 --> 2175.66] They need to join forces to take on the onslaught of the graphical editors.
[2176.30 --> 2177.02] Oh, yes.
[2177.02 --> 2179.72] The evil graphical editors from far away lands.
[2179.84 --> 2181.00] In my browser now.
[2181.16 --> 2181.48] Yeah.
[2191.58 --> 2210.60] This episode is brought to you by our friends at Square.
[2210.98 --> 2212.94] Square is the platform that sellers trust.
[2212.94 --> 2220.28] There is a massive opportunity for developers to support Square sellers by building apps for today's business needs.
[2220.28 --> 2223.42] And I'm here with Shannon Skipper, head of developer relations at Square.
[2223.62 --> 2227.84] Shannon, can you share some details about the opportunity for developers on the Square platform?
[2228.14 --> 2228.52] Absolutely.
[2228.80 --> 2231.48] So we have millions of sellers who have unique needs.
[2231.76 --> 2234.86] And Square has apps like our point of sale app, like our restaurants app.
[2234.98 --> 2241.22] But there are so many different sellers, tuxedo shops, florists who need specific solutions for their domain.
[2241.22 --> 2252.58] And so we have a Node SDK written in TypeScript that allows you to access all of the backend APIs and SDKs that we use to power the billions of transactions that we do annually.
[2252.84 --> 2257.14] And so there's this massive market of sellers who need help from developers.
[2257.14 --> 2268.56] They either need a bespoke solution built for themselves on their own Node stack where they are working with Square dashboard, working with Square hardware or with the e-com, you know, what you see is what you get builder.
[2268.78 --> 2269.84] And they need one more thing.
[2269.92 --> 2271.22] They need an additional build.