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• The speaker initially thought they had RSI and started using Vim to alleviate the issue |
• Vim's ubiquity on Linux machines made it a practical choice for the speaker |
• The speaker's initial experience with Vim was limited, but they eventually picked it up after feeling motivated |
• The speaker values Vim's simplicity and customizability, as well as its ability to train muscle memory for efficient shortcuts |
• The speaker loves the unique "grammar" of Vim, which involves specifying actions before selecting text |
• The speaker believes that normal mode is the key to understanding what makes Vim special and unique. |
• The speaker explains how they came to understand Vim's different modes by comparing them to a painter's work, where normal mode is like holding a paintbrush not touching the canvas and insert mode is like touching the canvas. |
• The speaker shares their experience of realizing the undo command works in a specific way in Vim, allowing for undoable chunks of work, which helps to understand the modal nature of Vim. |
• The speaker discusses the utility of Vim's visual mode for selecting and manipulating text. |
• The speaker highlights the customizability of Vim and its rich plugin community, mentioning several plugins they use, including surround.vim, fugitive, and exchange. |
• Discussion of custom text objects and grammar in Vim |
• Missing operator for toggling comments |
• Use of plugins, including Commentary, Vim Airline, and Git Gutter |
• Preference for minimal plugins and customization |
• Comparison of different plugins for Git functionality |
• Use of Ale for language-specific features |
• Recommendation of fuzzy file finder plugins like fzf or Selecta |
• The speaker discusses the limitations of copying their entire Vim configuration file, suggesting that users only copy the "basic editing configuration" section for a modern take on Vim config. |
• The speaker shares their personal preferences for Vim's features, such as automatic jumping to the last position in a file and the ability to undo previous actions. |
• The speaker recommends using "basic.vim" instead of their own Vim configuration file, which has "extra garbage" in addition to what's in "basic.vim". |
• The speaker discusses the phenomenon of "Vim mode" in other editors and apps, where they attempt to mimic Vim's command mode for the benefit of Vim users. |
• The speaker shares their experience with using Vim emulations in other editors, finding that they often lack the features and feel of real Vim. |
• The speaker notes that better knowledge of Vim leads to increased dissatisfaction with emulations, citing the complexity of Vim's codebase as a contributing factor. |
• The speaker discusses the benefits of accessibility and usability in software design, citing their own use of VoiceOver on Mac as an example. |
• The speaker and others they know prefer using vim navigation in email clients and websites. |
• The speaker discusses the "insider nerd club" aspect of using vim, where users feel a sense of belonging when they see others use similar keybindings. |
• Gmail and other email clients are mentioned as having vim-like navigation, but the built-in Mac mail app does not meet the speaker's expectations. |
• The speaker and others use vim-like navigation on Twitter and other websites. |
• The conversation turns to the reasons why vim is so popular, with the speaker suggesting that once users start feeling the benefits, they become "sticky" and hard to switch from. |
• The ubiquity and persistence of vim as a tool on Unix machines is mentioned as a factor in its popularity. |
• The speaker also mentions the ease of use on resource-constrained devices like Raspberry Pi and the aesthetic appeal of using a terminal-based editor. |
• Discussion of vim's editing efficiency and popularity |
• Criticisms of vim's handling of multiple languages in a single file |
• Comparison of vim to Textmate and other editors with better features for handling multiple languages |
• Frustrations with vim's configuration and scripting language (vimscript) |
• Issues with vim's default settings and lack of consistency across different systems |
• Comparison of vim's scripting language to Emacs Lisp |
• Frustrations with the Vim community and culture, including dogma and competitiveness |
• Difficulty with Vim's steep learning curve and the reluctance to start using it due to perceived pressure |
• Technical frustrations with Vim, including accidentally triggering macro recording mode and not knowing how to cancel actions |
• Importance of not being too hard on oneself when trying to learn Vim and being willing to give it another try |
• Speed of Vim is uncontested, but whether it's worth giving up other features is a trade-off |
• The value of speed in coding and the importance of not getting distracted or losing one's train of thought |
• Vim's longevity and the fact that it's unlikely to be replaced, making its keystrokes a worthwhile investment |
• A discussion of the history of popular text editors and how Vim has remained relevant despite changes in the market |
• Recommendations for learning Vim, including the "Vim Adventures" game and a potential upcoming course |
• An invitation to join the Changelog's Vim community and share thoughts on the episode. |
[0.00 --> 18.80] vim the final frontier sorry that's so lame i've just always wanted to do that let's run it back |
[18.80 --> 29.54] vim a modal text editor from 1991 with roots in vi that go back to 1976 that's 45 years ago and |
[29.54 --> 35.84] yet here we are in 2021 30 years after vim's initial release and it's still used and loved by |
[35.84 --> 40.68] nerds around the world you can't even really call it a comeback because it's been popular for years |
[40.68 --> 47.28] on this special episode of the changelog we thought it would be fun to hear a bit of vim's story from |
[47.28 --> 53.60] the mouths of its users so i gathered some friends new and old and asked them to tell me all about vim |
[53.60 --> 58.96] and why they love it thank you to our friends at source graph for partnering with us to make this |
[58.96 --> 65.10] episode interruption free teams with large code bases and many repos struggle with the usefulness |
[65.10 --> 70.54] that grep and command shift f offer they need a better way to search and discover all their code |
[70.54 --> 75.70] and open source dependencies they need source graph point source graph at the repos you work with |
[75.70 --> 82.28] stored in any code host then start searching stay in flow and find your answers quickly try source graph |
[82.28 --> 89.04] at info dot source graph dot com slash changelog all right let's meet our guests starting with julia |
[89.04 --> 97.76] evans i'm julia i've been using vim for i think 17 years and i am a programmer and i currently for a |
[97.76 --> 104.00] living write comics about programming hi i'm drew neal you may know me as the voice of vimcasts i also |
[104.00 --> 111.50] wrote practical vim and modern vim and aside from my sort of vim work i'm a web developer by day and i |
[111.50 --> 117.46] also do um uh sort of related to all the vimcasts and books and so on i do training sessions about vim |
[117.46 --> 123.82] so um i've been using vim since about 2008 something like that i think i'm gary bernhardt the thing people |
[123.82 --> 128.78] are most likely to know me from is a lightning talk called wat which is almost 10 years old now |
[128.78 --> 134.28] right now i'm working on execute program which is an interactive learning program that's kind of |
[134.28 --> 139.94] unique in that we mix lots of real code examples in with explanations all running in your browser |
[139.94 --> 145.42] real code examples in the browser i've been using vim for about 15 years since 2006 i was an emacs user |
[145.42 --> 150.20] before that and then before that you know visual studio and sort of more mainstream windowsy kinds |
[150.20 --> 155.04] of editors and i also went back and forth between emacs and vim a number of times in the early days so i |
[155.04 --> 159.52] have a lot of sort of comparison reference points there i'm suz hinton i do software development |
[159.52 --> 166.62] professionally and also in my spare time as a hobby i most frequently work in golang ruby javascript but |
[166.62 --> 171.62] i kind of like to do a little bit of everything from the top of the stack right down to almost the |
[171.62 --> 177.92] bare metal not quite assembly and i switched to using vim around four years ago one thing that has |
[177.92 --> 184.94] always fascinated me is how people come to select their tools techniques programming languages and so on |
[184.94 --> 190.64] as a developer your text editor is one of the most important choices you make because you use it all |
[190.64 --> 197.20] day every day it is the primary interface to the work that you do i learned vim not because i chose to |
[197.20 --> 203.52] but by dictate my programming teacher in college was a staunch vim proponent and forced us to write |
[203.52 --> 209.68] all of our programs sshed into a linux machine using vim i kind of hated him for it at the time but i |
[209.68 --> 214.78] definitely appreciate it in retrospect shout out to john clark if he's out there listening i |
[214.78 --> 219.64] remember him once saying pico is a totally fine editor if you're writing emails to your grandma |
[219.64 --> 226.34] if you're writing code you better be using vim so that is how i came to know vim here's how drew got |
[226.34 --> 233.66] started switching jobs i was at a job where we all used max and back then uh we were a rails shop and |
[233.66 --> 240.00] everyone was using textmate and i switched to a job where it was all linux workstations and textmate |
[240.00 --> 244.48] didn't run on linux so i had to pick another editor uh i think the ones i was considering at |
[244.48 --> 251.48] the time were emacs vim and gedit i think and yeah i think um it was a small company but there were a |
[251.48 --> 255.72] fair few vim users so i thought well if i start using vim i've got a few more people i can ask |
[255.72 --> 261.52] questions of so that was kind of what got me into vim and i knew at the time i was aware that vim had |
[261.52 --> 266.14] really good support for rails which is what i was mainly working with at the time mainly thanks to |
[266.14 --> 271.92] tim pope who created the the rails.vim plugin way back um so in some ways that was sort of the |
[271.92 --> 277.02] gateway drug to to vim coming from a rails background i think vim was quite quite popular |
[277.02 --> 281.94] with rails developers at the time so it kind of felt like a natural step it's funny how the social not |
[281.94 --> 288.42] social pressure but just like the social environment around you helped make that decision yeah yeah that's |
[288.42 --> 293.26] true i mean i could have could have moved to a job where there were i don't know five emacs users and |
[293.26 --> 298.68] two vim users and uh it would have worked out differently we'll be all watching emacs casts yeah |
[298.68 --> 305.48] while drew's experience may be somewhat common gary came to vim from a completely different angle |
[305.48 --> 312.30] and while i hadn't considered it before i have to say it's a compelling reason for me and i don't know |
[312.30 --> 320.94] how common this is but for me it was motivated by fear of rsi injury programming long term is dangerous |
[320.94 --> 325.62] for your hands fortunately not the rest of you for your hands and your wrists totally dangerous and |
[325.62 --> 330.62] i wanted to keep programming for many more decades so i was using emacs a lot of cording in emacs a lot |
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