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[1094.76 → 1097.22] I just saw the notification and dismissed it. |
[1097.26 → 1097.96] I was like, oh, whatever. |
[1098.04 → 1098.72] I'll get to you later. |
[1098.86 → 1100.38] I dismissed it and then mine came back. |
[1100.50 → 1106.74] Mine is for the add-on core underscore SSH, which uses secrets, which have been detected as not secure. |
[1107.40 → 1110.02] Probably a lot of people in the audience are getting this if they run home assistant. |
[1110.02 → 1113.02] It's a new feature, quote unquote, that has been integrated. |
[1113.78 → 1116.00] And frankly, probably a good one. |
[1116.00 → 1119.26] Yeah, but the internet being the internet, people are pissed. |
[1119.78 → 1122.12] I don't really get this. |
[1122.36 → 1126.38] Maybe I'm just becoming a grumpy old man now I'm a dad. |
[1127.08 → 1131.38] And outrage culture is just, I don't know, I'm just tired of it. |
[1131.38 → 1138.70] So there's a link in the show notes to a post by Troy Hunt, who is an incredibly well-respected security researcher. |
[1139.18 → 1142.68] And he's the guy that is behind the website, Have I Been Pwned? |
[1142.68 → 1145.28] And this website is incredible. |
[1145.40 → 1153.04] You can tap in any password into their database, and it'll tell you that, yes, this password is out in the wild. |
[1153.36 → 1161.96] And as Troy puts it, if your password is in this list, I've seen it clear text, which means that the bad guys have seen it clear text. |
[1161.96 → 1162.44] Right. |
[1162.70 → 1171.72] So no matter your opinion on how secure you think it is, I guarantee it's out there in the wild somewhere and somebody knows what it is. |
[1171.76 → 1173.40] So don't use that password. |
[1173.62 → 1176.72] It's actually pretty clever for the home assistant developers to build this in. |
[1176.76 → 1179.90] So the way it works is your passwords are hashed. |
[1180.30 → 1188.60] The first five characters of that hash, so just the first five characters of a hash of your password, are then used to query the Have I Been Pwned website. |
[1188.60 → 1192.70] It then returns a result of possible password hashes that match. |
[1193.26 → 1197.88] And then home assistant checks that list against your hash locally. |
[1198.10 → 1201.34] All of that validation is happening on your box. |
[1201.88 → 1214.84] And what I found fascinating, and Troy goes into full details in the article, he basically goes through the home assistant forums thread where people are bitching and moaning and whining about this feature being turned on without their permission. |
[1214.84 → 1224.66] To give you an idea of how, I don't want to say stupid, but honestly, when I was reading this Troy Hunt article, I was like, yeah, this thread is stupid. |
[1225.48 → 1229.14] Someone was complaining it was sending out data over their metered connection. |
[1229.40 → 1229.50] Right. |
[1229.60 → 1232.96] He then proceeded to say it's a few bytes. |
[1233.32 → 1234.72] Like 36 kilobytes, you know? |
[1235.00 → 1235.28] Yeah. |
[1235.48 → 1239.24] We're talking five times smaller than the average web page load. |
[1239.42 → 1242.12] If you notice that on a metered connection, then you've got problems. |
[1242.54 → 1242.74] Right. |
[1242.74 → 1244.60] We're not really talking very much data. |
[1244.80 → 1250.86] And it's probably, although we don't know for sure, only happening when you start up home assistant or reload the config. |
[1251.54 → 1254.34] How do you feel about doing this on your local LAN? |
[1254.42 → 1257.94] I mean, I'm definitely guilty of reusing passwords on the internet. |
[1258.58 → 1260.90] I'm certainly guilty of doing it on my LAN. |
[1261.28 → 1265.60] That seems to be the crux of everyone's argument is my LAN, my rules. |
[1265.60 → 1272.10] I have a safe, trusted environment, and I don't want to have to use good password hygiene. |
[1272.30 → 1274.54] I don't want long passwords that are unique. |
[1274.54 → 1277.70] And I can definitely relate. |
[1278.40 → 1284.52] There's sort of, when you do this for a living, every now, and then it's nice to be a little lazy. |
[1285.04 → 1289.90] Like, you know, what's the saying about the guy who makes shoes, his kids always have the worst shoes? |
[1290.54 → 1291.30] You know? |
[1291.66 → 1294.80] Like, because you just get home, it's the last thing you want to do, right? |
[1294.84 → 1295.84] It's just the last thing. |
[1296.08 → 1296.28] Yeah. |
[1296.28 → 1298.08] So I do understand that. |
[1298.26 → 1301.20] However, this is where I fall down on it. |
[1301.70 → 1311.16] The home assistant community is kind of a special case because they're playing around with IoT smart devices that are network connected. |
[1312.20 → 1319.08] There's a higher threat level, a broader threat attack surface, if you will. |
[1319.14 → 1325.28] And so I feel like you have to be a little more secure when you are willing to ride the IoT train, you know? |
[1325.28 → 1330.26] Because the problem is any one of those individual devices one day could become compromised. |
[1330.54 → 1333.98] And then that becomes a launching off point where they can go after other devices on your LAN. |
[1334.04 → 1335.34] And we see it happen. |
[1335.84 → 1342.18] And to that point, Troy actually makes this point in his article that LinkedIn, I mean, we're talking a proper website here, |
[1343.06 → 1348.64] had a data breach because one of their developers' home networks had a weak SSH password, |
[1348.64 → 1356.04] which allowed people to pivot through that developer's home network into LinkedIn servers and compromise LinkedIn that way. |
[1356.48 → 1357.82] Yeah, they brute forced his iMac. |
[1357.96 → 1363.58] And so, you know, I put myself in that developer's shoes and I think, well, holy crap, someone could pivot into Red Hat from here. |
[1363.62 → 1364.94] And I wouldn't want that. |
[1365.12 → 1368.96] So I think to myself, OK, actually, Troy, you've probably got a point here. |
[1369.00 → 1370.74] I do need to step up my game. |
[1370.74 → 1372.72] And he uses 1Password. |
[1372.82 → 1374.80] I think he's on the advisory board for 1Password. |
[1375.02 → 1377.66] But we talked last episode about Bitwarden. |
[1378.20 → 1385.34] And I really cannot emphasize enough, you know, there are command line clients and stuff like that you can use. |
[1385.38 → 1388.98] So you can put it in scripts and do all sorts of fun stuff if you want to. |
[1389.10 → 1399.78] And I think that's going to have to become a 2021 rather late New Year's resolution for me is to try and use that CLI stuff more on my LAN at least. |
[1399.78 → 1404.22] Yeah, good passwords, I think, matter when we're kind of riding the cutting edge of technology. |
[1404.22 → 1411.94] Even if you're not intentionally exposing your LAN to the Internet, you never know when some crazy thing could happen. |
[1412.30 → 1413.78] It's unlikely, but it could happen. |
[1413.98 → 1424.82] But really, you also never know if one day somebody's going to be able to rock up onto your Wi-Fi or something or somebody joins your LAN that you put on intentionally, but they have some misconfiguration or infection. |
[1424.82 → 1430.32] So it's kind of like multiple layers of protecting yourself is the best kind of protection. |
[1430.58 → 1438.78] And I think when you look at logins, you could look at maybe not only unique passwords, but when possible, also using keys to do SSH sign-ins. |
[1438.98 → 1440.80] So that way you have to have maybe a key and a password. |
[1441.18 → 1442.98] And that just takes it a little bit step further. |
[1442.98 → 1451.64] Like that LinkedIn developer, if he had had a decent password or password and a key, then the attackers would have never gotten onto his iMac and then never gotten into LinkedIn. |
[1452.12 → 1465.80] And when the whole COVID lockdown thing started, and we had a lot more people all of a sudden working from home, that was one of my first concerns is, well, now all of these corporations are as insecure as people's home networks are. |
[1465.80 → 1468.46] And you never know when that could be an issue as well. |
[1468.60 → 1475.92] I just think as much of a pain in the arse as it is, there are enough tools, and we know enough information now that it's worth doing. |
[1476.22 → 1483.10] The only thing I would have changed with how Home Assistant has implemented this is give me an option to turn it off for a bit. |
[1483.82 → 1486.16] You know, I'm not fixing it while I'm out here in the woods. |
[1486.94 → 1490.32] Silence that checkbox for seven days or something, you know. |
[1490.56 → 1493.38] Or until next update even, you know, that could work too. |
[1493.38 → 1497.86] I do believe they're actually working on making it opt-in or opt-out now. |
[1498.38 → 1503.54] So for what it's worth, the outrage has had some effect on the feature. |
[1504.24 → 1505.44] But I mean, I think it's great. |
[1505.56 → 1510.76] I think anything that we can do, and here's another point about the Home Assistant community being a special case as well, |
[1511.48 → 1517.98] is a lot of people are coming to servers for the first time because of Home Assistant. |
[1517.98 → 1522.78] They're running a box in their house for the first time that's got SSH listening on something. |
[1523.38 → 1524.90] Maybe for the first time ever. |
[1525.84 → 1533.60] And anything that Home Assistant can do for this kind of newer users that aren't, you know, |
[1534.00 → 1541.10] enterprise-grade buffoons like me that just reminds them that, hold on, you know, |
[1541.14 → 1546.02] if you're exposing your house to the internet through Nebukassar, through WireGuard, |
[1546.16 → 1548.86] through whatever it might be, there is some risk. |
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