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**Gerhard Lazu:** \[31:57\] That was a great one, so thank you, Dan. We will make it happen, for sure. Upbound Cloud, it's in the future as well... But anyways, let's leave that for another time, because this is one thing which I find myself doing - I get excited about so many things, and I wanna do everything, and it'... |
Cool. So there were two more incidents which happened shortly after our second one, the origin, the PR\#378, and they all had to do with Linode networking issues and Linode LKE unavailability. I'll link it in the show notes, the specific incidents, which we called them out... But as a result, August 3, August 26th, inc... |
There was a couple of things there... The one with LKE was interesting, because our database, the backups and the restores when there's networking issues - they are not as reliable, which then prevents things from rebooting properly... So that was like an interesting one. I'm sure we'll come back to this, especially as... |
The other one was around, again, CDN Fastly. The website was available 100%. 100% uptime on the Changelog.com via CDN. But our origin, our backend, the LKE one, in these periods, between the two episodes, between episode 10, which was July 15th, and this one, we had 99.69 uptime, which means we were down for four hours... |
**Jerod Santo:** Yeah. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** So this was a U.S. East issue. This is a networking issue in multiple data centers? When you say U.S. East, that's multiple, right? |
**Gerhard Lazu:** I'm not sure how many data centers they have, but... |
**Jerod Santo:** It's one region though, right? |
**Gerhard Lazu:** It's a region, yes. So they don't have U.S. East 1, U.S. East 2, or... |
**Adam Stacoviak:** I see. |
**Gerhard Lazu:** ...you know, as other providers have. So I think it's a single data center, but anyways, it was affecting us, and it was like a region-wide networking issue. That was August 3rd, and August 26th there was like LKE issue. It was unavailable for about an hour, and things were failing in weird and wonder... |
**Adam Stacoviak:** So Linode has a global infrastructure page where they show off the regions... I think it's one, marketing, but then two, obviously, informational... But if what they mean by U.S. East comprises Toronto, Newark, which is in New Jersey, and Atlanta, which is in Georgia - Toronto is in Canada - so that... |
**Gerhard Lazu:** For us it's Newark, in New Jersey. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** So what do you do then? When you have this kind of issue, how do you remedy? How do you plan for network downtime? One, you've got database backups that could go wrong, the reliability, as you mentioned, or even rebooting despite network issues... How do you SRE around this kind of issue? |
**Gerhard Lazu:** So we touched up on this in episode ten, where we talked about multi-cloud... But I think for us it's even simpler than that. I started looking to Fly, like seriously looking at Fly recently, and they have a concept of running multiple instances of your app in different regions, very easily. And it wo... |
**Jerod Santo:** No. |
**Gerhard Lazu:** The upload media volume. |
**Jerod Santo:** Oh, yes. |
**Gerhard Lazu:** \[35:56\] Until we have that, we can only run a single instance, because the volume is just local; it can only exist in a single region. Things get very complicated if we use multi regions. I know there are solutions, but the trade-offs - I wouldn't want to make them. It'd be much easier -- |
**Adam Stacoviak:** And that's a Linode thing, right? That's not a -- that block storage, essentially. That's what that is, is just local storage. |
**Gerhard Lazu:** Exactly. Block storage, local storage... Yeah. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Okay. I wasn't sure if it was their block storage service, and it's local to that -- |
**Gerhard Lazu:** Yeah, it doesn't matter how it's implemented, or who you're using, whether it's Fly, whether it's Linode, whether it's GCP... In this case, a disk can only be attached to a single instance, and it's like a Kubernetes limitation as well, depending on the CSI driver... The point being, until we store ou... |
**Jerod Santo:** So I've made the first steps in that directions, I just haven't made steps two through N at this point. And the first step was to identify the replacement library for Arc, which is the file uploads library we are using... Which does have S3 support, but has fallen into -- I don't wanna call it "disrepa... |
There are some folks who've picked up the mantle and run with it, and it's actually a community fork called Waffle, which is being maintained by the communities. I couldn't remember it, I had to find it in my bookmark history or my search history, because Waffle does not come to mind when you think of Elixir file uploa... |
**Adam Stacoviak:** That would include user-related stuff to like avatars, uploaded images to news items... Anything uploaded essentially into this - that would be no longer local; it would be in the S3-compatible, everything. |
**Jerod Santo:** That's right. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Yeah. |
**Break:** \[38:30\] |
**Gerhard Lazu:** There is one more thing which I wanna talk about before we tackle the next steps, which I'm a big fan of - what happens between episode 20 and episode 30. The thing that I wanna talk about before we cover next steps is the errors in Sentry that we've been seeing. So between July 15th and September, ba... |
Sentry makes it really easy to see exactly what's been happening in the app. 2.3k thousand of them are the undefined function error crypto HMAC parity 3. And this is actually linked to the Erlang 24 upgrade that we did with Alex Koutmos three months ago. Alex, it's your fault... No, it's not. It's actually mine. \[laug... |
One of the unintended side effects of that upgrade was that one of the libraries that we use - and Jerod knows more about this - is no longer working. So tell us a bit more about that, Jerod. |
**Jerod Santo:** Well, I can tell you the rabbit hole I've gone down trying to fix it, which is that basically our Twitter Auth has been offline ever since then... Which so far only Mat Ryer seems to know about, so maybe he's the only one who uses Twitter Auth on a regular basis... Because he's always like, "I can't si... |
So that's as far as I've gotten... I've found out what the problem is. I think it's when it's passing in an empty session cookie, for some reason, and it's trying to HMAC an empty string, if I recall correctly... It's hairy down in there, but actually, it's just navigating the debugging which has made me not be able to... |
So I haven't fixed it, I haven't opened an issue yet... I hope that somebody just upgrades the thing and it goes away. Maybe -- is Erlang 25 out yet? I don't know... What changed, Gerhard? What's going on in there? Because I can't figure it out quite yet. |
**Gerhard Lazu:** So a function call that this library is making no longer exists. Crypto HMAC with an arity of 3, which takes three arguments - it's undefined in Erlang 24. It must have been removed. So we can go to Erlang 23, it wouldn't take much, really... But 24 - it came out in July; it's a much better one. So ma... |
\[44:18\] Other than this, we haven't seen any issues. So it's a good upgrade to make. We are on the latest major of Erlang. Erlang 25 is coming out next year. They ship once a year, in the summer, June/July, sometimes May... But it's usually June. So I see two things. Either someone from the library just says like "Pa... |
**Jerod Santo:** Yeah, absolutely. |
**Gerhard Lazu:** I would quite like that. And if that doesn't happen - not a problem. Maybe we just disable Twitter Auth. If there's not that many people using it... Sorry, Mat. I don't know what we do about that... \[laughs\] But if there's not many people using it, why don't we just remove the feature, rather than -... |
**Jerod Santo:** Right. |
**Gerhard Lazu:** And either is acceptable. I don't mind which one it is, as long as the number of errors is going down, as long as we're improving this. What do you think? |
**Jerod Santo:** Yeah, I'm pro fixing it, but I'm also -- it didn't cross my mind just to disable it in the meantime. I think that's probably the move - you disable it till you get it fixed; and we definitely wanna get it fixed. There's no reason not to... |
And the ueberauth\_twitter is maintained; I don't' see anybody complaining about this. I feel like we're getting in a weird state that nobody else does, where -- I think that arity of 3 is the issue; it's passing in an empty string when it shouldn't be... Anyways, I feel like I could probably get to the bottom of it an... |
**Gerhard Lazu:** Maybe even just sharing the stack trace as we have it, and see what the developers of that library think or have to say. Maybe it's an easy fix, I don't know. |
**Jerod Santo:** Yeah... |
**Gerhard Lazu:** Maybe they don't even know this is happening, because we're the only ones having this problem, which is hard to believe... But maybe people are so stumped by it that they say "You know what - I don't even know how to report this issue." |
**Jerod Santo:** Yeah... Part of it is my open source citizenship; I feel obligated to spend eight hours on it before I open an issue, because I know that I'm gonna take someone else's time... So I'm hesitant to open it. Although, on the other side, you're gonna save other people time if they have the same issue. But t... |
**Gerhard Lazu:** Exactly. Well, that's why we do this, right? We think about improvement; how to improve things, even though it may be difficult... But it's that spirit of improvement, of contributing to the open source... Because otherwise, where would we be without it? I don't wanna think about that. |
The other source of errors, which -- by the way, these are only three days ago... Ecto.Query.CastError. We had 700 in the last three days. And that seems a bit more meaningful. |
**Jerod Santo:** Yeah. So this is a specific route. Your first point is well taken, because I haven't seen this one, whereas the other one, I knew about it quite well, because every time I look at Sentry, it's the top of the list. I haven't actually seen this one till right now, and it looks like it's a single endpoint... |
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