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I got an email from [Rob](https://twitter.com/rob_pike) one day, and he was like "Hey, do you wanna do this full-time?" I had already done Android a few years at that point and it was pretty obvious that Android was here to stay... It wasn't a crazy idea anymore, so it was time for a new crazy idea. But now it looks li... |
**Carlisia Thompson:** And now it's time for you to ove on... |
**Brad Fitzpatrick:** I don't know... I don't know what I would do. |
**Brian Ketelsen:** Yeah, I remember very specifically... Probably mid-2010, there was a good, solid time period where every change in Go was driven by a Camlistore change. It was easy to follow it like clockwork. |
**Brad Fitzpatrick:** All the HTTP stuff kind of came out of there, the database stuff came out of there, a lot of changes in the Strings package... Even `strings.Contains()`, and very basic things like that. |
**Carlisia Thompson:** So I took a look at Camlistore from watching your videos, and it's really cool. We have a few questions from listener ZelenHunter; his question about Camlistore specifically is "Will you go back to actively developing Camlistore?" I saw that you did have a release this month, but does that mean y... |
**Brad Fitzpatrick:** No, I actively review stuff that this other guy, Mathieu works on. He works on it all the time. I'm still kind of watching and involved; I don't write as much code on it as I used to. Maybe when I go on my paternity leave I will do that instead of... In my breaks. We'll see. |
**Carlisia Thompson:** Do you see it ever becoming a solid product? |
**Brad Fitzpatrick:** I mean, it's pretty usable and solid right now. Every release we do gets a little bit more mainstream and a little bit more usable. I think two or three releases ago we did this launcher... If you go to Camlistore.org/launch, we have a little form that creates you your own instance running on Goog... |
**Brian Ketelsen:** That's cool. |
**Carlisia Thompson:** That's cool. |
**Brad Fitzpatrick:** So then it came out, but it was like at a ugly IP address, and the security was over an HTTPS cert that was self-signed, and then I went off and I worked on [LetsEncrypt](https://letsencrypt.org/) support and I added that to the Golang. I worked with this other guy who implemented Acme, but then I... |
Now Camlistore can get a LetsEncrypt certificate but we needed to do a domain name automatically, so when people created their own instance, they had one. Then we created this DNS server that you get a subdomain of Camlistore.net automatically, and we have a little protocol that's like Acme, and we'll give you any subd... |
The end result is you go through this wizard and you say `create vm`, and then 40-60 seconds later you have a running instance with a fully-trusted cert and domain name. |
**Brian Ketelsen:** How do you get around the subdomain rate limiting for LetsEncrypt? Because they have a pretty strict 20 subdomains/week limit. |
**Brad Fitzpatrick:** We don't have that many users, so we haven't really had that problem yet. |
**Brian Ketelsen:** Okay, but be warned... It's coming. |
**Erik St. Martin:** Challenge accepted. |
**Brad Fitzpatrick:** Yeah... Well, at that point we'll help people to bring their own, or send them through some domain creation flow elsewhere. |
**Carlisia Thompson:** Another question from this user is "How is the core Go team dealing with burnout?" I'm not even aware that the Go team has a burnout issue, but I thought it was a good question to ask in case this is the case. Can you talk a little about that? |
**Brad Fitzpatrick:** Yeah, it is getting a little bit repetitive. I know [Andrew](https://twitter.com/enneff) - he went to work on Upspin because he kind of needed a change... You know, you do the same thing for years and years, and it kind of gets a little repetitive. |
I'm kind of there myself, because I think Go 1.9 will be my 10th or 11th Go release, not counting all the point releases in the middle... And it's a little frustrating that you can't fix a lot of things and you keep seeing the same bug reports and the same proposals over and over and you have to keep duping all these b... |
I try to mix it up and do different tasks occasionally, and focus on different things... The HTTP/2 stuff I did for Go 1.6 was a good distraction, because I got to actually write code and think about new types of problems. Now I'm doing all these dashboards and stats on community interaction, which is interesting in so... |
**Erik St. Martin:** Do you think that the frustration with not being able to change, and things like that, might help motivate more of a 2.0, or at least getting the thought process and talks going on about what 2.0 might look like? |
**Brad Fitzpatrick:** Yeah, I think we're all kind of feeling that or getting in that -- feeling that we probably need to do one. I don't know, it's been almost... Go became an open source project in November 2009. I think Rob was saying that if he were to do a Go 2, ten years would probably be a good time. |
Personally, my biggest concern is that another language would come out and would have goroutines. I feel like goroutines are Go's real feature. No one else does lightweight threading really well. Other people have copied the good tooling, but the go type system is incredibly interesting. If someone came out with a lang... |
**Brian Ketelsen:** Have you guys seen Crystal yet? |
**Brad Fitzpatrick:** Which one is that? |
**Brian Ketelsen:** Crystal is the Ruby-alike that's written in C or C++ and it's fast as hell, compiles down to native... They've stolen all of goroutines and channels, the whole works, and it is actually really fast. The standard library still needs some work; it's not 1.0 yet. I was playing with it a weekend or two ... |
**Erik St. Martin:** I always like tinkering with new languages. |
**Brad Fitzpatrick:** Who's behind it? |
**Brian Ketelsen:** I don't remember... A small group in Europe, maybe. |
**Erik St. Martin:** That's [crystal-lang.org](https://crystal-lang.org/). |
**Brian Ketelsen:** It's sponsored by... I can't remember. Manas.tech is the company behind it. |
**Brad Fitzpatrick:** That's promising, that there's more than one person. |
**Erik St. Martin:** It's always fun just to even poke at other languages... What are some of the other ones that we've poked at over the years, Brian? Pony, Nim... |
**Brian Ketelsen:** Pony is not for me. Nim is fun... What are the others? I've played with Elixir... Elixir is not different enough for me. |
**Erik St. Martin:** I mean, you're right there - goroutines are really awesome. I remember the first time I discovered that you can just use them at will... When you recommend that to people, they're like "How many of these can I have?" "As many as you need." "Wait, there's not some kind of cap?" "No, just keep using ... |
**Brian Ketelsen:** "How many do you want?" |
**Brad Fitzpatrick:** I was following both Rust and Swift... Both of them were flirting with the idea of adding lightweight tasks or goroutines or fibers or whatever you wanna call them, and both projects kind of gave up on it and said, "Well, it's a little difficult, and I think pthreads are good enough... Maybe we'll... |
Everyone kind of keeps thinking about it and not doing it. Somebody else will do it, I'm sure. |
**Erik St. Martin:** Oh yeah, I think it's a guarantee somebody will do it, it just becomes a question of who - is it a new language, or does it get adopted into the new version of a current language...? But I think it's hard not to at least consider it with the accelerated growth that Go has seen over just a couple of... |
I think that other prospective new languages at least have to question "Why are people so drawn to that language?" and start to adopt some of those things. |
**Brian Ketelsen:** Well, going back to Crystal for a minute... Crystal has the recipe for some good success, because people enjoy the Ruby syntax a lot (some people do) and adding things like goroutines and channels to that seems like it could be a good recipe, but when you play with it, it just doesn't all click like... |
**Erik St. Martin:** It sounds fluid, yeah. |
**Brian Ketelsen:** Yeah, I've heard many times... One of the core competences of Go is that it's written to be read, and most languages just aren't. Go is optimized for people to read that code, and it has such a huge impact on your productivity... It's hard to describe how hard it would be to replicate that somewhere... |
**Erik St. Martin:** I think from the other side too, people don't wanna try the language because they want something they feel is complex... It tickles that part of you brain, like "Oh, I need to learn something super cool and complex", rather than what they feel is like an easier language. So it's hard to break that ... |
**Brad Fitzpatrick:** Did you guys see YouTube is working on that Python runtime written in Go? I think [Grumpy](https://github.com/google/grumpy)... |
**Brian Ketelsen:** Oh, yeah. |
**Erik St. Martin:** Yeah, yeah. |
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