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**Brian Ketelsen:** That was a great post. |
**Carlisia Thompson:** Wasn't it? It's really interesting. He goes into different categories of things, for example package management, project organization and testing, error handling... It's a very good read. |
**Brian Ketelsen:** It really was, and probably there aren't that many projects at that sort of scale where you can get a view of that project from the outside without a non-disclosure agreement, so it's neat to see somebody intimate with that project talk about it so well. |
**Erik St. Martin:** So actually, NATS has probably been around that long, too. |
**Brian Ketelsen:** Did you just mansplain us? "Actually..." \[laughter\] |
**Carlisia Thompson:** I think he was more like there, like "Where is NATS blog post about the three and a half years of Go usage?" |
**Brian Ketelsen:** Well, there's a blog post on [Gopher Academy](https://gopheracademy.com/) - I think I even dropped it in the Slack - about NATS and Go and Ruby. Oh yeah, I did... High-performance cloud native messaging written in Go. |
**Erik St. Martin:** How long have you been working on NATS, Wally? |
**Wally Quevedo:** I think since I joined Apcera, about a couple of years ago. |
**Erik St. Martin:** It'd be interesting to hear how Apcera's platform and NATS has evolved over that period of time, too. |
**Wally Quevedo:** Yeah, it would be cool to summarize. |
**Erik St. Martin:** We'll tap Derek on the shoulder. \[laughter\] |
**Brian Ketelsen:** Cough-cough... |
**Erik St. Martin:** Because that means some of that stuff has had to have changed quite a bit. We don't think about it as much from release to release, but when you start thinking back three, four years, the things that have changed just in the idioms and the way we do things is actually really interesting. I can't ev... |
**Brian Ketelsen:** You know why we didn't care about vendoring? Because there were no packages back then. We all had to write our own. When I was a kid, we didn't have external packages, we had to write our won. |
**Erik St. Martin:** Yeah, there was very little outside of database libraries. |
**Brian Ketelsen:** Yeah. |
**Wally Quevedo:** Yeah, I think originally Derek also wrote his own hash implementations. |
**Brian Ketelsen:** He did, yeah. |
**Wally Quevedo:** Yeah, because the built-in one was not as performant. He wrote his own for a while. They have since been replaced, and what is seen in this part of the standard library was there for a while... During the evolution from NATS, they had their own hash maps. |
**Erik St. Martin:** I wanna say he talked about that in his GopherCon talk in 2014. |
**Wally Quevedo:** Yeah. |
**Erik St. Martin:** I haven't watched it since 2014, but I vaguely remember that. |
**Wally Quevedo:** Yeah, it's there. |
**Brian Ketelsen:** \[36:07\] That whole GopherCon thing was kind of a blur, our first year. |
**Erik St. Martin:** I think they're all a blur. \[laughter\] I think life since the first one is a blur. So does anybody have anything else they wanna talk about? I didn't see any projects this week, I've just been so heads down. |
**Carlisia Thompson:** I don't have anything else. I mean, I do have a bunch... There's so many things... |
**Erik St. Martin:** You guys wanna do \#FreeSoftwareFriday? I think that Brian has a birthday today... |
**Brian Ketelsen:** I do... |
**Erik St. Martin:** Well, it's not your birthday, but... |
**Brian Ketelsen:** No, my daughter's birthday. Lauren's 12. Hi, Lauren! I'll make her listen to this. |
**Erik St. Martin:** Does she listen? |
**Brian Ketelsen:** No, she never listens. She doesn't care about Go. The kids these days are making slime. She's 12, and that's the thing... They make slime out of borax and lotion and something else, and it's just this slimy stuff... That's all she does. Every time I turn around, I'm like "Where did that bottle of lo... |
**Erik St. Martin:** Hey, see? You gave me a hard time a few episodes ago because I started talking about Oobleck, and here they are making slime. Tell them to make Oobleck. |
**Brian Ketelsen:** I don't think it's that much different. |
**Erik St. Martin:** Well, the Oobleck - the cool thing about making that is that when you hit it with a lot of force, it becomes extremely solid... So you could run across it and things like that, but then it's just goo when there's not a lot of force applied. |
**Brian Ketelsen:** So every vessel in my house that could contain slime, is full of slime. \[laughter\] All the Mason jars, all of my tupperware - gone; full of slime. Yeah... Happy birthday, Lauren. |
**Carlisia Thompson:** What do you mean slime? I don't wanna derail this, but what...? |
**Brian Ketelsen:** It's... Oh, I don't even know how to -- it's almost like silly putty but thinner, and they make it out of common household stuff like detergent and shaving cream and glue and lotion... |
**Carlisia Thompson:** But what for? Just for fun? Just for the fun of making it? |
**Brian Ketelsen:** Yeah, there's absolutely no purpose behind it, which is why I know that this is a fad that will die soon, because there's nothing to do with the slime once you've made it, except put it in dad's Mason jars. So I'm looking forward to that going away. |
**Carlisia Thompson:** Gotcha. It's hilarious... |
**Brian Ketelsen:** I don't even remember, where did we -- oh, that's our hard stop, and I've been talking about it for five minutes... So yeah, I gotta go pick up a birthday cake. So \#FreeSoftwareFriday, let's hit that! I've got a \#FreeSoftwareFriday that I've mentioned before, by I'm gonna mention it again because ... |
I was so surprised this week... Every time I turned around, there was some other really cool piece of Go Micro that just blew me away. I built a microservice for authentication, and I thought "Well, I'm gonna have to be able to call this from the web, so I'm gonna have to build some sort of proxy..." - oh no, you don't... |
**Erik St. Martin:** I think you've got Go framework ADHD. |
**Brian Ketelsen:** I do not! \[laughter\] Every framework has its place. I still love [Goa](https://goa.design/)... And the nice thing about Goa and Micro is that they're both converging on [gRPC](https://grpc.io/), so very soon - as soon as Goa 2.0 is released - I think there's gonna be a mashup between the two of th... |
**Erik St. Martin:** Something interesting too is how much gRPC is taking over communication now. [Etcd](https://github.com/etcd-io/etcd) and [Kubernetes](https://kubernetes.io/) and all that are all gRPC now. |
**Brian Ketelsen:** Yup. Agreed. |
**Erik St. Martin:** \[39:57\] What's the messaging in NATS, Wally? How do you communicate with NATS? Is that just straight HTTP, or is that using some sort of RPC library? |
**Wally Quevedo:** Yeah, just bare TCP in a Plaintext protocol. |
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