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Okay, so last question, if you can answer it in three minutes or less... So the clock is ticking, of course... Talk to me about artificial intelligence in Docker. It seems to be potentially interesting in Docker Desktop. I've used recently ChatGPT to sort of learn how to build Docker files. You mentioned before you had... |
**Scott Johnston:** \[54:04\] I can, I can. And if you're okay, I'm gonna go a little bit beyond our time, if that's alright. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Please. |
**Scott Johnston:** So there's four areas, Adam. One is we're very privileged, I'll say, in that if you look around the ecosystem today, so many of the emerging AI/ML startups and technologies are using Docker, are based on Docker. And then not just based on Docker, but they expose their interfaces to their community u... |
Second is - going back to an earlier thread in the program - so much of our content from Docker Hub, our trusted open source content, is AI/ML tools. So to TensorFlow, PyTorch. Deep -- I forget the Deep; there's a whole series of Deep things from Google. All of those are being distributed from Hub, and so it gives the ... |
And the asterisk, or the punchline - or the kicker to this, it's better said - is that Docker Desktop, if it's on top of a laptop that has a GPU, Docker Desktop will allow the developer to take advantage of that GPU to accelerate the model learning locally on the laptop. So this is kind of we're providing tools or pick... |
**Adam Stacoviak:** For sure. |
**Scott Johnston:** The third is that Docker itself, completely anonymously, aggregates about 23,000 developer events every second. So we see kind of command line, we see what images are being used together, all anonymously... And so we have a very good insight in terms of what stumbling blocks developers are hitting, ... |
And then the fourth, to get finally to your specific example question - yes, ChatGPT is a fantastic tool for building Docker files and Docker Compose files. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** For sure. |
**Scott Johnston:** So watch this space for ways in which we can help devs more faster on-board and be productive with Docker, with these fantastic, fantastic AI/ML assets. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Yeah, I mean, I'm a Docker file maker now, whereas before I was not. I guess, my pair-programmer, my AI pair-programmer helped me do it, because I was like "You know what - I need to do this..." And it was actually my Jekyll blog. So I was like "I don't want to re-run and learn how to install Ruby o... |
And I described "Hey, I've got a Jekyll blog, with this version, I need Ruby this, I need that... Give me a Docker file that helps me do this." And with one or two small iterations, I've got that setup. Whereas before, it was intimidating; it was a blocker for me. And this is an unlocker, really. Docker is so easy to u... |
So please don't stop doing what you're doing, because we need more of it, in better ways, and we need it sustained, and all that good things. I'm like "Wow, I use ChatGPT, and next thing you know, I've got this Docker file." I was already using Docker Compose, and that hasn't been hard for me necessarily, but Docker fi... |
**Scott Johnston:** They can be tough. And then you go further down the rabbit holes, having them mount the container, and then building a container for test, versus building a container for production... Docker files get complex really quickly. But we're finding that ChatGPT and Docker Init together can really, really... |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Very cool. I only had a few more things on my list, but they're not worth taking your time beyond what we asked for, so I don't mind that... But is there anything left that I didn't ask you, that we can cover here in closing? |
**Scott Johnston:** I just wanna say thank you, Adam, for taking the time to come on the show and have the conversation. I do want to underscore that we wouldn't be here if it wasn't for the developer community. And we knew three and a half years ago when we did the pivot that we had to focus first and foremost on them... |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Yeah. Well said, Scott. Well, thank you so much for your time, thank you for all you've done for Docker, the company. I love your leadership. So much more we could have covered, but we'll leave it there for now. But thank you so much for your time. I appreciate it. |
**Scott Johnston:** Thank you, Adam. |
• Michael Grinich's background and experience at Dropbox |
• Founding of Nylas mail client and its initial success with end users |
• Challenges with commercializing Nylas due to lack of enterprise features and IT admin buy-in |
• Realization that product-market fit is not enough for business success, and need for a more strategic approach to commercialization |
• Transition of Nylas from focusing on individual mail clients to building WorkOS for enterprise API infrastructure |
• Connection between Nylas' early experience and the development of WorkOS |
• WorkOS was created to simplify enterprise software development by providing a layer for common features such as authentication, security, and user management. |
• The company's founder, Michael Grinich, realized that other companies were building similar features from scratch, which led him to create WorkOS as a solution. |
• The challenge of commercializing products is often underestimated, particularly when it comes to enterprise software, where IT admins need specific features such as automatic provisioning and directory syncing. |
• The "enterprise chasm" refers to the gap between growing companies that struggle to scale their software due to inadequate features for large enterprises. |
• WorkOS aims to provide a level playing field by allowing smaller companies to integrate essential features without having to build them from scratch, thus democratizing access to technology. |
• The challenge of balancing product development with enterprise features and requirements |
• The concept of "product-market fit" and how it changes as companies grow |
• The importance of enterprise features such as single sign-on, data retention, and e-discovery for company growth |
• The tension between product and sales teams in prioritizing feature development |
• Who should use WorkOS: startups after achieving product-market fit who want to expand into larger organizations |
• Low-hanging fruit integrations with authentication providers like Okta, Auth0, and Google |
• Single sign-on (SAML-based identity systems) as a key feature for enterprises |
• Compliance and security, such as SOC2 compliance, as a growing concern for companies |
• User management features like automatic provisioning and deep provisioning |
• Democratizing access to enterprise infrastructure by making it easy to integrate and use |
• Maintaining relationships with customers through change logs, social media, and Slack channels |
• The speaker shares examples of common issues that startup founders face when dealing with customers and negotiations. |
• Despite rumors of San Francisco's decline, the city is still thriving with many events and a strong startup community. |
• The speaker mentions how he finds joy in his work as an entrepreneur, despite it being challenging and requiring constant handing over of responsibilities to others. |
• He explains that he enjoys building tools and platforms for people, enabling them to create new things and giving them leverage to grow their businesses. |
• The conversation touches on the idea of building a design culture in an enterprise setting, particularly in software development. |
• The speaker compares his role at WorkOS to being part of the "backstage" or support team, rather than the main act. |
• The importance of attention to detail in product development |
• Starting a startup is likened to extreme sports, requiring constant adaptation and change |
• Founders must be willing to wear multiple hats and handle various tasks as the company grows |
• Joining an early-stage startup often requires flexibility and a willingness to take on different roles |
• WorkOS has flexible job roles and encourages employees to contribute to various aspects of the business |
• The sales process at WorkOS varies depending on the size of the company, with smaller companies able to self-serve while larger companies require more complex sales processes |
• Salespeople's role is not just to extract money but to help customers succeed with their product |
• Companies can grow rapidly in 18 months with changes in personnel and organization |
• Reselling value to existing customers is necessary due to changing needs and business evolution |
• Sales for SaaS products involves ongoing work with customers to power their businesses |
• Deepening relationships with customers leads to partnership-like collaborations |
• Storytelling is a key aspect of sales, focusing on the impact and value provided to customers rather than just listing features |
• Understanding customer needs and pain points is crucial in successful sales conversations |
• The founder's experience starting multiple companies and learning about the importance of combining product and business model development |
• The value of curiosity and being willing to learn in a sales role |
• The idea that "sales" is not just about selling, but also about understanding the customer's needs and problems |
• A discussion on the type of salesperson Michael Grinich is: asking questions, listening, and trying to solve the customer's problem with his product |
• The importance of not being pushy or trying to force a sale that doesn't feel right for the customer |
• Qualifying customers and understanding their goals and success metrics |
• The importance of building strong relationships with customers and partners |
• Aligning incentives in sales roles to create a culture of customer connection and harmony |
• The potential for unlimited upside in sales roles when aligned with company value creation |
• The difference between transactional and consultative sales approaches |
• Transitioning from hands-on sales role to bringing in a team |
• Scaling the sales function and evolving the sales motion as company grows |
• Leadership and cultural alignment, including staying connected with employees and setting clear expectations |
• CEO responsibilities shifting from hands-on work to strategic vision and cultural direction |
• Balancing growth with maintaining company culture and values |
• The speaker feels content and motivated in their role at WorkOS, despite being in a period of growth and evolution. |
• The ideal time to start a company is during economic downturns. |
• Michael Grinich shares a formula for coming up with good startup ideas: finding an area where one has unique insight and expertise. |
• Unique insight and domain knowledge are key to coming up with novel and effective solutions. |
• Founders who understand the problem space they're operating in are more likely to create successful companies. |
• Examples of successful startups, such as Ironclad, illustrate how founders can leverage their expertise to identify and solve specific problems. |
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