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**Jerod Santo:** I'm sure it was DNS, you know... |
**Adam Jacob:** I'm sure it was DNS. We're all pretty sure it was DNS. That feels an easy bet, you know? |
**Jerod Santo:** \[laughs\] |
**Adam Jacob:** So I was just struck by -- I was struck by a couple of things. One was the brutality, which - I think we could bring a little more of the empathy and humility back into the equation, of just like... You know, if today you weren't affected by the outage... We saw a lot of people who were like "Well, we w... |
I had a conversation with someone who sort of got mad at me because I said that. I was like "You should have some empathy, because your day is coming. If today wasn't your outage day, congratulations. Tomorrow will be your outage day, so get ready for that one." |
**Adam Stacoviak:** That's right. |
**Adam Jacob:** And they were like "We're good engineers." And I'm like "Man, you cannot good-engineer your way out of this." |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Is that your best Kermit the frog impression? |
**Jerod Santo:** \[laughs\] Is that what that was, Kermit? I don't think so. |
**Adam Jacob:** I can do Kermit the -- I can do a reasonably good Kermit frog. Yeah. "Your outage day will come. You will not enjoy what happens when your site goes down. What you will need is rainbows and hugs." |
**Adam Stacoviak:** \[laughs\] We do best/worst at dinner, and that's been my best today. Adam Jacob impersonated Kermit the frog. That was the best. |
**Jerod Santo:** That was pretty good. |
**Adam Jacob:** Yeah, I once did an entire -- a scene from Romeo and Juliet as Kermit the frog. |
**Jerod Santo:** Oh, wow. \[unintelligible 00:07:27.07\] on video. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Well, the next time you have a company-wide announcement, pull it out then. |
**Adam Jacob:** Do that as Kermit the frog? Yeah. |
**Jerod Santo:** There you go. Psychoanalyzing, if you will, the public response to this. I was trying to figure out why it was so gnarly this time around, and I feel like maybe it's because at this point AWS is kind of the man. They're like the Darth Vader of cloud services. I mean, maybe not that evil, but that impor... |
**Adam Jacob:** Yeah. It's easy. Like, when somebody shows up and goes "You should have empathy for AMOS, for AWS." It's easy to be like \[unintelligible 00:08:08.15\] |
**Jerod Santo:** Yeah, exactly. |
**Adam Jacob:** \[08:12\] It's not like AWS has empathy for me, AWS is a shark. They're out there eating to live, man... I don't know. I appreciate that about AWS, actually. I appreciate the part where they're very transparent about the fact that what they're in it for is the dollar bills. I know where I stand... \[lau... |
**Jerod Santo:** You know what they're all about. Sure. |
**Adam Jacob:** Yeah. No one's pretending that we're doing something we're not. |
**Jerod Santo:** And they're so good at it. I mean, there's a reason why they're the big dog, it's because they are very good at it. |
**Adam Jacob:** And it's not because they're bad at it. So yeah, I think some of it is just that AWS for sure is there. I think some of it is that everything does actually move in cycles, and the cycle that brought us HugOps, and the cycle that brought us a lot of the first generation of root cause analysis, and more e... |
And then, you know, Amazon's laying people off, they're also growing, AI fear, slop... All those things are in the air, too. Sometimes the AI marketing feels... Tawdry, is the word I'll use for it. And it's tough. |
**Jerod Santo:** Yeah. |
**Adam Jacob:** I think all of that comes together to be like "Okay, AWS has an outage, and now it's Mortal Kombat time." |
**Jerod Santo:** Right. Finish him. |
**Adam Jacob:** Yeah. |
**Jerod Santo:** Well, it's also just fun. It's fun to finish people. \[laughs\] Rip the heart out, and \[unintelligible 00:10:53.13\] |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Yeah. The finish him's kind of been a slow burn too, in terms of the cloud exodus. You've got those who have to be on-prem, those who want to be on-prem, those who desire to only have their two racks, paid for by themselves, and manage the two machines -- and maybe it is two racks, I don't know. I m... |
**Adam Jacob:** Yeah. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** So it hasn't been this -- I think maybe now is the finishing moment for some folks, but is the finishing moment coming from non-technical folks, or technical folks and non-technical folks? |
**Adam Jacob:** I think both, maybe. |
**Jerod Santo:** Just everybody... |
**Adam Jacob:** Yeah, I think it's everybody. I think everybody's ready for it to change. On a technical front, there's a bunch of really interesting things happening. If you're building new AI data centers, you need all these GPUs. That's where our focus is. But you also need high-performance compute, because the agen... |
\[12:11\] I was having a conversation with some people who build those data centers, and they were like "Yeah, all our customers want is tons of GPUs, super-fast networking, and bare metal compute. They don't want any layers in between." They're just gonna bootstrap that, giant high-performance compute clusters, and th... |
**Adam Stacoviak:** That's right. |
**Adam Jacob:** "We do have this fast network right here. What else could we do?" And it starts to push you in this very strange direction where it's like "Oh, actually, for the workloads we were running, it kind of did make a lot of sense to be like "Well, let's just go to AWS, and I can get burst capacity, and I can ... |
**Adam Stacoviak:** My exposure to this world is really through the lens of home lab, which is why I sort of get on this soapbox and preach it a bit... But I recently went to the Linux Fest here in Austin, Texas. It was awesome. Really cool, just homegrown bunch, real just kind of regional feeling; didn't feel overwhel... |
**Adam Jacob:** Yeah...! |
**Adam Stacoviak:** You know, Bootc has opened up so much windows for me. I'm just thinking about it in like Proxmox in my home lab scenario, but... |
**Adam Jacob:** Totally. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** ...you've got so much more power in the hands of folks at that level to really run your own bare metal now. |
**Adam Jacob:** Yes. And that's going to come back around again. That's happening because people are doing it. Once you start doing it, and the macro trend starts pushing you in that direction, people are going to start being like "You know what sucks? Trying to find the SSM parameter for what the right revision of Ama... |
**Adam Stacoviak:** "Tell me." |
**Adam Jacob:** Because - I don't know, I've done it a hundred times; I still don't remember. But when you think about that loop of "Oh, so much of the technology layers - they have been moving forward." They weren't stagnant. And yeah, I think there's more afoot here. There's a lot afoot here. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** Well, people want control back, too. The original idea was -- maybe for some it was like "Hey, there's a cloud here I can launch today. I don't have to build the infrastructure, pay for the infrastructure, even understand how to run the infrastructure necessarily..." |
**Adam Jacob:** Yeah. |
**Adam Stacoviak:** \[15:45\] You can sort of level up. And then you have this new world where you're like - well, fine, we've sort of either... The choice initially was let's move fast, so let's use somebody else's investment. Cloud. Now it's like, now we have proven our model, our product, or whatever, and we're matu... |
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