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and my father works in films and such, and I tend to, tend to be hypercritical of these things, and then, perhaps, perhaps it's unfair, because I, I, I must admit I enjoy these movies Yeah, right. and that's what they're for, but I don't, don't remember them, and I think it's, I think, I can think of movies I have less fun during and then after the movie's over, I remember it so terribly well because it, it had some, some meaning to me or something. Uh-huh. Right, exactly, yeah, there, there, there are several movies that hit home like that. Of course the ones I always remember are the, the older ones Uh-huh. I always like the musicals, and uh, those ones, that just stick in your head. Yeah, yeah,
they leave, yeah, they leave, they leave some songs with you, I don't know what it is Uh-huh. but it just, I mean, I don't know if this is old fart talking here or something, because I'm not that old No, it could be. you know, those old movies seemed to have had something that, uh, that was memorable somehow, Uh-huh. I don't know what it was. Um. Okay, well, I guess I got to get going, Okay, well, um, thanks for hearing me rap, I guess Got to go take care of the children, All right, nice talking with you. Yeah,
nice talking with you. Are you calling from Texas, by the way? No, I'm in California . Oh, okay, the first person I've talked to outside of Texas. Yeah, there must be Texas people, as near as I can tell. Well. Yeah, okay, well, thank you very much. Okay, well, I'm from the . Bye-bye. All right, bye-bye. Okay, we're rolling. I, uh,
what, what would you, what would, has your experience lead you to advise, uh, if my child were thinking of going to the Air Force Academy, what would you say? Well, I'd encourage it. Uh-huh. It's a good general education for a, a bachelor's degree. Uh-huh, uh-huh. And obviously, and obviously it's where they don't have a, any post graduate program there, but you get a, an excellent, wide, uh, basis of topics. You know, you get a good broad education out of it. Uh-huh. You don't, they don't graduate the best engineers or the best English majors, but maybe a graduate pretty good overall students out of there. Uh-huh. Uh-huh, uh-huh, uh-huh. Uh, How do you feel about, it must be a somewhat different environment from a regular college. How does that, uh,
how do you feel that is for someone at, at that phase in their life? Well, the for some people, it's good because they maybe they need a little discipline, need a little reining in at that, that stage in their life. Uh, other people, it, uh, it's, uh, suffocating, Uh-huh. you know, you kind of choke on it Uh-huh, uh-huh, uh-huh. uh, it, it depends on the person, on the individual, Uh-huh. but, uh, the one factor I think more than anything else in this day and age that's got to be a big factor in your decision's just the, the cost of, how much you're going to pay no matter where you go to school. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. And if you've been in for twelve years, I'm sure you've, you've got a, your share of student loans that, uh, you're probably going to be paying off or have been or, Well, I sort of, one of the reasons it's taken so long is I've been working all, you know, sort of half student, half working and source of income and stuff, Uh-huh. so I'm actually managing to do this with zero debt.
Oh, that's good. Uh, I couldn't, you couldn't do it otherwise. Oh, I mean I know people that graduated, or that I went to high school with that went to civilian colleges and they, they've got twenty, thirty thousand dollar debts, I mean you could have, uh, Yeah, I think if there's any major piece of advice I'd give, is to find a way of getting an education that doesn't incur that kind of debt. Yeah. It's not, I mean, I remember seeing an article one time about, you know, if the average person who spent that much money going to college just took the same amount of money and put it in a, a, in an investment fund, they'd be considerably wealthier than they would be from the job they'd get after college. Exactly. So, it's, it's really kind of crazy. It's, it's staggering when you think that, just here in central New York, is, uh, Hamilton College is just a few miles south of, you know, maybe about twenty miles to the south from where I am Uh-huh. and, uh, they're looking for twenty-two thousand dollars for tuition and room and board now. Really? A year. Huh. At just a small,
I mean they, they, they are it is a select, college. Yes, yes, I know. I was actually, I I was thinking of trying to get a job there I heard of it. Oh, yeah. But, you're talking incredible tuitions now. Uh-uh. I don't know how many people actually pay the whole shot. Very few I would imagine. Yeah. But, uh, I get, I just couldn't I mean it's more money that I make in a year, so You know, it, you know, me being one person with a above the median income, for New York state, you know, Yeah. I'm a I'm a second lieutenant in the Air Force now,
and, uh, I, Uh-huh. even as a somebody making twice what I was making, how could you put half of that into, to your child's education Uh-huh. and then just when they make, made, make it to the college years it's, Yeah, yeah. My God, I can't imagine. Well, my, my real feeling about, about the purpose of undergraduate education is it's really the time, yes, you do get an education, you do learn some things, but you eventually forget most of it. Yes. But what you don't forget is the growing up. It's really the period when people become adults. I mean people who don't go to college become adults in other ways. But, really, it's the entry into adulthood, I think. And I think that the best way to choose a college is to decide what kind of environment you want to be fostered in as you become, you know, as you gain new social skills, as you become, you know, more of a functioning member of society. And maybe the Air Force Academy is a perfect,
as you said for someone who, you know, a more, you know, who needs to learn self-discipline and so forth would be appropriate for them. Or, it's also a good environment, it may be good for someone who already has self discipline, who has a certain amount of leadership quality in their own, that, Yeah, and want to develop that. And, that, yeah, the it's the same. Uh-huh. It can benefit different people different ways. Uh-huh, uh-huh. But, uh, you know, I, I agree with that, because I see people that I know again, from high school, that I still keep in touch with, that didn't go to college Same patterns of behavior, same, uh, same socializing, same exact crowd that they hang with Uh-huh. Uh-huh. The same patterns of behavior, you mean? Yeah, yeah. and it's like, it's like frozen time, you know.
Exactly, it's I find it kind of sad, I really do. It is. It really is that they haven't found anything, anything better that, uh, or their, their experiences haven't been broadened at all, to, to you know, you know, Uh-huh. it's, it's a, it's a tremendous thing when you sit in a, in a college environment and discuss some issues and really sit there with people with disagreeing opinions and you hear all these different sides of the story that you never thought of Yeah. Right. and, uh, that's another big thing I think people get out of college is the appreciation for different point, differing points of view, you know, or different opinions. Uh-huh, uh-huh. Yeah, in high school everyone sort of tries to have the same opinion it seems. Yeah, exactly, yeah. Yeah,
the, the one thing I think that's no good for anyone is these monster institutions. These institutions of thirty thousand students and such. Oh I, And I see some freshmen wandering around in there and they're they're just like, you know, someone from the country lost in the big city, I mean, they, they, Yeah. I don't see them getting, I mean when I was undergraduate, I went to a, relatively small school for my first two years and then I transferred to a very large school. Uh-huh. And that worked out pretty well. I went from a, you know, a second rate institution to a higher rate institution. Uh-huh. But the first couple of years it doesn't matter to me what the quality of the education was. I needed to make friends. I needed to sort of learn the ropes. You know, there were things like that, that mattered a lot more and I needed basic, really simple education that you can get, pretty much anywhere for the first couple of years. Well, your education's a lot what you make of it, too,
so, Yeah, yeah, exactly. And if you're alienated, I mean I see people at supposedly really good universities who are just having psychological problems, that, you think this isn't sinking in. Yeah. Well, I, I've seen more graduates from M I T and that, Uh-huh. being, I work in a, in a an Air Force laboratory and so we've got a lot of, uh, M I T graduates that are in there and they are the biggest collection of screwed up people that I think I've ever run into. Yeah, yeah. Even, even more so, uh, like, military academy grads are a strange lot, too, I, I mean I have to confess to that. Yeah, it's sort of a, a rare select environment.
Yeah, and they have their own quirks and tolerances and, you know, certain things that don't bother us at all, that would drive other people nuts Yeah. and then certain things that ways, things we do, the way we do it that drive other people nuts that, Right, right, sure. But, these M I T grads are off in their absolute own world. It, it's a, I, I have more I have a lot of respect for M I T master's and doctorate, uh, degrees, Yeah. It's a top rated institution and now I, but they're undergrads are like, I, I'm amazed, at, at that's a lot of them even graduated. Uh-huh, uh-huh. But, uh, I don't know.
Well, I, I had known a lot of undergraduates who pick schools because they want the best reputation for a school. Not realizing that the reputation for M I T is because of the, of the doctorate research, and the professors who go there, Right. Right. and you're not going to see the professors Nope. you know, you're going to see some T A, you know. Uh, so they they, they want, you know, they want the best and they don't think, they think what the best is, is, reputation for, for research Yeah. and that's a one standard, but it's not relevant, to what they need. No. It's interesting that you mention, and I didn't think about that before when you were talking, but the service academies have all, all the faculty, uh, for the most part is, is military with a few exchange, professors from other, schools. Uh-huh. Uh-huh, uh-huh. But, uh, having the military faculty is really beneficial because they see it as doing their job and spending time with the cadets there, uh, is investing in the Air Force, and it,
Right. or the, the military itself, it's the future officer corps and so, I hear horror stories from friends of mine that they could never see their instructors, they could never get extra help. Uh-huh. For me any time I needed extra help any time of the day I had all my instructors home phone numbers Uh-huh. Uh-huh. and could call them, you go to their office anytime. I had some instructors that, uh, would invite me over to their house for extended study things on weekends, when I was having trouble with something Huh. and, Yeah, you won't get that at M I T or virtually or anything like that. No, no, and that, And you you know, and you can't blame the professors either, because you look at their job description, No.
you'd you know, teaching is third down on the list of importance things and, Right, right. Publish first, and the yeah, and, and that's appropriate if the university is trying to do serious research, because it's hard to be a researcher and a teacher at the same time. Right. So I'd say go to a, go to a college that has teachers. People who really are committed to the students and can afford to be because that's their job. Yeah. But, oh, well Yeah, it's, there's a lot of factors that people don't ever, ever consider in, in their selection of a college Uh-huh. and, uh, I don't know, maybe, I wonder if, if they enter these conversations that people have been having, uh ... what kind of fishing do you enjoy?
Well, uh, normally I like to, to go out fishing in a boat, and, uh, rather than like bank fishing, and just like to try and catch anything that's swimming, because I've had such problems with trying to catch any type of fish, that, uh, I just really enjoy doing the boat type fishing. So, you like fresh water. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. I've never tried like with, deep, uh, sea water fishing because you get, I get sea sick Uh-huh. Oh I see Well, one of these days, I'm hoping they'll have some kind of medicine, so I can go out and go, uh, deep sea fishing. Now, that would be nice. Well, I was raised on the Texas gulf coast, in the summers, Uh-huh. and during the Christmas holidays we'd go down to our house on the coast Uh-huh. and so, I thought fish came out of the ocean Oh, my goodness. and anything that was fresh water was muddy Uh-huh. so I didn't learn to fish in a lake until I was well into my twenties so I had, I had always been a, a sea fisher type which is a lot of fun.
Uh-huh. Oh I bet it is. There's so many different ways to catch fish. Uh-huh. You know, at night you can go walking in the shallows, and gig flounder and things like that. Which isn't technically fishing, but it's a lot of fun. Uh-huh. So, I, I grew up fishing. Uh-huh. What area of lakes do you like? Well, uh, now, I haven't done much fishing here in Texas, uh, because I moved from Ohio, Oh, I see. uh, but, uh, we did a lot of fishing when we were up there. But down here, I have a brother that likes to go over on the east, in East Texas, and do fishing. I can't remember what the name of the lake is, and he was just here this past weekend. I could have, I, I think he mentioned it again, but I couldn't remember what it was.
Uh, I want to call it Salt Fork, or Lake Fork. I, I can't remember, but he said it's one of the best bass fishing places. Oh, oh, oh, uh, I think I know where, uh, Lake Caddo, or something like that. I, you know, that may be it. That may be it. If it's supposed to be one of the best bass fishing places. They hold tournaments there, and everything. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, and he said that he has never gone anywhere before, and he's fished all over the United States, in which they can catch the biggest bass that you've ever seen. So I would love to go over there. They were talking about going over there, and, and some time in the spring, and I was thinking it would be great to go over there to go fishing, and, uh, and catch some bass. I would love to do that, but they have snakes over there, and I'm not too welcome around, I don't, I really don't want to share a boat with a snake.
Uh-huh. Uh-huh. I just, I, I, I don't see it. Yeah. I just, I don't I think that I perhaps would let them have the boat or something, I'd make some quick arrangements That's true. and I've told so many stories about the snakes Uh-huh. you know, when they pull in, there's a snake instead of a fish, and things like that Yeah. I'm just, Oh. I don't know, Yeah. What's the largest fish you ever caught? Uh, gosh, I think it was only like three and a half pounds, and for me that's big. That's why I'm saying I love to go fishing because I've never caught anything really, really big.
Uh, so, because it's always been, you know, in the, on a lake, and, uh, I know they have bigger fish than that but, you know, three and a half pounds, and that was, huge for me, Oh, on a lake, yeah. On a like that's not a bad size fish. *listen; transcript should probably read "lake" not "like" yeah, that's a good size fish I would be impressed Yeah, yeah. So, uh, but yeah, I'd love to go catch like the Marlins or whatever in the deep sea fishing. I've never done that. Uh-huh. I've, I've seen it, uh, and, and I have no problem going out in a boat, uh, it's just so dreadfully expensive, and there's just so many other ways live down there.
Yeah. It's not a treat Uh-huh. it's what you do every day. That's right. You know. That's right. Uh, one of my favorite things was, we were forever catching crab and steaming them you know, out on the, on the beach and you know, just, uh, pitching them out, on, uh, on, uh, what am I trying to say, newspaper and, and, breaking them up and sitting out there and eating them, and then digging a hole and pitching the whole thing in it you know Yeah. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Wow. Uh-huh. and, and that's it. Yeah. And, uh, but, the other little creatures would take care of what was left. That's right, So, going out on a boat, never did appeal to me simply because it, you know, there was so much else to do. that's right. Right.
Right. Well, do you live like along, uh, Houston, down there? No, no. I live in Dallas. I lived in Dallas. oh, okay. But you, uh, We had a house in Port Aransas. Oh okay. It's a little fishing village that is, Corpus. That's close to, uh, South Padre. Well, uh, South Padre is on down the bend Oh Corpus. Okay. Okay. Okay. it's like if you drew a line from Austin straight down, it would be in that region. Uh-huh. Uh-huh.
Small island. Yeah. Uh, Yeah. I, I've been to Port Aransas but, it was when I was a child. Oh, okay. Yes, because I have relatives who live in Houston, so when would go, and we would go to Port Aransas or then, on down to Corpus or further, yeah, like what your talking about. Because I was just wondering, we went to Galveston this, this summer, even with all the oil spills and everything, I mean, I was, oh, it was horrible. Was it bad? I well never, ever go back. I don't think. Uh, Oh, I hate to hear that. and, yeah,
and that, that's true, uh, uh, you know, the, the water was murky, and I would hate to think about catching fish or anything there Huh-uh. huh-uh, no I wouldn't want to eat them. No, So, no, no. Yeah. You went to Galveston. Uh, I have a favorite hotel that extends out over the water Uh-huh. the, uh, what is it, the Flagship? Yes. Uh-huh. Is it still there? It sure is.
I like that place. Yeah. Yeah. It most certainly is, so, uh, so that, it, it was, it was certain things that were enjoyable about it, but, uh, I don't, I think it's lost a lot of it's appeal since then, because of all the oil spills that they have had, and, uh, it always smelled the entire time we were there. It was, I didn't realize that had happened, for some reason. Yeah. We went swimming one time, in the whole week that, we were there, and the rest of the time we stayed in the pool, because the water was so awful, and, Well, of course, being raised on the water I'd never swim in it. yeah. Huh-uh. Yeah. Swimming is for swimming, pool. Yeah. That's why they call them swimming pools Uh-huh.
Uh-huh. That's where you swim. You do not swim in the ocean. No. No. No. Not anymore. I've seen what comes out of the ocean, and I have no desire to share, any space with anything like that. But, really, but huge sharks are down there. Uh-huh. I mean incredibly large sharks. Uh-huh. Uh, some of the young dread naughty boys in my family would fish for them all night Uh-huh. it was incredible the size of them, Wow. the next morning they would have them strung up across the getties Uh-huh. and it, you know,
so, just strung up, their tails would still hang on the bottom of the getties yeah, just, Wow. Wow. Yeah. Now I never knew they were that, that big, huh, I won't have anything to do with. Yeah. Yeah. Right. Well, it was nice talking to you. Well, it certainly was, uh, Maybe you can get, how many, have you had very many of these calls? Uh, yeah, almost ever day. How wonderful.
Yeah. Almost, almost ever single day from when they started it. Yeah. Maybe I'll just be so lucky. Okay, I enjoyed talking to you. Okay. Bye-bye. Bye-bye Phil, I guess a good question to ask is do you do your own work, or do you like to do it? Yeah, well, I, um, about, or just over a year ago I bought my own house, so this has been the first opportunity I've had to, uh, be working on my own lawn and garden, and, uh, you know, when, back when I was a kid, you know, mom would send me out to weed the garden. I, I'd hate it, you know. Yeah. Now, I sort of take pride in, uh, in the yard, and, you know, how the place looks, and, uh, so I don't mind doing it so much anymore. Yeah,
so do you have a, do you have a garden, or do you just do your landscaping now and your lawn? Well, it's, yeah, it's, it's primarily just, uh, like landscaping a little bit. You know, I've got some, uh, bushes around the you know, foundation planning, things like that, and then there's some, just some little flower beds, and my mom grows, she's an avid gardener, and she starts her own stuff from seed now, and she gets a little over zealous when she is planting these seeds in the wintertime and starting them. Uh, she ends up with so many plants that she can't fit them all in her garden. They have a huge yard and a huge house, and so she brings them up here from Philadelphia and gives me all her extras. Well, that's pretty good. Yeah. My, my sister is very over zealous, too. She's got some really nice flower beds. She puts a lot of time into them. This is my first year in a, in a house where I'm thinking about doing some flower beds and stuff. Oh, we, I've always had crude ones at my father's, but this is the first time that I really have to landscape a house.
Yeah. His house is more like a farm house. It's not on a main road. Uh-huh. My house is on a main road, and it has nothing Yeah. I mean, nothing. But, um, what I do do, and I've always done it is, at my father's house, we have, my sister and I have a couple of gardens. I think we figured out total, this is for vegetables about two thirds of an acre. Uh-huh. So we each have a third of an acre we do. Jeez, that's more than, that's more than the property I have right here, that you've got as a, uh, garden, That's a lot that's amazing. Yeah, well, it's my dad's, and we've had it for he's been there for a long time
Right. so, um, it just happens they built a shopping center next to it Oh, jeez. but, um, they put up a nice fence, so we still have a lot of privacy, and we grow a lot of food. Uh-huh. Uh, I enjoy it, um, the gardens are kind of old, you have to step down in them now because we've tilled them so much, Uh-huh. but there's still, we, we, my sister uses probably a fertilizer. I don't know if that's a good thing or a bad thing. But I wish this phone would stop screeching, Are you getting a lot of static on your end of the line? Yes. I'm trying, I don't know if it's my phone. This is bad.
It's not getting any better. Yeah, I can't even hear what you're Oh, okay. Oh jeez, it's gone. I don't see, I don't think my phone really does that, but every time I have this phone is a little weird, I mean it's been dropped on the floor a hundred times. Well, I don't know, there was well, whatever it was, there was a second there I couldn't even hear what you were saying, but, um, Yeah, I was beating on the phone going, Can you hear me. Yeah, I guess I was having a hard time there too. I thought it sounded,
well, I guess we better stick to the subject for the benefit of the people uh, uh, doing this work. Yeah. But, uh, yeah, I mean, that's a heck of a you must have a lot of different stuff you get out of there, especially up in Vermont there, you should have, uh, some really nice soil. Yeah, we grow a lot of, uh, the basic, corn, potatoes. Uh-huh. She likes to really get into her pumpkins and see how many she can grow. corn, potatoes, and, uh, acorn squash are good winter keepers. Yeah. I mean, things the way we grow are carrots, cabbage, that sort of goes to waste Uh-huh. you know, we eat it, we, just too much. She, she starts her own plants. She plants a lot of tomatoes
Uh-huh. I let her do all the planting and putting, and I, I do a lot of the, uh, a lot of the, the the back work, and stuff. But she does, she helps me a lot, too. Uh-huh. She puts a lot of financial. She plans it all out. Beans like to be near certain types of plants. Now, they find that tomatoes don't do well if you put them next to something like, uh, peas, I don't know. Something, Oh, really because of like the cross-pollination, or, No, it's just like, something like an onion and a tomato would go together, but you're not supposed to put your onions near your beans. I guess it's, it's just what scents it gives off, they just don't like each other. Huh. I mean, she, she reads all kinds of books,
so. I wish I knew more to tell you why, but, Huh. My mom put, uh, cantaloupes and cucumbers near each other once, and the got cross pollinated by the bees Yeah And we ended up with these, these, like things on the cantaloupe vines that, I mean, were looked like round big huge round cucumbers. Oh, that's really weird. Yeah, I mean, there, these were like some mutant. I've put my cucumbers down at one end of the garden and like I'll make an L shape I've put my cantaloupe. So they've been pretty close together. Huh. But I don't think the vines. They don't they don't have to be touching or anything, like you say, they cross pollinate just by bees, No, it's just the, like the bees and insects will do it. Um, Either that or my mom just had some bad seed or something.
Something weird. Yeah. This year, this last season it was too wet up here Uh-huh. we lost a lot of our root things, our squash and our potatoes, and we got half our yield. Oh, well. It was really bad because of the water. Yeah, when I, my family used to live in Littleton, Massachusetts, and when we moved in there we had a, a really wet backyard, and, uh, my mom wanted a vegetable garden. So we trucked in, uh, I think it was seven, what was it, cubic, seven yards, cubic yards, I think that's how they measure dirt Yeah. yeah, seven yards of sand. I got to shovel it all, lots of fun.
Yeah, I have to do that, I want to make some flower beds, and I'm going to have a seven yard truck come in with some top soil. Uh-huh. And I'm going to, my problem is I want to use those rail ties to build up a planter Sure. but I don't know if the creosote in the rail ties is going to do something, you know, if I want to grow a tomato or something in there Right. Well, it seems, I mean, I guess it'd go with my flowers. I've seen a lot of people use them, you know, for flower beds, but I don't know what, whether they'd have creosote would do anything, I mean, Yeah, I don't, I don't, I just don't think you, I always thought I'd put a tomato plant in there or something weird Uh-huh. but I don't think I could really eat the fruit off it without wondering.
And I don't know if they make landscape ties that aren't treated. Well, you can get, um, you can get pressurized lumber, Yeah, but they put, some kind of chemicals in there too. Oh, that's right. there's even, there's bad chemicals in those too. Yeah. Well, I'm not really worried about it, it's mainly for flower bed, so I'm not going to, no I'm just not going to put that tomato plant in there. All right. But, I, yeah, I do want to have a raised bed. I've never, my flower gardens are always been like on the ground. Right. They don't, it just looks so much better when it's up against the house, tiered up. Well, you can see it a little better and it stands out.
Yeah, this house that I have is just a three bedroom ranch and I can tell you there's nothing around it, cement foundation all the way around it. Not a shrub, not a bush. Um. There was a lilac tree, and the landlord cut it down and said, Yeah, that's one thing you have to do is keep that lilac bush cut down so it doesn't rub up against the siding And I'm looking at him like, Jeez. People would kill to have a lilac bush and he's cutting it down So. That's all right. Flower beds are all right. Anything, as long as it doesn't rub up against the siding. Rub up against the siding. Uh, Yeah, that's what he's worried about. The trees, or a bush, because lilac bushes, they, they grow fast. Some people, uh, would really like to have them, and then the people that do have them, they spread, and they sprout all over their lawn. Uh-huh. So, they're kind of a pain, but, you know, people who don't have them think they're great.
And people who do have them, curse. Right. Another thing I have that, um, is weird is the, a locus tree in the back yard. As a matter of fact there's three of them, very badly trimmed, they aren't trimmed at all. Uh-huh. And I can imagine if I had to mow the lawn in the back, which we said we'd do, if the trees hang down so, and the locus trees have like three quarters of an inch thorns on it. Yeah, they're like, I think I've seen those before, but I don't remember what they look like. They're a pretty tree, but you just, when you walk up to them they're covered with thorns. So we're going to get a chain saw and limb it extensively so it gets the trees up overhead, So it'll give you room to get under it, sure, Yeah, because I can just see brushing up against it, that it would rip your skin. Yeah.
It's worse than a rose bush. Um. Many times worse, because of course, it's a tree. Oh, a tree is always something very nice to have. Yeah, my dad used to work on them, so I don't think I'll have a problem. My husband will have problems borrowing one. then you got to get him to, if he's going to do it, you've got to twist his arm to get him to go do it. Well, if that's not the problem ... Okay, did you vote in the last, uh, national election? Yes, we, uh, uh, I haven't missed a one since I've been eligible to vote. Oh, that's good. Did you get to vote at the last one? I voted in the last national one. Yeah, I'm not sure *slash error; one utt with next
if I got the last local one. Oh, uh-huh, yeah, and sometimes the, the local ones aren't as publicized it seems that, uh, they should be. Yeah, you're not sure where to go and vote and all that. Right, and, uh, there's usually nobody running against, you know, the incumbents. Right, or you don't know what they you know, where they stand or anything like that. Right. So, uh, but I, I feel that, uh, a lot of people have gotten lazy about voting. Yeah, I think you're right. And, it's, it's, they're, and also they're fed up with the system, and they say, well, why should I even vote. Yeah, or sometimes they don't like either of the choices for the candidates, Right.
so they think, well, you know, why vote. Right. The lesser of the two evils is how we usually look at it. Yeah, really, especially in Texas Oh, I know it The last gubernatorial race was, oh it was awful. It really was, yeah. So I don't know, I, I, it'll be interesting to see how the next, uh, few years go. Yeah Did they get the serious problem that half the people don't vote. Yeah, I think, well, it's, it's definitely a problem, and I think it could get worse. Yeah. You know, we get this lackadaisical attitude,
and say, huh, you know, why should we vote, then, you know, it could, uh, it could lead to some serious things. Yeah. It also seems like maybe another candidate that nobody wants could slip in if, you know, not enough people are voting. Uh-huh. Right, uh, yeah, we can get, uh, yeah, if we get someone in there like that, then, you know, they could make all sorts of changes that they were, you know, had enough pull. Yeah, it's kind of like in Louisiana where that, uh, guy that's like a Ku Klux Klan member something got elected. Yes. Uh-huh. Kind of scary when you think about that. Yeah, and, uh, who's the other guy, LaRouche that, uh, is sort of the, uh, socialist, not socialist but he's so off the wall that, uh, he's gone in and tried to get into city elections and, uh, but he's got, he's been put away for, uh, credit card fraud, I believe. Oh, gosh. Yeah, Lyndon LaRouche, that's it.
Yeah. And, uh, yeah. Yeah, people will sit home and assume, oh, that guy would never get elected. Uh-huh. Next thing you know, you've got him. Right. If you don't go and vote, then, you know, very good chance that they, they will because a lot of the people like that, they'll strike a chord in something, you know, in some of the people, that so will say, look, you know, this guy's got everything together. Yeah. You know, I like what he says, and he'll be so far off the wall that they'll elect him. Right, yeah. And, uh, I think that's sort of what happened with Louisiana because, because, um, the guy did get elected, correct? Yeah. Right. That's what I thought. Yeah, he sure did. And, uh, , but you know, they can always fool us, you know.
He might do a good job. Yeah. I think one thing that maybe would help people vote is if the polls were either open more days, or you could mail it in, or something like, if you have, if you have real strict work hours, and you can only go like at seven in the morning or after work and you have to stand in line for so long Oh, yeah. I think that discourages a lot of people. What we do, usually, is, uh, vote, uh, absenteeism Uh-huh. and, uh, I know, here, you know, you don't have to have any reason, you can just go and vote Right. and the polls are open, what was it, a couple of weeks, the hours are good and they're even open on Saturdays and a couple of Sundays. Uh-huh. And so we've got plenty of time to go, because down here in Houston, it's, uh, the lines are long. Yeah, I'm in Dallas, and they're long here too. So, uh, but, uh, Yeah,
I voted absentee one year. I really was going to be gone. So, I did it, but, uh, it was nice. I would be tempted to do it again. Well, uh, I recommend it, because you just walk right on in, and there's usually not anybody in line Right. and, uh, you know, that vote's just as good as, you know, the one on election day. Yeah. I think they should change the whole system so that it's easier Uh-huh, yeah. I think more people would do it if it wasn't such a hassle. Um, yeah, I've been involved with, uh, some of the campaigns and the state conventions of the, of the Republican party. And it's really interesting to see the process as far as what goes through as far as the voting and the, uh, how the, uh, the not the ballots, but, uh, my mind has gone blank. I've been all evening How they develop, uh, what the candidate stands for Uh-huh, you know, the views, and, uh, you know, everybody gets to vote on, you know, well, should he be for this and on and on and on,
and, uh, it's, it's interesting. Yeah, that would be. I usually vote. A lot of times I'll vote a straight party ticket just because I don't take the time to find out what every, you know, other than the major candidates, what they stand for on what issues, Uh-huh. so I'll just trust well, the party kind of goes along these lines so I'll go ahead and vote. Right. There for a while, that would, that worked. We've, uh, I know I have, um, I'll stick to uh, to the, you know, sometimes I'll stick to a certain party, depends on the guy. Uh-huh. But, uh, if it, uh, gets down between two, then I'll, I'll vote for the party because I know, you know, something about the other guy Yeah. or, you know, they're both just as bad, and I'll say, Well, I know what this guy stands for as far as for his party, and, um, but yeah. You know, that's not the best way but,
No, I guess it'd be best if you knew each person and what they stood for and why and everything. But it gets to the point where, I mean, you've got to have the find the time also to read about the guy and, and be able to find the information about what he stands for. Right, and try to determine if what you read was objective or not. Right, or what you've heard on T V, which I think is just outrageous. Yeah. I, I don't agree with how the media handles elections. Yeah. I, you know, I'm tired of hearing about the polls, you know, you know, this is how he stands such and such a day the way they break it out, Yeah. it's just, it's just ridiculous. Yeah, I think it could affect the outcome, you know, could make it unfair. Uh-huh, it really could, and, uh, then, how, sometimes, how the media will blow things out of proportion and will run an issue into the ground which is good and dead,
and they keep dragging it on, and it could hamper the outcome of an election for the guy that should have won. Oh, yeah. Yeah, so, uh, Yeah, the press has a lot of power. They really do. I, I sometimes think that that should be limited more. Yeah, oh, but, boy you try get into that, you'd really open a can of worms. Oh, yes, or they, I agree with the freedom of the press, you know, and all the amendments, but sometimes it's for the public's own good that we don't hear things. Yeah, seems that they should regulate themselves a little bit, and I don't think they ever care to. No, they don't.
Well, I can't think of anything else really about the polls or voting, to talk about. Well, I enjoyed talking to you. Well, it was good talking to you. All right. Bye. Bye-bye. Okay, so do you all keep a budget? No, we don't. You don't? No, I, I make so much money here at T I that, that we just spend it. And we never have a problem meeting it from paycheck to paycheck. It's pretty neat being that independently wealthy and working for a major semi-conductor firm, you can just spend it well. Are you being smart, or are you serious? I'm being facetious. I'm being very comical.
Uh, we have a budget, um that works well. Uh-huh. I kind of look at it for more of a, we have a financial, uh, analyst, a finance administrator, I guess, that, that, uh, I guess the financial planners, the training now. We've had it for about four years here. Uh-huh. Got our businesses and, and, and our life in line, how to manage credit cards, how to put away, say for, you know, money markets and this kind of thing. Yeah. And, there's some freebies out there are you should put ten to fifteen percent of your monthly bring home in some sort of savings account. Uh-huh. Yeah. That being money market, uh, bonds, , savings, uh, or just a liquid account which, which we do. Uh-huh. Um, you should always have three months of your salary in a savings account in case there's a major need for that. Uh-huh. Okay. You should always have an umbrella permit that bridges your life insurance and your medical and your, uh, uh, car insurance in case you run into a lawyer and you break his arm. He's going to sue the pants off of you.
These kind of things are about a hundred dollars a year. So you know, these are all equivalent to the monthly budget things. Uh-huh. Some of them are there to pacify situations. And some of them are there to prevent things from happening. Uh-huh. But, uh, I guess we kind of got away from about the last sixteen months as far as saying, two hundred dollars for food and three hundred dollars for this and two hundred for that because we had a child which is about a year old, and then uh, we've just been kind of working on, Uh-huh. I've been developing it, but it's kind of hard. Diaper prices are going up, you know, and formula and stuff, you know. Uh-huh. That's funny. Yeah, we have a, we're twenty eight, and he's been working at T I for five years, and that was pretty much his first real, really major job of any, you know, professional, because he had worked, you know, part time during school and what not, and, uh, he was a little late graduating, so we're, you know, uh,
and we have a nine and a half year old son, and it's because, you know, we were eighteen when we had him, so, we're, we're kind of looking at this from the other aspect of, we, you know, we have a lot for, to be our age and, you know, just everything, and having the responsibilities we've had on us for, at such a young age. You know, we have a, like a nice house. People, you know, are really shocked at how nice everything is in our house. But, we don't, you know, live in a brand new house, either, maybe a ninety, hundred thousand dollar house Uh-huh. but we're in a thirty year old house that would probably sell for forty-five thousand. Uh-huh. So, you know, we have trade-offs. So we're more, we have a monthly budget with this, this, this, this. But, we have no savings, which isn't real wise, but we just, we don't have the income at this time really to have any, because we have three debts that we're trying to pay off from both of our student loans. We're still paying trying to pay those off. Uh-huh. And we have one car payment that we don't, I think we have about thirteen months left on it. Uh-huh. And after that, we either, what we want to do is begin doubling up our car payment, um, they'll pay,
our car payment is equivalent to both of our student loans. So what we want to do is next year keep driving the same cars and, um, pay on the student loans, split that car payment in half and pay, you know, double up payments on both our loans. And it'll work out perfect. Do you have your, uh, loans through the Texas Credit Union? No, we don't. Okay. Thing about the credit union is, it's, the way it's set up is if you have two thousand dollars left, let's say, on, on the loan. Uh-huh. If you go up there and write them a two thousand dollar check it doesn't all go towards principal. Uh-huh. They take out for the, for the finances the finance charge, which is kind of, you know, it's like one of these lose or swim type of credit, one of those loans is. Not really the best in the world, but. But, you know, they're, uh, since your husband is, is, is, um, a T I but doesn't have the loans with the credit union, they're offering something that might be worth taking a gander at. Really. I don't know what your percent is on your, on your car payments Uh-huh.
but they are, they'll take any T I non-credit union loan like if you have a fourteen percent loan for a new car. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Oh, really. Uh-huh. One of the secretaries we have down here is paying twelve percent through G M A C or something. Uh-huh. And she's doing it. I mean, it's not like, it's like. Does she have to pay to have it refinanced? I think they even cover that because they want you as a they want the T I to be part of the credit union. Uh-huh. T I to, See, we got ripped off buying our new car. We both come out of, uh, drugs and stuff, and we became Christians about five years ago. Right when he got home from Terrell. Right before he got hired for T I, he had gotten saved and stuff, and so, I mean, when you get come out of drugs and stuff, you have nothing, I mean, you know, you don't have anything.
You have the clothes on your back, and you might have a car, and that kind of thing. And so, when he, when he started working at T I, we, uh, you know, we really felt like God told us to buy a new car because he had an older car that was going to need to be fixed and high gas. But we got ripped off on it because we wanted it financed at four years, and we were young and we'd look about nineteen. People still think we're about, they ask us where we go to high school when we get our hair cut and stuff, both of us. And so, it's just kind of strange, you know, so five years ago we probably looked like real ding dongs, you know. Yeah. So we went in, and the financed the car for five, and we didn't know that. We got kind of taken, just a little bit. So we're kind of upset that we're having to, you know, pay this fifth year on the car, because it was just not a wise thing. But we learned a good lesson. So, you know. Well, five years is not that, uh, five years is not that bad of a problem only because you're paying more interest, but your payments are lower. Yeah,
but they, they would have only been about twenty dollars a month higher, and he Oh, really. Yeah, he just told me this last week that he, he said, don't you remember I asked them to finance it at four years and they came back and they said that they had it figured for five and we'd already signed the papers. And I maybe, I might have been there. I don't remember hearing that. But, I also wasn't the one in charge of it, so I wasn't paying as close of attention. Sure. But, anyway, instead of putting our foot down about it, we just went, okay, whatever, you know. So anyway, so next time we'll do that different. We want to next time pay cash for our car, too. We want to pay cash for everything we can possibly do. When we buy a house, we attended a Bill financial seminar, and he has a lot of wisdom on that, just on Biblical, you know, principles to finance.
Uh-huh. He runs a big, the largest real estate company in Fort Worth debt free. And we really believe in debt free living and debt free car buying and debt free house buying. And if we do take out a loan on a house in the future, what we'll do is pay twice a, twice a month on it, and, because you save a lot in interest, just doing that. Yes. And then, You save a lot. Right. If, if, if, if, and you need to be very careful, if the loan is set up to have bi, they call it a yuppie loan, if it's set up for bimonthly payments. Right. If you, because you'll save fifteen to seventeen years off the end of the loan. Right. I'm sorry, seven to nine years off the end of the loan. Right. And there are, there is a local firm that'll actually, if, if, like in my situation, I don't have that, because the loan was not available.
I can have, this firm will pick up my loan for a six hundred fifty dollar fee. So I can cut that much off the end of, but I'm not interested because we're moving out of the house next year. Oh really. Yeah. But, uh, those are all great. Uh-huh. The, the interesting thing, we're getting ready to have a house built Uh-huh. it's not, a lot of the firms that offer, mortgage loan firms, aren't offering, um, that loan. Uh-huh. You can ask and you can wheel and deal, but it's not as open as it should be. Yeah. It's a great idea. Hell, I'd love to cut ours in half, but, uh Uh-huh.
man. And if you figure, get with a financial person. Yeah. And you can figure up exactly when like the eighteenth month of a loan, if you make like a four hundred dollar payment over and above your house payment it'll make, uh, Uh-huh. it has a magic with numbers. It, I, it'll shave almost, you know, X number of dollars off, Right. Yeah, we we've become aware of that. We have a, there's a loan officer through our church, too, that I think could help us better. You know, he does that full time with the bank, you know. Uh-huh. And so we're going to use people that we're in a relationship with that we know, that, you know, we know are people of integrity. So. Sure. You know, that is another thing that, you know, we feel like our long term goal is going to be benefitted by next time we buy a car we're not just going to go to Toyota of Irving, you know, we're going to go to somebody that we know,
we're going to take someone with us older, and we didn't do any of those things. Somebody you trust. You know, there are so many rip-off artists here in this town. It's, it's, uh, it's really a sin, it really is. Yeah. I got taken on some on firewood. Really. I mean, uh, uh, the guy shorted us a half a cord of firewood, and my wife didn't know, and I stopped payment on the check, and he'd already been paid by a cashing firm. And, and they're suing us, they're suing me on this, and it's for a hundred and thirty-four dollars. Oh, my. Absolutely pathetic. I stopped payment on a check. Oh, that's funny. Oh, this last week, we bought a sewing machine at Zak's,
and then I found that you could get the same machine better for less locally. Not much less, but it was enough less, and I found they locally serviced it. And we just stopped payment on the check. So I hope they don't sue us over it But we never received any merchandise either, so I don't think it would hold Anyway. Oh, okay, well probably something like that, did you call them and tell them you just, you just. No, we didn't even call them. We just did it. Maybe my husband should call today. Might be a good idea, because you're going to get, what, a, a check, Well, this is kind of ironic because I work in T I legal department. Do you? And although we don't have any criminal actions here, we do have other, um, lawsuits that do go to trial from time to time. Uh-huh.
And, uh, when was it, a couple weeks ago I was asked to go to, uh, jury duty I, I wasn't selected but, um, for some of our cases in particular we have, um, very technical cases from time to time because of like our patents and such. Sure. And it's very difficult for lay people for somebody who might just, you know happen to be selected in our jury, to understand what we're talking about. Well, I do think that the cases like the, uh, oh, say something like Texaco versus Pennzoil, Uh-huh. or, or the Texaco Pennzoil problem, uh, is ridiculous for people just taken off the street to understand, and, really should have some better way where people who understand both the circumstances and the complex issues involved, should handle cases like that. Uh-huh. Right. Yeah, you know, some I don't, you always have the option, now in criminal I guess you always have a jury, but in civil cases you have the option of whether you want a jury or not. Oh, is that right? Yeah, and in some incidences I think they ought to, ought not to have a jury, Yeah.
um Okay, boy. Or, uh, or there should be some way where it could be opted for them not to have a jury. Uh, I was only on one jury ever, so far in my life, Uh-huh. and, uh, it really was a pretty trivial, case and it seemed to me all the time I was thinking of all these people in the courtroom over the case that involved, oh, a couple thousand dollars I think, it was, it was really just, uh, uh, terrific waste of everybody's time and money. Uh-huh. Um. And it finally ended up that, uh, even though we had reached a verdict before we were allowed to give it, they settled the case. Oh. They they had settled while we were deliberating. Yeah. Now, the one thing I did approve of there was that we didn't have to be unanimous because it was a civil case. Uh-huh. And, uh, we were split, uh, ten to two so, it was, uh, a good thing that, it wasn't a total waste of time to have a hung jury on a case that trivial. Yeah, well, um, I've never fully served,
I mean, I've been asked twice to go down but I didn't get elected on the panel, but, I know, that, um, for a lot of the civil cases it's rare, I mean, if your a lawyer, um, there, you could be a lawyer who never actually gets into the courtroom there's a lot of attorneys like that, that never get to the courtroom. Some, their kind of law doesn't get them to the courtroom, but even in, um, litigation which is doing lawsuits, is a lot of times that you never get to the courtroom itself Well, I think that the trial in a sense, is kind of a threat to hold over people to try to get them to reach an agreement out of court, because it does cost so much money. But it's a shame that, oh, it's not so bad for the court system because the money there isn't being spent but there's awful lot of money in time and effort spent in preparing for trial only to then finally get scared enough by going to the court and usually it's the scare kind of, of the jury because you really don't know one way or the other how that jury is going to feel. Uh-huh. You could feel that you really have a very strong case and that you're very much right but the jury may or may not see it that way, Sure. so you get a little you know, anxious there and go well, you know, I don't feel that sure Yeah. and who knows what the jury will say because sometimes, you know, the juries come down with a result and you go, gee Yeah,
I was a witness in a case, in a criminal case. Uh-huh. And it was absolutely horrifying to me how that operated because so much evidence was excluded, and that the jury was never allowed to hear and they convicted the defendant, I, on as far as I could tell, very flimsy evidence and two perjured testimonies. And I knew the people involved, both the people who d and the people who, uh, were defendants. Uh-huh. And, yeah, I think that was just a, a horrible miscarriage of justice because of the, uh, you know, staying by the absolute strict rules and not allowing things to be presented to the jury, that, uh, were highly irrelevant to the case and could, I thought, have established the defendant's innocence. Yeah. So, uh, I do, although I'm a lawyer's daughter and I have lawyer's, and judges on both sides of the family, and uncles and cousins and things like that, I really think that we have gotten into much, too legalistic of society and that we, we spend far too much on the fine points of the law and far too little on achieving justice. and it seems a lot of times that, uh, especially in criminals that, their rights are so protected but what about the rights of, you know, the rest of society, I mean, we're protecting this person's rights who has broken the law, um, Uh-huh. and we protect him so much, but what about the rest of the society, you know, what are we doing for them,
we're kind of, you know, forgetting about them and, I think sometimes that a criminal should kind of, if he breaks law, especially it he's a repeater, the law shouldn't just always cover for him, that some of his rights as should be taken. Well, and then in a lot of, Yeah, in criminal cases, uh, for instance, you can't bring up prior convictions unless they are somehow directly related to the case. And it seems to me that a jury can make a much more rational decision if they know somebody had fifteen convictions for a similar crime, Yeah. now it's possible that he didn't commit the but the likelihood certainly tilts it . Yeah. With a record like that. And, that was one of the things that we're not allowed to, was not allowed in the, uh, trial I went to, Yeah. though, uh, one of the two people who gave the perjured testimony, had a long criminal record and had been, you know, a real sleaze bag. And he came in and was presented to the court as a standing young man who had, uh, been in seminary to become a priest, and, but I happen to know his background and I know that he would have sold out his mother for, uh, uh, shorter sentence. Jeez.
And, you know, it's, it's really annoying when the, I asked the defense attorney later why he didn't bring up all this other trouble the guy had been in. He said that, that was barred, uh, by the court. Um, So, we do have some problems and it seems to me that, uh, maybe it's time to just scrap all the case law and go back to general principles and start over. And then make a legal system that carefully protects people but, uh, where you, Yeah, I'd even go for, for trying to get some truth out of the witness stand if they come up with some pretty reliable, uh, um, lie detector tests that we can see right then and there whether they're lying or telling the truth. Yeah. Yeah, that would be wrongful . Yeah, you know. Sure would. Yeah, I witnessed one trial many years ago when I was first, um, studying to be a paralegal and, uh, uh, they barred priors on this, uh, person and they never then told us, I guess, because priors had a reason as to why these two people were very much in hatred of each other. Um. And they never told us why these two people had such a vendetta against each other
and the crime was, uh, uh, attempt to commit murder, you know, Um. but they never told us why these people were mad at each other and gee, you know, that's, And you think that would be relevant. Yeah, you know, because they, they told us in school that, you know, crime has to be an intent, you know, has to be not just the act but you have to intend to do it because there could be accidental kind of things, you know, Right. but they never told us why these two people, hated themselves or if one had done something to, you know, really aggravate the other there was never any motive, given Uh-huh. and, and I had a tough time with that and, and being a person who saw what the jury didn't plus what the jury did, because we were just observing, you know, there in the courtroom, at the end of it all, I still didn't know Uh-huh. Yeah, right. I still have a lot of reasonable doubts and I've seen everything presented
and, you know, they just haven't done a real complete case here to my thinking. Uh-huh. I don't know that I want to, sit on a jury like that I think so, and I, and you'd still, you know, I want ask some questions here Yeah, that's something I thought would be a very good idea of when juries come in they are told just to shut up and listen. Uh-huh. And it seems to me that you'd get a lot more, uh, information if your questions were heard, if you were allowed to ask the witnesses things, or if, or the lawyers things or even the judge. Uh-huh. Right. But particularly the witnesses. Right. Yeah, allow them to, uh, go back and, and deliberate and, uh, you know, after each days proceedings come out with some questions that they want answered like the next day, bring those people back, Or if they would allow them to, uh, give broader answers, they, it's really kind of, uh, choreographed. It's like a script has been written when people testify.
They aren't testifying really in their own words, Right. Yeah, I can remember, uh, friends of Daddy ... There we go. Okay. Well, uh, what do you think about taxes, do you think we're paying too much? Yes and no. Income tax, no. I, uh, I look at it this way, uh, you've got to pay for the privilege of living here. Uh-huh. But, uh, being a, uh, a rec vehicle owner, well, in fact, I live in a motor home. I'm a what they call a full timer and, uh, it burns gas like crazy. I only get seven miles to the gallon. I really resent this fact that they keep adding on gasoline taxes and they call it, uh, uh, what's the word they use,
anyway, a, a luxury tax. Yeah. They add it on on to tires and gasoline, cigarettes, liquor. It doesn't bother me any because I've quit drinking and I quit smoking. So, that doesn't bother me but I don't think it's fair. Yeah. It's too, um, um, it's attacking just certain people. How true. Even with the gasoline tax. Yeah. Well, gasoline, especially, in this part of the country we all use it all the time, you know, it's, that's not what I would consider a luxury. No. Uh, fifty years ago the automobile was a luxury but it's a necessity today and, uh, as hard as they try to get these public transit things going I have never seen nor heard of one that really got of the ground. Or that accomplish what they set out to to accomplish. Yeah. What are your feelings on it?
Well, um, I, I think that we probably are paying a little too much tax considering what we're getting for it and how it's being managed and so forth. I mean, I, I think there could be a better system and we would get more for our money. It's totally out of our hands so we don't, we can't really do a whole lot about how that money is spent and where it goes and, uh, Yeah. That, that's, that's so true. I mean, they say well, you voice your opinion, uh, uh, uh, on election day. But not really. No, you don't. Look what happened on the last presidential election, read my lips. And what happened they turned around and double crossed us. Yeah. So, uh, I mean, you can't believe what you hear. Well, I think too, one of the things that rubs me the wrong way the most is those programs that are funded by Congress and, uh, that don't seem to have any validity at all. I mean, they're always far out
and, uh, you know, they're studying some obscure bug, you know, in some other part of the world or some such thing, Oh. Uh, yes. and our tax money pays for those things and I think that's wrong. I, I agree and, and, uh, I, I also think we extend too much help to other, uh, countries we need enough help here in this country. That's right. They're still people starving people here *They're There're why should we help starving people somewhere else. Yeah. And I think here lately they've been saying quite often and maybe somebody's coming to realize we're the nation in trouble. Absolutely. Now I can't wait for, uh, I, I could just picture what's going to happen here in the not to distant future. We keep hearing well, we're going to receive, uh, eight billion dollars from Japan for the, uh, uh-huh, the, the, the big, war over there in the Mideast. The war. Uh-huh.
And, uh, so many billions of dollars here and there and everything and, uh, the next thing you know we'll be turning around just like we did to Poland and say, well, just forget it. Yeah. And I think that's a mistake. Oh, definitely. Somewhere, you know, we have to realize that we can't just keep giving it away. Well, another thing now they keep decontrolling different things. First, it was the airlines then it was banks and, and, uh, um, savings association, and whatnot. We know what trouble they got into Exactly. And the same with the airlines back in the days when they were, uh, controlled and, and, uh, Transcontinental or, um, um, Interstate, uh, Trucking. I mean, as soon as the federal government gave up control on all that, they just went to hell in a hand basket. Yeah. Prices went sky high. Then, in, in the case of airlines, of course, they became highly competitive and they cut each others throats until they're, they reach the point where they're cutting their own throat. And, uh, well, of course, that's getting away from taxes isn't it, that's government controlled. But, uh,
Well, I, I think another thing too that, um, I've had a little contacted with, uh, in regard to taxes let's say that, uh, you have something that the I R S disagrees with or, you know, says, hey, we're not going to allow that. Well, I think they're very unfair in the amount of penalties and interest that they can attach to that because you, you will not only payback that that you wrote off but you will at least double that amount and, Oh, by the time you get through with the, uh the penalties. Yes. And that's, to me there's something wrong there, you know. Yeah. I mean, I can see paying the interest and some small penalty but they really stick it to you big time. Uh, I agree. I think the I R S is, uh, just too powerful. There should be some sort of a control on it. And they should be a little more humane. Uh-huh. Absolutely. Uh, the, uh, typical bureaucratic, I guess. That's, that's one of my pet peeves. I came up with a brilliant idea how we could reduce the, the budget. Uh-huh.
Very simple. Give, uh, uh, uh, government employees the average number of, uh, holidays as the, uh, private industry. Yeah. I mean, you think about it now, they, they get about sixteen holidays a year. That's a lot. It sure is. And I think here at TI we get, what is it nine or ten? Well, I haven't counted. I, I would have guessed eight even but you might be right. I don't have any idea. Well, I remember, uh, uh, thinking, I think it was the last time I did hear that we get about the average. Maybe even a little more, a day or so more than the average. Yeah. But, uh, government is ridiculous. Wow. Just think of the money they could save. I mean, they're, they're paying out this money anyway.
Yeah. Why not get the work out of the people. Yeah. And, well, anyway that would, of course, eventually come back to taxes. But, uh, as far as income tax is concerned, I can't complain too much about it. Uh, I'm single, I have no, uh, dependents or anything, my children are all grown and they're out worrying about their own income taxes. Yeah. Well, I, I have another thing that I thought about too, for instance, when you try to save money and you earn interest on whatever your investment is and, you know, we're not typically talking about big dollars but here you feel like you've, you've done something good you've, you've earned your interest and then you have to go back and pay taxes on it. So, the real amount of your savings on that is, is, not much. Uh, very true. That's, You know, it's kind of a vicious circle there. And then they tell you to, uh, well, invest it in, uh, is it I R A or something
and, and, when you turn, When you turn sixty-five why then you pay the tax on it And then, at a took that away as far as being, and the tax is a lot less. Yeah. But in the mean time you've got your money tide up in a low, relatively low interest bearing investment. I mean, it's not making ten, fifteen percent like a business is today. Huh-uh. Uh, me I'm a firm believer in that if you got it spend it. Well, you can come over to my house and spend it Well, you, well, do you, do you need some help spending yours? I wish I had some to spend. No. No. I just don't have any. Oh, uh-huh. Well, that's my problem too. I'm, I'm trying to figure out from one payday to the next whose going to be the lucky one this month that's going to get paid. Yeah. That's the way it goes Well, I guess we probably talked just about long enough.
Uh-huh. Yeah. Uh, let me ask you something. Did you get a catalog or something from these people? Yes. You did? Uh-huh. I've, everybody I've talked to has received one but I haven't gotten mine. Uh, I don't know. Um, well, anyway Ellen, it was nice talking to you. You too. And, uh, until next time. Okay. Bye-bye. Good-bye. Uh, no I think that maybe the, the automation people that are very discrete. Or not discrete, electronic devices. Oh, okay. Oh.
So, and, did he, is he the one that got you connected with us? Uh-huh. Okay. It's a lot of fun. Yeah. You want to punch the button and go? Sure, you ready? Yip Okay. Well, are you going to buy a car soon? Well, it won't be too much longer because my husband and I are both going to retire. And when we retire we're going to buy us, a, you know, a new one and, and get rid of the two that we have right now. And what are you going to buy? I I don't know, we're either going to buy a pick up, or we're going to buy a van. Or we're going to buy an economy car, how do you like that Well, have you been listening to Iacocca's arguments that, uh, that Chrysler products are the only ones that, that all have air bags?
Uh, yeah. Does that make a difference to you? Yeah. It sure does. I really would like to have something like that, and I'm hoping that by you know, that's like, right now, my husband would like for me to buy another vehicle right now. But I keep saying lets put it off, lets put it off, because I'm hoping they'll get so many better features. Yeah, like what? Well, just like that air bag. I think that thing is fantastic. Because I've seen some of the, you know, like the head on collision type things, when they had it and people walk away from it. Yeah. We had one here, I guess it was about three weeks ago, and the people walked away from the, wreck, with no scratches nothing. You know, a few bruises. That's . did you see the, uh,
I don't know if it was TWENTY-TWENTY, last Thursday or Friday night on, on seat belts? Uh-huh. Did that scare you a little bit? With the lady being thrown out and run over. Uh-huh. You got it. I, I, tell you what, I would not, I would not buy a car that had the seat belt where it was hooked under the door. that really I, I guess, I, that, that a little more than scared me, that irritated me, uh, that, because it, it, it surely didn't come as a surprise that, that if the door came open the lady would fall out, I mean, and, Well, you know what the average person, would you ever have thought of that? uh I mean now no, probably, well,
you probably wouldn't have, I might, the problem is I'm really into cars, and so it's not a, uh, for me it's, it's a real, it's a real consideration, uh, uh, and, and, uh, the, but no I probably wouldn't have even though I'm really quite into cars it's, it's probably my main hobby. Right because you always think, I mean, I don't know, maybe you don't, but just like me, I always think well, you know, these things must be safe, but that's just like, I don't know if you've heard about it a few years ago, they said, you know, before they had the, like the shoulder strap thing where it was just like a seat belt that goes across your waist? Yeah. All these people were, and, and it, it was on one of those kind of shows like TWENTY-TWENTY Uh-huh.
these people were like paralyzed, and because, it threw them forward, but they were hooked at the waist, and so it like, you know, did something to their spinal cord Yeah. then they were like paraplegics. yeah, you know, ROAD AND TRACK had a, had some articles on, and particularly with, with back seat, uh, with some, where kids, were, were sitting in the back seat with seat belts on, and they were thrown forward, into the front seat, and there was enough stretching, the combination of stretching the spine to, uh, I mean, the serious injury, even though they were, they were still locked in the Right. they were forced to go, so really if your sitting in the back seat, your better off not not to have your seat belt on, if it's just a seat belt. Yeah. We have a van, that, uh, just has seat belts in the back doesn't have a shoulder harness Well, tell me about your van. Do you like it? I have an Arrow Star van, we really do.
Uh, it's, it's a mini van, we've had it, goodness in May will be five years and, uh, they replace the engine at sixty thousand under extended warranty. And the transmission was replaced but they really are nifty, uh, the mini van, it's actually, we had a station wagon before, and it's a foot or two shorter than a, we had a regular size station wagon Uh-huh. and it really, uh, we like it, it, the interestingly enough one of the features we like are the electric locks. Huh. The reason that we're thinking about something like that, we took a trip in my brother in law and sister in laws to Florida Uh-huh. and, like I said, I mean, we're not that old but my husband works for the State, and after a certain amount of years you can retire.
And when he retires I'm retiring. Well, as soon as I get my quarters in, I'm, retiring period, Uh-huh. that's it, Yeah. you know, no more Well, but, the, did you, did you go to Florida in a van? As though Uh-huh And we wanted to travel, well, that was really nice traveling but you know, I like to know more, I mean, hear about more people that have things like that you know? Yeah. And see what they think of them, the different kinds Yeah. because I've only ridden in the one, What, what kind was it? that's it.
Uh, shoot I can't even think of the name of it now. What, what was remarkable, this van, even with, the, we have two kids, and we went to Disney World Uh-huh. uh, actually I grew up in Alabama, and I went to see my mother, and then went on down to Disney World, and it got better than, I think twenty-two, twenty-three miles a gallon. And this was with the air conditioner on and, and you know four people with, with luggage, Yeah. and, uh, course this, grant it, that's, you know, it's been four years ago, but it's remarkable that the, that the bigger vans, uh, they're, uh, my boss just bought a, a pick up truck, and, uh, he only gets seventeen miles a gallon. Yeah. But it, it has a big engine,
and it, it, pulls a boat and stuff, but it's, and it, it's got the seats that, and the other thing that is interesting, is it has, uh, rear air conditioning. Uh-huh. And that, that makes a lot of difference in those of us that live in warm climates. Yeah. Well, now, this one that we went in, it did to baby what kind of van was that that we went to Florida in? Ford. A what? Ford. A Ford? Ford what, you remember? conversation with He was trying to think of what the name of it was, Well, the big, you know, the big vans are all, real nice, this was a big one. I mean it was a big one, yeah,
oh those are it has the front and the back and you know, it has the uh, back seat let down into a double, I mean a queen size bed yeah. Yeah. and then it had the two swivels in the middle, and then the two swivel chairs on the front All right. and, I mean it was fantastic, Uh-huh. and it got good gas mileage, but I don't know I don't really, I don't, I want something I can drive too, you know, Well well, the mini, that, and I was scared to drive that big van. you'd be surprised if, if you drive a, one of the, the mini vans, uh, more or less alike the, the, uh, Chevrolet and, uh, well of course, Oldsmobile has got one, and Chryslers got one, but they drive remarkably like cars. Well, do you, does yours have that this one had it where you know, you would see something coming in the rear view mirror, I mean not the rear, those little side mirror things
Yeah. and it would look like it was further back than it was. Yeah but, the little, thing etched in it, say objects are, are closer than they appear or something Yeah, does yours do that too? Yeah. Oh. I was wondering if all vans did that, Well you, you can, you can, uh, install those mirrors, we've got the big side mirrors, which are really nice. I don't know if you've, well, if you've driven a pick up truck, you know, these are, these, uh, mirrors must be six inches across not nearly a foot high, Uh-huh. and they're really nice, uh, got them on both sides, actually they, they fold, so when you get in tight situations, you can fold them back. Yeah, But they're well, see that's the reason we couldn't make, really make them,
at first we were going to get a pick up truck, with a camper on the back of it, of it, uh-huh. but then that gas mileage was just atrocious, I mean it's, unreal, Uh-huh. it's, it just practically don't get any. Well, they have got, some of the newer ones they, you know, with the aerodynamic features, you can get pretty, pretty decent gas mileage. Yeah. And then, uh, he talked about a van, and I said, well, you know, I don't know, I don't know how the gas is on most of these. And another thing was that's the reason I said you know, there was such a big difference you know, in a little economy car, but I said maybe we might have to get us an economy car to pull along when we went somewhere. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Yeah. But really and truly the safety features but I wouldn't get one that, if it had, the seat belts on the door now I wouldn't get it.
Yeah. Period. Ford now announced I think in ninety-two, they're going to put, uh, air bags in their, in their vans. Oh that would be good. So, uh, and I think, I, I believe safety, I, I, I, I really do believe in this stuff, uh, and I, I think it can go, , I'm not, the air bags are a good deal but, uh, surprisingly, uh, they're, uh, you really need to do, you need a combination of both the air bags and the, uh, and the seat belts Oh I think so too, so, I don't think they should do away with the seat belts now. Yeah. I'm but I think you need the shoulder thing Yeah. I think you need the thing around your waist,
but, I think you need that bag to pop out too. Yeah. You know, because I know so many people, here that have been killed in head on collisions, where maybe if they had, had that, that air bag, they may still be walking around. Yeah. Yeah. But, uh, I think it's fantastic. I wish they required it in everything. Every new car that came out, I wish they would require it in it. It would be that would do to our insurance rates, you know, if, if, uh, if the insurance companies says it, says we're not going to pay, you know, a claim, if, if the car doesn't have, uh, air bags. Would be interesting wouldn't it? Yeah. Uh, that wouldn't be fair but, uh, Well, no because what they would do is, that's what they're going to plan on, you know, they would have to do it, the insurance company would have to do the same thing. They're given like, a ten year time limit where, Yeah. okay. These cars, I guess they figure all the old cars, will be off the roads or something by the, in ten years
Yeah. and then, you know, if you didn't have a car that had one, then your insurance would go up enormously, Uh-huh, uh-huh, uh, I've got to go my son's in a performance tonight, I have to leave, in a couple of minutes. Oh that's okay, Uh, I think we've probably spent a reasonable amount of time. Okay. It was good talking to you, Well, you, you too. Okay. Good night. All right bye bye. Okay, Dee, are you familiar with the Latin American policies? Yeah, to a point,
it's not my best subject. Really, yeah it's not mine either, but, uh, I know, I know our policy, like in Nicaragua, I am familiar with that because we have, uh, some friends that live on the Nicaraguan border and they are missionaries there and they, they live there and they have to travel by boat forty-five minutes to get to their car and stuff, and uh, I know that they helped a lot of those Sandanistas refugees coming across the border and they housed them and stuff. They have been down there about three years now, and they wrote that it's kind of weird they have bats in their roof, but the bats eat the bad spiders so they leave the bats, you know. So. Yeah. It's a whole, whole different culture or, It, it's weird down there because there's always lizards and things running around that people live there,
Uh-huh. they just, they take it for granted and it's like we go down there on vacation, it's like oh, how can these people live with these lizards and like bats in their house? Yeah. I think their policy with them that though, is, uh, I don't know, I think, I wish we would have just, I'm not that up on the policy of ways. I know that's kind of old, but I don't know, I just, I'm glad that the Sandanistas aren't in power anymore because I think that they were very wicked. And, uh, probably some of the biggest drug dealers that the world has probably ever seen, and I feel like most of the leaders in Latin America are probably, you would be safe to say that they were just very very, you know, big into drugs. Very very corrupt, like the Panamanians are, were very corrupt. Right. The thing about it though is the Panamanians is, a lot of servicemen down there. A lot of, a lot of American servicemen are involved, Uh-huh.
because I guess there was a big, big, uh, scam that, that all these guys up. Thousands of servicemen, got caught for running a drug ring. Uh-huh. Yeah. So, it's, it's like everybody is into it, it's just greed. Human greed. Yeah. Interestingly in Honduras, It's very pro-American. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. And we have I, my girlfriend used to, uh, be in the Navy and she was based, uh, based in Panama. Uh-huh. In Honduras, very, uh, uh, pro-American. Uh-huh. And there's a lot of men, I don't know how many American, uh, soldiers are there, but there's a lot. I mean, they, uh,

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