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As quoted from <nate.1504.735838830@psygate.psych.indiana.edu> by nate@psygate.psych.indiana.edu (Nathan Engle): What laws did they circumvent? Being "frightening" isn't a crime. Some people are afraid of young Black males. That doesn't make the mere status of being a young Black male a crime. The BATF itself admi...
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For those who didn't figure it out, the below message was a reply to another in sci.crypt, for which the poster put t.p.g. in the Followup-To line. I didn't notice that. Apologies to those who were confused. The substance makes little sense unless one reads the prior messages. However, I don't wish to enter into this...
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Ok, you don't like what I have to say. Would you care to demonstrate how the above list, or any expanded version of it you chose to post, demonstrates fairness in the actions of the UN wrt Israel? You make the odd assumption that I read Israeli papers, not European ones. My main source of news is the Economist,...
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Not due to race. Due to membership in an organization which publically proclaimed it would destroy the state which expelled them -- and furthermore kill a large segment of the citizens of that state, based on race.
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(sic) Oh, you're really bright. As if nobody would have understood it was a typo. Several parents with children who either had at one time or currently were inside the compound made the aforementioned charges. One parent actually spoke about said charges (in reference to his 13-year old daughter) WITH Koresh on the p...
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I am not a paranoid, nor a government toady, nor even am I the guy you were talking to originally, but I think you are simply NOT PAYING ATTENTION. A bunch of people living off by themselves with a lot of guns nearby is not that wierd in Texas. My own family, very quiet taxpayers with extremely con- ventional v...
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This can be turned around. The Austrians who should feel guilty about their actions during WWII, but don't, justify their anti-semetism by making every Israeli action into an atrocity. The Austrians, Germans and other Europeans have extensive trading relations with the Arab block; being pro-Arab is good f...
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Another name for this region is Cis-Jordan.
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None of you guys noticed my "Gross Mistake" 'cause you don't have a clue. I noticed the misspeaking myself and corrected it. I doubt you would have ever noticed. Actually I've read books and taken courses on the subject. Ah yes and like you lived in the greater Deutschland. You guys are funny. It's funny to see...
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NO SURRENDER! Delivered by Lenda Jackson at the RKBA Rally in Denver, April 18, 1993 It is a fact of modern life that urban residents, particularly women, feel threatened. A certain number of them actually are threatened. There are immediate threats, the things that women will tell you they're afraid of. The noise dow...
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What is this "Gaza"? Are you purposely separating it from the "West Bank"? If so, why separate the people and territories? If not, why are you just addressing "Gaza" here? By all means, continue to list the "etc." The reason I particularly bring this up here is that there are **many** from middle eastern and west as...
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I've yet to meet a group of Baptists who were stockpiling Cambell's soup and M-16's/AR-15's and banging/marrying thirteen yuear olds. You're a sorry son of a bitch if you can't draw a distinction between these two things. People like you cheapen our constitution by using it to defend sociopaths who aren't deserved of ...
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Why? He, Reno, and the FBI got what they wanted -- a reminder of who is the boss in America -- the thugs who work for the government.
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Please, read my post carefully, I am saying that lift the arms emargo and let the MUSLIMS defend themselves. The point is these Europians "civilized countries" neither want to get intervene militarily themselves and nor they like to see the muslims of the world to help the oppressed. (Remember what happened almost...
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From: Center for Policy Research <cpr> Subject: Zionists reject non-Jews. News Ethiopian Jews and not-quite Jews The Israeli press has published items about Ethiopian Jews waiting in camps in Addis Ababa for immigration to Israel, who are dying of starvation. The following are excerpts from an interview with the ...
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Why not try to eliminate discrimination from existing laws instead of trying to add discrimination that favors your group.
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Or, did anyone notice that when Clinton referred to the Davidians as 'religious fanatics' that a round of spontaneous applause burst forth from the reporters ? To me this was not only in poor taste, but it showed the media's bias and hostility to anyone not of the politically correct stripe. No wonder they have bee...
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Perhaps I failed to make myself clear: Minorities in the U.S. *correlate* with poverty. This isn't good and we should address it, but we shouldnt' ignore that minorities and poverty *do* tend to go together. *Does* Vancouver have a consistantly poor population drawn along racial lines? If it doesn't, ...
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Ah, those poor genocide apologists. Such quaintly charming habits of the Armenian barbarism and fascism. No swinging of lies will be enough to cover up the crimes of the x-Soviet Armenian Government. Not a chance. Now let the Kurdish scholars speak for themselves. Source: Hassan Arfa, "The Kurds," (London, 1968), ...
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The FBI says that some of the survivors claim to have seen the leaders of the cult talking about setting a fire, and to have smelt kerosene. I assume this will come out at any trial that occurs as a result of these events.
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<cpr@igc.apc.org> (in real life, Elias DAvidson) quotes A nutcase quoting a crackpot. Next time, post this to rec.humor, or perhaps alt.conspiracy.
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Mark Ira Kaufman writes
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I have a joint House-Senate conference committe report (i.e., crime bill) for the 102rd Congress which contains a "Brady Bill -- 7 day waiting period" within it. I believe it just died and never came up for a vote in either house. They got four years of Clinton's support to pass it.
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Apparently needing to clarify his comments from Thursday, Dr. Nizam Plawaby (spelling?), the Medical Examiner for Tarrant County, Texas, who has authority in the Waco deaths, stated that since no autopsies had been performed, there is no evidence for bullet wounds, or evidence against bullet wounds. Janet Reno also s...
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Today the Texas ME found two people, a man and a woman shot in the head inside the burned compound. But these were not the people that the FBI described a few days before. The FBI said that the person found in front of the compound had been shot and several children were also. The two people found today were on top of ...
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And just where is the evidence for this? FBI sayso. The Texas Medical Examiner refuted 2 of their lies today. Let me put you in a building, pump in CS, knock the walls down around you and see how fast you find an exit. I don't know why either, you're willing to swallow everything fed you. Good boy. Oh a Clinton a...
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That includes suicides. Since it has been shown in other countries that suicide rates are pretty much independent of the means available for doing oneself in (studies include some done/published in Japan, Canada, Austria, Norway), suicides ought not be included in the count. If this is done, the number of vehicle-re...
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[Posting the text of H.R. 711 ...] [ ... ] [ ... ] Note that this is a "licensing bill," pretending to be a "training bill."
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Because the Gun loonies were firing on vehicles with 50mm amunition that has a range of 3000 meters. Next question. The problem is of course the laws that allow a bunch of raving nutters to collect a huge stack of arms in the first place. The sequence of events meant that there really was no option but to attempt...
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My reference is a 4 page essay in our local Star Tribute newspaper putting the whole conflict in perspective. I will readily admit that I am no authority in this area; however, other posteers asserted that *some* Muslims did join hands with Croats and Nazis in persecuting Serbs. In any case, past actions do not in an...
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Just saw a new commercial(?) by the NRA. It starts out with a bunch of politicians talking about how to get rid of crime. They finally realize that they need to put criminals away longer but there isn't enough jail space so they decide on another gun law.( During this whole seen there quoteing various statistics on ho...
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I think there are some generally accepted criteria according to which one can evaluate whether certain policies or practices constitute racial discrimination. These criteria are to be found for example in the 1. International Convention for Abolition of All Forms of Racial Discrimination (ratified by most countrie...
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CHEERS Brandon. That's the best suggestion I have seen that. !!!
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You deliberately deleted a line! I don't remember how wrote it, but I remember what he wrote. He wrote Happy 45 birth day of Israel! and I worte: Is this means that the number of the people have been killed by Israel are so high that you can not keep the track of, or this is also a part of Zionism ideology that...
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Let's go to the videotape. Here's exactly what you posted: So if you weren't saying that the deaths of "bastard children of a sacreligious zealot" was no big thing (and I know I am not the only one who read it that way), just what the hell WERE you saying? So who brainwashed YOU into believing that whatever th...
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# : # Can someone tell me why when Mr. Cramer spouts on about homosexuals, # : # he only addresses homosexual men, and never, in any post I've read, # : # addressed lesbians? # # : I can't really speak for Mr. Cramer here, but I can say that a # : homosexual [male] is an entirely different animal than a lesbian. # : T...
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Wait a minute. The story being pushed here is that the fire started in ONE PLACE. This is not consistent with the story that they were TRAPPED by the fire (particularly in a building that all of a sudden had many more exits). Choose one, please. Well, for everyone besides Koresh and his blood children, we can a...
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((fluffy bi fantasy squelched)) Dear Mr. Elf,
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From article <pdb059-220493112512@kilimanjaro.jpl.nasa.gov>, by pdb059@ipl.jpl.nasa.gov (Paul Bartholomew): #> A very well put together post. I disagree with several key points, but the #> post is an excellent one with which to "engage in discourse": I agree wholeheartedly. Paul, you have handled this so well, I thi...
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Well, that was an easy decision. No more Bianchi anything for me.
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Yes the govt handled it in the Rambo Hollywood type style with extreeme Machismo. Perhaps thats not the way to handle it. It is a completely different thing to start asserting as many have done that the government is primarily to blame. The comparisons with the NAZIs in particular are purely gratuitous. Since you ...
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It is not a matter of dis-belief but a matter of which of their constantly (and radically) changing stories we are to believe. Steve B.
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Israeli nationalism (also known as Zionism) is the nationalism of the Jewish people. The Jewish people are not a new phenomenon at all. Palestinean nationalism is the nationalism of Arab people. Arabs have been around for a long time. They already have some 2 dozen states, large and small, covering 98% of the M...
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Which number is that? Zero? Please present "a number" of authoritative works which "suggest" that "homosexuality is a form of mental disorder, caused by childhood sexual abuse." Don't present your own biased conclusions, based on a collage of tidbits you've extracted from a few hours' research, as the conclusions o...
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From what I saw of the videotape, there was an explosion which looked more like one due to propane rather than (official version) ammunition. If only we could be certain that the hard evidence will be released.
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And now he is posting lies about Benjamin Franklin in talk.politics.misc. Seems our Mr. Salah will stoop to any level (or is that *climb*) to spread his hate.
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First of all, I wouldn't have gone after the Davidians for a firearms violation which I object to in the first place. Second, I wouldn't have executed a search warrant via an armed assault when all the Davidians were sure to have been there. Third of all, I wouldn't have cut off all outside communication to Koresh. ...
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Those of us who questioned the mass suicide line may still have wondered, "If it wasn't suicide, why did so few get out?" The answer is now available - the gas the government had been pouring in on them is so disabling that its use in wartime is banned by the chemical weapons treaty. The U.S. had agreed not to use ...
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... If we are indeed talking about CS, then this is not quite accurate. CS is "just" tear gas--albeit the worst kind. It isn't a nausea gas, and doesn't have direct CNS effects. However, it's quite bad--much worse than CN gas. I was briefly exposed to it once (during an engagement in Berkeley circa 1968 8^) and it's n...
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[...] Mr. Kuo: I don't recall seeing your byline around much before (at least on t.p.m). Let me clue you in on this newsgroup. t.p.m is populated largely by people whose hatred for the U.S. government, especially the government of Mr. Clinton, is literally boundless. To these people, the suggestion that agents of th...
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Shooting those .44 cal. blanks, I suspect. Them movie guys is dangerous. Practice with them, I hope. --
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This is a very impotant update, I will omit just a few lines, and add some "overhead" for the sake of the copyright :-) I say despite all the bad news for Muslims around the world, things are shaping up very well, a lot of killings might happen in the near future, though (as if Bosnia is not a lot). Right now, I feel...
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Is anyone out there knowledgeable on drug issues in Japan? I'm interested in knowing if Japan has or has ever had a problem with drugs, and how they dealt with it. I've heard, undocumented, that Japan years ago used heavy legal penalties to end a serious heroin problem. I'd like to know both sides of the story. Doe...
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( I AGREE ! ) I think the problem here is that Mrs. Reno strikes me ( After watching NightLine Last night ) as a person who is incapable of understanding OR dealing with a great number of things.
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This is the AP story from Fri morning. As the walls came tumbling down and tear gas filled the air, cult leader David Koresh sprang into action. He left his third-floor bedroom and began looking around the house, making sure women and children were secure and checking that everyone had their gas masks on properly. Wi...
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[pseudo-letterhead deleted -- dcs] # While Israeli Jews fete the uprising of the Warsaw ghetto, they # repress by violent means the uprising of the Gaza ghetto and # attempt to starve the Gazans. Why do I detect the faint scent of bias here? Could it be because the Israelis aren't feasting? Perhaps because t...
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Subject: RE: Europe vs. Muslim Bosnians From: f54oguocha Date: 13 MAY 93 02:28:53 GMT Serbs. 1929). Islam not who Croats? has childhood was You've asked a crucial question that underlies much of the genocide. Bosnian Muslims are slavic in ethnicity. They speak Serbo-Croatian. But there is a Christo-Slavic ideolo...
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Doesn't seem like those responsible for the assault were very concerned about the welfare of the children inside. Seems like they were more interested in flexing their muscle before the media. My reasoning? Just ask yourself this one question: Suppose the scenario was slightly different and we had Chelsea Clinton be...
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And And Bejing = Peking, who cares about native tongue, as long as we all understand each other. Oh, not more than a few feet, I wouldn't think. I'm sorry IF your paternal grandparents died in Oswiecym or Aushwitz, which is easier to say than prove, but if so, the lesson they paid thier lives for was wasted...
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Local media hasn't said much, if anything, about the MOW. Also, when I called a straight friend in Arlington to tell him I would be on his doorstep this weekend, he didn't know anything at all about the march. This is a gay-sympathetic person who notices things like this. I thought it was strange that he was unaware...
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Sealing off the Gaza Strip has the interesting side-effect of demonstrating the non-viability of Gaza as an independent state. Where are all of these people going to go to find work if they are separated from Israel? If they complain about having to show id cards on the way to work, how will they feel about showing ...
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It is indeed different usage of the word Muslim . In Bosnia , it is more or less used as an ethnic term not as religious one . There are people in Bosnia who refer to themselves as "Christian Bosnian Muslims" if you can make sense of that . Bosnian Serbs and Bosnian Muslims have the same language. Bosnian Muslims ...
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As David Veal points out, this sort of "promotion" would be used against gun owners by the mass media. However, here is my proposal: offer gun safety classes in your area, free, as a community service. Such a class would normally cost $40 or $50, so offering it free is a good promotion. Our Gun Club has organized s...
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Here in Georgia, the state legislature in 1992 "accidentally passed a law lobbied for by Opthamologists prohibiting anyone but a licensed MD from giving shots. They were trying to limit Optometrists from competing with them. They inadvertantly forbade nurses, EMTs, dentists, and tattoo artists from "piercing the sk...
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But of course it does. It's certainly a legal matter. If it's not a legal matter that interest *you* you may simply put it in your kill file.
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16. What is the condition of the propane tank mentioned by the BD survivors? I.e. is it crushed and does it have tread marks on it? -- Dave Feustel N9MYI <feustel@netcom.com>
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Is your stomach all right? Unable to digest your lunch? Cool down... In the context of Bosnia muslims are a nation. And nobody talked about them being a race. And Yugoslavia was a recognized nation. If you apply the principle of self determination to Yugoslavia then you should apply it to Croatia and Bosnia. ...
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James Madison, Federalist Paper 41: "It has been urged and echoed, that the power ``to lay and collect taxes, duties, imposts, and excises, to pay the debts, and provide for the common defense and general welfare of the United States,'' amounts to an unlimited commission to exercise ...
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What if we remove one zeron and make it "the genocide of two hundred thousands Muslims in Bosnia..", would that make it any better..? And how about the 2,000,000 Muslims who were driven and continue to be driven out of their homes..? is that "utterly ridiculous claim"? And how a...
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Ilyess sez: >So how would have *you* defended Saudi Arabia and rolled >back the Iraqi invasion, were you in charge of Saudi Arabia??? All Muslims knew that the whole thing was set up to destroy Iraq, not to "Liberate Kuwait", The people who were killed by the invasion are more (many many more), than t...
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The IRS doesn't need to rely on the Federal Marshall's Services; the IRS has its own Swat teams. I saw a picture of one in an article on the IRS in some magazine or other. -- Dave Feustel N9MYI <feustel@netcom.com>
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+>1. There is no such thing as non-toxic tear gas. Tear gas is non-breathable +> remaining in it's presence will cause nausea and vomiting, followed eventually +> by siezures and death. Did the FBI know the physical health of all the people +> they exposed?? Any potential heart problems among the B-D's?? ...
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Post all you want, foreigner. We'd rather hear from you than those "I'll support the fascist who writes the hecks for my salary" .edu site types! Should you expect the Police to come in and assault you, lay siege and refuse to help when they (yes, let's give them the benefit of the doubt) accidently burn down your ra...
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My sig has generated more mail than any of my posts. Robin Hood is a school financing plan wherein property rich school districts will have a portion of their tax revenue taken from them and given to property poor districts. The laudable plan is to equalize the per student spending. IMHO, however, it is a disaster w...
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Macedonia said yesterday it had neither requested or needs such forces. This is sort of like sending the National Guard to Bel Air when the riot is in South Central! Obviously, Clinton is again trying to make policy for image purposes in America rather than to try to deal with the real problem and assume a share o...
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According to an AP report (from Texas, written by Jaime Aron) this morning, in addtion to the gas pumped in by hoses from CS generators, canisters of tear gas were thrown into the building from armored vehicles, one of the canisters hitting a man inside in the face. This was in the part of the article *before* going...
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: Oh? Then why did the smoke and flames start from three different places? : In particular, three different places where there were no APV's? The crushed remains of a PRESSURIZED propane tank were found in the ruins of the BD compound. The key word is PRESSURIZED. When that baby was crushed, the gas would have gon...
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Good. Another liberal converted by Waco! If Dave had had something realistic, there would have been none of this "Bradley" vehicle crap.
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Utopia is a myth (although we can do a lot better than what we have today). But I think that you must pitch Libertarianism as a progressive agenda (ie You can do better under our style of system). I'm flattered by your invitation, but I'm afraid you have the wrong person. Although I completely agree with your civil ...
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Let me remind all of those Muslim-haters out there who like to mention the Mufti's cooperation with Germany as a reason to let Muslims be slaughtered everywhere in the world of the following facts: 1)Why blame the Muslims for what the Nazis did and FORGIVE ITALY, THE CROATS, AND MANY OTHER EUROPEANS FOR BEING REAL ALL...
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american and european universities were full of Angry Young People(tm) that wanted to overthrow the government, and wouldn't think twice about lobbing a molotov cocktail at the national guard (military police in Europe.) Certainly, it would have been very bad form to take anything the System(tm) said at face value. T...
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It is 'Serdar', 'kocaoglan'. Just say so. The SUNDAY TIMES 8 March 1992 Morgues fill as Azeris head for all-out war ------------------------------------------- Thomas Goltz, the first to report the massacre by Armenian soldiers in the worst violence since the breakup of the Soviet Union, reports from Agdam ...
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The above statement ignores reality. The BD WERE provoked. Damn, Phil. You must have seen a different tape of the initial raid than I did. Your `doorbell' happened to include lobbing percussion grenades and attempting to storm the compound through the windows. I can honestly say I have never seen a `doorbell' t...
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First, a tank drove through the wall into the living room. I can't stop thinking about the children who were inside the house (the room?) at the time. How many people got killed during the Tiannamen Square events? -- --------------------------------------------------------------------------------...
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Serdar, I have been told that you are not real, your account is fake (which I confirmed by trying to E-mail you) and advised not to waste my time writing to "you". But, I get pleasure from watching you make a fool of yourself. So you stand by the statement that all Armenians are barbarians. OK, I see. Lets ...
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. re. own. s. Will do! I appreciate the thoughtfullness of the Post to not be an intermediary for such sales. The "Right to bear arms" is one of the most misapplied rights in our Constitution, and assault weapons go way beyond what is, or rather should be (imho), a "natural" right in America. Just ask t...
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No crime here. No crime here. No crime here. Also no substantiation of your claim that Koresh said this. I for one have never heard this mentioned before. Where did you hear it? Up to which moment? The one where you decided that anyone who claims to be God no longer has the protection of the Constitution? Wha...
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From: harelb@math.cornell.edu (misc.activism.progressive co-moderator) Subject: F<O>CUS/HEALTH: How U.S. compares... Children/Elderly in Poverty F<O>CUS/HEALTH: How U.S. compares... Children/Elderly in Poverty ================================================================== Percentage of children and elderly l...
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Does the phrase "Innocent until proven guilty" have ANY meaning anymore? -- jmd@handheld.com
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[SB] Oh yeah, Israel was really ready to "expand its borders" on the holiest day [SB] of the year (Yom Kippur) when the Arabs attacked in 1973. Oh wait, you [SB] chose to omit that war...perhaps because it 100% supports the exact [SB] OPPOSITE to the point you are trying to make? I don't think that it's [SB] becaus...
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<< <<< <<<Anybody got Arlen Spectre's address? I want to write to him and thank him <<<for showing the leadership to demand a Congressional investigation <<<into the Waco mess. << <<If I had Arlen's address, I would go to his house (Do weasels live <<in houses or in holes?) and personally tell him what a pathetic id...
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I do not want to convince anyone. This is just USENET, not the real world. I just read the opinions others have about a subject, and sometimes I present my opinion. I think that this net is only useful to exchange ideas. I never wanted nor I want now to convince anyone of anything. First, and I repeat it, I never s...
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Not according to reports I have read. It seems that the Somalis think of our African American Marines in less than complimentary terms, using gestures that signify a word I refuse to use. Seems that even when you try to help people, they still insult you.
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Very narrow. Very, very narrow. If you'll recall, I was the nut that advocated the possibility of tactical nukes being militia weapons in certain situations. How can you possibly define what is a weapon and what isn't is only the start of this. And you've just described any civilian reactor because your def...
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Boston Globe, Wednesday April 21 1993 col. 4 "Bodies found in ruins as FBI defends raid on cult ranch" col. 5 "Clinton blames Koresh, orders probe of siege" col. 2 "The children: panws in a horrifying game" pg. 18, col. 1, Editorial page "Judgment at Waco" Now the scientific and political scrutiny of the horror...
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I don't want to attack anyone's personal opinions and thus have not included any articles - but it seems to me incredibly ridiculous and pompous for someone to sit back with the benefit of hindsight and point fingers at Clinton, Reno, the FBI, or whomever. First of all, it is a knee-jerk judgement. The facts are quit...
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