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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
You don't actually see yourself the way other people see you.
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
Often, you're very, very hard on yourself in a way
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
that other people really aren't going to be.
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
So that's one of the insights is you've
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
got to be really diligent about thinking,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
am I behaving in a way that represents
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
how I want other people to behave,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
like leading through example?
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
There's a lot of examples of leaders
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
that really mess this up, like they make decisions that
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
are like, wow, it's a bad example for other people.
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
So I think leading by example is one.
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
The other one I believe is working really hard.
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
And I don't mean working exhaustively,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
but showing a real passion for the problem,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
not necessarily your solution to the problem,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
but the problem itself is just one that you really believe in.
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
Like with discourse, for example,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
the problem that we're looking at,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
which is my current project, is how do you get people
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
in groups to communicate in a way that doesn't break down
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
into the howling of wolves?
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
How do you deal with trolling?
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
Not like technical problems.
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
How do I get people to post paragraphs?
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
How do I get people to use bold?
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
How do I get people to use complete sentences,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
although those are problems as well?
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
But how do I get people to get along with each other
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
and then solve whatever problem it is they set out to solve,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
or reach some consensus on discussion,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
or just not hurt each other even?
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
Maybe it's a discussion that doesn't really matter,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
but are people yelling at each other?
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
And why?
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
Like that's not the purpose of this kind of communication.
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
So I would say leadership is about setting an example,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
doing the things that represent what you want to be,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
and making sure that you're actually doing those things.
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
And there's a trick to that too,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
because the things you don't do
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
also say a lot about what you are.
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
Yeah, so let's pause on that one.
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
So those two things are fascinating.
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
So how do you have as a leader that self awareness?
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
So you just said it's really hard to be self aware.
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
So for you personally, or maybe for other leaders
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
you've seen or look up to,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
how do you know both that the things you're doing
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
are the wrong things to be doing,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
the way you speak to others, the way you behave,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
and the things you're not doing?
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
How do you get that signal?
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
I think there's two aspects to that.
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
One is like processing feedback that you're getting, so.
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
How do you get feedback?
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
Well, right, so are you getting feedback, right?
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
So one way we do it, for example, with discourse,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
we have three cofounders,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
and we periodically talk about decisions
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
before we make them.
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
So it's not like one person can make a mistake,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
or like, wow, there can be misunderstandings, things like that.
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
So it's part of like group consensus of leadership
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
is like it's good to have,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
I think systems where there's one leader,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
and that leader has the rule of absolute law
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
are just really dangerous in my experience.
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
For communities, for example,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
like if you have a community that's run by one person,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
that one person makes all the decisions,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
that person's gonna have a bad day.
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
Something could happen to that person, something,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
there's a lot of variables.
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
So like first, when you think about leadership,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
have multiple people doing leadership
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
and have them talk amongst each other.
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
So giving each other feedback about the decisions
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
that they're making.
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
And then when you do get feedback,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
I think there's that little voice in your head, right?
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
Or your gut or wherever you wanna put it in your body.
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
I think that voice is really important.
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
Like I think most people who have any kind of moral compass
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
or like want to do,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
most people want to do the right thing.
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
I do believe that.
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
I mean, there might be a handful of sociopaths
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
out there that don't, but most people,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
they want other people to think of them as a good person.
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
And why wouldn't you, right?
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
Like, do you want people to despise you?
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
I mean, that's just weird, right?
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
So you have that little voice
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
that sort of the angel and devil on your shoulder
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
sort of talking to you about like what you're doing,
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
how you're doing, how does it make you feel
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
to make these decisions, right?
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
And I think having some attunement to that voice
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Jeff Atwood: Stack Overflow and Coding Horror | Lex Fridman Podcast #7
is important.
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