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(Soundbite of laughter) | (soundbite of | (Soundbite of, | (soundbite of laughter) |
But talk a little bit about this. Because this, I mean, Swiss banks have been really notoriously tightlipped about their client lists. It's almost a cliche. What happened? | but talk a little bit about this because this i mean swiss banks, have been really notoriously tightlipped about their client. lists it's almost a cliche what | But talk a little. bit about, this Because this I mean Swiss banks have been, really notoriously tightlipped about, their. client lists It's almost a. cliche What | but talk a little bit about this. because this, i mean, swiss banks have been really notoriously tightlipped about their client lists. it's almost a cliche. what happened? |
It is almost a cliche. If you say something like, well, he was known to carry several Swiss bank accounts… | it is almost a. cliche if you say something like well; he was known to carry several swiss bank | It is almost. a cliche If you say something like, well he was known to carry several. Swiss bank | it is almost a cliche. if you say something like, well, he was known to carry several swiss bank accounts… |
Yeah. | yeah. | ||
…it immediately confers this kind of a mysticism or international man of mystery and danger. And a lot of that was de-exoticized this week when UBS was forced to give up just under 5,000 client names, and that's the unthinkable. If a Swiss banker were to just volunteer names, I think that's punishable by a prison sente... | …it immediately confers this kind of a mysticism or international man of, mystery and danger and a, lot of that was de-exoticized this week when ubs was forced to give up just under 5,000 client names and that's the unthinkable if, a swiss banker were to just volunteer names i think that's punishable by. a prison sente... | …it immediately confers this kind of a mysticism or international man of mystery and danger And a lot of that was de-exoticized this, week when UBS was forced to give up just under 5,000 client names and that's the unthinkable If a Swiss banker were to just volunteer names I think that's punishable by a prison sentence... | …it immediately confers this kind of a mysticism or international man of mystery and danger. and a lot of that was de-exoticized this week when ubs was forced to give up just under 5,000 client names, and that's the unthinkable. if a swiss banker were to just volunteer names, i think that's punishable by a prison sente... |
Yes. So, what happens to the clients and to the banks themselves? | yes. so what happens to the clients and to the, banks | Yes So, what happens to the clients and to, the banks | yes. so, what happens to the clients and to the banks themselves? |
The clients are going to fight this tooth and nail, but a couple, a handful have already fessed up and said we are guilty as charged. And the government, in addition in the United States, put through some sort of amnesty project in the carrot-and-stick tradition. | the. clients are going to fight this tooth and nail but a couple a handful have already fessed up and, said we are guilty as charged and the government in addition in the united states. put through some sort of, amnesty project in the carrot-and-stick. | The clients are going to fight this tooth; and nail but a couple a handful have already fessed up and said we are guilty as charged And the government in addition in the United States put through some sort of amnesty project in the carrot-and-stick | the clients are going to fight this tooth and nail, but a couple, a handful have already fessed up and said we are guilty as charged. and the government, in addition in the united states, put through some sort of amnesty project in the carrot-and-stick tradition. |
Because the signaling is more important. In addition to getting their back tax revenue, I think it's going to make other firms step forward and find IRS religion and say, look, we're going to take you up on your amnesty offer, and so the government gets a two-for-the-price-of-one. It gets to flex its muscles and show t... | because the signaling is more important. in addition to getting their back. tax revenue i think it's going to make other firms step forward and find irs religion and say look we're going to take you up, on your amnesty, offer and so the government gets a two-for-the-price-of-one it gets to, flex its muscles and show th... | Because the signaling is more important In addition to getting their back tax revenue I think it's. going to. make other firms, step forward and find IRS religion and say look we're going to take you up on your amnesty offer and so the government gets a two-for-the-price-of-one It; gets to flex its muscles. and show th... | because the signaling is more important. in addition to getting their back tax revenue, i think it's going to make other firms step forward and find irs religion and say, look, we're going to take you up on your amnesty offer, and so the government gets a two-for-the-price-of-one. it gets to flex its muscles and show t... |
Let's talk a little bit about the markets this week. Did you see dark clouds or a silver lining? | let's talk a little bit, about the markets this week did you see dark clouds or a silver | Let's talk a little bit about the markets this week. Did you see dark clouds, or a silver, | let's talk a little bit about the markets this week. did you see dark clouds or a silver lining? |
Well, the market, however monolithic we want to look at this thing, is at a year high. I mean, this has been a spectacular run if you think about it. I saw a stat somewhere that over the span of time where the economy hemorrhaged two million jobs, the market's gained 50 percent. That's unprecedented. And this is the be... | well the market however monolithic, we want to look, at this thing, is at a year high i mean this; has been a spectacular run if you think about it i saw a stat somewhere that over the span, of time where the economy hemorrhaged two million jobs the market's gained 50 percent that's unprecedented and. this is the best ... | Well the market however monolithic we, want to look at this thing, is at a year high I mean this has been a spectacular run if. you, think about it I saw a stat somewhere that over the span of time where the economy hemorrhaged two million jobs the market's gained 50 percent That's unprecedented And this is the best I ... | well, the market, however monolithic we want to look at this thing, is at a year high. i mean, this has been a spectacular run if you think about it. i saw a stat somewhere that over the span of time where the economy hemorrhaged two million jobs, the market's gained 50 percent. that's unprecedented. and this is the be... |
There were new numbers from the Mortgage Bankers Association this week. More than 13 percent of American homeowners with a mortgage have either fallen behind on payments or are already in foreclosure. What effect is this having on the U.S. economy as a whole? | there were new numbers from the mortgage bankers association this week more than 13 percent of american homeowners with a. mortgage have. either fallen behind on, payments or are. already in foreclosure what effect is, this having on the u.s economy as a | There were new numbers. from the Mortgage Bankers Association this week More than 13 percent of American homeowners with a mortgage have either fallen behind on payments or are already in foreclosure What effect is this having on the U.S economy as a | there were new numbers from the mortgage bankers association this week. more than 13 percent of american homeowners with a mortgage have either fallen behind on payments or are already in foreclosure. what effect is this having on the u.s. economy as a whole? |
It's a significant overhang going forward. We as an economy really binged on housing, really had this - almost this real estate new paradigm fetish, and I don't think that kind of excess inventory is going to be worked off in a year or two. We have several other shoes to drop in terms of delinquencies. There is a certa... | it's a, significant overhang going; forward we as an. economy really binged on housing really had this - almost this real estate new paradigm fetish and i don't think that kind of, excess inventory is going to be, worked off in a year or two we have several other shoes to drop in terms of delinquencies there is a certa... | It's a. significant, overhang going forward, We as an economy really binged on housing really had this - almost this real estate new paradigm fetish and I don't think. that kind of excess inventory is. going to be worked off; in a year or two We have several other shoes, to drop. in terms of delinquencies There is a. c... | it's a significant overhang going forward. we as an economy really binged on housing, really had this - almost this real estate new paradigm fetish, and i don't think that kind of excess inventory is going to be worked off in a year or two. we have several other shoes to drop in terms of delinquencies. there is a certa... |
The market was pricing in, once again, calamity just a few months ago, and now it seems that things aren't going to be as horrific as expected. So, it remains to be seen. | the market was pricing in once again calamity just a few months ago and now it seems that things aren't going to, be as horrific as expected so it remains to be | The market was pricing in once again calamity just, a few, months ago and now it seems that. things aren't going to be as horrific as expected So it. remains to be | the market was pricing in, once again, calamity just a few months ago, and now it seems that things aren't going to be as horrific as expected. so, it remains to be seen. |
Roben Farzad, senior writer for Business Week, joined us from member station WLRN in Miami. Roben, thanks a lot. | roben farzad senior writer for business week. joined us from member station wlrn in miami roben thanks a | Roben Farzad. senior writer for Business Week joined us from; member station WLRN in Miami Roben thanks a | roben farzad, senior writer for business week, joined us from member station wlrn in miami. roben, thanks a lot. |
Thank you, Liane. My pleasure. | thank you liane, my | Thank, you Liane My | thank you, liane. my pleasure. |
This is WEEKEND EDITION from NPR News. I'm Scott Simon. | this is weekend edition from npr news i'm scott | This is WEEKEND EDITION from NPR News I'm Scott | this is weekend edition from npr news. i'm scott simon. |
This morning the father of jailed American journalist Roxana Saberi reports that Iran's revolutionary court has sentenced his daughter to eight years in prison for espionage. Ms. Saberi's lawyer was not allowed to ask the court about bail. Roxana Saberi has reported from Iran for NPR, the BBC and other news organizatio... | this morning. the father of jailed american, journalist roxana saberi reports that. iran's revolutionary court has sentenced his daughter, to eight years in prison. for espionage, ms saberi's lawyer was not allowed to ask the court about bail roxana saberi has, reported from iran for npr the bbc and other news organiza... | This morning the father of jailed American journalist Roxana Saberi reports that Iran's. revolutionary. court has sentenced his daughter to eight years in prison for espionage Ms Saberi's lawyer, was not allowed to ask the court about bail Roxana Saberi has reported from Iran for NPR the BBC and other, news organizatio... | this morning the father of jailed american journalist roxana saberi reports that iran's revolutionary court has sentenced his daughter to eight years in prison for espionage. ms. saberi's lawyer was not allowed to ask the court about bail. roxana saberi has reported from iran for npr, the bbc and other news organizatio... |
We're joined now from Tehran by Roxana Saberi's father, Reza Saberi. Mr. Saberi, thanks so much for making the time to be with us. | we're joined now from tehran by roxana, saberi's father reza saberi mr saberi thanks so much for, making the time to be with | We're joined now from Tehran by Roxana Saberi's father Reza, Saberi Mr Saberi thanks so much for making the time. to. be with | we're joined now from tehran by roxana saberi's father, reza saberi. mr. saberi, thanks so much for making the time to be with us. |
You're welcome. | you're | You're | you're welcome. |
Can you tell us what happened in the courtroom? | can you tell us what happened. in, the. | Can you tell us what happened. in the | can you tell us what happened in the courtroom? |
Well, this morning - the verdict was issued on Wednesday, but since Thursday and Friday, the weekend here, how they - so, we had to go today to the court. The lawyers went there and they brought our daughter to the court with two persons from the intelligence office. I asked to go in - a lawyer asked to see if I could ... | well this morning - the verdict was. issued on. wednesday but since thursday and friday the weekend here how they - so we had to go today to the court the lawyers went there and they brought. our daughter to the. court with two, persons from the intelligence office i asked to go in - a lawyer asked to see if i could al... | Well this morning. - the verdict was, issued on Wednesday but since Thursday and Friday the weekend here how they - so we had to go, today to the court The lawyers went there and they brought our daughter to the court with two persons. from, the intelligence office I asked to go, in - a lawyer asked to see if I could a... | well, this morning - the verdict was issued on wednesday, but since thursday and friday, the weekend here, how they - so, we had to go today to the court. the lawyers went there and they brought our daughter to the court with two persons from the intelligence office. i asked to go in - a lawyer asked to see if i could ... |
So, after the verdict was announced to them, the lawyer told me that's what happened. They are sentencing her for eight years imprisonment for one charge of espionage, yeah. | so after the. verdict was announced to them the lawyer told, me that's what happened they are sentencing her for eight years imprisonment, for one charge of espionage | So after the verdict was announced to them the lawyer told me that's what happened They are sentencing her for eight. years imprisonment for one charge of espionage | so, after the verdict was announced to them, the lawyer told me that's what happened. they are sentencing her for eight years imprisonment for one charge of espionage, yeah. |
And for that matter, they listen to what you say on our air here. That being noted… | and, for, that, matter they listen, to what you, say on our air here that being | And for that matter they listen to, what you say, on our air here That being | and for that matter, they listen to what you say on our air here. that being noted… |
At the Cairo office of the Egyptian Organization for Human Rights, other relatives of people killed during the revolution express similar doubts. One is Mahmoud Abdul Rahim, whose 18-year-old brother, Ahmed, was one of roughly two dozen people fatally shot in downtown Cairo two weeks before Hosni Mubarak resigned. | at the cairo office of the egyptian organization for human rights other relatives of. people killed during the revolution express similar doubts one is mahmoud abdul rahim whose 18-year-old, brother ahmed was one of, roughly two dozen people fatally shot in downtown cairo two weeks before hosni mubarak | At the Cairo office of the Egyptian Organization for Human Rights other relatives of people killed during, the revolution express similar doubts; One is Mahmoud Abdul Rahim, whose 18-year-old brother Ahmed was one of roughly two dozen people fatally shot in downtown Cairo two, weeks before Hosni Mubarak | at the cairo office of the egyptian organization for human rights, other relatives of people killed during the revolution express similar doubts. one is mahmoud abdul rahim, whose 18-year-old brother, ahmed, was one of roughly two dozen people fatally shot in downtown cairo two weeks before hosni mubarak resigned. |
What happened after Hosni Mubarak? What did it change? Where is Egypt now? Where is the government, no government? Where is the rights of the martyrs for my brother, Ahmed, I ask?" | what happened after hosni mubarak? what did it change? where is egypt now? where is the government, no government? where is the. rights of the martyrs for my brother ahmed, i | What happened after Hosni Mubarak? What did it change? Where is Egypt now? Where is the government no government? Where, is the rights of the, martyrs for my brother, Ahmed I | what happened after hosni mubarak? what did it change? where is egypt now? where is the government, no government? where is the rights of the martyrs for my brother, ahmed, i ask?" |
The right he refers to is justice. It's something the families say they seek. They say their main frustration is that there are no investigations, let alone arrests of those responsible for the killings. Even families of victims who were not involved in the protests say they are getting no help from Egyptian officials. | the right he. refers. to is justice it's; something the families say they seek they say their main frustration is that there are no investigations let; alone arrests of those. responsible for the killings even families of victims; who were not involved, in the protests say, they are getting no help from egyptian | The right he refers to is justice It's something the families, say they seek They say their main frustration is that, there are no investigations let alone arrests of those responsible for the killings Even families, of victims who were not. involved in the protests say they are getting no help from Egyptian | the right he refers to is justice. it's something the families say they seek. they say their main frustration is that there are no investigations, let alone arrests of those responsible for the killings. even families of victims who were not involved in the protests say they are getting no help from egyptian officials. |
(Speaking foreign language) | (speaking foreign | (Speaking foreign | (speaking foreign language) |
Like Mohammed Abdul Aziz, whose 28-year-old wife was fatally shot in the face while she was hanging laundry on her balcony in a district where there weren't even protests going on. | like, mohammed, abdul aziz whose 28-year-old wife was fatally shot in the face while she was hanging laundry on her balcony in a district, where there weren't even protests going | Like; Mohammed Abdul Aziz whose 28-year-old wife was fatally shot in the face while she was hanging laundry on her balcony in a district where there weren't even protests going | like mohammed abdul aziz, whose 28-year-old wife was fatally shot in the face while she was hanging laundry on her balcony in a district where there weren't even protests going on. |
(Speaking foreign language) | (speaking foreign | (Speaking foreign, | (speaking foreign language) |
Ahmed Ezz el Deen, whose son was shot while they stood on a balcony in the same district, believes the police were shooting to try and keep people from going outside and joining the protesters. | ahmed. ezz el deen whose son was. shot while they stood on a balcony in the same district believes the police were shooting to try and. keep people from going outside and joining the | Ahmed. Ezz. el Deen whose son was shot while they stood on a balcony in the same district believes the police were shooting, to try and, keep people from, going outside and joining the | ahmed ezz el deen, whose son was shot while they stood on a balcony in the same district, believes the police were shooting to try and keep people from going outside and joining the protesters. |
Most of the families say they haven't received compensation promised by the government, although shoe salesman Awad says his family did receive a check for about $500. Former Prime Minister Ahmed Shafiq had pledged a monthly pension of $280 to the relatives. | most of the families say they haven't received, compensation promised by the government although shoe salesman awad says his. family did receive a check for about $500. former prime minister ahmed shafiq had pledged a monthly pension of $280 to, the | Most of the families say they haven't, received compensation promised by the government although shoe; salesman Awad says, his family did receive a check for about $500. Former Prime Minister Ahmed Shafiq had pledged a, monthly pension of $280 to the | most of the families say they haven't received compensation promised by the government, although shoe salesman awad says his family did receive a check for about $500. former prime minister ahmed shafiq had pledged a monthly pension of $280 to the relatives. |
Rights groups like Amnesty International are reporting government reprisals and intimidation toward victims' families to get them to stop trying to find out what happened. None of the relatives interviewed by NPR say they felt pressured, other than one man who said a Ministry of Interior investigator told him he could ... | rights groups like amnesty, international are reporting government reprisals and intimidation toward victims' families to get them to stop trying to find out, what happened none of the relatives interviewed by npr say they. felt pressured other than one man who said a, ministry of interior investigator. told him he cou... | Rights groups like Amnesty International are reporting government reprisals and, intimidation toward victims' families to get them to stop trying to find out, what happened None. of the relatives interviewed by NPR say they felt pressured other than one man who said, a Ministry of Interior investigator told him he coul... | rights groups like amnesty international are reporting government reprisals and intimidation toward victims' families to get them to stop trying to find out what happened. none of the relatives interviewed by npr say they felt pressured, other than one man who said a ministry of interior investigator told him he could ... |
Lawyer Heba Mohamed at the Egyptian Organization for Human Rights says they have filed complaints on behalf of 200 of the families to bring pressure on the government. She believes the pressure is working. | lawyer heba mohamed at the egyptian organization for human rights says they have filed complaints on behalf of 200 of the families to bring pressure on the government she believes the pressure is | Lawyer Heba, Mohamed at the Egyptian Organization for Human Rights says they have filed complaints on behalf of 200 of the families to bring pressure on the government She believes the pressure is | lawyer heba mohamed at the egyptian organization for human rights says they have filed complaints on behalf of 200 of the families to bring pressure on the government. she believes the pressure is working. |
(Through translator) It's promising because the prosecution is working with us to collect material and evidence against the security forces. | (through translator) it's promising because the prosecution is working with us to collect material and evidence against the security | (Through translator) It's promising because the prosecution is working with us to. collect material and evidence against the security | (through translator) it's promising because the prosecution is working with us to collect material and evidence against the security forces. |
She adds, that evidence will help in the trial of former Interior Minister Habib el-Adly, on charges that he ordered the fatal violence. | she adds that evidence will help in the trial of former interior minister. habib el-adly on charges that he ordered the fatal | She adds, that evidence will help in the trial of former Interior Minister Habib el-Adly on charges that he ordered the fatal | she adds, that evidence will help in the trial of former interior minister habib el-adly, on charges that he ordered the fatal violence. |
Soraya Sarhaddi Nelson, NPR News, Cairo. | soraya sarhaddi nelson. npr news | Soraya Sarhaddi Nelson NPR News | soraya sarhaddi nelson, npr news, cairo. |
The falling price of oil means that Venezuela's president, Hugo Chavez, has a little less oil money, but that is not stopping him from buying billions in Russian weaponry. In fact, for the first time since the Cold War, the Russian military is deploying in Latin America. They're invited by Chavez for military maneuvers... | the falling; price of oil means, that venezuela's president hugo chavez has a little less oil money but that is not stopping him from buying billions in russian weaponry in fact for the first, time since the cold war the russian military is deploying in latin america they're invited, by chavez for military maneuvers ch... | The falling price of oil means, that Venezuela's president. Hugo. Chavez has a little less oil money but that; is, not stopping him from buying billions in Russian weaponry In. fact for the first time since the Cold War the Russian military, is deploying in Latin America They're invited by Chavez, for military maneuver... | the falling price of oil means that venezuela's president, hugo chavez, has a little less oil money, but that is not stopping him from buying billions in russian weaponry. in fact, for the first time since the cold war, the russian military is deploying in latin america. they're invited by chavez for military maneuvers... |
Now, Chavez is inking deals with yet another rival of the Americans, Russia. Tom Shannon is the State Department's top official for Latin America. | now chavez, is inking deals with yet another rival of the americans russia tom shannon is the, state department's top official, for, latin | Now Chavez is inking deals with yet another rival of the Americans Russia Tom Shannon is the State Department's top official for Latin | now, chavez is inking deals with yet another rival of the americans, russia. tom shannon is the state department's top official for latin america. |
Venezuela is looking for an outside player to reaffirm its importance, and it has reached out to the Russians in this regard. | venezuela is looking for an outside player to reaffirm its importance and it has reached out to the russians in this | Venezuela is looking for an outside player to reaffirm its importance and it has reached out to, the Russians in this | venezuela is looking for an outside player to reaffirm its importance, and it has reached out to the russians in this regard. |
But there are others who see other motives. Francisco Uson(ph) is a retired Venezuelan general who once worked closely with Chavez. He now opposes the government. He fears that Venezuela could funnel Russian arms to the FARC guerrilla group in neighboring Colombia, an ally of the Bush administration. | but there, are others who see other, motives francisco uson(ph) is; a retired venezuelan general who once, worked closely with chavez. he now opposes the government he fears that venezuela could, funnel russian arms to the farc guerrilla group in neighboring colombia an ally of the bush | But there are. others who see other motives Francisco Uson(ph) is, a retired Venezuelan general who once worked closely. with Chavez He now opposes the government He fears that Venezuela could funnel Russian arms to the FARC guerrilla group, in neighboring Colombia an, ally of the Bush | but there are others who see other motives. francisco uson(ph) is a retired venezuelan general who once worked closely with chavez. he now opposes the government. he fears that venezuela could funnel russian arms to the farc guerrilla group in neighboring colombia, an ally of the bush administration. |
Any country in the Caribbean has to be very concerned with the president of Russia in Venezuelan soil. | any country in the caribbean has to be. very concerned with the. president of russia in venezuelan | Any country in the Caribbean has to be very concerned with the president of Russia in Venezuelan | any country in the caribbean has to be very concerned with the president of russia in venezuelan soil. |
The Venezuelans say the arrival of Russia is nothing more than a friendly exchange. Publicly, American officials have downplayed the arrival of the Russians and noted that for Russia, selling arms to Venezuela simply makes good business sense. Chavez, though, is often looking for alliances to counter American influence... | the venezuelans. say, the arrival of russia is, nothing more than a friendly exchange publicly, american officials have downplayed the arrival of the russians and noted. that for russia selling arms to venezuela simply makes good business sense chavez though is often looking for alliances to counter american influence ... | The Venezuelans say the arrival of Russia is nothing more than a friendly exchange Publicly American officials have. downplayed the arrival of the Russians and noted that for Russia; selling arms to Venezuela simply makes good business sense Chavez though. is often looking, for alliances to counter American. influence ... | the venezuelans say the arrival of russia is nothing more than a friendly exchange. publicly, american officials have downplayed the arrival of the russians and noted that for russia, selling arms to venezuela simply makes good business sense. chavez, though, is often looking for alliances to counter american influence... |
Chavez is very much interested in courting the Russians and other countries that he sees as adversaries or rivals of the United States. It's part of his overall policy. | chavez is very much interested in courting the russians, and other countries that. he sees as adversaries or rivals of the united states it's part of his overall | Chavez is very much interested in courting the, Russians and other countries that he sees as adversaries or rivals of the United States It's part of his overall | chavez is very much interested in courting the russians and other countries that he sees as adversaries or rivals of the united states. it's part of his overall policy. |
Deshazo and other American analysts said they believe that Obama will likely pursue many of the same interests of the Bush administration. That means Washington may very well criticize Chavez about press freedoms or Democratic governance. Still, the Bush administration strategy of late has been to strengthen ties with ... | deshazo and other american analysts said they believe that obama will likely pursue many of the same interests of the bush administration that. means washington may very well, criticize chavez about press freedoms or democratic governance still the bush administration strategy of late has been to strengthen ties with o... | Deshazo and other American analysts said they believe that Obama will likely pursue many of the, same interests. of the Bush administration That means Washington; may very well criticize Chavez about; press freedoms or Democratic governance Still the Bush. administration strategy of late has been to strengthen, ties wi... | deshazo and other american analysts said they believe that obama will likely pursue many of the same interests of the bush administration. that means washington may very well criticize chavez about press freedoms or democratic governance. still, the bush administration strategy of late has been to strengthen ties with ... |
We've focused on countries that want to work with us, and especially on large countries - the ones that we'd call the modernizers who are really involved in transforming the Americas. | we've focused on countries that want to work, with us and especially on large countries. - the ones that we'd call the. modernizers who are really involved in transforming the | We've focused on countries that want to work with us and. especially on large countries - the ones, that we'd. call the modernizers who are really involved in, transforming the | we've focused on countries that want to work with us, and especially on large countries - the ones that we'd call the modernizers who are really involved in transforming the americas. |
Shannon, though, believes that Chavez is clearly considering his options when it comes to Obama. Juan Forero, NPR News, Caracas. | shannon though believes that chavez is clearly; considering his options when, it comes to obama juan forero npr news | Shannon though believes that Chavez is clearly considering his options when it comes to Obama Juan Forero NPR News, | shannon, though, believes that chavez is clearly considering his options when it comes to obama. juan forero, npr news, caracas. |
If you listen to this program regularly, you'll know that we've been given exclusive access to the collection being built for the new National Museum of African American History and Culture. The museum is scheduled to open its doors on the National Mall here in Washington, D.C., in 2015. | if you listen to this program regularly you'll know that we've been given exclusive access to the collection. being built for the new national museum of african american history; and culture the, museum is scheduled to, open its, doors on the, national mall here in washington. d.c., in | If you listen to this program regularly you'll know that we've been given exclusive access to the collection being built for the. new National Museum of African American, History and Culture The museum, is scheduled; to open its doors on the National Mall here in Washington D.C., in | if you listen to this program regularly, you'll know that we've been given exclusive access to the collection being built for the new national museum of african american history and culture. the museum is scheduled to open its doors on the national mall here in washington, d.c., in 2015. |
But until then, we've been popping in to visit the founding director Lonnie Bunch every few weeks to see what he's acquired for the permanent collection, things like Michael Jackson's fedora and Harriet Tubman's personal hymnal. | but; until then we've been popping in to visit the founding director lonnie bunch every few weeks to see what he's acquired for the permanent collection things like michael jackson's. fedora and harriet tubman's personal, | But, until then, we've been popping in to visit the founding director Lonnie Bunch, every few weeks to. see what he's acquired for the permanent collection things like Michael Jackson's fedora and Harriet Tubman's, personal | but until then, we've been popping in to visit the founding director lonnie bunch every few weeks to see what he's acquired for the permanent collection, things like michael jackson's fedora and harriet tubman's personal hymnal. |
And when we went to see Lonnie this past week, the first thing he pulled out was a letter written in 1858. The radical abolitionist John Brown wrote it to his wife while he was a fugitive from the law. And he happened to be visiting Frederick Douglass at his home in Rochester, New York at the time. | and when we went to see lonnie this past week the first, thing he pulled out was a letter written in 1858. the radical abolitionist. john brown wrote. it to his wife, while he was a fugitive from the law and. he happened to be, visiting frederick douglass at his home in. rochester new york at, the | And when we went to see Lonnie this. past week the first thing he pulled out was a letter written in 1858. The radical abolitionist John Brown wrote it to his wife while he was a fugitive from the, law And he happened to be; visiting Frederick Douglass at his home in Rochester New. York at the | and when we went to see lonnie this past week, the first thing he pulled out was a letter written in 1858. the radical abolitionist john brown wrote it to his wife while he was a fugitive from the law. and he happened to be visiting frederick douglass at his home in rochester, new york at the time. |
Here, you have John Brown, who is a year before Harpers Ferry, but he's infamous or famous, depending upon your politics, for fighting against pro-slavery forces in Kansas. | here you have john, brown who is a year before harpers ferry but he's; infamous or famous depending. upon, your politics for, fighting, against pro-slavery forces in | Here you have John Brown, who is a year before Harpers Ferry but he's infamous or famous depending upon your politics for fighting against pro-slavery forces in | here, you have john brown, who is a year before harpers ferry, but he's infamous or famous, depending upon your politics, for fighting against pro-slavery forces in kansas. |
She put out a statement that said, quote, "her father seems to have entered a veritable spiral between a scorched-earth strategy and a political suicide." That's... | she put out a statement that said quote; "her father seems to have entered a veritable spiral between a scorched-earth. strategy and a political, | She. put, out a statement that said quote "her father seems to, have entered a veritable spiral between a scorched-earth strategy and a political | she put out a statement that said, quote, "her father seems to have entered a veritable spiral between a scorched-earth strategy and a political suicide." that's... |
Well, really there's nothing specific you need to do. Most people just are encouraged to fly the flag. I have a 13 star flag out today. I also fly the California flag, since it's the only state flag that was also created on June 14th, even though I live in Nevada. But I honor our neighbors to the west. | well really there's nothing specific you need to do most people just are encouraged to fly the flag, i, have a. 13 star flag out today i also fly the california flag since it's, the only state flag that was also, created on june 14th even though, i live in nevada but, i honor our neighbors to the | Well really there's nothing specific you need to, do Most people; just are encouraged to fly the flag I have a, 13 star flag out today I also fly the California flag since it's the only state flag that was also created on. June 14th even though I live in Nevada. But I honor our neighbors to the | well, really there's nothing specific you need to do. most people just are encouraged to fly the flag. i have a 13 star flag out today. i also fly the california flag, since it's the only state flag that was also created on june 14th, even though i live in nevada. but i honor our neighbors to the west. |
And it's often an attempt - or there are - it's often a good time to perhaps dedicate a flagpole or dedicate a new flag, in anticipation of the upcoming Fourth of July holiday. Anytime we're in a period of martial strife, such as the war in Iraq, it's also a time to maybe acknowledge or recognize those serving or those... | and it's often, an attempt - or there are; - it's often a good time to perhaps. dedicate a flagpole or dedicate a. new flag in anticipation of the, upcoming fourth of july holiday anytime we're in a period of martial strife. such as the war in iraq it's also a time to maybe acknowledge or recognize those, serving or th... | And it's often an attempt - or there are - it's often a good time to perhaps dedicate a flagpole or dedicate a new; flag in anticipation of the, upcoming Fourth of July holiday Anytime we're in, a period of martial strife such as the war in Iraq it's also a time to maybe acknowledge or recognize those serving. or those... | and it's often an attempt - or there are - it's often a good time to perhaps dedicate a flagpole or dedicate a new flag, in anticipation of the upcoming fourth of july holiday. anytime we're in a period of martial strife, such as the war in iraq, it's also a time to maybe acknowledge or recognize those serving or those... |
Now, I'm wondering, you said that you have a 13 star flag, flying outside your house now. Are there any rules about what kind of, what version of the flag you're allowed to fly? | now i'm wondering you. said that, you have a 13 star flag flying outside your house now are there. any rules about what kind of, what version of the flag you're allowed to | Now I'm wondering you said that, you have a 13 star flag flying outside. your house now Are there any rules about what kind of. what version of the flag you're allowed to | now, i'm wondering, you said that you have a 13 star flag, flying outside your house now. are there any rules about what kind of, what version of the flag you're allowed to fly? |
No, any flag, regardless of the number of stars, that was ever a U.S. flag, is still considered a United States flag, and should be honored as such. So… | no any flag regardless, of the number of stars that was ever a u.s flag is still considered a united states flag and should be honored as such | No, any flag, regardless of the, number of stars that was ever a U.S flag is still considered a United States flag, and should be honored as such | no, any flag, regardless of the number of stars, that was ever a u.s. flag, is still considered a united states flag, and should be honored as such. so… |
Has anybody made a 51 star flag? | has anybody. made a 51 star | Has, anybody made a 51 star | has anybody made a 51 star flag? |
Yeah, we have. We've made 51 star flags. I was in the flag business for 25 years, and believe it or not, 51 star flags locally sold in northern California, in New York City, in the panhandle of Nebraska. | yeah we have, we've made 51 star flags i was in the. flag business for 25 years and believe it or not 51 star flags locally sold in northern california in new york city in the panhandle of | Yeah we have We've made 51 star flags I was in the flag business for 25 years and. believe it or not 51 star. flags locally sold in northern California in New York City in the panhandle of | yeah, we have. we've made 51 star flags. i was in the flag business for 25 years, and believe it or not, 51 star flags locally sold in northern california, in new york city, in the panhandle of nebraska. |
And was this a joke so that people who didn't know there were only 50 states would be counting improperly, or was this a… | and was this a joke so that people who didn't know there were only 50 states would be counting improperly or was this | And was this a joke so. that people who didn't know. there were only 50 states would be counting improperly or was this | and was this a joke so that people who didn't know there were only 50 states would be counting improperly, or was this a… |
These were movements that had - had aspirations of creating another state. In fact, we sold them to, internationally. There was a similar group in the Philippines and we sold them to another group in Canada. | these were movements that had - had aspirations of creating another state in fact we sold them to internationally there. was a similar, group in the. philippines and we sold them to another group in | These were movements that had - had aspirations of creating another state In fact. we sold them. to. internationally There was a similar. group in the Philippines and we sold them to another group in | these were movements that had - had aspirations of creating another state. in fact, we sold them to, internationally. there was a similar group in the philippines and we sold them to another group in canada. |
Maybe if you put a star on a flag you're creating a state by fiat. | maybe if you put a star on a flag you're creating a state by | Maybe if you put a star on a; flag you're creating a. state by | maybe if you put a star on a flag you're creating a state by fiat. |
Well, that's what they call an irredentist flag. A flag with a star for a territory you don't control. | well that's what they. call an irredentist flag a flag with a star for a territory you. don't | Well that's what they call an irredentist flag A flag with a, star for a territory you don't. | well, that's what they call an irredentist flag. a flag with a star for a territory you don't control. |
Interesting. All right, well thanks for joining us today. | interesting all right, well thanks for joining us | Interesting All right well, thanks for joining us | interesting. all right, well thanks for joining us today. |
Well thank you. I was just going to tell you that there's a great Flag Day quote that Woodrow Wilson read at the first federal observance of Flag Day. | well, thank you i was just going to tell you that, there's a, great flag day quote that woodrow wilson read at the first federal observance of flag | Well thank you I was just going, to tell, you that there's. a great Flag Day quote that Woodrow Wilson read at the first federal observance of Flag | well thank you. i was just going to tell you that there's a great flag day quote that woodrow wilson read at the first federal observance of flag day. |
Okay. | okay. | ||
And if you, if there's time I'd love to share it with your listeners. | and if you if there's time. i'd love to share it with your | And if you if there's time I'd love to share it with your | and if you, if there's time i'd love to share it with your listeners. |
Sure. Go ahead. | sure go | Sure Go | sure. go ahead. |
Woodrow Wilson said, “The flag which we honor and under which we serve is the emblem of our unity, our power, our thought, and our purpose as a nation. It has no character than that which we give it from generation to generation. The choice is ours.” | woodrow wilson said “the flag which we honor and. under which we serve is the emblem of our. unity our power our thought and our purpose as a nation it has no character than that which, we give it from generation to generation the, choice is | Woodrow Wilson, said “The flag which we, honor and under which, we serve is; the emblem of our unity. our power our thought and our purpose as a nation It has no character than that which we, give it from generation, to generation The choice is | woodrow wilson said, “the flag which we honor and under which we serve is the emblem of our unity, our power, our thought, and our purpose as a nation. it has no character than that which we give it from generation to generation. the choice is ours.” |
Very nice. Jim Ferrigan is the protocol officer and former vice president of NAVA… | very nice jim ferrigan is the protocol officer and former. vice president of | Very nice Jim Ferrigan is, the protocol officer and former vice president of; | very nice. jim ferrigan is the protocol officer and former vice president of nava… |
Correct. | correct. | ||
The North American Vexillologists Association. | the north american vexillologists | The North American Vexillologists, | the north american vexillologists association. |
And now I curate, I'm a curator for the Flag Center, in California. | and now i curate i'm a curator for the. flag center in | And now I curate; I'm a curator for the Flag, Center in | and now i curate, i'm a curator for the flag center, in california. |
All right, thanks for joining us. | all right thanks for joining | All right thanks for joining | all right, thanks for joining us. |
Thank you for having me. | thank you for. having | Thank you for having | thank you for having me. |
You're listening to TALK OF THE NATION from NPR News. | you're listening to talk of the nation from npr | You're listening to TALK OF THE NATION from NPR | you're listening to talk of the nation from npr news. |
And now joining us is Blake Gopnik, the chief art critic for the Washington Post. Thanks for talking with us today. | and now joining us is blake gopnik the chief art critic for the washington post thanks for talking with us | And now joining us is Blake Gopnik the chief art critic for the. Washington Post Thanks for talking with us | and now joining us is blake gopnik, the chief art critic for the washington post. thanks for talking with us today. |
Hi, Joe. How are you? | hi joe how are, | Hi Joe How are | hi, joe. how are you? |
You wrote that the flag is an impressive piece of modern art, but you also said, I hope this is an accurate quote, It's ugly and weird. Why? | you wrote that the flag is an impressive piece of modern art but you. also said. i hope this is an accurate. quote it's ugly and weird | You wrote that the flag is an impressive piece of modern. art but you also said I. hope this is an accurate. quote, It's; ugly and weird | you wrote that the flag is an impressive piece of modern art, but you also said, i hope this is an accurate quote, it's ugly and weird. why? |
I, it sounds accurate to me. Why is it ugly and weird? Well, you know, I was walking down the street the other day, and living in Washington I saw a whole bunch of flags. And being an art critic my first thought was, what a strange-looking object. It really doesn't look like anything else in the history of art and desi... | i it sounds accurate to me why is it ugly and weird? well you know i was walking down the street the other day and living in washington i saw a whole bunch of flags and being an art critic my first thought was what a strange-looking object it really doesn't look like. anything else, in the history of art and design at ... | I it sounds accurate to me Why is; it; ugly and weird? Well you know I was walking down the street the other day and living in; Washington I. saw a whole bunch, of flags And being an art critic my. first thought was, what a strange-looking object It really doesn't look like anything else in the history. of art. and des... | i, it sounds accurate to me. why is it ugly and weird? well, you know, i was walking down the street the other day, and living in washington i saw a whole bunch of flags. and being an art critic my first thought was, what a strange-looking object. it really doesn't look like anything else in the history of art and desi... |
Yeah, I was just going to say, I mean, I'm glad you said Jasper Johns, because for some reason Jim Dine was coming to my mind as an, as someone who did art around the flag as well. Am I right or wrong about that? | yeah i was just going to say i mean i'm glad you said jasper johns because for some reason jim dine was coming to my mind; as an as someone who did art around the flag as. well am i right; or wrong about | Yeah I was just, going to say I mean I'm glad you said Jasper Johns because for some reason Jim Dine was coming. to my mind as an as someone who did art around the flag as well Am I right or wrong about, | yeah, i was just going to say, i mean, i'm glad you said jasper johns, because for some reason jim dine was coming to my mind as an, as someone who did art around the flag as well. am i right or wrong about that? |
Well, that's possible… | well that's | Well that's | well, that's possible… |
I shouldn't spring that on you. | i shouldn't spring that, on | I shouldn't spring that, on | i shouldn't spring that on you. |
…I don't, I ought to know this. Yeah, boy. (Unintelligible). | …i don't i ought to know this yeah, boy | …I don't I, ought to know. this Yeah boy | …i don't, i ought to know this. yeah, boy. (unintelligible). |
Sorry. I wasn't trying to show off there. I was just trying to get the right name. But you, I should've just taken the gift that, you handed it to me. So what bothers you about the design of the flag? | sorry i wasn't, trying to show off, there i was just trying to get, the right, name but you. i should've, just taken. the gift that you handed it to me, so what bothers you about the design, of, the. | Sorry I wasn't trying. to show off there I was just. trying to get the right name But you I should've just taken the gift that you handed it to me So, what bothers you about the design of, the | sorry. i wasn't trying to show off there. i was just trying to get the right name. but you, i should've just taken the gift that, you handed it to me. so what bothers you about the design of the flag? |
Bothers me is a strong word. It works very well as a flag. What, I guess you could say, bothers me about it, is how different it is from anything else we normally think of as good looking in our society. As I said in my piece today, what's interesting about it is that it's hard to imagine someone actually choosing the ... | bothers me. is a strong word it works very well as a flag what i guess you. could say bothers me about it is how, different it is from anything else we normally think of as good, looking in our society as i said in my piece today what's interesting about it is that it's hard to imagine someone actually choosing the des... | Bothers me is a strong word It works very well as a flag What I, guess you could say bothers me about it is. how different it is. from anything else, we normally, think of as good looking in our society As, I said in my piece today what's interesting about it, is that it's hard to imagine someone actually choosing the ... | bothers me is a strong word. it works very well as a flag. what, i guess you could say, bothers me about it, is how different it is from anything else we normally think of as good looking in our society. as i said in my piece today, what's interesting about it is that it's hard to imagine someone actually choosing the ... |
It doesn't look like the other things that we think look good. What it looks like, of course, is other flags. And flags have a kind of weird set of internal rules that determine what they look like, and it doesn't have a whole lot to do with looking good. | it doesn't look like the other things that we think look good what it looks like of course is other; flags and flags, have a kind of weird set of internal, rules that, determine what they look like and it doesn't have a whole lot, to do with looking | It doesn't, look like the other things that we think look, good What it looks like of course. is other flags And flags have a kind of weird set of internal rules that determine what they, look like and it doesn't have a whole lot to do with looking | it doesn't look like the other things that we think look good. what it looks like, of course, is other flags. and flags have a kind of weird set of internal rules that determine what they look like, and it doesn't have a whole lot to do with looking good. |
So are there any flags that you think look good, exclusive of, you know, of their flagness? | so are there any flags that you, think. look good, exclusive of you know of their | So, are there any flags that you think look good exclusive of you. know of. their | so are there any flags that you think look good, exclusive of, you know, of their flagness? |
You know what? The rules that govern flags are so different from the rules that govern the other things that we think look good in our society, that that may be a hard call. I happen to be partial to the flag of Canada, which I - where I lived for a long time. | you know what? the rules that govern flags are so different from the rules that govern the other things that we think look, good in our society that that, may; be a hard call i happen to be partial to the flag of canada which i - where i lived for. a, long | You know what? The rules that govern, flags are so different from the rules that govern the, other things that we think, look good in our society that that, may be a hard call I happen to be partial to the flag of Canada which I - where I lived for a long | you know what? the rules that govern flags are so different from the rules that govern the other things that we think look good in our society, that that may be a hard call. i happen to be partial to the flag of canada, which i - where i lived for a long time. |
Charge of espionage, and do you know anything about the substance of the charges, Mr. Saberi? And I want to say to our audience, we want to be very careful in speaking with you because, of course, you're in Tehran and people listen. | charge of espionage and do you know anything about the substance, of the charges mr saberi? and i want to say to our; audience we want to be. very careful in speaking with you because of course you're in tehran and people, | Charge of espionage and do you know anything about the substance of, the charges Mr Saberi? And I. want to say to. our audience we want to be very careful in speaking with you because of course you're in. Tehran. and people | charge of espionage, and do you know anything about the substance of the charges, mr. saberi? and i want to say to our audience, we want to be very careful in speaking with you because, of course, you're in tehran and people listen. |
Yes, that's right. | yes that's | Yes that's. | yes, that's right. |
(unintelligible) I know. | (unintelligible) i | (unintelligible) I | (unintelligible) i know. |
And the interesting thing about the Canadian flag is it looks more like something you'd imagine being designed by a clever advertising agency. It's got the symbol of Canada. It's got a maple leaf in the middle of it. It's symmetrical. The symbol is right smack in the middle of the flag. Those are all things that you do... | and the, interesting thing about the canadian flag is it looks more like something you'd imagine being designed, by a clever advertising agency it's got the symbol of canada it's got a maple leaf in the middle of it. it's symmetrical the symbol is right smack in the middle of the flag those are all things that you don'... | And the interesting thing. about the, Canadian flag is it looks more like something you'd imagine being designed, by a, clever advertising agency It's got the symbol of Canada It's got a maple leaf in the middle of it It's symmetrical The symbol is right smack in the middle of the flag Those are all things that you don... | and the interesting thing about the canadian flag is it looks more like something you'd imagine being designed by a clever advertising agency. it's got the symbol of canada. it's got a maple leaf in the middle of it. it's symmetrical. the symbol is right smack in the middle of the flag. those are all things that you do... |
But, I mean, okay. So, does that make it a bad advertisement for the United States of America? Or is it, it just is, and people accept for being the American flag? | but. i mean okay so does. that make it a bad advertisement for the united states of america? or is it it just is and people accept for being; the american | But I mean okay, So does that make it a bad. advertisement for the United States of America? Or is; it it, just is and people accept for being the American, | but, i mean, okay. so, does that make it a bad advertisement for the united states of america? or is it, it just is, and people accept for being the american flag? |
You know what? It probably would have made it a bad advertisement for the United States of America, once upon a time. But now, of course, it has so much symbolic weight attached to it that it works just great. That's of course one reason that contemporary artists, pop artists in the 1960s, chose to make images built ar... | you know what? it probably would have made it, a bad advertisement for the united states of america once upon a time but now of course it has so much symbolic weight attached to it that it works just great that's of, course one reason that contemporary artists. pop artists, in the 1960s chose to make images built aroun... | You know what? It probably would have made it a bad, advertisement for the United States of America once upon a time But now of. course it has so much symbolic weight attached to it that it works just, great That's of course one reason that contemporary. artists pop artists in the 1960s chose to make images built, arou... | you know what? it probably would have made it a bad advertisement for the united states of america, once upon a time. but now, of course, it has so much symbolic weight attached to it that it works just great. that's of course one reason that contemporary artists, pop artists in the 1960s, chose to make images built ar... |
Of course there were other people making art in the 1960s who made stuff that had some of the same weird energies as the flag, that in fact, didn't quote the flag directly at all. It wasn't about the flag, it just so happens that by the 1960s the kind of weirdness that you get in the flag, you also were starting to get... | of course there were other people; making art in the, 1960s who made stuff that had some of the, same weird energies as the flag that in fact didn't quote the flag directly at all it wasn't about the flag it just so happens that by the 1960s the kind of weirdness that you get in the flag you also were starting, to get ... | Of course there were other people, making art in the 1960s who made stuff that had some of the same weird, energies, as the flag that in. fact didn't quote the flag, directly at all It wasn't about the flag it just so happens that by the 1960s the kind of weirdness. that you get in the flag. you also were starting to. ... | of course there were other people making art in the 1960s who made stuff that had some of the same weird energies as the flag, that in fact, didn't quote the flag directly at all. it wasn't about the flag, it just so happens that by the 1960s the kind of weirdness that you get in the flag, you also were starting to get... |
Okay. When did the, I mean - when did the flag take on a military sense, as opposed to some other sense, do you think? | okay when did the i mean - when did the flag take on a military sense as opposed to some other sense do you, | Okay When did the I mean - when did the, flag take on, a military sense; as opposed to, some other sense do. you | okay. when did the, i mean - when did the flag take on a military sense, as opposed to some other sense, do you think? |
Well, my impression is, I'm not a flag expert, but my impression is that that's where it started. That in fact, it started in the world of military signals, really, right? The function of a flag, almost the only function of a flag, was to tell us from them, to know who was fighting for who. And that's where the thing g... | well my impression is i'm not a flag expert but my impression is that that's where it started that in fact it started in the world; of military signals really right? the function of a flag almost the only function of a flag was to tell us from them to know who was fighting for who. and that's where the thing got | Well my impression is, I'm not a flag expert but my impression is that that's where it started That in fact it started in the world of military signals really right? The function of a flag almost the only function of a flag was to tell us from them to know who was fighting for who And that's where the thing got | well, my impression is, i'm not a flag expert, but my impression is that that's where it started. that in fact, it started in the world of military signals, really, right? the function of a flag, almost the only function of a flag, was to tell us from them, to know who was fighting for who. and that's where the thing g... |
When you look at the records of the Continental Congress, on June 14th, 1777, when the flag was made official, our current flag that is, something like the Star Spangled Banner. It's quite clear that they're just conducting government business, that this is a relatively minor affair; it's just choosing a symbol that th... | when you look at the records of the continental congress on june 14th 1777, when the flag was made official our current flag that. is something like the star spangled banner it's quite clear that they're just conducting government business. that this is a relatively minor affair it's just choosing a symbol that the arm... | When you look; at, the records. of the Continental Congress on June 14th 1777, when the flag was made official our current. flag that is something like the Star Spangled Banner It's quite clear that they're just conducting government, business that this is a relatively minor affair it's just choosing a symbol that the ... | when you look at the records of the continental congress, on june 14th, 1777, when the flag was made official, our current flag that is, something like the star spangled banner. it's quite clear that they're just conducting government business, that this is a relatively minor affair; it's just choosing a symbol that th... |
Okay… | okay… | ||
Before that…sorry. | before | Before | before that…sorry. |
Well, I was just going to say, I'm afraid we're out of time. But you were on a good roll there, I'm sorry to interrupt but I have to. Thank you very much for joining us today. | well. i was just going to say i'm afraid we're. out of time. but you were on. a good roll there i'm sorry to interrupt but i have to thank you, very. much for joining us | Well I was just going. to say I'm afraid we're out of time But you were on a good roll there, I'm sorry to interrupt but, I have to Thank you very much for joining us | well, i was just going to say, i'm afraid we're out of time. but you were on a good roll there, i'm sorry to interrupt but i have to. thank you very much for joining us today. |
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