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Pretty good. In fact, better than I think most people are led to believe by the national media. In fact, I got so exercised about it, I just finished writing a book called "The Divided States of America?" - question mark - "What Both Liberals and Conservatives are Missing in the God and Country Shouting Match."	pretty good in fact better than; i think most people. are. led, to believe by the national media in fact i got so exercised about it i just finished writing a book called "the divided states of america?" - question. mark - "what both liberals and, conservatives are missing in the, god and, country shouting	Pretty good In fact better than I think most people are led to believe by the national media In fact I got so exercised about it I just finished writing a book called "The Divided, States of America?" - question mark - "What Both Liberals and Conservatives are Missing in the God and. Country Shouting	pretty good. in fact, better than i think most people are led to believe by the national media. in fact, i got so exercised about it, i just finished writing a book called "the divided states of america?" - question mark - "what both liberals and conservatives are missing in the god and country shouting match."
I just got so tired of being interviewed for national programs - not NPR I'm talking about here, but other national programs - where, you know, they would say well, you know, you're not quite what we're looking for. Your view's too nuanced. And what they do is they get the two most extreme positions they can find, they...	i, just got so tired of being interviewed for. national programs - not, npr i'm talking about here but; other national programs - where you. know they would say. well you know you're not quite, what we're, looking, for your view's too nuanced and what they do is they get the. two most extreme positions they can find th...	I just, got so tired of being interviewed for national programs - not, NPR I'm talking about here. but other national programs - where you know they would say well you know you're not quite what we're looking for Your view's too. nuanced And what, they, do is they get the two most extreme positions they can find they p...	i just got so tired of being interviewed for national programs - not npr i'm talking about here, but other national programs - where, you know, they would say well, you know, you're not quite what we're looking for. your view's too nuanced. and what they do is they get the two most extreme positions they can find, they...
And I think it leads the country to believe that the country is more divided than it actually is. Now we do have serious disagreements about the direction of the country, but I think there's far more common ground than Americans are led to believe that there is by the national electronic and print media, and I find thi...	and i think it leads the country to believe that the country is more divided than it actually is now we do have serious disagreements about the direction of. the country but i think there's far more common ground than americans are, led to believe that there is by the, national electronic and print media and i find thi...	And I think. it. leads the, country to believe that the country is more divided than it actually is Now we do have serious disagreements about the direction of the country but I; think. there's far more common ground than Americans are led, to believe that there is. by the national electronic, and print media and I fin...	and i think it leads the country to believe that the country is more divided than it actually is. now we do have serious disagreements about the direction of the country, but i think there's far more common ground than americans are led to believe that there is by the national electronic and print media, and i find thi...
I'm in literally hundreds of Baptist churches all across the country every year, and I find a lot more optimism than you would suspect from listening to the national media.	i'm in literally hundreds of baptist churches all. across. the country every year and i find a lot more optimism than you, would. suspect from listening to the national	I'm in literally hundreds of Baptist churches all across the country every year and I find a lot more optimism than you would suspect from listening to the national	i'm in literally hundreds of baptist churches all across the country every year, and i find a lot more optimism than you would suspect from listening to the national media.
Sure.			sure.
And I find that people are pleased with the progress our country's making on lots of different fronts and are very confident that the country could make a lot more progress if the people in Washington would catch up with the rest of the country.	and i find that people are pleased with the progress our country's making on lots of different fronts and are very confident that. the country could make a. lot more progress if the people in washington would catch. up with the rest of the	And, I find. that people are, pleased with the progress our country's making. on lots of different fronts and are very confident that the country could make a lot more progress if. the people in Washington would catch up with the. rest of the	and i find that people are pleased with the progress our country's making on lots of different fronts and are very confident that the country could make a lot more progress if the people in washington would catch up with the rest of the country.
This is one reason why I have a Washington office, but I live in Nashville. I live in the real world, and I go visit Washington because I find that - for instance, on the immigration issue, the country is way ahead of where both parties are, way ahead of where the government is.	this is one reason why i have a, washington office but i live in nashville. i live in the real world and i go visit washington because i find that - for instance, on the immigration issue the country is, way ahead of where both parties are way ahead of where the; government	This is one reason why I have a Washington office but. I live in Nashville I live in the real; world and I go visit Washington because I, find, that - for instance on the immigration issue the country is way ahead of, where both parties are way ahead of where the government	this is one reason why i have a washington office, but i live in nashville. i live in the real world, and i go visit washington because i find that - for instance, on the immigration issue, the country is way ahead of where both parties are, way ahead of where the government is.
And it's time for the government to catch up to where the people are and to demand a comprehensive immigration policy that would secure the borders, would deal fairly and justly with the people who are here and give them an opportunity to work their way toward permanent resident status, set up a genuine guest-worker pr...	and; it's time for the government to catch up to where the people are and to demand a comprehensive immigration, policy that would secure the borders would deal fairly and justly with the people who are here and give them, an opportunity to work their way toward permanent resident status set, up a genuine guest-worker ...	And it's. time for the government to catch; up to where the people are and to demand a comprehensive immigration policy that would secure the borders would. deal fairly and. justly with the people who are here and give them an. opportunity to work their way toward permanent resident status set up, a genuine guest-worke...	and it's time for the government to catch up to where the people are and to demand a comprehensive immigration policy that would secure the borders, would deal fairly and justly with the people who are here and give them an opportunity to work their way toward permanent resident status, set up a genuine guest-worker pr...
We have jobs that are available in this country, and we have people in other countries who want to come do them. One of the shocks that people find when they start examining this issue is that about 30 percent of the people who are here illegally really don't want to be permanent residents here. They would like to have...	we have jobs that are available in this country and we have people in, other countries; who want to come do them one of the shocks that people find when they start, examining this issue; is that about 30 percent of the people who. are here illegally, really, don't want to be permanent residents, here they would like to...	We have jobs that are available, in this country and we have people in other countries who want to come do them One of the shocks that people find, when they, start examining this issue is that about 30 percent of the people who are here illegally really don't; want, to be permanent residents. here They. would like to ...	we have jobs that are available in this country, and we have people in other countries who want to come do them. one of the shocks that people find when they start examining this issue is that about 30 percent of the people who are here illegally really don't want to be permanent residents here. they would like to have...
And the ones who want to stay here, if they abide by the law and they work their way off of a probationary status through paying fines and learning to read and write and speak English and want to stay here, we're lucky to have them. This country is a nation of immigrants, but more than that, we're a nation of settlers ...	and the ones who want, to, stay here if they abide by the law and. they work. their way off of a probationary status through paying fines and learning to read and write and speak english and want to stay, here we're lucky to have them this country is a nation of. immigrants but more than that, we're a nation of settler...	And the ones who want to stay here if they abide by the law and they work. their way, off of a probationary status through paying fines and learning to read and write and speak English and want, to stay here we're. lucky to; have them This country is. a nation, of immigrants but, more than that. we're a nation of settl...	and the ones who want to stay here, if they abide by the law and they work their way off of a probationary status through paying fines and learning to read and write and speak english and want to stay here, we're lucky to have them. this country is a nation of immigrants, but more than that, we're a nation of settlers ...
I lived in England for three years when I was doing my Ph.D. at Oxford, and England's a country that most people in the world would think would be a great place to live, but it is such an incomparably boring country compared to the United States. And the reason is the rich tapestry of all of the contributions of our va...	i lived in. england for three years when i was doing my ph.d at oxford and england's a country. that most people in the world would, think would be a great place to live but it is such an; incomparably boring country compared to the united states and the reason is the rich tapestry of all of the contributions of our va...	I lived in England for three years when I was doing my Ph.D at Oxford and England's a country that most people in the world would think would be a; great place to. live but it is such an. incomparably boring country compared. to the United States, And the reason is, the rich tapestry of all, of. the contributions of, o...	i lived in england for three years when i was doing my ph.d. at oxford, and england's a country that most people in the world would think would be a great place to live, but it is such an incomparably boring country compared to the united states. and the reason is the rich tapestry of all of the contributions of our va...
We have to move on, but I did want to get to one last thought. You talked about all the things that Americans are optimistic about, the ones you meet. Give me a for-instance, a for-example.	we have to move on but i, did want to get to one last thought you talked about all the things that. americans are optimistic about the ones you meet give me a for-instance a	We have to move on but I did want to get to one last thought. You talked about all, the, things that Americans are optimistic about the ones you meet Give me a, for-instance a	we have to move on, but i did want to get to one last thought. you talked about all the things that americans are optimistic about, the ones you meet. give me a for-instance, a for-example.
Well, for instance, for religious people, there's a tremendous upsurge in church attendance in Evangelical and conservative churches, particularly among young people. We've seen this upsurge all across the country in Evangelical circles. We, you know, our churches are growing, our youth groups are growing, our Evangeli...	well for instance for religious people there's a tremendous upsurge in church attendance in evangelical and conservative churches particularly. among young people, we've seen this upsurge all across the country in evangelical circles we you know our churches; are growing our youth groups are growing our evangelical col...	Well for instance for religious people there's, a tremendous upsurge in church attendance, in Evangelical and conservative churches particularly among; young people We've. seen this upsurge all across the country in Evangelical circles We you know our churches are growing our youth. groups are. growing our Evangelical ...	well, for instance, for religious people, there's a tremendous upsurge in church attendance in evangelical and conservative churches, particularly among young people. we've seen this upsurge all across the country in evangelical circles. we, you know, our churches are growing, our youth groups are growing, our evangeli...
The number of mission volunteers, both foreign and domestic, is at record numbers. And so people in the Evangelical world see a tremendous upsurge, a growing upsurge in people who are finding meaning and purpose in their lives through an Evangelical understanding of Christianity, and that encourages them for the nation...	the, number of mission volunteers both foreign and domestic is at record numbers and so people in, the evangelical world see a tremendous, upsurge a growing upsurge in people who are finding meaning and purpose. in, their lives through an evangelical, understanding of christianity and that encourages them, for the, nat...	The number of mission volunteers both foreign. and domestic is at record numbers, And so people in the. Evangelical world see a tremendous upsurge a growing upsurge in people who are finding meaning and purpose in their lives through an Evangelical understanding. of Christianity and that encourages them for the nation'...	the number of mission volunteers, both foreign and domestic, is at record numbers. and so people in the evangelical world see a tremendous upsurge, a growing upsurge in people who are finding meaning and purpose in their lives through an evangelical understanding of christianity, and that encourages them for the nation...
Richard Land, thanks very much. Appreciate your time.	richard land thanks very much appreciate your	Richard Land thanks very much; Appreciate your	richard land, thanks very much. appreciate your time.
Thank you.	thank	Thank	thank you.
(Soundbite of laughter)	(soundbite of	(Soundbite of	(soundbite of laughter)
Richard Land, president of the Southern Baptist Convention's Ethics and Religious Liberty Commission in Tennessee, also host of the weekday radio program for faith and family. You're listening to TALK OF THE NATION from NPR News.	richard land president of the southern. baptist convention's ethics and religious liberty commission in tennessee also host of, the weekday radio program for; faith and family you're listening to talk of the nation from npr	Richard Land president of the Southern Baptist Convention's Ethics and Religious Liberty Commission in Tennessee also host of the weekday radio program for faith and family You're listening to TALK, OF THE NATION from NPR	richard land, president of the southern baptist convention's ethics and religious liberty commission in tennessee, also host of the weekday radio program for faith and family. you're listening to talk of the nation from npr news.
And let's get another caller on the line. This is Kendall, Kendall with us from the Eastern shore of Maryland.	and. let's get another caller on the line this is kendall kendall with us from the eastern shore. of	And let's get another caller on the line This. is Kendall Kendall with, us from the Eastern, shore of	and let's get another caller on the line. this is kendall, kendall with us from the eastern shore of maryland.
Hi, yes, I am a college student and a mother, and the comment that I wanted to make was that I see our country going to more of a collaborative effort, more of a willingness to compromise and to come to the realization and a - I guess an agreement that we are not the greatest country in the world, and that we need to s...	hi yes i am a college. student and a mother and the comment that i. wanted to make was that i see. our country going to more of a collaborative effort more of a willingness to compromise and to come to. the realization and a - i, guess an agreement. that, we, are not the greatest country in the world and that we need t...	Hi yes I am a college student and a mother and the comment that I wanted to make. was that I see our country going to more of a collaborative effort, more of a willingness to. compromise and to come to the realization and a - I guess an, agreement that we are. not the greatest country in the world and that we need to s...	hi, yes, i am a college student and a mother, and the comment that i wanted to make was that i see our country going to more of a collaborative effort, more of a willingness to compromise and to come to the realization and a - i guess an agreement that we are not the greatest country in the world, and that we need to s...
And how do you see this reflected, in what people are talking about or what people are doing?	and how do. you see this reflected in what people are talking about or what people are	And. how do you see this; reflected in what people are talking about or what people are	and how do you see this reflected, in what people are talking about or what people are doing?
Well just - I listen to NPR all the time, and you've been having great shows about people pulling together, and pro-choice, pro-life coming together and trying to reach some sort of middle ground. We're hopefully seeing it to be successful in our federal government, and there's been examples of it in state governments ...	well just - i, listen, to npr all the time and, you've. been having great shows about people pulling together and pro-choice pro-life coming, together and trying to reach some sort of middle ground we're hopefully seeing. it to, be successful in our federal; government and there's been, examples of it in state governme...	Well just - I listen to NPR all the time and, you've been having great. shows about people pulling together and pro-choice pro-life coming together and trying to reach some sort. of middle ground We're hopefully seeing it; to be successful in our federal government and there's been examples of it in state governments a...	well just - i listen to npr all the time, and you've been having great shows about people pulling together, and pro-choice, pro-life coming together and trying to reach some sort of middle ground. we're hopefully seeing it to be successful in our federal government, and there's been examples of it in state governments ...
I think we also see it within our communities, more farmer's markets coming out reaching into the community, forming more of a - I guess just - no, that's not a very good example.	i think we also see it within our communities more farmer's markets coming out reaching into the community forming more of a - i guess just - no that's not a very good.	I think we also see, it; within our communities more farmer's markets coming out. reaching. into the community, forming more of a - I guess; just - no that's not a, very, good	i think we also see it within our communities, more farmer's markets coming out reaching into the community, forming more of a - i guess just - no, that's not a very good example.
(Soundbite of laughter)	(soundbite of	(Soundbite of	(soundbite of laughter)
But I think that it goes along with the mentality. We're starting to see just more - I'm not - I mean, we see it in our school systems with collaboration between teachers and our government. I just - I see it all over.	but i think that it goes along with the mentality we're, starting to see just more - i'm not - i mean we see it in our. school systems with collaboration between teachers and our government i just - i see it all,	But I think that it goes along with, the mentality We're starting to see just more - I'm not - I mean we see it in our school systems with, collaboration between, teachers and our government I just - I see it all	but i think that it goes along with the mentality. we're starting to see just more - i'm not - i mean, we see it in our school systems with collaboration between teachers and our government. i just - i see it all over.
Thanks very much, appreciate the phone call.	thanks very much appreciate the phone	Thanks very much appreciate, the phone	thanks very much, appreciate the phone call.
Thank you.	thank	Thank	thank you.
Bye-bye. And let's see if we can squeeze one last call in. This is Tim, Tim with us from Rochester, New York.	bye-bye and let's see if we can squeeze one last. call in this is tim tim. with us; from rochester new	Bye-bye And let's see if we can squeeze, one. last call in This is Tim Tim with us from Rochester New	bye-bye. and let's see if we can squeeze one last call in. this is tim, tim with us from rochester, new york.
Yeah hi, thanks Neal, great show.	yeah hi, thanks, neal great	Yeah hi thanks Neal great	yeah hi, thanks neal, great show.
Thanks.			thanks.
I just wanted to remind people of what President Kennedy said, you know, ask not what you can do for - ask not what your country can do for you, but ask what you can do for your country. It seems to me that community and family as a part of the community really is the cornerstone of the society. And, you know, in havin...	i just wanted to remind people of what president kennedy said you know ask not what you can do for - ask not what your country can do for you but ask what you can do for your country it seems to me that, community and family as a part of the community really is the, cornerstone of the society and you know in. having go...	I just wanted to remind people of what President Kennedy said, you know ask not what you can; do for - ask not what your country can do for you but ask what you can do for your country It seems to me that community and. family, as a part of the community really. is the cornerstone of the society And you know in having ...	i just wanted to remind people of what president kennedy said, you know, ask not what you can do for - ask not what your country can do for you, but ask what you can do for your country. it seems to me that community and family as a part of the community really is the cornerstone of the society. and, you know, in havin...
And I've done it off and on since then, and you get the sense that people - you get a sense that you actually come to know the neighborhood better than the people actually living there do, especially in certain types of communities -not all communities. But I definitely feel like, you know, we're losing a sense of comm...	and i've done, it off and on since then and you get the sense that people. - you get a sense, that you actually come to know the neighborhood better than the. people actually living there do especially in certain types, of communities -not all communities but i definitely feel like you know we're losing a sense of comm...	And I've done it off and on since then and you get the sense that people - you get a sense that you actually come to know the neighborhood better than the people, actually living there do especially in certain. types of communities -not, all communities But I definitely feel, like you know we're losing a sense of commu...	and i've done it off and on since then, and you get the sense that people - you get a sense that you actually come to know the neighborhood better than the people actually living there do, especially in certain types of communities -not all communities. but i definitely feel like, you know, we're losing a sense of comm...
I feel like we're moving away, we're forgetting, you know, that we need to get together to talk about things together and really come to, you know, an understanding so that we can take back our government and, you know, move our community forward in a way that best suits everyone.	i feel like we're moving away we're forgetting you know that we need to get together to talk about things, together and really come to you know an understanding so that we can take back our government and. you know move our community forward in a way that. best, suits	I feel like we're moving away we're forgetting. you know that, we need to get, together to talk about things together. and really come to you know an understanding so that, we can take back our government and you know move our community forward, in a way that best suits	i feel like we're moving away, we're forgetting, you know, that we need to get together to talk about things together and really come to, you know, an understanding so that we can take back our government and, you know, move our community forward in a way that best suits everyone.
Tim, thanks very much, appreciate the time today.	tim thanks very much appreciate the time	Tim thanks very much appreciate the, time	tim, thanks very much, appreciate the time today.
Yup, bye-bye.	yup	Yup	yup, bye-bye.
Tim calling us from Rochester, New York. We heard from many of our guests and many callers. Many of the callers and many of the guests indeed feared that the state of the union was overshadowed by the War in Iraq and the bad effects it was having on America in terms of the numbers killed in Iraq and here, the numbers m...	tim calling us from rochester new york we heard from many of our guests and many. callers many; of the callers and many of the, guests indeed feared. that the state. of; the union, was overshadowed by the. war in iraq and the. bad, effects it was having on america in terms of the numbers killed, in iraq and here the nu...	Tim calling us from Rochester New York We; heard from many of, our guests and many callers Many of the callers. and many of the guests, indeed feared that the state of the union was overshadowed by the, War in Iraq and the. bad effects, it was having on America in, terms of the numbers killed in Iraq, and here the, num...	tim calling us from rochester, new york. we heard from many of our guests and many callers. many of the callers and many of the guests indeed feared that the state of the union was overshadowed by the war in iraq and the bad effects it was having on america in terms of the numbers killed in iraq and here, the numbers m...
Today is June Fourteenth, Flag Day. A day when we're told to proudly fly the stars and stripes, one of the most widely displayed symbols in the country. It's bold, powerful, and iconic. In a minute we'll talk about what's called Vexillologist - I'm glad, I don't think I'm, I mean that sounds like a spelling bee word - ...	today is june fourteenth flag day a day when we're told to proudly, fly the stars and stripes one of the most widely displayed symbols in, the country it's bold powerful and iconic in a minute we'll talk. about, what's called vexillologist - i'm glad i don't think i'm i mean that sounds like a spelling bee word. - a ve...	Today is June Fourteenth Flag Day A day when we're told to proudly fly the stars. and stripes one of the most widely displayed symbols in, the country It's bold. powerful and iconic In a. minute we'll; talk about what's. called Vexillologist - I'm glad I don't. think I'm I mean that sounds like a, spelling bee word - a...	today is june fourteenth, flag day. a day when we're told to proudly fly the stars and stripes, one of the most widely displayed symbols in the country. it's bold, powerful, and iconic. in a minute we'll talk about what's called vexillologist - i'm glad, i don't think i'm, i mean that sounds like a spelling bee word - ...
Plus, we'll talk about the flag as an art piece. Is it visually pleasing? In an essay published in today's Washington Post, Blake Gopnik, the Post's chief art critic, takes a hard look at the flag.	plus we'll talk about the flag as an. art piece is. it visually pleasing? in an essay published in today's washington post blake gopnik the post's chief art critic takes a, hard look at the	Plus we'll, talk. about the flag as an art piece Is it visually pleasing? In an essay published in today's Washington Post Blake Gopnik the Post's chief art critic takes a hard look, at the	plus, we'll talk about the flag as an art piece. is it visually pleasing? in an essay published in today's washington post, blake gopnik, the post's chief art critic, takes a hard look at the flag.
800-989-8255, 800-989-TALK, or e-mail talk@npr.org.	800-989-8255, 800-989-talk or e-mail	800-989-8255, 800-989-TALK or e-mail	800-989-8255, 800-989-talk, or e-mail talk@npr.org.
First, Jim Ferrigan is the protocol officer and former vice president of NAVA, the North American Vexillologists Association. He's also the curator of a large private collection of flags. He joins us now from his home in Reno, Nevada. Welcome to the show.	first jim. ferrigan is. the; protocol officer and former vice president of nava the north american vexillologists association he's also the curator of a large private collection of flags he. joins us now from his home in reno nevada welcome to the	First Jim Ferrigan. is the protocol officer and former vice president of NAVA the North American Vexillologists Association He's also the curator of a large private collection of flags. He joins us now from his home in. Reno Nevada Welcome to the	first, jim ferrigan is the protocol officer and former vice president of nava, the north american vexillologists association. he's also the curator of a large private collection of flags. he joins us now from his home in reno, nevada. welcome to the show.