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Exactly. Exactly so. | exactly exactly | Exactly Exactly | exactly. exactly so. |
Whether it be trees or animals or bac--I don't know about bacteria, but that's--everything. | whether it be trees or animals or bac--i don't, know about bacteria but | Whether it be trees. or animals or bac--I don't know about bacteria but | whether it be trees or animals or bac--i don't know about bacteria, but that's--everything. |
Yeah. And he saw embryos resembling each other in the earliest stages. That makes sense from that point of view--the unity of type, he called it, where the arms of bats and chickens and human beings... | yeah and he. saw embryos resembling each other in the earliest stages that makes sense from that point of view--the unity of type he called, it where, the arms of bats and chickens and human | Yeah. And he saw embryos resembling each other in the earliest stages That makes sense from that point of view--the unity. of type. he called it where the arms of bats and chickens and human | yeah. and he saw embryos resembling each other in the earliest stages. that makes sense from that point of view--the unity of type, he called it, where the arms of bats and chickens and human beings... |
Right. | right. | ||
...all match up and things like that. If--they all makes sense if life has evolved and organisms share these common ancestors. | ...all match up and things like that if--they all makes sense; if. life has evolved and organisms share these common | ...all match up and things like that If--they all makes sense if life has evolved and organisms share these common | ...all match up and things like that. if--they all makes sense if life has evolved and organisms share these common ancestors. |
All right. We're going to take a short break, because we've got a lot more to talk about and I don't want to get into having to interrupt everybody like I normally do. Talking with Niles Eldredge at the American Museum of Natural History and Edward J. Larson of the American history--professor of A... | all right we're going to take a, short break because we've got a lot, more to talk about, and. i don't want to get into having to interrupt, everybody like i normally do talking, with. niles eldredge at the american museum of natural, history, and edward j larson of the american history--professor... | All right We're going to take, a short break because we've. got a lot more to talk about and I don't want to get into having to interrupt everybody like I normally do Talking with Niles. Eldredge at the American Museum of Natural, History and, Edward J Larson of the American, history--professor of... | all right. we're going to take a short break, because we've got a lot more to talk about and i don't want to get into having to interrupt everybody like i normally do. talking with niles eldredge at the american museum of natural history and edward j. larson of the american history--professor of a... |
I'm Ira Flatow. This is TALK OF THE NATION/SCIENCE FRIDAY from NPR News. | i'm ira flatow this is; talk, of the nation/science friday from npr | I'm Ira Flatow This is TALK OF. THE NATION/SCIENCE, FRIDAY from NPR | i'm ira flatow. this is talk of the nation/science friday from npr news. |
(Soundbite of music) | (soundbite of | (Soundbite of | (soundbite of music) |
You're listening to TALK OF THE NATION/SCIENCE FRIDAY. I'm Ira Flatow. | you're. listening; to talk of the nation/science friday i'm ira | You're listening to TALK OF THE NATION/SCIENCE FRIDAY I'm Ira | you're listening to talk of the nation/science friday. i'm ira flatow. |
We're talking this hour about Charles Darwin, the theory of evolution, with my guests: Niles Eldredge, paleontologist and curator of the Darwin exhibition at the American Museum of Natural History; also, Edward J. Larson, professor of American history at the University of Georgia in Athens and auth... | we're talking this hour about; charles. darwin the theory of evolution with my guests: niles eldredge. paleontologist. and curator of the darwin exhibition at the american museum of natural history also edward j larson professor of american history at the university of georgia in athens and author ... | We're talking this, hour about Charles, Darwin the theory of evolution with my guests: Niles, Eldredge. paleontologist and curator of the Darwin exhibition, at the American Museum of Natural History also Edward, J Larson professor of American. history at the University of Georgia in Athens and auth... | we're talking this hour about charles darwin, the theory of evolution, with my guests: niles eldredge, paleontologist and curator of the darwin exhibition at the american museum of natural history; also, edward j. larson, professor of american history at the university of georgia in athens and auth... |
(Announcements) | (announcements) | ||
What's a five-letter synonym of wrath? | what's a five-letter synonym of | What's a five-letter synonym of | what's a five-letter synonym of wrath? |
Darwin had always planned to publish his ideas. What he was doing during those 20 years was he was trying to get it right. He was trying to, as we'd say today, dot every I and dot every J and cross every T, because this idea had been being discussed throughout the scientific community in Europe fo... | darwin had always planned to publish his ideas what he was doing, during those 20 years, was he was, trying to get it right he was trying to as we'd, say today dot every i and dot every j and cross every t because this idea had been being discussed throughout the. scientific community in europe fo... | Darwin had. always planned to publish his ideas What he was doing during those 20 years was he was trying to get it right He was trying to as we'd, say today dot every I and dot every J and cross every T because this idea. had been being. discussed throughout the scientific community in Europe. fo... | darwin had always planned to publish his ideas. what he was doing during those 20 years was he was trying to get it right. he was trying to, as we'd say today, dot every i and dot every j and cross every t, because this idea had been being discussed throughout the scientific community in europe fo... |
Well, he probably would have kept doing that for another decade when another great scientist, Alfred Russell Wallace, who was a collector and already a committed evolutionist, a published evolutionist--he was a naturalist who went around the world collecting specimens and also writing papers. And w... | well he probably would have kept doing that for another decade when another great. scientist alfred. russell wallace who was a collector and already a committed evolutionist a published evolutionist--he was a naturalist who went around the world collecting. specimens and, also writing papers and wh... | Well. he probably would have kept doing that for another decade when, another great, scientist Alfred Russell Wallace who was a collector. and already a committed evolutionist, a published evolutionist--he was a naturalist who, went around the world. collecting specimens and. also. writing papers A... | well, he probably would have kept doing that for another decade when another great scientist, alfred russell wallace, who was a collector and already a committed evolutionist, a published evolutionist--he was a naturalist who went around the world collecting specimens and also writing papers. and w... |
So he wrote up a beautiful paper explaining his idea, and then he had to send it off. And he knew Darwin was thinking about evolution; sort of offhand he knew that. And he admired Darwin's other writings, and so he sent it to Darwin and said, `What do you think about this? What do you think about... | so he wrote up a beautiful paper explaining his idea and then he had to send it off and he knew darwin, was. thinking about evolution sort of offhand he knew that and he admired darwin's other, writings and so he, sent it to darwin and said `what do you think about this? what do you think about, ... | So he wrote up a beautiful paper explaining his idea and then he had to send it off And he knew Darwin was thinking about evolution sort of offhand he knew that And he admired Darwin's other writings and so; he sent it to Darwin and. said `What do you think about this? What do you think about thi... | so he wrote up a beautiful paper explaining his idea, and then he had to send it off. and he knew darwin was thinking about evolution; sort of offhand he knew that. and he admired darwin's other writings, and so he sent it to darwin and said, `what do you think about this? what do you think about... |
Well, Darwin read it in 1858 and was just floored. His--he had been pre-empted. He had been scooped. Somebody else had come up with his idea before he'd published. So he took his earlier writings about it, the essays that he'd pulled together about it and the articles, the stori--the accounts he... | well darwin read it in 1858 and was just floored his--he had been pre-empted he had been scooped somebody else had come up with his. idea before he'd published so he took, his earlier writings about it, the essays, that he'd pulled together about it and the, articles the stori--the accounts he'd... | Well Darwin read it in 1858 and was just floored His--he, had been pre-empted He, had been scooped Somebody else had come up with, his idea before he'd published So he took his earlier writings about it the essays that he'd pulled together about it. and the articles the stori--the accounts he'd ... | well, darwin read it in 1858 and was just floored. his--he had been pre-empted. he had been scooped. somebody else had come up with his idea before he'd published. so he took his earlier writings about it, the essays that he'd pulled together about it and the articles, the stori--the accounts he... |
Interesting. 1 (800) 989-8255 is our number. | interesting 1 (800) 989-8255 is our | Interesting 1 (800) 989-8255 is our | interesting. 1 (800) 989-8255 is our number. |
If you're a regular listener to this program, you know we talk a lot about this latest creationist challenge to evolution and natural selection called intelligent design theory. And the proponents of ID say that the Earth's creatures are too complex to have arisen through evolution and natural sele... | if you're a. regular listener to this program you know we talk a lot. about this latest creationist challenge to evolution and natural selection called intelligent design theory and the, proponents of id say that the earth's creatures, are too complex to have arisen through evolution; and natural s... | If, you're a regular listener to this program you know we talk a lot about this latest creationist challenge to evolution and natural selection called intelligent design theory And the, proponents of ID say that the Earth's creatures are too complex to have arisen through evolution and natural sele... | if you're a regular listener to this program, you know we talk a lot about this latest creationist challenge to evolution and natural selection called intelligent design theory. and the proponents of id say that the earth's creatures are too complex to have arisen through evolution and natural sele... |
And Warren Allmon has come up with a solution. He's the director of the Paleontological Research Institution and the Museum of the Earth in Ithaca, New York. He's also an associate professor of geology and biology at Cornell University. And he's put together a program to train museum staff and vo... | and warren. allmon, has come up with a, solution he's the director of the, paleontological research institution; and the museum of the earth. in ithaca new york he's also an associate professor of. geology and biology at cornell, university and he's put together a. program to train museum staff, ... | And Warren Allmon has come up with a solution. He's the director of the, Paleontological Research Institution and the Museum of the Earth in Ithaca New York He's also. an associate professor of geology and biology at Cornell University And. he's put together. a. program to train museum staff and ... | and warren allmon has come up with a solution. he's the director of the paleontological research institution and the museum of the earth in ithaca, new york. he's also an associate professor of geology and biology at cornell university. and he's put together a program to train museum staff and vo... |
Thanks for talking with us today, Dr. Allmon. | thanks for talking with us today dr | Thanks for talking with us today Dr | thanks for talking with us today, dr. allmon. |
Nice to be here. | nice to be | Nice to be | nice to be here. |
Hi. How big a problem is this in science museums now? | hi how big a. problem, is this in science museums | Hi How big a problem is, this in science museums | hi. how big a problem is this in science museums now? |
Well, I'm not sure that it's a new problem, and I don't know--if it is, I don't know how big it is. And it might not be accurate to call it a problem. Museums are all about being there for people who walk in. Most people don't come into museums to learn things; they come in to be entertained. An... | well i'm not sure that it's a, new problem and, i, don't, know--if it is i don't know how big it is and; it might not be accurate to call it a problem museums are, all about being there for people who walk in most people don't come into museums to learn things they, come. in to, be entertained a... | Well I'm not sure that. it's a new problem and I don't know--if it is I don't know, how big it is And it might not be, accurate to call it a problem Museums are all about being there for people who walk. in. Most, people don't come into museums to learn things they come in to be entertained And ... | well, i'm not sure that it's a new problem, and i don't know--if it is, i don't know how big it is. and it might not be accurate to call it a problem. museums are all about being there for people who walk in. most people don't come into museums to learn things; they come in to be entertained. an... |
But the main challenge, I think, is for museums to simply meet the increased popularity of this issue. | but the main challenge i think is for museums to simply, meet the increased popularity of this | But the. main challenge I think is for museums to simply meet the increased popularity of this | but the main challenge, i think, is for museums to simply meet the increased popularity of this issue. |
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And you've created something for your--for the museum guides called "Evolution and Creationism: A Guide for Museum Docents." | mm-hmm mm-hmm and you've created something, for your--for the museum guides called "evolution and creationism: a guide for museum | Mm-hmm Mm-hmm And you've, created something for your--for the museum guides called "Evolution, and Creationism: A Guide for Museum | mm-hmm. mm-hmm. and you've created something for your--for the museum guides called "evolution and creationism: a guide for museum docents." |
Most of our floor workers are volunteers... | most of; our floor workers are | Most, of our floor workers are | most of our floor workers are volunteers... |
Right. | right. | ||
...here in Ithaca, and we--and most of them do not have formal science training, so we put this little guide together at their request to help them have the information at their fingertips so that they can answer these questions. And the questions are coming more numerously now than they did, say, ... | ...here in ithaca and we--and. most of them do not, have formal science, training so we put this little guide together at their request, to help them, have the information at their fingertips so that they, can answer these questions and the questions are coming more numerously now than they did say... | ...here in Ithaca and we--and most of them do not have formal science training so we put this little guide, together at their request to, help them have the, information at their, fingertips so. that they can answer these questions And the questions are coming more numerously now than they did say ... | ...here in ithaca, and we--and most of them do not have formal science training, so we put this little guide together at their request to help them have the information at their fingertips so that they can answer these questions. and the questions are coming more numerously now than they did, say, ... |
Yeah. Yeah, that's what I was meaning before when I said there was a problem; the problem being how do you explain it to the people who are coming in, who are asking these questions? | yeah yeah that's, what i was meaning before when i said there was, a problem the problem being how do you explain; it. to the people who are coming in who are asking these | Yeah Yeah that's what I was meaning before when I, said there was a problem the problem being how do, you explain it to the people who are. coming in who are asking these | yeah. yeah, that's what i was meaning before when i said there was a problem; the problem being how do you explain it to the people who are coming in, who are asking these questions? |
You're listening to TALK OF THE NATION/SCIENCE FRIDAY. I am Ira Flatow. | you're listening to talk of the nation/science, friday i am ira | You're listening to TALK OF THE. NATION/SCIENCE FRIDAY I am Ira | you're listening to talk of the nation/science friday. i am ira flatow. |
And the thinking is that, at least in part, he was inspired by the second edition of "The Voyage of the Beagle," where Darwin hints very broadly about evolution. | and. the thinking is that at least in part he was. inspired by the second. edition of "the voyage of the beagle" where darwin hints very broadly about | And the thinking is that at least in. part, he was inspired by. the second edition of "The Voyage of the Beagle" where Darwin hints very broadly about | and the thinking is that, at least in part, he was inspired by the second edition of "the voyage of the beagle," where darwin hints very broadly about evolution. |
And right now, since it's in the news, lots of people come in, they bring clippings or they bring questions; `I just heard it on the news,' that kind of thing. And we do have a permanent exhibit about evolution in the museum and every exhibit is somehow connected to evolution. And so we wanted to ... | and right now since it's in, the news lots of people come in they bring clippings or they bring questions `i just heard it on the news' that kind of thing and we do have a permanent. exhibit about evolution in the museum, and, every exhibit is somehow connected to evolution and; so we wanted to be... | And right now, since it's in the news lots of people, come in they bring. clippings or they bring questions. `I just heard it on the news' that. kind of, thing And we do have a permanent exhibit about evolution in the, museum and every exhibit is somehow connected to evolution, And, so we wanted t... | and right now, since it's in the news, lots of people come in, they bring clippings or they bring questions; `i just heard it on the news,' that kind of thing. and we do have a permanent exhibit about evolution in the museum and every exhibit is somehow connected to evolution. and so we wanted to ... |
Right. | right. | ||
...better equipment to deal with that. Our--we know from surveys and from talking to visitors that their most intense educational experience comes through talking to people, no matter how much signage and exhibitry we have. | ...better equipment. to deal with that our--we know from surveys and from, talking, to visitors that their most intense educational experience comes through talking to people no matter how much signage and exhibitry we | ...better equipment to, deal with. that Our--we know from, surveys and. from talking to visitors that their most intense educational experience comes through talking. to people no matter how much signage and exhibitry we | ...better equipment to deal with that. our--we know from surveys and from talking to visitors that their most intense educational experience comes through talking to people, no matter how much signage and exhibitry we have. |
Yeah. I--and these days, science teachers in elementary schools are so ill-equipped to teach science, you would hope that they might have a place they could take their kids for a day trip or something to actually get some facts on the issues. | yeah i--and. these days science teachers in elementary schools are so ill-equipped to teach science you would hope, that they might. have a place they could take their kids for a, day trip or something to actually get some, facts on, the, | Yeah I--and these days science teachers in elementary. schools, are so ill-equipped to teach science you would hope. that they, might have a, place they could take, their kids for a day, trip or something to actually get some facts on, the | yeah. i--and these days, science teachers in elementary schools are so ill-equipped to teach science, you would hope that they might have a place they could take their kids for a day trip or something to actually get some facts on the issues. |
And that's exactly the idea, and then to do so in a non-threatening way and a respectful way, if they do feel challenged by it, but to also be an authoritative source of information if they're looking for information. Despite the fact that there are all these museums and all these books and program... | and that's exactly the idea and then to do so in, a non-threatening way and, a respectful way if they do feel challenged by it but. to also be an authoritative source, of information if they're looking for information despite the fact that there are all these, museums and all these; books and progr... | And that's exactly the idea and then to do, so in a non-threatening way and a respectful way if they do feel challenged. by, it but to also be. an authoritative source of information if. they're looking for information. Despite the fact that there are all these museums and all these. books and prog... | and that's exactly the idea, and then to do so in a non-threatening way and a respectful way, if they do feel challenged by it, but to also be an authoritative source of information if they're looking for information. despite the fact that there are all these museums and all these books and program... |
Dr. Eldredge, do you find people coming in, also, to your museum... | dr eldredge, do you find people coming in also to your | Dr Eldredge do you find people, coming in also to your | dr. eldredge, do you find people coming in, also, to your museum... |
Well, we haven't opened the Darwin exhibit. That opens to the public... | well we haven't opened the darwin, exhibit that opens to the | Well we haven't opened the Darwin. exhibit That opens to the | well, we haven't opened the darwin exhibit. that opens to the public... |
No, I mean, but in general, do they come in and... | no i mean but in general do they come in | No I mean but. in general do they come in | no, i mean, but in general, do they come in and... |
Yeah, they come in, but our docents are well-prepared. | yeah they come in but our docents are | Yeah they come in but. our docents are, | yeah, they come in, but our docents are well-prepared. |
Yeah. | yeah. | ||
We're, of course, doubling our efforts here for the Darwin exhibit. | we're of course doubling our efforts here for the darwin | We're of course doubling our efforts here for the Darwin | we're, of course, doubling our efforts here for the darwin exhibit. |
Yeah. And your exhibit opens this weekend? | yeah and. your exhibit opens this | Yeah And. your exhibit opens this | yeah. and your exhibit opens this weekend? |
It does open tomorrow. | it does. open | It does open | it does open tomorrow. |
Yeah. Warren Allmon, would it be an interesting idea--well, we have a link to this--to your guide of evolution and creationism on our Web site. People can download it and look at it; go to your Web site to look at it. Would it be an interesting idea to just supply this to any teacher who needs it? | yeah warren, allmon would it be an interesting idea--well we have a link to this--to. your guide of evolution and creationism on our web site people can download it and look at it go to your web site to look at it would it be an interesting idea to just supply this to any teacher who needs | Yeah Warren Allmon would it be an interesting idea--well we have a link to this--to your guide of evolution and creationism on our Web site People can download it and look at it go to your Web site; to look at it, Would, it be an interesting idea to just supply this to any teacher who needs | yeah. warren allmon, would it be an interesting idea--well, we have a link to this--to your guide of evolution and creationism on our web site. people can download it and look at it; go to your web site to look at it. would it be an interesting idea to just supply this to any teacher who needs it? |
We actually--since it went up a couple of months ago, we've had--I think my last count was a couple of hundred hits or--and inquiries about it from all manner of informal educators. So people not just at museums, but people at parks, people associated with Scout troops, all kinds of other groups. ... | we actually--since it went up a couple of months ago we've had--i. think my last. count was a couple of hundred hits or--and, inquiries about it from all manner of informal educators so people not just at, museums but people at parks people associated with scout troops all kinds of. other groups t... | We actually--since. it went up a couple of months, ago we've had--I think my last count was a couple of hundred hits or--and, inquiries about it from. all manner of informal educators So people not just at museums but people at parks people associated with Scout troops all kinds of other groups Th... | we actually--since it went up a couple of months ago, we've had--i think my last count was a couple of hundred hits or--and inquiries about it from all manner of informal educators. so people not just at museums, but people at parks, people associated with scout troops, all kinds of other groups. ... |
And, you know, these frank exchanges of views sometimes can really evolve into heated debates. What do you tell your docents to do if that happens--how to react to that? | and you know. these, frank exchanges of views sometimes can really evolve, into; heated. debates what do you tell your docents to do if that, happens--how to react to | And you know these frank exchanges of views sometimes can really evolve into heated debates What do you tell your. docents to do if that happens--how to react. to | and, you know, these frank exchanges of views sometimes can really evolve into heated debates. what do you tell your docents to do if that happens--how to react to that? |
We do have some kind of simple instructions to them that really have nothing to do with science or evolution, just things like be respectful, listen. We are a science museum, so even though these issues are intimately connected with religion, we explain to our docents that our institution is not ab... | we do have some kind. of simple instructions, to them that really have nothing to do with science or evolution, just things like be respectful listen we are a science museum so even though these. issues are intimately connected with religion we explain to our docents; that our institution is not ab... | We, do have some kind; of simple instructions to them that really have nothing to do with, science or, evolution just things like. be. respectful. listen We are a science museum, so even, though these issues are intimately connected with religion we, explain to our docents that our institution is n... | we do have some kind of simple instructions to them that really have nothing to do with science or evolution, just things like be respectful, listen. we are a science museum, so even though these issues are intimately connected with religion, we explain to our docents that our institution is not ab... |
Yeah. Well, good luck with your teaching out there in the science museums. | yeah well good luck with your teaching out there in the science | Yeah Well good luck with your, teaching. out there in the science | yeah. well, good luck with your teaching out there in the science museums. |
Well, thanks very much. | well thanks very | Well thanks, very | well, thanks very much. |
Warren Allmon is director of the Paleontological Research Institute and the Museum of Earth in Ithaca, New York, and he's associate professor of geology and biology at Cornell University. | warren allmon is director of the paleontological research institute and the museum of earth in ithaca new york and he's associate professor of geology and biology at cornell | Warren Allmon is director of the Paleontological Research, Institute and the. Museum of Earth in Ithaca New York and; he's, associate. professor of geology and biology at Cornell | warren allmon is director of the paleontological research institute and the museum of earth in ithaca, new york, and he's associate professor of geology and biology at cornell university. |
Our number, 1 (800) 989-8255. We're talking with Niles Eldredge and Edward J. Larson. | our number 1 (800) 989-8255. we're talking with niles eldredge and edward j | Our number 1 (800) 989-8255. We're. talking with Niles Eldredge and Edward J. | our number, 1 (800) 989-8255. we're talking with niles eldredge and edward j. larson. |
Dr. Larson, what did you think of that idea of... | dr larson what did you think of that idea | Dr Larson what did you think of that, idea | dr. larson, what did you think of that idea of... |
Museums form a crucial link in our education system in America. They have ever since the 1700s. Many people get their understanding of science and art and other things through museums. I can understand it's a very complicated area, especially for where you get a volunteer worker there in the museu... | museums form a; crucial, link in, our education system in america they. have ever since the 1700s. many people get their understanding. of science and art; and other things through museums i can understand it's a very complicated. area especially for where you get a volunteer worker there, in the ... | Museums form a crucial link in our education system in America They have ever since. the 1700s Many people get their understanding of science and art, and other things through museums I can understand it's a very complicated area especially for where you get a volunteer worker there in the museum ... | museums form a crucial link in our education system in america. they have ever since the 1700s. many people get their understanding of science and art and other things through museums. i can understand it's a very complicated area, especially for where you get a volunteer worker there in the museu... |
Mm-hmm. And, Dr. Eldredge, your exhibition includes a current biology textbook, the one that's used in Cobb County, Georgia... | mm-hmm and dr eldredge your exhibition includes, a current biology textbook the one that's used in cobb county | Mm-hmm And Dr Eldredge your exhibition includes a current biology textbook, the one that's used in Cobb County | mm-hmm. and, dr. eldredge, your exhibition includes a current biology textbook, the one that's used in cobb county, georgia... |
Exactly. Yes, that... | exactly yes | Exactly Yes | exactly. yes, that... |
...with the sticker and everything. Describe... | ...with the sticker and everything | ...with the sticker and everything | ...with the sticker and everything. describe... |
...it's only a theory and so forth. So we have, actually, a short film with Francis Collins and a few other prominent scientists on it explaining what theories are, that these are the big ideas of science--well-corroborated ideas. They're not just wild guesses. | ...it's only a theory and so forth so we have, actually a short film with francis collins and a few other prominent scientists on. it explaining what theories are that. these, are the big ideas of science--well-corroborated ideas they're not just wild | ...it's only a theory and, so, forth So we have actually a short film with Francis Collins and, a few other prominent scientists on it explaining what theories are that these are the big ideas of science--well-corroborated ideas They're. not just wild. | ...it's only a theory and so forth. so we have, actually, a short film with francis collins and a few other prominent scientists on it explaining what theories are, that these are the big ideas of science--well-corroborated ideas. they're not just wild guesses. |
Mm-hmm. 1 (800) 989-8255. Lots of people want to talk about it. Let's see if we can get a few phone calls in. Let's go to Nancy in Louisville. Hi, Nancy. | mm-hmm 1 (800) 989-8255. lots of people want to talk about it let's see if we can. get a few phone. calls in let's go to nancy; in louisville hi | Mm-hmm. 1 (800) 989-8255. Lots of people want, to talk about it Let's see if, we can get a few phone, calls in Let's go to, Nancy in Louisville Hi | mm-hmm. 1 (800) 989-8255. lots of people want to talk about it. let's see if we can get a few phone calls in. let's go to nancy in louisville. hi, nancy. |
Hey, how are you guys? | hey, how are you, | Hey how. are you | hey, how are you guys? |
Hi. | hi. | ||
You could take a stab at it. | you could, take a stab at | You could take a stab at | you could take a stab at it. |
So he had... | so he. | So he | so he had... |
And... | and... | ||
Good topic. You know, personally I'm a Christian that figured out that, you know, God was the who behind things, and the what, how, when it has to do with evolution doesn't bother me at all. But the high school library where I am, you know, library media specialist needs to have some stuff on this... | good topic you know personally i'm a christian that figured out that you know god was the who behind. things and the what how when it has to do with evolution doesn't bother me at all but the high, school, library. where i am you know library media specialist needs to have; some stuff, on this i ... | Good topic; You know personally I'm; a Christian that figured out. that you know God was the who behind, things and the what how when; it has to do with evolution doesn't bother me at all But, the high school library where, I am you know. library media specialist needs. to have some stuff on this ... | good topic. you know, personally i'm a christian that figured out that, you know, god was the who behind things, and the what, how, when it has to do with evolution doesn't bother me at all. but the high school library where i am, you know, library media specialist needs to have some stuff on this... |
The... | the... | ||
I'm also kind of interested in, you know, kind of a balanced presentation that allows for both. I'm not sure whether your guests can speak to that, but I just--I kind of want to do both, because I'm a--you know, I need to provide it all. | i'm also kind of. interested in you know. kind of a balanced presentation that allows for both. i'm not sure whether your guests can. speak to that but i just--i kind, of want to do, both because i'm a--you know; i need to provide it | I'm also kind. of interested in you know kind of a balanced presentation that allows for both I'm not sure whether your guests can speak to that but I just--I. kind of want to do, both because I'm a--you know I need to, provide it | i'm also kind of interested in, you know, kind of a balanced presentation that allows for both. i'm not sure whether your guests can speak to that, but i just--i kind of want to do both, because i'm a--you know, i need to provide it all. |
Let me just remind everybody, first, this is TALK OF THE NATION/SCIENCE FRIDAY from NPR News. | let me just remind, everybody first this is talk, of the nation/science friday from npr | Let me just remind everybody first this is TALK OF THE NATION/SCIENCE FRIDAY from NPR | let me just remind everybody, first, this is talk of the nation/science friday from npr news. |
Yes, Niles. | yes | Yes | yes, niles. |
The Web site, National Center for Science Education--that is the clearinghouse for all of this. They'll give you bibliographies. They will be fair, you know, but it's a science education outfit. But they are the ones that are best informed about what the literature is and so forth--what's going on... | the web site national center for, science education--that is the, clearinghouse for all of this they'll give you bibliographies they, will; be fair you know but it's a science education; outfit but they are the ones that are best informed about, what the literature is and so forth--what's going on... | The Web site National Center for Science Education--that is, the clearinghouse for all of this. They'll, give you bibliographies They will be fair you know but it's a science education outfit But. they. are the ones that are best informed about, what the literature is and so forth--what's going on... | the web site, national center for science education--that is the clearinghouse for all of this. they'll give you bibliographies. they will be fair, you know, but it's a science education outfit. but they are the ones that are best informed about what the literature is and so forth--what's going on... |
Great. | great. | ||
I might add that the National Academy of Sciences has prepared a wonderful booklet that is widely used to help explain the difference between theory and hypothesis that people can look to. Their--I imagine what the museum's put together with Francis Collins would be very helpful; he's very good on t... | i might add that, the national academy of sciences has prepared a wonderful booklet that is; widely used to help explain the difference between theory and hypothesis that people can look to their--i imagine what, the museum's put together with francis collins would be very helpful he's very good, on... | I might add that the National Academy of Sciences has prepared a wonderful. booklet that is widely used to help explain the difference between theory and hypothesis that people can look to Their--I imagine what the museum's put together with Francis Collins would be very helpful he's very good; on t... | i might add that the national academy of sciences has prepared a wonderful booklet that is widely used to help explain the difference between theory and hypothesis that people can look to. their--i imagine what the museum's put together with francis collins would be very helpful; he's very good on t... |
I'd like... | i'd | I'd | i'd like... |
Good luck to you, Nancy. | good luck, to you | Good luck to. you | good luck to you, nancy. |
OK. Let me make one other suggestion. | ok let me make one other | OK Let me make. one other | ok. let me make one other suggestion. |
Sure. | sure. | ||
You know, picking the right phrase is so important. It could be that you guys could just change theory of evolution to some other thing--you know, kind of like... | you know picking the. right phrase is so important it could be that you guys could just change theory of, evolution to, some other thing--you know kind of | You know picking the right phrase is so important It could be that you guys could just change theory of. evolution to some other. thing--you know kind of, | you know, picking the right phrase is so important. it could be that you guys could just change theory of evolution to some other thing--you know, kind of like... |
The law of evolution. | the law, of | The law of | the law of evolution. |
Yeah. There you go. | yeah there you | Yeah There you | yeah. there you go. |
Like the law of gravity. There... | like the law of gravity | Like the law of gravity | like the law of gravity. there... |
There you go, and it might solve the problem. | there you go. and it might solve the | There you, go and it might solve the | there you go, and it might solve the problem. |
OK. That's a... | ok that's | OK That's | ok. that's a... |
Thanks. Bye. | thanks | Thanks | thanks. bye. |
Thank you. That'd be an inte--what does it take to go from a theory to a law? | thank. you that'd be an inte--what does it take to go from a theory, to a | Thank you That'd be an inte--what does it take to go from a theory to a | thank you. that'd be an inte--what does it take to go from a theory to a law? |
Yeah, it is confusing because we do use the word theory in so many different ways. | yeah it is confusing because we do. use the word theory in so many different | Yeah it is, confusing because we do use the word theory in so many different, | yeah, it is confusing because we do use the word theory in so many different ways. |
Yeah. 1 (800) 989-8255. Let's go to Justin in South Bend. Hi, Justin. | yeah. 1 (800) 989-8255. let's go to; justin, in south bend hi | Yeah 1 (800) 989-8255. Let's go to Justin in South, Bend. Hi | yeah. 1 (800) 989-8255. let's go to justin in south bend. hi, justin. |
Hi. Good afternoon. | hi good | Hi Good | hi. good afternoon. |
Hi. | hi. | ||
OK. Other question. What's role did intelligent design play in Darwin theory and is that possibility that God, religion and evolution need each other to exist? | ok other question what's role did intelligent design play in darwin theory and is that possibility that. god religion and evolution need each. other to | OK Other question What's role did intelligent design play, in Darwin theory and is that possibility that God religion and evolution need each other to | ok. other question. what's role did intelligent design play in darwin theory and is that possibility that god, religion and evolution need each other to exist? |
Well, I can address the first part of that. We have on display one of the pages--one of the original manuscript pages of "The Origin of Species," and just by coincidence deals with complexity, which is the big issue of intelligent design these days, but is also the central issue of William Paley's ... | well i can address the first part of that we have on display one of the pages--one of the original manuscript pages of "the origin, of species" and just by, coincidence deals with complexity which is the big issue of intelligent design these days but is also the, central issue of william paley's 18... | Well I can address the first part of that We have on display one of the pages--one of the original manuscript pages of "The Origin of Species" and just by coincidence deals with complexity which, is the big issue of intelligent design these; days. but is also the central; issue of William Paley's 1... | well, i can address the first part of that. we have on display one of the pages--one of the original manuscript pages of "the origin of species," and just by coincidence deals with complexity, which is the big issue of intelligent design these days, but is also the central issue of william paley's ... |
Right. | right. | ||
And Darwin says no, there's a spectrum of complexity here and so forth. So intelligent design is an idea that's been--it's not--it goes way back even before Darwin's day and it simply doesn't work, because the more we find out about science--Mike Bee in his book, and he's an intelligent design guy,... | and darwin says no there's a spectrum of complexity here and so. forth so intelligent. design is an idea that's been--it's not--it goes way, back, even before darwin's day and it simply doesn't work because the more we find, out about science--mike, bee in his book and he's an intelligent design gu... | And Darwin says no there's, a spectrum of complexity here and so, forth, So. intelligent, design is an idea that's been--it's not--it. goes way back even before Darwin's day and it simply doesn't work because the more we find out about science--Mike Bee in his book and he's an. intelligent design g... | and darwin says no, there's a spectrum of complexity here and so forth. so intelligent design is an idea that's been--it's not--it goes way back even before darwin's day and it simply doesn't work, because the more we find out about science--mike bee in his book, and he's an intelligent design guy,... |
Ed Larson, did Darwin--was he forced after this came out to choose between religion and evolution? I mean, did people say you can't say this and still believe in God? Or if you do you're a phony? | ed larson did darwin--was he, forced after this came out to choose between religion and evolution? i mean did people say you can't say this, and still believe in god? or. if you do, you're a | Ed Larson did Darwin--was he forced after this came. out to choose between religion and evolution? I mean did people say you. can't say this and, still believe in God? Or if you do you're, a | ed larson, did darwin--was he forced after this came out to choose between religion and evolution? i mean, did people say you can't say this and still believe in god? or if you do you're a phony? |
No, he wasn't forced in any particular way. Indeed, he was pulled many different ways because many people who accepted his theory of evolution were devout Christians and remained evangelical Christians. One great example of that is Asa Gray, one of Darwin's closest friends and correspondents. He ... | no he wasn't forced in any particular way indeed he was pulled many, different ways because many people. who accepted his theory of evolution were devout christians and remained evangelical christians one great example of that is asa gray one of darwin's, closest friends and correspondents he was... | No he. wasn't forced in any particular way Indeed he was pulled many different ways because many people who; accepted his theory of evolution were devout Christians and remained evangelical Christians One great example, of, that is Asa Gray. one. of Darwin's closest friends and correspondents He ... | no, he wasn't forced in any particular way. indeed, he was pulled many different ways because many people who accepted his theory of evolution were devout christians and remained evangelical christians. one great example of that is asa gray, one of darwin's closest friends and correspondents. he ... |
OK. All Right. | ok all | OK All | ok. all right. |
Other issues came up. | other issues came | Other, issues came | other issues came up. |
Oh, he didn't know about it. | oh he, didn't, know about | Oh he didn't know about | oh, he didn't know about it. |
We're talking about Darwin and the theory of evolution with Niles Eldredge, paleontologist and curator of the Darwin Exhibition at the American Museum of Natural History, which is opening tomorrow. This weekend. For those of us who've seen the preview, it's fantastic. If you're in the New York ar... | we're talking about darwin and the theory of evolution with niles eldredge paleontologist and curator of the. darwin exhibition at, the american museum of natural, history which is. opening tomorrow this weekend, for those of us who've seen the preview it's fantastic. if you're in the, new york a... | We're talking about Darwin and the theory of evolution with Niles Eldredge paleontologist; and curator. of the Darwin Exhibition. at the American. Museum of Natural History which is opening tomorrow This weekend For those of us who've. seen the preview it's fantastic If you're in the New York are... | we're talking about darwin and the theory of evolution with niles eldredge, paleontologist and curator of the darwin exhibition at the american museum of natural history, which is opening tomorrow. this weekend. for those of us who've seen the preview, it's fantastic. if you're in the new york ar... |
Our number, 1 (800) 989-8255. You write, Niles, that no other historical figure in science retains such an influence over the years. Not even Einstein. Think that he's an even bigger historical figure. | our number 1 (800) 989-8255. you write niles that. no other historical figure in science retains such. an influence over the years not even einstein, think that he's an even bigger historical | Our number. 1 (800) 989-8255. You write Niles that no other historical figure in science retains such an influence over the, years Not even Einstein Think that he's an even. bigger historical | our number, 1 (800) 989-8255. you write, niles, that no other historical figure in science retains such an influence over the years. not even einstein. think that he's an even bigger historical figure. |
Well, there is the atomic bomb, so I waffle a little bit with Einstein. But Darwin has not been metabolized by the Western world. It's not just science. Science has metabolized him... | well, there is. the atomic bomb so i waffle a little bit with einstein, but darwin has not been metabolized by the western world. it's, not just science science has metabolized | Well there is the atomic bomb so I waffle a little bit, with Einstein But Darwin. has not been metabolized by the Western, world It's not just science Science has metabolized | well, there is the atomic bomb, so i waffle a little bit with einstein. but darwin has not been metabolized by the western world. it's not just science. science has metabolized him... |
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