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[2680.62 --> 2687.34] The way, the way our stuff was set up was that, uh, in Nesta, we had in the front matter, a title. |
[2687.52 --> 2696.88] Yes. Yeah. And middleman by default didn't have that. Uh, sorry. No, the way Nesta works is it |
[2696.88 --> 2702.58] grabs the H1. That's right. Yeah. Yeah. And I didn't like that. It's not in the, in the front |
[2702.58 --> 2709.58] matter. And so I had all these articles that had no titles, right? So, so what I did was I wrote a |
[2709.58 --> 2717.80] helper that basically pre-renders the entire HTML. So it gets rendered twice and grabs the, the H1 and, |
[2717.92 --> 2724.22] you know, pulls that out as the title for it. Um, and it works. It's amazing. It's amazing. |
[2724.22 --> 2730.88] Like, yeah. The fact that you could do that in middleman is pretty awesome to me. Um, that |
[2730.88 --> 2734.68] you, that you have access to like the whole document, you can render it however you want. |
[2735.04 --> 2740.54] Um, it's very customizable. I like the fact that you were able to do a lot of stuff with, |
[2740.70 --> 2748.36] um, with the URLs to like just trimming off things like .html if you had that and, um, you know, |
[2748.36 --> 2754.28] the directories with indexes in them becoming, you know, uh, pretty URLs. And I think we even had an |
[2754.28 --> 2760.14] issue with our comments when we first launched the SAS where we had, we forgot to put the trailing |
[2760.14 --> 2765.16] backslash on there or I think it was on there by default with middleman and we wanted to pull it off |
[2765.16 --> 2771.92] because the, the previous version of the site didn't, didn't handle, um, or didn't have a |
[2771.92 --> 2779.88] trailing backslash, um, on the URL. And that actually caused, um, what is that we use for the |
[2779.88 --> 2785.50] comments? Discus. Yeah. Discus. It caused that to think it was a different, you know, page. So |
[2785.50 --> 2790.08] therefore it had a different, uh, comment stream and we were all, we're all just messed up there, but |
[2790.08 --> 2796.68] got that fixed and it's still not technically fixed, but, uh, you know, yeah, we have the issues |
[2796.68 --> 2801.46] still open. We're, we're getting close. You need to spend some time on that on a weekend or maybe, |
[2801.46 --> 2805.36] maybe one of our listeners. Maybe, yeah, maybe a listener would fix that for us. |
[2807.22 --> 2811.70] You see, you see what's going on here. This is just a giant conspiracy between Adam and me |
[2811.70 --> 2816.16] to get you, the listener to write our code. |
[2819.16 --> 2824.26] Yes. Yes. And our articles. Yes. Absolutely. Let's, you know what, speaking of that, let's give |
[2824.26 --> 2829.68] some shout outs to those who have contributed to the SAS way over the years. You got me and you who |
[2829.68 --> 2834.02] started it. Uh, I don't know if there are any particular, or I'm just going down the contributors |
[2834.02 --> 2841.06] list on the SAS way, which is, uh, Mario Vicaldi, uh, Mason Wendell, Peter Gaston, who wrote a book |
[2841.06 --> 2847.08] on CSS. I think it was, um, something on CSS three, like a couple of years ago. Really, really awesome |
[2847.08 --> 2853.80] book. I liked it. Uh, Roy, not sure how you say your last name. Uh, Hugo, how would you say his last |
[2853.80 --> 2863.74] name? Uh, I do not know. It's French. Uh, so I will need to try then. Uh, Girardelle, Girardelle. |
[2863.96 --> 2867.02] I'm not sure. And then you got Frank S. I don't know what, I don't know why Frank is so elusive |
[2867.02 --> 2872.78] with his last name, but Frank S. Well, that was just the awesome thing. Like here's this guy |
[2872.78 --> 2877.72] posting from South Africa and he doesn't want to tell us his last name and I'm okay with that. |
[2877.72 --> 2883.38] You know, Frank S. Cause he wrote an awesome article for us. He's got some more in the pipe |
[2883.38 --> 2891.32] too, I think. Daniel, uh, Daniel M's, I'ms, probably I'ms, I'm gonna guess. And then over |
[2891.32 --> 2895.70] the years too, we've also had, uh, Chris Epstein come and do some technical editing for us. |
[2895.94 --> 2903.26] Wayne Netherland, um, has done some technical editing for us as well. And I don't think either |
[2903.26 --> 2909.70] of them really ever plan to write anything. Um, I think Chris is just too busy anyways. And so is |
[2909.70 --> 2916.98] Wynn, but they were definitely Sass fans, of course, Wynn and Chris wrote the book Sass and |
[2916.98 --> 2923.90] that was Sass and Compass in Action from, um, uh, who's the Manny. I think that's right. |
[2925.32 --> 2929.56] So, you know, obviously huge fans and, you know, there's been several times when we've had an |
[2929.56 --> 2932.80] article go out that we're like, yeah, we need technical eyes on that one. Make sure that the, |
[2932.80 --> 2936.76] you know, what we were talking about actually does make sense. And, and they come in and kind |
[2936.76 --> 2941.44] of like do some blessing, but see, we always operated on GitHub before, but we just never |
[2941.44 --> 2946.68] had it open. It was in a private repo and it was, you know, this kind of, so for any of you out there |
[2946.68 --> 2953.08] who are rocking out private content based repos similar to the Sass way, you might want to consider |
[2953.08 --> 2959.86] an open publishing, uh, methodology because I got to say, man, I think the, the, you know, |
[2959.86 --> 2966.82] the new design definitely, um, lends to it being a middleman, being so easy to use, uh, lends to it. |
[2966.82 --> 2973.38] But I think the future of the Sass way is definitely bright and being able to fork it. And we even have |
[2973.38 --> 2979.64] a contributing doc to kind of guide you through actually contributing and whatnot. And I think |
[2979.64 --> 2984.22] we've got some plans even to kind of earmark some different topics for people, lack of better terms, |
[2984.22 --> 2989.50] maybe assignments to, so to speak. And if you want to pick it up, you can pick it up, uh, or bring |
[2989.50 --> 2994.30] your own carrot and write about what you want. So that's, uh, pretty excited, man. Pretty excited |
[2994.30 --> 3006.56] about it. Yeah. So, um, so I guess following the normal rhythm of doing a change log show, I know |
[3006.56 --> 3012.28] this time is a little tiny bit different than maybe our past shows. Um, but I still want to treat it the |
[3012.28 --> 3017.04] same in some respects. So, uh, we always ask some cool questions at the end that we're kind of known |
[3017.04 --> 3024.74] for. And, um, the first question I'll ask you, John is, um, is if you weren't writing Sass, |
[3025.00 --> 3026.10] what would you be writing? |
[3028.84 --> 3038.44] I mean, definitely CSS, right? Um, I'm so grateful that there is, is Sass. Uh, I mean, |
[3038.44 --> 3045.30] or maybe less if less was around. I don't know if there wasn't Sass, would we have stylus? Um, |
[3045.84 --> 3052.90] I don't know. I don't know. Maybe. I mean, so I do other things, um, as well. I, I write a lot of |
[3052.90 --> 3060.66] JavaScript. Uh, love JavaScript. Um, it's probably my favorite programming language these days. Uh, |
[3060.66 --> 3068.72] it, I would, it would have definitely been Ruby. I love Ruby's elegance. Um, but I don't get to do a |
[3068.72 --> 3074.10] lot of UI programming in Ruby. And I, I think that's why I love JavaScript. It just lets me get in there |
[3074.10 --> 3086.46] and make stuff awesome. Um, yeah, I'm not a Hamill fan. Sorry. Yeah. I, uh, I've become not a Hamill fan. |
[3086.46 --> 3090.74] Uh, I'd rather just keep it simple. I'm almost, I'm almost a purist at that point. Just |
[3090.74 --> 3099.06] if I can't, I'm, I'd almost just rather write in the case of a Ruby project, like ERB or straight HTML. |
[3099.90 --> 3108.20] Yeah. I like the other ways you can do, but I feel like I've kind of turned away from abstractions |
[3108.20 --> 3114.86] lately. Like I like, you know, for the hardcore, uh, JavaScript, uh, developer who wants to use |
[3114.86 --> 3118.98] CoffeeScript, that totally makes sense. And I think it makes sense to use it when it makes sense |
[3118.98 --> 3125.44] for you and your project and your team. Um, you know, and the same with SAS and CSS, that relationship, |
[3125.54 --> 3129.74] I feel like at each layer, there's some sort of abstraction, but with HTML, I just felt like, |
[3129.98 --> 3134.36] like it was just didn't make any sense anymore for a while. I loved it, loved the short and easy |
[3134.36 --> 3138.12] syntax, but after a while it would somehow bite you in the butt. So I just got sick of it. |
[3139.36 --> 3143.94] And, uh, yeah, I mean, I had a kind of a similar journey with Hamill. Um, I mean, I know, |
[3143.94 --> 3148.74] I remember thinking about it in terms of Rails views and this is technical, but that it seemed |
[3148.74 --> 3158.42] to help make, um, our Rails view code cleaner, um, because it forced you to write stuff on one line |
[3158.42 --> 3165.18] and whenever you just inserted a whole block of Ruby code in Hamill, it looks just awful. Um, |
[3165.52 --> 3170.88] whereas in a regular view, you can kind of get away with it looking okay. Um, |
[3170.88 --> 3181.18] so I, I did like that effect. Um, but at the same time, struggling with indentation and why is it not |
[3181.18 --> 3189.68] rendering? And, um, I don't know. I'm, I, I've sort of backed away from that. I've also backed away |
[3189.68 --> 3195.78] from the indented syntax on, on SAS for similar reasons in that it's just not enough like regular |
[3195.78 --> 3203.24] web development, I think to, um, to merit like making and it doesn't have enough benefits |
[3203.24 --> 3206.08] to merit an entirely new syntax. |
[3206.08 --> 3212.06] Yeah. Um, that's, that's probably an easy way to sum up what I just said. I think that's how I feel |
[3212.06 --> 3217.30] is like you almost put yourself on an Island doing that and it might be a good Island. And, you know, |
[3217.30 --> 3221.48] like you had said, it might clean up your Rails view code in the, in the case of Hamill or something |
[3221.48 --> 3226.62] like that. But what you end up doing is you got the community kind of going one direction and you're |
[3226.62 --> 3231.42] over here and another, and you're hanging out in like white space aware land. And it's just, |
[3231.42 --> 3237.90] you can't copy somebody else's code from a tutorial or you can't like easily riff or pair with somebody |
[3237.90 --> 3243.82] or kind of share ideas. And I think even for like when you're collaborating over code, it's like, |
[3243.88 --> 3247.22] well, you're using one version of the syntax and I'm using another. So we can't, |
[3247.22 --> 3250.14] we can't work together. And that's, that's a problem. |
[3250.84 --> 3256.72] Collaboration is really the thing. I mean, I, I already, I mean, I, I just hate that point in |
[3256.72 --> 3263.04] any project where you're like, well, so what's your favorite tool to do this kind of thing? |
[3263.08 --> 3269.26] You know, it's like, um, you know, I'd rather not have to make those decisions in some ways. Um, |
[3270.10 --> 3275.14] you know, I, I mean, even less or SAS or, or other things like that, you know, I mean, |
[3275.14 --> 3283.60] obviously I'm going to choose SAS. I write a blog about the SAS, but, um, but you know, |
[3283.74 --> 3288.40] the fact is I'm going, there are going to be some, some of those battles on every project and |
[3288.40 --> 3290.48] I just wasn't willing to fight the Hamill battle. |
[3291.74 --> 3294.68] Yes. Yes. That's where I'm at with you. I'm, I'm right there. |
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