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[594.20 --> 599.94] programmer to to trust the library more instead of that if you don't have any types and you call a |
[599.94 --> 604.12] library and you get an error you basically have to debug a third-party code which is not easy |
[604.12 --> 610.06] yeah i think there are some really cool things about dart uh that the language itself which will |
[610.06 --> 616.78] we'll get into in in a in a little bit but uh the one thing that i think so okay so we we've talked a |
[616.78 --> 623.54] little bit about you know what's the the the major benefit of dart uh in its current form but what |
[623.54 --> 629.14] would you say where do you see dart in five years or in 10 years or in 15 years like where where do you |
[629.14 --> 636.70] want to see this project headed clearly we want to make sure that a lot of programmers will use it |
[636.70 --> 646.06] right now it's clear that web applications are becoming larger and larger and to control these big |
[646.06 --> 652.82] piles of source code i believe strongly that you need a better structure in the programming language |
[652.82 --> 659.26] and the way we handle libraries in dart will certainly help you the projects we have been |
[659.26 --> 666.76] supporting in dart they have all been saying that as soon as they uh get used to the new language which |
[666.76 --> 672.84] doesn't take very long they really really like uh the the typing and the tools so they can you can do |
[672.84 --> 678.34] refactoring that really counts when you build big applications and you have to maintain them over time |
[678.34 --> 685.00] yeah one of the the and this is kind of an aside here the fact that dart doesn't hoist variables i think |
[685.00 --> 690.68] makes it uh a lot easier to read like you know top to bottom than javascript just in general i mean |
[690.68 --> 696.32] that's like a a one little teeny feature of dart but like a major impact in readability when i've |
[696.32 --> 703.42] since i've noticed it so you asked uh what do we want to see in 5 10 15 years i'm extremely motivated |
[703.42 --> 712.00] to help the web continue to develop and deliver amazing experiences on mobile devices and so if anything |
[712.00 --> 716.90] we can do to help developers just naturally and organically continue to pick the web to deliver |
[716.90 --> 723.16] these really great experiences then i'm very happy i feel like at this point we need to give developers |
[723.16 --> 727.56] who are used to building on native platforms and who have very high expectations and tools and |
[727.56 --> 731.84] productivity i need to deliver that to developers when they want to target the web |
[731.84 --> 740.14] yeah so i think that that that's definitely a uh uh uh what's the what's the word a pretty broad |
[740.14 --> 744.40] goal right and i think that that's that there's nothing wrong with that i think that's a that's a |
[744.40 --> 751.64] that's a great goal but uh how do you how do you do that i mean i guess my question is i'm i'm trying to |
[751.64 --> 757.38] figure out a good way to word this but so in the 90s like you know javascript comes about and then all |
[757.38 --> 761.64] of a sudden today it's ubiquitous and it's everywhere and you can you know use it in any environment that |
[761.64 --> 766.48] basically a browser exists and and and now with node in cases of not the browser existing so |
[766.48 --> 771.92] like how does dart go from where it is now to becoming like a ubiquitous where you can use it |
[771.92 --> 778.80] anywhere well in the the first phase here it was very important to focus on the the web client and |
[778.80 --> 784.86] making sure that we can do web applications really well the next step is of course of course uh uh running |
[784.86 --> 790.04] on the uh the front end of the server so you can use the same programming language the same libraries |
[790.04 --> 797.62] in the client but also on the server side and with our last released uh release we we send out some |
[797.62 --> 803.44] more io code so you can actually run uh the the dart system on the server side so it's clear that |
[803.44 --> 809.10] if you can span from the client to the server it gives huge advantages to to the programmers |
[809.10 --> 819.96] yeah but again the uh what i would like to say that uh what's important to us is to make sure that |
[819.96 --> 827.86] we provide a very efficient uh programming platform and uh of course it's great to get more users but |
[827.86 --> 837.48] making sure that people can innovate faster uh is is a clear goal for us um i think um that is a |
[837.48 --> 841.46] different language and it's certainly not everybody that likes a new language for the web |
[841.46 --> 846.76] but deep down i think that innovation is what's going to make the web even better |
[846.76 --> 852.94] so it may be worth it to just talk about what is dart for a second because we we've talked a lot |
[852.94 --> 857.84] about the language a lot and i'm not sure many people know the full breadth or scope of the platform |
[857.84 --> 863.70] so real briefly it is its own language um and i'd love to hear lars talk a little bit about some of |
[863.70 --> 868.92] the influences to that but there's also a core set of libraries which i think is really missing from |
[868.92 --> 873.54] the web platform right now it's very hard to say like what kind of collection facilities do i have |
[873.54 --> 879.72] what do i have for dates and times what do i have for stopwatches debugging uh you name it uh so dart |
[879.72 --> 884.56] ships with a very rich core set of libraries it also has a package manager and inside the package |
[884.56 --> 893.36] manager you can go get libraries for crypto game uh game drivers um image processors you name it |
[893.36 --> 899.74] there's i think over 880 packages in our package repo right now we also ship uh an editor and |
[899.74 --> 905.94] plugins for other editors like sublime and webstorm and eclipse uh and then we have of course a dart to |
[905.94 --> 912.80] js compiler and we also have a great static analyzer which is speaks to that uh productivity aspect of dart |
[912.80 --> 921.12] where because dart is static and toolable i can run programs that tell me where i have warnings and errors |
[921.12 --> 926.66] before i run the program and that's such a huge productivity win so it's i really think of dart as a |
[926.66 --> 933.30] as a platform on which i can build so it's interesting because we actually had uh rob pike and andrew geron on |
[933.30 --> 940.44] the show to talk about goo or goo that's funny talk about go a while back but uh it feels kind of like |
[940.44 --> 946.94] you are taking the same like approach to dart as you as they are with go and that you know tooling and |
[946.94 --> 952.62] like productivity is a is a major major part of it it's not just a language that's you know that |
[952.62 --> 957.14] that's it's right it's not just the syntax that compiles the javascript it's its own language with |
[957.14 --> 963.54] its improved semantics uh better developer productivity and very toolable but i think the |
[963.54 --> 969.50] there are certainly big differences between uh go and dart yeah one thing i would like to highlight |
[969.50 --> 974.08] is that we have been very conservative when designing the language so if you have a background |
[974.08 --> 982.48] in java or c sharp or javascript it should be very easy to start being productive in dart i would say |
[982.48 --> 988.60] in a few hours you can probably understand most of the semantics of dart and that has been a goal |
[988.60 --> 995.24] from the beginning so that we can easily get programmers to be productive in our system yeah |
[995.24 --> 1003.72] so talking about uh a little bit about the community of dart here the is it similar as go |
[1003.72 --> 1008.42] where like it's an open language and that the kind of the whole world can see the changes that are made |
[1008.42 --> 1012.74] but you're you're hesitant to accept changes from the outside world as of right now anyway |
[1012.74 --> 1020.74] or on the contrary we want all the changes we can get so the so everything that relates to dart |
[1020.74 --> 1028.34] is out in the open uh even from day one uh all our chains let's go directly to the outside and and |
[1028.34 --> 1036.58] we are getting patches in from uh from external developers and we encourage that a lot it's of |
[1036.58 --> 1044.82] course clear it's clear that for some uh corner cases of the the advanced compiler not many people |
[1044.82 --> 1050.60] contribute uh but uh in in more light areas uh we get a lot of contribution uh especially when it |
[1050.60 --> 1057.28] comes to packages and and so on but on that note the language itself is now in the ecma |
[1057.28 --> 1064.48] spec uh process in fact there was some really good news there with the ecma group tc52 has been |
[1064.48 --> 1070.40] meeting to discuss the dart language spec itself and it looks great and it looks on track so what does |
[1070.40 --> 1073.98] that mean for dart when when if dart becomes standardized what does that what does that |
[1073.98 --> 1078.40] mean how does that change the game it basically means that there's an official process how the |
[1078.40 --> 1085.44] language is going to change in the future so we inside google cannot just decide um to change it |
[1085.44 --> 1091.08] and i think that's really important if we want to have other companies or organizations implement |
[1091.08 --> 1097.32] another version of the vm because then they can join the committee and make sure they have an |
[1097.32 --> 1103.80] influence in how the language is going to change in the future do you think that there's it's double |
[1103.80 --> 1108.96] yeah it's double important too when you're talking about building web languages and things that need |
[1108.96 --> 1115.10] to live in the open like the web ecosystem does so i think a lot of developers are just look for that |
[1115.10 --> 1121.22] to make sure that they can trust this is something that has legs and longevity let's pause the show |
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