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**Dan Mangum:** Absolutely. |
**Break:** \[48:14\] |
**Gerhard Lazu:** So I know, David, that this is your first KubeCon, and I am very curious to hear what was it was like for you. |
**David Ansari:** It was very interesting. I really enjoyed the hybrid format of this KubeCon, because unfortunately I couldn't be there in person. I would like to go there in person, but unfortunately there was still a travel ban for most of Europeans... So it was still very interesting to participate virtually, and t... |
**Gerhard Lazu:** Okay. Did you slack? How did you reach out to people? Zoom? How did that work for you? |
**David Ansari:** Yeah, so mainly over the MeetingPlay platform. When I was attending a talk, I could just ask my questions and they got live-answered; so that was a nice experience. There was the possibility to reach out via Slack, but I didn't use Slack too much. |
**Gerhard Lazu:** What about Zoom? Were there any Zoom sessions that you attended? I know that Priyanka used to do happy hour... I don't know whether she did this KubeCon, but that was one of my favorite sessions at a previous KubeCon EU, which was also a virtual one. No Zoom sessions. |
**David Ansari:** To be honest, I missed all the Zoom sessions. I wasn't aware that those Zoom sessions existed. Did you attend some? |
**Gerhard Lazu:** Yeah. That's what I said - not this one; I attended the previous one, and that was actually my favorite part of the conference, so that KubeCon EU. This was -- I was going for a different experience. I was going more like talking to people like I'm talking to you... I attended a few talks, there were ... |
**David Ansari:** That's correct. |
**Gerhard Lazu:** How was that for you? Tell us about it. |
**David Ansari:** It was a lot of fun, and the experience was very good from start to end. I first applied (I think) a few months ago, directly after KubeCon Europe. I was actually listening to Ship It episode 2, where some tips were given on how to submit an abstract... So I submitted my abstract I think just two days... |
\[51:53\] There was very good content being given to the speakers on how to prepare, with checklists and deadlines, and the communication was very good from start to end. Especially Cody - he was answering very quickly, so that was nice. I pre-recorded the talk and I submitted it one month before the conference; that w... |
**Gerhard Lazu:** I attended the talk, I have to say, and I really enjoyed it, especially how quickly you're answering questions... And I think there is something very unique about pre-recorded talks. Maybe the interaction isn't -- obviously, it's not the way you would interact if you were giving it in-person and you h... |
**David Ansari:** Thank you very much. |
**Gerhard Lazu:** You're welcome. During the talk, what was it like when you could -- basically, you were attending your own talk, and also you were answering questions. What was that like? |
**David Ansari:** So the experience was very good, and I think the talk being pre-recorded has many advantages for both speaker, but also for the attendees. Because for the attendees it is just frictionless. They have a better experience. They can ask questions live when they don't understand something, and I can direc... |
And as you mentioned, you can just pre-record the videos, you have multiples tries, you can edit it if you want... And to be honest, I was even having some parts of the videos which I had to edit and pre-record five times, just because the demo didn't work, for example... And it just results in a better end version, wh... |
So the questions came in, and I could just answer them during the talk, and as the video was playing, I couldn't even pay attention to the video itself, because I was focusing on the Q&A part, and also the conversation thereafter was great. |
My problem was a bit that my video was 32 minutes, and I had 35 minutes in total, so just 3 minutes left for Q&A. That was a bit short. But you can always continue the conversation after the talk. |
**Gerhard Lazu:** So are you saying that you wish the talk was shorter, so that you would have had more time for Q&A? |
**David Ansari:** Yes. So if I had to do the talk again, I would shorten it by probably 3-4 more minutes, just to leave enough room for questions in the end... Because I think that's one of the most valuable parts of the talk, so that you have a vivid discussion. Because that's the most important part of a talk, the di... |
And you even see how advanced your users are... I was a bit surprised, because people that joined didn't even know what RabbitMQ is, which made me think that maybe I should have introduced RabbitMQ even better at the start of the talk. |
**Gerhard Lazu:** So I think the level at which the talk was was intermediate-experienced, I believe. It wasn't a beginner talk. I also think - you're right, making it shorter is great, because there's two rules. Don't give out all of the information. And I won't tell you the second rule. That's it. |
**David Ansari:** \[laughs\] I'm curious now... Do you hold it for the end? \[laughter\] |
**Gerhard Lazu:** \[56:09\] No, I mean - there's two rules, and you only say one, right? Like, don't give out all the information; that's it. \[laughs\] |
**David Ansari:** Okay, now I get it. Now I get it. |
**Gerhard Lazu:** Okay. \[laughs\] So the idea being that you want the audience -- I mean, that's basically what prompts the questions, right? If you tell them half the story... I mean, there's so much more than you could tell them, but what do THEY want to know? And then they come to you asking about questions that yo... |
I'm wondering if maybe had you maybe spent more time in Slack, you could have continued some of those conversations there. I don't know. But what I do know is that another talk which I attended, that was Liz Rice's talk on eBPF, in the talk the Q&A didn't work. We could ask questions, but she couldn't answer, and then ... |
So I think that's a good idea, to say "Hey, if you wanna know more, if you wanna talk o me, I'll be there. Leet's hang out. Again, it's just an idea. Who know if it works out until you try it. |
Okay, so what I'm hearing is that for first-speakers I think that having the talk prerecorded may be a better experience, because that's stage fright, being there for the first time, being overwhelmed by emotions, being overwhelmed by what's happening... There's too much stuff happening, right? Especially at a big conf... |
**David Ansari:** So as I started the talk, I was very relaxed, because I knew that everything was pre-recorded, so nothing could go really wrong. I know that it can be intimidating when you go on stage, because if you do a live demo for example, many things can go wrong. So the talk being pre-recorded is just much mor... |
**Gerhard Lazu:** So what are you thinking about the next KubeCon? Will you attend it in person, virtually, will you give a talk? Would you prefer to give a talk virtually, or would you like a pre-recorded one? Or do you prefer to give a talk in person? What are you thinking? |
**David Ansari:** So if I have the chance to go to a conference in person, I would go there in person, because it's really about meeting the people. For me, a conference has two sides. The first side is really learning something, hearing talks, and having technical conversations, and the second part is meeting people a... |
**Gerhard Lazu:** Are you thinking of giving a talk, or submitting one? |
**David Ansari:** I would like to. |
**Gerhard Lazu:** \[01:00:04.16\] So if the talk - let's imagine that it gets accepted. Are you thinking of giving it in-person, or pre-recording, as you have this time? |
**David Ansari:** The next time I would give it in person, just to also practice. |
**Gerhard Lazu:** Yeah. So what I'm looking up here - I just wanted to confirm because I sometimes get his name wrong. So there's this person that I admire when it comes to public speaking. His name is Matt Abrahams, and he gave a couple of talks about memorable communication, even wrote a book, a very good one - small... |
Cool... So what did you enjoy the most about this KubeCon? |
**David Ansari:** I enjoyed most that there were so many different tracks that I could choose from. The whole ecosystem is very wide. I think there were around 8, 9 or even 10 tracks in parallel. There was a lot of topics and talks to pick from, so that was a very good experience. |
**Gerhard Lazu:** So it was a variety. Yes, it is a big conference, you're right. It's one of the biggest ones I know, and it's just so diverse. I love the diversity of KubeCon. I'm not aware of any conference that gets diversity better... And I mean diversity from all perspectives. |
Any favorite talks, anything that stood out, that was memorable? ...because we spoke about memorable communication. |
**David Ansari:** I didn't watch -- |
**Gerhard Lazu:** There were too many. \[laughter\] |
**David Ansari:** So for me it was quite late, since I'm in Europe... So on Wednesday my talk started at 11:30, so before that I just watched one talk, to see how things are working with the platform, and after I was too tired to continue watching talks at 1 AM in the morning. The next day I was watching one which was ... |
**Gerhard Lazu:** You do know that all these talks - first of all, you can watch them on-demand, in the platform, before they become available on YouTube. So what I tend to do - and this KubeCon this is what I've done... While I haven't watched the talks as they happened, only a few, what I've done - I would go back to... |
**David Ansari:** What was the most valuable content to you? |
**Gerhard Lazu:** I really enjoyed eBPF, I have to say. Something like the whole eBPF ecosystem - super, super-interesting, Liz Rice's talk, "Cloud-native superpowers with eBPF." Because I just love the kernel, I just love that observability, understanding what's happening inside the kernel... That's the talk that real... |
\[01:03:59.03\] I didn't even know that there's actually an eBPF foundation. I learned about that at this conference. And yeah, it's just really interesting - networking, and the kernel, and performance and metrics, and that sort of thing. |
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