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Yeah, I married your cousin's brother's uncle or something like that. Do you, I mean, is that since, I mean do you have them every year? Uh, yeah, every year. And, uh, still, you wind up meeting people you, uh, you never knew you were related to. Let alone Yeah. And, Well, I think that is probably why our is probably so interesting is cause we don't have them that often Oh, yeah. and then when we do, and everyone finally does get together, it is like after the, you know, Okay, so you have eight children. Um, what type of things do you do as a family to spend time together. Oh, we spend a lot of time outdoors jogging, bicycling, uh, going to the park, um, some time watching V C R movies um, generally cheap things Uh-huh. Uh-huh.
Uh-huh. Yeah, we know how that goes. Uh, with lots of kids you don't have lots of money for recreation. That's right. Well, that's fun. So, um, let's see, uh, some of the things we do together as a family, we like to play games a lot, and you may think this is funny, but one of our funnest games we like to play together is hide and seek, and we just have a hoot playing hide and seek when it's dark in our house, Yeah. and that is so fun. The kids just get a crack out of that. Um, we like, we do like to go to the park, too you, uh, like your family. Um, we don't do a lot of vacationing. Have you taken a lot of vacations together or, Most of our vacations are to go and see Grandma and Grandpa. Uh-huh,
and We get an occasional one or two day thing Oh. but most of them are going and seeing Grandma and Grandpa. Oh, now where do they live? In Arizona. Oh, so that's a bit of a drive for you there. Yes. Oh, so you like to go there for the holidays and. Oh, we don't go very often for holidays. Generally we try to get all of our kids back home for the holidays and let Grandma and Grandpa come and visit us. Uh-huh. Oh, uh-huh. Uh, what are the ages of your kids then? They range from twenty-four to five. Oh, yeah. So you have some in the nest and some out, huh. That's right. How old are your children?
We have, ours start at twelve and then they go down to four. I think the hardest thing for us has been, is to find you know, leisure time activities that all of our kids can enjoy together with the age span that we have, you know, I bet, yeah. like the older kids love playing board games and that kind of thing Uh-huh. but the young kids don't understand it Yes, uh-huh. and so they get real frustrated when we try to do that, and. Yes, and then if you want to play something on the little kids' level, then the older kids get real bored, and they want to do something else. So. Yeah. Yeah, I can, I can relate to that.
Um, do you feel that the current trend in families spending time together is a positive one or a negative one? I think it's improving, actually. Uh-huh. We had an interesting experience the other day. We, we have pretty much a, a routine that we spend, we don't have our kids play with other kids on Sunday Uh-huh. and we just kind of keep them at home Uh-huh. and our next door neighbor, uh, we were at a soccer game Saturday, and our next door neighbor was there, and somebody came up and asked if their daughter could spend Saturday night at their house Uh-huh. and she said, no, Sunday's our family day Uh-huh and we keep our kids at home so we can spend time with them. That's good. And I think those kinds of things are happening a lot where we are right now. Oh, good.
I think it's gone to one extreme where the families were just running all different direction Uh-huh. and I think more people are interested in spending time with their kids now. I think so, and I feel like, you know, like President Bush, Bush has mentioned quite often, that we are trying to become a kinder and gentler nation, and it does begin with the families at home Yeah. and so I, I'm a firm believer in that, too. I think a lot of people are panicked, how kids are turning out and how things are going for kids and realizing they've got to start doing something. So. Yes, that's, that's true. Well, we see that a lot out here in Utah, and, um, hopefully, hopefully it's going to spread, huh. . Utah's a lot better than Texas. Oh. Um, do you have a lot of large families out there in Texas, or. Very few. Very few.
You feel like you're in the minority? Oh, definitely. When we tell people how many kids we have they look at us like we didn't have good sense. Oh, dear But, uh. Well, out here in Utah, five is about the the average, Average. yeah. My wife and I were in Utah until I guess we were about twenty-four. Oh. Uh-huh. Never been back, since then, but, We have kids up there now, Oh. so we get up occasionally. Oh. Oh, I have some relatives out there in Texas, in fact my mom's out there in Texas right now, in Dallas, spending a month with her cousins, on their ranch, and. Where, where in Dallas?
Well, uh, no, I'm trying, Aberdeen? Huh. Is, is that close to Dallas? I don't have any idea. I've never heard of it. Oh. Must be a little town. Don't you. It's, I guess it's out there, clear out. They have a ranch that has like five hundred acres, and, Yeah. Okay, Martin, do you do any exercise? Yes, I do. Uh, I like to, uh, play basketball and weight lifting. Those are probably the two main things I like to do. Uh-huh.
Um, so those are more or less indoor sports. How's the weather out there in Georgia? Yeah. Um, in, in, in the winter, you, typically it's, it's probably too cold to go out and do things like tennis. Um, I like to play tennis in the summer time or in the spring, fall, Uh-huh. but in the winter it gets pretty cold. Oh. Um, yeah, so it's mostly indoor sports, I think, in the winter. Uh-huh. Um, how about yourself? Well, yeah, I'm on a exercise program. I'm riding my Aerodyne bike, um half an hour every morning, Uh-huh. and I'm just about ready to up it to up to forty-five minutes a morning, and I feel like that's been a real nice exercise in the winter time. It's it's kind of kept me from getting cabin fever and, um, has seemed to be a real nice aerobic exercise. Uh-huh.
Right. Do you do, uh, any anaerobic type, weight lifting or weight training type exercise? No, huh-uh. I, first of all I'd like to get my weight off. I'm about fifty pounds overweight, and so I'd like to get the weight off, and then I'd really like to get into that. Uh-huh. And, uh, we have a, my husband and I have a, a, aerobic video that's called The Firm. I don't know if you've heard of it, but it's a, an aerobic video with, not necessarily bouncing around and jumping up and down, but you're using weights, and that is the most incredible aerobic workout I have ever done. It's it's really fun. Huh. Yes, it's, it's, it's it's similar to aerobics with weights Yes, uh-huh.
but it's like low impact aerobics, just with weights. Uh-huh. Yes. Okay, are you familiar with, um, step or bench aerobics? Um, no, I mean, yes, I am, but I have never done it myself. Have you done that? Uh, yes, I have. In, in Atlanta that's, um, most of the health clubs are all, Oh. that's the, that's the in thing. That's the big thing, huh? At first it was just regular aerobics, but now bench or step aerobics have kind of taken over. Oh.
So how is that? Um, it, they call it a low impact aerobics, and it's supposed to burn off more calories at the same time. Oh. And from when I've done it, it does give you a good, a real good workout. But only thing I'm concerned about is potential for injury to your knees you know, that and movement of going up on the step you know, that could create a problem. Oh. Uh-huh. Yeah. They, they seem to think that it, it won't, but you never know. Now, if, um, playing basketball, are you knees, do you have healthy knees? Yeah, I, I think my ankles probably are my main weak point. Oh, dear But, I've, I've kind of taken care of that. I wear high tops and then also an a support ankle brace which is very stiff Uh-huh. and, um, wearing that I haven't had any problems in the past year or so.
Oh, that's good. Well that sounds, you sound just like my husband. He he injured his ankle about seven months ago playing volleyball, Yeah. and, oh, he's just had a heck of a time getting that ankle healthy. Yeah, I. So that's what he does, he wears his, his brace and his high tops and, Uh-huh. Yeah, I did, I injured mine so many times that rehabilitating became quite easy. Oh. Oh, . I mean, it would only take three or four days and I could play again on it because after a while you just learn how to rehabilitate yourself to play that way. Wow Uh-huh. Oh, dear.
Oh. But, um, so how, how successful is your exercise video? It is amazing how fast you take off the inches Uh-huh. and I would, once I start my I'd like to do the forty-five minutes a day on the bike for a week, and then, every other day I'd like to incorporate the video, and then the bike on the other day. Uh-huh. But, it is really amazing how fast the inches come off, and the muscle builds real fast. Uh-huh. Um, you can start, they recommend doing the video without weights for the first month and then after that you can just start with your five pound dumbbells, and then build up to your, uh, twenty-five pound dumbbells Uh-huh. and then you're just doing repetitious exercises throughout the whole video and it's a hour long video, so. So it's a good workout. It is, yeah,
I really enjoy that, so I'm looking forward to losing this weight and being firm and healthy Uh-huh. So, in the winter, I guess, there's a lot of, it's quite cold and snow. Yes. Yes. Now this one has been quite mild. Um, we could have been out walking throughout the whole winter, because really we only had about three weeks of snow on the ground. It was quite chilly but not, Hello. I pressed the button one, so we're recording right now. I'm sorry That's okay. I'm Bill from Raleigh. Okay, and I'm Melanie from Harrisville, Utah. Oh, another one from a different state besides Texas.
Yeah. Um, okay, Bill, we're talking about family reunions. Right. Okay, um, have you ever had to plan a family reunion? Uh, yes and no, it wasn't really a a planning one, but it was kind of, uh, it was a birthday Oh. and I brought a lot of family together then. Uh-huh. And how did you feel it went? It went pretty good. I'm, I've worked in hotels, so I, I kind of know how to do these things. Oh. I used to, you know. All this planning and, and getting together and such.
Um, oh, let's see what else. Usually when we have kind of our family reunion it's my grandmother's birthday, and and it's all of like, she, she comes from a big family. Uh-huh. She has like seven sisters I think. Oh, boy They show up and all their kids. And then all, she has, uh, I have like, uh, let's see, she has four sons and two daughters, and they show up and all their kids, Uh-huh. so it's a pretty big reunion, it's about two hundred people, maybe. Oh, my word. Well, what did you find was most helpful in planning the birthday get together? Um, the, probably the biggest challenge was getting a place where everyone, you know, could eat comfortably and, and everything, uh. Uh-huh. I guess probably the most helpful thing was that, um, for the rent, we rented like a, a rescue squad building or something like that.
Oh. Uh-huh. And, uh, each one of the, everybody that showed up donated some money for the rent and for, for like soft drinks and and so nobody like really got stuck with the bill. Oh. Oh, that's good. And each person in the family, you know, brought a dish, or something. Uh-huh, and then did you have a main meal, or did everyone just bring, it was just pot luck. It was kind of pot luck. Uh-huh. You know, everybody brought their specialties, I guess you would say. Yeah, yeah, show off a little bit Yeah. And of course my grandmother's food was, as always, gone first because she's such a great cook. Oh.
Oh. Now how old is she? Uh, she's eighty-six. Oh, goodness. Is she pretty spry, is she, you know, pretty. Now she does, she looks probably like she's in her early sixties Oh, wow. and if she didn't have arthritis, she'd get around better than me as a matter of fact Uh-huh. Oh. Oh, that's neat, that she's in good health, and that, at that age. Yeah. Oh, yeah. My nickname for her is Honey Woman. That's what I call her. Really. Well that sounds fun. Well, I I had a real challenge of planning a family reunion a few years ago, and there were,
we sent out five hundred, uh, announcements, because our family is quite large, like your, your family there. And so that was a real challenge, and I was president of our family reunion for two years, and I wasn't very at that duty, for two years in a row, but I found that advance planning was the key to success. Uh, also one thing that's helpful, and I don't know if your family's spread out or whatever Uh-huh. but most of, all my family lives like in the same county so Oh, that's wonderful, though But it's just kind of like get on the telephone and, it's so and such days from such and such date Oh. and everybody just shows up. Oh, well, that is, that is helpful. Yeah, our family ranges from, oh, goodness, well, Australia, I have a brother lives in Australia, to, uh, Boise, Idaho, and, and, uh, all kinds of places. I would say you're spread out, then.
We are Uh, my immediate family, you know, my, my parents and my brothers and sisters, I guess we're the ones that have the gypsy blood or whatever, because my dad was in the Army and we're we're pretty strung out all over. Oh. But since they've moved back to Carolinas, we still are the only ones do not live in in Yantsen County. In. Oh. I live in Raleigh, and then my, my parents live in Greenville, and I have one brother and his wife live in Greenville, and, uh, another brother that lives in, outside of Fayetteville. Uh-huh. So I mean, we're, we're spread out, but everybody else is centralized in, in, my home town, Waynesboro Boy. so. Oh, my gosh. Nobody moves away except us They must really like it there. Yeah,
I got out as soon as I graduated. Yeah. Oh. Just like this town is too small for me, Good-bye. Oh, you're ready to move on to How do you feel about gun control? Well, uh, I mean I don't think that guns should be outlawed Um. but it's going to, a lot of the stuff that, I mean all you do is to get guns and then like with the stuff of that massacre in Killeen, Texas not too long ago, But I don't really know, I mean, unless they do, uh, just outlaw them, how you can, uh, prevent that. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Well, don't you think that you know, just having, you know, some, you know almost like a driver's license be required you know with stiff penalties if you are found with, with you know a gun that is not registered or you know that you are not licensed to carry. Yeah, that, well do you even know what the procedures are now? Um. There is no national,
But, it's kind of like if you want a gun you can get a gun, especially if you have the money to pay for it. Uh, in most States as long as you aren't a convicted felon. You know or on probation or, uh, you know, other obvious things like that. Yeah. Uh, and I know, I know that like in a lot of states you could, you could be just like released from a mental hospital the day before. You know, be, be obviously insane, and then, you, you know but have your legal right to get a gun. Huh. I didn't know that. Well, that's pretty scary. So, does, now do they want us to say where we feel about it, like in rating it one to ten. Uh, yeah, I'd probably, I'd probably say about a five. That's where I would probably be Seems like it's a good safe number to pick, you know. Well, I mean, I mean I don't really know what they can, how they can really enforce the laws any better Uh-huh because I mean I do think that some people need them and, like, for protection and stuff Uh-huh. and I can understand them wanting to have them, but then again it's just like all those nuts out there. Well, you know, uh, uh, if you are looking at like you know country that, uh, where they do have a lot more gun control, like England and places like that, you know
the amount of violent crime has decreased by so much. It has? Because then, Well I mean yeah. The, uh, the in comparing per capita murders are incredibly lower than the United States. Um. Uh, you know, I mean, the problem though, you know, they, if the, since the United States had this, you know, pretty much unrestricted flow of guns going for so long that I think, you know, if you were introduced, you know, any controls, it would probably take a long while for them to take effect just because there is a glut of guns out there already. Yeah. You know, so it's, it's really kind of a complex problem. Well, is the crime that bad there in Atlanta? Uh, I'm not really sure how bad it is. I've, I've not really had that many problems with it, but I mean apparently we, we were ranked pretty high up. Yeah I know Dallas is. Uh. I mean, I think, you know, in the I mean I think we have been like ranked in one of the top three for murders in the last few years. I don't know if Dallas is in the top three Uh-huh.
but. Do you own a gun? No. I've thought about getting one. If I get one, I think I will probably, you know, get something. I probably wouldn't get a hand gun. I would probably get like a shotgun. Just for protecting myself. You know, from burglar type thing. Uh-huh. I do kind of live in the downtown area. Yeah. You know and shotguns are really good because they're, I mean somebody is not going to break in, steal it, and you know, use it to mug someone, you know. That's true. Uh, and you know, you, yeah, I just don't understand these people, you know, like when they, they decide they're going to buy a gun to protect themselves. They go out and buy a three fifty seven magnum which is going to shoot through you know, they are probably going to miss the person and, and they're going to shoot through five wall, and hit someone, you know. I mean a shotgun just really struck me as being you know a real good defensive weapon.
You can sort of point it somewhere in the direction of you know whoever. Yeah. You pretty much stop them. And, you don't, then the actual shot doesn't go that far, you know, a wall will stop it pretty much. and, uh, my Dad gave me a gun Uh-huh. but I never did go out and practice with it enough to feel comfortable with it Uh-huh. so I finally ended up giving it back to him. I said I don't want it. I don't want to be responsible for it because you know if you're not going to teach me how to do it and if I am not going to, you know, be responsible enough to go out and learn, I don't need it. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Yeah, that, that really does scare me. People, you know, that have guns because you know, if you ever get in the situation where you know you are not prepared to shoot, but you pick up the gun and point it at the person that, that person rushes you. Yeah. And they get it from you.
And you know, you're pretty much dead you know. Because you, you've just told the person that you, you're about to kill them then, You know Uh-huh. Set them off. and, and, well I mean, you, you basically made it clear to the person that you know unless he, unless, you know that you are a real danger to them and then you know if you, if they manage to get the gun from you, you know their first reaction is going to be you know, stop you. Yeah, well that's why I ended up giving it back to him. I thought well you know. I don't want it if I don't know how to you know, if I don't really know how to use it Uh-huh. Uh-huh. and I just didn't want the responsibility. Um. So. Well, uh, did you hear about that Killeen massacre or whatever? Yeah, the, did it happen at a cafeteria or something? Yeah, right. That kind of I mean it just makes you wonder how people get guns. Uh-huh. I would be scared selling guns to people.
So, Julie, how do you feel about AIDS research? I think we need, we definitely need more of it, definitely. I'd agree, too, but, I mean, it seems like it just makes economic sense in that, you know, uh, you know, it would have made even better economic sense to, to, to have had a lot more research than a longer ago. Oh, yeah, yeah, for certain. You know, because, you know, because, uh, the country's going to wind up paying for the treatment of patients. Exactly. Uh-huh. Exactly. Does, does like, do health insurance policies, like, for companies and things, do they cover diseases like that? I think they cover AIDS, but what they do is, uh, if, you know, you apply for, for to get a, a insurance policy they'll, uh, check to see if you're H I V positive Uh-huh. and if you are, not only will they not give you, uh, a policy, but they'll, uh, they have like, there's like, you know, a database of people that have tested positive, so you'll never be able to get insurance ever again.
Um, well, that's, but that's why they should have started doing stuff before. I mean, still, you know, since it's dormant for such a long time, there's still probably a lot of people, you know, before the tests ever really came out who are, who are draining a lot of money right now. You know, Yeah. I think a lot of it was, was just that, you know, because of, of the, you know, because, because the majority of the high risk groups were people no one really cared about. Right. Right. That, Right, and all these God-fearing people were like, well, you know God is trying to kill off all the et cetera, et cetera . Uh-huh. Uh-huh, yeah, uh, yeah, one, one, one one humorous retort I heard, heard someone, you know, who claimed that, you know, AIDS was, you know, God's punishment was that, then lesbians must be God's chosen people. Uh. Yeah. But, uh, Boy, that's a good one. So, uh,
Yes? Uh, do you think, you mean, do you actually think we're doing enough right now to, No, I really don't. I did, I did like a research kind of thing on AIDS research and stuff, and, uh, really we're not doing much at all, I mean, most of what gets raised, I mean, it's not really federal movement, most of what gets raised, gets raised by, uh, uh, you know, conscious, yeah, communities and things like that, you know. Private organizations. Uh-huh. Like, uh, San Francisco has a, a real, uh, strong AIDS support group and all that kind of stuff and and, uh, get, they get donations from the community, you know, they're real, And from corporations around the, around the city, you know, for AIDS research and that kind of thing Uh-huh. Uh-huh. and, uh, I think there needs to be more of that sort of on a federal level, you know, rather than just in the places where it's, you know, where it's predominated so far, because it's, you know it's bound to spread Uh-huh. I mean, it seems that, you know, it's just, you know, of, it's just going to reach a steady, a steady state a let, a lot, lot higher point than it will if we, you know, we'd nip it in the bud to quote Barney Fife. Right Yeah. I don't know, I don't know,
I, I, I don't know what the likelihood of that is, but, I mean, you know, people really waking up. Uh-huh. Especially with the ultra conservatives move our, our political system sort of seems to be taking. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. I would probably agree with that. Yeah so, Uh, so do, do you think it's more important to spend money on research or for support of, uh, people? God, that's a good question, Fish. I don't know, uh, I think, I think one of the main things that's really important to spend money on is education, not support or, or, research per se, but, but education because a lot of people sort of get drummed out of the work place and out of society, you know, kind of like lepers would you know Uh-huh. Uh-huh. and it's really, it's really not necessary, uh, until, until the, disease reaches its final stage, you know, becomes really infectious Uh-huh. and, uh, I think that would be the most effective support they could get is for other people to understand, you know, try to understand what they're going through and everything and try to understand that they're not, you know, they don't, they don't have to be just completely cut off from, from the community Uh-huh
Uh-huh. and that, and, uh, I don't know, I guess I think that, that, uh, research is, I guess the most important, just because I, you know, it, it really needs to come to an end. You know. Uh-huh. I don't know. I don't know, Fish. What do you think about that subject? I think it's, I think it stands a really interesting question of, uh, Well what do you feel about the, um, present situation in the Mideast? Well, it looks like it's just about as volatile as it usually is. Uh-huh. What do you think, Mark? Yeah, I agree. I think, I think there's definitely been some changes, um, and I think you know, the, the, um, end of the Soviet Union will definitely have its effect on, on the situation. Oh, yeah. Um, you know, in that there's, there's not, you there, you know, you know, basically since the end of World War two there was always, you know, that little proxy war going on. You know, with, um, the U S funding Israel and, and the, um, Soviet Union funding the Arab countries. Uh-huh.
And then we'll see what happens when, uh, they're not funded quite as much. Or supplied with arms the same way. Yeah. Uh-huh. Yeah, but on the same token, you know, Israel has lost a lot of their, you know, value to the U S in being, you know, the foothold of capitalism. You know in, in the Mideast. Uh-huh. Well, I, we tend to be pretty strong supporters of Israel ourselves, Uh-huh. you know, we kind of cringe when they make mistakes but yet overall tend to support them. Uh-huh. But, I think one of the most interesting things to me recently was, you know, during the war, uh, in, uh, Kuwait was, uh, the fact that they did not retaliate, for the, uh, scud missiles that were, uh, launched there. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. That just seemed to me to be a, uh, a phenomenal, uh, demonstration of restraint, and it must have reflected, uh, uh, some awful good, uh, diplomacy on the part of the U S. Uh-huh. Yeah, but on the other hand, you know, if they would have had a hard time retaliating because the, you know, they, they wouldn't have been given access to the friend or foe codes. I see. They basically would have, you know, had a, had a they had, they would have had, had to fly through, you know, two enemies.
Oh, you don't think they got the codes from the U S already? The U S would claim that they would have not given them to them. I see. I mean, of course, you know, public statements can be taken for, That's true. They can, yet they, Uh-huh. Yeah. Well what do what about this situation with the, you know, the, uh, continual, uh, harassment by Iraq right now and, uh, apparently failing to let the, uh, arms inspectors have free access. Uh-huh. You know, well, to begin with, you know, I pretty much question or what, what the U S motives were in, uh, in, in actually the original involvement. Uh-huh. Uh, I, the cynical side of me says that, you know, it was more for, uh, the, the domestic political situation than for anything else. You know, and that, you know, and for portraying Bush is a strong President. Huh, yeah, okay. Sure. Uh, I mean I really, I really think that, that, my gut feeling is that, that, you know, he pretty much picked, picked the fight with, uh, with, um, Hussein.
Uh-huh. I mean I'm not, not saying at all that Hussein wasn't quite willing to enter that fight. Right. But, you know, I think, I think that, that, um, we chose to have our official feelings hurt. Uh-huh. Where a lot Well, do you think that, uh, we should ignore it and just allowed him to go ahead and, uh, you know, move on into Kuwait and see what happens? I think, I mean I thought, I think that, um, in the past we've allowed lots of things like that to happen. Uh-huh. And I, I really don't, I really don't think that, I think, I think it was, it was, there were, there were a lot more demographic related interests involved than true foreign policy interests. Right. Um, Yeah, well may have been. You know, I'm not saying that that's not the case. Uh, Yeah. And I mean in, in, in along this line since, since, you know it, it really, it really didn't accomplish very much except we're getting, getting, uh, the Iraqis out of Kuwait. Right. I just don't, I just don't, I, I, I I, I, I don't foresee Bush making the decision to invest a lot of manpower and money and, you know, in, in fighting a second battle.
No. Um, you know, over, over the, uh, over, over what, what probably won't accomplish him, accomplish much for him politically. No, it doesn't look like we're getting ready to do, to do much more in there. Uh-huh. Even at this point. Uh-huh. Yeah. Well what about, uh, do you have any, any views on, uh, Israel's relation to the U S? Do you, think we ought to, you know, back off on our support of the country or what do Well, I have, I have very fixed feelings about Israel. Um, I think that, that for a long while we've, we've had almost a, you know, Uh, anyway, we're supposed to talk about recycling. Basically, what, what your personal opinion is on it. Uh, this is, this is really for a speech research project they're doing so, uh, I don't know. Florida is pretty good about recycling isn't it? Well, they just kicked it off down here in, in Sarasota county. Oh, they did?
Uh, they had been doing it, they started first in Sarasota City. Uh, you know, which makes up a pretty small portion of the county actually. Uh-huh. Yeah. And, uh, they've got these, I don't know what, if you're familiar with Sarasota county at all. Not quite, no. They've got these, it's, it's county wide program now. Uh-huh. And what they've done is they've broken everything down into garbage. Uh, yard trash. Plastic, cans and glass. And then, uh, paper. Uh-huh. Okay. Okay. Which, in the paper, it's just, uh, newspaper and corrugated cardboard. Is the only thing you're supposed to put in there. Yeah. Okay. No slicks. Uh, Oh, that's, that's good. Let me ask you this.
Do they require you to presort it? Yeah. Okay. See that's something in Minneapolis they're really strict on. In terms of you got to put everything in its own little bag and really presort it really, you know, tightly. But when I lived in Orlando, it's like you could put almost anything in there Uh-huh. and they'd just sort it out for you Yeah. Yeah . It was really pretty good if you're lazy like I am, so. Yeah, right. Well, you know, uh, I talked to this girl who, uh, she's a, an an acquaintance of mine and, and she's involved with, uh, oh, what is the name of that company. It's not Amway but it's the other big vitamin company? Shaklee.
Oh, okay, yeah. Okay. And, uh, and, and she's just Shaklee crazy, you know, because it's her business and everything. And, uh, you know, and she asked, we were talking one day and, and she asked me a couple of questions, you know. And she, and, and what she said that, that generally, the problems that people have with being environmentally conscious is number one, they don't want it to change their lifestyle and, and like, you know, especially make it anymore complicated or any extra work or anything. Yeah. Which that's, that's what recycling at home sorting does, you know. Right. I mean it's a little extra work. Uh-huh. And, uh, it can actually turn out to be a lot of extra work because what they do, what they do here in Sarasota county is they've got, It can, yeah. okay, you put your garbage in a garbage bag and you set it out by the curb. Right.
If you have yard trash, you put your yard trash in some kind of container. Uh, or you can have bundles up to a certain weight, and certain dimensions, tie them up and put them by the curb. Yeah, you got to tie them up and everything. Well, the plastic, cans and glass, they give you this little tub and it's about a foot and a half deep and it's about one by one and a half foot wide and long. Right. This is a little container. Uh-huh. And then they have another one the same size. That one's red. Then they have a blue one the same size for the paper goods. Uh-huh. And, so, like, you know, you would have to rinse out your pop cans. Otherwise you got bees and ants and you know, and, and if you've got, uh, food containers or anything like that, it's a big problem. Exactly. It is, you know, a big hassle. So not only do you
yeah. Yeah, that's true. I mean, up here, they give you one, one of those containers and you put everything in it. Uh-huh. So it's like, if, if you use a lot of stuff, you, it's like well you know, if you're a partying kind of guy and you drink, you know, like a couple of twelve packs, maybe, over the weekend it's going to be hard pressed to to put all your recyclables in that one place, you know. Uh-huh. This is true. So it's kind of a pain in the butt. This is true. But, uh, I don't know. That's definitely one thing they could do to make it easier is to just, you know. You have, have those garbage people that make, how every many, make twenty, thirty bucks an hour, have them do a little bit of the sorting. You know. And, and maybe come up with a better system. Uh-huh. Make it a little more convenient. But, Yeah,
they've got these large garbage cans that you can rent from the waste management company here. Uh, if you want to have a nice garbage can, you know. Yeah. And it's on wheels and it's big. Oh, you can actually rent those? Yeah. Okay. That's interesting. Yeah Yeah up here the, the city provides them. Kind of like, I think in, I think in the city they do but out here in the county you have to rent them. Oh, okay . And they just add it on to your water bill or something. So where exactly are you in terms of, of, like, Sarasota? Are you north of Sarasota or, East, East of Sarasota. okay.
Uh-huh. And Sarasota is on the west coast? Yeah. Okay. Like south of Tampa, right? Yeah. Okay. I'm, Yeah. About an hour. About an hour south of Tampa Yeah, that's, Okay. Uh, yeah, well. I listen to this talk radio station down here and it's really, they, I don't if you ever listen to talk radio but those guys, they just kind of get into, to stewing up trouble, you know. With the callers and things like that. Um, occasionally.
Yeah. But they get into some really good conversations sometimes, you know. And some of it, sometimes it's serious and they have some good feedback and all that stuff and from listening to that, I kind of got an idea that I thought would be good with Yeah. and this kind of fits into the, uh, the aid program, the welfare program that's going on right now. Uh-huh. And it's like, uh, So, uh, what things do you consider an invasion of privacy? Ooh, well I don't know. What do you think? Oh, I don't know. I had a little bit more time to think about it. I was thinking of, like, uh, I don't know, I was started to think about all the big, you know, data bases they have with all the information about you on them like the credit reports and all those, you know, demographics studies that they do that, um, you know, have, who knows, how much, you know, stuff about all the purchases that you've made and everything kept tract somewhere Uh-huh, uh-huh.
and I don't know, I don't know how much the stuff actually, what they actually have in there but I know they use that, I mean they sell those, Huh. Well what about, uh, required drug testing, uh, as a, uh, condition of employment? Yeah, that was, that, that was the other one I was thinking of I think that's, uh, I mean I know drugs are illegal. It thing actually. Uh, I, uh, have worked at Texas Instruments. Huh. Uh-huh. And, uh, they instituted a drug policy there. Drug testing policy where they randomly would test, uh, employees Uh-huh. and actually, to tell you the truth, I really did not think much about it. I, I hadn't, you know, it really didn't relate to me. But there were some things that people brought up like well what happens if they, they get a false positive, you know, what recourse do you have. Uh-huh. And, also, uh, uh, this is against the law for the government to do this kind of thing, this kind of big brother activity
and yet, uh, a lot of these large corporations such as Texas Instruments, although they don't admit to it, it's actually, oh, a drug testing policy comes about as a result of government pressure. Uh-huh. So what that means is, to me, that really it's the government that's requiring this, although they don't actually execute it themselves, it's really the government that . So, in that sense, it, at least, philosophically, it's really borderline legal. Uh-huh. Well I, I think the, I think that, you know, a person's competence should be more determined by, you know, their actions and their behavior and if they're, you know, if they're on some kind of, you know, controlled substance then, you know, it kinds of takes away from the job of, you know, the supervisor or manager type person, you know, who is able to evaluate them. I think they should be evaluated that way rather than with a, you know, a chemical, you know, Well, what about this, uh, AIDS epidemic now? Where you find that, uh, uh, you know, certain people are actually are, are criminal in their disregard for others. These people that are carriers and don't that don't reveal it? Yeah, and and, uh, of course, the ultimate solution is to operate on their brain so that it doesn't, it, uh, it destroys their libido. Yeah, that would be kind of an extreme. Now, uh, you know if they ever, I mean I've heard of things like, you know, making them, you know, marking them somehow or, you know, or something like that or, you know, putting them all someplace like in a kind of, So what about that as an invasion of privacy? Yeah.
I guess it kind of borders on where, I mean what do you value more. The invasion of, uh, the person's privacy or the possible danger to, you know, other people. So really, it gets to balancing, uh, personal freedom against, uh, the general welfare of society. Yeah. I guess that's that's been the big role of government, I guess I mean generally. Well, it, it's supposed to have been. Yeah Yeah. Well, that's kind of a difficult one to go into. I mean that, that particular case. No, it , Because I mean, there's a lot of people that, uh, I mean they could require, you know, obligatory AIDS testing for everyone because I'm, you know, there's a huge part of the population, not a huge part but a, you know A growing part. the AIDS population I guess that have it, that don't know they do are spreading it. Uh-huh. But, again, to require, you know, such a test and and then to make, make it is to subject them to, to discriminatory practices and other things. I don't know, uh, I don't know how exactly I feel about that.
Maybe chop their weenies off. Yeah. I guess, uh, uh, it's an easy one for me. I think that's, uh, there's something seriously wrong, yeah. What is it that you are, you know, particularly upset about? Uh, I guess, uh, I think they've lost their compass and, uh, I'm not sure they know exactly what, uh, uh, public education supposed to be for anymore. But, uh, I voted with my feet and, uh, my kids go to parochial school. Uh-huh. So, uh, What do you feel that your kids are getting in the parochial schools that they wouldn't get in a, the public school system? Well, one hundred percent of the, uh, customers care. That's one thing. Everybody cares about the education the kids are getting. And, uh, they, uh, take an active, relatively active part. Which, uh, I mean if you're, uh, sending two thousand dollars that way every year, you, uh, watch what goes on and you, uh, uh, pay attention and participate and, and you can influence the way things are. So you're saying that the taxpayer who also is really paying through the pocketbook for the education of the child may not be quite so conscious of the fact that they are paying the tuition for that child in the form of, uh, real estate or other taxes
and, and, consequently, they're not so motivated to get involved and make sure things happen the way they'd like to see them happen? Yeah. The immediacy just isn't there. Uh-huh. And, uh, uh, I also think that one of the problems and, actually, I don't think this, I think this is a cultural problem. The, uh, problem with public education is really, uh, really a problem with the culture. And, I guess my evidence for that is the school districts in places like California, for example, where only a minority of the taxpayers have children in school and you can't get a tax levy passed. Uh, people are, uh, reluctant to pass, uh, school tax levies even, uh, when the money is needed or would be well spent because it's, uh, they don't have kids in the schools. Right. I think that's a, a loss of civic virtue and a loss of, uh, uh, the cultural attitude that we used to have that education was first even if it wasn't our kids. I think that's, uh, that's the principal problem is that, uh, people no longer see it as, uh, as their problem and there's an immediate problem. Right. It troubles me too that the priority seems to be with my particular purse strings rather than the public good and by definition, for some of us, at least, the public good includes having an educated populace and then idea that, uh, you can make a sound judgment with respect to small votes in the, at the local level or bigger votes at the national level. Right. Yeah. Uh, it means that you've got to be informed
and you've got to have a certain level of education to do the reading and the critical thinking involved to come up with a decision. Yeah. You know, I, I believe that the original idea of public education in the United States, which I guess was controversial at the time of the constitution. Uh, you know, it barely made it. I think it was added afterwards I think the real, the principal was, uh, education for civic participation. Right. The idea was that everybody should have an education so that they would be a better voter and you couldn't pull the wool over their eyes. Right. It has taken on a more profound, and you'd think we'd notice it, economic uh, thrust. Yeah. Well, that's exactly what I was going to say. Now there seem to be really three reasons for education. One is education for civic duty. One is education for economic reasons. And one is education for civilization. I mean and I think that one, Well I'm glad that you added that one.
Yeah, I think that one's significant. That's what I used to think education was all about when I was a college professor and then I quit and got disabused of that notion But, uh, the, uh, uh, now the only thing people seem to agree on is that education is, uh, an economic enterprise to train people for jobs. And, uh, I'm not sure that people in the education establishment really know what their purpose is. And I'm really sad to say this, I never thought I would have but I really think that, uh, the educational establishment has become part of the problem. And, uh, that's why I guess I'm sort of, reluctantly, uh, in favor of these, uh, choice programs. Right. Well I, I agree with everything that you've said so far and the only that I'd want to add is that I'm a little more in contact, I think, with public school teachers than perhaps you are, uh, except as a parent of your child and the sense that I get from public school teachers that I know is that they are very conscious of what they feel they should be doing and they are the three things that you mentioned. But they find that they are also being asked to do a bunch of other stuff which they think is only tangentially related Right. That's what, like consumer, kids too?
Yeah . Oh, you laugh. How many, what ages? Well, twenty-seven up. Uh. And we had five. You've been through the fun part Oh, yeah. And how about yourself? I have a four and a half and a three. Oh. well. So. It's, I, I'm sure there's a lot of differences in the way, in the way it's done now and then. Yeah. Well, when mine were growing up, I did some traveling and but not that extensively but I always just made it a point, you know, to spend about ten minutes with each one of them. Yeah. So it was an hour, you know.
Yeah. But whether it was going back and laying in bed with them and just shooting the breeze or whatever, telling them stories or reading to them. What was the age difference between the youngest and the oldest? Six years. So they were all real close? Yeah. That's tough. That's a lot of time. Oh, yeah. We look back and wonder how we did it. Did you both work? Your wife too? No, she never did. Uh, well, qualify that. She worked at home, I'm sure Well, yeah, yeah. But that's, uh, well both my husband and I work and sometimes I feel like, you know, by the time I pick them up and get them home and get them fed, I have very little time each evening.
Yeah. Maybe thirty minutes max. Well that's plenty though. And well he spends a lot of time with them while I'm cooking and then I spend time with them while, you know, he's doing other stuff. And, and, of course, we try to spend a lot of time on the weekend. You know, there's a lot of times my house may not be as clean as I particularly like it but it's neat, it's straight and I can live with it because I do stuff with my kids, you know. Yeah. Right. Well, you know, with kids you're not going to have a neat house. Well, I've accepted that too And, you know it, it's tough to find time. especially with both of them working. That's true. It is. Yeah. That's true. And you just have to set the time and say, okay this is going to be it.
Well, that's true and, and we do a lot of that on the weekends, you know. We try to spend Saturdays together. Right. If my husband golfs, you know, he'll do it during nap time, things like that where they're not really missing the presence, you know. Right. And, and we do a lot of family things together. We're, we're kind of going the other direction this weekend. We're planning a trip, just he and I. This is the first time we've gone anywhere without the kids since she was born four and a half years ago. Well that's good too. Yeah, that's good that way too Well, I decided that, you know, you need that once in awhile. That you, you need to plan the quality time and, and I do think that if you plan it and spend that and make it quality time you don't have to be there twenty-four hours a day. Yeah. Well, that, they say it, it, all it takes is about five, ten minutes a day. Yeah. And, you know, and as the kids got older I made them, you know, help me cut the grass and kind of made that a project too. Or whatever Sure.
Sure. and, And they think that's a family activity, you know. Oh, yeah. Yeah. That's great fun And, uh, well, yeah, if, My daughter's like, Mommy can I help you with the laundry? Of course, you can Yeah. Just keep them talking that way. Absolutely. Yeah But, uh, another thing we used to do is have family councils. Every Sunday night. Uh-huh. And what would you do, what? Discuss everything that didn't agree with them. And we'd take turns being president.
Oh. And everyone would get one vote. And I always thought we'd get outvoted five to two Yeah. but it never worked that way. So they would just pick whatever issue kind of was at a head that week Yeah. Well and we could bring up and we could bring up stuff too. and then, Oh. And that was always good time. Boy, we really got to know the kids well. I imagine. And I imagine you still have a very close relationship with them. Oh, yeah. In fact, they were all in, uh, over the weekend for Easter. I, Oh, that's wonderful. See I was raised in that type of family where, you know, you don't disobey me, you mind me but if you have a problem with what we did or how we did it, you can always come back and talk to me about it.
Well, we did too. Yeah. And I remember the one daughter saying, we had a, a friend of hers that used to drive us up a tree Uh-huh. and she said, hey I don't make fun fun of your friends so why make fun of mine? Uh well. Kind of kind of hit us between the eyes. Yeah, yeah. You don't think of it that way do you No. But that, that was always good quality time for us. Now that's good. I like that idea. And then never attend, but if, if they missed it, they had to abide by the rules. Whatever was voted on, huh. Yeah and boy, they, they'd show up.
Well I think that's great. And we'd usually take notes Yeah. and, you know, the younger kids, uh, or maybe all of them needed help at one time or another. Yeah. And, uh, but they were usually tougher on themselves than they were on us. And they loved it. I, I think that's true. I can remember times my parents would say well what do you think would be a fair punishment. Yeah. And we would always come up with something that was harder than what they would have done you know. Yeah. So I do think it's right that they're harder on themselves, you know. Yeah. But, uh, boy, I, I feel for you and your husband. Oh, why is that? Well, my, my, uh, two of my, uh, So how do you feel about it? Uh, I, I don't see any problem with, with testing for random drugs. Yeah.
I, I, myself, almost, uh, am in favor of it. Uh, I work at Honeywell and I went through a, a pretty, I don't know, I went through a, standard drug testing thing before I, I was brought on. Uh-huh. I think that's pretty standard. At least at Honeywell it is. Uh, I think it's important to insure the quality and, and, uh, I don't know, almost the goodness of character. You know that kind of thing. Yeah. Where do you work? Uh, well I'm a graduate student right now at Carnegie Mellon. Oh, okay. Oh, okay. And I, I just came from Saint Paul. Uh, interviewing with Three M. Huh. Oh, great. And, uh, they have a policy for, uh, testing. If you, if they make you an offer, then they'll test you right before you start. Right. And I guess the only drawback I can see to, to drug testing is in, in case you are on some sort of medication that might give some, uh, sort of false positive result then there could be some sort of problem. Uh-huh.
Yeah. But Yeah. And that, that definitely happens, you know. I mean those, the drug tests, sure they're accurate but there's always that margin of error. Yeah. And that's, that's something to be aware of. Another thing is, a lot of times, you know, they aren't that accurate. They aren't that sensitive. Like if you're on a prescription drug of some kind, you know, what are they going to do about that Yeah You know, I was on a couple of different prescription drugs when I was tested for Honeywell and, uh, uh, you know, I know they didn't catch that or else they would have said something. Uh, I'm sure they screen for just a particular few types. Although the literature they give with you says yeah we do this and then they list about five thousand drugs they try to test for. Right. Uh, I don't know. What, what program are you in over at Carnegie Mellon?
Uh, electrical engineering. Oh, okay. Great. Uh, yeah, I'm a graduate student at U C F in Florida. University of Central Florida. Oh, wow . And this is actually a an internship up here. But, uh, they, uh, even for interns they, they do the whole random drug or the whole drug testing thing, so. They test you, uh, before they, before you start or before you even interview Right. or, Uh, they essentially, no I sure don't to someone talking to uh, they essentially, uh, they essentially, uh, made me the offer and then, and then, uh, did the drug testing thing after that. So, uh, it was one of those things where you go through the, the general battery of all their tests and, and then, they essentially give you the offer Uh-huh. and then at that point they'll, they'll ask you to go to a drug testing and things like that.
Oh. So, uh, there's some noise on this end. I'm actually in a mall calling so Oh You probably wondered, huh. But, Yeah. what happens if you were to fail? Then do they give you like one one more chance or two more chances? Yes. That's a good question. I believe from what I remember of the literature they gave, uh, if you fail I believe they give you one more chance. They probably give you a chance to explain yourself and then maybe give you another chance to go through it. Uh-huh. But, uh, you know, once again, those things are not that accurate so there's undoubtedly a proportion of people who do fail, you know. But, uh, are you working right now anywhere or,
Uh, no. Okay. I'm just about to finish my Master's in May and, uh just interviewing with companies right now. Oh, okay. Great. Yeah. That was the first time I'd ever gotten any kind of drug screening, you know. Was, was going to Honeywell. A friend of mine is also a doctoral student down there. Uh-huh. And he's doing an internship with I B M. Oh. And, uh, they, basically, uh, did the same exact thing. Uh, we both got our internships at the same time and we both had to go through drug testing at the same time. So, one of those things where we went through a kind of an identical process. But, uh, Did, do they test you at, right now, at work too? No, no. That's one thing they don't do is, is drug testing while you're on the job.
Okay. Uh, I think, I think the unwritten rule is, yeah, expect it but they don't do it. Oh You know, so. That's good I guess. I don't know. I mean, I, uh, I have gone to a couple of parties since, since that time and while I don't do any drugs myself, I've seen some people who work there, uh, you know, smoking a joint or whatever. Uh-huh. And, uh, you know, that's the kind of thing that would definitely come up, you know. But no, they don't, they don't really do that. So. Wow. Is it formal policy that they said they might test? Yeah Okay. Uh, first, um, I need to know, uh, how do you feel about, uh, about sending, uh, an elderly, uh, family member to a nursing home? Well, of course, it's, you know, it's one of the last few things in the world you'd ever want to do, you know. Unless it's just, you know, really, you know, and, uh, for their, uh, you know, for their own good. Yes.
Yeah. I'd be very very careful and, uh, you know, checking them out. Uh, our, had place my mother in a nursing home. She had a rather massive stroke about, uh, about uh, eight months ago I guess. Uh-huh. And, uh, we were, I was fortunate in that I was personally acquainted with the, uh, people who, uh, ran the nursing home in our little hometown. Yeah. So, I was very comfortable, you know, in doing it when it got to the point that we had to do it. But there's, well, I had an occasion for my mother-in-law who had fell and needed to be, you know, could not take care of herself anymore, was confined to a nursing home for a while that was really not a very good experience. Uh, it had to be done in a hurry. I mean, we didn't have, you know, like six months to check all of these places out. And it was really not, not very good, uh, deal. Yeah. We were not really happy with, nursing home that we finally had. Yeah. Fortunately, she only had to stay in a few weeks
and she was able to, to return to her apartment again. But it's really a big, uh, big, uh, decision as to, you know, when to do it. Yeah. You know, is there something else we could have done, you know, in checking out all the places that, uh, might be available. Of course, you know, there's not one on every corner, especially, you know, smaller areas, smaller towns. Yeah. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Yeah. Probably the hardest thing in, in my family, uh, my grandmother, she had to be put in a nursing home and, um, she had used the walker for, for quite some time, probably about six to nine months. And, um, she had a fall and, uh, finally, uh, she had Parkinson's disease, Oh. and it got so much that she could not take care of her house. Right. Then she lived in an apartment and, uh, that was even harder actually. Uh-huh. Uh-huh.
Because it was, you know, it was just a change of, change of location and it was very disturbing for her because she had been so used to traveling. Yes. I mean, she she had, she had children all across the United States Uh-huh and, you know, she spent nine months out of the year just visiting her children. Right. Uh-huh. And, um, that was pretty heart-rending for her. I can imagine. I think when she finally came to the realization that, you know, no, I cannot, I cannot take care of myself. Uh-huh. That's tough. That's tough. Yeah. I mean, for somebody who is, you know, for most of their life has, has, uh, not just merely had a farm but had ten children had a farm, ran everything because her husband was away in the coal mines. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. And, you know, facing that situation, it's, it's quite a dilemma. Yes.
I think, my mother, excuse me. Go ahead. Yeah. Well, my, uh, my, uh, probably one of the biggest decisions I think that was very strengthening for our family was rather than have one child make that decision than just delegate it. Uh-huh. I think that they, they had a great deal of, um, all the brothers and sisters got together and they actually had a conference. That's great. And, I mean, it was just, it was probably one of the most strengthening things for our family, getting down together and doing that. That's right. And, and just the children were involved in the decision, because it involved just them. And, you know, making that decision and then finding a place Right. Yeah. and everybody had duties to perform. Uh-huh. You know, whether it was just, you know, giving money or whether it was actually taking part in a lot, of the decision making, you know, like finding a proper nursing home. Uh-huh.
Yep. You were very, fortunate. And they, I know. They, and, well, they had, well, they had, they had seen it coming. Uh-huh. So, so, I mean, it, I mean, I, I, I, I I, I truly wish that if something like that were to happen that my children would do something like, that for me. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Absolutely. Unfortunately, a lot of times it, responsibilities like that seem to fall to, you know, maybe one child in the whole family, you know. Yeah. Yeah. Well, we, we, And, uh, it's usually not a very smooth, smooth thing. Yeah. We were, I was lucky too that I only have one brother. Uh-huh.
And, uh, fortunately, we agreed, you know, on exactly, you know, what we thought should be done. My mother also was very very independent. She had her own, still had her own little house and still driving her own car, at age eighty-three. Yeah. We were lucky in, that in one respect in that after she had her stroke she wasn't really, you know, really much aware of what was going on. Uh-huh. That nursing home life would not have been, you know, anything of her choosing, of course, she would, she would not have been happy there at all. Um. But as it turned out the stroke took care of that concern for us. Yeah. Yeah. Well, with my, with my grandmother I think it was, it was such that, uh, that she did not have the problem with, she was very well aware and her daughter came and visited her Uh-huh. at least her daughter, came and visited her and also her several grandchildren, came and visited her every day. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. That's great.
And I think that when she passed away it was probably one of the greatest, um, I, I, I think it would be, it was more of a relief for her. Uh-huh. Sure. And, um, I mean, but she was truly, she was truly aware. I mean, I, I, I I don't know how I would, how I would deal if one of my parents came with, with Alzheimer's. or something like, that which is, which is far more devastating. Uh-huh. That would be tough. Yes. Absolutely. And, um, I, I, I think that what one thing that they were concerned probably was the fact it wasn't necessarily, you know, like the quantity of care but the quality of, care. Uh-huh. Yes. That the people that worked there were very were very interested that, to make it as close a home environment, as possible. Right. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Yes.
It would, I think, I think, I think, you know for myself I, I see that as probably the, the, what everything would hinge upon. Oh, Is it, how close is it to a home environment. Yes. That's right. That's the, that's probably the major question. I think that great strides are being made nowadays in, in caring for the elderly, you know, in several, in a, in a whole lot of areas. Yeah. Yeah. Just people are, of course, populations getting older. Yeah. You know it's, it's interesting that, that a lot, the population of the United States is changing because, you know, uh, now that so many more minorities, where they have had extended families for such a long time. Uh-huh. Um, matter of fact in the United States we used to have extended families. Uh-huh, It wasn't, true. But, I guess as we become more industrialized and more, you know, less in a rural situation we, we don't, we, we, we choose not to deal with the, extended family because we feel it's kind of cumbersome, when in reality it makes things much much easier.
Yes, um. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. That's right. Sure. Absolutely. And, people, things are scattered so much nowadays. Yeah. I, I, I think that perhaps, perhaps the extended family, you know, that it maybe one of the solutions to a lot of things even child care. Yes. You know I mean, of course there, there comes other issues, you know, whether or not any of the grandparents whether we feel like are going to be a good, they're going to be a good caretaker for our children. Yes, But, just because they're grandparents. I mean they raised us after all. Yeah. Just because they're grandparents that doesn't automatically make them a good child carer. Yeah. But, uh, I, I, I think that, you know, we always, uh, I mean, I've, I've had a lot of good experiences with, uh, with many many people especially where they've had, uh, extended family. And I, and I, I kind of see that, that, you know, perhaps, you know, we may need to like get close to the family environment and and get down to the values of, you know,
Uh-huh. I mean, uh, it's, money seems to be too big of an issue. With, with, with, with what's going on today Oh, yeah. sure. realistically it is. and I, I think, I think that we may not, that may be, you know, perhaps if we put money on the back burner that may, that may choose to alleviate a lot of the problem. Uh-huh. That would, certainly help. I mean, I mean we may not, we may not have as high a standard of living Uh-huh. but the but actually have a truer standard of living. Right. That's just a matter of defining priorities, I guess or some priorities anyway. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think your right. Okay. Well, I guess that was it
Okay. It was good talking to you. Okay. Yeah. All right. Take care. Hey. Bye-bye. Bye-bye. Well, the first thing for me is I wonder, I see a couple of different ways of talking about what privacy is, um, if privacy is something that disturbs your private state, I mean an invasion of privacy is something that disturbs your private state, that's one thing, and if privacy is something that comes into your private state and extracts information from it, in other words, finds something out about you that's another. And the first kind of invasion of, the first type of privacy seemed invaded to me, and very much everyday in this country, but in the second time, at least overtly, uh, where someone comes in and, uh, finds out information about you that should be private, uh, does not seem, uh, um, obviously, everyday. I, I think I agree with that. I think in a good example on the typical thing that happens, uh, when the phone rang and it's T I calling, my immediate reaction is that it's some sort of strange phone message and then I realize, oh, no, this is something I solicited, That's right
so my immediate reaction was one of that sense of invasion but after that I realized, no, I, I really wanted this and it was sort of exciting and so, that was almost an example of an invasion that turns out to be not invasive. Uh-huh. Right, it turned out to be, uh, uh, an invitation. Exactly. Uh, and at the same time I think that I receive on, on the order of, uh, probably, seven or eight a week calls of the nature where one wishes that there were a convenient way to just hang up on it. From, from personal parties or from these, um, phone answer, phone, uh, commercial things. Commercial, solicitations primarily. Oh, that, that's a remarkable number. I get them rarely and I'm still astounded that, that one, they let anyone do them and two, that they have any effect in this whatsoever Um, because I'm usually so insulted by them I just hang up as soon as I recognize what, they are. Yeah. I think they prey on people's, um, inherent politeness on the phone even with the machine. I find people being kind of polite and waiting for it to finish what it has to say, and then they feel an obligation to respond even though there's not even a person there. And I think that's what makes one feel invaded is the fact that there seems to be little control
and you, one's feeling obligated, because of some sense of, of the way the ritual is played out. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. And, and, uh, that, that then ends up being the, the most common example for me. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Um, I guess I'm not typically feeling invaded in my privacy relative to this second, this one that you raised. Yeah. And I don't think I would have thought about that. I think that's a good idea on your part. I don't typically feel intruded on, on the things, uh, the sense of finding out information. Well, presumably those who find out such information, if they are doing it, I would prefer to not to be known, and, I mean, you know, the classic, oh, I don't know C I A conspiracy theories or whatever, would have such parties trying to do it without your knowledge. So there's, things that invade that second type of privacy where you do know about them and possibly things that invade that second type of privacy without you knowing about it, and I can't talk about the second one other than to, to, to generate paranoia It's a surmise and, I'd like to think that it's quite low, at least in this country. To, to surmise. It is there. I don't think I'd like the K G B is monitoring my phone or anything like that.
Well, I guess, although, I, well, that's a good point where you said that how does one define what invasion of privacy is, because, uh, if that's the case of a tree falling in the forest Uh-huh, yeah. and I'm not feeling invaded then maybe my privacy hasn't been because I have no sense of my privacy state having been invaded. Uh-huh, Uh, if your defining it in terms of information gone even if it's something you don't know about it, well, then I guess one could assume one was invaded uh-huh, uh-huh. but I don't feel invaded by it. Uh-huh, I don't, have a sense of threat in general from those sorts of things, uh-huh. I'm not sure why. Uh, I guess it comes from a sense of fact or facts and if someone finds out something about me that is true, I, I don't have a sense of loss from that. Uh-huh. Well, you must have a relatively clean conscience then Um, the, the other side of that might be if, if someone found out something or surmised something that weren't true then I would feel probably more invaded in the gossipy sort of sense. Yes, yes,
more harmed or something. right, because, you don't have anyway to turn it off. Yeah. did you hear about this Lotus data base that was being put together? Yes, I did. I was just about to write a letter when I heard they canceled it. That would be an example where my sense of threat would be high because I would find that there be, a good possibly that their facts were, were fantasy. Uh-huh, uh-huh. And then I would feel not only invaded in the sense that someone had obtained information from a, that I would rather they didn't and that might be the sense of the spending pattern, for instance, that, that I would have thought to be private. Uh-huh, uh-huh. But then if it turns out to generate incorrect things, that's even worse so, or if my call rate of, of eight or so a week went up even higher because uh, someone had, had, Uh-huh, uh-huh. They had you pegged Right.
And the person who had takes unsolicited phones calls and pays money and then all of, a sudden you get your thirty a week because now, they're advertising you. Yeah. Yeah. Right. Exactly. Yeah. And, um, one of the problems with the Lotus data base was, um, that it was uncontrolled access to who would have that information. I mean, they said they would give it out to only select companies but, um, you know, just like software is only given out to customers, I mean, you can't believe that. Right. Right. It would, it would be pirated and they wouldn't bother to check that carefully anyway to someone who's offering, you know, full cash price, for it. Right. I mean, you know, you can't tell it, what a company really has to do with it and there's something rather ominous about having virtually anyone, any hacker being able to know what your income is, what your spending habits are, and, you know, and, and that hacker just has to get in to, in touch with the sneak thief and suddenly and then what started as an invasion of privacy can be an invasion of your actual home.
Uh-huh. And I guess that turns out to be the basic problem with any invasion of privacy is whether or not you're feeling, threatened as a result of, of it Yeah. so, maybe that is a, a little bit of what privacy is. Yes. Exactly. Uh-huh. I also thought about it, was of, uh, waiting to talk to you that, another thing that occurred to me is there is not so much invasion of my privacy because I know how to behave such that there isn't. But I realized I have to behave in a certain way in order to not have people invade my privacy. If I deviate from social norms of behavior, if I run up and down the street yelling or something, someone's going to invade my privacy very quickly. Uh-huh. And I realize that that, I mean, I can take that for granted but I used to, I used to live in India and things are quite different there in terms of that. There's less of a sense of privacy. In fact, it's said that no Indian language has a word for privacy, certainly the language I know doesn't, but just says a word for loneliness. Oh, that's interesting. Loneliness is the closest you can come, which is really quite different. But, but no concept for wanting to be private.
Yeah. It's, it's generally being alone is not a very desirable state, at least officially. Okay. Um, so there's not, I mean, doors don't have latches on them. People don't tend to knock, you just, if there's a door closed and you open it because it's in your way you, people walk in out and, as a, as a westerner in India, and I was often surprised, and felt my sense of privacy there was quite invaded. Oh. That, that would be, That would be culturally shocking You know, it very much is. But on the other hand, I realized I could go out on the street and act like a complete lunatic, Uh-huh. and people would leave, me alone. Uh-huh. Whereas in this country where everyone respects the closed doors very much, if you go out and then act like the lunatic you, you violate the, uh, the norms of social, of, um, public behavior. Um, people start paying attention to you very much and they start asking questions and in the sense are invade, invading your privacy although, if you know what the social norms are, you know, quote unquote, you asked for it.
But it does mean that you have yet another reason to follow a set of social norms. Yes. And which isn't of, always the case in all cultures, and it wasn't until I was thinking about it just now that I realized that's actually something that's culturally relative. that is true. I haven't thought about that and, and that it's fascinating to, to think a lot of someone who doesn't know how to say private. Uh-huh, uh-huh. And that's really, um, well, I mean, I, I wonder how people have sex, and things like that, I mean, they you go to India and it's obvious, you know, the results of sex are quite obvious, as the population goes up an extra hundred million every few years. Um, but I, I just don't quite, um, there's hope, I actually for of the time I've spent there, I still don't quite understand how certain things that I assume and require privacy and require not just that you be alone but actually that you have a sense of privacy. Yes. Because anyone can be alone for some period of time but for me a lot of what I do requires a sense that there's this invisible barrier around me which people will respect.
Yes. And if that's gone, um, I, I really don't know how to live very well, and I wonder, I really do wonder how people do that. That's interesting. Are are there any other specific things that, that you feel like, where, where you feel your privacy to be invaded on a day-to-day basis or either on a growing frequency? All the the other classic examples, the Jehovah's Witness or, or Mormons or someone knocking at the front door, um, which is more intrusive because I have to really tell someone to go away. And there's that sense of, I have now opened my door they now see what I look like, what I live like and and they're doing something that normally I really only invite, people to. Okay. Because I, any, anyone, any friend, anyone I give my number to is welcome to call me, but no one is just welcome to come by my house. So that is more of a sense of invasion. So, that's another example of the invasion because of the not so ... Hi Diana. Hi Have you all been able to do much as a family these days? Pardon me. Have you all been able to do much as, uh, as a full family these days, all of you. Oh, yes, we've, uh, been, um, we've gone other, you know, all kinds of places,
we go out to dinner, Yeah. we take the kids to the park, and, uh, you know, whenever we, he, my husband has time off or something, we take them to the zoo, or we, you know, we do everything we can possibly as a family. Do you work outside the home? No, I don't. Yeah, I don't either, it makes it a little bit easier, I think, that way. Yeah, it does, an, an then, uh, you know, my husband enjoys spending time with the kids, you know, he'll, he'll take them out just to be with them. Yeah. So he, they can have time with him an. So you have a break too. Right, so and we, uh, we try to teach our kids as much as we can at home, you know, we have, we try to spend like Monday nights, we call it family home evening, and, have our kids, uh, you know, have little lessons with them, and, you know, just see, count, see how things are going in our family and, you know, teach them about their grandparents or something like that. Bring out pictures of them so they get to know them
Uh-huh. and, we just do all kinds of fun things like that an. Yeah, we have family that's far away. It sounds like you might too. Yeah, we do, so they, you know, the only way they know their grandparents is by pictures. Yeah. And, uh, Right, and phone calls that's about, about it. Yeah, right and, uh, you know, they, we, you know, we go to the park or we go in the backyard and sit down an, That's yeah, that's what we mostly do, pretty simple things. Yeah.
Especially since my youngest one is excuse me, only fourteen months. Right. She, she's really getting to the age where she's playing, and likes to go places. Uh-huh. Yeah, and with, you know, me being at home and just having the one income, you know, you don't have, this lot of extra money to, to do a lot of, you know, extra things. That's right. So, you, you make more fun than, you know. You know the kids just think it's wonderful just maybe to go get an ice cream cone or, yeah, or, uh, you know, go get a bag of M and M's or something like that, Oh that's a big thrill for them. they, they think that's a lot of fun. So we just, we try to spend as much time as we can. We, you know our, our whole weekends are are devoted to our children except for we might go out, you know, one evening or something, Yeah. but during the day, you know, it's all devoted to our kids and they come, go to church with us and so. Yeah, that's true.
Yeah, so. Have, um, have you ever been to the Science, it's called the Science Place? Yes, yes, that's what. We we haven't lived here too long and we went there a couple of weeks ago and, uh, Uh-huh, the kids thought that was wonderful. Oh, yeah, we, I guess there's Science Place One and Science Place Two. We've only been in, I think it's Science Place Two. I, is, I'm not sure which one we went into, it was about a year or so ago, when we went. The one we went in had, uh, the thing that sticks out most in my mind is that, like a kid's place area. Uh-huh,
yeah. That really seem, they really seemed to go wild in there. Yeah, yeah they had a lot of fun in there and, uh, there's, uh, there's some petting, you know, like, uh, uh, I think it's Owens Country Farms has a free petting, you know, like a farm that you can go to and the kids can pet animals and stuff. Where's that. That's on Plano Road, uh, it's like in Richardson you go up Plano Road, it's like a little bit past Campbell and Plano Road Uh-huh, uh-huh. And that's a lot of fun. Oh yeah. They have tours going through there and, uh, the kids think that was a lot of fun, too. Oh, that does sound like fun. It's a little bit of a ways,
We take, you know, whenever we take them to Showbiz or they think it's wonderful just to go to McDonald's, you know, they don't go for the food they go for the, to play around and, There's another place in Mesquite called Monkey Business, That's right. Uh-huh. and it's a indoor fun park and it has a bunch of different rides for kids. That's sounds fun too. And parents get in free and it's like, during the week, it's like five dollars admission per child, all day. And, and you said about Plano and Campbell is the petting, The petting farm, yeah. That sounds fun I think maybe we'll try to do that. Yeah, yeah
and the one in Mesquite is, uh, Scyene exit. Uh-huh. And it's, it's, uh, the kids just had a wonderful time there, they, you know, you just pay that admission, and then all the, the, the rides are free. You know, of course, they have all the little video games and, you know, those little quarter rides, you know, to, and stuff like that but, they thought that was lot of fun. Yeah. You can have birthday parties there an, I think that was better than like Showbiz Pizza cause there's more for them to do. Because they can just do, you don't have to have tokens for everything. Yeah, right. Yeah. So they had a lot of fun. That does sound like fun. Well I've gotten some good ideas from you Yeah.
I, we try to do a lot of things as a family and, you know, inexpensively as possible, so. Definitely. Well, I think, I don't know if we've done five minutes but I'm sure that will be good. Yeah, that will be good, yeah. It was good talking to you. Well it was good talking to you. I really appreciate your suggestions. Oh, no problem. Well, take care. Okay, bye-bye, Bye-bye. Well, um, with credit cards is, me, I, uh, I try to get maybe just one or two, I don't, I don't like having credit cards for every store. I, I, uh, I just don't like them What are you afraid of with them?
What am I afraid of? Yes. Um, I don't know if I'm really afraid of spending too much. I just, uh, don't think that I need them, you know. I, uh, they are tempting at times, but I, I just, you know, sometimes I just don't like everybody knowing everything about me, you know, so, Well, that's very, can be very, very true. So, and you know, everybody just gives you a credit card just so you'll spend money so, Well, that's the idea. They figure that, if they give you card, at no charge for a whole year that you will use it Yeah. Uh-huh. and, That's right. See they make money off of it, whether you use it or not. Absolutely. Well, the other thing, of course, is the fact that they hope, you will not pay your bill at the end of the month, so that you would be paying interest.
That's right. Uh-huh. I use mine a great deal, um, for groceries, for everything that I can and, then just write one check at the end of the month, for the entire thing, Uh-huh. That's what I do. right. That's what I do. Just a second. to child in Sorry That's all right. Sounds like you have a little one there. I have two little ones. Yes. Oh, you have. Yeah. So Great. How old are they? um, four and two and half. Oh, boy. Those are two very active ages
Yes. So, yeah, um, I'm, I'm like you I, I use my, only use my credit card for, um, you know, when I, you know, I just use it whenever I feel like I don't want to write a check, and then, but I don't charge anything that I can't payoff at the end of the month. Uh-huh. So, Well, uh, do you, uh, do you ever use the A T M machines? No, I never do. My husband does at work just to get cash out, but, uh, I take the checkbook so I, you know, I, just, if I need cash, I just tell him and he gets it out and I don't even think I know my number Well, I find it a great use from the standpoint that you don't have to continue to write checks, in order to get cash. Uh-huh. That's right. See we, he couldn't do without it, but, you know, since he can just do it right there at work, for nothing .
Oh, that helps. Right. Yeah. Well the, the other thing some people are not aware of, is they will use their A, their credit card like their Visa or their MasterCard for cash Uh-huh. and when they do that, they begin paying interest right from that very day on. You're right. And that's kind of silly. Yeah right. Absolutely. Yeah. Because they, they figure that, that's correct You're defeating the purpose. The idea is to use their money Yeah. And, uh, during that whole month and, then pay it at the end of the month. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, I get, I get at least one or two a week. People, you know, sending me a credit card or calling me on the phone and I just say I don't want it. Uh-huh.
Right. Because I, Well, I think that's the only thing you can do, is just say no and mean no and, not be tempted. Yeah. It's like, I'd like to know where they determine that I'm such a good credit risk that they can go and say, you get this much credit line. You know. Well, You've already been preapproved. oh, absolutely, preapproved. That's their favorite word. Yes. Everybody in the country is preapproved, I think. I think so, you're right. So, Well, it's interesting, uh, that, uh, people have the, generally the same view. of credit cards, no matter where you go. Yeah. Uh-huh. Yeah. And, then, some people they get so wrapped up in them that they find, you know, one day they find, wow, I didn't realize I had this much, you know, I'd spent this much money. That much stuff.
Right. And, then they can't meet the minimum monthly payments on it. Well, and some people use one credit card to pay for another credit card they own, Uh-huh. and, I mean, that does nothing, but exacerbate the entire problem. Yeah, it does because you're, you know, you, you're, you know, you're just costing yourself more money because you, if you can't make the monthly, the minimum payment, you're paying interest, again That's right. so, That's right. Yeah so, Well it's been enjoyable talking with you. Yeah. It's enjoyable talking with, seeing that somebody feels the same way, so, well, Right. Well take good care. Take care of your little ones. You, you too.
Good luck. Uh-huh. Bye-bye. Bye-bye. Here goes Sharon. Okay. Well what do you think about Nolan Ryan being the first baseball player to earn a million dollars? That's the only thing I found out tonight Oh, you found that out tonight? Yeah. I haven't even heard that, that's great. I think he deserves every penny of it. Yeah. But, there are some others out there that I don't believe deserve the money they're getting. Well, isn't it funny how baseball's getting less than like football players would. Oh, yeah. Wonder because football, And they play a lot, they play a lot longer season, too. And a lot more games, right?

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